# Top Tips For New forever mummies and daddies!!



## Frangipanii

Curiosity and eagerness to please brings me to ask you lovely and experienced people for your top tips. We are going to matching panel on Thursday  and start intros a few weeks later.  As most of you know I love fact finding so wondered if you could tell me any top tips that has helped you during your placement so far. It can be emotional, practical, theoretical or even whimsical!! And obviously not adoption specific! 
Anything....just wanting to be as prepared as possible. 
By the way their ages are 3 and 1. 
Thanks xx  x x x x


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Get as much sleep as you possibly can between now and introductions starting its exhausting on all levels and then you will be all at home full steam ahead.
Be prepared for any eventuality in nappy bag. First time we went to my mum and dads we went for a walk with my dad completely forgetting he walks and bubba woke up wanting food 40 mins from food OMG
Get clothes nappies etc ready before bath
Know what u r doing for meals and keep them simple as u won't have time
Forget housework
Look in the mirror its last time your hair/makeup will look good
Stock up on stain remover carpet cleaner
Expect the unexpected
Lucozade and choc got me through first few month

Above  all try and enjoy it. Its hard work and nothing prepares you for how hard but the rewards do come and when they do it is like all bdays coming at once. I have never laughed so much and I truely am a very happy proud mummy


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## MummyElf

I'm 9 weeks in and I'll try to offer some helpful tips! My LO is 13 months.

1. Stock your freezer for the first couple of weeks at home - have meals made and ready. I did chilli con carne, shepherds pie, spag Bol...that sort of thing.

2. Find out from the FC what the children like to eat and prepare and freeze ahead too. I've found Annabel Karmel's book of recipes for children brilliant - it goes from weaning to toddlers and some of it is good for the whole family.

3. Stock up on wine   In those first few weeks when you've accomplished the mission of getting them both to sleep you'll be shattered yet triumphant and ready for a bit of grown up time. I find a glass of wine helps me switch off.

4. Don't expect too much of yourself emotionally. The love and bonding takes time. Whilst I did adore my LO on sight, I didn't love her at first (I do now! Big time!) and this led to me feeling SO guilty. The behaviours that I knew I shouldn't be bothered by drove me mad to start with. And yes, she can still be very clingy, shouty and demanding, but my love for her does make me feel more able to cope. On the whole she's a diamond.

5. Do you have any friends who've done it?  If not maybe ask your SW to pair you up with another couple. You are undertaking a big venture taking two on of those ages, and emotional support from people who have been there will be massive. If not come on here and talk to us lot or PM us...just don't go it alone.   

6. Be prepared to do a lot of soul searching once they are placed and don't beat yourself up about your parenting. This may sound bizarre right now but it will make sense soon.  I spent weeks on a guilt trip, I'm starting to come off but it took time. All my visuals of how I'd be as a mum were a little different to reality. If anyone watched the recent drama BBC 'Top of the Lake' at the end one of the characters who has helped others and is a sort of spiritual teacher is leaving and she says to another character with a newborn baby boy 'he's your teacher now. You'll learn a lot from him.' Hubby and I commented on the truth of this.  I learnt a lot about myself when I became a mum 9 weeks ago... some bad, some good, some surprising!

7. Agree with AAA, hair and make up will be an 'epic fail' for a while! But a few weeks back I decided enough was enough and I do my hair and make up every day. I never stopped doing my make up, ever, but my hair did take a back seat as its thick and wavy and needy! I got it cut and returned to styling it. LO drinks her milk and plays with toys etc in my bedroom whilst I do this each morning. I need to do it to keep my self esteem and maintain who I am. She gets everything else from me all day long, so I will have that bit of me, come hell or high water. I also clean regularly. Again, I'm not living in a dump jut because I'm a mum. All I'd say is set the routine how you want it from day one and they'll get used to it. Mummy cleans as Mummy's house is important to her, and Mummy does her hair and make up 

Just my tuppence worth.

X


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## Frangipanii

oh wow.... you have had me in stitches and in shivers of fear all at the sametime! I think I will struggle with the tiredness factor, but not the chocolate factor! We are cooking the meals this weekend and wont be stocking up on wine as we dont drink really but chocolate....umm yes! I am actually going to print this list off and keep it with me as it is awesome. it reminds me to stay sane and realise we are not alone and it is going to hard and any feelings can be accounted for!
I am so nervous now! but trying to get things done! 
your advice is so gratefully recieved! I hope others benefit from reading it as both me and dh have done so!!!
love to you!!!! x xx xx


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## MummyAuntieKatie

MummyElf you've got some really good points there!

I believe that we expect far too much of ourselves and sometimes BB too.  Intros were so tiring, even when we didn't really do much on a particular day, it was strange, I never believed it could be as shattering as it was.

When BB came home, we were so tired by the time we got him to bed that we didn't eat properly for weeks.  It was really hot too.  I didn't think ahead and prepare easily reheated meals which I should have done.  

The lack of sleep the first few weeks was just a killer.  We were irrational, tired to the point of tears and that made us grumpy and fed up.  We were both trying to be there for each other but what we really ought to have done was take it in turns to wear earplugs and get a good night.  It was far tougher than I ever imagined and I am not exaggerating!  

Nappy bag, haha, the times I've gone out to realise I only have 1 nappy but needed 2, should have packed  hat, sun cream, a snack or a drink!  

Be honest with yourself and your friends, it's amazing how many people tell you everything you are going through they did too, when at the time you thought they were getting on fine!!  Most people struggle much more than they admit which jut means the rest of us feel like we are failing by not coping as well, it's all really just an illusion!  Speak to lots of people with birth children the same age, you'll probably find that the behaviours you are worried about are actually perfectly normal. I found that invaluable! 

Book lots of activities you can do together as soon as you feel ready.  We need to keep busy or we'll go loopy, we go out almost every morning and afternoon with a nap in between.

Don't let people tell you not to stick to a routine, people say 'you can't plan your life around nap times/bedtimes/mealtimes, it's no way to live'...  If it works, stick to it and tell them to go bunny!  I've realised over the last 8 weeks that our routine is what gels our day together and it makes everyone happier.  If we mess it up we pay for it somewhere down the line and it's just not worth it.  If my friends aren't willing to fit in with that routine then I won't be seeing them, simple! 

Absolutely agree about looking after yourself and your home.  I looked around one day at all the kids stuff and mess and decided enough was enough, I wanted my house back.  We have the lounge as a kiddy free zone too, it's where we retreat to at the end of the day and there are no toys or mess around.  I also do my hair and make-up every day, I am a person in my own right not just a mum and/or wife.  Am I right that you will have hubby home?  Make the most of it, it's such a joy to be able to poo and shower on your own!  BB won't just go and play in his room so I have to take him in the bathroom with me.  I really look forward to weekends when I can shower in peace and poop in private!! 

I'm sure there's loads more....  Luckily there are so many lovely new mummies and daddies here to share their experiences!  

BB up from his nap, I've heard him get out of bed, cross to the door, open it then run back to bed again!  I don't think he'll stay up there quietly for long, best sign off xxx


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## Wyxie

Someone asked me a few weeks ago what I wished I'd done before I adopted.

I really wish I'd done some serious weight time in the gym before I adopted. You have no idea how much time I spend lifting/holding/carrying/controlling one or other child, sometimes I end up having to carry both. Even with a baby carrier, doing the housework/hoovering etc with a baby in a carrier makes it twice as much hard work, not to mention pushing the buggy plus buggy board several miles most days now. Wyxling is around 2 1/2 stone, Bladelet is 20 lbs, given the ages of your kids you'll be looking at around the same, and when they are fighting or completely rigid they feel a _lot_ heavier.

I also wish I'd bought a house with bigger bathrooms. Fitting me and both babies into either of ours is a nightmare, and like AuntieKatie, I don't get to do anything in private. Bit late for that now though.

Also just practical stuff, like moving problems before they happy if you can. We only have one big downstairs room, which is a pita, because all our lounge and dining furniture is in there, together with PCs, so I have to teach our kids not to touch stuff which just adds to the hassle. If I was able to, I'd have a room with pretty much nothing that they could really do damage to in reach, and then a separate room for dining stuff and computers which they only went into to eat. It would make life so much easier! If you can make your lounge pretty child proof, wall mount TV, no important breakable stuff they can get to, just basically sofa, carpet and toys, it will make things so much easier, especially if you've got a child you know has behaviour issues.


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## GERTIE179

I would echo everyone's advice especially toddler proofing as Los with trauma they have an uncanny knack of trying dangerous things seeking attention. I would've loved LO to watch tv just so I could've got a min in early months  but was not to be the way. Count for having very little personal space as even with hubby you may find one (or both) wont let you out of sight whilst they know you are there.

Do all your big cleaning jobs as if might be a while before you can let someone else in house to help or clean for you with you about. Clear space in wardrobes, loft, garage as appropriate as Los accumulate a lot of stuff very quickly. We also had a lot of clothes bought that were all too big which has been great as shopping in first few months was mainly online.

Keep something easy to read in bathroom/bed for a 5min to yourself just to recharge. Also I struggled to sleep when LO did eventually sleep so bear in mind you might need help switching off/winding down.

Good luck x


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## gettina

Fabulous thread. Thanks mummies, and Fran! X


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## Frangipanii

Yes it is isnt it....such helpful advice!!! ♥♥♥♥♥


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## skyblu

You have had fantastic advice here and has brought back so many memories. Can't believe how far we have come. Something I will say that happened to us during intros, we were so tired and emotional that we got to the point were we didn't think we could do it. We were completely drained, but guess what.... it is normal  I remember coming on here 3 nights before lo came home, it was 11.30pm, I was crying uncontrollably ,DH wasn't talking to me because he didn't know what to say as he felt it too and I was desperate for someone to answer we asap. 6.00 the next morning I was on line and was pleased to see 4 replies saying is was perfectly normal. 
If you ever feel like that, at least now you will know before hand it is perfectly normal and nothing to worry about.
To say we are pleased we went ahead is an understatement, all I ever wanted was to be a mummy and I pleased to say I think I am doing a fine job at it, It is a shock to system your life is not your own any more but lo is worth every bit of the sleepless nights, the tantrums and the mess she creates every day, and my god when they give you a massive cuddle and kiss, you know you have done the right thing.

Good luck at mp tomorrow, I will be thinking of you.
Skyblu.xxx


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## Frangipanii

Now this is all real....this advice is the most awesomest thing ever!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

Thanks for all the tips. So useful and makes it all sooooooooooooooo real!!!

Anyone any ideas of meals to freeze that toddlers eat. The kids eat everything so any suggestions welcome. 

Thanks 

Xxxxx


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## MummyAuntieKatie

I tend to feed BB whatever we are having unless it's spicy.  Spag Bol, bacon and mushroom pasta with an alfredo sauce, chicken and chorizo in tomatoes & garlic.  He eats anything too.  However, I have also been using quite a few Heinz kids ready meals, they go down well, better than HiP or any of the others I tried, or the little tins of things like macaroni cheese, bolognese, rigatoni etc.  Also, my cousin got me into the fresh tortolini from tesco with some pesto mixed in, kids seem to love that.  

I had big ideas of us all eating together and making all my own food.... I got over that in the first couple of weeks!! I'm no super mum, ready meals are fast and easy when you have a hungry toddler on your hands. xx


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Just wanna say in case anyone is reading this that  mummyhood can also be achieved if you don't have a large home. We live in a very small 2 bed flat with no garden. Every single room is full to bursting and a massive pink element can be found everywhere you look. We have done it yes we want to move but only for a garden really. We always go for a walk everyday fresh air is good for your soul and also does lo good. Swimming, play centres and parks are all great. I never took bubba to family centres or toddler groups because I was and still am more than happy to have one to one and she needed that she would never have coped in large groups. Don't get me wrong I hit an incredibly low point but my family got me through and the little smiley face looking back at me was the best medicine.
Yes it is awesome to have a shower and poop in private but in those early days I was so worried what she was doing that actually it was easier to have her in with me.
Its flipping hard work harder than I ever imagined but now its just amazing and time goes so so quickly. 

Anyway sorry if that sounded bit weird. Having a raging hormone day just off for our walk after watching Tinkerbell. 


Xx


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## E3021

Hi,

This is a really interesting thread and you've had loads of great advice.

One thing that strikes me is how very different we all are in some ways - house, food etc but all of our LOs are thriving. At the end of the day they need you and your love, everything else is just personal preference or circumstance. Trust yourself, don't try to be something you-re not or live up to an imaginary ideal - it will crumble around you. You have been approved and matched so you are right for these LOs.

Try and sleep, try and enjoy every minute of the preparation and the introductions, although it can be stressful and an anxious time it is also precious and the start of your family life. 

Enjoy  
Xxx


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## MummyAuntieKatie

E3021 said:


> One thing that strikes me is how very different we all are in some ways - house, food etc but all of our LOs are thriving. At the end of the day they need you and your love, everything else is just personal preference or circumstance. Trust yourself, don't try to be something you-re not or live up to an imaginary ideal - it will crumble around you. You have been approved and matched so you are right for these LOs.


So true! I went into this with these lovely ideals abut feeding, how I would behave, what activities we would do together every day etc etc... Eventually I realised I was too idealistic and needed to give myself a break, a pass to be normal, not super human! Do it your way and find your own routine without pressure to conform to unrealistic ideals. That's a great piece of advice. xx


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## MummyElf

Going back to food, the Annabel Karmel's book is great - from babies to toddlers. I use the toddler section as LO is nearly 14 months and make ahead and freeze cheese sauces for mac n cheese with veggies, pasta sauces, breaded chicken....it does everything....veggie burgers, meatballs, loads of pasta recipes, fish pies ... If you want this book I have a spare copy which I can post you if you PM me your details x


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## keemjay

some great advice already  
sorry about odd formatting copying and pasting from some former threads..

1) a lovely song to sing..both of mine had it every night before bed right from being placed, and still have it now at age 7 and 6..we lie next to them face to face, as close as possible..​you insert the right names/hair type and eye colour to suit your child​we also adapt it now and again on occasions eg what 'special 6 yr old you are' on a birthday..or 'what a toothless girl you are' when first tooth fell out! they absolutely love that​I assume you all know the tune ​twinkle twinkle little sophie​what a special girl you are​blond curly hair and soft soft cheeks​(touch the hair and stroke the cheeks)​dark brown eyes with which you peek​(make little binoculars with thumb and forefingers)​twinkle twinkle little sophie​what a special girl you are​
2)Get out of the house at least once a day..anywhere will do... walk around the block with the buggy, or with a toddler just amble your neighbourhood, trail sticks on railings etc. go to the library (even babies can have fun crawling about..doesnt have to be storytime session (is it me or are those sessions always hideously busy and stressful?)) walk to the corner shop to get stamps/groceries..Toys R Us is a great playground.. we spent many an hour there playing on all the little bikes  anything..just get out!! buy good wet weather gear so even a rainy day doesnt stop you. fresh air and a break from the 4 walls is as important for you as it is for the children!​3)massage your LO's if they will let you. DD didnt really sit still much in the early days but if i put the wiggles on for 10 mins she would sit still and i could do her hands and feet. get something with a calming smell, lavendar for bedtime use maybe. mine still love it now, i often massage their feet while dh reads their bedtime story on our bed.​4)just general helping round the house with everyday chores is absolutely great for bonding..more traditional childhood philosphies advocate that above most other things..bascially working alongside you as you go about your day. I have to say i have always found it less stressful to have mine say, peeling the potatoes with me (and i mean peeling in a very loose sense..more washing/scooping up peelings etc) alongside me than rushing to do it while they are occupied (for a nano second) doing something else or else running riot somewhere else. I used v successfully a 'funpod' when mine were smallwhere they could be up alongside me at the counter safely. sweeping/hoovering/wiping/dusting etc is all really good stuff for them to learn, as is stacking and unstacking the dishwasher (crockery included) loading/unloading the washing machine. Its funneling at its ultimate i think.​kj x​


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## thespouses

No it's not just you, library story/singing sessions are horrible!


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## galaxy girl

Frangipani - my 2 were the same age as yours on placement. Looking back I expected 3 year old to be more grown up and  independent than he was!! ( plus he def regressed on placement - toileting. Feeding. Dressing. Sleeping all regressed big time) . It was tough cause I had a baby ... I couldn't cope with 2 ... Didn't have the arms free!! But it was what he needed and in the end we had to go with it! Any questions please ask!! 

Wyxie is right re the lifting but on the plus side I lost half a stone!!


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## Frangipanii

Wonderful reading. I have even sent the link to my hubby so he can take notes. I am also going to print it and take it to introductions with me....we are away in hotel for a week so will have plenty of time. Will of course be exhausted. 
Been starting some of your suggestions.....today we cooked two meals-beef stew and chicken casserole which my urchins both eat and love. You should of seen hubbies face when I was chopping the carrots up small. He wss so happy. We have also been stocking up on things and discussing how to support each other as well pointing possible issues out. Both have some challenges so it will be interesting. 

I cannot tell you how helpful all this is. Thanks again. 
Galaxy girl.....how active was your youngest. Supposedly our boy is a bit ott on the whole running around playing thing with no fear of anything and a low pain threshold. .....sounds like he may have adhd to me but dont want to label or define him until he is older and I have my facts straight. 
Keemjay....loving 2/3/4 completely amazing. I cant sing so it might not be a good idea to do that. 
MaK and E3201... I think keeping it realistic is soooo important. Hubby is a romantic though so it will be interesting!


Love to you all x x x x x


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## galaxy girl

Frangipani - my youngest was just 12 months in placement and not walking at all! Didn't walk for 6 months either. He was huge!! Had been completely over fed .. His wee legs wouldn't have supported his weight. Doesn't sound like your wee man will have that problem!


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## Wyxie

Not being able to sing doesn't matter to a baby.  Have you heard young kids sing?  It's awful, really, truly, horrendous.  But, as long as you can kind of hum along in something roughly approximating a tune, it's still a good thing.  The rhythm alone is really good for kids for regulating, especially if you rock them in time to music, and really, we can all do that.  Mostly, they just learn the sound of your voice, and if they're old enough to understand the words they'll probably like it if it's a song about them.  I'm always badgering my husband (who has a dreadful sense of pitch) to sing to our kids, and he's really resistant.  I am fortunate in that I'm reasonably musical, and I often play the piano for and with them, but I don't have a great voice.  Doesn't bother the either of our kids at all.

Low pain threshold is not necessarily a bad thing.  I would be more worried about a very active child at that age who didn't react to being hurt, as that tends to be a sign of more significant problems.

Sounds like you're really enjoying your nesting time.


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## Caledonia

aaa is a MUMMY said:


> Just wanna say in case anyone is reading this that mummyhood can also be achieved if you don't have a large home. We live in a very small 2 bed flat with no garden. Every single room is full to bursting and a massive pink element can be found everywhere you look. We have done it yes we want to move but only for a garden really. We always go for a walk everyday fresh air is good for your soul and also does lo good. Swimming, play centres and parks are all great.


I am a long way off from being matched as only starting out but thanks for the re-assurance! I was starting to panic - I am in a 2 bedroom flat also - pretty spacious but actually kitchen/dining/living room combined and was starting to worry! Good to know it can be done


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## E3021

My LOs were 18 months and 6 months on placement. One week in and the baby learned to crawl, and she got it quickly and was fast so when DH went back to work after paternity leave I had two under twos who could both move!!!

I learned to baby proof pretty fast, I'm still standing, my house is still standing and more importantly so are my DDs!  

You will cope with your situation, it's all you will know so you just get on with it. People are always asking me what it was like to have two at once, it's hard to answer as it's the only experience I have. It's hard but I love it and I quickly got organised and into a routine so I'm always one step ahead (well nearly always!!)


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## Flash123

Fran, excellent advice on here. It's been a fab thread to read and amazing how so many experiences/feelings/actions have resonated with us all yet we are all doing what we can in unique, individual ways that are right for our little ones. Here are my thoughts: 
~ nothing in my wildest dreams prepared me for the utter physical and mental exhaustion of intros. I never really believed people when they said how tiring they are but my lord. Just when you thing you can't get any more tired hey move in 24/7 and its WOW! During intrs dh and I  both had complete meltdowns. We questioned whether or not we were able to be good enough parents for this precious little man and seriously thought about not going through with it. FC were lovely with lo but made things really tough for us. Things were so tough we delayed him coming home for a day because they had undermined our confidence so much (we now know they had planned a party and wanted lo there!) 

~ dh and I never ate for weeks, we couldn't work out how to fit it in to our day so good idea that you are stocking up already

~ the world doesn't end if some days, when you are at the bottom of that tank, if you give them a tin of spaghetti hoops, don't make it out of pj's,  don't make the bed and watch t.v.  Yourlo's won't notice, they just need you xx

~ do what you want not want others think you should do. Lo's sw has put pressure on us to join groups but until now I didn't feel ready. I really enjoyed the 1:1 time with him and felt it has helped us both bond such a lot. 

~ accept help from others. In the beginning I was too proud. I thought I could be wonder mum and wife...I fell ridiculously short! Now sil does our cleaning (it was her present to us until I go back to work) mum ones the ironing, mil cooks us lots of meals. If people didn't mean it they wouldn't offer. 

~ while lo is awake I haven't been to the toilet, had a shower or dressed in private for 3 months and I don't give a ****. I also haven't worn make up, done my hair properly or worn an item of clothing not caked in food or sick and dh says I look the best he has ever seen me because I'm so happy and content ( at least that's what he tells me anyway lol) 

~ my sling was the best thing I bought along with huge cheap shower curtains for our floor picnics. Once a week lo and I have a floor picnic where we eat lots of messy finger food (he's 11 months) then we bath/shower together afterwards. He absolutely loves both and again it has been wonderful for bonding.

Enjoy, enjoy, enjoy xx


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## Frangipanii

Wow thanks Flash, Wyxie, E3201, Galaxy Girl etc. Your advice is all crucial. 
Wyxie....I have decided I will sing!!! I have good double glazing so should be ok!!!! If I cant make a fool in front of them there's a problem lol. 
Flash...some invaluable advice there!!! Thank you....the spaghetti hoops and no cleaning sounds very feasible!
Got email off prep group friend saying we can ring her for support the week of intros as she nearly had a melt down and as hers are of similar age I suppose that makes sense!!! I am not too scared to ask ha ha. Going to be stranfe sraying in hotel for a week in a strange place meeting our children!!
Nine sleeps to go. 
Think ALL people going to intros should read your lovely advice everyone. It is priceless. 
Xxxx


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## -x-Lolly-x-

I am reading and trying to take it all in as it is excellent advice from people who know how hard and tiring, yet wonderful intros can be. I just need panel to say yes today so I can start to put it into practice next week   

Thank you ladies


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Fran we have had loads of fun with signing and singing dvds it makes singing bit more fun bubba really loves dingle dangle scarecrow we have been dancing round as scarecrows and learning makaton at the same time.  I have also learnt loads of signs as well.


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## MummyElf

We do sing and sign too, LO loves it and last weekend signed 'dog' - her first sign. Massive excitement from us! I sign all the time to her and last night she copied me and signed 'night nights' back to me at bedtime. Best thing ever! Off the scale pride!


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## galaxy girl

Ah lovely mummy elf ! I also recommend nursery rhyme CDs for the car. Then you can sing along!! And mr tumble on something special for signers! I'm makaton  trained for my job. Didn't really use it with my very verbal kids though! But we did  and do watch something special


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Mummy elf lovely moment and one to cherish. 
Playgroup suggested it as she loves mr tumble and at home she doesn't stop talking and singing and they felt it would add a new dimension to it for her and it really has.


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## Frangipanii

Anyone recommend any tv programmes that are not complete tripe and slightly educational that I can record on sky in advance.  Four sleeps to go! 
Thanks for advice...checking out toddler groups tomorrow and stuff to do during intros and when they first come back here. Xxx


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## Wyxie

Personally I find CBeebies is best for educational stuff that keeps them entertained, we hardly ever have anything else on.  There's a lot of crap on there, but some stuff is quite good, and you can get it all on Iplayer so we can pick and choose what is on at the kid's "TV times".  Something Special they all seem to love, Alphablocks, Numtums, Squigglet (teaches writing), Nina and the Neurons is good, but although Wyxling watches it, it's a little old for her really, also Andy and Kip's Wild Adventures and What's the Big Idea which is really nice for teaching kids quite difficult concepts.  There are quite a few which are entertaining with some educational content so you don't feel like you're sitting them in front of complete crap.  There are also story times on CBeebies which both mine like now.


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## keemjay

yeah i reckon cbeebies isnt bad if you need to have tv on..most other channels are rubbish..i used to use dvd's more (look out in charity shops or ask on freecycle) mine LOVED the Wiggles..it took me  a while to not feel a bit weirded out by 4 grown men prancing about singing childrens songs but it is actually really good clean wholseome fun!
the old ones are the best if you can get hold of them..Rosie and Jim was lovely..and educational. Tikkabilla was great too..bit like playschool..


mummyk x


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## galaxy girl

Mine also like peppa pig - the only non c beebies thing we watch ! Is v short so good for short attention spans and it has some nice themes - we watched  the going to the dentist one before doing so and it really helped outline what would happen!


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## crazyspaniel

Keemjay, DS loved Tikkabilla, I'd forgotten all about it! 
Can highly recommend 'Come Outside' too, with Auntie Mabel and Pippin the dog  
DD will only watch 'something Special'.....!


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## skyblu

My Lo also loves peppa pig and we watched one where she goes on holiday on a plane which really prepared lo for our holiday. Fifi the flower tots is also a good one, but mainly c bebbies is the best one to watch. 

Good luck Fran on intros, four more sleeps. 

Skyblu


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## katie c

i love alphablocks, they are so cute.   dinosaur train is good, i think thats a nick jr one. and waybuloo and night garden are ace for winding down the LO. i never knew that was the purpose of night garden before i became a mum, i just thought it was a slightly trippy tv show   

ok...my tips.

you cant have enough mini tupperware boxes. for freezing food portions and for decanting half eaten snacks/breadsticks into so they dont go stale. dont bother with tommy tippee, pound shop ones will do, or i got some sets of 8 small rectangle shaped ones from sainsburys, on offer for a quid

ditto flannels. a friend said it was better to clean your LO with a flannel and water after meals rather than wipes all the time. i brought three bundles from ikea and only realised when i got home i had 18   Loads of my friends cracked up laughing but they have been invaluable. I use a top and tail bowl i've been given (that other people told me i'd never use) , the flannels are kept in one side and i use warm water with a squirt of johnsons top and tail wash (or whatever its called) for clean ups

Get a small cheapy plastic basket to toss the flannels/bibs in and keep it near the washer, to chuck in when you have a load. Rather than put them in the laundry basket to go musty

Having said that, you cant underestimate how good wipes are too, especially for getting sick/missed food off the carpet. have a packet in every room.

Crawlers aged about one need dungarees. Our son is between clothes sizes and always crawling out of his pants   

Food...you need a hand blender with one of attachments so you can blend food in a little plastic tub. and a reasonable sized freezer. Frozen veg is amazing. i have frozen cauli cheese, frozen mash (stir fish and pureed broccoli in for instant fish pie), frozen mixed veg. And improvise on those Annabelle Karmel recipes with whatever's in your freezer. Frozen fish is great too, one fillet usually makes two meals. LO also likes those small frozen yorkie puds.

The other thing i do is buy one of those stew packs from asda (you know, with swede, carrots, onions) and boil that up with a couple of spuds, some veg/chicken oxo, then mash or blend. Split that into portions about 200g, and thats either lunch (like a thick soup) or tea with some fish or shredded chicken stirred in.

Forget eating together too, nice idea in principle but i dont want to eat at 5.30.   The only day i do that is sunday, i make us a roast dinner but with mash rather than roast spuds so i can eat with one hand (have been known to eat the meat/yorkie pud with my fingers) and feed the LO with the other hand. If you do a reasonable size piece of meat, you can then use the left overs for super quick meals the following days. Last week i made five meals out of a joint of beef   

If you get one of those Johnsons toiletries boxes they are a perfect size for a nappy changing kit. we keep one downstairs for poo emergencies   

Dummy clips are the best. Babies have an amazing game that involves them throwing their dummy/toy out of their buggy. after five minutes it stops being cute. one clip for dummy, one round the leg of teddy. Ruins their game but hey ho   

oh and visitors, meet somewhere neutral not at your house, i cant recommend this one enough.

if i think of anything else, i'll come back.


----------



## Wyxie

katie c said:


> Crawlers aged about one need dungarees.


This is so true, plus all kids are incredibly cute in dungarees. Short dresses and tights work well for girls too, and useful when it gets cold and they just want to pull the socks off. Also, when they start walking, they still do lots of crawling for ages. All in ones with feet (sleepsuits) are a pita in the way, because they crawl for a bit, and the feet end up hanging off the end of their actual feet, then they try and walk, and fall on their faces. You end up having to sort them out for them every 2 minutes, and it bugs them almost as much as it will bug you. Dungarees are brilliant, and you can get great all in ones without feet, and they work really well for crawling and just walking too. If they won't keep socks on, just stick tights underneath - I do that for my son, just like I did for my daughter, although I do tend to keep the hand me down pink tights for in the house only.


----------



## -x-Lolly-x-

Yes Katie, I agree with your pre-mummy theory re in the night garden... Apparently little pink loves it and it's incorporated in her bedtime routine, but WTF is all this ninky nonk talk?!!


----------



## GERTIE179

Wait til you get Pinky Bonk or as DH calls it the farty flying thing!! 
X


----------



## -x-Lolly-x-

Oh goodness, this is a whole new world


----------



## katie c

oh no! it's the ninky nonk!   

(its kind of a runaway train thing that makes a squeaky noise. told you it was trippy)

the little tune at the beginning where iggle piggle rolls down the sail of his boat and goes over the sea to the nigh garden brings a lump to my throat and a tickly feeling to my eyes. how women who've given birth and have all those hormones flying around can handle it defeats me


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## -x-Lolly-x-

Might youtube first to desensitise


----------



## GERTIE179

Its on cbeeb every night at 630. Lil man has became addicted to this and mr bloom but thk gawd nothing else. 
X

The worst & funniest thing about parenthood is the fact that you learn these so FS and they stay in your head!! Wouldn't change it for the world though
X


----------



## MummyElf

I can promise you will grow to hate In the Night Garden    My BIL is convinced Upsy Daisy is a man in a dress   We checked the credits; it's not   LOs love it though and it was a big comfort when LO was poorly newly into placement. Cuddles and ITNG.

Katie C has offered many amazing tips! My LO is now in tights under trousers as she won't keep her socks on and has bad circulation so ends up with frozen feet. Little man will be the same. I've got the large 'vital baby' freezer pots from amazon...large been small, but this will be the right size I think.

I love Grobag sleeping bags too....wish I could wear one!

I wash hands and face with a small plastic bowl of water and my hands after dinner as LO hates being 'cleaned' post meal with a passion but we've made a game out of the bowl of water and she loves it. I occasionally use my Ikea flannels...Like Katie I also bought about a million  ....and they are great.

Oh and the tommee tippee pelican bibs are fab. Plus if Weetabix is going to be on offer, In the summer I stripped her to her vest and now she wears a big wipe clean long armed Ikea overall bib with the tommee tippee pelican bib on top! And wash it off the second breakfast ends or you'll be getting out the chisel   They should use Weetabix for building with....sticks more aggressively than concrete!


----------



## -x-Lolly-x-

Thanks Gertie, will check it out tomorrow and learn the characters, songs and dances off by heart, that outta impress her!!  

Great tips, thanks everyone, have been reading with interest and now realise I have a lot to learn (and buy  )


----------



## Flash123

Ooooooo lolly, you wait lol the joys of the night garden. The pinky ponk often has very unfortunate 'ponks' which causes iggle piggle to spill his 'ponk juice'. Macca packa lost his uff puff and upsey daisy lifts her skirt if she's happy! My lo has now developed a cleaning fettish thanks to macca packa. He sees a wet wipe and starts wiping. Bless him. 


What a pip!!!!!!


----------



## -x-Lolly-x-

Uff puff and skirt lifting?!!   Oh my...


----------



## Anjelissa

lol  at you lot and ITNG    
I'm supposed to be on my way to bed so I'm not even going to get started as I'll be here forever, but sooo funny  .

Anj x

Ps...Katie...the bit that gets me a bit teary is at the beginning of the night time hour where there's always a baby with a parent doing the 'round and round the garden' stroke on their hand before bed  . Our little man copied that almost from day one of placement putting his hand out to us to be stroked, so that bit always gets me


----------



## katie c

oh, and if you do go to ikea for flannels, well the 'baby pack' is great, 10 for three quid i think...but they're white. so unless you're planning to soak them a lot, i'd buy the coloured ones from the bathroom department 

tommy tippee bibs grim me out a bit tbh  but i have been known to double bib master c, plastic bib underneath, fabric one on top (to aid wiping of face) i also buy the fabric bibs with a hole you pull over the head, as he just yanks off ones with velco fastenings. you dont see them everywhere but they have some in asda, and you get them in places like QLM and poundland.

and yes, weetabix, if you are putting the bowl in a dishwasher, soak the bowl first. ditto anything with broccoli in, especially if you've pureed it.

i've also developed the single handed cleaning after meals routine to a T. leave small child in highchair. wipe tray first (so they dont immediately mash clean hands in the crap) then face and hands, then child out, quick wipe of seat, quick wipe of clothes, then return child to chair and wipe the floor. if you dont have a tiled or laminate floor (we have tiles) i'd definitely invest in a bit of that plastic covering stuff otherwise your carpet is going to _ming_


----------



## Emma-is-a-mummy

Now I want to get little man into watching this just to see what it's all about lol. 

He's a Thomas the tank kinda lad  he stands there dancing to the theme tune haha. 
He doesn't really watch TV but I'm sure that will change. 

Thanks for tips everyone 
Xxxxx


----------



## katie c

Anjelissa said:


> Ps...Katie...the bit that gets me a bit teary is at the beginning of the night time hour where there's always a baby with a parent doing the 'round and round the garden' stroke on their hand before bed  . Our little man copied that almost from day one of placement putting his hand out to us to be stroked, so that bit always gets me


awwwww, so cute! bless him


----------



## Wyxie

Hehe, I know all the Nightgarden songs off by heart too.  It really does help calm them.  Although in our house there is major disappointment when there isn't a dance.  Wyxling also notices all the inconsistencies and they really bug her (Iggle Piggle's blanket in the dance being one of them).

If you think that's weird, wait until you see Baby Jake (or Nightmare Baby Jake as we call it in this house).

I am firmly convinced that as long as I have enough weetabix in the house to completely coat the shed, in the event of a nuclear attack, we will be fine.  Either that, or we'll have to tunnel underneath the highchair very quickly!


----------



## MummyElf

The Makka Pakka song is my favourite .... Makka pakka akka wakka Mikka Makka Moo......

He does have the most enormous bottom too!


----------



## Anjelissa

Wyxie said:


> Hehe, I know all the Nightgarden songs off by heart too. It really does help calm them. Although in our house there is major disappointment when there isn't a dance. Wyxling also notices all the inconsistencies and they really bug her (Iggle Piggle's blanket in the dance being one of them).


  Our little man is exactly the same re/the dance, he's really disappointed when it's a story instead of the dance, as he likes to copy it. Luckily he still get's to see Iggle Piggle fall over each time at the end (another favourite part).
He used to be really scared of the toucan type bird on the branch due to the noise it makes and grabbed us for a cuddle whenever it came on.
I've warmed to most of the cbeebies's programmes but Baby Jake is still just as annoying and I think always will be. Luckily little man doesn't like it either  
It's a whole other world isn't it! 

I've noticed lately how different programmes bring back different memories, eg Waybuloo reminds me of when our little man was a baby and the early days of placement (he used to go into a trance when it was on).

I have to say (going back on topic), that we did find the bedtime hour very good to have on in the evening, it's very calming, ds loved it and it was another way of marking parts of his routine for him  
Now we have a story before bed (as tv in the evening sometimes gets him wired  ). 
Oddly we did have ITNG on last night before his story (as it was a rare calm evening  ), my sil was over and little man was generously going from one of us to the other for cuddles, it's quite bizarre the conversations you find yourself having as adults when watching children's tv, it really is a different language! 

Anj x


----------



## keemjay

oh yes I'd forgotten FLANNELS!!! i got a heap fro  IKEA too..we still use them now even though the kids are 6 and 7! baby wipes are evil on skin(..including bottoms..we used washable wipes) when you consider that they get stains off carpets inc red wine and a have a multitude of other cleaning uses its incredible to think they are sold to use on skin..I would never EVER use one on a child face/near their eyes etc  


kj x


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## Anjelissa

Gosh kj, 6 & 7!  
When did that happen?!  
Mind you, the same way as 4 did for us I suppose  

That's another point for new Mums & Dads, it sounds really clichéd when people say oooh they grow up so fast!  
I didn't really realise how true it is until becoming a mum  
When our little boy was placed at 11 mths, the age of 4 years seemed a whole lifetime away for us, but here we are and it's just gone whooooosh!   

Anj x


----------



## katie c

<back to night garden> who knew there was a blue family next door to the pontlipines (or whatever they're called> 

they don't seem to get on. made my evening


----------



## Anjelissa

katie c said:


> <back to night garden> who knew there was a blue family next door to the pontlipines (or whatever they're called>
> 
> they don't seem to get on. made my evening


  They are the 'Wottingers' and you don't see them much, they are very much a 'keep themselves to themselves' kind of family  
Mind you, with 8 children I don't think I'd be up to much socialising either  

Anj x


----------



## Frangipanii

Thanks so much for all this advice. Well the time has come to print it off! We are leaving tomorrow for our hotel and then we meet our urchins on friday!!!! Terrified!!!!!!! Cant thank you enough!!!! You are all so lovely! Would love to respond to you all individually but I have so much to g
do! We have only just decided to go to the hotel a night early so we can relax!!! 
Never been so scared in my life!!!


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## skyblu

My god, you lot have cracked me up with you night garden stories    Know what you mean though.

Good luck Fran, will be thinking of you on Friday, your time has finally come. Enjoy it as it will go by in a flash. 

Skyblu.xx


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## SummerTilly

Good luck Fran deep breaths, and remember you are the right mummy and daddy for them - those nerves are really just excitement for your dream come true xx


----------



## SummerTilly

PS thanks to this thread I found cbeebies last night. 

Quite disturbing really.


----------



## Anjelissa

Lots and lots of luck Fran   
One more sleep!!!  
I look forward to hearing how it's all going  

Love Anj x


----------



## katie c

got another tip. and this is not anything to do with ITNG   

when i did master c's nursery, i bought a little plastic kids stool from ikea called a mammut. mainly because it was the same green as his units, it was cute, and it was only a fiver 

anyway it takes an adults weight (well, an adult that weighs the same as mr c or me   ) and its bloody awesome at bath time. kneeling and bending over the side of the bath kills your back, this is just the right height so you can sit and still reach the LO.

i've also perched on it and just watched master c sleeping through the bars of his cot   

and while i'm singing ikea's praises (i dont work there, honest   ) their hooded towels (called torva) are fantastic. most of them are square but these are rectangular and really wide, so you can wrap the LO up really well


----------



## Frangipanii

Thanks everyone!! 
Katie....I have those stools!!! Great advice!! X
well sat in bed in the hotel eating chocolate and chilling out!!! Nerves like hell...broke down in supermarket a while a go but feel ok now!! X x x


----------



## galaxy girl

How exciting fran!! Will be thinking of you tomorrow! If you can sleep now do it... That's my tip .... Sleep while you still can!


----------



## newmum

Thanks for the advice ladies

Today I have batched cooked vegatable soup and bolognese both in the slow cooker and cottage pie and chicken casserole in the oven

Thought I would get ready for LO arrival and when we won't have time to cook I will have meals prepared   well that's the idea!! Hope LO likes


----------



## Frangipanii

An amazing day!!!! Totally unbelievable and special and it was an amazing life changing moment! We met our children and fell in love. Got big cuddles and called mummy and daddy! They are adorable and it was a beautiful experience. They are cheeky, lovely, affectionate, cute and made me speechless!!  There will be bumps but the foundation laying is going wonderfully! Hubby says that he heard the best thing ever today when his dsughter said 'silly daddy'! 
What a day x x


----------



## Anjelissa

Awwww Fran, that's so lovely   
I know the first moment we met our little man is a moment we will never every forget, it's hard to put into words isn't it.
I'm so glad it's going well  

Love Anj x


----------



## Jules11

Fran,

Congratulations,  I bet you are both incredibly happy and relieved tonight.  During our first day of intros I remember feeling soooo relieved that I didn't "not like" our LO.  I'd imagined so many images of the super nanny type children who are edited to show effectively a total horror.  I was so happy our LO was just a lovely little girl who I couldn't wait to spend more time with.  Hearing mummy and daddy for the first time is sooo special.

I know you'll have a tiring and lovely time ahead,  look forward to hearing all about it.  Well done Mummy.

Jules xxx


----------



## skyblu

Congrats Fran, so pleased all is going well. Never forget hearing mummy and daddy for the first time, it is so priceless. Take plenty of picks as they change so quick.
Have a lovely week.

Skyblu.xxx


----------



## MummyElf

Ahhhh Fran that's lovely!! 'Silly Daddy' sounds like she's been watching Peppa Pig  

I'm so pleased for you, enjoy your intros, it's a magical time xx


----------



## Frangipanii

Thanks. I am completely loving it!!!!! It is amazing!! Jules...that is exactly how I felt completely!!! It was such a relief!!

Being honest I do recognise that she is going to have moments so we have to enjoy the good times as much as possible!!!! I am going to love them no matter what....warts and all. It is a good job they are cute!!!! Xx


----------



## JoJo7

Hi ladies, I stumbled across this thread a little by accident (I'm not adopting but going through ivf). However I found myself reading and following the thread and feel the need to share what an AMAZING bunch of ladies you are. Truly. 

Fran - I am thrilled that your first intros with your children are going well. I got a lump in my throat when you shared how it went.

Very best of luck and lots of love to you all on your journies. I hope you won't mind if I pop by every now and again.

Love and luck to you all

Jojo xx


----------



## katie c

ok, i have a couple more   

make yourself a sandwich the night before (or if your OH takes one to work, get them to make you one too) and pop it in the fridge. then when you're preparing lunch you only need to do the child's and you can then eat as the same time as them.

also chop up some fruit or make a snack (i like soreen with jam) and during the morning you can grab a bite as you go.

i am lucky in that my son is happy to burble in his cot for a bit when he wakes up, so as soon as i hear the first chirp, i'm up, showered, dressed, bit of slap then downstairs with the monitor. make bottle, get his cereal ready etc, then up to clean and dress him. 

then once he's ready its all ready to go.

i also take advantage when he's strapped in his chair with his bottle to run up and grab his changing mat, toy pig, used nappy and cleaning bowl which obviously i cant carry down at the same time as him.

might sound a bit obvious stuff but every little helps


----------



## Frangipanii

They are the missing pieces of my jigsaw puzzle! It is not easy but we are getting their my daughter is just like me with her outspoken and stroppy attitude but silly sense of humour and my son is like a cuddly tornado!!! I am falling in love. Yesterday was one of the best days of my life, the day before was one of the hardest.  Intros are definitely a funny environment.    X 
Thanks JoJo and Katie some good tips there. X


----------



## MummyElf

That's lovely Fran and I know just what you mean! Although there are /will be ups and downs, they are the missing piece. It's 12 weeks today since LO came home and she is sat earnestly eating her lunch with me (food is a solemn occasion  ), dairy lea smeared all round her face, happy as can be. It's all been worth it   xx


----------



## AoC

I have to add to this....  

First of all, Congratulations Fran!    

1)  Protect your back.  Small babies come light and get heavier slowly, as your muscles accommodate that change.  Older babies and toddlers come heavy straight away.  I hurt my back in intros, and it didn't heal until I went back to work, because I re-tore it every time I changed a nappy/bent over to chase a face round the room and wash it!    Spot the movements that are risky - for me it was bending and then reaching out to a distance - and minimise them as much as you can.  And then take ibuprofen....

2)  Plan your meals.  Pre-child, I always hated writing up what we were going to eat ahead of time, prefering to wing it and think about what I 'fancied'.  With me gluten free, DH with his own preferencs, and a fussy eating toddler, that just isn't possible.  A weekly menu, written out on a Sunday, keeps me sane.  And 2b)  Batch cook and freeze when DH is having his quality time with little 'un.

3)  Use.  Free.  Childcare.  I know, I know, you've waited and hurt and worked years and years to have YOUR child in YOUR arms, there's no way you're going to hand them over to someone else!  I said that, too.  With hindsight, if our gorgeous boy had been going to a nursery once a week from quite early on, we would all have done better.  One of the most liberating things for HIM has been learning that he can let us out of his sight AND WE WILL ALWAYS COME BACK FOR HIM.  He's blossomed in the social context, too.  And the day after his first full day at a childminder, he woke up, looked me in the eye and said, "big boys don't hit Mummy.  I not hit Mummy anymore."  How I didn't sob all over him, I will never know!    So proud.  (And some childminders can deliver the Early Years programme, so are eligible for 2 year old and 3 year old free childcare funding.)

4)  Find out what gets you through the day, and make it happen.  For me, it was the simple idea of making iced coffee and iced tea and putting a jug in the fridge.  Thus instant caffeine, on those days when I just wasn't going to get to make a cup of tea or coffee and drink it.  Chocolate's good, too.  

5)  If it's not working, change it.  We get hung up on routines (which are good things!) and patterns sometimes.  I got stuck in loggerheads with a two year old who was not interested in tooth brushing and face washing, and the bathroom became a battleground.  We bought another toothbrush and toothpaste, and moved the morning routine into the living room with the help of Saint CeeBeebies.  Instantly, we got good mornings back.  

6)  Get outside, whatever the weather.  Invest in some good outdoor gear and go outside and splash in puddles, collect leaves, throw sticks, hunt for elves in the hedgerows and parks.  The impact of fresh air and exercise on everyone's mood is astonishing.

7)  You don't have to do it all at once.  I fell into the trap of looking at my adoption leave as the time I had to do everything with him.  Actually, we've got the rest of my life.  

  Abandon Pride All Ye Who Enter Here.  Oh yeah, I wasn't going to use childcare.  I wasn't going to feed him Disney things out of tins.  He wasn't going to have lots of telly.  I certainly wasn't going to let him eat junk food....  Who did I think I was?  *eyeroll*  Don't set out to be this sketchy idea of SuperMum.  SuperMum is belly laughs and mess and soul-healing cuddles.  Anything more is a bonus.    Give yourself a break and don't feel guilty if the only way he naps is on the sofa in front of Toy Story.  

9)  Remember you are Remarkable.  You set out to start/complete your family by giving hope, love and a future to a child who was hurt.  You are amazing!  You're wonderful!  No amount of Bad Mummy Days (and they do happen) will change that.  You are a cut above, and don't you EVER forget it.  

10) In spite of all the above, you will feel horribly, gut-wrenchingly guilty if you wake up one morning for another day of mumming a grieving, angry, hurt child on little or no sleep and a support network that appears to have emigrated over night and suddenly realise you are not looking forward to the day, and you're not enjoying yourself.  It's okay.  I am holding your hand right now, sitting beside you on the sofa telling you this:  "it's okay.  It's natural to feel like this.  Nobody said you had to love every second of every day.  There are hard times and there are wonderful times, and before long the wonderful will wildly outnumber the hard times and you'll forget what the hard times felt like.  Yes, you're not enjoying this right now.  You're only human.  But you can do this, you can and you will.  And soon you will have more joy in your life that you know how to handle.  Oh, and call your friend and say you need a hand.  And call your DH and tell him hes' cooking/bringing home tea."

(I agree with whoever said reclaiming your house/space!  We haven't cracked that one yet, but I REALLY need to have some tidy space again!)

(And google Parenting With Crappy Pictures.  It's all true.    )


----------



## GERTIE179

Aww AoC never a true word has been spoke  x


----------



## -x-Lolly-x-

AoC  what a truly lovely post, I welled up at the last bit   and I can really relate to you with the perfect supermum image and the guilt that comes when you 'break the rules'


----------



## Anjelissa

Another fan here!   
AoC.....what a brilliant post! Please can I come to your house for some of that ice-tea/coffee?  

I urge any 'soon to be forever mummies and daddies' to please read her post, it's all so true and very uplifting and inspiring  

Anj x


----------



## MummyElf

AoC you've nailed it - what a perfect and perfectly true post!

I often have a hot water bottle in the evenings now as lifting LO is starting to really hurt. She isn't walking yet and don't I know it, although around the house I often ask her to use her walker because she's so close to walking...I think she can but won't


----------



## AoC

*blushing*  Awww, guys.    I think I just needed to say some of that!  LOL!

Thanks so much, I'm glad it struck a chord.


----------



## Duckling

Oh AoC just had to come on to say brilliant brilliant brilliant ! So so true and I'm sure a huge comfort/reassurance to many!
Xxx


----------



## MummyPea

AoC, you've made me well up too! We're meeting our potential LO's FF and SW on Wednesday and they want introductions to start in 5 weeks as he's only 10 months old. Feeling a little emotional at the moment and stressed but your post was the life I needed. xx


----------



## Mummy DIY Diva

Love it AoC where have you been x x


----------



## crazyspaniel

Ah AoC,
Loving all your points but especially number 10 it really struck a chord with me right now....
May have blubbed a little but feeling some much needed positivity now!

 cs x


----------



## katie c

oh A, another one who needed to read 9 and 10. i've had a bloody awful day and felt like the most impatient, horrible mother in the world, to a little boy who seemed to have grown horns since yesterday and has absolutely done my head in. and how bad have i felt about it all night?

thanks for that.   its not his fault, its not mine. it was just a bad day. 

(and remember me, from that other thread, all those years ago?   )


----------



## MummyAuntieKatie

AoC I agree with everything you just said!  My back is killing me, as is my knee, I certainly need tidy space in the house to feel human, as well as being able to poop and shower alone and I am no supermum despite my grand ideas!  We are looking at child care 2 mornings a week for the reason you have stated, I need some time to myself and BB needs to mix with others knowing that I will always come back.  His SW has frowned on this but another one suggested it might be just what we need.  When he goes for the first time he will have been here 5 months.  I think it will do us the world of good!  

Bug hugs to everyone.  I said to someone the other day that anyone who portrays themselves and the perfect parent is just papering over the cracks because no one is perfect and everyone has bad days xxx


----------



## AoC

Any time, Anjelissa!  

You're so right, MAK!  Our boy's SWer clearly approved of us not using any childcare, but our own was hinting it would be a good idea.  I honestly wish we'd gone down that route much earlier.

I've just been being a mum, DIY Diva!   In the early months, he was fairly intolerant of my using a phone or computer in his presence (because he wanted to do everything himself!) and I honestly just didn't have any time or energy once he was asleep.  I've just started back at work, and I'm finding it easier to find 'me' time in that new routine.

Yes I do, Katie!    It's lovely that so many of us have found our family, one way or another.


----------



## MummyElf

MummyAuntieKatie said:


> AoC I agree with everything you just said! My back is killing me, as is my knee, I certainly need tidy space in the house to feel human, as well as being able to poop and shower alone and I am no supermum despite my grand ideas! We are looking at child care 2 mornings a week for the reason you have stated, I need some time to myself and BB needs to mix with others knowing that I will always come back. His SW has frowned on this but another one suggested it might be just what we need. When he goes for the first time he will have been here 5 months. I think it will do us the world of good!
> 
> Bug hugs to everyone. I said to someone the other day that anyone who portrays themselves and the perfect parent is just papering over the cracks because no one is perfect and everyone has bad days xxx


I think this is a great idea AoC! My mum is going to take LO out each week for a couple of hours .... Yes please! A recharge is so important and I feel so much more tolerant after a break. Yes we love them, but it isn't always easier - they are little people after all with personalities


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## SummerTilly

AoC - thanks for your post - brilliant x

As for the childcare debate... let me say this.  Yes, children need security.  Yes, they need time and attention with their parent(s).  Yes, they need to know that mummy and daddy are there for them. 

But.

Money doesn't grow on trees.  Parents are people too.  With personalities, friendships and relationships outside of being a parent.  In order to be a good parent and to provide the love, and security that children need, parents need to rely on loving, wonderful and supportive child carers and babysitters either occasionally (for an evening, morning or afternoon out) or on a regular basis - so that they can go out to work, be productive, have an intellectual life and earn money. 

At the end of the day, our children have in all likelihood come from backgrounds where there was little if any care or concern for their safety and well-being, little if any money, little if any role models of what good positive relationships, friendships and work ethics look like - in fact, little of anything. 

So whilst SS has an ideal of what a parent should be like (somewhere between Mary Poppins, Maria from the Sound of Music or in fact any role that Julie Andrews has played - except for Victor Victoria, which was a real career low) the reality is that each and every one of us is giving our children an amazing forever family that is based in reality and not a fiction of what life in the 21st century is like. 

If having 'time out' for a few hours a week enables you to be a better parent, then go for it.  At the end of the day, however brilliant our SWs are - and some of them truly are amazing, mine included, they aren't there 24/7 providing advice, making judgements or deciding what to do about a child with a temperature and/or strange rash at 2am.  That's our job.  Because whilst they have facilitated the amazing process that has made us parents, they aren't us.  They aren't the people who respond to our child(ren)'s needs, who answer to the call 'mummy' or 'daddy' in the middle of the night. 

So, like AoC says, we don't have to be perfect - we don't have to be 'super' parents.  We just have to be the people who, for our little ones at least, are the axis upon which their world spins. 

Whether it's in a tiara and ball gown glammed up to the nines or in a pair of dirty dungarees making mud pies - we are the centre of their universe.  And that's enough 'perfection' for me.


----------



## MummyAuntieKatie

SummerTilly said:


> So whilst SS has an ideal of what a parent should be like (somewhere between Mary Poppins, Maria from the Sound of Music or in fact any role that Julie Andrews has played - except for Victor Victoria, which was a real career low) the reality is that each and every one of us is giving our children an amazing forever family that is based in reality and not a fiction of what life in the 21st century is like.


I think I love you!!!


----------



## keemjay

AofC
  BEST.POST.EVER


----------



## Arrows

love it!
Time out is definitely needed!!! LO home for nearly a year now and I rarely get to use the bathroom alone!
I'm very sociable and for me one of the thing I did very quickly was go out and meet with friends for a coffee with LO in the pushchair (bearing in mind he was under a year). Friends had stick instructions for the first month not to touch him at all and for the first week or two to ignore him and only focus on me. We only met in public places so the only 'home' environment he knew was ours. For me this was essential! Just having the love and hugs from my friends and the fact they did as I asked re. LO made a huge difference and was an incredible support.

Really helpful way of involving local people was getting them to cook meals for you to freeze so you don't need to stress about cooking.

Admit that you will make mistakes and be willing to change your mind on some things -pick your battles! I never wanted to be big on TV but that 30mins on an evening when they're tired, hungry and horrible and you need to cook and do laundry, tidy up, make lunched for the next day etc TV is a brilliant distraction. It's okay to have a messy house. Honest. If mess stresses you out -have one room or corner that you keep tidy and that you can retreat to but forget about the rest.


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## Frangipanii

Hi peeps. Well I recognise I am slightly butting in the middle of a topic but need some tips. Kids came from a single female foster mum. They were both harmed by a man emotionally and physically. And now they are both obsessed with my husband and my son constantly wants to hurt me. I may as well not live here sometimes. Any tips on how to change this, how to deal with my emotions and how to live in my own house. Admittedly I am not as fun as my husband at all. Not sure what to do. Help!


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## AoC

Well said, Summer!

Fangi, I've PM'd you, but one other thing I'd like to say is that I know it feels like he wants to hurt you, but that's not what is happening. I felt the same way, felt he was rejecting me, wanted to make me suffer, deliberately wanting to hurt me, but my SWer said that wasn't what was happening and with hindsight she was right.

What's happening is all subconscious to him. He had big, bad feelings inside he doesn't know or have the brain development yet to deal with. He's grieving his FC placement and at the same time loving the new mummy and daddy and home and attention. So he's feeling intense sadness and intense happiness at the same time. This fizzes away in his gut and builds up a head of steam he doesn't know how to express. Grown ups know to cry, or drink (!) or go for a run. He can't do these things, or recognise that that's what he needs. His growing brain and body tell him to do aggressive, violent things instead, to express all that big emotion. But his head also tells him that's bad and wrong and he shouldn't do it, which acts against the impulse, making everything bigger and worse. The female figure has been the safe person in his life. He's probably already quite closely attached to you.... sooooo.... you are the 'safe' person in his life to hit.

Subconsciously he knows you will help him feel better. The way he achieves this at the moment is all twisted up and wrong, but it will get better, I promise.

He's not trying to hurt you, he's trying to feel better and knows you're his mummy and can help.

I'm only making this point, because I went down a bit of a spiral of bad feelings by letting myself personalise it (although how do you not personalise a strong and highly accurate fist in the eye?!?!?) and it would be great if you could avoid that spiral. At one point I remember very clearly thinking that I was the wrong mummy for this boy, that I was a terrible mummy, and I was 'breaking' this perfect child the FC had loved and looked after.

I was wrong on all counts.

And distract, distract, distract! Although it's important he knows it's wrong, when we kept confronting it it just escalated, until the day he sobbed that he was a bad, naughty boy and I swore to myself I would NEVER let him think or feel that. And that I'd get better and ducking and saying, "hey! Let's play hide and seek!" or "race you to the bathroom!" or "I think I just heard [favourite toy] calling you!" or "What's THAT?! [pointing at toy cow] Is it a dragon?!"

Hang on in there, Frangi. (((((((hugs)))))))

How old is your boy?

(We also had the obsessed with hubby, and single FC thing. Then hubby had a day alone with them and was at his wit's end, because all he'd say was, "I miss mummy!" And this was WHILE my Bug was giving me such a hard time!)


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## AoC

(and I know two is different, not trying to say I know it all or anything!  I should probably butt out and shut the heck up now! )


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## GERTIE179

Aww Fran I'll PM some practical things that got us through but AoC is sooo right. Your little boy feels safe enough with you to show you his feelings and hurting/pushing you away is just now he's wired just now with bug feelings etc. over time you'll show him how to handle those. It took us a while and LO dudnt have as bad an experience with birth family as your lil dude but grief and hurt comes out in different ways. We were told to expect a bad time even though he had good care & attachment experiences. Ours was a good 4 months of daily bashings (yes from a tiddly 17month old) and meltdowns. But it gradually got better as he became more settled, trust was built and now it's been a while since he lashed out and even then it was hardly anything (actually it was normal toddler level). 

If might be your little guy was around violence/aggression pre & post birth us possible genetics or it could just be his default way of showing you he's scared, grieving his loss, hurt, terrified, plus is scared he's now going to lose you.

Your feelings are very very normal. Can you divide and conquer to get 121 time for both of you with each child? Behaviours are always easier without another toddler to kick off/join in with. It helps them build trust that you both can care for LO well. Kids are great at dividing too so make sure you and DH spend even 10mins after they're in bed talking about something neutral (feelings of jealousy & blame are notorious at thus time so I found stocking to a news story or about other family news etc helped us stay strong).

I'll PM you the other stuff after LO is sleeping x x


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## crazyspaniel

Fran,
You've had brilliant advice so far, which I have also been reading eagerly!
We have the same problems here so just wanted to say you are not alone with this  
it's taken some time but I do now acknowledge that the physical and emotional hurt is not intentional, although it doesn't stop my physical and emotional pain..... 
Try and make sure DH pushes them back towards you sometimes with comments like 'mummy will help you with that, she is very good at it' etc
Hope things improve soon  

cs xx


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## AoC

You know, I'm so glad I've come back on FF.  I used to think it was just me with the hitting, that I was somehow making him do it  (I know that's not true now."  I used to think I was somehow a failure, that all the other adopters were living their happy ever afters without getting a fat lip on a daily basis.

Though I'm sorry so many of us have been through this, I'm so, so glad it's so much more usual than I thought.



Thanks guys.

Aren't we awesome?


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## crazyspaniel

DITTO...!
As my Sw keeps telling me we were chosen, we CAN DO IT!!


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## Frangipanii

Thanks. Ladies. Cant tell you much as I have to sleep but I am so pleased to read your advice. I am certain that the tears streaming down my face from reading it all is a sign that I am not alone and I don't have to feel so useless. 
I had a girlie day with daughter...mostly went well. She has a quirky sense of humour which is so dry and hurtful that I some times get angry! I try not to but its hard. 
As for hubby. It was his idea for us to bond and him to bond with darling boy. We both had amazing days until we came back together and our son was horrendous. Separation anxiety me thinks and anger that I and his sister went away. My husband saw the real him which helped. I keep thinking what have I done. 
I find myself getting angry so easily and obviously I would never lash out but I certainly dont feel anything positive towards them. Little boy has just learnt mummy and I feel nothing...it is so sad. I have all your supoort so know I am going to get through this. But I never thought it would be this unrewarding and impossible. 
Sorry everyone. I am going to show my husband your advice so we can work through it together. And I believe advice from experienced people is better than social workers. 
Much love x x x


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## Mummy DIY Diva

Sending hugs fran wish I had words of wisdom but I don't.  However I do have total faith in you.  I know you'll get through x x


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## Wyxie

Big hugs Frangi, don't feel bad about how you're feeling.

Taking things out on Mummy is extremely common in adopted children.  I think it's really important to understand how much children grieve for the loss of a relationship that was bad for them.  Mummy is normally the one who's perceived to have let them down more previously because most adopted children will have had a closer attachment to their birth Mother than Father due to the chaotic sort of lifestyle these families have.  Again, statistically, they're considerably more likely to have had a female main carer in foster care.  They don't understand the reasons for removal from birth Mum and foster carer, and this raises all sorts of different insecurities, resentments and questions in different children.  Some kids have the desire to punish Mummy, because it's Mummy that always abandons them, for some it's simply that this Mummy needs to be tested to see at what point they will be sent away, in their own heads they know they are bad and that's the reason they keep being abandoned, so they act bad, and push Mummy away, because that's how they see themselves and they view the future abandonment by this Mummy as inevitable.  There are also the simply overwhelming emotions that they can't process, and as babies and toddlers simply have no way to deal with at all, they can't self-regulate, or rationalise, and rely on adults to help them regulate, but that's very hard with new adults and so things just tend to cycle out of control. 

I would not have believed how incredibly hard it is to not take it personally, but it's really hard, when the daily reality is a very traumatised child who just seems to be doing everything in their power to fight, defy, and hurt.  It feels malicious, it feels personal, it feels like they hate you and are trying to make you unhappy.  Intellectually, it's very easy to accept that it's just a very hurt, scared and unhappy child, but in the moment, I find it next to impossible sometimes.

With regard to children who push away Mummy, it's absolutely vital that when they're going to other adults for the things that they should be getting from Mummy, love, cuddles, nurture, etc, they need to be referred back to Mummy, and told that Mummy will always look after and care for them, Mummy has lots of love and cuddles for them, Mummy will always be there for them.

Re using nursery etc, I don't think there is a blanket "yes, it's a good thing" or "no, it's not".  I'm sure it's a big benefit for some kids, but not all adopted children will benefit from separation early into placement.  My daughter had been bounced around from pillar to post for 19 months of her life and dumped with so many different people that she was a complete mess.  On the very rare occasions she's been left with family the after effects have been awful and extreme.  She needed time at home above all else.  We needed to work through the severe attachment issues and she needed to see that this Mummy wasn't going to keep dumping her with someone new whenever it suited.  A childminder would almost certainly have confused the fragile relationship we have built.  It has been gruelling, and god knows I need a break, but her needs have to come first.  We're 16 months in with Wyxling, and I sent her to nursery for the first time on Monday, and I think, perhaps, it's not too soon, but I can't say for certain.  Her anxiety about me not coming back, or someone else coming to take her away, and just simply Mummy not being there, was massive.  I feel like it's probably the right time now, and that she does need to learn to function without me, and also that she's ready to start to learn that separation is OK because I will always come back, but only just.  Our son has been with us for 3 months and I certainly wouldn't leave him with anyone yet.  I go running or swimming three times a week when my husband is here, same days, always come back after half an hour or so, maybe nearer an hour for a swim, and he is absolutely inconsolable the whole time I'm out the house.  When I say it's time for Mummy to go running he screams, throws his milk cup on the floor closely followed by himself, and he's still sobbing when I get back.  I keep thinking the routine of it will get through soon, but it hasn't yet.  I think this will even itself out quicker than my daughter's insecurities, and that if I am honest he would probably be feeling a lot more secure if he wasn't having to deal with the issue of sharing Mummy with another young child, something he's finding extremely hard, but as things are he's not ready to be left.  Fortunately, on his own, he's actually a very easy baby to be with at least half of the time.  The other half he's a little monkey, but again, much more easily managed without my daughter here, so just having my daughter at nursery feels like a massive break.  She is, to put it mildly, hard work!  I guess what I'm trying to say is that in an ideal work a short break from this complete stranger who is suddenly the centre of your life is a really good idea, but with some kids I think you have to accept it's not a good idea and tough it out for a while.

Best wishes,

Wyxie xx


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## MummyAuntieKatie

Fran, I get angry too, it's just a really hard process.  However, I am finding that I get less angry as the days go by and BB bonds more and shows his personality.  I can't explain why I get angry though, sometimes I think it's lack of sleep, maybe confusion about my feelings, similar issues the children are going through I guess?  We just have to be the grown up and deal with it in a better way than lashing out or shouting but that's sometimes easier said than done!     Sending you lots of stay calm thoughts.

BB also had a stronger bond with DH at first, only DH could calm him at night when he had a bad turn and it was so difficult, however, 3 months down the road and things are so much better.  

Have you tried Rescue Remedy or Kalms tablets?  I sometimes take both!  Kalms do a night version too, to help restful sleep.  Worth having a go. xx


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## Poppets Mammy

Fran   you've got us all behind you (not in a creepy standing over your bed way 😜) I think we've all been there, felt what your feeling. The early weeks are so hard, it's a lot of adapting for everyone. The violence is hard to deal with and some days you have the patience to deal with it appropriately and some days you just don't and feel angry and upset. I think you've been given some wise words already, not much to add. Give yourself a break, I know how I felt with Poppet and you've got double trouble - my heads spinning just thinking of it. They are prob trying to please DH and not directing their feelings towards him as they are prob scared of the consequences if they do. Not saying DH isn't loving and fun and interesting but they are prob showing him so much attention out of fear. Meanwhile you are safe Mammy and your getting it from all angles, you have to be their rock and while trying to understand their feelings and reasons behind their actions you also have to teach them in the calmest manor possible that it's unacceptable behaviour. Try not to over parent either, I'm guilty of this and still have bad days where I've been on Poppets case all day and her behaviour has shown frustration and we've just been at locker heads all day. Yes introduce routine and boundaries but also ask yourself 'does that really matter' at times to help gain some child perspective on minor behaviours/activities. Power battles are also a nightmare, avoid them at all costs, set fun goals that will get them motivated to do what you actually want of them and if it's something that doesn't matter just cave before getting sucked into the battle in the first place. All of these little things will help improve the general mood in the house. The deeper emotional issues simply need time, plenty of love and affection and stability will help start to heal over the cracks. You don't feel it yet then fake it as much as poss, it eventually becomes genuine - and if one afternoon you've just had enough and feel unable to fake it then don't beat yourself up over it. 
I think we all know and empathise with what your going through, please don't feel bad about it, it's a very very hard journey but it really does get easier and easier week by week and the joy you'll feel when everything settles down and your feelings grow for your children makes it all the worth while. 

AoC I love your posts, they made me giggle. I love a bit straight talking me. Glad you've returned xx


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## AoC

Thanks Poppets Mummy.  I'm glad I have, too. I only wish I'd come back earlier, then maybe I wouldn't have felt such an oppressive weight of shame about how things were going back then.

Just to share some positives to keep the hope flag flying.... I used to get hit on a daily basis, sometimes it felt like I had bruises on bruises, although few of them were visible. Now I get spontaneous kisses and cuddles, spontaneous "I love you, Mummy," and "I miss you, Mummy." I get Bug going to bed wriggling with happiness, saying, "tomorrow is Daddy Day, then Nursery Day, then Mummy and Daddy days then DOUBLE [CHILDMINDER] days!" I get bug's friend meeting him at playgroup and inviting him round for tea and Bug going, "yes, 'at ood be nice. But Ize very busy."

When I'm frustrated and annoyed with myself, I get, "You sad, Mummy?" and "No, stop. Listen, now, Mummy," wagging a finger in an admonitory way, "iss not difficult, don' cry," basically saying I should stop being so hard on myself.  I get walks down into the village holding my hand nicely all the way, saying, "I hold your hand, so, so properly!" when before he would have been carried back in a fireman's lift, kicking his wellies off and trying to scratch my face while screaming. I get phone calls, via Daddy, saying, "when oo coming home, Mummy? Oh. Okay. Ize see oo later."

I get strokes of my hair instead of pulling it. I get pats and smiles and loving looks instead of punches, tickles instead of scratches. Instead of throwing things on the floor, I get someone who picks up things I've dropped and goes, "there oo are, Mummy." (Okay, and sometimes a big theatrical long-suffering sigh and a "Mummy! ooo DROPPED it!"

I get a boy who loves me to the moon and back, and knows that I am him mummy and will always be there for him.

And who thinks that's pretty damn fine.

So hang on in there. This, too, shall pass.


----------



## AoC

(Also, in case you hadn't noticed, I'm completely besotted)


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## Poppets Mammy

AoC - thank you for that post. I'm not currently going through a hard time and things are ticking over smoothly and happily at present. But your post helped me see how far we've come ourselves. I could of wrote your post if I was reflecting on the last 7months. I too go hit and bit but now get spontaneous cuddles and kisses and 'I love you Mammy'. Poppet doesn't fight over holding a hand anymore and walks nicely. She has picked up so many of my manourisms and humour and will copy what I've said and I can so picture her saying 'Ohhhh Maaaaaammy, so clumsy! You dropped it' while having a shocked and disapproving look on her face   she is on the whole very compliant and loving and her sense of humour and imagination is just extraordinary. I too am smitten 😍 I'm sure your last post will bring lots of how to those in need of it and it's really made me look at how great things now are for us. Thanks   Xx


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## Arrows

So last night my darling boy started screaming for absolutely no reason at 4.14 am. I tried telling him 'No, it's na-nights time. Go to sleep!', I shouted, I shoved him back into bed and tucked him in extra tight and the hysterics grew worse. I lost my rag completely and shouted at him to 'shut the f*** up.' Heaven know I wish I hadn't but after him mucking about and staying awake in the end until 6am I couldn't bear it. Anyhow, after 20mins initial hysterics (and the neighbours clearly getting hacked off as I could hear them complaining through the walls as they're not that think) I, through severely gritted teeth said to him 'do you want a cuddle?' He instantly shut up, arms outstretched 'cuddle mummay'. ARGH!!!!
So of course I pick him and sit with him and give him a cuddle, and of course within a minute of holding him close I kiss him, tell him I love him (and mean it) and relax. He then carried on chatting, singing, mucking about and grizzling until 6am but anyhow.
As exhausting and frustrating as my son is, as little sleep as I get, and as much as some days I would give up half of the chocolate in my house for just an hour of uninterrupted soaking in a bath or to be able to go to the loo without a child on my lap or having to clean up poo-explosions -I can't imagine and would not wish to have my life without him. Being a mum seriously changes your whole outlook on like.


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## Frangipanii

Thank the world for normal mums! Hey Arrows!!! Xxx


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## Flash123

Arrows... I have just raised a very large toast to you. Wine before 5....it's been one of the days.


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## Frangipanii

The biggest struggle with this is what to do with an angry toddler and as I have had so much advice I thought it may be worth people putting it on a thread. 
My day has been horrid. Hubby in bed ill and son had been a horror of horrors!!!
Wish wine was an option! But if I start I want more than a bottle!!! Xxxx


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## Flash123

Sending you a big hug fran ((((((())))))) wish it was a real one and wish I has answers to your challenges. All I can say is you are doing a wonderful job and well bloody done you for hanging in there. Xxxxx


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## MummyAuntieKatie

Arrows, hubby and I both acted badly the other day. BB was demanding attention through crying a lot, always wanting Daddy and not Mummy and we both had enough and shouted.  In the end all 3 of us cuddled on the sofa and we said we were sorry we had been grumpy but that slapping and crying to get your own was was not ok etc...  Everyone has a bad day, I just tell myself that I will do better tomorrow. 

Fran, hugs!!  BB's behaviour wasn't as extreme as your LO's but we have had tantrums, crying, hitting etc, even a bite once and we have seen a huge improvement but it's certainly a challenge and we don't always act in a way we feel is helpful.    However, as BB has settled and become more comfortable these behaviours have decreased massively. xxx


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## Anjelissa

OOOOH....so annoyed!  
I just wrote out a huge post and lost it just as I was about to post it!  

I'm too tired to write it out again so just want to send big hugs, and HUGE glasses of wine to all who need it  
None of you are alone in how you feel, I'm sure so many people have read the last few posts with empathy, I know I did  

There will always be difficult phases, but the early days of placement are particularly hard and in that respect it does get easier as you all settle and grow together as a family.

We completely and unconditionally love our little man to the moon and back (not copying you AoC, just an old Savage Garden fan   ), and because of that, in some regards any challenging phases are easier to get through. Of course you can love your lo instantly (as we did) but it's the feelings and relationship that grows over time that make any future challenging times slightly easier than early days of placement (when it's such a huge adjustment for all of you).

Love to all  
Anj x


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## SummerTilly

Anj - I was cleaning the house to Savage Garden on full boar today  

Haven't played it in ages and now to hear it mentioned twice in one day - brilliant!


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## Anjelissa

SummerTilly said:


> Anj - I was cleaning the house to Savage Garden on full boar today
> 
> Haven't played it in ages and now to hear it mentioned twice in one day - brilliant!


lol  
I used to be a a bit of a 'superfan/nutter' back in the day, even usually had VIP passes (through fanclub) at Darren Hayes gigs/tv performances etc, and normally managed to wangle myself (along with other equally nutty-fans) down to the front row....another life-time ago now! quite a crazy time!  A lot of fun though!  
I'll have to dig out my many cds, I haven't listened for ages 

Great housework music! 

Anj x


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## peacelily

No tips that haven't already been mentioned...but LOVE LOVE LOVE Savage Garden and Darren Hayes


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## Flash123

"I knew I loved you before I met you" darren hayes. My song for me and my little man. Simply beautiful xx


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## Anjelissa

Flash123 said:


> "I knew I loved you before I met you" darren hayes. My song for me and my little man. Simply beautiful xx


Awwwww, Yeh, that song means a lot to me too Flash 

Gosh, you've got me reminiscing now about my stalking activities  (or rather 'supportive' activities) that we all got up to, many many moons ago  !
Myself and a few other crazy-nut-fans were even given tickets to Des and Mel when Darren appeared there!
It was so funny as the audience was full of blue-rinse (very nice) fans of Des O'Connor and then there was us, about 20 of us all sat at the front with our Darren Hayes tour t-shirts on  .
A lady of about 90 tapped my friend on the shoulder and said 'awwwww, he's quite good that Darren-chap isn't he'  
See....I told you you'd got me started!! lol 

I'll shut up now or people will be referring to the thread for advice and find us all babbling about Savage Garden and Mr.Hayes!.......Slightly confusing 

Anj x


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## SummerTilly

I knew I loved you before I met you.... so beautiful and so apt for our journeys. 

Wells me up  

Aaaah...


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## Anjelissa

SummerTilly said:


> I knew I loved you before I met you.... so beautiful and so apt for our journeys.
> 
> Wells me up
> 
> Aaaah...


Yep, totally  
Plus Michael Buble's 'Haven't met you yet' is another song that means a lot for quite a few of us on here (and was in the charts prior to us meeting our little man so I'll always now make that connection).
It's strange how song lyrics can mean so many different things to different people isn't it 

Anj x


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## Arrows

try looking up 'Happy Adoption Day' -a very cheesy but great song and also comes as a book with the music written in the back.
Book:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Happy-Adoption-Day-John-McCutcheon/dp/0316603236/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381863554&sr=8-1&keywords=happy+adoption+day
Song:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Happy-Adoption-Day/dp/B00CVDZOK0/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1381863554&sr=8-2&keywords=happy+adoption+day


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## Frangipanii

Hi All. 
Well thanks for support again. I have to report quickly cos the monster are up that I have had two good days. Also got a new car which  adds so much freedom having two. Also decided that there is noooooooooo way I can not work til boy urchin goes to school so I will update my practise in January and look for a job in may. 
I have tried many of your suggestions and with some successes so many thanks for that. 
I have got some extra support from our agency and we are going to start theraplay and name changes soon. Lots to handle and work out. However if I have two good days in a week I may start feeling more human. 
Your support is amazing and often hubby and I read your post in bed together so that we can remind ourselves of techniques and the fact that we are human. 
Got to learn to pat myself on the back too(according to my social worker). So for a change heres some good points. 
1 they both sleep through the night
2. We get called mummy and daddy respectively
3. The little girl urchin tells us she loves us
4. We have routine and structure in place
5. We have no food issues....of which there were many in foster placement
6. She has no major behavioural issues but she did in foster placement 
7. He is learning to play (treated as a new born in placement)
8. His speech is coming on everyday
9. They are both getting fitter and loosing fat
10. Both their skins problems are improving
so there you ten things that are going well. 
Oh and we love them...there has never been any doubt of that. 
So with thanks and with those positives I finish on a good note. I am grateful for supoort and no doubt will need it again as this is the hardest thing ever and you have so much wisdom to offer. 
Love f x x x x x


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## Anjelissa

Frangi,

That's amazing, you're doing such a wonderful job and going by your last post it sounds like your lo's are coming on leaps and bounds!  
I can't even begin to imagine how much harder it is having 2 at once and although hopefully advice from those of us who are a bit further down the road will all help, even those of us with just one lo (so far  ) can see and appreciate the potential extra difficulties (and of course joys) that 2 would bring   

Your sw is right, you deserve a HUGE pat on the back, just read through all the points in your post once again, they alone confirm that, and I'm sure they are just the tip of the iceberg with regards to how well your lo's are doing    

Love Anj x


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## Jules11

Fran,

Congratulations on your amazing progress so far.  

DH and I have started to challenge each other to focus on the positive events of the day.  Sometimes it is as small as LO gave me a high 5, she said thank you when you gave her a banana.  I has helped us focus of the positive (not always as successfully as we'd like)  rather than the tantrums and mayhem that often take over our days.  We are awarded a choc biscuit if we name the most positives.

Good luck and keep your chin up 

Jules xx


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## AoC

Loved your post, Frangi!  I want to dance around and shout and punch the air for you - those ten things sound GREAT and some of them are HUGE, HUUUUGE achievements!  You completely rock.


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## Wyxie

It sounds like you're doing really well to be honest. I don't want to tell you how long it took us to get some of those things. Wyxling refused to call me Mummy for months, wouldn't even acknowledge her own name, it was a huge, huge battle.

It occurred to me today that one thing no-one has said, is that there isn't a quick fix.

We were fortunate enough to meet with a children's psychiatrist about six months into Wyxling's placement who gave us a whole lot of useful advice about our very troubled little girl. The thing that really helped me most at that time, I think, was her telling me that I wasn't going to find a "right" way of dealing with Wyxling's behaviour that fixed it. She told us that behaviour issues that are routed in serious attachment problems take a _long_ time to fix, and that we needed to stop making the behaviour issues the focus of our relationship with her. It was very hard not to with Wyxling at that point as she would some days spend hours trying to hurt me/fighting with me/defying; it was all a complete mess really. We learned how to just get out the house and try and have fun anyway. She said that it took a very long time for behaviour like this to stop, and as time went by and she started to attach to us, the episodes of bad behaviour and huge distress would get less frequent. At first it might just be that we could have a good half hour, or hour, or maybe a few hours, without any major incidents, then it might be days or weeks or even months, but that it would still come back again for a long time, it would just get less frequent and less overwhelming. It doesn't mean that we're doing something wrong, necessarily, when we have one of these throw backs, there can be lots of things that cause insecurities to surface and big wobbles, with Wyxling, there really are lots, and any routine break can do it.

All the best,

Wyxie xx


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## Frangipanii

Thanks everyone. Dont get on here much now but have updated on the main thread. We are doing great i think. And i love all your messages of support. And i love making.positives as it gets me through the day. 
Not sure that would have made sense 5 weeks wyxie a go but it sure does now and is really helpful. In fact perfect timing. My son is terrible at times and instead of getting it ' right' we are just trying to not go to bed with mental agony and it seems we are doing the best. 
Thanks ladies. 
Another child crying now so best go x x x


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## Frangipanii

Oh wow...this brings back memories. 
I can now add my own
1. Accept the idea of having a messy house
2. Get used repeating yourself
3. Remember to get ready at least forty minutes early than you planned to go out!.
4.see the behaviour not the child...is unrealistic
5. Nobodies perfect but time does help
6. You never get used to a pooy nappy
7. Loving a child who calls you mummy is just awesome! 
And more but wow how times have changed.  We dont have it perfect but it is close.


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## -x-Lolly-x-

Good points Fran  

I'll agree and also add...

Don't beat yourself up if not every meal is home cooked, healthy and wholesome! Fish fingers are ok you know  

Go to bed before 11 if you want to function successfully the next day!

Buy Nelson's teething granules!

Get out every day, even if it's just in the garden or to the local shop

Don't feel guilty if you get it wrong. Parenting is trial and error. The fact you feel badly shows what a great parent you already are, if not you wouldn't care

Tomorrow is always another day!!


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## Emma-is-a-mummy

Fab comments ladies I agree with all of them.


Another to add never be afraid to tell your friends your having a bad day I dont know what I would do without my besties. (You know who are) we speak everyday and are a fantastic support to one another. 

We are all fabulous mummies  xx


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## Frangipanii

Totally loving the new tips. And yea we are amazing mummies! 
Now this is naughty but another tip I would point out is work out how to keep up your sex life and keep it frisky or quick!!!! (actually giggling now) hubby really struggled with the idea of s.e.x with kids in the house obviously not romantic so be creative and focus!!! Sorry of this is tmi....lol but come on we all have needs!!!  
my other one which is totally the other end of the spectrum was make time for yourself to go to the loo, shower or bath alone! My en-suite is my sanctuary.  
Oh and get used to ruddy laundry...I am so totally sick of laundry! 
Xxxxx


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## MummyPea

Haha Frangipanii! Completely agree with keeping a sex life. It is weird do it with a little person in the house but that's what afternoon naps are for 

Best advice we received was from our SW.... Don't put pressure on yourselves. Whether that's pressure to feel something for LO on day one of intros, or pressure to be a perfect yummy mummy who keeps up with your child's wants and needs 100% of the time while also keeping house and home perfect. It's unrealistic and will cause so much stress.

Advice from me... Enjoy the little moments. Sometimes we have bad days, especially with a toddler who is teething and pre-verbal. But I always try and focus on the good parts of the day, even if it was only a brief moment.

xx


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## Mummy DIY Diva

Hello wonderful ladies I'm back missed you all. When I finished work a colleague bought me some lovely beauty products.  She told me she was adopted and that her Mum ran herself ragid early days trying to be perfect.  She said because you've had to prove so much you put loads of pressure on yourself.  You don't have to be perfect you just have to be you and that  is exactly what your children need. So when you're stressed and expecting to much look at these and take a moment to remind yourself you are doing sn amazing job and you are exactly what your children need. 

Wise lady that's my tip! She also said to be chosen is truly special x x


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## Ally Wally

Just what I needed to read DIY diva. Thanks for this. Very inspirational after a tough few days. 

Xx


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## Lorella

DIY Diva - what a lovely update to hear xxx


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## AoC

Me too, DIY Diva.  Thank you.


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## Mummy DIY Diva

Thanks ladies my other tip is keep a potty in the car lol. If car journeys run over you just won't make it with little legs and bladders. For Girls anyway I'd just go behind a bush for a boy lol xxx


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## Wyxie

There's definitely a nack to helping girls wee without a potty/toilet so as not to get their shoes soaked!

I think my only other bit of advice to add, is however much time pressure you're under each day, never, ever, be tempted to shave your bikini line in a hurry.  It won't end well.


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## Arrows

Things to remember:
1. It's okay to need time out - for you not the kids! 
2. Even after years of waiting and loving your kid(s) more than you even thought possible it's okay to moan about them and have a bad day. Parenting is really hard, regardless of whether it took a long time to get there or not!
3. Your support network are there for a reason -use them!
4. Cook enough for two meals at a time so you don't feel so stressed on your busy days. 
5. Try to get out the house once a day, just to get some fresh air -rain, snow, fog or sunshine.
6. YOU ARE NOT SUPER MUM/DAD!! It's okay to get things wrong!
7. It's okay to change your mind -you know, like when you say I'm never ever gonna use the TV to 'babysit'...
8. Using the toilet without a small person watching is more of a luxury that you think!
9. You were picked because of who you are. Becoming a parent is totally overwhelming to start with but don't forget you are still you -it adds another amazing dimension but you are not ONLY mum/dad.
10. A happy mummy/daddy leads to a happy small person.


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## AoC

LOL Wyxie!

Loving number 9, Arrows.  We forget that bit too easily.


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## katie c

I'm just bouncing this, as there seem to be a few newbies coming through all at once, and I found this thread super helpful when I was one!


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## Frangipanii

Wow seems so long ago that this started. Xx


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## Frangipanii

does everyone always analyse their parenting? I have just told DD off and I did get a little heated, even carried her to her room. I am now sitting here feeling guilty as well as blaming her birth family for the trauma which is causing the behaviour when actually it could be that she is just normal and I over analyse everything she does. we are struggling with her food. She always takes food that we have told her she is not allowed at school and takes no notice of us. this has been going on for over a year. she lies about it but I can always tell when she is lying. because of some issues we have told her that she has to have fruit for pudding at school and no extra bread but everyday she does it. I don't understand why/. we have tried consequences, explaining it to her, involving her teachers but she continues to do it. the food at her school is not healthy and it kills me that we have worked so hard to get her healthy after being horrendously unfit and obese when she moved in,- massive food issues due to overfeeding and neglectful feeding. She has a positive relationship with food now at home but it goes out the window at school. she hasn't gained any weight in the two years since she moved in, neither has her brother. they have gone from 90+ percentile to around 30th percentile. I think it is a power issue.  but feel lost. sick of having to deal with it. she is the most amazin child otherwise, normal issues like sibling rivalry and tantrums etc of course, she aint perfect lol. 
any advice.?


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## Mummy DIY Diva

As you know our two are very similar food wise we're behind you as dd has no control anywhere.  I have her on a packed lunch because of it. Just makes it easier school dinners just aren't  healthy enough for my eldest way too much opportunity to binge and too much sugar. Hugs I know exactly how you feel no real solutions.  My dd has actually lost 2 kg in the 18 months she's been with us so totally understand your frustration.  We didn't intend her to loose just happened but tbh she's still got quite a way to go before I'd say she's got appropriate / healthy body fat levels.  Xx


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## Frangipanii

Thanks so much diva, you are as always my rock. 
I think we will have to go pack lunch way as school are not bothered at all! Xxxx


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## Mummy DIY Diva

Unfortunately we live in a society where over eating in children is seen as really good.  Which given the childhood obesity crisis is crazy.  Adults regularly praise my dd for eating more than a grown adult should  and tell me how fortunate i am that she eats so much.  I mostly take deep breaths and try not to carry out an attack similar to the ones my daughter used to carry out on me when I served dinner because she hated that I gave more food to her over six foot father than I gave her. Hugs food is one of the hardest things xx


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## aaa is a MUMMY

We have the exact opposite it can literally take Bubba 45 mins maybe an hour to eat a small handful of cereal. We are just starting packed lunches as not convinced she is eating anything at lunch despite being told she does. Every meal time is a good hour and a half just for 1 course. She has taken all day to eat about 6 sweets. 
As far as bad parenting I am sure we have all had those moments where we think oh why did I do that. Think its been human, these little mites push those buttons and then keep pushing.


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## -x-Lolly-x-

We're the same as aaa, little pink is very nearly 3 and wearing 12-18 month clothes. We've worked out she's only grown about 15cm in the last two years. Hate food issues  Hugs all


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Amazingly Bubba is closer now she is almost 5 to the right age clothes although we do have the odd pair or two of shorts that we brought we she came home almost 4 years ago that still fit!!! School clothes are the worst I actually found some trousers that suited her and now can't get anymore they are age 3 and are perfect. I however was gobsmacked when there was a little girl in her class who is probably a foot shorter!!!! She was weighed and measured recently at the hospital and somehow she has gained 2kg and grown 4cm. There is hope


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## Frangipanii

Well the food issues continue but I am paying less attention simply cos I don't have the energy at all. But seems we are all goingb through our own journey with it . What do people put in their pack lunches .I am not a fan of sandwiches so would like alternatives .

On a different note our middle child won't stop wetting the bed. He is three and a half years old. We are thinking of putting him back in nappies at night to take the pressure off him because he can't manage it. He is dry four nights out of seven and we have tried everything. Any advice .
Xx


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## GERTIE179

Hey Fran - my boy is 4.02 and still in pull ups at night. He is similar in consistency. Boys can take longer as they need a hormone to be produced to enable this.  I would go pull ups and encourage LO to get up if he needs toilet. My personal opinion is I dont think there's any rush for this. Most friends with boys ahvent been dry at night until 4/4.5 so i'm not worried in our house.


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## Arrows

My eldest will be 4 in December. He's nowhere near ready to be dry at night yet and uses pull ups.
I have 3 brothers and know the eldest was still having issues as a teenager, middle one was around 10 or so and youngest was dry by 4. Apparently I was dry from age 2 so all different!
No need to stress


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## -x-Lolly-x-

Hiya Fran. I also wouldn't worry at night at all yet, he's very young and boys do take longer. Little pink is younger but in honesty I haven't tried night time training at all yet, it's just bedtime pants (pull ups) on and that's that. Haven't the energy just yet and what the rush?! For lunches mine love pitta bread, crackers and cheese, breadsticks and dip. They aren't so keen on wraps but that's another option. Or a little salad if they would have it? Boiled eggs, cheese etc. Mine wouldn't go that far...   Little pink is good with this type of food, it's proper meals that she's awful with!

aaa that's fantastic news!!


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## AoC

Bug did this - weeing at night just didn't wake him! Initially we used pull-ups at night, but then he seemed over it and we stopped using them.  He regressed a bit and we'd get a wet night once a week ish, but it was never a big deal.  Change of sheets, toss boy in shower, proceed as normal.

We used fitted sheet over an absorbent bed mat, over a waterproof sheet.  The bed mats were brilliant.  I think he still has one on the bed now, just in case, LOL!

I don't think he was consistently dry overnight until well into the 4s, but I'm not completely sure, as I didn't really keep track.

I did notice that fruit shoots (not that we have them often, but sometimes when out and about!) tended to make for an over active bladder, so avoided those after lunchtime.  I kept the fluid intake down after tea.  I found if he was wearing pants overnight he seemed to have less accidents, maybe the sensation of contact there helps?  I also found if he got overheated he was more likely to wet, so kept the fleecy jams for the coldest nights.

When he was really struggling, we lifted him at our bedtime and propped him on the loo, but I'm not sure this was helpful, really.

I still don't think he's been up in the night for a wee more than four times his entire life - I think his bladder just grew!


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## AoC

Oh, and packed lunches.  I used to use silicon cupcake cases in a tight-fitting lunch box, so that there were six mini portions of something for lunch. I always made sure one was protein heavy, one a fruit/veg, and one a dairy. While trying to encourage Bug to eat more, I'd always include at least one thing he wouldn't normally eat, and one thing he'd definitely love. For what it's worth, in nearly two years of making packed lunches, he NEVER ate anything new. Take that, 'fussy eating' advice.... 

With no recommendations as to healthiness, these are things I tried:-

Breadsticks (with a little dip pot - ketchup/peanut butter/whatever)*
Cocktail sausages *
Cream crackers with cream cheese
Mini ritz crackers with pate
Sultanas/raisins
Buttered crackers*
Little sandwich shapes (use mini cookie cutters) with peanut butter, choc spread*, cheese spread, jam*, cheese, ham, chicken, beef, humous etc.
Chopped ham or ham flowers
Cherry tomatoes, chopped
Cucumber sticks
Carrot stars (mini cutters again)
Frozen peas
Cold buttered pasta shapes
Pasta shapes with tom sauce
Rice salad
Rice balls (http://www.bigkidsmallcity.com/2012/09/i-love-school-lunch-boxes-rice-balls/)
Little roulades of ham and cheese
Cheese shapes/mini baby bels etc
Little seeded crackers*
Pretzels (not too salted)*
Breakfast cereals*
Chopped strawberry
Raspberries
Blueberries
Chopped apple
Tinned mandarins
Yoghurt coated fruit pieces
Fruit leathers*
Fromage frais tubes*
Popcorn*
Vegetable crisps
Rice cakes
Cold chicken pops/nuggets
Potato salad

Anyway, the sky's your limit.

*Foods Bug actually ate. Sometimes. And, in the case of cocktail sausages, only when they were Tescos. Not Aldis, Marks and Sparks, Asda, Sainsburys, Morrisons, local butchers, branded, Booths, Waitrose or Lidl. Only Tescos. *swears*


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Avoid black currant it is an irritant. I was told when I had my hysterectomy and my bladder went crazy. My nephew had real problems for ages I kept telling my sil but she is one of those people that knows best and carried on with it. When he eventually was referred to the hospital it was first thing she was told and results were instant. Bubba leaks if she drinks it and can't make the toilet. It's in a lot of things including medicines so maybe worth checking.


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## crazyspaniel

Dd is nearly 5 and is nowhere near dry, her pull up is wet every night although I know she will also wee in it when she wakes in the morning, grrr...!
I know the worst thing I could do is make an issue out of it so I go on buying the pj pants!


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Crazy I thought the same Bubba would wet the bed through her pull ups on a regular basis and I just thought I am gonna see and almost a year later we have only had 3 wet beds and no where near as wet as pull up leak. Gob smacked.


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## ciacox

Just read this entire thread. Thanks so much guys. LO moves in Monday and this was such a helpful read.


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## AoC




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## aaa is a MUMMY

Enjoy every minute I know there are times when. I haven't but it's these oh so special days that remind me how flaming lucky I am to be a mummy to my awesome little girl. Who is growing up faster than I realise. I was given a truly beautifully written card this morning and my heart melted. Xx


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