# NK Cells high - could this finally be an answer?



## Sophcol (Nov 24, 2014)

Hi there, 

After failed IVF and FETs and two miscarriages in the last 12 mths my consultant has finally tested me for NK Cells which have come up high. 

I'm waiting to hear about my treatment but feeling kind of positive that they've actually found something wrong! I think I will be prescribed intralipids and another steroid. 

My question is, does anyone have any experience good or bad with NK Cell treatment in secondary fertility? My consultant has always insisted this was unlikely as I have a child, but I have always thought that something like this might be wrong. 

Starting 3rd round of IVF in september and this is our last so hoping this treatment is the key!


----------



## Hbkmorris (Apr 7, 2010)

Hiya Sophcol, 

Some consultants don't even believe in immunes problems but thankfully yours has now seen that it could be an issue and better still you have got a result which could be the reason behind your failures and mc   It's a bitter sweet moment I know. 

What were your levels? I had mine done in 2012 to which came back at only slightly raised being 5.9% still had immunes meds to cover cycles and had 1x BFN, 1x MC and 1x BFP but waters broke at 20 weeks sadly my son grew his wings. 

I then returned for another fresh cycle in March this year which was a BFN.. Stunned as everything was top notch 2x Hatching blasts.. I decided to have another Nk cell biopsy and it came back at 20.62%..   Now with this in mind was it the immunes or other factors! I had my consultation with Prof Brosens and he is re-testing me as in 2012 the test was done on day 6 after ovulation but this time day 11. We are going to try and see if I can have the next biopsy done around day 6 to see if it's still super high. 

Now there is much conflict with different consultants as to when you start the prednisolone as this can have a knock on affect. They say you need some inflammation for implantation to occur but not enough for it to over supress your immunes. In essence I feel that if mine come super high again I may start 5mg running up to the week prior to EC (of my donor) and from her collection go with 20mg/ 25mg. I'll have two intralipids prior to transfer and one on transfer day. 

Just to also add that my consultant is in research stage to see if these NK cells increase with age and after birth of a child.. If that is the case this could be the reason my levels have shot up so maybe something to consider for you too x


----------



## Sophcol (Nov 24, 2014)

Hi Hbkmorris, 

Thanks so much for your reply and I'm so sorry for what you have been through, that is devastating. 

I haven't got my results as I left them at the clinic but it was a 14. something %. It is bitter sweet as I know it's not a guaranteed thing and you've said there could be other factors as well. With my second cycle I only got two eggs and one fertilised so I'm having my AMH tested again before my cycle in September starts. 

That's good to know about the prednisolone as I'll be taking that, I'll do some research. One thing I have learned is that is not an exact science and the consultants do not have all the answers!

I had the blood test rather than biopsy and I'm wishing now I had the biopsy and I think it would be more accurate but as they are treating me anyway maybe there is no point?

Do you know when you'll be having treatment again? It's so hard to get the energy up to do this again. I'm excited to get going but also very scared. After a few loses it's hard to think about a positive outcome (I also had ectopic and left tube removed). A positive preg test will never be a happy moment, just the start of the anxiety! Wishing you lots of luck with the next steps.


----------



## Hbkmorris (Apr 7, 2010)

Hiya, 

I feel your pain so much and I thank you so much for your kind words. The pain I feel is so unreal and I hope it passes soon, devastating is the only word that sums it up a T  

Ok, so your levels are high but not mega high whish is good. It truly is a bitter sweet result though. I'm not sure if the reading for the tests via bloods are the same as biopsy so it might be best to ask the question. Either way I'd think the immunes meds will be the same. Not sure where you are located but I went to Coventry for mine with Prof Quenby and Brosens. They are leaders in research for implantation failure & recurrent mc. I do believe their theory's of some if not all of their results but as it's still in research stages I do take some of the info with a little pinch of salt as so many other factors can be the cause at that time. I had a TAC which is a C-section procedure to secure my cervix.. I've got that in the back of my mind and wondering if cycling end of Feb/March was too soon but then another part of me things Nk cells..   honestly you can easily go cuckoo can't you. 

I think regardless of what test they will treat you accordingly so I'd not really worry at this stage. God willing you don't need it but if further down the line the outcome doesn't change you can then take a look at having a biopsy. Fingers and toes crossed it won't be required. 

I'm having a cycle in September also. Be towards the end of the month. I've no energy, positive vibes and the right head space right now but hoping as the weeks pass I shall start to gain strength and hope and pray to his nibs up there they we are given our dream with no upset or dramas   

I've had my left tube removed also.. but down to hydro. Darn thing was clipped at the start of my journey but it the wrong place therefore after cycle no 5 failed I paid private for an MRI scan which showed it bulging.. Thankfully the private gyne chap felt sorry for me so accepted me on the NHS to get it removed. Since then two BFP and a negative so at least it proved to be the problem for the first 5.  

Am I right in saying you ae trying in September again? Wishing you tons of luck also. We shall find that positive vibe and we shall get there. xx


----------



## Sophcol (Nov 24, 2014)

You will get there Hbkmorris, you sound so strong (even if you don't always feel it). It's nothing compared to what you've gone through but I have found the pain has got less, but I can also remember it so clearly, so I think about it enough I can always make myself cry!  

Yes I have gone bonkers trying to work out what is wrong. Over the last 3 years I've given up various things and tried weird diets, spent a fortune on accupuncture and other alternative treatments - I don't think I'll bother with any of that this time! 

I wish I could go to Prof Quenby, there is a lot of love for her on this site. I'm in London and at Kings, they are good but I don't think specialists in this area and I'll need to go to another clinic in Harley St for the Intralipids. I have thought about changing clinics but it's very convenient for me to go to Kings as down the road and I never know if it'll just be the same at another one!

You have a lot to be positive about - so is this round an FET? Are you going abroad or in the UK? I feel like it's got to be our time soon! I think I'll be around middle of Sept. I'll be thinking of you and let's keep in touch!


----------



## Hbkmorris (Apr 7, 2010)

Oh bless you, I can be so strong at times but right now I'm not feeling it.. Come next week I should be ok, I just need some time to think of 'ME' and then I shall go back into auto pilot and become a nut job with tests and ticking the boxes to check me over. It's like being on a crazy train!!  . Cry if you need to, don't forget the meds will be messing with your hormones so that's another reason you'll be feeling what you do. 

Sometimes there's just no rhyme or reason but we must keeping fighting and keep trying and above all keep    going  

I have to say when I first went to Prog Q and Prof B in 2012 it was all very super new and they were really gaining all the info they could on NK cells and how these things affect us ladies. Thankfully due to their hard work they really have turned things around and best of all they've highlighted and proved that NK cells do have an impact. You can go to them and pay privately costs £360 so not over the odds unlike Dr Gorgy. 

You have to have faith in your clinic and if you do hold it with Kings then you stay, if at any point you start to doubt your clinic then you come to new thoughts about changing. 

I'm going for another fresh cycle with TM in Cyprus who are just amazing. In fact I wish I'd left my first clinic sooner, gone to my UK private clinic sooner to try my eggs and then bizarrely gone to TM sooner to try tandem cycle with is OE and DE combined.. Sadly after my OE mc I lost all faith (I do have two frozen in UK which are all on hold for last play back up) I also have 5 frosties from this years cycle but again they are my back up plan. Think this will be my last fresh and then I've my frosties to play with.. After that it's game over  

I'm sure we'll bump into each other on a cycle thread somewhere down the line if not you know where I am so be sure to message me with your updates xx


----------

