# Poor responders : Part 81



## Rachel (Mar 10, 2004)

A new home for the start of a very snowy day here!  Keep warm and safe everyone









    for you all xx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Thanks Rachel, yah me first x


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

just a bookmark

lots of luck today Ally xx


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

ally thinking of you today darling xxx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Ally & Missy good luck with your scans a

Who was testing today! sorry My head is   good luck and praying for 3 very happy ladies!

HEavy snow here too and Dh informs me Londons on a go slow so hope you ladies make it in and out of clinic ok!

Hugs

Sx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Morning all!

Good luck for today Ally! Hope things have taken a turn for the better.

It's Rural Chick's official test day today - was it the same as yesterday mate? Or has it turned into a BFjuicyP? I do hope so.


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Rural Chick      

Thanks for the reminder Mir morning how is the Bobstart what does he make of the snow? 

Sx


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Morning ladies

All the best to Ally and Missy today - wishing you loads of luck and       that you get the news you want.

School is shut again today so working from home, which is just as well as when I retested this morning it was another  . I've got to go for a blood test tomorrow as well - it should be today but they said I could go tomorrow to save taking time off work - I don't think we'd have got there today anyway.

I'm feeling kind of numb at the moment, I had a quick    and now just want to get on with the next stage. No sign of   yet so I guess that's the cyclogest working its cruel spell 

I know I am in the best place to keep me positive and shall be keeping an eye out for any news.

Have a great day 

Catherine x   

Have just seen the good wishes from Mir and Purple - perhaps I should spend today learning to type quicker


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Morning all,

Working at home again today, it's well snowy again here     

Ally- I am thinking about you hun   

Missy- Lots of luck for your scan  

Rural-  

Was Elinor testing today too girls?

Hi purple hun  

Hi Mir- Bless Robert, I can just imagine him in a little snow suit    

Feeling a bit down today, weird eh  

Love Anne
xxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Oh Catherine-    .

Hi beachy-  

xxxx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Oh Catherine      

So sorry it was not positive hunny!

Thniking of you!

Sx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Rural Chick    thinking of you, praying tomorrow brings good news


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Morning!

Right lets see if I can keep up with this thread!

Ally - Good Luck! 

Mira- Is today Bobs appointment?

Beachy - Morning sweetie. XX

Sorry thats the best I can do as not read last thread! 

Love to you all. XX


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Laura- Morning, how are the chippers? xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Morning laura,

Did you have a nice day yesterday with friends? Bet they loved your little bundles  

Sx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=93199.0

Just reminising... here is the 2nd ever PR thread, me and Roozie now both have chipers npw can you believe and there was us discussing take aways and AMH just like you girls are now... Can't find the first one, mybe it had a differnt title.

Anne - Chippers are good all zonked out on pillow next to me, well Eddy is stirring and a little red faced... think he may be doing me a little 'gift'.


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Hi Anne

Sorry that you're feeling a bit down today.   

Your new Minky puppy duster sounds fab - I have to admit I hate housework with a passion, so much so that when we have people to stay, we have them in quick succession so that we only have to clean once!!!! I am incredibly tidy though - my tights, socks, undies are all colour co-ordinated and my CDs are all in alphabetical order - I'm sure I've got some OCD.

Hi Rachel

I only said wait til you go to *bed* - if you choose to *sleep* .......    

Catherine x


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Catherine,  bless you for your concern but please, don't worry about me hun, up one min, down the next  
I think we all have a little OCD   

xx

Laura-


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Morning Laura- hope you like his gift  

Anne   

Morning Purple


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## Rachel (Mar 10, 2004)

Here you go Laura

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=74535.315


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Rachel- how are you this morning?  Are the girls enjoying the snow?


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hey beach how are you?

Laura just read first few pages and it's lovely to see you guys chatting like that! Also interesting to see what was 'the in thing' for Pr's then   

Anne sweetie pie       

Rural    

Ally should be in her scan now, hoping it's good news, I know we're all lovely and deserve our BFP's but just think Ally is such a womderful person that I'm hoping with all my heart it's success for her!!!!
Morning Rach! You do take care of us hey! how are you hun?

Sx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Purple- I'm fine thanks, just trying to decide what to do today

Ally-lots of luck sweetheart


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## Rachel (Mar 10, 2004)

Hello Beachgirl

I'm fine thank you. Losing my voice which the girls (and probably dh ) will like!! They're loving the snow yes, very much. 

I can't believe how much we've had! It reminds me of when I was little (many years ago!!  ) and we had lots for days and weeks at a time. But I don't ever remember schools being shut   Well, only if no heating or burst pipe or something.

Rachel x


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Anne - so sorry you are feeling down today. Does it help to know that's an entirely rational reaction to what you've been through? Let yourself grieve, and don't give yourself a hard time.  

Catherine - so sorry hun. I just read your signature - all that weight loss - WOW! You so deserve a BFP after all that. Mind you, all the girls on here deserve a BFP after all they've been through, but unfortunately, as Tracey said not long ago, we don't always get what we deserve - unfortunately it doesn't work like that.   Anyway - you can have a gold star from me for all that weight loss. How did you do it? I really really need to lose weight to increase my chances of conceiving naturally, but I just can't do it. I'm so weak.

Ally -     .

Morning Beachy, Laura, Miranda, Purple, Rachel and everyone else.

Well, it's very snowy here in devon. As I work from home i don't get a snow daythough - it's not fair! Bloody DP forgot to chop me some more logs before he went to wrok and it's freezing in here. I'm not allowed near the chainsaw unfortunately so I'm buggered. Brrrrrrr!!!


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

oh wow, its really weird looking back at the Part 2 thread - me getting my AMH results. ....Bit depressing too - out of me, Roozie, Nicki Miranda and laura I'm the only one who hasn't got a LO...


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Wish I had someone to play in the snow with....would be great to be sledging or making snowmen... 

Rachel- cab't imagine why they'll be happy you losing your voice


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Jo


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Hi Jo

Thanks for your kind words. It was the thought of not being treated that made me do it - I now swim for 30 mins each morning before school, and go for a couple of 3 hour walks at the weekend with DH. I have cut out chocolate, cheese and alcohol and eat mainly chicken and fish. To get my BMI to 25, I still have about 2 stone to lose, but I can't see how. The last two weeks have been a nightmare as I was told no exercise after the IUI and I've really missed it - fat lot of good it did. 

Please can anyone help with the wheatgrass - I've been searching and see that they do pills as well - are these as good as the powder - I'm finding it hard enough to get the milk down me as I really don't like it, but grass as well - I guess I'm just a bit of a fusspot.

Purple and Beachy - thanks again for the    , please have some from me    

Catherine x

PS Jo, just seen your other post


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Jo - Stay away from that chainsaw!!   I started posting on the PR thread at Part 5, then stopped after a few months and I still dont have a LO either   

Rachel - really wanted to build a snowman too but felt too silly making one on my own!  Have fun  

Beach - early bird....catches the thread first!  

Anne -     Is Jason home today too?  

Catherine -  think you can blame your mum for any OCD.  How can she expect to raise weel-adjusted children wihen she is checking you both have the same number of letters in your names!!!     

Laura - morning!!  

Purple - hello hon!   

Popsi - mornng!  

Miranda - hello there!  

Love and luck to Missy and Ally    

Hi to everyone else! xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Jo   
Ali   

It will happen ladies !!!!

Sx


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

aww, thanks Purple, Beach, Ali and Catherine. I don't believe it will at the moment, but hey ho. I have lots to be grateful for - mainly a fantastic DP who I am head over heels in love with and makes me feel great.  

Not looking forward to having to go into Mothercare this afternoon to buy a present for my friend's week-old baby this afternoon. And then going to see it and coo cooing. She knows about my problems, but still insist on me cuddling it (sorry, he!) I'm really worried she's going to ask DP and I to be godparents. I'm sorry, I know it's a bad attitude, but i don't want to be  bloody godparents. Especially when I know the sentiment behind it is "aww, she can't have her own, so I'll let her be a godparent - the next best thing." Grrrrrr


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Jo  

Ali- Nope he's at work today


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

oh Jo no need to apologise on here hunny! our emotions are normal and the god parent thing is such a tough one! hope the visit to mothercare is not too bad though I know myself it can tear at your heart. I often avoid that and when need to find gifts for friends newborns (and there are so many) I got to other places like M&S Primark etc that are not all full of people briming full of joy and babies or if I'm feeling really bad I order on line!

I'm at present meant to be making a new baby card for a good fried who had her 2nd in jan and I've had her gift here for 2 weeks, but the card making seems just too much right now! Mind you need to get on with it or the baby will have outgrown the clothes by the time she recieves it   

It's 5 years ttc this month for me and DH and just seems overwhelming sometimes    

Sx


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Purple, quick have some more        
Catherine x


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Thanks hun

  right back at ya


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

That's why this thread's so special and I'm so glad to have found it.


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## PinkPeacock (Nov 9, 2006)

Hi ladies,

I've only just got to work after leaving my house at 7am!!!!    Snow and idiotic driving is a bad combination.

So sorry to Rural Chick for the BFN. 

Hugs to everyone else. Will post properly later when I've done a bit of work.


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Rachel    enjoy your snowman and post us some pics x x x


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

All I want to do today is buggar all but the phone keeps ringing and emails piling in - even though I'm at home, I can't get any dossing time


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Morning girls,

I feel very tired today and it’s all down to the decaf latte I didn’t have thanks to Natasha!! (Ahhh you know I’m just kidding sweetheart  )

Catherine: I just wanted to say how very sorry I am you had a BFN hon.  I’ve been there not long ago and I know how you feel. 

Ally: Thinking of you my darling – hope scan is going well.   Please God please please    promise I won’t ask for anything else for a few days! 

Laura & Rachel: How sweet of you to post the early links for us. I shed a few tears but in a nice way.

Jo: You will get there too honey, just hang in there.  

Anne: Morning ikkle one.   Don’t be down we don’t like seeing you low.  

Nix: Where are you mate? Come on, I could do with some laughing. See I even mention your name and I laugh   

Zuri: Morning hun, still here? (I know it’s not funny - sorry!  ) 
What did you end up eating last night? 

Purple: Are you also WFH? You lucky girls! 

Juicy: How are you gorgeous? Are feeling productive today? 

Pink: Re your previous question about embies not sticking – did you consider getting immune tests done? Natasha is the immune lady drop her a PM if you have any questions and I’m sure she’ll be happy to help.

Bobs: Hope you are OK.

Beach: You don’t know what to do today? How about shopping? 

Miranda: Boing! ( I loooove this! )  

Angel: I hope you are OK hun, please come and tell us how things are if you can. We worry about you. I hope all is OK.  

Sam: Has AF arrived yet hun? Hope so! Any more news from the SIRM guy you’ve been stalking?  

Missy: You shown your   twice now hun. Are you a little flasher – shame on you!  

Tracey: Hi luvvie, how is work these days? Are you being a good deputy?

Lainey: WHERE ARE YOUUUUUU?? Hope you are OK honey.

LJ: I hope there is still    Mine supposed to arrive tomorrow or Sunday unless something went right!  

Fishy:  

Kate: Walnut whips for breakfast? 

Gawd is that everyone? My fingers have gone flat from typing. Apologies if I left anyone out but you know I love you all.  

I have a question girls. Having just had a BFN do you think I should get immune tests done before I go ahead with another cycle? I’m hope I’m OK but the last thing I want is to have a few BFN’s and then discover I have immune problems too. What do you think? Tash, Nix?

Love to everyone.

Pixie xxx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Hi there all

Carys - 7 eggs is FINE and don'tyet anyone tell you otherwise.  Yes, you will see people getting 20 eggs or something but they are high responders. You are still well within the normal range. From what I understand 5-15 is considered normal and above 15 is high. If you look at any study on "poor response" it will generally define it as being 4 or fewer eggs or less than 4 on maximum stims. I am confident you were not on maximum stims and you still had a normal response. In terms of response you have done fine and now you just need to get that BFP next time.

Lightweight - I think you have had a lucky escape with your clinic. Any clinic that can say there has never been a pregnancy with AMH of 0.7 is talking nonsense and doesn't deserve your custom.  I am seething with anger that they dared say such a thing. As Miranda says we have several successes here and Sam has posted some inspiring links regarding success stories with low AMH. Plus, Miranda is right in that the US is now regarding lower levels of AMH as being just fine - take a look at this link from Repromedix (a big US lab) - http://www.repromedix.com/pdf/AMHbL17CF181.pdf Good luck at the Lister and put your old clinic firmly behind you. Several ladies here (including my sister who got pregnant on her first IVF) have been booted from clinics so you are not alone. 

Donkey - I cannot believe I have found another "Katharine"; my sister Kate is also a "Katharine". So did your dad fancy Katharine Hepburn too?? 

Missy - thinking of you today and  so very hard!! I also shop at urban wheatgrass; I like the fact it is small and I love Colin the Cow!! Also, they are right in that is does taste better the longer you take it.

Swinny - lovely to see you! Hope your dad is ok; can't believe your FET is so soon. 

Popsi - glad the adoption process is going well. 

Hazelnut - you've come to the right place! I will PM you some stuff on DHEA. I know your FSH must have come as a huge shock since you are under 35 and hadn't been trying for a year so I can see the test was just for reassurance.  Hard though it is you should really have another to check it wasn't a blip. Please hang on in there. A lot of the ladies here will have been through similar so stay strong. 

Natasha - your diet is impressive. I like to think mine is pretty good but I do have a weakness for Green & Blacks 85% dark chocolate. I can't remember the last time I had a McDs. Never had KFC. I remember really wanting McDs when I was a kid, but my mum wouldn't allow it and we had to have our meat and 2 veg!!

JoM - must be hard seeing the others with their babies. Hang in there. 

Miranda - how is Robert's hand?

Anne - sorry you are feeling low. 

Ally - thinking of you so much today and hoping that scan goes well. Do remember that whatever happens this is not your last hope!  

Purple - hitting 5 years must be hard; I hope you are ok. 

Pixie - thanks for remembering; AF tipped up in full force this morning - made a real mess all over the bed. So it's on to next month for me!

Love to Sam, Ali, Kate, Beach, Bobbi, Juicy, Tracey, Kazzie, LauraB, Nix, Nikki, NicksW, Fishy and anyone else I have missed.

/links


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Sorry Pix forgot to respond.  I honestly don't know much about immunes but my sense is that it may be worth having the tests done so that you know you are clear or they can treat any issues.  When you get that perfect eggie out you don't want to be worrying about whether you may have an immune issue.   Just my thoughts but, as I said, I'm no expert on immunes.  If you have any questions on DHEA I tend to know more!!


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Pix & Lj- I am ok, brightening  up by the minute  
xxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Beachy- Hun, what's the weather like by you? 
We have to pick Jason's youngest boy up tomorrow from Dewsbury as his ex usually meets him on J28 of M1 but she's not a confident driver in crap weather.

xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Morning pix yes WFH well at home anyway not much work being done  

Your posts are always so impressive! you include everyone!

Hey LJ, I'm ok hun a bit raw but hey all part of this journey me thinks  

Sorry to hear AF put in an appearance, nevermind hunny sure you and DP are still loving trying  

Beachy hunny have you built the snowman yet?

Hugs to all

Sx


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

include everyone except me


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

That's cos you're special      

Morning ali sweetheart  

Sx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Purps - I'm fine with AF!  and even if I were a bit upset, I'm wouldn't come here and say "oh no - I've not succeeded first month ttc and I am soooo upset!!  Please comfort me ladies!" It might, just possibly, be REALLY ANNOYING!!  You still have time Purple so try not to focus on the "anniversary".  Hang in there and focus on your consultation with the Lister.    

Anne - glad you are doing better.  

Hi Ali!! 

We are off see Cirque du Soleil tonight!


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Ali: I’m so sorry sweetie…I’m a terrible person!   How are you anyway? Do you think you can ever forgive me?      

LJ: Thanks. I have the same logic, maybe I should get it checked out. Sorry your AF arrived. Did you work out which day you ovulated, do you know if you   on that day?

Anne: That’s better sweetie  

Purple: No so impressive now eh?  

xxx


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## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Morning ladies - WFH again, this is so boring, hate being stuck  

Swinny - good luck with the FET hun, that's come around so quickly  

JoM - would have loved to have increased the vodka intake, but i was logged into msn so couldn't get away with taking any longer of a lunchbreak   DH and I are at home again today, he seems to think the pub is a good idea for today too  

Kate - joining you with the lurgy hun, this is the 2nd time in a month i've been ill, i'm never ill  

Nix - tea was a chicken roast with afters of apple and blackberry pie and cream, yummy, DH loved me last night  

Nat - your diet is amazing, but it shows why you are so georgeous  

Purple - at least you are doing something about it hun, DH and i were TTC for nearly 12 years before we did, think how stupid we feel  

Ali - morning hun, how you doing  

Ally and Missy - thinking of you both  

Catherine - hi hun, sorry to hear you tested -ve again this morning, hope you're ok  

Popsi - DH and I have started discussing options if we can't go any further with t/x due to cost etc, i'm frightened that DH wouldn't be able to cope with adoption academically, there seems alot of studying etc, how much is involved  

Hazelnut - DHEA is definately worth a shot hun, good luck  

Missy - just had to add from a proof readers side, i so wanted to re-post your post with paragraphs added  

Lightweight - glad you found the Lister through this site, we'll be watching your progress eagerly  

Anne - you ok now chicky  

LJ - sorry AF turned up like that hun, mine's nearly here too, always next month sweetie, get your strength up ready  

Laura - morning, has Eddy finished filling his nappy yet  

Mir - any pics of the bobster in the snow  


Ended up at my next door neighbours last night - have managed to keep away since they brought their newborn home 3 months ago, i coped, but i still don;t see them as naturals, baby James had been up all night with constipation, yet i know she is breast feeding still and eats garlic constantly, surely she should realise that the two are connected, makes me annoyed, not only is she causing him pain, she's causing me pain as i can't STAND garlic and it drifts into our house and i have to light all the candles to get rid of the smell  

Just shat myself, had an avalanche of snow fall from the roof of the house  

DH and I won more on the GGs yesterday, our jockey neighbour needed help getting out of the estate yesterday morning by DH and neighbour, so they had a mini flutter on his ride and it came in at 16-1, bless him, we were so excited, talk about fate


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Morning Fishy- Another win again on the horses- well done you!
I'm Ok ta hunny.


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Yeah I'm fine too Fishy - thanks for asking


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Hi Fishy - pub sounds a good idea. My meeting for this afternoon has been cancelled so I'm hoping my friend who's staying with us at the moment will be up for an afternoon drinkie.   Oh dear, if I was serious about ttc I wouldn't be drinking would I??  

LJ - or anyone else - I have a quetsion about DHEA. Am I right in thinking it can cause so much of an increase in oestrogen that it can stop you from ovulating if your levels get too high? It's just that my last 2 cycles have only been 15 days so not long enough to have ovulated. This is completely out of character for me. I was thinking about reducing the dose a bit (currently on 75 mg a day) to see if this makes any difference. What do you think?

Any news from Ally yet? Does anyone know what time her scan was? And MissyG?


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Hi, just wanted to say even though I'm new to this thread, thank you all for being so lovely and including me.  I'm very touched by everybody's kindness and I hope to get to know you all.  Although I think it'll take me a little while to remember everybodys names I'm afraid!

Hayley xxx


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## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Pix -                                                            
Is that enough grovelling


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Hi Hayley!  

Jo and Fish - pub sounds like a great plan today!  Have fun  

Pix - I think some bubbles might help..........   

Anne - hope that phone gives you a little break.  You reminded me last night that I need to get a new phone too.  

LJ - hello there!  Hope you are not working too hard    Sorry about the sheets  

Purple - thatnks honey......whata sweetie   

Hello to everyone else.  Need to get dressed as I am naked in my lounge having just got out of the bath - get go past laptop without have a sneaky look!


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

You know thats the reason I don't do such impressive posts, I'm bound to miss someone out, it's as much as I can manage to mention the ladies chatting at that time.  

Ally's back from scan she met up with missy which must have been lovely she'll be on later to update us all

Hey Hazle  

Ali  what an image hunny hope no one can see in   

Sx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

see you later ladies, off for a break from comp going to have porridge and watch ER & Grays anatomy from last night!

They always make me   but think a good winge will sort me right out

  to all

Sx


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## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Well it wasn't my worst fear realised but almost.... the one follicle on my right is growing well and the lining looks good but the two follicles on the left have hardly grown at all so no way they will catch up now. So, I have 1 follicle, it is on my right which is the side with a blocked tube, do we go for it? It might not even have an egg in it and the chances of it being a good one are so slim. B0110ck5 is what I say! I have to go back on Tues and we decide then if we go for EC on Friday - Friday the 13th - great, that was the date I had my egg collected with Create and that was not a lucky day. 

It was really lovely meeting Ally and I am sure she will be on soon. 

Missy xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Missy


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

for Missy.

Catherine x


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Hi Missy - I'm really sorry it wasn't better news.

I think I would go ahead if you have one good follie. I was in a similar position and I went ahead to EC as I didn't know whether I would ever get even one follie again, and would have kicked myself if I didn't. And if it's growing well, lets hope it's agolden follie with a lovely eggie in it?  

take care poppet,
jo xxxxx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Dr Faris at lister last week said he'd go ahead with 1 follie as in his words it only takes one!

stay strong and hopefully that follie has a fab fab egg in it sweetie

Sx


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## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Go for it hun, you'd always wonder 'what if' if you didn't   and if your lining is doing well, you have every chance


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Missy- Hun, yes, I would go ahead too and if the Lister are happy to do so then go for it. You could have the ONE special egg in that follie hun.  Bless you, keep warm and drink as much as poss over the weekend.


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Missy: What is your E2 hun? I might be wrong but your E2 level should give them an indication of if that follie has an egg or not? 

Fish: Awwww thanks honey. I was just copying Ali!! Right back at you with the kisses  

Ali: Is 400 enough darling? Check it out you saucy lady  

xxxx


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## Juicy (Jan 23, 2008)

Missy...bummocks, as nix would say, to those follies on the left.  Sorry love, i was really hoping you'd have three  

However, I'd go ahead with one - especially on Friday 13th as that way, your embie will be made on valentine's day - so it's actually really auspicious this time round, I think    

day 1 for our embies on our bfp cycle was our wedding anniversary, which made me feel it was a good omen

glad you had company at the Lister!
xxx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Missy - I echo the others; that follie may contain your golden egg so don't let it go! 

Pixie - yes, our timing was right (I am charting my cycles) - it just wasn't our month! 

JoM - I have to confess I don't know if DHEA could cause your problems or not.  I know it increases peak E2 levels in IVF cycles but that is generally felt to be good.  And you need high E2 for a ovulation.  I will look around but you may have stumped me!  

Catherine - I forgot to welcome you earlier; hope you are doing ok.  Congratulations on your weight loss - amazing.


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Afternoon chatty ladies 

Well have to come to work but feel really crap, sore throat snotty nose swollen glands and aching    Tried to read back and remember what i can but have forgot most of it already, so please excuse my useless peronals

Missy - i would definatly go for it no matter what hun i transferred to iui after having only 2 follies and every time i think about it i wish i had gone to collection as my tubes arnt the best.    

Catherine       hugs to my twinnie with the same name  

Hayley - hi hunny wlecome to the thread  

Anne - oooo u sound just like me when shopping i always have to go and have a look round the clothes and make up  

Hello pixie, natasha, ali, sam, fishy, pruple,zuri, littlejenny, laura,tracey steph lucy juicy jo mac and everyone else, cant wait to get home and get into my jamas, time for some more anadin  

Kate
xxxxxxxxxx


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Missy - hon, big   for you.  Pix has a good point - what is the E2 level?  That could be important info when trying to make your decision.  Did they suggest any alternatives to you?  I think it does depend on which cons you end up seeing as to what stance they take.  After i left my appointment I thought what about the E2, but they didn't take my bloods, just talked to me and said it was a risk with just one follie and recommended IUI/au naturel.  In hindsight, I wsh I had asked for the E2 level to be checked and then decided.  

Whatever decision you make will be the right one for you.  I'll pm you too.  Alixx

Pixie -      All is forgiven my darling xx   

Purple - enjoy having a good grizzle.  Can be very cathartic


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Kate- Sorry you're not well hun  
You should go home and rest up xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Bob-


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Hi Bobbi -  

Hi Kate - I agree with Anne - GO HOME! NOW! Get on that sofa with your duvet and a lovely cuppa (or JD and coke? Great for the throat) in front of some trashy tv.


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Bobbi - glad you spoke to Angel; hope she knows we are all thinking of her.


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Catherine - just wanted to add that there can be a reason they make you go in for a blood test!  Sometimes the wee tests are not that reliable.  At my sister's clinic they told her specifically that she would have to come in for a blood test since they had had too many ladies getting BFNs on wee tests and turning out to be pg!


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

team PR.

Sorry for disappearing on you. Thanks for thinking about me. 

Will give you a little update on me, then make a cup of tea and try to catch up with you all (only 30 pages to read  ) 

Blood test on Wednesday confirmed that beta had risen slightly (from 350 to 450). Together with the heavy bleeding, this doesn't look great. I was referred to the EPU to rule out eptopic yesterday. They couldn't see anything. I had been warned by the doctor beforehand as she said that beta has to be over 1000 for them to be able to see a sac at this stage. After 4 hours in the EPU, I came out no wiser than I was before. They don't know whats causing the bleeding and I'm at a risk of having a miscarriage. The consultant said that there is no choice to wait and see what happens.  

All this waiting and uncertainty is driving me crazy. Luckily DH, my Mum and the lovely Bobbi have been keeping me sane. And of course you lot, everytime I log on here, your positive messages make me feel like I shouldn't lose hope just yet.


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne - i would love to go home hunny, but sickness not looked on very favourably here plus on in tomoz morning!  Mite just go and have a kip under my desk in a bit tho  

Jo - i will defo be having a jd and coke or two later.  Anyway hun, im here at the mo so anything you need just ask ur beatch  

Bobbi - hiya petal glad u have spoken to angel, isnt it amazing how we always think about people and keep checking back to see if they have been on to give us an update?  Hope she is ok and really hope its good news.   U up to anything exciting this weekend hun? 

Ali - hi hunny sam told me be prepared to go to ec with only 1 or 2 follies so suppose i'll have to be, am hoping for more but then im just a greedy beatch  

Had another dose of anadin and now having a diet pepsi to keep to keep me going


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Angel - ooohhh i was just talking about you so to speak    Will be keeping everything crossed for you hunny (even my legs) and dont do that for just anyone.  Wishing you all the luck in the whole wide world big


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Angel- Thanks for letting us know, we've been thinking about you  
There is still hope hun, and I for one will be   for you xxx

kate-


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Angel     will be keepign evrything crossed for you   

Anne- it's not too bad up here, I think the M62 is flowing fine, just allow more time for travelling

Purple-not yet no...it's melting slowly now...

Pixie- I've been out food shopping and popped into Boots for a few bits too...the shops were very very busy

Missy


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

slycett said:


> Anyway hun, im here at the mo so anything you need just ask ur beatch


     oh how I love having my own beatch.


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Angel - I am so sorry about what you've been through the last few days. I can't imagine how difficult it has all been for you. Take care of yourself.


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Angel - I am so glad the lovely Bobbi has been comforting you!    justing waiting to see what happens muct be so hard but you are still in the game so don't give up.


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Bonjour les filles!

Missy - honey I'm sorry the news wasn't as good as you'd hoped but you know the FF mantra - it only takes one! And yes, absolutely bummocks to the little sods on the left that were too lazy to catch up! But you've got your golden follie on the right so if the E2 levels indicate there's an eggie in there I say GO FOR IT!!!    

By the way, you can tell this liquid diet has done the trick already re modifying my cravings for salty fatty foods. When I read about your fish and veg meal my mouth started watering! At the beginning of the week I would have killed for a nice plateful of chinese spare ribs and special fried rice, now grilled fish and boiled pots and broccoli sounds like heaven!

RC - honey I have everything crossed that the little blighter is a late implanter. You'll get in there tomorrow and have a nice big HCG number    

Kate - take your backside home and go to your bed as my auntie would say! No point staying in work when you feel rough as a big bag of rough things! Also I know you're a very generous person but I'm pretty sure your colleagues won't be too happy if you give them the lurgy! Please go home honey and look after yourself! 

Wotcha Jen, sorry AF turned up to ruin the party (not to mention the sheets!) it just goes to show how our cycles seem to have coincided on this thread. She came to visit me too in the night! Bit like Santa really  The odd thing is I'd completely lost track of where I was in my cycle I was thinking I had another week at least!

Hiya Bobbi! How u doin'? Thanks for letting us know about Angel

Yo Pixie - what am I? A clown to you?!   

Mira - boing indeed! We're going to have to call you Zebedee!

Laura - Hey supermama! Still amazed you manage to find the time to come on here! Did you ever get to have that cup of tea that you were craving last week?!  

Anne - thanks for sharing yet another loo mishap! And on your wedding day, no less! Now I don't feel so embarrassed about saying I have REAL probs with bladder control. How many times have we been on the motorway and I've said to DH ok I need you to pull over at the next service station so I can have a pee, I start to doze off and he forgets what I said and zooms straight past it! Then what usually happens is I get absolutely hysterical wriggling in the seat and screaming STOP THE CAR!! NOWWW!!!! and having to jump out and find a bush somewhere   Thank God for Tena Lady is all I can say! Gawd knows what I'll do WHEN I get preg!!! I find tea and alcohol make it worse so now I stick to decaff tea and we never go out anymore so alcohol's no problem  I also clock where the public toilets are everywhere I go!

Love to everyone else! Although I'm very disappointed that you've all been so grown up about things, now I have no excuse not to go out and do exercise! Boooo!!!   

Well I'm still feeling decidedly jolly today despite AF! I also spoke to my mate who gave birth on Weds today and I feel a million times better about everything. Those horrible feelings are gone and now it's just pure reflected joy I feel for her and little Cameron. Not sure if I mentioned that she was never a particularly maternal type but today she says those feelings have come flooding in, along with her milk so I'm just overjoyed for her. And her other half, who despite being a lot older (49) and originally insisting that he was no good with newborns, is mucking in, quite literally! It also helps to know that a lot of the irrational stuff I felt on Weds can probably be put down to PMT!

Well time for walkies! Laters y'all

Jaysus, I'm so slow, 8 replies posted in the meantime!

Angel hon, hoping and praying that bubs is still holding on lovey   please just try to rest up as much as you can!



Jo Macmillan said:


> slycett said:
> 
> 
> > Anyway hun, im here at the mo so anything you need just ask ur beatch
> ...


That's not fair I asked for one first! Where's my beatch?!   

xxx


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Maybe I spoke to soon. As soon as I posted, I got a call from the clinic to say the my beta levels have dropped drastically since Wednesday. 

I'm devastated.


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Aw Angel honey I am so sorry


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Angel hunny there are no words to make it hurt less I'm so very sorry

Just know you're in my thoughts and take care of yourself sweetie    

Sx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Angel- I am so sad for you hun     . I don't know what else to say  

Nix- Hi Hun


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Angel        
Catherine x


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Thanks for your messages.

The statistics are 12% of pregnant women experience bleeding in early pregnancy. Of those 50% go on to miscarry. I had to be part of the 12% and then again in the 50% bracket. Like its not enough being a PR! Its almost like there is a higher power there telling me to give up and that we are not fit to be parents


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Angel I'm so sorry hun    I hope you are not alone.


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Wow girlies 6 pages by lunchtime!! I will have to go back and try and catch up after I have posted!!

Hello lovely girls  

Welcome Caroline and Hayley -   Caroline so sorry to hear about your BFN and Hayley very sorry to hear about your high FSH diagnosis. I too have had this diagnosis, and there is no easy way to say it, it sucks. I would advise you to have it done another couple of times on CD3 over the next few months, just to ensure it that it wasn't a one off freak high level. My heart goes out to you though, it is very upsetting, if you need to talk or need advice please PM me  

Angel hon, I am so so sorry, what a torturous time this has been for you, lots of love to you and your fella   there is no higher power who would do such a thing to you Angel, you will be wonderful parents, we can be very sure of that  

So the scan really did not show much, they could see 3 antrals on one ovary and 2 on the other but there is only one that appears to even want to think of growing, and we are not really sure if it is doing much at all!! It is still so so small to measure. I feel lots of things (a) relief that a year after my dx I am still showing 4-5 antrals (b) flat  because the process for me is always so long and drawn out (c) relieved that we are carrying on (d) disappointment that they didnt cancel today as now I have to do more injections and the next plan of action can not yet start (e) lacking in positivity as I have been her twice before, I have soldiered on and it has all gone wrong in the end. I just feel numb and over it. My lining was up from 4.7 to 5.6 and I am back in on Tuesday, so we will see what happens then. You know how you get when things are not going all that well, you get disillusioned and you almost wish away this opportunity as you feel it is a non starter and you want to get on with something newer and more positive, thats how I feel to be honest, would have been almost relieved if they had cancelled the cycle today!! 

It was lovely to meet Missy at the clinic, really lovely, PM me your email address Missy and I will send you the info that Sam shared with me. 

Missy in terms of going ahead, I think the girls are right, the E2 level will be important when making that decision, they can be pretty sure of the presence of an egg by looking at this so when it comes to decision time have a frank conversation with Jaya about it. Personally having been through this twice before, if I have one follie and a good E2 this time I will be going for it. I will however need to really counsel myself about the pitfalls, there is a chance that you could wake up and there be no egg or as has happened to lovely purps and anne the egg could fertilise abnormally etc. I don't want to be doom and gloom at all, I just think it is important that you feel strong enough to cope with that should it arise. On the other hand (and I like to focus much more on this) there are many cases of pregnancies that have resulted from 1/2 follicles, we have posted links before, I will try and dig them out. This is never an easy decision for anyone to make but lets just focus on that golden follie growing into a lovely fat egg (can you visualise this for me please - NOW!!)  

Just had to take Charlie my big fat tabby cat to the vet, it turns out that HE is the flea bag!! Poor Percy is getting the fleas from him!! I flea my cats, I am a good mum but nothing seems to kill the psycho super fleas!! I have to fumigate the flat again this weekend - fun!! 

I have noticed that alot of you are on quite strict diets, when I say this I mean not to lose weight but I guess for hormone balancing etc. I used to be very strict but now I eat bread again, have the odd glass of wine, have chocolate and the odd cake or biscuit and I still eat dairy - am I nuts  

Thank you all for your wonderful unending support, all of you are so special to me


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

angel555 said:


> Thanks for your messages.
> 
> The statistics are 12% of pregnant women experience bleeding in early pregnancy. Of those 50% go on to miscarry. I had to be part of the 12% and then again in the 50% bracket. Like its not enough being a PR! Its almost like there is a higher power there telling me to give up and that we are not fit to be parents


Nonononono!! That is NOT what's happening here at all! Honey if and only if this does lead to a m/c it is simply that poor little bubs wasn't strong enough to make it, nothing at all to do with whether you're a fit parent. None of this is your fault and you WILL be a great mummy!     

xxx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Angel     so so sorry sweetheart x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Angel - I'm so so sorry for you         I was exactly where you were in Dec 08 when I had my miracle pregnancy and mc, waiting for that phone call and hearing the horrible news that the levels had dropped is just awful. If your anything like me your probably in a state of speechless shock right now.  I had the same thoughts as you, maybe I don't deserve this?  You do deserve to be parents - you don't have to look far to see drug addicts, alcoholics and people who do unmentionable things to children having kids - so it is completely clear there is NO justice or fairness in how or to whom children are born.  I think the % of people who bleed at the start of pregnancy maybe higher than 12% for IVF pregnancies..... it certainly seems higher than that on here. 

You will get past this, I promise you will.  As hard as it's going to be, try to remember that you DID get pregnant - so you can get pregnant, so there is still hope for you.          I'm so so so sorry you have to be going through this, but you are strong and you will get through this. xxxxxx

Missy - I'm sorry it wasn't better news for you      All I can say is if it were me, I would absolutley go for it with that one egg, there is no question in my mind that's what I would do.             this is the egg for you.

Ally - Thinking of you.  All our love and hugs are with you.          

Natasha - gorgeous photo!  Wow!

Sorry I don't have time for more personals today girls.  MIL is arriving soon and staying the weekend so I need to get the house **** and span. 

My AF still hasn't arrived, which has got me competley down and very stressed. I'm trying to tell myself it's due to me having a crap diet for a month, and not doing any herbs or acu whilst I was away....and it's not that my AF has gone forever.  Also, another problem is that every time I have pee'd on the OPK sticks this month, I have had an LH surge.  Which doesn't mean I've ovulating constantly for the last 40 days, what it more likely does mean is that my pituitary gland is pumping out it's hormones like crazy, likely FSH & LH, probably because there is no estrogen to shut it off, or build a lining to shed.  I'd hate to have an FSH test done at the moment, I think I'll avoid that it's just too scarey.  Nix, maybe if we all are cycling together can you guys tell my AF to get on board!

Will be back on later, lol Sam xxx





LOL Sam xx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi Ally - you just posted!  I sent mine before I saw your were on here.

xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

O angel hunny, im so so sorry       take care of urself honey     Dont give up sweetheart, although this must be heartbreaking for we, we are here to will you on   

Nix - ony another 2 hours left to go hunny, and they passed it onto me - so they can have it back ha ha ha evil aint i  

Jo - ur wish is my command    

Ally      petal, no ur not nuts honey, im gonna be on same diet as you this tx, i will try my best to give up things that are bad for me, but to be honest i feel down enough as it is without having to give up everything that to me makes my life fun and enjoyable.  So if ur nuts, then so am i   Petal i will be keeping my fingers and everything else crossed for you this weekend and    like mad that ur golden follie has a nice juicy eggie in it ready for collection   

Bobs -  you are a special girl hunny looking after angel   

Hi catherine, anne, and purps think im going for a kip for half hour


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Angel- Please don't think like that hun (I know it's easier said than done) you will be lovely caring parents and you will get your longed for baby- just have some hoops to jump through first (that's what my lovely hubby said to me today when I was  )


Ally- I'm not normally a     lady but I am for you hun. I so want this to happen for you.
You are a very brave and special girl


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

So very sorry Angel  . It may not be much comfort at th emoment, but as Sam has said, at least you know your body can get pregnant, and it WILL again.


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Ally, I know you are feeling like you've been here before, but there's no reason why this time won't be different - after all - you've been on an entirely different drugs regime haven't you? I too will be   for you...


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Ally sweetie,


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Allybobs - sorry you were disappointed with your appy  but it is good that those antrals are there even if they're being lazy buggers!  Did they increase your dose in the end or are they continuing with gentle stimms? Sorry if you've already said, I'm suffering from bird-brainitis at the moment! Please try not to beat yourself up for not being all happy happy joy joy, it's difficult to stay positive the whole time but whenever you do find yourself feeling really negative, is there anything you can do to distract yourself?  Obviously you have the joy of fumigating the flat over the weekend (yaaay! Not!) but apart from that what else can you think of? I like to bung some music on louuuud and sing (scares the neighbours though!) Or getting stuck into a really good book?  Whatever you need to do to distract yourself. And if it doesn't work well never mind, at least you tried and that's gotta be better than beating yourself up over it, n'est-ce pas?  In the meantime I am doing LOADS of positive thinking on your behalf!        

Oh and poo to the diet!  I am a firm believer that a little bit of what you fancy does you no harm!  And ZW can KMA!!!

xxx

Oh bummocks, 8 replies, I really must learn to type quicker!


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## PinkPeacock (Nov 9, 2006)

Angel - I don't think we've met yet, but I've read your posts and wanted to say how sorry I am


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Sam - hi hunny sorry didnt mean to miss you off   Im with you on the same problem with poas.  I started the cbdfm this month and every day since day 6 i've had a high.  On cd16 today and still high but no peak yet.  Cycle last moth was 42 days tho, so still holding out for a peak which will prob dome day 21 and then af turn up day 26 

Ally see hunny - we are all     and sending you       and loads of     , so have a little bit of what you fancy this weekend sweetheart 

Nix - with you all way on a little bit of what u fancy, and right now i fancy a walnut whip


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Angel, I haven't spoken to you before but just wanted to send you lots of love xxx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Ally - I think it sounds as though your appointment went pretty well.  I know you feel you have been here before but you never know what will happen this time and you are right to feel happy that there are still follies there!  It also sounds as though your lining is pretty good - as I have said before, Kate's was only 6 when the twins were transferred. Try and have a relaxing weekend and stay warm.  We'll all be rooting for you on Tuesday.  

Angel - anything I say will be inadequate; I am so terribly sorry.  I think Sam truly understands in a way I just can't.  But, as she says, you did get pregnant and hopefully that will be a comfort later.

Sam - we'll try and do an AF dance for you!  I agree it's possibly because you've gone off the herbs etc. since they were really working well for you.  I'd get back in the saddle on those again.

Hi Carys! Hi Nix1 Hi Hayley!

love to all.

On diets - is bread bad?  I didn't know.  I think I eat pretty healthily - try and buy organic wherever possible and keep things balanced.  Lots of fruit and veggies and no caffeine or alcohol (except the odd sip).  Trouble is you can drive yourself a bit nuts (which I eat a lot of too) trying to do the right thing.  I thought dairy was ok too as part of a balanced diet.  If I don't eat enough generally my weight plummets and that is bad too.  I just try and keep it balanced.  Have I said balanced enough or have I got the balance wrong leading to imbalance?


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Ally sweetheart, I can see why you feel like the history is repeating itself but I don’t remember you having that many antrals before? It is obvious that your body wants to get pregnant and you are not menopausal like they said you were before. I am no expert but is this the best protocol for you? Did they up your dose? Those antrals need a good kick up the bum to grow if you ask me. 
Sorry about Charlie and the fleas – what a bummer!   

xxxxx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Lightweight: Docs/nurses can be so cruel. I’d been told I had a very low AMH over the phone too and it wasn’t even the doctor calling me to tell this but it was his WIFE! I was on a train packed with commuters, can you imagine the state I was in? She even gave me the donor speech on the phone. Who the hell she thought she was – I have no idea!
Sorry about your DH having an accident after the bad news – is he OK? 

xx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Lightweight - in my sister's case it was high FSH and not low AMH which caused her to be booted!  She was told her FSH was too high and they would only treat her with donor eggs.  It was St. Mary's in Manchester.  She jumped ship to Manchester CARE and got pregnant with the twins on her first cycle.  They didn't run an AMH test because they told her her FSH was so bad that the AMH was bound to be bad too and it wasn't worth upsetting her further when it wouldn't change her protocol.  

I cannot believe you were so shabbily treated as well as being given completely wrong information. How can any doctor possibly say nobody has conceived with AMH of 0.7?  Has he tested every woman ever before the became pregnant?  I rather suspect not.....            

Please know that you are not alone. Ladyverte here was turned away from her first clinic because her AMH was too low (I think it was 0.4 or 0.5 ng/ml) and she went to the Lister where she responded fine and got 6 eggs.  She didn't get her BFP that time but they are optimistic for the future.


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Thank you all 

Sam - love you  you are such a fighter, I had a dream the other night that i had done the estrogen priming protocol and got pregnant through it and that I had made you and Missy godparents (sorry missy forgot to tell you that later!!) I am well up for getting involved in researching more about EPP but when can we do it as I work Mon - Thurs??  Your AF still not here - this is getting frustrating now!! Come on you AF we need you to come pleeeeaaaase, you are doing Sams head in!! 

Nix - You bird brain No! I am the bird brain round here, cant string a sentance together, cannot remember what people post and everyone posts such lovely things I want to give individual responses but I just find it so hard, I think these drugs effect my brain, honest I do  Yeah I need a distraction, got the Benjamin button film tomorrow but to be honest Brad pitt is making my skin crawl as an old man!! I am so glad I can have a little of what I fancy but how about a whole lot of what I fancy, I had a jumbo twix, yogurt and burger one day this week, another day I had indian takeaway and krispy creme, yesterday I had a Rachels organic divine rice, I am unstoppable!!

Jo - unfortunately they didnt really change my drugs, I have done Menopur all three times and clomid twice, the only difference this time is that I am doing chinese herbs alongside  and did the pill before. Must have been hard seeing the first PR thread sweetheart, I would have found it hard too 

Anne - glad I have got you to go all religious on me!! Nothing like converting someone!! 

Lightweight - I had a horrific experience when I got my diagnosis at UCH (where was your clinic by the way), it was delivered in a heartless way by a heavily pregnant smug consultant!! Also when my sister went in for tests she saw a nurse who said "so you are menopausal then" as if she was saying "nice day outside" - LOVELY. You would have thought one look at her sweet 37 year old face may have made her realise that being possibly menopausal was not going to be very easy to hear!!!! I really empathise with you 

Pix - you are right, I am not really that happy that we have tried the same thing so many times but it is so hard to fight fight fight and Ben gets cross with me for questioning the doctors, why are boys such wimps? You can't just sit back with something so important and Ben really will not question anything - arrghhhh!!

I have set up a new thread in the POF section called 'Miracle stories for the low days' which has links to lots of inspirational success stories ending in pregnancy for high fsh/ low amh girls. It would be great if anyone has inspiring links if they can put them there. This way, when we are very low and need to be lifted up we can find a whole treasure trove of inspiration, and most importantly we will be able to find it quickly. Here is the link:

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=174687.0

Sam can you put your ones on there if you have them to hand? LJ - I think you have some corkers too? I am hoping that it will be a good link to give to newbies who come on in a distressed state too 

Is the title crap - shall we call it something else?

Love you all xxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Ally- That is  a absolutely wonderful thread name- not looked yet as I am still WFH     but I will do as soon as I can hun


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi lightweight  - hunny that treatment is disgraceful    Hope ur dh is ok after his accident, u are in the right place here hun   

Pix - why do these clinics treat us like no hopers it makes me so angry, all they are bothered about are their stats  

I had 2 cycles at birmingham womens and decided to have my amh tested before trying again.  I rang the priory in birmingham to enquire cos i was thinking of moving there, they told me they had an opening evening in december offering a free consultation with fertility "expert" would i like to book an appointment time?  I said great yes of course i will so app was booked.  Move forward 3 weeks (approx 10 days after amh test) i rang to get results nurse said oh its only 0.71 and i said oh thats really low isnt it she said yes and we left it at that.  3hrs later i had a call from another nurse saying oh we have ur amh result through now and its really low we dont think you will respond to tx so there's no point having ur free consultation so we will cancel it for you.............however if you would like to see our fertility expert as a paying patient we can make you an appointment    I lost my rag then and told them not to bother as i had already made app at the lister as they offer different drug protocols to get a better response and not just bog standard ivf like they do.  Plus they are not so focused on their stats and offer us poor responders at least a chance, then i slammed the phone on the beatch   Im still angry now when i think about it all


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Bloody hell Lightweight what a horrible experience. And for you too Pix, jeez don't these  holes have any compassion?!

Anyway you know what we say to docs who write you off for low AMH?  We say KMA!!! And then we come on FF and we look at the PR bumps and babies thread!

Allypally - bless you for putting that thread togevver!  and yup you is a birdbrain too innit cos I still don't know if they increased your dosage or not...    Anyhoo enjoy Brad (well, not old Brad but yummy young Brad... mmmm!  )

Heee! Guess what everyone?  I just realised have to break my diet today cos auntie Zita says no fasting when AF's in town.  YIPPEEEE!!!!!!!  Er I mean, what a shame, I was feeling so much better for it and another 2 days would have been fantastic!  No seriously it's really good and I do feel better for it but damn it's gonna be nice to chew something for a change!   

xxx

Bummocks! Another post - wotcha Kate and well done for telling BW where to shove it in no uncertain terms!


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Pix - hi hunny - oooo my af is due in 9 days perhaps i should get some practise in and not fast for when its here  .

Ally - hunny that thread name is brilliant - know i could do with a bit of lift at the mo


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Kate: Are you still at work? Sod them mate! Just go home if you are not feeling well - FFS! We are not in 80's!  

Jo: It sounds like you have a beatch now!  


OMG how cold is it!!   
Just went out to get some food, it's so cold that my face froze and then fell off. It did - honest!   

xxx


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

slycett said:


> Pix - hi hunny


Who    



Pixie75 said:


> it's so cold that my face froze and then fell off. It did - honest!


   

xxx


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Ally - what is it with men and "doctor knows best"?  You are paying enough at the Lister - they should not be afraid of the questions and should actually expect them.  And I thought your sister's FSH was only about 12 or so.  What did the nurse think she was on about  I will check out your thread and see what I can add.  I think I emailed Sam of couple of successes - one lady had an AMH of 0.06 or something and got pg naturally!

My sister says the worst thing is that her old clinic STILL won't admit they were wrong to tell her she had "zero chance" and was "untreatable".  She has written three times now explaining that someone with "zero chance" would not have got pregnant and they just keep dodging the point and congratulating her in a patronising manner.  I think it does depress her to feel that the next patient who gets an FSH result of 22 will be treated in exactly the same way and told they have no chance, even though they know what the end result was for Kate.


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Nix - soz hun im a poorly blonde at the mo   

LJ - do you think it would make any difference if we complained to hfea about our treatment at these clinics hun, i for one would be willing to do that.


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Also will Mir, Laura, Jen and any other girls who have had high fsh/ low amh post their success stories on my new link? xxxx

Pix - have you found your face yet??  

Glad you all like the link, lets hope it fills up with wonderful info for us all


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Ally - I added a couple but I can't find one I PM'd to Sam which was quite good.  This poor woman was positing she had just got her AMH of 0.1 back and was really upset, told to go for immediate IVF with little hope etc.  She got some nice responses and then posted later to admit she had discovered she was actually pregnant when she was given her AMH result!  I hope Sam still has my PM!


----------



## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Hi Ally, thanks for saying I could contact you, I've sent you a PM, hope thats ok- lots of questions- sorry!

I work as a midwife, and organised my initial blood tests myself, just to 'check everything was ok'.  So I actually looked the results up myself, so had a big shock with my FSH of 38.  I saw the Gp the following day who wasn't much help, but my first consultant appt is tommorow, so I'm so glad I've had the chance to read around and chat to some of you ladies who know about this, before the appointment,where I'm sure he won't be very optimistic about my chances!  So thank you all x


----------



## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Hi Twinnie (aka Slycett)

Surely you can go home now and get yourself snuggled into bed to cure that cold.  

I too wish that the clinics would publish their criteria - I'm going to tell my NHS consultant that the cut off for IVR at ARGC is 11 (ish) and that this site is more useful that the HFEA official blurb!!!!

    and      to everyone.

It's the weekend      

Catherine x


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hello!

Ally - ur andral count is fab, think my last cycle it was 6 for me! remeber your on a low dose.    where is the new thread.

Jo - i did think that when i read through.  sorry ddnt mean to upset you.    i think it means your next in line for a bfp!  

oh bum, i can't remember what else i was gonna type.  my brain is shrivelled.


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Hayley - I am sure the lovely Ally will answer all your questions!  I suspect the first thing the consultant will want to do is a repeat test to ensure it's not a blip or a lab error or something.

Hi Catherine 

Hi Laura - hope the chiplets are doing well!

Bobbi-


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

lj - they great... how are the twins?  are they smiling now?


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Laura Hon here is the link
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=174687.0


----------



## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Hi LJ

I meant to say a big thank you to you when I first posted for all the info you have posted on DHEA - it was so useful when I first realised my FSH was on the high side. It's interesting that Dr. Sam at the ARGC is apparently recommending it now as well. I haven't told them I'm taking it, mind you.    .

Hope the   isn't too bad. I'm still waiting for her to appear - usually she's here within a few hours of the pee sticks!!

Catherine x


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

not sure if the twins are smiling yet but I do know Oliver is now 8 1/2 lbs!!  

Catherine - you are very welcome!

 is proving a horror this month - have taken some fresh painkillers in advance of cirque du soleil this evening!


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Ally:    No hun - no more face! Shame, really.

Your ne thread is great- what a fab idea.   

Tash: Are you there? 
Just a quick question - Am I safe in getting my lunch from "Fresh & Wild"? 
You will be proud of me cos I've had some fresh wheatgrass juice today, I was nearly sick but still managed to finish it - errrmmm how sweet is it by the way?


xxxx


----------



## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi ladies - Ally your the best!! I had wanted to start that thread myself but lazy me never got around to it!! I will absolutley add my links onto them sometime over this weekend, hopefully I'll get a break from frantic cooking and cleaning while MIL is here!

Re IVM girls, I have been speaking to the doctor who invented IVM and while he sympathises with us, he really doesn't think (and they have done some trials) that IVM offers any hope for PRs - but he did say he has had some success with something he calls "crash IVF", I posted a link to that on this thread a couple of weeks or so ago now if you want to go back and have a look....sorry I haven't still got the link.  I didn't follow up on crash IVF as the number of people in the trial was very low, and the success rate wasn't anything stunning either.  Plus I just don't have time at the moment as I'm swapped by Estrogen Priming Protocol paperwork!  I have to admit - I didn't shower yesterday, I was too busy using wikipedia to translate half the stuff in the paperwork I was sent!

I have also been speaking with a doc in the UK who does IVM, I'll post his last email so you can see why IVM is unlikely to work for PRs when I get back to my PC - I'm not on mine at the moment. I totally see his point, but I also agree with him that in the future - far future, it's possible IVM maybe able to offer something to PRs - unfortunatley I don't think that that will be in our timeframe  . 

I'm not done with them yet though - my next line of questioning will be, if a PR has had too many unsuccessful IVF cycles, and is not willing to give this another try.....even though the chance with IVM is incredibly low........... as it's "completley" different than IVF, would it not be worth a shot? I mean, if our few eggs do not respond to IVF, before giving up could we at least be given the opportunity to try IVM?

Ally - I loved that spreadsheet! I'd never seen that, amazing!  I'm going to guess this is natural, but what exactly does BD mean?

Sam xxxxx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Ally - Do you want me to post, not sure i fit the bill?  My fsh was only 17?  Others on the thread had FSH in the hundreds?


----------



## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

*Angel *- so very sorry to read your news - how devastating  I have no words, just lots of virtual    to you 

*Ally* - good news re your antrals - sending them lots of growing vibes - grow you buggers, grow!!   

*Hazelnut* - sorry this might be a stupid question but what cycle day was you on when your FSH was tested at 38? Was it day 2-4? 

Sorry for no more personals - still feeling really rubbish from cold, which has now gone onto my (now sore) chest, checked with pharmacist and can't have any cough medicines, even the mild ones - just paracetamol. Going to stay in and keep warm for next few days - hopefully will shake it off over the weekend, if I don't will go see my GP.

Going to post updated list in a sec, don't think I did one since about 3 threads back - sorry! 

Lots of love to all 

Steph xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Laura - what was your AMH?? Did you ever have it done??  

Steph honey - thanks for the growing vibes!! I am so sorry you are still feeling rubbish - big kiss


----------



## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

*TEAM PR*   *PR Ladies awaiting next treatment:* *Anna the third*
Planning 3rd IVF(?) - due to start ??/??/08*Bankie*
4th IVF - Lister - starting soon January 2009*Betty1*
looking into lowering FSH after BFN on 3rd IVF in August '07*CathB*
contemplating 4th IVF maybe on Short Protocol, or possibly donor eggs?*CPJ*
2nd IVF - Lister or Guys? - starting soon after BFN in September 2008*Hayleigh*3rd ICSI - starting soon January/February 2009*Jo McMillan*1st IVF with previous partner cancelled - now on DHEA & TTC naturally with new partner *LittleJenny*1st cycle to retrieve eggs for freezing/future use retrieved 7 eggs, with 4 being quality enough for freezing - currently contemplating ttc naturally at end of summer*Lola C*2nd cycle to start soon - 1st cycle was BFN in May 2008*MillyFlower*4th ICSI cycle - maybe at the Jinemed?*Purple72*3rd IVF - Lister - start pill next cycle February '09 *Saffa77*2nd cycle - IVF - SP - due to start February '09 *Sam22*Cycle monitoring October '08, 1st IVF Feb '09*Sammiejr*1st IVF tested negative 20/02/08 - next appointment 29/04/08*Slycett*3rd IVF - due to start soon*Sonia7*4th IVF/ICSI - Midland Fertility Clinic - was due to start November '08 but delayed to January 2009 due to hypertension *Swinny*FET (after 4th ICSI) - early February 2009 *PR Ladies currently undergoing treatment:* *Ally1973*
3rd IVF - SP Lister - currently stimming with Clomid/Menopur - EC ??/02/09*Lainey-Lou*5th IVF - LP - London/Cyprus - Jan/Feb 2008 - currently downregging *Littleareca*2nd ICSI - January 2009 - currently stimming - EC ??/002/09*Missyg*
1st IVF - Lister - currently stimming - EC 13/02/09?*Team PR members currently on 2 week wait  :* *Ali27*
1st IVF - Lister - LP - converted to timed sex - testing ??/02/09*Elinor*6th IVF - SP - January '09 - testing ??/02/09*Zuri*
1st IVF - LP - January '09 - testing ??/02/09 *Team PR members who need to update: * *Echappebelle*
7th IVF - SP - testing ??/11/08 - update required re result*Team PR members who have experienced a recent miscarriage or loss: * *Abdncarol* 1st IVF - Aberdeen - no heartbeat found 05/10/08 miscarried at 14 weeks  *Angel55*
3rd IVF - January '09 - tested positive 02/02/09 but bleeding then falling HCG levels 06/02/09  *Beachgirl*3rd IVF - tested positive 28/04/08 - no heart beat found 02/06/08 at 9w4d - Natural miscarriage 21/06/08 at 12 weeks  *Cath J* 3rd IVF (2nd ICSI) - Care Northampton - no heartbeat found 14/05/08 miscarried 9w3d  *Inconceivable* 1st DE IVF (after 3 IVFs with own eggs) - Reprofit - tested positive 20/08/08 but biochemical  *Jeza* 1st IVF - tested positive 18/10/08 - miscarried at 5w  *Latestarter* 3rd ICSI - Jinemed - mid-November 2008 - tested positive - no heartbeat found/blighted ovum diagnosed on scan 7w5d 06/01/09 *Nikki2008* 4th ICSI - premature labour started 27/10/08 - baby boy born too early at 20w - so sorry  - planning next cycle Feb '09 IM Barc'a*Snic* 3rd IVF - tested positive 27/04/08 - miscarried at 6w  *Tracymohair*2nd IVF, with ICSI this time - September 2008 - tested positive 08/10/08 - scan 24/10/08 showed empty sac  *Team PR members currently recovering from a negative or cancelled treatment cycle: * *AbbyCarter*
4th IVF - August 2008 - tested negative  *Alegria*3rd IVF - Lister - November '08 - SP - cancelled due to no response after 6 days of stims *AlexG*1st IVF - 1 egg collected - abnormal fertilisation 11/03/08  *Anna1973*1st IVF - Lister - EC 29/11/08 - no eggs retrieved  *Anne G*
1st IVF - Lister - January 2009 - 3 eggs - failed fertilisation  - will try again in March '09 *Babyspoons/Spoony*1st ICSI - April '08 - tested negative  *Be Lucky (Bernie)*3rd ICSI - Lister - tested negative 25/07/08  *BDP (Becca - Ally's sister)*1st IVF - December '08 - converted to IUI due to poor response - tested negative  *Bobbi3*
1st IVF - SP - Hammersmith - EC 12/12/08 - 1 egg - abnormal fertilisation  *Bunjy*3rd IVF - Chelsfield Park - tested negative ??/10/08  *Carole69*2nd/3rd ICSI - EC was 17/04/08 - tested BFN? (update required)  *ClaireP*4th ICSI - Lister - tested negative September '08  *Donkey*
3rd IVF - EC 17/01/09 - ET 20/01/09 -tested negative 02/02/09  *ElenaSch*3rd ICSI - Slovakia - March '08 - tested negative 14/03/08  *Elsbelle*1st IVF - cancelled due to no response 15/08/08  - considering using donor eggs at Serum, Athens *Fishface*2nd ICSI - tested negative 21/12/08  - follow up 29/01/09 *Jal*2nd ICSI - Lister - SP - 2 embies transferred day 2 - tested negative 17/10/08  *Jan27 (Cheryl)*2nd ICSI at Lister - Feb '08 - cancelled due to no response - maybe Jinemed next?  *Jnr*1st IVF - UCH London - 1 blastocyst transferred - tested negative April '08  *Kazzie40*2nd IVF - Turkey - LP - PGD for translocated gene - October '08 - cancelled as 2 follies raced off in front  *Kiwigirl*1st IVF - NZ - cancelled due to poor response  - *Ladyverte*1st IVF/ICSI/PESA - 2 embies transferred - tested positive but chemical pregnancy  *Lilacbunnikins*1st IVF - Barts - June '08 - cancelled due to poor response  *Lincs Jax*7th IVF - only 1 egg fert, didn't make it to transfer  *Lins1982*Diagnosed with POF - 1st IVF Jinemed, Turkey - September '08 - cancelled due to no response  *Merse1*FET - 13/03/08 - tested negative  scheduled to have endo op 13/06/08*Minttuw*3rd ICSI - ARGC - tested negative 12/07/08  *Moth*1st ICSI - tested negative September '08  *Natasha6*3rd IVF - 2 embies transferred - tested negative 22/10/08  *Nova*3rd IVF (1st cycle cancelled as no response/2nd cycle no fertilisation) - Nurture - August '08 - cancelled due to poor response  *Nixf01 (Paris Nix)*6th IVF & immunes - ARGC - November '08 - ET 04/12/08 - 3 embies transferred - tested negative  *Pesca*1st ICSI - July/August '08 - one egg - failed fertilisation  *Pinkcarys*
1st IVF - 7 eggs - tested negative 31/01/09  *Pixie75*1st IVF - Turkey - 1 egg/1 embie - tested negative 09/01/09  *Paw*2nd IVF - UCH - tested negative 22/07/08  *Rachel (Moderator)*Fresh treatment cycle at Ceram in November - tested negative 02/12/08  *Rural Chick*1st IUI - ARGC - tested negative 06/02/09  *Sheldon*2nd ICSI - LP - Norway - October 2008 - tested negative 05/11/08  *Shelly38*2nd IVF - Reprofit - October 2008 - cancelled due to no response  - booked for DE treatment August 2009*Silverglitter*2nd ICSI - LP - tested negative May '08  - follow up 27/06/08*Siheilwli*4th cycle - ICSI - tested negative 17/10/08  *SJC*4th cycle - SP - Lister - tested negative  *SpecialK*1st ICSI - EC 17/11/08 - 4 mature eggs - tested negative 02/12/08 ^hug^ *Swinz (SarahSwin)*2nd cycle - IVF - SP - 2 eggs collected - failed/abnormal fertilisation  *Terry*6th ICSI - SP - tested negative 28/05/08 - will try 7th cycle end June/start July 2008  *TracyM*3rd DIVF - July/August 2008 - tested negative  *Vonnie*3rd IVF - Royal Infirmary, Edinburgh - tested negative  *PR Ladies who have decided to stop treatment/move on:* *Francie*Good Luck    *Lollipop (Gabrielle)*Good Luck    *PR Ladies undergoing Adoption process:* *Linziloo*Good Luck    *Popsi*Good Luck   *PR Ladies with bumps*   *Ali May*
 on 2nd IVF - tested positive 10/10/08 - first scan 30/10/08 *Beans33*
 on 2nd IVF/ICSI - SP - 2 transferred + 2 frosties - first scan 09/09/08 *Boppet*
 on 1st ICSI - Lister - 13 eggs (so technically not a PR in spite of lots of doom/gloom from previous doc, who gave donor egg speech!) - due ??/??/09*Button76*
 on 1st IVF - UCH - twins! due ??/??/09*Droogie (Heather)*
 on 2nd ICSI after TESA/TESE - Nurture Notts - 1st scan 17/12/08*EBW*
 naturally! - November 2008 - due ??/??/09*Jameson777*  on 2nd IVF, this time with ICSI - Hammersmith - 2 embies transferred - tested positive 25/08/08 - first scan 05/11/08 *Jojotall*  on 2nd IVF - Lister - LP - 2 embies transferred - tested positive 22/10/08 - due ??/??/09*Juicy*  on 3rd IVF - Lister - tested positive 25/08/08 - due 04/05/09 *Kitykat*
 on 4th IVF - ARGC - SP + immune tx - tested positive 30/11/08 - due 08/08/09*Matchbox*  on 1st IVF June 2008 - LP - LWH - due 14/02/09*Odette*  on 1st DE IVF (after 3 IVFs with own eggs) - Barcelona IVI - 2 transferred/8 frosties - tested positive 06/08/08 - due 14/04/09*Ophelia*  on 9th ICSI - Sweden - HCG beta results 28/11/08 - first scan ??/12/08*Swoo*  on 3rd ICSI - SP - next scan 29/05/08 - due ??/??/08*Stephjoy*  on 1st DE ICSI (after 4 ICSIs/2 cancelled ICSIs/1 Natural IVF/ICSI with own eggs) - Reprofit - 2 transferred/1 frostie - tested positive 30/09/08 - due 08/06/09*Sunshine1977*  on 3rd ICSI - February 2008 - due 31/10/08 *When Will It Happen?*  on 1st ICSI - tested positive 10/07/08 - due ??/??/09/td]*PR Ladies with babies*   *Bugle*  Benjamin Oliver - born November 26th 2008 - after 2nd ICSI at Jinemed *EBW*  Kate - born January 14th 2008 after 4th ICSI*Emmachoc*  Hari - born October 4th 2008 - after FET following 2nd IVF cycle*Laurab*  Eddy Noah,  Cerys Mary and  Bethan Lilian Doris born December 16th 2008 
(triplets 33+1, all healthy  ) after 4th cycle, this time with ICSI - Jinemed*LittleJenny's sister, Kate*  Emily Megan and  Oliver William born November 20th 2008 after 1st IVF *Miranda7* Robert - born June 26th 2008 - after 3rd ICSI at Jinemed*Nicky W* Emily Alice - born May 23rd 2008 after surprise natural BFP while d/regging for 4th IVF*PaulB & his DW Jennig*  Caitlin Mary - born New Year's Day 2009 - surprise natural BFP April '08 after failed fertilisation on 2nd ICSI in Feb '08*Pin*  Olivia Jane - born November 30th 2007 after 1st IVF*Roozie*  Emma,  Lucy and  Jake born January 29th 2008 
(triplets 32+6, all healthy  ) after 1st GIFT at UCH


----------



## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

laurab said:


> Jo - i did think that when i read through. sorry ddnt mean to upset you.  i think it means your next in line for a bfp!


aww, thanks Laura. I'm fine, don't worry. It is great for everyone on here to see what success team PR have had over the years. Do you promise I'll get a BFP next?Promise Promise Promise    

Ally - thanks ever so much for that thread. It's great, really encouraging.

I had the same query as Sam about BD though..that's one abbreviation I don't know!


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Big D..k


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> Big D..k


Very good Nix!!!!

I dont know what it means (bloody americans) but assume it means au natural!

A xxxx


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Blimey, maybe I was right then?!   

xxx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Yeah - I really am hoping the Big D**k method works for me as i'm not doing so well on the IVF!!


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi ladies 

Ally - think i may join u on the big d**k method - think i just need cheering up    

Jo - hi hun its ur beatch here ready and waiting at ur service  

Feeling poo so sorry no personals just running and a bath and goona get me jamas on, wish i hadnt got work 2moz, least it only 4 hrs i suppose


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Ummm....ladies, BD = Baby Dance or so I was once told by an American friend.

Ally sorry that your scan didn't go that well today. I really do hope that Tuesday brings better news.  

Missyg - I agree with others, you should go for that one follie, it might just be THE ONE.  

Rural Chick - I do hope that the beta test tomorrow gives you a lovely surprise. I've heard of so many women with negative HPTs only to be told that their hcg is positive.

Bobbi -   thanks hun. Will call you back. 

Thanks for all your posts. Lots of love to you all. At the moment I'm just feeling numb; waiting to break down and have a proper cry. I haven't moved from the sofa since the phone call.


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

Hi all 
I've not mailed for a while. My 3rd IVF failed and I've had more tests. Most recent FSH 11.7, AMH 6 - poor responder.
I went for a consultation yesterday at the UCH clinic with Dr Serhal who painted a rather dire picture. He told me my tubes had no doubt been damaged by the removal of my ectopics - cutting off the blood supply by half to each ovary. Therefore, I have very little chance of IVf ever working re a live birth. He suggested an Ovarian Stimulation test but said really I should consider adoption or egg donation. We weren't shocked just more totally , totally demoralised. I guess we thought there was a little hope. He was very helpful and understood that none of this could have been helped - as the ectopics had to be removed, just a shame they messed my ovaries up in the process...
Anyone got any views...grabbing at straws. Feel abit like when you are desperately trying to swim and keep above water and then you just give up and sink...miserable I know but there just seems no way out of this mess.
Egg donation is a massive thing to consider eh...it will never be my child but it would be my husbands....wish I could turn back the clock xxx
Any views would be useful / comforting x


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Girls BD = Baby Dance! ( though maybe a big di*k would do the trick, or at least we would enjoy the trying!)


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kazzie - love it! Is that really the translation?  

Angel - Big kiss hon - so sorry about everything you must be worn out  

Bunjy - Oh hon I am not saying that your diagnosis is not true but I can tell you something else, Dr Serhal and UCH have a terrible reputation for being doom and gloom with anyone that doesnt have peak fertility/ anatomy. I had a terrible experience with UCH (different problem but cold heartless attitude). I would strongly suggest you get a second opinion before you give up and move on to other options, you dont want to regret it down the line.  . Also I dont think you can just take a consultants word for it as it they can't really say that you can't have a baby unless you have your ovaries removed (and still then I have heard stories of women who have had a bit of their ovary left behind who have got pregnant!!). Therefore I would advise you (a) find a new clinic (you are in london?) The Lister are fantastic. AND (b) actually try some ovarian stimulation, this really is the best way to find out what your ovaries are capable of. The lister will probably say something completely different (as I am obviously not a consultant) but please make sure you get that second opinion  

A xxxx


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Hi everyone - Angel I am sorry about your news,   thinking of you.

Ally - sorry the news wasn't as good as we all hoped, but   that there is at least one decent folly when you have a scan next week  

Missy - Like the others have said, I would definately go for it with the one folly - good luck and hope it brings your BFP   

Jo  

Rural Chick - sorry about the BFN, I too hope it's different news when you have the blood test results tomorrow  

Bunjy, It is a difficult decision about the ED but if you did go down that route the baby would be yours, you would have nutured it and brought it into being and given birth, I believe that a lot of the ED mums on that thread say the baby feels all theirs and so they should because it is theirs! Good luck with your decision.   

Kate - Hope you are feeling better soon  

Hi Hazel and welcome.

Hi to everyone else Bobbi, Miranda, Laura,  Steph, Purple, beach, Juicy, Sam, Anne, pixie, LJ and anyone else I haven't mentioned

Take care love Karen xxx


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Ally - Yup cross my heart...........................


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Yep, I second that!  BD= baby dance!!!  
There was another chat- forum I used to go on from time to time before I knew I had a problem and its quite a common abbreviation!

Steph- yes my FSH was on day 3


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Ah huh Baby Dance ^rolfmao^ . So it shows that for high fsh women, on this spreadsheet more women are getting their BFP the ol fashioned way than my IVF....Ally I remember having this conversation with you, that this is the trend we had noticed ourselves frantically searching the web. Difficult though, as IVF just seems to much more immediate and ttc naturally just feels like it takes time that we don't have  Even though it's possibly just as if not more successful.............

Damn I just lost a big post!!! Arrgghhh, I'll try to put it all together again. Sorry for the lack of personals lately girls - I've been trying to spend more time on research and less time on chit chat, as I find I just can't do it all...I'm probably more useful & interesting this way anyway!

Angel - all my love to you. Nothing can take away the pain you are feeling today. Time does heal, you won't feel this horrid forever. I promise it does. Try to do something nice for yourself this weekend, eat a piece of chocolate cake, shopping, massage - anything ok 

Kate - hi! Absolutely complain to the ****! Please do. In the survey they had going recently I made strong suggestions that clinics should be charged for telling woman that when it is entirely not true. They should only be able to say, "chances are low, we don't treat you but there are other clinics that will give you a chance!" The other suggestion I made was that alongside published success rates, they should HAVE to state their screening criteria, whether that be FSH, AMH or age or anything else. Infertility is a life shattering diagnosis for many women, why are they allowed to inflict serious psychological damage without repercussions?

LJ - Sorry for your sis that they won't admit they said anything wrong - [email protected] I hope she complained to **** too. I've been back on the herbs about 2 weeks now... bbooo hooo, where is my AF. Have fun at cdsoliel - I'm going tomorrow night

Nix - you always make me laugh.   bisous

Steph - thanks so much for sending out the update again, what would we do without you. Go home and keep your bump warm!

Bunjy - hi and welcome! You absolutely need a second opinion from a REAL clinic like the Lister....I have a funny feeling that you may end up a lot more positive once you have spoken with them. The ARGC has a terrible cut off for high FSH women, but actually you would still receive tx there! So all is not lost. I did notice something weird in your post, about the tubes cutting off half the blood supply to your ovaries. Girls did anyone else think this sounded a bit...well lets be honest, completely c$%p!??I didn't think the tubes carried blood to your ovaries at all, in fact I thought they did carry egg to womb...but the idea is for them "not" to have any blood in them. .... for example if lining from the uterus somehow finds it's way to your tubes it can cause endometritis.....so this all sounds very strange to me. Sounds like you need a real doctor dear!

Pix - hello . Bluuurrggghhh, I really hate wheatgrass, it makes me gag. I know I should push myself to drink it more - I'm proud of you.

Hazelnut - welcome! Try editing your profile and putting a little bit about yourself in your signature, it helps us all get to know you xx Oh you just did that. xx

Hi Jo, Laura, Rural Chic, Natasha, Anne, Beach, Mir, Tracey, Popsi, Swinny, Purple and all the other ladies. Xx Love and happy Friday to all!

Bobbi - here is a bit of my discussions with the IVM guy, sorry it's not more positive. Xx It's a step forward for women with PCOS but not really for us,  at least not now



> IVM for women with low ovarian reserve. I obviously completely understand the difficulties faced by couples where there is a problem with reduced ovarian reserve. In the past, IVM has been attempted as a treatment option for such couples. However, the antral follicle count and female age are by far the main predictors of success during IVM (more so that the level of AMH or FSH). The resting antral follicles are so small that the rate of picking up eggs is much lower during IVM than it is from the generally larger follicles found during IVF. Furthermore, by definition, the eggs retrieved during IVM are immature and therefore need to be matured in the laboratory for a couple of days. Therefore only around 60% of the immature eggs collected actually become mature. At that point they are not the same as an IVF egg which has been collected when already matured in the body. We know that an IVM mature egg has less chance of later implanting than an IVF mature egg. Therefore, for all women, regardless of the state of their ovaries, the success rate with IVM is less than it is for IVF.
> 
> Consequently the studies that have been reported where IVM has been tried for women with a low antral follicle count the success rates are no better, and indeed probably worse, than achieved during IVF. In Oxford we do not offer IVM to women with normal ovaries for the reasons given above and so the same is true for women with low ovarian reserve/low antral follicle count. It may well be that in the future with improved laboratory maturation techniques that the situation changes. For instance, it may be that in the future an immature egg, may have a much higher chance of becoming mature in the laboratory and result in an even better quality egg than one matured in the body.


As I said before; I'm not done with them yet though - my next line of questioning will be, if a PR has had too many unsuccessful IVF cycles, and is not willing to give this another try.....even though the chance with IVM is incredibly low........... as it's "completley" different than IVF, would it not be worth a shot? I mean, if our few eggs do not respond to IVF, before giving up could we at least be given the opportunity to try IVM?


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

dont you hate it when you try to save time by typinng the smiley's and they don't work!!!


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Sam thanks once again for all that usefull information! you are an absolute gem!

I knew they were doing IVM at oxford with PCOS ladies, but to be honest not sure they ever be helpful to PR's even if the results anywhere else  prove it to be beneficial

Fish & I both have had the DE speech IMHO far too early from Oxford as they do not seem to have ANY idea about PR's and just close the door on IVF if there one size fits all protocol does not work. Cannot Imagine them being any more flexible with IVM.

Good luck with the next line of questioning, I just can guess that they never have PR's with more than 2 or 3 at tops failed cycles because they just deliver a stat 5% chance and refuse to treat as well as DE speech,

Sx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Bunjy - I have to say this is the reason that i wanted you to get a second opinion - I really didn't think what Dr Serhal had said sounded correct, Sam has explained exactly what I was thinking!

_Bunjy - hi and welcome! You absolutely need a second opinion from a REAL clinic like the Lister....I have a funny feeling that you may end up a lot more positive once you have spoken with them. The ARGC has a terrible cut off for high FSH women, but actually you would still receive tx there! So all is not lost. I did notice something weird in your post, about the tubes cutting off half the blood supply to your ovaries. Girls did anyone else think this sounded a bit...well lets be honest, completely c$%p!??I didn't think the tubes carried blood to your ovaries at all, in fact I thought they did carry egg to womb...but the idea is for them "not" to have any blood in them. .... for example if lining from the uterus somehow finds it's way to your tubes it can cause endometritis.....so this all sounds very strange to me. Sounds like you need a real doctor dear!_

Girls - I have updated my miracle list, I heard that you couldnt access a lot of the links so I have lovingly pasted them all into the thread so you can see them now!!!


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Bless you ally you're a star

Sx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

jo- i promise!!!!!!!!! 

ally - i never had amh done, well they did it in turkey but i never got the results too scared.


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

You are a definate success story though Steph and an inspiration to many of us!


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Sam - honey you deserve a gold medal with all ur research   we love you sooooo much   

Purple - i didnt have the donor egg speech to my face hun, it was just written in my notes when i had my copy arrive in the post, not one of best days  

Angel thinking of you sweetheart    

Ally hope ur ok hunny, thinking of u and hoping ur enjoying a bit of what u fancy     

Bunjy     hunny sorry ur 3rd cycle failed.  Hmmmm donor eggs now thats a hard one   

See if this helps you in any way as i could sure use some help deciding on this one! Think me and dh hav decided that this will be our last go with my own few eggs left (thats if i manage to get any)  My bf offered to be a donor but was rejected by 3 clinics in the midlands because of her age, shes 37 now.  However sam abdallah at the lister has said thats rubbish the hfea states that the donor should be under 36 unless in exceptional circumstances and what circumstances are more exceptional that a donor list of 2 yrs plus.  So as long as debs fsh and amh are ok they are willing to accept her.  Deb and her dh came over before we knew about so called donor age cut off and discussed the whole regime.  I told her exactly how awful it was the down regging the stimming and all of it and still she wanted to go through with it.  I have spoken to her since speaking to the lister and she is still willing and happy to be a donor for me.  Now the decision is in our hands.  Do we want to go for a donor cycle if our cycle fails?  And if so do we want a known donor or anonymous donor?  Its so hard to decide for me, she is my best friend in the world we have been through so much together, held each other up when suffering depression got drunk together laughed and cried together, i can think of no greater gift she could give me, she is like a sister to me the sister i never had.  We look alike both small, blonde hair blue eyes, same silly sense of humour, she has 3 beautiful girls aged 18,13and 6 so her family is finished.  She doesnt see every period as the chance of a lost baby, which shes knows that i do, she says her eggs are now of no use to her and she would love for me to have them. On one hand i would love it on the other im not so sure there are so many many things to consider, would it be better anonymous so there would be no constant reminder of who's egg it was?  Would it bind us together even closer as the sisters i so wish we were?  What if we ever fell out? What if it worked and i had a girl but i could see debs 3 girls in her.  See where im going here cos i cant?  What im trying to say is a donor egg for me i think will be just that.  At the end of the day it will be fertilised with MY husbands sperm implanted in MY body and hopefully stick in MY womb.  MY body will nurture and feed it an it will be MY body that gives birth to it, and the baby boy or girl will be MINE oh and dh's of cours, but he just supplies the gism   I know everyone is different hunny and im just giving you my opinion in the hope that it may help you reach a decision for you and your dh  

Im shattered now 

Hi bobbi, kazzie hazlenut natasha and everyone else


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Kate so sorry you heard it like that must've been even worse than telling us face to face

Sx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hope that makes sense cos i've just read it back and im none the wiser, think im just trying to convince myself i would be doing the right thing have my bf as a donor, and i think i might have just convinced myself that i am.


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Sorry I can't advise on DE situation sweetie, but what a lovely offer from your friend!

So thoughtful and kind. I like you have no sisters so might be something DH & I get to. We've talked about DE in South Africa where the rules are slightly different and you get to see baby pics of the donor, but not told any of our friends about DE speech so not been in your position yet hun. Certainly worth talking to some ladies who've had donor egg's and maybe find out pro's and cons of known/anomynous

Sx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Purple - thanx hunny, never thought of that


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kate honey - it is interesting that you have brought this subject up now. Earlier in the week I had a bit of a meltdown as my younger sister (26) sent me an email saying she was going to the Lister for a consultation to discuss her future and possibly helping be an ED to me and my older sister. I freaked out as I didnt really want to discuss it this week, but also as it made me feel wierd. On one hand of course I would love to have a baby that looked like me (my sis looks VERY similar to me except with smaller boobs  ) but I didn't think I could handle Ben and my sis making a baby together (even though I know that that would not really physically be happening!) I also worried that if we did decide to do it and she subsequently pulled out then we could fall out, badly. I also had a horrible preminition of falling out with my sis and my mum saying something like "come on be fair to her, she did an amazing thing for you, she gave you the gift of life" and I don't like feeling beholden to anyone! 

Finally I decided that having a known donor would never work for me for a very selfish reason. When I have a baby I want that baby to have a connection to me and a connection to Ben and NOONE else in my world (although I do realise that if I chose a donor in the UK my baby could contact them in the future). I feel that having been through so much already I really deserve that.

I just wanted to tell you how I felt as I have thought about it alot, but it is different for EVERYONE and as time passes you will know what the right answer is. For now though don't think too much about that as we still have high hopes for your eggs young lady!!! 

Purps you just popped in - it is good to know that you see piccies in SA, that is actually quite important to me and was under the impression that you could only do that in America. The way I see it when I look into the eyes of the child in the photo I want to connect with them, is that silly!!  

Lots of love 

A xxxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - thanx so much hunny - even more to think about now      I have hopes for my lil old eggies too hun, but i dont wanna set those hopes too high.  Just be good to have other peoples opinions before we make a decision, cos they make bring up things i havent even thought about yet,  cos i dont wanna make a decision and then feel scared or undecided all over again, does that make sense hunny?


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

purple72 said:


> You are a definate success story though Steph and an inspiration to many of us!
> 
> 
> Durrrhhhh !!!!!    why did i yype steph when I ment you laura hunny!!! Not that steph isn't just as successful and inspirational!
> ...


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

Bunjy said:


> Egg donation is a massive thing to consider eh...it will never be my child but it would be my husbands....wish I could turn back the clock xxx
> Any views would be useful / comforting x


*Bunjy* - I agree with others that Dr Serhal is reknowned for doom and gloom and pushing patients towards ED because he wants to protect his stats, have seen this story time and again on FF - please do seek a second opinion from a PR expert clinic like the Lister before even thinking about giving up on your own eggs.

You are right, IVF with donor eggs is a massive thing to consider, and it takes a long time to come to terms with losing the dream of a child who resembles you physically (to be totally honest, it still hurts even now  though to a much, much smaller degree than before, I am sure it always will in certain circumstances... although, I really can honestly say I don't think I could love this baby growing inside me more if I tried!  )

However (and I'm sure most women who like me have gone for DE, after giving it a damn good shot with their own eggs, would agree) I definitely do not see the baby I am carrying now as my husband's child but not mine. He is having a baby with me, not with my egg donor! As Slycett (Kate) said, I will give this baby life, give birth to it, love it and hopefully nurture it to become a wonderful person, as any good parent wants to do for their child. I really don't think I could be more excited about being Mum to the little person growing inside me, even if it was genetically from my own eggs. I have to admit your comment did jar me a little - but I know you very probably didn't mean to offend anyone by what you said - I have had the donor egg speech myself and know how raw, lost and confused it made me feel at the time.  

In time I came to see the DE option as a door marked "HOPE" that I could choose to go through if I needed to. I have no regrets in having a few more tries before doing so, and no regrets about using an egg donor... by the time my treatment came round after being on a waiting list, I was so very ready for trying something which offered 60-70% chance of success (according to my particular clinic's success rate) instead of the single figures indicated by the number of BFNs I had had and my age... and I was lucky enough for it to work first time, which reinforced that it was indeed my eggs that were the problem, not the mild immune problems I was diagnosed with or anything else.

I hope so much that you will find a good clinic who will help you get that BFP with your own eggs and that you will never need DE, but I think we are very lucky that we live in a time where the technology is there to use it if we need to.  Good luck sweetie.   

*Kate* - what a lovely best friend you have - you are very lucky and I'm glad the Lister agreed that she's not too old. Also you* Ally* - what a lovely sister. I can totally understand why you have worries about using a known donor though... its a huge step no matter who donates the eggs to you, and like you I would worry about how it would affect my relationship with that person in the future. Kate, have you thought about maybe having donor counselling - you, BF and both your partners, which would help clarify any of the issues you are worrying about? Am sure the Lister could arrange this for you if needed. 

Off to make some honey and lemon for myself and DH, who now has my cold too, poor sod! 

Love to all 

Steph xxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Purples been on the alcopops again


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

purple72 said:


> purple72 said:
> 
> 
> > You are a definate success story though Steph and an inspiration to many of us!
> ...


I did wonder!!


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kate - that makes complete sense, I totally understand. This is why I have started exploring the possibilities in my head too, to give myself some time to get used to it as an idea and become comfortable with it and knowing that it is there as an option makes me feel less sad and scared about my future, it is good that we can explore these subjects together


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Steph have u been on the alcopops too hunny, take it u meant me when talking about donor eggies, and im kate - my consultant is sam tho


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Ally not silly at all! I too have thought about that, but like we chatted yesterday I think you know when the time has come for Donor Eggs, at the moment I am so desperate to try this time with the lister. IF it's unsuccessful, well like Kate I think that would begin to make me look at other options, just for now though I'm hoping praying that Lister can give me and everyone else our miracles

Hey steph! 

Night ladies

Love and hugs and sweet dreams

Sx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Steph your post made me


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

slycett said:


> Steph have u been on the alcopops too hunny, take it u meant me when talking about donor eggies, and im kate - my consultant is sam tho


Arrrghh!! Doh! so sorry Kate - gonna go correct it now! It's my snot-bedecked brain! (euww!) xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - yes it is good hunny     and i find it very easy to talk on here a lot easier than speaking to fertiles    I can totally agree with you on wanting ur baby to be a part of u and dh and no one else cos to be honest hun i feel the same with me and scottie    How i feel tho its hard to explain sometimes  i wanna make him a daddy and me a mommy i always wanted loads of kids but just never met the right man to do that with.  Till now, and im not getting any younger hunny, have looked into adoption but think with my background of depression it would be too difficult to be accepted, and when i was looking at adoption i thought of a donor cycle and felt uneasy and then i thought why am i feeling uneasy as it would be adoption of an egg so to speak and hopefully that egg could give us a child.  Im rambling now ignore me hun, im gonna get another drink, i really shouldn't come on here when im ratted


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## bangersandmash (Feb 11, 2007)

Hi Ladies, I am really sorry to but into your thread but I am hoping that you will be able to help me. I have had tried IVF before and converted to IUI as I only produced I follie. I had tests and apparently have poor ovarian reserve so they say unlikely to respond well to IVF at all and maybe ED for us. I am on my 2nd round of IVF now taking clomid and menpopur. I have just had a day 8 scan and they report 1 x 12mm follie and  "a number of smaller ones between 8 and 10mm". Apartently they dont count them intill they are over 10mm. Now I dont know if this is normal or not - and does this sound like I might not be responding? The scanner said it was ok but that she couldnt say anything else which made me a little uneasy. They have upped my dose and I have to rescan again on Monday. Any information on whats good for a day 8 scan would be much appreciated. Bangers


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

Pixie75 said:


> Steph your post made me


Aww Pix, bless you


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Ratted or not you are making perfect sense to me, when I said I wanted my baby to be just about me and Ben I didnt mean that it had to be my egg, it could be a donor egg, it would just need to be an anonymous donor, I completely understand that you feel that having a family is becoming more important that biology, I feel more and more like that as time passes. But hey lets hope the lister come up with the goods eh!! 

Purps


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

Bangers, I would say from what you've written that it's looking quite promising for you this time!  - 8-10mm is not far behind the lead follie of 12mm at all, and hopefully the smaller ones will catch up - you still have time. Hang in there hon! and lots of luck    - let us know how you get on


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - heres hoping hunny    im sure we will get there petal, and i understand also about anonymous donor thats why in a way im still undecided.  In a way i dont want my dh looking at any child we may have and thinking oh it looks more like deb than it does me and kate.  Oh hunny we are in a predicament aint we    Anyway us and our eggies aint finished yet, god no, it aint over till the fat lady sings, and i aint ready to pump out a tune just yet     

Hi bangersand mash have blown you some bubbles to get u started, hunny i know on my last cycle i had 2 follies 1 at 12 and 1 at 7, went back 3 days later and only the 12mm one had grown and i was on the max dose of menopur.  If they have upped ur stimms hunny they have a chance of catching up so dont give up yet eh?  get a hot water bottle on that tummy and i'll send u some      to get em all growing   

Steph - when we go down for scan on march af we have app to see donor co-ordinator and have a chat.  Chances are deb will prob come down with me for more than 1 app as dh starting up his own business, i've told him as long as he's there for ec i'll let him off the rest   

Purps hope ur ok hunny


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## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi everyone,

Firstly I just want to say to Angel I am so sorry for what you are going through right now. Heartbreaking. 

Thank you all so much for all your replies to my post earlier. I just read back through them as had hit another low and it really helped and has made me feel much more positive. They didn't test for the E2 today as said they will on Tues so will have to wait and make a final decision on that then. I went through a natural cycle with Create and the disappointment when the one egg I had was rubbish was enormous but I guess I have to be prepared for that. I think if I don't give it a try I will, as one of you said, wonder if I will get another egg to try with in the future. 

New paragraph... Ally it was wonderful to meet you and I wish we had had longer but maybe we will cross paths again - I am back on Tues at 10.15. I love the miracle thread you have set up and that has helped me already as the first one I read was the one egg one. I wouldn't even know how to set up something like that so I am so impressed. Also I loved your dream and I hope it comes true! Will pm you my e-mail.

Sam you are amazing me more every day, I don't know where you find your energy to chase these doctors around the world with your tricky questions! When you talked about Dr Sher before (many posts ago) it reminded me of Dr Gleicher at CHR - very salesy and very sure of themselves but not so willing to give specifics just I can get you pregnant sort of thing. Still I am starting to want to go and sit on their doorsteps until they do! I am going to talk to Jaya next week about doing the estrogen protocol if this doesn't work out as I want to know how long I will have to wait to try again and also what happens if I don't get my period back as you have to start the estrogen patches one week before a period so must be ovulating. Oh yes and also please can you pm me the details of your POF doctor.

Good night all.

Missy x


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Night night all, tomorrow is another day of opportunity for us all


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

night night sweet *Ally*  and good luck for Tuesday *missyg* - hope so much you are able to proceed and that you have that "golden egg" there


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Nite night girls  ally, steph thanx for ur help tonight u have both given me food for thought - like i need any more food?  

Ally Missy wishing u both the best of luck with all my heart


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

'night Kate, sweet dreams


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Steph you are such a night owl sweetie  

Hope your cold gets better soon



Night Kate hunny & Missy so good to see the paragraphs hun   x

Ally m'dear think you've already gone but sweet dreams my friend x

Sx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

one handed post again...

kate - have you had counselling? my sister offered me her eggs and everyone thought it was the best option. i decided to go see a counsellor to discuss and it was very helpful.  for me i would prefer an anon donor, for me my sisters lack of privacy was the main reason.  i could deal with the donor bit but not everyone being involved.  have you had counseling? i'd reccommend.

steph - being a mum is so much more than a one cell egg.  

xx


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Just got in from having a thai meal out with friends and trying to quickly catch up.

Angel -    am so sorry that you are experiencing what I can only describe as a nightmare.  This is so so so unfair.  If there was anything i could do to make this all better i would, truely.  

Ally - only read your first post so far but completely related to what you said about how you would have felt relieved if they had said cancel this cycle.  Since reading about Missy's day earlier and then everyone's lovely replies about going for it with just one egg, I have been reflecting on my situation last week.  Although, like i said, I think it depends on which cons you see as to what perspective you get, I think that I felt that relief when they recommended abandoning due to the one eager beaver and 4 v v v small straglers. I think that partly, due to what else I was dealing with with DP, I was exercising some self-preservation and deep down i was so scared of going through it all and then it not working that I just heard all the risks involved and chose to bail.  It seemed that I had to make that decision there and then, on the spot.  Should i have gone with it?  Obviously I hope and pray that the DIY worked but am wondering already.......................     

Will catch up properly tomorrow and then post properly too.

love to you all - sleep well.

Ali x


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Ali hon - we are always going to wonder what if, what if I had gone ahead with the IVF instead of dare i say it 'DIY' etc but you must try to put that out of your mind, you made your decision because it was the best one for you, you seemed pretty sure of your decision at the time so I didn't try and convince you otherwise as it seemed very much a done deal. There is NO evidence that going to EC with one egg is better than say IUI or DIY, some even say that a low amh egg which may be more fragile is better left inside the body to fertilise. In Missys case she has a blocked tube on that side so her decision has to be either go for EC or abandon and try again, a very difficult choice when so much money is involved and you are so emotional about it. In my case I have tried to get a follicle 3 times now, still trying on the third go. If I do by some sort of miracle get a follicle I would like to go to EC (as long as my E2 shows good levels) as I would like to get that egg out and see if it fertilises etc to get an idea of its quality. If it is totally [email protected] quality then I may want to think about DE as an option sooner than I had planned. If the egg was great quality then I would probably go back to the Big D*ck method!! So we all have our reasons for making the decisions we make and they don't necessarily suit each one of us. You are bound to feel worried hon and the what ifs will creep in to taunt you, you have been through so so much, but it is not over yet for you, we still have very high hopes for your wonderful golden egg. Loads of love


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kate - how you doing today? I hope I didnt confuse you more last night xxxx

Missy - Come on lets have some amazing follie growing action!! Lets both have amazing surprises on Tuesday!! I will forward you Sams info now.

I have woken up feeling a bit sh!t today, bit p!ssed off as I was ill at christmas and don't think I deserve another bug yet!! All snuffly and coldy  

Going to see Benjamin Button later, my movie dates with Ben are the highlight of my week these days   I don't have to talk to anyone, I don't have to explain why I am not drinking, they make amazing hot chocolate, perfect!! I never would have imagined that that would become my favourite thing, before IF I was much more likely to be lying in a darkened room nursing a hideous hangover on a Saturday afternoon!!


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Morning girls  

Hi ally     no hun u couldnt possibly confuse me any more than i am already   To be honest hun it did me good to talk to someone else about it as it usually just goes round and round in my head driving me batty.   Still havent decided tho, cos really i want a little one from my old eggies if at all possible, but having an open mind to other options does help me.  

Laura - we will see donor egg co-ordinator at our next appointment, dont think i could possibly go through this without some type of counselling first whether its known donor or anonymous   How are the chiplets hunny?  Bet they look so cute in their snow suits  


Ali - morning hunny, you have done the right thing for you and thats all that matters. The reason i would have prefered to go to ec is cos my tubes are so crappy, both are scarred and one is completly blocked   To be honest dont know why i try ttc nat every month supposed its cos i just cant sit on my fat little **** doing nowt    Im keeping everything crossed for you sweetheart


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kate - oh good - I agree, its really good to talk about it alot as I think it helps come to terms with it, it also as Steph says so well 'leaves the door marked hope open' x

Girls - just noticed my bubbles, you must have doubled them in the last few days THANK YOU!!!


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - blown you a few more sweetie


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## elinor (Jul 4, 2008)

morning everyone.
sorry, I haven't caught up with the thread yet, and this is a me me me post.
Didin't post on Thursday because I started spotting (day before testing) and thought if I just ignored it all might be well. I couldn't post on hear and not tell you, so I just didn't post and was al   and anxious.
then friday (test day) I woke up at 4am convinced my period had started - I had started bleeding a bit. 
Went to hospital, told them I thought it was all over, but nurse was really helpful, reassuring and said we will have the results later.
Phoned later to be told over 50 is definite positive, under 5 definite negative and I am at 8. This means something has happened, but it is unlikely to be a pregnancy that progresses. So really, either the current bleed is the end, or I should expect it to all get worse. I am feeling vaguely sick most of the time, as well as having period pains. I have had 3 cycles at ERI, and on ALL of them I have not had a clear result. First it was the low positive (26?) which went on for a while, but I then lost at 6 weeks +4 days; then last time a result of 5 (then had heavy bleed and all back to 'normal' in a week); and now this.
I am beside myself. I just don't know what to do or think. I even wish it was a straightforward 'no' since if this really isn't meant to work for me surely it would be better just to find out sooner, and not have the anxiety and false hope (they have said 'very, very unlikely to progress, if anything could be ectopic but won't know till later...' - been lovely and sympathetic, but I just get to go back in a week's time. Then I think if 'something' has happened on the 3 out of 4 IVF cycles where I have got to ET but i hasn't styed, should I be looking at immunes and NK cells and all of that? Should I have done those before starting this cycle?
God I had better stop waffling and feling sorry for myself.
I will try to catch up with other people's news (and reply to Pink Carys post from the other day - thanks to whoever pointed that out to us - some people have so much more to deal with than me, I know). I have at least done the phone call to mum (and texted sisters) A friend is coming through later - the plan had been to celebrate or get very drunk - now I con't really do either!! At least she's a good friend, and although she doesn't know from experience herself (single and TRULY never wanted kids - she is not just saying it) she is good for listening (but doesn't understand quite like you guys do).
hope everyone else is doing ok.
Will post later with some personals
all best wishes
Elinor


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Elinor - oh sweetheart im so so sorry you are stuck in limbo      Wish i knew some magic words to make you feel better, am thinking of you hunny bun


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Elinor     really hoping that this turns around for you x


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## Donkey (Nov 24, 2007)

Morning

Catherine – don’t worry I am very good at colouring in, particularly A level standard – I love a bit of choropleth mapping!  Yes I miss being in the classroom but I’m so nosey I love the whole school big picture thing too.  I have to say my role as AHT is than my role as teacher with additional responsibilities (2 big ones) at my old school.  I am honestly less stressed now.  I was at Marlborough in St Albans, I’m now at Chauncy in Ware.  Where were you?  We didn’t get a snow day yesterday…
So sorry that your bfn was confirmed  

LJ – I don’t know about Katharine Hepburn he’s never said.  But I ALWAYS have to spell it for people.  Hope AF is over quickly and you can continue with your ‘injection campaign’.  

Swinny good luck with FET  

Fishy do you need Gamblers Anonymous rather than FF?  

Welcome Lightweight, Bangersandmash and Hayley   

Missy I’m sorry it’s not the news you wanted but there is a silver follie (lets pray e2 shows it’s golden).  I would go for it.  If I was you and I didn’t I would always be wondering.   

Angel and Elinor I am devastated for you both.  Although I am heartbroken with my own bfn  it must be so much worse for you both with bleeding and waiting and waiting.  You are both very strong  

Ally you must be emotionally drained with this cycle.  Keep strong and pray for better news at your next scan.  


I have to say I’m really struggling with this bfn.  I can’t stop crying.  I manage to keep it together at school then cry on the way home.  Yesterday it was all night.  I just feel so scared that I will never be a mum, then I get irrational thoughts that dh, my parents and my cats will die and leave me on my own.

  My self set target today is to not cry, stretch target not to produce huge amounts of snot and have swollen eyes.  

A huge hug to everyone as so many of us are feeling fragile   and a big hello and   to everyone I have misssed.


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## elinor (Jul 4, 2008)

Thanks for the thoughts and prayers people.

Just don't know what to do, or what to think. Trying to believe that something is still possible...

Angel - I was so sorry to read your post - first to be hopeful when you said that Hcg wsa rising (the fact it was not exactly doubling didn't matter, and could easily be explained by both embies implanting and then losing one), but then that yesterday's test showed it falling. I am so so sorry.  

Steph - I hope you are feeling better today, and poo to not being able to take anything other than paracetamol for your chest and cough.

Kate - glad you are also not ready to give up on own eggs too - I will happily consider ED, but still don't feel ready for it - it keeps nearly working with my eggs....

Ally - really hoping that next week wll bring news that your little follie is growing into a golden one.      

Missy -   and   for you too.

Hello to Rural chick and Lightweight and everyone else I haven't posted to before. Make sure you don't listen to the doom and gloom of any one clinic - get yourselves along to one that actually treats women who aren't in the 'ideal' categories. I replied to the HFA survey last year (or earlier this? Can't quite remember) but was really clear that clinics should have to publish results based on who they treat - ie the ones saying 'aren't we wonderful and in the top 5' or whatever could then be exposed as only taking women with low FSH, high AMH and a good chance of responding well.

lightweight - don't worry about the d/r - if they need to keep you on meds for a few days longer they will - it might mess up your timetable, but doesn't affect the results. hope it can all start to plan anyway, but please do not stress!

Hello also bobbi, donkey, beachy, purps, Ali, Anne, Laura, Little Jen, Nix, Fishy and everyone I have missed out.

all best wishes
Elinor xx


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## Swinny (Jul 10, 2007)

Hiya girls

Well AF arrived yesterday (with a vengeance  ). Started taking my steroids 20mg of prednisolone and low dose aspirin. Felt quite icky but that may just have been that I was really rough with my AF. I've got to go for a scan on Friday (the 13th  ) to check my lining and then over next weekend I will be doing ovulation tests and as soon as I've ovulated my iccle snowbabies will be thawed.

Beachy - Lets get our thinking caps on and organise our day out. My ET will probs be at some point week beginning 16th. 

Ally - 

Elinor - I really hope things turn out matey  

Kate and Juicy  - Thanks for the welcome back   

Hiya Donkey, Purple, Fishface, Mirra, Nix, Little Jen, Laura and verybody else. Sorry for lack of personals but this thread moves at lightspeed and I canny keep up with all the new names. Wishing evrybody luck and love at whatever stage your at.

Love Sarah xxxxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

LightWeight, haven't read the thread but happened to catch your previous post. very glad Miranda kicked it into touch. honestly these drs are real idiots. PLENTY of womenn, espeically younger ones get pg with that AMH. i am sick of hearing these people being paid a fortune to wreck women's lives with incaccurate info, i really am. it is life changing to hear that sort of thing adn you coudl do DE for no good reason. it is appalling. 

there.


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Afternoon ladies

Elinor, Angel, Ally, Missy, Donkey and everyone         .

Have just got home following the 6 hour round trip to London, plus the statutory 3 hours hanging around for the bloods results (I love getting up at 4.00am, honest!!).

The HPTs proved not to be faulty - the blood test confirmed the         .

It's times like this I still wish we had a cat to kick.

DH has been a real star - he is gutted as well, but has run me a lovely hot bath and made me a large, strong G and T - I've been promised a glass of wine as well - no cat so am going to get pi55ed instead!!!

Am now waiting for the  to show her face so that we can get on with it again - why is it she's never there when you want?

LJ Hope the  is being kinder today and that you had a lovely time at Cirque du Soleil.

Love to everyone.

Catherine xx

PS Thanks to Twinnie (hope you're feeling a bit better today, hun) Purple, Ally, Steph, Laura and Ali for the conversation about DE. I was reading this whilst I was waiting for my results this morning and it lead to DH and I discussing it, which is great, as we had not considered it til now.

PPS Apologies in case I post anything outrageous later under the influence!!!


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Rural Chick     sorry to hear that x

Swinny-we will manage to catch up this week promise ya x


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Hi Beachy - thanks     

The wine is taking effect already - I'm such a lightweight (sorry, no pun intended, hun) as I only normally have one drink a month when the  arrives.

Have decided I'm going for an hours swim tomorrow as I haven't been allowed to for the last 2 weeks and it's a great hangover cure.


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Afternoon my lovely ladies!!

Donkey hunny   

Rural chick you too sweetie    enjoy that G&T and Wine, I purchased 2 bottles of fizz to go with hubby's curry tonight so will join you on the pi55ed front! 

Swinny Fri 13th is not a bad omen it's a good omen I believe!!     for you and your frosties!! and with the current thinking that FET are goint into a less traumatised environment hopefully you'll get your BFP!!!

Elinor Sweetie    sending some     for you and keeping everything crossed even my eyes  

Kate Slycett hunny how you feeling today?    And Steph? Any better hunny?     Can you use vapour rub at least on your chest! my DH swears by it!

Ally hunny hope you enjoy brad film tonight, it's a long film hey? might require 2 hot chocs   

Ali so hun what did you get shopping? (there really should be a green icon for jealousy I think)

Hello to  beachy, Anne, Laura, Little Jen hope you enjoyed CDS, Nix, Fishy, bobbi, juicy, mir, lightweight, anna, nicki & Love to all not mentioned

Sx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hey Pix, can't believe missed you off the list!

Thanks for adding me on ** hunny, you are just like your avatar    

Sx


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Evening everyone

Having a very lazy day today. I had a facial this morning and not done much since.

Ruralchick.  Sorry you didn't get better news.

Elinor.  I have everything crossed for you.

Angel.  I have PM'd you.  I know what you mean about feeling that someone doesn't want this to happen.  I sometimes think that someone only wants us to have one child as I was pg with Max when Marcus died so they never met then the three MC.  But like others have said you just need to think of all those who really don't deserve children who have loads so it can't be true that you get what you deserve.  I firmly believe that life is just random and things happen for no apparent reason.  I'm sure you will get to be  mummy some day soon.   

Ally,  Sorry the scan was inconclusive.  I can imagine how you feel.  I so hope you will get there.

Swinny.  Sorry AF is not treating you well.  Good luck for your scan on 13th.  With all this snow it feels like the right time of year to have snowbabies put back where they belong.

Donkey.    Sorry you are feeling so bad.  I hope you are able to pick yourself up soon.  Don't feel guilty about feeling bad though, it is only natural.

On the known/unknown donor subject my personal view is that I would prefer the donor not to be known to me.  I think if it were someone I saw all the time I would always be wondering what they were thinking when they looked at my son or daughter. Would they be questioning my parenting skills etc.  Then again I am someone who is always worrying about what other people are thinking.  I think everyone is different though.

Hi to Pixie, Sam, Laura, Miranda, Kate, Purple, Ali, beach, annacameron, Juicy, Nix, Littlejen, Jo


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Sarah - I was born on friday 13th! of the witching month - October - and it hasn't been too bad to me, life.

Elinor - my heart aches for you, having this inconclusive crapola to deal with yet again. Although I'm always in the 'wouldn't it be great if' camp, you've been to that camp and got the T-shirt I reckon. I'm hoping against hope that perhaps you'll break through that crapola barrier this time.
Have you been put on Aspirin, Prednislone etc? 

On the donor issue, my DH wanted to go through with being opped etc to give me a child (he has two already), so I think he would have found it hard to accept going through all that with donor eggs. But had it been the way that donor was the only sensible way forward and DH had no other children I would have embraced it like Steph has.
I agree with all of you who have said a known donor is just too close for comfort - you can almost forget the gamete situation as long as the donor isn't around... but if they were a close family member it would be nigh on impossible, and being that grateful - even if it isn't expected - it would weigh heavily on me.
Having said that, when DH's first PESA looked as if it was bummed out he was willing to ask his brother to be a sperm donor straight away. He looks at things in a much simpler way than I do.

Heck, I'm rambling. I so wanted to make a coherent point! Boo. I am a bear of very little brain at the mo.


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hey Tracy hunny, 

Enjoy a lazy evening   I'm sat with a glass of fizz despairing at englands cricket score!! I'm sure I'm alone on the cricket fan point! but the West Indies are slaughtering us  

Anyway! DH is making one of his fab curry's so at least somthing to look forward to

Hey Mir, I think you come across alot more coherent than you think hunny! Hope you DH and Bobstar are ok

Love to all

Sx


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## Donkey (Nov 24, 2007)

I've been reading through again and I've am very touched by the DE debate  and steph' spost made me   
I think that carrying the baby ties you to it biologically even with a DE.  I know a scientist would disagree with me but we are dealing with emotions here.

Generally i agree with  the anonymous donor as I do think it makes it easier for you and dh to create your own unique family without someone else.  Saying that at the very start of my IF journey my cousin who is my best friend offered me her eggs, even before we knew what my issues were.  The offer still stands and she is holding out on her hysterectomy (loads of gynae issues too) until I am sorted.  She has 3 children and I know she wants me to be a mum.  I also know that she would surrogate for me, if she could.  However she has had her womb lasered so she can't carry any more children.  I would be comfortable with either of those options with her and I know it would bring us closer.  On the other hand if it was my sister i couldn't go through with it.  It's such a personal choice and overall I think an anonymous donor eases the strain.  
We have all had to consider options that we would never have thought about many years ago when we thought we'd fall pregnant as soon as we stopped contraception (I wish!).  We all have different perspectives now and we have to do what is best for us.

Lovely piccie tracey

Lots of love to you all 
D xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

RE Donor Eggs

The one lovely thing our consultant said at our follow up when he shocked us talking about DE was that he felt and this was his opinion but it made hubby & I think DE could be a possibliity was that with D sperm the poor Hubby feels very left out as in the whole process he has no involvement apart from supporting his DP But with DE the Donor provides 13 chromosomes, the mum (Recipient) grows it, supplies blood to it feeds it nurtures it and incubates it to perfection. Without the mummy who gives birth to this baby all that Egg will be is a period!

As A DE recipient your little one who you are growing, feeding and nurturing is as much yours as your hubby's, I believe that totally. Thankfully somebody was kind enough to donate 13 chromosomes but without you - the mummy, your babe would not be growing and developing into your bundle of joy!


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

That's lovely Purple.  I hope you are enjoying your Fizz,  DH bought me some mini bottles for xmas so i could have bubbles whenever I wanted.  Unfortunately there are none in the fridge.

There is also some evidence that as the recipient you actully affect the genes of the little one.  Steph could probably tell us more.


Evening Donkey

I am just watching Jonathan Ross from last night.  Tom Jones looks much better with grey hair.


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi ladies 

Still feeling rough and very tired, have napped all afternoon on and off and could easily fall back to sleep now   

Donkey      hope ur feeling a bit better this evening hun  

Tracey - what a gorgeous photo that is petal im just having a jd and coke medicinal purposes of course  

Purps hi hunny, i always used to watch the dad when i was younger and i loved it, alas no more tho, footy does my head in even more tho  

Elinor -      hunny hope you get some answers soon.

Miranda - im a bit of a no brain at the momment too sweetie feels like my head is full of cotton wool 

Catherine my twinnie - so sorry about ur result hunny life sucks sometimes    Have as many g&t's as u want hunny you deserve it   

Swinny - good luck for friday hunny, hoping this is the one for you      

Beachy - hi hunny booked any more holidays yet?  

Lightweight - good luck for you scan next week hun  

Zuri - hi petal not long to go now       for a bfp for you   

Ali - hello sweetie yes hn dh managed to get out of bed early enough this morning   He has been busy today for a change and i have just let him get on with what he's doing, im too knackered to help him do anything 

Bobs - hi hunny what you up to this fine evening?  

Anne - how you hunny, doing anything exciting this weekend? 

Hello to pix, nix, ally, lucy, juicy, missy, becca, steph, laurab and everyone else.

Going back to donor eggies, im still not decided   Unknown donor, would i always think do they look more like their donor than they do dh or me?  Known donor i would know straight away wouldnt i?  But how would i cope with that?  Or would it even be a problem seeing as we look so much alike anyway?  Although me and deb are bf we do not live in each others pockets prob see each other every couple of weeks?  Questions questions always more b loody questions   

Have a good night ladies, sorry to keep going back to same conversation but just wanna get things straight in my head before making any kind of decision.


Love Kate
xxxxxxxxxx


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

*Rural Chick* - so sorry it was BFN today - sending you lots of    and good luck for whatever you decide to do next   

*Elinor* - sorry you are going through such a nightmare time - am  that all will work out for you   

*Mira *- glad Bob's little hand finally got seen by specialist and that it can be operated on - please give him a  from me! 



Donkey said:


> I've been reading through again and I've am very touched by the DE debate and steph' spost made me
> I think that carrying the baby ties you to it biologically even with a DE. I know a scientist would disagree with me but we are dealing with emotions here.


*Donkey*  you are right about the biological ties created by carrying a baby created from DE - in fact most scientists would agree with you, and there is a whole branch of accepted science dedicated to this - epigenetics. I think Tracey mentioned earlier about the birth mother's influence on the genetic make-up of a child born from donor eggs - anyone interested might find the following FF post interesting: http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=79093.0 - fascinating stuff! 

Lots of love to all 

Steph xxx


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Hi Girls - re the donor/someone you know/don't know conversation ( can't spell the word begining with a   ) my personal opinion is I don't think for me it could a friend or anyone I knew outside the family but if I had a sister ( which I don' t) I might consider them because I would feel that the baby would have my genes and the grandparents/aunties/uncles etc would be all exactly the same as if it were me but obviously this is just genetically speaking because if the donor was unrelated it would all still be the same in any case.
(if that makes sense) because it would have been my body nuturing, caring and giving birth in essence giving life to being.

I suppose for me I am looking at it from the babies point of view because I already have children. But I suppose it depends on what kind of family you are. I am am quite an open person and think I would share it all so everyone knew including the child. However if it was a donor I am not sure that I would because I wouldn't want that child to feel for a second it was different to it's siblings.

But then again I expect its one of those things that you don't know how to play it totally until you were in that situation. I think I would be far more open to someone I don't know if I couldn't get family if I did not already have children.

Although I can see that if it was a family member the obligation to be be eternally grateful may weigh heavily on your shoulders. I think that it is good that where you have had offers from family or friends it is great that you feel there is a back up plan that has the possibility of becoming a reality.

I know that I would want to know that I had tried to get pregnant with my own eggs numerous times before I thought of moving on to DE though but like Steph said ( your post did make me   ) it is a path of hope for you that it's not the end of the road if tx fails.

When I kept on having the m/c the docs did blame my DH translocated gene and suggested a sperm donor, we did look into it for a while but at the time despite the pain of the miscarriages I ( my DH was ok to move onto SD) could not give up the dream of having a genetically related child to both of us and am glad that I stuck to my guns then because we found out much later that I also had a blood clotting disorder that would have been a factor in the m/c's as well.

For those of you who are in the process of thinking about DE, like I said try with your own eggs if at all possible but if you do decide to go for DE and get pregnant you will find that the pregnancy and carrying the little one will definately make you the mum no doubt about it, because the bonding for the mother begins from the moment you know you are pregnant that this little miracle is inside you.

I wish that one day each and every one of us will experience it, it is worth all the heartbreak, pain and tears that unfortunately some of us have to suffer to get there, but I got there against the odds and think that all you can too, it might not happen in the way that you first thought but it will happen somehow if you can bear to pick yourself up from the disappointments along the way.

This is certainly the place to be to be supported when you need a helping hand to pull yourself up to try again   

Take care all love Karen xxx


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Hi Elinor - I am sorry that you are in this limbo land of having to wait it out   thinking of you.

Rural - I am sorry that it was an official BFN today   congratulations on the huge weight loss - how did you manage that? I am sure that it will help enormously for IVF - all I am told is my age and weight put me in a very small chance category for a BFP.

Donkey and Steph - that is very interesting about epigenetics and I believe that it is true.

Miranda - glad to hear that Mr. Roberts hand can be sorted, love the new piccy by the way.

Tracey - love the new pic too.

I will have a go at sorting Joshua's picture tomorrow by resizing it if I can.


Take care all love Karen xxx


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

Karen - lovely post    I'm really sorry if I made anyone  though - it wasn't my intention!

A tip for resizing photos if you have no image editing software which will do it for you - I put mine on ******** first, ******** automatically resizes them for you - if you then go to your ** photo album you can grab the uploaded photo onto your desktop (right-click with mouse? not sure as I use a Mac and we drag-and-drop instead of right-click!) and then you have a much smaller photo (memory-wise) to upload to FF - hope this helps!


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

It has taken me hours to read through from yesterday and now my eyes feel    

Ally - 5 antrals!!   Where have they been hiding?  I know you feel like you have been here before, but think about how much healther you have been recently with the food and the exercise.  That is bound to have an impact so have faith, keep nurturing that golden one and see what Tuesday brings.    Thanks for you lovely message and reassuring words.  BTW, cos of you i had to go and get some G&B hot choc today and am about to have one  

Thanks too for setting up the new thread.  Though i think it should be called the "2 fingers up at those   consultants".

Kate - thanks for your lovely words too.  Hope you are feeling better now after you medicine     Re - the donor eggs, I probably have 2 friends who, if they offered, I could cope with them being ED's cos of the type of people they are.  But there are other friends with whom i know it would be too difficult.  I think it so much depends on you and Scott and your friend and her partner.  Without knowing them personally it is so hard to say.  

Eli -   hope you get some clarity soon.  Hope you were comforted by your friends this evening.  

Natasha - how did you dinner party go last night?  

LJ - you still balanced?!    How was CDS?  

Purple - had fun shopping ta.  Got a new wrap top and a dress (that is going back!!  looked awful on) and some Dr Haushka face stuff.  Had a nice lunch (which I was dreading cos i knew my friend was going tomake me talk about stuff) but I held it together admirably! Enjoy the curry and the fizz   

Nix - did you have a nice walk today?  How is Chuckles?  

Anne - what you been up to today then>  Entertaining the boys?  

Pixie - you got that face back yet?  

Sam - Wish AF was here for you and not MIL! Or is she ok as they go?  

Bobs - did you hear about your meeting the other day?  

Catherine - sorry the blood teat confirmed sad news.  

Lightweight - awful about DP/H crashing car.  Those clinincs have no idea about what their insensitivity and narrow mindedness affects the patients.  

Laura - it was you who answered my very first post on FF in 2007 and told me to come to this thread.  I owe you  

Bangers - welcome! Good luck with this IVF cycle  

Steph- thanks for updating the list.  Hope you and DH feel better soon    Your post made me   too.  

Bunjy -  

Donkey -      

Swinny - good luck for the FET  


Hi to Carys, beach, JoM, Tracey, Kazzie, Mira, Anna.......and anyone I have missed off. 

I'll post this and then do a fresh one incase it disappears!


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

thanks Steph   when you put that message I was on microsoft photo thingy and had failed several times to downsize for whatever reason, I did what you said about face book and voila, its there!! thankyou xxxx


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

I went shopping and for lunch today with a friend who has also had some IF tx, without success (to date  ).  We talked in detail about it all and it made me feel a bit better about my decision.  Your posts helped too.  

I am now half way through the 2WW and feel nothing different.  I know I should be more positive but I just keep thinking that we had timed sex for 3 years (more recently with the CBDFM) and nothing   so having sex twice on one day is just not going to cut the mustard.  If it worked, I would be beside myself and I would be posting on the new thread before I'd pulled my pants up!  

Last night was just thinking, in hindsight, "What was I expecting the response to be?"  Anyway, I feel confident today that I made the best decision for me at the time so fingers crossed for next weekend.  

Went shopping at Waitrose this afternoon too and bought a load of tampons, hoping that if I have loads and loads (got a load of tampax in Sainsbury's last week cos they were on offer!) I wont need them for a while!  These ones in Waitrose came in a cute, spotty little tin for you handbag so I couldn't resist   

Well, must dash and deal with the delighful suppository    

Love to you all.  Night night xx


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

Hi *Ali*  glad you had a good day shopping and talking to your friend  I also bought sh1tloads of towels/tampons too before my last tx, I found them the other day and it felt great that I don't have to use them! Hope you will also be putting yours away in a cupboard for a long time!   

*Kazzie* - yay!! so glad it worked! What a gorgeous pic of your little man - such a dear little face, thanks for posting it  (now you have made me  !)


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Steph - here's hoping that for once Sod's Law works for me too!    You need to get to bed with that cold of yours; wrap up warm and cosy and have some hot honey and lemon.... 

Kazzie - what a gorgeous photo of little Joshua.


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## Swinny (Jul 10, 2007)

Purple – Thanks honey. Yeah I have to agree that this cycle should be less harsh for my body, I am on a medicated FET though to guard against NK Cells and will also be on Clexane injections after transfer, but about a million times better than my poor little ovaries being kicked about by the mega dose of Menopur. 
Anyhow what’ve you been up to this weekend, anything nice?? 

Beachy - Dad's home now and doing OK. They've not gotten to the bottom of whether it's his heart or lungs, but at least he's home and a bit happier. We took him out last night as it was his 70th. Really nice night. I will give you a bell on my way home tomorrow for a catch up xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Rural chick -  I am so sorry hun. Hope the G&T and wine worked last night. How’s the head this morning?

Tracey – Hiya chicky, thanks. How have you been?? What’s your next steps?. Fab piccie chuck aswell xxx

Mirra – I was also born on the 13th (December) and I’ve also had a good life so maybe the 13th is a good omen. I am thinking that way anyhow! How’s things with you and baby Bob? Xx

Donkey – Your cousin sounds amazing. How selfless is she that she’s holding out ona hysterectomy. I have to say that I have a friend who wnet down the DE route and she has the most beautiful little baby boy now and theres no question that she is 100% his mummy. She adores him.

Kate – I am with Tracey on the identity of the donor, for me personally I think it would easier to have an anonymous donor. It’s a marvellous gift for somebody to be an egg donor but I just couldn’t know. When we’ve considered the DE route 3 of my closest friends offered, although I thanked them all for their amazing offers I could never have accepted for me personally it would have been too hard, but everyone is different so you have to go with your heart.

Steph – Oh honey your piccie is sooooooo lovely. How are you doing?? Which steroids were you on for NK cells hun?? I am on Prednisolone and then Clexane after transfer. Half way there matey, bet you are beside yourself with excitement. Big cuddles being sent to you, DH and bump xx Oh and get cuddled up in the warm to get rid of that stinky cold xx

Ali – Halfway there hun, hang in there kiddo. Those Tampons/Towels will have a long wait to be used xx

Hiya to everybody that I’ve missed.

Love Sarah xxxxxxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Wow - our internet connection went down last night (it was traumatic!  ) but now I have lots of very interesting long posts to catch up on!! 

Ali - glad you got some G&B - did you like it?? Also love your bulk tampon buying, this is the sort of reverse psychology that I use, painted my toe nails in the hope I get to EC this time!! Hang in there honey xxxx Re the other thread, may have to direct a few consultants to it eh   still wouldnt shut them up though, they would still find a reason for why they know best!! The Lister consultants are really good though, at least they accept that there is so much that science doesn't know about fertility.

Purps - lovely lovely post about DE hon  . I noticed you are a cricket fan, when you start at the Lister try and get Alison as your scanner she is a MASSIVE cricket fan and goes off to India and the West Indies. All the scan ladies are lovely but if you like cricket she will LOVE you!  

Kate - thanks for the bubbles  

Karen - your DE post was lovely too, thank you for posting that, we are all at different stages of consideration on this subject but I know that personally I find it very comforting to talk about it in this setting, really helps me get my head around it, only problem is I am streets ahead of DH and he doesn't have this forum (and would never use it in a million years!!) I wish he would or I fear he will never come to accept and embrace this is an option in the way I can see myself doing.

Steph honey - I can't see your piccie yet   I am always days behind everyone else! I think I have caught your cold!! Feeling really groggy and had a really sore throat this morning   I hope you are starting to feel better.

On the subject of colds/ flu, i know I will probably not get to EC but I just got worried, will they go ahead with GA if you are ill??

Wow - Benjamin Button, one of the most amazing and emotional films I have seen in a long time. It stirred so many emotions in me it took me a while to compose myself to leave the cinema. I thought I was going to cry and cry and cry! Oh and my fear of seeing Brad as a wizened old man was unfounded, him as a young guy more  than made up for it!!  

Whats everyone up to today? Wheres Anne - it is unusual to not see her for this long?

Anne - you okay poppet? Hope you are just busy and having a nice time   

Love to all xxxx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Morning girls,

Ally: I saw Benjamin Button last night too and it made me   I thought it was amazing! What a story?! Brad Pitt   Is he ever going to get old?  Hope not 

Oh also - "Have I told you I've been struck by lightening 7 times"  

Purple:


purple72 said:


> Hey Pix, can't believe missed you off the list!
> Thanks for adding me on ** hunny, you are just like your avatar


   

What are you saying Purps - I have flashing outfits and shoes?  

Ali: Still no face hun. I might go and get a younger one instead  I wish I could do that with my ovaries too. 

Elinor/Donkey/Angel/Catherine: These special     for you. Hope you are all OK.

Anne: Hope you are having so much fun with your 3D friends hun and you've forgotten all about us 

I'm off to a 3D friend's birthday party this afternoon. Tracey we are coming to Godalming to celebrate, might bump in to you? Love your photo with Max by the way, he looks so cute. 

Hope everyone is having a great weekend.

Lots of love.

Pix xxx


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Girls,

Only a quick hello as am just about to go out to lunch with my brother and his lot.
haven't stopped all weekend as we've had the boys and been out to see Jasons dad and his new lady (she is very nice, we approve!!) and ha to pop into work yesterday too so am shattered!!!

Haven't got time to read all back but is everyone ok?

Anne
xxxx


----------



## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

Hi All

I am truly grateful for all your replies. I certainly didn't mean to offend anyone and consider the responses I have had as being a very interesting  debate on an issue that so many of us are having to contemplate.

You have helped me enormously. My appt last thursday at UCH was, in theory, a last fling, one last opinion.. and as it turned out quite a solemn and sobering experience.

Like loads of you - we have been through the mill, lost four babies and in having 3 of them removed also, as it appears, possibly lost my fertility.

I will contact the Lister next week and ask for an appointment. We have also had discussions this weekend over adoption (which we had tentatively looked into) and Donor Eggs. 

I guess you just never ever think it will come to this point. My writing on this board helps lay it all out so to speak - with people who are more objective, have an idea of what we are going through and who can give an honest opinion without fear of losing a friend ...as seems so often be the case in this experience - so many just don't keep in contact anymore.

Also, theres no one professional to point you in the right direction in fertility - how do I know I'm wasteing another £200 seeing a Dr who might actually be pants or biased in some way - this is the only arena I have to get that sort of feedback and I am eternally grateful for your honest views. They help at a time when I can ruminate on hours on what we should do next and not necessarily come up with an informed decision.
Thank you again.

I will keep you updated x



.


----------



## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi Ladies 
Not sure if this is the right area for me, but can I ask a question. I am on day 6 of stimming. I'm on x6 amps of Menapur. I was due to go down to x4 after 3 days but on Friday had a call to say to stay on x6. She said my e2 is rising but they would like it to be higher. At baseline on Tuesday it was 40, on Friday day 4 it was 250. I have been worrying, they cannot increase my dose any more, should I be worried? 
When I was on iui in Nov, I was on x3 amps, they raised me to x4 amps and after 20 days of stimming I finally had x2 follies. 
They were all very suprised because my fsh is 7.5 amh is (can't remember what it is) and have been pg before? Is it unusual for someone with good fsh to be a poor responder? Maybe I need a different drug?
Sorry for all the questions
Anna x


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Afternoon ladies 

Just a quick one from me today to catch up and say hi, been to brothers and m-i-l's for lunch and just about to start the ironing again!!!   

Hope everyones having a nice weekend try and catch up again later

Kate
xxxxxxx


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## dakota (Feb 6, 2007)

What do you think of your clinic?​
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=174973.msg2798346;topicseen#msg2798346


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

OHM its snowing like mad here


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Kate- we' ve had flurries but so far nothing major...


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hi all,

Been awol today as think I've caught Kate & Steph's bugs across FF!

As for Cricket! Bobbi I symathise hunny, I never had any interst in cricket till met DH, he took me to a one day final at lords first year we were together and I was hooked, we then went to South Africa to meet his parents and South Africa were playing England so got to know all the rules and have never looked back! Does help that so many cricketers are hot! and fit! my fave is kevin Pieterson! how lucky that liberty x woman is!

Ally I had liz for my scan and think I'm booked with her for next time! she seems so lovely and such a chatterbox, mind you it was abit strange having a normal conversation with me stripped from the waist down    

Glad you and pixie enjoyed Ben Button, Think I may be abnormal     as never seen what everyone likes about brad! I'm a dark haired girl all the way no blondes for me.

Pixie, yes I can imagine you with flashing shoes    

Mir glad you finally got seen for Rob's hand! sure they only told you what you know already! Any timescales on his op? 

Welcome sobroody, sure someone will advise soon, I have normal FSH but have never responded on last 2 cycles, trying this time on menopur for first time (Gonal F didn't do trick for me)

Bunjy my clinic (oxford) were v negative after my previous 2 bad responses, I had app at Lister last week and though they said previous IVF response was as strong an indicator as poor FSH/AMH results, the figures they showed us were far more positive than Oxford 20-30% compared to 5% so hopefully they can offer you the hope you need right now

Hey Anne hope your long round trip went ok?

Hello to everyone else, nose dripping now so will catch you all later (don't want to spread it through my keyboard    

Hey beach we had a quick flurry this aft but raining now

Kate where are you hunny? (in the country I mean)

Sx


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi purps - in a little town called halesowen about 8/10 miles south west of brum, our road is white over already and cars are covered, been snowing here for 2hours solid now.


----------



## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Bless sounds lovely!

Ours still hasn't defrosted since last week but sure this rain will make it disappear  

I love it

Sx


----------



## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Hi, please excuse me if I am less than coherent. I had friends round for roast pork for lunch which was delicious.  Watching that Jamie Oliver programme about British pork led us to go and buy a shoulder of pork - absolutely fantastic, cooked it for about 5 hours and it just fell apart.  Anyway, it was washed down by a 3 bottles of red (not each) and now I can't stop drinking!  Sod the bloody diet, I didn't lose any weight last week even though I was really good.

No snow here in Godalming

Pixie, I hope you had a nice time this afternoon. I didn't leave the house so didn't have a chance to bump innto anyone

Miranda.  I think I missed your post on Robert's hand.  Have you found something concrete wrong with it?

Kate.  I don't envy with you ironing.  I hate it.  love cleaning but hate ironing

Sobroody1.   It does seem that there are a few of us with normal FSH but low AMH and poor response.  My FSH is between 9 and 10 but my AMH~ is 0.5 and I have only ever got 1 egg

Bobbi.  Hope the fact that this is the first time you have logged on this weekend means you have been having a fab time?

Bungy.  I'm sure you won't have offended anyone.  All of us on this thread might have to consider other options.

Ally, I hope you arent getting a cold.  Someone on another thread said it is only if you have a temperature  that they won't go ahead with EC

Swinny.  My next step is: I have gone on a waiting list at CRM for donor eggs.  They say they should find a match within 6 months or less.  Half scary, half exciting. My only concern about DE now is that I still won't get pg and how I will cope with yet another failure with good odds.

Kazzie.  I am glad you have managed to upload the photo of darling little Joshua.  He looks gorgeous.  I know I have said it before, but I am so sorry for your loss

Ali.  I am glad you  had a good time with your friend and she understood where you are coming from.

Purple, sorry you are catching the FF lurgy!  I hope you feel better soon

Hi Beach, Anne, Juicy, Laura, Nix, LittleJen, Jo, Donkey, Angel, Hazlenut,  Natasha, Nikki, Emmachoc, Steph and anyone I have missed


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Tracey what a lovely pic of you and the little man! 

Sorry mods for one liner  

Sx


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## PlanetJanet (Oct 4, 2008)

Hi,

I thought I would post on this thread, as I'm quite new to FF and got a bit lost.  However, I think this is probably the most relevant place (I hope!!!).  I have been taking DHEA for a couple of weeks now (50mg) and wondered if anyone else has heard that it can cause excess oestrogen?  I have a high oestradial and am worried that it will increase with the DHEA.  Although I'm not sure what the link is between high oestradial and poor ovarian reserve.  

Does anyone have a clue - I don't!!***

Thanks alot everyone and good luck to all....

PJxxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

hi, PJ, i don't know much about DHEA but I do know that low ovarian reserve does tend to go hand in hand with early high E2. ie early in the cycle, e2 starts to climb so ovulation would often be around day 11 or 12 rather than 14 with women of L.O.R.. (by the way, this is completely separate from a short luteal phase, though the same woman could easily have all 3!)


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi everyone,

Ally - hello hope you are OK. I read through the info you got from Sam from Dr Sher and am now in a bit of a panic! 

Can anyone who has issues with NK cells tell me whether it is too late at this stage of my tx (day 13 of stimms so far looking like will continue for several more days) to get tested and where do I go? I just read on the info from Dr Sher that if you have anti-thyroid antibodies which I do you have a 50% likelihood of having NK cells. If I do have NK cells what does this mean at this point? Can I go on medication now or is it too late? Also according to Dr Sher I should be on steroid meds for the thyroid issue too (I did get told this by Dr Gleicher at CHR and showed the list of meds to Jaya but she hasn't mentioned them since). Anyone know anything about this?

Sorry so many questions, just wondering if it is all too late for this tx and it will have been a completed waste of time and money!

I feel such an idiot I thought the anti-thyroid antibodies were not an 'immune' issue even though it is also called auto immune thyroid disease.  

Oh also wanted to say I saw the donor discussions and that info from Steph on the genetics was fascinating and has made me even more sure that is the way I want to go if my own eggs don't start behaving! I also had a friend who offerred her eggs to me but although DP was keen as he would prefer to know what the person is like I personally would prefer anonymous. Anyway the info from Steph just confirmed that to me. Thanks Steph.

Missy xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Missy - oh sh!t hon - I didnt want to freak you out with that stuff - sorry!! I know nothing about immunes, nothing I am afraid but Sam has recently had some tests done and Natasha and Nix are currently undergoing treatment for immune issues so hopefully they will be able to help you. Until then lets hope you are in the 50% that don't have issues. I hope you have managed to not go mad over the weekend. I have got a cold and sore throat and that has made me really grumpy, roll on Tuesday       

Hello everyone else sorry no more personals I am going to get an early night.

A x


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi ally - im with you on the early night hunny - had a crap weekend and no doubt the rest of the week will follow suit. Im p**sed off and going to bed


----------



## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Me three hope we're all feeling better tomorrow!

Sx


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Not quite in bed.....

Kisses and cuddles for Kate and Purps - sorry you feel the same girls.

Night night all xxxx


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Ok thanks Ally I think I will pm them.  

See you Tuesday hopefully. 

Night all.

xx


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi Planet Janet -I have a high level of uterine nk cells (had a womb biospsy at liverpool, mine are 7.1 anything over 5 is high) and will be taking steroids (20 mg prednisone (sp?) ) from embryo transfer and heprain from a bf and baby aspirin throughout. Mine are high but not super high so they think steroids will do the trick for me (rather than needing anything more radical like ivig). I understand you can have blood tests done to identify nk cells but I am pretty sure you have to get this done privately ( Liverpool is the only nhs hospital where you can get the test but this done via a womb biospsy which is not an option for you now). I know Dr ******* in London does the test as do CARE in Nottingham (but I think CARE send their blood tests to the states) 

Try not to panic you have a 50% chance of not having high cells. I have read taking a good quality fish oil with epa can help with nkcells. I am taking a double dose of zita wests vital dha with has both.

Thanks ladies interetsing to know that some of you have a normal fsh too. Have my 1st scan this am so we shall see what's happening.

Anna x


----------



## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Morning girls.  After lots of womb juice last night I ended up falling asleep on the sofa at 7.30 then when I went to bed at 10.30 couldn't sleep!  Serves me right I suppose.  Why is it impossible to just have one glass of wine without finishing the bottle and more.  I must get back on track today.  I must say we had the most fab roast pork.

Missy.  I hope you get some answers from Natasha and Nix.  Don't forget, if you did have to cancel this cycle you won't have spent much unless you got to EC.  I hope that doesn't happen though.  

I have a lovely day planned today - a smear test at 12.00.  Oh the joys of being poked and proded around in your lady garden!  I should be used to it now as apart from the IVF I have to have a six monthly smear as I had to have treatment for pre-cancerous cells.

Planet Janet.  I have always told the consultants that I am taking DHEA and they haven't mentioned it might be a problem.  Some have said there is no concrete evidence that it helps egg quality but none have said stop taking it.  Although when I went to CRM recently for my egg donor appointment they said they would want me to stop taking it as soon as I am matched as 'they wouldn't want to be increasing a male hormone'.  It makes sense anyway to stop when I am matched because by that point I will be well and truly over hoping for a miracle natural BFP.

Kate and Purple, I hope you are feeling better this morning.

Good luck for tomorrow's scan Ally.

I hope all my ff friends have a good day today.  Those of you with snow - enjoy it.  We just have horrible rain and I have to go out in it soon.


----------



## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Morning Tracey Hunny! 

What a [email protected] day I hate smears! Be careful out there I've just got back from my powerwalk and although the pavements look just wet inbetween the melting snow they are bl00dy slippy!!!     I'm just glad no one had a camara, must have looked hilarious at times!!!!! Its raining here too but feel like ice hitting your face! thankfully that's all of me that was exposed so not too bad!

It makes me smile when you mention the pork! seems like you really enjoyed it   

Sobroody good luck with your scan hunny!

Ally hope your feeling a bit better this morning, I'm status quo really so no worse at least just TMI mucousy and burning chest so I wrapped up well   

Kate how you doing hunny!?

Anna that's good info to have hunny thanks

On the DHEA front last time I took it I took 75mg and had lots of spots and a tash starting, this time I started on 50 and have had the same, now maybe my thinking is wrong but if I'm getting such a strong  reaction I believe I must have enough circulating Testosterone so last few days have been taking 25 and rash has lessened a lot, bit early to comment on the tash as need to wax first and then see what comes back! but spots not gone away but much more manageable so think I'm going to stick to that dose for now.

For all you DHEA experts am I just pi55ing in the wind with that dose?

Hugs to all and take care out there today!

Sx


----------



## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Purple, I am very impressed with you going for a powerwalk this morning, especially as you are not feeling great.  I am not looking forward to leaving the house, I don't really have a rain coat and just a tiny handbag umbrella.  Need to go in a minute as I ordered some 'fertil plus' herbs on the internet and they were delivered to the post office so I have to pick them up. I was suckered into buying them from a website that had loads of quotes from older women who got pg 5 minutes after starting them.  I am probably just being gullible.  Oh well, I have a couple more months to hope for a miracle natural BFP.

See you all later.

Tracey


----------



## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Morning!!

Ally - I lurve the G&B's.  All their range has 25% off in Waitrose at the moment, if you are interested.  Hope the nail varnish on the toes does the trick    Good luck for tomorrow    

Pix - how was your party?  Did they know who you were without your face  

Anne - I read that you had been to see Jason's dad and his new BABY    

Bobs- hope you get good news today.  I saw Esmerelda yesterday and she asked me if you still had bad breath    You're rignt, she is charmless.

Sobroody - Hi!  

Kate - luch at mil's....yummy   Are you snowed in today??  

Tracey - what do you mean, you love cleaning     My mum made that pork last week and she raved about it too.  Hope the smear is not too unpleasant. 

Janet - hello  

Anna - Hi  

Missy - keeping everything crossed for you for tomorrow.  How you doing?  

Purple - power walk - aren't you good.  How far do you go?  Hope you feel better soon.  

Love to everyone!!

I had booked last week and this week of work to cover all the scans and tx etc, with a view to cancelling it if the tx was cancelled.  Well, it was cancelled but I still had last week off.  But I haven't gone back today either!  I saw my boss yesterday and she said to do what I liked and persuaded me to stay off if thats what I wanted to do.  However, I am thinking that it is a bit of a waste of annual leave and that maybe I could go back Wednesday?  Would rather stay on here all week and watch This Morning!!    Will give it some thought


----------



## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Morning Ali hon,

I would stay off if I were you, but try to focus your mind on doing something you enjoy doing rather than just mooching around watching daytime tv (I am SO good at mooching!) What about doing something simple like buying yourself a good book, and going to sit in your favourite coffee shop with coffee (decaff) and cake? How decadent. Or treat yourself to some clothes? Or a walk on the beach (I don't know where you live. And the weather is shocking - forget that one actually!) Or take out a really good DVD and curl up in front of the fire? Why don't you make a list of lovely things you enjoy doing and try and do one everyday...

Talking of This Morning - I was watching it today (while WFH you understand  ) and they were talking about Jade Goody and about her cancer that has spread. God' it's so so sad. That and Tracey going off for her smear today has really made me realise I need to book one - I haven't had one for 4 years now.... Somehow my worries have been put into perspective....

love to you all girlies x


----------



## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

On a different note - tracey - I missed the Jamie Oliver roast pork thing that everyone's raving about - can you tell me what it is? Or anyone else who saw it?
ta. x


----------



## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Jo book that smear hunny, a few minutes of discomfort for 3 years of reassurance, (apart from Tracey hunny sorry yours are 6monthly!)

I got a few books on sat from local charity shop and am enjoying Candice bushells 4 blondes at the moment! When meant to be WFH   

Not that good with the powerwalk ladies only did aabout 1 mile, but warms the old bones me thinks   

Ali, I've been floating on air since I called central homecare so once again Thank you   

Tracey, we've got to try it all haven't we    I've been using moon cup after BMS in hope that sperm will stay where necessary, sure that's just clutching at straws, but at least I feel I'm doing something    Hope you got your parcel and smear wasn't too bad!

Hugs to everyone else

Sx


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Morning ladies,

I now realise why i was feeling so p**sed off weekend.  Af turned up this morning after only 20 days    Last months was 40 days    No idea whats going on with my hormones   Still feeling a bit down and fed up to be honest hopefully will now now af's here yet again. Hope it will be gone by satday dh is taking me to hotel and show in london for valentines day, so am looking forward to a valentines bonk 

Jo - get that smear booked now hunny - no excuses, im ur beatch after all! 

Purple - hope ur feeling better today hunny  

Ali - not snowed in today hun, supposed to have bad weather tonight tho, they have put out severe weather warning of heavy snow and blizzard conditions for the midlands   I could do with tomoz off anyway   I would go back wednesday hun and have a day of treats for urself tomoz  

Tracey im with you on the ttc nat   I just cant sit here doing bugger all, even tho it leaves me upset every month or every 20 days 

Ally and missy good luck huns hope the news is good, fingers crossed for you both  

Anne - u ok hunny   

Hi to everyone else, must go and have some dinner im starving.  Diet did not go well at all weekend, needles to say am now heavier than when i started diet 4 weeks ago   

Kate
xxxxxxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Girls,

Elinor- I am so very sorry about your news hun, I hope I haven't missed any updates. How are you hun?  

Angel- How you feeling yourself today? 

Kate- Thanks for the text Mrs  . How's your cold actually hun? Sorry b itching AF has arrived early    

Pix- Nice weekend?  

Ally- You too hun, nice weekend? Tomorrow is your scan isn't it?  

Donkey- Hope you're ok hun?  

Purps- How is your cold now hunny?  

Ali- Did I say Jason's dads baby    I meant new lady     

Nat- How was your dinner party lady? 

  Lainey, Fishy, Tracey, Juicy, Bobbi, Sam, Fishy, Jo, Nix, NikkiW, Miranda, LJ, Lucy Beachy, Popsi, Missy, Rachel, Nikki2008,
All the new ladies

AF arrived last night so 4 days early  . 

Anne
xxxx


----------



## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Well, I had my smear which I didn't even feel.  I also had to have a blood test for something called CMV which you have to have if going for donor eggs or sperm in the UK.  When I told the nurse why, she said that she had had failed IVF too.  


Kate, sorry your cycle seems to be a bit up and down.   that AF has gone before Valentines.  Sounds fabulous.

Anne, I am sure you said Jason's dad and new lady.  I hope AF treats you OK

Purple.  1 mile powerwalk sounds very energetic to me.  Enjoy your books

Jo, the Jamie Oliver programme was about British pigs and how their welfare is much better than European pigs who keep their sows in crates so small they can't turn round.  So, make sure you only buy British bacon and other pork products.  He was also talking about the fact that in the UK we don't buy shoulder or belly pork cuts which are cheap.  Apparently we actually export those cuts and have to import pork loin which is what we want to buy.  We had shoulder and belly and cooked them both for ages so the meat literally melted in your mouth.  Funny though as nearly everywhere had sold out of shoulder on Saturday so obviously Jamie's programme worked.  DH used a recipie from Jamie's Italy book.

Ali.  You might find that going back to work helps take your mind of the 2ww.  Then you can use your annual leave for holiays or more tx later.


----------



## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi girls

Long time no see!! Hope you all still remember me!! Can I rejoin this wonderful group of ladies pls?

Had 3 months off tx (bliss) and have been taking DHEA (finding spots and tash so fetching but sticking with it as seems to be getting better) and coenzyme Q10 plus usual vits. Now getting back on hamster wheel, just waiting for AF to arrive which should have been today but sod's law - 1st time it has been late for months, feels like it is on route though so any dreams of a natural BFP are not going to materialise before we have to start again!! Then I'll be starting on the SP with full dose menopur (not looking forward to getting my head round that 1 as always done Gonal F).

Looks like there has been lots going on here and I will try and quickly catch up on all your news.

Love and luck to you all.

J x


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Welcome back J hunny!

I'm on menopur this time round too after 2 IVF's with Gonal F! I actually watched a you tube vid on it yesterday but everyone says it's fine once you get the hang of it! Have you bought yours yet! Just that I got quotes this morning and there was a £600 difference between boots and a company called healthcare at home which sell it to you for 11.60 a vial, a huge saving if you're having 90 vials like me  

Let me know if you need the details

Sx


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi ladies, I am sorry to butt in I really hope you don't mind. I've been reading this thread for a while (and you've given me hope at the times when I've had none) but I haven't been brave enough to post. (I'm very shy!) I've just posted on peer support but I wanted to post here to see if any of you had had the same experience as me and could give me some hope. I'm feeling pretty hopeless right this minute after an appointment with my clinic this morning ...

I am 35 and have low AMH (3.5 pmol and that was a year ago - not been brave enough to retest since) and endo. We are just doing our first IVF cycle at Barts - I saw Jaya at the Lister last year (thanks to recommendations on FF) and she said there was no harm doing an NHS cycle so we have. Barts put us on the microdose flare protocol, which Jaya said she would only put us on if I didn't respond on the SP.

I started 0.3 ml of Buserelin on day 2 and have continued it since then and I have had 450 of Menopur since day 3. I went down to 300 for one night but they upped it again. My first scan on Friday (after 5 days of stims) showed 5 small follicles and another scan today (after 8 days of stims) showed that 4 were still under 10mm and 1 was 11mm. The consultant thinks we should cancel, he says it would be a "miracle" if we got pregnant with that slow a response and that it indicates a problem with my eggs on this cycle. He said that on the microdose flare protocol I should have larger follicles by now. They have taken bloods and I am waiting for a call back this afternoon. They say I can carry on if I want to and see what has happened in 2 days time, but he clearly wasn't recommending it. 

Obviously I am devastated, left the clinic in tears and am feeling pretty hopeless right now. If that was what the Lister would have put us on if we hadn't responded on the SP, wasn't that the last chance saloon? I don't feel like I can quite grasp it. I know I'm not young, but I didn't think this would be it for me already.  

Has anyone else had this happen to them on this protocol? Is there a chance another protocol or a change of drugs could work next time? Obviously if we do cancel I will go back to the Lister and get some advice from them as well. 

Thanks so much if you have read this far and my thoughts are with everyone else going through this
x


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi Purple, if you want some tips on Menopur I have loads   It is fine once you get used to it
x


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Hi Jal.

When I first read your post I thought you said 3 months off (meaning work) and I was very jealous  
Good luck for your next tx.  I moved from gonal f to menopure and found it fine.  I was worried about going from the nice easy pen to mixing vials but got on just fine once I had done the first one.

I have a question for you all girls.  I had been thinking of not telling people about the donor eggs if we are lucky enough to get pg.  But I worried about the fact that I will be perpetuating the myth that a 43 can get pg with her own eggs (I know it is possible but you know what I mean).  I hate the fact that people quote lots of older women having babies when some of them have very likely had donor eggs.
Should I just think of myself and not tell people.  I would tell the child though.

Hi Almond.  I am not that experienced and I am sure others on this thread will give you advice.  If I were you I would want to go on stimming for at least 2 or 3 days and see if any of the smaller follies catch up.  I am sure I have read a few stories of people whose follies have suddenly caught up in a matter of days.  Many of us here have gone ahead with one or two follies.  I suppose it depends on whether you think you have a chance of getting a better response in the future.  If you do, and money is tight then it might be worth cancelling before EC.  As you say, you are relatively young, but I know more than anyone how the years tick by if you don't do anything.  I hope you are able to make the right decision for you.

Tracey


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hi Almond, no BFP for me YET   but just wanted to know if you cancel can you go again Free of Charge! 

I was cancelled first IVF during Stims (NHS Cycle) and they didn't count it as a cycle unless you got to EC, so may be worth asking if you can go again, esp if as doc's said he thinks it's a problem with your eggs on THIS cycle, maybe he thinks it would be better next time around

Apart from that I've no other advice hunny, although your bloods may suggest how many eggs in those follies, It's a hard decision, but make sure you get the bloods and then maybe they can discuss it with you further

   

Tracey DH & I have had just this conversation, unfortunately no answers as yet, think it's a tough one but maybe check out the ED boards as those ladies may be able to give you more food for thought both ways on this issue. My concern is very selfish as wouldn't want DH's family knowing    

Glad smear went well hunny!! Hope you didn't get too wet   

Sx


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## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi Girls

Thanks so much for the welcome back!!!

Purps - can you send me the details, i may well be starting tomorrow or Wed so may have left to late to go elsewhere for meds - i am usually just really lazy and get them from the hospital pharmacy!! If  you have the link to the utube vid that would also be fantastic, here we go again, when do you start or have you already? Sorry, still catching up.

Hi Tracey - I wish I had been off work, but to be honest I prob had the 3 mnths off when I was going through tx   - I was there in body only!! In terms of telling people about DE, I don't see how it is anyone's business but yours and totally up to you what you tell people.

J x


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

purple72 said:


> Glad smear went well hunny!! Hope you didn't get too wet


I doubt it, I never found smear tests that exciting    (sorry, couldn't resist!) You were out early for your powerwalk! Stop showing me up missus! 

Almond hon it's so difficult to tell at this point. If you increase your liquid intake (2l water a day, + 1 of milk too if you can manage it - semi-skimmed or skimmed for pref) and your protein intake, it might make a difference on your next scan, also try keeping you tummy warm with a hot water bottle or wheat bag. By the way your doc is talking b0ll0x in my opinion, the problem is not with your eggs, it's with the protocol he's put you on. Perhaps if he spent a bit less time making you feel inadequate and a bit more time considering what he might do differently to help you it might be a bit more constructive! Sorry if that rude but it's idiotic statements like that which lead to all kinds of misery and feeling that it's never going to happen!

Hi Tracey - hon I don't think it's any of anybody else's business tbh. As long as the child knows that's all that matters. And women of 43 do get preg naturally. Ok it's rare but it does happen! But if you do go for donor eggs, I don't think you should feel obliged to shout it from the rooftops if you don't want to. Why should you? If the child had been conceived via natural conception, would you feel obliged to tell people chapter and verse of how many times a week you did it and in what positions  You're not trying to be an advert for DE after all, as I understand it, you just want to complete your family. And how you do that is none of anyone else's business!

Hi Jal - welcome back lovey - don't panic re the menopur honestly it's a bit fiddly faffing around with all those stupid little vials but you'll be mixing 'em up like Jamie Oliver before you know it!

Hey Jo love, how are ya?!

Hiya Anne - sorry your AF turned up early, always the way when we don't want her to 

Soo AF appears to have landed on the PR thread, so far that's me, LJ, Anne, Kate... anymore for any more?! Sam did she show up yet hon? If not, have a dance on me!:





Love to all!

/links


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Tracey- Glad your smear was ok. I am nagging my SIL as we speak as she hasn't had one for 9 years!!!!
xx

Hi Jal- x

Hi Almond x

Hello NIx chix- How are ya? xx

Sorr for little posts- am snowed under at work.
Just booked my next FSH/AMH test for Wednesday morning  
xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Nix,     only you hunny!!!!

You're on fine form hey! as for showing anyone up, first exercise I've done since friday  

Jal will PM you sweetie

Hugs to everyone else

Sx


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Nixf01 said:


> purple72 said:
> 
> 
> > Glad smear went well hunny!! Hope you didn't get too wet
> ...


   

Nix, thanks for your comments re telling or not telling the world. I liked your analogy about not telling the world how many times you had to have sex to achieve BFP. Unless you are two of my friends who often relate that they only had to have sex once for each of their six children between them.  

I am having a v lazy day. Max fell asleep so I have been watching daytime tv and surfing the net.


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Hi ladies 
Thanks for the welcome. Had my day 7 scan today and I only have x5 follies, x3 on the left, x2 on my right measuring between 6 - 10mm. The nurse told me to be positive, that its early days and we should see more activity over the week (have scans on Wednesday and Friday) I was really uspset. I'm on the maximum dose of meapur x6 amps. I asked if I should have been put on a short protocol with a different drug ie gonal f as it took me 20 days on x4 amps tp produce just 2 follies for iui. She frowned and said to stay positive, early days etc. The doc I saw was the most junior in the clinic and asked the nurse what she thought of my dose...alarm bells should have started ringing then  

I'm drinking lots of milk, water and have made my meals protein heavy. Not sure what else I can do?

Asked what my amh was and its 8.5...that's not great is it?  

Almond - keeping my fingers crossed for you. Can we be cycle buddies? Eating protein and drinking milk is good advice. I also heard  fresh pomegranate juice is good...M & S do the fresh stuff, next to the sarnies, £2.44 per small bottle but delicious and v good for you. 

Tracey - I agree with purple. Using an egg donor is no one else's business! 

Nix - I too have friends who caught the first month of trying, makes me feel pants   

Anna x


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## Nikki2008 (Jan 11, 2008)

My internet connection is still not working   I missed so much!

Just to quickly update, the ultrasound showed ante-verted uterus (which I knew). 5 and 7 antral follicles.  AMH is 17.75 pmol/l.  DP's DNA fragmentation index is 10.8% (moderate levels of DNA fragmentation: 8% and high levels of DNA fragmentation: 2.8%). That looks actually rather good doesn't it? So is my only problem immune stuff?

Need to get internet sorted, this just won't do


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

purple72 said:


> Nix,    only you hunny!!!!
> 
> You're on fine form hey! as for showing anyone up, first exercise I've done since friday


   My God, I had to read that twice, FRIDAY?! What, last Friday? That's nothing! Anyway it's against the rules to exercise at the weekend. I mean even God took a day off, right?!   

Jal - can you ask them to split your prescription so you can get the first day or so's worth from the hossie and then buy the rest elsewhere?

Sobroody hon  to be honest 5 is not great but it's not nothing either! It IS very early days, as they said at your appy today, and you're doing everything right hon except maybe if you're at home, walk around with a hot water bottle strapped to your waist. If you're out and about, try the stick on warming patches that you can use for period pains and muscle strains. Sorry your doc isn't exactly instilling you with confidence but you're on their max dose and 5 isn't so bad to be going on with. I think someone posted on here recently that the average is 5-15 so despite what you may be reading on cycle buddies threads, you are in the average range! And who knows what may pop up between now and Friday? 

Think you might have got me and Tracey mixed up there but that's nuffink compared to some of the howlers I've committed while under the influence of menopur   

Enjoy your lazy day Tracey! Fab that Max decided to have a little nap in the middle of the day so you could slope off and catch up with your FFs! And your 2 mates sound like my SIL. She only had to look at her DH and she fell preg apparently. They had a daughter, decided to try for another one and ended up with twins...  Funny thing is, he (her now ex-DH) doesn't even like kids. Stupid !

xxx

Oops Hi Nikki  sorry I know bugger all about sperm analysis but I'm sure someone who has a clue will be along in a bit!

xxx


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## elinor (Jul 4, 2008)

Hi everyone

thanks for all your posts and messages and hopes and prayers for me... Still feeling   - really don't think it is fair to feel nauseous (a good sign !) but have period pains too  . Clinic haven't got me on anything ( I am already taking baby aspirin) - just have to wait till Friday.

Seeing my friend at the weekend was good - I only managed to get out of my PJs five minutes before she rang the doorbell, but it was frozen outside and blowing a gale, so I don't think I missed much. Went out with another friend on Sunday when wind had died down and it was all looking winter wonderland like and had a walk in the country. Saw buzzards and kites (the ones with strings attached, not the birdies) up over the hills and grebes diving in loch as well as cormorants - fighting over the unfrozen bit of the surface. Really beautiful, and I managed not to cry most of the day....

Back to work today and I find out that in terms of reducing stress/cutting back on hours I have not even reached stage one!! I first mentioned my wish to do this last year, in April in my 'annual development review'. Then seriously in November - with a view to actually reducing hours for January treatment - then again in December. My line manager has finally found the personnel policies, and told me I have to make my request in writing and they will get back to me within 6 weeks!! If I knew THIS cycle would work, or that taking time off would make the crucial difference I would just demand time off unpaid, but I cannot do that indefinitely, and certainly not if I am thinking about needing further testing for immunes and NK stuff.... Why is none of this ever simple?

Sorry for moan/rant.

So broody/Anna - sounds to me like you are doing everything you should. Are you using hot water bottle/ heated pad thing to keep abdomen warm? Don't worry about the dose - if you are on your clinic's maximum then you can't go up higher, and I had fewer follies on my day 8 scan (all smaller too) but still got 3 eggs at EC. You have only been stimming for 7 days, so please don't panic yet. Sending    and    your way!! Ps your AMH is more than double mine....

Hope everybody who needs smear tests books them - I am on a 12 month recall (was 6 months, but only ever because I was having IVF and the rules about recall differ north and south of the border, so I got to have to comply with both because I was at a clinic in Manchester - this meant I got referred for colposcopy, and if you have been referred for that they have to keep you on 6 monthly for a certain length of time (north of the border), before reducing it to annual... It is so ridiculous, but having had a friend at school lose her mum to cervical cancer I am prepared to go as often as they invite me - not pleasant, but if it saves lives then you can't really object)

Tracey and everyone on the DE issue - I think it is a personal decision, not a public statement. I would always want to be honest with any child I had about how they were conceived (but since I am single I'm going to have to come up with something, so it might as well be the truth!). You don't have to be the poster family for DE or anything. I also think the whole epigeneitcs thing highlights the crossover and interaction between genetics pure and simple (if there is such a thing) and nurture and the fact that your genetics, your baby's and your environment all have a role to play in the creation of that life for 9 months.Noone argues that environment has no effect - we are all for smoke free toxin free environments for pregnant women, and if alcohol, drugs, caffiene, raw fish, cheese and almost everything else has an impact on baby's development then surely the role of the mother even for DE must have a HUGE impact as filter for all the environmental factors, as well as her genetic makeup influencing what of baby's predispositions are actually activated. 
In terms of the known/anonymous donor aspect I don't have friends in the right age group, except new mums, so asking is not really appropriate and both my sisters are out (one is older than me, the other has other health problems that make it not an option). I think it really is a personal choice. I just want one cycle to work, and I don't care much whether it is my eggs or someone else's.

Hi Almond and Jal

Hi Anne - sorry you are snowed under at work, better to be snowed in at home I think! Hope it gets better....

Hi Ali - hope you can find some    out there. Know how you feel about trying to stay positive when you don't feel it!

Ally, Nix, Fishy, Beachy, Purple (wow to the exercise - staying upright between bus stop and office was my achievement for the day!), Kate, Steph, and everyone else - hope you are all well and feeling positive.

All best wishes
Elinor xx

just seen extras I missed

Nikki2008 - yoru results sound very promising - that's 12 antrals, and a lovely AMH result. Know nothings about sperm though, hope someone else can help with that.

Purps - I agree with Nix - even God had a day off!! But if you like the powerwalking, just try not to fall over! x


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> Soo AF appears to have landed on the PR thread, so far that's me, LJ, Anne, Kate... anymore for any more?!


and me - arrived on Saturday as I expected!  

Hello girls,

Work is very busy today  

Tracey: We were at the Inn on the Lake yesterday. I thought the food was horrendous!  My organic cod with parsley sauce came in parsley soup and I had to fish the cod out of the plate!  
OMG how many kids and pregnant women live in your area by the way? Broody beatches!  

Anne: Hi lovely my weekend was good - very lazy as usual!  How about you, have you done much? 

Nix: What is the best place to get my immune checked hun? I'd like to get it looked at before I cycle again. 

Hello Purps  

Hello to everyone else...

Pix xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> My God, I had to read that twice, FRIDAY?! What, last Friday? That's nothing! Anyway it's against the rules to exercise at the weekend. I mean even God took a day off, right?!


Loving your thinking and will follow your programme oh Queen!     

Did you get any snow in france hunny?

Off for a bit now as going to GP to see if he can give me pill, silly pharmacists at boots and tesco's wanted to keep whole script in exchange for giving me the pill! Not bl00dy likely!!!!

Hey Elinor, walk sounds wonderful!    till friday hunny! Wish I was actually that good just trying to shift weight last 2 treatments have piled on unfortunately keep eating DH's curries so the weight is not going anywhere!?!?

Busy week this week for us PR's I think lots of scans and tests, hoping we get lots of follie growth and BFP's

Hugs to all

Sx

Keep trying to post and yet more reply's hi pix! my AF's due next week valentines    but for all you ladies in sync now at least it'l be gone by then


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi again ladies, somehow you have managed to make me laugh ...

Thanks so much for all your tips. We are lucky and can have 3 NHS cycles (might be going down to 2 if PCT change rules) but not sure if we cancel would count as one or not, will find out thank you for pointing that out. I will wait and see what the blood tests show they are calling me between 4 and 6. If they show some response I think I will try for another couple of days despite the doom and gloom consultant because I dont want to be thinking what if in a few months' time and what is the harm (apart from getting a slap on the wrists for wasting their time) as even if this counts as an NHS cycle we would still get at least another one (if we carry on with Barts but might just go to the Lister if nothing else Barts could do). Feeling a bit more positive as it seems from some frantic internet research that other protocols might work even if this one doesn't. Not time to give up yet. 

Tracey - been following your story and feel really excited for you that you are thinking of going for DE. I've thought about that a bit myself though only v preliminary. I reckon its totally up to you whether you tell people, I don't know if I would or not. Bloody people who get pg "every time their partner looks at them" and feel the need to tell the world. GRRRR

Purple - thanks for explaining about the blood tests, so that must be why they are interested in the oestrogen then because it will show if anything is happening. As to Menopur, one of my tips for the Menopur is to get a fat needle (pink in my clinic) because it sucks the last dregs out of the bottom. I was struggling for a while with a finer one and I had to hold it upside down but it didn't all come out. Also if you have got that water bottle you have to break make sure you snap it low down where the dot is otherwise you will end up with glass everywhere (it looked like a disaster zone after my first attempt, I smashed about 8 of them) and use a tea towel when you break it so you don't cut yourself!

Nix -thank you for what you said re consultant, not at all rude, made me laugh and I wish I had been composed enough to say something to his face. I dont think they realise what effect their words are having, how horrible it is to hear news like that and then for them to make you feel like you are a hopeless case. I have been frantically drinking water and eating protein all weekend and I have had acupuncture as well and a hot water bottle fastened to my stomach. I feel so miserable I haven't done any of that today but you are right I should carry it on just in case. 

Anna - sounds like we are in a similar position I have been on 6 vials of Menopur as well but I am on Buserelin as well. I have 5 follies too (I was delighted with that!) but yours are doing a bit better than mine size wise. Are you doing the long protocol? I am doing something called the short flare. I think your AMH is ok depending on what scale you are looking at but I think even on the pmol scale it is ok, I think I have read that on here that 5-15 is classed as normal. I will have to try the fresh pomegranate juice, thanks for the tip. I've been mixing smoothies with protein powder to get extra protein.

Thank god for this thread, not quite sure what else I would have done with myself this afternoon

x


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Pixie75 said:


> Nix: What is the best place to get my immune checked hun? I'd like to get it looked at before I cycle again.


Hey love, they do it at the Lister don't they? And I think they do it in-house so it's a bit less than at the ARGC cos they still send everything off to the states

Almond hon- doesn't matter if you haven't done it so far today! It's only what, after 3? Loads of time to warm up that tum and get that liquid down yer neck!

Hey Purps - no snow at the mo, just yucky rain but we did get a bit at the weekend. All melted again now tho!

Els _ I forgot to say sorry for the limbo you find yourself in at the mo. Same thing happened to me on my last cycle in France and it was a nightmare not knowing! Fingers crossed that your levels keep rising hon!   

xxx

xxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Elionor  

Hi Pix hun- Glad you had ncie w/end  . We had the boys so it's always pretty tiring as we travel to Leeds and telford to pick em up. We went visiting this weekend. Met Jasons dads new chick, went out with my bro and his lot yesterday so not stopped really  
xxx

Almond & Anna


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi almond, anna and jal 

Hi nix u had a good weekend hunny bun? 

Pix glad u had a nice weekend hunny  hope our af's are gone by weekend i feel like i aint had a good shag in ages 

Purps im just gonna buy the pill hun its 2.99 for 2 packs and my doc is on holiday for next 3 weeks so may as well get it same time as everything else 

Elinor - ooohh ur walk sounds lovely hun, i walked dog yesterday morning my only bit of excercise all weekend 

Anne - best of luck for amh/fsh hun, you getting them done at the priory again?  Gotta get mine done next month as well 

Nikki sorry hunny dont understand the dna fragmentation lark at all - glad ur back with us 

Hi to beachy, fishy, tracey, steph, missy , ally, donkey, becca, ali, miranada, laura, lightweight, kazzie, lucy, juicy and everyone else  

I have just eaten so much chocolate i think im gonna be sick 

Kate
xxxxxxxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

Nikki, that all looks great, excellent!  12 AFC and 18 AMh - excellent. good luck. xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Nik- Hi hun, nice results for you  

Hi Kate- Yep, priory hun. I have horrific Period pains - never ever used to get em till  I started TX  
xx


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

slycett said:


> I have just eaten so much chocolate i think im gonna be sick


well, you need to feel better soon, cos I need my beatch to go and get me chocolate NOW! And LOTS OF IT!!


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Hi everyone!

Sobroody/Anna - your AMH isn't too bad; they are still really confused about the scales but 8.5 is really ok. There is some scary scale out there which had 15+ as "normal" but many places now consider that to be very good and 5-15 to be fine.  With your cycle, I would listen to the nurse and keep going.  5 follies is a workable number - that is what my sister had!  

Nikki - sounds like your only issue is immunes.  Your AMH is excellent and DH's sperm stuff seems super.  At least you can focus on the right issue now, which has to be a good feeling.  

Sam - Kate has now complained to the HFEA but only recently.  I totally agree that clinics should be hauled up for giving women totally wrong information.  I hope AF tips up soon! 

Lightweight - sorry about the bleeding; I would give your clinic a call to get some reassurance.  BTW - it is a good sign that your AF are normal and regular. 

Bunjy - I think your doc at UCH seems to be painting an unnecessarily negative picture but they are a bit notorious for that.  Lucy on this thread was refused treatment by UCH only to respond fine at the Lister.  I wouldn't assume they are the "last word" - you are too young to give up! 

Jal - I am sure you will do fine with the menopur; if I remember correctly you responded fine when they got your dose right so do stay positive! 

Tracey - like the others, I don't think you need to be a walking DE ad.  If you want to keep it quiet then keep it quiet.  In this country there will still be many more natural pregnancies at 43 than DE babies so I don't think you are "perpetuating a myth". 

Swinny - glad you are off again! 

Missy - I know it's hard to stay positive with one eggie but it really could be your golden egg. Terri, who used to post here a bit, had a "one egg wonder" baby!  I feel for your dilemma on the thyroid issue and I'm afraid I don't know the answer.  

Laura - I can actually understand you not wanting to know your AMH at the time of your tx but it would be interesting now!

Ally - thanks again for all the inspiring tales.  Kate doesn't seem like a miracle at all!!  Lots of women have got pg with much worse FSH! 

Anne G - try not to worry too much about your AMH or FSH; focus on the fact that you did respond on your cycle. 

Elinor - very sorry to hear what you have gone through. 

Angel - really hope you are ok. 

Ali - the 2ww is so tough; be good to yourself. 

Catherine - sorry for your BFN 

Miranda - so glad they are finally dealing with robert's hand issue.

Donkey - give yourself a bit of time to recover - it isn't going to be immediate. 

Purple - I think that 25mg DHEA will still give you a boost; you shouldn't take more if the side effects are too unpleasant.

PlanetJanet - as Anna C says, if your E2 is too high at the start of your cycle it may show you are too far into your follicular pahse and may ovulate too early.  Some women ovulate early in their cycle anyway so it is hard to give hard and fast rules - I have read that ovulating earlier than day 11 is "bad" because it means the egg is not ready but then there are loads of women who naturally ovulate at day 10 or 11 and it is fine!  Plus, ovulating too late is also "bad" because the egg will be over mature!!  With DHEA, it can theoretically increase E2 but to be honest I have never read of this causing an issue and most of the research on DHEA has been on women with diminished reserve.  

AnnaC - hi there  

Bobbi - hello! 

Pixie -  

love to Kazzie, Fishy, Steph, Kate, Jo M and anyone else I have forgotten.


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne - if i have a "normal" 28 day cycle i usually start to get af cramps anytime from day 21 onwards, this cycle apart from feeling a bit down and anxious nothing, tbh i would rather have had the pains.   Being nosey now hun    are you having e2 and lh done at the priory as well?  Just wondering how much it is?  May as well get them done altogether if it aint too much more dosh?  

Hi littlejenny how has ur weekend been?  #

Jo - ohh hunny i ate all the chocolate  However i may have to pop to shop on the way home to get more.  

I really do need to get my little fat **** into gear to lose some weight, can you beleive i have a cross trainer, treadmill, and excerise bike in spare bedroom?  Currently they are posing very well as clothes hangers


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Kate- yes hun, gonna have E2 and FSH too- think amh is 95.00 and fsh is 50.00 dunno about E2  xxxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Cheers hun   Isnt it a joke we have to pay for normal blood tests tho, as if tx isnt costing enough already


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Anne - my Gp is always happy to do my FSH for free - is it worth asking to save yourself £50? Or do The Lister insist on doing it themselves - I know some clinics do.


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

didnt realise that Jo- I might just keep to the same place on this occasion to save hassle as got to hvae e2 and anh done there anyway
xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Jo and Anne - my doc normally does them on nhs but he is away for a few weeks now so may as well just get them done all at same time.  Just slightly peeved about paying, especially when its 50quid i could have spent on clothes or chocolate or sex toys


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

slycett said:


> Just slightly peeved about paying, especially when its 50quid i could have spent on clothes or chocolate or sex toys


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Hi Lightweight, have you seen the where to get cheap drugs board on here? The first page has a list of the most popular sources

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=9821.0

Kate -    you are too funny!
xxx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Doc Nix – thanks hun. I’ve just looked at the Lister site and there are 5 types of tests – which one of these I’d need to get done?  

Natural killer cells CD69
Natural killer cells cytotoxicity
Natural killer cells assay (CD69 & cytotoxicity)
Anti-cardiolipin antibodies
Lupus anti-coagulant

Anne: Your GP will do your FSH/LH/E2 hun and while you are there I’d get Testosterone done as well if I was you - so you know what your level is and you can adjust your DHEA dose?
I’d had the most painful AF after tx.   

Kate: You are a horny little one today   

Nikki: Wow! That’s great hun. That must be a relief for you.  

xxx


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Pixie75 said:


> Doc Nix - thanks hun. I've just looked at the Lister site and there are 5 types of tests - which one of these I'd need to get done?
> 
> Natural killer cells CD69
> Natural killer cells cytotoxicity
> ...


Lahd missus, mi no know! I think the ARGC did the Natural killer cells assay (CD69 & cytotoxicity) one but I never actually saw the results (just the bill!) so I don't know exactly which it was. I know they checked me for TNF-Alpha cells which I think falls under the cytotoxicity thing as well as the NK cells assay, but to tell you the truth I just let them bleed me dry without asking for too much detail  And I mean that quite literally, when you have the whole lot done it's about 14 vials of blood! I think if you have a word with the clinic and explain your situation, they should be able to advise you which ones to take.... or Auntie Tash might have a better idea...?

xxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

ACA and Lupus your gp should be able to do. 

id get the other 3 done. it's like this:

1. nk cells - may or may not be relevant, in terms of absolute numbers. 
2. nk activated - per most peoepl if anything is relevant, this is it. 
3. the assay - takes the NK activated ones and assesses how potent their killing power (nice eh?) is when added to (a) steroids such as prednisolone of a given conc and then separately to IVIg of varying concs too. 

if you believe in immunes, it's useful. 
i got the lister profile done and am now getting the ARGC one done too though which is doubling up but there it is. They do some extra ones, for a princely fee of course. do consider getting the whole panolpy done at ARGC and avoiding my mistake. 

good luck...


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## Bonchance (Feb 7, 2009)

hello all 

I just joined fertilityfriends at the weekend and was wondering if I could join this thread? I have had 2 failed cycles of ICSI and am waiting to be told that I have POF.. thats if the hospital ever gets around to giving me an appointment!  I am still trying to get my head around all the issues of low amh and poor response to stimulation and was hoping I would gain some info and advise on here.
Regards, Bonchance


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi everyone, I'm still in the game, Barts have called me and say blood tests show something starting to happen and I should carry on with the stims. Another scan Wed. This feels like mental torture ... Just need to erase what the consultant said this morning so I can try and be positive ... and get my **** down the stairs off the computer and drink a protein shake and stick a hot water bottle on ...

Lightweight - I did the pill before this cycle and spotted all the way through, they said not to worry about it. 

Hi Bonchance I just joined this thread this afternoon

x


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## Nikki2008 (Jan 11, 2008)

just a quick one from me, Pixie I think you asked about where to get immune tests done, I can recommend Dr Gorgy (ex ARCG) who can do the Chicago tests, those are the one originally proposed by Dr Beer (authour of 'is your body baby friendly), consultation 120, can't remember how much the tests were but can dig out receipts if you are interested or better still just call (http://www.fertility-academy.co.uk). Ok, internet cafe next to kebab shop so I thought I pop in while they do my chips 

/links


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Pix - i know hun im a tramp    

Lightweight good luck with ur scan hunny  

Almond good luck too petal    

Welcome bonchance    

Hi nikki, pixie, anne, lj and everyone.


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Sorry ladies don't have it in me to do many personals but I am sure I don't need to tell you how much I love you all! 

Anne - thank you for text honey pie! 

Bonchance - I am sorry to hear about your failed cycles  I have been putting together a thread over the past few days which may help to lift your spirits http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=174687.0 I know how horrible it is to have cancelled cycles, low amh and be told you may be POF. You are in the right place here as there are a few of us who have 0.1 AMH and although we would obviously not wish it upon each other it is good to know that there are others who understand how you feel. I hope that your consultation goes better than you are expecting (when you get there!!).

Kate - sorry about your bloody af - what the hell is she thinking! No wonder you havent been feeling good hon 

Purps - well done for power walk this morning hon - careful tomorrow though as i think you may need a canoe!! 

Nikki - wonderful news you must be thrilled, we may have to kick you off the thread now 

Pixie Pops - glad you liked Benjamin Button too 

Missy hon - see you there tomorrow darling, got everything crossed for you    

Keeping me head down girls as I feel a bit like I am having my last supper tonight!  Such mixed emotions, on the one hand I am hoping they cancel as I don't want to go 21 days (as I have previously) only to have a cancellation (although obviously I will still cry my eyes out if that happens!), on the other hand I am hoping I suddenly have 5 measurable follicles (as if that would ever happen!) and am already dreaming about being the girl that got there against the odds!! Why can I never find the middle ground!!

I am exhausted I have been researching over the past few days and I have added a good few more 'miracles' on my thread, it has been good therapy in the run up to this scan.

May be back later but if not wish me luck


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Ally, thank you so much for starting that fantastic thread to give us all hope. I just wanted to wish you all the best for your scan tomorrow. I've just joined today though been lurking for a while. Would love to hear this is the one for you. Thinking of you and have everything crossed
x


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hello all!
Not read back through properly but just popping in to say hi to all!  
Angel   
LJ - sorry it wasn't your month but I'm sure it will be soon  
Swinny - good luck with kicking off again   
Ally - good luck, hoping for some good news for you.

Back at work now, not going too bad. Emily is getting a tooth at last!   Having a mummy day tomorrow at home.
See everyones got their AF - lets hope no one has any more 
Love to all
NicksW


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## Donkey (Nov 24, 2007)

Evening
So much to catch up on...

Welcome Bonchance and almond

Kate, Purple and Ally? ( I think, I've lost the thread) hope you are over the PR lurgy and feeling better  

Ally and Missy, huge   and   for tomorrow.  

Nikki2008 thank you for the PM, hope your internet is working soom

Natasha my Alan Beer book arrived today, already I can see so much that applies to me.  I already feel that we have a way forward.  

Anne sounds like a busy weekend  

Zuri how long til OTD, hope the 2ww isn't driving you too mad.  

Ali - hope you're ok  

Well i had my NHS appt at my local hospital today to refer me to the Hammersmith for my other 2 NHS cycles that the PCT will now fund.  The doctor didn't enquire as to how  i had responded to my 3 failed cycles but told me I should start considering DE as I was getting older and I had to consider calling it a day as there is only so many goes I can have and not to waste my time /emotions.  I just smiled, nodded and ignored, just thinking of you girls and how outraged you would be.  Before I can be referred I have to have bloods and a scan again.  He also said I had to have anothe HSG but I refused unless I had it under sedation.  Last time was torture, I went into shock, my abdomen spasmed and I couldn't walk for 24 hours.  So I have to have a hysteroscopy under GA.  Has anyone had one?

Elinor and Angel  

Lots of love to everyone else LJ, beachy, nikkiW, anna, nix, pixie, lightweight, jo, miranda, sam, jal, bunjy, bobbi, fishy, lucy, juicy and anyone else sorry if I'v emissed you.

Donkey xx


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Hi Nicki.  I am glad is going OK back at work.  Are you working full time.  Is Emily going ot nursery?

Almond.  You said this thread made you laugh earlier.  Stick around and maybe join the PR chat room on Wednesday night (assuming we have one this week?) the girls on here constantly have me in stitches.  I have never met a bunch of women with so many problems but who can keep on laughing despite everything.

Welcome bonchance.  As Ally says you are not alone.

I am suddenly having a bit of a panic about my 3 MC and the fact that I never got them investigated.  At the time I thought I wouldnt have any more tx so there was no point.  Half of me thinks it must have just been my eggs as I have had two natural pregnancies but now I am wondering if there is an immune issue or clotting.  Do you think these things can develop?  Or would they have always been around and therefore can't apply to me because I had Marcus and Max ok.
Any advice gratefully received.  The worse nightmare for me would be go have a DE BFP and then yet another MC.  

Angel, how are you doing.

Donkey.  I am glad you feel there is a way forward.  Poor you having a horrible HSG.


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Donkey   glad you put your foot down about the GA, not had one under that but I'm sure you'll be fine.  Did thye give you an idea of wiaitng list times?


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

hi girls, thanks for your kind words about Joshua's picture. I think that it is possibley my favourite one but I am lucky enough to have a few! (which some aren't  ) I got most of the really good ones in about a week and half time frame when he was not on the ventilator or oxygen (the tube is a nasel gastric feeding tube as he wasn't strong enough to suck a bottle) when he had had a catheter for a procedure to help his blood flow. I had decided to dress him in normal clothes, take in toys and a seat for him to sit in so he had fun with those, I also have video footage of that precious period where he looked and was feeling 'well' and am so thankful for that. 

Nix - the bloody AF beotch turned up for me, I have to admit I did have a tiny bit of hope because it was 16DPO yesterday when I started spotting, on a non medicated cycle I never go past 11/12 DPO and on a clomid cycle with luteal support they said I could test 14DPO to let the HCG out of my system. I don't know when my period would come in a HCG luteal support cycle if not pregnant because last one in September I did get a BFP but turned into a chemical pregnancy as when they did my Beta was really low.

This is why I didn't test on Friday because I wanted to give it a bit longer incase it was the  synthetic HCG in my system or another chem. My last 5000iu of HCG for luteal support was on 30/01/09 - a week last Friday, anyone got any ideas when that should have been out of my system by?

I had allowed myself to dream to plan to go to the hospital today to get my beta done because in this dream when I did the test this morning I had a nice strong postive! (dream on...........) It would have been nice not to have been 'teased'  

Kate - sorry about AF turning up like that   I too cannot 'waste' a natural cycle much like you and Tracey feel.

Tracey - I would think about what's best for your family and not worry about admiting that it is donor eggs. I am in a odd situation there because if I had donor eggs I would also think about donor sperm as DH is naff nowadays plus the faulty gene, the other thing there is though I would feel because I already have children would that be fair to the child not being genetically related to either of us.

If we just used DE and DH sperm I definately would not, like purps want to tell DH family anything because my MIL is barking, a bit like Laura's and I think she would think in that senario that the child was more hers then mine! In the other senario of using donor sperm they definately would not accept the baby as their grandchild in that case, if they knew it was donor sperm,  my DH has two sisters who have children and my boys come a poor third to them so dread to think what they would be like if they knew not genetically related. Therefore I really think in any of the scenarios above I would not tell anyone to make sure the child got treated the same.

As I already have children I am not sure that I would tell the child either, but obviously one of those things you really don't know until you are actually in that position.

However I think I would tell the child if I didn't already have children but again a guess because I will never know for sure. Probably a wait and see how you feel approach might be best. I definately would not tell anyone in advance of the baby being born.

Purple - well done on your power walk, I did feel l did my bit as I went swimming this morning as got the kids into school as no snow but might not tomorrow as heavy snow forcasted tonight. However the water was boiling, honestly it was like a bath, as I like to swim 60 lengths it was not good, plus it encourages people to hang around in the way talking when the one's of us with fat to burn need to get on   

Nicki - I see that you will be doing IMSI and oestrogen priming protocol. I did email the Dr. about either microdose or oestrogen priming protocol and have had an email back saying they think short antagonist protocol for me as there is more risk of premature ov on those and it needs close monitoring so I take that to read that they are not prepared to offer me either of those then. To be fair they were extremely worried I would ovulate on the short protocol, they gave me a further two scans after I took the HCG so it might be they are prepared to offer to others but not me, but not totally 100% sure and sometimes very difficult to get any info any of them. I am still considering the Jinemed but I wish they did the IMSI because this is a major plus for me with DH crap sperm!

Hi Lightweight, Almond and Sobroody - you will get some great advice here, I still feel much a novice myself but have been helped so much by these guys.  

Ali - good luck for that precious BFP - I am   that this is it for you.

I had intended to do major personals but have been writing this post on and off since 17.00 and have now forgotten where everyone is at since I read through at 16.30 this afternoon, sorry  

so hi to everyone I haven't mentioned!

Take care love Karen xxx


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## Donkey (Nov 24, 2007)

Beachy  he said probably march time as the lists aren't too long at the moment...sounds promising.  I'm learning to put my foot down with these doctors, I think us girlies are far too polite sometimes and doubt our own contributions and knowledge.  

Hi Tracey  - in the first chapters of alan beer's book he says that there are generally reasons for a mc it's not 'god's will' or 'unlucky'.  However cos you've had 2 pgs i don't know how that stands Sorry i'm not helping much

Donkeyxx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Donkey: I had a hysteroscopy and it was absolutely fine hun. It only took 15 min and was no different than an EC to be honest. I bled for a day or two afterwards but had almost no pain - so don't be afraid. You will be fine. 

Nix&Anna&Nikki: Thanks for all the info girls - all very helpful.  

Ally & Missy: Wishing you all the luck (hopefully you won't need it!) in the world for tomorrow's scan girls. I'll be thinking of you.    

Night night - I'm off to bed now, will try and have an early night. 

Pixie xxxx


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

Hi All
Just to let you know - I took the plunge, called the lister and they offered me an appt with Dr Ren ? for 19th Feb - so thats pretty soon. I think this will be our last 'initial consult' worn out by shopping around and wonder whether its us trying to find someone who will tell us what we want to hear. We'll see. Thanks for your msgs - I'm crap at remembering everyones details - so sorry...didn't get any sleep last night and just totally knackered out by everything. 
You've all helped me alot - am very grateful and send all of you a huge bar of cadburys, bottle of pinot grigio and a film with a man of your dreams in it - preferably wearing something that makes you smile - for some a pair of swimming trunks for others a duffel coat - your choice xxx


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Evening all.

Kate, you make me       You are a woman after my own heart, what with your fondness for sex toys and chocolate   Mind you, somone on this thread (I think it was Laura) did call me a sex maniac at one point. I'm not, it's only cos I'm in a fairly new relationship (nearly 2 years now ) and we still actually have sex because we fancy it, not to make a baby... I'm trying to keep it that way by deliberately not keeping an eye on my CD....but it's getting harder... (oops, no pun intended.... )

Donkey - I too had a hysteroscopy and, like Pixie, it was absolutely fine (loved the GA actually...) I refused to have the HSG as I'd heard horror stories and I'm a complete wuss when it comes to pain.

Bonchance - welcome! I'm interested to see you have  low AMH and fairly good FSH too - it's supposed to be contradictory isn't it?! Sorry about what you've been through. Looking forward to getting to know you.

Ally - good luck for the scan tomorrow. I hope you manage to get some sleep.  

Early night with a book and a cup of tea for me as DP is out tonight.
Night all x

OOh, just saw your post Bunjy. Great that you've got an appt at The Lister. If they can't get you pg, I don't reckon any other clinic (at least in the UK) can. xx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hello lovely ladies - so sorry I've been AWOL, had MIL over plus still trying to keep myself busy finding out more about the oestrogen priming protocol.

No personals - as I'm wrecked and have to go to bed!!!!!


Missy & Ally -             for tomorrow.

Ali -    Sorry AF came.

Natasha - hope your feeling better soon poppet and your cold leaves you alone. xxx

Tracey - I honestly wouldn't worry too much about immunes, egg is likely our major issue.  You can have the tests done, but it might just worry you unneccassarily.  Look at Steph, switch to DE and the mild immune issue doesn't seem to play that much of a part.  Then again, if DE is expensive...it might be worth getting the test done - £750.  My feeling is, that they find issues in the "majority" of women that they test.

Oh there I go I've started writing personals... I have to go to bed! Welcome new girls!!!!

I must go  - lots of love to you all......  

Sam xxx
P.S.  Still no AF for me      I'm so worried.


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## Swinz (Jul 31, 2006)

Girls - I can't keep up with this thread LOL!  How are you all?  Good I hope!  Welcome to Lightweight, Almond and Sobroody  - you'll get fab advice here!!

If anyone can be bothered   to listen to my latest dilemma ..............

To IVF or not to IVF - that is the question.  A year ago I over stimmed on Clomid - so I can't help but wonder whether it might work for us!!  So - I e-mailed my clinic to see what they thought.  I'd sort of decided that Donor Eggs would be the way to go for us.  I've done major research across the globe (Just got off the phone to a very nice lady in Ohio, US) but tonight I got an e-mail from my clinic to say that I could do a Clomid cycle with Menopur and Follicle tracking for the bargain price of £1,000 and then if we recruited follies - convert to IVF.

I know I shouldn't be thinking about the money but DE's will set us back between £8k, so should I be wasting money on tx that in my heart I don't think will work?  I've never been so confused in all my life!!  I don't want to be tempted to go to EC with 2 follies like before knowing it'll end in tears - when we could be putting that cash towards tx with a better ? outcome.

So - thats todays!!

Lots of love

Sarah xx


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

hi Sarah - I would be inclined to give my own eggs one last go for 'peace of mind' rather then anything else so that if you are going to ever be 'ready' to move onto DE you will feel like you gave your own the best shot. I sorry I can't see any details on your signiture so don't know what your history is in detail.

It's one of those if it works you will be thanking god you did it, if it doesn't you will be wishing you had put the money towards DE. However I know I would always be wondering because of this maybe 'fated' special offer that has come up, you could see that as a good omen that just maybe it WILL work   

At the end of the day it is totally up to you but that is my honest opinion.

HTH love karen xxx


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## Bonchance (Feb 7, 2009)

Tracey -thank you for your warm welcome  

Ally -Thank you for your support and for the link, I will definite check this out.  Good luck with your scan tomorrow and I hope you get 5 big ones  

Jo - thank you for your support and I agree it is a comfort to know that I am not alone and reading about other people conquering all these hurdles brings back hope for me. Wishing you good luck   

I can't get my head around the contradiction of Low AMH and normal FSH.  I feel very frustrated with the health system right now as it took over 2 years from initial referral from GP to getting first ICSI.  Now to be told that I am running out of eggs, I keep thinking maybe if I could have had ICSI earlier there would have been more eggs 3 years ago!   I know ifs and maybes do no good but sometimes it's hard not to think that way!  I feel so much precious time has been wasted.  In the beginning when first ttc I wasn't too worried because all my tests were coming back as normal.  At that time we discovered that DH had sperm issues so thought that explained our problems with ttc. Then when ICSI#1 (private) had poor response, I went for AMH test in other private clinic and was devastated to hear result and still don't want to accept what it means.  I keep hoping that they got my test mixed up with someone else -sorry I know I am being selfish, wishing it happened to someone else    I was hoping ICSI #2(NHS) would prove AMH result wrong.. but this time, result was worse, I had no follicles only a cyst.  Just been reading earlier thread and just learned that cyst can absort stim drugs.. so now maybe have an explanation as to why it didnt work.  I think I will probably get more answers here than I will from my current clinic, especially as I am having problems trying to get a simple appointment from them to discuss the recent ICSI failure 

I will try to finish on a positive note though and would like to wish you all good luck in achieving your dreams to become parents 
I do believe that we can all find a way to make it happen.. so never give up


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Bonchance, I just wanted to tell you how much I feel for you.  I too have an AMH of 0.1, I only found out in Sept 08 - I was so shocked as I honestly thought I didn't have any fertility problems.  I've spent months in tears, had it retested, trying to find a way out of what it meant.  I know it's not much of a help, but you are not the only one who has had this horrible, life shattering diagnosis.  There are a lot of us on this thread now who have been through this.      I'm not sure what clinic you are at, but if you can afford it, your best at a clinic that has experience with low amh women - not one that hasn't.       I'm so so sorry this has had to happen to you too, I wouldn't wish this diagnosis on my worst enemy, I honestly wouldn't.  I only hope that we can offer some support and advice, and maybe make you realise that you are not alone. 

Make sure you look at Ally's thread - all hope is NOT lost.  There ARE women out there who are getting pregnant with amh of 0.1.

LOL Sam xxx


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Just a quickie girls

Good luck Ally and Missy today xx

Think it's all over for me, test on Thurs but woke up this morning to usual period pains knowing it was on it's way, went to loo and it was confirmed, it's on it's way

Not sure how i feel yet as still half asleep but think it's going to be a long day

Cheers
Z x


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Zuri hon - is there any chance that it is just spotting or do you really think it is AF? Spotting/ bleeding is quite common in early days, just a thought. I really hope it is not AF hon  

Must dash got to go to the lister now and I have wet hair - I have really been putting off going this morning!!


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Hi Ally, was holding out a bit of hope but then did a test and it's negative

Good luck xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Zuri hunny sorry to hear your news,   

Thinking of you!

Ally my sweet sending vibes to you right now! hope it's all going well, am off out so will not get to see board till tonight! But know I'm thinking of you

Missy good luck too hunny

Hugs to everyone else, no powerwalk this morning as too lazy and need to get on that road!

Hugs to all thinking of ya chat later

Sxxxxx


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Hello to all of you I met on here the other night, and also to everyone else. Haven't had the chance to come back on this thread for a few days,it seems impossible to catch up.

Just wanted to wish Ally all the best with your scan today, hope it all goes well xxx

And also to say- Zuri- I'm really sorry, sending you lots of love x


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Morning all,

Zuri: Oh hun I'm so sorry.   Are you not meant to get a blood test on Thursday though? HPT won’t show anything at this early stage.Have you called your clinic; they might offer you an earlier blood test? 

Bonchance: I was also made to wait for 2 years before I was told that I had DOR. See my signature. I am also very annoyed/upset and disappointed with the health system. I can’t stop thinking if I’d had IVF 2 years ago I will have had more eggs but I can’t bring the time back. Try and focus on what you can do from now on hun. Have you started taking DHEA? How about Acu, TCM, Multi vits, DHA etc…?

Ally & Missy: Lots of luck girls   

Morning to everyone else…

Love,

Pixie xx


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Hi Pixie, i think i would just be clutching at straws i am sure a HPT would show a positive 2 days before test day, its 14 days ago tomorrow that i had egg collection so think it's pretty conclusive plus my AF is getting heavier as the day goes on

I still have to go for the test on Thursday anyway - to be honest if it wasn't going to work I said i;d rather my period come before test day as I was just dreading Thursday and having to wait for that dreaded phone call with the result

x


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Ally and Missyg, best of luck with your scans today! 

Elinor - I'm sorry you are in limbo until Friday.   that everything works out and it was just a late starter. I was in a similar boat last week, and I totally understand how you must be feeling.

Donkey - thanks for thinking about us when you too are going through a tough time.  

Tracey - thanks for you advice. I don't know what I'm feeling right now. I know that time is a great healer, so now I can't wait for time to zoom by. 

Bobbi - hope things are ok with you. You have been quiet.

Bonchance - you have come to the right place. There have been some success stories of ladies with low AMH on this very thread. I am too scared to have my AMH tested.

Zuri - not trying to give you false hope, but I too had implantation bleeding and cramping a few days before OTD. I too thought it was all over, but got a clear BFP. So don't give up just yet. If it was implantation bleeding, it takes another 24 hours before the hcg is at a level that can be detected by the HPT. 

 to everyone else. 

The last blood test has confirmed that hcg has dropped drastically since Friday. So its all over for us. I'm so exhausted. Last week was a real roller coaster and its taken it toll on me. In a sense its a relief to finally know whats happening (or not as the case may be), but it still hurts. And we keep on wondering why.


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Hi Angel thanks for responding, I know there is a tiny chance things still could be Ok but I just know it in myself that it's not and would rather now just deal with the result as if it's negative, if by some miracle it's not come Thursday then fantastic but I am not going to hold out any hope

I am so sorry to hear it is now all over for you, it must have been such a tough week not knowing (i think this is why I want to just think it's over because it's just too stressful wondering is it or isn't it) but I am so sorry it must have been devastating to see a BFP then to lose it, thinking of you   

xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi lovlies  

Ally- I am thinking about you sweetie  

Missy- Good luck hun  

Angel- I am so very sorry hun, I really am  

Donkey- Hun, I had a HSG last year but my god, yours sounds traumatic  .   

Sam- Sorry you've not had AF hun, how late is the beatch?  

Zuri- Hun, keep positive, it's only Tuesday and as Ally said, it could be spotting. I really hope it is hun  

Kate- Hi hun, how you feeling today?  

Pix- I might call my docs but depends if I can get in tomorrrow. its a pain in the **** all this innit?    

Nix- Got any snow over there love?  

Nat- You ok sweets?  

Bonchance- Welcome  

Almond- Good luck for scan tomorrow  

NikkiW- Hope work is ol love. What do you do?  

Nikki2008- kebab? you? never     

Angel-  

Elinior-  

Kazzie- beautiful pic hun  

Tracey- Wish I could offer some advice hun, try not to worry  

Bunjy- Good luck at Lister appointment  

  Miranda, LJ, hazlenut, Lainey, Bobbi, Steph, Juicy., Fishy, Purps, Lucy, Jo
I'm sorry if I've missed anyone, theres so many of us these days!

Anne
xxxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Morning ladies

Zuri so sorry hunny, i so wish the result had been different for you  

Just wanted to wish both Ally and Missy good luck for today with scans.......so GOOD LUCK girls hope u both get a result   

Anne - af has turned really heavy for some reason - not impressed 

Hello to everyone else, gotta go admin girlie wants her desk back  

Kate
xxxxxxxx


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Angel - I don't know you as I only started posting yesterday but I am so so sorry to read your news. There are no words are there. Thinking of you x

Zuri - so sorry as well to hear your news. I totally understand why you would want to deal with the result as if it is negative, I would be the same. Thinking of you x

Ally - been thinking of you this morning, really hope the scan went well

Bonchance - I was devastated when I got my AMH result (0.5 on the ng scale, or 3.5 on the pmol scale). I actually could not believe it was happening to me, I thought they must have made a mistake. It came totally out of the blue as well - I went to Dr Zhai because I'd just found out I had endo and she always does the test when she starts seeing people. The result was a total shock, I assumed I had loads of eggs left. But this thread has given me so much hope. My (nice!) NHS consultant has been fairly robust, saying they dont believe that low AMH should block people from treatment and they think the jury is still out on the test (though I am currently at risk of having my first cycle with them cancelled for poor response, more about that in a minute). And the Lister have treated lots of low AMH women as people have said and they have good success rates - at my con they showed me the results for women of my age with low AMH per cycle and they were impressive

Tracey - thanks for telling me about the chat, I didn't know about that. will come to one of those even if I just listen (I'm not v good at chatting I don't think!) and I could definitely do with some more laughs   

I am finding it really hard to be positive this morning, despite my blood tests yesterday afternoon showing something was "starting to happen" (whatever that means!). I have that bloody consultant's words from yesterday morning ringing in my ears   and I'm dreading the scan tomorrow. Desperately trying to be positive though and carry on with the heat, water, protein etc rather than just giving up but it is hard. Please please grow follicles and prove him wrong  . Did a bit of research online (!!) and see that although the microdose flare protocol is often really good for poor responders, it isn't always. So there is hope for me I hope if this one doesn't work out!

Hope everyone else is having a good day, this thread is keeping me going ... Thanks so much for all of the warm welcomes and good wishes which is really lovely especially as I only just started posting
x


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Jo - took your advice yesterday and went shopping, bought a few bits and also had hot choc and cake in John Lewis cafe.  I honestly dont just veg all day!  But I have decided to return to work tomorrow.  Did you book your smear?  I'm going to PM you - hope thats ok.  

Kate - Snowed in yet?  Sorry about AF    Hope it clears off by the weekend  

Anne - you did say Jason's dad's new lady but I seem to misread everything, making it related to ttc, babies etc!  If I read "consider" I think it says "conceive" etc.     Sorry AF is being wicked  

Jal - good luck hon.  Hope AF turns up on time.  

ix - i had that same thought too about the smear....wet etc!    

Anna - hope those follies grow grow grow... 

Nikki - 12 antrals and fab AMH    How are things with DP now?  Hope you get your internet sorted soon.  We miss ya  

Eli - so sorry hon    This is just so awful for you.  I cant believe your work are so slow and disorganised either - thats appauling  
Hope they finally consider your written request.  

Pix - sorry about af    and the cod soup    

Purple - hello again!   

Almond - good luck!    Well done on the blood test results.

LJ - I have also heard that ovulating too early is not good but both the sonographer at the Lister and the cons I saw said that the body will release the egg when it is ready and early makes no difference.  I asked again cos I had only stimmed for 7 days ebfore I triggered my eager beaver and thought it would have ripened to quickly but I was catagorically told that was not the case.   

Ally - thinking of you    

Missy -     thinking of you too  

Nicki - back at work   Hope its ok and you dont miss Emily too much.  Enjoy your mummy day today  

Donkey - 2 NHS cycles!    I could have none as my FSH is over 11.  Can I come and live with you?   

Kazzie - I am so sorry AF came adn there was no BFP.       Take care of yourself for next few days    Re - how quickly the HCG leaves the body, Donkey explaind that to me a few days back.  I try and find it and post it again.  

Sam - NO AF YET!  for me.  Today is day 9 after nookie.  Sorry about yours being AWOL still.

Zuri - so sorry   but hoing that a blood test brings better news  

Angel -   Sorry sweetie.  This is just dreadful    Allow yourself to grieve.  

Natasha - you ok?  

Hi Tracey, Popsi, Juicy, Hazelnut, Sarah (I say go with clomid cycle and see what happens  ) and to any one else I have missed.  

I am now 9 days post nookie, having taken the trigger 10 days ago.  I feel nothing different.  My boobs are sore, but I am guessing that that is the progesterone suppositories?  I actually had a cup of coffee this morning as I know that women often go off that before they even realise they may be pg and I enjoyed it.  Really not holding out much hope.  Does anyone know which day I should test though, incase I need to?  They never said.  Sat?  Sunday?  Have also decided to return to work tomorrow and will just tell the other staff that the snow messed up my plans etc.  Dreading it now though cos my colleague who had her baby is coming in tomorrow (just found out) and bringing the baby to meet us.  I know that she will make me have a hold and then all the others will start saying, as they always do, "it suits you....when you having one?"


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## Kazzie40 (Apr 1, 2008)

Hi girls - Zuri I am sorry about your BFN   

Angel - I am also sorry about your news too  

Ally - I am   that things will be looking good when you go for the scan today - good luck   

will bbl as meant to be doing stuff

Take care love Karen xxx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Just to let you know it wasn't good news for us today. There still wasn't any activity in there so after 13 days of stims we have stopped the drugs. Jaya wants us to go back on Friday for a final scan but ultimately it is all over for us. Thank you for all your good lucks, texts etc, love you all to bits   

Looks like it is time to get myself super fit and ready for the big di*k method, as we will need to have sex every other day for the rest of my fertile (joke!) life if we are to catch that elusive egg should it pop up! 

I think it would take something really amazing and promising to get me to go through IVF with my own eggs again although Sam I know you are going to convince me that a IVF/ Shopping holiday in the big apple is the way forward!!! Money will soon become an issue and I need to be sure that I am putting my eggs in the right basket (no pun intended). 

A xxxx


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Really really sorry Ally I had everything crossed today would be good news for you - thinking of you    x


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Ally- Can't really say more than in my text hun. But fairplay to you for being as upbeat as you can. You are a beautiful lady  

Hi Z-


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Ally - just seen your news. So so sorry. Thinking of you x

Ali - I don't know if this helps but I have been ttc for several months with Cyclogest before started IVF (Cyclogest because get bleeding in second half of cycle) and clinic told me to do a HPT 14 days after ovulation and if BFN stop the Cyclogest. By the way the prog actually makes my boobs less sore but that's because I have low prog I think? 

Bloody tactless people at work   
Amazingly with all the holding of other people's babies I've been doing recently, no-one has asked me that question. GRRRRRRR if only people realised, they have no clue what we go through
x


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Not much time as I am at work but couldn't read without saying

Ally.  So sorry that you didn't get better news.  I don't know what to say.  

Zuri.  Bugger AF.  Sorry you didn't get your longed for BFP

Angel  .  Nothing else I can add really.  I will be thinking of you over the coming days and weeks.   I hope time doesn't take too much to heal (as much as it can heal)

Ali, just wander off to the loo the moment you think baby is going to be put in your arms.  I don't think you can read anything into the not going off coffee.  I didn't go off anything when I was pg or get any other symptoms at all for the first 18 weeks.

Love to everyone

Back this evening


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

some people are quite insensitive aren't they about having you hold their babies- my friend thrust her new born into my arms in October and I nearly freaked.


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - sorry hunny   wish it had been better news     You are such a great lady sweetheart   

Angel - thinking of you sweetheart   

Ali - still     for you, no idea on when to test tho   Cant u get out of building as soon as mother and baby arrive, doctors app or something?


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

I am supposed to be visiting my friend this week with her 2 week old new born and I just can't face going now, will be hard to act happy and excited for her even though i should.... 

x


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Ally, I'm so sorry about this. Give yourself some time, before you think about the next steps. Theres got to be something out there that is right for you and you will find it. 

Just think of all the stories that you have put together in your thread. You'll get there one day, heck we'll all get there eventually.  

Almond - thanks for your kind words and welcome to this thread. 

Tracey - thanks. At this point its difficult to beleive that I can feel better. I keep on crying every so often and wonder why the beanie didn't want to stay on. Felt so sh!t when SIL asked me what causes that and whether there was anything that could have been done to prevent it. I know she didn't mean it in a horrible way but just made me feel like I did something wrong. Now pulled myself back together. One thing I'm not going to do is blame myself. 

Kate - thanks hun


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Ally, so sorry it wasn't good news for you.  Thinking of you.

Lots of love xxx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Thank you all so much. I think I should point out to the newbies that my reference to Big Di*k method is really relating to an earlier joke, I am not usually that crass! It means BMS!


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Angel- Hunny, it was nothing at all that you have done, SIL needs to rephrase her questions I think 
And yes, we WILL ALL get there hun  

Hi Kate-  

Hi Hazlenut


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Ally - I am so very sorry; was praying so hard for you today.  I think now is time to regroup and, as you say, get yourself super fit and maybe focus on the TCM.  Also, if you have the cash at all, I wouldn't rule out NY.  The US does seem to get better results for poor responders so it may be worthwhile.  Now is just thinking time though and grieving time.  As I said, I am so very sorry.

Donkey - Glad you were able to smile at your doctor.  One thing I have been realising recently is that more and more doctors seem to offer DE very quickly to women over 35 telling them it is their "best chance".  And that is true - any woman over 35 has a better chance of pregnancy with the egg of a 20 year old.  But the fact is that you are responding fine with decent eggs so you don't need to consider DE at this stage unless you want to.  38 is hardly past it in IVF terms - my sister was 38 when she got going with IVF tests.  in terms of the emotional angle - that is nothing to do with him and it is your decision how many IVFs you can take!  I know they always say not to look to "celeb" stories but Trinny Woodall did nine to conceive her daughter and Brooke Shields went through seven to conceive hers (followed by another conceived naturally!!!).  If you have the financial and emotional resources to carry on then do so - you response and your eggs suggest it's worth it! 

Almond - forgot to welcome you to the thread earlier; glad you are carrying on and hope that you can emulate Donkey and laugh at your doc.  a lot of them seem to trot out the "egg problem" theory with absolutely no evidence at all.  You could just be responding slowly so keep at it!!

Bonchance - I know that others on this thread will know how you feel.  And your case (like Jo's and Miranda's) is particularly tough because you have great FSH so having low AMH is very rare - which, of course, is no comfort.  As Sam says, key to going forward is getting yourself to a clinic with experience in dealing with low AMH/high FSH cases and poor response.  The best one in this country is the Lister.  I'll admit that my sister was at Manchester CARE but, to be honest, she turned out to be a normal responder so, much as I respect them for treating her, I still wouldn't credit her clinic with having performed a miracle - Kate is just proof that these results don't necessarily mean anything.

Zuri - I am so sorry to hear of your BFN.  I know other ladies on the thread will understand better but I am so sorry.  Give yourself time to grieve and then focus on your next go.  You have every reason to be hopeful.

Ali - thanks for the info on early ovulation; it sort of makes sense that it doesn't really matter.  We all have different cycles after all!  Sorry you are feeling nothing "different" - trouble is that for most people the first sign of pregnancy is a missed AF so you do just have to wait….

Angel - I know it is horrendous but this is truly one of those times when you have to simply wait for the pain to ease.  I am so sorry I cannot offer more comfort than that.  Let yourself grieve.

NicksW - hi there!  thanks for popping by!  How is it back at work?

much love to everyone else.


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## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi everyone,

Ally I am so gutted for you. It was so lovely seeing you today.   . 

Zuri, I am really sorry you are having some spotting, it doesn't mean it is over but I know it is frightening and so disappointing. I really hope it is just some implantation spotting.   Thinking of you.   

Angel - so sorry you have had to go through this.   

Ali -     

Hi Donkey how are you?  

Anne -  

Well I went for my scan this morning and in preparation had been having strong words with my left ovary, I thought it had been paying attention as it has been really hurting - but it hadn't been listening at all as the two little follicles are still small and haven't grown much. BUT......I got the shock of my life when she showed me my right ovary now has two follicles, one 11mm and one 13mm!!!! How that has happened I really don't know as there was def only one there on Friday. I know there is still no guarantee there is an egg in either of them or if there is that they will be any good etc etc but if they keep growing well at least I have a chance now which I didn't really think I had after the last scan. I don't think Jalia had seen anyone so happy with 2 follicles before! I have to go back on Friday and then if     they are a good size I will have EC on Mon. I am not going to get my hopes up but I am just happy for this moment and will take the next stage as it comes.

Waiting for my NK cells results - I had the test yesterday at the Lister - it should be back Friday which Jaya says will be early enough to deal with if it is positive. She doesn't seem to want to put me on the prednisonlone for the thyroid immune issue yet -she wants to wait for the results on Fri and I am not sure why as Dr Gleicher from CHR recommended I should be on it throughout the tx - anyone know anything about this? 

Thanks so much for all your positive thoughts.

Off to work now.

Love Missy xx


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Thats fantastic new Missy - hoping those 2 golden follies grow more by Friday xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Missy- Will cross everything for Friday hun xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Missy - good news hunny     for friday for you   

Angel - sorry about insensitive s-i-l hunny some people never think before opening their gobs


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Ally -   I am so sorry.    I have been hoping so so hard for you.  

I am sure that Ben wont mind you referring to BMS as the Big D*ck method!!  Get yourself some of that pre-seed lube (which can help), continue with the TCM which made your AF's more regular and have some fun!  

Lots of love to you.


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Ally,

I'm so gutted for you and for all the other lovely ladies who are going through some tough time at the moment.

All these bad news, just make me want to cry and cry and cry&#8230; but as I said to you on my text you have only tried one clinic and there must be some other places out there that can help you/us. This new protocol is looking very promising; I personally want to give it a go. 
Guess what, I dag out my blood test results the other day and my AMH is 0.7*pmol * so we are also AMH buddies. 

Give yourself some time, before you make any decisions darling. I know it's very hard to keep trying but maybe give yourself a time limit and do what you can until then? That's my plan anyway.

If you need someone to cry with I am the best candidate for you honey.

Love you lots.

Pix xxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

some hugs for all that need one.....


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Big hugs to everyone! 

Missy - glad you had some good news!


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Have any of you ladies heard of this clinic in the states *Colorado Center for Reproductive Medicine* I have been told it has an 80% success rate but costs about £10k! a lady who had 3 tries at a clinic here in Zurich told me she ended up going here and finally got a positive - she was slating the swiss laws of embryos freezing - no way am i thinking of going there but it has made me wonder about their system here - but then I think i am just reacting to todays events, my clinic has a 40% success rate after all - it just isn't my time....

But when this clinic was mentioned to me I thought about some of you ladies when you have discussed the methods and treatment in the states - from all accounts this clinic has a very aggressive approach but has results

x

P.S the doctors name there is Dr. Schoolcraft and this lady told me he is one of the most famous IVF docs in the world - no idea if what she has said is a load of bull but thought i'd at least mention it x


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Never heard of that on Zuri, wish I had a spare £100,000 then I'd pay for us all to have a go there


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hello ladies,

Ally - again I'm so so sorry hon.  Cry all you want today  , eat chocolate cake, take care of yourself, watch comedy on TV, and I'm here for hugs if you need me. And no, I won't be encouraging you to go to New York for tx, it is gobsmackingly expensive. I think it would have worked out about the same as here - last year when the $ was weaker against the £, but now it is absolutely a lot more expensive to cycle in the US. Plus, as they will likely use 750 of FSH on me, I don't even want to look at what the cost of the drugs will be. Not to mention flights and hotel.   Always happy to talk to you about what I'm finding in the US if your interested, but money absolutely has to be considered as even if they are getting a better response in the US, poor responders are poor responders whatever country we are in, so you need to consider the money.          Let us know when your ready for us to support you in whatever you decide to do next Ally. xxxx  Can I ask how is Ben taking this?  

Pix - I'm sorry that your AMH was pmol, I'm really really sorry Pix. But you do give me hope, I was away while you were cycling, but I seem to remember you did get to EC, so it goes to show that your AMH isn't everything.  Really hoping we can add you to the Miracle Links post soon. 
Bonchance - I am really hoping you have low FSH, but just to check did you get your estrogen tested alongside your FSH? I know at the Lister they always look at the two together, but my NHS GP didn't know that they two are linked. My FSH is high, but my real FSH is much higher because my estrogen is so high it is suppressing my FSH.

Missy - that's wonderful news on the 2 follies. Will absolutely be holding my breath for you until Friday.  I'm sorry I don't know anything about the immunes, but I do think that sometimes doctors overprescribe treatment for immunes issues, so I wouldn't be too worried about what Dr Gleicher has to say.  You really sound like you are doing great. xxx  Are you still going to run the EPP past Jaliah?  LittleM who posts sometimes is going to show it to her consultant too, I think it's Thum. I'd love to hear what they thought of it.

Zuri - I'm really sorry about your BFN,    but I am glad you posted here so we could support you.  As LJ says, you have every reason to be hopeful, please try not to beat yourself up too much, you have many many more chances ahead of you.  This is not the end.    

Almond & Hazlenut - welcome to team PR! Really glad to have you both here. You've found the right place.

Ali - Best to wait 14 days from nookie before testing - if you can wait. If you can wait, it's better than getting a false BFN. If your like me though, you will start testing on day 12. (Assuming nookie was ovulation date or day before, give it 2 days or so to implant, then 10days to produce enough hcg to be picked up). Use the First response sticks as they seem to be the most sensitive.  Fingers tightly crossed for you      .       

Angel - I'm so sorry you still feel raw, it's to be expected.  Take care of yourself.

Tracey - I really relate to what you said about not telling people if you have an DE child, as this just adds to the myth that having children past 40 is more possible than it really is. DE is of course something I think about every day, and I wonder the same.  I know I was under the impression that it would be easy having a baby up to 40, and then still even 'likely' I could have a child post 40......and I wonder what if more people spoke up about DE?  In September last year, I almost fell off my chair when it was suggested to me - I'd never ever even heard of egg donation before September 2008.

The other thing is, if we are all contemplating doing this, and likely a lot of us will, wouldn't it be so much easier for us and our kids if everyone was out in the open, so people would be more aware how common this is.   On the otherhand, I don't want me or my child to be the ginea pig \ poster family for ED. So likely, I'm not brave, I like you would tell the child but not anyone else.  

I do have friends that I know wouldn't understand and would think I had done the wrong thing, I absolutely know that's what they would think. Of course, I'd be happy to loose them as friends in a nano second in favour of having the family I want.   I have no idea what my sister would think - she is very single minded and would have a knee jerk reaction, but then stick with that reaction for life.  And yes, I wish I were different and could tell everyone so that our DE children can grow up knowing just how common it really is, and not feeling like they had to hide how they were conceived. In the little tiny town I grew up in, my friend runs the local acupunture clinic.  She told me LOTS of her patients have done and are doing DE.... they tell her, as she has treated them throughout and know she has to keep patients confidentiality, but they don't tell anyone else.  DE is so so so much more common than we are lead to believe. Does anyone know the numbers per month in the UK at the moment?  Given I'm guessing more people likely go abroad for DE as they waiting lists are much shorter, I'd at least triple that number. 

Steph - I loved your post. It made me  , but it was happy tears for you. 

Kate, Anne, Mir, Nix & LJ, Swinz, Natasha - hi girls! LOL to everyone else

Still no AF. It has me so so worried. Chinese Dr told me it was just the jet lag, but I've had jetlag enough times to know this is beyond that. I know I'm doing lots of research into the EP protocol, but I just wanted you girls to know I don't think it's the holy grail for poor responders.  It just does sound interesting, and it is different, and they do have reasons why they think it's much better for PRs than the short protocol.  But, as US clinics absolutely refuse to give out their stat's specific to Amh levels, or number of follicles, I think it's a coin toss as to whether it gets better results, or just different results than the SP.  It does seem that some people who don't respond to the SP do respond better to the EPP, but I'd say the success rates are still low for us regardless of the protocol.  If you have the money(which given the FX disaster is now a lot) and the will to keep trying with your own eggs, I do absolutely think it's worth a try.  For me, it's going to be a bit cheaper as DH's work are desperate for him to spend more time in the US, so they will pay for our flights, and a large share of the hotel costs - of course they have no idea I have a hidden agenda and want to go for tx, they think I hate NY and don't want to go at all    

Anyway, can you girls pray for my AF to come back. xx
Sam xxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Sam- Little AF dance for you


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Anne: Are there enough hugs there hun? Ouch my eyes hurt! 
Just noticed you and I have the longest signature  What's that all about - the only thing we are missing is our shoe size. 

Missy: Glad to hear you have 2 great size follies now. Hope you have 2 juicy eggs in them. 

Ali: Just take a lunch break when your friend comes with her baby. I did that the other day and it worked. 

Kate: I found a perfect Valentine gift idea for you. Click on the below link and scroll down!  

http://www.dailycandy.com/london/article/41483/Be+Mine

LJ: Hello lovely - hope all is well at your end. 

Zuri: Never heard of that clinic before but it sounds interesting. 10K? I'd defo expect a real gold follie for that! 

Sam: Thanks for being so positive about my [email protected] AMH hun. Yes I did produce an egg and had 4 follies so there Ally it can work -chin up my lovely friend. Sam I hope you get your AF back very soon hun. I agree with your Chinese doc. I know flying messes up my system badly and the most I fly is 4 hours.

Here are some special hugs for Angel, Donkey, Catherine, Zuri and Ally     

I've just been offered another job! It pays more than what I am on now and it's a higher position but I can't be @rsed to take it.  My mental health won't allow me to focus on a new position and I'd probably lose it in no time. At least my current employers know the situation and trying to be understanding when I am low.

xxxx

/links


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Praying like mad that your AF comes soon Sam - this is just so upsetting and worrying for you   Now this tx is over that will be my next concern!! I don't mind you encouraging me to go to the states with you!! I am up for it if I can see something really really encouraging, better still I would like to use their protocols here!  

Pix - I can't believe your AMH is pmol - that is just ridiculous! But as Sam says it is really encouraging that you are responding to the drugs and getting to Transfer, once you are at transfer your AMH is not important - hugs anyway hon   Great being offered that job (even though you won't take it) that must do your self esteem good!  

Zuri - hope you are handling things okay today xxxx  

Ali - I have the preseed all ready - just need to bloody well ovulate now!! 

A xxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Ally-  

Pix- Well done on the job hun, even though you prob won't take it. it's a confidence boost and shows just how bloody fab you are   
Love that link
Love that choc winky


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Anne - you bought a huge smile to my fash,  where did you get that wonderful little monkey!!! Thanks hun

Pix - you DID respond to the drugs, so you must know there is still hope for you. xx I know, jetlag has messed with my cycle in the past...but not this much   And I have no AF signs, which I usually get for days beforehand.  You know I totally agree with you not talking the better job, if your current job is understanding that means so much.... Would you consider telling better job that you are going through IVF at the moment, and think taking on a new job might be not fair to anyone right now?  Scrap that, terrible idea! Even if they were understanding, your on career mummy track and they would withdraw their offer immediately! 

Ally - just got your email with Dr Check references - thanks! I will dive into them.  My email has been down all day, you could have sent them yesterday. 

Remind me to buy that preseed girls.  I know this is TMI, but we share all on here   I've never needed it before in my life - probably had too much rather than too little.....until last month that is.  MUST remember to buy it.  Can you buy it online?

Sam xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Sam- He is on the normal smileys when you click more  

OK, question- what is preseed?

xxx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

your right - I've found him!!! i'd just never noticed him before -    hey there little fella


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Oh and Pix, if your interested PM me your email and I'll forward you way more info than you ever wanted on the EEP 

Sam


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Sam thanks hon, very reassuring (not the job advice! ) but AMH.
I'll PM you my email address now - thanks. xx

Anne: Preseed - www.preseed.co.uk

Ally: See i've told you it can happen - I'll prove them all wrong, you'll see! 

xxx

/links


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Pix- Ah yes, got you now. x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Ally - if you want to try the EPP here, I think we have enough info to seriously take to Jaya, and get her opinion at least. 

We have lots of documents describing the WHY they think it's better, and we have a drugs calendar also.  They do seem to use dexamthasone also(a steriod, some studies say prevents miscarriage) - which they don't mention in their research papers, and extremely high FSH, so I'm not sure The Lister would be willing to try it.  There are certainly enough of us interested in it... so they may listen.

Personally, as I've said I certainly haven't decided to do it - I'm still a long way off that as it is a very high dose of FSH, but if I do decide to do it I think I'd rather go to the US.


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

would you girls believe I haven't showered yet today! Bad me I know..... I'll be back online later.

Sxxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Bloody hell, having a mad panic about my FSH & AMH tests- bet they have changed for the worse


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Anne G said:


> Never heard of that on Zuri, wish I had a spare £100,000 then I'd pay for us all to have a go there


no £10,000 Anne hehehe £100k would be rediculous


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## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Sam,

I have spoken to Jaya before about epp but this was when I thought I was going to CHR to do it and then decided to stay here and try the Lister. She has looked into it in that she communicated with Dr Gleicher and has his protocol to use on me if this cycle fails but I very much got the impression she didn't really want to do it and that if I did do it I wouldn't get any support as it isn't something they know anything about. 

Also, as you have mentioned, I don't know if they would exactly replicate the drug amounts on the protocol or not - this is something I would have to ask her. As I haven't gone that way with her I am not sure exactly how it would work - don't know if I would have to tie back in with CHR again to get the support or the Lister just follows the protocol and fills in where necessary. I didn't feel that she was really that interested in looking into it but you never know. If this cycle doesn't work for me I do want to try it as it is not as if I have had an amazing response with the microdose flare protocol (!!) but I am worried she will manage to persuade me that if they tweak the meds.......! Finacially we can only do this twice so it will be a difficult decision. Aside from all that I am not sure I will get my period back after this anyway. AF dance for you    . I know how it feels just not knowing what is going on.

I will probably wait until my follow up and then I will take all the information you have given me and see if I can get as much feedback as possible I am just not that confident I will get it. I think you are right and if you are going to do epp it is better to do it in the US where it is their thing but I can't fly (haven't explained that yet - will at some point but not now as meant to be working) so would have to try it here plus I guess the cost of going to the US is so much higher than when I first looked into it.

In the meantime I am going to try and will my 2 follicles to produce some good eggs. Slightly worried I may have cooked them as fell asleep with one of those back pain heat packs the other night and woke up wondering why my ovaries were on fire! Fried eggs anyone!!

Missy xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Ally hunny,

Thanks for letting me know I've been thinking about you all day!      have a big hot chocolate and get a big hug from your lovely Ben

Angel hunny so sorry it's turned out this way!!!   


Hello to everyone else, this place is such a mine of information and expertise along with a wealth of Experience so glad I found you all

Hugs to all got Accu tonight so need to just do some paperwork, hopefully back later if not catch up with you wonderful ladies tomorrow

Sx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Sam - in 1991 there were 24 donor egg babies born.  In 2004 there were 535.  There were roughly 5000 DE babies born from 1991-2006 so approximately 300 a year.  Beyond that figures are murky.  When the law changed to remove donor anonymity from 2007, donors dropped off massively and, as we see here, the shortage means that most women will now go abroad for DE treatment so there is no way of monitoring numbers.  However, I do feel strongly that nobody should feel any pressure to be open about the use of donor eggs for fear of perpetuating the idea that it is easy to get pregnant over 40.  To put things in perspective, in 1996 there were 12,103 births to women over 40 in the UK; this rose to 20,793 in 2004 and then to 23,706 in 2006 and, as we know, it is still rising.  So let's take 2004 since I have figures for over 40 births and DE for both those years.  If we take your suggestion and triple the number of DE babies (which is probably going to result in an overestimate because fewer people were going abroad in 2004 because the anonymity law had not changed) AND we assume that all DE births were ALL to women over 40 (obviously not going to be the case) this would still mean that only about 7.7% of births to over 40s were DE.  And you could probably break that percentage down further - of the 20,793, 909 were babies born to women 45 plus in the UK in 2004 and it is very likely that a higher percentage of those were DE than for say women of 41. I agree that it isn't necessarily easy to get pregnant over 40 and yes I do have suspicions whenever I read of a "celeb" having twins at 46 or something!  However, the fact is that the vast majority of women who give birth over 40 use their own eggs and I don't think those who use donors are perpetuating any kind of myth if they choose to keep it private.  Hence I really feel that those who are worried about this here should not do so - it is nobody's business but your own and if you choose to keep it private then that is fine!

Pix - Please please do not focus on your AMH result; you got a response on your last cycle and that is what is important!  Once you get to ET, which you did, then the results don't matter.  Just focus on your next tx. 

Anne - the same applies to you; you responded on your IVF cycle so the AMH and FSH don't matter!!


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Jeez, what a day!

Ally, Angel and Zuri sending you mahooooosive 

Hi to everyone else and I'm really starting to wonder whether we should get so hung up on all these numbers being chucked around FSH, AMH, AFC etc when it seems like it's all irrelevant. Your miracle story thread, Ally, along with the PR success stories seem to me to prove that it's less about the numbers and all about getting the right protocol/the right month...

Why the hell can't the professionals pull their heads out of their  s and collaborate together to make the hellish IF journey easier for us, instead of contradicting each other and rubbishing each others ideas all the time?! Why can't they listen to eachother and exchange ideas in order to plan the right protocol to get us preg instead of using last month's hormone levels as a reason to tell us to give up hope altogether?

Shouldn't we be able to look at those numbers and say ok my FSH/AMH/AFC/level of NK cells etc is a bit crap but that can be dealt with and I can still get preg.

This is what the blasted HFEA should be doing, making these pig headed idiots work together to help us, instead of wasting time dictating to clinics how many embryos they can replace!

Sorry this is an utterly pointless rant but it just upsets me to see us all getting so stressed about the last set of results when there is evidence out there to indicate that it doesn't mean we can't get preg!

OK am shutting up now 

Love to all

xxx



LittleJenny said:


> Pix - Please please do not focus on your AMH result; you got a response on your last cycle and that is what is important! Once you get to ET, which you did, then the results don't matter. Just focus on your next tx.
> 
> Anne - the same applies to you; you responded on your IVF cycle so the AMH and FSH don't matter!!


YEAH! What she said! Now why aren't the clinics making this clear?!


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Forgot to say - Sam, I really hope AF turns up soon.  I know that is a real stress for you, just as it is for Ally.  We will all do an AF dance for you.


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Thank you all again for all the welcomes. Interesting reading about the EEP protocol, I was reading about that yesterday when I was frantically searching for some positive news. You are all v knowledgeable on here! Interesting Jaya spoke to the doctor in the US as well. 

But missyg really hope you don't have to go down that road, great news that you have 2 good follies growing and you have given me some hope for tomorrow as well   

Sam - really hope your period comes soon. That must be so stressful. Are you seeing Dr Zhai?

LittleJen - you are a mine of information, a lot of which (plus your sister's story!) has kept me going for the many months I have been lurking so thank you so much for that. 

Kind of wish they hadn't invented the bloody AMH test. 

Does anyone else read their message over and over before they post it by the way? ... ! Will I grow out of that?!

x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

LJ - thanks for all your info. I know you meant well, I do take your point though, and I know that what you meant was if we don't want to tell we don't have too..... which I'm sure I wouldn't want too....but rather than make me feel better it actually made me feel more alone and freakish that I need to think about DE.  

Maybe I'm just trying to convince myself, but I honestly think there are more than 300 DE children a year in the UK, given there are 4000 donor conceived (that's egg & sperm) children a month in the US at the moment.  Plus, I picked up fertility & somethingerother magazine, it was only about 20 pages long. I'm not kidding EVERY page had at least one ad, most had 2 or 3, for clinics doing egg donotion overseas - you can even go to Barbados! There can't be this many clinics advertising unless it is a market that's worthwhile...which 300 a year across so many clinics is not.  Sorry LJ, I just think the numbers are much much higher - or maybe I'm just trying to make myself feel better.  I know your intention was the opposite LJ....so thanks for trying. 

Purple - enjoy your acu - wish I could go everyday a the moment.

Almond - yep, I'm at the Zhai clinic too.  Are you there too?  Note I was pregnant in nov, mc at 6weeks...so I do think she is doing something right.  

So, the only friend in London I've told what is happening to me ...I'm supposed to go over there for a cup of tea, but she has been avoiding my calls the last few days...she's been ttc, and I knew she was pregnant, and she is.  Rather than go, I cancelled as I'd rather sit here and feel sorry for myself.  I HATE THIS!!!  I don't want to be one of those people who avoids \ is not happy for pregnant people...but I am.  

Sxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

Sam22, how about this? the more pg people, the less stress on nhs fertiity clinics?? and indeed the fewer people wanting fertility treatment privately, so the better the treatment we get. 


look at it as a bonus!


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

I'm lost in all these figures guys - sorry! I have an engineering degree but it's been a while since I finished uni and changed career! 

Sam - did you get my PM? I'm emailing my consultant in Turkey as I want to ask his opinion on EPP and would love to forward him the research results you have.
Have you showered yet? I was wondering where that smell was coming from! 



sam22 said:


> I HATE THIS!!! I don't want to be one of those people who avoids \ is not happy for pregnant people...but I am.


me too!!  

Anne: Stop worrying honey. FSH makes no difference as the Lister goes ahead with the cycle whatever the figure is anyway and as for AMH you know you've got eggs. Have you started taking DHEA yet?

xx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

Nix, completely agree. what a total NON JOB working for HFEA is....what on earth good do these people do?  ZIPPO. and why do we pay them over 100 a cycle for NOTHING, save reducing our chances by minimising nos of ET.  


I am convinced that there is a deep rooted mistrust of women with jobs out there, having children. 

I think that it suits that very old fashioned group very well for women NOT to manage to have a career then conceive later on as all their policies are unhelpful. 

I really think the 3 embryo policy for >40 is a disgrace, ditto 2 for <40 if the quality isn't good. When you consider that for older women the game is often "hunt the good egg", it makes perfet sense to put back as many as possible but they don't allow it. 

WHY? 

grrrr HFEA


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Oh Sam hunny     not quite got to accu yet as having to make congratulations card for friend whose birth announcement card just came through! I've been putting it off for ages because it just hurts to do it!!!

wish we could all just have our journeys come to a successful end and get on with our dreams of parenthood rather than feeling so alone in this sea of infertility.

So glad you guys are all on the raft with me

                

To all tonight!

Sx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Sam - I am so very sorry I upset you   and I agree that 300 a year is not accurate.  I just took that as an average from the 5000 known from 1991-2006 but given that there were only 24 DE births in 1991 but 535 in 2004 we know the numbers are rising dramatically.  Plus these numbers do not include those who have gone abroad for treatment which is why I tripled the 2004 figure in working things out.  I can't find any accurate recent data except a newspaper "estimate" of 2000 donor births each year (sperm, eggs and embryos) in 2007.  But I agree that most women will seek DE treatment abroad which will never become part of the stats.  Plus, as you rightly say, there must be an extensive market for the clinics abroad, although it doesn't all come from the UK.  I really am sorry if I made you feel bad.  All I wanted to point out is that no woman who receives DE treatment is responsible for perpetuating any kind of myth of fertility over 40.  Maybe it is easier if I just point out that the number of births in the UK to women over 40 in 1938 was 27,200; in 2006 it was 23,706.  So, despite all we hear about "record" numbers of women giving birth over 40, the numbers were actually greater back in 1938 and the recent increases are not solely the result of donor egg availability.  So nobody who uses DE and keeps it private is somehow responsible for perpetuating any myths.     I am really sorry I made you feel worse.


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Just popped on to give Ally, Angel and Zuri and big hug


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi ladies 

Pix - mind if i join u and ally hunny?  Just dug my amh out and its 0.71pmol too    I got 2 egg this time last year so hopefully it aint diminshed far from that   Love the valentine gifts    still got the ann c**k rub and p**sy rub so i'll be making sure they get packed for our dirty weekend in london   

Sam - Hop ur af turns up soon hunny will say a    for you tonight  

Hi to ally, anne, littlejenny, natasha, beachy, annacameron, missy, almond, lightweight, bonchance, tracey, steph, zuri, bobbi, and everyone else.

Gonna watch emerdale and worry about my next lot of amh/fsh results now


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Sam, I was at Dr Zhai's from Feb last year but haven't been since Nov, was ill all Dec and then Jan started pill for IVF and I'd been told to stop the herbs in prep for IVF so haven't been back. She definitely made a difference to my cycles and I liked the fact she wasn't ultra strict about diet etc, but I hated the temp taking, it just made me too obsessed! she does wonders for some people though and her adverts say 70% success rate ... still not decided if I will go back if this cycle doesn't work, as its expensive and I'll need to save for the Lister (plus also scared I will got told off!)!need to win the lottery!! 

Sorry about your friend's pg announcement - ouch. even when you know its coming or guess it still hurts. It is hard to be happy for someone when them getting pg is a massive reminder of what you are missing. That's the problem, it just reminds you of your own pain. I find it really hard to be physically close to pg women as it is just too painful.

x


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Evening everyone.

Missyg.  Well done on your two follies.  I hope you get at least one golden egg.

Littljen.  Your post about the number of over 40's getting pg did make me feel better, and more optimistic that I still might get a natural miracle in the next few months.
I think I will probably try and keep it quiet.  Not least because when, after my MC I said to my Dad 'my only chance would probably be with donor eggs now' he immediately said 'oh god you wouldn't want to do that would you'

Just about to watch super size super skinny!  I don't know why I watch it as each episode it more or less exactly the same as the last!

Anyone chatting tomorrow and if so, what time.  I have pilates until 8.15

Almond, I probably should read my posts before posting but I am lazy and never do.  I hope I don't make too many mistakes


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## Donkey (Nov 24, 2007)

Evening

sorry just a quickie but I wanted to ctach up with Ally and Missy's news.

Ally   I am so sorry that y 've had this sad news.  Look afteryourself and Ben   

Angel I'm so sorry to read your news too   althoug I can understand that it is good to finally have closure.  You must be exhausted after such a traumatic week  

zuri big   hugs to you too.  Lets   there is a change on OTD and this is just implantation

Sam can your GP help and prescribe something to bring AF on?

Missy such fab news, I'm so excited for you  

Big hugs to you all  
Donkey xx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Tracey - I know what you mean about supersize super skinny but I am watching it too!!

Donkey hon   hope you are coping okay x

Feeling heartbroken, down but definately not out. I am going to do some research on EPP with a view to doing a different protocol some time in the future but mainly I think I am going to focus on trying to get my ovulation sorted and the good old fashioned BMS. I stopped taking the DHEA at the beginning of the year, I think I might start it again but this time at 75mg as i was only on 50mg before! I will also carry on with the Chinese stuff a bit longer.

Just cooked what was going to be cod mornay but ended up making a bit of a cod fish pie with spinach on the bottom. It looks a mess but hopefully it will taste nice!!   I also bought banned foods, hot cross buns and rachels organic divine rice, going to eat for the next 3 hours, explode, then go to bed! 

Just thought is Natasha okay - havent seen her for a few days?

Zuri  

Love to you all xxxx


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

I've been watching it too  

Ally so glad you are not out. your plan sounds really sensible. you never know when that good egg will pop out and one good egg is all it takes. I'm sure I must have 1 in there somewhere! I find stories like these hard because I think it wont happen to me, but I know someone who after 4 cycles was told to give up with their own eggs and then got pg naturally. that's just one story and I've had other friends get pg after years. if it can happen for them then it can happen for us. hope you enjoy the banned foods. if my cycle gets cancelled tomorrow I am eating a massive box of chocolates and that is just for starters  . 
x


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## BDP (Dec 10, 2008)

Hi girlies!! So sorry I've been such a stranger - don't know what happened really. Work has been horrid, and trying to fit in that, acupuncture, some very sporadic exercise and LOTS of eating seems to take up so much time! Computer also broke so had no way to log on for about 2 weeks (can't at work - no time and don't want people seeing cause it's none of their damned business!

Anne - I hope you are doing a bit better now hon. And Pixie, and everyone else in the middle of it all, and those who've come out the other side without happy news they so want and deserve.

Last and not least, the hugest amount of love to my dear sweet brave sis Al, who has had such a tough time, (hence my sad face) but will get through it with our help. Oh, and if the fish pie is disgusting I must confess I am to blame as I was on the phone to Al for about 2 hours this eve while she attempted her mornay sauce!

My update is that I have decided (wth the advice of my acupuncture and also going with what's in my heart) to have a 3 month break from it all and try IVF again in April. Have also laughed in the face of caution and recession and booked a ski trip with friends. We're off to France 1st week of March, yippee!!! (Well, what are credit cards for after all - it's practically free!!)

Love to you all and speak again soon I hope
Becks XX


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Becca - good to have you back hunny enjoy ur ski trip    

Almond - good luck tomoz hunny     for you   

Ally - watched it too hun but fell asleep   Enjoy all ur nosh sweetie, i have had after eights pink wafers ww dessert oh and now some chedders so if u dont mind i'll come and explode with you  

Tracey - sorry bout ur's dads comment hun, but lets face it, he's only a bloke and what do they know!


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## alegria (Dec 10, 2007)

Hi Team PR,

Just wanted to send a huge  to everyone, and especially to Ally.



sam22 said:


> I HATE THIS!!! I don't want to be one of those people who avoids \ is not happy for pregnant people...but I am.


That's exactly how I was starting to feel, all bitter and twisted, especially with my work colleague, who is now massively pregnant, sitting next to me at the office. But had a chat recently with my acupuncturist, who is absolutely lovely, and she's helping me to try and see it in a different light... instead of feeling uptight and closing my heart when near to pregnant women and babies she has encouraged me to actually open up to them and, as much as it may hurt in the beggining, try very hard to be around them as much as possible.. the idea being, babies have an amazing amount of good, powerful energy floating around them and instead of resisting and closing myself to it I should want to tap into this amazing energy, opening my heart to it and hopefully it will rub on me too 

Sorry if I sound too 'zen' but just wanted to share the thought.

Alegria x


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Ally I'm sorry    Your attitude is fantastic

Ali sending you    

Thank you ladies for all the support and pma. How can my 5 follies not have grown? Have my day 9 scan in the morning so will find out Work has been mad today and couldn't even log on at lunch!

Anna x


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Sobroody - good luck for 2moz hunny   

Alegria - doesnt sound saft at all hunny, maybe i might just give it a go   

Nite girls im all stuffed on chocs and biscuits


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Thanks slycett

I'm taking a HUGE hot choc up to bed (to get my milk intake up) 

Night all


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## BDP (Dec 10, 2008)

Hi kate, thanks for the message and talk to you more soon! I should be in bed but have spent about 2 hours trying top secure a pair of moon boots on E-Bay! Not usually much of an E Bayer, and luckily stopped myself before spending twice as much on a mouldy old pair of boots that would cost half as much new in the shops! am officially the fattest as have had: chicken samosa (DH shoved it down my throat - and he wonders why I'm fat?!), glass of wine, HUGE plate of chilli and rice, and seconds! Bowl of crunchy nuts! Now I've purged my guilt must go to bed, but got to clear up kitchen a bit first - urgghhh. Night night lovely FF girls XX


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## Ali27 (Jul 13, 2007)

Ally - i had homemade fish pie too but, without sounding like I am bragging, mine looked appetising!!     Perhaps not so healthy though as no spinach.  I now have visions of you like the man in that Monty Python film!!     BTW, I know you look nothing like him  

Sobroody - good luck for tomorrow hon    

Alegria - I have a friend who says exactly the same.  I do try, adn its easier with friends who know what i am going through.  But tomorrow I am going back to work and have found out that a colleague is coming in to show off her new baby adn I'm not looking forward to that.  

Becca - ski trip sounds just what you and DH need.  Good for you  

Almond - I think that too - those sorts of things never happen to me either    Hope your scan goes well too    Get that box of chocs in the morning - that way sods law says you wont need them and you'll have to resist all week!  

Hi to everyone!!

Its probably a good thing i am going back to work today - started watching QVC earlier and was tempted to make some purchases from Bobbi Brown.  Didn't need so much self-contol when the disgusting leather bags came out.  Its quite mesmerising though


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Now that Kate and I have exploded I am off to bed but wanted to say....

Becca - glad to see you back hon xxxx

Alegs - thanks for hugs hon. I totally agree with what you say about being around pregnant ladies and babes, my mum says the same. I wish it didnt make me feel so sh!t though, always want to go home and top myself as I feel so useless!! Maybe I should try a bit harder though, its not all that attractive that twisted bitter state is it!!  

Almond - heres hoping you don't need the chocolates tomorrow!! And if you do.......well at least you get the chocolates!!! You will be gutted though as you won't get them  

Sobroody - masses of good luck for tomorrow x

Ali - good luck with channelling all of the positive baby vibes out of your friends baby into your uterus tomorrow!! Lovely fish pie - how lovely - mine was really good in the end actually - looked good once it had gone golden in the oven and Ben LOVED it. Pleased with myself for getting it together, usually only eat toast when my treatment is cancelled! Hope you are hanging in there okay on your 2ww.


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## lucky_mum (Dec 16, 2005)

*Ally* - so, so very sorry it didn't work out again - I am so  for you, really wish it had been different, you are so lovely     Will pray that the Big D*ck method will come up trumps for you and that you'll get that natural miracle - stranger things have happened! 

*Angel* - so sorry for you too - sending you huge   

*Zuri *- sorry to read it has been BFN so far -  that you may get a surprise on Thursday's beta test though 

*Missyg* - yay!! for the extra follicle - great news - good luck!   

I had a lovely afternoon today - went with my Mum to visit Laura and the triplets, Miranda was there too with Robert so it was a PR baby cuddlefest! Hi to the newbies and so sorry to all those I've missed - better go as have to get up early to drive to MIL's in Cambs where we are going to stay for a couple of days, back Friday probably - take care all!


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## Bonchance (Feb 7, 2009)

Hello PR Team -its hard to keep up with all this reading and finding out how you are all doing today!  
Thank you all for your comforting words, advice and suggestions and you have certainly given me a few ideas to look into.  I really didn't think there was any chance of me ever getting pregnant with own eggs due to recent amh and crap ICSI response and thought DE was my only option now.  But all your postings and links are giving me hope. 

I have had acupuncture since July 08 and TCM herbs and reflexology, vitamins etc.. taking advice from zita west books. 

I don't know what DHEA is?  I don't know what EPP is?
I don't know what clinics are better for treating patients with low amh - how do I find this out?  Have seen lister clinic mentioned here alot but don't know where that is? thank you little jenny for recommending lister ..do you have anymore info on it?

Sorry only joined FF last weekend and this thread last night so haven't read the archives 

With ref to earlier discussion on DE issues.. I was at work last week and colleagues were discussing DE and patients going abroad for fertility treatment.  No one at work knows what I am going through, by the way.  Anyway, two of my colleagues were being very *****y and making nasty comments on why would people seek treatment overseas and why would anyone want to become a mother in their 40's and seek fertility treatment at that age   I was furious, but had to contain myself so that I didn't give my secret away.  Of course, these 2 colleagues are both mothers, who obviously just take it all for granted.    I think they are just ignorant and have no understanding of people struggling/ fighting to become parents.  I am so glad that I have never told them about my problems and I never will!  They just wouldn't understand.   

I feel so grateful to be able to come here and find so many understanding and caring people, who are so supportive and try to bring hope, while sharing their joys and sorrows with us all.  

Sam -thanks for your advice re: searching for clinics with experience treating low amh.  I think the doc said my oestrogen levels were fine also!  I must check look them up again though.

Zuri -so sorry things don't seem to be going to plan.. I really hope it works for you 

Angel - so sorry   

Almond- I am new to thread also, only joined yesterday. Thank you for your words of encouragement and good luck with your scan tomorrow 

Ally - so sorry that you didn't get good news today    I hope you had a glass of wine too while you were eating naughty foods?  I drank a whole bottle of wine when my last scan showed zero follicles in Jan 09 and then I went on net and booked a cheap holiday! So be kind to yourself 

Pixie, Lightweight -thanks for your support and advice

Missy -that is great news and hope all goes well for you on friday 

Sobroody -good luck with scan tomorrow 

Nix -I agree with you and wish that all clinics would work together/share information to help find solutions in perfecting the perfect plans and protocols to deal with our probs with getting pregnant   Sometimes I feel that the patients know more than their fertility docs 

Think I have said enough and it's time for bed!


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Gosh it's almost 1am and I haven't been able to sleep all night. I feel like a rubbish person for not being happy for my friend who is pregnant. ...... I really wish this was easier   Yep Ally, I'm not sure the bitter and twisted look really suits me.  I'm also really trying to decide where is best for me to do my first cycle in April, the Lister or New York on the EPP (I have to admit beside the scarey cost, the 750 of FSH is scaring me too).  I wish there was a pr thread in the US that I knew about, so I could check in with those girls and see how they were doing on the EPP...

LittleJen - Of course I absolutely know you were not trying to upset me, I hope that came accross  ....I know you would never do that. It's just that here on this thread is the only place I feel "normal", everywhere else I feel like a freak low-quality useless woman who is infertile before my time.    I do believe there are a lot of women out there doing DE, but I also WANT to believe it if that makes sense.  Sometimes (actually a lot of the time....) it just causes my heart to hurt so much when I hear or read about how easy and common it is for other women to conceive. I hope you can understand that.  When I see a woman my age or older with a little baby, one of my coping mechanisms is I tell myself not to get upset, you don't know what that woman has been through - it could be a donor egg baby.  And when I see women older than me with my dream twins - which is so common these days largely due to IVF, I tell myself 'it's likely DE'.... and it just helps me cope, because then I don't feel like it's just me who is so useless and everyone else can have babies. I know you didn't mean to cause me to be upset...I just want to live in my village where I can believe that I'm not abnormal.     Kisses for you Jen. I probably should have just kept my mouth shut and not told you that it made me feel worse.... sorry Jen.

Almond -      and lots of baby dust for tomorrow. I've been trying to follow what clinic your at as it's not on your signature. I know you are saving for the Lister but are you cycling there now? I kind of love Dr Zhai, I do find her calming and her mixture of chinese and western medicine is a blessing - she totally understands every western test and protocol, and I do think she did help my cycles.... sooo hoping this is just a very long blip.  I do know what you mean though, i'm kind of scared of her at the sametime too!

Pix = will try to get that info off to you tomorrow.

Missy - will respond to your PM tomorrow too.

Hi Becca!  Welcome.  Can I just say your sister has helped me through some of the darkest days of my life... she's an absolute treasure.  I don't know what I would do without Ally.  

Ali - are these are desperate times when you resort to QVC, I once got tempted and bought a skincare line from them! Principals secrets I believe was the name... I don't think it was any better than boots to be honest...

Kate - have a fun dirty we in London!  Wow, wish I could do something to revive my libido! 

I hope Natasha won't mind me posting on her behalf but she's actually not feeling well...her clinic said it's a side effect from the humira and she is to rest up.  She made it to the sofa today, (from the bed), so hopefully she is on the upwards slope to feeling better.    for you if you get to read this Natasha.

Oh I hate insomnia..............I'm going to try to sleep again now.....my won't I be exhausted tomorrow!

Good night girls
LOL Sam xxxx

Hi Steph - you posted while I was posting! Wow what a wonderful PR day you have had!!  This made me smile (hard to do tonight...)  

Bonchance - you posted while i was posting too. Lister is the Lister hospital in London, they have the most experience with PRs. EPP - estrogen priming protocol, new to us too! Some clinics in teh US are doing this for PRs, and it seems the IM in spain have now adopted it for PRs too.


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Morning ladies. I've been thinking of all of you who haven't had good news over the past couple of days  

Bonchance - as Sam said the Lister is in London and it has got a good reputation for poor responders. It doesn't turn anyone away from treatment e.g. because of high FSH and it still has really good overall results. They have a website and they will send you a brochure if you want one and they also do an open evening every month, I went and found the talk they gave really useful. Sorry about your tactless colleagues, people just don't have a clue sometimes do they  

Sam - I'm at Barts doing a NHS cycle but I've seen Jaya at the Lister (who was all for us trying an NHS cycle, respected her for that) and I will definitely be going back at least for advice if this one doesn't work out. I'm actually entitled to 3 NHS cycles and money is tight, but if Barts can't do any more for me then I think the Lister (or abroad, which I haven't ruled out) will be the only option.  

Please don't feel like you are a rubbish person for not being happy for your friend. It is totally understandable. I think the thing is, it is not so much that we are not happy for that person (if you weren't in the position you are in, you would of course be happy for her), but that we are sad about our own situation and someone getting pregnant reminds of our own pain. 

I love what Alegria wrote and I have had that advice too and I try but I find it hard. I have to say I find it much easier to be around babies than pg women - I do find it hard to be that close to an unborn baby, because it hits me really deeply. And sometimes I do just feel so angry that it has happened so easily for them (as has been the case with a lot of people I know) and just not me. I think its all normal, but not necessarily helpful, so I've had to try and change that. Hope that makes sense!

Steph - am loving your bump when normally find them really hard! Was following your story when I was lurking and a massive belated congratulations  

Sobroody - hope your scan went well, it was this morning wasn't it?

I'm just getting ready for my scan which is at 12.40. Without going into detail (!) started getting some of the physical signs I get around ovulation time which is making me hopeful that something is happening but I almost dont want to be because I cant bear feeling as upset as I did on Monday. Just hoping I get a nice consultant today. DP is coming thank god. 

sorry sure I have forgotten something I wanted to say to someone but have to go and have shower now. was nice feeling to go to bed last night and think I had connected with all these women in a similar position to me and we were all over the country rooting for each other

x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Good morning girls.... my don't I feel fragile this morning. I hardly slept at all last night.  Maybe it was my friend getting pregnant that really upset me.... or maybe I'm just a menopausal - insomnia being one of the "symptoms" of POF   I know I'm very stressed, so today I'm going to try to do something nice and destressing for myself....maybe try to go for a massage?

Bonchance - I was too tired to really reply to your message last night.  Are you in London.  I realised I also should have pointed you the direction of a good consultant at the Lister.. Jaya lists on the website that she has a special interest in high FSH patients (which I know your not, but high FSHs tend to be PRs too), and most PRs seem to gravitate towards her.  I'm not with Jaya, as I didn't know about her when I first contacted the Lister, but sometimes I wish I was.  They do have a waiting list for appointments, so best to try to call asap and book yours.  In case you didn't know, this is not an NHS clinic so you have to pay privately.

I'm so sorry about your colleagues being insensitive about DE...I've heard so many similiar conversations in the last few months, it's chilling. Some of the comments I have heard have astounded me.  It's absolutely true that people who haven't been through what we have been through don't understand, I wonder if they're will be a time when they ever will.  When I hear them speak, I always wonder if they are just opening their mouths without engaging their brains and actually "thinking" about the opinions they are spouting - and they don't really mean it, or if they really just don't have even the slightest understanding of just how life shattering infertility is.  Your right not to tell them what your going through, but it must be so difficult pretending.       It is upsetting, as if I do DE, I don't think I would tell people - not even my family - as I don't want the judgemental opinions of people who don't understand, and yet I know I'd want to tell the child, so how do I arrange this as I'm sure the child will want to speak about it.  

Zuri & Angel -   , hope your taking care of yourself today. 

Hi Almond -     for today.  Oh good luck!  Where is Barts, is that in London too?  I know you have low amh, but do you have high FSH too? I thought that NHS wouldn't treat us, so good for you if you are getting tx at Barts!  Of course you won't need it because this cycle will work out for you - but on the chance that you do, I wonder if Jaya could tell you what protocol she would use on you, and you could try that at Barts to save you money? Is this even possible on the NHS?  

Alegria - I like the idea of trying to spend lots of time with pregnant ladies and babies and that energy. I do agree all that new life can be a lovely energy to be around - hoping I can get to that state...... even half way there would be good, anything has got to be better than the way I'm dealing with things now.

Sobroody - good luck for today too     

I had an idea last night when I couldn't sleep.  How many people are interested in trying the EPP at the Lister if they are open to it? 

I know they don't want to try something new, but I'm wondering, if there were enough of us who wanted to do it, maybe they could do some kind of trial with us to see how it went.  Option 1 would be the best: we offered to participate in a trial in exchange for free tx and drugs (ok, dreaming....), Option 2: we participate for free tx, and we pay for our own drugs,  Option 3: We get them to agree to do it for us, and we pay for everything.....

Sam


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi Sam, so sorry you are feeling fragile this morning   this is so hard sometimes, i know pg announcments can knock me for six for days sometimes. a massage or something else lovely sounds like a great idea.  

Barts is in London and for a while it was the most successful NHS clinic but now I think it is Guys? I dont have high FSH, it has been consistently normal so I'm another oddity (tho my oestradiol is slightly high) but I know for a fact that Barts do not turn people away for that. In fact the lovely consultant there Miss Tozer who I've seen a couple of times privately has been really encouraging about my low AMH and also told me about a recent success they had with a high FSH patient. She has also been adamant that people should not be refused treatment simply because of low AMH - don't think other clinics (NHS or otherwise) would have taken the same line. Jaya told me she'd try me on the short protocol first and the microdose flare if it didnt work and Barts put me on straight on the microdose flare (so I was really worried about not responding to it, as was Jaya's second resort - tho not so worried as I think they can tinker with the drugs and sometimes something less aggressive can work). but I would def go and speak to Barts after talking to Jaya before moving (in any case, I may need another lap soon grrrr so would stay at Barts for that). I don't know if the restrictions on FSH come from the PCTs funding the treatment or the clinics themselves? 

take care today Sam thinking of you xxx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Wow Almond - that's the first time I've ever heard that from an NHS (or a huge number of the private clinics), that they don't turn away high FSH..... and lots of NHS clinics we know turn women away based on AMh too. I have to say, Barts do sound really lovely.  Is it a postcode thing where you have to live in the area to cycle there?  I'm guessing it is.  I pray all those twitches mean your follies are hard at work Almond.        Good luck today, will be waiting for your results.

Sam xxx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Btw Almond (and Bonchance), I think normal fsh is a really good start to your cycle, it means that your body has not become accostomed to high levels of FSH, which can dull down your FSH receptors, which is believed to be one of the reasons high fsh women don't tend to respond well to drugs. It is also one of the reasons the EPP using estrogen & down reg's you for a while first, and then during, to try to make the FSH responders switch back on again.  Mir, who now has gorgeous baby Robert, had low amh, but normal FSH....and IVF worked for her!

     

Sam


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

re barts and fsh - unless they have a cut off I dont know about Sam? but not been given that impression and definitely dont have an AMH cut off. I had a choice of where I could go within a few London ones and picked Barts for other reasons (this was over a year ago before I knew re amh stuff) but glad I did now. thanks so much re that extra info I didn't know that. just off now eek back later thanks for the good wishes and hope you feel better xxx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Sam - I can't say I can empathise with what you are going through but I did get a glimpse of it when Kate got her test results.  I know she too felt she had turned from being a young woman to an old one overnight.  Please don't assume your insomnia is a sign of POF; to be honest, I think it could just as likely be because you are feeling so low and are so anxious about AF etc.  And I totally agree with you on people judging DE.  Before my sister's IVF, she was looking into DE in case it turned out to be something she wanted to do.  I spoke to my mum about it and she said "oh I'd never have done that if I'd had problems - it wouldn't be my child".  It really annoyed me.   Kate was going through hell and my mum - who had got pregnant first month trying with Kate and second month with me - was passing bloody judgment about how people deal with IF!!!  I pointed out that my best schoolfriend was adopted and asked Mum if she regarded my friend as not being her parents' child.  This did produce some backtracking but it really upset me and I then told her that she really needed to keep her mouth shut about things she couldn't possibly understand.   I hope you are ok.                

Alegria - when my sister got her FSH result she spoke to one of her friends who was 36 and single. It turned out this friend was desperate for children but had not met the right person and had watched her younger sister and many of her friends marry and have children so it was rough sometimes.  She too advised Kate to be around children and pregnant women and not shy away because she said it actually helped.  This story does have a happy ending because Kate's friend shortly afterwards met the right person and her first baby is due any time now!  I think it is a very individual thing and I can understand people on this thread finding it hard.  I also think it is up to those pregnant ladies and those with children to be a bit sensitive and not bang on about how they just have to be in the same room as their man to get pregnant etc.  You just never know what another person is going through (see my bit on DP below) 

Ally - I agree you should go back on DHEA; remember it does enhance spontaneous pregnancies in those with DOR too.  And keep going with the TCM!  

Bonchance - I'll PM you my "standard" message on DHEA; it won't be very personal but hopefully it will help.

Pixie - my sister has an engineering degree too! 

AnnaC - I am totally with you on the HFEA; see also my stats on over 40 births and how they are in fact lower now than in the 1930s, despite all this talk of an "epidemic" of older mothers.

Almond - good for you for trying Dr. Zhai.  I really am a believer in TCM for PRs.  It seems to get results and help people's cycles.  It also takes detailed notes of each and every aspect of people's cycles.  Also, it has a truly holistic approach and doesn't assume your AMH or FSH result tells the whole story on your fertility. 

Tracey - glad I made you feel a bit better; I also read about a study at St. Mary's which showed that 55% of women over 40 who had had 3 consecutive miscarriages went on to have a healthy baby.  There is defintiely hope!  

Becks - a skiing holiday and a bit of a break from IVF sound like good ideas!! 

Sobroody/Anna - best of luck at your scan today.  

Missy - I thing your body temperature can regulate itself - you won't have fried your eggs!! 

Donkey - I hope you are doing ok 

Zuri - and you 

Angel -   

Kate - don't worry about your next FSH and AMH - you know you respond!!!

Natasha - hope you are ok; not seen you for a while. 

Bobbi - and you! 

Fishy - you too! 

Steph - sounds like you had a wonderful time at the PR bumps and babies meet up! Hopefully more of the ladies here will be joining that happy group soon! 

Almond - good luck for your scan today too! 

Love to Purple, Miranda, NicksW, Nikki, Elinor, Hazelnut, LauraB, AnneG and anyone else I have missed.

I was over at the house of the sister of a friend of DP's last night.  I don't know her and her husband that well at all but DP was making cracks to the girl about how her brother (DP's friend's older brother) got his wife pregnant again the first time they did the deed after the birth of their first child, despite his excessive drinking, smoking etc.  He was joking about Irish twins etc.  I cringed because he should know better.  I then went to the bathroom and saw a fertility monitor.  I had my wee as quickly as possible then dashed out to shut DP up and had a go at him all the way home.  Who knows the pain his stupid comments may have caused?


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Sam - sign me up for the epp hun, option 1 if possibe  option 2 if possible  but prob be option 3    Good luck everyone scanning, sorry no personals am feeling crap, but i do love you all


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Bonchance - have PM'd you stuff on DHEA; it is basically an old post from this thread but it would take you a while to dig it out so I have sent it straight to you.


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi girls,

Sam- Hi hun, sorry you're feeling a bit fragile. Has AF made an appearance at all?  

Ally- My brave lady. You are a treasure to this thread and we defo couldn't do without you  
Glad you had some yummy food last  

Pix- A hug for you sweetie  
Yep, started on the  DHEA on Friday hun. No insomnia just a few headaches  

Becks- Lovely to hear from you hunny  
Thanks for your texts. I am getting there with the odd     but will be fine soon I hope
I am stimming April too hun  
Well done on skiing trip on that free C/Card (love that!!)  

Kate- When you off for weekend of filth in London hun?    

Nat-  

Ali- Step away from the TV hun    You make me laugh with your shopping   
I am going to Bull Ring tomorrow to get Jas Vday cards and Bday pressies.
Also booked a suprise night in a lovely hotel in Wales for next sat for his b.day   

Anna- Good luck with your scan  

Angel & Donkey-    

Zuri- Hun, how are you?  

Tracey- Glad you're feeling a bit brighter  
I am going at it like crazy this month to see if there is any chance of natural PG (   )  before I start pill next month

   Bobbi, Beachy, Popsi, Lainey, Miranda, Steph, LJ, Purps, Fishy, Nix, nikkiW, Nikki2008, Missy, Almond, AnnaC, Juicy, Laura, Elinor, Hazlenut, Rural

Love Anne
xxxx


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## angel555 (Apr 7, 2008)

Hello Team PR.....

So much going on here, haven't had the chance to read up.

Just wanted to say thanks again for all the support. Taking it one day at a time and don't feel ready to make decisions about the next steps yet. I'm scared of trying again; BFN is horrible enough; but if we were lucky to get a BFP again I would constantly feel scared that the same thing would happen again.  

Anyway, I accepted that I can't cope and feeling worse so have decided to go and stay at my parents place for a few days. A change of scene should be good and that way I don't have to see anyone for a while. Really looking forward to it. Their internet connection isn't the best so probably won't be able to get online from there.

Will miss you all. I'll catch up with you when I'm back.


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Angel- I understand what you mean about seeing people hun. Just look after yourself and have a nice break at your parents


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Angel - good idea to have a break.  what you are going through is soul destroying.


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Angel.  I hope a change of scene makes you feel a little bit better  

Becks.  Well done on the skiing trip.  Things are definately free if you don't use real money  

Anne.  Enjoy the    Hotel sounds lovely

Ali.  I used to love QVC.  A friend and I used to turn it on after a few drinks and have a laugh at what they were selling.  They used to have a presenter who was fab, he managed to make you really believe everything he was saying.  I have never actually bought anything though.

Littlejen, thanks for the stats from St Marys

I emailed a miscarriage clinic outling my circumstances and asked whether they thought there was any chance I could have a problem (other than old eggs).  Typical, they just replied and said I could book a consult if I wanted.  I suppose it was too much to ask for them to just reply to my email and tell me whether they thought there was somethign to look into - I suppose they won't make any money like that !

Sam.  Will you get the chance for an afternoon nap today?

All.  Was your fish pie the Jamie Oliver one - his is def the best (although I leave out the hard boiled eggs as  can't stand them)?

As usual in this part of my cycle (CD21) I am constantly wondering if I am pg.  I don't have any symptoms apart from backache when I am in bed,but I never learn - I am always hopeful.  I think I would even manage to think I might be pg if we hadn't had BMS that month!

By the way girls, I still haven't bought anything (apart from food) since 6th January.  Well done me. 

Lots of Love

P.S. Anyone in chat tonight?


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## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Hi,

LJ - glad you don't think I will have fried my eggs as I did it again last night! Keep falling asleep with the heat packs on - got to stop doing it as I am sure it is not good - the heat builds up and up not like the wheat bags (well mine is a lavender bag but same thing) where it gradually cools down  - can only use that at work though as don't have a microwave. 

On the people saying insensitive things topic just wanted to add my Mum in to that! Was telling her about where I am up to last night, have told her about FF etc, and she said 'look at your sister's friend and all that fuss when she had IVF and then she just had two babies naturally'. ALL THAT FUSS!! I nearly lost it with her. She knows everything I have been through/ am going through plus I have told her about some of the PR team and the pain and heartache everyone goes through let alone the fact my sister's friend had an eptopic, lost a tube and nearly died, and she comes out with that! She then said it must have been down to the friend relaxing. I told her I didn't think if I just relaxed a bit my eggs would suddenly reappear and she said 'oh, I don't really understand all this, where have your eggs gone'!! I must have told her what is going on with me a million times. 

Anyway, this is my mother, who I would expect a lot more from so I think if that is what I get then I can't expect anyone else to be any better. As I have said before if you haven't been through it you don't get it. We just have to learn ways to deal with it. I am starting to think I might just start to be really honest and if people ask me the dreaded question I will say we have some medical issues and it is hard for me to talk about - I just have to practice saying it without crying.

As for the donor egg topic I think if people are insensitive or judgemental, as I have experienced with friends, when the subject is being discussed I will say something along the lines of: 'I guess it is very hard for you to possibly understand this from where you are sitting - it is not something you can make a quick judgement on, which you are probably doing right now, as I have thought about it for months and am still unsure of how I feel about it 100%'. And try not to cry!

Angel -  hope you have a good couple of days at your parents. Take care. 

Sam, sorry you are not feeling great. You have worn yourself out doing all your research! I would be up for option 1, 2 or 3 of your great epp plan. 

Ali, hope your first day back is going OK or was it yesterday? Did you hide from the baby or have a cuddle? 

Back to work.

Missy xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hi anne - we are going down saturday morning for valentines day, going to see we will rock you at dominion theatre and stopping at the raddison somat or another     

Missy - people just do not understand what we go through hunny, how can they if they have never been there?  We understand on here tho hunny   

Tracey - we all hope every month hun, we wouldnt be human if we didnt, i'll be in chat from about half 8 as its football again tonight  

Angel - enjoy ur break sweetheart and make sure u spoil ureself rotten  

Hi lj, bonchance pix nix sam natasha nikki ally becs and everyone hope ur all up for a chat later  

Kate
xxxxxxx


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Hi everyone. Just wanted to share a typically French surreal moment which I hope will put a smile on your faces! I've just looked outside and the circus is in town. Literally. Just down the road, outside the supermarket they've parked their trailers and there's 3 camels and a horse wandering up and down the grass verge! 

I'm going to see if there's any crocodilagators in the Seine!   

xxx


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## elinor (Jul 4, 2008)

Hi everyone

just a quick update on where I am at the moment because I haven't had a chance to catch up with the thread (it just goes so fast!).

Today I pretty much feel hopeless for this cycle - prepared for TMI in next sentences... Bleeding that started on test day last week had been intermittent and not like a 'proper' period, so I was trying to stay hopeful and believe that maybe it was a late implanter (especially as still feeling queasy now and then). But last night MAJOR bleed, with clots and everything, so I don't think anything could have survived in there. Still have to go back Friday to get it confirmed. Still not sure what/where next. At least I went to local support group on Monday - some 3D friends who know what it is all about!! It makes such a difference being able to talk there and also on here because you feel you are talking to people who truly understand.

Will try to catch up and will definitely post later, but meantime I hope everyone is doing ok and send   to all.
best wishes
Elinor xx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Elinor - oh hunny     wish i could make it all better for u somehow  

Nix - OMG the circus - havent been since i was about 8     Will you be going  hunny?  I would if i were you


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Missy - glad it isn't just my mum!  Mine means well but sometimes assumes she can understand things which are totally beyond her.


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## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

OMG, not again, i don;t get on the laptop for the weekend and spend all week trying to catchup, i'm still 4 pages down, but gonna post before i get even more behind  

Angel -   sorry hun for the sh!t time you've been having, been thinking about you  

Ally - as always you're down but not out, even in your most desperate times you seem to have a plan and be together, sorry it didn't work this time hun, i hope your next step will work   thanks for the new thread  

LJ - wow the twins are really growing  

Kazzie - joshua's pic is so scrummy, it's lovely to have them to remember him by  

Kate - you really got us all thinking hun on the DE route, even had the conversation with DH and it wasn't something he would talk about before   My cousin also offered me too, i laughed it off as she isn't the healthiest person, but the thought was lovely   I would have to go with anonomous personally, but if you are lucky enough to have such a lovely friend, then go for it - IF you need to   I'm blaming you for sending the lurgy down the Internet, i've had crappy flu/cold again, twice in one month, shows how low we all get with IF when we are all ill  

Donkey - no more gambling this week hun, only now and again, i do live in a horse racing village so now and then it just has to be done   how are you doing, your post looked very upbeat, you have a new plan, wish we got more than just the 1 NHS go, make the most of the system hun  

Swinny - good luck with the FET hun  

Rural - sorry you had yout BFN confirmed  

Tracey - your new pic is so cute, did Max enjoy the snow?

Purple - i managed 190 situps on monday and did half an hour of core exercises last night - i'm trying to get this weight off too  

Steph - hi fellow MAC user  

Ali - how's the 2WW hun   G&Bs are doing butterscotch eggs, they are yummy  

Mir - glad to hear bob's hand can be sorted, think i missed that post  

Jal - hi hun, welcome back  

Nix - another AF chum here sweetie, at least it'll be over for valentine's   Circus  

Almond/Anna -   for your follies to grow  

NickiW - how's work going, hope you have a lovely mummy day  

Zuri - sorry to hear about your BFN hun, i really had a good feeling about you  

Missy - good news on your 2 follies hun, sending you lots of     for them to grow grow grow  

Sam - have you got AF yet sweetie  

Pix -  

Anne - how you doing hun  

Elinor -  

Still got the snotts, but feeling a bit better now, glad to now be back at work after being stuck at home in the snow  

Started my DHEA, what side-effects can i expect, have a really woolly head and don't know whether to blame the DHEA or that my eye's need testing, finding focussing hard at the mo  

DH just dropped bombshell that he's going to be working away next week in London, just when BMS is due   That'll be another month gone by the by  

Hugs to everyone xx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Fishy -   good to see you


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Elinor _ I'm sorry hunny    

Almond how was your scan? 

Missyg - sorry you're Mum's not being very sensitive, mine has learnt not to make any commenys around me know as she always puts her foot in it. 

Angel - take time for yourself     I know how you feel. All I can say is that you will find it easier to cope with in time...no comfort to you now I know. I had counselling after my 4th and found it saved my sanity, that and accupuncture.

Women can be so insenstive. One 'friend' said 'Oh you know what's its like when you have kids' well actually after 6 mc's and 3 years of trying no I don't!   Another friend invited herself up for the weekend and turned up with a 20 week baby bump, suprise! She knew about be background. Had she told me I would have asked her not to come! Then we have the likes of Charlotte Church making out ivf is some sort of expensive 'easy' choice  

Anyway had my scan. My  e2 levels were much better, had gone form 206 last Friday to over 800 Monday (not sure what todays levels are). An additional x2 follies have popped up, but they are small (5/6mm) and may not catch up. The five original follies have all grown, though the two on my right have grown more than those on the left. Lead follie is now 13mm. So fingers crossed the others catch up. At the moment there are only x2 follies at a decent size (13 & 11 mm, the rest are around 7.5mm  Next scan is Friday. 


Anna x


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Eli -   



LittleJenny said:


> Missy - glad it isn't just my mum! Mine means well but sometimes assumes she can understand things which are totally beyond her.


I remember when I mentioned DE to my mother, her immediate response was words to the effect of "oooh no, I wouldn't do something like that". I think it's a bit like Pavlov's dog or something, the knee jerk reaction from that generation always seems to be the same... unfortunately! I talked to her about it later on and there was the same hasty back-tracking but her inital reaction really disappointed me... 



slycett said:


> Nix - OMG the circus - havent been since i was about 8   Will you be going hunny? I would if i were you


Scared they might not let me back out again! 

xxx

Yo Fish  whassup! Oh bugger just saw your comment re DH! But where do you live? I thought you were in the South East?! Chick, get your butt on the train, follow him to London and jump his bones!!!

xxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anna - well done on the e2 levels hun   Hope the other follies catch up in time for your next scan  

Fishy nice to have you back hunny   Follow dh down to wherever he is working and s hag his little ass off, tell him working away is no excuse  

Hey anne - perhaps we should have a brummy bonkathon this month then seeing as our af's turned up on the same day?  I will still do cbdfm this month so hopefully i will ovulate for a chance


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Nixf01 said:


> Yo Fish  whassup! Oh bugger just saw your comment re DH! But where do you live? I thought you were in the South East?! Chick, get your butt on the train, follow him to London and jump his bones!!!
> 
> xxx


Yeah, where's your committment Fishy? Poor show    (oh, actually, I thought she lived in the North?.....)


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

... bloody hell, I didn't even know she was preggers....
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20090211/ten-corrie-star-alison-has-baby-girl-5a7c575.html

/links


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Kate- yep, I am gonna shag till the cows (or camels Nix  ) come home   
have a lovely weekend hun  

Fishy- hello hun, I am ok ta. Hope your cold gets better    

Hi Nix- That circus info has cracked me up kid


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Anna- well done on scan  

Elinor- I am so sorry for what you're going through hun


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne - will get dh to give it his best shot (literally)    am looking forward to it myself.  As i said in txt this  morning hun am really mixed up about whether its worth me trying again but suppose if i dont at least try i'll never know.  Weekend away will be good for us and at least af should be completly gone by then and we can have some fun  

Nix - i always wanted to run away and join the circus when i was a kid and be a trapeze artist, dont know how i'd have coped tho im sh1t scared of heights


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Talking of the circus coming to town........

..........................I think I could probably join the circus, I am upping my dose on the DHEA so who knows give me a few weeks and may be able to!!! 

Back for personals later - kisses and hugs all round xxxx


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Ali - how did meeting your colleagues baby go  

Missy - DH and i had the same conversation, new years resolution, anyone asks the 'baby' question and they're gonna get it full force, i'm fed-up of telling lies now, let someone else feel mortified after putting their foot in it  

Anne - with you on the DHEA headaches, feels like someone is sitting on my head and covering my eyes with their big butt  


I'm ahead of you girls, already thought of following him down there, only glitch is he's going down with another guy and they are staying in the flat they are working on   His workmates don't know our situation, how odd would it look if i follow him down there and take him to a hotel to shag his brains out, they;d think i was a bunny bolier that wouldn;t let there DH out of their site   mmmm dillemma, will have to see what DH thinks tonight, he wants to work through and get things finished early so he can come home earlier in the week


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi ladies, bloody hell this is a busy thread! I'm called Julia by the way not almond, not sure why I picked such a ridiculous name, I think because that was the colour we were having our walls painted when I joined. sure I could have come up with something better than that! ... I have some good news finally from my scan so happy more about that in a min but first:

Elinor - I don't know your story but I read your sig and am so sorry to read your news. can you speak to your clinic at the meantime? thinking of you x

Ally - been thinking of you all day even though i dont know you and really touched by your story and inspired by your attitude actually. hope your are doing ok today   

Angel - hope you have a good rest at your parents, thinking of you as well  

Slycett - hope you have a fantastic weekend in London   I couldn't tell from your sig, how did you get on when you went to the Lister, what is the next step for you if you dont mind me asking?

Anne - glad to hear you will be going at it like crazy before you start the pill! when do you start, march if you are stimming in april? i read in zita west's book good to do ivf in spring / summer as is growth time so  

LJ - well done for being so sensitive last night, if only everyone was like you!! I hope though that you become one of the ones who gets lucky quickly  

Tracey - you make me laugh, I'm exactly the same by the way, I think I did actually think I was pg when we were trying naturally before the IVF even in the months when no BMS ... I know miracles happen but I think that is pushing it

Missy - so sorry your mum was insensitive. I think people try don't they but they just don't know what to say or they put their foot in it. found your post really helpful in thinking about what to say to people. when is your next scan by the way?

Anna/sobroody - sounds like things are going well to me and it is still early days. I think you are a couple of days behind me aren't you? Before today all my follies were under 10mm apart from one and now things have improved, so keep doing what you are doing and fingers crossed for Fri   

fishface - love your cat, I've got one similar. **** what anyone think about you being a bunny boiler! get down there if that's what you want to do  

As to my scan, yippee!!! I have 3 follies now 11-13mm and poss another one but my left ovary is hard to get to cos of endo so they can't see until they get to egg collection (wow, I might actually get there!), plus some smaller ones as well. Am just so delighted and grateful. I know it is not a lot for a normal responder, but on Monday we were being told to cancel and that it would be a miracle if we got pg on this cycle and now it feels like we are in with a shot. It only takes 1! luckily had a nice dr today and do not ever want to see the one I saw on Monday again  . so I have another scan on Fri and hopefully they will continue to grow. so more heat, water, protein shakes! plus I have been having acu with a lovely lady locally while I decide whether I go back to Dr Zhai and she has been reassuring and positive and she knows about PRs cos she also works out of the Lister and Zita West and I have found it really helpful. So no box of chocs for me (well not the whole box already had a little bit but it was "healthy" choc so doesnt count)

I might be around for chat later if I can work out how to do it ... !

hello to everyone else
Julia x


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Julia- Well done on the follies hun!!
Yep, I start pill in March, then stimm April.   
xx


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## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

almond/julia - well done hun, that's great news, so glad things have taken a   step up for you   My pussycat is my pride and joy, he's my 7.5kg baby, a bit heavy to walk around with after a while


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - hugs hunny you are an inspiration to me at the mo sweetheart, here i am sat wondering whether its worth another a go and then there you are planning the next route    I just need a good kick up the **** sometimes to stop me from feeling so sorry for myself    Hope you come in for a chat later hun. 

Julia - hey hunny great news on the scan.     that friday brings even better news    I will start pill on my next af which is due 8th march but knowing my cycle may be anything between 20days which this one was and 42 days which my last one was   Will hopefully be cycling same time as my brummie buddie anne if they can fit us in for scans on the same days would be great  

Fishy - hope u manage to sort somat out for bms hunny, even if it is a quick one up an ally somewhere  

Hope ur all up a chat later?  About 8.00 to 8.30?

Kate
xxxxxx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Anna and Julia - well done on the scans!  Looks like you both have some workable follies!


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Kate / Anne - fingers crossed for both of you, that will come around before you know it and you are in such good hands there. Anne do you know if the antagonist one is the same as what I am doing now (see my sig), I think it might be?? 

fishface - my cat is v small but alarmingly fat, people always think she is pg (well at least that's one of us)! she is currently trying to persuade me to feed her even tho it is clearly way too early and nowhere near dinnertime

thanks LJ. am delighted, I think they thought I was nuts at Barts with my celebrations

i have just worked out how to enter the chat room! which room do i go to (? is that what you call it??) for the pr chat? also does anyone know if there are instructions somewhere about what all the symbols mean ...?! 

x


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Hey Julia, fab news re your follies hon!  And same to you Anna!

Anne and Kate - brummie bonkathon 

Re: Chat and echoing Julia's question, where do you lot hang out when you go in there?  I can never find anybody when I go in there!

I went and had a look at the circus thingie, they're setting up for this weekend in the carpark there but it made me a bit sad actually. There were 2 beautiful lionesses cooped up in this trailer, hardly any room in there at all. One of them just sat there looking at me with these really sad   like she was saying, "I'm not supposed to be here".  I remember now why I stopped going to the circus when I was little. I didn't like the animals being cooped up then either... 

I did see 2 kids get the fright of their lives tho, they were antagonising one of the camels and it went for them! It was chained up but they didn't realise how long the chain was!     Serves 'em right, the little sods!

xxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Julia- I did the Antagonist but I went straigt from the pill to 375mg Menopur then cetrotide to stop ovulation then the oviltelle trigger shot just before EC.
I didn't down reg x


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> Anne and Kate - brummie bonkathon


   

Hello girls    busy at work but reading when I get chance.

Fish:  That wasn't very nice! 

Sam: Thanks a lot for the email. 

Anne & Kate:  

Everyone  

xxxxxx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Its very sweet people saying I am 'brave' and an 'inspiration' and all that but really I am just the same as you all, you are all brave and inspiring   I am just doing my best to not fall apart like all of us.

Kate - honey extra special kisses and hugs hon  

Pix - Same to you honey pie. How are you doing babes, day improved?   

Fishy - lovely to see you darling   I just saw your gorgeous pudkin is 7.5kg. I had Charlie weighed at the vets last friday and he was the same!! He is big boned though!!  

Anne - just love you thats all really xxxx

Almond - well done that is great great news!! You can't have the choccies now you naughty girl!!  

I am going to apply to go to the NIH (National Institute of Health) in Washington DC. They do an extensive study on POF and you can go there ( free of charge - only paying your flight) and have access to people who trully understand POF. They run loads of tests on you and try and establish if there is a reason for your POF and offer you guidance on the best tx to protect your future health including HRT etc. I am particularly interested as I have noticed there are quite a few ladies who have concieved whilst on HRT or estrogen therapy. The NIH do stipulate that they are not there to work out how to get you pregnant but to try and protect your health but I still think it would be wonderful to have access to such knowledge and understanding of this crappy condition. 

Anyway that is me for now.......

A xxxx


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## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi all

Been trying to read through the last 10pages all afternoon so that I can do some personals, had to speed read the last few so apologies to anyone I I have missed!!

Almond/Julia, Great news on the scan!!

Ally1973, sorry the scan wasn’t the news you were hoping for, time some time out and enjoy all the forbidden fruit!

Donkey, good for you, smile and ignore, good news on the 2 NHS attempts

TraceyM – can’t help you I’m afraid, I would have thought you were ok after having 2 full term pregnancies but who know what happens as time passes, surely the consultant would have suggested looking into it if necessary?

Kazzie – sorry about AF, she just loves to tease doesn’t she, I was 3 days late this month just to tease me as I’m starting treatment!

Swinz – can’t advise I’m afraid. I am on ‘go 3’ at them moment and not ready to think of the DE route yet 

Bonchance – Hello, I feel for you on your journey and totally agree that the NHS should see us sooner if they then talk to us about getting older!!

Zuri – so sorry it didn’t work this time

Lightweight – good luck on your cycle!!

Angel555 – so so sorry, hope the break helps

Sam – hope AF comes soon

Becks – Hi, don’t think we have met before but I like your attitude!!

Ali27 – good luck going back to work!

Fishface, laurab, anneg, purple – hiya x

And a big hello to everybody else!!

AF turned up today so booked in for Day 2 scan at 11:30am tomorrow and will prob start stims tomorrow evening if all is quiet in there.

have a good evening all

J x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

hello girls,
Ally - I really want to go with you. See my email.. xx

Tracey – GGrrr your clinic for wanting money just to give you an opinion.  I emailed my nutrionist (who is lovely, but in fairness works at a big clinic) a question the other day, only to be told that if I’d like an answer I could book a 15min phone consult....  In fairness though, they are not all like that. The over 1 hour long call I had with the consultant at the SIRM was free, though the price for IVF tx is incredible..

Angel – I think it’s a really good idea to go to your mums.  What you are having to deal with is so much, hopefully they will take care of you.

Elinor – I’m so so sorry hon.  I wish there was something I could say.  We are all here for you, hopefully sharing the pain a little helps.  xxxxx  

Missy – your mother sounds so much like mine!  Sometimes I’m thankful she lives so far away.  She asks, how are you, I tell her what has been happening – which is usually more bad news – and she says, well glad things seem to be improving then!  They just don’t get it!!!! With my mother, I honestly think she doesn’t really listen.... or it just doesn’t find it’s way into her brain.  To add to the list of insensitive things, my newly pregnant friend – the only London friend I’ve told part of what’s going no too.... that I managed to see today.... I told her about immune tx and what people have to do for that (in the context of me deciding whether or not I will do immunes tx)  Her response  “Well if it comes to that you have to just have to call it quits then don’t you, I mean you don’t go killing yourself for something that has low odds of working”.  Trying to explain to her the pain of infertility is so much worse......and the “low odds” outcome being a child.... well let’s just say, I think I’m going to give up on explaining it to people. Think I'll just make up a simple story, like - oh god I don't know, medical issues sounds fine - I'd be too embarrassed to ever mention menopause...I find it hard to even type that word, I hate it. 

Kate – your weekend sounds fantastic!  Enjoy every minute!!  You really seem like dynamic person to me!

Nix – that’s so hysterical!  I can’t remember the last time I went to the circus.....other than cirque du soleil which I did on Saturday night.

LJ – that reminds me, what did you think of CDS?  I'd seen Quidam before and I think it is my favourite, I really enjoyed it last time... but to be honest this time I sat there the whole time wondering why the parents in the production were ignoring the little girl and wondering about egg donation, and thought about IF the whole time - felt really bad as DH spent £60 on the ticket, so I just told him I loved it. ....  I really need something that I have to concentrate on I think....letting my mind wander is not good for me right now.

Anna  - great news on your follies! Fingers crossed for Friday!  

Fish – hi! Welcome back

Anne – , I love that your always online to cheer us up you happy little bunny!

Julia \ Almond – yyyaayyy great news!! Congratulations! I really am totally over the moon for you! Please please give us a BFP on this thread!! Can I ask the name of your acupuncturist – i think I saw them all at Zita! BTW – I was thinking what a fabulous name almond is and wondering why I couldn’t pick something like that, and now I’m stuck with stupid Sam22. Would you mind posting your protocol – again sorry – so we can all get a look

I'm still feeling very low ladies, need to pick myself up, and get myself together...and focus on the next part of the plan.  I sometimes think that being in limbo is the worst, and that maybe it would be easier if I just tried to move on. But honestly, I don't think I'd ever stop feeling the pain, so might as well keep going.  I'm thinking seriously of going to the US for tx, it does seem like a lot of time and money for something that is unlikely to work...Missy, your last PM is really pushing me in that direction though. 

Sam xx


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Hiya Jal - good luck with your scan 

Sam - will speak later xxxx

This was the story that inspired me to finally apply for the study in Washington:

_I am at the NIH study for POF, and yesterday morning during the ultrasound appointment, I found out I am about 8 weeks pregnant. Talk about exciting--and ironic! Anyway, I am still at the study (it's over tomorrow), and I wanted to share this exciting news and let y'all know that this kind of miraculous thing certainly can happen. I was taking Vivelle-dot .1 mg and Prometrium on the calendar schedule recommended by NIH when I must've gotten pregnant. I was not trying to conceive, and the whole thing was a big surprise! Dr. Popat at the NIH said they have been finding increasing numbers of women with POF who are getting pregnant while using Vivelle-dot, and in fact, they are conducting a study on it at NIH.

The NIH POF screening protocol is absolutely incredible (I would say that even if I hadn't discovered such exciting news for myself.), and I have never had such attentive, enthusiastic, comprehensive care--certainly not for POF! I highly recommend it.

Before this news, I had FSH levels of 95 several months apart and was diagnosed in March of this year. At that time I had an ultrasound where the doctor found no follicles and said my ovaries were basically a barren wasteland. So there's hope!

Thanks to all of you for being so supportive and inspirational to me!_


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi Jal- Good luck for scan  

Hi Pix m'lovely  

Sam-


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Alls-


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi Jal - blew you some bubbles hon xx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Sam & Ally - Can I join you too girls?

Ally: I'm feeling a bit better honey - thanks. I had acu earlier on and I think it helped except that I have a bruise on my private part now! When did he get there - did he knock me out? I'm all suspicious now!   

Sam: Your reserch is very impressive. Thanks for putting that together for me again.  

xxx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Bloody hell- Washington sounds amazing, it really does  

Love you too Mrs Millard    

Pix- I know I shouldn't laugh about your lady area bruise hin but I can't help it   
Glad you're feeling a bit better  

My head feels like somone is pressing and squeezing as hard as they can, making it in to a tiny pin head   
xx


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Anne G said:


> My head feels like somone is pressing and squeezing as hard as they can, making it in to a tiny pin head


that'll be me for laughing at my lady area bruise!


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne -  ooohh im sniffing nafarelin first hun, so think i must be doing something different.  No idea what tho?   

Ally - oh god hunny you gotta go do it if you want sweetheart, what a chance to have, go for it girl!  

Sam - oh wish i could make it ok for us all, the only thing i can say sweetheart is follow your heart and ur dream will hopefully come true, we will support you whatever u decide to do    

Pix oooh has ur acu man been putting his needle in somewhere he shouldnt have??  

Hi jal - good luck for ur scan tomoz hun   

Nix - poor poor lions   must admit i laughed my head off at the camel and the kids tho    

Julia - one of us normally opens a room called pr something or other, we will guide you in hunny dont worry   

Photographer just rang, he is dropping our album and painting off tonight, hope they've managed to airbursh the wrinkles out me fisog   

Kate 
xxxxxxxxx


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## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Julia - Great news re your scan!    I'm on day 9 of stimms today. We both have scans on Friday 13th....eeeek! 

Anne - if you watch corrie you can sometimes see her bump...they've been dressing her cleverly and shooting her top half!


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## Hazelnut (Jan 30, 2009)

Hi ladies, I've been really busy at work today  but have just tried to catch up abit on everyone's news!

Julia- thats great news about your scan- really pleased for you.

Ally- really interesting about the Washington treatment/ research, I'd be keen to hear more about that.

Also wanted to say I hope you don't mind me tagging along on this thread, I know I haven't had any treatment yet so i don't officially know whether I'll be a poor responder but with a raised FSH i'm likely to be heading that way.  And as I haven't told any friends or family yet about what's going on, although I would wish any of what you're all going through on anyone, I find it a comfort to be in contact with others who've been where I am at the moment.  So thank you for all being so nice and I hope you don't mind me being here!

I've got some DHEA on the way, so I've got those headaches to look forward to too!

H x


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Hello ladies!

Sorry not been about much today, had bad night on call last nnight was up from 01:30 till 05:30 with silly staff in scottish hospital doing the strangest things with my company's machine and drug! honestly sometimes I wonder how they manage to mess things up so royally!!! And unfortunately for me they never mess up at 2pm in the afternoon! always 2am in the morning!

Anyhoooo, enough of that so much love on this thread at the mo! Ally sweetie you may poo poo us calling you inspirational, and you are right lots of people on this thread are inspirational, but at the moment I know of no other who is quite as inspirational as you considering the week you've had! Honestly I'm not sure I've ever know such an amazing woman as you! I'm a big Maya Angelou fan and if I can bporrow one of her phrases you are a phemonenal Woman!!!

Love ya sweetie

Hugs to all the other fantastic PR ladies, Bobbi, Natasha, Juicy, not heard from you for a while, hope you are well and my response last week has not upset you!?!?!?

Sx


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## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Ally - the NIH in Washington sounds fabulous; look at what they are finding out....

Hazelnut - glad you are keeping an open mind on response.  As you know, my sister ended up responding normally despite high FSH so you really can't tell.  She was told repeatedly that they would be likely to cancel, that 3 eggs would be an exceptional result etc. etc. etc.


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Ally- really hope that you get to go to Washington x

Hi to everyone else x


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hi girls -

Purple I love Maya too!  Your a phenomal woman too you know. I met a lot of the wonderful NICU nurses when DD was in hospital, you girls blow my mind, your so strong and you truly do one of the most amazing jobs in the world for the world 

Kate - I'm sure you will look unbelievable! I wish I knew how to airbrush my photos!

Hazelnut - listen to LJ, she knows her stuff! She's right, you never know we may have to boot you off this thread!    Don't worry we won't.


Anne & Julia - Friday is going to be a big day for us girls!

Sorry your heads feeling bad sweet Anne

Pix -       re your private bruise...

Hey Ally, if you have it can you send the link to that thing about villedot and the NIH. I'd seen it a few years ago, and was desperately searching for it as I wanted to show my POF doctor.

Out for dinner with DH tonight.  It will probably be good, I've had a rough couple of days.  I know I'll be obsessively talking to him about IF, maybe I should try to not think about it for one night and just try to have a fun night, give the poor guy a break.  You know what would really take the pressure off me, if he was as keen on adoption as I am, but he's not. I always thought about adoption, maybe because I knew some adopted kids...and thought it was something I'd like to do, regardless of how many bio children I'd had.  DH is not so keen on the idea - he's not saying no, just that he doesn't know....and I don't think he will even think about it for a second until we are out of options.  If it were left up to me, I'd want to start the paper work now...


Sam xxx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Ah Sam sweetie, I think we'd all make Maya Proud    

I don't work in the NHS anymore unfortunately but do support them and thank you for your lovely complement! You are having a rough few days but please don't let go of how much you have educated us Pr's and given us hope when the days seem dark! Your posts always inspire me and many others I'm sure, without you we wouldn't even know of the EPP that so many of us have looked at let alone all the info on other protocols and test results.

I know you are having a rough time of it just now and I wish so much that we could lighten the load for you, but please know, even though we have never met that my heart is reaching out to you, willing the sunshine to breakthrough the dark cloud! knowing that soon you will see the ***** of light that will lead you to the correct path like I hope we all will find!!!

I think sometimes the road we are meant to travel is hidden to us as we are concentrating on the road we think we should be on. Life is such a funny animal which takes us to places we never thought we'd be blessed to visit, and allows us to meet people we had never known we would find.

My DH has always been so completely against DE adoption and even fostering, but in the last few months the door has opened to him for DE and who knows what else if our road turns in that direction.

Try your hardest to enjoy your meal out tonight because above everything else you deserve a wonderful night with you hubby!

I feel blessed to know you, now I have    on my face but I thank what ever higher power out there that I have you ladies as you are my raft in this turbulent ocean of IF

Hugs from the heart Sam 

Sxxxxx


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

am v bloated after downing a massive protein shake  

Jal - good luck for scan tomorrow and with the start of stimming

Sam   Hope you have a nice dinner tonight with your DH and so sorry about your day. People really dont understand and that conversation must have been heartbreaking for you. It is so hard knowing what to say to people, especially about low reserve. I had someone insisting I was fine I had years left and she just wouldn't listen when I said I didn't. I find it difficult to talk about my IF stuff with people (but I have started to do so increasingly) and actually I think I am ashamed of it which is ridiculous. So hope tomorrow is better for you Sam  . In answer to your question, I'm doing what's called the microdose flare which is a more aggressive treatment than the standard SP I think. They add in Buserelin or a similar drug (I think they are called "agonists") and that gives an extra FSH kick at the start of the cycle before its suppressing effect kicks in and then you take the stim drugs as well. Jaya only wanted to use this on me after trying the standard short protocol but Barts wanted to go straight for it so that is what I ended up doing. To be honest I would rather have tried something a bit less aggressive first because it could affect egg quality I think but we'll see what happens ... I'll pm you re acu. Really hope tomorrow is better for you Sam   

Ally - what an amazing story and what an exciting opportunity. really interesting and would love to hear more

Hazelnut - of course you are welcome here (tho I have only been here 2 days myself so not sure up to me to say that! but I know you are as everyone has given me such a lovely welcome). It is not just when you are cycling that you need support, in fact I almost felt a relief that i was finally doing something and the time getting to here has been really difficult. and you will def learn a lot here. well done for actually speaking, I lurked for months (but still learned loads!)

Purple  

x


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Sam honey - I can give you more info when I find it, can't remember how to get back there at the moment, best thing would be to contact the lady I sent the email to and map out your case. I really hope you have a lovely evening with DH, you really deserve it   if you can please try and have a good time together that isn't consumed by IF (I know that is so so hard but it may just make you feel a bit better once you have achieved it. Love you hon  

Purps - OMG you are so so lovely! If I remember rightly you did quite a good job of putting on a brave face after your last IVF, some of it must have rubbed off on me!! You are making me really tearful with your lovelieness I have to say, I wasn't the same person before IF, much more spoilt and selfish, there is nothing as grounding as this. I do obviously wish I had lots of eggs and no fertility probs but then I wonder what sort of person I would be today and would I have got to meet such wonderful women?? Then I wonder if I truly would turn the clock back   OMG your early call sounds horrific, I found it hard to get up at 8 this morning!! 

Beachy - thanks honey - how are you sweetheart? What is happening with you at the moment? x

Hazelnut - I will gladly share the info with you as soon as I work out how to find it, but lets really hope that your high fsh was a blip and that you don't qualify for going!!   You are very welcome here hon although I wish you hadn't had to find us  

Pix - how is your punctured punani?? You just reminded me, I read on a thread once that someone went to acupuncture and was asked if they could needle the area between front bum and back bum!! Of course everyone told her to get out of there quick smart!! They didn't ask you if they could do that did they??  

Missy - hope you are doing some serious follie growing hon xxxx Sorry about your mum that is totally sh!t, I am afraid that noone gets it unless they experience it. My mum is sweet and really does her best but insists on saying she understands exactly how I feel, i literally have to argue with her "mum you will NEVER understand, I know you try, but its just not possible, you have 3 daughters all 'accidents'!!" winds me up x

Steph - thanks hon, your ** bump pic is gorgeous, you must be walking on air to see your dream become a reality in front of your eyes!!  

LJ - yeah really excited about the study - not guaranteed a place but you can but try  

Kate - excellent getting your photos!! I assume this is wedding photos? I still have mine in boxes - 5 year anniversary this year!! 

Nix - honey pie circuses make me sad too   Yeah those little sods deserved it, did they get bitten  

Tracey - my pie wasnt jamies but I will check it out! Mine was kinda cobbled together out of my memory!

Natasha - worried about you - can you let us know you are okay xxxx 

Off to eat another healthy meal of fishfingers and beans!! Love it!! 

Love you all xxxx


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## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Oh purple-fellow-sam - now I'm crying   Thank you so much for your wonderful post, see I told you you were a phenomenal woman   You have pulled me out of my depression, and your right, I am going to have a good time tonight and look for the ray of light in the clouds. I'm going to smile and try to laugh tonight.  Thank you so so so so much. xx

I'm happy for you that DH is considering DE, hopefully you won't need it, but it really does take the pressure off knowing there are other options out there.

I received a post tonight from another FF, who has been doing a version of the EPP elsewhere, and is now at the Lister as it didn't work out for her. She is now hoping that in her words "sacrificing a few eggs for better quality" might be a better way to go. I've asked her if I can post her pm on here so you can all read it.   I LOVE that she took the time to give me her opinion, if there are any other people out there who have done the EPP please please don't be shy - let me know what you think!  We need all the research and experience we can get.

I know I've said this before girls, but I don't think EPP is the holy grail, and I can't get any stat's out of these b£(*$(y clinics - and trust me I've asked in every possible way, to the point of rude.  I'm sharing as much research as I can find, and asking for any help I can get too , but I don't want to give the impression that I think it is fix all, it's just different.

My guess is, the stat's are likely no better than anything else - otherwise wouldn't they be publishing them to the world? Or at least to little old me!   But I do think it is "different", and maybe if you don't respond to one protocol, it might be worth a try before moving onto other options.   

(This is my idea with IVM too, as the RE who invented it has said to me, the results for PRs are likely worse than with IVF, but I wonder, is it worth a try before you give up? If the stats are that bad, likely not unless it's incredibly cheap!)

I kind of feel this way about DHEA too - sorry I know that's almost blasphamy on this thread.... but I wonder, if it really was a miracle, wouldn't that be reflected in the CHRs stats?  Don't get me wrong, I'm cultivating my chin hairs along with the rest of you... and I feel that about immunes tx too.  If the ARGC had "solved" the problem, wouldn't their ET to Preg rates be A LOT higher than the Listers? Especially considering they don't take low FSH patients?

What I do think, is we are all different.  For all we know, my issue maybe low DHEA, and raising this may work wonders for me, but not someone whose issue is very high FSH \ low estrogen. So the EPP may work well for them, as the theory is it turns the FSH receptors back on.  (Me, I've always tested very high - too high, for estrogen, so may not do much for me).  Maybe if your getting to ET each time, then your issue could be immunes, and maybe immunes tx will do the trick for you.

I sometimes wonder if I should even be trying IVF at all, and not just focusing on TCM which did get my cycle back and sorted for a while last year.... and then I did get up the duff...if only for 6weeks!

Right - now I'm officially late for dinner
LOL Sam xx

Oh Ally & Almond you have just posted too.  thanks a zillion girls!  how would I get through the day without you!!! Must actually run now, DH is going to KILL Me


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## Nikki2008 (Jan 11, 2008)

I am back online  

My appologies for the lack of personals, I am still trying to catch up

Decided to try timed intercourse with ovulation induction while waiting for my ICSI/IMSI, day 2 of my injections, day 8 of my cycle, scan on Tuesday showed one 12mm, one 10mm and one 8mm follicle, so 12mm looks pre-selected and injections will hopefully recruit one more. Injections were a bit late in the day, as I made my mind up a late to try this, anyway had intralipids today for immune support and also on prednisolone, heparin and aspirin. More intralipids on Monday. Don't hold too much hope but thought this way I could figure out if I can use intralipids instead of IVIG. So more blood tests in 10 days time. 

So no chat room tonight?


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## Rural Chick (Nov 27, 2008)

Evening ladies
Well, that'll teach me to drink too much, won't it. For some reason on Saturday evening, I remembered that I had to change my email address on here - the only problem was, I typed it in wrong and have literally just been able to log on again just now.    
I have to say my headache was not good on Sunday, and I don't think it was the DHEA!!!!   
     to everyone on here, especially those who has had sad news recently. I shall try to do some personals later, I promise.
Do you mind if I pick your brains?
Last month I took DHEA for the two weeks prior to my IUI and this month my FSH was down to 11.4 but my E2 was up from 62 to 287   and this was on day 1, rather than day 2. Is this the DHEA do you think or is it yet more proof that I'm past it - I'm 42 tomorrow and not looking forward to it.
On a more positive note, I've got my appointment with the Lister next Wednesday and hope to start IVF asap. Can anyone give me an idea of what time scale I might be looking at? I will be roughly mid-cycle then and would really like to start in April if at all possible. I see that a lot of you are on the pill, which I don't really undestand at all.
Sorry that this is such a me post, I have some more school work to do but I promise to catch up and do some personals later tonight or tomorrow.
It's so good to be back - I've missed you all for the last few days.
Catherine x


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Chat room is open

Rural Chick.  When I was at the Lister back in September they were fine for me to start on my next AF and I didnt have to go on the pill (although that was their first suggestion).  However, I did hear that due to a move of lab they were putting everyone on the pill first.  Someone on another thread who was due to start at the Lister in Jan was then told she couldn't and had to wait until March and then go on the pill for a month.  I think you will have to find out the latest situation when you have your consult.  Or you could ringn them

Nicki2008.  Good to have you back,  I can't imagine life without the internet for any time


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## mag108 (Jun 28, 2008)

Hi all
I havent posted on this thread before, fairly new to the site, think I joined last sept. I feel a lot in common with you all.
Find preg women difficult (and were I work its mostly women with 13 preg in the last 2yrs, lots of insensitive conversations there, one colleague preg had big full on preg chat with other colleague preg, on the subject of guess what? pregnancy and she knew I had just had a miscarriage). Had to lose touch with a friend who was expecting.

Find people with babies diff (though not my friends with adopted children, know they have been through so much). Its understandable but very difficult. Now finding families in general tricky, feel jealous of anyone with kids at mo. Go to work before the shcool kids so I dont have to see them! God that all sounds so miserable, but these are my daily (our) struggles.

Last month of 4 mth clomid cycle. Then it will be IVF and poss ED (if I can get my bloke to agree that is!)

Told me amh is 6.9 so on the low side.
Had one nat preg but m/c at 11 wks aug 07 (devastation as just after death of my mother). One clomid preg but m/c again. Supportive acupuncturist.
Trying to stay positive but feel like I have already begun a grieving. My life is on hold. Thinking of specialist counselling, anybody got exp of that>?

Facts and figures for IVF are different all over the country. Am impressed at Lister (only london clininc have checked out) Up north were I am the clinics dont have such good success rates and am now wondering about going to London for IVF. Any advice?

Am trying to improve diet, taking supplements etc.

Many thanks for listeneing


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Hi mag 108 and welcome and so sorry you are having such a tough time   so sorry to hear about the death of your mother which must have been devastating. this is a great site and this list is lovely. i have only just started posting here in the past couple of days. from what i have read on here, your amh is actually in the normal range for some clinics which class normal as 5-15 pmol (there are 2 scales and am guessing yours is the pmol scale). Littlejen who posts here explains it much better than me. infertility is really tough and i think only people going through it can understand how it gets you. i think it is grief that we go through, I know I have gone through the different stages of it and I go back and forth through them sometimes as well. i dont know about specialist counsellors but i have just googled and it and there is an association for counsellors who specialise in infertility - maybe try that? i think counselling is a great idea, this is a life crisis and getting help is good. Getting some help (not really counselling, but not totally different) has really helped me come to terms with other people having children and getting pg and though I still find it difficult sometimes, it is definitely not like it used to be. I am learning to appreciate what I have as well, which keeps me happier. The lister is a great clinic and there are others too, there is a board especially for the lister and there are also some other clinic specific boards. hopefully you will not be a poor responder! even better, hopefully you won't have to get to IVf and will be successful on clomid  

Ruralchick / Catherine - hello I'm new. when I was at the Lister for a cons in Jan they were having building work done and couldnt cycle everyone like they usually can and so were booking people in advance. as to the pill, I think it is part of my cycle to stop me ovulating the month before ivf and having a leftover follicle which could then be reactivated by the stimming drugs (not a v good explanation, but the gist of it i think!) I am not at the lister now but had an appt there which helped me with my nhs cycle. good luck with your appt  

Sam - you are so right that everyone is individual. i had to stop fertility sites for a while because i started worrying about what everyone else was doing and thinking i should be doing it as well when actually we really are different and even when our situation seems similar to someone there is v likely to be some important difference we can't see isnt there. you may well be right and natural conception / tcm could be the right way for you and Dr Zhai has certainly got some phenomonal success stories. i have never been pg and they reckon for me ivf poss nec cos of endo, but I have heard way too many stories recently of people getting pg naturally after years of trying and in some cases a lot of ivf to think that is the only way. i wouldnt believe it if i had just read the stories but it has happened to several people i know. i think sometimes the right way just becomes clear ... especially when as you are you are doing everything you can. anyway i will shut up now and hope you had a lovely dinner  

Ally - have to agree tho I hate it that in some ways IF has changed me for the better. i think this is the first time i havent got something i wanted and realised that i dont control the world around me. it has also forced me to open up to people and trust people and on the whole i havent been let down. have also met some wonderful women as well. some of it i believe will make me a better mother - when i get there, however and whenever that is ...

bloody hell have gone from never posting to never shutting up. sorry! missed the chat cos went too early and found it too complicated. have to read the instructions!

good night to all
xx


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Morning ladies 

All quiet on here tonight!

   for all today

Got to go do some work in NICU in oxford today and not looking forward to it as it's where I had my 2 failed IVF treatments    Same car park same building!

I'll be fine and hopefully will not be as hard as I imagine, just been dreading it for weeks.

Hope everyone has a good day! 

Welcome new ladies

Sx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Purple    hope it goes ok


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## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

Thanks Beach Sweetie, I know in my brain it will be fine, but my heart is sore.

Hope you have a good day hunny

Sx


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Hi everyone

was lovely to meet up with some of you in chat yesterday!

I've finally clocked where the Maya Angelou subject came from yesterday, clearly I'm not reading the posts as carefully as I should!

 Rural Chick - remember age ain't nuthin' but a number!

Purps -  you'll be fine, I know you will! 

Welcome Mag108 - if you're coming to London for tx I think everyone on here would recommend the Lister.  I'd also say take a look at the ARGC although I know many people don't like the fact that they have a cut-off of 11 for FSH levels before they'll treat you....  I didn't like it much either tbh, but at the end of the day if they get me preg I won't give a flyer!

Hiya Beachie - hope you're having a nice day so far lovey!

Love to everyone else, am going out to play cos the sun is shining! And I'm trying to avoid the mountain of paperwork I have to file here and... oh yes making a decision about what to do job-wise... I've been saying I want to change career for a long time and have the perfect opportunity to do it now as my former employers don't seem to be quite so keen to take me back as they were a few months ago...

My dream is to become a qualified acupuncturist specialising in fertility (so I can set up practice in our village!) but the courses are expensive and are in London...  I can't figure out how to get on the course without mashing up our finances and possibly our relationship with the constant to-ing and fro-ing from the UK...  I know there must be a way but I can't see it and it's very frustrating!  Any suggestions gratefully accepted!

xxx


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Morning ladies 

Just time for a quick hello this morning so thought i'd sneak in

Welome to mag and welcome back rural chick 

Hi purps, beachy, almond nikki nix pix zuri becca sam natasha ally anne and everyone else.

Cant make 1st march   too much to do as next day is scottie's grand opening we'll be drforsting food cleaning and fetching loads of stuff, but if the date changes im up for it!  really gutted as was looking forward to it


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

slycett said:


> Cant make 1st march  too much to do as next day is scottie's grand opening we'll be drforsting food cleaning and fetching loads of stuff, but if the date changes im up for it! really gutted as was looking forward to it


Awww BUMMOCKS!


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## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

Morning all!

Hope you had a lovely dinner last night Sam.

Morning Purple, hope your day goes ok.

Just a quickie as need to get dressed to go to the clinic, oh how I've missed the dildocam  

Chat later 

J x


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Jal - good luck hunny enjoy the dildocam u lucky lucky girl  

Nix i know hunny im really gutted,   told him i would go on my own but think he really needs my help with this as hes not the most organised person.  I've even taken a week off work so i can give him a hand and get him into a routine so to speak so he knows what he's doing each day.


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## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Just a quickie update - no miracle here, blood test result was negative - as expected


x


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Zuri.     take some time before you decide your next course of action.

In chat last night we decided to have a team pr meet up when Nix is over here.  Is anyone free on Sunday 1st March to meet in London?  If you are, can you PM me as this thread moves so fast I might miss a post from someone who wants to come.  If anyone has any fave places that will allow us to chat in peace and have a bit of lunch and some drinks suggest away.

Welome Mag.  sorry you are feeling so low.  there are a couple of people who I know have had some various types of councelling with mixed views so I am sure someone will be along to help.  If you are feeling this bad you def need some help.  I hope you find that you are not a PR.  What was your FSH?

Jal.  Hope you enjoyed the dildocam.

Even though I am not in tx I still seem to have plenty of opportunities for people to prod around down there.  I had a smear last week and on Monday I am going for a gynae appointment to try and sort out the fact that most of the time I feel like I am about to wet myself and sometimes do  

I have decided to go ahead and make an apt with the Miscarriage Clinic.  I think if I don't I will be wondering if I should have done if I get a BFP on a future DE cycle but then go on to MC.  Oh, well, what is another couple of hundred quid in the grand scheme of things.

Better go, I am at work

Might not be on later as I am going out to dinner with some old work friends which I am looking forward to.  Anyone want to take bets on whether I will be good and have a salad or be bad and have a huge bowl of creamy pasta and a few glasses of wine


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi girls,

Zuri- Hunny, I am truly sorry for you, here if you need me  

Sam- Hope meal was lovely  

Ally-  

Pix- How are you today sweets?  

Jal- Good luck for scan  

Missy- Scan tomorrow?  

Kate- What's happening on March 1st then hun?  

Nikki2008- Welcome back chick  

      Anna, catherine, Tracey, Nix, Nat, lainey, Hazlenut, LJ, Purps, Elinor,Fishy, Juicy,Beachy, Popsi, Almond, Laura, Mag
Steph, Mira

Been for my AMH today and picked up a copy of my last results in October- they are 6.32 Pmol- what does that mean girls?
I am all confused again now  
I think I was right in dividing by 7.14 to get 0.88, or was I?

Kisses & Hugs
Anne


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Anne, 1st March is our pr meet date.  Kate was going to come down for it.


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## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Zuri - I'm sorry honey    here if you wanna chat or rant or whatever...

'Ere Tracey I forgot to say i can finally see your new profile pic and it's luvverly! 

xxx

PS - Come on Tracey, gotta be pasta, all the way girlie, you know it makes sense


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Zuri - so sorry x

Anne - I think you divide by 7.14, mine was 3.5 pmol (god knows what it is now) which comes out at about 0.5 I think Jaya said and so 0.88 for you sounds about right? can i have your amh please?!

Jal - hope dildocam went well. my dp looked a bit horrified when i called it that to him the other day but how else can you describe it?

Tracey - hope you have a good eve, creamy pasta sounds much more fun. I'll pm re 1st march in case you dont read this i'd like to come or another date if it gets changed

hello everyone, sorry still not used to all the names to say hello by name
x


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## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Just realised that Becka will not be able to come - she is off on her skiing hols on 1st March!! But I am definately in! 

Anne - you worked your amh out right hon - don't panic!  

Purps - stay strong today - you can do it - you are invincible!!  

Kate - beep  beep   beep  about 1st March!!

Zuri - really really sorry sweetheart  

Busy busy busy so chat later you load of potty mouths (last nights chat  )


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Tracey- ah got ya.  I am down on 2nd April so if anyone is around after work for a drink that would be nice xxx

Almiond- yes, I though that was right xx


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

what did I miss in chat last night anyway? sorry I didn't make it- my head was in so much pain had to lie down the minute I got in from work


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Hey anne that amh doesnt sound bad at all hunny     Having a meet up dahn landon 1st march and was gonna come till dh put me on a guilt trip and looked at me with big sad puppy eyes 

Tracey gotta be the pasta! hope ur having a pudding too  

My amh was 0.71pmol so thats means im off the sodding i suppose 

Hi ally - i know petal im well fed up about it 

Hi almond


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Hey girls,

How is everyone? It's very quiet here today? Very strange - no?

Zuri: Sorry honey - I hope you are OK.   It sucks doesn't it! 

Tracey: I'll PM you but I'd love to join you guys for  on 1st March.

Purple: I hope you'll be OK later on hun. 

Ally: My punani  is OK darling but I still have a bruise which I'm really p..off about cos was planning a naughty Valentine's weekend.  DH hasn't seen it yet but I bet he won't be impressed knowing my acu guy crossed the line! 

Sam: Hope you had a lovely time with DH last night. 

Anne: How is that headache now honey - hope you are feeling better. Hmmm AMH scale debate? Where is LJ  , she will know.

Nix: How is circus today? Your acu idea sounds great hun, not sure what to suggest though cos haven't got a clue! Hope you get some ideas form the girls in the know.

Kate:  

Hello to all the newbies - here is a welcome   

Has anyone been on Letrozole/Femara protocol?

I've just spoken to my consultant in Turkey about my next tx. He suggested I should be on Letrozole/Femara protocol on my next round. He said Letrozole is very similar to clomid in the way it works but it is quickly cleared from the body and is less likely to adversely affect the uterine lining. I've also asked him about EPP and he said they have been using it but the response has been no different than any other protocols for DOR's.  He said with EPP the purpose of priming E2 is to get body to use its own FSH or something along those lines&#8230; 

Love to everyone...

Ps: Tash where are you mate? Still working on my thesis? 

xxxxxxx

just seen these    


slycett said:


> My amh was 0.71pmol so thats means im off the sodding i suppose





Ally1973 said:


> Kate - beep  beep beep  about 1st March!!


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## fluffy jumper (Aug 13, 2007)

Hi

I was just spending my lunchhour searching for posts on recurrant miscarriage - as you do!!
I came across a post which linked to three papers on repeated implantation/recurrent miscarriage.

I know some of you have aske about immunes before. I found them quite informative. Unsurprisingly, they say there is no conclusive evidence re immunes but they do explain them quite well if anyone wants to have a read.

Investigation and treatment of repeated implantation failure following IVF-ET:
http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/21/12/3036

Evidence-based guidelines for the investigation and medical treatment of recurrent miscarriage : 
http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/full/21/9/2216

Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists Scientific opinion paper
IMMUNOLOGICAL TESTING AND INTERVENTIONS FOR. REPRODUCTIVE FAILURE
www.rcog.org.uk/resources/Public/pdf/SAC_Paper_5.pdf

I am still undecided about having a consult now I have seen the price £225 and that would just be the start, there would be bloods and possible treatment on top. I think I will see how quickly my GP might be able to refer me instead.

Kate. You made me laugh about you having to help out DH by taking time off. It sounds like my DH. He liked to come up with ideas but I then have to do the boring research and subsequent paperwork.
My DH needs to come up with a business idea or new career as he is not working. He is from a cheffing background and one idea was to buy a coffee/snacks van. I will be interested to see how your business venture works out for you. Good luck

Pixie. Hi. Can't you comb your lady garden over the bruise  

Nix. How about becoming an IF councellor?

I am glad to see you are all encouraging me to take the healthy option tonight  

Really better go and do some work now.

/links


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Tracey - i will keep you informed on how it progresses hun, i am looking forward to it myself   

Due to my incredibly low level of amh i have just had to eat a chocolate muffin to get over the shock  

Zuri - im so sorry hunny i missed ur post earlier     pm hun if u want to chat, thinking of you   

Pix - hi hunny not heard of that protocol before but its gotta be worth a go  

Anne - didnt miss a lot hun, talk of poo again and nix is coming over for 1st march hence the meet up. PS can i pinch a bit of ur amh please


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Pix- How about putting some cover up on the southern garden?    
Headache is ok at the mo thankfully.
I think I am gonna have a weekend of a bit of that too- I need to sort out my lady bush though- it's a bit of a jungle down there at the moment


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## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Ps- I would love to come donw on the first but we have the boys that weekend- sorry ladies
Would have loved to - would have been great too to meet Pix & Nix  xxx


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## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Kate, laughing re your choc muffin good for you   i'm renaming it awful miserable hormone

sorry you can't come to London on 1st tho   and just seen Anne cant come as well


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## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

Hi girls

Zuri -    so sorry, take care

Tracey - have the pasta and wine - plenty of time for salads when you're sat at home!!

AnneG - 6.32 is not bad, i think on some scales they say 5 - 15 is normal but they do differ

Pix - just go for seductive lighting! or just turn the lights off - nothing strange in that in my house  



Dildocam was fine - all quiet in there so got my big bag of goodies, put me on 450 of menopur which is my clinics highest dose - just the 6 vials a night to prepare!! Gave me some plastic things to snap the glass so feel happier about that bit. Took blood but didn't say I had to phone them for FSH result so guess they will just call me if  it is too high (has to be below 10 for my clinic). Will be interested to see what it is when I go in next though.

Better do some work.

J x


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## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Anne G said:


> Pix- How about putting some cover up on the southern garden?





traceymohair said:


> Pixie. Hi. Can't you comb your lady garden over the bruise


   

I don't have a garden! It's not my style  

Jal: Your idea is the best one so far 

xxx


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Pixie75 said:


> I don't have a garden! It's not my style


Pix- I never used to have one either and was always waxed regular then I stopped cos I was worried the waxing might affect my eggs etc but I think I'm gonna go again. Do you wax? sorry to be personal but need some guidance on the bush situation


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Pix- I never used to have one either and was always waxed regular then I stopped cos I was worried the waxing might affect my eggs etc but I think I'm gonna go again. Do you wax? sorry to be personal but need some guidance on the bush situation  
[/quote]

What no garden? Mine is like the bleeding Eden Project!!


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

ARGHHHHHH - just lost a post  

Nix - can't stop thinking about the big pussy cats   Good luck with the new career hun, i'm sure you'll be able to turn your hand to anything you decide on  

Ally - glad i'm not the only one with a big fat pussy  

Jal - good luck with starting your t/x hun  

Pix - i'm sure you've had a prick in that area more than once, shouldn't be leaving a bruise though  

Anne - do these headaches eventually go away   i take my 50g DHEA with breakfast and by lunch the headache is cutting in, by evening it's hard to even concentrate on the TV, focussing is really difficult  

Hazelnut - of course you are welcome hun, looking forward to seeing how you get on with t/x  

Sam - hope your meal was a success  

Mag - welcome  

Purple - hope today goes ok in oxford, i'll be thinking of you  

Zuri -  

Tracey - enjoy your pasta tonight hun   Would love to join you on the 1st, not sure i'll be able to make it though, meeting another FF in bristol on the 28th, it would mean i'd be on the M4 all weekend   Will let you know  

 to everyone xx


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Hey Hotsh1t 73! -  at punani! Ah, gone are the days when I could use such terminology freely without fear of being understood by unsuspecting white people! Ali G's got a lot to answer for...   Mind you the french word for it is pretty funny - foufounette! Sounds like a little cuddly toy dunnit?!



Anne G said:


> Pixie75 said:
> 
> 
> > I don't have a garden! It's not my style
> ...


Pix shall henceforth be known as "baldie"  Mind you I got rid of mine too, don't like having hairy bits!

And Anne I'm sorry hon but  what the hell have you been doing with the wax that it could affect your eggs?!

Ah Fishy's back and I see the pussy theme is continuing! Oh well, makes a change from poo i suppose!

God I love this thread!   

xxx


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Anne: Anne I had a few sessions of laser done on that area hun and that sorted it out but it was a while ago before I had IF!



fishface said:


> Pix - i'm sure you've had a prick in that area more than once, shouldn't be leaving a bruise though


Fish: What makes you think I'm not a virgin honey?  

Ally:


Ally1973 said:


> What no garden? Mine is like the bleeding Eden Project!!


   you'd better sort that out before starting your "bid d**k" protocol honey!

xxxx


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Fishy- Today I seem to have no headache but I think they usually come on around evening time after I've had a day at work on the PC I guess. I am on 75mg. I take 1 3 times a day
xx

Nix- I was woried that having em all yanked out might efffect things but I wnna be a smoothie again now.  hurts like hell though dunnit


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Girls - i am now imagining you all as baldies, how the hell can i meet you face to face


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Going hairless is all well and good but how do you deal with the regrowth


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

the itchyness! Ants in your pants


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> Pix shall henceforth be known as "baldie"  Mind you I got rid of mine too, don't like having hairy bits!


  look who's calling me baldie!



Anne G said:


> Pix- I never used to have one either and was always waxed regular then I stopped cos I was worried the waxing might affect my eggs etc but I think I'm gonna go again. Do you wax? sorry to be personal but need some guidance on the bush situation


I don't have that problem you see Anne cos i have no eggs!!  

xxx


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Fishy- Still displaying the garden at the moment hun    

Alls- waxed growth is not bad at all- all nice and smooth and no prickly bits - yes that's prickly bits not pricky bits


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Afraid im a wimp on waxing the bush girls, gotta be hair removal cream for me  

Ally - regrowth dont itch with the cream hunny  

Anne think my dh is part german as he loves a hairy bush   However now we're married he gets what he's given    

Hi fishy hunny how u doing? Think headaches eventually go hun, just takes a while   

Be back later gotta go give customer a price


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

kate- Make sure you don't quote your customer on anything bush related after all this bush chat


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Just told my work colleague about you baldie girls, that gave him a  

Rather stick to tweezers myself


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ooo fishy now that does sound painful -  ouchy ouchy  

Anne - customers! can they not see how busy i am on the pc 

Jal well done on the scan hunny - oh the memories of menopur have i've missed it...NOT.   Good luck hunny


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

fishface said:


> Just told my work colleague about you baldie girls, that gave him a


you did what??

OMG!! Nix we are famous!!


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Fishy- I have just crossed my legs on the thought of tweezers


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

..... We are the Bushless Wonders


----------



## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

This has made me laugh! You're hairy Marys! 
I trim then use an epilator to keep a neat triangle, stings a bit   but saves me having to shlep out to get wax.
Its not very dignified having everything on show, the least I can do is keep well groomed  
Anna x


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

sobroody1 said:


> I trim then use an epilator to keep a neat triangle


Designer bush!   very good Anna!


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

I hate pubes poking out of womens swimsuit uuuggghhhhhhh makes me want to throw - do they not realise how disgusting it looks!  Not they i look to see if women have pubes poking out u understand   its just that some are so long u cant help but trip over them


----------



## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

That;s why shorts are a good invention....


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

yes, I've seen some of those ladies with pubes so long that you could almost platt 'em


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Oh my   just heard on the radio kim marsh's little boy born at 22 weeks and has sadly died    How awful


----------



## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

I remember a girl at school in a leotard who had long pubes sticking out of her leotard....scarred me for life!


----------



## Jal (Jun 11, 2008)

went off for an hour and its all gone mad with talk of gardening  !!

Gave me a good old             

Left it too late to do mine today so had to get the razor out quickly - not looking forward to that regrowth!


----------



## Ourturn (Oct 8, 2008)

Slycett - how sad ....real life mirroring the Maria storyline...poor thing


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Kate- Just heard too- how awful. Bless them and their little Angel


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne makes me so sad    Poor girl i cant imagine what she must be going through, does not bear thinking about


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

I feel so so terrible now, Kim Marsh was on my list of women I hated recently for being pregnant at the drop of a hat (even though ultimately I love her), along with Sian Williams etc   SO sorry Kim, really I am.


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Alls- I didn't know she was preggers. Don't feel bad hunny


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Tracey - just wanted to pass something about immunes I found on to you:

http://www.earlypregnancy.org/EPBM/EPBM%20IV/Vol.%20IV,%20Num%202/EPBM1288.htm

I am off to see Dr Gorgy tomorrow after my scan as I don't think the Lister are interested in giving me any information or support on this. If I say to Jaya should I be on such and such for my thyroid she just replies - I will write you a prescription. It is like she is not willing to give her opinion on what I should do but if I suggest it she will give it to me! So just to complicate matters I am going to get my immune support from somewhere else, just can't see the point in doing all this if I don't cover all bases.

TMI warning.....I have been having loads of EWCM since Tuesday, the pain in my ovaries got so bad last night and then today it has subsided and CM also plus now my nipples are painful which I usually get after ovulation. Could I have ovulated prematurely even through the suppressant meds?

Thank God for FF or I would forget to do my pre scan tidy up - the topic seems to come up conveniently just before each of my scans. I'm with Kate on the cream though, too scared of waxing. Had to go bald when I had my appendix out many years ago and the regrowth itching was worse than the op!

Haven't seen anyone's news today apart from your pruning methods so sorry if have missed anything. Will try and catch up properly later.

Oh did see something about March 1st - I would love to come and meet everyone!

Just seen 8 posts since I started this- god how sad for Kim Marsh. Awful.

Missy xx

/links


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Who put that little face with the raised eyebrow on my post? I didn't!! Is there a post ghost??


----------



## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Just had a nice snooze on the sofa for a few hours come back, checked the updated threads and find 4 pages about the state of each of your bushes!   it's put a smile back on my face

Mine's neatly manicured and hubby takes great pride in taking care if his garden   

x


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Züri said:


> Mine's neatly manicured and hubby takes great pride in taking care if his garden
> 
> x


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

glad we've made you    Zuri xx


----------



## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

i am a disgrace nothing waxed or pruned for about 5 weeks and situation getting dire. meant to get all waxed before started injecting and scans and didnt quite get round to it oops!!! 

feeling so bad think i might have to wip out the diy wax later??!  not sure is fair to my clinic not to!

missyg see this on the CM http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=172325.0 (sorry dont think i have to post link like that not sure how to do it)
seems it can stop and doesnt mean you have ovulated and is also ok if you dont get any?


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Ally - hunny its normal to hate to pregnant women    especially with what we have to put up with sometimes, bumps everywhere, comments from everyone, adverts for nappies, newborn babies everywhere the list is endless sweetheart, so dont beat urself up about it  

Almond - i had a lovely bath last night and defuzzed legs and underarms, lady garden tonight or tomorrow   

Zuri - glad we made u smile hunny bun    

Missy - glad u've joined me on the cream hun, was starting to think i was the only wimp on here   Is ur next scan tomoz petal?

Hi sobroody - wow ur brave dont those epilators pull quite a bit 

Anne - where you off to for jasons birthday hunny?


----------



## Ocelot Cub (Mar 31, 2008)

Kate - thanks hon   I do feel bad though, maybe a good time to stop being bitter!! 

Missy - you typed 3 x ? that makes that   - click it and you will see! I had to work that one out as I kept getting it!!


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

kate- Off to this place in Wales- went in december 2007 and it was beautiful. Was meant to be a suprise for him but he's having a rough time at work at the mo so told him last night 
http://www.ffynnontownhouse.com/?gclid=CInwveKm15gCFZiT3wod8wF7cQ

/links


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Thanks almond that is really helpful! I just did a ovulation stick and nothing came up at all which made me conclude that it is over but having just read all that I am going to try not to panic. 

Yes Kate my scan is tomorrow so now I have to pray they are still there. My use of cream is also down to complete lack of organization and last minute panics. Ah I like being called petal!

Oh thanks Ally the mystery is solved! I am so gullible you could have told me anything!

xx


----------



## TryMeditate (Sep 19, 2008)

Hello dear ladies and baldies!! This is going to be a shorty - just like my bush  

Just wanted to give you all a big hug, and a huge thanks. Thanks to your girls - I DID - have a lovely evening last night with DH. And from now on, i've decided to try to remember the "***** of light coming through the clouds" - thanks for that purple     . you are so right, we just don't know what life holds for us, something really positive maybe just around the corner.  Whenever I was feeling down, I reminded myself of that. We had a nice time, and I even managed to laugh a bit 

Pix & Nix - always freaks me out a little, these hairless ladies   Don't you need something to protect yourself a little against DHs hairs when you are bumping uglies?

Pix - I too did the laser thing about 8 years ago..... oooouucchhh.  I went to the cheapest bucket shop possible on Queensway to get it done, and as I had a rather high hairline, they went all over where my ovaries are... this is one of the things I have on my looonnggg list of things I did to myself that have zapped my ovaries   Please don't worry yourself about this ok, my list is very long and it also includes wearing too tight jeans that cut the blood supply off to my ovaries, an operation, exposure to chemicals, excess coffee and stress, total lack of excersise and sitting at my desk all day for years, a virus I had (the Nora Virus) in Jan 2008, radiation from all the flying I had to do, the fact that where I went to uni was "reportedly" near a toxic waste dump - totally unproven, being a smoker,  and a few other things I did that I'm not going to mention I did in public.  

Missy - I'm thinking the same about immunes tx, I know the lister are not keen on it.  I do have to say, I'm going to get mine retested and get another opinion before I take any hardcore medication.... My TFN cells were only just above the range, but ok my other baddy CD5+CD19 (NK cells) were double the range  .  I'm not 100% convinced it's my issue, but if I have another mc, or if I'm lucky enough to get to ET a couple of times, I will absolutely go into it ....................but I do know the ARGC makes a lot of money out of it.  Which CM is EWCM?  If it is the "thin watery" one, you get that when your estrogen is high \ peaking- which coincides with ovulation in a normal cycle in a normal woman , but it doesn't mean you have ovulated.  It could be just all your follies are giving off lots of estrogen because they are big and there are lots of them. So it's a good thing.

LJ - did you ever get that book I recommended to you which has a fab section on CM?

Just wanted to let you know my big news - AF arrived!!!! Finally the stupid beatch! Why is it that I've been begging her not to come for a year, then when I want her to come (as there was no BMS this month) she damn well won't! Now, must work on getting a regular cycle again.........

I have to go.... I won't be online much today - boo hoo.

LOL Sam xxx

Sam xxx


----------



## missyg (Jan 2, 2009)

Hooray for your AF Sam!   

EWCM is egg white cervical mucus!!


----------



## fishface (Jun 17, 2008)

Anne - that looks lovely, i'm so jealous  

Sam - whoopppeeee, the witch has appeared  , pleased for you hun   Glad you had a lovely evening, you needed it  

Pix - i can tell the whole office if you'd like your famousness extended


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Sam -  yayyyyyy about time af turned up hunny    Glad you had a nice time last night and i couldnt agree with you more on letting IF take us over, yes it does   I intend to enjoy myself this weekend and do as much shagging as possible knowing there is no chance as af will have only just finished   

Missy - good luck for ur scan tomoz (petal)   Hope its good news again


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

yep, can't wait Fishy. As Kate was saying, I need to try and get a bit of the old Anne back- the happy and relaxed (and fun!) version - pre all this IF crap xx

Sam- Yay


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Missy: I had the same thing on my cycle hun - lots of EWCM from day 10 till 13 but it was all fine so don't panic.

Anne: Ahhhh how nice for you guys. You are a lovely couple. 



sam22 said:


> Pix - I too did the laser thing about 8 years ago..... oooouucchhh. I went to the cheapest bucket shop possible on Queensway to get it done, and as I had a rather high hairline, they went all over where my ovaries are... this is one of the things I have on my looonnggg list of things I did to myself that have zapped my ovaries  Please don't worry yourself about this ok, my list is very long and it also includes wearing too tight jeans that cut the blood supply off to my ovaries, exposure to chemicals, excess coffee and stress, total lack of excersise and sitting at my desk all day for years.


Yes I did all of those things too Sam! Laser only goes 1 layer down of the skin though but I still stopped getting it done since I found out about IF - bit too late I guess! 

Did you see my doc's comment on EPP? He didn't rate it 

  for your AF arriving.

Fish: Would you like me to send you a picture?  

x


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Anne - just had a nose - wow hun that looks gorgeous, which room u goin in?


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Kate- Would you believe we are in the Myfannwy


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

sam22 said:


> Pix & Nix - always freaks me out a little, these hairless ladies  Don't you need something to protect yourself a little against DHs hairs when you are bumping uglies?


Hehe! The donkey shaves too so it's all good! 

Now missus I'm pleased that AF finally decided to show her face, rotten cow! But I hope you're joking about your list of "things that you did to zap your ovaries". I'm sure that the majority of women have done one or several of those things and they're not _all _suffering from fertility problems! Hon if your ovaries have decided to give you grief it is NOT because of anything you did or didn't do! It's just pure bad [email protected] luck!

It is bad enough going thru the hell of if without burdening ourselves with the misconception that somehow it's our own fault... God knows I've even pulled ZW up about this one, when she started with her crap about how we're all selfish career women who've left it too late on purpose. We need to give ourselves a break. We're already surrounded by ignorant people telling us if we just relax it'll happen and crap like that so I feel we owe it to ourselves to acknowledge that we haven't brought this on ourselves at all. So Sam, and everyone, whaddaysay, can we make a deal? No more of that "I did this to myself"? Cos we didn't!

xxx


----------



## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Nix - im with ya hunny i've had enough guilt in my life an i dont need anymore.  However sometimes when that little devils on me shoulder it sometimes comes creeping back  

Anne - you lucky girl  It looks gorgeous hunny hope you have a fab time   if u know what i mean


----------



## Züri (Feb 7, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> I've even pulled ZW up about this one, when she started with her crap about how we're all selfish career women who've left it too late on purpose.


Are you kidding me? is this what she thinks/says? this really infuriates me - some women don't meet their ideal partners until their in their 30's i got married at 30 and started trying at 31 so am I a selfish career woman? grrrrrrrrrrr sorry that's just really hit a nerve 

P.S Wish I had a career left to be selfish about!!


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

ZWest can shove her opinions right up her **** 
I didn't meet Jas till I was 36
Silly beatch


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Züri said:


> Nixf01 said:
> 
> 
> > I've even pulled ZW up about this one, when she started with her crap about how we're all selfish career women who've left it too late on purpose.
> ...


don't get me started!



Anne G said:


> Kate- Would you believe we are in the Myfannwy


Now why doesn't this surprise me...?!    I just went and had a look at Myfanwy.. it looks very nice


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Anne G said:


> ZWest can shove her opinions right up her


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Sam - I think you are so right on your observations on what "works" being evident in results.  This goes back to your previous point about clinics publishing results by FSH/AMH/previous poor response results as well as age.  CHR does say that most of its "younger" patients (under 3  have been rejected by other clinics and told to go direct for DE.  If that is the case, their results are impressive.  And their results for those 40 plus are certainly impressive.  But, as you have said before, you can't really tell until you have more detailed data.  A 40 year old who is only receiving IVF/ICSI because of MFI could throw things off.  Sorry you were distracted during CDS and I am really glad you had a decent evening last night.  You had seemed so low the past few days I was worried.  And yes I did get the natural way to better babies book so thanks!  I can see your point about TCM and natural conception possibly being the way forward for you.  As you know, I have often wondered if my sister was rushed along to IVF too soon, especially since I have discovered that she and her DH (both hopelessly unbiological) were doing the deed at totally the wrong times.  You would have thought someone would have asked them about this but no!  I know she got a great result with IVF but I wonder what would have happened if someone had looked beyond her FSH.  

Jal - pleased you are off and pleased they have upped your dose; I think you should do really well this cycle!

Mag - really sorry for what you have been through.  As others have said, your AMH really isn't that bad.  Anne was right - it is about 0.88 on the ng/ml scale and this is certainly within the norms (if low end) according to most modern scales.  Also, it really isn't everything just like FSH.  Ladyverte (Lucy) has lower AMH than you and she responded just fine on her cycle.  My sister was the same - high FSH but ok response.  See the below link for an AMH scale from the US.


On clinics, I really would head for the Lister if you want the best in terms of possible poor response although we don't actually know how you will respond!  My sister was with Manchester CARE and she did fine so that is a northern option.  However, you have to bear in mind that she didn't end up being a poor responder.
      
Catherine - I doubt DHEA would cause your E2 to go that high but I don't really know.  sorry I can't help.

Zuri - I am so sorry about your blood test.  Give yourself some time sweetie.

Purple - I hope work is ok.

Pixie - my fellow baldie!!  I too head for hollywood regularly!

Nix - wise words on the guilt trip.  I hate the blame game on this.  It does nobody any good.  Oddly, I also feel for the poor women in their 20s suffering from IF because they are often not taken seriously.  I think my sister would be a prime target fo ZW's wrath since she did meet her DH early and was married in her 20s.  however, he didn't want children and they only started trying when he changed his mind.  I don't think it was selfish of her to sacrifice her own desires and not quietly go off the pill and have a child by a father who didn't want it.                

Tracey - hope you are ok.

Anne - why on earth did you think waxing would damage your eggs  the things we women get paranoid about!!!

Fishy - sorry about the headaches; hope someone can help.

Beachy - hello

love to every else.  Hoping Bobbi and Natasha are ok - haven't seen them for a bit!


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Hi LJ- I guess I was just worried about having that "area" messed about with- if that makes sense?
But hey ho - bush or no bush it didn't help me last cycle   
How are you?
xx


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

I've just come back from a coffee break - what's the debate about ZW? Is she a baldie too?


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

My take on ZW is that she means well and actually talks a lot of sense in terms of optimising your lifestyle for fertility.  However, I think she tends to have a couple of blind spots.  First, she's always banging on about how women should have babies first and building their careers later; not going to happen Zita - employers are not too thrilled to take on someone who has to leave at 5 every day to collect a child from daycare.  Second, she has no idea about the need and importance of the right partner who may not appear when you are 25.  I shudder to think about the hassle my ex would have given me if we had had children.


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

forgot to add I am fine thanks Anne and I am so pleased AF has arrived Sam!


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Pixie75 said:


> I've just come back from a coffee break - what's the debate about ZW? Is she a baldie too?


    yeah but only cos me, Anne Zuri and Kate grabbed her and pulled all her hair out by the roots   
xxx


----------



## Little Me (Aug 29, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> yeah but only cos me, Anne Zuri and Kate grabbed her and pulled all her hair out by the roots
> xxx


Hair on her head we hasten to add


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> Pixie75 said:
> 
> 
> > I've just come back from a coffee break - what's the debate about ZW? Is she a baldie too?
> ...


Good for you girls! I never liked the beatch  

Hi lovely LJ  xx


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

Anne G said:


> Nixf01 said:
> 
> 
> > yeah but only cos me, Anne Zuri and Kate grabbed her and pulled all her hair out by the roots
> ...


   
I'm still buying her poxy multi-vits though, she got me in the end!


----------



## purple72 (Jul 25, 2008)

You ladies are hilarious!!!!    

Thanks for all the kind thoughts today, work was fine actually, all that worry for nothing   

Can't stop as off to pilates and need to try and get on with making DH's valentine card

Love to all you baldies and hairies, me I have a small landing strip on top but bald underneath find it so much cleaner!

Sam glad you had a nice meal hun

Zuri sorry it wasn't best news

Hugs to all

Sx


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

LittleJenny said:


> My take on ZW is that she means well and actually talks a lot of sense in terms of optimising your lifestyle for fertility. However, I think she tends to have a couple of blind spots. First, she's always banging on about how women should have babies first and building their careers later; not going to happen Zita - employers are not too thrilled to take on someone who has to leave at 5 every day to collect a child from daycare. Second, she has no idea about the need and importance of the right partner who may not appear when you are 25. I shudder to think about the hassle my ex would have given me if we had had children.


You got it LJ! Such a shame cos apart from that she pretty much talks a lot of sense but she really did put her foot in it with that interview in the Daily m*** (hate that rag!) She went there about not starting early enough and then compounded it by sounding almost patronising the women who turn up at her clinic with bags full of various vitamin supplements and stuff. That was when I lost it! When I spoke to her I basically said (among other things) "well surely you can see that you contribute to that, with your recommended daily vit intake that exceeds the accepted RDA"... which she flatly denied so we agreed to differ! As you say Jen, it's like a blind spot with her, she really can't see it...


----------



## Pixie75 (Sep 27, 2008)

Nixf01 said:


> When I spoke to her I basically said (among other things) "well surely you can see that you contribute to that, with your recommended daily vit intake that exceeds the accepted *RDA*"...


errr what's that? I'm taking her vits too - she's not poisoning us is she?


----------



## Jumanji (Feb 13, 2008)

Pix - I think her vitamins are actually very good although I personally take Marilyn Glenville's which are pretty much the same!  Remember RDAs are pretty conservative and your body is pretty good at getting rid of what it doesn't need.  don't worry!


----------



## almond (Mar 20, 2008)

Nix I remember a while ago there was a thread on FF about ZW and that mail article and someone spoke to her on the phone about it. was it you? good on you was seriously impressed at the time. I agree that she talks a lot of sense but that mail stuff was offensive and downright unhelpful (have never actually seen the article but read about it on here).


----------



## Han72 (Feb 15, 2007)

almond said:


> Nix I remember a while ago there was a thread on FF about ZW and that mail article and someone spoke to her on the phone about it. was it you?


Yup, that was me! Coo I really am famous! And not just for being bald...   



Pixie75 said:


> errr what's that? I'm taking her vits too - she's not poisoning us is she?


Nah, she's not poisoning us! It's just that basically none of the regular brands combines all the different types of vits and minerals in the quantities that she feels are necessary. Her stuff is quite expensive, so people read her books, take a note of everything she says and end up buying tons of different ones to try and make up her recommended amounts, which is why she has people turning up at her office with bagfuls of bottles and pills and whatnot. That was why it wound me up when she mentioned it. It's partly down to her own recommendations that women do this and the only way around it is to fork out and buy her stuff!
xxx


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

Hi all
Has anyone been told they are going through an early menopause ? My previous clinic has called me and advised me to not try more IVf as my fsh 11.7 and AMH 6.4 - they reckon early menopause - sounds horrendous....x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Yes, I was, Bunjy! Just before the cycle that got me Robert...

Sorry to be brief gals - will read back and post later!

xxx


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

I have an appt a the lister on 19th feb but just feel so bloody flat...like giving up - just totally fed up with appts, misery and tests....with my results is it likely I would have to go abroad to pursue treatment - I know I'm jumping the gun but I need to have some direction other than life with a goldfish and cat x


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

Bunjy, it is less liekly for you than the average 22 year old sure. 

but the early menopause business is rubbish. 

women get pg every day with those numbers.


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

It gets on my tits that every doctor tells me different and i have to keep paying them for the honour...couldn't face turning into my mum at 33yrs ... would be hellish for me and pets - any advice gladly accepted x


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## shortie66 (Feb 6, 2008)

Bunjy - im sorry hunny     dont give tho go to ur app at the lister and see what they say


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I'd go abroad again Bunj - really I wouldn't touch a UK clinic with a bargepole again. It's so nice when they know your name and treat you with respect. And it's great to simply focus on tx while you're doing it - someone else to do the cleaning cooking and crap.

Plus, for the price of a cycle here you can stay at a lovely hotel and have massages and stuff! Lovely jubbly.

Book now! That'll stop you feeling flat.

xx


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## Bunjy (Jan 25, 2007)

hi Miranda7
Can you tell me more details on your treatment abraod - how did you organise it ? did you do a package deal with treatment and accomm ? sounds like alot to organise ? let me know x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Have a look round the clinics abroad section and decide which one you like the look of - if it turns out to be the Jinemed I can help you!

But there are lots with lots of people who recommend them.

It's not that much hassle - I agreed a price beforehand and then it was a matter of booking the time off work and the flights and Bob's your uncle. (Well strictly speaking he's me dad and me boy, but there you go).

It was a lot less hassle for me, anyway - I found the Lister impressive but very stressful, driving from the westcountry every two days and having an endless stream of different consultants for everything.


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

no it should not.....
but for you, Id certianly keep on top of it. 
and don't be sad. you and we all will get there (eventuully admittedly in my case!)


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Pauline - I was there for 18 days. It's that short because even if they downregulate you, you'd do that here then fly out for stims and scans. But for most PRs they would have you on the short protocol anyway, so you'd just fly out on day 2 of your period and go for it.

Whatever clinic you choose, do email them your history first, so you don't get to wanting to go somewhere and they say they won't treat you with your smear results - there's nothing worse than setbacks like that.

Right - I STILL haven't read back, as I keep getting distracted by household chores!

I hope everyone's ok.

xxxx


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## annacameron (Dec 16, 2008)

Id say a clear medical indicator for going abroad is if you feel you might have poor egg quality and therefore want a chcnace of more trying to implant to get the one good one. 

oh and the cost, sunshine, better care etc. 

PS Miranda, did you know mr Taranissi says that cycling ove rthe summer in the UK is much better than any other time? there is somtheing in that i'm sure. you alwasy feel more alive in the summer dont you?


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## dakota (Feb 6, 2007)

New home this way.....http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=177971.0


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