# 3rd BFN today - what do i do?



## jessamine (Aug 23, 2008)

Absolutely gutted to have another BFN and to make it worse AF hasn't arrived so I feel like my hopes had been raised even higher as she always gave a sign of some sort on my last two tx's.

Before I went for et this time the embryologist said that he would culture my remaining embies for a further 24 hours to see if they suffer from arrest as I have never had anything good enough to freeze.  Also the embies that went back this time were identical to tx 2 a 4 cell and a 5 cell grade 1 and 1-.  On my first tx I only had 2 4 cells but again good quality at grade 1.  I interpreted him as saying that if they do suffer from arrest then that is it, if they don't divide surely they can't make a baby?  I may however be wrong in my interpretation as I a quite pesimistice if I am honest.  In view of this I want to get my follow up appointment sooner rather than later as he said he would make sure his findings went in my notes.

Can anyone think of anything I should ask other than the usual?  Does anyone know if there is anything that can be done to prevent embryo arrest?  am I flogging a dead horse?

can't cry properly at the moment, this IVF stuff sure is tough.


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## saphy75 (Mar 15, 2004)

so sorry you have got another BFn hun    and sorry i can't help with your question   i hope you get some answers soon 

pam xx


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## LuuLuu (Jul 15, 2008)

Jessamine

I know exactly how you feel - I'm only on BFN number 2 but its enough to make you wonder why such good embies haven't worked.  The embryologist was really pleased with mine this time.  However, we wanted to see if we could get to blast, but couldn't because the clinic is shut on a Sunday.  Am so cross about that.  I'm sure its either embryo arrest or an implantation issue but my Consultant said last time he wouldn't recommend any more tests until I'd had 3 BFNs.  Don't know if I want to keep putting myself through this til he'll do that.  Can do a FET in June I think but why should I have the heartbreak.

I'm really going to try to push for a hysteroscopy or a lap n dye at my follow up I think.

Really think I should be having NKc tests too etc.

Hope you are 'getting there' - have you had your follow up appt through yet  I am just waiting a call back but I know they won't give me one til AF has arrived - grrr!!!


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## jessamine (Aug 23, 2008)

Hi Luuluu - so sorry to hear your news I was convinced the result would be what we were all hoping for.

I had my follow up yesterday and it was as I thought.  The embies that they cultured for a further 24 hours did not divide again so it appears that they do suffer from arrest and that the only way forward for me really is to go down the donor egg route.  Because I have severe endo it is likely that it has affected my egg quality.  I was confused about that as I had always got grade 1's but apparently that is to do with the quality of the cells rather than the embryo itself, if that makes sense.

I really don't know what to do now, dh is very supportive and wants to discuss our options but I am frightened to bring it up as I am worried I will make the wrong choice.  Part of me really wants to try DE but another part of me can't get past the fact that it won't be my child.  My consultant did say that by having DE it would help them see for certain if it was my egg quality or a sperm issue by the way that divide and also I suppose they can compare mine and the donors embryos.

I really wish I could give you some helpful advice.  I figure that the fact that you have been able to get some frosites must mean your quality is good so perhaps, and I know this is hard, it is just a case of luck and that next time will be your time.  I really hope it goes well for you and do let me know how you get on at your follow up as I would be truly interested, take care.


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## LuuLuu (Jul 15, 2008)

Hi Jessamine

I know the donor egg thing is a tough one to get your head round and its a totally personal choice.  You have to go with your gut feel.  You will know soon if you are ready to go down that path.  I do know they work hard to ensure the donor has similar physical characteristics though and my gut says that if you are carrying a child for 9 months, it will feel like yours!!!  And when you first hold that child, you will have no doubts.

I know a girl on the Chester board who is expecting a child through DE and Spanish law allows the donors to be anonymous too so there is not the worry of a comeback in the future that there is with UK donors.  

I guess now you have to consider all the options and go with what you feel most comfortable with.  I think it is fab that your Fertility Unit has been able to identify embryo arrest as the issue because at least you don't have to repeatedly go through heartbreaking BFNs wondering if that is the reason.  Doesn't make it any easier to deal with I know but I know you would hate to have to go through this several more times if that is the issue.  I'm confused as to how you can have grade 1 cells but not grade 1 embies    

As soon as you are strong enough, have that discussion with DH - he sounds amazing and the choice you make will be the right one at the time.

We have 9 frosties - 8 simply because they were frozen on Day 1 so we don't know the quality.  The 9th was frozen on day 2 so I'm hoping that's a promising sign.  I'm definitely insisting on a later transfer this time so we can look at whether that is an issue.  I'm also going to push for more tests - if I don't get them this time round, at least they'll know how much I want them if we have to go through another BFN.  Like you I'm     we have just been unlucky so far but I want to cover all bases.

Definitely keep in touch - its really good to support each other.

Take care.

LuuLuu


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## ljo (Jul 1, 2008)

Jessamine

I'm sorry that it has been so hard for you. 

I was wondering if you have ever had any blood tests or hair sample tests to check if your nutrition levels are where they should be?

I had all this done before my 1st IVF in 2006 and I spent some time getting my nutrition levels right before I actually started treatment. I was fortunate enough to be successful in my 1st cycle with boy and girl twins.

However, since then I have had two BFNs even though they have transferred blastocysts - and I just had my levels checked again and it seems that I am so deficient in zinc that this is a real probable cause why my last two IVFs didn't work. This has been despite me taking pregnancy vitamins and a separate zinc vitamin for almost a year.

On a post I published recently, another site member suggested that Pine Bark Extract (Pycnogenol) can help with egg and sperm quality as it helps destroy free radicals. I have since had this confirmed by a nutrionalist and on her suggestion I take 120gm a day and my husband 200gm (100gm in morning and 100g at night with meals). 

The nutrionalist also suggested Progreens by Nutricology which I take first thing in the morning to help alkalinese my womb, help with egg quality etc. Another thing I'm going to do on her suggestion is take Whey to Go by Solgar (vanilla flavour has the least sugar) during my stimulation phase to help strengthen the eggs.

My sister and I also have endo - my sister took DHEA to strengthen her eggs. I have noticed a number of postings in the endo pages where women have taken different drugs to strengthen their eggs too.

Another site member with endo recently wrote to me telling me how after 3 IVF failures she had the blood flow to her womb checked with a scan. It proved she was having trouble with blood flow and when this was corrected she conceived on her 4th IVF.

I hope some of this might help.

Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

Ljo


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## topaz7 (Aug 10, 2008)

*jessamine* -   I remember you from the Ladies in Waiting thread back in January. I'm so so sorry to see you've had another BFN and that your consultant is recommending DE. 
My consultant told me that the eggs are engines and if these aren't good, then pg won't happen. He told me to try again and then perhaps think about DE. I think it's a hard thing to think about so soon after a cycle. Give yourself some breathing room.   

Good luck!

xxx


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