# biospy results



## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

girls i have high levels on uNK CELLS

the upper limit is 5% and my reading is 6.2%, need to get home to read the letter

i have a telephone consultation on thursday!

im kinda pleased something was found


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Kara I've missed the info on these tests - are you doing Beer testing then? Is the telephone consult with Chicago or with Liverpool? Hope it gives you the answers you want
C
xxx


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

You have something you can put right now then Kara


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

this is a call to liverpool

its not full immune testing this is a biospy taken from the uterus and not blood taken from the arm ( like chicago tests)

steriods is thought to be the treatment, i will know more on thursday


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Will Cardiff be willing to work with you on the steroids as well?


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

siheilwli said:


> Will Cardiff be willing to work with you on the steroids as well?


yes i spoke to JE before i even went for the biospy as i didn't wana throw hundreds of pounds away if they wouldn't support us, saying that they are non believer in immune issues as many are


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## lola C (Jun 16, 2007)

I hope this means you get some answers at last Kara and a possible solution too.  XX Good luck for Thursday - have you done your questions list yet?


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Fantastic Kara, that's why I think Cardiff are great, they are completely willing to work with us, not against us.


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i am building my questions lol

only have 5 at the moment


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## lola C (Jun 16, 2007)

Only 5 - but you are the queen of questions - I bet you have a pair of Anne Robinson specs - would you dare tell JE 'You are the weakest link - goodbye!!!!"?


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

lola that would be so funny, i think i would get away with it

im sure i will think of many more


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

I wrote a long long list of what I wanted for this cycle, printed it out and gave it to her... and it's now in my file... and everyone checked it every time I went in! Felt a right bossy boots - but I'm pretty convinced you're worse than me !


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

me worse than you 

nah never lol well maybe a little

i think our bodies tell us so much and i have learnt to listen to my intuition and so far its been right, not sure i would go down the IVIG road but never say never


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

thats just added another question lol


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Have you read Beer's book, what I don't get is why there's less talk about LIT than IVIG, when the book quite clearly puts emphasis on both. Is it because USA don't do LIT - I think it may be illegal there and people have to go to Mexico to get Lit done or something.

I feel exactly the same about IVIG - I am very nervous of it, and want to see more tests / proof of it working.


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

yeah i have the book

IVIG does make me nervous but i do believe it can work for some, the only thing that makes me wonder if i should ask about her prescribing ivig is because i have taken steriods ( this is just a far off thought but i will be asking the question)

dr quenby at liverpool says why use ivig when steriods work!

i have taken low dose dexemethsone before the she use a higher dose and a steriod called Prednisone, im kinda hoping that the lower dose didn't lower the levels enough and the stronger steriod will do the trick


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## Laura36 (Jun 27, 2007)

Wow Cat & Kara you're talking another language!!  That all sounds so complicated.

Glad your results have come through and that your telephone consulation is so soon.  Sorry probably being really   but does this mean you still need the lap or can you move onto a new cycle?


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

It does seem from postings here that steroids do the biz. Hope it's all you need,
Cat
x


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

yeah and the steriods she uses are stronger than what ive tried

ivig is like last chance saloon


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

my questions for tonights telephone consulatation

1. what does a level of 6.2 tell you?

2. Did you test for the 16+/- marker? am i right it think the 16+ is killing power?what does this tell you

3. What makes nk cells high?

4. Could this be the reason for recurrent implantation failure?

5.Would you prescribe anything other than steriods? humria/IVIg?

6.what presentage would the steriods lower the nk cells by?

7.would 0.75mg of dexamethsone been too little to have an impact on the nk cells

8.what is the different between dexamethsone and prednisone?

9. when would i start the steriods, at stimms, ec or et, bear in mind i will be having blastocyst transfer? can i start on stimms day 6?

10.Should i start taking fish oils?

11.Can i have a copy of your analyse?

12. Do you do any other immune test?

13, would you advise any?


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Good luck Kara


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## Lou F ❁ (Feb 28, 2003)

Kara do u want to borrow my new specs for your chat to Doc Quimby !!!!
let me know how u get on wont ya 
xx


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## Fidget (Jan 27, 2005)

Kermie.......... what are you doing over here   

(ohhh I need to spk to you about where your staying for the rats burpday   )


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i would love your new specs, just hope i don't have to talk to diane the cow


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## Lou F ❁ (Feb 28, 2003)

lol mmm still not heard from diane so i guess i will ring after i have ov'd !!!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

they better agree to give me a copy of my results or i will really start to **** her off


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

lol kara great questions ..good luck for the phonecall


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

im losing my head now the doc still hasn't called back, she made a space for me between 430pm and 530pm and its now 5.39pm

i hate it when this happens ffs


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## Scouse (Aug 9, 2007)

Kara I hope you're on the phone right now!  I'm really interested in your answers............will help me when i ring the clinic!


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## Cath34 (Oct 14, 2008)

Best of luck Kara. Let us know x


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## Laura36 (Jun 27, 2007)

Have they called you yet?  That's so cr*p if they don't keep the appointment  

Hope it's gone well


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

im deffo not going for full immune tests



just had my telephone consultation and i feel happy with her advice



here is my questions and answers



1. what does a level of 6.2 tell you?



that i have raised nk cells but not too bad

2. Did you test for the 16+/- marker? am i right it think the 16+ is killing power?what does this tell you



she tested for cd 56 nk cells which were 6.2, the 16+marker is killing power and that value is 0.6.

3. What makes nk cells high?



they don't really know

4. Could this be the reason for recurrent implantation failure?



yes she thinks this is the reason

5.Would you prescribe anything other than steriods? humria/IVIg?



no , she can't do this even if i wanted it and then went on to say how because there is no proof at the moment she would advise against it, there is a dr in america that is doing a trial and the results are out at the start on next year and if IVIg is shown to work she will advise me to remortgage the house and go for it until then she feels it would be a waste. i agree with her on this.



she said the problem with lots of immune treatment is they are never sure which one worked.

6.what presentage would the steriods lower the nk cells by?



they will lower my levels to a safe value

7.would 0.75mg of dexamethsone been too little to have an impact on the nk cells



she said she was pleased knowing that i had only taken this dose as she thought i had a high dose, 0.75 wouldn't lower my nk cells

8.what is the different between dexamethsone and prednisone?



dexamethsone crossed the placenta and prednisone doesn't so less risk ( i always thought it was the other way round)

9. when would i start the steriods, at stimms, ec or et, bear in mind i will be having blastocyst transfer?



at tranfers, she doesn't wana stop any of the stickness of the lining which can happen with over use of steriods, she wants my hopefull good blast stick before the drugs kick in

10.Should i start taking fish oils?



yes this could be good

11.Can i have a copy of your analyse?



yes she will write with all details and will be in touch when the ivig study is done or when any other recurrant implantation proof is available, implantation is harder to solve than recurrent miscarriage

12. Do you do any other immune test?



not at the moment, this biospy is one good test rather than lots looking at the same thing. most cd56 cells in the blood system are cd56+16+ in the uterus most are cd56 16- its the +16 in the uterus that are the problem

13, would you advise any?



no


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

we spoke about removing my tube etc and she thinks it a very good idea

bring it on


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## Laura36 (Jun 27, 2007)

Excellent Kara, sounds like you got some great, clear answers to your questions.  
How are you feeling?? Positive about moving forward?  Just bring on your lap now then you can get going!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i feel very postive at the moment

im doing all i can for my next cycle and it feels good

bring on the lap, i want it now


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

kara.. i am so pleased you have got answers to all your questions now honey x you are moving along nicely, your next cycle will be like having IVF compleltely new and fresh again as so much has changed


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

yeah i do think its like starting all over again

i have answers and that makes me feel really quite proud of myself


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

oh girls at last i have plans woo hoo

while i am waiting i am gona lose a few pounds in prep for 20mg of prednisone yeah 20mg a day

im gona take omega fish oils (high strenght) folic acid and vitamin b12


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## Lou F ❁ (Feb 28, 2003)

if u lose any lb's i will be lucky to actually find u at Vincent Davies even in the odd xmas pressie dept !!!!
Glad u got some ansa's u will have to go through them next week when we meet for coffee b4 i go home


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

you not going then this week, poor you hun

monday is a good day for me next week

i have been reading dr beers book and it mentions fybromyalgia


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## Lou F ❁ (Feb 28, 2003)

Nah it seems we are gonna be here till next weekend Al's last working day is friday so monday is good for me too, and am sure Michelle will be up for a celebration piece of cake or something as scrummy   
I am gonna have to buy the book arnt i might order it in amazon and have it delivered for when i get home  
see u monday


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

get the book, it takes a few reads to get into it

chocolate cake i hope


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## Lou F ❁ (Feb 28, 2003)

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm chocie cake i may have to induldge !!!
right bed for me Al already snoring and now the  dog has started too !!!
see ya monday
Lou
x


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

bye for now trouble


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

wow kara you must be real pleased tonight after reading the answers i feel real happy that you have some answers at last   come on canellation so kara can have her op!!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i can't have a cancellation til i have a prep op!!!!! which could be feb time

i do feel pleased with her answers and really pleased i went and had it done


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## Laura36 (Jun 27, 2007)

Woohoo, your next tx is so going to be a BFP Kara!!!

Just think, lap in Feb/March, tx in April, BFP in May


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

wouldn't that be great

2009 will be our turn


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

sod the pre opp lol .... i do have a good feeling that 2009 is your year


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

thats what i thought, i said i would go for a pre op at the drop of a hat but she just said i will be called for pre op around feb

takes the **** really but not alot i can do, its been 3months since my bfn and i am itching to start now lol


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

im not suprised with what you know now you must be raring to go but enjoy the rest of the year and christmas i have a feeling you will be preggers next crimbo


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Are Liverpool prescribing the pred for you, and when are you starting?
Cat
x


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

liverpool are writing to me and clinic with doses etc

20mg a day starting at et


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

liverpool would prescribe it but i would have to go and pick up the script so i asked clinic if they would and they said yeah


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Sounds good Kara, it looks like you've got a cast iron plan on how to move forward now. I'm full of admiration.
C
xxx


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

got to start all vits now

im just pleased that they found something as silly as that sounds


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

I completely understand that. It gives you something to work with.


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

how you feeling hun?


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

Not bad actually today - bouncing back as always!!! DH and I had a good cwtsh and talk last night, and he's really keen on doing more tx... feels like we should do 3 proper try's before we give up.  I think maybe I should try steroids too, as with anti thyroid antibodies, it's got to be contributing to why not a   thing implants in me!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

high dose steriods?

glad your bouncing back mate

so no doubt you will have loads of questions for your follow up


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## siheilwli (Jan 18, 2006)

IF... I do another tx, I really want immune stuff investigated, I'm guessing it would be high dose- don't know enough about it yet. I think we're talking humira / clexane or heparin type stuff / pred. I don't want to do LIT or IVIG, for me it's a step too far, but equally I'm not sure I want to spend spend spend on this stuff, so I need to do a bit more homework and find out prices. Ideally maybe I could do this before using my frosties as well. 

How did you sort out your tests?


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

humuri is expensive too

full chicago immune tests are about 1500 plus whatever drugs

this biospy was just nk cells and the doc said its one good test instead of lots of tests looking at a similar thing

this test was £480 if you pm me your email address i can forward you the details

IVIg is on trial in america and i won't use until its proved


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## ebonie (Apr 17, 2007)

Kara i am glad u are sounding much more positive i am    for you hun


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## Queenie1 (Aug 21, 2008)

well done kara on getting such good news. now you can start planning everything and next year will be your year you deserve it.


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

Glad you found out now Kara and you can make steps to put things right ready for next time


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i spoke with clinic and louise was quite shocked with the dose of steriods but like i said hey if i get the end results i can put up with the side effects


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

my mum says dnt worry she was on 30 a day for a year and was ok


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## Cath34 (Oct 14, 2008)

Hey Kara, I've read that lots of people take Prednisolone for many other reasons apart from IVF. Have you heard this? I'm sure you've googled it?


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

yeah im fine with taking it and hey if i put on wait, i hope i will be putting on a load more after my next cycle

more peed i have to wait ages for the op pmsl


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## Cath34 (Oct 14, 2008)

Yeh I'm sure you are. Dont worry about the weight gain. TBH I have found that I have gained weight with all of the IVF drugs including the dex! But it's a means to an end so bring it on I say!!!!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

yep me too

i found hrt the worst


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

kara.. i told you 5 months is nothing !!! sorry did not reply phone died on my had to plug it in and am now to lazy to walk to next room and get it   sorry hun x


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## Cath34 (Oct 14, 2008)

Really? I'm due to take that in a weeks time


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

popsi you lazy thing lol

cath ive taken 3 lots of hrt now and it can cause weight gain


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

kara i know lol.. but every time i stand up i have to deal with blood lol !!1


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## Cath34 (Oct 14, 2008)

oh joy  Well if thats what it takes!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

popsi you so need a mooncup


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

i know.. i think i will invest in one next month .. its getting rediculous now


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

it takes a while to get use to but its brill


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

Seems like Popsi needs a bucket!


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

andi.. i think your right   .. lol, kara understands what its like


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

aww sorry hun, didn't mean to sound unsympathetic


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

lol.. it ok i know you care really  .. was teasing ya.. but its lethal !!! cant be more than an hour away from toilet lol .. keeping nurofen in business lol


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

mooncups rock and reduce pain

maybe i will start a mooncup thread


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

you already have Kara


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

just thought of that

i remember , must go find it


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

lol.. just looked at them on ebay.. i am insulted .. size a for over 30's size b for under 30's !!! what r they trying to say   ...my bits are all new and in order thank you very much


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

lol thats what i thought


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

so do i buy the one for grannies or now lol .. at my age


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## ANDI68 (Aug 17, 2007)

thats daft. I thought the childbirth thing did the sizing for you not age


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## popsi (Oct 11, 2007)

me too And, DH thinks i need a big one as its what i am used to     men hey lol


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

see you in the moon cup thread


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## miriam7 (Aug 8, 2007)

pmsl naughty hubby ! i thought they would come in light flow heavy flow like tampax!


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