# Lost - where do we go now?



## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Hello,
Well I have followed FF since the start of the year and only ever posted a couple of times but I have found it so supportive reading everyone elses experiences.
However, now I am lost.  We just got a BFN yesterday after our first try of ICSI.  We are broken.  I did everything, ate brazil nuts, drank milk/pineapple juice, lots of water, generally really healthy.  I went for regular accupuncture and had 2 on the day of embryo transfer, so completely lost that it didnt work.
We did manage to freeze 1 wee embryo (3 day, 8 cell) but are now stuck as to what is the next best step to take.
We are torn between having another fresh cycle due to my age (I am 36 this year) so thought that we should try to get the best eggs out now, or give FET a shot?  What have others done in this situation?
We had treatment at the Edinburgh Royal Infirmary and plan to stay there (I think....again, do you suggest moving clinics after a BFN?)
We also phoned today to get a follow up appointment with the consultant but cant get one until the 24th October, feels like a lifetime away.  If we go for FET how long is it before you can start?  For a fresh, do you have to take 6 months off from your last cycle?
Thanks for reading.
Whigers x


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## Hbkmorris (Apr 7, 2010)

Hi Whigers

May I just say how sorry I am to hear of your BFN, I have had two now and trust me it never gets easier.

Ok I was faced with exact same question back in April, we had two embies on day 3 to freeze and I questioned fresh or frozen. After much thought and endless chats it was decided that we would try a fresh cycle of ICSI due to the success rates being so much higher and as we were paying for all our treatment I decided that I'd rather spent the extra £2k towards fresh.

As you ca see that too was a BFN but this time we made it to blastocyst and now we have 2 bastocyst in the freezer too so in Spetember we are hoping to try with them and if that doesn't work leave things as they are as we have no monies left and the emotional side of things is to immense at this time.

So my heart says go with another fresh cycyle and hope to make another frostie as it's always best to have more in the freezer just incase your little solo one doesn't survive the thaw.

Take care, hope I've not confused you x


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## staceysm (Nov 18, 2010)

Hi Whigers,

I am really sorry about your BFN.  What I have learnt over my time on these boards is that there is no rhyme or reason, as to why it works for some and not others.  Like you some women have done everything possible to help it along and it doesn't work.  For me myself, I am overweight, eat crap, had the odd glass of wine, don't exercise and I got a BFP first time.

Firstly I would say, try not to worry about your age. I had my first treatment when I was 35 yrs old and I was informed by the clinic that yes you fertility does decline gradually over the years from 35 yrs of age, but you don't become infertile over night.

As for FET or another fresh cycle it depends on how many attempts you intend to have and your Finances.  For me I am going with a FET, because it is a lot cheaper then IVF and you just never know if those frozen embryo's could become another child for us.  If this FET fails then we will have another fresh cycle next year and I will be 38 yrs old by then.  

As for the time scale different clinics have different policies, some go with FET straight away and some say 3 or 6 months.  I would also say if you are happy with you clinic then don't change just because you have a BFN.

I wish you lots of luck with your next cycle whatever you choose.

Stacey
x


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## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Thanks ladies for your replies, its so invaluable to get support and advice from others who have been through it all before.

hbkmorris - I am sorry things have not worked for you so far but you sound very positive and I just know that helps.  We are self-funding as well and in Edinburgh you only get 2 free goes on the NHS.  We have used up one of those already & will lose the other when we have our next cycle, however, we are about 1 year into a 3 year waiting list so we are just not prepared to wait that long to get our 1 last free attempt, time is not really on our side.  Sending you lots of positive, happy vibes for your FET in September.

staceysm - yes, it really does seem to be a complete lottery as to getting a BFP.  I have read so many different blogs about various diets, life style changes etc and there is definitely no obvious answers as to whats best.  Like you, we are self-funding and once the next cycle is over, I have no idea where we will get the cash from!  We are going to take the next 8 weeks before our follow-up appointment to enjoy life again, go a bit wild, get drunk!

Thanks again for taking the time to reply, you really have helped me feel a bit brighter.

Whigers xxx


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## lindylou1 (Feb 3, 2011)

Hi Sarah,

I tried to PM you but your inbox is full.

I just wanted to say how sorry I am to hear about your BFN honey. I know exactly how you must be feeling, it's absolutely heartbreaking. From someone who's been there, it does get better, trust me. I know at the moment it will feel like all your hopes and dreams have been ripped away but as time goes by you will heal and you will get to the stage where you can be positive and look to the future again. 

Please don't beat yourself up over what you did and didn't do as you will just drive yourself crazy. I'm sure you did everything you could to be in with the best chances of it working, sadly it seems to be down to lady luck. I did all the accupuncture, pineapple juice, brazil nuts etc etc and got a BFN first time round too. I think, in all honesty, we would have to have been very lucky indeed to get a BFP first time, although I know that doesn't make the heartache any easier to deal with. You will go through many emotions over the next few weeks and even months, give yourself time of grieve and don't be too harsh on yourself, just go with it, the worst will pass given time. Make sure you both talk about your feelings and be there for each other. 

We are just about to get going with a FET cycle. It's been quite a wait but to be honest I probably needed that time to heal emotionally and have a holiday and I now feel ready to start again. I plan to be much more relaxed about the whole thing this time round and just go with the flow. No doubt this idea will fly out of the window as soon as I start DR!

Take care honey,

Lynn


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## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Whoops, I am still trying to work this site properly!  I've emptied my inbox now so i'm off to PM you Lindylou1.


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## beachbaby (Jan 31, 2008)

Whigers, i am so sorry it did not work, it is a lottery and no one can say why it dies or does not work, what are your fertility issues if you don't mind me asking?
regarding funding, you are very lucky to get 2 goes on the NHS my PCT withdrew funding 5 years ago as i got to the top of the list ( i missed out), since then they refunded for 6 months this year and it has been withdrawn again. However my understanding is that in your NHS funding your FET will be free included in the first free go, it includes any treatments until all embryo's from that cycle are used.
We were supposedly male factor, but further tests after 3 treatments all self funded we found i had a clotting problem which causes early miscarraige.
good luck with your future treatment


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## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Hi Beachbaby,
Thanks so much for your message.
Well I am supposedly fine & DH has very low sperm count, about 4 million.  Although we havent had our follow-up consultation, the whole cycle seemed to go weel with a good number of eggs, above average fertilisation rate.  We didnt get any embryo to blast stage though.  You cant help wondering at what stage did it not work?  I was just reading online at the weekend about immune testing & how the womans body can attact the embryo so it doesnt implant - have you heard much about this?  Unfortunately we are probably ony 1 year down the NHS waiting list so will most likely end up paying for the next fresh cycle again.  If we do this, that uses up any free goes on the NHS.  If the 2nd attempt doesn't work, I have no idea what we will do as we will have used up all our savings by then. 
So absolutely delighted to see you have twin boys!
Take care
Whigers x


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## beachbaby (Jan 31, 2008)

Whigers, do you lose your right to the NHS treatment every time you pay for a cycle? In England you can self fund 3 full cycles before you lose your NHS funding, please check,all may not be lost.
All my treatment cycles were classed as 1 go as i only ever did 1 full ICSI cycle (the FET's) are included in this cycle, therefore i could have had 2 more self funding ICSI cycles before losing NHS funding.
hope that helps
Keep positive


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## Girlyhalfwit (May 13, 2011)

Hi Whigers, just thought I would post a reply, as I also had the same decision to make as you - I'm also 36 and I also had a BFN after IVF back in May.  Our cycle went textbook (apart from the BFN of course)- I started with a low AHM and responsed excellently to Gonal F - they collected some great eggs and the fertilised really well.  We had 2 put in and froze 7. I was devasted when it failed, as I assumed stupidly that as we have had a child previously that we just needed a little help.  I must say though that although IVF went well, I didn't feel great - had bloated tummy, pains after EC and ET, also I was ill during 2WW.
I went along to the review after BFN and straight away my consultant suggested we use the Frosties.  My DH was of the opinion that, that is why we froze them, so we could use them!  I must say I had my FET on Monday and it is far less invasive and I have heard that it can be more successful for some people because of that reason!  We also figured, that as we have 5 frosties left, so will use them up first - we could potentially have 3 + cycles for less than we had one IVF treatment.  Our clinic uses Vitrification during freezing and thawing is a lot more successful - our first 2 were thawed perfectly and both had 10 cells.  Personally I was swayed by what my clinic suggested - they are the experts after all - but only you can make the decision at the end of the day.
Best of luck Hun xxxx


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## Girlyhalfwit (May 13, 2011)

Sorry I forgot to say - perhaps you should give the clinic a ring re your review - as if you are paying why can't you be seen earlier? I had a review within 10 days of my BFN and got started with my trial cycle a month after, which went really well - my BFN was mid june and already had my trial FET month and actual FET - just the nail biting 2WW to go....arrrrrrrggggghhhhhhhhhhhh!


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## Girlyhalfwit (May 13, 2011)

Sorry me again - just looking back through your comments about women rejecting her partners sperm or Embryos etc - I asked my consultant this during my review and she didn't really like the science behind it, as even if they think this could be a factor - the drugs etc that you would need to take aren't very healthy for a Embryo. I'm not really sure exactly what she said, but I know that after speaking to her, I didn't want to go searching down that route.
Must go now, or will never get out the door today!


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## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Hello ladies,

Beachbaby - yes, sadly you lose your NHS funded cylces when you pay - its just so unfair!  I think that is standard in Scotland.

Girlyhalfwit - thanks for all your posts.  Have to admit, I felt fine throughout treatment.  No pain after egg removal, a bit bloated and we had to go for an extra week on down reg as my lining took a while to thin.  I think we will definitely speak to our clinic and see what they recommend.  I am still swayed towards full cycle but if they really think FET is better first, think we will follow their advice.  
I am going to call the clinic today so see about an earlier appointment.  We are self-funding through the NHS so think thats why there is a delay - we are having treatment at the Edinburgh Royal Infirmary.  Are you private?
With regards to the womans body rejecting the embryo, i had read also that a lot of consultants are against the testing & drugs involved.  I dont think they seem to do it in Scotland, not that i could find anyway.
Gosh, so many decisions to make! 
Got everything crossed for your 2WW - not long now!!!!  Sending lots of positive & happy thoughts.
Whigers x


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## Girlyhalfwit (May 13, 2011)

Yes we are paying privately as already have a child.  Our clinic has been fantastic and I believe that even if your aren't self funding they are just as proactive.
Re the Embryo rejecting - My Consultant actually used the term "Quack Science" and I really do trust her.  My Mum came to my follow-up appointment, as DH was away and I always like a 2nd pair of ears - she's a nurse and what the Consultant said about it, made her think that it was a route that I shouldn't look at.  Anyway that's just my opinion - you've got to do what you feel is right.
Good luck my dear! xxxx


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## Betty-Boo (Oct 14, 2007)

My consultant feels the same - says all the immune stuff is not medically proven.  Yes some get pregnant - but what's to say they wouldn't otherwise - he also says its terrible the way some clinics pray on a woman's vulnerability by charging the earth for needless tests and miracle cures ... (This was after I asked to be tested after my m/c - he said not to waste the £1000's it would've cost) ....
So didn't bother ... Fingers crossed for everyone.


  


Mini xx


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## whigers (Jan 6, 2011)

Yes, I have to admit, there did appear to be a lot of scepticism about immune testing online.  I think its something I will leave alone!  I think I so want it to work next time round that I was looking for every possible way to make this happen.
Thanks for all your advice ladies.
Whigers x


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