# Pregnancy and Parenting after Infertility - Donor Recipients - Part 25



## carrie lou

Pregnancy and Parenting after Infertility - Donor Recipients - Part 25

New Home - Happy Chatting.... 

Make this a lucky thread for all of us! 

Bump list!

[csv=]
Name, EDD, Flavour

Josina, 31/10/14,  
Jess81, 6/11/14
Lee22, 19/12/14,  
OzCalling, 20/1/15
[/csv]

"Baby" list!

[csv=]
Name, Baby, D.o.b.

abcdefgh, DD, 21/8/12
, DD2, 16/6/14
amandaloo, DS, July '11
Babdee, Jacob, 30/7/10
, Charlotte "Lottie" Rebekah, 4/9/14
carrie lou, Zachary Stephen, 26/5/11
, Arlo James, 29/8/14
ceci.bee, Joshi, 11/4/11
emlore, DS, 10/10/13
hakunamatata, Addison, 10/2/12
, Emma and Amelia, 27/5/14
JanaH, Joseph, 25/5/11
juju81, Noah, 17/3/10
, Phoebe Amelia (6lb 15oz), 17/4/14
Lindz, DD and DS, December '10
Mighty mini, DS1, 5/7/10
, DS2, 4/4/12
Mistletoe (Holly), DS, June '11,
, DD, Jan '14
paws18, DS, 17/3/10
pinkcat, Joshua, July '10
, Emily (5lb 5oz), 19/3/14
, Megan (4lb 11oz), 19/3/14
Shelleysugar, Violet Grace (8lb 2oz), 8/7/14

[/csv]

Waiting for or having treatment:
amandaloo, trying for Baby No. 2 - IVF
ceci.bee, trying for Baby No. 2


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## carrie lou

If anyone wants the list/s updated please let me know


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## Babdee

Please can you add me to the list Carrie?
Jacob born 30/07/10
Number 2 EDD 30/08/14

Thanks


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## hakunamatata

Thanks carrie. So pleased your scan went ok. X big relief

Holly I dont know how you do it. Glad some things are coming together for ypu and your dad. X 

Janah I hope the scan reassures you. They do say brown is old but I understand your worry. X 

Afm struggljng a bit today after trip to mums yest. Did some puzzles with addi but its killed my knee. My bump was really uncomfy in night and today. Having a lot of low down pressure. 32 wk scan this pm. X 

Think of you often pinkcat. X x


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## carrie lou

Babdee, I've added you   Meant to say really pleased your scan went well yesterday and yay for another on team cream    


Hakuna, good luck for your scan later


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## ceci.bee

Hi Carrie can you please add me too - Joshi DOB 11.4.11, waiting to start TTC#2

thanks hun


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## JanaH

Back from my scan and all fine still too early for heartbeats, they reckon it is implantation and because I'm on anti-coagulants. I saw the pregnancy sacs and yolks so we will have to wait to see the heartbeats next Wednesday.... it's TWINS 

Carrie can you update - Joseph born 25/05/2011


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## carrie lou

Congratulations Jana


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## northernmonkey

OMG Jana, another set of twins on the board - loads of but one get one free at the mo lol! How do you feel about two??

Hak - bless you, you're having a rough time of things but it'll be worth it when you hold your little girls. How are Addi 's naps going?

Babdee - congratulations on a healthy scan and well done on your restraint ha ha. Glad to hear you're happy with your school too. I'm devastated - dd #2 hasn't got in to my eldest's school despite the head assuring me that it would be ok. Have emailed her this morning and am waiting to hear back but I'm assuming I'll have to appeal. The school's intake is only 12 and another sibling hasn't got in either. I'm in shock, I just can't believe it. My dad is really poorly too and I just don't need this.


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## speeder

I am just popping on again.. Wow I can't believe all that has been going on.

Jana - huge congratulations.  TWINS?!?!  Wow.  I take it you weren't expecting that i.e. you hadn't had a med cycle? Have you been feeling grotty. Just want to say that I have had implantation bleeding too...

NM - I suffer from anxiety like you mentioned too, especially about things out of the blue like donor's health etc.  I really sympathise... Although in many respects, because the donors are screened in the first place they probably have a far better medical history than the rest of us mortals in the first place. (My own family's history would be a heart sink for anyone wanting me as a donor). 

Hak - you are amazing. I remember chatting when you were pg with Addison, and now you are having twins too.  I hope you are keeping OK...

I know I haven't been on here much recently but would I be allowed to rejoin?  We have just found out we are hopefully having number 3. I'm 5 weeks and would love to chat again if that is OK....  It was DIUI first time with a crappy sample so I'm gobsmacked and praying the little bean sticks. I would love to say the worry about m/c is less this time but it isn't, but with my two little ones I have less time to worry if that makse sense!

Hello to everyone else and I look forward to hearing your news xx


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## northernmonkey

Hi Speeder! Oh wow, congratulations! What fab news - a Christmas baby then am I right?  My last two girls were conceived from rubbish samples so it just goes to show if it's meant to be it'll be.  What great news - all the best for next 8 months.


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## carrie lou

Oh Speeder what amazing news Hun! Isn't is funny, it's often the cycle you're convinced isn't going to work... This baby was the slowest growing embryo of the crop and it's the only one that stuck! Congratulations and welcome back


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ooh congrats speeder  

Janah I knew you were having twins!!  I said after your blood results it would be! Congrats! 

Babadee we got our first choice of school. But 2nd would of been ok too.


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## ceci.bee

Wow Janah that is wonderful news   not surprised you have implantation bleeding on anticoagulats with two implanting!!! 

Speeder congrats that is wonderful news of course you are welcome back here - lots of us not having tx and just chatting 

Ju you have gone quiet hope that means you are pushing   

NM so sorry about your daughters school that is gutting     

AFM had my ovarian reserve test today, so far good antral follicle count (6/7 on each side) waiting for blood results in the next few days and then can decide if we go for IUI or IVF.............getting excited but not giving up alcohol and coffee fully until we know when we are starting.........

lltos of love to all
Ceci


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

NM - that is terrible about school - it must make it really hard with school runs being in two places at once and for the younger one not to be in a place with older one for support. I am so sorry.   Must be difficult if dad is unwell - he is a long way away too isn't he? I guess if the school is full someone has to lose out. I don't know how they choose.

Jana I had 3 episodes of bleeding with Emily - one at 12 days, one at 5+4 which was heavy an red - woke me up in middle of night with gush and soaked pjs and a smaller brown bleed at 6+2 which I was told to expect as they could see implantation blood all around the sac. It is very common as the embryo has to burrow into the lining and make blood vessels for the placenta. It makes a lake of blood around itself to grow. If that blood escapes you see it. Most people who see this naturally think they are having a late period.

Babdee and Carrie - good news on scans

Speeder - well done!


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## amandaloo

My goodness how much developments  in a day!

Speeder - congratulations on number three wonderful news and yes of course your welcome back  

Jana- wowwwww TWINS lovely how nice. How do you feel about it . Did you have two transferred I forgot?

Hak- sorry to hear your struggling   you look great on ******** pic  . Six weeks not long too go hope it flys by for you xx

Holly- good to hear there are some developments with your Dads future care  . You've done amazing breast feeding all this time don't feel guilty about topping up   it's not always practical to do it especially when your so busy  

Northernmonkey- how can that be I always thought they automatically get in if sibling there   hope you win the appeal  

Ceci- good news  hope the bloods show further good news for you  

Babdee- great news on the scan  

Carrie - great news about your scan too  

Just waiting for the next good news now   juju !

Hi to everyone who I've missed


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## My Son is My World

Wow its all happening on the new thread isn't it!!

Speeder - congratulations! Do you have your scan booked in yet?

Jana - double the trouble, but double the love too! Congratulations on expecting twins! There are twin boys that go to my baby sensory class and they are just adorable and are always looking for one another - so cute!

Babdee and Carrie - glad to hear the scans went well 

Ceci - sending you lots of luck for your upcoming treatment

Hi to everyone else - sorry if I've missed anyone. Well its been a glorious day here today so we spent some lovely time outdoors and James enjoyed rolling (and rolling and rolling....) on his blanket in the shade. I even got his chunky arms and legs out for the  world to see - he looked adorable (but then again he always does!) Xx


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## abcdefgh

Wow, lots of good news today  

Jana - Glad you got the reassurance needed from the scan and congratulations on having twins! Amazing.

Speeder - congratulations on number 3! How old are your other two now?

Mistletoe - Glad you've made some progress with your dad. Sounds like you are doing amazingly well with everything.  

Carrie and Babdee - Congrats on the scans! 

Juju - hope you are not too fed up and that things start happening for you very soon!

Ceci and Amanda - Hope the good luck in this new thread continues for you two! Sending you both lots of luck. 

AFM - I'm off work now for nearly two weeks so I feel like I finally have the chance to start getting organised for the baby. Will feel much better once we've got a few things done in the house and can hopefully spend the last few weeks getting excited rather than stressing!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Nm that's pants hun   

Amanda no it's not automatic. You still have to go through the usual process and having a sibling doesn't make it your right to School


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## shelleysugar

Hi Carrie
Can you give me a pink bear on the front page as we have found out we are team pink  .  Also congrats on your 20 weeks scan - you seem to be kicking at my heels!!  I will hit the 30 week milestone next week!!  eeek!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello to everyone else
Shelleysugar xxx


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## carrie lou

Lovely news Shelley   Wow, 30 weeks! How did that happen?!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

We have  a girl        


Ju had her girl at 635pm tonight. She's gorgeous. Everyone is fine. She did amazing!!


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## My Son is My World

Fab news mighty thanks for sharing  Does she have a name yet? X


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## northernmonkey

Congratulations Shelley on team pink! I love having girls  

Holly - yes my dad is 300 miles away. We were only up there 2 weeks ago and he's very frail generally but started with a chest infection the day after we came home and is really poorly with that.  He has stage 4 kidney disease but can't have dialysis because of all his other health problems. It's awful to watch him, he can't really walk unaided and has these weird shaky episodes which his gp suspects might be due to a toxic build up from his kidneys. He told my mum a few days ago that he wants to know how much longer he has left because he wants the suffering to end.    

Elmore - what a lovely picture I had in mind of your ds rolling around in the sunshine  

Mini - yep absolutely pants but I'm not giving up, I'll go to appeal. The school they've allocated us will mean  driving for over 2.5 hours per day! 

Juju - congratulations! Fab news, well done!


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## carrie lou

Well done juju   Can't wait to hear more


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## amandaloo

Congratulations juju been excited waiting for your news   hope your all ok and you recover well xxx


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Congratulations to Juju


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yes her name is phoebe Amelia ❤ 6lb 15oz.


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## northernmonkey

Lovely name Juju. Phoebe was one of my favourite girls names but it sounded a bit too similar to dd#1's name. I love it.


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## Babdee

Juju, congratulations!!!     Hope you're all well, and looking forward to hearing from you when you're feeling settled 😊 xxxx

Janah, wow, twins!!! So exciting!! 😄😄 all the best for the next scan xx

NM, I'm so sorry. That's awful. It must be a tiny school?? With an intake of only 12, can they not squeeze in a couple more children? The school they've allocated is a ridiculous journey if you're expected to do that. Best of luck with the appeal. Can you get your local MP on the case too?? Xx  

Congratulations Speeder!! Lovely news 😊 when's your scan? Xx

Thanks Carrie! I was still tempted to find out, and was searching the scan images for a clue, but I think the sonographer was keeping that bit out of sight as we'd said we didn't want to know! Not that I'd have probably been able to work it out anyway! Lol!!

Lovely news on team pink Shelley 😊

How did your scan go hakuna? Sorry you've been struggling; it's all such a strain on the body 😕  

Good luck for your blood results Ceci, exciting times! 😊

Enjoy your couple of weeks off work abcde. Hope the blue sky stays for it! I always find it much easier to get things done when there's blue sky!!

Elmore, sounds like you and little James had a lovely time 😊 he sounds so cute! 

Mighty, glad you got your first choice of school 😊

Hi to Amanda, Holly, Pink cat and anyone else I've missed xxx


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## Babdee

Phoebe is a lovely name 😊 😊


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## My Son is My World

Love the name Phoebe! That would definitely have been a contender if we'd have had a girl. Hope mummy and baby are doing well xx


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## juju81

Bugger me I've true to catch up....

Wow speeder, congrats hun  

Janah, twins..whoooo hoooooo  

Urmmmmmm sorry, I give up haha

Yes little Phoebe was born yesterday.  Contractions started spontaneously on weds at 5.  Progressed slowly overnight and went back in yesterday morning at 10.  Got moved to delivery when I was 3/4cm.  At 4pm I was 5/6cm then at 5.45 I was fully dilated.  Started pushing at 6 had her at 6.35.  My word was it painful.  Had an epidural although it didn't take it all away and turns out the tubes had come unattached lol! I'm waiting to be discharged now. She's very very content at the mo, very different to Noah.  He'll meet her when I'm home because i know he won't sit still for 5mins!! Can't believe I'm a mummy to 2


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## JanaH

Ju congrats she is beautifull.

Just a quick one as I'm on my phone. I was admitted through a&e last night after a massive bleed. I had a scan before proceeding to an erpc. I lost one there is still a sac but they cant tell if its viable yet.


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## My Son is My World

Oh jana so sorry to hear that. Thinking of you and praying you have a sticky one on board xxxxxx


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## Babdee

Oh Janah, I'm so sorry    Xxxx


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh no janah hope you're ok


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## carrie lou

So sorry to hear what's happened Jana   


Juju, congratulations


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## amandaloo

Jana- so sorry to hear that    hope you are ok   

Juju- sounds like you did really well hope your home soon x


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## shelleysugar

Massive Congratulations Juju        - I hope you are now home and sharing her with your little Noah. Great name too  

Jana - so sorry to hear your news, fingers crossed that the other sac is viable    

Shelleysugar xxx


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## abcdefgh

So sorry Jana  

Juju - Congratulations and well done! What a pretty name. Hope you are all home now and she is settling in well.


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## northernmonkey

Jana - so sorry.  I hope the remaining sac carries on to a healthy pregnancy for you.    When will you know?


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## juju81

Thanks everyone   


Janah, oh hun, I'm keeping everything crossed for you lovely


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## northernmonkey

Juju how are you and Phoebe? Are you home yet?

Jana   how are you doing?

My dd#2 is 4 today. I can't believe it, she's growing up so fast. She's still not 100% well bless her. I can't remember whether I said but the gp gave her an inhaler last week which helps her cough but she's up and down generally. Seems like she gets wiped out really easily and if she runs around she gets really breathless and starts coughing again. We took her to a wildlife park yesterday and she suddenly went really pale and didn't want any lunch, just wanted to come home then perked up 20 mins later and played on the park for ages. She just doesn't seem right but I can't put my finger on why.  She just doesn't seem healthy compared to my other 2 who are really robust. Probably just my neurotic streak taking over!


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## speeder

Jana - I'm so sorry. I really hope you get some better news on the other sac. Everything crossed for you x

Juju - huge congrats on the safe arrival of phoebe. Beautiful name!

Abcdefg - I think the last time we spoke number one was about to arrive   how long have you left?

Carrie - that's amazing you are 20 weeks too - have you found out flavour?

NM - I'm a real worrier about my kids' health too. DD1 was a bit unwell for a while - congested, coughs, glue ear, stomach issues. I have basically cut out gluten and dairy from her diet. I know it's a very neurotic sounding thing to do and I didn't do it lightly but the difference in her has been astounding. No more ear infections, more energy, tummy problems gone. could something your DD is eating not be agreeing with her? 
I know how horrible it is watching them not being quite right.. Xx

Shelley - huge congratulations on team pink. It's the only team I know but I love it! 

Hello to everyone else. Gorgeous day here so soaking up sun and trying to ignore my nausea


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## northernmonkey

That's really interesting Speeder, I think I'll do a bit of research.... I dread not being able to give her her beloved pasta though   How long was it before you noticed a difference? What kinds of things do you feed her now?


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## speeder

It's been quite gradual with the dairy. I realised she couldn't cope with any - not even goats stuff. But I can't cope with dairy either so it's no surprise  the gluten I did overnight and her tummy cleared up straightaway. 

Does your DD snore? Mine did every night - swollen adenoids I think. That has gone too...

You can get rice pasta


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## Fizzypop

Hi nm, on the breathlessness and coughing does it get better when she's taken the inhaler? Presume she was given a blue ventolin? When I was a kid my asthma was aggrevated by cat hair and I just remember feeling really ill whenever I was near them. A lack of energy would also be because she is struggling to get oxygen...nowadays my asthma is aggregated when I get hay fever and you mentioned you were at a wildlife park so wonder if there's some link...interestingly no longer allergic to cats and now have 2 plus a dog! But asthma was so bad when I was a kid that I was regularly in hospital x also not sure how long it's been happening but my dd has been in hospital twice for bronchiolitis which apparently is a virus (and not related to asthma) but symptom relief comes from ventolin or nebuliser. If the blue inhaler is definitely relieving symptoms it might be worth asking to see the asthma nurse and getting a preventer inhaler and a peak flow measured thingy so you can chart it for the drs yo try to get some help. And also wanted to say that there have been studies that asthma can be linked to dairy or something but I can't remember exactly what the study was...might be worth having a look. Hope that gives you some food for thought xxx


Happy Easter all!


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## speeder

Fizzy - that's interesting re your last comment about asthma/dairy. My cousin took her little girl off dairy due to severe asthma, against doctor's advice. The improvement in her asthma has been immense - she is off meds now!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yes asthma is linked to dairy


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## abcdefgh

I'm 31 weeks, Speeder - due 23rd June. It's another girl  . 

Hope everyone is having a good weekend. x


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## My Son is My World

Apologies in advance for the me post but i need a good rant! We went over to my dp's family today for an Easter get-together. Dp isn't close to his family so we don't see them often at all and only his parents know about our use of ds. Anyway as soon as we get there there are two dogs barking like crazy and jumping up me while holding janes so hes absolutely petrified and starts crying. I finally manage to calm him down when hes whipped out of my arms by one of dp's cousins - he starts crying again so they decide to pass him around like a parcel and he just cries at everyone of them. Dp's uncle then decides James must be hungry (he wasn't as he's not long been fed) and suggests i feed him some Pringles. I politely say no as hes only just over 6 months and at the moment im only feeding him homemade purees, but they insist and next thing i know they're trying to push prawn crackers in his mouth. He was hysterical and i was seething so i took James off them. Then at 6pm dp said we had to leave so we could get James hone and bathed as per his usual routine which he absolutely loves and they all start saying we should stay there longer (James is a creature of habit and goes crazy id we dont follow his routine). We stuck to our guns and left but i could hear them all whispering and looking at me like I'm some kind of ott mum. Just because dp's brothers kids do what they want and only eat crisps and chips they think I'm too strict. Seriously annoyed! Am i being unreasonable do you think? X


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## northernmonkey

Emlore  - just a quick reply because I'm supposed to be packing for our move on Thursday so dh will come looking for me soon.   first of all, well done on your restraint! I would have gone berserk if I'd found someone trying to shove crisps into my 6 month old. Secondly, if you're unreasonable then so am I because my parenting sounds just like yours. I know my in laws think I'm too rigid, my dad thinks my girls go to bed far too early at 7pm (just one of his many criticisms) and my sister made a joke behind my back that I made dd's bath wash by hand - that one got back to me so I imagine it was one of many. It used to upset me but now I honestly don't care.  The way I look at it is I'd rather people talk about me for trying to do my best than for beating them or some other awful reason. My kids are happy and that's what counts. And judging by James's beaming smile so is he so stuff the rest of them!


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## juju81

Emlore, they are arses for even critiscising.  You're his parent. We all do things differently.  I'm a lot more relaxed about crisps and chocolate but Noah is older, I certainly wouldn't have fed him prawn crackers at 6months especially if you are only pureeing!  Let them talk about you! I used to joke at my sisters rigid routine until Noah came along an again, I'm not as rigid as she was but he followed a routine give or take minutes!  

Janah, how you doing hun  

We came home Friday.  First night she woke once at 3.30 then we all slept until 7.  Last night she woke at 12 but took until 3 to sleep, she then stirred but basically between 12 & 6 I got 1hrs kip    she barely cries tho and even being awake all those hours she was just looking at me.  Totally in love with her


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## My Son is My World

Aaaaw juju she is beautiful!!!!! X


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Emlore I've always been rigid in my routine too. And have always got home for bath and bed at 7pm. No baby should be eating crisps at 6 months whether it's purée or BLW!! They'll choke FFS! 

So no you're not over reacting!!


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## shelleysugar

Emlore - stick to your guns - mum knows best!  I'm planning a clear routine as I've learnt from my sisters - one had a fairly strict routine and one didn't.  The routine worked!  My other sister had months of problems from not having a routine and now has adopted the same approach.  As for the prawn crackers - I think you were remarkably restrained - I'd have left hours before!

Juju - gorgeous photo of little Phoebe  

I hope you all had Happy Easters - we loved our egg hunt around the house - my niece and nephews were so excited and then high as kites on chocolate - fantastic!

AFM: 30 weeks on Tuesday and feeling lots of kicks - this pregnancy really is flying by....

shelleysugar xxx


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## amandaloo

Elmore - heck have they no sense surely people know you can't feed crisps to a 6 month old   . You must have been mortified . As for the routines I think it's a good thing my DS seemed to thrive on it. I wasn't always to the minute but would always aim to trying to stick to it the best I could. We went away when DS was about 4 months old and we stuck to the routine we didn't go out at night we just watched tv in the static instead . You just do what you think is right  

Shellysugar- wow 30 weeks that's flown by  

Abcdef- you too all the pg on here se to fly by 

Juju- the pics of DD are lovely 

I feel yucky today I just can't seem to shift lllness at moment


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## ceci.bee

Congratulations ju so happy for you guys she looks and sounds wonderful. Enjoy these precious first weeks x

Elmore good for you for being strong mum and standing up to do family people give all sorts of rubbish to kids   you are doing the right thing for your baby and they should u derstand and respect that! I too am a big stickler for routines esp at bedtime as they are associated with having a secure and confident child.

Lots of love to all
Xx


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## carrie lou

Oh Emlore, good for you taking a stand! I'm not terribly strict about routines but I am led by Zac and I know when he is tired and needs to get to bed - in the same way, you know James better than anyone else and you know what's best for him. We've often had to change plans or leave somewhere early because Zac was tired or grumpy. Let's face it, an overtired, unhappy child is not going to enjoy a social occasion anyway and almost certainly neither are you! 


And as for giving him prawn crackers   I know guidelines have changed since we were all children but surely that was never recommended! It reminds me of when my MIL tried to feed Zac a choc ice at 4 months old - he hadn't even start solids yet! I was fuming   


You're the mummy and you know best


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## My Son is My World

Thanks for your support ladies - you're right i do know James best. Him being healthy and happy is my priority so if other people don't like it they can get stuffed. If that makes me an upright mum then so be it 

My goodness I've eaten way too much chocolate this Easter - I'm sure i just have sugar running through my veins rather than blood!! X


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## JanaH

I managed to get scan with my consultant today and unfortunately lost both.


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## My Son is My World

Oh jana I'm so sorry to hear of your loss. Big hug. Thinking of you. Please take some time to look after yourself xxxxxx


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## amandaloo

Jana- I'm so so sorry that's awful    . Take good care of yourself  . We are all here for you  .


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## carrie lou

Oh Jana I'm so sorry hun  Lots of hugs to you.         It's just not fair.


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## Babdee

Oh Jana, I'm so sorry     Lots of love and hugs xxxx


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## hakunamatata

Oh janah im so sorry sweetie ive only just found the thread thought you had been quiet lol, im so sorry this is happening to you. X 

Babdee grrr for interfering people, stick to your guns. X 

Ceci hope your blood results come back all ok

Hope everyone is ok x


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I'm so sorry janah


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## juju81

My heart goes our to you janah, so flaming unfair


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## shelleysugar

So sorry Janah   xxx


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Jana


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## northernmonkey

I'm gutted for you Jana, what awful news. Take care of yourself.


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## ceci.bee

Janah hun I am beyond gutted for you sweetie                                                              my heart goes out to you both


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## speeder

Jana I'm so so sorry  it is so terribly unfair. Thinking of you xx


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## abcdefgh

So sorry Jana. You've had such a terrible time   - it's so unfair.


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## JanaH

Thanks everyone, its hard but we will get through it. We've got one embryo left and DH wants to stop after that. I've got my results from the swabs they took whilst in A&E and it was positive for GBS. I think there is a link between my miscarriages and the GBS and I will discuss this next time I see my consultant.


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## amandaloo

Jana - what's GBS? Lots of hugs to you it must be very very hard  

Got some good news today the clinic are letting me have the embryoscope for free ( 700 pound) they said because of what happened last time and that we have been loyal ! Bloomin eck ! Booked nurse consultation for next wed and scan on sat. Then will be waiting until mid to end of may before I start the drugs .


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## JanaH

Wow that is great news Amanda. GBS is Group B Strep


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## hakunamatata

Amanda about time you got something back honey. On we go. X 

Janah good to have answers but you must be so be so frustrated and angry. Big hugs to you. X


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Can they do anything janah? 


Amanda they'll be issuing loyalty cards next    Glad you've hot money off tho.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

A course of antibiotics will get rid of group B strep, but some people just carry it. Normally if it is found they just give you antibiotics in labour as it can cause meningitis in the newborn. My area do not even test for it though so I would not have known if it was there or not.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

My clinic do the three for the price of two IVF offer.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I've never been tested either. I remember pippi having when she was pg


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## northernmonkey

Jana I tested positive for gbs after having dd#2. I only found out because her belly button wouldn't heal up and a swab on that showed gbs so they then tested me. It comes and goes from what I understand. I was tested again a few weeks before having dd#3 and was positive again so had iv antibiotics during labour. 

Amanda - lots of women carry gbs. It's a harmless bacteria to the woman but as Holly says can  have serious consequences for newborns.  You can pay for a private test (around £35) but the midwife arranged mine because I'd tested positive previously. The problem with the nhs test though is it's not as sensitive as the private test so you can get a false negative result.


----------



## carrie lou

I've never been tested for it either   I know someone whose LO was very ill with meningitis from it after birth, so I wonder why they don't routinely test for it?


----------



## JanaH

I was tested when pregnant with Joseph only because I ended up in hospital, so I know I carry the bacteria. I was given antibiotics during labour. Carrie my midwife said she constantly fights for it to be given to all women at 35 weeks.


I just wonder if the bacteria is positive at the time of transfer if it can enter with the embryo, causing colonisation inside the womb. I think I will change my progesterone to maybe the injections or cyclogest rather than crinone, and try and not have as many scans and internal investigations. Might ask to go on antibiotics before I start treatment and before transfer.


----------



## Babdee

There's a petition to sign to ask for the test for gbs to be added to the antenatal screening programme. Go to gbss.org.uk to find the link. DH's cousin tested positive for it last year at 31 weeks pg, and she contacted all the family asking us to sign it xx


----------



## northernmonkey

I think the argument against testing is that even if you're a carrier, the risk to baby is very small. Also if antibiotics are given to every woman who tests positive it increases the resistance of bugs to anti b's.  If the nhs hadn't agreed to test me though I would've gone private as obviously I wouldn't have taken any chances.


----------



## speeder

Jana - has your clinic said the GBS could have caused the problem? Only because I was told 40% of women carry it naturally so it's not uncommon. I would be interested on the clinic's take on this, as the AB before treatment is an idea.

There are also women online I read about who treat it naturally with garlic and manuka honey which wasn't something I tried myself but could be worth exploring?

I had the private test when pg both times before - around 34 weeks. Second time it was positive and I had the AB. My understanding is that it is rarely an issue unless your baby is preterm or your waters break a long time before delivery. But I still felt it wasn't a risk I wanted only because my colleague's friend lost a baby to it  my midwife made it clear she disapproved of my decision to have the test. I do agree that giving lots of antibiotics isn't great and can increase resistance but it was a decision I wanted to make myself. The NHS don't offer it and hasn't any plans to change this which is all very well unless yours is that baby in one hundred  

Jana - I'm thinking of you today x


----------



## juju81

Morning girls,

Not sure if this will work but I have uploaded a few pictures of Phoebe..

http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/juliegrieves81/library/Phoebe%20Amelia%20Grieves

Password is phoebe

/links


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

You need a password ju


----------



## northernmonkey

It's phoebe. Pay attention


----------



## carrie lou

Lovely photos Ju   Hope everything is going well


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaaw ju what a little beauty she is!! You must be so proud  xx


----------



## hakunamatata

Absolutely lovely,  so like n!


----------



## amandaloo

Juju- just perfect  

Hak- not long to go now x


----------



## ceci.bee

adorable Ju making me even more broody ...............


----------



## carrie lou

Hey ladies. We're off to Centerparcs tomorrow    I can't wait. Zac is all excited too and helped do the packing today  Mostly cars and stuffed animals


----------



## ceci.bee

ooh Carrie have a lovely holiday. I am currently inside with Joshi who has come down with Chickenpox - he said to me today 'mummy did I get the chatterbox from my friend Alec when he had spots'   
any top tips about managing the next few days would be great 

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## juju81

Enjoy Carrie, I love love love centre Parcs 


Ceci, Eurex.  Amazing stuff.  And bicarbonate of soda in the bath.  To be honest, after a day or 2 Noah was alright and I took him to the park for some fresh air   


Thanks girls,  she's just a dream.  Seriously.  Am totally and utterly in love.  She poos, feeds and sleeps.  Something Noah never did     We have just been on our first girly shopping day whilst daddy was at work and Noah's at nursery/childminder


----------



## amandaloo

Carrie- have a great time  

Ceci- oh no poor J hope he's better soon . Did you find out what your results were ? Do you know what tx your having yet? Sorry if I missed it !

Babdee- how are you? 

Hope all the lovely ladies with bumps are ok and obviously the ones without bumps too !

Well I feel so much better about this cycle now I've had a massive turnaround from negative feelings to positive . i went for my scan saturday the lady was very reassuring she said they recommend three Ivf's because ppl can just have bad cycles . She also said that if it was my eggs that were hard to penetrate then the iCsi gives a lot better chance so feel a bit better about it all she also said I had 8 follicles on each side which is very good and she wouldn't have guessed I was 39 from my scan . I just feel more positive now even though I knew some of this info already !


----------



## hakunamatata

Feeling positive is half the battle amanda so you hang onto that. X x 

Ceci hope j doesnt suffer to much. Cp is dojng the rounds with addi friends. Coild do without that with pending arrivals but what will be will be. 

Today I went solo and coped ok. Was spoilt with mum last wk so was really worried about this week.  Addi obliged and napped today which im sure helped.  She also got put up in dance and danced independently. I was so proud.

Well I might go up and have a bath as back is hurting. X x on we plod.  4 wks tomorrow


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

northernmonkey said:


> It's phoebe. Pay attention


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Juju - Phoebe is a beauty and her and N are like 2 peas in a pod. My two are so alike too. But I have also had the experience of girls vs boys now and I agree that girls are like a dream, poo, eat, sleep, smile and look beautiful. E is now cooing and it is sooooo cute! You wait! E and this other baby born the same day had a full conversation in cooing language the other day at breast feeding group.  

Amanda - that is very good news that you feel positive. I agree - ICSI the way to go if you are a little more mature in the IVF game - I had 100% fertilisation in my last cycle with ICSI and two babies out of 8 eggs and I was 39.  

I am sorry I am not good at catching up with everyone at the moment - I am reading and I hope you believe me when I say I am rooting for everyone pregnant or TTC or dealing with LOs. I jist don't have the energy to post about everyone. But I am thinking of you.
Dad has been so unwell with his Alzheimers and has become a shaddow of his former self. Social services have now closed the case as he is moving to be near me. One miracle - I have managed to secure him NHS continuing care funding for the time being. I just hope for the long term, but awaiting the full assessment. They are paying for now. I spent Easter weekend writing a 7 page document having read the whole NHS framework to support ongoing funding.
He is still in hospital being aggressive, emotional, agitated, confused and trying to escape. He knows us, just, but only really responds to E now. He loves her. He was verbally aggressive to me tonight and the look on his face is staying with me. He only told me to ''get up'', but in such a tone that I have never heard before. He was packing bits and pieces and trying to get out of the window and telling me to take him home. Next minute he was trying to sit down with no chair behind him and then sleeping bent over on the edge of the bed, ready to fall. He was crying and saying he did not know what to do all the time.
Really sad.
I have been sorting through 50 years of stuff at the house and throwing away lots of memories. I can't keep it all though.


----------



## ceci.bee

Holly               so tough. well done on securing the funding that is a major battle. 

lots of love
Ceci


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## northernmonkey

Ju - Phoebe is so beautiful, glad to hear everything's going well.

Amanda - great pep talk from your nurse!  I think this is a greAt time of year to be going through tx - everything is coming back to life in spring so it's a good omen! 

Holly -    I've said it before but I don't know how you cope. I was in tears reading about your poor dad this morning. I really feel for you.  

Ceci hope Joshi's  pox aren't bothering him too much. I'm hoping dd#3 will get it soon then that's all three of them had it. 

We've had a mental few days here. We moved house last Thursday, had the two eldest girls' birthday parties on Saturday and Sunday which was all more than enough to cope with, then our poor old dog died on Friday. He was very old and had been ill for a while but we kept putting off the inevitable. Then he got worse last week and we made the awful decision to let him go on Friday.    So sad, I know it was for the best but I feel so guilty. I'm desperate for another one, not because it will replace him but because it doesn't feel right without a dog here and I think it's good for the girls to grow up with animals. 

Well I'd better go and unpack more boxes. I'm surrounded by them....


----------



## carrie lou

Holly, so sorry to hear what you are going through   I wish there was something I could do to help. It must be heartbreaking    If you would like me to take over some of your modding duties, please just shout - I'm happy to step in for as long as you need   


NM, so sorry about your dog - they really do become members of the family don't they   


Sorry for short post, just a quick update while on our hols. Heading home tomorrow   so will catch up properly then. Hope everyone is well


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie hope you've had a good holiday.  Yes you're right pets are like family, dd#2 is really missing him bless her.

Had good news today - dd#2 has got a place at our eldest's school yippee! One less thing to worry about.

Got a huge spider population in our new house   I hate them and so far we've had one a day. The latest was  5 mins ago when dd started screaming at me to get her out of the bath cos there was a spider in there. I went through and sure enough there's a big hairy monster swimming on the surface!! I grabbed dd, sent dh in and he found it sitting on top of a telly tubby bath toy. Yuck.


----------



## hakunamatata

Nm sorry to hear about your doggy. Im not looking forward to that time.  I cant imagine life without ruby. Dogs are a lot of work but I think now we've started it the girls will always want us to have one. 

Holly sorry youre having such a hard time with your dad. Well done for securing funding for him. You really are a star managing to do that with all you have on your plate. 

Carrie hope youve had a good break. Bet zac loved it. Are you feeling ok?

Hope everyone else is well. I can finally say im having my babies this month.  Im hoping after a couple of wks, my tum is soooooo tight and uncomfy.  Luckily hubby got off early today and rescued me. X


----------



## ceci.bee

Wow hakuna that has come around fast. Good luck and hope you get to your CS date in one piece


----------



## amandaloo

Northern monkey     . Sorry to hear about your dog   so upsetting  . My dog is 16 in July  . Hope your ok 

Hak - yay not long to go  

Ceci- how are you all settling back to life in England?

Mightymini- thanks  💪

I've been for nurse consultation so all set to get started now just waiting for af so I can book the endometrial scratch and also ill then know when I'm starting meds.  Found out my amh was 12 that's normal range which I suppose is good !


----------



## carrie lou

Hello ladies   

Amanda, that's great that you can get started soon   And AMH of 12 seems good, mine was only 7.7    


Hakuna, wow not long for you now! Hope you are doing ok   


NM, ooh spiders - I actually don't mind them   


Hope everyone is well.  


AFM, we had a lovely break at Center Parcs. Since getting home yesterday though I have discovered two ticks on Zac!!! We managed to remove them promptly but just hope he doesn't get Lyme disease, where we were staying is known to be a risk for it.   


I've been feeling a bit low actually. I'm not sure why. My angel baby's due date is coming up two weeks from today and I'm finding it harder than I thought I would. I'm so grateful to have one healthy amazing child in the world and another in my tummy. So I feel a bit of a fraud for mourning this little life that never got properly started. But I still feel so sad when I think of my little angel bean   


Also I've been worrying about how I will manage with two children. I know it's ridiculous since many people cope just fine with two or even more, and I know some of you ladies have lots more on your plate right now than I do (Holly   ). But I really don't know how I will cope. Most days I struggle with just Zac at the moment. I can't see how I will ever leave the house again when I have two children to get ready. I've wanted this baby for so  long and still do, so I feel really stupid and ungrateful.   Sorry for moaning. I know how lucky I am and should be happy right now. I'm just having a low day


----------



## hakunamatata

Carrie hun I know exactly how you feel sweetie. 2 is a big change from one and three for me. What we've got to remember is thst we will feel so much better when not pg. I often feel overwhelmed and try to take it one day at a time. Im really struggling now. Small jobs send me back to bed. Managed to get hosp bag packed today so big accomplishment and labelled piles of clithes depending on bsbies weights. It all scares me if I let it. I came back off my meds 4 wks ago so im really pleased about that. I had to be off for delivery.  Im hoping to deliver in a couple of weeks but dh thinks theyre in for the long haul.

How are you feeling janah. I think of you often and realise how lucky I am. Life is so hard to understand sometimes. X 

Big hugs to all you girlies


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## juju81

Carrie.....ticks   ah chick, I still think about the one I lost before Noah, you're allowed to feel sad hun  .  I've actually found it a doddle with 2! I was seriously worried about how I'd cope as I had PND with Noah but its so so different.  I know Noah is a year older then Z but I still think it will be ok  

Amanda, AMH of 12 is good. Mine was flipping 3 and tht was last year!

Hak, not long hun exciting stuff.  Does addi understand?


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## northernmonkey

Carrie -   Ju's right, you're allowed to feel sad. Let yourself grieve and don't feel guilty about it. With regards to worrying about how you'll cope, I'll be honest and say I find 3 a real struggle (but I'm not complaining, I wouldn't be without any of them.) what I've found is when I only had one, I wouldn't have dreamed of taking her out without her being dressed in a clean outfit, face spotless, change bag fully packed with nappies, wipes, drink, snacks etc. fast forward 7 years and dd#3 is practically being dragged up.   most days I roll up at school with her still in her pj 's, weetabix round her chops and in her hair. I've lost count of the number of times I've gone out for the day and had to find a shop to buy nappies because I've left the house in such a rush I've forgotten to pack any.  I'm sure you'll be much more organised than me but my point is that I make it to the end of each day in one piece (just!) and dd#3 is just as happy as my other two. It will only be a matter of weeks after this one is born that you won't be able to remember what it was like with just the one.


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## northernmonkey

Amanda my amh was 12 too when I conceived #3. 

Ju - glad to hear it's all going great. How's Noah with Phoebe?


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## carrie lou

Thank you ladies   


Hakuna, well done on coming off your meds. I'm still on my antidepressants and MW recommends I stay on them until well after baby is born as it's such a vulnerable time anyway. I'm seeing consultant on thurs though and want to ask about switching to another type that are safer for breastfeeding and less risk of withdrawal in the baby. You're right, little tasks can seem overwhelming. This evening I burst into tears trying to cook the dinner because I just couldn't seem to manage it while also supervising Zac   DH had to step in and help. Sounds like you are doing really well though honey, you should be proud   


Ju, thank you   Pleased to hear you are coping so well with two little ones. It's just that some days Zac is so demanding and such a handful that I really can't imagine having a newborn as well - and yet in 4 months time that is exactly what I'm going to have   It scares me sometimes. 


NM, you're right, my standards have already slipped a bit I think since being pregnant   


Thank you ladies for being so supportive   Think I just needed to get it all out there. I know I have been depressed since losing my little bean last year, and I am getting better definitely, but some days (like today) I'm reminded that I'm not quite there yet.   But having Zac, and now this precious Baby Bear growing in my belly, helps so much, and I'll never forget how lucky I am.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah stay on your anti ds. I did struggle with 2 but I had reasons too. I still had pnd and it wasn't a planned pg.    And i did wonder how I was ever going to leave the house. Ds1 was really difficult to deal with. He was only 21 mths. But it's all different now. Ds1 is still a nightmare child. (I'm blaming the donor) !!!!    But the hard days don't last long.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie - you will adapt. I can't remember what it was like with one now. My children are clean and tidy and I manage to remember everything and get two ready in the morning. At this stage with C I was still struggling to leave the house on time for anything and remember to pack everything but somehow with two, you are so experienced from number one that you are ultra efficient and packing two lots of things, dressing two and packing for two seems to take less time than it did at the same stage with the first one, if that makes sense.

I used to feel like it took 4 hours to get out of the house with one. It does seem to very occassionally. Rarely you have a day like that,  but mostly you can be up and out to things with two just as easily as with one as you are faster at doing things and you can pack loads into a day if you are organised....

e.g. on a Thursday my two are up and fed about 8-8.15, C goes to preschool at 9.15 with packed lunch, this week I then went straight to the supermarket and did the shop with just E. Then came home and put it away. Did a quick feed, got back in car and went to baby sensory, did a quick feed at the end of class. Drove to baby weigh clinic and breast feeding group at the childrens centre had a chat with the mums, lunch and feeding and then picked up C at 3 from preschool, nipped over to the swings near preschool and then came home.

On Friday we were up and fed at about 9am. Playgroup at 10 (although I did not get there til 10.30), then home for lunch and I adjusted C's car seat as I noticed his straps were too low (that turned into a real fight   and I had to hoover the car under the seat (Yuk!). Then we went back out the children's centre for playgroup. Then came home and C had his friend over to play for 2 hours.

At 4 months I would have struggled to just make it to the baby clinic/breast feeding group as my outing for the day.

With number 2 it feels like you are no longer a newbie in the job, just taking on an extra project in a seasoned job.

Hope my rambling makes sense.


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## hakunamatata

I like your rambles holly. X 

I will go straight back on the nught babies are born its just advisable to be out of your system before birth. Then I will avoid feeding 5 hours after medicating. It will be a challenge. But ive got to feel better than I feel now. Well, beter head back ti bed and try again. Addi has swimming at 8 30 x


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## juju81

NM, Noah is absolutely fine with her, strokes her cheek, occasionally wants to hold her but mostly jst likes to make sure she's here.  When he wakes up or comes in from being out the first thing he checks is phoebe.  My niece however, she's 6.5, is obsessed with touching    she was 2.5 when I had nah and exactly the same but I thought she'd grow out of it lol!


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ju - I have found all over the place at every group that we have been to that the girls are obsessed with E and want to poke her and dolly her all the time. It is like bees to the honey pot with little (and big) girls with babies and they just cluck. I sometimes have 3 little girls with their heads vying for space in the car seat with E. At the weekend with the family party it was all the women begging to take it in turns for a cuddle. Stimulated E so much that when we came home she slept 10 hours!

C shows interest in E like stroke her hair or want a cuddle (latest is trying to pick her up   ) but then he is off with his cars, trains and fire engines


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## northernmonkey

> Mistletoe (Holly) said:
> 
> 
> 
> Carrie - you will adapt. I can't remember what it was like with one now. My children are clean and tidy and I manage to remember everything and get two ready in the morning.
Click to expand...

Just to clarify my children aren't dirty, I'm just talking about a bit of breakfast round baby's mouth! I'm clearly not even efficient, never mind super efficient haha! Then again I knew that even before I was a mum!!


----------



## carrie lou

Don't worry NM, I know what you mean - bit of breakfast round their chops never hurt anyone


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Hak hope you're feeling ok with coming off your meds. Didn't realise you had to rv off then for the birth. Glad you've got a plan to get back on them  

Carrie my 2 have always got breakfast round their chops!   

Nm do you like your new house?


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

northernmonkey said:


> Mistletoe (Holly) said:
> 
> 
> 
> Carrie - you will adapt. I can't remember what it was like with one now. My children are clean and tidy and I manage to remember everything and get two ready in the morning.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Just to clarify my children aren't dirty, I'm just talking about a bit of breakfast round baby's mouth! I'm clearly not even efficient, never mind super efficient haha! Then again I knew that even before I was a mum!!
Click to expand...

NM you are looking after 3 with school runs - you are doing an amazing job! And just moved house.
I don't count having a little bit of breakfast on face as dirty as you can just wipe it next time you have a minute.


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## northernmonkey

Holly - seriously, I'm not efficient! I'm the same with everything - dh walks in the kitchen if I'm cooking and can't understand why I appear to have every utensil, pan and full cupboard contents all over the worktops    I'm going to have to get more organised because before we moved I had shops etc on the doorstep and now I have to drive everywhere which I don't have time to do. I think I'll get you to move in with me for a week to sort me out! 

Mini - I'm loving the house, it's got so much space, it's the house of our dreams. I don't know how we managed in our old place now with just two rooms downstairs. 

Got some good news last week, dd#2 has got a place at our eldest's school. They've squeezed her in without an appeal. So relieved!


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## hakunamatata

Thats brilliant news nm its all coming together. Glad you love your house. Do you have a downstairs room you can dedicate to play? I would love that.  X


----------



## northernmonkey

Yes Hak, we have a playroom which we always used to say was a must in our next house.  It's great - the bedrooms and living room are no longer full of toys! I also have a dining room yippee! We used to be cramped up on a tiny table at the end of our equally tiny kitchen.  How are you doing? Bet you can't wait to meet your girls, you've done so well.   Ps have you chosen your names?


----------



## carrie lou

That sounds fab NM. I dream of having a conservatory with a hard floor (the rest of our house is carpeted) for messy play, painting etc so it's easy to clean up afterwards! Maybe one day eh!   


Hak, hope you are ok   


I saw the physio on tues for my back/pelvic pain. She gave me a special support to wear (which I'm afraid i'm not getting on very well with) and a sheet of exercises to strengthen my core muscles and hopefully take the strain off my back. Still struggling with the pain especially in the evenings. But hopefully this will help. Sorry for no more personals. I have consultant appointment this morning and got to get Zac to the childminders. Hope everyone is well


----------



## juju81

NM we had a play room in our last house...fab!


Carrie, I didnt get on with that belt either.  Those exercises are good.  Hope they help you towards the end tho because nothing helped for me towards the end.  Did it affects your labour last time? The pain in my pelvis with both labours was grim.  I could have handled the pain had it not included hideous pelvic pain too.  Don't want to sound negative, hopefully will be ok for you    


Phoebe is 3wks old already    We changed her milk to comfort and she's so much more settled now and no longer projectile vomiting! It's thicker too so she can't guzzle it as much    Just adore her.  She's smiling and the last couple of days has started cooing too.  Nick said he heard her in the night cooing, as thou she was taking to someone


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaw juju she sounds amazing! At 3 weeks James was screaming the house down 24/7. Maybe it is true what they say about girls being much more content babies than boys x


----------



## carrie lou

Juju, last time I only had pain in my back, no pelvic pain at all, so no it didn't really affect my labour. I was going to ask you about that actually. I am already thinking of asking for an epidural again this time, hope that doesn't make me a wimp, but the background pain is pretty significant already and my epidural with Zac was magic!  


Glad Phoebe is doing well. I remember the cooing stage with Zac, just lovely


----------



## Babdee

Hi ladies, sorry I've not been around for ages; spent some time at my in-laws for a family birthday, and feel like I've been rushing around, but not actually sure what I've been doing, and don't think I've really achieved anything!! We got chickens at the weekend though! I'd no idea quite how much pooping they did! It's everywhere! We've got a walk-in run, so there's quite a big area to clean up! I'm less inclined to let them in the main garden now!! Plus next door's chickens keep escaping through the hedge into our garden, pooping everywhere... Hmmm!

Just been trying to catch up with everyone, sorry if I miss anyone!

Gorgeous photos of Pheobe juju! She's beautiful 😍 can't believe she's 3 weeks already!

NM, great news on dd#2 getting into the same school 😃 and I should think so too! And your new house sounds perfect! I know what you mean about getting to the shops though. Our old house had shops on the doorstep, but now I have to drive everywhere. Got used to it quickly though, and the house is worth it 😊 enjoy settling in!

Carrie, sorry you're struggling with the pelvic pain. I too saw the physio last week, but haven't got a support belt as yet. She gave me some exercises to do (but I keep forgetting to do them, oops!). Sounds like yours has hit you worse   Hope your consultant appt goes well today  

Hi Amanda, I'm good thanks 😊 your AMH is better than mine was nearly 18 months ago! So glad you're feeling more positive. Very exciting getting ready to start again  

Hakuna, hope you don't have to wait too long   

Holly, Mighty Mini, Ceci, Janah and everyone else, hope you're all ok  

Love to all xxx


----------



## juju81

Emlore, how is James sleeping now? Noah was awful.  I was apprehensive duing this pregnancy  but she really is a dream!

Carrie, not a wimp at all.  I yelled for one in the end becuas so couldn't take the pain in my pelvis anymore.  She delivered 2hrs later but it took away most the pain (unfortunately my right side didn't numb so still needed G&A through each contraction.  Also, I'd had 1.5hrs sleep in 24hrs and just wanted to be able to doze.  Anyone who calls you a wimp needs a poke in the eye quite frankly!


----------



## My Son is My World

He's SO much better thanks juju - has a couple of 40min naps in the day and sleeps 7pm - 6am with only a couple of wake-ups. Hes coming up to 8 months now. He still shouts when he goes down but only for 5mins or so. Its sad really because as much as I'd love another baby i know i couldn't do it - the thought of having another baby like that (i know a second baby may be the complete opposite but my luck would be to have a clone of James!) as well as my little prince would tip me over the edge x


----------



## carrie lou

Juju, thanks   I mentioned to the consultant today about wanting an epidural again this time and she was very supportive. Unfortunately I'm still very confused about my antidepressants and what to do - think I'll need to go back to my GP to discuss it in more detail.   

Babdee, ooh I've always wanted to keep chickens but you're putting me off a bit!    Hope you're well honey   

Emlore, Zac was very unsettled as a baby too    believe it or not you reach a point when you forget all the worst bits and can contemplate doing it all again   I'm convinced this baby is going to be just like Zac but this time at least I'll know what to expect and how to cope better. Not sure if it is a boy/girl thing or not, because my mum said I was the same as a baby - maybe genetic in our case, either that or karma   James is gorgeous by the way, reminds me of Zac as a baby   

AFM, saw consultant this morning. All well with baby and heart rate a nice steady 152. Still no clear answer on whether to stop or continue anti-ds. My gut feeling is to continue them but I need to make sure it will be safe for baby and breastfeeding. I'll get another appointment and scan at 32 weeks for reassurance which I'm pleased about.


----------



## My Son is My World

Thanks Carrie   I know I'm biased but i think he's absolutely beautiful. I love it when people stop me in the street or shops and say how gorgeous he is. Hes my little superstar! Time is flying by with your pregnancy - so exciting! X


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ju - that it early for smiling and cooing - E started smiling at about 8 weeks and cooing a bit later. She has a lovely cute squeal now when she is cuddling a teddy up to her face last two days - I had to video it. We call it E's new noise and C comes to tell me she is doing it. He really loves her. Keeps asking to cuddle or hold her and smile (means he wants a photo taken with her).

I am sorry I have not been about much. I thought I was getting there with Dad's nursing home place but the assessed him Friday and come back to tell me he needs the highest level of care in their top unit, which has no beds right now. So now NHS continuing care is saying they will have to move him twice - to a place near the hospital and then to near me. Not ideal to move a confused dementia person with tendency to aggression twice at all.

Then the nursing home phoned to say a sister home that only opened last year has not opened the top floor yet and now they have a waiting list they could open it in 3 weeks and put dad there. All brand new and super lovely home. 
Nhs continuing care assessment nurse is also arguing that he does not need such a high level of care despite the ward that have looked after him for last 6 weeks, his consultant, the dementia consultant, the nursing home assessor, who is a psychiatric nurse and an independent psychiatrist all saying he does.

Because the nhs continuing care don't want to pay the bill me thinks! 

I was told in quite strict voice yesterday that just because they have interim funded him does not mean he will be eligible for ongoing funding, How can a person who needs the highest level of care suddenly get better enough not to be eligible? I think might have to fight for it.


----------



## juju81

Emlore, I was put off for ages having another one because of how bad Noah was.  It wasn't until he was 2.5yrs old that that deep rooted yearning came back.  No child is the same.  My two have proven that to me.  Even through my pregnancy I was petrified of how I'd feel after and how the baby would be.  James is still young, give yourself some time.  Also 2nd time round you are so much calmer too!

Carrie, glad cons was supportive.  At the end of the day tho its your choice  

Holly, try not to panic about yor dads funding.  My BIL dad was told no ducking but when it came down to it he's being fully funded.  Feel for you hun.  Is DH any more supportive?  I had an email about cooing and says from 3wks they can start cooing! She proper smiled at nick (not a wind one) about a wk old.  Her whole face lights up.  She was smiling away at me at 3.30am lol!


----------



## northernmonkey

Emlore - I agree with the others, you forget all the reasons for not wanting another baby once the first one starts growing up.  Once things become easier and you realise you've turned a corner and survived, you know that you can survive it again.  Nothing wrong with just having the one if that's right for you though! 

Carrie - no shame in epidurals. I had to have one with dd#1 and 3. I'd been ill for weeks with #3, hadn't eaten or slept properly for ages and just didn't have the energy to cope after about 6 hours. Plus dd was pressing on the entrance to my bladder so I couldn't pee which resulted in my bladder filling up to the point of agony which was worse than the contractions! Get one ASAP if you want one and enjoy your labour.  

Holly -   it must be so frustrating trying to get your dad sorted. Hope funding is finally agreed soon. 

Babdee - you've put me off chickens too 

Hi to everyone else , got to go get baby up.


----------



## My Son is My World

Ladies any ideas of what i can get dp for his first fathers day? I want something personal that he can keep. I dont want to spend a lot (well i cant afford to more like!) but i want it to be something he can treasure forever x


----------



## hakunamatata

What about the handprint or footprint on a mug emlore. X 

Its friday everyone we made it. X


----------



## carrie lou

Emlore, my hubby is usually content with coffee and a bacon sandwich in bed   But if you want something special, how about a mug with James's face on it. DH got me one for my first Mother's Day and it's very special to me. I think there are websites where you can upload the picture you want and they put it on a mug for you   


NM, thanks Hun, that's good to know - I thought for second and subsequent babies you were expected just to grit your teeth and put up with the pain! But my epidural made me feel so much calmer and in control and able to cope. I loved it   I just felt the MWs disapproved a little when I asked for it, I tried gas and air but it didn't really help, just made me feel spaced out and weird. I refused to try pethidine because I was already feeling sick and worried it would make me feel worse. The MW rubbed my back with lavender oil, I said yes that's very nice.... But I still want that epidural please!!!!!  


Well girls it's viability day for me - 24 weeks! I can't quite believe it


----------



## amandaloo

Carrie - that's great news happy viability day !   . I had induction and all the midwifes advised me to have epidural ! I have a personal friend who's a midwife and I text her to say I had been induced and she said have an epidural . I wouldn't think twice about having one again   couldn't care less what midwifes think induction or no induction! Think of yourself 

Holly- what a time your having   hope it all gets sorted out soon  

Northern monkey - your new house sounds great .   . 

Hak- not long for you now can't wait to hear your news x

Babdee- lol re the chickens I can imagine they are messy

Emlore- think I got my DH a cup too but it wasn't personalised one just one that said daddy on 

Juju- Phoebe sounds like a dream  

Mighty mini- how are you? 

Ceci- you ok? When will you start?

Janah-   thinking of you still  

Hello to anyone I missed !

Afm- well booked in for endometrial scratch will look forward to having that again not! Starting downreg meds on 26th May .


----------



## northernmonkey

Emlore - the mug idea is a good one. For my first Mother's Day, dh bought me a little photo frame that said 'I love my mum' with a little pic of dd. It's tiny, only fits a passport size pic but it still takes me back when I look at it. It's by a company called spaceform - a bit pricey but lovely. My size frame was probably a tenner or so. 

Amanda - yay, not long now! I forgot to say my amh was 12 too when trying for dd#3 and consultant was happy for me to do IUI so it must be an ok level.  

Carrie - whoop whoop, 24 weeks! Where's that gone??!!

Hak - yippee for Friday! I've got 2 kids coming home with dd for tea so will need a drink after that!


----------



## JanaH

I haven't posted on here for a while, but I am reading.


Holly sorry you are struggling to sort your dads care.   


Amanda good luck with your next cycle    


Carrie happy viability day   


Hak how are you doing    


NM, Emlore, Ju, Babdee, Mini and everyone I missed hope you are all well.


AFM: OMW, I'm really struggling to come to terms with what happened. I hate this roller coaster... I have been crying everyday trying to figure out why it happened again, DH wants me to go and see the counsellor. We had a follow up with the consultant today, we will transfer the last embryo in my next cycle. They will do a swab a couple of days before transfer, and add antibiotics. I'm going to try with only progynova and not d/r, just hope I don't ovulate. We will change the progesterone support to either injections or utrogestan, and do the Fragmin and Pregnyl again as we got a good result this time. I just hope it works as I don't know if I could deal with another loss.    My friend had her baby today, we would have been due about the same time.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Lucas smiled early too. Mw said they do smiles from a wk. 


Emlore ds1 was horrendous. I was adamant I wasn't having anymore for the same reasons. But Samuel is totally different. Like phoebe, he was a dream. Still is. You are much more knowledgable and know what to do/not to do.


----------



## northernmonkey

Oh Jana   I'm not surprised you're struggling, you've been through an horrendous time.  Today must have felt like a double blow, going to see the consultant and getting news of your friend's baby. What awful timing, not that any timing is good for these things.  I really feel for you.  I hope you don't mind me asking but are you sure you feel strong enough to try again next cycle? I know I would be the same and want to get going straight away but you sound (understandably) very fragile.  Sending you huge hugs. xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sorry I seemed to have missed loads of  posts  

Jana it's very early days so just be kind to yourself.  

Anyone want a 3 year old??


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

And a 2 year old for that matter


----------



## juju81

Janah, I'm so so sorry.  Your post is heartbreaking.  I cried everyday after my loss.  My kind friend let us have her nans holiday home in Dorset just to get away at the time.  Take your time and agree with hubby, speak to the counsellor.  She's lovely there.  Are there any tests you can get done that might give you answers on the mc's? Is it the same donor you've used all along? (Sorry I can't see your signature) big big hugs coming your way


----------



## ceci.bee

Janah hun                          I can completely understand wanting to go again after a loss, and also about other people's due dates being around the same for your lost pg                      thinking of you and hope you can get the support you need

Emlore - I only started to feel like TTC for another when J was 2+ - once they are growing up and getting out of nappies mother nature starts to kick in again - sensibly she keeps you from not wanting another when you already have one baby to deal with   take your time, and I bet you will be back having more tx in a couple of years   

Holly - good luck with your battle - at least most of the professionals are now realising how sick he is and how much you have been trying to cope with over the last few months, and I hope he gets placed soon. once he is placed, it is actually very hard to evict someone who has funding, even if they withdraw it, so that would be a good place to keep the battle for funding going. good luck, not easy at all.

AFM - AF is here and we have decided to start our 3 IUIs first, now just trying to call the clinic but they are closed until monday and doesn't seem like an emergency to call the doc with - have any of you guys who had IUI had AF start on a sat and the baseline scan on a monday?

thanks guys
lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## juju81

Ceci, my clinic don't close over wknds so not sure what would have happened.  I know I ended up having some bloods later then planned as I was away! Not sure if its the same but I'm sure one day won't make any difference.  R u medicated? I know u can use clomid 2-6 or 3-7 days so u must be able to have scans on day 3!  Come round quickly


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci I think my clinic told me that if AF arrived over the weekend scan would be on the Monday. Good luck! x


----------



## northernmonkey

Mini tell them it's 7pm and put them to bed


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

No chance of  that!!


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Have to share - we all went to bed last night about 10.30 and all woke up this morning at about 9.30! I can't believe little lady slept 10 plus hours!
I was engorged and woke a few times to check she was breathing, but all fine!

Ceci - good luck!    

Jana   

MM - I'll do a swap for my 2 year old!

Emlore - I am already broody, but sensibly I know I should stick at two! But now I have two I would be fascinated to see what other little people I could make!


----------



## Babdee

10+ hours!! That's brilliant Holly! Hope you feel refreshed!

Janah, I'm so sorry. I think seeing a counsellor would be a good idea. Much love to you xxx

Emlore, for a long time I couldn't even contemplate the thought of a 2nd child. Even though Jacob was a very easy baby, the thought of doing it all again terrified me. Even now I'm a little nervous, but feeling more excited as the days pass. My sis-in-law had 2 under the age of 2; I thought she was crazy! Just take your time and enjoy James 😊 who knows how you'll feel in another year or so 😊

Right, off to stand in a load of chicken poop now!! 🐓😁🐓

Love to all xxx


----------



## northernmonkey

Jana - have been thinking of you.   How are you doing?

Ceci - did you get your scan on Monday?

I've got a lady coming to see me and dd#1 on Wednesday from Cambridge University. She approached me via my clinic to ask if I'd take part in a study looking at mother/child relationship/development relating to donor conceived children aged between 4 and 9. I thought it sounded quite interesting so said yes we'll take part!


----------



## ceci.bee

NM that sounds really interesting - that group are the one who have done the work about telling and talking at young ages versus older ages and do great work.

Are any of you watching generation cryo? Finding it very interesting and more emotional than I thought - and also validation for the HFEA decision to only allow open identity donors in the UK - although esp strange for us as we got our DS from the same bank as they have in the show and we also dealt with the same woman who rings the kids up regularly about their donor! the donor in the show almost has the same number as ours, but I double checked and it is not the same bloke - phew!

NM I did have my scan thanks and was given the go ahead - had my second gonal F jab last night and back for a growth scan tomorrow morning - hoping for insem mid-next week I think......         trying to be as chilled out as poss - mostly as I am expecting it not to work first time   

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## My Son is My World

Ceci i love generation cryo - its had me in tears on more than one occasion. Interesting how lots of the teens stared out saying they didn't want to meet their donor but as bree found more out about him they were all coming around to the idea of communicating with him. We've always said we'll support ds in whatever decision he makes - whether that that be finding out info on his donor or not xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci I didn't realise it was the same research group. I'm really looking forward to it.  Good luck for your scan tomorrow - no reason for it not to work this month, both my medicated cycles resulted in a baby! 
What channel is generation cryo on? I'd love to watch it.


----------



## My Son is My World

Its on mtv NM - the series has just finished this week but in sure you could get it online or on catch up. It was really insightful x


----------



## amandaloo

Jana- so sorry   life is so cruel  . I feel for you I really do   . Hope your ok  

Northern monkey - that sounds really interesting I would have said yes to that as well  . 

Ceci- best of luck for your cycle I will keep everything crossed for you  

Emlore- I daren't watch it I think I'll be blubbering the whole way through  

Afm- got my drugs for the icsi cycle . Endometrial scratch booked and date to start drugs on 26th scratch 27th . Even got the prestim scan booked too for 11th June ! All ages away huh ! Still don't feel 100 percent . I can't put my finger on what's wrong with me   I feel exhausted a lot had bad headaches sore throat bit of all sorts thank goodness I'm not starting just yet !


----------



## ceci.bee

hi Amanda - good luck for you upcoming cycle - just wondering from how you say you are feeling if you have had your thyroid checked recently? It is a really common reason for IVF not to work and very easy to treat, and causes tiredness headaches and general lassitude. Keeping it all


----------



## My Son is My World

What an amazing day! I love it when the sun is out. Cheeky chops got his legs out today - everyone was commenting on how cute he was, I was such a proud mummy  Hope you all enjoyed the sun too! Xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Amanda I'm Always getting my thyroid checked if I'm
Feeling tired. It's always ok tho. 

Nm sounds interesting. Shame I can't do it.    

We don't have MTV


----------



## amandaloo

Ceci- thanks for advice . I bought myself some iron and Piriton and I've started to feel bit better . Maybe that's coincidence but anyway it's a start  . Good luck for Insem   

Hope everyone ok


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks Amanda -hope you feel better soon. Just back from the clinic - they said 'go straight home and trigger NOW your follies are ready' - back for insem tomorrow and lining looking good keeping everything


----------



## Babdee

Good luck for tomo Ceci 😃


----------



## carrie lou

Good luck Ceci


----------



## juju81

Exciting times ceci, good luck x


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks guys


----------



## hakunamatata

Good luck ceci. X x x 

Amanda he is a cutie. Will break some hearts x


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Good luck ceci


----------



## northernmonkey

Exciting stuff Ceci! Good luck!


----------



## carrie lou

Eek. I went on Xytex website yesterday to register my pregnancy. While on there I decided to look up our donor. It says he has reached his maximum number of families and no more vials are available from him, even to people who already have a child from him. So if we want a third child (  ) our two units in storage are our only hope!


This got me thinking about how many half siblings Zac might have... so I went on the donor sibling register website and put in our donor's number - there are at least 20 other children from the same donor    So strange to think of Zac and Baby Bear having that many half siblings potentially all over the world. I won't attempt to contact any of them as DH feels weird about it. I just wanted to be able to give Zac the info if he asks one day. Mind boggling


----------



## My Son is My World

Carrie i was only thinking the same thing about siblings the other day after watching generation cryo although i would assume these would all be local for us as we used a donor who attends the local hospital. Makes me wonder if they look anything like my prince. I didn't realise you could just log onto the donor sibling website - i may have a look later x


----------



## My Son is My World

Just had a look - our hospital isn't on there. I searched via the donor number and that isn't there either :-( Would have been interesting to know x


----------



## carrie lou

Hmm interesting, perhaps it's only the big sperm banks that are on there? You could try asking at the hospital. I think Holly used a London based donor and found out about siblings by asking at the clinic


----------



## ceci.bee

Emlore - your little boy will be able to find out about half sibs from the HFEA when he is 16 if he wants to - they keep a register of all births from each donor. Not all clinics I think at the mo sign up to the donor sibiling registry. I found watching the siblings get in touch with each other on generation cryo really interesting - so many of them looked so different yet all alike IYKWIM and they all got on really well (at least on camera anyway!) and it gave me hope that Joshi is likely to enjoy meeting his half sibs if he wants to when he is older - and I think he will as the main message from the programme is finding the half sibs was actually better for the kids than finding the donor and they were all driven by curiosity, which I think our children will have as well as it is totally normal and human response to the unusual situation they are in.

On another thought - I got through my 'letters to my donor' book from the NGDT yesterday and sat last night reading the letters with tears in my eyes - our letter is in there and the collection is wonderful - you can get a copy if you want from www.ngdt.co.uk/letters

Right, off for insem now -thanks for all the good wishes, keeping the PMA       

lots of love to all
Ceci 

/links


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Never heard if that book ceci. 

Oh I might look on the sibling site.  

How was insem ceci. Are you pupo?


----------



## ceci.bee

Yup Mini am PUPO went very smoothly and think I felt ovulation in the night when I was up with J at 4am- OTD 5th June.....................


----------



## My Son is My World

Good luck ceci! X


----------



## Babdee

That sounds v promising 😃 timing sounds spot on!     
Xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Good luck Ceci!


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks ladies   

Mini you can watch generation cryo through the donor sibling registry site if you want

love and light
xxx


----------



## juju81

This is where I get angry that Noah has no option to track down any siblings  

All the best ceci, bfp vibes coming your way


----------



## My Son is My World

Juju why isn't he able to track siblings? Sorry if you've mentioned it before i must have missed it x


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks Ju - is your donor not registered on the DSR?


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci - congrats on being pupo. Hope the 2ww madness doesn't set in too quickly!

Juju how's Phoebe?

Jana how are you?   Am thinking of you. 

Afm dd#3 poorly at the mo. Dr has tested her urine (had fun and games trying to put a sticky bag on her bottom to collect her pee then transfer it to a bottle...) with a dip test and thinks she has a uti  so she's in antibiotics. Poor little thing has been so unhappy today, she cried for most of the day and was obviously really uncomfortable.  
Hope she gets a bit better overnight, it wS awful seeing her like that today.


----------



## amandaloo

Ceci - Best of luck sounds perfect x

Northernmokey- hope DD3 gets better soon


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Nm aww hope she's ok.  

Ceci   glad it went well


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I'm going to register on the dsr


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

You've got to pay


----------



## carrie lou

You can just look up siblings if you know your donor's number. I didn't pay but could still access basic sibling info.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh really?


----------



## carrie lou

Yeah, that's all I did. You can't send or read any messages but you can see how many other siblings there are from the same donor.


----------



## juju81

Emlore/Ceci.....my donor didnt want to be identifiable so shoud have been destroyed when the laws changed.  Big clerical error and he wasnt    . We only found this out in 2011.  They destroyed our reminding vials.  When we decided to have phoebe it took nearly a year of fighting to import more if the same donor for sibling reasons.  It means however that neither of them can make contact with donor or potential siblings!  Big cock up!


How's it going ceci?


----------



## abcdefgh

Hi. Not been on in ages   – hope everyone is well  

Ceci -best of luck with your current cycle! Hope the 2ww isn't driving you too crazy.

Hakuna - is your section this week? Just wanted to pop on and wish you all the best. Hope everything goes well and you enjoy welcoming your two new additions to the family! 

AFM - I'm 36 weeks. Have been feeling pretty good recently and surprised how much energy I had compared to last time at this stage but all of a sudden I've got a stinking cold and feel rubbish  . Anyway, last week of work this week so hopefully I'll feel better in a couple of days and get to enjoy putting my feet up for a bit!


----------



## carrie lou

Abc, goodness 36 weeks already   How are you coping working this late in your pregnancy, I take my hat off to you cos don't think I would manage at all well!  


Ceci, wishing you luck on your 2ww  


I'm sure Hakuna was having her c-section on Tuesday - anyone heard anything? Hope everything going well for her   


AFM, my little boy turned three on Monday   We took him to Diggerland for the day and he had an amazing time. Was nice to have him all to ourselves for the day which hasn't been the case in previous years. We are having family over this weekend to celebrate.


Am nearly 27 weeks now - 3rd trimester here we come! Can hardly believe I've got this far. Feeling big but not as uncomfortable since stopping work. Back and pelvic pain a lot better thank goodness. Starting to get nursery organised which is very exciting   Baby very VERY wriggly especially in the evenings.


Lots of   to everyone. Been quiet on here, hope you are all ok


----------



## juju81

Aww happy birthday Zac  

Abcd, is given up by that point too.  My pelvis had pretty much given up and then I got shingles  

Hak has had the babies, everything went well but I'll let her give more details xx


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaw juju your profile pic is amazing!!! What a little cutie! Xxx


----------



## ceci.bee

Happy birthday Zac     and yay you are at the 3rd trimester fab news. I really want to take Joshi to digger land, he would go mad for it!

Ju agree with emlore, that picture is beyond adorable   how is she sleeping now?

AFM going slightly nutty on the 2ww - only 6 days left now, and veering all over the place, one minute convinced it has worked, the next convinced it hasn't! 6 more sleeps....................


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie - belated happy birthday to Zac! Sounds like you all had a lovely day.  

Ceci -Will you test early??

ABC gosh, not long to go now! How exciting!

Well we didn't last long without a dog.   Rehomed another rescue staffie last weekend. He's an absolute baby, so quiet and placid.  The girls love having a dog again, it's fab.


----------



## amandaloo

Ceci- the 2 ww it's a killer! Wishing you lots of luck and sending positivity your way  

Carrie- wow that's gone quick! Hope Z had a good bday 

Northern monkey - awww a new dog   take it it's settled in well ?

Juju- agree pic is adorable 

Hak - awaiting your official news )) congratulations xx

Hello everyone else 

Afm- started downreg on Monday had endometrial scratch Tuesday. So on our way again .


----------



## juju81

Glad the dogs settled well NM.  Suppose it's always a worry how they would settle in!

Ceci, stay positive   not long now 

Amanda   hun.  When is EC likely?

Ceci, she is an absolute gem.  She falls asleep about 8/9.  Wakes between 2-4, quick feed and then is waking between 7-8.  She's been moved out of our room as she kept re-waking about 5 because our room was too light.  She likes darkness.  If she snuggles into you she goes face first and nuzzles down.  We've also put her on her tummy to sleep now and that's made a difference.  She was weighed on weds and is up to 9lb 9.  As you all know, I struggled big time with Noah for the first 18months really but I don't feel like that at all.  I'd even have another one if I could guarantee they would be like her!  Noah adores her and for me, im so glad I have the age gap I have.  So so easy


----------



## amandaloo

Juju- ec likely to be 23rd June week . Glad your managing well P sounds like a dream . I always found that Noah slept better in own room too at that age . Think I'd have a similar age gap if I was ever that lucky again ! 

Northernmonkey- duh of course your dog has settled in ! I blame the drugs ha !


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci,   for the 2ww. Halfway there now! Yes Diggerland was brilliant, though he was a little overwhelmed and kept his distance from the real working diggers... Though there were plenty of 40-something men having the time of their lives on the diggers   We had a little giggle  But there were lots of other things to entertain a little one. 


Amanda, ooh you're off! Good luck    


Nm, a new dog, how lovely - bet the girls are pleased   


Juju, glad to hear Phoebe doing well   


Happy weekend everyone, we are off to my mum's cowboy themed fancy dress birthday party tomorrow night... Me in my checked maternity shirt and six month bump


----------



## Babdee

Happy 3rd birthday to Zac!!

Lovely news for Hak! 😀

She sounds a dream juju! A perfect family 😃 glad to hear the age gap is working well; will be the same age gap for us!

Not long to go now Ceci! Thinking of you   

Amanda, glad you're going again 😊 sending lots of    your way

Hi to everyone else 

I too am almost 27 weeks now. It's going so quickly this time around! Jacob has just finished with chickenpox, which was quite good timing as we go to Cornwall next week for 2 whole weeks! Can't wait to get away 😊 just got him a shorty wet suit and a fishing net today! He's v excited!
Xxx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Juju - E is exactly the same as P - wonder if it is s girl thing? I was putting it down to her having to look after herself a bit more than C did as I can't be in 2 places at once. She settles so well on her own. She sleeps from 9 ish til 4 and then again til 8. Awake for a couple of hours and then has a long sleep in the morning and then awake again for a couple of hours and then an afternoon nap and then awake again until sleep time. So very easy and nothing like C was in tems of settling very easily, being easy to read and work out if it is feed, cuddle, playtime, nappy or sleep she wants. She is such a content and happy baby.

Can't wait to hear Hak's news.  

Ceci -     

Emlore - I think the girls who have used American donors can get info from the donor sibling registry. I am not sure if UK donors are on there. I don't have a number for my donor and asked the clinic. Which reminds me I still need to get his pen sketch.

I won't bore you with where I have been - you can read from my profile the post on the other thread. Basically had a distressing time with Dad and trying to sort out his house.


----------



## northernmonkey

Holly - as a mum of 3 girls I can say it's not a girl thing   You and Ju are very lucky!!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Holly Samuel was a good sleeper. Just like phoebe is. 2nd babies I reckon. Lucas was a nightmare !


----------



## carrie lou

Maybe it's a second baby thing - we are more confident about what we are doing and our choices and have a better idea what to expect. Mind you I may well be eating my words in 3 months time   I'm convinced this baby is another little Zac


----------



## northernmonkey

Umm baby #2 not much better here either. Maybe it's just me


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

No I am ultimately sure they all have their own personalities, likes and dislikes from day 0 and whatever we do you can't really train them. Perhaps I am wrong?
But if I was doing Gina Ford or similar I would say it was rubbish if I was trying it on C, but if I had tried it on E first would say it was a dream. Actually I think the baby naturally does it or doesn't.
Best to be relaxed and go with the flow. And I think you can do that more with the second one as you have learnt the lesson.

I had a first baby who struggled to breast feed and second one who found it naturally easy. My friend had first baby who was a natural suckler who was exclusively breast fed for 6 months and a second baby who shocked her by not wanting the breast at all and after a few days had to send her hubby out for bottles, formula and a steriliser as the child was starving.

I cannot believe my little girl is 5 months old on Tuesday! And little man will be 3 in 3 weeks time.  where is the time going?


----------



## carrie lou

Actually that's one thing I was really always grateful for with Zac, that he was such an excellent little breastfeeder. I know a lot of people struggle but honestly for me it was never that hard. I really hope this baby takes after its big brother in that respect at least


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah I did gina with Lucas avd he wAs good on it and responded to it great but Samuel responded to no cry sleep solution like a dream.


----------



## juju81

To be honest, phoebe was really quiet when I was pregnant.  The amount of times I went to EPAU to be monitored due to her lack of movement and now I know it's just because she's a chilled out baby.  Don't get me wrong, I've had a few bad evenings with her and nick had a bad night last weekend when I went out and stayed out for the night but could honestly count on one hand the amount of times!


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Same here. I went to be monitored one day at the unit at work as I had not felt her move all night and all morning at work. I was scared in the end and couldn't concentrate.

I used to tell the midwife she was quiet all the time and got told off for not going to get monitored. Even given a leaflet on fetal movements and told to go as many times as necessary.
Of course she always woke up and kicked the monitor in disgust at being disturbed!

In the first week in scbu out of 5 babies in the room E was so quiet compared to them I worried if she was OK. All the other babies sounded like bumble bees buzzing or kittens mewing all night, but E was completely silent. She cries quite hard now if she is dirty, tired or hungry, but easily calmed by what she wants.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie - don't be shocked or surprised if this baby is different to Zac. He may or may not be able to do things that Zac could or couldn't and every baby is individual. I think my friend was very upset her second rejected the breast so it is best to be prepared for every eventuality and not take it to heart too much. As with all things in this fertility game, hope for the best but be prepared for the worst and always have plan B.


----------



## abcdefgh

Haha - was going to say, it's definitely not a girl thing  

My DD1 was fairly quiet in the womb but is has always been a very lively baby / toddler who doesn't seem to need nearly as much sleep as most kids her age  . This one has been more active in pregnancy so I'm hoping for the opposite outcome this time with regards sleep etc! I also like the second baby being more chilled theory   . But you just never know... 

Carrie - glad your pregnancy is going well. Exciting!

Juju - Pheobe is gorgeous  

Amanda - wishing you loads of luck this cycle   

Ceci -   

Hi everyone else


----------



## northernmonkey

Ha ha, yet again my #2 goes against the chilled second child theory! DH and I always joke that it's ironic how her birth was the easiest of the three girls yet she was (and is!) the most complex, difficult child out of all 3 of them! Unfortunately she has inherited my bad temper and stubborn streak!  All 3 of mine are fab sleepers now and #3 was best out of all 3, but she was still around 5 months old before she settled into a routine. 

Amanda - good luck for your upcoming cycle. How are you feeling? 

Carrie - like you I've been lucky and had babies who took to bf'ing immediately. I would've been gutted if I couldn't have bf'd, although I came close to giving up with dd#3 in the early days because I was positioning her wrong and it was agony. 

Jana -   if you're reading.


----------



## carrie lou

See, Zac was incredibly lively as a bump, wide awake and alert and never slept as a baby, and now is a super active child! So far this baby is at least as active, which is why I'm preparing for another eveready bunny   Who knows I could be completely wrong.....


----------



## hakunamatata

Evening ladies thought I woild come on to say hi as I've just had a feed and I'm on watch for a bit before heading to sleep.  Yes they're here. 

Emma Louise Catherine arrived 27th May 6:55 pm weighing 5lbs 10oz and
Amelia Jayne Florence arrived 6:56 pm weighing 5lbs 12oz.

Both had big weight losses originally so we are on strict feeding regime. Mixed feeding. Amelia has jaundice but A&E concluded no treatment yey. Being weighed again today.

Addi coping overall well though trying boundaries.  DH helping with night, asleep now. My turn soon. X  Sorry all me will post again soon. These 2 definitely seem more chilled so far.  X


----------



## Babdee

Beautiful names Hak 😀 huge congrats to you all, and lovely to hear from you! Can't wait to see some pics when you're more settled 😊 hope their weighings go well today xxx

It's interesting to hear of the different feeding stories between babies. I had really wanted to b-feed Jacob, but found it pure agony, and I gave up at 2 weeks. They noticed he was tongue tied at about 3 or 4 days and were able to snip that there and then, so I'd hoped he would settle down, but I could never get past it. I've been worrying I wouldn't manage again this time and feel that same guilt again. It's def interesting to hear that subsequent babies can be so different!

Love to all xxx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Hak - wonderful news - well done you!


----------



## ceci.bee

yay Hakuna congratulations


----------



## shelleysugar

Congratulations Hak on the safe arrival of your twins - beautiful names too     

I can't believe it's the 1st June already!  One month until EDD for me - where has the time gone?  I think I have an eveready bunny cooking too Carrie - looks like I'd better brace myself!  I start my maternity leave on Tuesday, which is just as well because I've taken to needing an afternoon nap lately, which wouldn't go down too well when you're teaching 30 children!

I've been a bit elusive on here lately because work has been so busy but I have a feeling I'll become obsessed again while I'm waiting for baby to arrive.  

Shelleysugar x


----------



## northernmonkey

Hak - congratulations!          Good weights too!  

Ceci - how you feeling?? I just got a huge feeling that I can see you with a little girl in the future....

Babdee - wow you did great persevering for two weeks with painful breastfeeding. My youngest didn't latch properly to begin with and it was agony. The midwife sorted me out at day 4 when I told her I was really struggling, but there's no way I would have managed with the pain as long as you did so you really shouldn't feel guilty.  One tip for you though - I was putting dd to the boob with the same hand as the side she was feeding from ie if she was feeding from the right boob, I was pushing her head towards it using my right hand. The midwife watched me start a feed and suggested I hold baby's head with my left hand instead. I remember thinking fine, I'll do it but it's not going to make any difference... Well amazingly the difference was instant and from that moment it was problem solved. So it seems sometimes a tiny thing can make a difference and it's luck if you find the right person who can give you that magic bit of advice. Good luck!


----------



## ceci.bee

NM that is so sweet of you - my PMA has taken a massive nose dive today after feeling pretty positive last week - feeling now v premenstrual and negative - not helped by having to work this am in the shed while Joshi and DH go to the park in the sunshine!
I will try to hold onto your thought   thanks hun


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations Hakuna!!!! Lovely news   Will update your details on the front page when I get a minute.


Ceci    


Shelley, wow one month to go! Enjoy your mat leave, it's such a special time waiting for your baby to arrive   And if you do have an eveready bunny - don't worry, they have lots of positive points too! Main thing is not to have too many expectations of yourself or the baby and whatever you do DON'T compare yourself or your baby to others - eveready bunnies are a law unto themselves!


----------



## juju81

I love my eveready bunny! Such personality too.  I absolutely love the 4's too.  I'd say the best age yet.  The conversations Noah comes out with has us in fits.  So, those approaching the dreaded 3's be sure to know, the 4's are just bloody lovely!

Shelley, wow one month to go.  Are you all sorted? Name? Pram?

Carrie, have you sorted names?

Ceci, I said on the other post but how your feeling could be either.  Keep up that   Lovely xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ju so in a months time I'll have an angel child then??   


Hak many congrats. How are you feeling?    Lovely names.   


Ceci I can see you with a girl too. Do you like being at home now? How has josh settled in? 


Well we are in the terrible 2s stage     Refusing to get dressed etc etc oh the joys. Hopefully we are coming to the end of the terrible 3s    But like NM, he's got my temper and stubbornness


----------



## northernmonkey

Mini - actually my recently turned 4 year old has improved massively during the last few months so have hope! 

Well my dh has gone and taken me massively by surprise and said he will discuss having another baby. I'm gobsmacked - he has always been adamant that there would be no more then yesterday he said if I was really desperate he'd consider. So I've spent all flippin night debating it in my head. My heart would love another one but deep down I know I would struggle and of course financially it would be a mad thing to do. I feel guilty that the girls don't get enough (any!) one to one time with me now so it would be even worse with another baby. I'm 40 and the risks worry me. But there's a spare seat at our dining table....  So I'll hold off selling the pram for now...


----------



## hakunamatata

Ohhh wow brave lady. X x 

We're venturing out thid am. Daddy taking addi to dance and leaving me over road in cafe. X


----------



## carrie lou

NM that's amazing!!! Good luck with your decision   


Hakuna, enjoy your morning out!  


Ceci, how are you holding up?   


Juju, yes we have names ... but as we don't know if it's a blue or a pink bundle we've decided not to tell yet  You're right about eveready bunnies and their personalities. Zac is so bright and funny. I love the imaginative games he plays, can't wait till he has a little sibling to share them with like I did with my sis. And his determination, my goodness - I won't ever worry about him getting ahead in life cos I can already see he can do absolutely anything he puts his mind to! And lately he is so affectionate too, giving me cuddles and telling me he loves me and baby bear. Really touching  He still has his stroppy moments but they are getting easier to deal with somehow.


Hope everyone is well. Did anyone else's DH have a sort of caveman regression (can't think how else to describe it!) when there was another baby on the way? Lately DH seems to be having a go at me about stupid random things like I didn't get up quickly enough to answer the phone yesterday  It really upset me, I know pregnancy hormones probably made me take it worse than I usually would but still. Later he apologised and said he is just stressed about possibly not having a job by the time this little one is born. But why can't men just say what it bothering them instead of acting like an idiot


----------



## ceci.bee

Carrie    IKWYM about men   they can be so annoying! but at least he apologised for it and did realise he was being unhelpful - not all men do that ............

NM wow 4 - I am one of 4, 3 older girls and a boy who is the youngest - was fab but also had, especially on the boy -  its a big decision but an exciting one!

Ju and Carrie I am with you on the 3-4s - Joshi is at such an adorable age, really affectionate and sweet - he came up to me yesterday saying 'mummy, would you like a kiss?' and sometiems won't let me leave the bedroom at night as he is blowing so many kisses for me and I have to stay to 'catch' them  - completely adorable. and he would really benefit from having a sibling so really keeping all the little PMA I ihave left for thursday      we are now settled back, but really missing Malawi - especially the space, the weather and our friends there, plus our amazing childcare. But it is great to be seeing friends and family here, and DH is really enjoying his job here, and working from home is working well for me for now - I would love a little girl, or a little boy, just struggling with the 2ww a bit!

I have been given a book called 'the honest toddler' - Mini I think you would find it really funny! advice to parents 'written' by a toddler - check out their ******** page

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## abcdefgh

Congratulations Hakuna! Lovely names   . Hope you've had a good trip out this morning.


----------



## ceci.bee

forgot to say you are really amazing Hak, making it out of the house with the twins so soon! hope you are feeling ok - what did you decide to do about your meds in the end?

xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Hak - hope you enjoyed your first trip out with your girls. Well done getting out so soon. Bet you had lots of clucky ladies making a fuss - I know I wouldn't be able to resist tiny new babies  

Carrie - like Ceci says, at least your dh apologised which a lot of men can't do (in fact I'm not very good at it either  ) There again I'm not good at accepting apologies either (not painting myself in a very good light am I?!) so DH would still be paying for that comment today!

Ceci - your comments about being one of four children are really interesting. In what ways was it hard? It's funny but I said to dh last night that if we had another baby and it was a boy it would totally throw the dynamics of our family (not that I would be disappointed!) At the moment it's very unlikely that we will have another. DH said he'll consider it if it's something I feel I have to do, but I wouldn't feel happy having another on that basis. It would be important to me to know that we had both wanted it equally and I totally respect if dh definitely wants to stop at 3., I certainly wouldn't resent him for it.  On a different note, I was looking through my diaries from tx months where I got bfp with dd#2 and #3 . At the stage you're at now, I wrote the following-

Dd#2 - Still no symptoms whatsoever. 2 days until test date. Can't wait for it to be over so I can get on with the next cycle.

Dd#3 - feel totally normal, can't even kid myself that I feel pregnant. Trying to stay positive, it's still only 11days post IUI but I know it hasn't worked.

Hope that helps you regain some positivity!


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks NM that is really helpful - off to buy some tests tomorrow         with regards to four kids, every family is different. My Dh's cousin is the young boy with 3 older sisters and he is the most charming, lovely man who is completely brilliant with women - my brother went the other way and really struggled with three bright older sisters, who he never felt he could live up too (partly due to his slightly odd geeky personality) and he used to get really angry with us when he was a toddler and throw sharp things at us and hit us, and when he was older he completely opted out on life and had to be pushed by mum through the educational system. There is also a 3 year age gap between him and my younger sister, so an 8 year gap with my big sister and none of us have ever really got on with him. So much with children is down to inherent personality and if he had come first he probably would have been the same (although if he had, mum would not probably have gone on to have 3 more babies   )

I loved growing up in a big family as there were always games and fights going on, and always someone to side with when someone else was being horrible, but I am not sure I would do four, although i would love 3...........


----------



## Fizzypop

Hello ladies, can I share my news     


Baby no. 2 is coming in December! I've been lying low a bit but sooooo relieved that we have got this far. Going to tell DD tonight, am so excited   


Hak - I hope your trip out went well, you are really brave going out so soon x


Ceci - love your family description! My DH is one of four (3 boys, 1 girl). Girl massively intelligent (went to oxford etc), 3 x boys had to be dragged thru education as you say too. He talks about things like not being able to take your eyes off your dinner for fear of someone nicking the good bits and eating chocolate and treats when you had it otherwise someone else will! I am an only child so never experienced anything like that!!


----------



## amandaloo

Hak     . Well done you . Hope your recovering well ? Good luck today on your first venture out 

Ceci- not long now best of luck xx

Shellysugar- wow only a month time flys!

Abcde- how are you getting on with your pg ?

Fizzypop- congratulations woop woop !!! Is that from iui?


----------



## ceci.bee

Fizzy wow congratulations that is amazing news    how many weeks are you and when are you due? Was it IVF/IUI? hope you are enjoying it and your LO is excited

Fizzy - your DH is totally right about having food (and everything else!) nicked by someone else, including clothes, toys and sweets in the interest of 'sharing!'


----------



## juju81

Fizzy you little tinker   congratulations to you my lovely.  Fantastic news.  

Hak, enjoy your coffee (and cake I hope   ). I keep saying I'm going to get a note stuck on the pram.  Everyone and I mean every stops me. This is usually how our convo goes

"Ahhhh she's tiny.  How old?"
"6wks (or whatever)"
"What's her name"
"Phoebe"
"Oh how lovely.  How much did she weigh"
"6lb 15"
"Is she good?"
"Yep"

No joke!    i LOVE the attention  

Ceci, not long.  Will you test early?

Carrie, my hubby struggles to say sorry! Can't fault him through my preg tho.  Maybe your DH is worried about the job, it's bound to worry him isn't it


----------



## juju81

NM - 4?


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

NM 4 ?   No seriously - that is lovely. My cousins had 4 - two girls and two boys and they are all lovely and all close. My mum was one of 4 girls and it does give you lots of support and friendship that I don't have as an only child.
I wonder how many kids I would have had if I had suceeded in this game at 30 like I wanted to. I now feel slightly sad that I can't realistically have any more, although the clinic seemed to think I could try when I popped in there recently. They said if you have had a baby recently you have a better chance. I haven't used older than 39 year old eggs though. Now it would be 43 year old eggs.
I should just be thankful for what I've got. Childcare costs and practicalities when I have no DH support 3 would be too much for me to manage alone.

Carrie - My DH is not behaving like a caveman he's behaving like an alien.  


Juju - I have the exact same conversation different name and 1oz difference on weight. I am always being told she is diddy and too small for 2,3,4 or now 5 months, and I have to say she is following line between 2nd - 9th centile and absolutely fine.

Fizzy - well done! You kept that quiet!

Ceci - good luck for test day. Must be exciting and nervy all at the same time.

AFM - E had her third jabs this pm. She has been fine with last two lots so hoping she will be ok this time. She cried for a minute had a feed and a sleep and seems ok. She a such a cutie. She is learning about kisses and lurching at me for sloppy licks! She is also getting really into toys and patterns and such a look of concentration. She is able to go in her door bouncer and Baby Einstein ring. I love the fell of her little hands on my face and hands.

C keeps having kisses and saying ''I love you mummy, you love me mummy?'' Also at times very naughty though!

Dad really bad, very very distressed and agitated. You would not let an animal suffer the way he is. The have put him back on antibiotics forr the 5th time in 3 months as they think he has yet another chest infection making him more confused. But they have put him on the wrong ones. He has had 4 courses of hospital acquired chest infection antibiotics, and needs to go up to next level, but nursing home doctor did not have this information, despite knowing he's been in hospital for two months and has prescribed community antibiotics. Hope this will not mean he ends up in hospital again. Hoping he can move to home near to me week on Monday.

My friend's mum died suddenly of cancer last week. We loved her. She used to look after C when I rode my horse with her daughter.


----------



## carrie lou

Fizzy, yay congratulations! You must be about 12 weeks along now - how are you feeling? I'm guessing you will have a similar age gap to us  

Holly, so sorry about your friend's mum  And sorry to hear things are still difficult with your dad


----------



## Fizzypop

Hi all, well I had what I thought was a disastrous cycle! Didn't respond at all well and then only 4 eggs collected, kept lots of pma and statistically ended up not much worse off than when I had 10 eggs in my (ah-hem) younger days...as had 2 put back, none suitable for freezer. Then just kept my head buried hoping and    That everything worked out for us as I didn't know what I would do if it all went wrong. Seems so daft now! DH tells me we are done but I will always want one more...but I don't think I can go thru another cycle x


Carrie - yep my DH is a miserable      sometimes, they r just not very good at communicating!


Holly - so sorry to hear about your dad, it sounds very traumatic but at least you know how to navigate the system - that helps massively.


Ceci - meant it say before have everything crossed for you xxx


Just told dd - she was a bit underwhelmed!


----------



## juju81

Holly, sorry to hear about your friend.  My grandma died very late last night.  Although she'd been suffering from cancer, it wasn't expected so suddenly.  She actually died from a heart attack    had an absolutely awful day.


Fizzy, it's always the cycles you don't hold out much hope for that actually work.  What's your due date?  Don't worry about DD response.  She's young still to really understand fully


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Juju


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Fizzy congrats. How many wks are you?

Hak how was the trip?

Nm   

Holly sorry about your friend  

Ju hope You're ok  

Ceci when Is your test day. ?


----------



## shelleysugar

Sorry to read about your grandma Ju    

Fizzy - congratulations, I'm sure your DD will come round to the idea!

love to all xxx

AFM: Maternity leave starts today.... yeah!


----------



## ceci.bee

Ju really sorry to hear that hun


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaw juju and holly - big hugs to you both 

Congrats fizzy!

Shelly - wow where has your pregnancy gone. It only seems like yesterday that you got your bfp!

Hi to everyone else


----------



## My Son is My World

Sorry i pressed send before I'd finished. So James has now reached the early crawling (backwards only) and being able to sit up from laying down stage. As a result hes decided he wants to practice these new skills everytime he's in his cot rather than sleep. Hes now been in there for 30mins and i can still hear the little tinker on the monitor shouting and banging the cot sides like a drum lol. Might be funny now but i wasnt so amused at 3 30am, 4 30am, 5am and 5 30am earlier! Xx


----------



## shelleysugar

Emlore - it really has flown by hasn't it!!

Your little James sounds like he is full of beans - he sounds like my nephew!  I like the idea of backwards crawling - that's quite an art!!

Shelleysugar xxx


----------



## My Son is My World

Shelley - full of beans is one way of describing it!! Are you nesting yet? Its such a magical time waiting for your bundle of joy to arrive so enjoy every moment (and get LOTS of sleep too!) x


----------



## ceci.bee

So I crackedvand tested early. Dh is on nights and its his birthday today and when he comes home I can give him the best predsent as I got a BFP!! Hope he will forgive me for the early test without him..........
Have a good day
Lots of love from a smiling ceci


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Ceci that's wonderful Hun, I'm soooo pleased for you! You must be over the moon   Wishing you a happy pregnancy


----------



## Fizzypop

Woooooo hooooooooo massive congrats and fab birthday pressie x so pleased for you xxxxx


----------



## My Son is My World

Woohoo ceci such fantastic news! Xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats ceci.


----------



## Babdee

Oh Ceci, wow!!! Congratulations!!!!!! Such fantastic news 😄😄😄      Really really happy for you 😄 xxx


----------



## amandaloo

Ceci- woo hoo congratulations BFP   

Holly and Juju - sorry for your losses


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci - I knew it!! Congratulations, fantastic news to cheer us up on a dreary wet day   So happy for you! Happy birthday to your dh too.

Shelley happy maternity leave !

Juju and Holly - sorry to read your sad news.


----------



## Babdee

NM - thank you so much for your kind words and advice  I always felt I'd given up bf too soon, but it's v comforting to hear you say I'm not a failure, esp as you succeeded, if that makes sense? The guilt lasted maybe 6-12 months; I always felt I was being judged. I will try this time what you said about which hand to use. I had a visit from the health visitor yesterday as well, and apparently a bf-ing worker will automatically visit after baby is born. This didn't happen with Jacob, so hoping this too will help 

Fizzypop, congratulations!! Wonderful news! 😄😄

Enjoy mat leave Shelley!! Not long now!! V exciting!

Holly and Juju, so sorry to hear your sad news   

Emlore, your little James sounds adorable 😊

Afm, had my 28 (well 27) week midwife appt yesterday and had the whooping cough vaccine/booster. Arm quite achy now! Baby is currently transverse, so didn't get an accurate bump measurement 😐 Next appt in 5 weeks. It's going so quickly!
We're off to Cornwall on Friday for 2 whole weeks (hence early m/w appt)!! Can't wait 😄 first holiday in nearly 4 years! Think I'll have a lot of catching up to do on here when I get back! Hehe! Hope we all get some sunny, warm weather 😊

Take care everyone, love to all xxx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ceci - how fabulous - wonderful news!


----------



## Kuki2010

Ceci,
What a fantastic news!!!! Soooo happy for you! Kukixxx


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks guys - just booked my appointment tomorrow for a beta and DH was beyond delighted to get home after a rubbish shift and open his card with the pee sticks inside    now have to do some work........hmmm not sure how I will manage that!


----------



## abcdefgh

Mistletoe and Juju - Hope you're both ok  

Fizzy - Wow, congratulations! Hope you have a very healthy pregnancy.

Ceci - Congratulations, that's amazing! Lucky you with it working first time - what a relief. Enjoy this special time.

Babdee - Enjoy your holiday!

Amanda - Hope everything is going well with your cycle so far.

Shelley - I think you're due just about a week after me so our little ones could be born very close together. How are you feeling?


----------



## carrie lou

Just been to the doctors. My poor little boy has an inguinal hernia and needs an operation


----------



## ceci.bee

Carrie sorry to hear that hun         it is a very small op, he will be fine and hope they can do it before the baby comes


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaah Carrie bless the little soldier :-( Did they say when he would be having the operation? X


----------



## carrie lou

Thanks   No we don't have a date yet, the GP is referring us to paediatric surgeon at the hospital. But he did say they do them fairly promptly especially in little boys, because of the risk of complications if left too long. So hopefully will be done before baby arrives. I just hate the thought of him being distressed   It was bad enough taking him to the GP this morning.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

C had his testicular operation and abdominal exploration and he was bouncing around after a couple of hours. The paed surgery ward we eventually had the op at was set up for little ones ( i would recommend the op is done in a paed set up ward as we had that awful first day in a cobbled together adult day surgery unit and it was so not right and distressing) and there were so many toys the operation was quickly forgotten. Gaseous induction and a caudal block given after the gas meant no needles and distress. My little boy gets distressed just by the emla cream bandages, let alone a cannula.
You can't even see the scar on his belly now as they placed it in the natural crease and it is only about 9 months.
He will be fine Carrie.


----------



## juju81

Whooooo hoooooo ceci, congratulations lovely 

Carrie, bless him.  I think it's worse for the parents then the babies. I worked on a paediatric ward when I was younger in work experience and the kids were running around in the play area like nothing was wrong xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Where's the hernia carrie?  

Samuels got to have a hearing test cos he's not talking yet. I'm sure he's fine but just need to get it checked. He may need grommets if it is his hearing.


----------



## carrie lou

It's in his groin Mini. Hope Samuel's hearing test goes well   

Thanks girls   I know he'll be ok and I know it isn't a bit deal really... It's just another thing to worry about, you know?  And DH is freaking out over whether there is any risk to Zac's fertility   DH himself had undescended testicles that weren't corrected until he was 7 and there is a strong likelihood that is the reason for his infertility. So anything in that area gets him a bit on edge.


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci, I didn't mean to overshadow your good news today. I really am so happy for you and so lovely to think of DH opening his card with the pee sticks inside   Bet he was thrilled


----------



## shelleysugar

*abcdefgh* - we do seem to be very close in dates - what is your EDD? Mine is on the 1st July. I've been fine and having a good pregnancy but this week the puffy ankles have started, how attractive!! At least I've got the ultimate excuse to put my feet up! How about you?

*Carrie* - sorry to read about your LO needing an op downstairs. I'm sure they've caught it nice and early and there won't be any long lasting problems but I understand your concerns. I hope you get a date through for the op quickly...   

hello to everyone else xxx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

It's a fairly common op carrie. Must be scary tho. He'll be bouncing about in no time.


----------



## Fizzypop

Carrie is that type of hernia a normal hernia? It can't be linked to fertility can it? Like others said more scary for us than them! 


Mini if it's his hearing then surely he wouldn't respond to your commands etc? Or can it be something else? 


Sorry if I'm being thick ladies!!!


Can someone remind me how to get a ticker? I can't remember x


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

He could have slight glue ear. They can still hear but obviously miss certain sounds to make words. He won't even say ta. He says ba. He can say mummy but when pushed. (Not physically )   he won't look at something and try to say it. He just says uuuh uuuh uuuh   he does animal sounds. I actually think he just won't talk. I asked him tonight to say ta. But screamed at me. And basically told me to butt out


----------



## carrie lou

Fizzy, just click on someone else's ticker and it will take you to the website, then just follow the steps   


No I don't think this type of hernia is usually related to fertility. But DH is worried they will accidentally nick one of his tubes or something during the op   I think it's unlikely though, I mean paed surgeons must be used to operating on tiny little bodies, surely?


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

The inguinal canal is the opening the testicle travels down during fetal development I believe, and if it does not seal properly after birth the intestine can also get into it. It can be associated with fertility issues. 

Carrie there is always some sort of risk with any surgery, but any paediatric surgeon will be used to operating to find undescended testicles as this is a comon problem in babies, so will be very experienced in identifying the structures. The risks will be very small.


----------



## hakunamatata

Congratulations ceci that's the veru best of news. Yippee

Carrie so sorry about the extra stress hun. Something you and dh dont need. X big hugs

Im just feeding amelia xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

How are you feeling hak?


----------



## JanaH

Congrats Ceci    


Hak how are you doing?


----------



## hakunamatata

Im doing ok thanks girls  coping better than I thought so far. Dh back to work monday then mum here tho. X ceci you must be grinning from ear to ear


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks Hak - yes it happened amazingly easily after what we went through first time around, we are still in shock a bit. So pleased you are doing well and the girls look gorgeous.

Janah thanks hun - lovely to see you back, how are you getting on ?                

HCG back yesterday 228 - have lost sense of perspective - is that about right for 16 days post IUI or 14 days post transfer??

love to all
Ceci


----------



## abcdefgh

I've no idea, Ceci - I only ever did HPTs. I'm sure it's fine, though. Do you have a scan booked yet?

Hakuna - Glad to hear things are going well  

Carrie - DH had a similar op when he was very small. When we first found out about his zero count we kind of naively hoped that might be the cause as then it would have been more likely to be a blockage than NOA, but the docs all said it was extremely unlikely that the op would have caused problems. And that was over 30 years ago, so I'm sure the risks are even smaller now.  

MM - Hope the hearing test goes well  

Shelley - My due date is the 23rd of June. I'm feeling pretty good for this stage, thankfully. This time last pregnancy I had horrendous carpal tunnel but seem to have escaped it this time so I'm very pleased about that. I hope this warm weather doesn't make the swelling in your ankles too much worse for you. Definitely get those feet up!


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

That is a great level Ceci - these ones are days post LH surge or trigger shot....
http://www.advancedfertility.com/earlypre.htm
Could it be twins?

/links


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

ABC - with C I had terrible joint pains one after the other in pregnancy and the first year, including carpal tunnel syndrome which got worse and worse and I was treated at about 9-10 months after delivery in occupational therapy.

With E I had far less joint pains and have not had really anything other than I have terrible carpal tunnel syndrome in my right wrist. 

I now am quite sure it is pushing my bugaboo pram that worsens it, as when I stopped using that it resolved and now it is back again, but only one wrist. With C I used to push it with both hands this time I tend to push it with my right arm as I am holding onto C with the left


----------



## juju81

Abc blimey that came round quickly! Are you all ready?

Ceci, no idea lovely.  Sounds like a decent number tho from what I've seen on FF before  

Phoebe was 7wks on Thursday and rewarded us with sleeping through the night Wednesday and Thursday.  Whooooooo.  In bed by 8.15 and woke up yesterday at 7.10 and this morning 6


----------



## abcdefgh

Yep, all ready I think Juju - finally! I'm just a bit worried about how DD will react. She has no understanding whatsoever of the fact a baby is coming to join us! 

Wow, Pheobe sounds like an amazing sleeper   Enjoy!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci yes it's a fab number.


----------



## Josina

Hello everyone 
Hope it's ok to join you
I 'know' some of you from the donor sperm thread. Hi!
Won't be able to join in parenting part of this thread just yet but I've been reading along for ages and hoping to be able to participate soon. 

Ceci-- thats a great level   Mine was 800 on 18dpiui (day19)-- see my full reply to wifey on the other thread

Hak-- congrats on your lovely new babies   

Juju-- super that Phoebe is such a good sleeper. I'm hoping my LO will be too   because you were saying she was quiet in pregnancy too, and my LO is very lazy!

Mini-- my friend's daughter wasn't talking and she kept saying that one day the child would just begin talking with full vocab. I was worried it was Autism. We were both wrong-- she got gromits and had some speech and language. They were worried shed have learning delays but now aged 6 she just has a slight lisp.

Shelley and Abcdefgh-- so excited for you both in the home stretch   sorry about all the aches and pains  

Wanted to share about carpal tunnel because I've gotten it really early   it's worst in right hand. I've been wearing a splint for two weeks and seemed to help at first but actually the pain and inconvenience is miserable. Worst thing is lack of sleep. I also tried holistically with magnesium and liquorish, which are suppossed to help. But it didnt help enough. So today, under advice from consultant doctor and my GP, I went to the hand clinic for a cortisone injection in my wrist, which is apparently completely safe in pregnancy. Injection itself was painful and then brief numbness and pain/ bruising, but it's already better and the pins and needles are gone! It's amazing. Glad I get to avoid having the operation. 
I really reccommend it Holly-- not worth all that pain   Check if it's safe while breast feeding tho. 

Afm-- had a scan today at 18+6 and everything is fine. My 20 week anomaly scan only booked for 24+5 because doctor is going on leave   So my lovely DH agreed we can go for a private 3/4D scan in 3 weeks time. Will be lovely to see LO again soon. Doctor says I should feel the kicks really soon for reassurance.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats josina  

No he's defiantly not autistic   in the last few days he's begun to say more sounds. He was shouting mumma from his cot the other day which is a first. But he can sing. He sings along to nursery rhymes with all the actions.  

I think he's just like his dad..... Slow!   but he's just turned 2 and decided he wants to be potty trained so for a boy that's really really early


----------



## carrie lou

Josina, welcome! Lovely to have you here   


Mini, isn't it funny how if a child is "slow" in one area they make up for it in another... Zac was a very early talker (for a boy) but at just turned three we are still struggling with potty training   Sounds like Samuel is the exact opposite!  


Ceci, I never had beta done but it seems like a fab number to me! Congrats lovely   


Abc, wow any day now for you! Your Edd is my hubby's birthday, can't remember if I said that before   


Jana, hope you are ok   


Juju, glad phoebe is doing well -7 weeks already!   


AFM, 28 weeks ! Saw MW yesterday and she thinks baby is lying transverse at the moment and kicking me way over on one side of my bump   Feels very odd at times. Zac is being a bit more clingy than usual recently, I think maybe he is feeling a bit insecure about the new baby. Anyone know how I can reassure him? We've been having lots of cuddles


----------



## NiceCupOfTea

Hello everyone, I was active on this forum a couple of years ago mainly on the Ds thread.  Now baby T is 2 and I'm ready to be part of this community again if you'll have me.

It's amazing to see how things have changed in that time, babies growing up and new ones coming along.  I'm hoping to join you all for the next part of the journey and beyond...

T


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone 
Can I be added to this thread again. 
DS born 17/03/10 
Been popping on and off board some of you might remember me. 
About to start TTC #2 with DIUI. 
Hoping to start down reg next week. 
Take care 
Paws


----------



## juju81

Hi Josina, welcome to out lovely home   are you staying team cream?

Carrie, Noah was only potty trained in the January last year.  Just before he turned 3.  Don't worry about it.  Some are earlier than others.  If he's not ready, leave it another month.  Makes it so much easier when you follow their lead  

Paws, my original bump buddy  . How you doing?

Cup of tea.  Are you planning anymore treatment?

I'm going on holiday a week Monday to Gran Canaria.  Can't flipping wait.  My hubby couldn't really have much time off after Phoebe was born as his work went mental and being self employed he had to take it.  So it will be the first time in 8wks where we've spent more than just a few days as a family.  Can't wait


----------



## paws18

Juju nice to hear from you. 
Have a fantastic holiday.  We are not long back from gran canaria. If your staying near peurto rico angry bird park was worth a visit our wee guy didn't know who angry birds were but loved the climbing frames etc in the park. 

Carrie - My wee guy didn't potty train till he was 3  1/2 he is very stong minded and refused to sit on the potty then after many months of me stressing he decided he was too big for nappies and he would use potty and he was dry 3 days later all his doing I never done a thing. It's worth waiting till they are ready if you can. 
Take care everyone 
Paws


----------



## ceci.bee

Hey everyone

lovely to see some old faces back on the TTC journey again, and welcome Josina, lovely to have you over here hun    

Carrie just saw your post about Zac - don't worry for a heartbeat about anything except your son's health - he will bounce through it I am sure, and the fact they got it early means I think it is very unlikely to affect his fertility in the future. if you are at work (think you work in the NHS), have a wander thro paeds surgery - you will see kids who had major ops 24 hours before bouncing around, and the parents who are carrying all the stress looking like they are the ones recovering from the op   , he will be fine.

Ju have a fab holiday - we went to Gran Canaria a few years ago and had a wonderful holiday - if you have a car drive up into the mountains, the views are amazing and some great walks and restaurants

hope everyone enjlyed the sunshine today - we had friends over for tea for DH's birthday, and had a lovely time chilling in the garden. we are missing africa a lot, but long sunny evenings defo help, as the sun went down on the dot at six there, and then the mozzies arrived, which feels a long way away in our garden in London! 

lots of love to all
ceci


----------



## juju81

Oooh Paws, were staying at the Gloria palace amadores between PR and Amadores.  Will take a look at that.  Is it past the shopping complex? Used to be a water park but when we went last year it was derelict?

Ceci, I've lost count the times we've been to grab canaria.  Started going when I was 12.  Flipping love it.  Found the perfect hotel to so were back for our 4th trip to that hotel alone


----------



## abcdefgh

Hi Josina  . Glad you had a good scan  . Sorry that you've been suffering from carpal tunnel. It is awful. Great that you've found a solution though - hope it stays away now.

Mistletoe - Hope you can get it sorted too. It's really miserable. Mine went away fairly quickly after DD's birth - I just had tingly finger tips for a couple of months after but no pain or stiffness. I didn't realise it could go on getting worse  

Paws and Nicecupoftea - welcome back and good luck!  

Juju - Hope you have a lovely holiday! We will be going to France in August when the little one will be a similar age to what Pheobe is now. Everyone seems to think we're mad but I don't think going away when they're that young is much more difficult than being at home really - or at least I hope!! It's just the car journey from Manchester I'm not looking forward to...

Carrie - I don't really have any advice about reassuring Zac as DD is much younger and doesn't get it at all   but there are a lot of books out there about families having new babies which may be nice to read together. We had a Princess Polly one out the library - there may be a Pirate Pete boys' version? 

Hope everyone's had a good weekend


----------



## amandaloo

Hi Josina - glad to hear all was well with your scan and welcome  

Paws- welcome back  ^hugme

Carrie- I'm sure DS will let you know when he's ready . Have you got that book pirate pete potty training ? It really helped me train DS

Nicecupoftea- hello and welcome 

Hak- hope your ok  

Juju- lucky you not long before your hols now eh 

Afm- well having a hard time with this downreg I'm permanently tired and had at least a week and half of bad headaches/migraines  . Been feeling a bit emotional too even getting a bit envious on ff site  . Stupid I know  . So I will just pop on now and again but if I go missing for a while you know why . Hoping that when I reduce downreg meds it will help


----------



## JanaH

Amanda hope you geel better soon, those d/r drugs are evil   I use to get really bad headaches on them as well. Hope you can half them soon, thinking off you


----------



## Fizzypop

Amanda - hope that you feel better and am keeping everything crossed that this is your time xxxxxx

I had a complete fluke with potty training. Spontaneously said to dd on thurs before Good Friday "do you want to wear big girl pants from tomorrow and no more nappies", she said ok, so I went with it and she did it! Up till that point she had done a few wees on and off but nothing consistent, never a poo and them on Good Friday she did. She didn't want to use potty or training seat just go straight for the toilet which cracked it. I had been putting her in knickers on and off when she was playing at home for a few months before but hadn't been potty training as such. 

When I look back, she was dry from Friday and I took her to a soft play centre on Saturday, I must be a bit bonkers to have out my trust in her, but no accidents!!!


----------



## ceci.bee

amanda                big hugs, this IF is so bloody unfair and completely understand backing off from FF for a while - hope the DR gets past soon and you get moving with your cycle                     this is the one for you

Janah hun        how are you doing sweetie?


----------



## abcdefgh

Amanda -  . I don't have experience of downreg drugs but know how emotionally draining treatment can be and can only imagine how much harder it is when you're feeling physically exhausted too  . Completely understand your feelings about FF at the moment and it definitely makes sense to take a bit of a step back if that helps. Wishing you all the best.    Xx


----------



## carrie lou

Amanda  My heart goes out to you, I remember last year after my bfn and then my mc how hard it was to keep coming on ff and adding about other people's pregnancies. As much as I was delighted for them, because I knew they'd been through a lot too, it was a reminder of what I didn't have (yet). Do whatever you need to to keep calm and sane. I know you will be back soon to share some good news with us  

Fizzy - lucky you on the potty training  I keep hearing how easy it is when LO is ready - just can't imagine Zac will ever reach that point without a bit of encouragement! 

Jana how are you? 

Ceci  Thanks honey. Hope you are well 

Paws, juju - oh you make me feel so much better  Zac is very much like your LO Paws, he simply will not sit on the potty and no amount of coaxing, bribing etc will make any difference - he is incredibly strong willed! And I think he gets it from me so no use complaining about that  I'm almost sure he knows when he needs to go and can even hold it for a while .... It's just the next step we need to work on. He starts nursery in a few weeks and I'm hoping a bit of peer pressure will work its magic 

Cup of Tea, Josina, Mini, Abc 

We have an appointment to see the paediatric surgeon next thurs, I'm glad we didn't have to wait too long. We spent the weekend clearing and sorting out the nursery and Zac's room - can't believe how much junk we've accumulated in three years! But it felt good to be getting things organised for the baby.


----------



## ceci.bee

Carrie - I am sure nursery will do the trick - he will train in about 5 minutes when he sees the other boys using the toilet - J was dry at nursery long before he was at home, and peer pressure works much better than mummy pressure   . Great news about being seen so quickly - not so many waiting lists in paeds compared to adults! hope it all goes well 
xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Just a quickie from me as I have a very grumpy 18month old... 

Carrie - we had problems with dd#2 holding in her poo even though she would pee on the potty. Someone in one of the other threads recommended a book called 'what's in your nappy' and within a few weeks she was doing it all on the potty. Look it up on amazon. DD still asks me to read it to her now!


----------



## Josina

Thanks for the warm welcomes everyone  

Amanda     Hope it's not too much longer on the downregging so you can get started.

Carrie-- glad you got an appointment for Zac so early. And exciting to be getting the nursery ready  

Juju-- not team cream! Couldn't wait. Actually found out at 13 week scan. It's team Blue!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Amanda   hope you feel better soon. 

Fizzy well done with the potty.  

Well Samuel had his hearing test and he's fine.    he did do well with the tests. He was do proud of himself. He didn't play up or anything. Did everything they asked. He's a bright little thing.  

There's some speech therapy drop in's I can go to to give me some tips.


----------



## ceci.bee

Phew Mini that is good news - I am sure his language will come in his own time


----------



## ceci.bee

Quick question for all you guys - I had some funny pains today on my right side so went to A&E as advised by my clinic - I am either 4+5 or 5+1 depending on how you date things, but either way very very early. My HCG last week 7 days ago was 228, today it was 2339!!!!  I had an early scan that showed one possibly two very small sacs with no fetal pole seen - now am very confused as beta is way over doubling, but pg looks very small (although super early days) - freaking out a bit - they want me back for another scan tomorrow, can't decide if I want to go or not, as can't face the thought of endless 'well its a bit too early but it looks a bit small' again - was too horrible last time   but at the same time want an explanation - any advice would be really helpful


----------



## juju81

Aww hun, is a pole expected now?  I'm
Surprised they scanned you to be honest as it's so early and just causes un necessary stress. I'm not sure I couldn't go to the scan  tho to be honest.  Sorry, not mic help am I


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci sorry I can't offer any advice but didn't want to read and run. Hcg obviously good. Did you just have scan today ? If so I don't understand why they would get you back tomorrow - surely another day isn't long enough for them to see anything else on the scan?  Far too early to see anything as you say - my guess is that there are two snuggling in hence the niggles (any chance there could be more than two


----------



## JanaH

Ceci     it's to early to see a fetal pole and the sacs will still be small. I personally wouldn't go for another scan tomorrow can they not do another blood test on Friday and rescan next week?


----------



## Fizzypop

Ceci - that's a really difficult decision - either way you are going to be worrying xxx I also don't understand why they would scan so early but they sound like a very efficient A&E dept so on balance I would go for another scan if offered, maybe they will see something and be able to put your mind at rest or give further advice xx like Jana says can they do bloods every other day too? I can't remember what happened to you before but my friend is measuring small but everything else looks fine and the sonographer told me that 1mm = 1 week at this point so it really is impossible to say "too small" due to measurement errors etc xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci, I agree with the others - it's so early and I'm not even sure they would expect to see a fetal pole at this stage. Can you possibly bear to wait a few days longer, you are likely to see more progress by then. HCG levels sound really good so be hopeful


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ceci - I had round ligament pains extremely early in all three of my pregnancies - it was the first, very prominent sign and by the third pregnancy I came to recognise it well and almost did not need to pee on a stick!. A terrible ripping pain in my iliac fossa area low down when moving in bed or sneezing. In E's pregnancy it was before my pregnancy test and very strong. I thought perhaps it was related to my previous c-section as it was very sore and the pain was a dull ache with breath taking sharp episodes with sneezing.
I had that bleed at 5+4 and went to A+E. The doctor told me that he would not be able to scan me if my level was under 1000 as there would be no sac to see. They were concerned that the pain and the bleeding might be ectopic and wanted to ensure the embryonic sac was in the uterus not the tube. I had C with me and they said if my level was under 1000 they would have to keep me in until they could scan me and see the sac.
Bloods came back and my HCG was 4200 at 5+4 which they said was very high.     I had already had a lot of nausea and they said that would explain it!  They could scan me and check the sac was not in the tube and I Went back after 2 weeks for heart beat. I had one embryo, one healthy baby.


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks so much guys       feeling calmer now - and thanks HOlly for your story, very reasuring

I think I will sit it out and wait for my booked scan at 6-7 weeks - just spoke to the clinic doctor and she said my HCG levels were going up as expected and not to worry too much, too early to say if twins or not, just have to wait it out..........all I want is a happy outcome - all the talk of early small growth brought back horrible memories of my MMC and don't want to go there again unless I have to.

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

The only reason why I wonder if they want you back daily is that you had stimulated IUI so an unknown quantity of embryos and there could be more, perhaps one in the tube and they don't want a ruptured ectopic.
As I knew I only had one embryo and they could see it in the correct place my risk of ruptured ectopic was zero.


----------



## carrie lou

Yes I meant to say, I also had that ligament pain in all three of my pregnancies and like Holly for me it was the first symptom - with this pregnancy I knew before I tested purely because of the ligament pain. Could that be what you've been feeling Ceci? Like a sharp stretching pain when you cough, sneeze, laugh or move too quickly? 


Rising HCG is surely reassuring. I can understand your anxiety though having had a mc myself   Hope the wait isn't too agonising for you


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I had a scan at 5 wks and no foetal pole then told to go back after a wk. sounds sll normal to me. .......2


----------



## juju81

Ligament pain was my first sign too,  even before I tested.   


Holly, WTF is iliac fossa


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I had ligament pain too early on.


----------



## carrie lou

It's where your appendix is Ju


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ooh!


----------



## abcdefgh

Hope you are ok, Ceci, and managing to stay as relaxed as possible  . Keeping everything crossed for a successful outcome. X

AFM - Any tips for getting a 21 month old to appreciate the value of sleep?! She has always been a very lively child and not much of an napper but it's getting ridiculous... She's been up at around 4.45 every day this week, has a maximum of an hour's nap during the day and goes to bed between 7.30 and 8, so gets only a total of around 10 1/2 hours a day, which is nowhere near what the experts seem to suggest is the right amount of sleep for her age   . I'm not really sure there's much we can do about it, though, as it seems to be enough for her at the moment - she is perfectly happy and energetic all day. I just feel exhausted by it and it's frustrating that I don't have much of an evening or any time to myself during the day when she's at home, as well as having to get up at ridiculous o' clock in the morning! Not sure what I'm going to do when my nights are also disrupted by a newborn


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Mine goes to bed later and gets up later. And no I do not get much time to myself! He has always been a night owl.

He gets up at around 8.30, but goes to sleep about 10. There are a few prebed tantrums and resistance tactics. But it I find it is impossible to get him to get into bed and go to sleep unless he is very tired. He will nap in the car. Very rarely will he have a daytime nap now otherwise.

My little girl is going to sleep at about 8.30, waking at 11 and 4 for milk and sleeping til 8. 4-8 is co-sleeping. In fact we are all in a single bed together from 4am.
She then has a morning nap and yesterday after a couple of hours play and lots of rolling over and squealing, new toys and lots of excitement she slept all afternoon.

You will find it OK with a new born. I worried before.

Is your LO waking up cold at 4am because it was hot at bedtime and all the windows were opened and by 4 it is cold. Is it the early sunrise or the dawn chorus.

Unusually, C woke at 5am today and had milk. I think he was hungry/thirsty. And then had a little tantrum about wanting to go downstairs to find a shark, then it was a kitty-ty egg (kinder surprise egg) and then after a stern word from me about it still being night time I got him to go back to sleep until my hubby tripped over something and swore at 8am.

Have you tried a glo clock or whatever they are called with sun and moon.


----------



## juju81

Hmm not sure I can help really.  Noah goes down at 7 and is up at 6/7ish.  Phoebe is now sleeping 8-5ish, quick bottle and back down until 7ish.  You may not have a newborn who wakes loads.  Before phoebe was sleeping pretty much all night, she was only waking once between 2-5!  No 2 babies are the same.  Could you try doing some controlled crying with her? Or the gro clock but didn't really work for Noah and she might be a bit young to understand the concept x


----------



## carrie lou

You could try the Gro clock, we got one when Zac was about that age and it did work to a certain extent! You can always sell it on second hand if it doesn't work out as they hold their value pretty well.


Only other suggestions I have are blackout blinds for her room in case the early sunrise is disturbing her, and perhaps dropping her nap. I sympathise as Zac has always seemed to need less sleep than others his age. But since dropping his nap he is sleeping 7.30 - 6am fairly consistently. Whereas before it was more like 8.30-5!!!! It's especially hard when you're pregnant isn't it, and all you want to do come 7pm is collapse in a heap   Hope you find a solution


----------



## ceci.bee

amanda - we used the gro clock for Joshi and he is brilliant with it - we started when he was about 2 and a half but could've done earlier I think - it made a huge difference to us. Blackout blinds could also help as early rising sun is certainily helping to wake joshi up these days - we have just put them in his room. Good luck hun!

thansk for all your help yesterday - I didn't go for the scan today after speaking to the clinic doc last night who was very reassuring - I think all an extra scan would do for me at this stage would make me more anxious - I would rather just wait for one where we could expect to see a heartbeat and go from there. thanks again you are all fab


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Abc I think personally she's too young for a gro clock. Samuel is 26 months and started waking at 5am so I feel your pain. I'm exhausted today.   It's just a phase.


----------



## abcdefgh

Thanks everyone  . I've never even heard of a gro clock - will have to investigate. She has a blackout blind in her room so it's not the light and there no open windows. I have tried once or twice to cut out the nap but she either just ends up having a really late nap or would need to go to bed early, then get up even earlier! I guess it just is a phase and hopefully won't last too long   . Thanks for the reassurance about the newborn too. I guess there's no point stressing anyway.

Mini - sorry to hear you are in the same boat  .

Carrie and Mistletoe - sounds like you've had your fair share of sleep issues too.

Juju - Lucky you! 

Ceci - I'm glad the clinic have reassured you. Do you have a date for the scan?


----------



## Josina

Ceci-- sorry to hear your worrying news. I guess they had to rule out ectopic so that's why they needed to scan, but it's too early to be reassuring and sometimes I wish these experts would keep their mouths shut! Just worrying you unnecessarily. Fingers crossed for actual scan        

Mini-- glad Samuel's hearing was fine  

Abcdefg-- sounds like good advice and worth trying. Sorry, it must be tiring


----------



## Fizzypop

Up until a few weeks ago my DD was consistently a 9-7 sleeper with hour at lunch. There are always going to be kids that are different from the norm. I just lived with getting no evening to myself (although she's very independent at playing so actually wasn't too much of a bother!) because I got a lie in  now all of a sudden she sleeps about 8-8.30-7 (and will sleep longer of given a choice!) with about half hour nap so I think it is some sort of development/phase type thing. I don't envy you those early mornings though! 

Ceci - hope you are feeling better today x keep the Pma up xxx


----------



## My Son is My World

Sleep - what's that?! No it isn't that bad now thank goodness but James has never been a great sleeper however he is amazing now compared to what he was. Hes currently going 7pm to 5am when hes wide awake and ready to start the day ( I've tried putting him down later but he still woke at the same time so I'm sticking with 7pm) plus one 40min nap early morning and one early afternoon nap of 40mins. He has both blackout blinds and blackout curtains in his room so it isn't the light waking him its just his body clock. I swear when hes 16 and wanting to stay in bed all day Il be bounding into his room at 6am every morning singing good morning to get him back 

Ceci - sending lots of pma your way! I hope the week flies by for you and you have a perfect scan 

Hi to everyone else - i hope you're all enjoying the sunshine xx


----------



## hakunamatata

Emlore that made me laugh x 

Hang inbthere ceci


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks guys - my PMA is all over the place, like my hormones I suspect - I think the 3ww for the scan is worse in some ways than the 2ww - only 10 days left and we should be 6+5 on scan day so if there is something there to see, we should see it             thanks for the PMA I need it

xxx


----------



## hakunamatata

Have everything crossed for you ceci. X


----------



## OzCalling

Hi everyone, do you mind if I join you? 


I already know many of you from the NOA and also the donor sperm threads   


This is my first ever pregnancy after being on this site for 6 years, so it's all very exciting! I'm 9 weeks tomorrow, all was perfect at our 7 week scan and now nervously waiting for our 10 week one with our obstetrician next Thursday. I hate wishing the time away but this early bit is particularly nerve wracking and I really just want to announce our news to the world and enjoy every minute. I'm so excited, tired and nauseous that I can't focus at work at all   . Just wondering when you got your nuchal translucency test done? I'm keen to get it in week 11, but am I better off waiting until week 12? 


Ceci - just wanted to send you massive       , I totally agree that the 3ww for the first scan is soooooo much worse than the 2ww! Try to keep up the PMA, it's very hard though. Hopefully Joshi is keeping you occupied and takes your mind off it all       


Abcdefgh - hope the phase is short lived! One of my girlfriends has had a terrible time with her first baby that's now 18months. I really feel for you knowing what she's gone through, sleep deprivation must be very hard


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats oz. I sometimes read the donor sperm thread and followed you a bit   
I waited 12 wks for my test. 

Do you live here or oz?


----------



## shelleysugar

OzCalling - Congratulations!!!  Welcome to the thread.  A perfect 7 week scan is fantastic and best of luck with the 10 week.  You're right, the early bit is very nerve wracking and time drags but I promise you it speeds up (almost too much!!).  I did my NT scan exactly on 12 weeks.  I guess you can enquire about going a week early but I waited.  If you're having a scan at 10 weeks, it would be nice to space them out a bit to make the waiting for the next one shorter!!

Ceci            

Shelleysugar x


----------



## ceci.bee

Oz fabulous to have you over here - so too see you and Josina join the chat on this side - and good luck for your 10 week scan...............


----------



## Josina

Hi Oz
I had my NT at 13+3 which is late. It has to be done by 13+6. I would think 11 weeks is early. There's a reason it's called THE 12 week scan. And I agree with Shelley, rather space out the scans  Mine were at 7, 11, 13 then only at 19 (too long!).


Ceci-- thinking of you. Not long now. Wishing you strength


----------



## northernmonkey

Oz - congratulations on your pregnancy, especially after such a long wait!  11 weeks is not too early for a nuchal scan - it can be done anytime between 11 weeks and 13 weeks 6 days. And a 12 week scan is actually officially called a dating scan so that's a bit misleading.


----------



## carrie lou

Oz, many congratulations and lovely to have you join us! I believe as NM says the nuchal scan has to be done within a certain window so you may want to double check, I think 11 weeks would be the earliest you could have it. Best of luck for your next scan   


Ceci   How long till your scan?


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Blood test plus nuchal translucency scan
This involves a blood test and an ultrasound scan. All women should be offered a dating scan between weeks 8 and 14 of pregnancy, and a nuchal translucency scan between 11 weeks, 2 days and 14 weeks, 1 day of pregnancy. If you choose to be screened for Down's syndrome, the dating scan and the nuchal translucency scan can be carried out at the same time, between 11 weeks, 2 days and 14 weeks, 1 day of pregnancy.

This is what the nhs say.


----------



## northernmonkey

Isn't it crazy how they set the parameters to include x number of days - how many women actually know the exact length of their pregnancy! And those of us who do because of our tx are usually given a different edd at dating scan anyway


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I have told them my EDD at my dating scan as we know exactly how old the embryo is. In my first pregnancy I could have been given an EDD 8 days later, but as it was it indicated that the baby was very sick as we knew it should have been bigger.

As for Oz's query, from a doctor friend I was told that the NT scan and blood test is most accurate if done at 13 weeks.


----------



## ceci.bee

Oz - very exciting you are getting to 12 weeks - such an important milestone

Carrie how are you doing? you must be near your due date soon?

Holly - how are things with your dad?       is he out of hospital in placement yet?

AFM - scan next wednesday, so not too long now -- this wait seems to be draaaaaaging but at the same time i almost don't want the scan if it is bad news, but at the same time need to know, so I am trying to live in lala land at the mo and concentrate on other things - easier said than done! apart from big boobs and good skin I don't have many symptoms this time around, slight nausea only but then I am only officially 5 weeks according to LMP, or 5+4 according to IUI date, so not really expecting it yet if it is going to turn up.....easy to send myself         

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## OzCalling

Thanks for the welcome and the advice everyone  

Will see how we go with the 10 week scan and ask our obstetrician about it too. Ideally we could do it at 11 + 6 as FIL arrives to stay for a week the day after and I am dying to spill the beans to everyone! So far only my mum knows and I can't wait to announce it, all our family is either in the uk, the us or a different state in Aus so be nice to tell one of them face to face. Fingers crossed! 

Ceci - time is going soooo slooooowly for you I bet. Hang in there     Your symptoms sound good


----------



## northernmonkey

Ceci - honestly, I've no doubt you're fine. I didn't have any symptoms until around 8 weeks and even then they were very subtle.  

Oz - whereabouts in Oz are you?


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci   At 5 weeks the only symptom I had was sore boobs! The rest arrived about 6 weeks. Thinking of you Hun  


My EDDs have never been changed. With Zac he was measuring spot on at 12 weeks and I told them I was certain of my dates, so they left it alone. This time baby was measuring ahead but again I said I'd had IVF, and again they didn't change my EDD. I'm glad really as I know almost to the hour how old this baby is   


Had a funny conversation with Zac this morning. He asked me who made us? So I reminded him how a baby starts from an egg and a sperm. Then he immediately asked, why didn't daddy have any sperm? I was really surprised, it's the first time he's brought up the topic himself, quite exciting to know he is obviously taking in the information and thinking about it


----------



## Jess81

Hello Everyone, 
hoping you don't mind me joining you. I've only just found this thread.  I'm currently 20 weeks (Tomorrow) pregnant with our first baby, We used double donor after 6 failed tx using our own. 2 drs told us it was likely that DH's sperm was DNA fragmented and because his count was so low they couldn't test it. We decided on double donor for various reasons, but i felt that we personally couldn't just use donor sperm we couldn't get our heads round it... i also felt there was likely something wrong with my eggs because the quality of the embryo's were never that good and never got to blast! 

we have our scan tomorrow and are staying team cream!! 

hope to get to know all of you better soon xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Hi Jess! welcome and congratulations! I know you from the Nov/Dec thread which I moderate   Lots of luck for your scan, I really enjoyed my 20 week scan both times - so detailed


----------



## Jess81

Thanks Carrie, 
please can you add me to the front page. xx


----------



## carrie lou

Sure will Jess   


While I'm at it I notice I've been terribly slack about maintaining the lists - Juju and Hakuna in particular, can you let me know what details you'd like me to put for your LOs as I see you are both still on the "bump" list   Sorry about that!


----------



## JanaH

WARNING: sorry this will be a me post but I am fuming    and need some honest advice please

Well we transferred our last embryo on the 6th June. From a day after transfer I had to inject Pregnyl every other day. I had my first bloods done on Monday which came back as HCG 41 and progesterone 35, I repeated it today HCG 39 and progesterone 46. The clinic called and said it's inconclusive and I need it repeated on Friday, but we go away tomorrow until next week Sunday. So they said to continue with my medication until the 30th and come back for another blood test. I told them I took my last pregnyl yesterday morning and if that could have an effect on the result which off course brought up some alarm bells. 

They told me I should have stopped the pregnyl but no one told me to, and asked if I did the same last time and I said yes I was still taking it when we had the miscarriage. I will do a serious investigation into that at a later date as I'm not happy with how things are being dealt with at the clinic at the moment...  

For know they don't want me to stop my medication just incase, but I don't know what to do. Do I continue with the progesterone and progynova and see what happens maybe do a hpt over the weekend and if that is negative stop or continue and hope for the best with the next blood test. They told me to stop all meds if AF arrives. I'm in limbo at the moment. 

Seriously can't deal with all of this.

Hope everyone else is doing well.


----------



## ceci.bee

Janah             I can totally see why you are fuming hun, they have not been clear with you at all. I have never heard of anyone taking preganyl continously, I took both progesterone and progynova (oestrogen) for both my frozen cycles and with Joshi I took them both up to 10 weeks.

I would defo not stop taking either of them (and ask if you need some more progesterone, as my clinic like blood levels of >100) - but it is very odd you are still injecting preganyl which is basically HCG- usually it is given to trigger ovulation as a once off and that is it - did they prescribe you lots of it?? I would phone back and ask to talk directly to the consultant, and make it clear you only want to talk to the top doc to get definitive advice  - when is your OTD? 
Big       and good luck

lots of love
Ceci


----------



## JanaH

Hi Ceci,

Well today is 12dp5dt, I didn't do a trigger the pregnyl is just the 1500 booster shots every other day. Last time I got 6 ampoules until test date and then they repeated the prescription and gave me until my appointment with the consultant. I had 6 left from last time so they didn't give me any new ones. It is only until I mentioned it today that they knew I was still taking it, but they gave those to me last time that is why I don't understand this massive missunderstanding. I did ask about the progesterone and they said it's fine. 

The consultant is only there on certain days as his also a NHS consultant. I'm so going to try and find a different clinic after 3 FETs and 1 Fresh cycle so all in all after 7 embryos we still don't have an ongoing pregnancy. 

What annoys me even more is we pay a lot of money and I know mistakes are made easily but surely not when it comes to medication.


----------



## ceci.bee

Janah              , even if your consultant has a NHS practice as well as your clinic he is responsible for your care and therefore should be available to talk to - I bet the clinic have his mobile number and can call him, asking him to call you - threaten a complaint - should get it happening. I totally agree that medication issues should not happen anywhere, but particularly in such a sensitive area. There is no way of knowing at the mo if your blood HCG level is a pg or the preganyl, I guess if you stop it and repeat in a few days they will know, but defo worth talking to the boss about. and switching clinics for the next cycle sounds like exactly the right thing to do! good luck hun


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Jana - I have heard that some clinics use HCG injections for repeated miscarriage to help establish the pregnancy and help the embryo along a bit if it is not making enough HCG of its own. I am not sure how it works as I am sure there are many many hormones involved with chemical messaging between the mother and embryo and HCG is just one that we can measure. But anyhow, I have heard of it before.
There is not anyway of knowing if the blood results are the pregnyl or not.

Ceci - the hospital wanted Dad out, of course. The home near me was not up and running at the time so they put him in a temporary placement near where he was in hospital. It is supposed to be a great nursing home NHS continuing care use all the time and apparently there are homes they would not put anyone in. 

I have to say I am not particularly impressed with the care. He is supposed to be funded 1:1 24/7, but he has had some continence disasters where he has been so confused and left alone in a strange room over night, he has been very aggressive and they have virtually wiped out his mobility by stopping him from getting up and walking like he was wandering about in hosptial. The care in the hospital ward was better I think. They are even making him sleep on a mattress on the floor to stop him getting up at night, which apparently is meant to be a least restrictive method!

They were also sedating him too much all day and making him more confused and unsteady.

He cried when I last saw him and just wanted cuddles. He had few words - like ''I have not got any money'' or ''I don't know what to do...'' but not much else. He does not understand much of what you say, but loves the children.
He has missed father's day, my birthday and C's birthday as I can't get over there this week preparing for C's party and various other things like my birthday lunch, a funeral and solicitor appointment.

I had a word with the social worker who is looking after the deprivation of liberty order and he has observed care at the home and has given some advice based on my complaints and he has been back to check on him and reports that he has been a bit less aggressive since they have allowed him to walk a bit, reduced the sedation and been less in his face all the time. He did say that he looks very tired - poor man must be exhausted being in a heightened state of fight or flight all the time at his age.

He is also on his 6th chest infection in 3 months which does not bode well.

I had a shock though - NHS CHC rang me last week and said that the home near me is now asking for £3000 PER WEEK for my Dad's care after assessing him. So it looks like I might be asked to leave him where he is at £1000 a week or find something else near me. It is so depressing why nothing can ever run smoothly. But at least the NHS is providing his care at the moment.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh janah what a nightmare   I would demand you speak to someone today. 

Holly hope you get your dad sorted.


----------



## carrie lou

Don't have much time but just wanted to send massive   to Jana, so sorry for what you're going through - you've every right to be fuming   Especially with the amount of money we spend on these things, you'd expect them to pay a bit more attention to detail. Really hope things work out for you   


Holly sorry to hear about your dad   What a nightmare


----------



## ceci.bee

Janah hope you managed to talk to someone sensible and have a plan hun            

Holly so sorry your Dad is still in such a bad way - £3K per week  puts the cost of IVF into perspective a little bit - hope he gets a bit more settled in the placement

Just wanted to post this link in the donor sperm thread about the HFEA - looking for views about donor conception and pays £50
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=322923.0;topicseen

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

That's a shame carrie, I'm away next wk otherwise I could if done it. I do a lot of focus groups. Easy money. I did one on wed talking about flowers


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci I'd love to do that but we live so far from London, the train fare alone would be more than £50  But I've done the online survey at least.

Zac started asking me again about eggs and sperm this morning - in front of MIL!    I thought she was going to have a heart attack, but no, she took it all in her stride... perhaps there is hope yet  

We saw the paediatric surgeon this morning and Zac does not in fact have a hernia - whatever it was has gone away by itself so no treatment needed unless it comes back. I'm very relieved


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaw Carrie what a huge relief that must be for you  xx


----------



## abcdefgh

Jana -   Sorry for what you are going through. I hope the clinic give you some answers and can make it up to you somehow.

Carrie - That's great news  

AFM - Our lovely baby girl was born on Monday - one week early. It was a horrible labour but we are both doing well now. DD1 is being very sweet and well-behaved so far (apart from still getting up at 5!). I feel like a very lucky mummy


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations Abcd! Hope all going well


----------



## OzCalling

Janah - so sorry to hear about your clinic, that is really awful of them and I completely understand your anger. Have you managed to get in touch with your Dr? I hope you get some answers soon     


Holly - sounds like you've had a very stressful time finding good care for your father, hope his health picks up soon   
CONGRATULATIONS abcdefgh!!! Wonderful news, lovely to hear DD1 is being a good big sister     


Northernmonkey - sorry never replied to your question! We live in Sydney, have done for the past 4 years. Before that we were in Brisbane for 3, I'm already losing my English accent


----------



## ceci.bee

Congratulations ABC that is wonderful news delighted for you! hope you recover and start to get some sleep soon.....

Carrie phew what a relief, so happy for you guys - it is interesting Z is so interested, J is not the slightest bit interested, including refusing to read his my story book recently, because it makes him 'feel sad' in his words   hope that will pass - think I will make one of our own with our own pics in, will help him more....

xx


----------



## carrie lou

Aw bless him Ceci - I'm sure as he gets older and can take it in better  he'll show more of an interest.  How are you doing?


Well I have an interesting problem.... I've just discovered Zac has a half sibling living in Canada. I even know the child's name thanks to xytex's connections website. I wasn't trying to find out but received an email from the child's mother who wants to make contact with half siblings. I haven't told DH anything about it because I don't think he would want to know. Don't know what to do... On the one hand my curiosity is killing me! But I don't want to go against DH's wishes.


----------



## ceci.bee

Carrie that is a really tough one. I think you have to be honest with DH - you didn't solicit this info, it just came to you, and then you can decide what to do about it together. I thought about looking at the DSR and decided that is Joshi's info for him to discover when he is older if he wants to. You could always email this woman back and just say sorry but no thanks for now - but better you and DH do it together.

good luck, let us know how you get on, as lots of us will end up in a similar situation I suspect in the coming years.....
xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

OMG carrie   how did you find that out? We are with xytex too. I need to know


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh abc just seen your news.     What went wrong with the labour?


----------



## carrie lou

Mini, when I registered Zac's birth and this pregnancy with them apparently I was automatically signed up to their connections website - then out of the blue I got this email saying someone else on the site wants to be friends with me. So I logged in and found out she has a child by the same donor and is looking to trace half siblings   Didn't even realise it was possible


----------



## shelleysugar

CONGRATULATIONS abcdefgh       xx

Carrie - what a dilema! ~Talk to your DH about it and make a decision together.  I guess that's a situation we could all face in the future!  Interesting....  

Shelleysugar xxx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I can't remember my password for xytex. I need to email them cos I'd like to find out how many siblings he's got. You might get a cheap holiday to Canada


----------



## northernmonkey

Apologies in advance if I miss anyone. DH has gone cycling in the alps for the  weekend and I'm totally worn out after just 36 hours on my own with the girlies. 2 more sleeps to go.... I had to get the three of them ready this morning and be at dd's school at 8.15am for the school photo because younger siblings can be included. Well I already felt like I'd done a full day by the time I got there, then the photographer sat the girls on this stool and took a few photos and next thing dd#2 fell off the flippin stool  and screamed the place down!  I eventually calmed her down and managed to bribe her into agreeing to try another photo (the first ones were rubbish) on the promise of a sticker book, then there was a power cut so I gave up and came home. But still have to buy the sticker book tomorrow.   

ABC - congratulations! Fab news! What weight was she? Hope you're all doing ok and enjoying being a family of 4. 

Ceci - how are you? When is your scan?

Jana - I'm not surprised you're angry, that's shocking treatment. I hope you've managed to get some answers. Which clinic are you at?

Oz - what took you over there? Do you miss the UK?  My dh visited Perth a few times through work and absolutely loved it. 

Carrie - I'd definitely discuss it with your dh but I'm like Ceci, I want all contact with siblings to be instigated by the girls if and when they choose.  And if I'm honest I kind of want to bury my head in the sand a bit! That's amazing that Zac is talking about the donor stuff. Even my eldest doesn't bring it up!

Mini - how on earth do you get involved in a focus group about flowers ??!!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

They wanted to know why people didn't but chrysanthanans.   you register with loads of companies and they send you emails about each group. £40 easy money. I did one on nappies for a month. Free nappies and £80. I made half of it up. You had to weigh the nappy and say if it sagged etc.


----------



## northernmonkey

Oh cool! I like the sound of that! I could do it and not tell dh then keep the cash lol - only kidding - too honest for my own good I am   Which companies, I want to register!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Just google market research focus groups


----------



## carrie lou

Hey ladies, I talked to DH last night and as I expected, it was a flat no - he doesn't want any contact. I do agree it should be Zac's (and Baby's) choice when they are old enough as to whether they want to trace half siblings. 


It's just so interesting and weird to think of them being out there somewhere! But obviously I won't take any further action.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah probably best to wait for the kiddos to make the choice. Exciting and scary tho


----------



## shelleysugar

Carrie - that sounds like a sensible choice but it would be good to retain the details as a starting point for if and when the time comes that Zac and baby bean want to follow it up.   x


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I'd send an email saying thanks, but it should be the child's choice when older, but ask that they keep you up to date with contact details.

It is funny to think of siblings and what they might look like and be like and that there could be a huge family out there. I would love my children to have contact with half siblings, but my DH would be the same and I wonder if there is a facility in the uk anyway?

I know my donor reached the 10 family limit and there was at least one set of twins in 2010 and now E in 2014.
So at least 12 children and maybe more siblings in between or to come plus any donor's own family.
Could be quite a few!


----------



## carrie lou

Yes, I know our donor has reached his maximum family limit and there are at least 20 other children out there somewhere (not counting this baby). That's worldwide though and just the ones that are registered on DSR. It's sort of mind boggling isn't it, you try to mentally prepare yourself that this might be the case but the reality is hard to get your head around


----------



## ceci.bee

I totally agree it is a really weird thought - but one thing I really enjoyed about watching generation cryo is I think that Dee has either 15 or 25 half sibs and she meets them all, and they all really enjoy getting to know each other - and I hope the same will be true for J if he decides he does want to meet half sibs, as I haven't looked deliberately at the DSR but I am sure he will have lots as we used a US donor so no family limits.

2 sleeps left until my scan - feeling a total mix of   and   and am going a bit


----------



## My Son is My World

Carrie that email must really have gotten you thinking. I often wonder about any half siblings that James may have and emailed my clinic a couple of weeks ago out of curiosity and found out that he already has one half sibling and there are a few people lined up for treatment with the donor too. As we had our treatment at the local hospital i do wonder how close these people may live to us. I guess there will be many situations that occur in the future that are going to get us all thinking but all we can do is put our LO's needs first and do what is best by them xx


----------



## juju81

Just back from holiday, amazing time.  Both of them were amazing.  Noah loved it and phoebe just chilled out   


Abcd, congratulations lovely.


Carrie, I'm happy for all info...Phoebe Amelia, 6lb 15 17th April 2014


Ceci, good luck for tomorrow chick   


Jana, holy heckers,  I'm not keen on the clinic since Di left,  I emailed them a pic of phoebe and they didnt even acknowledge it    


Hi everyone else, sorry, need to get myself bathed and in bed!


----------



## OzCalling

Ceci - best of luck for your scan, will be thinking of you! Such a nerve wracking time, let us know how it goes and sending masses of vibes for a lovely flickering heartbeat       


Janah - any news from your clinic? Hope you are doing OK   



Very interested to hear about the half siblings side of things. We're in a different situation obviously as we're using known donor, so our children's cousins will also be their half siblings. It will be interesting to see how they all feel about that over time!


Northernmonkey - my DH (then my DB) took me over here, although it was really me who pushed him (he's Aussie but lived in UK for 7 years). I was blown away by the lifestyle here and wanted a lot more of it. I miss family and friends, but it's hard to miss the UK itself when we spend most weekends on our boat, swimming, eating, napping and reading!!! I still pinch myself at how good it is, sorry to sound so smug! I no longer post photos on ******** as it just looks like I'm showing off   


Juju - your holiday sounds perfect, amazing how good they both were! 


AFM - had our first obstetrician appointment today and our second scan. Bean is perfect, got to hear the heartbeat for the first time which was incredible. I'm still waiting for someone to wake me up and tell me it isn't real! Now all booked for our NT scan at 11w + 6, should be fine as the baby's measuring 4 days ahead so going by GA will be 12w + 3. So happy


----------



## juju81

Oz, what was your BIL's reaction to your preg? And his wife?  My sisters just returned from Oz! She came home to be with her boyf! I have a feeling she'll go back out there in a few yrs tho with him and live


----------



## ceci.bee

hi everyone - just back from my scan and had a pretty unusual result - wondered if any of you know anyone who has been in the same situation? we have two pregnancy sacs, but only one has a heartbeat, that LO is measuring perfectly for dates and looks great. the other sac has a distorted shape and the sac is full of blood, and they say I will miscarry that one. But I have had no bleeding at all so far, and it looks like the healthy LO is blocking the way out  for the other one - the healthy one is in the lower sector over my cervix, and the other one is at the top. they say they don't know if I will loose both, or if as the healthy one grows it will move and allow me to miscarry the other one, or if the healthy one will absorb the other one in time and continue to grow. We are back for a scan next week and in the mean time have to rest, no exercise, no sex and wait and see. I keep trying to hang onto the good news that we have a lovely healthy LO with a good heartbeat who is growing perfectly, but it is hard knowing we could loose it.   If any of you know anyone who has been in a similar situation I would love to hear about, and in the meantime will wait for the next scan.........7 sleeps.............

xx


----------



## JanaH

Ju glad you had a good holiday.

Oz enjoy your pregnancy it goes very quickly  

Ceci hope your scan goes well today.  

I'm on my phone so can't do long post. I did a hpt on Saturday which was negative so stopped all my medication, AF arrived yesterday evening but its not very heavy its actually quite light for me. Had a massive migraine last night and woke up with it as well. At least we are having an amazing camping trip in Belgium the weather is gorgeous everyday so far has been in the high 20's. 

I think we have reached the end of our journey, we have 5 vials left but I don't think I can go through IVF again.    I'm not getting younger and the money isn't getting more   Its going to be a hard journey to get through as I really wanted a sibling for Joseph as we have no family in the UK.


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Jana I'm so sorry Hun   Try to enjoy your holiday as much as you can and maybe when you get home you'll be able to look at things with a fresh perspective. I know what you mean though, IVF takes so much out of you physically and emotionally so can completely understand why you would want to call it a day especially after everything you've been through. Thinking of you     


Ceci, I'm afraid I don't know of anyone in a similar situation - it must be a worry but try to focus on that healthy little bean and I'll keep everything crossed that it hangs in there    Thinking of you too     And hope the next week passes quickly for you.


----------



## Jess81

Cece, I had a twin pg but lost one at 8 weeks. I didn't have any bleeding at all so must have absorbed it. My second sac was there at 12 week scan but didn't cause any issues. 

Try not to worry though and if u do have any bleeding don't think the worse as it's likely to be this sac. Xx


----------



## ceci.bee

Thanks so much Jess that is really helpful to know and good advice. Congratulations on your healthy LO

Janah hun            I am not surprised you are exhausted emotionally by everything you guys have been through            we are all here to support you in whatever decision you make is right for you guys - such a tough call


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I know a lady at work who bled and lost one pregnancy sac and the other one went full term and another lady at work who had disappearing twin syndrome.
Of course Yaya had to have a selective termination in the second trimester for a chromosomal anomaly in twin 2 and the whole baby was reabsorbed.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Jana     

Juju - lucky you having a nice holiday. I a desperate for a holiday but can't see one happening. Of course DH went to Normandy for d day last week, a concert on Saturday and this week he has gone to work at Glastonbury. But I am still here.

I started weaning E yesterday properly. She has had a suck on a couple of bits of cucumber and water melon and a teaspoon of apple juice in the last few weeks, but nothing much. 
Yesterday I decided all of a sudden that she was ready for proper meals and made her some baby rice. I was only going to give her a teaspoonful, but made a bit more than I planned and she ate it all and nearly had the pattern off the plate too. She has just had another few spoons of rice today. Tomorrow when C goes to preschool I am going to make her some carrot, pear, apple and butternut squash purees and put them in ice cube trays. I have also bought her some rice cakes to suck on. I am going to do a mix of finger foods (baby led) and some purees to get some nutrition into her. Much the same as what I did with C. Very exciting - but I still can't quite work out how 6 months has gone by. 

I bought her a load of clothes in ASDA earlier. I probably do not need any clothes at all, but there were some really cute things. I bought 6-9 months. She has only just grown into her 3-6 month clothes (6 months next week) but I have loads in this size already.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci try not to stress. A lot of women wouldn't have scans at your stage do wouldn't know they were carrying twins. Praying it turns out ok. What will be will be  

Janah   hope you're ok  

Oz I'd love to live there. Don't blame you for pushing dh to go.   

We are on our first caravan holiday   boys love it. I'm about to kill all the seagulls for keeping me awake


----------



## OzCalling

Jana - so sorry      hope you are enjoying your holiday and take some time to make whatever decision's right for you     


Ceci - think it's 2 more sleeps til your scan, sending you masses of       


Mini - hope you've managed to quieten the seagulls, glad your boys are loving the caravan holiday! 


Holly - glad to hear your little girl is taking to solids with gusto 


JuJu - we haven't told them yet! Partly due to superstition about jinxing things, partly due to them and us not wanting them to be any more of a special part of this journey than they already are. BIL in particular didn't seem keen to hear about our treatment, he was happier for us to get on with it as our private business and he's just looking forward to hearing the happy news that he'll be an uncle. Both he and his wife couldn't have made this easier for us TBH, so far they have been the perfect combination of supportive but not intrusive in any way so let's hope that continues! They'll obviously be the first to know after our 12w scan on Monday, can't wait to go public. Silence is not my strong point and am avoiding speaking to most of my friends as I'm too scared I'll blurt it out, silly really


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oz sounds like you've got the perfect support in your BIL and wife.


----------



## abcdefgh

Thanks for all your congratulations   

Mini - She was back to back so it was just very long, slow and extremely painful, and ended in forceps in theatre. But we were both absolutely fine afterwards and it's all forgotten about now so we are actually very lucky. Hope you are having a lovely holiday!

NM - She was 7lb 11oz so not that small but seems tiny compared to DD1, and DD1 suddenly seems to weigh an absolute tonne  

Juju - Glad you had a good holiday. Sounds ideal.

Shelley - Happy due date! Hope things get moving soon and that everything goes smoothly. 

Ceci - Thinking of you and hope you are feeling as relaxed as you can. I have everything crossed that your strong little one continues to progress well.

Oz - Your life in Oz does sound great - well done! And I'm happy everything is going so well with the pregnancy.

Mistletoe - Wow, doesn't time fly? Glad to hear the weaning is going well.

Hi Carrie Lou, Emlore and anyone else I've missed.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

We have chicken pox! only about 5-6 spots on C so far. They both had a temperature last week/weekend, now the classic blisters.

Dad seems calmer, which is bitter sweet if the nhs withdraw his funding. But at least he is a bit more settled, I still want to move him nearer me, and the psychiatrist who I saw with him yesterday said any unit he goes to needs to be for dementia and challenging behaviour.
Poor man though was trying to cry and telling me that no one wants him any more. I tried to explain that I could not get over there with lots going on and this is why I wanted him to live near me, but I don't know if he understands.


----------



## ceci.bee

Holly, so pleased he is calmer but so sad that he is so ill, big hugs to you and him both              

Oz, agree with Mini, your BIL and his wife sound really well set up - hope you enjoy telling them both   what a precious moment

AFM had our scan today - our little beanie has a good strong HB and is measuring at 8+2 (I am 7+6), and has moved up and out of the way, whcih is great. The other sac is breaking down and they say I should start to bleed soon - so many mixed emotions, happy to have a healthy baby but sad to say goodbye to the non-viable twin   - and hope that we don't lose both


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci, that's great news that your little bean is doing so well. Sorry about the other twin though, must be very mixed emotions for you  but stay strong for that little fighter hun      


Holly, that must be heartbreaking seeing your dad so sad  Glad to hear he is calmer. Sorry to hear you have chicken pox, we are still waiting for that - but as Zac started nursery this week, don't suppose it will be long - only hope it won't be too close to due date!


Abcd, sorry to hear you had such a hard labour hun, hope you had some good pain relief  


Oz, so lovely that your BIL and wife have been so supportive of your situation  How are you feeling?


Mini, glad you and boys are enjoying your hols  


Hope everyone is well. I spent most of today being monitored on antenatal ward, with suspected pre eclampsia after developing blurred vision and flashing lights  Was pretty scary but thankfully all tests came back ok and baby is fine. Dr thinks it must have been a type of migraine even though I had no headache  Just glad everything is all right. 32 week scan and consultant appointment tomorrow


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci glad everything is ok. Just think of the bean that didn't make it is keeping the little one going.  

Carrie glad you're ok.   Samuels been at nursery for over a year now and still hasn't had the pox. Wish it would hurry up  


Holly glad to hear your dad is calmer.


----------



## OzCalling

Ceci - must be such a relief that your little one is doing well and has moved up and out of the way. Wonderful that he/she has a nice strong heartbeat, I'm sure you have a fighter in there! Still very sad that the other embie didn't make it and that  you will start to bleed soon, look after yourself and rest up as much as you can     When is your next scan?


Holly - sounds like such a difficult situation with your Dad    sorry to hear you're coping with chicken pox on top of it all  


Carrie - glad all is ok but must have been worrying. Hopefully just a one off blip! Best of luck with the 32 week scan, not long to go now! How is Zac settling into nursery? I'm feeling good thanks, think my energy levels are beginning to pick up which I'm grateful for


----------



## Jess81

Cece, just wanted to say i lost a twin at 8 weeks but i never bled. so if you don't try not to worry!! i was told that the body can re-absorb the lost one which is what obvioulsy happened to me. big hugs, it's a very mixed emotional time... i felt bad for feeling sad when we had such a little fighter in the 2nd one. xx

Holly, sounds like your really going through the mill at the moment, your poor dad. it's so sad isn't it. we have a lot of altzimers (sp) on both sides of our families so i know how you feel. 

Carie glad all is ok with you.

Hello to everyone else. 

AFM i have another scan today, little monkey wouldn't get in the right position for certain heart meaurements 2 weeks ago so have to go back, at least we get to see baby again. 

xx


----------



## WolfyOne

Hi everyone, I am rather cautiously joining the thread after getting a BFP on a Clearblue Digital yesterday. I also got a faint positive on a Boots test and a was-it-even-really-positive on a One Step cheapie. I tested again this morning with the One Step (only brand I have left now) but it's still not really showing anything, but I'm trying not to worry and will use another tomorrow. Strange as apparently the One Step is more sensitive than the other two 

The clinic have booked me in for a 8 week scan in 4 weeks time. In the meantime, I have ordered a couple more Clearblue Digitals so that I can test each week and make sure things are progressing ok. I'm feeling as though I'm too worried to be happy at the moment! There have been a couple of miscarriages in my family so feel as though I am really aware that things can go wrong. 4 weeks seems so far away!!

We are due to fly to Latvia in a couple of weeks for a long weekend (family wedding). I have been umming and arring about whether to cancel as my clinic advise no flying in the first trimester. I know other ladies' clinics are not so strict. My parents have been researching around and think maybe it would be best if I cancel given everything we have been through to get to this point, even if the risk is minimal.


----------



## juju81

Ceci, glad the scan went well.  Sorry about the twinnie.  They say everything happens for a reason    Are you at risk of PP again?


Wolfyone, congrats chick.  Word of warning, my digi's never moved up as they should have with Noah.  Got myself into a right tiz about it but everything was ok.  Personally, I'd say step away from them    


Holly, ah bless your dad.  Does he still know who you are? Getting him nearer will make things a lot easier.  How is home life? How is DH? Any change?  Noah had the pox last year, he'd just turned 3.  He wasn't covered and only had one day where I had to give him calpol.  Eurex is amazing stuff.


Oz, your BIl and wife sound lovely.  Thing is, it's not really anything to do with them now is it.  Just like our donors aren't.   


All ok here.  Phoebes sleeping through, Goes down at 6.30/7 and wakes between 6/7.  She's amazing.  She makes me broody   .  I've been referred to a hip specialist because of my hips.  Doctor thinks I have Hip Impediment and an X-ray showed a bulge on my left hip joint (the ball part) so might have to have key hole surgey to remove it.  All that plus in 2912 my egg reserve was only 3.something I don't think my clinic would treat me with IUi again and no way would I have or afford IVF.  I feel really sad actually.  I can't even bring myself to get rid of anything this time    A friend announced her pregnancy on ** the other day and I felt that awful jealousy   .  I need to get a grip and enjoy my beautiful 2 I have!


----------



## juju81

http://s1374.photobucket.com/user/juliegrieves81/library/Phoebe%20Amelia%20Grieves

I've added 5 more pics

/links


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## juju81

If it asks for a password it's phoebe


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## amandaloo

Hi everyone 

Ceci - sorry to hear about the loss of one of your twins    so glad that your other one is doing well . It must have been a massive relief having that scan   

Holly- sorry to hear about all the troubles with your Dad . It will make it so much easier if he moves nearer to you  

Wolfyone- congrats on your BFP and welcome to the thread 

Carrie- hope your feeling better today sounds like you had a worrying time yesterday . Good to hear everything was ok in the end

Abcdef- many congratulations sorry its a late congrats!!

Juju- you sound like you have a dream baby . Why don't you look into the operation then ask the clinic ? Your iui stats are second to none anyway so can't see why you couldn't try again if you were well enough?

Oz- welcome to the thread sorry its taken me so long to welcome you 

Might mini- Noah has been at nursery since about 10 months old and not had the pox either ! Hope your boys are well 

Jana- thinking about you  

Afm- well it's DS birthday tomorrow he's 3  looking forward to it . I've had the icsi . Currently on the 2 ww . Did lots better so glad we decided to do it again . Got 12 collected 9 were injected and 7 fertilised . All the emmbies did very well day 3 I had 5 in top grades and 2 average . So they suggested blast transfer . Anyway by day 5 it started to slow down and they hadn't quite made it to blasts so had day 6 transfer . Had two blasts put back of average grades . Think my chances started to reduce when I got the day 5 phone call. Anyway can only hope and pray now . Started to feel a bit better about hearing everybody else's BFP stories now . Think I was starting to get over emotional about things on the downreg . Fingers crossed eh !


----------



## carrie lou

Amanda, good luck honey   Don't worry about the embies being slow growing. My baby was only an early blast on day 5 and took until day 6 to catch up with the others, yet out of all four of my embies, it's the only one that has made it. Sometimes it's the slow steady ones that do the best.   Happy birthday to Noah for tomorrow, can't believe our little ones are three already   


Wolfy, congrats and welcome! Always to nice to have new girls joining us   Regarding flying, I flew at 7/8 weeks with Zac but it was only a one hour flight, and no problems - I've never heard anyone else advised to avoid it in first trimester. But it comes down to personal choice really. Oh I've also heard negative things about digi tests, I don't like them personally. This time round I just did a couple of first response tests in between getting BFP and first scan, just to reassure myself the line was getting darker (it was  )


Juju, Phoebe sounds like a dream   Will have a look at the photos in a mo. Don't feel bad about the jealousy. IF messes us up I think. A friend of mine just announced her pregnancy on ** and even though I know they've been trying for ages and I'm thrilled for her, and even though I have my beautiful boy and another gorgeous one on the way, I still felt that horrible pang of jealousy   Completely irrational I know   


Oz, glad you are getting a bit of your energy back - make the most of it   Zac is settling in pretty well thanks, this morning was his first proper session and although he was a bit tearful when I left him, apparently he settled down really quickly and got stuck in to all the toys and activities   


Hope everyone is well. I had my scan this morning and everything looks fine   Baby measuring 4lb1oz already so likely to be a bit chubbier than Zac was, but still within expected range. Also has a very big head just like his/her big brother   We got some lovely pics of baby sucking his/her thumb, and yes despite massive temptation, we remain team cream


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Amanda - C was an early ungraded blast on day 5, but as he was only one of two that were early blasts on that day the embryologist said to transfer.
And E was a day 6 frozen blast. She was top grade though, the only one out of 4 remaining.
To get to blast means that means you have found out which embryos were strong enough. It would have been hit and miss to transfer on day 3. Sounds like you have a good chance!

Juju - your pictures are lovely! I like the little blue dress. I will have to post up an album.


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## juju81

Carrie, I reckon you have a 7.5 or 8lb'er there! At 31wks phoebe was estimated at 3lb11 I think! She was 6lb15! I reckon your having another boy  

Amanda, was thinking about you tge other day.  Am so glad you decided to go again.  Did you get any to freeze? When is OTD.  It's GOT to be your turn hun.  I've got everything crossed   .  Happy birthday to Noah.  The threes were great fun


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## loulouh79

hello everyone 

PLEASE TELL ME THIS IS A THREAD FOR DONOR RECIPIENT MUMMIES. 

Ive been a little lost going through the threads currently im meeting some wonderful people but id really like to chat with mums that are DE recipients. Am i in the right place ?

I got my most amazing BFP friday 27th june, I cannot expressed the love i have for my tummy its weird but i feel very protective already, Im only 4weeks and 6 days today. 

My hcg levels were high 
9dp5dt - 638 approx (wrote them down and lost paper)
12dp5dt - 2300 approx 

I transferred two blasts, does that seem like ive got twins  Im aching for Twins i sooooo hope so 

My first scan is in 2 weeks so fingers crossed ill see my babies/y 

Im just a little scared as im not really having symptoms, very on and off mild cramps now and again, a bit of heartburn, shortness of breath and sore boobs but all could be to the progesterone injections 

Is anyone similar ? 

thank you in advance to anyone that answers. feeling a bit alone with no one in the same boat as me to talk too. No one i know has done DEIVF x


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## Fizzypop

Amanda - i am so glad you had a better result this time. I can't remember if you did anything differently? Like Ju says, this has to be your turn, I am keeping everything crossed for you xxx

Ceci - keeping everything crossed for you too xxx

Well, we have found out we are on the blue team this time  so chuffed but now means I have to have a huge clear out of girl stuff and I feel a bit emotional about getting rid :-( I think I'm going to keep the small baby stuff so that when DD has bigger dollies she has clothes to put on them 

Dh has said no more now but i still want one more.......

Also have a low placenta but on all accounts nothing will be confirmed until 36 weeks? I know Ceci had PP. did anyone else have similar? Xxx


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## carrie lou

Fizzy, think Mini also had a low placenta second time round but still managed a normal birth. Congrats on team blue! lovely news   


Loulouh, welcome and congratulations! We are mainly donor sperm mummies but welcome all donor recipient ladies here. Hopefully we can offer some support. Lots of luck for your scan   I can relate to the worry over symptoms but really for me the main ones didn't kick in till about 6 weeks, so it's still very early for you. Don't worry   


Juju, yeah I checked the growth chart and if baby carries on at this rate s/he will be about 7lb12oz at term. Zac was 7lb7oz but then he was two weeks late   My mum thinks boy too, but DH and I can't make up our minds what we think


----------



## ceci.bee

Loulou welcome and congratulations on your BFP that is wonderful news and fabulous beta results. A good friend of mine (not on FF) has twins from DE, and now helps out with a twin helpline   she is a happy and wonderful mum. good luck for your scan           

Fizzy - I think quite a lot of women have a low lying placenta and most move before 36 weeks - you are likely to have a normal delivery and very exciting to be team blue - boys are fab

thanks everyone for the kind messages - still feeling up and down about it all - been referred to EPAU by my GP so they can keep an eye on me there - never seems to be straightforward, but stilll trying to keep               that my LO makes it 

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## ceci.bee

Amanda forgot to say congratutions on your blast transfer - keeping everything


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## Jess81

Loulou I'm a double donor mummy to be!! Xx


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Lou louh79 - we are all mummies to donor conceived children and for sometime we have been trying to encourage the DE mummies to come over here. This is the pregnancy and parenting thread for all donor conception mums and dads. You are welcome!
We wanted a thread on this board for pregnancy and parenting donor conceived children as the issues we face are slightly different for the long term - unlike the cycle buddy pregnancy threads. We hope to make bonds and get advice from each other on issues of donor conception like telling other people and telling the child, or not, for that matter as time goes on. Helping the children. Issues of siblings etc. There is no other area like it.

Fizzy - I had a very low lying placenta at 20 week scan but it was out of the way by 34 weeks. But I had a planned section anyway booked so made little difference to me.

I know what you mean about the emotion and the little clothes.
I have just got out and washed all of C's little boy clothes newborn to 6 months sizes - my step grandson is due in 6 weeks and as 18year olds just out of school/college and stepson just about to start his apprenticeship, they have little money. I thought about using some of the clothes for E, and she did wear a pair of denim shorts I found in the bag yesterday that C was too small for in the summer he was born, but in fact I have so many cute pink/girly things that I want to use, that I will just give the youngsters all they want. I am only keeping C's tatty teddy vests and the first outfit they both wore when born - a neutral max and millie sleep suit.
I thought about selling the clothes but a friend who did a nearly new sale made £15 for all her things after a lot of bother washing and ironing and arranging childcare and another took a car packed full to the roof with clothing to an advertised exchange place and only got £43!

Chicken pox getting worse. Now has quite a few spots. I think E has a couple too, near her nappy area, but hard to say. I suspect she will not have it bad as she is still partially breast feeding. Time will tell.

Ceci - sounds promising. I am sure all will be well.


----------



## juju81

Whoooo hoooo to team blue fizzy. One of each. Lovely jubbly.  I'm looking forward to seeing if there is a definate difference between boys and girls  

Loulou, welcome lovely  

Holly, hope E doesn't get them badly.  Unfortunately I have heard and have seen first hand that second baby's/children are unfortunately affected worse as they get double strain.  Hopefully with your boobie milk it won't affect her like that


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Forgot to say Carrie - growth scans are not very accurate.
They told me C would be 9lbs  plus at birth - he was 7lbs 14 and went down to 6lbs 10oz in week one.
They told be E would be 7.5-8lbs at term and she was 6lbs 14oz.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Welcome Lou Lou and jess  
Loulou sounds like twins to me   

Amanda ooh good luck hun. When is test day?  

Fizzy welcome to team blue    I had a low lying placenta. It wasn't as bad as pp but it eventually moved up by 36ish wks. It was still a bit low but they said as soon as I went into labour to go in or any amount of bleeding to go. I was fine and had a natural delivery. They just monitor you with scans. 
I tried to get a c section but my con was adamant I should do it naturally   Glad I did now.  

Ceci glad they are looking after you  

Holly clothes don't really sell. Unless you do bundles. I sold loads of other baby things on **. The house is empty. Just the kids to go now


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Lucas is 4 on Saturday. I do hope he leaves the 3s behind on Friday night as I can't cope anymore with the 3s. They do my nut!!


----------



## juju81

Minx, Noah's just was instant when he turned 4.  Just like the change in him going from 2 to 3


----------



## carrie lou

So far the 3's have not been so bad for us - more manageable than the 2's I think - but then we are only one month in   


Happy birthday Lucas for tomorrow


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

It is strange what you say about the birthday milestones - like C as soon as he turned 3 he wanted to use the potty.


----------



## juju81

Let's hope he stays that way carrie


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah!! 

He's been awful Again today. I hope he wakes up a lovely 4 yr old tomorrow.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Mini - I will wave a magic birthday fairy wand!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Thanks holly. Think I need a tranquilliser gun


----------



## hakunamatata

Hey girls sorry been awol.  Life craxy busy.  Miracle os all 3 girls and hubby lol asleep at mo. Girls are grand they weigh 8 9 snd 8 10 now. Still breast feeding witb vouple of bottles in night due yo 5 mg of olanzapine.  Ive been quite tesrful as all 3 very overwhelming.  Did solo for 3 days and help for s couple.  Think I will need help for a while.  X x 
Elest awake now. X x 
Congrats ceci but so sorry for  thr loss of your 2nd embryo. 
Better dash.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sounds like you're doing well hak.


----------



## carrie lou

Hak, sounds like you're doing brilliantly honey. It's bound to be overwhelming with three so young, be kind to yourself. And breastfeeding twins! Big respect to you!


----------



## Fizzypop

Hak, sounds like you are doing really well. Three kids and bf two of them - go you! 


Soooooo, what happens when they get to 3? Do I need to be scared? The 2's haven't been too bad for us.......


----------



## ceci.bee

Hak hun - I agree with the others it sounds like you are doing an amazing job, not surprised you are finding it overwhelming - my mate is a twin mum, do you have other twin mums to talk to? She helps run a twin mum support helpline - I can get you the number if you think it would help to talk to other twin mums   - she was telling me about BF two and it sounds like an aweseome task


----------



## amandaloo

Hello

Loulou- congratulations and welcome  . Best of luck for your forthcoming scan x

Mightymini- happy bday to Lucas x

Hak - nice to hear from you . You sound like your doing well . I bloomin struggled breast feeding one never mind two !! 

Anyone who asked when OTD is its the 14th July which I think was a bit OTT when I had a six day transfer  . 
Forgot to put earlier so modified all the emmbies made it too blast but we couldn't freeze the remaining ones as they were not good enough grades seems a Shame 


Was DS bday yesterday was a great day loved it and so did he x


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Hope ds had a lovely birthday Amanda.  

Fizzy. Yes be scared. Very scared    it's hell on earth


----------



## Josina

Hi ladies

Amanda-- congrats on being PUPO! That sounds like an amazingly different experience and a great response. Shame they couldn't freeze any of the others tho. Fingers crossed for your little embies on board       and happy birthday to your ds

Fizzy-- yay for team blue    Glad your scan went well.

Holly   Chickenpox on top of everything else!!!  

Hak-- great to hear your girls are doing so well 

Ceci-- good that you have a referral to EPU so you can be monitored closely ^  when is your next scan?

Welcome Lou Lou and Wolfy-- congrats 

Mini- hope your ds is a new child since his birthday yesterday  

AFM-- I posted on the donor thread about having some difficulties with people's comments about the baby, and who he will look like. And he's not even here yet! How has that experience been for those of you that have your LOs? We have told important people but don't want the whole world to know. Anyway, some of the comments have been coming from people in the know! Baby is going to be tall because DH is, have blue eyes etc.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

People see what they want to see. A lot say he looks like dh (clearly doesn't   ) (he looks like the donor   ) 

Then others say he looks nothing like dh. One girl who didn't know about the donor asked if the hospital had got the sperm mixed up. That hurt


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Josina - as for questions about who the baby looks like, just nod. Both mine are blue eyed. C has turned a very definite blond and E might be under her baby hair. We are both brown hair, I have green eyes and DH grey blue. Both of us had blonde hair as children, so I just say that and say hair colour can change over time. My friends around the corner - she has very dark brown hair and her OH brown, but they have a blonde daughter and they had a natural pregnancy.
Also characteristics are matched to your OH so if they say oh he will be tall like his father say yes I expect he will. How do they know whether you are answering about the bio father or the social father? Only you know!!!
People see what they want and you can just say I think he takes after my side of the family or looks like some long dead relative!

My DH and his brother are nothing alike and are much taller than their parents so it really makes no difference. I think you have to toughen up and not read too much into people's general chit chat.

As for the CP, C seems to be getting better - a lot of the spots are crusting over now. But E is plastered in them. She has them everywhere and more appearing everytime I check her - there are lots of dots just starting too. Not as bad yet as some pictures I have seen, but she has a lot. All in her hair and bottom and everywhere else there are some, even on oles of feet and armpits. She is very grizzly and demanding poor love. Lots of cuddles.


----------



## carrie lou

Similar experiences here. Zac has hazel/light brown eyes, which I can only assume comes from the donor's side, since mine are blue (DH's are green). Apart from that he looks very much like I did as a child. He has very curly hair which is always the first thing people comment on and ask where he gets it from, I just say I was the same at his age. 


Tbh it is something you just have to get used to. For us it started in the hospital the day Zac was born, the midwives gathered round the bed and started discussing who he takes after! It was a little awkward but I was distracted by other things at the time so didn't pay too much attention   


These days occasionally someone will say that Zac looks like DH in one respect or another (even though it is blatantly untrue) but I just smile and say something vague. I don't really feel like explaining our entire fertility history to every random stranger who has an opinion on the subject. So really that's all you can do.   Don't worry, it will get easier. 


And yes we have had some bizarre comments from people who know the full story. E.g. MIL insisting that Zac looks like DH's middle brother   when obviously there is no genetic link  there. I can only think she was either in denial, didn't think before speaking, or just said it out of habit. After all it's one of those "stock" questions that people seem to ask about every baby - how much did he weigh, how is he sleeping, who does he look like


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

We are both dark hair brown eyes. Ds1 is the same. Ds2 who is natural is blonde blue eyed! Dh and my sister both had blonde hair. My sister is still blonde blue eyed


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

You can just say genes mix in strange ways!


----------



## Josina

Thanks ladies. It's very reassuring for us newbies. Some days I manage to forget about it but what I call the 'donor issue' is still on my mind other days. I'm hoping it begins to fade more and more when LO arrives.


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## carrie lou

It will Hun   It will always be there as a part of who your LO is. But it won't seem like the biggest issue anymore, I promise.


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## carrie lou

Anyone know how to encourage a child to drink more?  Zac has never been keen on drinking but it's getting ridiculous, and in this warm weather I really worry.... He doesn't seem to feel thirsty at all! If I didn't nag him to drink he would probably survive on less than a cup of liquid a day which surely can't be enough! The only drink he really likes is chocolate milk so I've taken to giving him a cup of that each day - naughty mummy I know   But I'm desperate! Any ideas?


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Jelly, ice lollies


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## Josina

In South Africa all the mums give their kids Rooibos tea. It's completely natural and caffeine free. I think some of the bigger UK stores sell it- Red bush tea. And it's cheap. Make with milk and honey or sugar like normal tea, and you can say its tea like mummy drinks which might be appealing to him. It counts as good as water because it's not caffeine. Maybe also a sugar free dilute squash....


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## carrie lou

Josina, i drink gallons of rooibos! Especially since being pregnant. I love it    I've tried giving Zac some, at most he will drink a few sips.


He won't touch jelly. Ice lollies are hit and miss.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Watery food - watermelon, cucumber, yogurt, custard, soup.

C likes ice cubes - he has them under supervision due to theoretical choking risk. He drinks lots of milk, dilute juice, my drinks and bathwater (yuk) so I am not bothered about fluid intake, other than the leaky nappies and accidents whilst potty training.

Does Z have lots of pale wee - id so he is getting enough from somewhere.


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## hakunamatata

Addi was just the same carrie and drinks the capri suns now. Lots of diff flavours and likes being a big girl holding the carton after learning not to squeeze it lol. It is worrying tho. And she doed like drinkjng sugar free squash from my glass. The compromises you mske hey to get fluids into them. X 
Thanks for all your comments girls. Its easy to feel like you're fsiling spreading yourself so thinly. X


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## carrie lou

Thanks girls. He does have wet nappies, not as many as I'd like though. Hard to tell if his wee is pale or not. And we have had a couple of episodes where he's gone 11+ hours without weeing overnight  


Hak, thanks - he does like drinks with straws, I was just worried about the sugar content if he has them all the time - but as you say it is probably better that getting dehydrated!


Well I've dug out the ice lolly moulds and Zac has helped me make some orange juice lollies for later. We'll also give rooibos another go, maybe if we can make it like a tea party it will be more appealing for him


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## Jess81

Josina, i'm having the same thoughts... we are double donor so have absolutley no idea what baby is going to look like. we chose as close colourings as possible to us but i've always said people will see what they want to. very close family and friends know our situaton but when we show people our scan pics DH says looks like baby will have your nose lol!!! He's much better at it then i am and to be honest as baby is moving and kicking now i'm forgeting more about the donor issues! 

whilst i'm here.. can i ask how you came to the decision to tell or not tell your LO about the donor?! and if you did choose to how old and how you told them? we still haven't chosen what to do yet..... 

thanks xx


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## ceci.bee

Jess and Josina - we get so many comments about J and who he looks like - we are both dark eyed and dark haired, and he is a proper ayrian with bright blue eyes and blonde hair. Most of the time we say 'well its a genetic lottery' - which is certainly true, and it does get easier with time definitely - it only annoys me now when people in the know ask - as they should know better! Mini I like your comment about the stock questions people ask about babies - that is so true, adn everyone says a baby looks like the dad, even if they so don't - I think it is an evolutionary cultural way of confirming paternity - after all 10% of babies in the UK are not conceived by the man who brings them up   

Jess - with regards to telling, we have told J and will continue to do so - the DC network has some great info and resources about telling, it is something you both need to work through together as it is a very personal decision - there are two great threads on here, one for tellers and one for those who aren't telling, worth having a read through. there is data from donor concevied children that if they are told, it is better to tell earlier and make it just part of who they are rather than telling them when they are a teenager and have to reconsider their identity - we have taken that on board and keep trying to read J his 'my story book' which he has told us he doesn't like as it talks about mummy and daddy being sad   

Hak - I am sure you are doing an amazing job, just getting through the day with them clothed and fed I suspect is a huge acheivement - how are they sleeping? 

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

We told ds1 as soon as he was born. We read the donor book to him. He knows about sperm and eggs   and daddy's sperm didn't work properly. So we ask a kind man who are donors. He's not interested really. But in our family it's important he knows especially as we have a naturally conceived child. In my opinion honesty is the best policy. You have to think how they will feel if they didn't know then suddenly found out. Bit like adoption. These things always have a way of coming out eventually. 

IMO not telling means you are not fully accepting of a donor. You should be proud of his conception and celebrate it by bring open.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie - another suggestion - if he likes straws - do you remember those curly straws or the ones with multi colours. C also has a santa cup with a bendy straw that he likes.

I am sure a bit of on line digging and you could find a really cool straw.


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## ceci.bee

Carrie - great suggestion from Holly, Joshi loves drinking with his green frog straw and always drinks twice as much, plus food with high water contents like jelly and stews etc will help- ultimately if he is really thirsty he will drink - it is such a powerful urge that I defy any toddler to overcome it, and if he is not really thirsty he is getting enough water however he is getting it. he is 3, so he should be able to start going through the night without weeing - not necessarily a sign he is dry, but a sign his brain is getting a bit more mature and switching on anti-diuretic hormones when he is asleep........good luck, not easy I know


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## My Son is My World

Ladies sorry for the me post but I wanted to see if any of you had been through anything similar - I've applied to do 4 days as of when i start back and it has been rejected. I'm absolutely gutted and cant stop crying as the thought of leaving my baby boy for 5 days at a time just breaks my heart. Have any of you had something similar and appealed? X


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

What is their reason emlore? I'm not supposed to be doing 30 hrs but my manager is good so agreed it. They have to have good reason


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## Jess81

Thanks ladies, I've always thought I would want to tell because it's better to always have known then find out as a teenager. 
I guess I'm just scared that LO will eventually want to find out about donors and half siblings and I'm not sure how I would cope about that but I guess we will have to cross that bridge when we get to it xx


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## My Son is My World

Mighty - basically they said that work had increased since i left so it isn't feasible to reduce my hours. I feel so upset and deflated. I haven't cried this much since we had it confirmed that we needed to use ds :-( x


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## amandaloo

Emlore- have they not got improving working lives policy? Seems a bit harsh just a blank no! I work in nhs so they are pretty good with reducing hours etc . Really sorry to hear that I can imagine you are very upset. If it helps I work my full time hours in a four day week. Would that be something they would consider if they won't let you drop the hours? I also get a set day off per week to help me with childcare . Hugs to you xx

On the telling front we have told our DS we read him the my story which sometimes makes me cry however I'm getting better at reading it. My DH says he will never read it to him so it's up to me. Funny how he knows about sperm and eggs . I cried the other week reading it because he pointed at the men in the book ( who are the donors) and said is that my daddy . I think it was unrelated to actually the sperm donors and thinking it was his daddy but just made me cry


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## My Son is My World

Once you apply you're not allowed to apply again for 12 months so any other type of flexible working pattern isn't an option.  It just makes me so sad that it was such a hard path to get my little prince and now i wont even be able to be with him for 5 days a week. I feel like a completely useless mummy right now :-( x


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Yes Emlore - Luckily I reduced my hours from 5 to 4 days in 2009 when I started ivf and they were allowing a few other seniors at my grade to drop, so they could not refuse really then.
Then when I had C I asked to reduce to 3 days which had always been my plan from when I chose pharmacy when I was 14 years old - I thought pharmacy would have the flexibility to be family friendly when the time came and thought that when I had young children I would never work more than 3 days a week on a regular basis.
My boss said no! I stressed and fretted and cried. She told me I could do a job share, but I would have to find the person - how I do not know?! She offered me a managers' job in another team at 3 days a week and I accepted, but then the post holder withdrew her resignation.

So anyway, I posted on a few forums and got little response for a job share. Then they allowed me to advertise on NHS jobs and we had a perfect applicant, but she decided to go to a similar job near her home that she secured.

I went back to work in July 2012, and used accrued annual leave to do a phased return until September, but then was on 4 days leaving C for 11 hours a day, plus weekend duties. Honestly.... it was nowhere near as bad as I thought it would be. This went on until January and then my boss came up with an idea. She had realised that the work in my team had been increasing to ridiculous levels and the person who covered my mat leave did not want to drop a grade and was applying for more jobs. So she asked for a little more staff budget and made our job and 8 day a week sort of job share splitting our areas of responsibility so I did 3 days a week concentrating on one side of the role and my colleague 5 days the other side. We still worked on the same wards, but dealt with the finance reports, policies, consultant queries, risk management etc etc for defined sectors of the department. We started this in March. Then I became pregnant again. In some ways I wished I hadn't done it, because then I would have had full maternity pay, but in others the opportunity was there and unlikely to come again, the other person would have left and it then would not have been possible, and I would have missed 9months of my boy, and I might not have got pregnant.
Money is a worry, but I am not going to worry about the mortgage in my old age, I will worry about time spent.

I suggest that before you appeal you have a couple of KIP days and see what the problems are. Work out how you could suggest the work is covered, job share for example and then push forward with an appeal - obviously it has to be formally set out and within any time limits. Is there anyone else in a similar position who would like to share at your work? Anyone who could do the job who has left for similar reasons who might like 1-2 days work a week?
If you can prove that there will be no detriment to the business with your proposal then they cannot refuse.

But really, going back to work is not as bad as you imagine it to be at this stage. I promise.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Emlore - just saw this on Netmums.....
http://www.netmums.com/coffeehouse/working-childcare-692/working-689/1133633-rights-work-before-after-you-have-your-baby-advice-webchat-9th-july.html

/links


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## My Son is My World

Aaaw thanks Holly that is great - I'll definitely post my issue and will hopefully receive a reply. I'm sure it won't be as bad as I imagine it to be and I'm extremely lucky that I'm getting to spend the whole entire first year of his life with him but I can't help feeling absolutely heartbroken to be leaving him like this. Going back 4 days would have made it that little bit more bearable as I could have focused on my 'Fun Friday's' with James but now he'll only get quality time with me 2 days a week. It isn't enough and I hate it - my precious son will be with some nursery worker more than he'll be with his own mummy. Life is s**t sometimes :-( x


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## carrie lou

Oh Emlore, I can understand why you're so upset - I also wouldn't relish the idea of a 5 day working week with such a young child. Not to mention the cost of nursery fees full time   Holly's advice seems really good though.   I have been fortunate, I'm another nhs employee (aren't there a lot of us on this thread?!) and they are usually very accommodating towards working mums. I'm hoping to go back 2.5-3 days a week and an having a year off (though could go back sooner depending on our finances  ). Hope you manage to sort something out Hun   


Jess, we are also in the "telling" camp - we knew from fairly early on that we would want to tell our child/ren the truth. I would just be so worried they might find out from some other source and feel they'd been betrayed or lied to. Can't remember when we started telling Zac but he was very young, still a baby. We started off by reading his "My Story" book and for his first birthday I made him a personalised version with photos of me pregnant with him, scan pics, baby photos of him etc. He loves looking at it because he is the star of it   Just recently he has started asking more questions about it and where babies come from, probably because I'm pregnant again, and talks about eggs and sperm. Though of course at his age he doesn't yet grasp the full implications. But I'm pleased he is showing an interest and things are heading in the right direction   


Thanks ladies for all the ideas re drinking. He has managed two small cups of rooibos tea today in addition to his normal drinks, which is a real achievement. We forgot all about the ice lollies   but can have them tomorrow! Ceci, good idea about the straw, I'll see what I can find


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## amandaloo

Elmore . I know they said you can't reapply by rules but could you not have a word with your boss and say you will do the hours but do it over 4 days Is it not worth just asking ? Surely it can't harm anything? You just never know ? If you agree to do the hours the boss wants they might compromise on giving you day off ?


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## juju81

Emlore, can't you appeal?  

Carrie, Noah goes every night not weeing for over 11hrs    don't worry about that hun, that's what happens when they are in pants overnight lol!  Noah's always been a pretty good drinker.  Won't drink anything other than water.  Just leave his cup out.  Like ceci says, he'll drink if he's really thirsty!  

Minx, I didn't realise DS2 was blond? I thought he was mousy lol Probably just the pics!  

I'm knackered.  Who's baby is due next?


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## carrie lou

Waiting for news of Shelley.... And after that I think it's me!!!!!!!!!    


I made the mistake of telling my mum today the names we have chosen for Baby Bear - and she doesn't like the boy's name  Says she hopes it's a girl now! blooming cheek. I wish I'd kept my trap shut.  We're not changing our minds cos we can't agree on any other boy's name anyway, so she'll just have to get used to it!


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## My Son is My World

I can appeal but im not sure on what grounds really - i need to wait for the letter to see their official reason for rejecting me (i dont remember what they said on the phone as i was so upset). Ugh what a horrible day this has been. I need my lottery win asap so i can tell my employers where to go and then i can spend every day with nu beautiful boy x


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## ceci.bee

Emlore hun          so sorry your employers are being so inflexible. I guess you have four choices - one suck it up, two sort out some kind of job share, or three, find a new job when you go back after mat leave, or four talk to a lawyer and appeal the decision - none of them easy. I went back to work full time after Joshi as I had to complete my PhD in the time we were in Malawi and that was time limited and I couldn't do it part time. Now we are back in the UK I am on 3 days a week on a job share (another NHS employee   )  and my work life balance is better. Good luck wtih whatever you end up doing, not easy      

Amanda hun just read your post about reading my story - I am sure he is just trying to get the message and not thinking anyone but his daddy is his daddy. One of my mates from the DC network has made her own 'my story' using pictures from the family with the text in the story, and I think Carrie and others here have done the same. I keep meaning to do it, so I don't have to explain that the dodgy looking bloke in the current edition is actually daddy!           

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ju in the winter he's mousey but blonde in summer. Probably be mousey when he's older. His eyes are blue. He's very fair skinned and burns easily. Ds1 goes brown  

Emlore. You need to put a good case for you to drop a day. They'd have to re train someone else if you left. By dropping a day would help if ds is sick, so you wouldn't need to take so much time off. Your sickness record would improve etc Etc. 

Carrie maybe ds is just dry at night? Lucky you


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## carrie lou

If only he were dry by day


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I'm potty training Samuel at the moment. He's just started telling us when he needs to go. He can't/won't talk but very early in pt for a boy. 😜 

Nappies are easier


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

While we are stuck indoors with pox I am trying to potty train C. He has been running around bottomless all day with potties and toilets and garden in running distance. He has been doing really well weeing in the potty or toilet. We have had one poo in the toilet and 3 where he has copied the dog and gone into the garden. Lots of praise and beaming smiles and stickers.

However, needing some advice. We have had 4 wees on the carpet. No poos indoors thank goodness. He does not want to wear big boy pants or use pull ups as intended. I managed to bribe him into wearing pants this morning and after a count to 10 he had weed on the carpet.

I would like to say he has done so well this week that we could ditch nappies. But I just don't have the confidence to put him in pants and trousers in the house, let alone leave the house and go somewhere.

Help!

Emlore - you need to write your appeal from the employer's point of view and really reassure them that your proposal makes good business sense and won't cost them money. As Mini says they will have to retrain someone to take over your role (although that is a tricky one as they probably already have for your mat leave). They might also have recruitment costs to replace you or a gap. Depends on what cover they have at the moment and whether they are angling to keep that arrangement.
Go on line and look for successful appeal case studies.

I always say that this government announcement that flexi working is now available to all is rubbish as the employer just has to give a stock answer for it not to be worth the paper it is written on. Anyone can say that it will cost them money to advertise or will be hard to recruit and that is that.


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## carrie lou

Sorry I don't have any advice Holly, we have our own potty training woes. Mine can be persuaded to wear pants around the house but point blank refuses to sit on potty or toilet even though he knows when he needs to go. He won't even wee in the garden. So we resort to nappies when leaving the house. Have just accepted we will have lots of accidents when he's in pants as it's part of the learning process - my washing machine doesn't know what's hit it  


Love that C copied the dog  Sounds like he is making good progress, I'm sure he will get there


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## Fizzypop

Carrie - that is exactly stage we went thru with DD so you are getting there  she had pants on round the house then asked for her nappy back on when she wanted to do a wee or poo, which we did. We tried to encourage using toilet but she didn't want to so just went with what she wanted. When I finally took nappy off during day she was instantly dry. We've now been dry for about 7 nights in a row but I'm too scared to ditch that nappy yet!!!

Emlore - I am also a full time working mummy, for us it was needs must to be able to pay for more ivf as well as be comfortable money wise (and I knew my role wouldn't work on a part time basis). It was hard at first - DD is at nursery 4 days a week and my mum for day but she loves nursery. She asks to go on days she isn't in and will be going full time from sept til I go on mat leave. I do however work one day a week from home as I commute to London, so I get to do nursery pick and drop off once a week, plus my new boss is super flexible if I need to come in late/drop off/pick up etc. 

Would it be possible for you to suggest anything like that in your appeal so although you're working full time, you are working a bit more flexibly? X not sure what you do but there are lots of websites that advertise part time jobs now, if the appeal fails you could go back full time and look for a new job?

Did you make your request under the old rules or new rules? You will have to see what the reason is for the declined and them appeal accordingly with other suggestions as to how it could work. Let us know what they say on the letter xxx

You NHS mummies are lucky. My DH is NHS and they are so inflexible! Unfortunately his boss chose not to have kids then regretted it and couldn't and is really difficult to those with kids. Argh.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Holly don't use pull ups. They will confuse him. Just go with pants. Buy de joggers for ease of washing. Get a travel potty to take out with you.


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## ceci.bee

We didn't use pull-ups as we didn't have access to them in malawi, but we did offer J a choice every morning when he got up of wearing big boy pants and using the potty/toilet, or wearing a baby nappy - he soon clocked onto the fact his friends wore big boy pants (especially helpful older boy and girl) and after watching them use the loo and using the loo en-masse at nursery he clocked on pretty quickly. It was definitely helped by having hot weather and hard floors, plus a housekeeper to clean up all the time   but actually it was the peer pressure that did it, and lots of chocolate buttons as rewards for when he did what he did on the potty/toilet - they clock on pretty fast that a reward is better than a wet bottom   - but Holly, sounds tough to try while he is ill with the pox, lots going on for the little man right now


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## amandaloo

Ceci- thanks   I might have a go at doing a book but I'm not very creative!


I started PT dS at about 20 months by just putting him on the toilet every now and again with pull ups on rest of time. Then just increased it over time . Some times he point blanked refused to go on so didn't make an issue just tried every day. Then after about 3-4,months of doing that took him out of nappies with nursery and mum and dad on board. Was hard work and many a time I felt I did it too early . However I found it easier to do it that way as I literally didn't have time to do full on potty training with working full time. I kept thinking I could do it on annual leave but then any significant annual leave I wanted to go away and really didn't want to do PT on holiday! Oh yes I used choc buttons or a little reward when he used the toilet too but not every time and it didn't continue he doesn't get any now . 


Well I'm half way through 2ww   . Again had lots of symptoms but can't read into anything as I've had nearly every symptom going in all my 2ww 's .I'm not feeling confident though had the usual af pains for past few days and have seen a bit of pink spotting today which usually for me means bad news . Had a bit of a cry but not quite giving up yet !!


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## carrie lou

Hang in there Amanda   When is OTD? Thinking of you   


I'm hoping peer pressure will do the trick for Zac. He started nursery last week (just two mornings) where a lot of the children in his room are potty trained already... Nothing yet but I suppose it's still early days   I have tried offering incentives like sticker chart and even choc buttons but nothing will persuade him to sit on the potty or toilet. He is very strong willed   Can't think where he gets it from   Oh and we don't use pull ups either, my mum gave me some but I can't see the point if he is still not going to sit on the toilet, he might as well be in a nappy   


But Fizzy, it's good to know you went through the same phase - hopefully we are heading in the right direction!


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ceci - he decided he wanted to use the potty and toilet all of a sudden after having his potty trained friend over   . Said he did not want a nappy. It just coincided with the pox this week, and because we are at home anyway and the weather has been OK I have gone with it.
I am going gently with him and giving choices, lots of stickers and praise, and trying not to say too much if there is a wee on the carpet.

Today he did want his Thomas pants on, he took them off to do wees in the potty and went out in the garden for a poo, but we have all just had an afternoon nap and there is a poo in his pants that I will have to clean in a min. I have put a towel under him for now as he is nicely sleeping.

We are making progress though. Unsure about what to do for nursery tomorrow. All his spots are crusted now so he can go from the pox point of view, but wonder if I should just go with a nappy as it is only a couple of sessions before end of term anyway.


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## juju81

I think I tried potty training Noah.  Spent a couple of days with him peeing everywhere so gave in and out him back in nappies then when he was 32months old decided to go for it again (a few months after giving up) and literally just took him out in pants one day.  Every half hr or so kept on at him asking if he needed a wee and we had no accidents.  Poo's were another issue.  He kept crapping his pants, went on for about 4wks.  He knew he was doing it as he smiled each time so my dad suggested taking a train away everytine he did it.  I took 3 trains away before he realised I meant it and he never poo'd his pants again!  Just go with what you want.  Everyone will have different ideas on how to do it! Took until Christmas last year when he went pull-up-less at night and he was 4 in March!


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## juju81

Amanda, I've got my fingers crossed xx


----------



## ceci.bee

Amanda


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Amanda - you had a day 6 blast? Yesterday embryo was 12-13 days old? That is exactly when I had implantation spotting with Emily.


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## amandaloo

Hi 

It's not spotting any more it's there every time I wipe and red too . Just think its over now to be honest   it defiantly looks like af . Had period pains to go with it too. Might do a test soon . Been very upset today been to work too it's not been great :-( .


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## ceci.bee

Amanda hun           sorry you are having such a rough time at home and work         still worth testing - so you know one way or the other, as HOlly says bleeding/spotting and a BFP are not incompatible


----------



## Josina

Amanda       really hope it's not the witch


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Have you tested Amanda?


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## carrie lou

Amanda


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## amandaloo

No not tested OTD not until Monday . It's def my af it's in full flow now . Will test a bit earlier probably


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




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## juju81




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## ceci.bee

Amanda hun               so sorry this was not your time sweetie


----------



## WolfyOne

Hi ladies, I'm now 5w2days. When I did Clearblue a couple of days ago it had increased to 4-5 weeks (2-3 conception). Just before lunch when I went to the toilet there was a little brown discharge when I wiped. I phoned the clinic but they said old blood is nothing to worry about. I wiped again but there is nothing. Do you think everything is ok? Still got another 2.5 weeks until 8 week scan


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## northernmonkey

Amanda - I'm so sorry. Like the other ladies I desperately wanted it to work out for you. Nothing I can say will make you feel any better but I just want you to know I'm gutted for you.   

Elmore - any update on the job front? What kind of work do you do? 

Wolfy - I had brown bleeding with my first two pregnancies which was nothing sinister.  It went on for two weeks with my first so I was a nervous wreck but it's very common.  My GP sent me for a scan at 6.5 weeks where I saw a lovely heartbeat so obviously that was reassuring - might be worth seeing if your gp would do the same?

Ceci - how are you? When is your next scan?


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## amandaloo

Hi ladies

Texted nurse yesterday at clinic and told her she said how sorry she was and i could ring her if needed. I tested today to put my mind at complete ease and of course it was a BFN which I already knew . I didn't even watch it nervously I just did it and got in the shower as knew anyway . Goodness I wish I could have had some luck I've tried for 2 and a half years now it just dosent seem fair . I thought I'd get a sniff at a bfp on one of the go's but no .  . I'm coming  round a little as the days go on in resect of I'm not breaking down crying . Don't know how I went to work must be mad. One night I sobbed in my bed alone crying that ill never have a little baby ever again   

We will of course give ourselves some time to decide what to do next but I don't think treatment is an option anymore as I've said before had enough now. Going to book a holiday next week . 

Sorry for me post and as always thanks everyone for being there I wish I could have brought better news :-(


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Amanda, I'm so sorry sweetie   Can understand you've had enough by this point. A holiday seems like a good plan, have a break and recharge your batteries after the stress of everything. I'm just so sorry, like the other girls I really hoped this was your turn. Wish I could say something more helpful but just have a really big     instead. Xxxx


Wolfy, I had brown bleeding with Zac (5-6 weeks) and with this baby (7-8 weeks) and as you can see everything was fine. The only pregnancy where I didn't have any brown bleeding was strangely enough the one I miscarried   See your GP and ask if they can get you in for an early scan to put your mind at rest. I'm sure it will be fine though, it's really very common.    


Hope everyone else is well


----------



## ceci.bee

Amanda hun               so sorry to hear that and I am not at all suprised you are feeling totally fed up and beyond sad                   I hope your holiday gives you the break that you both need and you can both spend time together as your little family and enjoy your little boy      


NM had another scan yesterday - all looking good with the healthy one, the non-viable one has not changed much....

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Amanda - there are lots of options - there is always a plan B. Chin up!

Friends I have had success at CRM where nowhere else could help - one went with them for one last try - 10.5 cycles, several mc, ohss, and this last cycle a baby boy.

Another friend success at reprofit after about 8 cycles with support from steroids, clexane, aspirin, thyroxine and gcsf injections.

Another option is double donor or donor embryos.

GJT on another thread could not cope with treatment anymore and adopted an 18month old recently - she said it was surprisingly easy and her baby is perfect.

Never give up hope.  

Wolfy - I had a big red bleed that woke me up and soaked my pjs at 5+4 with Emily. I had implantation spotting at 3+5 and more brown spotting at 6+2. It can be absolutely fine


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Amanda


----------



## amandaloo

Thanks ladies

The options of treatment are out of the window now even if I did change my mind my husband has put his foot down says he will not support me as he's not doing it again. I wouldn't have changed my mind anyway . 

Wolfy- I had a some spotting in my pg was told to take time off by midwife for few days . All was well try not to worry I know it's hard


----------



## My Son is My World

Hi Ladies
Just popping on quickly so no personals I'm afraid - I'll catch up later. I was hoping to see some good news from Shelley but nothing yet....fingers crossed their little princess has arrived safely xx


----------



## OzCalling

Amanda -          so sorry love, life is so bloomin' unfair. A holiday sounds like a great idea, hope you are feeling a little stronger every day, I'm sure it will take time      


Wolfy - have you had any luck finding another place to get an early scan? Hope so as the waiting is so hard, unnecessary to wait any longer than you have to because of your clinic's outdated equipment. I'm sure the bleeding is very worrying, but it's very common in early pregnancy so try not to worry   


Carrie - not long to go now until your LO arrives! Exciting times   


AFM - so far all going well, our 12 week scan was absolutely amazing and I am still grinning from seeing our baby wriggle around. We got a down's ratio of 1:11,716 so very relieved. Have had a wonderful time telling everyone this past week, makes it all seem a little more real. Another appointment with our obstetrician today, hoping he will give me the all clear to start exercising again (he's very conservative and didn't want me doing anything before 13 weeks). Feeling very wobbly and fat at the moment, have been eating everything in sight so pretty sure my belly is all cake and not baby at all


----------



## WolfyOne

I have had mild brown spotting on and off since Fri. This morning, though, at 5.45am when I had my first pee a long (2mm by a couple of inches) red clot came out and there was blood when I wiped...after phoning my clinic (which said at 5+5 their equipment would be no help) and the early pregnancy unit at two hospitals, I have an appointment at 3.30 this afternoon. I am so upset and devastated...granted I have no pain and nothing more since but I feel like it's probably all over...


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Stay calm hun.   can't believe your hospital has such crap equipment


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## ceci.bee

Wolfy hun                and                      for your scan this afternoon hun thinking of you

Amanda                     I hope you can both find peace with your decision and enjoy being a small but perfect family of three                

Oz that is lovely news, well done. I am also off exercise and sex at the mo, and feeling really so much like going for a run it is mad, but am waiting for my 12 week midwife appointment where I really really hope they will ok it ......

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## amandaloo

Wolfyone- hey it must be scary but try and keep calm  . I remember at one of my scans them saying I had an area where it might bleed but it wouldn't harm baby . There's lots and lots of women that bleed during early pg xxxxx I know it's hard when it's happening to you though . Lots of hugs and good luck today I'm sure everything will be ok xxx

Thanks everyone


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Wolfy, sorry to hear about your scare   But lots of women have bleeding early on, even bright red, and everything can still be ok. I've got everything crossed for your scan later on


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Wolfy - as I said I had a big red bleed and Emily is fine. There is a lady on another thread who had a massive haemhorrage that soaked all her clothes on the bus and she had a baby boy and another on who had clots every day throughout the first trimester and her little boy is 3.

The scanner will be able to see a gestational sac if the HCG level is more than 1000. There probably won't be a heartbeat at this stage, but they will be able to see the sac and if there is blood around it.

It is remarkably common to bleed in early pregnancy. Are you on clexane or aspirin as this may increase any blood you see. 
The blood will have clotted this morning as it was sitting there for a while when you were sleeping.

Try not to panic yet.


----------



## shelleysugar

Dear all
Thank you for all your well wishes - this is the first time I've had a chance to come on here!

Our little miracle has arrived and we are over the moon.  Violet Grace was born on Tuesday 8th July at 6.48am weighing 8lb 2oz.  She is perfect  The birth story I'll save another time - but not the most straightforward!  The most important thing is that she is here and it makes everything worthwhile.   

Oz - congrats on your 12 week scan - enjoy every moment and before you know it, you'll have a baby in your arms   

Wolfy - so sorry and take care    

Shelleysugar x


----------



## ceci.bee

Shelly hun that is amazing news congratulations, and love the name        


Wolfy hun how did it go?

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## My Son is My World

Fantastic news Shelley and what a lovely name - hello little violet  Enjoy every minute as they grow way too quickly xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations Shelley! Hope everything is going well    


Wolfy, hope your appointment went well


----------



## WolfyOne

Congrats Shelly  

I had the scan, although she said I was really difficult to scan and see anything as my lining is course (?). The nurse is 99% sure she could see a gestation sac with a yolk sac, but as she could not be 100% she has also taken blood. They will phone tonight with the results but also to book in a second blood test for within the next 48 hours, which I'm guessing is to see if my HCG levels have increased. Since the blood this morning it was reverted to black/brown discharge. Not out of the woods, but there is hope    

She has told me to rest up for a couple of days, so have phoned in sick to work.


----------



## My Son is My World

Keeping everything crossed for you wolfy xx


----------



## ceci.bee

Wolfy such early scans are so hard to read so great news she saw something. Hope bloods OK and you can be rescanned soon to reassure you. Rest well x


----------



## carrie lou

Sounds hopeful Wolfy.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sounds good wolfy  

Shelley     Well done hun. Lovely name


----------



## northernmonkey

Congratulations Shelley    Lovely name - Violet was on my list too, it's such a pretty name and quite unusual. Hope you're both doing well and enjoying these precious early days. 

Wolfy - glad to hear your scan went ok.  Sounds good that the red bleeding hasn't continued.  Fingers crossed for your bloods to bring more good news.   

Amanda -


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Shelley         spin  

Wonderful news - welcome to the world little Violet!


----------



## amandaloo

Shelley - wonderful congratulations loving the name too enjoy every minute , hope you recover well xxxx

Wolfyone- hope bloods are ok xxx


----------



## teresal

Quick message from margesimpson 
shes has had her twin girls yesterday. Alice Norah 6lb6oz and Zoe Alexandra 6lb13oz born by c section. All doing well xx


----------



## WolfyOne

Blood results are in. 605 on Mon and 619 today...devastating given the nurse was 99% sure she could see the gestation sac with a yolk sac inside. Spoke to some foreign doctor I've never met for the results. He basically said their focus now is working out if it is ectopic (which I don't think it is given the scan and no pain) or a normal miscarriage so I have to go back tomorrow at 9am. I asked if there was any hope at all. He said is would be incredibly unlikely the pregnancy will progress, although DH is holding on to that hope. Still just got brown spotting. Feeling so low on life.....


----------



## shelleysugar

Wolfy          x


----------



## amandaloo

Wolfyone - I'm sorry     . I don't know what bloods are supposed to be at this stage . Lots of hugs really hope they are wrong xxx


Teresa thanks for letting us know . Congratulations to Margesimpson ))


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

So sorry Wolfy - is there any chance that you could have been pregnant with twins and one is miscarrying and the blood HCG is at a cross over point? I have heard of this before and then the HCG goes up again.

Hope you are ok


----------



## carrie lou

Wolfy, thinking of you honey. Hope tomorrow goes ok. You can PM me anytime you want to chat, having been through a loss myself recently maybe I can be of some help. Lots of     


Great news on Marge's twins - two more girls! Have been wondering how she was getting on.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sorry to hear this wolfy    This happened to me at 6 wks. So I know what you are going through. Take all the pain killers you can. Hopefully you'll be ok tho.  

Oh marge    so Thats 4 then


----------



## Josina

So sorry Wolfy         




Congratulations to Shelley    


and Margesimpson


----------



## ceci.bee

Wolfy hun                       so gutted for you sweetie

marge that is wonderful news, four under five wow!   enjoy


----------



## amandaloo

Wolfy- thinking about you today  .


----------



## OzCalling

Wolfy - so gutted for you, sending you masses of                       


Shelley - have posted on the DS thread, but massive congratulations again!!!!!


Amazing news about Marge, I remember when she first joined the NOA thread and now she has 4 babies. Incredible! 


Hope everyone is doing well, it's Friday in Australia already - yippee!!!


----------



## WolfyOne

Third blood test today shows 25% increase in 43 hours (to 76 so still nowhere near the 66% but weirdly more of an increase than the first two (2%). The nurse says the increase is still too low so she believes the pregnancy is failing, but I have to wait for the scan on Monday morning now...so much waiting...


----------



## ceci.bee

Wolfy the waiting is agonising, the worst bit I think - I waited 2 weeks between being told I was likely having a MC and actually having the ERPC - scans blood tests, all give more info but also more anxiety Thinking of you and sending                that your bean turns out like Alison's on the early pg thread              she was told to come back a week later to check the scan and plan an ERPC, and her bean had a growth spurt and had a lovely HB


----------



## amandaloo

Wolfyone- really feel for you at this worrying time       that there is some hope


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

It could be a twin pregnancy where one is failing and the levels from that one are dropping whilst the viable one is increasing. I so hope so Wolfy!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sorry to hear this wolfy. This is what happened to me


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Wolfy, it must be awful to be in limbo land like this   I will keep my fingers crossed that there is some hope.


----------



## WolfyOne

Just wanted to update you ladies that unfortunately it is over for us. I miscarried today  

I wish you all luck and hope to be able to rejoin this thread within the next year


----------



## My Son is My World

So so sorry to hear that wolfy :-( sending you a big hug xx


----------



## carrie lou

Wolfy, so sorry honey.   It is heartbreaking, I know. Remember if you ever want to chat just drop me a line, even if you just want to rant about how unfair it all is. I've been there unfortunately.


There is also the pregnancy loss board on FF which I found very helpful after my mc. Take care lovely, thinking of you and sending all my


----------



## WolfyOne

Thank you Carrie...having a family seems like such a distant dream now...


----------



## carrie lou

Oh honey. It once felt like that for me (and probably most ladies on this thread) and yet here I am big and heavy and pregnant with my second child. I really could never have imagined I could be so blessed. You WILL get there sweetie. It won't happen the way you probably hoped, and will almost certainly take longer than you expected - but you WILL get there. And when you do it will feel so much more precious and special because of the hard journey you've been on. Take care of yourself


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

So sorry hun. Hope physically you're ok.   Mentally we've all been there. You will get there, just give yourself some time.


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone 
Wolfy so sorry to read your sad news. 
Take care of yourself. 
Paws xx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Wolfy   

Remember, even though it feels very raw and overwhelming, it is still a really good sign that you got pregnant. It means you produce embryos that can become blastocysts, hatch and implant. All good signs.

Many of us on here have had devastating losses and now have babies. Don't give up. I lost beanie at 17 weeks and I thought my life was over. I am glad I kept going as otherwise Charley and Emily would not be here now.
There is always hope.


----------



## ceci.bee

Wolfy hun             I know it feels like such a distant dream right now, and your heart is breaking, but you will get through it and you will get pg again and you will be a wonderful mummy. Holly is right, your body knows what to do, just that beanie wasn't ever destined to grow up to be your beanie, but there is no reason the next time it won't be. we have nearly all had losses on this board, so know how hard it is, especially at the moment when you still have pg hormones in your body - physically you will feel better when you get AF (the emotional side takes longer     ) - we found out we were pg with joshi on the due date for the beanie we lost, and it really felt like an omen that Joshi was going to bring us all the happiness we lost on our IF journey, and it was true. Good luck hun and we are all here for you


----------



## MadameCissy

Hello ladies,

I recognise a few names here from other threads. I don't know why it took me so long to show up in the donor conception thread but anyway... 

First of all, Wolfy, I am so, so sorry that you're going through this.   Like some of the other ladies here, I know what it feels like to have something so beautiful and then see it slip away from you. I hope you're pulling through ok. Take lots of time to look after yourself.

Hello to everyone else.


----------



## northernmonkey

Wolfy - I'm so sorry.    Take care and let yourself grieve, you will always be a mummy to your little beanie. As the other ladies have said, as hard as it might be to believe right now you WILL get there. 

MadameCissy - welcome to the thread.  

Paws - I'm not stalking you, honestly, but saw your posts on the other threads. Good luck for today.


----------



## paws18

Still thinking about you wolfy such a difficult time but time does make it easier to cope   
Lol northern monkey all went good today everything on track for DIUI on thurs. 
Feeling blessed to have got through this treatment been a slow responder but getting there slowly but surely.  
Take care everyone 
Paws xx


----------



## ceci.bee

Madamecissy   welcome lovely to see you over here

Paws good luck on Thursday hope it goes smoothly and


----------



## paws18

Ceci bee thank you 
Had IUI this afternoon. It went ok bit crampy but so far ok.  
Now on the dreaded 2ww. 
Can anyone tell me do I keep taking burselin down regulation nasal spray after IUI. 
I forgot to ask and have left a message for clinic to call back. 
Any advice would be great. 
Thank you 
Paws 😘😘


----------



## northernmonkey

Paws - congratulations on being pupo!! Wishing you a relaxing (well as much as it can be!) 2WW and a lovely BFP at the end of it.    I had buserilin jabs until my IUI then just progesterone pessaries - as far as I can remember the buserilin is just to 'shut down' your cycle to enable the follicle growth to be artificially controlled. After you've ovulated your own hormones can take back over. Obviously get confirmation from your clinic though, don't take my word as gospel!! By the way does your ds start school in September??


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

For IVF you stop taking the buserelin just before the trigger shot.


----------



## northernmonkey

Ah yes Holly I remember now - that's exactly what I did.


----------



## carrie lou

Good luck Paws   I didn't take buserelin but did take another equivalent (can't remember the name   ) for my IVF cycle and like the other girls said, you stop it before EC. Check with your clinic though   


MadameCissy, welcome - lovely to see you here    


AFM, it's a year to the day since I had EC and my precious Baby Bear started the amazing journey of life! I find it awesome that one of those tiny eggs became my little perfect baby who is kicking me to pieces from the inside   I'm 35 weeks tomorrow   Feeling huge and really struggling in this heat - could really do with a swimming pool in the garden right now


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

News Flash - Emily is crawling!


----------



## carrie lou




----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Blimey! How old is she?


----------



## My Son is My World

Paws - congrats on being pupo! Hope the 2ww passes by quickly and you get a lovely bfp at the end of it!

Holly - have fun chasing Emily everywhere. We desperately want them to move and then once they do we want them to sit still.

Carrie - wow 35 weeks! I sympathise with you as i was at a similar stage last year and was constantly hot and bothered. Keep those feet up as much as possible to try and avoid those sexy cankles  Do you have any vibes whether bubba will be an early or late arrival?

Afm - well my little prince is just over 9 months and is cruising all day long and zooming around holding onto his his walker.  The only time he stops is to eat - he is literally a human hoover and is costing us a fortune in food. Today he's had muesli, a banana, scrambled egg and soldiers, a nectarine, sweet potato, broccoli, a carrot, peas and an apricot!!! He just shovels it in his mouth like thee is no tomorrow - hes a superstar!! Xx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Just over 6 1/2 months. She can also walk holding your hands or if you hold her hands onto the baby walker too. She is so pleased with herself. She chuckles to herself all the time she is up to something grown up.

Dread to think what she will be up to at 13!


----------



## amandaloo

Elmore - what a little stunner  you have 

Holly- heck   your going to have your hands full . Emily sounds a delight 

Paws- best of luck  

Madamecissy- welcome  

Carrie - wow how quick has that gone !

Hello everyone it's boiling isn't it    . I'm
Not complaining though !


----------



## ceci.bee

Emlore joshi was just like that, eating everything in sight some days eating far more than me, and he still is! just a sign of a healthy growing boy, and great he is not fussy, makes  a massive difference I think   

Holly she sounds gorgeous and very adorably precocious in her milestones   I am sure she is loving being outdoors in all this lovely weather 

Carrie - last few weeks thinking of you - have several friends/family due in aug/sept, very exciting, just strange about the school year if he or she turns up before or after the 1st sept   

Amanda - agree am loving it, took J to the beach on Sat near margate, he loved every second it was so sweet.

AFM 12 week scan on thurs - trying to keep PMA that everything is ok, just feel so different this time around it is really disconcerting and all the stuff about the second twin and the anxiety has added to that - just want to start telling people and actually enjoying being pg!

lots of love to all
CEci


----------



## paws18

😘 hi everyone
Am on my phone so apologies for lack of personals. 
Thank you all for replies regarding nasal spray. 
Have kept it going after speaking to clinic as they say it means we can do back to back right away if we get a BFN this cycle. 
But got everything crossed for a BFP.

Day 1 of the dreaded crinone gel got everything crossed I don't feel too sick with it as each time before had loads of nausea 🙊🙊

Take care catch up soon 😘😘
Paws xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Emlore - ha ha, typical male loving his food! My eldest dd is a fab eater, she'll try anything but dd#2 is so fussy and #3 is showing signs of going the same way  

Holly - wow, Emily is doing well!

Paws - when is your OTD?

Carrie - must be hard being preggers in this heat. When's your due date? You must be soooo excited 

Ceci - seriously, 12 weeks already!!! How did that happen??!! Those 12 weeks have flown (not for you I'm sure.)  We went to the beach at the weekend too, it was lovely watching the girls play in the water and build sandcastles.  And Dd#3, who for the last few weeks has screamed the house down at bath time loved being in the sea.   I had to go in chest high holding her and she was giggling away, it was lovely.  

Hak - hope you're doing ok if you're reading.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Emlore enjoy a greedy boy. Ds1 won't try anything new   But ds2 eats like a porker!  

Ceci good luck hun  

No news here. Samuel is slowly starting to talk. Has been referred for speech therapy.


----------



## carrie lou

Ceci, wow, 12 weeks already!   That's flown by. Good luck for your scan   


Emlore, glad to hear little man enjoys his food   Zac was super fussy at that age and only really wanted milk still, but these days he'll eat almost anything. Especially at nursery, he eats like a horse, I think because of peer pressure   


Nm, sounds like you had a great time at the beach   Yes I have been struggling a bit in the heat  Today seems a bit cooler though. My due date is 29th August. Part of me hopes baby will be a few days late and get into the next school year - we will see though, just hope I don't go 15 days overdue like I did with Zac   


Paws, hope the 2ww is going ok so far   


Hope everyone is well. I'm 35 weeks now and finally packed my hospital bag. Got to start writing birth plan this week   My anxiety has been worse lately, think I need to go and have a chat with GP soon.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Do you know what you're anxious about carrie?


----------



## carrie lou

Worrying about the birth, worrying what if something is wrong with the baby. DH is being made redundant 10 days before my EDD and as yet doesn't have another job lined up. And in laws are threatening to visit and I just can't face them after what happened last time.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh dear. Try to compartmentalise each worry. Write them all down and number each one In to importance and probability of it being a realistic worry and write down how you intend to resolve the issue. 

You've had scans so you know baby is ok. You won't know how the birth will be until it happens. Your in laws will just have to feck orf! Your hubby's job, well have you got your money sorted? Mortgage? Rent bills? Does he get a pay out? Go to the bank etc.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ds1 told my dad about dh's sperm     it's the first time he's mentioned it. He got it a bit wrong but at least he spoke about it.  

My dad was a bit shocked he'd said the word sperm. He thought he's misheard him


----------



## carrie lou

Thanks Mini   Yes he gets a decent redundancy package so we'll be ok for money for a while at least. He's opened a savings account with highest interest rate he could find to put the money in. 


Zac asked me yesterday if I'd eaten the baby   and that's how it got in my tummy! I had to give him a very simple explanation of IVF


----------



## northernmonkey

Mini that's great advice re anxiety. I'm going to try following it too.  What a great story about your ds telling your dad about the donor. I often wonder if my dd1 will ever bring it up with anyone. Dd2 won't even let me read the book to her!

Carrie - what happened last time your inlaws visited? Is dh making much effort to find another job?


----------



## carrie lou

He's applied for a few in the last couple of weeks NM. 


When Zac was born I had a house full of visitors the day after we came out of hospital. I think there were 11 people here. I was exhausted, hormonal, milk pouring down my top, no clothes fitting me properly, face all pale and puffy, no makeup, hair a mess - you get the picture. MIL never stopped telling me what to do - I was holding him wrong, I was feeding him wrong, every time he so much as twitched a muscle she would scream at me, "He's got WIND! Quick, sit him up - SIT HIM UP!!!!!!" as if he were in imminent danger of death. Zac was passed round like a pass the parcel so everyone could have a photo taken with him. MIL wanted me to be in one of the photos but as you can imagine I wasn't feeling very photogenic, however, she would not take no for an answer and physically pushed me in front of the camera. Finally I lost it in front of everyone and shouted at her that I didn't want to be in the f***ing picture - which is very unlike me. Then snatched my two day old baby back and went upstairs and sobbed and sobbed on my own with him. 


The inlaws stayed until 9pm that night even though I was plainly exhausted, and DH and I had to spend a good hour cleaning up after they'd gone, when I really should have been catching up on sleep. They even wanted to come back the next day but I said no.


If you asked her now MIL would have no memory of having upset me at all that day, but three years on and I still haven't got over it. This time I've said NO VISITORS at all until I, and only I, decide we are ready. Even then there will be no food served for them and they will be asked to leave after two hours. The problem is actually enforcing this. DH is famously bad at standing up to his parents. They are on holiday now for the next two weeks so I have a temporary reprieve, but I'm worried they will want to visit when they get back. I'm still traumatised


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie - who is looking after Zac when you go into labour?

Other than that person tell no one. Get your DH to tell no one. Stay in hospital for as long as you can to recover a bit and then only tell people you have had the baby when you are home and calm. That way no one will be any the wiser. Luckily I was in hospital for 6 days and really only had a few visitors that I had to go and meet outside the ward. They brought Charley to the door to see his sister and then had to stay in the day room as SCBU was so restrictive. It gave me a chance to recover a bit. A few neighbours and friends called in when I begged them once I was home, but I really had the opposite problem - I like having people to help/company and was quite alone. Not even DH showed any interest or helped. 

It broke my heart in the SCBU ward when the other 3 ladies had their DH there clucking over them constantly and inlaws or parents there for hours cooing over baby, fetching and carrying and chatting and I was all alone.

My MIL and FIL even had appointments at the hospital I was in during the time I was in and they still did not come and see the baby. I think my FIL has spoken to her twice since she was born and my MIL has held her 4 or 5 times. DH has held her 3 or 4 times because he was given her to hold for come reason - he has never picked her up. 

My Dad on the other hand, even though I hardly am able to see him, he has dementia and is miles away and has been very poorly, has held her, smiled at her, talked to her and bounced her on his knee for hours. It completely livens him up. Such a contrast.

Even my BIL and SIL who were only here from Aus for 1 week after she was born, visited me every day in hospital and took me for tea and cake and held the baby. They and the friends who had Charley were my saviours.


----------



## northernmonkey

That brings back memories of when I had dd#3.. My mum and dad, sister and 6 year old niece turned up the day I arrived home from hospital and stayed for ages. My sister is fab and takes over (in a good way) - she makes coffee for everyone, washes up etc, but even so, I was desperate for them to go after about an hour. I remember my dd1 and niece trying to follow me in to the loo as I went to lock myself in there with the baby because that was the only place I could get 5 minutes peace!! If you're happy to leave Zac then I would suggest making the most of your stay in hospital where visiting times are restricted! Or plan home visits say an hour before the midwife's visits/Zac's bedtime etc so you have an excuse to kick them out.


----------



## northernmonkey

Holly, our posts crossed. Your dh and in laws are shocking.


----------



## carrie lou

My mum is looking after Zac when I go into hospital. I will probably have to stay in longer this time (with Zac we only stayed one night) because of the meds I'm on, baby will need to be monitored by the paediatrician for a day or so. So at least that will give me some extra recovery time I suppose.


It might not be so bad if my MIL was actually helpful - but she isn't. Or if she knew when she'd outstayed her welcome, or if she had any idea of what's a socially appropriate way to behave. But she doesn't. And as you know we don't get on well to begin with.


Towards the end of my pregnancy with Zac, she started ringing me every single day to ask if there was "any news" - the one time I was too fed up to answer the phone, she immediately went into a panic and rang my mum to find out what was happening (what was happening was that I recognised her number and couldn't face speaking to her so ignored it  ). If she starts that carry on again it will be difficult to keep it from her when I do go into labour. 


Last time when I got home from hospital, everything was so new and overwhelming, the only people I really wanted around me were my own mum and DH. But they were so busy entertaining visitors that I barely had a chance to speak to them. My mum was brilliant actually and tried to tidy up after the inlaws, but when she had to leave (at a respectable time!) the inlaws had started opening bottles of wine and were basically settling in for the evening. They couldn't take the hint. 


Holly, your DH sounds appalling and it does seem very mean of your inlaws that they didn't even pop in to see you.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Nm which bit of advice did you like the best? Telling in laws to feck orf?!!!   it's all cbt. Writing stuff down really helps. There's lots of different exercises you can do to sort out your stress. 

I need to re read my notes again. You need to sort out what is reality what is just a thought etc. (An assumption) so for example. Worried cos a friend is not speaking to you cos she didn't wave when you saw her in the st. 

Did she actually see you? 
Have you done something to make her not speak? 
Maybe she's upset with something that has happened to herself
Maybe she was in a rush. 

Solution - 

Ring her to see if she's ok 



I need to follow my own advice


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie - it's a difficult one. I dreaded having everyone descend on us (not just family but friends too) but other people just see it from their point of view - there's a brand new beautiful baby and they can't wait to meet it.  Whereas as mums we're exhausted, hormonal, maybe not feeling sociable and personally I wanted to bond with my baby with dh and our other girls, nobody else for the first few days.  However I wasn't brave enough to say that so what I did when we had dd#3 was get dh to ask his mum to cook us some meals that we could reheat, that way she was helping in some way when she visited.  Or got them to get some shopping for us on the way.  Is that something your mil could/would do? Or would she use that as an excuse to turn up at the door with a spag bol every day?   the other thing you can do is quietly have a word with guests, explain that you don't want Zac suddenly being 'ignored' so could they focus more on him. You might be surprised actually - I remember with dd#2 and 3 that the baby isn't actually given too much attention because the older one just doesn't allow it!  Try not to let it take over the last few weeks of your pregnancy though - enjoy it as much as you can and deal with it at the time.  

Mini -   I just love the logical way of dealing with concerns. I love writing things down anyway - I have notepads all over the house with lists etc. I don't feel in control if I don't write stuff down. And I worry so much internally that I feel like I could go mad sometimes, so getting it down on paper sounds like it would stop that spiral into total panic.


----------



## Josina

Carrie-- sounds like you've gotten some great advice re anxiety. I do get stressed often and practice some breathing activities while counting, which helps settle me in the short term. My sister even has an app! I think Minis solution is great for long term. Also, although awful timing that your DH is being made redundant, thank goodness he is getting a good payout so you don't have to worry financially.

All this talk about visitors after birth is starting to make me anxious now!!! My mum has taken two weeks off work to come stay here from a week before edd. I think I will manage that ok because she is very helpful and loves cooking, and also will bring some paperwork with her and see friends. However, then DHs parents arrive a week after edd. Thank goodness they've decided not to stay with us. I live them to bits but think it may all be a bit much for me, and I just really want DH and I to have bonding time with our baby. So I know it's not pc! But I'm really hoping this little guy decides to come early   just a bit 

Ceci-- good luck for your scan on Thursday! It's amazing how fast time is flying, though I'm sure it's not for you. Thanks for your message on the other thread. I'm trying not to post too much pregnancy stuff on there. Things are going well with my pregnancy. I'm loving it, and apart from the carpal tunnel have had a really easy time of it. As much as I want to meet LO, I also feel like this is going so fast and there's so much to do before he arrives. I'm just trying to enjoy it. Loving all the kicks, and DH starting to feel him too and see the movements! It's amazing  

Holly- your Dh and in laws sound so awful      

Mini-- lol about your ds1 talking about sperm! I couldn't tell my DH what I was laughing about because there's no way he'll find that funny  

AFM- small bit of advice please. My belly button is sore today. At what stage does it 'pop' out, and does anyone remember it being painful. I'm worried it's something to do with the scar from my lap last September. Holly- I seem to remember you saying that your scar split at one stage in your recent pregnancy- do you remember how far along you were at that stage?


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Josina I remember it being about 32 weeks. But might have been earlier.  It was very sore and I showed it to the consultant at my 36 week appointment.  It did not heal until baby was out.  Then it healed fast.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Josina that's a shame he wouldn't find it funny    I had a chat to him about getting it the wrong way round. He then asked how did the donor get the sperm out of his tummy     so I just had to say it comes out of his willy


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

We have just had the conversation about which of C's friends have a willy and which friends don't.  Given that he goes around repeating what happens randomly it could be awkward. He also at the moment claims that all sorts of people have hurt him or smacked him sometimes true if I has seen a friend wack him, but sometimes quite clearly not what happened.  For instance the baby can be kicking her legs as babies do and he will say E hurt him. And he has said daddy pushed him when he is firstly talking about his friend's dad and they were just playing on the trampoline. Even with me I have lightly guided him out of a doorway or back to the house by hand softly on head and he screams I have hurt him or pushed him when I really haven't.  I am worried he will get us into trouble or worse. You read such terrible stories. Is it normal at this age to say such things?

More news Emily is standing herself up at chairs, sofa,  anything really.  I turn my back for 1 second and she is up. Omg eyes in back of head. She doesn't land softly yet so it is a worry.


----------



## ceci.bee

Mini love that   we haven't had that conversation yet, but I am sure we will! J is very interested in the differences between girls and boys, and told me 'mummy you don't have a willy, you have black hair'   no questions yet about where the donor sperm comes from thank goodness   

Holly - don't worry too much, even if she bumps down, all her muscles will be so relaxed it will be hard for her to actually hurt herself, and the front and back bits of babies skulls are the toughest so even if she does whack her head it is very unlikely to actually do anything at all apart from make her cry. She sounds like her mum, bright, determined and brainy   

AFM back from my 12 week scan, all looking fine thank goodness. NT was only 1.9 and beanie was wriggling all over the place, even better news the placenta is in my fundus so no repeat of previas!!!! haematoma still there but not causing any problems, and overall feeling very relieved and reassured. we are staying team cream for now, but I feel so different to last time I wonder if we are having a girl

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## carrie lou

Holly, Zac will occasionally come out with something like that e.g. claiming that I've hit him. Thankfully he's never said anything like this in public though. I really don't know what to advise but it doesn't seem that unusual. Normally I just reply very firmly that I've never hit him and never will, because hitting hurts people and makes them sad etc and that's why we don't hit anyone. 


Ceci, that's amazing news, congratulations! I hope you can start to believe it's really happening now   And yay for the placenta, you must be doubly relieved. Will you find out the sex later on or stay team cream all the way? I have to admit I was itching to find out but now I'm down to the last few weeks, it is really exciting not knowing. I'm looking forward to that moment when DH and I can look and find out for ourselves if we have a boy or a girl


----------



## amandaloo

Just a quick one 

Ceci- fantastic news on your scan you must be very relieved  

Hello everyone xx


----------



## juju81

Holly, go Emily . Phoebe started rolling 2 days ago   


Ceci, fab news hun.  My friend had a 12wks scan today too    Fab news on the placenta and well done for staying team cream.  I couldn't do it lol! Also, I was convinced I was carrying a boy again as so similar but alas, she was a girl! Don't think it means much.  Old wives tale maybe??


Carrie, my anxiety went through the roof through those last few weeks.  Mine I think sounds different to yours,  I was terrified I wasn't going to come home with a baby.  To this day I still can't believe we have 2 healthy babies x


Amanda, how you doing chick?


Hope everyone else is doing ok?


Summer hols here.  Noah starts school the 3rd September    Can't believe he's old enough to be a school boy.  Bless him.  He's mega excited so that's a good thing.  Phoebe continues to be a dream baby.  So content and chilled and smiley.  Couldn't have asked for more


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ceci - thanks for the reassurance regarding falls - she attempted the first step today and fell off before I could grab her.
How fabulous you had a lovely 12 week scan. I hope you can put a great big grin on your face and start to really get excited now.   

I have to say, even though I have my miracle two perfect children, I am still a tiny bit envious. If I had started this 15 years ago and it had been easy like I had planned I wonder how many children I would have had? - probably 4. I always thought 2, but I can see why people have more now - it is just so unbelieveably exciting having a new baby growing inside you - I love it!
Don't get me wrong - I am totally happy with what I have and v. very grateful, I just can see how people have 3 or 4 children now, whereas I could not before. My friend who's partner had the snip after their 2nd together - his 4th, has bump envy too. She has PCOS and endo, so it was not easy for here either.
I can see her DH point of view - he has a son younger than a grandson.

Talking of grandchildren - my stepgrandson will be here in a couple of weeks. We worked out the other day that this child and E will start school on the same day.

Dad being moved nearer to me on Monday - after all the waiting. He is a bit brighter now he has settled in at the nursing home. I hope another move is not a mistake, but it will be good for us to be able to see him more often, particularly when I return to work - I don't want to have to be driving 120miles round trip to see him for 2hours when the house is rented out we won't be able to stay

Carrie - are you on mat leave yet?I bet this heat is horrendous. I sometimes have zero energy, and I am not heavily preggers.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ju - our posts crossed - well done phoebe.
It is strange to think of Noah at school as they seem so little still. I too forget that he is only a year above C  as he seems so much older, yet C will be started next year.


----------



## carrie lou

Holly, yes I'm on mat leave thank goodness - really don't think I would cope with work anymore. The heat has been unbearable, everything seems like such an effort! The past few days have been a bit cooler here which has been a relief. Still I feel as if I've hit a wall of sorts and am absolutely exhausted most of the time.   Not complaining though as it will all be so worth it.   


I feel the same; as grateful as I am for my two little miracles, I don't feel I'm "done" yet. It may be crazy but I think I'd like a third child   I always dreamed of having three (am one of three myself). I suppose that's a conversation for a couple of years time. 


It does seem incredible that our boys will be starting school in just over a year! Is anyone else considering sending their LO part time to begin with? Zac is a late May baby so will be one of the youngest in his class, 4y3m when he starts.I know that by law they don't have to attend full time until they're 5.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci well done  

Holly ds1 starts school in sept. He's a July baby so will be the youngest. But no he's going full time. My friend sent hers part time until after Xmas. Can't see the point tbh. They'll miss so much


----------



## northernmonkey

Holly - my dd#2 is a drama queen and will also say I pushed her if I usher her through a door! She will also complain that her little sister has kicked her or hit her when it was clearly not intentional. I usually explain that it was an accident but say it's still polite to say sorry then hold baby's hand and do the baby sign for sorry. All is forgiven then! (Usually!!) 

Ju -  did you get your first choice of school?  Our schools have been massively oversubscribed this year, I know loads of people who have been disappointed.

Ceci congratulations on your scan! Have you told lots of oeople today? 

Carrie - our dd2 starts school in September. She's an April baby and is quite immature for her age. She gets tired really easily and I considered starting her doing just mornings until half term. However there are only 12 children in each school year and I don't want her to miss out on spending the agternoons with the other children. If it was a bigger school and there were other children deferring until January I would do that without a doubt, but because it's so small and they have lots of staff, the kids really come on in those first few months. Our school are also really flexible so if I feel she is getting particularly tired I can bring her home at lunchtime or just keep her off for a day (I did that with dd#1 a few times.)  

Amanda - how are you? 

Dd#1 started asking me about our donor today. The conversation went something like this-

Dd: did the man who helped you also help other people?
Me: yes, he did.
Dd: he must be a very kind man
Me: you're right, he must be.
Dd: what's his name?
Me: we don't know his name, but when you are older we can find out lots more about him if you decide you'd like to.

Short conversation but the first 'proper' chat we've had about it. I wonder how long it'll be before she works out that these other children the donor helped create are half siblings....


----------



## northernmonkey

Mini our posts crossed.  I love your  replies. Straight to the point, no waffling


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I was rushing


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Holly meant to say that ds1 also shouts out "don't hit me" "you've  hurt me" when I'm Trying to usher him out  the door or something      so you're not alone!


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone 

Just caught all your chat about kids starting schools. How has that happened can't believe they're going already. 

My wee guy isn't going till next summer as in scotland cut off to start is end of feb and he is march birthday. 

He is socially not ready as can't sit on his bum for 2mins am just hoping this improves over the next year. 

AFM 
2WW is dragging in feeling really bloated and cramps but no sore boobs so far. 
Had lovely few days away with family but no internet as in country. 

Take care 
Paws 😘😘


----------



## northernmonkey

Paws I think that's a much better arrangement in Scotland for starting school.  My dd would definitely be better off with another term at preschool. When I was looking round schools for dd#1 there was only one Head who said the younger children actually perform better later on if they start school later and I think that's because the schools get less funding the fewer children who start in September, so the others all encouraged September start for all children. Glad you had a nice holiday, hope it took your mind off 2ww a bit.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Nm you know legally you don't have to send them to school until They are 5? Ds is so ready and he's just turned 4


----------



## northernmonkey

Yeah I know Mini and I did think about it but she would be the only one out of 12 kids who would miss the first 4 months. dd#1 had started reading (as in blending sounds, she hadn't got through War and Peace  ) and writing by Christmas when she started (and loved school!) so i don't want dd#2 to fall behind everyone else. 

I'm sat in a soft play with my two older girls. These places are hell on earth at weekends.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah it's nice that they'll all start at the same time. 

I refuse to go to soft play at wkends


----------



## juju81

NM, no I didn't get first choice.    Found out the morning I went into labour.  Had a good day on the 16tg April   . I've come to terms with it and have spoken to my work about changing my hours to school hours and now happier about it.  Noah starts full time straight away.  I also don't see the point of dragging it out.  

Carrie, May isn't too late.  He'll be fine.  My niece turned 4 end of august then started school 1wk later.  My friend has an august baby and she's worried too but she'll be fine.  They all catch up anyway!  

I sooooo want another baby.  I'm in agony most days from my hips and back though so no way I could go through it and NO WAY could we afford the childcare


----------



## amandaloo

hi

Paws- fingers crossed for a positive outcome of your 2ww

Juju-    another!!! sorry to hear you are in so much pain too  

Thanks to people that have asked how I am. Well in reply I feel terrible, feel flat, unmotivated, mad, angry, upset you name it I feel it. My DH has totally put his foot down and said no more treatment and no adoption so hes given me a double whammy. Im mad with him because he said he would consider adoption I just feel like not talking to him that much if Im honest. Hes threatened me with a talk from both sets of parents as feels I am unreasonable wanting to carry on! Whats it got to do with them? They had a choice when they were younger on their family and how many they wanted I havent had one    I mean that in the respect of we cant try naturally. He has only just returned back to work last week as he took time off sick. He even made me cancel a consultant appointment that I had arranged for last thursday . DH told me he would only go if he did not have to take time off work well he only does appts on a thursday and DH does not have thursdays off   . Anyway he basically was in a mood about me going on my own even though he was dictating about only going on a day off! I cant win? Ive booked a holiday to Zante for two weeks goodness knows how we are going to get on. My DH keeps getting in moods and Im trying my best to hold it together. DH says we cant let it break us which I totally agree with and dont get me wrong I understand why he may be moody etc but he hasnt been that nice with it. Im not going to just put up with things!


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Amanda Hun   It sounds like things are really hard for you right now. Is there any way DH would reconsider adoption? I remember you mentioned a while ago that he was quite keen on the idea? I totally get what you mean about not having a choice in the size of our families, it is so unfair that for us the choice is taken away to a greater or lesser extent and it's bound to make you angry. And no it's not really got anything to do with your parents or in-laws. This is something between you and DH and to get your parents involved seems like treating you like an overgrown kid, which really isn't fair on you.


Men do react badly to things and don't always deal with them appropriately. I know this from my own experience   When is your holiday? Hopefully a bit of a break and time away will give you both some perspective and a chance to talk things over. Wish there was something more useful I could say. You're in my thoughts and I'm sending you loads of hugs sweetie. I hope things start to look brighter soon


----------



## amandaloo

Carrie - thanks so much that's really nice of you   holiday in three weeks not long off x


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Amanda


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Amanda   men are very practical whereas we are the emotional ones. It's not fair he's changed his mind over the adoption. 

It's very early days, have a nice holiday and see how it goes from there. I'm sure he's just trying to protect you in his own man way


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone 😘

Amanda -   hope the holiday helps and your DH has a change of mind. 

Juju - are you going for no 3 !!!

AFM   

So far still just feel bloated and twinges. 
Only 2 days left till OTD on Friday got everything crossed no AF before Friday am on knicker watch !!!!   

Take care 
Paws xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Amanda -   why is your dh getting in moods? Is it because the tx hasn't worked or because you still want another baby? Or something unconnected? I really feel for you. I know I would feel exactly the same as you do.  Why doesn't he want to go for adoption now?  Do you think he sees you upset and is scared you'll resent him so is kind of sticking his heAd in the sand and hoping that life will just move on? As for getting parents to speak to you, I agree it has nothing to do with them and hopefully they would tell him that! Unfortunately us ladies know that the desire for another child isn't something that you can talk yourself out of - if the longing for another one is there it doesn't matter how much you adore the first one or how lucky you know you are to have him, you yearn for another just as much and I think that's something men just don't get. If you can't see your future without another child then I think you should tell him so he can rethink the adoption - perhaps he does think you'll just 'get over it' otherwise.  

Paws - good luck for Fri!


----------



## amandaloo

Hi 

Paws - fingers crossed  

Thanks for all your replies   will try and answer all the questions 

My Dh has a history of depression and currently feels depressed again he's gone to the Gp and had meds upped and also been off work too . I wouldn't say the moods are related to be honest I think it's just how he is sometimes. I know he has told me he feels very guilty that its all his fault that we are in this position so that could be related to the moods and also I think he was hoping it would work . 

Really don't know what to do I've been looking at embryo donation wondering if that's easier than adopting but that's going to be a no too as I've already mentioned it to dh . I keep looking at options but know I haven't got any    suppose I'm
Just kidding myself . With regards adoption my dh just saying no at moment and I'm not keep asking him thought I'd give it some time . I've thought of going gps myself next week if my low mood doesn't shift. But on the other hand scared of what that would do if we did decide to adopt . I've heard and read ppl getting turned down or asked to wait longer for history of depression and my dh already has this too . Can't win :-/


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Amanda  I know what it's like to live with a DH who's depressed. It's not easy. It's no wonder you're feeling low too. Definitely go and see your GP even if it's just for a chat. There may be other things besides medication that can help you right now.


Regarding depression and adoption - I think I remember a post popping up on this subject on the adoption boards recently. Might be worth you having a look. If DH is that low at the moment it's probably not the right time to make any decisions about future options. Give yourselves some time to get over the trauma of the last few months before you decide what to do next. Sounds like he is trying (in his own man way) to protect you from any more hurt and trauma.             Lots of love honey.


----------



## carrie lou

Have a read of this Amanda

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=324898.0


----------



## JanaH

Amanda


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Amanda - you would be a really good candidate for double donation or embryo adoption as you have already carried a baby to term. Maybe let the dust settle and have a nice holiday and then try the subject gently with him again. There is not such an emergency rush with this option as success depends only on the age of the egg donor, as long as there are no internal womb issues or immune problems.


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone

OTD today and sadly BFN on first response as test hospital gave us didn't work. 
Still no AF so waiting on clinic to call back but sadly looks like a BFN for us. 

Take care 
Paws. Xx


----------



## northernmonkey

Oh Paws I'm sorry to hear that.   Take care of yourself.


----------



## amandaloo

Paws - really sorry to hear that   

Thanks everyone really appreciate all your advice 

Have a nice weekend xx


----------



## shelleysugar

Amandaloo -    thinking of you, I hope you can enjoy your holiday xxx

Paws - sorry it's not looking good  

Shelleysugar x


----------



## carrie lou

Paws, so sorry Hun   Take care


----------



## juju81

So sorry Paws    Are you going back to back?


Amanda, have been thinking so much about you hun


----------



## OzCalling

Paws - I'm so sorry your cycle was a BFN. Do you have plans for another try or will you take some time out? 


Amanda - sounds like such a difficult situation. I really hope you can get some support and a way through this soon - sounds like he is putting up a wall to protect you both from more disappointment but it must be so hard for you when he won't even discuss options     Hopefully with a bit of time he will be a little more open. 


Sorry I've been MIA for so long, time since the 12w mark has just sped up unbelievably!


----------



## paws18

Hi Everyone 
Thank you for all your kind thoughts I really appreciate it. 

Had few days gathering thoughts and we have decided to carry on and do another cycle back to back so got everything crossed again as this will probably be our final try. 

   
Take care 
Paws xx


----------



## Josina

Paws-- sorry for your BFN     That's good you've decided that you're able to go back to back and try again. I always found it really helped me to move on and try get positive again for next cycle    


Hi everyone. I'm looking for some advice/ reassurance please. Just not sure if I'm having normal feelings. Having a very down week and struggling to concentrate at work with all the emotions and thought in my head. Yesterday I had the wierd thought that I'm actually carrying a complete strangers baby. It made me feel very sad   and disconnected from LO. Is this normal?


----------



## carrie lou

Josina   It's not a stranger's baby honey. It's your baby and DH's baby. Genes are not what makes a dad, I promise you. I do think it's normal to have these funny feelings after what we've been through to get to this point. When I was pregnant with Zac I also had some doubts and wondered if we'd done the right thing. But I can promise you, hand on heart, from the very moment I held him for the first time, that all just vanished. He was OUR baby boy. I remember DH's joy at holding him for the first time and talking to him. He was (and is) every inch Zac's daddy. It doesn't matter how he was conceived. I'm sure you will feel the same. In the meantime take care of yourself, and we are all here to chat if you need us. Lots of love sweetie


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Josina - all sorts of thoughts and feelings are normal. I promise once your baby is here it will be your unique and beautiful child for you to nurture with their own look and personality.
I think we forget that no one who is pregnant knows what their child will be like.
And remember that something like 99.9% of human dna is the same. So you are related very closely to every other human on Earth.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/1416706/DNA-survey-finds-all-humans-are-99.9pc-the-same.html
http://www.genomenewsnetwork.org/resources/whats_a_genome/Chp4_1.shtml

/links


----------



## Josina

Thanks Carrie. I think that is how I'm feeling.. A little doubtful that we've done the right thing. And yet at other times I feel so lucky, and so grateful to my DH for allowing this to happen so I can experience pregnancy. 
Thanks Holly for that alternate perspective too. I did give myself a talking to about that-- that LO is a new human being who is a stranger to me regardless of whose sperm made him. And I am really looking forward to meeting him. Thanks for reassuring me it's all normal.


----------



## ceci.bee

JOsina hun              I think we have all gone through similar feelings while having tx and being pg. But my mum put it perfectly when she said 'babies bring love with them' - our feelings especially DH's when J was born were transformed, he is the joy of both our lives and you could not imagine a more devoted loving dad than my DH, honestly it is wonderful to see. Mother nature knows what she is doing, you won't worry about these things when the baby is here I promise. Try to enjoy the end of your pg as much as you can, such a special time and really try to put these feelings to one side, as they don't mean anything about your or your DH's ability to love or parent your child         

sorry all have been MIA handed in my PhD last week, started back in the NHS and applied for a new teaching job so it has been all go - and no time for anything ............

much love to all
Ceci


----------



## Lee22

Hi ladies

I just realised there was this thread with lots of familiar names!

Wow Ceci PhD with a little one and going through treatment! That's amazing. Well done!

Hope you don't mind me joining. 
Hi to all


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## carrie lou

Welcome Lee! Lovely to see you over here  Would you like me to add you to the list of "bumps" on the front page? Just let me know your EDD


----------



## OzCalling

Welcome Lee! How is everything going with your pregnancy? 
Josina -    I replied on the DS thread, think the odd wobble is perfectly normal in any pregnancy let alone donor conceived ones! Hope you are feeling better. 
Ceci - wow good for you, hope you get the job!
Carrie - could you please add me to the bump list too? EDD 20th Jan, staying team cream! Thanks. 

AFM - feeling a little sorry for myself with my 2nd cold and sore throat in 3 weeks! I never usually get ill (think it's been 8 years since my last cold!) so I'm being pretty pathetic    But I tell myself that my lower immune system is another sign that I am finally pg and that cheers me up a lot! Hope everyone has a lovely weekend


----------



## Lee22

Carrie- yes please 😊 19/12/14

Oz - u poor thing! I hope u feel better soon! 
I have been ok thanks. Got quiet a scare with my cervical length but feeling much more relaxed now that things seem to be going ok. 
LOVE the fact that my hair is now x2 as thick as it used to be. I feel like I could be on a Shampoo ad now 😄😄 
We are thinking about taking a "last couples" trip but can only go when I'm 28 weeks and feel a bit anxious about that. We thinking of Croatia, so it's only a 2 1/2 hour flight but feel a little worried. What do u ladies think?
Am I being silly or should we rather stay home?


----------



## ceci.bee

Lee - go on holiday. totally safe to fly at that gestation, and it is a great idea to have a last holiday before you become parents - no more relaxing by the beach for you for many years to come   - I wish I could go with you!

Oz hope you feel better soon

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## My Son is My World

Lee definitely book a holiday. Looking back now I wish we'd done something like that during my pregnancy as our little man is very demanding so we've hardly had any couple time since he was born (10 months ago!!). Dont get me wrong I wouldn't change the last 10 months for the world but definitely enjoy every minute of just being you two before your little bundle of joy arrives xx


----------



## carrie lou

Absolutely, think of it as a babymoon   I agree with Emlore, being a mum is wonderful but exhausting - barely a moment to yourself. The most exotic holiday we've managed since Zac was born 3 years ago was a week in Ireland. It is just really hard to travel any great distance with a baby/toddler (at least in our experience) so make the most of it while you can.


----------



## Josina

Carrie-- please can you add me to the front page too   EDD 31.10 Team Blue. Thanks!

Ceci-- thanks for the reassurance   I am away for the weekend and feeling a bit better. Think I needed a break from routine and work. Tiredness feeds into being down.

Hi Lee and welcome to the thread. I'm away visiting my grandmother who I won't see again til next year (if she makes it   ). So I am 29 weeks and it is a two hour flight. The airlines here let you fly til 32 weeks and then between 32 and 36 weeks you need a doctors letter. After that you can't fly. I didn't want to leave it too late because I'm not here with DH, so if I went into early labour while away then it would be awful. But at this stage I feel completely fine, and the flight with bump was still comfortable too for such a short flight. I'm not sure how I'd feel about being away in a foreign country though....
We have booked a 'babymoon' just for three nights when I am going to be 32 weeks. It is a two hour drive away. We booked a really special seaside cottage and I'm really looking forward to spending quality time with DH. We even decided to leave fur babies with my dad so we are having a complete break (they are a joy but don't let us sleep in   )


----------



## Lee22

Thanks all for the comments. 
I have decided to go!
It's only a short flight and I'm sure I'll be fine
I was also worried about being in a different country but I think I need to stop worrying about absolutely EVERYTHING. 
If I have in to my fears I would never leave the house 😄
We only live once I guess!

We also thought about doing a beach cottage in the Uk. But when baby is here that is probably the only type of holidays we will have for a while. 

Hope everyone is having a good weekend!

Our neighbour had a gas leak last night, was pretty scary. 
We had a knock on our door at 9pm and they checked our house was safe and within 30 min had diggers ripping up the neighbours paving to get to the gas line. 
Very happy it was found!!!!


----------



## juju81

Go go go Lee! Altho I have to say, travelling with an 8wk old was a piece of pis  

Josina, yay for team blue 

Will read back..


----------



## My Son is My World

Hi ladies
Sorry for the lack of personals but I'm in desperate need of some mummy advice. I'm back at work in oct and little man will be going to nursery a couple of days a week (my parents the rest of the time). So far we've had two settling in sessions which have been absolute disasters! The first one I stayed in the room for 10mins then left for 30mins. In that time he'd cried solidly and could not be soothed at all. Today again I stayed in the room for 10mins and just let him play and didn't interact with him. I then left him for 15mins and when I came back the nursery nurse was just in the office about to ring me. He was in such a bad state he had a rash all over his body from being hysterical and his whole body was shaking like a leaf. I feel like the worst person in the world for making him go to nursery :-( Anyone been through this who can help/have any ideas on how to make it better? My heart cant take him being so distraught x


----------



## Lindz

Hi all

Just catching up quickly on my phone

Awwwww Enlore I feel your pain. DD was distraught when I left her too. (DS wasn't fussed!). I promise it gets better and pretty quickly too. It's great that you've started your settling now so you have time to fit in lots of shorter sessions before you go back. I was so worried about DD I asked nursery if a child had ever not settled (answer- only one ever and that child didn't speak English) and was starting to look at childminders. 

It depends what your nursery suggest and allow. They will have seen this hundreds of times. Mine let me come in as often as we wanted and started off with me not leaving at all, then just popping to the loo, then 5 mins etc. She still cried but was less distressed. She also took in a favourite toy, blanket etc. For us it was just time. By the time I went back to work she was still crying at drop off but I would ring 10 mins later and she was ok. It took about 3 months for her to stop crying at all. Needless to say both mine absolutely love nursery now, run in smiling etc. She even complained the other day when it was my non working day that she wanted to go in

Good luck, it is so horrible at the time, I'm not sure if me or DD cried more, but it will pass!

X


----------



## My Son is My World

Thanks ever so much lindz that does help to reassure me. It took me all my strength not to burst into tears when I saw him in such a state and once he was home and down for his nap I couldn't stop crying. I just feel terrible for my poor little boy :-( x


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Emlore, sorry to hear it's been so distressing honey   I was going to suggest the same as Lindz. You have two months still before you have to go back to work, so use the time to schedule lots of settling in sessions and do things as gradually as you can. So start off staying with him the whole time, giving lots of cuddles and reassurance so he learns it's a safe and happy place. Then leave for a few minutes at a time and gradually build it up. I know it's really hard, I found it heartbreaking at first leaving Zac as he would get so upset. But it got better surprisingly quickly and like Lindz, if I phoned or texted to see how he was, they would tell me he was fine and had stopped crying within minutes.


Also try taking in a favourite toy or blanket so he has something familiar to snuggle, and maybe a photo of you that he can look at if he misses you. 



You're not a mean mummy at all   You're just doing what you have to do. It will get better, I promise


----------



## ceci.bee

Elmore it is the hardest thing, but he will really start to love it I promise - I found the settling in bit the hardest as he knew I was there and saw me leave, but now when I drop him at the door and kiss hiim goodbye, he runs in often without turning around to say bye - it is all adjustment, and hard for you too, contemplating going back to work and your life as a mum changing so much - y mate cried in the loo every day for the first two weeks she was back at work she was missing her LO so much, but it does get better - good luck and deep breaths


----------



## amandaloo

Elmore - your not on your own   . It's really hard leaving them at the beginning . I didn't stay with my ds he had some days where he just  did a few hours then it increased . He took a while to settle in which shocked me as he was always quite laid back he cried quite a lot . It does all settle down though try not to worry it can take a little while   . Personally I think my ds would have found it harder if I had stayed 10 mins then gone but every little one very different


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## OzCalling

Emlore - that sounds so upsetting for you, must be so hard! I will have to go back to work after only 6 months and I honestly don't know how I'm going to cope. Great advice from everyone, good luck and stay strong   


Ladies - I too am in need of some advice. Has anyone's DH become quite distant during pg? We had a bit of a heart to heart last night which may not have been the best timing as he'd been out on a long client lunch, but he basically said that children will be 'my thing' just like having our boat is 'his thing' and it has thrown me for six! I'm now questioning whether he really does want this afterall and maybe I've just been so blindsided I've pushed him into something he's not happy about? He said he feels absolutely no connection with the baby at the moment and that although of course he'll love and bring him/her up as best as he possibly can, becoming a father is just not the most important thing to him. He clearly still feels a sense of failure about not being able to genetically father a child as he basically said it's a constant reminder of what he cannot do. I keep telling myself it's normal for men not to feel as connected as they aren't experiencing the physical changes and can't feel the movement yet, but I feel so hurt and lonely by his attitude. He's also very physically distant, not just in the bedroom but also hardly ever puts his arm around me or kisses me, it's like he's pushing me and the baby away


----------



## northernmonkey

Emlore -   you've been given great advice by the other ladies but I just wanted to say every post you write on here shows what an amazing, proud, devoted mummy you are so don't feel like a bad one. If you were a bad mummy you wouldn't care enough to be upset.  Secondly remember that the nursery won't let James cry for hours - they were about to phone you so he will only be upset for 10 mins or so max (and you could specify that time to them.) I think we've all been there though, it's the most awful feeling to walk away from our crying baby and goes against all our instincts but stick with it   And let us know how you get on. 

Oz -   generally speaking I think what your dh has said is just how most blokes feel.  They don't have the maternal drive that we do and for most men having children just isn't the be all and end all. I'm sure my dh only agreed to tx because he knew our marriage wouldn't survive without me having children and now he is the most amazing dad.  If I'd been happy to remain childless though, dh would have been perfectly content with riding his bike whenever he wanted! And as you say, they don't have the physical experience of being pregnant which I think makes a huge difference.  As for him being physically distant, have you pointed this out to him or was your chat more about the baby?


----------



## My Son is My World

Thanks for the support ladies. My poor little sausage was screaming all night long last night after his nursery experience - its really kicked off his separation anxiety. It breaks my heart that he thinks I'm not going to return when I leave the room :-( I'm going to see how the session goes next week and then have a chat with the manager about strategies to settle him in better. Aaaw if only I could win the lottery and then I could tell work exactly where to stick their job and spend my days with my beautiful little boy. A girl can dream cant she?! Xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Emlore it's all normal hun. Ds1 was fine but it took
Ds2 longer to settle. He's a mummies boy   but they both love it Abd settled eventually. Ds1 has just left nursery ready for school  

Oz my dh went really weird while I was pg. I thought we were splitting up. It was awful. Even he didn't know what was wrong. But it's all normal for men not to have any connection. Plus it's normal for them to not be bothered if they have kids or not. Dh said he wanted kids but it wasn't everything. 

Don't forget they are men and don't have the natural mothering instinct that we do. 

Once that baby is born he'll be a proud daddy


----------



## OzCalling

Thanks NorthernMonkey and Mini, it's good to hear that it's normal. I think he's actually quite stressed about finances and is having a really bad time with work so he's probably just done his normal silent and moody routine as he doesn't often talk about what's bothering him. Our chat did seem to clear the air though and he's actually been a lot brighter and more affectionate since - he often forgets that sharing the worry often makes it less of a burden    He also started talking about needing to sort and clear out the room that will become the baby's nursery, so he's obviously thinking about it all more than I give him credit for. 


Emlore - poor little guy, hope next week goes a lot better for you


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

That's good oz. I think my dh was a bit depressed tbh. He said he wasn't but he clearly was. He got a bit of counselling before ds1 was born. I actually thought I'd  have to give birth on my own as I didn't want him there if his heart wasn't in it. Anyway all was fine and all forgotten by the time baby came.


----------



## carrie lou

Oz, he sounds like a very normal man! I think lots of feelings can be natural after the process we've all been through. I remember having similar concerns about my DH when I was pregnant with Zac. He didn't seem to bond at all with the bump and I felt sort of isolated and guilty for being so wrapped up in the pregnancy that I forgot to be worried about his feelings   Eventually I managed to get out of him that he was feeling a lot of sadness at "not being able to get me pregnant" (his words) but that didn't mean he didn't want the baby. Let's face it, it takes a lot of courage for our men to do what they've done and agree to using another man's sperm to start our families. I don't think they would have got that far if they didn't actually want it deep down. 


DH did eventually bond with Zac, I just think, as everyone else has said, it's different for men because it's not their body going through the physical changes. They can feel a bit detached I suppose. DH is a wonderful father now though and loves our little boy to bits. I remember how lovingly he held our newborn Zac in the hospital, talking to him and being so proud of him. With this pregnancy he has been very different, talking to and rubbing my bump from early on, and getting excited buying things for the baby (even though we have more than enough hand me downs!). It's good that you and DH have been talking, I'm sure he will be just fine


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Emlore - does your nursery have an attachment/key worker system. If so spend half day sessions ending with lunch/nap when you do not leave with you and your key person playing with your child. Make sure you are happily interacting and friendly together and your baby will relax and get attached to the key worker when you are away.
When you leave, be sure to tell your child you are going and will be back very soon. Don't just slip away as this will induce panic if you have suddenly vanished. First of all just go to the door, wait out of sight for 1 minute and then return saying ''I am back!'' In a bright voice. Just gradually increase it. But once you say goodbye just turn around and leave and don't look back. No drawn out tearful goodbyes. Eventually your child won't know if you are to be gone for 1 minute or 6 hours, but they WILL know that you will be back.

Oz - my dh has completely rejected me and baby girl. He interacts with my son more than he did before now, but I spent the whole of my pregnancy with E alone. It might change when she starts talking and playing.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I honestly don't know why you are still there holly?? You deserve so much better and so do your children.   He's nothing but a bad @ss git


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## My Son is My World

Oh holly big hugs! I don't know how he can treat you all so badly - living that way cant be good for any of you :-( xxx


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## juju81

Carriieeeeeeeeeeee! Not long chick.  Exciting stuff 👍👍


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## carrie lou

I know! Soooo excited to meet this little one now but s/he seems very comfy.   I'm seeing consultant on Thursday and going to broach the subject of induction. SPD is agony at the moment and the thought of possibly another two weeks to go makes me


----------



## juju81

Urgh you have my sympathy!! Go straight for the epidural if you've got spd.  My god it was agony


----------



## northernmonkey

Wow Carrie I didn't realise you were so close to your due date! How exciting! Good luck


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## My Son is My World

So exciting carrie! Do you have a feeling on whether baby will be team blue or pink? Xx


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## carrie lou

Thanks NM  


Juju, yes I def want an epidural - I'm in enough pain already without contractions to deal with as well!   I've put in my birth plan that I want one in BIG RED letters so hopefully they take me seriously and don't try to talk me out of it   


Thanks Emlore   I'm really not sure whether team pink or blue. Early on I thought probably girl but everyone around me tells me it must be a boy   And we've been subconsciously referring to baby as "he" - so we will see


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie - everyone told me I was having a boy with all 3 of mine because I carried them all out front. Obviously no truth in that!

Dr put me on iron tablets on Friday. I've been exhausted for months and have tried to just carry on. People kept telling me I was bound to be tired having 3 little ones but it felt more than that. In the end I went to my gp and had a blood test which came back low iron so I'm hoping I'll feel better soon. I was a bit surprised because we do eat red meat 2/3 times a week but I'm often too busy to eat lunch   so my diet overall has probably hasn't been great. And as I've felt rough for so long I'm guessing it probably stems back to pregnancy. Wish I'd gone to the doc sooner!


----------



## OzCalling

Holly - you poor thing, my little spat with DH is nothing compared to what you have been through with yours. I don't know how he can treat you like that but you deserve so much better. 


Carrie - so exciting that you will be meeting him or her soon! I hope they make their arrival soon and you don't have to put up with the SPD for much longer, ouch. 


Northernmonkey - hope the iron tablets kick in soon and give you more energy


AFM - just back from our 19 week morphology scan and relieved to hear that our Beanie is looking perfect and all measurements are spot on    DH seems to have snapped out of whatever he was in before and has cleared out the junk from the room that will be the nursery and is talking about us getting an au pair so I don't have to put the baby in childcare and can continue to breastfeed (I work from home and have to go back after 4-6 months because maternity leave in Australia is archaic). At least this way I can still be on hand if I need to be. V happy!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sounds like a plan oz. lucky you.


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## carrie lou

Oz, that's great news in the scan and so good to hear that DH is being more positive.   And an au pair sounds like an excellent idea. Wish I could work from home but it's not possible in my line of work   


Nm, sorry to hear about the iron deficiency - hope the tablets help   My bump is also all at the front, people tell me I'm "all baby"   But I think the reason everyone thinks it's a boy is because it's an incredibly active baby (just as Zac was) and quite big, estimated at 7lb at 37 weeks   (if scans are to be believed!). But I'm not sure that means anything. Whatever, it will be the most wonderful surprise


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie my dd#3 was estimated to be 'average size' and she was 9 lb 11! Even when she popped out the midwife said 'whoa where we're you hiding this one !'  Just goes to show that even with all today's technology some things are still impossible to work out! 

Oz - what do you do for work?


----------



## OzCalling

I look after the marketing for a technology company NM. The CEO has a really good attitude when it comes to how people work best, he recognises that an office environment doesn't suit everyone and luckily I can do my work from anywhere. I'm hiring a full time assistant who'll be able to help me cover the early months, so I'll have to be in the office every day until Christmas which will be a shock to the system! I'm used to wearing slippers and tracksuit bottoms every day    Not sure how I'll cope with the travelling after I start back at work, been flying interstate every week for the past 6 weeks.... hopefully everyone will come to Sydney instead!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=324765.810


----------



## My Son is My World

Yey! I saw this yesterday but didn't want to say anything. Such wonderful news. Lets hope mummy and baby are having lots and lots of lovely cuddles x


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## juju81

Wow, on her due date too  congrats Carrie x


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats carrie    2 little boys. Good luck with that one


----------



## carrie lou

I see you ladies have stumbled on my news already   


Well, after being seen in antenatal clinic on Thursday and being told my cervix was completely "unfavourable" - so much so that the doctor couldn't even reach it to do a stretch and sweep - apparently baby had other ideas! 3am on Friday morning, just 3 hours into my due date, my waters broke so into hospital we went. There was meconium in them so they didn't waste much time inducing me, and little Arlo James arrived just after 2pm. I was only in actual labour for about 5 hours though. Suffice to say it was a lot easier and less traumatic than first time round   Though we did need the assistance of forceps because little man decided to drop his heart rate and was facing to the side, so had to be turned before he could be pulled out   However, he was born perfectly healthy and beautiful.  7lb 9oz. 


He looks very much like his big brother did at that age, but is very chilled out by comparison. In fact I start to wonder if the Prozac I've been taking has actually affected him. He is already feeding like a little pro and I am feeling so much better than I did after Zac's birth, that they sent us home this afternoon. Zac is ecstatic and dotes on his little brother already. Just as well Arlo is so laid back because he's already been subjected to some very exuberant cuddles! 


Emlore, thank you for your pm honey, sorry I didn't have a chance to reply because the wifi in hospital was pretty dodgy.   


Will post more when I have the chance, but as you can imagine it may take me a while to catch up with myself! Love to all


----------



## ceci.bee

Wow Carrie congratulations that is wonderful news, so happy for you guys and so pleased things are goin smoothly for you this time around - long may that continue! Enjoy these precious few early weeks xx


----------



## paws18

Congratulations carrie 
Enjoy all your baby cuddles and hope big brother is super helpful xx
Take care 
Paws xx


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie Congratulations! Welcome little Arlo      

E was very quiet and chilled out and fed well. I was worried about her as there were 4 other babies in the room with us grunting, crying and squeeking like mice all night, and E was serene and quiet. 
She is a little live wire though - be prepared Carrie - the second time around they can't wait to join in and do everything faster.

E is not 8 months yet, but is walking with her baby walker and trying to let go when cruising now. She cruises with one hand and can stoop and get back down onto her knees without falling. She has her first tooth today and spend ages at tea time feeding me and the dog (I stopped the dog from stealing) her gingerbread man with gleeful smiles.

C can get very boistrous with her and carries her around the room with legs running in the air nineteen to the dozen before she is unceremoniously dumped somewhere else. She giggles her head off so I guess she likes it. But I do have to supervise as C does not know his own strength sometimes and gets overbearing. He does not seem to understand when to stop. That once was funny, twice was hilarious, but the 10th time is enough! He is really pushing the boundaries. I never thought I would say this but when does preschool term start?!?!? He needs the stimulation. Difficult at the moment because we are clearing out at dad's because the refurbishment starts in a week and he is bored while I am busy.

One of my post natal group friends who I was only just a month ago discussing writing my will, guardians for the children (she offered) and how I was worried about dying and leaving the children with no one, has just dropped the bombshell that she has invasive breast cancer. She had major surgery on Wednesday and is facing months of chemo. Her daughter is 3 days older than C. I am so shocked and saddened. It is one of my worst fears. To potentially leave my babies behind without their mummy. The most heartbreaking thing possible to have to face. I hope she can get throught this.


----------



## OzCalling

Massive congratulations Carrie! So pleased you've had an easier time this time, lovely that Zac is being a good big brother although I'm sure there will be days when he wants the baby to go back to where it came from! Enjoy settling into life as a family of 4 xxx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

So glad things went well carrie.  

Holly - oh my your poor friend.


----------



## juju81

Ah fantastic Carrie, well done you.  Is Z at nursery at all? It was lovely getting back in some routine with Noah after Easter.  Having 2 is a piece of pee  .  

We've both got colds at the mo bless her.  Think Noah will follow.  He starts school weds which is a shame, just hope he feels ok!

Who's baby is next....


----------



## amandaloo

Carrie - massive congratulations love the name by the way xxx


----------



## northernmonkey

Carrie - congratulations, you must be so relieved you weren't overdue this time. Lovely name!

Paws - I just read your signature - how's the 2ww going? When's OTD? Sending you lots of   

Holly - your poor friend. That's my worst nightmare too, I'm neurotic about leaving my girls without a mum. 

Amanda - how are you?


----------



## paws18

Hi everyone 
Northern monkey my 2WW is going ok so far feel ok just stressing it won't work again 
OTD is 11/9/14 feels like ages away. 
Thanks for thinking about me. 😘
Take care 
Paws xx


----------



## Lee22

Carrie- massive congrats!!!! So happy he arrived safely and you are doing well     

Paws- good luck with your 2ww


----------



## Josina

Carrie-- massive congratulations on the safe and punctual arrival of Arlo       So happy for you, and glad to hear its going so well this time.

Paws-- fingers crossed and good luck    

Holly-- sorry to hear about your friend    

Juju-- it's ME   I'm next! Can't quite believe it. From today I can say baby is due next month! Feeling totally unprepared, excited, terrified, not ready/ ready, but generally just incredibly happy


----------



## My Son is My World

Woohoo josina! How quickly has that gone?! Don't worry about not feeling ready - I don't think anyone can ever be truly ready but as long as you have all of the essentials then you'll be absolutely fine.
Mummies I just wanted to pick your brains - James is almost 11 months old and has been cruising around everything for ages. He now happily stands on his own for about 20 seconds at a time and he took his first step (just the one!) the other day so I think walking is imminent. Everything I read says hold off getting shoes for as long as possible but is now that time? He doesn't really walk outside at the moment so not sure if its necessary? When did your lo's get their first shoes? X


----------



## JanaH

Carrie congratulations on the safe arrival of you baby boy Arlo


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Emlore - once they are confidently walking inside and you are thinking of outside toddling get some shoes for them to get used to. If they are walking bare foot indoors it is different walking in shoes.

All the babies at our nursery kept shoes on except for naps as they had an outdoor free play policy.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah as holly says emlore


----------



## carrie lou

We didn't get shoes until he was walking outside, about 13 months I think. Didn't see the point before then. I believe while they are learning they need to feel the ground with bare feet. 


Arlo got weighed today.. He's lost just over 6% of his birthweight. MW is happy with that and will weigh him again on Wed. Mummy's milk must be doing the trick


----------



## juju81

Emlore, they do cruising shoes so softer then walking shoes.  Noah got his first pair when he was one! 


Carrie, fab news.  How's he sleeping?  Neither of mine lost any birth weight    


Josina, woah! Not long then.  So exciting counting down.  When do you finish work?


Noah starts school weds.  Can't believe he's old enough!  He's very excited though.  Phoebe was weighed last week.  19wks and weighs 13lb.  All I get is "she's small" "aww she's tiny". One bloke at the Toby Carvery said "ahhhh how old, 1 month" urmmmm no she's 4.  "Oh she's very tiny"     my little poochy woochy pie     Just been camping again, was fab.  Both kids loved it.  Am on the countdown to New York now.  2 months to go


----------



## shelleysugar

I've just popped on to try and catch up on the latest and just want to say a belated BIG CONGRATULATIONS to *Carrie *on the birth of little baby Arlo. What a fab name - really unusual. I'm pleased Zac is so excited about having a baby brother - how exciting for you all. Well done on the mummy milk! lots of love Shelleysugar xxx  

*Josina* - best of luck - I hope you have the birth that you have planned and all goes smoothly. Will be thinking of you.

 to everyone else xxx


----------



## paws18

Everyone 
Elmore our wee guy was about 1 when he got cruseres 
Josina. Good luck  not long to go 
Juju can't believe Noah starts school  My wee guy at nursery  till next August . Think we start different times in scotland.  Hope you had fab time camping  NY lucky you 
AFM still demented on 2WW doesn't get any easier 

Take care 
Paws 😘😘


----------



## northernmonkey

Emlore - my dd#3 didn't walk until 16 months and I bought her shoes at about 18 months. She's forever taking her shoes off anyway and walks around barefoot much of the time! Kids shoes are so expensive and their feet grow so quickly I would wait as long as possible!

Paws - did you have stimulated IUI? How many follies did you have?

Juju - ah school night tomorrow for Noah   don't they look grown up in their uniform? My dd starts on Monday cos their school get the older ones back first. She says she can't wait but I'm not so sure... All I could get out of her after her settling in days in July was 'the carpet is too hard' and 'the carpet is uncomfortable.' I think she's read too much princess and the pea!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ds1 starts school on thurs!! He's having a sleep over at my parents as requested by ds1


----------



## carrie lou

Lots of little ones starting school this week - so exciting! Hope it goes well for all of them.  


Paws     


Shelley, thanks honey  How are things with you and LO?


Juju, he is actually sleeping pretty well at the moment. He did a 4 hour stretch last night so I won't complain   Zac is an early bird though so it's hard to catch up on sleep later though DH is helping out.


I can't believe how much Arlo looks like his brother did at this age. I keep staring at him. It's almost like having the same baby again


----------



## carrie lou

Juju, I meant to ask - how long did your SPD take to settle down? I'm aching quite a lot today and not sure whether it's normal


----------



## juju81

For wks after Carrie.  My hips are still bad and I've been referred to a spinal consultant because of my back.  You can contact physio for up to 6wks after I think (I could but not sure if that's because I was under them anyway during preg).  

4hr stretch is amaze.  I remember going to bed at 9 and not having to feed until 4am 👍. I was bottle feeding tho so nick did the last feed


----------



## carrie lou

Oh gosh, sorry to hear that Ju.   I suppose it makes sense that it wouldn't go away immediately, after carrying the baby for 9 months! MW is coming again today so I'll ask about physio. It's nowhere near as bad as when I was still pregnant, but the ache is still there at times.


----------



## paws18

Good luck to all the school newbies 
Hope it's going well 

Paws xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

He loved school. Major meltdown by 530 due to tiredness and asleep by 645   see what day 2 brings


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Wow it has gone quick pink cat.


----------



## paws18

Fingers crossed mini for Monday that school goes well 
Pinkcat my friend has a wee 8 week prem who is still under care if paediatricians as was tiny and her wee one was kept till over her corrected date to start solids started them at over 7 months. 

Take care 
Paws xx


----------



## ceci.bee

Pinkcat- the best bit of parenting advice I was given ever was from my male boss (!) - 'trust your instincts' and he is right - we have a million years of evolution esp in parenting in our genes, and going with your gut feeling about when your babies are ready for weaning I think is completely the right thing to do. I weaned J a bit earlier than 6 months (4-5 months) because he was so hungry all the time and milk just didn't seem enough for him, and it felt like he was ready to go, and he lapped it up. Giving the babies gut time to develop a bit more as they were prem also seems like a good idea - go for it when you and they feel ready.

AFM am at work this weekend and DH on childcare - very interesting bit of role reversal, think he is going to be a bit more sympathetic now to why I can't always answer the phone when he rings up from work!

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Don't they say wean prem babies earlier?


----------



## Lee22

Hi all

Sorry I have no idea about weaning so not much help there!  

I was wondering if any of you went for elective c sections? Or if any of the pregnant ladies are considering one.

I know I the UK everyone looks at you like you are insane for asking for an elective section but to me I just feel it may be more controlled.
I don't know if I trust things to go to plan with a natural birth. Am I insane

Before IF I was so pro natural and anti elective sections for no reason, but now I just feel after all we have been through I can control things more with a section.

Any thoughts


----------



## My Son is My World

Hey lee
I think the choice is entirely yours - you should do whatever you feel most comfortable with. Speaking from personal experience I had a normal birth with gas and air and i was up walking about 1 hour after the birth and recovered pretty quickly however my friend who had an elective c-section struggled in those first few weeks with picking up baby and nappy changes etc. Like I said I'm only speaking from my experience (and I think i was one of the lucky ones who had a birth exactly to plan which I know is rare) and there can be long recovery times after a normal birth too so it is just a case of weighing up the best situation for you and your needs. Have you spoken to your mw about it? How long have you got left now? Xx


----------



## carrie lou

Hi Lee. I've had two normal births but I know exactly what you mean about control, it was important to me too, especially this time because I was somewhat traumatised by my first birth which didn't go at all according to plan (which as Emlore says is not uncommon!). Second time I briefly considered asking for a section but decided the recovery time would make things really tricky looking after a toddler as well. For instance you aren't supposed to drive for six weeks after a section, I wouldn't be able to lift and cuddle my eldest etc. 


For me this time round, I really wanted an epidural early on in my labour so I wouldn't have to worry about the pain but instead could relax and focus on staying calm. I made sure this was well documented in my notes and birth plan so the MWs looking after me were aware of what I wanted. Thankfully I got my early epidural and it did exactly what I wanted it to. Things didn't go to plan (again!) and I ended up in theatre with a forceps delivery, but I still felt I was in control because I was able to listen to the doctor's explanation and understand what she was doing all the way through.


At the end of the day though it is your body and your baby, you have to do what is right for you. I can certainly see there are advantages to an elective section. Discuss it with your MW and hopefully she will be supportive of whatever decision you make.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

You're very young. I'm not sure they would give you one. It's a major op and does take time to recover from. I asked for one but they refused. I'm
Glad I didn't have one now tho.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I had 2 planned c-sections for maternal reasons of choice and risk factors (my age over 40 at delivery, loss of baby in 2nd trimester, 13 year history of TTC and IVF, overweight, 2nd time around previous c-section, and they thought first was a huge baby (9.5lbs predicted on growth scan, but he was only 7.14 and 2nd time they thought the placenta was low and baby breech - both corrected themselves)

My consultant said because of my age my risk of an emergency section with a baby in distress was 30% and after all I went through I wanted to avoid that at all costs. I wanted a planned c-section.
Ist time was very easy to recover from, 2nd time I had wound problems, numbness which is improving and a haematoma/infection. But I was still moving around OK and able to care for my babies. I get no help and was caring for a newborn and a toddler no problems at all.

My consultant did however say that if I had been 10 years younger he would not have recommended it.


----------



## Lee22

Thanks all. I guess there's still a lot of time left. Maybe baby will decide for me  
I'm 25 weeks Elmore

I agree a natural birth is the best way but just scares me if things don't go to plan.

I have spoken to MW. They seem to think I'm crazy to think it may be better for me.

I'm originally from South Africa and not one of my friends has had a natural birth. All planned sections. They all think it's crazy not to have one!  

Im not scared of pain I just don't want things to go wrong and end up days in labour and need to end up having an emergency section or forceps delivery. I think sometimes they take the "everyone should have a natural birth" too far here or let people struggle for far too long.

If only we had a crystal ball to know which choice to make!


----------



## Fizzypop

Lee - I used to be the same as you re planned section but my hubby went mental at me, he kept saying it is a major op and recovery times etc. 

Like mini I am glad didn't have one - I ended up being induced - going through all the steps and medication because nothing was happening then ended up with forceps. All not as bad as I thought would be and recovery is much more straightforward. 

One of my friends has just had a section and ended up back in hospital for 4 days with a womb infection that wasn't responding to antibiotics - has put me right off!!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I had forceps and induction with my first. I did bleed too and was ill after but my body was just in shock as it was my first. I had an epidural so no pain.  A section would of been far worse. With the2nd I wanted a section but I wasn't induced and had an epidural. He was sucked out but I didn't bleed and only had minimal tearing. Much better than the first and sooooooo glad I didn't have a section. 

My friend had a section cos of her bp and she didn't realise how long she'd be recovering for after. 

Natural births help the hormones kick in to help recovery mentally. 

The mw are trained in dealing with any problems and any emergency they'll deal with. 

You could end up having a lovely water birth.


----------



## amandaloo

Juju and Mini - how were your twos first days at school?

Lee- I think it would be better to try naturally if you can get your head round the thought that is. I wouldn't like the recovery afterwards . Hope your ok  Sleep on it for few weeks   Before you make a decision . I had forceps and induction with mine but everyone is different  

Carrie - how are you getting on ? Hope you've recovered well  

Just come back from a great holiday feeling lots better about everything . I've still not ruled anything out. Hubby has got his head round tx not working and not having any more but I've told him just because he has done doesn't mean I have ! Will have to see


----------



## northernmonkey

Paws - how are you? Are you holding out to OTD?? Hope 2ww hasn't been too torturous. 

Amanda - glad you had a good holiday. Sounds like it's done you good.


----------



## northernmonkey

Paws - I meant are you holding out to OTD to test!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Amanda he loves school thankfully. No tears yet   

Glad you had a good holiday. Hopefully you'll come to am agreement with dh


----------



## ceci.bee

Lee hun - I am also grappling with the same decision. I had a section first time around as I had no choice with a complete placenta previa, and it did take some time to recover from, particularly as I was anaemic afterwards and had a lot of pain getting out of bed to feed baby, and it took a bit longer for my milk to come in. but one thing I didn't expect is that I have some endometriosis now (not symptomatic, but don't ovulate from one ovary now due to endometrioma) and after googling found it was a side effect of caesarians that no one had mentioned to me. Plus if you have a section first time around it makes the decision about VBAC or more sections much harder second time around - as the vaginal birth is inherently more risky after you have had a section, but I am thinking about it as I really want to experience it, and don't want complications from another section (the more sections you have apparenetly the more complications you are at risk of). My obstetrician quoted me a risk of 1:200 scar rupture and a 1:800 risk of loosing the baby with a VBAC, which is higher than a section, but still very low - it works out at 99.8% chance of a healthy delivery in the end...........but is still a risk either way. If I had a normal delivery first time around it had been fine then I wouldn't be in this dilemma, so defo something to think about. I think fear of loss of control in labour is quite normal, and midwives are really good often at handling that and helping you with fears - ultimately it is something that virtually everyone woman in history has done, and if they can do it, so can you!

any thoughts on the VBAC question would be v helpful - doing lots of reading and can't totally make up my mind.......

llots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## juju81

Ceci, my friend had a VBAC no problems.  Says she would defo go for another vaginal if they were to have another.  I suppose something else to think about is, your body hasn't gone through labour before either so will in effect be like a first time labour length wise....however there are some people who have quick first time births      .  Personally, for me I would never choose to have a section and would only have one if absolutely necessary and I'd tried everything else!  I just couldn't do the recovery. It scares the bejesus outta me   


Noah had tears last week at school (went full time from day one last weds).  Looked school but hated the lunchtime.  This week has been much better and we've had no tears since drop off Monday.  Makes it so much easier, emotionally, for both of us.  Harder than I ever thought seeing my baby sobbing and hanging off me.  He was like it at playschool but never had any tears at nursery last year.  Most bizarre!


Phoebe is nearly 5 months, happy chatty little thing she is.  She's adorable and seeing her relationship with Noah getting stronger each day is beautiful.  She finds being boomeranged in her jumperoo highly amusing


----------



## juju81

Ceci, how the heck did you get to 18wks already!!!!  Will you find out what you are having?


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci I forgot you were pg  

My friend had a vbac with disastrous results. Both nearly died  due to abruption. I'm not over reacting either. All ok now but she can't have anymore children due to this. Her baby didn't breathe for 20 mins


----------



## amandaloo

😱😱heck that does not sound good mini are they both ok now? I had to look up what vbac was goodness knows what I was expecting  

Ceci- I guess it's still a hard decision


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Yeah both fine now. It's amazing how quickly she got over it. Physically anyway. She said she woke up to the doctor telling her she'll never have anymore children. Her husband had to stand and just watch it all happen.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Recovery from a section is not that bad really! If you haven't done it you are only going off your fear of the unknown.

Even with complications second time around it feels like a distant memory.

I was fine. I was mentally positive about it. The births were planned, controlled and easy. To me, what is a couple of days of a bit of soreness compared to healthy babies not put at risk from a risky birth. If something with the birth had gone wrong I would never have forgiven myself. But that is just me.


----------



## juju81

I think if you are young then go for natural.  There are risks involved in both natural and c sections so wasn't there a risk something could have happened with the section holly? Surely if natural was that dangerous Holly, they wouldn't be so loathed to perform c sections for no reasons??  I remember begging them not to give me one with phoebe as they scare the hell outta me and her words were "oh no, you won't have one, we don't like giving them??


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I agree - everyone's risk factors, life experiences and fears are their own. As I said, my surgeon said if I had been 10 years younger, without 13 years IVF or a second trimester intrauterine death of a baby, then they would be encouraging a natural delivery.

I work in ICU so I see the worst of the worst.

My risk of an emergency c-section at age over 40 was 30%. That could have been at 3 in the morning.

For me a planned operation, in daylight hours, with awake rested, fed and watered staff, with blood bank open, consultants on site for obstetrics, anaesthetics and paediatrics, no rush as it is not an emergency so great care can be taken with doing the operation was important.

The risk of a planned section in certain populations, such as my own is now deemed to be the same as a natural birth. This is why the NICE guidelines published in 2011 allow maternal request. It is not right for everyone, but it was right for me.


----------



## Josina

Lee-- I'm the opposite! Really want to go for natural but being in South Africa my chances are quite low   Unless I go for a home birth which I'm not comfortable trying.
The CS rate here is 70% which is ridiculously high


----------



## carrie lou

Yep, my cousin lives in South Africa; she's just had her second baby. Her first was a c section (not sure of the reason) but this time she really wanted to try for a natural birth. But her doctor said if she didn't go into labour by her due date, it would be another section, no discussion. So that's what she ended up having. 


In the uk at least we get a choice. I think if you really really want an elective c section, you will get one, under the NICE guidelines. Whereas for my cousin the choice was effectively taken away.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

That's dreadful for the docs to do that to women in SA.  

I asked for a section and got refused. So the new ruling is not as clear cut as it seems.


----------



## Josina

all my friends here have had C-sections. If baby is head down then they will let you go to due date or a few days over (maximum a week) before inducing you. But if baby is any other way then CS is booked for 37/ 38 weeks. 
My LO was head down at 32 week scan so I'm hoping he will remain that way and give me a chance at natural.


----------



## carrie lou

My cousin was told they wouldn't even induce her because of previous c section.   


I have other friends in SA who have had babies, and likewise, not one of them has had a normal birth.


----------



## Lee22

Hi All,  thanks for all the advice!

A big part of thinking about elective section comes from me being South African.
Not one of my friends have even attempted a natural birth. They all get told its 'safer' or they have some back pain and feel uncomfortable at 37 weeks and the doctors tell them they need an 'emergency section'. 

I really don't agree with that. I don't know one of my friends that has even gone to full term, they all get booked in at 37ish weeks.
I actually think the true c-section rate in private health care in SA is even higher than 70%. They get that stat by averaging out the natural births that happen in government hospitals.
I worked in the private health care system in South Africa and I would say the section rate is more towards 90-95%.
Also just taking an average of the friends/people we know.
They do it for the money, they can schedule their day (so more time on the golf course) and they can predict things a little easier.
My friends in SA think its 'barbaric' to have a natural birth  
I have honestly had 5 friends say those exact words to me! No wonder im scared!!

But all of that said, i think the UK also avoids C sections more than they should. I think they sometimes leave the decision to move to a section much too late. Which is what worries me.
This little lady seems like she will be a very big baby and just worried that with such a big baby that I will end up having the trauma of labour then end up with an emergency section or forceps etc.
Forceps scare me!  

All so confusing!!!
But I think i just need to see how the next few weeks go.

Josina, cant believe you are almost there!!!! So excited for you!!!!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I'm shocked at how they treat pg women in SA. It's awful. How can natural births be barbaric when it's the most natural thing in the world.


----------



## northernmonkey

Hi Lee,

Have you thought about doing a hypnobirthing course? I did it when pg with my second baby and went from dreading another labour to being excited and having total confidence in my body's ability to give birth.  I had an amazing home birth and my dh actually delivered dd because the midwife didn't arrive on time.  It was so opposite to barbaric that dd was born at 4.30am and I was looking forward to next time by the time I was having breakfast! My dd was 8lb 14oz so not tiny and it was straightforward. My third baby was 9lb 11oz (I'm 5' 3") and normal birth so don't assume that big babies automatically mean complications. x


----------



## Josina

I'm about to start a Hypnobirthing course 

Lee   sorry you are feeling fearful  

Mini- it is shocking. But I think the trouble is that we have a private healthcare system. So if anything goes wrong the doctor is blamed directly. It all boils down to litigation worries... And planned C-sections can be controlled and 'safe'. It is possible to organise your own doula or midwife and give birth at home. There is also a very good natural birth government facility near me... But the problem is that if something goes wrong you are moved over to maternity ward at the government hospital and that is horrid apparently- noisy, overcrowded, lots of student doctors and nurses, and no individual personalised care. The cost of the personalised private care is the high rate of C- sections.... I've chosen hospital rather than home because I really trust my doctor and just want LO to arrive safely.


----------



## juju81

Interesting reading all this.  I just assume every country is the same as the UK!  Altho a friend of a friend lives in Thailand and she had to have a section as they don't like natural either!


----------



## My Son is My World

I'm like you juju and didn't realise all this happened in other countries. I feel so lucky to have been able to have a natural birth - it was the best experience of my life and I look back at it with very fond memories x


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Makes sense I suppose josina. 

Nm you're just weird


----------



## carrie lou

Hi everyone, hope all well  Been quiet on here 

Just thought I'd post a link to my birth story if anyone wants to have a read
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=326863.msg5913217#msg5913217


----------



## amandaloo

Hi 

Carrie will have a read later 

Got some news for you all . After a very relaxing and brill holiday my husband has come round to idea of some medicated iui . This however is all he will agree too . He won't go abroad he won't do embryo donation he won't do icsi or Ivf either or adoption ... Booked a consultants appt for 9th Oct . Not sure what to think about it all now think it's clutching at straws a bit thinking iui is the answer . Maybe if consultant says something different it may change his mind again ? Funny thing is I've finally come round to idea of it just being us three ! Can you believe that ! I'm enjoying myself at the moment and actually wondering if this is what I really want anymore 😱


Hope you ladies are all well xx


----------



## Lee22

Lovely diary carrie! Thanks for sharing. I can't wait to have our little lady safely in our arms. Makes me tear up thinking about it

Amandaloo - that's wonderful that your DH and you reach a decision. I think it must be completely normal to be a little anxious when trying for number 2. It's that fear of the unknown again. 

I've just been for a GTT. Felt REALLY rotten after drinking the lucozade. Almost fainted and urine test the past 2 weeks has been very positive for sugar. Really hope I don't have GD!!
I have been already so careful with my diet. My friends have even commented that I'm the only pregnant women they know who hasn't gotten stuck into the sweets and cakes  
That's what annoys me if it comes back positive. I can't eat much more healthier than I already am! 
I have kept pretty slim during pregnancy and bump measuring normal so not sure why I would get diabetes.

We are off on our babymoon on Sunday. Little anxious to be leaving the country but gotta be brave 

Out of interest, from our previous conversation, this was in the Guardian yesterday.
I thought the private rates were more towards 90% in SA and it does seem to be!
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/24/caesarean-section-south-africa

Lots of love to u all

/links


----------



## Babdee

Hello ladies,
Hope everyone is well. I'm really sorry I've been away for so long... Nearly 4 months I think. It feels like it's been a v long summer, with Jacob finishing preschool mid July, and being at home all the time! Lots of entertaining required!
Big congrats Carrie on the birth of Arlo! 😄😄 and arriving on time I see!!
Juju, can't believe Pheobe is 5 months already!!
Amanda, looking at your signature, I'm so sorry to see your recent BFNs. I hope that your consultant appt can help you come to a decision together xx
Ceci, how's your pregnancy going? 20 weeks now? Do you know what you're having?
Hello to everyone else, old and new 😄
Well, my news is that we had a baby girl, born on 4 September (5 days over!), weighing 9lb 15oz 😄 we've called her Charlotte 'Lottie' Rebekah. All doing well 😊 it's a bit of a shock returning to the baby stage, but loving every minute! Please could you update me on the main page Carrie? Thank you 😊
Love to all xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations Babdee! I love the name Charlotte/Lottie, beautiful. Have updated for you


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats baba   My sisters name is Charlotte and I'm Rebecca   (Becky) 

Amanda glad you had a productive holiday.


----------



## amandaloo

Congratulations babdee yayyy lovely news . Hope you recover well xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Hey ladies. Hope everyone well.


Does anyone else have an extremely early riser? Zac is regularly up for the day between 5 and 5.30   This morning in fact it was 4.10 which is ridiculous even by our standards. Obviously I have a newborn waking me several times a night and DH has job interviews to prepare for so the sleep deprivation is taking its toll! Yesterday we finally snapped and put a gate on his bedroom door and told him he's to stay in his room until mummy and daddy get up. We left snacks, toys, and a DVD on the laptop to entertain him. So this morning he did stay in his room till 6 which is an achievement - but from 4.10 onwards he was calling me every 20 minutes or so asking for something else, so I didn't get any extra sleep! Do I persevere with this and hope he gets the idea? Any other ideas?


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

I wouldn't gove him the dvd either. Just let him get bored so he'll go back to sleep. Don't answer him. Get him a gro clock so he knows when it's morning time


----------



## Babdee

Yes a Gro clock works well with Jacob. We have it set to 7am weekdays and 8am at the weekend. He pretty much accepts now that he has to stay in his room until the 'sun' is up. We can hear him playing often from about 6, but he leaves us alone. Worth a try. Xx


----------



## carrie lou

We had a Gro clock but it broke   Might have to get another.


----------



## amandaloo

Carrie- I wouldn't leave DVD in there or snacks . I'd ignore him until he goes back to sleep . Id persevere with that for a while rather than entertaining him . Noah did it for a while  that's what I did . Never had a gro clock but might be worth a try x


----------



## northernmonkey

Babdee - congratulations! Beautiful name. Glad to hear everything is going well. 

Carrie - I agree with the others, don't give him anything that suggests it's not nighttime. Both my older girls went through this and we would just go into their room, tell them it was still nighttime and leave them to it! Gro clocks are a big success in our house too.

I need some advice ladies please. Dd#2 knocked her front tooth on Saturday and told me this morning that it's wobbly. We've just been to the dentist and he said he's 90% sure it'll settle back down but if not she'll have to have it extracted. In the meantime he wants her to avoid biting on it for a few days. Problem is, dd puts everything on her mouth - she'll chew on her clothes, toys, books, lunch bag .... I've told dh I'm keeping her off school for a few days so I can keep an eye on her but he thinks we should let her go in. I just want to do everything to save her tooth and avoid the trauma of extraction. I can't expect the teachers to watch her every minute. What would everyone else do?


----------



## amandaloo

Northern monkey - you will be suprised how quickly it settles down same thing happened to Noah and my mum and dad took him to dentist. I can't remember it being wobbly for a prolonged period id say 2 to 3 days if that ? And on second day it was a lot better . Noah was young though when it happened not sure if that would make a difference really . He was eating solids at time . Would she eat soup etc for next few days ? I'm not sure if I'd keep off school for it ? Maybe a day or something ?


----------



## Lindz

Hiya everyone
NM- we had the same with DS. I was honest with him and told him he had to be gentle with his poorly tooth so it could get better and just tried to give him softer stuff for a few days. His moved for at least a week or so and then lost it's colour and went grey. I thought it had definitely died and we'd have to have it back but it seems to have settled and regrown nerve routes so is getting colour back and now looks almost white again. At dentists tomorrow so we'll see. 

Carrie- had same with DD. We also had gro clock. Gave her no additional toys or anything (though she does have some in bed with her) and just went in when she called, gave minimum attention and just said its night time until it's yellow. When she managed to make it to the sun without shouting we gave lots of attention and praise and a little treat if she did it for 3 days in a row. Start with your clock going yellow really early to make it achievable and move back gradually. We're still only at 6:45 but we're all ok with that for now. 

X


----------



## northernmonkey

Thanks for replies. I was surprised to read that your little ones had the same, which is silly really because loads of children must knock their teeth loose the number of falls etc they have.

It's reassuring to know your boys' teeth both settled. I can handle it turning grey as long as it stays put!  Bedtime was a bit of an ordeal because dd sucks on a blankie's foot in bed and I had to tell her she couldn't have him for the first time in over 4 years because I was worried it would aggravate the tooth :-(  I've decided to keep her off school tomorrow because she has swimming in the morning so probably not the best place to be with 4 and 5 year olds flinging arms and legs everywhere   Plus her gum is split so swimming pool water and open wound.... Yuck!  Oh well, fingers crossed she'll be ok but in the meantime it's something for me to worry about for the next week or so!


----------



## carrie lou

Thanks girls for the advice, I'll let you know how it goes   


Nm, sorry to hear about DD's tooth, poor thing - hope it mends itself soon


----------



## juju81

Carrie, we have the same thing with Noah.  Gro clock doesn't and hasn't ever worked in our house! Anything before 6 and we tell him it's night time still.  After that, he has a pad in bed and plays games or watches trains on YouTube     Until we get up.  Usually around 7.  He's a year older tho and will happily just lie in bed and watch that!


----------



## northernmonkey

Ju mine are banned from you tube after I found them about to view a Frozen parody of do you wanna build a snowman titled do you wanna f**k a snowman


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




----------



## My Son is My World

Haha nm that made me lol! Xx


----------



## ceci.bee

very quiet on here is everyone ok? have been MIA for work trips back to Africa and now the states, hectic and tiring at 20+ weeks but good to keep things moving before i go on mat leave.

Mini hope your boys have recovered from their shock   

lots of love to all
Ceci
ps Josina have you popped yet??


----------



## My Son is My World

Wow ceci you're superwoman - I wouldn't be able to do all of that travelling now let alone when pregnant. Get those feet up!

Well my beautiful boy is one!! I just cant believe I'm a mummy to such an amazing little boy. Yes he can be a little monster who doesn't ever seem to sleep but I wouldn't change him for the world - hes given us the best year ever. Woohoo party time!! Xxxx


----------



## carrie lou

Happy birthday James! Where did that year go?!  


Ceci, oh bless you, can't be easy when you're pregnant   How is Joshi?   


AFM, all doing well. Z had some issues adapting to life with his little brother but we seem to be turning the corner. He's just getting over a nasty stomach bug though and barely eating anything   A is doing great and weighs 11lb11oz. We have our 6 week check today. It's exactly a year since my mc   I still feel sad about it but am so grateful for what I have now.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Carrie it was nm that had the shock  
My god how do you do it!

Carrie lucas had the same 'issues'   his lasted about 3 months   

Emlore hope he had a good birthday.   still not sleeping??


----------



## My Son is My World

He had a fab day thanks mini! I'm such a proud mummy - I love my prince so much! He did get much better at sleeping but since hes been doing his nursery settling in sessions (which he hates still!) the separation anxiety has kicked in and hes so clingy and upset at bedtime that I'm having to hold him to sleep again. It wont be forever though so I'm not complaining - I actually love watching him sleeping in my arms and feeling his breath when hes snoozing x


----------



## ceci.bee

Emlore happy birthday James! 1 is such a special birthday, hope you had a wonderful day, and he settles more into nursery soon         

Carrie so pleased Z is doing better with his big bro, it is such a massive adjustment for them, I am expecting it to take a while for us as well...............and 6 weeks is a lovely thing to be doing on the anniversary of your loss


----------



## Josina

Hi everyone

Ceci- thanks for asking about me. I'm still here   Reading along as much as I can but my ff obsession has been overtaken by the busyness of trying to finish work (dragged out paperwork for last two weeks   I WILL finish by Wednesday. I will!) and getting things ready for baby. 37 weeks. Hospital bag pretty much packed, just need to add snack food-- in SA I will be admitted for 3 nights for natural birth and 4 nights for CS so it's more like a suitcase   Baby 'room' (corner of our bedroom) still not ready but DH is on board to finish painting this weekend and get everything down from the loft. I am doing masses of laundry! Had a lovely baby shower on Sunday- everyone was very generous- with things I don't need! So we have zillions of gorgeous, cute 0-3 outfits and about 10 different blankets! Shopping today- going to try change some of the outfits to bigger sizes and get some of the essentials like a changing mat   Exciting times. My last scan at doctor was a week ago. Baby is head down but not engaged. My cervix is very closed apparently so Dr thinks I will definitely go full term. I'm just happy he's growing so well. And maybe I'll get a couple of weeks to relax. He was already 6.8lb so going to be a big boy. Sorry for Me post. Difficult to look beyond me at the moment to be honest   DH birthday this Tuesday- its been very overshadowed!! Need to sneak off during shopping today to get him something from his parents and my parents so he has more than one gift to open.


----------



## juju81

♥ Mighty Mini ♥ said:


> Carrie it was nm that had the shock
> My god how do you do it!


Mini, what on earth are you going on about?


----------



## juju81

Not long josina, wow.  How exciting.  Wha is your due date?


Ceci, alot of travelling.  Were you on your own?


Carrie, glad Z is coming round to the baby.  Thankfully I never had any problems with Noah but I do know of a few who really had a tough time   


Emlore, wow.  1 already.  The first year flies by then slows down a bit 


All ok here.  I've got huge problems with my back and legs.  I've slipped a disc and now have sciatica.  I'm awaiting a cons appointment on the 20 th november.  Ages away.  Am off to New York in 3.5wks too so I'm seeing an Osteo in the hope she can ease it enough for that.  We've just started phoebe on a little bit of BLW. She's not really interested,  Noah's now settled at school too.  So were now on the countdown to Christmas


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Hi peeps, lovely to hear all the news.
Ceci - not going anywhere near Ebola I hope!
Must be hard travelling pregnant.

Emlore - congratualtions on reaching the 1 year birthday - lovely. I am sure the separation will settle down in the next few months.

Juju - lovely to hear you are near 6 months. My piglet eats everything of hers and then starts on mine and C's. Countdown to Christmas - eeek. We are having a small Halloween party at one of the Mum's houses and have been buying cheap bits from the pound shop and ASDA to dress up in. We are tasked with making spooky cup cakes - got a red velvet mix for ''blood'' cup cakes and chocolate mix for the rest, and lots of spooky coloured sprinkles and decorations.

Carrie - he is a big boy already. E is 9 months and only weighs 17lbs, although she has started to look more chunky since she started food. All babies are so different - my baby girl, so good at breastfeeding compared to C has self weaned at 9 months from the breast - she started biting me hard with her teeth and now does not want to even try and suckle. I am a bit sad in a way. She is not interested. Whereas C who struggled with breast feeding went on til 14 months, and would have carried on if I had not had to stop for the frozen embryo cycle.

Rest of my news - Dad's house refurb going well, but I am up at least 2-3 nights a week til 3-4 am researching fittings and trying to get within the budget - choosing item, trying to get price matches, looking at delivery charges etc. It is mind blowing, but lots of fun. This week I have bought the bathroom fittings - basin, bath + screen and toilet, all the accessories, taps, shower, waste fittings etc.

I am now researching all the carpets and tiles for the house and the 3 types of blinds needed. Roller fabric for the wet areas, white wood for the other windows and vertical fabric for the patio doors.

I have already had to choose kitchen fittings, paint colours, laminate flooring, windows, internal and external doors, stair parts, door furniture, electical fittings and how to rewire it, garden, who to do all the work, skip hire and all the massively hard work we did clearing 50 years of stuff. 

Dad doing well in his nursing home.

Got to get ready now. We are taking C to see Thomas the Tank Engine in the flesh this afternoon. Fat controller's tea party at 5!


----------



## juju81

Ah bless her Holly.  Phoebes 6months next week and only 14lb2! She's a tiddler like her brother was!  

Enjoy Thomas, we took Noah last year.  He loved it x


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ju nm found her girls watching do you want to [email protected] a snowman on you tube. Ceci thought it was my 2. 

Holly are you resting out your dads house?


----------



## carrie lou

Holly, wow sounds busy but very exciting   Yeah I can't believe I have such a chunky little boy. I am quite slim myself and usually size 8-10 so it's bizarre to think all his chubbiness has come from me!    


Juju, sorry to hear you're suffering   Hope the osteo can help and you can manage to enjoy your holiday   


I had such a funny dream last night and thought you ladies would probably appreciate it. It was about our four units of sperm crossing the Atlantic   A tiny Zac was in one vial and a tiny Arlo in the next, and mystery children in the other two! I told DH this morning, he thinks it's bizarre but I think it's lovely   


We had our six week check yesterday. GP laughed when she saw how chubby my boy is! He has such a plump tummy and little rolls of fat on his legs   Only thing she commented on was that his chest muscles get drawn in when he breathes which can be a sign of a floppy larynx - probably will sort itself out but she's referred us to paeds just in case   Bit worrying. She didn't examine me at all though, thought at the least she would have felt my tummy


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

I happen to have my red book here for E at the mo - writing in it her second tooth, clapping to if you are happy and you know it and standing unaided (latest tricks!) and she was 11lbs 9oz at 18 weeks old!

Well done you Carrie! You must produce some gold top milk!


----------



## carrie lou




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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Carrie they check the mother separately. Well they do here anyway. Hope arlo is ok.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

I was not examined in either of my 6 week checks and I had c-sections, one with a wound complication of a haematoma and infection.

To be fair the doctor asked me the second time if I wanted to be examined and I told her that the wound was completely healed with no issues and that I was just dealing with numbness and a bit of tingling on touching up to my belly button, which can be normal after a c-section, I did not have after the first one. She agreed it was all normal and would settle with time.


----------



## juju81

I wasn't examined either.  Just asked if I had any concerns!


----------



## My Son is My World

Love your profile pic juju - too cute  x


----------



## juju81

Ahh thanks Emlore.  I was thinking yesterday actually about how much our lives have changed over 5yrs.  I never in a million years thought I'd have 2 children.  Just from IUI too <3


----------



## carrie lou

Totally agree, today we drove past the cathedral where we went to the Saying Goodbye service for our angel baby a year ago. I got choked up thinking about it and how far we've come since then, I sometimes feel like the luckiest girl in the world. 


I saw the same GP after Z was born and I'm sure she felt my tummy then, so was a bit surprised she didn't do so this time. But fortunately I have no concerns.  She did ask how I was doing with regard to mood and my antidepressants. Also asked the dreaded contraception question   But she knows our history so I just said we don't need any, and she dropped the subject.


----------



## My Son is My World

Ladies I'm looking for a little bit of advice from you experienced mummies if you don't mind...

James has never been the best of sleepers (as some of you are already aware!) but a few months ago we did get to a point where I could put him in his cot, leave the room and he'd shout for 5mins but then self-soothe to sleep. However, since he's started his nursery settling in sessions (which he hasn't taken well to at all) we seem to have gone a million steps backwards with his sleep. We still do the same bedtime routine as always, but now the second I turn his lamp off and leave the room he will stand up in his cot screaming hysterically :-( Clearly this is separation anxiety that my poor little sausage is suffering from. I did try the cry it out method but on both occasions I've done this he's made himself so sick after just 5mins that it is like the exorcist has been in his room so I'm not prepared to do that again and put him through so much distress. I've also tried just laying him back down each time he stands up (not saying a word to him) but he's literally up again like the speed of light and is still screaming hysterically - that game went on for over an hour both times I've tried it. I have found a bit of a new solution - sitting on his floor and holding his hand through the cot for 5mins then taking my hand away but still sitting there until he's pretty much asleep (I can't leave sooner because you think he's asleep and then he lifts his head and starts looking for me and if I'm not there the screaming and standing cycle begins all over again). This new routine takes about 20mins so isn't too time consuming but I just don't know if I'm doing the right thing by him. Any ideas/suggestions/experiences of similar sleeping problems with a 12 month old?
Thanks mummies (sorry for the me post!!)  x


----------



## carrie lou

Sounds tricky Emlore. I don't think there's any right answer here but I personally wouldn't do cry it out while he is still suffering from separation anxiety, he needs to learn that you'll be there for him. You could try a technique called gradual retreat which is where you gradually distance yourself from him until he is falling asleep on his own. It might work well since you're already at the point of just holding his hand. So start with that, then sitting beside him without holding hands, then each night sit a little further away from him. The idea is that eventually he won't need you in the room anymore and will go to sleep by himself. It's not a quick fix though obviously and only one approach. You have to do what's right for you. Good luck Hun


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sounds like it's working for you emlore. They all go through these silly stages. Both mine did. The way I dealt with it is leaving the room for literally 5 secs, go bs k a d lay back down and repeat. I'd leave it slightly longer each time. 

I'm doing this at the Moment with ds2. He's 2.5yrs. He's at The stage where he's attempting delay tactics.   he needs a wee then he needs a poo then he needs another book then he needs to watch his clock,   he refuses to kiss me do I say good night and walk out for 5 secs. He screams at his gate, I go in and he gets in bed.   job done. Tonight he did a little moan    

But sounds like the hand holding is working. I did similar we called it lie on the bed. We'd lie down with them for a few mins then I'd say I'm counting to 5 and then I'm going. Seems to work for us.


----------



## northernmonkey

Oh Mini you've reminded me of the delay tactics! I remember dd#2 doing that.  It used to drive me insane. One night after numerous excuses to get me yo go back in the bedroom, I told dd I had to go downstairs to phone grandma (a lie.) I went down and 2 mins later dd shouted through the monitor that she wanted me so I said I was talking to grNdma and would go up when I'd finished. Silly girl believed me and fell asleep. I did that every night from then on and it sorted her out! It still amazes me that for a bright girl she didn't suss me.  

Emlore I agree with the others, stick with what you're doing. I saw what Carrie has suggested on a baby sleep programme last year and it works. What's the latest with the nursery?


----------



## carrie lou

Oh gosh yes, Zac does that... I need another drink, tuck me in again, I want a toy to cuddle, this is the wrong pillow.... And on and on. Can drive you crazy some nights!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

At one point samuel was messing about so much lucas got hold of him and dragged him to bed himself   

Samuels speech has suddenly Improved he's gone from Saying nothing to sentences   Still not heard from speech therapist but I don't think he needs it now. His fave words are , why, WHAT!, cos I want to, and I don't want to


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

You are doing the gradual retreat method and that is very gentle and the best way for a child who is suffering separation.
I just gave up and co-slept with mine and do even now. C, E and me all start off in the single bed together cuddled up. I stay awake until E is asleep and then put her in her cot and she is fine with that - grumbles, turns on tummy, blanket over and snores (C never was happy and always woke up and did a lot of hysterical jack in a box standing up), and then I can usually leave C and go back down to get things done and rejoin him later.


----------



## amandaloo

Hi ladies

Elmore - sorry I can't help but sounds like you have had good advice from everyone .  Hope it works for you  

Been to see consultant last week . Going to do two rounds of medicated iui . This will use up remaining sperm therefore no more go's. I think this will put closure on it .. You just never know though . I'm 40 on Saturday so hoping for a little miracle .  I'm having injections and the injection to time ovulation which I feel will be of more benefit . 

Hope you are all ok 

Amanda x


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




----------



## Babdee

Thinking of you Amanda, and wishing for your little miracle       

Hope you're having success Emlore. Lots of great advice from the other ladies.

Afm, I haven't been very well. I ended up going to out of hours surgery a couple of Sundays ago, thinking I had a flu-like cold, but feeling rotten, and was told to go straight to a&e. I ended up in hospital for 5 days on a drip, and was told when I'd improved, what had happened. Turns out I had severe pneumonia and was borderline sepsis. They said I only just got to hospital in time, otherwise I'd have been straight to ICU for probably a couple of months, and might not have made it out again. It's all been such a shock, and a huge scare. And not to be able to see my babies the whole time was heartbreaking. I'm home now, but feel totally exhausted! All those wonderful men and women in the nhs saved my life. The whole experience has been quite a wake up call! Look after yourselves ladies, just as much as you look after those around you xxx much love xxx


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## carrie lou

Babdee that's so scary Hun   Hope you're ok now. Can't remember if you were BFing, but if you were, are you still able to carry on? Must have been awful being away from your LOs especially with your baby still so young.  


Amanda, very good luck Hun - will be crossing my fingers for you


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## northernmonkey

Amanda - great news, hopefully the timed IUI will do the trick.   

Babdee - omg how scary. Thank goodness you went to the gp when you did. Do you suffer from chest infections or was it totally out of the blue?


----------



## Babdee

Thank you Carrie, NM  
No I'm not bf-ing Carrie. I had (once again) been feeling guilty for not doing so, but after all this, I'm relieved that I'd already stopped, and that my milk had dried up. Some of the meds were not suitable if bf-ing, and Drs admitted it was much easier that I'm not. I shall not feel guilty anymore!

It was totally out of the blue NM. They initially said that they were treating me as though I'd picked it up in hospital as it was less than 8 weeks since giving birth there, but they've also said that my immune system won't have recovered from pregnancy yet, so that is likely to be the reason it got so bad. But yes, so v scary.
Still on antibiotics, but def seem to be improving  hope you're all ok xxx


----------



## carrie lou

Babdee you poor thing   Yes I can imagine it would have been very difficult to keep BFing in hospital and on lots of meds. Maybe as you say it's just as well, one less thing to stress about


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## northernmonkey

Babdee I'm sure your body needs all it's resources in order to fully recover over the next few months so it definitely sounds like a good thing that you're not bf'ing. Are you managing to get much sleep now that you're home? I hope you have plenty of help around you.


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## amandaloo

Babdee- oh my goodness that sounds awful    You poor thing   . Really hope you feel better soon xxx


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## ceci.bee

Babdee            hope you feel better soon

Amanda that sounds like a really good plan, I am keeping my fingers crossed for you


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Rest up babadee


----------



## Josina

Babdee- that sounds very scary indeed   Hope you feel better soon and have lots of help around you    


Amanda- that's good news that you're able to have some more tires. I think I'd feel the same if there was still sperm left to use because it leaves a hanging What If. All of my attempts were medicated as it gives more control and a slightly increased chance of success. Good luck    

Emlore- sounds like you're doing the right thing.it must be hard when they are screaming like that


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Babdee - I work in ICU and we do see people out of the blue with pneumonia sometimes. Especially if they are run down and immune suppressed. Flu in pregnancy/just after is very dangerous and people forget - your body copes with a lot around pregnancy. Complications like pneumonia are one of the biggest risks. Try and get some rest, good nutrition and don't forget to accept any help on offer. Hire some help if needed or get homestart charity to send a volunteer to help.
Do keep hydrated, mobile and wear those ted stockings - you don't want a clot in your legs if you are post pregnancy and recently seriously ill. xxxxx


----------



## northernmonkey

Josina have you finished work now? This last part of pregnancy is so exciting, enjoy it! Hope your dh had a good birthday. I know what you mean about it being overshadowed - my DH's birthday is 5 days after dd#2 and 4 days before dd#1 so he's lucky we remember it!


----------



## Babdee

Thank you for all your lovely messages 😊 they mean a lot xxx  

Holly, thank you for all the advice    I feel rather stupid for not having realised or thought about how serious flu can actually be. I was too busy thinking about school runs, nappies, cooking, washing etc. to stop and think how unwell I was starting to feel. We're going to look at getting someone to come in and do some cleaning, and I'm making sure I eat/drink well, but I had to google ted stockings... No one has mentioned them before. Where do you get them from? I was having daily injections in hospital to thin the blood. Xxxx


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

They should have given you ted stockings in hospital really. Your GP can prescribe them for you, or phone the ward and ask them if you should be wearing them since you are post pregnancy and have been very unwell.
I wore them for 6 weeks after both my c-sections and we would treat someone with extra care if they were recently post natal with sepsis.


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## My Son is My World

Back at work on Monday after my mat leave :-( Please someone tell me this will get easier x


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Aww it does emlore. I like my adult time. Its nice to come home to them tho.


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## amandaloo

Emlore- I agree with Mini the adult time is good it reminded me that I had a life as well as being a mummy . Hope it goes well tomorrow xx


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## carrie lou

Aw Emlore, yes it will definitely get easier Hun. And the girls are right, some time being yourself and not "mummy" will be good for you. And you will better appreciate and make more of the time you do spend with J. Hugs to you, it's hard leaving them for the first time, but he will be fine


----------



## My Son is My World

I'm sure it will get easier in time but I just feel absolutely heartbroken and cant stop crying. I look at James and just feel so sad for him that his routine that he loves is about to be turned upside down. Hes such a little sensitive soul too. Feeling like a very bad mummy right now :-( x


----------



## carrie lou

Oh Hun, you're not a bad mummy at all!   Children are a lot more resilient than we think. He will adapt in no time. It's normal to feel like this; the first time I left Z I couldn't concentrate on anything for worrying about him  It was really hard, but he managed fine. Will be thinking of you and hope your first day goes well


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

It'll be fine. He'll find his own routine while youre in work


----------



## Babdee

Hope your first day isn't too tough emlore   I think it'll be harder for you than for James. I'm sure he'll be fine  

Thanks for the advice Holly 

xxx


----------



## My Son is My World

Thanks for all of your support ladies. James was with my parents today so had a fab day! Nursery tomorrow though - week! X


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Emlore - I did the same - I was totally heartbroken. In fact it clouded my maternity leave the first time worrying so much about how heartbroken I would be and how awful it would be to ever leave C.
But I was so surprised to find out how much C enjoyed nursery and having a social life in a different place, the different learning opportunities etc and how much I enjoyed someone else telling me how well he was doing. I also loved pick up time and all the wonderful hugs.
I realised just how much he thrived on nursery when he stopped going when I went on Maternity leave - he was so bored. Now he skips into preschool locally and tells me how much he likes preschool. He will be the big brother looking after his sister this time when we go back to work as it looks like they will be in the same nursery (in different rooms). This second time, although I am not looking forward to a return to work as there are not enough hours in the day and I will miss the children, it is not clouding my maternity leave in the same way as I know E will enjoy it.


----------



## ceci.bee

Emlore         it is such a wrench going back to work and changing things around, I found it really tough. I did half days for the first two weeks, which really helped, and like HOlly when I realised how happy Joshi was with his nursery and nanny (we were in africa then with affordable childcare) I felt much better, although ironically sad that he didn't seem to miss me more than he did! He loves his nursery and thrives on the social life there, and is now learning spanish and doing yoga and all sorts of things he wouldn't be doing with me. you are not a bad mummy, you are a mummy living in the real world who needs to earn an income, and in time will set a great example to him of a strong working loving mum. Good luck, it will get easier


----------



## Josina

Hi ladies
Quick question if anyone knows... :
I've been advised by midwife (and google) to have lots of sex. says sex is recommended because semen has prostaglandin which can help get things moving apparently. But I was wondering, do our Azoo boys produce prostaglandin?
I'm still comfortable enough, and DH happy to of course, but if it's pointless then I'm not sure it's worth it. Was quite funny last week when we tried


----------



## carrie lou

As far as I know they do produce prostaglandin. But from what I've heard you'd need a bucketload of semen to make a difference   I'd still say it's worth a shot though. Anything that gets things moving   How are you doing Hun, not too fed up I hope?


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Couldn't tbink of anything worse


----------



## Josina

Thanks Carrie
A bucketload hey   maybe not!
I'm doing great. Have loved being pregnant... Worried I'm going to miss it   but starting to feel more uncomfortable now and excited to meet LO. 
Went to see midwife yesterday and she says he's staying put this week. I was hoping he would make his own decision and arrive bit early so I don't need to fight with my doctor (the whole CS thing here that I mentioned before). But seems its not meant to be. Probably induction next week. Midwife said the later I can push that with doctor the better chance I have of natural.


----------



## My Son is My World

Wow josina where has the time gone?! So excited for you. Come on little fella hurry up your mummy wants to meet you 

Ladies do any of you work compressed hours? X


----------



## Lee22

Josina- time does fly!!!
I really hope he arrives soon! Try everything I say, all the old wives tales 😄 they may just work. 
I can't believe how quickly time does go. Think I'll also miss my bump. 
Thinking of u and let us know how u getting on


----------



## northernmonkey

Quick question ladies. How old were your lo's when they dropped their afternoon nap? My eldest two were over 3 years old before they dropped theirs and that was because they became more difficult to settle at night. Dd#3 has been fighting hers for about 3 weeks and she'll be 2 in December. Surely a child of her age still needs a nap?? If I cuddle her to sleep she'll usually go for around 2 hours but I don't want to have to do that every day! She's being a madam generally so I'm not sure if it's a phase....


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

My son has a nap in the day if he is in the car or after a full day at nursery and he is nealy 3.5.

News Flash - Emily is walking 2 steps completely alone and can go indefinitely holding a little finger tip in each hand or pushing a trolley. Was 10 months yesterday. She is very pleased with herself!


----------



## My Son is My World

Nm - my ds is 12 months and refuses any naps in the day at all! I've tried everything but no luck so he gets up at 6am and doesn't sleep until about 7 30pm. Its a bloody nightmare!!! X


----------



## Lindz

Morning ladies
NM- mine are nearly 4 and still have their nap. Think it's me who need it more than them though and know I'm on borrowed time. Seems to vary hugely from child to child

I'm having a proper wobble about whether to try for number 3. I've always thought we were done but I've been having little doubts. Problem is that DH is totally against and wants to move on and save to take kids skiing rather than save for treatment. I'm also scared of it not working, scared of another high risk pregnancy etc etc hmmmmm!!


----------



## carrie lou

Zac dropped his nap around his 3rd birthday. It seems to vary a lot.


Lindz, ooh number three! Exciting. Good luck with your decision   


Arlo is due his first vaccinations tomorrow but poor baby has a nasty cold   Anyone know if he can still have them? Don't want to delay if we can help it but also just want to do what's best for him


----------



## Babdee

Jacob stopped his afternoon nap a bit after he turned 2, but will still sleep in the car during the afternoon now...

Wow Holly! Two steps already at 10 months!! Clever girl Emily!! 😄

Good luck with your decision Lindz! Exciting! 😄

Lottie is also booked in for her first jabs tomorrow Carrie. She was originally meant to have them last week but she had a slight temperature so the nurse wouldn't do them. She's had a cough/cold for a while now as well, but I think it was the temp that was the issue. Is Arlo's temp ok?

Xxx


----------



## northernmonkey

Thanks for your replies. She's in her cot now chatting away.... She must be the only child I know who doesn't fall asleep in the car or the buggy, I think she's worried she'll miss something! I guess I'll just carry on putting her in the cot after lunch and at least she gets some down time before I hear the usual 'mummy COME ONNNN!'

Holly - wow well done Emily! That's very early. 

Emlore - 12 months!!!! How have you coped??!! 

Lindz - lucky lady having 2 still napping.  Oh gosh, the broody wobble.... I know all about that one and am having it again now (I know deep down we won't try again though.)  You're in a much better position though - you're young and don't have to make any decision in a hurry. Is your hubby adamant that he doesn't want any more?  Having more than 2 definitely has major financial implications - well it did for us anyway - but having 3 is great (I would say hard work but if you can manage twins you can manage another 1!) 

Carrie - I thought a temp was more an issue with jabs but give your gp practise a call and they'll advise you. Hope Arlo feels better soon. 

Babdee - hope Lottie feels better soon too.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Lucas was 3.5 and samuel still has his. He's 3 in April


----------



## northernmonkey

She stayed in her cot for an hour today but didn't sleep. As predicted, she started her usual 'mummy, come on! Sleep suit off!' I ended up getting her back up and she showed absolutely no sign of tiredness before bedtime at 7pm. I'm gutted. I'll keep trying but I fear it's the beginning of the end! I don't know how I'll cope without my 2 hour break....


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie Jabs only delayed for fever.


----------



## carrie lou

Thanks all. He doesn't have a fever so I'll take him to the appointment this afternoon. 


Babdee, how are you?  


Nm I felt the same when Z dropped his nap but then he started going to bed much easier so I had more time to myself in the evenings.


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## Lindz

NM- I've got friends whose little ones don't always sleep but still need the option or quiet time. They put them down with a book to look at or an audio book to listen to and set the gro clock for an hour so they know they stay there til it's yellow. Sometimes they come down after the hour, sometimes they drop off so don't know it has gone yellow and stay there for 2 hours. Seems to work well and breaks up the day and gives everyone a bit of relaxing time. It's my plan for when mine stop napping!

DH is adamant that we're stopping at 2 but he was the one who said to keep paying for our sperm storage in case I changed my mind. He'd come round if I really tried I think but he'd like a guarantee that it would work first time, there'd only be one, everything would be happy and healthy etc. Think he's been scared by me being totally occupied with DS having awful reflux and him basically dealing with DD on his own for 9 months and sleeping on her floor. He'd need some convincing it would be different this time!


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## northernmonkey

That's a good idea Lindz, I'm going to keep her up today because she's at the childminders this morning and is always hyper when she comes back but tomorrow I'll try the books and toys. 
My dh has always been opposed to having any more tx  but weirdly came home from work last night and told me if I really wanted another he would discuss it!!! We had the same conversation a few months ago and we agreed no more which I accepted then he gets me thinking again.... I don't know whether it's the fact that I know I don't have long to have any more (I'll be 41 next month) or that our remaining sperm has to be used by May or that my youngest isn't a baby anymore but part of me does think just one more.... I think emotionally, mentally and physically though I'm at capacity with 3! Do you know the time limit for your remaining vials?  Your dh might be adamant but so was mine! And another friend of mine is trying for #3 after her hubby changed his mind despite saying for over 2 years that he didn't want any more so you never know. You can certainly reduce the chances of a multiple pregnancy - I was terrified at the prospect of conceiving twins last time and my clinic said they could do a follicle reduction if I wanted to. I do hope your hubby comes round if it's what you really want!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




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## Babdee

Yes, I like that idea too Lindz! I'll remember that for when Lottie is older!

Did Arlo have his injections Carrie? Was he ok? Lottie had hers, and oh her poor little face when the first needle went in; made me feel so guilty! Think she forgave me when we got back home though as I got a tiny smile! ☺☺

I'm not too bad thanks Carrie  I'm having a repeat scan on my leg next week to check for a dvt though, as I had a little leg pain and swelling last week. Dr doesn't think it is, thankfully, but wants it checking anyway. I'm certainly being looked after! Still have a feeling of chest tightness/shortness of breath after pneumonia 😐 but I'm due for a follow up chest X-ray in a couple of weeks, so that should show up any issues.

Hope everyone's well xxx

Ps I managed to preorder the signed new Take That album!!! Woohoo 😄😍😄


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## K jade

ladies i really really hope you dont mind me posting here. But i'm in need of some  desperate advice and wandered if anyone could help. 
as you will see from my sig dear hubby is NOA. 
He is willing to consider DS but only if we never say anything, ever, to anyone. Maybe he will change his mind on that.... 

anyway as suggested by many on here I have accessed alot of info from the Doner conception network. 
I have to say I didnt find it particularly reassuring. 
It seems that families there are very much always talking about the doners with their children. Maybe I'm wrong. but its like a big part of their life even when the child is growing up. I really am worried that should we go down the doner route, how much are we expected to talk about the doner?
I would almost feel like there was an intruder in the house.. does that make any sense at all?
i would really like our family life to revolve around me, hubby and our child , and not feel like theres some imaginary prescence in the house all the time. 
secondly I know a huge amount of people who whilst are not doner conceived, are not raised by their biological fathers. some have never even met their bio fathers.  and they all have absolutley NO  issues with it
So why are parents of doner conceived expected  to shout it from the roof tops as if its something to declare?? is a bit of family privacy too much to ask.  I am worried we will be known as the doner family. 
Maybe i am interpeting the inforamtion from DCN wrong. 

what im really after is how much do you feel the doner is in your life?? or has it more or less melted away now you are parents. 
i just want as normal family life as possible but i seems impossible. 
I do hope this hasnt offended anyone  
any thoughts would be gladly received 

xxxxxx


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## amandaloo

Kayla jade - hi hope you are ok it's always hard when you first find out   . From my point of view my DH wasn't keen on telling anybody at all either at first . We then went to counselling which we were told we had too before starting tx with donor sperm . They also encourage you to tell the child which I understood why the more they discussed it . It can be more upsetting for the child in later life if they find out somehow that you have kept it from them . We both agreed after the session to tell if we were so lucky to conceive .  My DH continued to say While we were going through or waiting for treatment etc that I could only tell one person for quite a while but then over time he realised he needed to tell people close to him himself for support . If I'm honest I kept to my word for a while but then after some time I started telling a few more  once he felt more comfortable with it all . It's very sensitive for men and they can feel it's all their fault  .  When  the first ivf worked I worried about  if he would bond ok etc but I really had nothing to worry about at all . My DH is a wonderful father to him and loves him to bits  . With regards how it affects your life after you have a donor child I don't think about it all the time but it's there if you can understand that  . I will always remember what a kind man has done for us and I wouldnt want my son to be any different . 
It does crop up every now and again for example the midwife asks you about illnesses that your husband may have when your pregnant but it isn't relevant so I told the midwife .. We went to an appt the other week with Noah and again we got asked that question so had to tell another dr . I think you have to be prepared . Had a bad experience when we registered the birth too as my DH said he wasn't the biological father and the registrar didn't know what to do sent us out and called us back in again ! Apparently you don't need to tell them this but DH had seen notices about being illegal to lie etc in there !!! Apparently you sign forms in your ivf etc with regards legal parenting ! Just wanted to give you snippets of information too help you . I honestly think the best way forward is to tell the child . But I wouldn't hold it against anyone who hasn't either . 

Babde- get well soon 

Northern monkey - I think my DS was about 2 and half  it might have even been younger . The odd occasion he will have a nap in aft.  I found he went yo sleep better at night once it dropped .  I think vials have expiry dates on them . When my  payment  is due I'm  sure it  says on the form when they expire .


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

In my opinion if you don't tell they'll only find out years down the line and if they do then will they see it as a dirty liytle secret. ? My dad found out his mother easbt his mother when he was 21 so I know the hurt it has caused. 

It's always best to be open with no secrets then no one slips up avd causes so much upset bro ME it would feel like a black cloud hanging over us like an elephant in the room.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Baba I love take that


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## carrie lou

Kayla jade, hi and welcome   You are right, the DCN is very pro telling. Personally so am I. Like Mini says, we would hate for them to find out some other way further down the line and feel we'd been lying to them for years. We've also told our immediate families so that if our children start mentioning the donor in front of them, they won't be shocked but will be able to be understanding and give them an opportunity to talk about it; it is part of who they are after all. But this doesn't mean we shout it from the rooftops. We have had to tell doctors for medical reasons on occasion (e.g. Zac my eldest was referred to the eye clinic for a possible squint and they asked me if there was any history of squint in the family - in fact my DH does have a squint but clearly there couldn't be a genetic link!) but haven't had cause to tell anyone else as yet.


I wouldn't say there is an extra presence in our house. We read Zac his story sometimes about how he was conceived, and will do the same for my baby when the time comes, and I do often think about this wonderful man far away who has done such an amazing thing for us. But it doesn't crop up in everyday conversation or intrude into our family life. 


Obviously circumstances are different for everyone and you have to take time to decide what is the best route for you and your family. I hope this has been helpful to you, and best of luck for your next steps


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Carrie you've just reminded me of something. We don't shout it from the rooftops. Only close family and very close friends know. But a couple of months ago we read his book again and explained again about the donor and how ds2 was a natural conception (I gibd that bit harder and feel guilty ) but ds1 took it all in and mulled it over and spoke to my dad about it. He asked him How the donor got the sperm out of his willy     my dad was so pleased with that question


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

I don't think it should be kept a secret. The taboo should end. There are many different sorts of families now and all are normal and the children should be allowed to feel normal happy and loved by whatever method their life was created and nurtured.

My DH has a big issue about it and we have drifted apart. He is finding the children more and more adorable though so things might get better with time. My son calls him Daddy, but I would not call him a warm father, but not sure that he ever would be as it is not his personality. My dd is too little yet, but goes over and stands up near him and tries to interact. DH ignored her for a long time, but now she is starting to walk and talk at 10 months he is taking videos and talking to her more and more.

I have not spoken to my son about it yet. He is 3 1/4 and just at the stage of asking which of his friends have a willy and being told that babies start off life inside mummy't tummy. He is not ready yet for more.

Before you have a donor conceived child the perception is that you will be telling them everyday from newborn and reminding them when they say Dadda for the first time that they also have a bio- dadda.

This really is not the case. Once you have your baby they are your precious baby. You are doing the day to day care and seeing all the wonderful wonders that happen every day. Years go by before you have to even think about mentioning it and how. It has to be done fairly early, so it is never a shock, but only when age appropriate. You have to be ready for the questions and for teens to throw it in your face as they can and will do in the heat of the moment. ''your not my Dad anyway, so I will do as I like''.

I remember that the donor was not at the egg collection, embryo transfer, the first scan, the 20 week scan when the gender was revealed (if that is what you want), the midwife appointments when you hear the heartbeat, the birth, naming the child, on the birth certificate, the first smile, first word, first steps, etc etc etc. They left some sperm as a gift in a clinic to someone they did not know, but knew they wanted to help them overcome the pain that childlessness brings. To me that makes them a very lovely person and very important to my family, but they are not there in everyday life.


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## carrie lou

Mini   When Z was about two, he once started asking me about eggs and sperm in front of my very conservative catholic MIL! To her credit though she didn't react!


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## Lindz

Hi everyone
NM- wow to thinking about number 4. We bulk bought our sperm so have quite a bit left til 2018 I think. Problem is I don't think I'd want a much bigger age gap than now. It's a problem with having treatment that it has to be such a concious, deliberate decision, it's not like it's something that might just happen or something we'll fall into. I blame my new niece for me being broody. I might try and just let things settle for bit and see how I feel. May isn't far away for you though   


Kayla jade- I'm not the right person to respond really as me and DH haven't sorted out our telling issues at all (me wanting to, him not). It can be a difficult and complicated situation. I did just want to echo Holly really though in that once you're pregnant other things take over. For me and DH we went through a bit of a stressful pregnancy together where my health and the babies were all we talked about, then it was milk and sick and poo and sleep deprivation, now it's schools and holidays and whether to try for number 3   . As I say, we in some ways have made a bit of a mess of things in terms of what we're doing about telling but in terms of our babies, they are happy and healthy and lovely and gorgeous so i guess something's going right.


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## Fizzypop

Hi Kayla-Jade, just wanted to reiterate what others have said really. We do not think about donor at all in our family life, our DD is ours and do not feel like there is anyone else involved...we haven't yet told but recently had our first conversation together (me and DH) about the time feels right now (baby no.2 is imminent and DD already knows that "babies slide down mummies tummies and out there [front] bums" (blinking big kids at nursery!!) so for us it will be out there soon. We've told parents and close friends know but it isn't something that comes up to talk about. I made it a big deal telling my mum and honestly I think she has forgotton about it!! For me it helped massively in getting my head around it that someone in my NCT group has 2 DE conceived children and was completely open about it whereas I had never wanted to talk about it. Periodically people say things like DD looks more like DH now and we laugh it off (not only because we know what we know but also because we both think she's my mini me, only has blond hair not dark!) and DD talks about the new baby having dark hair like daddy - and maybe he will because they try to match the donor to your DH so it wouldn't be that unusual. Plus DD has gorgeous bright blue eyes that neither I nor the donor have - I think they come from my dad who had similar bright blue eyes, so you get throwbacks even in normal genetics if that makes sense...? Anyway, I'm rambling but think what I'm trying to say is, for me, it's been different to how I thought it would be but wouldn't change for the world 

Hope everyone else is well - baby due in 4 weeks eeeeeekkkkkkkk!!!

NM - go for it I say


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## amandaloo

Fizzy pop !!! 4 weeks 😱😱😱 where has time gone x


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## juju81

Kayla, we've told Noah and if I'm honest it's only because it felt the right thing to do, it's not what I wanted to do though.  . We are open with everyone.  Nick has no issue with anyone knowing and actually I've had a few people messaging me privately to get info because they are in the same situation.  

Whilst Noah reads the book and asks questions it appears to go in one ear and out the other and can be months before he starts asking questions again so don't be worried about it consuming every waking hour x

NM - 4  . To be honest id like another one but I think that's because phoebe is so damn good!

Phoebes on the verge of crawling.  Where did my baby go  

Just been on a girlie holiday to New York.  Amazing  . Nick loved being at home with the kids and is now saying I should work full time and him part time   don't think so mate!


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

You lucky thing Juju - I am sitting here, eyes drooping, wishing I had 20 minutes to myself to have a nap. Never even get a minute.

E did 5 steps alone yesterday and was copying noises so well - a long conversation in the car. She watched Charley Bear on the TV this morning and I asked her if she was watching Charley Bear and she very clearly said ''yes''


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## carrie lou

Juju my hubby has suggested the same thing but ain't no way it's gonna happen!


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## Josina

Baby Benjamin born on 6th November by CS after failed induction at 40 +5. He is perfect and we are totally in love. I'm feeling incredibly lucky to have such a gorgeous healthy boy. Bit emotional and tired, bit sore after CS, but breastfeeding is going well and DH is completely happy, so it's all going really well


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## Lee22

Welcome to the world baby Benjamin!!!!
So happy he arrived safely and you are all doing well. 
Hope the pain settles quickly Josina
So so so so happy for you and your family.


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Congrats Josina


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## carrie lou

I've said it already but congratulations Josina   Pleased to hear everything going well. Beautiful name you've chosen for him


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## Babdee

Huge congratulations Josina!! 😄😄 lovely news xx


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## amandaloo

Congratulations Josina        Hope you recover well xx


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## My Son is My World

Welcome to the world baby Benjamin and well done josina! Enjoy all of your mummy and baby cuddles - they're the best thing in the world xxxxxx


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## juju81

Awww congratulations Josina, lovely name, was on my list when I first fell preg with Noah❤❤

Mistletoe, grrrr to your tired eyes.  I have struggled big time today with tiredness.  Only got back yesterday morning!  Bless E, soon be one


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats joshina   Hope everything is ok


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## K jade

ladies thank you soooo much for taking the time to respond. and massive congrats Josina!!!! 
although i am not sure yet whether this is the route for us, it has been amazing to hear thoughts on it from people who have actually been through it. 
xxxxx


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## ceci.bee

Congratulations Josina that is wonderful news so so excited for you                   

Kayla Jade - I can also reiterate what the others have said - DS seems like such a big deal when you are contemplating it, and then you get pg and the baby comes and mother nature just takes over - my mum put it brilliantly when she said 'babies bring love with them', and my DH adores J and we hardly ever think about the donor, only to send him vibes of gratitude for our wonderful family. DH is now very open about the NOA with close friends and family, and we read J his my story book - and with the new baby we have talked about it a bit more, but overall it is not really relevant now, and certainly there is no feeling of a 'third person' in the relationship, we are family, made a bit unsually, but with all the normal worries stresses, sleep deprivation, joy and happiness of any other family. Goood luck with your decision

NM wow #4 gosh good luck with that decision! 

Holly E sounds like she is doing brillaintly - how are things with DH?

Fizzy wow can't believe you are 36 weeks that has gone so fast! hope it all goes well - think I am next after you?

AFM have been MIA due to work, have my PhD viva next week so have been a bit distracted, but otherwise pg going really smoothly this time around, long may that continue as I am planning to work up to 36 weeks if I can make it that long - mostly for money reasons, but also means I can have xmas break, and then go back for 2 weeks and go on mat leave in mid-jan.............J v excited as are we all,

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Did you find out what you were having ceci?


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## K jade

Again thank you so much ladies. i still feel very confused about our options and scared i may never come to a decision. Sadly DH has been diagnosed as Stertoli cell only,which has been a double blow. 
There seems to be a fair few horror stories out there on the internet. Should i pay these creedence or not? I imagine or hope that people who are donor conceived and *not * upset by it are out there happily getting on with life and not posting about it online? I have to say MTVs generation Cyro was surprisingly reassuring , all the youngsters on it seemed really well adjusted and happy with their families. 
all we want to do is be good parents, and hope that is enough. and of course , selfishly, i long for the biological connection with a child. 
thank you for your thoughts. 
a very confused Kj
XXXXXX


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

I have a colleague at work who is adopted and another family friend who is too and both are perfectly happy.

I have a colleague who has two donor egg children, one from this country and one from Spain and both her daughters are happy.

I think if it is explained in an environment of love and early enough so it is never a shock all will be well.

I think if you leave it until they are late teens and drop it on them during an argument that could possibly be the worst way.

Also if in the old days there was donor anonymity, the child could never find out about part of themselves and this might have an impact on some. I have read some children walk the streets looking at faces trying to see if anyone could be related to them. Now most donor conceived children have the option to find the donor, so even if they never do it there is that knowledge there they could. And even if they do it will satisfy a curiosity.

My colleague who is adopted, did find her birth mother and satisfied her need to know, but her mum and dad who brought her up are still very much the most special people to her. Her birth mother is someone she keeps in touch with, nothing more.


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## ceci.bee

Kayla Jade - deof stay away from horror stories on the internet - the daily mail did a terrible article a couple of years ago interviewing some people who were told as teenagers in non-planned way and then sensationalised what they said and it was in no way a reflection of what happens now. What you are going through is a grieving process, and we have all been through it and it is totally normal. I agree that generation cryo was really reassuring as all the kids were very open and ok with the concept, and most interestingly, those with dads in their lives weren't so interestesd in finding the donor as they were worried how their dad would feel about it, and I thought that was so sweet and so telling that the bond that you build as a parent and child is the most important thing. I know you are searching desperately for a way through your situation, and I am so sorry about the sertoli diagnosis, that is really rubbish. Greiving for your fantasy baby that you are not going to have now, that you planned to conceive in bed with your DH is so hard, and the fact that you are not going to be able to make that baby is heartbreaking. I found going to a 'preparing for donor parenthood' workshop at the DC network incredibly helpful and really helped DH and I move forward in the process, partly the people we met there (most of whom we are all still in touch with) and the convenor danny, who opened the discussion by saying 'if I had the option to reverse my NOA I wouldn't do it, as I love my children too much and could not imagine my life without them' and now I know exactly what he means. Another thing that helped was stalking this thread, as all the wonderful women here are chatting about normal parenthood things, and actually the donor question is hardly ever brought up, as we all have too many other things to worry about! masses of              and              

Ceci


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## carrie lou

Kayla, you've hit the nail on the head - searching the internet will by and large only turn up the negative stories and ignore the overwhelming majority of donor conceived people who are perfectly happy about the situation. I'd suggest going on the donor conception network's site and reading real life stories from all perspectives about donor conception. I found it really reassuring that most people, if told in a respectful way, don't see it as a big deal. My little boy is 3.5 and we already talk about it with him. He knows daddy didn't have any sperm and a donor helped us to have him. Obviously he doesn't get the full implications at this age, but I'm glad we are already telling him.


My brother has a friend who was conceived with donor sperm and donor eggs (because of genetic reasons on both sides) and his parents didn't tell him until he was in his late teens; he didn't take it at all well and has really struggled with the knowledge. This is one reason we decided to tell our children early, so they would never remember a time when they didn't know. 



My DH has Sertoli cell only as well   I remember that feeling all too well and it's true that you will be going through a grieving process now, so give yourselves time. Whatever you decide, the child you eventually have will be the child you meant to have, and whose genes it carries will be irrelevant. Lots and love and luck to you. Do keep in touch as I'm sure we'd all love to know how you get on.


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ceci Did you have a gender scan??


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## ceci.bee

Hey Mini - no we didn't, closed my eyes at that bit we are staying team cream for now, although I would be lying if I said I wasn't tempted


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥




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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Kayla - I am sorry you have sertoli only diagnosis. It kind of firmly closes that door for good.
I am glad we did not have sertoli only diagnosis as this would have called into question my step son's parentage and that is somewhere I would not want to go - the implications would have been horrendous. My step son is very like my DH physically. This is why our diagnosis of NOA was so shocking - I thought DH was a sure thing in terms of fertility.
But it was a shock and my DH would not accept it - I went through years of hell - him not talking about it, refusing to accept it, refusing to take the option we did have open to us. All the time my fertility ticking clock tick tocking away.

I was much more accetping - my view is that you have to re evaluate your options and do what you CAN do rather than dwell on what you can't. Once one door is shut, look at the open ones and choose a route. Unfortunately when DH wants to go through the door that has GIVE UP on it and you want to go through the door that says DONOR and consider the door that says ADOPTION it leads to a bit of conflict.

I got my way in the end, but only by standing firm. I went through the door that said DONOR and he was given the option to follow. We were at stalemate, it was unbearable and someone had to walk somewhere. He still has not accepted it. But he is getting better with the children. Now my little girl has started to walk and be more interactive and chatty, he has started to warm to her. He loved taking us to the zoo and showing DS all the animals. It has been blooming hard, I am not going to lie. If you have a DH who will grieve and move on and be supportive and throw himself in at the deep end and swim, then you will have success. I am so jealous of the ladies on here who have had DHs who have got on with their lives and accepted things, when mine has given me nothing but a hard time.

I don't think DH likes the baby stage much at all and this is probably part of it - I don't think he liked the baby stage with is genetic son. I also do not think he copes with change at all well on any level.

I think the whole thing about having the baby you are MEANT to have is one way to accept it. My babies are just utterly adorable. Really adorable. I know I say that myself, I am biased, but they really are - they are people who were meant to walk on the earth and lighten up the lives of everyone who's path they cross. Without our journey I would have different children, probably just as adorable, but they are fantasy children. The ones that are here, that I can cuddle, play with, teach, feed, chatter to, love in general are the REAL children. Fate has a lot to do with it. You don't know what the other babies would have been like. I could dwell on the baby I lost at 17 weeks. If I had had that one, I might not have had either of the children I have now. 
I don't know whether I would have done a full IVF cycle again to have another. I might have stuck at one. As it was, as both treatment cycles from the first fresh cycle failed, I did another full fresh cycle and got my little boy and then my daughter from the frozen embryo. They are my life. The baby I lost stepped aside to let my two living children come along.

Thoughts for today!
Preschool run coming up....... real life continues!


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## ceci.bee

Holly that is a beautiful post, could not agree more with how you feel about your children - exactly how I and DH feel about J and will about our new LO when he/she arrives. You have had such a tough time with DH, so pleased to hear he is starting to interact more with both children, am in awe of how you have managed to tough it out with him to achieve your dreams


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## K jade

thanks again for your kind replies. really appricaite it. 

DH will  only consider anonymous donation and not telling the child, and, sadly I'm inclined to agree that that would be better for us, 
but in reality I know it couldnt happen as it its too much of a secret to keep. I just dont think I could lie to the person i loved the most.  
feeling very sad with the situation. 
xxxxxx


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## ceci.bee

kayla hun              give yourself and your DH time for this, it is a long journey and everything is so raw right now. In the UK you can't use sperm from an anonymous donor, all donors are now ID identifiable after a change in the rules in 2005, and you can't import an anonymous donor from overseas to use - the only way to use an anonymous donor is to actually travel to another country for tx. As for the telling/talking issue, my DH was exactly the same at first, and I think it is a normal reaction as lots of other women have said their DH's said exactly the same. But you don't need to make a decision about telling and talking now, that is a process that evolves slowly from deciding what to say when people look at the baby and say 'gosh doesn't he look like his dad' (happens ALL the time), and what to say to medical professionals when they ask about family history, when your child starts asking about his/her origins. What my DH quickly realised, is that J is a person in his own right, and we didn't have any right to withhold important personal information from him, so decided to tell. Have you read through the support threads for those telling and those who choose not to? It is a very personal decision, but one that evolves with time. There is no evidence that children reject their parent when told about their donor origins from an early stage, but this can happen when the child is older and finds out he or she has been effectively lied to, and that can lead to problems. We will never know how those children who weren't told and didn't find out feel about it, as they have no idea, but as you say, keeping that sort of secret for an entire lifetime is actually very stressful. My consultant told me at the start that if you decide not to tell, you can't tell anyone and that includes parents, because you never know what might happen in the future if someone you told is ill/drunk/angry/demented and says something you wish they hadn't. I couldn't face the prospect of that, and although DH and I worried about stigma with the telling, actually we haven't encountered anything but support, affection and help.

I can't stress enough, take your time, grieve, and then plan your future together. If it helps your DH or you, have a look at our blog from malawi, where you can see pics of DH and J together and the amazing love and bond they have, also feel free to PM me with any questions you may have 
www.gavemandjoshi.blogspot.com

lots of love and              

/links


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## K jade

thank you sooo much ceci 
yes i think he was referring to going abroad. 
i agree, feel if we did that , then decided that we wanted to put their best interests first and tell, it would be awful as they would never be able to get any info on their doner. 
keeping a secret would be stressful. Id rather have it out in the open but i cant see DH coming round to the idea. he is not ordinarily a stubborn person, but he wont come round to this at all. he just says it would be awful and damaging for the child to know and it would be awful if the child then throws it in his face as a teenager. 
I feel that I would be a good mum and would never raise a child to do that (i know all teenagers can be pretty horrible), BUT the child would be part of *me[/b so would love my DH unconditionally as i do.

I have decided not to railroad DH into it. I'm going to see if the clinic will offer us an appointment with the counsellor to discuss it, I'll ask if he'll come along (i honestly think just getting him to come will be hard enough) and then hopefully take it from there. But i am fearful that he just will not go for it. then what? do i give him more time. what if he never comes round. my fear is being forced to choose between having children and my DH. what an awful choice. 
anyway sorry for the ramble. thankyou so much ladies for your advice and kind words it really is a lifeline at the moment 
xxxxxx*


----------



## Lee22

Kayla- I'm so sorry you have found yourself here. It's a terrible shock and really not fair that these things happen. But like the other ladies have said, there is hope at the end of the rainbow. You just need to figure out what is best for both of you. Don't rush into anything. Make sure you are both happy with your decisions. 
I think going to the counsellor is vital. I do hope your DH can come around to that. It can be very helpful deciding either way. 

My DH was also diagnosed with Sertoli cell only. It was a horrible time coming to terms with it all. 
My DH actually dealt with it better than I did! The reason I think he did is that he is adopted. 
He was obviously devastated and sometimes still has moments when he feels down about things but he knows from first hand experience, that genetics does not make a father or mother!
He has never wanted to know his birth parents and his adopted parents are HIS mother and farther. 
He knows that our little one, who is due to join our family soon, will know that he is her father and that yes, she has a different story from other kids but that's what makes her even more special. 
We know there will be hard times and tough questions to come but I know we can get through it all. 
Only our family and 1 close friend know about using a donor and we not happy at the moment to tell anyone else. 
We will see how things go but hopefully we can find that balance between sharing her story with her and keeping our privacy. 

I really hope you find the right answer for your family. 
Remember, everyone is different and never feel you are forced or have to force anyone else to think the same. 
Just try keep the communication open and give yourselves time to grieve this loss you have at the momenet.


----------



## Lee22

One thing I forgot to mention...
My DH was very happy to have ID disclosure of the donor as one thing he has said is that even though he never has wanted to meet his birth parents he would have loved to have a photo of them or know a bit of background info Like how old they were, where did they live, what they did etc. 
He said he feels it will make our daughter a more settled and complete person to not wonder what this genetic donor out there looks like. 
You saw the same in that MTV show. Most of those kids were just curious about what he looked like and some background info but didn't need or want anymore info.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Kayla - as you can tell I have been there, done that and got teeshirts in every colour of the rainbow.

What your DH has said is what they ALL say when raw and grieving - at least he has agreed to consider anonymous donation and no telling at the moment. Believe it or not that is a very positive step, even if you can't see it - it is the first step on the ladder towards acceptance - my DH said it is NOT happening - NEVER not in a million years, it is wrong, blah blah.....
A counsellor once told me that it takes 2 years to grieve any big loss - in this case loss of fertility, loss of identity and loss of the child you thought you would have together and how it would be conceived and then get clarity on what you want to do instead. She also told me after about 3 sessions with DH that if I wanted children I would have to leave him as he was never going to change his mind, she felt he was that closed to it.

I don't know what it is with men? They can never see it from other's perspective, they become selfish and insular and don't think about this child being a human being with feelings and you being a woman with needs to be a mother too and the child having their own unique personality and being genetically half of the person they love and married, so surely they could love and adore the little you too? And them being the father with 99.99% of the role, except producing the miniscule sperm cell that you can only see with a microscope. Surely something you can only see with a microscope is not all there is to being a father? I don't see my egg as being the only thing to do with being a mother - in fact if anyone asked me what being a mother is, I would not say ovulation!

If I had no ovaries I would use donated eggs in a heartbeat. I would be the mum (with a helping hand from a kind generous selfless person who wanted to help a stranger).

I think the same about my children's donor. He wanted to help strangers going through the heartbreak of infertility. That must make him a nice person before you start on any other qualities. It is not a 5 minute thing for a man to become a donor - they have to have multiple tests, quite a lot of scrutiny and lay themselves open to be being told they have something wrong with them and can't be a donor about 95% don't make the grade. Then if they pass all the tests, they have to go to the clinic 3 times a week for 6 months, making excuses at work or going very early in the morning, travel to the clinic, being seen going into the clinic etc, friends finding out? and have more tests at the end. They also have to lay themselves open to potentially up to 20 children knocking on their door in 18 years time. (10 donor created families and an average of 2 per family) and all the potential implications for their own family in the future, perhaps not even having the foundations to that family laid in their own lives or yet created.

I told my doctor at C's 8 week check that C was donor conceived as the subject of me needing contracpetion came up. I explained that if there was a miracle and they could cure azoospermia and blocked fallopian tubes then I would then need contaception.  The doctor then told me that he had been a sperm donor and that he had told people at a dinner party once and they had been horrified. He said he had told them to get over it and think about why he had done it - that every day he saw people who were deeply suffering from infertility and had no way out unless people donated, and that is when he decided to help.

Keeping a secret could be very hard. You would have to destroy all traces of all paperwork on the subject, never tell anyone. You also could not change your mind in the furture and destroy your child's trust. I think it is better to be open about it from the start and then it is never a shock.

People find that even people they have told often forget. And people see what they want to see. My children are tall because their father is - well yes my DH is tall, but so is the donor, so I don't have to lie, I just agree. They are fair because their father was fair as a child - yes, I expect the donor was too, so again I don't have to lie.

More thoughts for today!


----------



## hopeful wifey

Hi lovely ladies, 

I hope you all are well.

Just hoping that i can ask for a bit of advice - we finally have our BFP and had a scan yesterday so all on track.  The clinic have given me a letter to take to the GP so i can have a booking in appointment.  Just wondering what happens with regard to the donor aspect in this appointment? 

Our GP has been sent copies of all of the letters regarding our treatment from the clinic so I would assume that these are all on my notes?

I am not sure whether I need to bring it up again with them or if they will need to discuss it when I have the appointment - our doctor is newly qualified and I really struggled when i went in to get a referral letter (as did my husband) as she had no clue regarding NOA (couldn't even spell it) and was having to look everything up on the internet which was really really uncomfortable.

If anyone could help I would massively appreciate it 

xx
wifey
xx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

With it being donor sperm i didn't bother disclosing it. They knew it was icsi but that was it.


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations wifey    Wonderful news. Unfortunately a lot of GPs don't know much about infertility - when I needed my AMH tested my GP had to google it   


Re booking appointment - it's entirely up to you what you disclose, however you will be asked lots of questions relating to yours and hubby's medical history and obviously hubby's genetics won't be relevant. So for this reason I decided to be open with my midwife about the donor sperm. Also if you tell them you had fertility treatment to conceive, you will probably get extra scans and appointments as they know how precious the pregnancy is. My MW was great in that respect. Good luck Hun


----------



## K jade

ladies just wanted to say thanks again for your advice and responses. It very helpful. 

lee22, thats great that your DH feels like that and that he felt so happy and content with his adoptive parents. it shows that biology really means very little. 

Holly thanks for your advice. I agree keeping a secret would be hard. But my DH wouldn't want the doner 'invading' our lives or  so he puts it. i have to be honest i do feel the same. he says if we did the doner route it would be our baby and that would be that no half his half somebody Else's. thats great that your Dr was a doner himself!! what an amazing man. 

we are back to the drawing board, I'm finding it hard to come to terms with what to do next. maybe we will go down the anonymous route. Not ideal, but sometimes i guess you just gotta do what you gotta do. it will be difficult, but think Ive given up on any route we take being easy 
thanks again 
XXXXXX


----------



## Josina

Kayla-Jade     It's such a hard time, the decisions and grieving. I still get moments when I remember back and feel so sorry for myself. But time really does heal... And a beautiful baby even more so. As someone with a brand new anonymous donor baby I just thought I'd share my views briefly (LO finally asleep as daytime naps not his favourite, so I should be showering instead of browsing ff!!!) my story is that we did an IVF synced cycle in London last year. As is UK law, we used a known donor from Xytex. The MTESE and whole cycle was unsuccessful. So then we were back home in South Africa where the law is the opposite. Only completely anonymous donors available unless you ship in from overseas at extortionate prices... My DH was happy and relieved. He'd always preferred the idea of anon because his view was that he didn't want our child trying to track down the donor when they are older. He, and his family, strongly believed that if the child knows for definite that they cannot track the donor, then that is a fact that will stop them even thinking about it. Of course I'm skeptical, but it was a very huge step for my DH. He actually moved onto the idea of donor easier than I did. Im the one who pushed going to see Mr R in the UK. I needed to go to the best we could afford, and get a black & white answer to help the decision. Anyway, the thing we really struggled with was about telling or not telling the child. In the end, I basically put my foot down and said as much as I wanted to have a baby and experience pregnancy, I flat out refused to agree to not telling. This is because of all I have read on here and donor conception network. Our baby is his own little person. It is his right to know. And I am useless at keeping secrets, never mind something so massive. It would have eaten me up from the inside. And also, too many people already knew, which made it risky to even try keep a secret. We had a big debate about secrecy versus privacy, and agreed that we won't tell any more people at this stage (all close family and a few friends know). We hope to not make a big deal of it with our son in terms of telling, and yet somehow teach the idea of family privacy.... Not sure that will be possible as we intend to start telling when he is very young. My DHs main concern is that LO will mention it to extended family or close friends who do not know.... But at the moment we are just enjoying having him in our lives, and dealing with all the normal parenting issues with a newborn. Enough of my waffling. I'm going to try shower while Benjamin is still sleeping!


----------



## ceci.bee

Wifey woop woop     and fab news your scan was good, that is wonderful. I also found that at the booking appointment I was asked lots of questions about family and personal medical history, so just said that the male side we only had limited information and they were totally fine with that - prob easier that it is a central london hospital so they see all sorts and deal wtih everything, but it has never been an issue - only after I delivered and they started to give me the chat about contraception was when I had to laugh and say that it wasn't necessary - easier if you say that DH doesn't make sperm instead of talking about NOA, all MW will understand that no sperm = no biological conception hence donor. I am v excited for you and so happy you are moving onto the next stage

Kayla       sent you a PM love, good luck whatever you decide to do or what path you decide to go down. Remember also no decisions now are firm or fixed, and in life generally a flexible attitude especially with parenting is necessary!

Josina lovely to hear from you and hope you enjoyed your shower    and so happy you are enjoying life with your LO. 

AFM 30 weeks nearly and all going well, very different to last time, and J is also so excited, he keeps coming out wiht names and patting my tummy, so adorable   

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## juju81

Ceci, this age gap is just perfect.  I wouldn't have it any other way.  That's just me tho, no offence to others!  I do find my days saying "noah get out of her face"
Problem is she adores him and constantly laughs that it just encourages him even more!! Haha


----------



## northernmonkey

Josina - congratulations on your little boy's arrival! Enjoy these first few weeks, it's an amazing time.  

Ceci - 30 weeks already??!! That seems to have whizzed past!

Juju - your photo of Noah and Phoebe is so cute, I love it. I wish I could get my 3 to sit still long enough to get a good photo - one of them is always looking in a different direction or blinking or just point blank refusing to pose  

Interesting reading about the telling/not telling/anonymous donor etc. I was giving my eldest dd a cuddle at bedtime last night and she asked if my niece has my bil's genes (we've discussed genes very simply as being a list of instructions that determine your hair colour, eye colour, height etc.) I said yes and dd asked how come? So I explained that of our 2 sets of genes one is contained in the sperm and because my bil's sperm made my niece she has his genes. Then went on to say that dd has genes from the sperm of the kind man who helped us. Next thing she's asking how did the sperm get from him to me - luckily she was happy with the answer 'the nurse put it in my tummy with a really tiny tube' - turns out dd thought a sperm was huge because it's drawn larger than life in her My Story book . Then for the first time she asked what the donor looked like. It's the first time she seems to have really grasped that this is actually how she was conceived rather than confusing it with a fictional story. This is totally the right decision for us to be open and honest but I do dread the day when she asks if it means dh isn't her real dad (which I assume is inevitable.)   I'm absolutely ready with my answer but she adores dh and I hope it doesn't make her feel sad in any way.


----------



## amandaloo

Josina - congratulations yayyyy enjoy and hope you recover well xx

Fizzy pop-- next !

Afm- just done a medicated iui BFN again just don't think I was meant to have two ! Don't be worrying about me though I'm ok .


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oh Amanda hun


----------



## Blondie71

Northernmonkey was really interested in your post there about disclosing to your daughter, am I right in thinking your daughter is 7 now? I have 20 month old boys (I'm single and used donor sperm) what age did you start introducing the topic to her? I assume in my case as we don't have any daddy in our house that I will def have to do it younger than you have but it's interesting she's grasping the concept now, good to observe how other people handle things


----------



## OzCalling

Kayla -        such a hard time and I'm sure you just want to press 'stop' on your brain as your mind whizzes around at a million miles an hour. There's been some great advice on here, I'd only add that in my experience my DH just needed extra time to get his head around things and find the path he was comfortable with. I think your decision not to drag him through it is absolutely the right one. Everyone has that knee jerk reaction about not wanting to tell and the fear of rejection from the child, but for many this changes in time I think, for some though it doesn't and they remain adamant about keeping the donor anonymous. I found the waiting so incredibly hard, but once we'd had the failed TESE and the sertoli cell only diagnosis and some time for us both to grieve and accept that the door was firmly closed, DH realised that he needed to talk to someone about how he was feeling and we were lucky to get a counsellor who he really clicked with (we'd tried one previously that neither of us found helpful). He actually went to the first appointment on his own and I could visibly see the difference talking through what was going on in his head had on him. He needed to talk to someone other than me, someone not emotionally invested who he could be completely honest with. 


Long story short, but eventually it ended up with us having his brother as our donor, of course not the best option for many but despite my initial horror it is 100% the right choice for our family and we both feel so happy with it now. Everyone is different and there's no right or wrong, you just have to try and be patient and talk it through when he's able to open up about it and you'll get there. But it's important that you're BOTH happy, don't get pushed into something you feel is not right for you. 


Josina - hope you're loving every minute and you're recovering OK


Ceci - soooo sweet about Joshi! Great to hear this pregnancy has been smoother sailing for you.  


Amanda - so sorry about your BFN, are you planning on another try soon? 


Wifey - phew, so glad the scan went well! Huge congratulations, hope you can begin to relax and enjoy being pregnant in the coming weeks   


AFM - 33 and a half weeks already! All going well so far and the baby's now turned head down. I've so enjoyed being pregnant, although the Sydney summer is beginning to get to me, can't believe that in 6 weeks or so we'll meet our LO!


----------



## carrie lou

Amanda sorry to hear that Hun     


Oz, I was heavily pregnant in a heatwave over here so I sympathise, though yours is probably worse! Not long now    


Ceci, glad things are going well. Will you be having another c section or a VBAC?   


Nm, really interesting to hear how your dd1 is understanding more about the donor. Z has started asking lots of questions about it but they don't always make sense!  


Hope everyone is well   We are good. Although A seems to have a sort of childhood eczema, we've been to the docs and he now has lots of creams and ointments - hope he grows out of it eventually, poor baba


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Carrie - C had patches of baby eczema - dry patches that would justy appear and look sore and flaky.
The doctor gave me aqueous cream but this is totally the wrong thing and makes it worse. Also I never knew this but olive oil has been found to make baby eczema worse as the fatty acids in it make the skin more permeable and prone to dry patching. I used to use that on C because I thought it would help!
Diprobase is suitable. 
http://www.babycentre.co.uk/x1044400/can-i-use-olive-oil-to-massage-my-baby

Also look at your diet and think about allergens in breast milk. A colleague's baby was sensitive even to the most tiny amount of cows milk in her diet.

Amanda   

I have finally finished the refurb on Dad's house and the tenants are in. Paying me more than it was originally valued at before the refurb was completed by a long way, and they want it long term if possible. They seem perfect.

We have been all ill with cough and cold. E has been very ill and diagnosed with Pneumonia on Friday after 2 weeks of being ill and temperatures and 3 trips to the doctor and now on a second course antibiotics at double the dose.

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


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## carrie lou

Holly, the doc gave us Oilatum to keep his skin moisturised. He's also got hydrocortisone cream for the really bad bits though they're getting a lot better already. Yes we also tried olive oil before - HV recommended it of all people   


Sorry to hear E has been so ill   Good news about your dad's house.


I've just found out I'm going to be an aunty   My sister is expecting her first baby in June, so Z and A are going to have a little cousin!!!!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

My friends brother is a dermatologist and warned her not to use olive oil on Cradle cap
Or eczema


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

I just edited my post as I realised there was a ''not'' in the sentence that completely confused the meaning.
I think you got what I was saying though - olive oil is BAD for baby skin.


----------



## ceci.bee

amanda               

Hollly so sorry you have all been poorly, hope you are all better before xmas and great news about the tennants. How is your dad getting on the home?

Carrie, sorry to hear about the eczema, hope he grows out of it and you can identify a cause that you can eliminate. 

NM, loved how your talked to your daughter- Joshi was asking about the donor tonight, so we had a very basic chat, but he keeps coming out with all sorts of questions so think I have to be as age appropriate, but straight as possible.

Oz seems strange I am so close behind you, remeber you getting your BFP way before me   my baby also head down and giving me some spd etc but otherwise all good. Very excited for you and hope you are enjoying the summer sunshine down under.

AFM had a long appointment with the VBAC specialist midwife at our hospital (1 hour appointment!) where we got to ask lots of questions and talk through everything in a lot of detail. I think after that we are going to go for a VBAC, but with a low threshold to switch to a caesarian if I get anything that is associated with problems, including induction, failure to progress, fatigue etc, and they are cool with that, so now have to get ready for getting ready for a labour - more excited than apprehensive, but probably down to hypno birthing after CS CD I have been listening to..........

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Sounds positive ceci  

Holly hope emily is ok  

Lucas wanted me to read his my story the other night. He had forgotten whst he calls the donor. Must talk about it more often now. He asked if samuel was made from a donor too   I knew that was coming. Although I have always been honest with him. I said daddy's sperm started working again and samuel was a surprise. He ssid he wanted to be a surprise too. I said he was obviously cos he was. Both were.  

If he starts talking about it more frequently I might have to have a chat with his head teacher to warn her incase he starts talking about sperm and eggs


----------



## juju81

Noah's just started asking questions too.  Asked nick why his sperm didn't work.  Thing is he's now kind of forgotten the convo.  Thing is , should we keep bringing it up or just wait for them? Personally I'm of the opinion I'll wait for Noah to ask.  Tough one.  

Ceci, I'm sure you will be fine.  Have you laboured before? I don't think you have have you so could be long.  Can't believe you are 31 wks already! Have you sorted names?

Oz, not long either.  Seems to have flown by! 

All good here.  Phoebe is 8 months tomorrow.  Started crawling and have 2 teeth.  At the weekend she started standing too.  Gutted.  I wanted her to be my baby but she's doing everything quicker than Noah!  She adores him but I do find my self spending days telling him to get out her face!  Back to work on the 5th January too.  It's upsetting me quite a bit


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Ju if lucas asks about seeds from plants and how do things grow then I tell him then refer to how he grew in my tummy from a donor sperm etc. Just so there's a quick reference to it to keep reminding him. I just don't want him to suddenly forget then find out a year down the line. It's like drip feeding them. That's how I do it anyway.


----------



## carrie lou

Me too, I want it to stay in his mind even if we don't talk about it constantly. But for example when he talks about where babies come from, or "who made us"   I'll remind him of it. And of course we read his book every so often.


----------



## Blondie71

Hiya I've just looked up the "my story book" and it doesn't seem geared for single mums who have used DS but rather couples, do you know of anything similar for us single mums as I like the idea of using books to help, I know I'm still a couple of years away from any discussions but I like to be prepared lol.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

If you contact the DCN they'll tell you the best book to get. I'm pretty sure they do a book for single mums


----------



## carrie lou

Yeah the DCN do a variety of books to cover different circumstances, sure they'll have something suitable


----------



## daisyg

Just to let you know that the DCN do publish books for Solo Mums who used donor sperm. They are available from their website here:-

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/our-story-sperm-donation-solo-mums

There are also new books now available via the website for Solo Mums using double donation and embryo donation:-

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/our-story-doubleembryo-donation-solo-mums-second-childtwins-after-purchase-you-will

Also don't forget that DCN run Telling and Talking workshops to help you tell your little ones (and bigger ones!) and you can also order the Telling and Talking books from the website.

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/our-story-doubleembryo-donation-solo-mums-second-childtwins-after-purchase-you-will

http://www.dcnetwork.org/workshop/telling-talking

If you are a member you can borrow books from the library. I would also really recommend joining for the support and the opportunity to talk to others in the same situation as you. There is also support for your children and the opportunity to talk to other donor conceived children in the future.

Finally, there is also a new DCN video called 'A Different Story Revisisted' which shows donor conceived children of all ages talking about what it is like to be donor conceived.

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/different-story-revisited-dvd

I have 8 year old boy/girl twins conceived via donor embryo in Spain. I am a member of DCN and have been telling my children about their conception with the help of the books since they were about 2.

Best wishes,

Daisy xxx

/links


----------



## carrie lou

Thank you Daisy    


Does anyone know if there is a version of My Story for a second child? Obviously some bits are not relevant if you already have a child through donor sperm. I'd like to get a book to tell Arlo his story but can't see anything appropriate on DCN site? Might have to write it myself


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Doubt it carrie. I need one for samuel really but doubt they'll do that either. I need to somehow tell samuel how lucas came about but don't know where to start


----------



## carrie lou

Must be tricky Mini   Don't the DCN have some advice about it?


Think I will make a book for Arlo, like I did for Zac


----------



## daisyg

Hello everyone!

Yes, DCN produce a pdf called 'Mixed Blessings' which is specifically for families who have non-donor conceived and also donor conceived children. You can order it here:-

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/mixed-blessings-pdf-version

If you are a member of DCN, there are lots of other 'mixed' families you could talk to or meet. You can of course also make your own book or even adapt the DCN ones with your own photos and stories!

Best to all,

Daisy xxxx

/links


----------



## ceci.bee

Ju          sorry you are feeling sad about going back to work, it is so tough for the first few weeks but you will get used to it. she sounds gorgeous and is probably doing everyuthing so fast because she is a) a girl and b) has Noah to copy for everything    you are right I didn't labour last time (hence the VBAC) but would still like to try to go for it rather than just go straight for a section, but am v aware of the risks and have a low threshold for switching if it is going on too long or I am tired etc.

Daisy do you know if the DC network is doing an updated routine mystory book? I heard  a while ago they would but not sure if it is out now??

lots of love to all
Ceci


----------



## Blondie71

Thanks for replies ladies appreciate it and gosh thank you Daisy for so much information and the links that is amazing to have at hand   I will def be having a good read and will order any books I can get my hands on, I'll also join DCN too as you say it's a good tool for connections for the boys should they be interested in future x


----------



## Blondie71

Daisy if you don't mind me asking do your kids bring up the donor issue much or is it pretty much a non subject in your household nowadays? I just wonder is it something they dwell on as they get older or not?


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Ju - can't believe you are back to work already soon. I have taken off the whole year and all my annual leave so don't return until the first week in March.
E is walking really well now. She is toddling around the house very pleased with herself.
She has got over the pneumonia and tonight has another blooming temperature. I know it is the time of year - but please, not again so soon. She was ill for 3 weeks before and had 10 days off and now ill again. I am hoping to get it all over with before going to work as I could not have nearly a month off with grumbling temperatures and nursery won't have them with one. Children's illness is one of the most stressful things of trying to hold down a job and be mother especially in my busy high pressure job. And now I have two of them to catch things. If I could be a SAHM I would.
I am hoping the temperature might be teething (wishful thinking)... a 5th tooth is just poking through tonight.


----------



## juju81

Holly, I'm not in a position financially to be able to take any unpaid! Sucks but like ceci and nearly everyone else has said once I've done a few weeks it won't be too bad.  I get to pick Noah up from school everyday now as changed my hours & still get a day off with Phoebe so it's not all bad!    Is it her first tooth? Phoebe popped 2 up with just one unsettled night! Amazing lol


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## juju81

Hi Mellsy, we are very open with people.  My hubby took it upon himself to tell people who asked if we had kids yet.  You'd be surprised how many people actually have a lot of respect for them for being so open and going down that route.  Now that the babies are here, people actually don't ask anymore so it rarely comes up.  It was more before we had kids and people gave you the "ah, are you going to have kids" kind of wuestion!


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

melsy it doesn't come up at all. Very close friends know but that's it. It might crop when I'm chatting to my friends but it's rare.


----------



## carrie lou

Mellsy, for us it might occasionally crop up among our immediate family who know about the donor. Eg my mum asked me if the donor was into sports because my eldest is very active and outdoorsy (and I'm not at all sporty so he doesn't get it from me!). But it's not something we talk about on a daily basis. There's a difference I think between being honest and broadcasting it to all and sundry. We have only told immediate family and one or two close friends. To be honest, I can't see why your hubby's friends would need to know at all (if you don't want them to, that is). There is no reason to think people would guess when the baby is born. You'd be surprised now often people who don't know the full story will point out imagined similarities between DH and our boys.


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly)

Babies don't have a rubber stamp on their forehead that says I am donor conceived. Most people have no clue and any characteristics can be related to distant relatives if questions come up. They will be none the wiser! 
Remember any child is a mixture of genes. How many families of siblings look exactly alike - very very few!


----------



## northernmonkey

Mellsy my dh only told his parents. None of his friends know.  Loads of people remark on how our girls look like dh because they see what they expect to see. I've often thought that various children at my dd's school are the spitting image of their mums who I see everyday in the playground, then one day their dad comes to school to collect the child and I realise that actually they look just like him and not like their mum.  And my previous next door neighbour had a son who in my opinion bore no resemblance to either his mum or dad but it would never have crossed my mind that they weren't genetically related.


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

My dh,s friends don't know. It's only my friends that do really. And only close friends. 

I had to ask my oldest friend if I'd told him cod he never mentioned it and I couldn't remember if I'd told him or not. Any way I had but he had no reason to talk about it


----------



## daisyg

Hi Blondie,


> Daisy if you don't mind me asking do your kids bring up the donor issue much or is it pretty much a non subject in your household nowadays? I just wonder is it something they dwell on as they get older or not?


Sorry for late reply to your question. Well, I think things are often different for single mums who have used double donation/sperm donation as there is no Dad present, which is not the case for couples.

I have been completely open with my twins since they were born. However, I just introduced their donor conception very gently, mainly by using a DCN book and reading it occasionally as a bedtime story. Later they chose to read it as they loved hearing stories about themselves and how they came to be! If an opportunity presented itself, I would gently talk about the donors etc. but only gently but regularly.
I discovered that you do have to tell fairly regularly as young children simply just forget the information they have been told, so don't assume that if you tell once, or only rarely, that they will have understood. Telling is a continuous process, not a single event.

Anyway, once they started school, I have told each year teacher about their conception and shown them the DCN book, just so they can support them with any questions. However, to date, my children have never told anyone else they are DC kids and they are now 8.

They have however, occasionally asked questions about the donors e.g. what are their names, will we see them and do you know them? At moment this is very low key, and I just answer any questions very honestly but age appropriately.

What I have found though is that at the moment they really want a Dad and talk about that a lot. My daughter and son have been asked constantly by their school friends, and although they say 'we don't have a dad in our family', their friends just don't understand and keep asking them. This is something to be prepared for. I just try and acknowledge any sad feelings with love and support and remain positive. My son is constantly matchmaking for me by pointing out men at the bustop and wondering if I like them enough to marry them!

Anyway, my overwhelming experience is that I quite often wonder about the donors when I look at my kids. I have some sadness about not being able to give them more information, but I have a lot of support from my family and I also know lots of other families with DC children so I hope that will help as well as support from DCN.

So for the ramble! I think telling is hard and sometimes we would rather not do it, but having been honest with my kids, it really feels like the right thing to do despite the funny questions!

Best,
Daisy
xxx


----------



## esrj199

Hi ladies

I hope everyone is well and I hope you don't mind me asking a little question!!

I'm currently 36 weeks (tomorrow) pregnant with twin boys and beginning to get pretty nervous about what is to come. One of my biggest worries (and DH's) is that we feel we can't picture what they'll look like (having used donor) and my DH's overriding worry is that they used the wrong donor. I'm sure these feelings are very normal at this stage, but I wondered if any of you felt this in the latter stages of your pregnancy and if so, could offer some reassurance!!

Mathis thread has been so reassuring for me over the last few months, I thank you!!

Happy Christmas xxx


----------



## daisyg

Hi Ceci.bee



> Daisy do you know if the DC network is doing an updated routine mystory book? I heard a while ago they would but not sure if it is out now??


Yes, DCN has an updated version of that book which is now called 'Our Story' (for heterosexual couples using donor sperm.

Here is a link:-

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/our-story-sperm-donation-heterosexual-couples

 Hope that helps,

Daisy xxx

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Talking to my friends everyone worries what their child will look like. My friend has a tiny bit of chinese in her OHs distant ancestry and she worried a lot about what the baby would look like. When her son was born he looked like her DH a lot. Now he looks like her a lot.

I think you can get far too bogged down and worried. No one knows what their child will look like when born and what they look like when born, hair colour, eye colour, shape of face etc, is nothing like they will look like at a year or 5 years or as an adult.
My DS was born with brown hair and blue eyes. He still has blue eyes but is very blonde.
DH and I are both brown haired but were both much lighter as children so if it comes up I say we were both blonde as kids.
My DD was born with very dark brown hair and now at 1 year she has light brown/blonde hair.
I have green eyes but both my children have blue eyes. As blue eyes is a recessive gene, I must have a blue gene/

The overriding thing I get all the time with my two is how they look so alike and like twins and I talk about the fact they were made on the same day and my DD spent 2.5 years in the freezer. And if they had picked her embryo out to put back with my DS then I would have had boy/girl twins. This usually is such a fascinating conversation for everyone that any talk of parenting disappears.


----------



## JanaH

Merry Christmas to everyone   hope you all have a lovely time with you little ones and family.


----------



## Lee22

Hi all

Just to let you know baby A arrived safely on the 18th December and we are in love!

Slowly adapting to life with such a precious gift. 
DH was in love the first moment he saw her and has been like an excited kid the last week. He says he wouldn't have wanted things any other way as we wouldn't have had HER  

Esrj I was also freaking out of out them using the wrong DS and the baby looking completely different   
I think it's normal! When u see your boys none of that will matter!

We are finding nights tough. Little A does not sleep at all at night. Apparently that's common due to the type of milk you produce at night??
Well I must have the good stuff as she is a "werebaby" at night and doesn't want to be put down or stop feeding. Which has resulted in very cracked and painful nipples  
Any advice?

Merry Christmas to you all!!!


----------



## Jess81

Hi ladies, hope you have all had a good couple of days. 

Our baby girl arrived 7 weeks ago and we are so in love with her! I was wondering if anyone knows where I can get a double donor book from? Thanks xx


----------



## daisyg

Hi Jess,

Huge congratulations on the birth of your little girl! Here is the DD book from DCN....

http://www.dcnetwork.org/products/product/our-story-double-or-embryo-donation-heterosexual-couples

Best wishes,
Daisy xxxx

/links


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

Breast feeding advice - invest in a tube of Lansinoh and smother your nipples in it. 

Go to a lactation specialist and Get your baby checked for tongue tie. Get your latch checked - don't be ''lazier'' at night with getting the latch right as you are tired and just want to put her on - it should not be painful and if it is you need to take her off and start again.

If all else fails try nipple shields to allow the nipple to heal.
If it looks infected and the redness is spreading see the GP for antibiotics.
It will get easier.

Look at the Kellymom website for huge amounts of evidence based information on getting breast feeding right and dealing with all the challenges.


----------



## ceci.bee

Hey Lee and Jess congratulations on your arrivals, that is wonderful news! thrilled for you both.

Re breastfeeding, totally second HOlly's advice - Lanishoh is brilliant and helped me so much with that incessant feeding. To help sleep, try to get bubs to drain your boob so the fatty hind milk come through which will help with sleep, but you may go through some nights cluster feeding - totally draining in so many ways but worth it to get the feeding well established. Good luck hun, this stage feels endless but it does pass I promise   

Happy Christmas to everyone - sorry have been offline for a few days at my parents but thinking of everyone at this time of the year celebrating all our little miracles. Joshi's jumping up and down at the sight of his presents was one of the best things ever.

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## amandaloo

Hi 

Lee and Jess - many congratulations xxxx

Merry Christmas everyone xx


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## carrie lou

Hope everyone has had a lovely Christmas - we certainly have, and 3 seems the best age so far for enjoying it   


Many congratulations to Lee and Jess on your new arrivals    


And a third endorsement from me for Lansinoh - I had quite a bit of pain feeding Zac at first and it helped no end. Strangely had no pain at all with Arlo - perhaps your nipples are tougher by the second baby   Anyway, stick with it if you can because it does get much easier and then you'll be glad you persevered


----------



## My Son is My World

Congratulations to both Lee and Jess on your little bundles of joy  

Sorry I've been awol lately but James has had three chest infections, two viral infections, an absolutely terrible cough and conjunctivitis to top it all off (the joys of him being at nursery!!!!) After weeks and weeks of being ill he luckily recovered just in time for Christmas and he was an absolute superstar. He loved all of the attention he got and he literally ate like a king over the whole period bless him. He's always been such a fab eater and when he stopped eating and drinking for all of those weeks whilst he was poorly it really upset me, but he's more than made up for it over the last few days bless him.

Hope everyone had a fantastic Christmas xx


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## amandaloo

Emlore - poor James that's awful   Glad he's had a good Christmas though x


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Emlore glad he's on the mend. I've learnt that as long as they drink then not eating is fine.


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## Josina

Hope you've all had wonderful Christmases  I've been trying to send this message for three days now! Keep getting interrupted!

It's Benji's first Christmas and we're loving every moment. Well almost (he had his 6 week vaccines last Monday so has been a bit grumpy and clingy). But it's a huge difference compared to this time last year- we were so miserable, having just had our 6th BFN. Now I look at his little face and can't believe I'm a mummy. Just feel so happy and blessed.

Congratulations Jess. Your LO is the same age as my Benjamin. Hope you're doing well  

Congratulations Lee! So happy for you  
But sorry to hear about nipples. The lactation consultant at our hospital said it really shouldn't be painful. Make sure you have the correct latch (maybe look on google pics). She said his mouth should look like the K from Kellogg's cereals, with bottom lip practically turned inside out. Have you tried different positions? The cream helps if you put it on after every feed. And sleep without clothes so they get air at night (put towel under the sheet). Sorry if this is all obvious or repetitive.
In terms of nights- I heard that newborns often get day and night mixed up at the beginning because they are used to being lulled to sleep in your tummy while you are moving about in the daytime, and they are awake and active while you sleep at night. Don't know if it's true but I certainly noticed it, and after a couple of weeks Benji seemed to get the hang of night time. I make sure all night feeds are in darkened room (very low nightlight) and I do not talk to him at night. So we are quiet and I usually doze too. my best advice is not to look at ff or ******** at night- wakes me up too much. Very easy to go back to sleep if you're actually still half asleep   Hope werebaby gets the hang of nights soon

Emlore-- poor James! That sounds like an awful string of illness. So good he mended by Christmas.

Esrj- Late reply to your post.... I felt exactly the same worries in my pregnancy, especially nearing the end. And especially about donor mix up- my biggest fear was a mixed race baby who we couldnt explain... Also, we chose a donor that was blonde even though my DH has dark hair, because he was the best fit in every other way. And we were both blonde as kids so I knew we could just say that. However on the donors profile it said that his father and sister had black hair (he and his mum had blonde) so I was worried we'd have a baby with black hair when we are both brunettes. Anyway, out popped baby Benjamin with dark hair and quite a Mediterranean complexion. It was a surprise, and also a relief. And some of my friends said the dark hair would fall out and may be replaced by blonde. He's 7 weeks now and his hair did thin drastically, and has been replaced with what looks like dark brown hair. This is a very long story... Basically someone on here told me that people see what they expect to see, and that has been our experience. Everyone says he looks like DH- his eyes, his hair, his forehead! And we just smile. Actually DHs line is "gosh really! Can he give it back please!"   A long winded reply to reassure you that it's all ok. DH is having a bit of trouble adjusting (his words) but it's completely normal boy behaviour I think, and unrelated to using DS.
I see on the other thread that you're booked in for an induction. Want to wish you masses of luck and happiness. A new years baby


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## My Son is My World

Hi pinkcat 
Sorry to hear you're a poorly house. Unfortunately its that horrible time of the year when everyone is ill. Since my ds started nursery in oct when my mat leave ended hes just had one thing after another bless him. Roll on spring when we cam get all of the doors and windows open and blow these pesky germs away!!!
Your iPad charger comment made me lol - these babies get up to so many naughty things. I bet if you'd given her the iPad charger she couldn't have cared less but because it was out of her way it was do much more appealing (and tasty!!). I currently gave a stinking cold and my ds found my box of tissues yesterday and ate half of one all in the space of 10 seconds of my back being turned! Whoops. 
Hope everyone is well xx


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## ceci.bee

Emlore hun how are you getting on with the nursery and work issue? Is your LO now happier about being left? I hope you had a lovely Christmas

pinkcat loved the chewing through the charger - good job it wasn't on charge at the time! I found watching one baby hard enough at that age - two must mean you really need eyes in the back of your head!

This thread has been really quiet hope it is because everyone is too busy being a mum. I am 37+1 today and finally on mat leave, which is lovely but am still working at home trying to finish various projects off   but getting very excited now to meet our LO.....

lots of love to all
Ceci


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Pinkcat can't believe the twins are 10mths  

Ceci cripes 3 wks left  

All fine here. Nothing to report


----------



## My Son is My World

Aaaw ceci get those feet up! You're officially on mat leave so you need to rest, rest, rest!

Thanks for asking about my ds - hes doing really well at nursery despite the never-ending illnesses he (we!) gets from there. He no longer cries when I drop him off and the nursery nurses have really taken a shine to him and fuss him which he absolutely loves. I barely get a wave in the mornings when I drop him off as hes too busy flirting with them bless him. Such a little Romeo at only 15 months lol.

Are you all prepared for the arrival of your lo? You must be so excited! X


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## juju81

Pinkcat, it's flying isn't it   Phoebes just turned 9months.  She's a whirlwind, I'm absolutely shattered.  She's trying to flipping walk     


Happy maternity leave Ceci.  Am jealous! Would love to still be off work   


Emlore, child care establishments and sickness go hand in hand     Hope James is better xx


So, who's next?  Who having more treatment?


----------



## OzCalling

Hi everyone, sorry it's taken me this long to get around to this, but my baby GIRL is here! She arrived a week early on Tuesday 13th after a 9 hour, straighforward labour. She is utter heaven and perfection and DH and I are totally smitten. We have called her Tia. She was born a tiny but perfect 6lb 3oz, 49cm long. 




I managed to have a natural birth (although she had the vacuum put on for the last push as I'd run out of steam), and I had to have an episiotomy to avoid a bad tear. I coped with gas and air (that stuff is good!), having a bath, using the swiss ball and staying as upright as possible. DH was incredible throughout and I had the most zen midwife ever, she did her first delivery in 1966!!! It was an amazing experience and I now have my beautiful daughter (was such a shock that she's a girl, I was convinced she was a boy!)




We've had a few issues with breastfeeding as she has such a tiny mouth she made my nipples really sore. But we're getting the hang of it and she's already over her birth weight and feeding well. 




Watching DH give her a bath every evening and overhearing him talk to her is enough to make my heart explode with happiness. Worth every tear and every needle a million times over and it's true, the donor thing is such a non issue. 




I haven't read back over the posts, but I hope all is well and sending much baby dust to you all xxxx


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## esrj199

Huge huge congrats Oz!! Enjoy every minute xxx


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats oz. Has dh's brother seen Tia?


----------



## Lindz

Huge congratulations to Oz and DH on the birth of Tia. Just read your diary, well done on a great delivery and sounds like you are all in love. It just keeps getting better xx


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## My Son is My World

Congrats oz on the safe arrival of baby Tia xxxxx


----------



## juju81

What fabulous news Oz.  Made up for you xx


----------



## amandaloo

Oz - what wonderful news congratulations to you all enjoy every single minute xx


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## ceci.bee

Wonderful wonderful news Oz, so chuffed for you and it sounds like you overall had an incredible experience. I am so happy DH is taking to being a daddy - it is such a wonderful thing to watch isn't it after all you went through to get there - 110% worth every bit of heartache I reckon.

Hopefully soon behind you - coming up to 38 weeks this week   not sure how I got here so fast but hoping I have as good an experience as you.................

lots of love to you all
Ceci


----------



## carrie lou

Congratulations Oz, wonderful news!  

Ceci, are you all ready? So exciting


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## amandaloo

Hi ladies

Hope everyone is ok ?

I'm about to embark on the very last treatment we will have . Having diui this coming cycle . It's our last two vials of sperm which both will be used . I'm happy to say that I've finally come to terms with not having another . I'm having this iui as part of closure if anything . I really feel like we have done everything we could to have another . There is no way I would buy any more sperm , I'm finally burnt out with it and I've had enough which I never thought I'd say but I am   . Our journey will finally come to an end one way or another by the end of next month . Will feel weird never going to the clinic again !  

Can you all remember me telling you about Noah and my worries about him . Anyway he's been diagnosed with epilepsy . He's having partial seizures . Been prescribed medication  Lamotrigine which will increase over the next eight weeks .  

Amanda


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

wishing you all The luck Amanda   

I remember you saying about Noah. I ssid it was epilepsy didn't i. How severe is it? He might grow out of it.  Hope he's ok, and you


----------



## OzCalling

Wishing you all the luck in the world Amanda, you sound very positive about the outcome either way      I'm sorry to hear about Noah, that must be very tough. Hopefully he has a mild case, my brother has it and is able to manage it very well now without medication as he knows the warning signs of getting too tired and run down. Big hugs to your gorgeous boy   


Ceci - not long for you now at all! So exciting! I really hope all goes well with your LO's arrival, is Joshi getting excited? 


Thanks for the congratulations everyone, we're settling in pretty well and Tia is gaining weight and feeding like a champ! We've cracked the breastfeeding now I think, which is a great relief. Mini, in reply to your question about DH's brother, yes they flew down from Brisbane (an hour's flight) on the day she was born! It was really lovely, and Tia got to meet her little cousin who's about to turn 2. There was no weirdness, it was all just like a regular uncle and aunt meeting their niece. His wife, my SIL, has been an incredible help as well when I've had questions about settling or feeding, I'm so grateful for their support and it doesn't feel invasive in any way. So far, so good!


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Oz so pleased it's all worked out well with SIL and BIL   Must be a great relief. 

Amanda sorry I sounded rushed in my reply.   Hope you're coping ok with Noah's diagnosis. Must be a worry. Hopefully the meds will control it.


----------



## Fizzypop

Hello everyone!! 

Oz huge congrats - glad you finally have your little bubba and all is going well x 

Ceci - not long now, eeek! Are you all set up for vbac still? 

Well I'm a bit late in letting you all know but baby Sam was born 6 weeks ago!! It was all a bit quick, was overdue, didn't realise I was in labour, road blocked due to accident and alternative blocked by slow lorry which resulted in us having to call an ambulance en route to hospital and he was born in the ambulance! Very nearly in back of car. It's taken me a while to catch up what with Xmas and having two but all is well so far x plus all the FF emails have been going to my junk folder so didn't get any!! 

Anyway this is a v quick message while the two are occupied, hopefully be back to catch up in a little while x


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## juju81

Amanda, big hugs hun and a ton of    .  Poor Noah.  At least you've finally got to the bottom of it   


Fizzy, congrats, he's gorgeous btw   


Pinkcat, don't panic!  Noah NEVER sat up and I mean never! Even now he sits in the 'w' position (I'm pretty sure he's hyper mobile which would explain some of it). He's got by these last nearly 5yrs just fine not sitting on his bum.  When are you checks? Do you have them?


----------



## ceci.bee

Amanda          hope the meds work and they can stabilise the seizures for him, must be a worrying time, hope there is a local support group that can help you       good luck with this last iUI              


Oz great you are home, hope ou are enjoying these precious early days   

Pinkcat - all babies do things on their own schedule. Defo worth getting her seen and assessed, but is she doing other things as she should be? if so, it might just be she needs some help with sitting. good luck and hope that they can reassure you        

Fizzy wow that does sound dramatic! congratulaions wonderful news...hope you are home and settled now

AFM now 38 weeks and feeling fine - had a sweep yesterday and they are going to sweep me weekly, have a cS booked for 41 weeks if I don't go into labour before as I don't want to be induced...hoping it all goes smoothly from now on........


lots of love to all
Ceci


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## carrie lou

Hi ladies! It's taken me all week to get round to posting    


Ceci, hope the sweeps do something - good to have a definite end date in sight though! Hope you're keeping well. Are you still team cream (sorry can't remember if I've already asked you)?    


Fizzy, congrats on the arrival of Sam, lovely news  and what a dramatic arrival! Hope everything going well  


Oz, glad to hear everything going well  


Amanda, very best of luck for your cycle - will keep everything crossed for you. You sound very much at peace with whatever happens. Sorry to hear about Noah's diagnosis  


Pinkcat, Juju, Mini   Hope everyone well   


AFM. Arlo 5 months now, sitting up, rolling over, very sweet but a bit of a handful at the moment - not sure what going on exactly but lots of crying and hard to put him down for more than a few seconds.  He does at least sleep pretty well at night though which I'm grateful for. He really loves his big bro and smiles whenever he sees him. Seems really keen to join in with playing trains, Duplo etc - really cute. Zac is back in pull ups after a disastrous attempt at potty training, really am close to pulling my hair out! He starts school in September, how is he going to cope? I spoke to HV about it and she supposed to be liaising with continence nurse for some advice but hasn't got back to me.


----------



## carrie lou

Meant to say, we are going on holiday mid March - first attempt at long haul travel with the little ones, and I'm starting to feel a bit apprehensive! Would appreciate any advice or tips from those of you who've done it!


----------



## Flipsy

Can I join in?

We have 4 month old twins from double donor. We have a little  6 day snow baby that we hope to do a FET later this year.

The twins were a freeze all on day one & the FET


----------



## amandaloo

Hi

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone   . Been busy so haven't been able to reply earlier . DS seems to be ok so far on medication so fingers crossed .

Good luck to Ceci not long to go now  fingers crossed x

Mini - yes think you did guess  

Flipsy - hello of course you can the more the merrier  

Started meds  now was a bit  touch and go  if I might have had to cancel ! I couldn't get to appointment on Thursday because it was gridlock on the roads around here . Anyway luckily they said I can go Friday instead so went yesterday .


----------



## Josina

Good luck Amanda       I'm glad you didn't have to cancel after all the mental prep   Sorry to hear about Noah but good that the meds seem to be working.

Oz- Congratulations! Wonderful news         So glad to hear that it went well with DHs brother and that your SIL is being so supportive. Also glad the breast feeding is now working much better. Painful nipples are no fun 

Fizzy- What a dramatic arrival for baby Sam       congratulations

Flipsy- Congratulations to you too on the arrival of your twins. 

Ceci- nearly there   so exciting! 

Carrie- hope you can get some help with the potty training for Zac. 
Sounds like Arlo is doing so well with all his milestones - and early! maybe the crying is in part because of feeling overwhelmed/ overstimulated by being able to do these things so young...?

Pink cat- I would definitely get Megan assessed. For reassurance if nothing else. and don't let them make you wait too long for an appointment- if there is something she needs extra support with then early intervention is key!

Hi to everyone else  

AFM- all going well here. Benjamin is such a calm happy baby. He makes this parenting thing look easy! We're visiting family at the moment and he was angelic on the flight (even got complimented by neighbouring passengers). And the last two nights he's slept through the night (10 hours) at just 12 weeks old! He previously had only ever slept 6 hours max with two night feeds. I think it must be something to do with the high altitude here... But now I know that he CAN sleep through- really hope it can carry on when we get home  
I'm starting back at work part time as my official maternity leave is already over   Just grateful that I don't have to work full time. We have a brilliant nanny 2 days a week and my dad is going to take him for an afternoon. I may need to find a nursery willing to take him for 2 mornings a week but initially I'm going to try doing the paperwork element of my job during nap times and evenings and weekends.


----------



## ceci.bee

Josina - amazing your LO has started sleeping through before you go back to work, that is brilliant! but gutted that you are stuck with only 12 weeks mat leave that is so tough

Carrie hun - we took Joshi to america when he was one, all the way from maalwi to california, and he was brilliant - he slept most of the way and we were able to entertain him when he was awake. An older child is much harder- we flew a lot two and from with Joshi from Malawi to london and it is bearable, especially if you have lots of distractions and keep telling yourself that the flight is time limited and not forever! and ignoring any looks you get from other travellers - if anyone is bolshy, ask them if they want to babysit if they can think they can do better - a good way of shutting them up! Good luck hun

Amanda                

Pinkcat was thinking about Megan, and defo take her to see your Gp rather than hang around in a group appointment with the HV

Flipsy lovely to see you here hun and congratulations on your twins

AFM am waiting around now for things to happen, but trying to keep busy in the meantime.........we are team cream and going to try for the VBAC, will update when things happen!

lots of love to all
ceci


----------



## juju81

Carrie, sounds like Arlo is unsettled because of progress.  Phoebe started to become unsettled at 6months.  At 6.5 months she was crawling and rapidly progressed to standing and cruising.  We're only now starting to get some full nights but that was tweaking her day sleeps! She was such a good newborn!!! Think it's 2nd child syndrome as she's about 5months ahead of where noah was development wise!!

Good luck Ceci 👍

Flipsy, welcome hun 👍


----------



## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Samuel is 2nd child snd has been behind lucas all the way! Phoebe is a girl so will be ahead.


----------



## carrie lou

A is definitely ahead of where Z was at this age. He's been sitting unaided since just before 4 months   Z didn't manage that until 6 months. He's trying to crawl when on his tummy but mostly just ends up going backwards; still, I don't think it will be long before he's on the move. Whereas Z didn't crawl until 9 months. I think A is just desperate to keep up with his brother   


Ceci, thanks for the tips hun - I'm already starting to plan what distractions to bring for Zac  


Josina, wow sleeping through at 12 weeks! Let's hope it continues for you  


Flipsy, welcome and congrats on the twins! they are just a bit younger than my littlest one  


Amanda how is it going?


----------



## Flipsy

Thank you all for the welcome. *Carrie Lou* I used to read the September/October due board but was always too scared!


----------



## Flipsy

One of each *pinkcat* xx


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Any news on ceci?


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## ceci.bee

Hey mini I am still waiting due officially next week. ........due for another sweep next week and section booked for the 19th as induction too high risk for vbac ......keep all fingers crossed!  

Xx


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## amandaloo

Ceci - exciting can't wait to hear your news x


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## OzCalling

Good luck Ceci, thinking of you and hope your LO makes a smooth uncomplicated entrance to the world soon!!! So excited for you xxx


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## northernmonkey

Good luck Ceci!! 

Amanda - how is your cycle going?


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## Mistletoe (Holly)

I've been away for ages from here. Just checking in. Ceci - news? Can't believe you are due already!

I am back at work next week E is now nearly 14 months and C only has 6 months left before school starts - how did that happen? They are both fantastic! Amaze me everyday. E is so confident on her feet and climbing and loves books, music and teddies. Such a girl!
Dad's house finished and rented out last December for a good price. Dad still in nursing home with severe dementia. Still recognises us and eats. Gets very agitated at times and aggressive on occassion. He is well managed though. NHS funding ongoing is confirmed so that is a relief. Last week though I was told that he has probable lung cancer and I have been asked to make a decision on whether to even put him through a lengthy and unpleasant diagnostic process if he then would not tolerate any type of treatment. Hard one!


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## amandaloo

Hi

Holly - I wondered where you had been  . So hard making them kind of decisions feel for you  

Nothernmonkey - thanks for asking just in second half of two week wait not that positive really been having strong af pains for last few days but not over just yet !


Ceci - any news x


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## northernmonkey

Amanda - when's your OTD? 

Holly - what an awful decision to have to make on your own. How do they investigate - is it a biopsy?


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## amandaloo

Hi 

OTD today got a bfn alongside af starting yesterday . Feel like we have done everything now and I'm ready to stop . Little sad everything's come to an end but we will have no regrets which is a better feeling than always wondering what if . 

Ceci - any news x


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## JanaH

Oh Amanda I am sorry that you got another bfn.    

Ceci any news??


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

So sorry Amanda. You tried your hardest


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## carrie lou

Amanda, I'm so very sorry Hun. But you really did do all you could and as you say, it's better than wondering what if. Hope you're ok.    


I spotted news on Ceci over on the pregnancy threads, don't want to steal her moment though so won't say anything more


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## ceci.bee

Amanda               . So gutted for you hun, I really hoped you would get lucky.

Thanks Carrie, have been struggling to find enough time to get online, but baby Arthur Nicholas arrived by C-section last Thursday weighing 8lb 11oz and we are all loving having him home, he is adorable  and Joshi is coping really well and loving spending time with his baby brother. Arthur is doing brilliantly, particularly managing a 4 hour stretch of sleep in the first week! Long may it continue.......

Lots of love to all
Ceci


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## OzCalling

Amanda, so sorry that your cycle didn't work. Like you say, you have done everything you can, you sound like you've made the best decision for you and your family xxx

Ceci, fab news on the birth of baby Arthur, CONGRATULATIONS!!! Over the moon for you and wonderful that he is a good sleeper so far! Xxx


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Congrats ceci   

Hope you're feeling ok  

Just a quicky. We got lucas a replacemt my story  book and it got him talking again about the donor. He wanted to know if he could see the donor and why we didn't see the donor    he's 4.5yrs   He's well aware that his brother came from DH. So it's really sinking in now


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## carrie lou

Congratulations Ceci    Lovely to hear that J is enjoying being a big brother already.


Mini, that's really interesting to hear. Z as you know is a year younger and is only just starting to grasp the donor story. He once asked me what the donor's name was   but that seems to be the extent of his curiosity about it at the moment. It's always interesting to hear how older children respond to it.   


A is 6 months this weekend     and just started commando crawling! We've begun a bit of baby led weaning. He isn't eating much yet but enjoys exploring with different tastes.


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## amandaloo

Thanks everyone   you've been a big support for me for these past few years so thanks for being there  

Ceci - yayyyy congratulations lovely to hear your news  

Mighty mini -   . He sounds a clever little boy . Hope your ok  . It's a bit of a shock when they ask questions it upset me a bit .

Carrie- good luck with the weaning


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## ceci.bee

MIni that is really interesting. Joshi is similar - we read the my story book recently, and a few days later he asked me 'does my donor have blonde hair like me'? He is blonde and we are both brunette (as is the donor) and is clearly starting to put things together, aged nearly 4. But he didn't seem fussed, just curious so hoping we answered ok and keep answering his questions........

Thanks guys - loving the newborn stage again


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

There's been 3 baby's born at the playgroup I go to. I got a pang of that newborn stage.


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## My Son is My World

Ladies it is so quiet on here. I've been awol juggling work and mummy duties and have finally logged on thinking I'd have loads to catch up on but clearly not. Hope everyone and their lo`s are doing well and that you all had a fabulous mother`s day xx


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## juju81

Scary how quickly this year has gone pinkcat.  Phoebe is 1 in a few weeks  . Sorry, I can't remember your other little girls name, is she sitting? Cruising? Will she kneel? Just remember, noah never sat either.  Is she trying to do anything else?

So, I've kind of lost track.  Have we any other babies due? Anyone going for more treatment?

As said above, Phoebe is 1 in 3 weeks time.  My little baby is growing so quickly.  She has taken 3 single steps so I don't think it will be long before she's off and that makes me sad too.  Noah was 5 last week aswell.  How does this happen.  It really just fly by.


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## Lee22

Juju- wow 1 already!!! Where does the time go!

Pinkcat- I hope u get some answers. Could u maybe speak to a paeds Physio or OT and get some advice?

Was wondering if any of your DH are on hormonal replacement for their azoospermia?
My DH was put on testosterone cream but i read the package insert and now it's completely freaking me out that there will be transfer to me or our daughter. The consultant laughed when I brought it up and said I shouldn't worry and he made a joke about me growing a mustache 😳
Anyone know anything about it? Any partners using it?


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## amandaloo

Hi ladies

Pinkcat -it must be a worrying time for you all   . Hope you get some answers soon  

Lee- I've never heard of hormone replacement for azoospermia? What is it supposed to do ? 

Juju - heck that's gone quick ! No more treatment for us now . I've started selling all the baby things I had saved  

How is everybody ? It's gone quiet on here ?


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## northernmonkey

Lee - my dh was on the daily testosterone gels and used to sleep with no top on and I would snuggle up to him most of the night in bed. When I went for hormone tests before trying for dd#2 my testosterone was high and that was the only reason I could think of.  I was totally freaked out too and told him he couldn't use them anymore! Now he has a slow release jab every 12 weeks instead. And my levels went back to normal when he stopped using the gel....  He wasn't too keen on the jab at first because it is given in the backside but now prefers not having to mess about with the gels.  

Amanda how are you doing?  Must be so hard letting your baby stuff go.  

Our little ones are all growing up so fast. My eldest will be 8 next month!!!! Her skin is starting to change - she's had a couple of small blackheads and tiny spots, it's so scary how soon we see signs of them really growing up.


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## WolfyOne

Hi all

I thought I would come and join this thread after our 20wk scan yesterday (team pink but will know for sure at 32wk scan)  

Sometimes though I do feel worried about how our child(ren) will take to the donor situation. I feel such a desperate need for DH and them to bond. I was reading the DCN bulletin this morning which linked to an article by an Irish donor child that has been campaigning for non anonymity of donors, but in the article she was basically describing how awful her life had been and how selfish parents were for choosing this option. She made no mention of her legal father, just kept referring to the donor as the father. It really upsets me reading things like this after seeing everything DH has been through to deal with infertility and the difficult decisions we have made...

How have you all dealt with things like this? Does anyone have children old enough to comprehend the situation? Have your DHs fully bonded with them?


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## WolfyOne

Thanks Jade, it does scare me reading things like that x


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## juju81

Just quickly before my phone gets snatched a a nearly one year old  . (1 tomorrow ❤)

My little boy is 5.  We've drip fed him as and when the time is appropriate for a convo (not just randomly through the day lol) ie he once asked how Phoebe got in my tummy so we talked about sperm making babies and daddy's sperm didn't work so a nice man helped.  He doesn't bat an eyelid and we will continue to talk about it in this manner.  My DH and the kids have the most amazing bond and it's been there since day one.  I never go on the DCN.  Just find it very in your face


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## daisyg

Hi everyone,


My feeling from my own experience, is that DC children are of course normal!  I am a normal single mum, living a normal life with 2 8 year olds.  Day to day that is what being a parent and child is about of course.  The difference for me is that my children are donor conceived which is a thing about them which may or may not be important to them.


I hope that however they feel I am able to respect that and deal with any issues they may or may not have.  Not all DC children/adults have issues about being donor conceived and some have some issues and some have more.  It just depends. Donor conceived children don't have to have had trauma to still ask questions and ponder the whys and wherefores.


My children really want a Dad at the moment and that is ok (although it does make me sad sometimes).  I hope I can deal with their feelings with love and sensitivity. Sometimes their questions are harder to answer, but I try because I love and respect them and want to do my best as we all do.  I also feel that I made the choice to use DC to have my kids and feel some sense of responsibility for that choice in the way I want to support them.


I think respect is important, for all of us, including those we do not agree with.  That is hard I know!  But they are human beings and they feel what they feel for whatever reason,  even if we don't agree and it makes us feel angry or uncomfortable!


Best to all,


D xxx


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## K jade

Thanks daisyG. What ur saying makes alot of sense xx


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## carrie lou

Just want to echo what's been said already ... We are "drip feeding" Zac (nearly 4), and tbh he doesn't see it as a big deal at all at the moment. This is what we wanted because I don't want him to remember a time when he didn't know, but rather for it to be an accepted part of who he is. And I completely agree that most of the time we are a completely normal (whatever that means!) family, dealing with the normal day to day stuff like nursery runs, teething, teaching good manners, etc.


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## carrie lou

Forgot to say, we found out today Zac has been offered a place in our first choice school in September. It's a small village school and of all the ones we visited, dh and I agreed this was the one we liked best. So we're thrilled!  

Anyone else find out about schools today?


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## ♥ Mighty Mini ♥

Well done Carrie  

We are drip feeding too. He finds it fascinating. He's nearly 5. He did ask if he could see the donor the other day   and if we saw the donor   but it's just innocent talk from a 4 year old. He only really talks about it if we read him the donor book. He does think about it tho I think because he once talked to my dad about it. He asked my dad how the donor got the sperm out of his body  

DCN has helped thousands of families and it's good to know they are there if you need support. I've cancelled my membership as didn't find it helpful for us. But who knows in the future.


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## WolfyOne

Congrats Carrie and thanks for the responses ladies  

Out of interest, is there anyone with slightly older children that could say how they are dealing with the donor situ?


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## northernmonkey

Wolfy - my eldest dd will be 8 in a couple of weeks and we've read her the My Story book from DCN since she was tiny. She only recently seems to have really grasped that it's about her and not a fiction book!  I'll answer questions as and when they crop up but she doesn't seem too interested right now.  My 4 year old won't let me read the book to her but I'll keep trying! I honestly worry less now about the donor issue than I thought I would,  at least in terms of our family. My dh and the girls adore each other and he has said in the past that if he had the chance to go back and have children the easier way he wouldn't, because we wouldn't have the children we have now (and our middle dd  was a total nightmare for 2 years so that was  quite a comment  ) The way I look at it, dh and I planned our children together, we both longed for them and celebrated the bfp's together, he supported me through the pregnancies and births and really has been the most fantastic dad, and I can't imagine the girls ever seeing him as anything else than their daddy.


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## WolfyOne

Thanks for sharing your experience monkey x


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## amandaloo

How's everyone doing this thread is really quiet ? 

Carrie - ds got first choice too x


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## carrie lou

That's great Amanda   Zac has taster sessions at his new school in June.

It is really quiet here... Do we have any babies due any time soon?


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## hopeful wifey

Hi All,

Finally hoping join you lovely ladies on this thread as am currently 31 weeks (where on earth did the time go   ) with our first child.  Have been petrified to move over to this thread for fear of jinxing something but have been reading since we started our first IUI. 

Have also been worrying recently more and more as my due date approaches about the same issues.  Mostly how best to start telling our child about the donor and also how this will affect the child when they get older - has been really reassuring reading everyones posts so just wanted to say thanks really. 

Also find that i am worrying constantly about what our baby will look like and a massive fear that the clinic will have used the wrong sperm and we will have a baby from a different race    - did anyone else have these erratic thoughts  or am I going completely insane?

Carrie & Amanda - really pleased for you both with the school places 

xx
wifey
xx


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## carrie lou

Welcome hopeful wifey, how exciting - not long to go! Do you know if you're having a boy or a girl?

No you are not going mad - I think it's normal to have these worries, even the irrational ones! But just remember how careful to clinics are about checking and double checking everything, they won't have used the wrong sperm. And regardless of what your baby looks like, it's guaranteed to be the most beautiful child you've ever seen


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## northernmonkey

Hopeful wifey - welcome to the thread, and congratulations. How has your pregnancy been?

Carrie/Amanda - well done on getting the schools that you wanted. This year seems to have been a quieter one for primary schools - it's certainly been easier to get into the good schools in our area than it was last year. Are your boys excited?

Had a tough few weeks here- my dad passed away 3 weeks ago which wasn't totally unexpected but still an awful shock. Luckily the girls are still a bit too young to be too upset.  Our eldest had her birthday two days after dad died and it was so hard doing FaceTime with my mum and not seeing my dad there, but when I took dd up to bed later that night there was a perfect white feather by her pillow so I like to think that was dad's way of showing he was thinking of her on her birthday.  It's just so hard knowing that my youngest won't really remember him.  

Sorry for the me post, hope everyone else is ok.


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## Lindz

Aww, tough times NM, so sorry to hear about your Dad. Hope your Mum and family are doing as well as you can be. I find kids to be huge helps at times of sorrow. They can make you smile and laugh even when you feel like crying xx


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## Lindz

A big hello to everyone. Long time no post. Mine are off to school in Sep, how did that happen?! Looking forward to the reduction in childcare costs but I think it will be a shock to all of us them going 5 days a week. No idea how DD will cope without her 2 hour afternoon nap either 😄. 
I've also failed to convince DH to ttc for number 3 so struggling with that a bit sometimes too. Anyone else had a DH come round? He's pretty set that our baby days are done and doesn't want to go through treatment, money, etc etc. I think he's just ready to move forward as a family but I can't shake off that I'd like to try on e more. He also can't get over how hard the first 6 months was with the twins but it wouldn't be like that again. We know what we're doing, we've got more support and there's only be one of them (probably!) any advice on either talking him round or talking myself into dropping it gratefully received. We're usually really good at compromise and communicating but there not really a middle ground here!

X


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## bundles

New home this way ladies 

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=335988.new#new

xx


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