# Should my DH do a SCSA DNA Sperm Test??? - Please Advice



## HR (Sep 13, 2008)

Hi All,

As you all can see from my signature, I have undergone 3 IUI, 3 IVF and 1 FET, all have been BFN.  I have not been pregnant even once in my life.
We are also suffering infertility due to my DH's poor swimmers.  He has poor motility, poor morphology and his count has improved from borderline now.
He has been taking various vitamins for years now, though his count has improved, his motility(40%, none of them are rapid linear, all of them are slow linear) and morphology(10%) remains the same.  I think that his morphology rate is the reason for all our BFNs.  We also did Karyotype testing for both of us, and there seems to be no problem for either of us.

After all the pain and suffering of so many BFNs, I am considering the SCSA sperm DNA test.  But my doc says that it is something to be done only to determine if we need IVF or ICSI and that it could be meaningless to do it now as he thinks we have a good fertilitsation rate in IVF.  We actually tried IVF + ICSI (50+50%) in our first IVF, and the fertilisation rate in IVF was better than the ICSI.  This was a surprise for me, because people who get poor fertilisation result in IVF go for ICSI.  Why would our ICSI fertilisation rate be poorer than IVF rate.  I was wondering if the ICSI technique applied by my clinic was not up to the mark.  

Has anyone here had the SCSA test done?  What could the results of SCSA be used for?  
I also considering moving on to Donor Sperm.  How do I know when it is the right time to move on to Donor Sperm?
Will this SCSA test result help me in knowing if its right time to move on to Donor sperm?

Please share your experiences... I really dont know where to go from here...

-HR


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly) (Jan 1, 2007)

I don't know anything about the test you mention - just looked it up briefly and it is about DNA fragmentation.

There could be many causes of BFN. You are getting a good fertilisation rate according to your clinic.

It could be other factors - have any of your IVFs taken the embryos to blastocyst or even assisted hatching. Egg or embryo quality might mean that the embryos are failing to develop to blast.

Have you tried another clinic? Or a different stimulation protocol?
Is your lining optimal at transfer?
Is the embryo transfer procedure done properly at your clinic? The technique can lead to failure.
Have you got immunity problems - like NK cells that so many people seem to mention these days.

I am suffering from a BFN this morning after a FET. My first IVF resulted in a pregnancy that ended at 17 weeks. It is horrible - that feeling of time running out and being back at square one.

We are using donor sperm as my DH does not produce any at all. How does your DH feel about moving to donor sperm? - mine finds it extremely hard and we nearly split up over the issue. If we had the chance of a baby together, then we would pursue every option first. If you have tried everything then is the time to move on. You will need implications counselling before being allowed to proceed.


----------



## HR (Sep 13, 2008)

Hi Hopeful Hazel,

Thank you for your response.  
I agree, there could be many reasons for a BFN.  
In our last FET, we did try to go for blastocysts as we never tried that before in the other cycles.
Out of 7 embryos, 2 went on to blastocysts and both were transferred.  Atlast it was a BFN again.
I live in Denmark, and so I am with the public healthcare system here.  They have a standard protocol and they do the same protocol for everyone here.
I am told that my lining has been good in all my cycles, it has been between 9 and 10.
I have been struggling with the clinic here to get some tests done for me.  I was only able to get a karyotype chromosome test for me and my DH.
It came out good, but they dont seem to be knowledgeable or interested in Immune tests.
So, I feel very hopeless and helpless most of the times.

The reason why I wanted to consider DNA test is that, in all our cycles, i have noticed that our embryos struggle to get past the 3rd day.  Until 2 days, our embryos showed a good level of growth and then on the 3rd day, most of them died.  Since there seems to be no problem with me with all the tests they did on me, and my DH is suffering from MF, we thought that all the BFNs could be due to sperm issue.  we wanted to know if we should move on to Donor after this many BFNs.  
My clinic tells me that it is a waste of money to do this test, as the result could be used only to determine if we need IVF or ICSI and we are already past this stage. I had IVF + ICSI (50% each) in my first cycle, and the ICSI fertilitsation result was bad than the IVF rate.  HOw could that be  People having poor fertilitsation rate in IVF go for ICSI and they do succeed in getting pregnant too.  

Sorry for all the rambling, I have so many questions in my mind and I dont find any answers anywhere and am trying to do my best to find answers, or a right direction to head for.

I am very sorry to know about your BFN this morning, i can imagine how painful it should be.  And no need to say about the miscarriage.  I perfectly understand what you mean by being back at square one.    You are saying that your DH doesn't produce any at all, I have read in many places about the sperm being retrieved from inside by an operation and then using those sperms for ICSI.  Have you heard about that or tried it?    

-HR


----------



## Mistletoe (Holly) (Jan 1, 2007)

DH unfortunately had 2 operations over which 6 biopsy samples were taken from his testes and not a single sperm was found. His FSH was 37 - for a man it should be between 1 and 9. We were given a chance of finding sperm of 1%, and of course we tried, twice.
He took it very badly. His sperm just stop maturing at the point of the spermatocycte, which is very early in their development. We don't have a reason for it, especially as he has a 14 year old from a previous relationship.


----------



## HR (Sep 13, 2008)

ohh, how difficult... i am very sorry to hear that.
Donor route isn't either a easy one for both of us.  My DH also finds it hard, but when we think of living without a baby for ever, he kind of feels that he has no choice other than to accept it, but even then it is going to take a lot to convince ourselves to go that way.  

I wish you good luck    take care...


----------

