# **starting natural IUI, what is the right size of a D10 follicle & endometrium?*



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi all,

I had follicle tracking last month just so they could get an idea of how my body is working. After all, I have asked for IUI to be unmedicated primarily!

My day 10 follicle was = 22mm and the endometrium = 9.4mm thick but still   

What is a normal size unstimulated follie anyway? 
Love Debbie


----------



## clarabelle (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi Peaches - I have never had an unstimulated cycle monitored - but this month on 75mg menopur had 24mm follicle and 10mm lining. . .  .and currently on 2ww 

Clarabelle


----------



## Dixie Dee (Mar 5, 2006)

Hi Peaches,

I haven't had an unstimulated cycle either but on my latest attempt, I had two follicles of 21mm which they said was really good but my lining was only 6mm   which is not so good. I have asked around on this forum and it seems anything above 8mm is good. So your figures sound great, I am sorry that you did not get a  

I think I will be starting some unstimulated cycles if this attempt at IUI is unsuccessful. I ovulate naturally and Chlomid seems to be thinning my lining so I would like to see what would happen without it. I would also like to know what my measurements would be naturally.

Please let me know how you get on and I will be sending you lots of       and  

love Dixie xxx


----------



## jess p (Sep 25, 2004)

I was told anything above 14mm for folicles & over 7mm for lining.

Even with this, iui does only have fairly low success rates so don't beat yourself up about the BFN.

Good luck!
Jess x


----------



## HellyS (Nov 3, 2005)

I have had four cycles unstimulated (mistimed one) and I only ever had one follicle on each cycle, averaging at about 23 mm and the lining measuring at approximately 8mm (although it was 1cm on one of the cycles)

Hope this helps.


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Thanx, Clarabelle & Jess & all

am so b*** furious at   showing up not one but 2 days early for the last few months & getting  

I heard clomid made the womb lining a bit thin, so yeah, seeing what you produce au natural's a good idea, though clinic push me into having stims...coz of my terminal complaint..........OLD BIRD-ITIS. LOL
Love Debbie xxxx

  

good luck to all the girls either on their 2WW or testing


----------



## kizzymouse (Jan 13, 2006)

Old bird itis I like that!!!    Starting to feel that way myself luv!!

My 1st iui follie was 17mm and lining was 10mm, that was with drugs, I had another 2 follies 16mm and 15mm but bfn for me too  

2nd round coming up!! I hope to get more follies this time!!    

Good luck everyone!!


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hiya kizzy

that's a great size endometrium! and the follies are a good size too (did you read the thread which said big, big follies = dodgy eggs). No, I would be happy wth your results, chick, & with IUI each month builds ( or every other month) ups your chances, especially as you ae having stims. Hopefully,   for you soon!

Seems like I have to go the DIUI route as dp's 4th SA is back & though the motility and count are now good, there are only 2% of normal forms (using the Kruger 'strict morphology test). So a bit     today.....

Maybe talking to the clinic will cheer me up. JOKE! LOL
Luv, peaches xxx


----------



## britta (Jan 31, 2006)

Hi, 
Sorry to barge in, just wondered if anyone could advise...?
Last month i was supposed to have IUI but it got abandoned cos i had a poor response, i was on puregon. This time I'm having natural IUI as when i had follicle tracking (previous to first attempted iui) i produced better follicles than last month and blood tests showed i ovulated.
I had a scan Monday which was day 10 and had nothing worth while! Is there a chance they will grow, there were some little ones - under 10mm. 
Just finding it hard to stay positive after reading the posts above and throughout the board about the size of other peoples follicles at this stage! Do i have a chance or do you think it will get abandoned again...
Thanks for reading, I'd be grateful for anything!!
Lots of love and luck to all, 
Britta xxx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hiya britta

The follies may grow by day 14..they need only get to about 16mm before the clinics will be happy-clappy! what day are you on now?

Are you back in for follicle tracking today? can you update me on what size the folilies have grown to & what size the endometrium is??

Maybe they will just up your stims  for *next* cycle (worst case scenario) & you'll get your   with a little patience!

Love Peaches xxx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi again britta

I read that drinking 2 litres of water and 1 litre organic milk helps follicle size. I ovulate naturally & I saw that your body seemed better this month...could be residual effect of the stims tho?!!

Have you tried standardised Agnus Castus tabs @ 1,000mg per day? They do help to normalise hormones and do up LH which helps with ovulation. (you can't take AC tabs and fertility drugs tho...that would make you feel a bit yukky!)

Let me know what you decide to do,
peaches xxxx


----------



## britta (Jan 31, 2006)

Hi Peaches,  have another tracking scan in the morning so i will you let you know the follie size and the thickness of my endometrium at some point 2Moro.
Thanks for your advice on helping the follies, i will down some water and organic milk 2nite and keep doing so!! As for the vitamins etc... i have a really weak stomach and i am sick with nearly every new tablet i put into my body , last year we went to America and i saw a Chinese herbalist there, spent a fortune on the prescriptions and couldn't take any of them so i am a bit reluctant to try!! Thanks though, its really appreciated!! 
I'll update you 2Moro, Bye for now and thanks again!
Love Britta xxx


----------



## Rebecca1416 (Aug 2, 2003)

I had a really strange cycle for my last natural IUI attempt.  Follies did not want to grow, so was only about 10mm at day 10, and at about 13mm by day 14.  Went on to grow to 20mm by day 20.  Lining also thin until long after day 14.

It was strange becasue I usually have pretty regular cycles.  I was feeling a bit grim and stressed, and it maybe that my body just decided to take its time until I felt better.

So relax and see what happens.


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi Rebecca,

no, that makes sense! if you have long periods, the follie wouldn't develop so early as you wouldn't be ovulating as early in the month would you??

Best of luck with your next basting sesh!  fingers crossed for  

Love Peaches xxx


----------



## kizzymouse (Jan 13, 2006)

Hi Peaches, just reading your ticker we may be cycling together!
I worked out I will be due to be basted around the end of April, if everything grows the same as last time!!  

Hope we can be cycle buddies!

(old gits togetha??!!   )

XXXX


----------



## Lulu2003 (Jan 10, 2006)

Hi Britta,

My follies were slow growing on puregon. I was on day 21 before I got basted and I was lucky enough to get a BFP from my first attempt. After 9 goes at CLOMID and no ovulation this was excellent for me. My layer also got time to get to over 12mm.

Hang in there and fingers crossed.

Lu


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

*Hi Peaches and rest of lovely ladies on here * - thought I'd add my follie measurements in to show how they can be a total law unto themselves and be soooo different with each cycle both medicated and natural  NB - I have no known or previously detected IF probs with ovulating and average length for all my natural cycles is a healthy 28-30 days. Sadly prob is DH has no sperm at all so therefore using donor for IUIs.

*1st IUI medicated *with Menopur injections - cd 8 = one 10mm follie and Endo 5.7mm 
cd10 = 8mm & 11.5mm follies Endo 5.8mm 
then cd12 - disaster - follies had all shrunk largest was only 7mm but endo 11.2 (appeared to have ovulated before follies matured properly so stims drugs appeared to have adverse effect for me!) cycle abandoned no insem 

*Natural investigation cycle* to just track follies (no meds or insem) done on next cycle immediately after above IUI attempt - 
cd8 = 3x 8mm & 10mm x1 & Endo 5.5mm
cd12 = 14mm & Endo 8.9mm
Ovulated cd15 with 37 for progesterone level on day 21 so overall a good cycle and everything performed much better than how it did on the stim drugs!??

*2nd IUI this time Natural* - cd8 = NO FOLLIES at all!!!!  waiting for cd10 scan to see if they are late developers! Could well be the investigation cycle was bit of red herring and the good results were due to left over menopur effect in the system!?? Will have to wait and see 

So there is not always good consistency to our cycles or that is certainly the situ my case! I am convinced that stress plays a large part in how each cycle goes, as on this current IUI (where I have no follies at all as yet) my first scan came just a day after experiencing a great trauma. The trauma was caused by my clinic ringing me to say "we are very, very sorry but we have to cancel you tx and scans as all DIUI treatments are now to be postponed and no longer offered at our clinic due to the current donor shortage crisis." Then by some miracle an hour later whilst I was still in state of shock and dispair about this heartbreaking news -they rang me again to say ignore what they had just said and that on this occasion they had suddenly managed to find me a donor and treatment could therefore continue with scan the next day now back on - no wonder my follies don't know if they are coming or going!!!

Will definitely try some pineapple juice and keep swigging my water, will let you know if follies do decide to show on tomorrows cd10 scan if brain remembers too.

Peaches - your measurements sound great so I really hope next time will be the one for you, a 22mm is great size follie and your endo is very good especially for a cd10 - my clinic told me anything above 8mm is very good and that the endo does last minute big spurt just before ov same as follies.

Love to everyone
Hippy
xx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hiya kizzy

oh that's great! yes we would be getting our IUI at the same time!! keep me up to date (old git indeed! Lmao)

The whole follie size and endometrium debate in great. Obviously the cycle length has something to do with when they have their little spurt (*if* they have their little spurt! LOL). I find it interesting that women are doing better without drugs sometimes. I wonder if they are given out too soon & then the ovaries get harder to stimulate

*Britta, * yep, keep on with the juices, chick, your follies may grow later in the cycle 

*Lu, * many congrats on your  really wonderful news

*Hippy...*thanks so much for your contribution, it's amazing what our bodies do isn't it? keep on keeping on I know how this donor sperm situation is, it's awful. To think I'll have to sort that out before next cycle. Unless AF doesn't turn up!

Btw, I am keeping a 2WW diary in the appropriate section, it may be of interest t you girls who are having follicle tracking ec etc

Love, peaches xxxx


----------



## britta (Jan 31, 2006)

Hiya Peaches, 
Had my scan, day 13, follie 12mm others under 10mm all on left side, endo 5.5mm.
Hippy, that was good reading, just shows how things differ,
Love Britta xxx


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

Promised I'd update on my latest natural IUI follie scan measurements after getting zippo follies on Cd 8. I now have on cd10 a 11, 7.5 and 6mm on right ovary and four tiddlers on the left with an improved lining of 6.4mm so tx continuing for now     lets hope make it to insem this time!!!

I did drink a lot of extra water between cd8 and todays improved scan so maybe this really does help!?

Big hugs to all
Hippy
xx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi Britta & Hippy

Nic-ce sized follies and endo for you both now!    I am so glad! I had IUI yesterday usin DP's sperm (clinic say the sperm parameters are not really good enough but  asked if I could try ONCE before moving (hopefully) to DIUI.

I don't feel positive. Even though I had a fatty-follie (LOL) (22mm) & a good endo (just under 9mm) again ,conceiving would be against all odds as DP's sperm morph is very, very poor.

I am keeping a 2WW diary!! Read it if you feel inclined  

Keep on drinking the water and organic milk & let's pool our ideas and our results as we go along, ok?

Love peaches xxxxx


----------



## kizzymouse (Jan 13, 2006)

gOOD LUCK pEACHES


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

Peaches - just wishing you a speedy 2ww and yep I will be following your 2ww diary hun! I will be sooo hoping  that even though you are not feeling that positive, that it could still happen for you.

Kizzymouse - Hi   hope you doing ok?

Britta - Good luck to you too hun and the other IUI ladies  

Love
Hippy
x


----------



## britta (Jan 31, 2006)

Hi Peaches, glad the basting went OK, GOOD LUCK on your 2ww , i will defo read your diary!! Really really hope it works for you!! 
Had another scan 2day, all looked good, got to go back 2Moro to see how I've got on will then get a day for basting. 
Hippy, hope you make it to basting chick,  
Love and luck, 
Britta xxx


----------



## SWEETCHEEKS (Sep 15, 2005)

Hi,

At my clinic they say anything bewteen 18mm and 20mm is a perfect size (medicated) we were originally having ivf which got coverted to IUI at last minute due to poor responce ....

anyway my follies were a perfect size for me as i was very lucky and got my mirical first time round ....   ....

aswell as pco and low sperm count (7 million inserted) .. we still did it ...

I would try for the 18mm/20mm ones!! PERFECT!!

  
Sweetcheeks xxx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi sweetcheeks

I have read your + outcome with great happiness, well done! it would've been horrid to have gone through the whole protocol of IVF and to have just done nothing...God was watchin you, chick, and reckoned you needed a break!

I hope that others on this thread go on to report back a !

*Kizzy*: how is the treatment going? YUK! sounds foul!

*Britta:* have you been shot with the love-gun this cycle after all??!!!

*Hippy:* how are you coming along? anything nice to report

Love peaches xxxx

 
_
ps: have been reading my own 2WW diary. Hells bells I am officially in a low:-(_


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

Peaches - sadly todays cd13 scan quite didn't go to plan (yet again!!) and my 11mm lead folly had only grown to a tiny 11.5mm since last Friday    Am booked for another scan tomorrow if I suddenly get my LH surge (CM indicates this is not very far away now) and definitely a scan Weds (cd15) whatever happens so they can monitor what is going on. Getting to a 2ww just still seems as elusive as ever, and not sure if will get to make it to insem this cycle   

Anyone got any nice juicy size 18mm follies I can borrow Hee  

Love to all
Hippy
xx


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

Just to update those of you following my follie results (see previous posts on this thread) - I went for CD15 scan today to find NO FOLLIES at all  my immature sized 11.5mm lead folly had ruptured without an LH surge as it was so small, so no insem can be done and IUI tx yet again had to be abandoned for the third time   .
Love
A sad Hippy  
x


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hi hippy

I'm sorry you have had to abandon this cycle. it's so frustrating!

I guess you have to decide if you want to go for a change of stims. People are unique & what worked like a charm for one may not be suitable for another.

It may be that you need just a little bit extra than what you have been previously given?? Or a straight change of stims [ie the injectables eg: pregnyl? menopur?]

_Btw, even though I grow big follies au naturel, I still am getting _  !!

Have you though of taking 2 months out & doing some acupunture and maybe following a highish protein diet plus lots of fluid?

Lot of love,
peaches xxxxx


----------



## kizzymouse (Jan 13, 2006)

HUGS for Hippy, what a bummer, when's your appointment for next treatment?

I would do as Peaches said and get em to up your drugs or change them, obviously you arent suited to em.

Sending you lots and lots of     

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Hippy (Aug 2, 2005)

Hi Kizzy and Peaches   - THANK YOU both for your kind messages.

Following this latest complication in my IF tx journey i.e the now re occurring problem of my eggs being abnormally small and not able to mature to a size viable for conception - my clinic said I could try a Clomid cycle and failing that go on to try IVF, but they didn't sound very confident about either as previous drug tx cycles had no effect on my eggs either.

My DH and I have been on IF tx for a solid three years now (DH was on IF tx for two of those years and had to have HCG injections three times a week every single week for that entire duration) and every single step of that journey since day 1 has hit unexpected medical complications and obstacles for us, as result we have now reached our absolute limit of perpetual heartache   and unrelenting stress. 

Maybe if we had been lucky enough to have reached just one 2ww during that entire three years of tx (!!!!!)   things might be different and we would plough on, but for us and the nightmare journey it has been, we have begun to perhaps feel it is all been a sign there is a different path for us.

We are going to take a year out to try to recover from the stress of the last three years and then maybe if our hearts still burn as strongly as they still do now to raise a family - we may look at applying to adopt.

To be pushed mentally and physically to a place of having to be the ones to decide to stop IF tx and let go of the dream is a place I sincerely hope you won't have to go, and I wish you both and all the others following IF tx all the luck in the world. The support I have had on this site has been mind blowing - THANK YOU ALL   xx

Love
Hippy
xxx


----------



## peaches41 (Mar 4, 2006)

Hiya hippy

I hear you. Three yrs is a long time & clinics seem a bit rigid. i.e they don't really tailor the tx the the patient, instead they have this cure-all pill [clomid] or cure-all injectables:--(

_On the other hand you may find that clomid's the one for you! _

Having a break makes sense, it's just exhausting emotionally and physically. Brutally hard for some people.

I wish you all the luck in the world, hippy, & when the break is up & you are back on the horrid tx rollercoaster that you are granted your baby.

Love peaches xxxxxx


----------

