# excited re: FET transfer



## buster24 (Jul 11, 2005)

hi all i went yesterday for a wee scan as had been having really sore period pain, and clinic were concerned that i may have cysts again. Anyway my next period is due on the 26th april and i am having my FET with this cycle. I have 8 frosties and had it in my head that i would thaw 4 and keep 4 for another go, this is my first FET but my 7th ivf, these aggs were donated by my wonderful wee sister in november, anyway while i was there DH had some forms to complete and we were paying for the tx yesterday, the nurse then said there is a message on your notes from the embryologist all the frosties are really great quality and was wondering if you would like to thaw all 8 and try for blast     , well i was shocked it had not been mentioned before and as i have always had poor egg collcetion we have never been lucky enough to go to blast, also this is a new clinic that i moved my frosties to on the 31st jan, they had ther first wee day out across glasgow    . so i am excited but nervous too. DH says we must go for the blasts which i do agree, he also said kim if we dont it would only be for the reason of money and giving us one more go, but if we go to blast we may not need that one more go. so its been decided, i think also if this one is for us, i am doing non medicated as i feel i have pumped my body full of so many drugs that maybe it doesnt like drugs so need to try without, but if we are lucky enought for this to be the one and we manage to get more than 2 blast and fingers crossed a few to  re- freeze that i would donate the ones left, to help someone else. So thats my news. If only it works out as planned in my head             
has anyone else had there frosties taken to blast and been successful
thanks kim xxx


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## anna the third (Jan 15, 2008)

i don't understand why they want to thaw all 8? is their thaw rate not very good? if so you shouldn't be there. i'd personally thaw eg max of 4 and at my clinic all 4 wld probably make it. i would then put them back, without going to blast. i think freezing thawing etc must be a very stressful experience and i wld want to get them back asap. 

has it been explained to you that using blasts doesn't alter the quality of the embryo? it does improve the clinic's success rate as they are putting back only the ones that have got through the extra few days. i'd want to use them all if possble and have more goes.  

blasts themselves are no better than other embrs - they are older and have got through another stage, 2 days, so you've selected the ones that are more likely to work, that's all. but it's a myth that you can alter your chances by using blasts per se. the day 3 embryo that become sthe blast wld do jsut as well - the point is that you dont necessarily know t choose it.


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## buster24 (Jul 11, 2005)

hi thanks for your reply, no they are having excellent rates at this clinic, ther is a dr who is doing a study in our area and he thinks this clinic which is fairly new is heading to be one of the best in the country. So i am happy with them, the nurse did also mention that if i prefered they could thaw hals and see how they are doing then call me to let me know and then decided to thaw the rest. but i just think i should go for all, and see how many blast we get and maybe out of 8 i could get really good ones.As i said this is my first FET so not as clued up on it as i am in ivf. But they are having great results with there FET, so this has given me alot of confidence. There are 2 other girls on here who have had ther FET babies already and a few more pg. But since i have had 6 goes with 3 day embies i feel i must try something different and try going to blast stage as not many more options for me.
thanls for your reply
kim xxx


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## anna the third (Jan 15, 2008)

I am sure you have done the research - going to blast does not instrinsically change anything about the embrs. it jsut helps you select the best ones ie helps the clinic's success rates. The same day 3 emb has the same success as it would as a blast - did they explain that to you properly? it only helps you choose the best ones by day 5.  

so the plan is to thaw all 8,  choose the best blasts and then refreeze the remaining, hopefully 6. what are clinic's success rates with REfrozen ones? for me, id mess around with what are very fragile things as little aspossible.


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

anna the third said:


> I am sure you have done the research - going to blast does not instrinsically change anything about the embrs. it jsut helps you select the best ones ie helps the clinic's success rates. The same day 3 emb has the same success as it would as a blast - did they explain that to you properly? it only helps you choose the best ones by day 5.
> 
> so the plan is to thaw all 8, choose the best blasts and then refreeze the remaining, hopefully 6. what are clinic's success rates with REfrozen ones? for me, id mess around with what are very fragile things as little aspossible.


*anna*

the reason clinics recommend taking to blastocyst if possible is because in natural conception, an embryo wouldn't naturally be in the womb at day 3, it would still be in the tube. At blastocyst stage the embryo is ready to start implanting and would naturally be in the womb.....this is wht the success rates with blastocysts is higher, because they're in their natural environment at the right stage.

Yes, there is the risk involved that not all embies will make it to blastocyst and there's also the fact that some embies may have resulted in successful pg if put back in womb at day 3 but didn't make it to blastocyst in lab conditions.

If there's a chance of going to blastocyst then it can improve your chances of success so I personally would always say go for it !

*buster*....wishing you loads of luck...it's something we've considered but for now we've still got 6 frosties and having fresh treatments and we'll see if we can get to blasto on this current one !!

Take care
Natasha


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## anna the third (Jan 15, 2008)

yes i understand completely the synchronisation issue but didn't want to complicate it. 

there is a lot of rubbish talked about blastocysts and how "going to blast" improves your chances so much, actually it doesn't and can't. There is possibly a slight but unproven improvement as you say owing to timing and location - ie avoiding day 3 in utero when it should be in fallopian tubes - but the cost of that is the culture medium for an extra two days. 

What it certainly does is to improve clinic success rates - given that these are calculated per cycle, it improves rates FOR THAT CYCLE but not necessarily overall. in fact it can't. you are losing optionality and i think it's risky.


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## buster24 (Jul 11, 2005)

hi anna i really dont want to sound rude, but i was wondering if you have had bad experiences with either your clinic or with blasts, you sound a bit bitter, sorry that is not meant to be offensive.
I have had many tx now not only in this country but also in istanbul, and i choose this clinic which is the GCRM not only for their success rates but also for their very individulised care. I have spoken to lots of ladies who also have gone here and are very happy with thier treatments. One of the directors of this clinic is the man who actually made the first protacol for treatment of ivf, that is still being used to this day. he is a very well published man and highly respected in this field, he left the nhs to start thsi clinic as he felt that new research was not being implemented the way it should , so i feel in very safe hands here.
also you would not have confused me, i am a senior nurse in a very busy hospital and have 2 degrees. 
Wishing you luck in what ever tx you are having.
kim xxx


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## anna the third (Jan 15, 2008)

thanks and when i reread my own post it did indeed sound a bit rude! oh dear - i am jsut typing quickly and replying to many people so...very sorry if i sounded brusque!

Your original post didn't make sense to me from a technical perspective hence why i didn't want to introduce more tech. There must be stats that you have that I'm missing - eg stochastic anaylsis of the various success rates. 

I've observed a lot of misinformation re blasts on FF and wanted you not to suffer from it. Clearly you aren't and i'm sure you've researched it all brilliantly, inclduing the REfreezing which would concern me, to be honest, but Im sure you know what you're doing. 

So, fingers crossed and very best of luck. xxx


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## buster24 (Jul 11, 2005)

anna thankyou for your reply, and yes after all these years of tx are not many research papers i have not read infact feel like i have completed another degree     all the best to you
Well back to my original question has anyone taken there embryos to blast stage and been successful would love to hear.
thanks kim xx


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

anna the third said:


> yes i understand completely the synchronisation issue but didn't want to complicate it.
> 
> there is a lot of rubbish talked about blastocysts and how "going to blast" improves your chances so much, actually it doesn't and can't. There is possibly a slight but unproven improvement as you say owing to timing and location - ie avoiding day 3 in utero when it should be in fallopian tubes - but the cost of that is the culture medium for an extra two days.
> 
> What it certainly does is to improve clinic success rates - given that these are calculated per cycle, it improves rates FOR THAT CYCLE but not necessarily overall. in fact it can't. you are losing optionality and i think it's risky.


Anna

Whilst I do understand you have been through blastocyst treatment cycles and it's not been successful for you, I'm afraid I do find your comments quite negative & quite disheartening. I'm really sorry that blasto's haven't been successful for you but this doesn't mean they wouldn't be for another. 

Blastocysts can improve success rates for us as ladies having treatment...it's proven stats and also if you take a look on the voting board of this website you'll also see it's proven stats for FF members too. If there wasn't some definite success rates then clinics wouldn't opt for it and it is also one of the reasons why there is so much research into & more clinics are offering this, especially in light of the HFEA and the single embryo transfer.

Whilst I don't intend to debate this issue, I know we are definitely going to go for blastocyst transfer, if possible, since this is our 6th treatment cycle (and I can assure you we've certainly looked into it all !)

I do appreciate that you too have done research but please also understand that whilst taking to blastocysts has sadly not been successful for you (as many others), overall the stats show that it can improve chances overall.....not just improve clinic stats (which I don't quite understand where you're coming from as whether it's day 2, day 3 or day 5 transfer it would show on stats as achieving ET....the stats for live births are separate).

I wish you lots of luck in your journey. 
Take care
Natasha


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## buster24 (Jul 11, 2005)

sorry to keep asking but has anyone taken their frozen 3 day embies to blast and had a BFP 
thanks 
kim xx


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## canoworms (Sep 6, 2007)

Hi there, 

I can't answer the day 3 transfer question, but just wanted to say we're about to do our first FET as well. We have 9 day 1 embies on ice. We've opted to defrost all 9 take to blast. The clinic will freeze any blasts if we are lucky enough to have any.

Good luck with whatever you decide 

xx


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## Guest (Apr 6, 2008)

Hi all

We are also having our 2nd FET - I'm afraid we haven't done blasts and aren't this time either. We have 19 embroys and have discussed with the embryologist and are defrosting 4 to start with.

I have been told that older embryos ie day 4 or 5 don't defrost as well as younger ones of day 1,2 or 3, so I don't think they would refreeze any if we were to get a few blasts on any FET cycle. Canworms - what have your clinic said about the chances of frozen blasts surviving the thaw (having been refrozen)?

Angie x


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## canoworms (Sep 6, 2007)

Angie73, 

As you say defrost rate of blasts is not good - I think it was 40% that we were quoted.


xx


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