# Hard to move on from own eggs



## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

After our 4th fresh cycle and miscarriage in January (2nd miscarriage in 4 cycles) I felt like enough is enough.  We had a break from it all as physically I was really run down and unwell and felt like I could never do any more treatment again.  6 months on we are considering donor IVF at the Lister but haven't gone on the waiting list yet as I'm not really ready physically or emotionally but am getting there.

I thought I would be able to move easily to donor eggs after 4 unsuccessful goes with my own eggs but I'm finding it so hard to let go.  We are already using donor sperm for male factor so it's extra hard.  It would almost be easier if I had premature ovarian failure or something but all 4 cycles have gone really well, good response and numbers of eggs, good fertilisation etc....it's just the outcome.  I've never had any fertility issues identified other than my age.  I'm 41 and will be 42 in August.  We were given a 17% chance with my own eggs and 45% chance with a donor.  We are only doing this once more so I know it's more sensible to go for donor.  My husband would not entertain the idea of any more than one more round and I don't think I've got it in me either.  We are just exhausted from it all.  

I suppose it's hard as I still have eggs so therefore could still have my own child but the odds are low.  I'm having some counselling which has thrown up all sorts of things which has been interesting (potential psychological blocks etc).  It has also explored when we stop and have to end the journey which is so so hard.  I know we may have to face this soon though.  Really finding things hard emotionally right now.  Just needed to use this forum as an outlet!


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## Clarabelle71 (Jan 14, 2016)

magicpillow i think i remember your name from the 2 ww or early pregnancy board. I had my transfer Dec 2. I was 46 for transfer and had 3 embryo blasts transferred and one took. We did a DE cycle and i have to say feel the same love for this baby as the one we lost at 7 weeks with OE in 2016. My dh was against trying DE in 2015 when we did our first ever ivf treatment. I don't blame him for wanting to try with my eggs as we had no idea if fertility for my age could have been better than expected. I had tears though as had prefered a Tandem cycle. Following year the loss of our baby at 7 week scan was so heartbreaking he said he never wanted to see me like that again. We could only afford one more cycle so went straight to donor egg rather than Tandem. I was successful first time so sitting here 32 weeks. I think of this baby as 100 % both mine and dh's but thankful to the donor. I could have gone through life childless if i had just gone on with using my own egg. We want to keep it private its not anyones business if you prefer it that way. I have no regrets and cannot wait to meet my baby. Best of luck. X


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## Happylife (Feb 4, 2017)

Hi Magic, why don't you do PGD to test your fertilized embryos before transferring them? You are still young not even 42 with good response to the Med I think you should try PGD.


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## wishfulthinking (Nov 9, 2008)

MagicPillow-I moved on to DE at age 38 after 4 failed OE IVFs and multiple IUIs.  I had my first DE daughter at 39.  It was very difficult to let go of my OE and my genetics.  Even when I was going through the DE cycle I was still sad about losing my OE.  Fast forward to my two children and I cannot imagine loving any children any more than these two.  Sometimes I feel a twinge that they don't look like me but mostly I am just busy mothering and giving and receiving love.  It is definitely worth it to move on. I speak from experience.  I just wish I had moved on sooner so that I were a little bit younger of a mother-but hindsight is 20/20 I guess.


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

Hi magicpillow

There is no right or wrong in this journey. For some people it is easy to move to DE, for some it is easy, some people prefer to adopt and some to stay childless. Everyone is different and there is no right or wrong. 

If you don't feel ready, then don't do it yet. have you identified any other causes of infertility on your side other than age? If not and if you can manage financially then have another go with OE and try PGD to see if the problem is egg quality. You may then be more able to decide moving to donor eggs.

AFM - i would like to give you another perpective. If we fail to have our own children then we have decided to live childless. I have already endured huge heartache and if i don't have my own by next March then that is it.

But as I said there is no right or wrong. So many ladies had DE and have happy families. As long as you are ready go for it. Another option is to try counseling 

Whatever you decide all the best. But when you do make sure that this is what you and your other half really want


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

It is very difficult and you have to be comfortable with your decision whatever it is, there is no right or wrong choice. we are all different and so are our choices. For myself, I moved quickly to DE as I wanted a baby, and had to do it on my own. I couldn't afford to keep trying OE with little chance of success due to my age. I didn't deliberate too long about it. I would have regretted not trying. I just wish I was younger but it is as it is. I have two beautiful children, and lots of people actually think they look like me. My son is as a result of a fresh cycle, my daughter from an FET ( a blast from the same cycle). I am planning a further cycle in autumn with my remaining frosties. 
I have never regretted it, I forget most of the time that they are not genetically mine, and I would not swap them ever.
I respect everyone's decision as we are the ones having to live with it, but I do feel there is an obsession sometimes with having a baby from OE, as if DE are second best. I'm sure most people wanting OE don't really think that, it's just an impression I pick up from reading lots of posts, and maybe I'm a bit sensitive about it. My children are special and they are who they are, they're perfect even though they're not from OE.


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

Deblovscat

You introduce a very interesting perspective to the conversation. 

I don't think that it's because DE are second best. To the contrary, as they come from younger people they may be better. 

I think it's down to how we have grown up and what the society -very wrongly- teaches us: "you have to get married, you have to have children, you have to blah blah blah". It's down to the prototypes that exist in our subconsious. And they are simply wrong. Everyone is different and anything goes in life as long as it makes you happy. If you are happy then people around you will be happy too

You see, the problem I see is that very often, exactly because we have grown up with these prototypes, we become obsessed with having a baby. We don't take a step back and ask ourselves and ask "do i actually really want a baby?is it because i want to or because everyone else has therefore I should as well?

Through the years I have seen many women trying for a baby and having difficulties. One of them became a wonderful mother. It's all she wanted in her life and she is great. Another one was getting obsessed about having a baby. She had one and now she hates her life. She loves the child but regretted having her because she finds it too hard. Unfortunately I have read in here about women who had DE and then felt no connection to the child. Unlike your children who are lucky to have you these children are not going to feel loved. To me the interests of the child is paramount. That's why I am saying think very well before you make decisions. 

AFM-the reality is that I am so deeply scarred from this process that I want it to stop. After 4 cycles,3  miscarriages, one TESE operation and two myomectomies I think i am done. I don't have the will to go through finding, choosing a donor or through the adoption process which I know from friends it's an ordeal that takes many years. Enough. We don't deserve more torture. The reason I want a child is becuse we have so much love with my husband and it would be great to have a child in our home to experience that.


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

Efi - I totally feel your pain and I think it's sensible to know when to stop as it's too painful for you.
I don't think DE are second best, I just think it's the perception in society and that there is an overriding obsession with OE. I think that everyone has to think hard before making decisions and do what is best for them. It is necessary to be certain about being committed to DE as by then it's too late. I think though that although some women may not feel the connection to a baby from DE, this can happen for a baby from OE. There are lots of women out there who don't feel a connection to a baby however conceived, it's not necessarily linked to DE.
Adoption is hard as well so it's not an easy route.
I know what you mean about certain expectations about our journey through life. I never imagined I'd be a solo mum, I always had the dream of meeting my soulmate and having a family, it just hasn't worked out like that, so I've had to choose a different route.


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

I’m not really not sure what I want to say, just that I’ve have both, oe conceived naturally and de children and I love them all the same, but the de children are a little more special in the sense of how they were conceived. I’m not sure why so many people struggle with the de thing, when you think about it it is only one cell we are using from another person, we donate blood, tissue and other organs and it’s not looked on as anything other than a very special thing to receive or give, the cell of an egg should be the same. For the people who struggle with deciding to do de, I think a way to look at it is like this: your making a chocolate cake, you have all the ingredients and start putting everything into the bowl, you realise you don’t have an egg for the cake, so you pop next door and borrow one from your neighbour, you continue making the cake with the rest of your ingredients, bake it, then ice it, so once you have done all of that, who does the cake belong to? You, who have put all the time effort and ingredients or the neighbour who you borrowed an egg off?


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## morganna (Sep 16, 2008)

Stacey............I am laughing.  But I love your analogy. Makes perfect sense to me  !


My one and only birth child is DE and she is EVERYTHING I could ever have dreamed of!! EVERYTHING.



Morganna xx


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## Mrs. Munchkin (May 10, 2017)

Stacy I love it !!! 
We have been given an option of an egg donor but with a different blood group to us do you mind me asking did you want a blood match or was this important to you ? How old are your children and have you told them about their story ? We have an oe child but would like her to have a sibling . Thanks xxx


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

Stacey10

This is one of the most amazing posts I have ever read! lol

Amazing and sooo true!


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

Yes, we asked for the same blood group, I have twins that are 4 and a 1 year old as well. We awill not be telling our children as we do not want them to feel any different to our older children and we do not want our older children to treat them differently, to us they’re all the same 🙂


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

Ladies thank you so much for all your replies.  It massively helps to hear other people's take on this issue and it goes to show there is no right or wrong as we are all different and you have to go with what feels right.  My husband is adamant our next cycle will be our last and to be honest, I can't keep living like this in limbo land.  Donor egg gives us the best chance of that but it's v v hard to let go of my own eggs for some reason.  I'll get there.  I don't think we would do own eggs with PGD as I'd worry that if they are all abnormal, we've wasted the cycle.  I only ever end up with maximum 2 embryos at blasto stage. 

Great analogy Stacey - so true!  I think I have worries the child will see the donors as the 'real mum' and 'real dad' and how they will feel having no genetic link to either of us.  It's almost like both of us are defective.  We will definitely tell the child so it's just thinking about what they would make of it all.  Would they feel different to their friends who were all conceived in the normal way ('how babies are made') etc and would they get teased?  Lots to think about.  I'm sure I'm worrying unncessarily.  

Efi our situations sound very similar.  I also saw your post about siblings too and I found that interesting.  Nice to have other people who understand about this whole journey.  Thanks again ladies.  I feel like I'm gradually moving more towards the decision to go for donor.  I'm having some counselling to help me work through it all


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

I suppose one downside of my own eggs is a worry about potential autism being passed down.  My dad and brother both has aspergers and my cousins son has severe autism.  I do worry about there being something in our genetics so hopefully a donor would potentially eliminate the genetic side of that unless there is autism in their family!


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

You do actually have a genetic link with  the potential baby, read up on epigenetics. Like I said, it’s only one cell, everything else that goes into making the baby is from you. Your body, your blood etc, if that same egg was given to someone else or the donor use the egg the resulting baby would be totally different.


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

Love your analogies Stacey and totally agree with you! 
My gorgeous children are mine and mine alone - although I'm grateful to my donor for giving me the cell!


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## Clarabelle71 (Jan 14, 2016)

Stacey also love your posts. You are so right. 

Magicpillow wishing you much luck no matter what you decide. X


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

You ladies have made me look at donor eggs from a completely different point of view. Actually it's just a cell.

Magicpillow, our stories are remarkably similar. We also are of similar age. Even family wise we seem to have some similarities.

Good luck on whatever you choose darling and remember there is no right on wrong. If you don't feel comfortable just don't do it. Also you have plenty of time to relax and think about it as with donor eggs you don't have the age limit.


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## Wunderwomban (Jan 16, 2017)

I'm 6 weeks with DE....I still get moments where I feel a loss that I'm not carrying OE, but I did read something recently that said it's helpful to think of your child having 3 biological parents, so dad, the donor and you. Your child is being formed from your body and cells, so biologically you will help to make it. So already at this early stage my body has helped to transfer a tiny embryo into a 6 week fetus. Though the DNA sequence comes 50% from donor, your DNA patterns will shape your child in your uterus and will determine how their DNA is expressed and the child will be physically and psychologically different to if say the donor had carried it. I don't know if that helps, but it helps me to remember this.


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## SweetRose (Aug 13, 2018)

Hello all..this is my first post ever on this site! Thank you for sharing your thoughts as this is what I am now going through. 2 failed IVF cycles and several cycles that went from IVF to IUI and several cycles that just had to be cancelled since they weren't going anywhere. I have been doing this for 2.5 years and exhausted physically, emotionally and financially. I just turned 44 so not getting any more fertile either! We were told yesterday that DE is out best bet but I am not ready. I told my sister who is ten years younger and she said she is willing to donate her eggs to us. Not sure what to do and how to feel about it all. Anyone experienced having their sister as the donor??


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## pauli (Sep 19, 2016)

Hi SweetRose, I am in a similar situation, turning 43 in 2 months with a number of unsuccessful cycles behind us. My sister offered us her eggs and we both cycled together about a year ago. I was reluctant to accept her offer as she is 1 year older, but she was determined as she had success on her first IVF attempt 18 months earlier. She ended up with 1 blast, I had 3 blasts but all were uneuploid through PGS. So no transfer. 

If my sister was 10 years younger I would be all over her  the idea of having a child genetically linked to her boy would be wonderful. They would be half siblings, they would be a family when we are not here anymore, they would have each other, what a comforting thought. We have almost no other family left. As that’s not an option for us now, we have accepted a donor through the same clinic. We got a lot of information, photos and even info about her background. 7 page file! 

She seems lovely and we are grateful to have this option. But I know it’s not for everyone. It took me some time to come around. Hopefully you will be able to make a decision soon, good luck xx


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## Nicnik (Feb 17, 2016)

Hello ladies,

I'm glad I came across this thread, as I am in a similar situation.

I'm 43.5 and we've had 8 own egg ivf cycles over the last 5 years with 3 different clinics, transferring 16 embryos in total. Our 3rd (NHS) cycle worked, but unfortunately ended in missed miscarriage at 10 weeks. I still produce plenty of eggs each time I cycle and we always get good quality embryos and there are no known issues (we also tried PGS for one cycle and had a perfectly 'normal' blast transferred, but this didn't take). We've decided we can't go through any more own egg cycles when the chances are so low now with my age, so we have decided to move to DE, but I am finding it very hard to make the next move and start arranging with a clinic - the main reason for me (and please, please don't judge me on this) is that I am finding it hard to trust that the clinic will find a good match for me and I worry what the child will look like. Obviously I'd be happy as long as I have a healthy baby, but I can't shake these other feelings. I am going for counselling and my counsellor doesn't feel I'm emotionally ready to move to DE, but are you ever _really _ready to move to DE?! I feel I can't leave it any longer, as I don't want to be much older than I am now to be a mum (should we be lucky enough for it to work!), but struggling to make the next step. My counsellor said that in reality, even when conceiving naturally, there is no guarantee that the child will resemble you, which I totally get, but still struggling with the idea.

I agree with everything you ladies have said, it makes perfect sense, but wish I could shake this feeling off, so that I can move forward. xx


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## SweetRose (Aug 13, 2018)

Nicnik: I totally relate to how you feel. I am even hesitating to see a counselor because I don't feel ready. If I have my sister donate, I feel it will always be awkward, specially between her and my husband. And if I use an anonymous donor, who knows about the actual looks and temperament. I feel it won't feel real. Sorry...I know many people have done it and they say there is so much love for the baby anyway...but again, everyone is different. I imagine if my mom told me today that I was conceived through egg donor, I would feel differently about her...I don't know, I think that is just me 
Good luck to all who are going through this!


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## Anna20162016 (Jul 13, 2016)

I'm in the same boat.  I'm gearing towards just being childless and stopping,  It's just not working for us, we're broke, tired, frustrated and I desperately need to move on. We have had many failed attempts and now doing TSI since April this year hoping for a miracle, the time is coming for me to quit

I have mainly decided against donor eggs for the reason is I just am not comfortable with the little information that you receive on a donor in terms of family history and medical history.  I have seem family and friends with children with special needs ( autism ), teenagers with bi-polar etc  and it scares the hell out of me what I've seen people deal with. whatever risk you know you'll have with your own genes you just don't know with donor.  I could not get my head around this with DE, the screening is just not good enough for me, it just shows what a person has declared in their application and a lot of time these conditions are just not tested for ( with places that actually do gene testing on their DE)  and my fear is in a lot of the cases the donor does this for money and with the need for money comes little white lies.  

I do agree it's one cell, but that cell will grows to a baby with your donor genes and if you have a partner his sperm.
I would love to explore a clinic that has loads of screening, pictures, fully verified educations, family hostory etc. 

I would love to be able to move to DE, I just can't do it ... yet or maybe never.  It's such a hard call I'd love to see how  people overcome their objectives to DE or how you make peace with being childless .  Just a horrible situation really.


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

I totally get where you're coming from niknik, sweetrose and anna and I'm sure we all have initial doubts. I think we all have to do what we're comfortable with as a child is forever! I respect what everyone thinks. If you can't really deal with having a child through DE, it is probably better to decide to remain childless, although that in itself will be really difficult.
I think that too much stress is laid on OE vs DE, though I'm not saying anyone is wrong for thinking that way, but I really do love my gorgeous children totally and barely give the DE aspect a thought but then I thought pragmatically and wanted a healthy baby and this was the best chance. I accept I have to take on trust the medical history of the donor but if there is a potential health issue, the HFEA can make contact with the donors. I don't have a photo but have pen portraits of both donors which give me an idea about them. As I went to a clinic in the UK, there is donor release when they are 18. Even if you use OE, there is no guarantee that there won't be a medical or personality issue that has been inherited from generations ago that no one knows about! I love my children so much and it sometimes upsets me that there is a perception that OE is the best outcome, though I know people don't mean it to come across like this! 
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.


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## minerva71 (Nov 15, 2016)

deblovecats, agree with you. I think it's all about being comfortable and confident in what you're up to. I didn't have have any choice and it wasn't very difficult decision for me to have a baby through DE. What's in the other one's mind impossible to guess or understand. But how right you are saying there is no right or wrong. I was sad to know I can't produce an egg that could become my baby later but this is nothing comparing to a childless life in my opinion. I'm blessed with twin boys I delivered at 46. They are my everything and seeing my husband in them is priceless. I don't keep in mind they were conceived through donor eggs. I'll never say I love them as though they're my sons because they are mine!


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

Loved your post deblovescats, really helps. 
Minerva, congrats on your twins.  I'm currently on the waiting list at the Lister for donor egg IVF and I thought I was fine with it but am having a wobble again.  I think the main issue is that we are already using donor sperm as my husband has azoospermia so it's the double donation that's getting to me at the moment.  I've started hoping that maybe my husband might have some sperm and I could still have his baby using donor eggs. I know that's futile though as he never had any sperm in the samples and his diet is terrible which he will never improve on as he's such a fussy eater and won't eat any fruit or veg.  
It's just all quite tough and I feel sad at the moment, kind of like a grief.


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## Clarabelle71 (Jan 14, 2016)

Magicpillow , i had my baby girl aug 15 and although she does not look like me at all i could not love her more. My dh was able to use his sperm after clinic saying to go with double donor. His morphology was 2% and had a stomach bacteria issue. We had him on vit c, alpha lipoic acid, omega 3, and zinc, and cut down smoking. Everything was fine for analysis day of collection. I know double donation may be the best chance but perhaps with effort he can test again. Wishing you much luck. In the end you will love the baby no matter and child will be lucky he/she was wanted so much. X


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## miamiamo (Aug 9, 2015)

LuckySt4r - such an amazing and inspiring story xx


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

LuckySt4r

What a wonderful story. All the best to your wonderful family. xxx


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## Efi78 (Jun 26, 2017)

Anna20162016 said:


> I'm in the same boat. I'm gearing towards just being childless and stopping, It's just not working for us, we're broke, tired, frustrated and I desperately need to move on. We have had many failed attempts and now doing TSI since April this year hoping for a miracle, the time is coming for me to quit
> 
> I have mainly decided against donor eggs for the reason is I just am not comfortable with the little information that you receive on a donor in terms of family history and medical history. I have seem family and friends with children with special needs ( autism ), teenagers with bi-polar etc and it scares the hell out of me what I've seen people deal with. whatever risk you know you'll have with your own genes you just don't know with donor. I could not get my head around this with DE, the screening is just not good enough for me, it just shows what a person has declared in their application and a lot of time these conditions are just not tested for ( with places that actually do gene testing on their DE) and my fear is in a lot of the cases the donor does this for money and with the need for money comes little white lies.
> 
> ...


Hi Anna

I meant to answer to your post for a while now.

I am exactly on the same boat as you. Nothing against DE but I don't trust clinics at all. From what I have seen they are really irresponsible. I am 40 years old and had my fair share of pain. I have made the decisions to live childless because quite frankly I can't take any more pain and do another cycle, move to DE/adoption/fostering etc. At least not for now.
In terms of DE I have the same reservations as you. I have no faith clinics do proper screening thus feel insecure.

At the moment I am not trying IVF or anything else. Just good old traditional sex and I am trying to come to terms with living childless, while being someone who loves children and has a great marriage. Tough one but c'est la vie.


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## lechatgris (Oct 9, 2015)

I tried with my own egg in January in Copenhagen (do not recommend Copenhagen Fertility Clinic), and failed. I thought I was out of the baby game entirely because I had rejected the idea of not using my own eggs. I am a single woman, and I already felt guilty burdening a future child with not having a connection to her/his biological father. So I threw in the towel after the failure at my one and only attempt in January. However, I am now coming around to the idea of a donor egg.

@magicpillow, have you considered the clinics in North Cyprus? The Team Miracle clinic (North Cyprus IVF Center, I think it's called) does a cytoplasmic injection tandem cycle. That means that they will use both your eggs and a donor's eggs. If your fail to fertilize, then they use the donor embryos, all in the same cycle. And the cytoplasmic injection is a new technique where they inject young women's mitochondria into your older eggs to rejuvinate them in some way: https://www.lowcostivf.net/latest-news-from-north-cyprus-ivf-center/cytoplasmic-tandem-cycle-your-ivf-chances-just-increased

I am trying to decide if I am simply too old at 46, and not waste my money on trying the cytoplasmic thing with tandem cycle and just use a donor egg and sperm, or to try their thing in case there is a miracle. In any case, you are only 42, which is not that old for that.


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## Anna20162016 (Jul 13, 2016)

EFI78

I went the fertility show in London and spent time speaking to all the DE places.  I felt the only place with proper information in terms of non - anon and a full history/background check is the USA and the costs seem to be 20 - 30 K + for DE there. there's is another company out of SA that I might explore also.  The issue with DE for me is it's not your genes it will never be your genetic child.  I think some people try and convince themselves that their DNA is passed to the baby as you're carrying the baby but it's not the case.  to me it's a massive decision life changing to accept someone elses's DNA for my child.  

For me it's the unknown that's the scary part,  I would do DE if I was fully satisfied with the full information on the DE and even had a connection to that person.  
I seriously don't know how anyone does anon DE, it's a massive risk that I would be afraid to take.  All babies are lovely, but babies grow up and nurture versus nature etc comes into play.  I know that a DE would be my DH DNA due to his sperm so that's the positive part of DE,  it's the unknown.  I would also be concerned with all the DNA places out there now, years to come your DE child will have to be told as what if they did the DNA test and find  out they have siblings and family all over the places.  It's scares me.


I need to read more DE stories I know there are a lot of happy people out their with DE babies/children.  I know myself and I would need to have deep knowledge if I was to move forward and have a donor egg, which is choosing a DNA partner for my husbands sperm.  The whole thing freaks him out re DE.


It's so hard to move on from your own eggs, so so hard, I think maybe it gets to a point that you're like I want a baby and the above risks do not matter to me as much as having a baby for your family. That's what I seem to see what happens.  I'm just not at that point and don't know if I ever will be.  I think  you have to be in a place to see DE as a gift or something like that.


I applaud anyone that has overcome the same objectives as I'm struggling to do so.

I'm currently going TSI each month with stim meds since my last failed ICSI in Feb this year, it's hard.  I might do another ICSI in Jan or Feb.

Lechatgris 
I had been in touch with that clinic in Copenhagen, they were frankly just rude in emails and didn't go with tthem. 
I had heard of that treatment in Cyprus and haven't heard any sucesses but I'm going to call them on that. Is IVF regulated in Cyprus?  I know a lot of consultants I might ask them this.
if the cost isn't too much go for it. 
its a numbers game at 46 to get your own eggs to work, anything over 42 it seems to be just try and try until if you're lucky you get that golden egg.

Please keep me posted would love to hear how you get on 

x


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## miamiamo (Aug 9, 2015)

Efi78 - I am sorry your IVF-s failed. I wish your dream come true whatever it is. xx


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## Mochashosh (Jan 23, 2018)

Hi Anna

I just wanted to say how much your post resonated with me.

We've been advised not to have another O/E cycle, and that the best chance for us is DE.  But I cannot reconcile the idea of carrying and bringing up another person's child.  I think people really do delude themselves when they convince themselves that the baby inherits some of the birth mum's DNA.  Of course there will be crossover because by coincidence you and the donor mother will share a number of SNPs, but that's not the same thing at all.

Of course, for some people that doesn't matter, and the joy of having a baby is so great that the genetic origins become irrelevant.  And believe me, I would never judge anyone, and I applaud people who've had DE babies and love them just the same as if they were OE babies, if not more.  How truly wonderful to be able to do that.  But that's not me, and it sounds like it might not be you either.

Like you, I would only seek out a donor in the States, or possibly one other country, because in my case there are religious/legal issues too, and I'd have to be extremely sure about the donor. In my case, I've yet to see a donor on a database who meets my criteria, and I'm not sure they even exist. But the cost is prohibitive, and even if I were to justify it, I feel bad about supporting an industry which exploits vulnerable women, and where there is such inequity that only the very wealthiest have the option at all.

We've talked about finding a family member to be an egg donor, but I think that would be the worst of all; knowing that you were bringing up a child whose real mummy was still in their life.  You are so right in saying that the interests of the child have to come first.

Someone told me the other day that I was being "too picky".  What the eff? This is a person's life we're talking about - of course you have to be very responsible in your choices to make sure you give them the very best chance.  

But then that means that I don't get to have a baby at all, and I'm not sure if I can live with that either.  

Life is very tough as we all know, and we get dealt many hands that we don't deserve at all, but I hope you can find the answer that is right for you.


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## Tincancat (Mar 19, 2012)

I think there appears to be some difficulties here with regards the term mother.  I'm certainly not bringing up anyone else's children: they are mine.  Yes they happen to have different genetics but that's no big deal for there is nothing special about my genetics in fact they may have a better set than ever I could have given them   Having children is a risk full stop: you never know what's going to happen.  I took good care of myself when pregnant and still lost my first, my own egg, twin sons despite this.  Lost my second pregnancy also OE.  By my final try it was donor eggs and it boiled down to a simple fact did I want a baby or not. Anonymous donors but the reality is in this day and age of DNA testing if my boys wanted to they could find out more.  Having great donors on paper doesn't translate into the perfect child.  A donor may not be University educated but that may be lack of an opportunity rather than intellect.  I'm hoping my boys will have the same thinking as me: family is what you make it not what genes you have. 
TCCx


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## Clarabelle71 (Jan 14, 2016)

I prefer to keep things private but my mother and doctors knew about donor eggs. Iam grateful to the donor and Iam my daughter’s real mother. Her only mother. I actually prefer not knowing the donor and I know I carried this beautiful baby, my body made her, and she is part of me. X


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## Tincancat (Mar 19, 2012)

Clarabelle I'm with you on the anonymity of the donor.  I actually prefer not to know.  I can imagine if I did know maybe then I'd be looking at them thinking can I see her/him in them.  As it is I've no expectations or targets for them.  They are who they are.  My boys are like unwrapping layers of a parcel: there is a surprise under there and I don't know what they will be like but it's exciting all the same.
Given the choice I'd have chosen ID release donors over anonymous donors but I see it as less of an issue now genetic testing is freely available.  I'd have only gone with ID release to give my boys a choice and to make it perhaps easier to look for genetic relatives. 
If genes become a big issue for my boys then I'd support them in looking for genetic relatives.  I'd probably do my genetics too just out of curiosity to see my ancestry and where my genetic family came from. 
TCCx


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## Clarabelle71 (Jan 14, 2016)

If we do choose one day to tell our baby about the donor ivf I would not mind them doing genetic testing if they wished but she will have a genetic link on her father’s side and my sister who adopted 2 children did keep it open and they had no interest in finding their genetic family. We were told nationality of donor so at least know that. I had a mmc with oe and never saw this pregnancy as any different so I was so relieved to reach the end with a healthy baby. I could not emotionally or physically keep doing oe with losses. To reach the end of pregnancy with a healthy baby is the most wonderful feeling. 

My dh is religious and is thankful we were sent our baby. X


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## RB76 (Jul 27, 2011)

I very rarely post on here now as have moved on from treatment altogether but I did want to post in case it helps someone to hear about my experience.

I was very unsure about moving to DE. Like others on here I had no choice really. Even during pregnancy I was very worried and concerned about that aspect of being a parent. 

The thing is, infertility is a very lonely and unhappy time, it permeates every aspect of your life and you never really feel truly happy (this was my experience anyway - I obviously cannot speak for everyone else). So you spend hours deliberating and worrying about every aspect of it all. By using DE you are of course making choices not only for yourself but for a potential child.

I finally did become a mother through DE treatment and have the most amazing little girl. She was born very prematurely actually and is a surviving twin (obviously fate did not feel we had had an awful enough time with the five failed cycles of Ivf treatment and £30k cost). I just have to say, there is nothing in the world that could persuade me now that having DE treatment was the wrong thing to do. I am happy now, in a way that I would never ever have experienced. Becoming a parent has been and always will be the best experience of my life. I think about the DE side of things only very rarely. Do I wish my child didn’t have to have that question mark in the future? Yes, of course - but has she not been conceived in the way she was, she would be a different person, and that is just unfathomable to me. 

Moving to DE is the best decision I have ever made and although I know it feels like a leap of faith, I would urge anyone in two minds to take it. 

Good luck to all x


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

Thank you so much for that RB76.  It really helps to hear stories like this.


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

I concur with what Tincat and Clarabelle have written. I am so glad you are happy with your baby RB. Mochashosh, I totally get why some women find it hard to move forward with DE and respect anyone's decision not to go ahead, but I also find it hurtful when the donor is referred to as the 'real mother'. I know that this was not the intention, but I just wanted to say that under no circumstances do I regard my egg donor as their 'real mother'. I am grateful for the eggs she donated to me, but that's as far as it goes in terms of being a mother. My donor had a baby of her own from the same cycle and she is the 'real mother' to that child. I look at my lovely children and feel so blessed. I love them more than I can ever imagine, and do not think about the donor aspect most of the time. The love that they give me is to their 'real mummy'. I realise that further down the line, there may be questions they will have, but we'll deal with that when it happens. My 4 year old son is always telling me that he loves me and it melts my heart! I have never regretted my decision. For me, it was not a difficult choice to move from OE.
I believe there is far too much of a focus on a genetic link.


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## jdm4tth3ws (May 20, 2012)

Currently 31 weeks pregnant with donor egg and donor sperm baby. I also have own egg and own sperm children. I can honestly say, that the love I feel for my unborn child is no different to the love I have for my other children. The worry and concern I have felt over the last few days with reduced movements is no different to how I felt with my other children when we had episodes like that with them. 

My children (22,11 and 8 yrs)  all know how this baby was conceived and none of them feel that he is anything less than their long awaited new brother to be. My youngest has really enjoyed the pregnancy from to start, finding out about pregnancy,using the doppler to find his brothers heartbeat. Every night before sleep, he puts his hands on my belly to get his brother to kick him. He cuddles me and then makes a point of cuddling the bump. He kisses me and then kisses the bump. He can't Wait to have his brother here and be helping. 

I had a 30 week 4d scan done last week and was amazed to see the face of my youngest child looking back at me. The baby is (so far) the absolute spitting image of my 8yr old. My mum was stunned, My husband was and my eldest son immediately said " My God! He looks like xxx!!"- my youngest son.

For us, we are very grateful to both the donors involved that have given us 1 cell each of theirs to give us this chance to complete our family. But thats all it is. 1 cell per person. The rest, my husband and I have done. I have nurtured him. Fed my body the right nutrients. Protected him when I had a large haematoma. Continue to take insulin 4 times a day, continue to eat the right foods, and rest as and when required. My husband has continued to look after me, our children and our Home to ensure I do the most important thing, grow our baby. We are all so looking forward to welcoming our newest bundle of joy. 

I respect anyone who says they can or can't go through with donor treatment. But If it is theonly way to achieve that long awaited baby, then I would obviously consider every part of it. It is a fantastic opportunity. I am just so grateful that infertility treatment has advanced this much that there are realistic  alternatives these days to trying to achieve a pregnancy and the chance of having/completing a family.


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## Mochashosh (Jan 23, 2018)

Deb, I am so, so sorry to have hurt your feelings, and hope you can accept my sincere apologies. I didn't mean to in the least, and I hope we can still be friendly.

I bang on about how insensitive people are about saying the wrong thing, and then I go and do it myself. How awful!

The latest howler came from an acquaintance who said something like, "Having DE is the same as adopting". I didn't ask for her opinion, and I am not glad to have received it as I didn't find it in the least helpful, and I'm not sure that it's true. I don't know why people feel they have to offer unsolicited opinions. Unless they've been there, they don't have a clue.

I also spoke to a charity today who understand where I'm coming from with the religious issues, but can't really help. Still, it was good to have talked to them, because I know that nobody else will remotely 'get' the religious stuff. They will mostly be polite about it, but they won't have any affinity or understanding. That's fine, but it's a relief to find someone who does.

I think I can pretty much rule out America because the charity reckons that to get a donor who met my criteria in the States would cost 50K per cycle. I think it's evil to charge that kind of money, and I don't want to be part of an industry that does so.

I don't really 'do' Christmas, but I'm going to try and have some fun in the next few weeks, because I reckon we've earned it.


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## bombsh3ll (Apr 19, 2012)

Whilst I personally didn't struggle with DE & chose it at 31 for different reasons than most, it is clear there is a very wide spectrum of feelings towards donor conception. Some can seem irrational and others, especially from people who haven't experienced infertility, stem from ignorance. I think the term mother and father are often used loosely and mean different things to different people. For example if a woman conceives on a one night stand and never sees the man again, he has provided genetic material, but isn't exactly a father - he may never even know he has a child. If a single woman uses donor sperm from a sperm bank, is that a father? Some would say yes, some no. 

Does the 22 year old student who donated eggs to me think of herself as a mother? I doubt it, unless by now she has children of her own.

As for DE being the same as adopting - it IS totally different, but I wouldn't take offense at somebody thinking that if they are particularly fixated on their own genetic material. Obviously I am glad I have my daughter now, but IVF was actually our second choice having tried and failed at adoption first, as I would rather have given a home to a child already in the world & not put myself through that. 

Although some people do find the idea of DE difficult for whatever reason, I can honestly say I have never seen anyone say they have regretted having a DE baby. There are many stories on here of people really struggling with DE who end up over the moon when they are finally blessed.

B x


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

Well I’ve got my oe children and de children and they’re all the same to me except my de children are a teeny bit more special because of the way they came to me. 
Sort of sick of people thinking that de children are also not as special or the next step down from de children also, getting de is a gift like receiving a new kidney or a heart. It’s not choosing a second best option. 
If you receive donor blood, that blood mixes with your blood and becomes part of you, you don’t walk around saying oh the blood in me isn’t mine etc, it becomes part of your blood. When you use de your borrowing one cell from someone, yes you need that on cell to start, but everything else once started comes from you. And people really need to read up on epigenetics, it’s a proven fact, and also if the same embryo was put into another lady the resulting baby would be totoally different.


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## miamiamo (Aug 9, 2015)

jdm4tth3ws  - amazing story, I wish you and all your family a lifetime of happiness together.


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## jdm4tth3ws (May 20, 2012)

Thank you Miamiamo, we can and we can't wait to have him here. Got to wait as he's too little for now, but we are counting down the weeks now, rather than up to get to viability etc. Really looking forward to my arms being full soon. 

Jdm x


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## deblovescats (Jun 23, 2012)

Moch - thanks for saying that. Maybe I'm just a bit sensitive about the subject, but I do appreciate what you said. I appreciate your honesty in not being sure about going ahead with DE. You really have to be 100% if going down this route. I can honesty say that my children are the best thing to happen to me and I would not be without them. I barely give a thought to the donor aspect, I just focus on the cuddles and my little boy telling me he loves me all the time. He has started school now and we were talking about his little friends and I asked who was his best friend, he responded 'you'. My heart melted!


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## Everythingcrossed42 (Nov 30, 2018)

Hi I’m 42 nearly 43, had two miscarriages through natural pregnancy and just did a round of ivf with PGS. We got 4 good blastocysts but all of them came back as abnormal. The consultant had said we may now want to consider using DE, I had already started to consider this as my egg quality is obviously not great.  However, the reality is now a bit heartbreaking.  It’s been fascinating reading this thread and I guess it is just down to personal choice. I’m interested to understand for those in the UK, where You went for treatment, I hear that there is a shortage of eggs in the UK and from my little research seen that there are lots of clinics in Europe offering no waiting time and supposed high success rates. I know there are different regulations too re donor anonymity but just looking for any recommendations. Thanks


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## June2015 (Jun 20, 2015)

Hi Everythingcrossed.,

We went to Boston Place clinic, as at the time they were working with an egg donor agency called New Life.  (They now have an exclusive agreement with Alturi agency).  I also considered CRGH and when we to try for another baby, we also looked at Gennet city fertility (as our original consultant from Boston, had since moved to Gennet).  In the end we stayed with Boston Place.  They are part of the simply fertility group.  Might be worth having a look at. 

I cannot comment on the shortage of egg donors in the UK. I guess it depends on which characteristics you're seeking and which clinics work with with agencies etc. 

Let me know if you have any more questions, but if not, good luck with everything. I've never once looked back and wished I hadn't pursued the donor egg route xx


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## bombsh3ll (Apr 19, 2012)

Hi Everythingcrossed42,

I'm sorry you're hurting at the moment. I was devastated when I lost my fertility at 31 due to tubal damage, but having embarked on IVF and had painful OHSS twice and a stim induced hydrosalpinx, for me there were only positives to using DE. I could have used my own eggs. I produced tons of them, & they were good quality. I saw DE as an upgrade, a bonus, an ovarian facelift, getting something extra that I wouldn't have got if I were fertile  

I would maybe reframe your point of reference now to seeing that a move from OE to DE at your age instantly shifts your chances of success from less than 5% to maybe 70-80% plus. That's not heartbreaking, its amazing!

In the UK when I asked about DE, still in so much pain from OHSS that I could barely walk or breathe, I was told no clinic would "waste" donor eggs on me, like I wasn't deserving. Also I was keen on anonymous, untraceable donation, I didn't want to be on some HFEA register. We ended up going to Spain for treatment. 

My clinic was FIV Marbella, & they were amazing from start to finish. Great communication, lovely premises, clean, well organised, all the latest technology (it far surpassed the UK NHS self funded experience), safe medical care (obviously I didn't want to place my donor at risk of OHSS - they only used mild stimulation not the aggressive regimens still being used in the UK at that time), let me have a say in my treatment, understood and accepted my wish to use DE rather than go through it again myself & also let me have 3 embryos put back. They really put me at ease & I felt so safe & comfortable there. 

That cycle was successful, but the mark of a good clinic in my opinion is one where you would go back even if it hadn't worked, which we definitely would have done. The aftercare was great, the co-ordinator would phone and email to see how I was doing, answered queries straight away and advised me when I was bleeding, also sent a replacement prescription in a day when my house was burgled & my estrogen & progesterone in the chemist's bag stolen from my kitchen top, which I would have miscarried without. 

Whatever you decide to do, I wish you the best of luck and success!

B x


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## Everythingcrossed42 (Nov 30, 2018)

Thank you both that is reassuring and good to have some clinics to explore. 
Bombsh3ll I can't believe the UK clinic treated you like that, how awful. My clinic in the UK have been great but seems like I might have to wait quite a while for a donor, also like you I think I want the anonymity which you get abroad. 
Will keep you posted on our journey and yes slowly trying to change my reference point.


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## Wunderwomban (Jan 16, 2017)

https://aeon.co/essays/microchimerism-how-pregnancy-changes-the-mothers-very-dna


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