# Hello ~



## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi my name is Angie and this is the first time I have logged onto Fertility Friends,I am totally useless when it comes to computers so I hope I am doing this right!!! My sister recommended this site to me as it really helped her when she was going through her IVF. My new husband(we got married 4 weeks ago)recently...well after many tests found out that he is infertile and our only hope of having a child is through sperm donation or to adopt!If there is anyone out there that is going through,considering or has had sperm donation please let me no as we are feeling very alone and don't no where to start!!!!


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hi Angie 

I'm Angie too 

Shortly after marrying my DH we tried and tried and tried to have a baby straight away. When we weren't successful after about 6 months we found out that my DH has severe azoospermia, basically he had about 1million on a good day and zero sperm on a bad day.

So we were advised that IVF with ICSI was our only hope. We've had 2 unsuccessful treatments. We were advised that perhaps donor sperm was the way forward. So in September we will be having Donor IVF with half my eggs and a 3rd ICSI using my DHs sperm with the other half. Hopefully it will be third time lucky for us 

We imported sperm from Xytex in America before they changed the rules so that you can't do that anymore. I know that some clinics have sperm from donors, but loads of clinics including ours have a real shortage due to lifting the anonymity of the donation. This is driving alot of people overseas when they need donors for sperm or eggs. There are many boards on this site to offer support when you are thinking about using a donor. http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=93412.0

Anyway, if you have any other questions please let me know and I will be happy to help or guide you to the right direction. 

Love best wishes,

Angiexxx


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## DizziSquirrel (Feb 15, 2005)

& Welcome to FF Angie

 for being in this situation and feeling so alone,
many of our members are not confident on the pc so if you need any help just post a reply here and I will do what I can, ther is also a very good technical help section where you may want to ask specif questions or search answers 

have you decided whether to take the Donor sperm route or adoption  
do either of you have a prefrence 
I see Angie has left you a link to the donor section of FF I know a few members have been sucsessful and should be a good starting point for you   

I am also going to leave you some links

*G&B ~ Community board*
CLICK HERE
*
Male factors ~*CLICK HERE

*Adoption & fostering ~*
Adoption & Fostering

To make the site easier to navigate click on the index tab at the top of any page - pink hearts mean there is something new within the board you have not read/looked at and if you scroll right down you will see the last ten posts from all over FF all are clickable  if you refresh this page (f5) it will update the last ten posts as well as the boards/threads and who's online!!!
take some time to look at the help tab too 
Check out the Locations boards for your home town & a site search for your clinic 

Wishing you Friendship  &    


If you need any help just ask!
~Dizzi~


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

Hi angie

you are not alone,  there are two threads that I post on one is for general azoospermia,  the other is for non obstructive azoospermia,  come and join in all the girls are lovely and you'll get some great support as we are all going through the same.

My partner and I have been ttc for 2 1/2 years and in february we were told he has no sperm,  we are still going through tests at the moment so it is still early days,  his urologist believes at this stage that the cause is sertoli cell only syndrome,  I still havent got my head around exactly what it is. 

We are going to go as far as we can with DP,  with regards surgical sperm retrival if they find any.  But we are resigned to the fact that we probably need a donor.  we seem to be luckier then most as Dp brother has said he will be our donor for us.  Whilst it's fantastic that he is willing to do it, it does open up a whole minefield of issues and what if's.

you havent gone into detail with what tests investigations your husband has had, so come along to the other threads and you'll get all the support you need.  this site is a godsend for those days when youre feeling really low or youve just got what seems a really silly question to ask.

sending you loads of love 

Rebecca


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## Kamac80 (Nov 24, 2005)

Hi angie and welcome to the site 

Sorry to hear what you have been through trying for a baby already - its not easy to cope with at times.

You have come to a fantastic place full of advice and support and you have been left some great links to try out.

I wish you the best of luck with everything.

Kate xx​


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi Other Angie

Thankyou so much for your reply,infact I have only just realized that I had a few replies to my 1st post!!!I work for BA flying here there and everywhere so I blame it on the jet lag!!!We are still coming to terms with the fact that we need doner sperm and decided we will give it ago,we have contacted a few clinics,only one got back to us and were very helpful so our doctor is in the prosess of sending our notes to the Sussex Downs Fertility clinic in Eastbourne,

Good luck with all your treatments,I can't believe there are so many of us out there!My sister had unexplained infertility and had 9 goes of IVF before she had her little boy!!Anyway I am off to Hongkong tomorrow and need to pack,

Thankyou once again and i shall keep you posted and have got my fingers crossed that it works for you next time.

Take care

love

Angie xxxx


Angel129 said:


> Hi Angie
> 
> I'm Angie too
> 
> ...


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi Dizzie

Thankyou so much for your kind reply,I have only just noticed that I had a few replies,I really am the words worst when it comes to pc's!!!!I have just had a look at your story and the only thing i can say is that you are amazing very brave and just keep on going,I wish you all the luck in the world.My sister also went to the Lister,she had unexplained infertility,I think she lost 3 one being eptopic,on her 9th go she had her little boy and soon fell pregnant naturally with her little girl!!!She was so upset when she found that my DH and I are also going to struggle to have a family.
We have decided to give sperm donation ago and are now waiting for a consultation to get the ball rolling on what we can and can't do,I am 36 so don't want to hang around,we are coping ok so far,I have my moments when it scares the hell out of me and moments when I am very positive,I would still like to adopt regardless of what happens,I work for BA and have met many couples bringing back little ones from far off places,there are so many kids out there needing a home,I'd adopt tomorrow if I could but no I can't do both at once!!
I am off to Hongkong tomorrow so need to get some much needed beauty sleep before I face all those passengers tomorrow!!!when I get back I shall check out the links that you and the other members have enclosed.

Take care

luv

Angie xxx 


Dizzi squirrel said:


> & Welcome to FF Angie
> 
> for being in this situation and feeling so alone,
> many of our members are not confident on the pc so if you need any help just post a reply here and I will do what I can, ther is also a very good technical help section where you may want to ask specif questions or search answers
> ...


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## DizziSquirrel (Feb 15, 2005)

Fly safe - See you when you get back
There is a donor sperm/egg board - were you will be made most welcome 

Thanks for taking the time to read my story, I'm not giving up yet watch this space!

I thought you were having an early night - ( I was having one too  )

~Dizzi~


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi Rebecca

Thankyou so much for your reply and I am so sorry it has taken me ages to get back to you!I'm long haul cabin crew and got back from Hong Kong early thismorning!I'm still getting to grips with this web site!!

I'm so sorry to hear that you are having the same problem as my DH and I,it all sounds very similar,to be honest I can't remeber all the technical terms for what is wrong with my DH and to be honest he's had so many tests as the doctors were not really sure themselves!It could be something he was born with or they think he could have gone through a male menapause as they also discovered he has osteoparosis!poor thing has gone through endless tests and all we really know is that he has a zero sperm count and we need to have donation to have our own bambino!!

The whole thing scares the hell out of me but at least now we know what we have to do,we had been trying for about 2 years before all the tests started and for the past 8 months we had been hanging on to a tiny thread in the hope it was something like a blockage or if his hormones were boosted a miracle might happen!!!Oh well all we can do now is wait,our GP is fab and has forwarded our notes to the one and only fertility clinic that got back intouch with us after we contacted a few!!

We have been told that we really need to go abroad and that Spain is the place to go!It all seems like a waiting game now,i'm 36 so want to get cracking asap,we are also considering adoption which is something i'd like to do regardless but will take one step at a time!!!I have my days when I hit rock bottom especially when I'm across the other side of the world jet lagged,but then part of me is excited and very positive that either way we will have a family one day its just gonna take a bit longer than we planned!!!

See you can tell i'm jet lagged I'm really waffeling on!I would be really interested to know how you get on and what steps you decide to take and I wish you loads and loads of luck,

Thankyou so much for sharing your info with me,I can see now this web site is going to be my saviour (once i learn how to use it!!)

Take care

love

Angie xxxxx 


beckyb said:


> Hi angie
> 
> you are not alone, there are two threads that I post on one is for general azoospermia, the other is for non obstructive azoospermia, come and join in all the girls are lovely and you'll get some great support as we are all going through the same.
> 
> ...


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

HI Angie

well since I left that post  and things have moved on for us ,  weve had the results of DP's chromosome karotyping and it was the worse news we could have heard.

basically he has no Y sex chromosome.  he is 46XX men are usually XY and women XX.  it's apparently a very rare genetic condition affects 1 in 20,000 men.  Everything about him is male, normal male bits, it's just during embryonic development part of his Y chromsome got stuck to his x or something,  I still dont fully understand it, we have an appt with a genetisist on monday.  The only sign that there is something wrong with men with this condition is that they have small testicles which dont develop so are unable to produce sperm.

Ive only found one other couple on here where the guy has the same thing.  So thats it for us,  we have our answer.  it was devastating to be told for definite that there is absolutely no chance of ha ving DP's biological child,  but in a strange way we feel lucky that we only found out there was a problem with his SA test mid february and a few months later we have a diagnosis.  that may sound strange to say but like you say your 8 months on and theres always that small hope,  theres other couples 2 years on still ploughing on with test after test,  spending more money in the little hope of finding sperm.  It must be so heartbreaking for them  I'm not sure I could do that.

we feel at least we can deal with the fact and move on to the next stage  which is most definately a sperm donor.  and there things get really complicated,  In march not long after we'd found out there was a problem with Dp sperm ( or total lack of it)  we received a phone call out of the blue from his brother offering to be our sperm donor if we needed one.  he only got married in february and we knew they were going to be trying straight away.  we had decided we wouldn't have directly asked him untill they had a child of there own.  then a month ago they announced they are pregnant.

whilst it's a fantastic thing for them to offer to do for us it does open up a whole minefield of issues.  DP likes the idea of still having a small genetic link to any baby that we might conceive and is very close to his brother,  they only live 15 minutes away and we see them all the time,  which is one of my concerns, one of very many.  

so we are now waiting for our gp to refer us to a clinic, we arent not considering using an anonymous donor, however with the sperm crisis in this country at the moment and the waiting lists for it,  it does make his brothers offer all the more attractive.

weve also considered adoption, however when I rang them they wont even talk to you until you are a year past your last fertility appointment,  they want you to have time to grieve and come to terms with the fact you wont have your own child.  They also said your highly unlikely to be given a baby.

I would like to go the donor route first and if we are lucky with that then consider adoption at a later date.

omg just realised how long this is so sorry  hope you havent nodded off,

you are so right about this website being your saviour,  it's fantastic  you'll  some really good advice and support,  it must be hard to be going through this and then have to spend so many nights apart, especially across the other side of the world.

loads of luck for your appt at the clinic,  let me know how you get on



becky xx


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

HI Becky

So sorry to hear your news,your not alone on this one,my DH also has been told that part of his condition is small testicles!Its something that they don't seem to no much about and are still researching into it,thats one of the reasons they think he may have been infertile since birth!
Its so wonderful that your brother in law has offered to be a donor,I'm abit like you though it all seems abit to close to home!but I'm sure when you get an appointment at the clinic you will see a councilor that will cover all this with you,at least you will have the same blood line and know where the genes came from!!We will have to have a donor too but not someone we know,we don't have that option but have discussed it in case someone offered!I offered my eggs to my sister,she had 9 goes on ivf before having her little boy and I know that if it had come to that it would not have bothered me in the slightest,so think about it seriously as you could be waiting for along time for donor sperm unless you go abroad!!!
We are now waiting for our referral and I will let you know soon as we get our appointment,I'm so sorry to hear your news is the same as ours but I feel like I'm not alone now if that makes sense,most if not all fertility problems that are covered on TV are to do with female problems very little covers mens!Is your DH open about his problem? mine has come to terms with it now,we had the 'I can't give you what you want etc'but now he is open about it and tells people he doesn't work properly,we've stopped pretending to our friends that we're not interested in kids etc and told them the truth,they have all been a massive support to both of us,sometimes you really find out who your friends are!
I know what you mean about adoption,I've looked into it alot,I met a lovely couple on a flight from Beijing a while ago that were bringing back their adopted daughter from China,she was beautiful 10 month old baby,the story behind her was so sad and its a massive problem out there,check out the web site CACH,I had *celeb on a flight to LA a while ago with little one who tey had adopted, gorgeous little boy,such a shame she didn't even look at him for the whole 10 hour flight!!!
Anyway I've gone on and on again now!!!oops!Good luck Becky I really look forward to hearing from you again,it will all work out in the end,be positive...Ino its hard to right now!!
Take care

Love

Andrea xxxxxxxxxxx
*edited by mod to protect poster*


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

HI Andrea

There is a new series starting thursday on BBC3 about infertility,  be interesting to see what slant they take on it.  there has been a couple of programs recently about MF.  one was about a teenage boy who found out his mum used a sperm donor, and another was called the great sperm crisis, a comedian travelled the country looking at the sperm donor numbers and trying to encourage men 'to give a toss for britain'  both were good programs highlighting the issue of MF and sperm donation only trouble is that they get shown on silly channels like BBC3.

If they were on mainstream tele I think it would raise the issue so much more,  I never knew there was a problem untill we were put in this situation and I'm sure the majority of the population dont either.

These celebs who adopt from abroad do annoy me,  I'm sure a lot of it is about the publicity,  theres enough kids in this country need loving homes.  although in this country the authorities do seem to make everything so hard  whatever it is you want to do whether thats tx or adoption.  (maybe you should pm me the name)

My Dp was fairly open in the beginning when we just knew there was no sperm. he told a couple of workmates and his brother and parents,  he didn't really want me to tell my parents as he thought they might feel differently about it him,  but of course we did tell them and they dont feel any differently at all.  He found his workmates surprising though as 2 single guys he told,  were like oh well and didn't seem to think it was that big a problem, and the one guy that does have kids was exactly the same,  strange!!  so he has stopped talking to them about it.
He doesn't really want our friends to know,  none of them are aware we have  been trying anyway.  
when it comes to the chromosome thing he is adamant he doesn't want anyone at all to know,  he says everything he read indicates that basically he's a woman.  which is total crap and not what ive read at all.  
He has definately found this bit of news harder to deal with then initially being told there was no sperm. so i'm respecting his wishes and weve just said to parents that its a genetic thing caused testicle not to develop  and left it at that.

so where are you in your  hubbys testing,  has he had all his blood tests and chromosome tests done?


becky x


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi Becky

I saw the programme on the great sperm crisis which was fab,also watched a child against all odds last year wher they covered a little on male infertility!
My husband has had all his tests done,the whole thing came to light when he had a problem called gynochomastia....ignore the spelling!!!Its a hormone in balance which made one side of his chest swell up bit like a deformed boob!!!thats when the DR's started asking questions about babys and they did a sperm test that came back as ZERO!!!then they did all the chromosome tests which came back normal!!!The DR's then started to explain about LH and FH levels etc,I wish I could have recorded everything they said as its all so mind blowing!!!Anyway he basically doesn't produce testosterone so has to apply testo gel everyday!!he has had an op to remove the fatty tissue from his chest which as you can imagine he was very self consious about!!We saw the urologist a month ago who explained the small testicle problem and how he is missing an antibody,he then got sent for a bone scan to see if he has osteoparosis which he does,this is caused by the lack of testosterone,these tests have gone on for ages and finally we can get the ball rolling now and do something about it.

I completly understand your husband not wanting to tell anyone,we kept it a secret for ages,thankfully our wedding took over whichalso kept us focused...its very easy to let it take over your life!!my sister did and I have always said right from the start that even though its so inportant to us it won't take over!!!Since our wedding 7 weeks ago all we have had is when you having a baby....and if one more person tells me my clock is ticking away...i will punch them!!!!We have told close friends and family,my husband has come to terms with it all,he's been through so much thankfully its made him a stronger person and open up more.
Well i'm off to Singapore on thurs for 5 days,i'm hoping when I get back we'll have some newsfrom the fertility clinic,I want to get the consultation over and done with so I no where we stand and our options!!!

Whats your next step?be strong for your husband,i'm always very positive around my hubby,he gets very down and frustrated over the whole thing so I try and be positive for him even though I occasionally want to burst into tears!!!

Take care

luv Angie xxxx


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hi girls,

Hope I'm not crashing your thread. 

I've been reading with interest about your DH's having small testicles (that didn't come out right, but you know what I mean ).  Anyway, my DH has small testicles as well.  He has normal size scrotum and everything else  When we went to the urologist they did an ultrasound on his testicles to see if they could see a blockage (varicosele, or something like that, I think that's what it's called.)  They didn't see any blockage and didn't really come up with any reason why his testicles were small.  It's very frustrating actually.  They also did a blood test to determine his karyotype, again I think that's what it's called and he came back as normal for that.  They did a hormone test and evidently his brain is telling his testicles to make this certain hormone that makes the testicles produce sperm but they just aren't doing it.  Sorry that seems kind of simple but it's been a while since we were there, almost 2 years, and this is the way I remember the doctor telling us.  

I'd be interested to know what tests your DHs have had done. It would be great if we could pool all our information and take it to the doctors and they could find a cure   I'm living in a dream world, aren't I.

Anyway, take care and speak to you all soon.

Love,

Angiexxx


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

HI Angie

it's a gorgeous day here today,  it must have inspired me as ive been quite the little housewife today making and freezing lunches for DP to take to work,  ive made 2 weeks worth  so freezer is now bulging.  he has choice of meatballs & spaghetti in a spicy tomato sauce,  chicken and chorizio in a tomato sauce,  italian ham & parmesan ravioli in a carbonara sauce.  also a caremalised onion and goats cheese tart and a spinach & feta cheese filo pastry parcel.

must admit to not having made the last two they are a sainsburys pop in the oven jobbie but they look and smell nice,  will send him with them and a nice caeser salad.  i even feel like tackling my ironing now.    OMG there must be something wrong with me......

we have said we aren't going to let this whole infertility thing rule our lives, and I must admit to doing my crying during the day when i'm on my own as I work from home.  I do try not to do it in front of DP  but sometimes it's very hard  and we have a few tears together.  

His brother & SIL are having a big family bbq  on saturday,  she has a very large family and their close friends are coming as well,  they have their first scan on Wednesday so i'm sure at the bbq theres going to be loads of talk about the pregnancy,  so i'm really not looking forward to it at all,  but we dont feel we  have any choice but to go as DP only has the one brother (they only live 15 mins away)  their parents live in Devon so a long way from  here and wont be coming up. so if we dont go he wont have any family there.  were going to stay a couple of hours and put on a happy face then make our excuses.

Newlyweds,  congratulations,  was it a lovely day,  how was the weather?.  wev'e talked about getting married for a while,  Dp's brother got married in february and he has always said that after that he would ask me, didn't want to steal their limelight.  then 2 days after their wedding we got the results of the 1st SA.  So now we dont know whats going to happen.

Ive just started 2 new businesses which i run from home doing website design and photography which although going well aren't making any money yet,  DP, has major debt problems and isn't able to get any credit so the thought of having to find and save money for fertility treatment and then to pay for a wedding and where on earth do  I get the money from to start saving for my daughter to go to university.  she's 13  so really it's going to be here before we know it.  PLus we bought our house 2 years ago,  weve had some decking built in the garden and have had a new kitchen put in,  but it still needs flooring and tiling and painting,  plus the living room is covered in wood chip and desperatley needs doing.

If you think about it too much it's very depressing.  

DP's chromosome thing could end up with him not producing testosterone or low levels and he could have to have TRT, however urologist says at moment his level is on the low side of the normal range and is ok.  I think they said 7 cant remember.  we have appt with genetisist  on friday morning to discuss the results of the karotyping.  We are waiting for GP to refer us to our local fertility clinic where we are going to talk to them about sperm donation and the possibilty of using BIL as known donor.

knowing now what DP's problem is I wish we hadn't left it so long before going to the GP,  but we were both aware we had weight to lose so were trying to do that at same time as ttc naturally.  hindsight is a wonderful thing as they say.

well i must go hang some washing out before the sun disappears and the rain comes

have a good day

becky x  oops it's a long one again!!!!!


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

HI angel

crash away your most welcome.  

the urologist explained the hormone tests to us in a similar way,

the hypocampus (i think) sends message to testicles saying make sperm and it should get message back when that it is done,  if it doesn't it continues to send another message saying make more,  this results  in a high FSh level.

Dp also had an ultrasound scan on his scrotum which has shown a small variocele, but because of the karotyping results it it irrelevant.  the karotyping showed he has XX sex chromosome.  men normally have XY and women XX.

the condition is called 46XX male syndrome, basically he is a man with normal male bits, but something happened during embryonic development which has resulted in his testicles not developing so which is why they are small and unable to produce sperm.
it's a rare condition affecting 1 in 20,000 men.    Ive only found one other couple on here who are affected by the same thing,

we have appt with genetisist on friday to discuss the implications and sperm donor is our only option.

what is happening next in your treatment, have the dr's discussed biopsies and things like Tese, mese etc to search for sperm.

becky xx


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hi Becky,

Yeah that's the test.  My DH has a high FSH level also.  His karyotype though came back normal; otherwise, same sort of situation to your DH.  

My DH does occassionally have sperm though, some days 1million some days zero.  We have had 2 ICSIs although they have both ended in BFNs.  But DH hasn't had to have TESE/PESA.  To make a very long story short we have recently found out DHs brother has zero sperm as well, even though we were lead to believe that his daughter was a biological one, turns out she isn't. They are due to be at the fertility consultation as we speak.  

We have imported sperm from the US in April before they changed the law so that you can't import sperm from a donor that has received financial compensation for their time.  So we will be having a DIUI in August or September.  We'd really like to have another go at ICSI and we were going to do a cycle 1/2 DHs sperm with ICSI, 1/2 donor's sperm with IVF, but we simply can't afford it.  £6000 for each cycle of ICSI, £600 for each cycle of IUI.  Unfortunately, it really does come down to money.  I suppose we could wait a while and try to save some money, but I just feel like everyday that goes by I'm getting older and older and our chances are going down and down. 

Anyway, it will be interesting to see if anyone else has a similar situation.

Take care,

Angiexxx


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

Hi Angie

isn't it awful when something that should be natural to achieve ends up coming down to money..

how interesting that your hubbies brother  has MF problems as well,    do the doctors think they have connected problems or is it pure coincidence?

How did you find out about hubbies brother.  is the daughter aware?

I must admit using BIL as a donor is definately the more attractive option when you consider the problems with numbers of sperm donors and the waiting lists in this country.

becky x


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hi Becky,

I've cut and pasted this next bit to save me from having to type it again.  I posted this on the male factor thread about 10 months ago after we got our second BFN.

'After our last ICSI so much has happened in regard to our treatment path that we haven't known whether we're coming or going.  We've been having a really confusing and difficult time with everything.  Family histories with regard to fertility have come out that have basically caused us to have to take a step back and realize that we've probably wasted along the lines of £10,000 on two failed ICSI's that probably had no chance of working, not to mention the absolute agony and heartbreak.  
About 2 weeks after our last failed ICSI one of my husband's adopted cousins revealed to us that her father (my husband's father's brother, DH's uncle) had a very low sperm count.  We obviously knew his cousin was adopted but we thought it was down to DH's aunt.  My DH's other uncle also has adopted children but again we were lead to believe this was down to DH's other aunt who had a hysterectomy 6 months after they were married.  We will never know if this uncle has a good sperm count or not.  
But probably the most shocking information is that my sister in law (DH's brother's wife) cheated on her husband 6 years ago resulting in our little niece, but then has lied about the fact that this little girl is DH's brothers for all this time.  She's only just been forced into telling the family because the other man threatened to out her to everyone if she didn't.  I can't stand the sight of her at the moment and DH's parents are making every excuse under the sun for her which I just can't believe due to the fact that she cheated on her son and has lied about the fact that this little girl is his.  They have been married for 16 years trying to conceive for all of those years and have no biological children to show for it.  Dh's brother has never had a sperm count(although I understand that he is having one soon) but all signs would lead to the fact that there is a problem there as well.  
Anyway, we were at Holly House on Friday to see one of the consultants.  We had a follow up after our last failed ICSI but obviously at that time believed that my husband's infertility was just a one off in his family so we thought it was necessary to go back in and see if there was anything else we should be doing.  It took us 6 weeks to get an appointment and in the meantime we've had the cystic fibrosis and y-deletion tests done both of which are negative.'

So we are definetely thinking that the fertility problem we are having runs in DHs family.  Until my brother and sister-in-law get back from the fertility doctor today we won't know exactly what is 'wrong' with my brother-in-law, but I'd almost put money on him having a similar problem to my DH.  My brother-in-law has already had a SA and he has zero sperm.

Angiexxx


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

Hi Angie

what a nightmare situation SIL put her husband in,  I suppose at the end of the day he has been the one that raised her,  gave her comfort and security,  that is what makes you a dad, although it would always be better to be honest about these things and to have let him have made the decision whether to raise another mans child as his own or not.  given that they now know there is a fertility issue on is side it may make it easier for him to accept.

It will be interesting to see if there is a thread of infertility that runs through your hubby family,  

becky x


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi Becky

Me again,having one of those days where I can't get anything done and keep spotting people out and about in the sunshine pushing prams!!!!
Well my wedding was fantastic...something I said I would never do...well not a big white wedding anyway....so there I was in my posh white frock walking down the aisle!!!I think the odd glass of champagne and rescue remedy helped with the nerves!!!It was such an amazing day that I will always treasure,we talked about cancelling our big day when we realized we were going to have to have fertility treatment,the cost of the wedding was bad enough without treatment too!!!I have to say I'm so glad we went ahead,it really kept us sane,it meant we had something to look forward to and something else to talk about other than tha baby issue.

soon as I realized we had a problem I started pumping any spare cash into a savings account,Xmas,birthdays etc I ask for money for wedding presents and alot of our friends that know our situation were very generous and gave us money for our baby account!!!we are gradually paying off the wedding bit by bit,it wasn't a huge wedding but still cost more than we planned (worth every penny),we went to Cornwall for our honeymoon,stayed on an organic dairy farm,being a trolley dolly the last thing I wanted was to get on an aeroplane!!
After the wedding I really had the wedding blues and when we returned from our honeymoon we had more tests then they told us what we had known for a while which is sperm donation!

Your job sounds interesting,I'd love to work from home,I do alot of drawing and keep getting told to make a career out of it,I'd love to but it won't pay the bills!!!I enjoy my job,I go to amazing places but now I'm married I want to be in one place,be normal for a change and bring up a family!I'll carry on flying til I have a baby or adopt,I can't afford to leave!!

Good luck with the BBQ over the wk end!my cousin is expecting her first,Ivf baby too,I was thrilled when I found out she was pregnant then got very down which I felt really bad about as she had been through alot herself!Alot of my friends are trying for there 2nd now,I feel very left behind!!we are similar ages and even though they all understand and are very supportive I feel excluded from conversation!!maybe I'm just paranoid!!I'm feeling sorry for myself today!!!

Well I hope I haven't bored you too much!!!I'm off to Singapore tomorrow get back on Monday so you'll have a breather from me going on and on!!!Its really amazing to read other peoples situations,its a massive help,I can't believe the amount of people going through IVF it should all be free on the NHS!!!!We won't get any funding!!!!

Good luck at the BBQ

take care

Angie xx

PS I think there are a few Angie's on this site...


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hi Angie07, 

Sorry I kind of comandeered your thread.  I hope I didn't upset you   Sorry if I did.  I had just been following your story from when I had first welcomed you to the site and saw that your DH and Becky's DH and my DH had some issues in common.  

Hope you are well!!

Angel129xxx

PS)  YOur wedding sounds gorgeous


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

Hi Angies 

your wedding sounded lovely. even before finding out about this we wanted to have a small initimate informal wedding  kind of like a garden party atmosphere.  but even that will cost a good few thousand which we dont have.


I think you should pursue the drawing if it's something you enjoy and have a talent for,  Ive been lucky that DP's salary is jut enough to allow me to be at home but obviously it's not that easy for everyone,  it is lovely to be working from home, I never ever believed i could be running my own business.

what kind of things do you draw?,  is it something you can start off in addition to your existing job.  we set up the website business for people like you that have a hobby where they want to make some money or a small business,  weve designed sites for a couple of ladies who are cat breeders and a lady that had decided to set up her own small consultancy business.

if you'd like any ideas just let me know,

enjoy singapore,  have you been before.

becky xx

have fun in


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## 4everurs (Nov 12, 2004)

welcome to ff


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Hiya girls,

Angie, going to Singapore sounds just what I need right now.  I'm glad you had a good time and 4 days off to boot   It's all sounding very glamourous 

I'm feeling really down today.          DH and I had our counselor implication meeting this afternoon with our clinic's counselor because we will be using donor sperm for our next attempt in September.  Well DH and I have been through so much since he was diagnosed as azoospermia about 2 years ago.  My mom had a stroke 2 weeks before our wedding 2 1/2 years ago and couldn't come to our wedding, my grandfather died 2 weeks after our wedding of alzheimers and he was like a father to me, 6 months after we got married we found out DH had very few sperm and we needed ICSI, after our 2 failed attempts at ICSI DH's brother's wife decided to tell the entire family, including DH's brother that their 6 year old daughter(and only child) wasn't his.  That she had an affair 7 years ago and didn't bother to tell anyone about it, even though she knew what we were going through and how this would affect our treatment, not to mention how it would affect DH's brother.  Turns out DH's brother has zero sperm and they have just started fertility treatment.  So we basically wasted £15,000 on treatments and tests we didn't really need, because it probably wasn't going to work.  

Anyway, DH very rarely tells anyone including me about his feelings, but decided that today when we were in front of the counselor talking about have we thought of every angle of having a child via donor sperm, that he would let it fly, and I mean let it fly  He has so much anger and resentment towards the NHS for not treating him based on the nature of his physical condition, the HFEA for making it so difficult for us to get ahold of a donor and having to pay them a fee each time we have a cycle, his sister in law for being a total b***h and a liar, and upset that we have to be 'judged' in such a way that people who are naturally able to have babies aren't, i.e. having counseling to see if we are fit to be parents.  Then started on about the fact that it's his fault that we can't have kids. I mean he went into one for most of the hour.  I felt really    for him and for us and it just felt that he's been keeping it all bottled up like he can't talk to me about it which    me a bit.  Well, the counselor was really sweet and listened to everything and told him that he was going to make a great dad, etc.  I was just so worried that she was going to say that we couldn't go ahead with treatment b/c DH was so upset.  

Top it off we are having serious financial issues due to paying for all this treatment and it is just sort of piling up today.  His parents are forcing us and I do mean forcing us to go on holiday with them and DH's brother and sister in law, who are the two people we would least like to spend a holiday with.  We cannot afford to go on holiday at all, whatsoever, but still need to rent a car and pay for hotels and food for 2 1/2 weeks in Canada and the US.    Don't know how we are going to manage it.  DH is looking into remortgaging to hopefully release some of the equity in our house. Doesn't help that Dh's brother is selling his house and land to a developer for £500,000. 

It's certainly not the best time to be paying for another treatment, but I just feel my biological clock ticking away everyday that goes by that I'm not pregnant. 

Sorry for the winge, but can't talk to anyone else about this that would understand.

Enjoy your 4 days off!!!

Angiexxx

Beckyb,  hope you are well!!


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Oh my go you poor thing no wonder you feel down,it feels as though these fertility clinics are playing wth our lives what with all the emotions and expense!!!Your poor DH sounds as though he poured his heart out today,my DH is the same,he's open about the situation but I never no what he is thinking,we had an almighty row a few weeks ago,it was awful but cleared the air,before we got married and found out why I wasn't getting pregnant he wanted to cancel the wedding!!!

How is your mum now after the stroke?Does your DH parents know what you are going through?a holiday to the USand Canada is not cheap!!I think i'd have to put my foot down and not go!especially also having to go with sis inlaw and bro!!!!The financial side of IVFetc really frightens me,why does everything always come down to money!!!We are still paying for the wedding but I have a seperate account thats been going since I found out that we will need treatment,my sis spent thousands on IVF and gave up her job as the stress was making her worse,luckily her husband earns more than what me and my dh earn together!!!

I know what you mean by clock ticking away!!!can I ask how old you are?i'm 36 and constantly get people at work telling me how my clock is ticking away and I should get a move on!!!!I want to scream at people sometimes,occasionally I tell people why!!

I think your dh keeping everything bottled up is very normal,my husband feels he has let me down which is total crap cuz i woudn't have married him other wise!!!Have you looked at going abroad for treatment?Spain is meant to be fantastic and cheaper,I went for an anual check up recently and had a chat to a lovely nurse who had recently been on a seminar on fertility with some top DR,she said Spain is the place to go to!!The Bridge clinic apparently send you to Denmark!!!I occasionally feel like jacking it all in and go for adoption instead ut if i know that if i don't even give it one go i'll be forever wondering.

I have to sign off now and pick my friend up from the station,please don't get down,I shall sign in again soon to check your ok

take care

I know how you feel

luv Angie xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


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## beckyb (Feb 27, 2007)

HI both Angies  this is confusing  lol

Angie(angel129)  personally i might be tempted to tell MIL what she can do with holiday, but then again probably wouldn't.  My mum hasn't been particually supportive about our issue,  maybe she is but I'm just expecting too much.  when I told her DP was Azoospermic her reply was  Oh well if you cant, you cant.  On the other hand DP's mum is fantastic,  so positive and supportive.  which seems weird as she was the one we worried about telling.  she suffers really badly with drepssion, her nerves, anxiety.  the smallest thing usually sets her off, but this she's handled really well.  It sounds like he really needed to get it out of his system, hopefully it will do him some good keep strong hunny... 

Angie 07  Like yourself, me & dp do talk about this whole issue quite openly but I'm never too sure I'm getting exactly how he feels and that he's keeping a lot bottled up inside.  I personally think you should give tx at least one go before deciding on the adoption route as you say  you could be left forever wondering if that one time might have worked.

well I need to go and take our puppy for a long walk, knacker him out.  we are off to BIL & SIL house tonight to discuss their offer to donate sperm.  what a conversation,  I feel sick at the thought with anticipation and downright fear.

How do we start this conversation,  they are really laid back and I suggested to Dp that we buy a porn mag ( well actually that he buys one lol)     and say here you go we got you this so you could start practising.    

wish me luck,  will post again once the embarrasment of tonight has passed


becky xx


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## Angel129 (Oct 28, 2005)

Angie,

Thanks for responding.  I'm 32 in July.  I know it doesn't seem that old, at least it doesn't to me, but as we've been trying for a baby for the last 3 years, and have been unsuccessful so far, I know how fast the time can fly.  Unfortunately, we're only given a short time to conceive in our lives and I just feel it fleeting away.

Luckily, my mom is fine.  She's 'only' 57 and at the time she was 55.  The doctors think it was like a freak accident sort of thing, but as I'm from the US she obviously couldn't fly that far 2 weeks after having a stroke.  

DH's parents know exactly what we are going through.  The most frustrating thing of all is that they have swept everything to do with SIL under the carpet, water under the bridge, ancient history.  I swear she has been exalted to sainthood.  If DH tries to talk to his mother about it, she just dismisses it and tells him he needs to forgive SIL.  We've tried to put our foot down several times about this d*mn holiday, but it's FILs dream according to MIL that we should all go together on holiday, for one last time.  They've given us some money to pay for the flights, but that doesn't include the car, hotels, food, attractions, etc...
MIL is always on DH about why don't we have any money, um duh fertility treatment   MIL tells DH 'Your brother can afford to go on holiday, why can't you?'  Um, BIL hasn't had to pay for fertility treatment, bought his house 10 years ago for £60,000 and is selling it for £500,000, etc... So his family really aren't helping our stress levels.  

We've definitely thought about going abroad, but I have to say I haven't looked into the costs.  DH doesn't do any of the research for the fertility treatment which really annoys me.  We've imported sperm from the US and will probably be doing a split cycle in September if a miracle occurs and we find a money tree, or catch a leprechaun or something.  We're in the process of trying to claim back our money from the banks, and may remortgage.  Hopefully that will free up some funds.  We'll see.

I know what you mean about adoption.  We haven't ruled that out yet, but DH wants to experience pregnancy and childbirth and having a newborn.  Where as I would be perfectly happy to adopt.  I've always had a dream of adopting a little girl from China, long before I met my DH, but he doesn't seem too keen on it.  He needs to realize that it's about compromise though. 

Take care hun.  Thanks for listening.

Angiexxx


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## Angie07 (May 30, 2007)

Hi other Angie

I too would love to adopt from China,I went to Beijing in feb,on the way back we had a couple bringing back their new daughter they had just adopted,she was so beautiful,10 months old,had been found in a box!!!They were a lovely family,already had there own child but felt they needed to adopt so went to China,took them 2 1/2 years!!!!!They told me to check out a web site called CACH.....children adopted from china,my DH and I talk about it alot but like your DH wants the experience etc also I think he feels he's let me down and I have the right to be pregnant etc!!!I have now got to the point where age is not on my side and know we have along way to go before any treatment will begin,I really want to adopt regardless of having treatment but know i cant do both at once,I also found out from Becky you have to wait a year before you can start the adoption prose's after fertility treatment etc It all wants to make me scream!!!All I want is to give a child whether its mine or adopted a lovely home and up bringing but there are so many obstacles in my way!!!Becky is right though I need to give Ivf ago or I will be forever wondering...what if!

Your mil sounds abit of a nightmare,my mil is slightly on the interfearing side!!!what is it with boys and their mums!!!She told my DH that its not meant to be!so we went through a patch where he wouldn't consider anything!!!almost broke us up,now he's the complete opposite and desperately wants a family!!!How many goes of treatment will you have before you call it a day if the worst comes to the worst and it doesn't work?my sis had 9 goes of IVF before she finally got pregnant,her story was in EVE mag last Dec,we cant afford 9 goes and will struggle with 1 go as we won't get funding!!

The whole thing is a nightmare,I'm going through a real patch at the moment where I can't see anyfurther than today!!!if that makes sense,I don't want to be in this position in 6 months time but no I probably will be!!!Definatly look at going abroad though,Iv got my fingers crossed for you for sept,it will come round quickly,my sis had acupuncture and swears by it,

Right I have to sign off now,my pal has been staying with me and i need to get her to the station,

Take care  

luv

Angie xxx


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