# Heart or head?



## Bubbles12 (Aug 29, 2012)

Hi,

In brief....

4th cycle and got my beautiful DS.

Earlier in the year, we decided to go once more for a sibling. Its important to me. OH is 20 years older than me, should he go before me, i dont want me being a burden solely on DS, care homes, Christmases, illness. I dont want it all on him
He also deserves a sibling, he has that personality that would bounce off another child in the house. He would really benefit from being a brother.

Anyway, we cycled in November and it failed massively. Only 12 eggs, 10 were immature and nothing fertilized. I put a complaint in to the clinic asking for a refund and they declined.
So, this is where we are at. Half of the last cycle went on the Credit card. 
We are in quite a bit of debt. We rent a house, not in a position to buy until we come into money (by that point, my OH could be deemed as too old) I dont have nothing nice for myself so much. We just about manage a holiday a year, DS always looks nice, doesnt miss out on anything etc...
But, we both want to try this once more. The clinic has told us what they will change and im pretty sure we will have a better cycle next time. 
It just means putting another 3K on our credit card and maxing it completely out. Money will be quite tight for a good while after.
So with this all in mind... i dont know what to do... 
I just think in 10 years, i wont regret maxing my credit card out... but in 10 years, i will regret not trying again...
Delaying isnt an option... im 34 and my egg quality has never been great plus OH will be 55 next month

Its now or never.

What would you all do?

Not 'its your decision' 

What would you do if you were in my shoes??

Thank you xxx


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## littlechicken (Nov 15, 2013)

Hi bubbles,

I think you’ve answered your own question - you would regret not trying. If you feel confident the clinic can do something different his time I would go for it too. I desperately want a sibling for my daughter for exactly the reasons you mentioned and I had such a special relationship with my brother that I would love her to experience that. All our treatment has gone into credit cards too. It doesn’t sit comfortably with me at all but neither did not trying. 

I hope it works out for you x


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## dumbwing07 (Feb 4, 2012)

*Bubbles12* - this is me right now, I had my son via IVF in 2015 on the NHS, now we are thinking of ttc #2 and it so hard to make the decision because we are afraid of the debt this may cause. Also I work part time and go to university so we are not in the same financial position that we were before DS was born. Maternity is the scary one for me. It was so tight before for us and now im only working part time. 
We are thinking of waiting until my education is over and i am back in full time work but this is 4 years away and I have just turned 30. It took 3 years to get my DS so the time worries me. 
I have made an appointment at the clinic I got pregnant with DS at and we are going for a chat in the new year. We have an appointment with the bank before this as our mortgage fixed term is up so we are hoping they can help us figure the finances out. 
End of the day, I really think you just have to go for it, I know I am debating this with myself too but ultimately i think we will end up just going for it and making it work if we get lucky again.
I am here if you want to chat! xx


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## Bubbles12 (Aug 29, 2012)

Thank you both... 

Im glad there are others that are in simular situations that are taking the route i wish to take.

Ive decided that im not happy with the clinics descison and have called them and said i want it looked into further. Ive told them either way, i will be doing another cycle there next year but i feel ive been scape-goated and the wrong information has been given from the consultants.

I have spoken to family and majority understand why i need to do this again, which helps but nevertheless, i will be a further 3k more in debt than i wanted 😞
Im feeling bitter against people i shouldnt... against fertile people that get to do this for free and i have to get myself in masses of debt just to get at the starting line with them. 😒

Im not going to find out until the new year, but they aint going to waver.... 

The only positive to come out of this is that we all know on my next cycle, they will be cautious and i will be cautious and asking lots of questions so i doubt the same will happen again.


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## Ali_123 (Mar 13, 2014)

For me personally, I wouldn’t want to end on a bad cycle when you know you can probably have a better one next time...it would feel like unresolved business. 

Sorry to hear that you didn’t get a refund 😢

Xx


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## Mochashosh (Jan 23, 2018)

I think if you would always wonder 'what if', and you've told the clinic you're cycling again, it may be worth a go.  However, consider what will happen if you're not successful AND you have a shedload of debt, which means less to spend on your son, and make sure you think about what you will do in that eventuality.

Is there any way you could get hold of some of the money without getting into more debt?  For example, would you parents be prepared to help you out?  Or even would you be comfortable with asking for money instead of gifts for Christmas?  You may not be and that's fine; it was just a thought. You don't have to say what the money is for if you haven't told people about assisted conception.

I always say this to people, and I don't know if it helps, but I'm an only child and I would not have it any other way.  I saw what my friends experienced with their siblings and I never wanted any of that.  I think there is a stigma attached to only children which is quite unnecessary.  

I do hope with all my heart that you are fortunate with your next try and that your lovely boy has a sibling, but if you don't, you will still have an amazing son who has a remarkably loving and courageous mother.


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## Bubbles12 (Aug 29, 2012)

Thank you

Ali - this is exactly my thoughts too. This clinic made my DS and i want to leave the clinic, not on a bitter note as im worried it will tarnish any thoughts of my experience there with my DS too, if that makes sense.
This is defiantly unfinished business.

Moch - im not too concerned about the debt if we are not successful if im honest... car payments end next November so that will automatically transfer to pay the credit card off. 
If i do get pregnant, whilst on maternity, thats when it will be sticky. Very sticky.
As said,  the reason i want a sibling for DS isnt just to grow up not being an only child (he has 2 brothers already, but they are in their 20's, im obvs not their mother 😂) its more for when i get old. That he has people around when im ill.
My dads girlfriend only had 1 child, now that childs dad is poorly, the child said to her mum how tough it was, as she was doing all running around and organising with no help etc. I dont want that at all for my DS. I know that having another doesnt guarantee it, but will defiantly give more or a chance.

My mum has no money and my dad, huh, well, he is very tight with money and has the attitude of 'your an adult now' so i wouldnt ask him. 
As for christmas, all gifts have been bought. My mum is giving us money which will go on the credit card. The OH siblings will give us vouchers, we give them vouchers... the most pointless gift exchange ever!
Im still toying with what to do... 
In the next year or 2, the car cant go up it as we wouldnt be in a position to pay... but..
It would only be sticky for 2-3 years.... after that, we will have sorted ourselves out. 

I hate this.... there are people close to me that fall in poop and come up smelling of roses every single time... (good for them)

Me... i fall in poop and come up honking of it...


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## Mochashosh (Jan 23, 2018)

Hello Lovely

I know what you mean about other people smelling of roses.  I feel like everything I do is doomed to failure.

But I think you really have answered your own question; if you really feel strongly about a sibling you have to go for it.  If your clinic was a bad experience would you consider a different one?

So sorry your dad is mean; mine was a bit the same, but he's in daddy heaven now.

I think the best thing you can do, regardless of whether or not you are successful with the sibling, is to make as much provision as possible for your old age so you can be independent and not have to rely on any of your children.  I know this can't always happen because of illness etc. but if you can keep your financial affairs in excellent order and keep your will up to date you will save your children a great deal of trouble.  I know this sounds a horrible thing to say when you're only in your 30s but I've been through my dad dying fairly fast with no time to put the finishing touches to his affairs, which meant a lot of work afterwards.  My mum is now 85, fiercely independent, runs her own business, and would sooner cut off her right hand than have me care for her if it were needed, which it most certainly is not.  She has made excellent provision for her welfare and safety, and my husband and I have Power of Attorney just in case.  Whether you have one child or a dozen, everyone should do these things, I feel.  Also, I must tell you that my cousins have been absolutely amazing support to me in times of difficulty, so having good relations with the nicer members of your extended family (forget the horrid ones) is invaluable.

I don't know if it's possible (or worth it) to cash in the vouchers.  At a pinch, you could buy something pointless with the vouchers and then return it for cash - but check the shop's policy first - some of them won't offer cash refunds but only credit, which won't help at all.

I don't know if this helps you at all (probably not), but in summary, if the debt isn't keeping you up at night and won't ruin these precious years with your existing son, and you feel very strongly about having a sibling, then go for it.  That way you'll know you've done everything you can.


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## bombsh3ll (Apr 19, 2012)

When I was doing IVF, my rules were that as long as I was medically fit, under 40 (who knows if I would have changed that with time, I know a lot of folks don't start until later on but I was 31 when I lost my fertility & started IVF the same year), could fund cycles by saving up/making economies/working extra/going without non-essentials but NOT getting into debt or putting our home at risk, & God was above me hearing my prayers, I would continue. 

If any of those things stopped applying, I would either stop temporarily or permanently depending on the circumstances. 

You mention your child having to care for you alone in old age - you can't think like that. Who knows what's around the corner? Infertile people with no children at all often worry about having nobody to look after them, but many fertiles with dozens of children are lonely and neglected stuck in care homes. You may go suddenly of a heart attack after a long healthy life, or get run over by a bus tomorrow. Or your child could emigrate & not give you a backwards glance. Also, thinking of their more immediate as well as long term future, getting into debt isn't a great thing to do. 

I'm guessing from your history that egg sharing isn't a possibility. One option that I would definitely have gone for had I known about it sooner is Embryo Adoption. It costs a fraction of the price of a full cycle, and generally the embryos come from batches that produced enough successful ones already for that woman/couple to complete their family, so that stacks in their favour. 

Back when I was doing treatment, Embryo Adoption cost about 2000 euros in Spain (travel etc would be on top but you could make a holiday out of it, you don't need to take nasty stim drugs or go through painful EC or risk OHSS etc, you would feel completely well). It wasn't common in the UK then but I believe it may be slowly taking off here too. 

I didn't find out that existed until I was preparing to go to Spain for DE, but if I'd heard about it from the start I'd have definitely done that before putting myself through fresh IVF. I couldn't have cared less about genes & in fact we tried post-birth adoption first before IVF but couldn't clear the impossibly narrow, high & continuously moving hoops required to qualify for that. 

I definitely wouldn't get into debt though or jeopardize your family's security. The fact is that most IVF cycles fail, & people end up losing their homes & in all kinds of trouble and still no baby at the end of it. I think that is even more of a consideration given you already have a child to provide for. 

I wish you the best whatever you decide and that your next try if & when you do is successful.

B x


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## Bubbles12 (Aug 29, 2012)

Thank you

Deffo food for thought there on both sides... im more baffled than ever.

I keep on having to remind myself that it is only an extra 3K. When we started this, i budgeted to max out the CC... we didnt do that... so when i look at it like that, we are only going over £1500 from the original budget.

Bombsh3ll... my first 4 cycles were egg share. We were going to do egg share again but my local clinic (who im with now) only offer up to the age of 32. And the next local clinic was going to cost us 4K so we figured we may as well pay the extra K or 2 and go to the clinic we wanted to go to.
For us, DE isnt an option, my eggs are still able to give me a baby (i think) and if they wasnt, i wouldnt want to go down that route.

I think with any option i take, there will be a level of regret there... but id rather regret something ive done, rather than something i havent. 

That said, this situation has completely stumped me and keep going back and forth... trying to weigh what is more important for my son, money, materials, holidays or a sibling, for priceless memories, friendship and potential security in later life.
Urgh, someone make it for me!


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