# Second IVF - reassurance needed!



## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Today I had egg collection for my second IVF. The doctor had lowered my FSH intake for fear that I would hyper-stimulate; as a result I produced nine eggs (as opposed to thirteen last time) though the clinic still seemed to think that was pretty good for my age (42). 

The difficulty is that this time round, my donor's sperm count is far lower.  They're doing ICSI right now. They say that all nine eggs are suitable for implanting but I won't know until tomorrow how many embryos - if any - I'll produce. The wait is killing me; what are the chances of producing no embryos at all and are they less likely to develop well or go into blastocyst than 'normal' embryos? Is it probable that we'll have nothing at all to work with? 

Also, why are the clinic not more disappointed, do you think about my producing fewer eggs? They keep saying 'quality not quantity' but personally I feel sad to have four fewer, despite my doctor's concerns that my blood levels showed some danger of hyper-stimulation. 

Would appreciate some insight or reasurance so I can sleep tonight!

Thanks a million (no pun intended)

S


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## TwiceBlessed (Nov 8, 2006)

dont know if I can help at all, being 38 I am crashing this thread........

I have only ever had ICSI and always less eggs than you.  (6,5 and only 3 -well 2 decent- for this cycle.

ICSI gives the best chance if you have lower egg/sperm numbers.

I really can confirm it is quality over quantity...having been given a 1% chance of ET while stimming...I only had one decent follie on day 7 of stimms.  I am now 29w pg

Wishing you all the best and hope someone else comes on with some better info for you x


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Thank you for your quick reply, and CONGRATULATIONS on your pregnancy!!!!

XS


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

Sally I would die for those kind of figures ...9 eggs is fantastic... Like EBW I had only two useful follies, sadly negative...  With 9 eggs I think you have a v. good chance...


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Well thank you! I think I'm just disappionted because A) His sperm count was 68 million before, 22 million the second time (reduced to just over a million post thaw) and B) I produced thirteen eggs the first time.

I notice that you've had a Create Health appointment. I am also with Create Health, who, as I'm sure you know, work in conjunction with the LFC. Are you considering a natural or low dose IVF with them? 

S


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

I am doing low stimms cycle with them on my request, although they did sugges a natural one...I think this may well be my last cycle so I wanted some stimms to see how I respond...I would be v. happy with 2 eggs tbh of good quality...  If I had 9, I would be on cloud nine and would cycle until I get a positive at the prices they have got... You have got a fantastic ovarian reserve and hence there was no reason for the clinic to be disappointed as most people they treat don't get that kind of response...


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Thanks....actually the clinic isn't disappointed at all; in fact, I've just spoken to Create Health who confirmed that they wanted me to have slightly fewer eggs than before because they think they'll be of better quality. Also, they've been worried that I have the potential to hyper-stimulate. So I feel better about that -- my biggest worry now is whether the sperm will do its bit to fertilize a good number of those eggs!

So are you basically pleased with Create Health? It would be great if Mrs. Norgand's theories are true, that lower doses are better for older women (less expensive too!)


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

In my opinion they are a bit overstretched, a bit like NHS in many ways, but can't fault the equipment and Dr Campbell is lovely... I didn't like being charged for the induction even though it will be deducted at the end and I didn't like the fact that they were v. slow in answering my queries and still haven't got the results of my dh's sperm sample and he did his bit over 3 wks ago...On the positive side they are not as greedy as other clinics and the place is intimate and cosy...


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Yes, I have some quibbles - ie they don't always get back to me as soon as they should - but after last year's treatment at the London Women's Clinic, I feel more valued. I like Mrs. Norgand; what she says about lower doses makes sense.

I see your situations are slightly similar in that I also had a termination with an ex partner nearly two years ago. Curious to know what you do next!

XS


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

By the way - seven eggs fertilized!!

Will know on Friday whether they're going for day three or five.


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

7 -  that's fantastic...  Gosh... You are so lucky... It's excellent...I think you are onto a winner....Well-done...       

You must have had good reason to terminate a pregnancy at 40... Good luck , Do keep us posted... 
Hope you can go to blast as better chance to pick a good quality embryos...  I think you are in with a v. .v. good chance....


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Thank you, and again I'm struck by some similarities in our history...I also was unsuccessful with clomid and had a biochemical pregnancy last January.

At least it sounds as though you are fertile. Were you not impressed with Terenisi? I've heard such mixed things. Personally I just can't possibly afford him, or rather, if I spent that kind of money I'd sooner go stateside where they stuff you full of embryos.

I'd be very interested to hear where you go next!


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

Sally - I think Taranissi throws everything he has at his disposal on people and it works for some people and doesn't for some others .. It didn't work for me.. I think my lining was partly to blame as it was only 5.7.  The clomid protocol thinned my linnig big time. Normally quite good.  I wish I hadn't done that cycle now...as could have done 4 of Geeta's and then I would have drawn the line... I think he does charge people too much.  My basic cycle was 8k... 1k for hysteroscopy on top + bloods 1.5 k...  It's still on my credit card and is a reason why I am financially challenged at the mo... 

My next step is egg donation as my ovarian reserve is not good.  This is if dh agrees bcs he is reluctant. 

What protocol were you on?  I am worried that buserelin may swithc my ovaries too much... A lady who is currently cycling with the Create had her scan this morning and had 5 follies, but only size 5 mm on day 7.  They were 12- 15 on her baseline scan.  Worried that I will have the same tomorrow when I get my scan.  Did you have any problems with buserelin at all? 

I wish you good luck with this cycle.... Fingers crossed... Join us on natural ivf thread - we are all at the Create Health...


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Thanks for that, that's really helpful. I'm very pleased to hear you say that about Taranissi; I'm sick of people saying that he's the best all the time! I actually know at least two people who haven't succeeded with him and I half wonder whether his clinic slightly invents reasons to charge people...more tests etc...

The Bussserilin had no side effects apart from possibly a bit of bloating; nor did the FSH. My lining has been fine so far though like you, when I was on clomid, my lining was thinner. I was seeing a very good herbalist and gynacologist called Trevor Wing who gave me ultrasound and showed me other various ways that the clomid interfered with my cycle; for instance, by producing cysts that disrupted my surge (or at least the monitor's ability to read them) in following months. 

I will check out the natural health thread - dying to find other people at Create Health!


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Oh I realize I didn't answer your question about protocol...was on .5 ml of busserelin, 150 iu of FSH (though she took me off it for the last day or so.) In total about ten days of stimming.


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

what dose were you on?  I am on 150 gonal F and 0.5 buserelin... WEre you on a higher dose?  Or is your response this good on the same dose as mine..?


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## Sally2 (Nov 24, 2006)

Same dose as you, yes.

So will you go for another do you think?


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## INCONCEIVABLE (May 1, 2007)

Probably not..


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