# 5th IVF/ICSI, no sniff of a BFP or a frostie... Where now?! Similar experiences?



## Beans25 (Feb 15, 2013)

Hi guys

Just had our 5th BFP in less than 2 years. I can't even describe how I am feeling just now. I know many will have asked  this and please point me in the right direction of other topics but what on earth do we do now?! And has anyone else out there been through similar?! I'm not 30 yet and am constantly being told that my history is surprising but I am totally lost! In summary, got our first and only natural BFP really quickly (2 months off the pill) in March 2011- got result day after we got married! It was ectopic and ruptured and I lost my right tube. Tried naturally for a few months but I knew that my other tube was in a bad way from endo so had our first IVF April 2012. Poor response but 2 good quality embies put back. 2 other embies not suitable for freezing. BFN. August 2012 changed protocol- good response. 8 embies, 2 good ones put back, none suitable for freezing.BFN. Advised hydrosalpinx -removed Septembed 2012. Terrifying- no other option but treatment now. February 2013 ok response only 3 embies. 1 good one, one not so good one put back. No frosties.BFN. May 2013 7 embies, 2 good ones put back, nothing suitable for freezing.BFN. July 2013-changed clinic. December 2013 5 embies, EEVA used, 2 high predictors, one lovely looking, put back. Nothing suitable for freezing.BFN. Can this really just be bad luck?! I'm really concerned that none of our embies are ever good - out of 28 we have made, 10 transferred and 18 perished. I've never heard of anyone else never having anything to freeze! Has anyone else had luck after 5 or more?! What did people do next?! Donor treatment? Immunes?! Gosh this is soooo hard!!!


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## Fingerscrossed7 (Feb 14, 2013)

Hi Beans25,
Sorry I can't offer any advice but I know exactly how you feel. Just had our 4th BFN. I feel devastated, like yourself I just don't know what to do. I am kind of losing all hope. Cliche but I have a physicall pain from inside literally feels like my heart is breaking. 
Didn't want to read and run but I can't offer any guidance as I am in the same boat. I hope other ladies have wise words for you. 
All the best 
Xxxxxxxxxx


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## Louisej29 (Nov 19, 2012)

Hi beans

I'm so sorry to read what you have been through.  It's heartbreaking this journey and each knock back just gets harder and harder.  

We've had 4 ivfs- 2 bfn and 2 miscarriages so not  much luck either.  I would definitely have your immunes tested if you haven't already. Some clinics dont recognise immune testing but someone like the lister in London would do this for you. also have you thought about having all the tests done with penny in Greece? Easily done by sending off sample of period blood ! Has your other half had all the sperm fragmentation tests? 

I'm sorry you haven't had any luck.  I would suggest all the tests- I think now we have had every test there is !- and a change of clinic.  We haven't given up on OE yet but starting to think about donor.  Would that be an option for you at all? 

Good luck and I hope all your dreams come true in 2014 xxxx


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## moobags (Nov 13, 2013)

Hi Beans

Sorry to hear about your bad luck in total we have had 49 eggs fertilise over 5 fresh OE cycles 8 of were blasts 2 were 3 dayers 1 day 2 and for our two FET's 1 frozen blast 2 two dayers we have had 5 chemicals 1 BFP ending in MMC on cycle 5 and two straight BFN's.

Our last cycle we went down the donor route and had three perfect blasts transferred which resulted in another chemical it appears that my lining is not great and that my body attacks the embies the only advice I can offer is to test for immunes apply for your medical notes and have consult with other clinics that specialise in patients who have had multiple cycles.

My GP was happy to carry out the thyroid function, blood clotting and liver function test I had to pay for Karyotyping, Hidden C, NK cells and Sperm DNA if you havent had any tests done I would go down this route I would also have a follow up with your current clinic and ask them the question with regards to your eggs.  I know some people struggle with going down the donor route but I got to a point where it seemed like the only thing we hadnt tried plus I just want to be a Mum.

I hope you can find some answers I think I would have given up a long time ago but I managed to get pregnant once so I just hope and pray I can do it again on my last ever cycle.

Moo x


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## Fingerscrossed7 (Feb 14, 2013)

Hi Moo,
How much did you pay for karyotyping, hidden C and NK cells tests? And we're did you get these done?
Oh also how long did results take?
Xxxxxxxx


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## Beans25 (Feb 15, 2013)

Thank you for your replies Fingerscrossed, Louise and Moo. It's nice to have people to talk to. Yes, the fact I have had a BFP is something I hold onto. The fact it was in the wrong place but implanted and grew makes me wonder whether it's my uterus that is the problem.

I'm definitely thinking immunes is the way to go next. I'm not sure what our clinics attitude to it is but will be asking. As for DE, it is something DH and I have talked and thought about at length. My view is that I would obviously prefer my OE but as you say, I just want to be a mum, and any baby would still be carried by me and have my blood running through it. We had thought after round 3 that DE might be our option so it is not something I wound have a problem with.

I'm going to look into all these tests. I've got my notes from my previous clinic too. And I concur with Moo, where did you get yours done?

Thanks again everyone, just feeling pretty rubbish just now.x


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## Pammie gee (Dec 16, 2013)

Beans25 said:


> Hi guys
> 
> Just had our 5th BFP in less than 2 years. I can't even describe how I am feeling just now. I know many will have asked this and please point me in the right direction of other topics but what on earth do we do now?! And has anyone else out there been through similar?! I'm not 30 yet and am constantly being told that my history is surprising but I am totally lost! In summary, got our first and only natural BFP really quickly (2 months off the pill) in March 2011- got result day after we got married! It was ectopic and ruptured and I lost my right tube. Tried naturally for a few months but I knew that my other tube was in a bad way from endo so had our first IVF April 2012. Poor response but 2 good quality embies put back. 2 other embies not suitable for freezing. BFN. August 2012 changed protocol- good response. 8 embies, 2 good ones put back, none suitable for freezing.BFN. Advised hydrosalpinx -removed Septembed 2012. Terrifying- no other option but treatment now. February 2013 ok response only 3 embies. 1 good one, one not so good one put back. No frosties.BFN. May 2013 7 embies, 2 good ones put back, nothing suitable for freezing.BFN. July 2013-changed clinic. December 2013 5 embies, EEVA used, 2 high predictors, one lovely looking, put back. Nothing suitable for freezing.BFN. Can this really just be bad luck?! I'm really concerned that none of our embies are ever good - out of 28 we have made, 10 transferred and 18 perished. I've never heard of anyone else never having anything to freeze! Has anyone else had luck after 5 or more?! What did people do next?! Donor treatment? Immunes?! Gosh this is soooo hard!!!


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## Pammie gee (Dec 16, 2013)

Hiya im new to this group, we had exactly the same throughout our treatment. We had three ICSI treatments in 2012 all three cycles we got two eggs put back in and each time we had none for freezing. This was so frustrating. We were very lucky on our third go at ICSI i fell pregnant and went on to have a little boy, the egg's that i got implanted in this cycle the clinic told me werent very good quality basically they were the best out of a bad bunch and this was the time the treatment went on to work. Dont give up hope its the hardest thing in the world and no one understands unless they have went through it. Try and stay positive i really hope it works for you next time xx


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## Louisej29 (Nov 19, 2012)

Hi girls

Re where to get testes done-----

I had hidden c , ureasplama and a few others bits tested at serum in Greece. They do a thorough test for about 170 euros. Think it's about 7 things they test.  Took about 2 weeks from when they received my sample ( you send them a sample of period blood!) 

Karyotyping and nk cells I had tested at lister.  That's more expensive.  Nk cells blood test was £550.00 and took a fair few weeks to come back but is worth doing to plan your treatment going forward. 

Good luck!

Xx


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## purplepeak (Jan 31, 2012)

Hi Beans,

I'm very sorry to hear about your experience.

As well as immunes generally, it might be worth thinking more specifically about endo. Endo can affect not only egg quality but also uterine environment. Some things which some doctors think are worth trying are:

1) laparoscopy to remove endo, eg from ovaries
2) medications to reduce inflammation which is caused by endo and which affects uterine environment. Some clinics - Dr Braverman in the US and Serum in Greece and perhaps others - are using a drug called GCSF for this. It is new and relatively unproven but those doctors think based on their experience that it can work. Also NSAIDs (non-steroidal anti-inflammatories) like celebrex. I understand you can consult with Dr Braverman alongside doing a UK cycle but it is hugely expensive. Serum is not expensive (4000 euro for two cycles, plus travel expenses and drugs, obviously). I'm cycling there. Serum would also advise you on whether laparoscopy is a good idea in your case. They usually do a free phone consultation before you have to go to Greece. 

There's probably more info on the endo board? Or on the Serum board if you're interested in following that up. 

Good luck!

XX


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## moobags (Nov 13, 2013)

Morning Ladies

The Hidden and the 7 Tests combined I had done through Serum which were approx £170 Karyotyping I did through my GP with referal from my old clinic this costs £150 for me and £150 for my DH the NK cells test cost £470.  The tests I had done free at my GP were: -

Thyroid Function Test
Antimulleriam Hormone
thyroid peroxidase antibodiesDay 2 tests which are: -Audrogen index
sex homone binding globulin
total testoerone

My advice would be to speak with your GP to see if they would be happy to do any tests for free it may also be worth emailing Penny at Serum and arranging a telephone consult it wont cost you anything and she will give you some great advice.  One other thing if you have your notes check back and see what thickness your lining has been mine has always be on the low side boarderline for transfer the only time I got it above 7 it got to 8.5 and that is when I became pregnant.

Hope you get some answers.

Moo x


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## pinkpixie (Jul 31, 2009)

I have 5bfns (mixture of fresh and frozen) but did get my bfp on our 6 the and final go. Out last cycle was at a clinic I trusted completely and I did have my immunes tested which showed a few issues so was on metformin, steroids clexane and intralipids. It was also the first cycle we had gone to blast. Also we had both given the vitamins and supplements we were taking a good 3mths to work. If anyone has a ny questions about what we did ask away
I honestly believed it would never happen for us and now have a 15mth old
Xxxx


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