# My life seems so pointless



## Ermey

Please help me girls, have got myself in a terrible state. I just can't see why I am on this planet anymore, or where I fit in. 

Most people seem to have a purpose, a role in life because either they are parents or they have a career. I have neither and just cannot see where I am going or why I am here. I can't tell DH because he will feel upset that my love for him is not enough to give me a meaningful place in the world.

I feel like I have no future. 

When we were told to stop tx I threw myself into my degree as a comfort, and a way of feeling like I had a purpose in life. Since I graduated in July I have been obsessed with trying to pursue my dream career in the arts sector. This has meant doing unpaid voluntary work, and seeking out work experience placements, most of whom haven't even bothered to contact me let alone offer me anything.

The place I have been volunteering part-time at for 18 months now, recently had a job come up, and I asked to see the job description. turns out they advertised it "internally" and have already filled the post. Even though I wasn't sure I wanted to apply I am gutted that after working for them for so long without any pay, I wasn't even given the chance to consider applying. On top of that the manager gave me a long and tactless lecture about how to get work experience and that I should be telling people what I want them to teach me etc etc (how do I know when I haven't worked there?!).

This small incident seems to have sent me over the edge. It has suddenly struck me like a smack in the face that my dream of having an interesting job (for the first time in my life) is just a baby-substitute, a way of constructing a meaningful place for myself in the word. It is so so hard to get a foot in the door of these jobs that I now feel like this dream is just like my dream of having a baby......complete fantasy.

I am feeling so awful today, like my life has no meaning, that I may as well not be here. Don't worry Im not 'suicidal' but the way I feel is that it would be quite a relief if I didn't wake up sometime soon.

I know that sounds melodramatic, but its not just about the stupid job thing, its just that I cannot keep picking myself up and dusting myself off and trying to believe in myself anymore, when there is permanently this empty space inside of me. I was trying to fill it with a good job, but now I see I am expetcing too much, that nothing will fill that hole which has been ripped open in me, and is about so much more than 'having a baby'....but having a value in life, putting something into the world that will never be the same again. 

Everytime i think I am better and feeling normal and positive about the future, I slip backwards again. The worst thing is that theres a feeling of guilt for feeling like this, like maybe I am just pathetic and weak, like maybe if I just 'pulled myself together' I would stop being so pathetic and everything would magically fall into place.

Dh doesn't completely understand (although he tries), and my friends have stopped asking how we are, and my family change the subject if I try to talk about it all. meanwhile I think I have been profoundly affected forever, that I have lost myself and will never again be the same person.

Sorry to be so depressing and sorry for myself thanks for letting me off load somewhere.


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## Ermey

Just popped back to say that after a big cry and cup of tea I feel better. 

Not great, but better enough to cope. Tomorrow is another day and all that.

Just wanted to update this thread with a less negative post.


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## LoisLane

Hi Ermey

Glad you are feeling a bit better, a good old cry an a cup of tea, always seems to do the trick doesn't it.

Well done on your degree, that is an amazing achievement in itself.  It does seem a bit unfair regarding your voluntary work placement that they didn't notify you regarding the job opportunity there.  I'm not sure which area you are gaining experience in, I presume it's very specialist.  Are there other companies you could contact locally, who may have positions available, can you gain a good reference from where you have been working to support any applications?  Just a few ideas, hope they help.

Louj x


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## Myownangel

Eermey,
I'm glad you posted this thread. You articulated what I have myself felt many times. When you said "I have lost myself" - I relate so well to that. Just because my recent post is optimistic doesn't mean I don't have times when I feel just as you do. It is like having the rug pulled from under your feet - everything has to change and you don't know where or how you are going to fall. 
Don't give up on your dream. I know the feeling that everything is 'baby substitute'. That negative idea can pervade our thoughts, making everything look and feel like a waste of time. But it isn't. Even just posting here is a worhtwhile thing - you helped me! 
It sounds a bit of a cop out - but in time you might be pleased that you weren't offered this particular job. There may be something better out there for you. 
I think you need to do something that is just for you - that way, no one can invalidate it or take it from you. I create artworks - mixed media 'things' that aren't at all accomplished. But they mean something to me and to hell with what anyone else thinks. 
There is one lady I know who is a crochet wizard and she makes those little blankets that they give to women to wrap their stillborn babies in. I think that is amazingly worthwhile - such a small thing but it made a huge difference. I just mention this as an example.
I don't know what you are in to - or what would appeal, but I bet there is something.
And don't feel guilty about set backs - we all go through them (witness my melancholy posts). And I know how hard it is to get back up again - but we do. And we MUST be stronger people for it. Thanks for posting.
Bernie xxx


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## NuttyJo

I just wanted to give you a hug as im feeling exactly like this right now. I hope things improve for you hun


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## wishing4miracle

i often feel like this and want to say youre not alone.i feel as if i get up go to work,come home,go to bed and thats it.i dont have any friends outside work and i dont go out.well the only places i may go is over to my or dh parents.big deal.ive got a job i dont like and i got no friends.i often feel i have no meaning apart to work and to be with dh.i cant go do things i want to when i want o,i dont like socialising coz i have no confidence,we cant have kids naturally and do what the norm do.nothings ever easy.

big  

hayley


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## Yamoona

Ermey please no apologies for posting how you feel. We can all relate and have all had the same thoughts at some point. Maybe your degree put your grieving on hold and now it is all over the process has begun. You have achieved so much, and I can totally understand the 'where do I fit in' comment. I have definitely felt that on more than one occasion but like you say tomorrow is another day. Might be time to volunteer for someone who appreciates you a bit more. Have a look round and see what you can find.

LOL
Yx


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## Anthony Reid

Sending you big hugs Ermey. (and a little present)

Tony
x


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## Ermey

Thank you so much for your kindness everyone. Feel rather wobbly still, and cried again on poor old DH when he got in. Feel very weepy and its not even PMT for once.

So comforting to know others understand, and to feel that I can let the feelings out here. Lots of things you have posted have struck a chord. 

I know my degree was a massive thing to achieve especially as i did it while doing 4 particularly distressing ICSI's. The fact that this doesn't feel enough perhaps is just another symptom of childlessness. It makes life so complicated, as you say Hayley, and yet its so hard to articulate why.

Yamoona, thanks for your concern and thoughts about the grieving process, I wondered this myself. i am aware that I have done lots of grieving, both during my degree and after, but wouldn't be surprised if it was made more complicated because of the degree. i struggled so much at that time. 

Tony...... awwww thanks! Your such a sweetie.   


love to all


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## janeo1

Ermey 

If only pulling yourself together was so easy!    I'm so sorry you are having a tough time lately, the work thing was shoddy treatment, not surprised you were upset I would  have been livid. Would definitely think about volunteering somewhere else if I was you.  I think your comment about been profoundly affected sums up the horrid legacy of IF. Yet despite it all you have achieved a lot, and will continue to do so. Chin up chuck better days to come.  

Jane x


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## Natalie01

Wow! Are we twins  Snap and snap.  I was diagnosed with Turner's Syndrome when I was 16yrs old-baby dream over. 
I am also a recent graduate (an actress) and I know what it is like to have one door slammed in your face and then to struggle to get through another one with yet more rejection.  It is hard to focus on a dream when it seems so far away.  Many thanks for your post, it has really made me think that it isn't just me. Nice One FF!!!!!!


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## emcee

Hi Ermey

I'm sorry that you are feeling so down at the moment. As the other lovely wise folks have said, its not easy this journey, and there are many slippery slopes along the way and back to being overwhelmed with the onslaught of emotions. Lets face it, IF is a *massive* thing to deal with, and I firmly believe it affects every single avenue of our lives, no matter where we are in the world or what we do. Its isolating, its traumatic to go through, its traumatic to _live_ through, dammit!

You have pushed yourself so hard in your personal life honey, perhaps your emotions are coming to the fore now to grieve a bit because you have a wee bit more time to yourself than you did when you were studying to do your degree. I am so awed by you being able to achieve all that you have done whilst going through gruelling treatment as well - no mean feat, what an amazing and inspirational lady you truly are!

I'm also terribly saddened to see that you feel you have no-one to talk to amongst your family or friends. As if you didn't feel knocked back enough, huh?  IF is something that often makes us re-evaluate, I know I found comfort from the most unexpected sources, and coming here was one of them. I sincerely hope you can find some comfort and support from us here too.

Your post rang so many bells with me, I have often wondered where I fit into the big wide world now that the role of motherhood is not something that I will ever fulfill - and I'm still battling away at a crap job as I haven't found alternative employment yet! I know that there is more to me, to all of us than pro-creating, its just so bloody hard when its all you ever wanted and dreamed of and its cruelly snatched away 

Do not think you are pathetic or weak for slipping back again honey, did you know this is also a part of healing and grieving? That it is commonplace to be brought back to square one again and again? These setbacks happen to all of us honey, why a few weeks ago I was in pieces because one of my friends the same age as me had gotten pregnant and was taking it all for granted and I had the usual 'it has happened for her it could happen for you too' [email protected] from mutual friends (which hurt more, felt like they had never understood what I have been through or why it won't happen for me - must I spend the rest of my life explaining I have no plumbing 'down there')! My friend does not have nor has ever had any IF issues either, don't get me wrong shes lovely, it just hurt because it slapped it home to me that it will never be me!

Turns out it was that time of the month for me when I usually feel at a low ebb, and that I just needed to remove myself from the pillocks who had upset me for a few days until I got my head around things in my own way... and after many cups of tea (I do love my cuppa) and solitude and quiet chats with DH I found my 'mojo' once again... and coming on here helped, even though I didn't write about it at the time - I couldn't articulate my thoughts to be able to say what I wanted to be honest!

The same Ermey is there - although she may be tinged with sadness and sometimes a little more sombre, she exsists... shes just been through an incredibly difficult time and she needs the support of her FF here to bolster her for a wee while.

Imagine us all holding you very close Ermey honey - see how many people you have helped just by writing about how things are for you? You are not on your own!

With much love and a massive squeeze
Emcee xxx


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## Myownangel

Emcee said it right - we   you Ermey! Sending you lots and lots of love and a big cuddle 
Bernie xxx
P.S. I love Emcee's use of the word pillock - haven't heard that in ages. Very accurate usage...


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## Megan10

Oh Ermey,
I am so sorry that life is feeling particularly hard at the moment. You have every right to be angry at the way you were treated. That degree was such an amazing acheivement and you did it at a time when you had every right to curl up in a corner after all you had been through.

I agree with others that maybe its time to find another opportunity. I am not sure what area of the arts you are pursuing? Another practical thought might be to share up front with this current place or a future place that you would like to get certain experiences during your time with them. How about asking for regular feedback review sessions to plan what will be the focus for the next few months, who can coach you on specific topics and what you can do to be considered for a permanent post. Just some ideas, more than happy to help you build a plan if that would help. I would suggest its important that in your volunteering there is a win/win for both sides. 

Grief is such a personal thing that I would not dream of advising you. However I would say from my experience that it needs time to come out, be recognised and allowed to wash over you. Once that happens you can start to work through it better. I resisted for a long time, hid behind work, tried to block it from my mind but eventually I had to let it happen. I feared I would plunge into a big dark hole, totally unable to function but it wasn't like that. With the help of a good counsellor I explored my grief and my fears and it helped more than I can say in reaching a degree of acceptance and feeling better able to move forward. 

One final thing I wanted to share was that my counsellor helped me to see that I was still me with a right to grow and be fulfilled and happy doing whatever rings my bell! One of the most useful suggestions she made was to take some of that spare nurturing I had ready for my children and use it on myself for a bit. 

I originally saw myself as having a big gap in me which should have been filled with motherhood. Now I see myself as complete as I was before I even considered children, no gaps or holes and in the centre of my life. Around me are all the relationships that are important to me; my DH, family, friends and I can reach out and touch each of them and make an important connection. Sadly there is one relationship I will never have and that is with a child, my child. Despite that I am still a whole, complete person who maybe has some spare capacity to reach out to other children or friends or to acheive other things in my life. After all, my parents found fulfillment in having a child and nurturing that child to be her own happy, fulfilled person. I want to find a way through this sadness and do just that. Life can't just be about always creating the next generation as you way of feeling purpose.....like a perennial hamster wheel. It won't be the same life I would have had if I had been able to have children but it will be a full life. I have no idea if this is helpful but it has been a real breakthrough to me.

Ermey, you are such a strong person and you will get through it but a very wise lady I met on Meredith's workshop shared her enormous regret that she had pushed her grief aside for 10 years and it was still just as strong and bad. She encouraged me not to make the same mistake and although it took me months of fighting with myslef to get the courage to jump I am eternally greatful to her.

Thinking of you hun,
Love MeganXX


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## Ermey

Hello again lovelies.  

Feeling calmer today, though slept badly and feel quiet, thoughtful and still fragile. I was talking to DH yesterday and realised that part of why I had got so upset was because the whole thing had shown me to be still very fragile, and that it took me aback as I have been telling myself how well I've been doing. It was like a flashback to the height of my bad times...You know how you can just tick along thinking you're doing ok, and then the smallest things can tip you off balance, into an abyss.

Emcee and Megan, your comments on the grieving thing are interesting and helpful. Thinking about it I have definately been blocking it in my attempts to get some normality back. If I think back to this time last year, if i had a bad or sad day where the grief wanted the best of me, I would just let myself cry all day if needed, and allow myself a day of being a hermit (away from the pillocks  ), and I just accepted this was what I needed to do, even though it hurt. Recently though i have been pushing the bad and sad feelings away in a determined effort to try and live my life. I guess maybe its backfired on me eh?
I guess this comes back to your comment Emcee that going "backward" temporarily is all part of the normal process which i knew but I think I was trying to avoid it happening. Megan I really recognise your fears of opening up a black hole of grief. But I certainly don't want to feel like this in 10 years time, so thank you for your encouragement to try and face it. (gulp...where to begin?).

Its been comforting to hear of the rest of you who are unfulfilled in your working lives...Its weird though isn't it? My mum gave up work in order to bring up her five children, and she has always felt devalued by society for 'only' being a mother. Meanwhile the childless feel devalued for not being mothers! It makes you wonder what kind of mixed-messages society feeds us. 

I m going on holiday in 10 days tim, and when i get back I think i will resign from the vol work where i am. Perhaps my quest to get a job has been a way of trying to look out for myself but I think I need to be a bit gentler on myself and do a bit more self-nurturing.

Megan - I love the idea of using your nurturing instinct on yourself. But how have you gone about doing this?? I have so much love to share which is why it is so painul but I never thought of turning it inwards.

You guys are just the best, i can't tell you how much you have helped.

E  xxx

P.S natalie - thank you for your post, is comforting to know I'm not alone out there in the post-uni limbo!


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## emcee

Ermey

Just wanted to send you my love and to let you know that we're holding you very close at this moment in time...

xxx


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## Yamoona

Giving up your job sounds like a good idea as it will open up new doors that you might not have seen if you stayed.

I am glad you feel better today, I have had a bad few weeks too. Been feeling the same way as you have. Last night I went to see a friend who has 3 beautiful children, a good looking husband, great house, loving family etc. We used to be really close but over the years I have become a member of the outer circle and not the inner. I had to listen to her complain all evening and at the end of it I realised she had not asked me once how I was. I walked away feeling really depressed and a failure and have felt like it all day today. Why do I put up with this you may ask. Well I have been asking myself that same question all day and I think it's because if I walk away I have no link to my 20's. Silly I know but I feel lonely enough as it is and with no close family having people that have known you a long time feels like a comfort. But I feel that maybe the reality is they still think of me as a 20 year old and therefore treat me like one and that is not healthy. 

Previously I have felt that I was doing ok and yet here I am grieving again, it never ceases to amaze me how many times you get a new whack of feeling like this. I am due on next week so don't think that is helping. I just need to have more confidence in myself and like myself more and maybe then I will find my place in this world. One thing I know is that no matter how much I fantasise, a baby is not going to do that for me.
xx


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## Ermey

Oh Yamoona, hugs to you  

It seems that one of the key features of involuntary childlessness is to make you feel on the outside, over and over again. Whether its at uni, in the world of work, or among our closest friends and family, there it always is to bite us on the bum, that we are in a different space to others. we are alwas searching for something that makes us feel part of it, and not forgotten.

So often the people we care about most, who we thought know us best or longest accidentally make us feel alienated. I think maybe people are blinkered by nature...that now they aren't constantly reminded by us via clinic appointments and pregnancy tests etc they sort of forget that for us it never goes away completely.

This is the place where I always feel on the inside, and not the outside, and I love the image of a circle of girls (and guys   ) protecting each other.   

Big hugs to everyone, as I can see that we all share the same worry that started this thread, that of belonging in this world.

xxx

P.S Emcee, thank you hun, it really does help. x


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## flipper

Reading through I'm glad you're starting to feel a bit better Emery.

Speaking as one who chucked in her job last December with nothing to go to I can only repeat what one of the wise ladies here said "jump and the net will appear". It did in my case and I'm sure it will in yours.

I'm sorry that you have nobody you feel you can voice your concerns to, I was in a similar position, I love my family and friends, but somehow, I couldn't bring myself to talk about my doubts for the future. How on earth were they to understand the "why am I here?" question when they all had kids? 

Splash loads of that wonderful nurturing instinct on yourself and your dh and explore life, it can be wonderfully rewarding.

As to what's your role or purpose in life, in my opinion (for what it's worth) is to be you. Just plain, wonderful you, degree 'un all. Never sell youself short Ermey, life is a precious thing as you're as entitled to just as fulfilled one as someone with six kids.  However, like a number of the other ladies have said, I sooooo recognise the emotion. I said in front of somebody about 2 years ago now and said just the same thing. 

Enjoy your holiday and I hope you come back refreshed and ready for what ever comes your way.

Love

flipper


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## Myownangel

Ermey - I love the idea of a 'circle of friends' - drink a toast to that ! And Yamoona - I think your 'friend' sounds awful. Maybe you need to limit the time you spend with her. I can understand why you wouldn't want to cut her off completely, but just make sure that you see her when you are feeling strong. I have some people in my life like that - it sounds awful, but these are people who sap me and never ask how I am, always complain about something or other and are a total drain. Of course they do have good points - but I have to limit my exposure. When feeling vulnerable I make sure I surround myself with positive friends. I know it isn't always possible to be in control like this - but it is something worth thinking about. I know things have been better since I made the decision to do this.
At least you can come here knowing that you will be supported and never judged. This board and the ladies on it are a life saver!
Bernie xxx


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## ULTRA

wishing4miracle said:


> i often feel like this and want to say youre not alone.i feel as if i get up go to work,come home,go to bed and thats it.i dont have any friends outside work and i dont go out.well the only places i may go is over to my or dh parents.big deal.ive got a job i dont like and i got no friends.i often feel i have no meaning apart to work and to be with dh.i cant go do things i want to when i want o,i dont like socialising coz i have no confidence,we cant have kids naturally and do what the norm do.nothings ever easy.
> 
> big
> 
> hayley


Dear Hayley,

I was so sad when I read this posting of yours saying you don't like your job and you have no friends outside work. Maybe this is partly the cause of your unhappiness and desperation to be a mum, but a child can't and should not fill that specific void in your life. I believe you'd have much better chances in succeeding with your treatment if you were happier with the rest of your life. Why not research some old friends from school via www.friendsreunited.com or improve your chances of finding a job you really like by learning new skills. 
A friend of mine hated school and left with 2 GCSEs (D and E) to get married and to work in a supermarket stacking shelfs. After years in that dead-end job she was so bored she actually missed school! She enlisted in an evening course at her local Tertiary college to repeat her GCSE Math and English. It took her 2 years but she passed with a B and a C. This gave her confidence to do another course in Design, sth she always was interested, but never thought she could do it as none of her family encouraged her.
To cut a long storey short, she eventually gained an HNC in Interior Design and now works part time for a large department store as she fell pregnant naturally during her final year at the age of 32 after trying unsuccessfully for a baby for 6 years.

There is only one person who can turn your life around and change the things that don't feel right - YOU! You are young, healthy and have a husband that loves you. This is more than a lot of women have and it should give you confidence to find a hobby, meet likeminded people in a course, etc. Small steps still move you forward. There are grants available if money is a problem. If there is nothing in your local area, go and visit the nearest library or google the Open University (you need no previous qualification to start studying with them).

Please don't get me wrong I don't want to tell you what to do, just some suggestions on how to become a happier person as you sounded so desperate.

All the best, -ULTRA-

This post contains an unconfirmed link and readers are reminded that fertilityfriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


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## VT

Ermey

I am so sorry that you are going through this at the moment. Have you thought that the place where you volunteer didn't give you the job opportunity because why would they want to pay you when they are getting your skills and brain for free right now? I don't suppose they will think that you will leave because of it. As long as you are getting what you want from the experience it makes sense to stay, when you aren't then it is time to move on.

Flipper,

I truly hope that your 'jump and the net will appear' philosophy is true cos I have just jumped!! I decided that I can't stand it working here any longer and that I should leave. I finish on 6th December and after that I will be unemployed for the first time in my life!! Or should I say that I will be 'self employed' as I am thinking about setting up my own training and development consultancy! Part of me thinks I must be completely mad, but what the hell? Nothing else has worked out they way I wanted despite working my butt off for years so I figure why not?

Yamoona,

I too have a 'friend' like yours. One I have had for 20 years and over this last year or so she has been drifting away. I keep trying to keep our freindship going and to keep in contact, but I think it is finally time for me to let it go. The final straw came last week when I called her on the way home from work, to spend nearly 40 minutes on the phone listening to her tell me all about her life and problems. I think if I got 10 words out Iwould be exaggerating and those were only to say oh no, poor you, what happened next. Her phone apparently ran out of battery and she cut me off with the promise to call me back. She hasn't yet! and at no point did she ask how I was or what I am up to. In fact she has no clue of anything that is happening in my life at all and earlier in the year when I texted her to tell her our last tx had failed, she didn't even respond, then she didn't send me a card or anything on my birthday and when I challenged her about both she said... for the tx that i had no idea how hard it was for her as she didn't know what she could say to me and therfore chose to say nothing, and about my b'day that she didn't know what to get me so she got me nothing!

Reading this back has just made me realise that I need to let it go and move on! God what am I doing even thinking of trying to keep in touch with her?

I think you are right when you say it's about hanging on to the past, like it will affect our futures. It won't I know, I'm just not sure I can cope with grieving for anything else right now.

May be that's what I need to allow myself to do when I finish work. Grieve for my lost children, lost friends and lost dreams and then figure out what happens next.

Bernie how right you are when you say

"At least you can come here knowing that you will be supported and never judged. This board and the ladies on it are a life saver!"

Not sure where I'd be without you all.

Bless you.

VT
xxx


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## Megan10

Ermey,
I have been thinking about you alot since your post and hoping you are finding a way forward. It sounds as though you have made plans about your job and that is great. Plus I hope your holiday will help.

You asked how I have managed to direct nurturing on myself? Well I have got work to agree to a 4 day week so DH and I have more time together (we have a business to run on Saturday and then take Sunday/Monday weekends). I sit in cafes and drink CAFFINATED cappuchino, grow vegetables and love collecting everything fresh from the garden just before I cook it. If needed I take time off work to be sad or see a councellor. Last night DH and I walked in the crisp autumn evening unil it was almost dark. I am starting to explore my creative side, making jewellery, looking at sculpture or glass fusion next. I am thinking of turning a spare room (you know the one) into my workshop. They are all little things but anything that makes the day feel good and raises a smile is fine by me. Somehow they feel like tiny steps towards my future. 

Do let us know how you are Ermey. We go back so far on these boards that I am always glad to see your name apear! 
Love and hugs MeganXX


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## Ermey

Hi Megan  
Thank you so much for your lovely words.   We do go back a long way don't we! I agree, it is nice to share this stage with an old FF, although I would much prefer we weren't having to be here of course!

I am feeling a lot better this week thanks. I think this is a lot to do with the fact that on Saturday we fly to NZ to visit my little sister for 3 weeks.  
This has given me 'permission' in my own head not to job hunt this week, and therefore I have not been thinking about the long term future too much. I suspect I might have awful post-holiday blues on return when i have to face reality again, but for now, I need my holiday more than anything else!

Thanks for sharing th ways in which you "self-nurture". I'm so glad you've been able to arrange proper "weekends" so that you can have quality time with DH. So many of our friends with kids seem to really envy our couple-time, and we have capitalised on this in trying to look after ourselves. We tend to take long country walks at the weekend and often in places that aren't particularly local, and sit up late watching films, and every so often we splash out on a going to the theatre or up London to an art exhibition. And most especially we have treated oursleves to child-unfriendly holidays in long-haul destinations. 

I smiled at your description of sitting in cafes drinking CAFFEINATED coffee!! I can SO FEEL your pleasure at not having to worry about the caffeine etc! Since DH and I stopped tx I think one of the biggest consolations has been not having to worry anymore about what we eat or drink. We were SOOoooooo desparate at one point we were utterly painfully conscious every single thing tht passed our lips. We were ardly drinking caffeine, and we didn't have an alcoholic drink for a good 18 months. 

In contrast this year I have probably drunk more in total and been tipsy on more occasions than any other year!  

Intersted in your spare room/workshop plans, as I had exacly the same marked up for ours as I would really like to take up some art again. We are the worlds worst decoraters though so it may never happen.

Take care xxx


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## wishing4miracle

ultra-just seen your post to my response.on leaving school i went to college for 3 yrs and gained gnvq art and design in intermediate and advanced at merit level,also gcse photography which i passed.life has its ups and downs and nothing can change that.me and dh discussed having children before we were even engaged so we know where we are.we thought it would be so easy having them but sometimes it doesnt always happen that way.its good in away that we found each other because we both have problems in fertility.i hope we get there one day but if we dont we dont .theres nothing that can be done.we are young and can wait for afew yrs yet.i know i dont have friends outside of work and i dont see anyone but at least i have my dh and family.and also my ff friends on here.i lead a sad life i know but nevermind.i havent had any friends since school i supose.

ermey-how you feeling now.hope things are getting better for you.


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## Myownangel

You don't lead a sad life wishing4miracle - and don't let anyone make you feel that way. It's not so easy making friends after school and college and lots of us socialise with workmates. Also oing through the infertility thing I know I've lost friends through this - cos they were insensitive or had babies and I couldn't cope with that. So don't worry too much about it - you're doing the best you can - and that is way good enough. (((HUGS)))
Bernie x
P.S. I'm your friend....


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## wouldloveababycat

Can def empathise with your posts hun ..hope you find the strength to follow a slightly different path but one that still brings your much happiness x
Cat


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## ULTRA

Hey what a coincidence, your GNVQ in Art&Design is a great stepping stone you can build on while you wait to become a mum. Why not enlist for a part-time HNC in Art and/or Design? This will give you sth positive to focus on, you'll make new friends at seminars and a fantastic qualification on the way to a better job while you can still try for a baby.Good luck!

ULTRA


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## emcee

Hmmm... sometimes, when infertility has sapped the strength and confidence out of us I don't necessarily think its the best time to be planning to do something else with your life to be honest!

Emcee xxx


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## caz nox

Hi, 

Gosh - I could have written your post. 

When I first met my husband many years ago he asked me what my dream was in life.....since the age of 16 I had only ever wanted to be a mum, he laughed at me. But now, he knows what I mean. 

I am not close to my mum - can't stand her and I wanted to be able to make sure I was a better mum than her! 

I often tell my husband that my life is poo and I cannot see the point in anything. I only work to pay the bills, I do not want to be here, but I do not know what else to do. My husband is distraught when I say that. 
I do have a special friend who does listen to me - she tells me to stay positive, but it is so hard too. She really does not understand - she has two perfect girls, but she tries her best. 

I lost faith in my family (not my immediate they are great) but my cousins and auunties and uncles - not one turned up for my sons funeral. 

I know that the only thing that would make me better is to have a child. Even my counseller agreed with that but we are doing all we can to achieve that. 

Anyway - I have a long road ahead of me and I want to fight all the way until my body and bank tells me when to stop. 

You are not alone in your thoughts. 

Carrie


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## bell

Hi Ladies

l have just read though all this thread and think everyone is spot on we all have something in common, 

l never had my family with me, due to not having a very nice childhood due to things happening to me that i could not do anything about, but when i did  my mom hated me for it and everyone followed, so l was not a good girl at school possibly due to family life at the time but l walked out of school at 15 years old no CSE nothing, but l also said that l would have children when i was ready and love them uncondtionally always be a proud mom and stand by my children 100%, when your young you dont think about not ever having children  and the heartbreak you have trying to have them, l kept saying to myself am i getting punished for something i did in my past life or am i getting punished for getting justice 

We decided november 2006 that i should leave a very stressful job nothing that held a career or anything but l could not cope. now l am at home all day all on my own until dh comes home, but l have decided to start my own business, as no l am not so sure i can cope going bk to a office enviroment, l like my own company so we are starting this in the new year, 

but i will be honest at the moment l am crying more now than i did jan 2007 and l think i am still fragile and find things hurt me more as realisation is now hitting home, because  all the love l have is not going to be given to our child, l hope this makes sence to everyone l am going on and on sorry but l just wanted to say that when i read everyones thread the biggest thing that stands out to me is that we all feel the same and we are all in the same position as each other and we all hurt as much as the other one does, and we think the same as we are all dealing with the same things , and on  a personal note from me l need you guys your the best thing that has and still is to me, please do not stop because if we did not have each other on this thread where would we be,


bell


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## VT

Bless you Bell. 

You are not being 'punished' it is just something that happens and I am so sorry that IF is something that has happened to you.

Starting a business sounds exciting. I am going to do it too in the new year. I finish with my job at the start of December so it looks like exciting and rewarding times are ahead of us both.

I also think that the fact you are crying more now just means that you are letting it out and that can only be a good thing. I know that when the pain is too much I hold it in and just get through the days and it is only when it starts to ease from that gut churning point that I can actually cry. Perhaps the same for you?

You take care of yourself and know that we are here for you.

Love

VT
x


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## Myownangel

Dear Bell and VT, 
You are right - you need to cry and let it all out. I have come to the conclusion that the grief is so bad our bodies kind of let it out in bits and pieces. And that goes for past traumatic events too (believe me, I've had a few of those). Not pleasant, but with every sobbing session there comes just a little relief (I find). I found dh crying the other day    and was secretly pleased (no I'm not a sadist!) I was just pleased that he is finally getting it out.
And you must not forget Bell that you are making progress. It doesn't feel like it, I know. But when you are feeling a bit stronger, you'll look back and see just how amazing you have been. All of us are - we are surviving this awful part of our lives – and it is just a part of our lives – and we are reclaiming our futures. 
I think your business sounds a great idea. I think it is always good to find a creative outlet. Create something new, something to make the world go round a little easier.  
Bernie xxx


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## emcee

Oh Bell, bless your heart, you are a lovely person and you have not deserved any of the crap life has thrown at you and I am so sorry things are feeling so raw for you at this moment in time.

Sending you much love and a big squeezy  

Emcee xxx


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## brown

hi ermey

I'm very new on here but just wanted you to know I am thinking about you. 
Love from Suxx


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