# anyone had success with v poor sperm morphology??? Please help!



## sickofwaiting (Jan 31, 2013)

Hi

I am feeling desperately sad as my first ICSI cycle has failed. We are both 30 and have male factor issues, namely poor morphology (1-2%) we had 11 eggs injected, and 9 fertilised. Was really happy with that. But then only 2 developed enough to be transferred, and I had a 3day transfer of 2 grade 2 embryos. The remaining 7 didn't make it to freezing. And we now know that the 2 they put back didn't work either. This doesn't feel like it's just bad luck, how can 9 fertilised embryos all be rubbish. I am worried the sperm quality is so poor it is stopping the embryo from developing or something. I really want to think that it will work next time, but I think it might be all over for us. 

Please help!! Feeling so so devastated, hubby is even talking about using donor sperm xx


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## Jenso (Jan 15, 2013)

I dont have a success story but perhaps you can ask your clinic to try IMSI for your next cycle? I have heard that you will get better quality embryo from it. My DH also have poor morphology and we are trying IMSI this time around..


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## sickofwaiting (Jan 31, 2013)

Thank you for your reply, I have never heard of IMSI! I will look it up now, thank you  xxxxx


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## Omelette (Nov 28, 2007)

Sickofwaiting - sorry about your BFN, we all know how it feels. 

My sister in law's husband had sperm issues. They were told they couldn't concieve naturally but the very next month she had a surprise natural BFP. They had trouble conceving a second, tried IVF and on their first go ended up with twins. 

Don't be too disheartened, ivf often takes a few goes and you are still young. And just because embryos can't be frozen doesn't mean they are rubbish, they have to be top grade to be frozen. I used a 25 year old egg donor and ended up with 2 for ET and freezing out of 17, that's just nature I'm afraid. Doesn't mean failure will happen again though especially if your eggs are good. I would have another chat with your consultant. Also, men are continually making millions of sperms and you only need one to do its job!


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## sickofwaiting (Jan 31, 2013)

Hi Omelette

Congratulations on your BFP that is fantastic news. Thank you for your support and advice it has made me feel better. We have an appointment with the doctor at the clinic tomorrow so will ask them lots of questions and hopefully he can make us gain some perspective and positivity back. 

I really want to be one of those couples that has a surprise natural BFP, got to just keep trying and moving forward that's all we can do I suppose. Wish I had a crystal ball, this is sooooo hard. xx


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## HopingAndPraying (Mar 28, 2013)

Hi sow

I really hoped to see more success stories about this   my hubby has low morph too and I had a failed cycle in June , similar numbers to you 10 eggs and 8 fertilised and on day 3 I only had 3 front runners left..good grade but bfn. I transferred 2 and 1 went to blast but was not good enough to freeze.. The others stopped dividing. I was so upset.

I am so sorry to hear of your bfn, and I know how devastated you must feel, as think on your first try you are so full of hope x look after yourself and make sure you ask lots of questions at your review meeting. After only one try its hard to say what will happen on your next go, so don't give up  

My consultant did mention that on day 1 -3 it is the egg that does the majority of the work and the sperm dna kicks in properly in day 3 .  So it was then assumed it was down to egg quality that caused the embryos to slow down and I assumed it was due to poor sperm. I think its a bit of both , as I asked if there were any issues visible with the eggs and he said no, but you don't know these things until after fertilisation arghhhhhhhhhh!

Good luck to you and your hubby, and I really hope round 2 brings you a gorgeous BFP xxxxx


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## sickofwaiting (Jan 31, 2013)

HopingandPraying - I'm so sorry to read about your failed cycle. Are you going to try again? It sounds like we are in very similar situations. I am trying to keep the faith but I just keep thinking that it might never happen and trying to get my head round alternative options like sperm donor or adoption but I can't bear the thought of either at the moment. All I want is my hubby's baby that's all I have ever wanted. It's so unfair. 

xx


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## Helend75 (Dec 9, 2012)

I had a BFN in early May. OH has a low count (really low; 2.2 million for first ICSI, 1 million for second ICSI). I've nothing practical to offer in terms of advice or words of wisdom I'm just here for sympathy!! We get told that in amongst the count normal forms haven't been recorded, but I don't know if that's because there are so few they don't bother or because there are none to be seen. I find it really difficult to discuss the SA issues with the consultant as I'm very sensitive to how OH and his feelings. Rock & a hard place... I don't tell him anything I read on here & do wonder how big a barrier he sees the sperm issue as being.  I keep a lot to myself and stress about everything - donor sperm hasn't been mentioned but I don't know how either of us would react to that.

First cycle, 4 of 6 eggs fertilised, 2 transferred at 3 days (7 & 8 cell good embryos), 2 stopped growing at 2 cells. This cycle 2 of 6 eggs fertilised & fortunately both were at 4 cells on day 2 which was when they were transferred.

I too have lost positivity; I was under the impression that we were predominantly male factor, but I'm now worrying about my own egg quality - I changed clinics between cycles 1 & 2 - I was told from 18 follicles to expect 12 eggs and fertilisation of 8, so to have got 6 came as a huge shock.

I've scoured these pages for glimmers of hope through the 2ww & there are some there!! It's just difficult as you know to balance your hope against the potential for disappointment...


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## coweyes (Sep 4, 2008)

My friend dh has very low sperm count, she had 2 day 3 embryos put back, she had twins, she then had another cycle and had another son.

My dh has very low sperm count, don't know about the morphology, a bit stupid of me after 4 cycles i guess but iv never thought of asking as long as there is enough for icsi that was ok by me. 

I know its totally disheartening but there are many woman and men on here (counting myself) who have multiple and very complexed cases, but treatment has finally worked. Please remember that your first round is one hell of a learning experience for both you and your clinic. Hopefully they will recommend something different next time and will def have your failed cycle to go by, that can only be positive. We were recommended imsi for my dh, but the clinic that was best suited to my chromazone problem doesnt do it, but after 4 cycles i have a 7 month old daughter. Make sure you have a review of your failed cycle, do some research and go in with a list of questions about how your next cycle will be more tailored to you and your dh needs.


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## HopingAndPraying (Mar 28, 2013)

Helen75  - just wanted to say good luck with this cycle….your wee 4 cell embies were at the right stage for day 2 …so I have everything crossed for you. Try and stay positive for the sake of your 2 wee embies and I hope they are snuggling in nicely as I type.

Coweyes congrats on your little one, its lovely to read a positive story x hope you are enjoying being a mummy

Sickofwaiting  , try not to worry about adoption or donors just yet, you both have age on your side and your next try could be the one for you. Don’t lose hope after one try…I was in the exact same position as you in June and felt like it really was the end….but have decided to go again..

Hopefully we will get there xxxxx


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## purplepeak (Jan 31, 2012)

Hi ladies,

We had three failed cycles with very poor sperm morphology. We are now in the process of doing our fourth and our doctor thinks the sperm is massively improved because of an antibiotics protocol. There aren't many clinics which believe in this. I'm at Serum in Greece. Jonathan Ramsay, a doctor you can see privately in London, offers a test called ROS and depending on the results of that might prescribe antibiotics. There's a lady on here called L_ouise who had 6 failed cycles then her dh took antibs from Jonathan Ramsey and the 7th was successful. So, it might be worth a consultation with either Serum (they do phone consults and you don't have to be cycling with them) or Jonathan Ramsay? 

High dose vit C is supposed to be good. And also vit E.

Good luck!

P


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## sickofwaiting (Jan 31, 2013)

Hi lovely ladies. Thanks for all your words of wisdom and support, it means a lot.

Just had consultation, the doctor actually said the sperm sample was actually not too bad, 20million with 5% normal forms. Last test we had was 1% so we are really happy about this. He actually surprisingly said the egg quality wasn't too great! My FSH is quite high for my age (9.5) so it's swings and roundabouts, now I'm worried about my eggs!! Does anyone have any tips on improving egg quality? I've always just been focusing on the sperm! They are trying me on Menopaur next time rather than Gonal F as I didn't respond very well on that. He said the Menopaur may help me to produce eggs of better quality. Does diet and exercise help? I'm also going to be on the progesterone injections next time as I got my period whilst on Cyclogest... so at least there are things we can do differently next time to hopefully get a better outcome.

xx


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## stowaway (Jun 21, 2011)

Hi PurplePeak, 

Interested to read your post and wondered how your sperm problem was solved?

Thank you 

x


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## cosmopolitan4112008 (Oct 18, 2013)

I read about many cases with morphology like your husband's and they succeded. There are many factors involved in success. The lab is extremely important. Try to ask for imsi or picsi. If they can, have those embryos grow till day 5 and 6 in addition to cgh testing. 
In the meantime,  give your husband the following: pycnogenol 100 twice a day, vit d3 2000 iu daily (you take it also edp if your d is low), b12, selenium and zinc.


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## purplepeak (Jan 31, 2012)

Hi Stowaway,

My husband took antibiotics (doxycycline) for 40 days. The sperm went from 100% abnormal to a high percentage normal. So much so that on our recent cycle we were able to have IVF instead of ICSI and got four blastocysts (3 of which 'perfect') instead of the poorer quality embryos we've had in the past.

Good luck!

PX


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## cosmopolitan4112008 (Oct 18, 2013)

@purplepeak

What is the daily amount of neupogen that you are using? At what point in the cycle did you start it?


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## bbcolt78 (Nov 3, 2013)

Hi PurplePeak-

I'm in the US, and my RE recommends Pregnitude for improving egg quality. I was able to purchase it on Amazon.com.

I'm sure IVF cycles are different around the world, but we had a successful IVF with ICSI. My husband had 0% morphology and very low count. For our cycle he took one round of antibiotics (we both did). Other than that, he was asked to do much. Again, I'm not familiar at all with cycles from other countries.

Good luck to you!


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## cosmopolitan4112008 (Oct 18, 2013)

My dr recommends mitochondria energizer for egg quality because it restores energy of the cells and their division.


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## stowaway (Jun 21, 2011)

HI cosmopolitan4112008 & PurpleDeck

Thanks so much for replying - and your advice. It's really good to hear. 

PurpleDeck - did they give your husband antibiotics because they found some kind of infection? Seems to have had really amazing results! 

Thanks K


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## one_day_maybe (Mar 18, 2013)

We have sperm issues, count of 0.2ish million, poor motility and 0% normal forms.  Our first cycle, from 11 eggs, 8 were mature and 5 fertilised.  Our best embryo on day 3 was only 4 cells and was put back, none of the rest made it to blast.  We got bfp but it only lasted a few days.

After that cycle, DH started acupuncture alongside all the vits and supps he was taking.  I also read that poor development in the first few days may have been an egg issue so I continued with acupuncture, started taking Q10, stopped taking royal jelly and massively improved my diet.  We changed clinics and they changed my drug protocol slightly.

This cycle we got 11 eggs again but 10 were mature and 8 fertilised.  4 made it to blast and, had 2 put back and 1 frozen.  

Just wanted to show that things can change massively from one cycle to the next, we never would have believed we would get to blast this time.  I have just had another bfp and praying that this one sticks.

Please don't give up hope ladies, especially after just one cycle as the clinic will have learnt loads xxx


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## purplepeak (Jan 31, 2012)

Hi Stowaway, they didn't find any infection although we had quite a lot of tests for infection. So they gave the antibiotics on the assumption that perhaps there was an infection which hadn't been detected. The clinic try it when there is poor sperm quality and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't - presumably when it does it is because of an underlying undetected infection. 

Hi Cosmopolitan, I used 50iu neupogen from day 1 of stimms. 

Thanks for the info Bbcolt. 

Congratulations one-day!

P.


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