# Any sucess stories trying for a sibling after caesarean section?



## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

After 5 long years of DE IVF we finally had our miracle daughter in march this year. She was born by elective caesarean section. 
We recently returned to the clinic to discuss trying for a sibling with our last remaining frostie and the consultant advised that my chances of success have been reduced by 15% because of the section. He advised that there were 3 quality research papers which have found this. I was gutted to be honest. I had no idea that C-section was an issue for future pregnancy.
So I would be really grateful to hear of folks experiences in trying for a sibling after having a C-section?
Thank you for taking the time to read my post.


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## K jade (Aug 11, 2013)

What Omfg I literally had no idea


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

I know, nei


K jade said:


> What Omfg I literally had no idea


I know, neither did I. Its newly discovered research apparently. I'm pretty upset about it tbh. Did you have a section?


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## K jade (Aug 11, 2013)

Im really shocked to hear this and also very discouraged having had an emergency c section and also wanting a sibling with a remaining frostie. 
Very disappointing.


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

K jade said:


> Im really shocked to hear this and also very discouraged having had an emergency c section and also wanting a sibling with a remaining frostie.
> Very disappointing.


I know, I totally understand and I'm in the same boat. That's why I was hoping to hear some success stories to give a bit of hope but no one has responded.....I hope that's not because there are no success stories?


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## Saltysea (Apr 8, 2019)

I‘m sorry but this sounds ridiculous. There are millions of people that have perfectly healthy pregnancies after C-Section. You can find a study to show almost anything you want these days, it really only means something if repeated studies keep showing the same result. C-Sections get such a bad rap these days as well although they have saved untold numbers of maternal and baby lives, never mind baby disabilities/complications! I wouldn’t worry about this in the slightest and if you need further reassurance, just go and ask any other specialist and I’m willing to bet they will say something completely different.


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

Saltysea said:


> I‘m sorry but this sounds ridiculous. There are millions of people that have perfectly healthy pregnancies after C-Section. You can find a study to show almost anything you want these days, it really only means something if repeated studies keep showing the same result. C-Sections get such a bad rap these days as well although they have saved untold numbers of maternal and baby lives, never mind baby disabilities/complications! I wouldn’t worry about this in the slightest and if you need further reassurance, just go and ask any other specialist and I’m willing to bet they will say something completely different.


I really hope that you're right. I know of plenty natural pregnancies post c-section via friends and family, but none of them were IVF. The consultant said there were 3 quality research papers? I've asked for links to the papers so maybe that will give more info when I get them. 
I was very surprised when he said it tbh but the clinic have been so incredible are at the cutting edge of fertility research. He also said that the papers were very recent so I assumed this was why I hadn't heard anything about it? Are you saying that the information is wrong? I'm really praying that it is wrong, but I also don't understand why it would be said in a consultation if it was?


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## K jade (Aug 11, 2013)

Im guessing the studies looks at own egg fresh cycles rather than exclusively FETs.I'm wandering if sucess was partly lower because ultimately egg quality declines with age?
I did have a brief Google and saw 1 study based in China. It was conducted after the abolishing of the 1 child policy.
Women accessing ivf for a sibling were having reduced sucess . We'll they're going to be aren't they as they will be older. 
I defining know at least 1 person who had sucess with a FET after a c section. 

It's discouraging though as with zero sperm, crap eggs my womb was basically the only thing which was in working order ! 

Vrw100 I'm gonna still go ahead and u should too..
Fingers crossed we both defy these studies 
Xx


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

I ended up with a planned csection with my last baby after an emergency one with my twins, obviously I didn’t have any problems with the pregnancy after the first, but have had subsequent problems after the second involving a lot of money, when you sign the forms, your signing an agreement for supposedly being told of post complications of the surgery although they say that they’re rare and they don’t list them all, one of 5em is a niche in the scar, which is quite common, and you have to have surgery to repair the scar, another one is a scar eptopic etc, post uterine infection from the surgery etc, be nice if they actually sat you down and explained these beforehand, obviously not if it’s an emergency one.


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## dojiejo (Jul 2, 2013)

I had a C-section 6.5 years ago as my DS was breech. We started trying for a sibling from when he was 18 months old. Unfortunately I did experience a complication from my C-section with a full thickness niche that meant there was communication between my uterus and abdominal cavity. I kept having fluid collect in the niche. I had the niche repaired surgically in November last year and currently 11 weeks pregnant. C-section niches are definitely appearing more in the literature now then they did even a few years ago and not everyone who has a C-section has a niche. I think it is difficult to say if the C-section will be a problem until you start trying. Congrats on the arrival of your DD this year.


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

@dojiejo I had a small niche repaired coming up two years ago because of fluid as well, that repair according to the surgeon was a success, however I’m still suffering from “fluid” and have had 3-4 transfers cancelled now and nothing seems to be working at all. So glad you had a good outcome 🙂


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## dojiejo (Jul 2, 2013)

@Stacey10 I am so sorry you have had to go through this as well. This cycle that was successful they did aspirate some fluid from my scar that never went away. I have had lots of cancelled cycles aw well. I did go for an ultrasound for the surgeon to review prior to this successful cycle to see if there was anything further that could be done, the surgeon was completely happy with the ultrasound. Maybe it is worth asking to be reviewed again by your surgeon.


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## OursBlanc (Apr 15, 2019)

Hi Ladies,
My doc ( at IB Alicante) also mentioned that there is a reduced rate of pregnancy after C-section. I had to have a C-section as uterine fibroid (in the outside wall of the uterus near cervix was partially blocking route for baby, so basically had no choice but an elective C-section.
This year started to try for a sibling with our remaining frosties. One of the first test the clinic asked even before we started was to have an ultrasound scan and a hysteroscopy to check for uterine scarring and presence of a niche ( fluid filled sack on the scar where uterus was opened up) . Luckily my gynae consultant delivering our daughter did an amazing job - I have practically no internal scar, apparently down to the skill of the double layer stitching technique that she used which produces no scarring. See reference:
Single- versus double-layer closure of the caesarean (uterine) scar in the prevention of gynaecological symptoms in relation to niche development – the 2Close study: a multicentre randomised controlled trial. S. I. Stegwee et.al. 2019 ( open access journal)


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## Lola2021 (Dec 25, 2020)

Saltysea said:


> I‘m sorry but this sounds ridiculous. There are millions of people that have perfectly healthy pregnancies after C-Section. You can find a study to show almost anything you want these days, it really only means something if repeated studies keep showing the same result. C-Sections get such a bad rap these days as well although they have saved untold numbers of maternal and baby lives, never mind baby disabilities/complications! I wouldn’t worry about this in the slightest and if you need further reassurance, just go and ask any other specialist and I’m willing to bet they will say something completely different.


Totally agree. I know LOADS of women who had sections and went on to have successful pregnancies in quick succession!


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

K jade said:


> Im guessing the studies looks at own egg fresh cycles rather than exclusively FETs.I'm wandering if sucess was partly lower because ultimately egg quality declines with age?
> I did have a brief Google and saw 1 study based in China. It was conducted after the abolishing of the 1 child policy.
> Women accessing ivf for a sibling were having reduced sucess . We'll they're going to be aren't they as they will be older.
> I defining know at least 1 person who had sucess with a FET after a c section.
> ...


Absolutely, wise words and well said. I'm defo going ahead and trying regardless and you're right that perhaps there were other variables not accounted for. I only have 1 frostie left but I would still try a further DE cycle if that last one fails. Fingers crossed for us both x


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

Stacey10 said:


> I ended up with a planned csection with my last baby after an emergency one with my twins, obviously I didn’t have any problems with the pregnancy after the first, but have had subsequent problems after the second involving a lot of money, when you sign the forms, your signing an agreement for supposedly being told of post complications of the surgery although they say that they’re rare and they don’t list them all, one of 5em is a niche in the scar, which is quite common, and you have to have surgery to repair the scar, another one is a scar eptopic etc, post uterine infection from the surgery etc, be nice if they actually sat you down and explained these beforehand, obviously not if it’s an emergency one.


Thank you for responding with your experience Stacey10. The study that I came across on a google search concluded that caesarean scar defect had a significantly negative effect on subsequent pregnancy attempts, but in the absence of defects the odds were the same as vaginally delivery (its the same study that Kjade found I think). So it sounds like the scar defect only occurred after the 2nd section for you and it backs up the findings of that study.

They also say though that CSD are present 24-70% of the time after section but there is an awful big difference between these 2 values so that's pretty unhelpful really.

You are absolutely right though about the fact that the negatives simply aren't discussed fully enough. In the event of emergency section it's totally right and understandable, but less so with an elective. Its really not great when folk find things out after the event when it causing problems. I'm really sorry that you're having problems after your last one.

Do you know if there is any way of knowing if a scar defect is present or not? I'm not aware of any symptoms but apparently there often aren't any symptoms?


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

dojiejo said:


> I had a C-section 6.5 years ago as my DS was breech. We started trying for a sibling from when he was 18 months old. Unfortunately I did experience a complication from my C-section with a full thickness niche that meant there was communication between my uterus and abdominal cavity. I kept having fluid collect in the niche. I had the niche repaired surgically in November last year and currently 11 weeks pregnant. C-section niches are definitely appearing more in the literature now then they did even a few years ago and not everyone who has a C-section has a niche. I think it is difficult to say if the C-section will be a problem until you start trying. Congrats on the arrival of your DD this year.


Awwww, uber congrats on your pregnancy. That's wonderful news after all the disappointment you've had trying for a sibling.
6 and a half years is a long time for the problem to be diagnosed? Did you have any physical symptoms? How did they end up finding the niche? Did you have to wait for a while after the niche removal before you could go for another transfer?


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

OursBlanc said:


> Hi Ladies,
> My doc ( at IB Alicante) also mentioned that there is a reduced rate of pregnancy after C-section. I had to have a C-section as uterine fibroid (in the outside wall of the uterus near cervix was partially blocking route for baby, so basically had no choice but an elective C-section.
> This year started to try for a sibling with our remaining frosties. One of the first test the clinic asked even before we started was to have an ultrasound scan and a hysteroscopy to check for uterine scarring and presence of a niche ( fluid filled sack on the scar where uterus was opened up) . Luckily my gynae consultant delivering our daughter did an amazing job - I have practically no internal scar, apparently down to the skill of the double layer stitching technique that she used which produces no scarring. See reference:
> Single- versus double-layer closure of the caesarean (uterine) scar in the prevention of gynaecological symptoms in relation to niche development – the 2Close study: a multicentre randomised controlled trial. S. I. Stegwee et.al. 2019 ( open access journal)


That's really interesting to hear about the stitching technique. How did you find d out what technique your surgeon used?

I'm also at IB Alicante. Are you with Dr Castillo? It sounds like I should perhaps arrange an ultrasound and hysteroscopy to see what the situation is. Where did you have your tests carried out? Were they straightforward?


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

Lola2021 said:


> Totally agree. I know LOADS of women who had sections and went on to have successful pregnancies in quick succession!


That sounds very encouraging indeed Lola2021. Were they IVF pregnancies?


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## Stacey10 (Jun 7, 2013)

vrw100 said:


> Thank you for responding with your experience Stacey10. The study that I came across on a google search concluded that caesarean scar defect had a significantly negative effect on subsequent pregnancy attempts, but in the absence of defects the odds were the same as vaginally delivery (its the same study that Kjade found I think). So it sounds like the scar defect only occurred after the 2nd section for you and it backs up the findings of that study.
> 
> They also say though that CSD are present 24-70% of the time after section but there is an awful big difference between these 2 values so that's pretty unhelpful really.
> 
> ...


A lot of times, you can have spotting between your periods, like old blood, or you go for a scan mid cycle and the see “fluid” in your uterus, which is usually old blood that has accumulated in the niche and as it exits the uterus it gets “stuck” in the niche.
yes the first csection I had no problems at all, just this last one. It really is like Russian roulette, the surgeon here who did mine said he is seeing more and more come in for corrective surgeries, also the ones who don’t have any obvious “symptoms” like the spotting, well one of the symptoms is unexplained infertility after a C-section as well.


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## OursBlanc (Apr 15, 2019)

vrw100 said:


> That's really interesting to hear about the stitching technique. How did you find d out what technique your surgeon used?
> 
> I'm also at IB Alicante. Are you with Dr Castillo? It sounds like I should perhaps arrange an ultrasound and hysteroscopy to see what the situation is. Where did you have your tests carried out? Were they straightforward?


Hi. My gynae at the NHS hospital, who also practices at the local Spire, did an ultrasound said that consultant who did C-section done a great job as barely any scaring and no niche. I had one hysteroscopy with the NHS as part of investigating infertility and discovered my fibroids so before any pregnancy, then a 2nd at IB before trying for baby no 2. It was mainly to check if the fibroids had grown where they shouldn't have because of the hormone medication ( thankfully not , they are either intramural or subserosal) . It is a straight forward procedure and you can go home afterwards. The uterus gets filled with fluid and then they look inside with a camera on a thin pole. You can probably feel the fluid going in, but not painful is such. Yes, we are with Dr Castillo.


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## dojiejo (Jul 2, 2013)

vrw100 said:


> Awwww, uber congrats on your pregnancy. That's wonderful news after all the disappointment you've had trying for a sibling.
> 6 and a half years is a long time for the problem to be diagnosed? Did you have any physical symptoms? How did they end up finding the niche? Did you have to wait for a while after the niche removal before you could go for another transfer?


Sorry I have taken so long to reply. My main symptoms have been extremely heavy periods post having my son in 2016. This was so different to my reasonably light periods prior to my pregnancy. They could seethe niche on ultrasound, it was only after a SIS that they saw there was a communication between my uterus and my abdomen. After my repair I had to wait 6 months before we could do a transfer.


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## vrw100 (Jul 4, 2019)

dojiejo said:


> Sorry I have taken so long to reply. My main symptoms have been extremely heavy periods post having my son in 2016. This was so different to my reasonably light periods prior to my pregnancy. They could seethe niche on ultrasound, it was only after a SIS that they saw there was a communication between my uterus and my abdomen. After my repair I had to wait 6 months before we could do a transfer.


 Thank you, thats really helpful. I'm sorry that you've had such a rough journey to tey for a sibling. I really really hope you get your little miracle from the most recent batch of eggs 🙏.

My period has only just started again after 7 months but it was really light. I have thought of going for an ultrasound to see if they can see a niche but I'm undecided?


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