# cycle buddy?



## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hello

I am on my first cycle of clomid and just wondered if anyone was on tx at the same time? I am now on CD11 after taking Provera to induce AF and then 50mg of clomid from days 2-6. 

katylou - this is what I meant!

Hope to hear from lots of you lovely ladies soon  

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hi Bev

I think there is a place on the main area where people put their diaries & get buddies. I am a little bit behind you, am on day 5 of my 1st clomid cycle - after having a bleed induced by norethisterone.

  
R
x


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## Mrs Chaos (Feb 12, 2004)

Hi Bev
here's a link to cycle buddies hun http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?board=68.0
and one to 2ww diaries http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?board=27.0

Best of luck with your journey
Gayn
XX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Ah, with you now Bev  Hey cycle buddy and nearly cycle buddy! 
Hope you're feeling ok tonight - read your other post about your follies  I don't really know enough to know what that means, but I'm sure people on here will know more. Surely they've still got a good few days of growing to do anyway? Eggy vibes  Sorry if it's personal, but why do some people get scans at that stage? I'm only getting the 21 day blood test, and now feel like I'm missing out on something  
Sometimes I feel like they just put me on the provera/clomid without too much thought, just to give it a try! The consultant was very nice, but didn't seem to know very much about the tests I'd had so far and asked me what hormones were tested for the previous year, etc., as if I would know  I know this sounds like a bit of a no-brainer, but when I was prescribed the provera/clomid at hospital I told him I'd had a relatively recent (very rare) cycle, and he didn't even ask me if I'd checked if I was pg. I'm just in a bit of a rant now, but that upset me at the time because I read all the warnings in the booklets that came with the tablets  Rant over, sorry!!!!
Despite the above evidence to the contrary (!) I'm hanging on in there and feeling _quite_ positive - still got strange dizzy feelings, but been reassured on here that you can get weird side-effects mid-cycle too. 
My sleep has been a bit disturbed too. Mr Lou woke me up last night because apparently I was having some crazy dream and punching the mattress  Because of this I've been really tired and I fell asleep after dinner tonight, and I'm now wide awake at 1.20am - doh! 
Gayn and others, is it ok to leave this thread here just now even though it's a cycle buddy thread? 
 Stalyvegas   Bev  Take care both of you - it's really good to have people at the same stage to talk to. Fingers Xsed it's our month. 
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi Katy and Stalyvegas

Hurrah, we've got a thread going!!!

Stalyvegas, I'm glad you got your AF and are now on the crazy clomid journey!! How are you doing so far?

Katy - I'm sorry you're experiencing dizzy spells, hopefully they will stop soon. I've been like you in terms of waking up and having really weird and vivid dreams. I feel absolutely shattered during the day and wide awake at night!!!  

In response to your question about scans, my consultant wanted me to have follicle tracking scans to see whether the clomid was working or not. She needed to know how effective it was because it might not make me ovulate at all. So far I've had a scan on day 4, day 11 and I'm having a day 15 one too. I don't know what my cycle length is so I might even need another one after that!!!! The only problem is, although my cons wants me to have these scans, I have to pay for them at £40 a pop!! Oh well, I'm sure it is worth it. 

Most of my tests have been done through my GP so far (blood tests, STDs etc) but he doesn't really have a clue WHEN these tests have to be done. For example, I had a blood test to see if I had PCOS and he did it at the wrong time in my cycle!!

Anyway, hope to keep in touch. Fingers crossed and        to you both.

Love Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi girlies,
Hmm, def going to ask about these scans when I go next Wed for my day 21 blood tests. Because I have no cycle, the cons said it was highly unlikely I ovulate and he would hope for the best the first cycle and he would up the clomid if not. Surely it would have been better if we could actually _see_ - even if for one cycle  That's rubbish that you've got to pay for your scans, Bev  Would be struggling to do that at the moment - hubby just finishing a Phd so only working part-time just now.
My tests were done through the GP too, which I and the unit were pleased with because didn't have to delay clomid or anything. 
No dizzy spells today, so feel positive about that  The pains I've felt for the last few days have gone - mysterious because I thought tomorrow would be ov - wonder if it was earlier  
Hope you manage to get a decent night's sleep Bev, and that everything's ok with you too Stalyvegas,
Eggy vibes   
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hello

Katy, I completely agree that it would be better to see what is happening in your first cycle to then make changes for the next. I'm glad the dizzy spells are over and the pain is gone. 

I've had feedback on how many follicles I should have - 2 is plenty!!! My sonographer got it wrong by telling me I should have more than that on clomid!!!  

So, the positive vibes are back on and I'm feeling good. Lots of   for me!!!! Sorry if TMI!!!

Take care, lots of love and  

Bev XxX


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## Mrs Chaos (Feb 12, 2004)

Hi
sorry I've not replied sooner to Katy's question had a day from hell yesterday 
The thread is ok here 
Lotsa love
Gayn
XX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hiya Bev/Katy

Had bad day yesterday - posted on Clomid Girls - went to bed on monday night and forgot to take my clomid tablet - was gutted. Waited all this time for it, and then 2 courses of norethisterone to get a bleed, only to forget to take it. Not sure if I have screwed up this cycle....  took my missed tablets yesterday morning and my last one last night, today is CD7.  Dont feel any side effect yet, bit nauseous but thats more about having 3 coffees and no food today.

Been swimming with DD this morning and she tried to drink most of the pool, and then bumped her head and has a nasty bruise now - I look like I have been bashing her about!!!

BMS from saturday, but DH says 'why wait' and has been trying it on all week anyway - but whats new!

Hope you two are ok, and hello to anyone else ready this.
R
xxx


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi Stalyvegas

I'm sure you will be absolutely fine. I forgot to take my last tablet and had to take it the next morning. So far, it seems to be working so don't worry too much. As long as you took it, I think you'll be fine. 

I hope your DD is ok!!! My friend's boy is always doing stuff like that!!! 

Take care, let me know how you get on. 

Lots of love and  

Bev XxX

P.S Katy - how you doing?


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hiya

DD is fine, bruise is fading a bit, although she bit her lip earlier and had a bloody mouth! Poor little thing, she is fast asleep now though.

Took my metformin tonight so will be dashing off to the loo with tummy pains soon no doubt, have been pretending to take it as I hate it - but thought it best to take it again properly!

R
x


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hey girlies,

How are we?  All "busy" I hope    Poor DD Stalyvegas - I was always covered in bruises as a child, and I'm not much more careful now    I'm sure one late tablet won't have screwed up your cycle.  Are the tummy pains a side effect of the metformin?  Hope they don't get too bad    
I've been a busy girl too Bev.  Especially since I don't have a cycle to know how long it is, it's been BMS since Sat, and going to try to keep it going everyday for a week    We had a laugh last night cos we were both exhausted and had really stressful days, but day 14 so...
Did you have a day 15 scan today then Bev?  If so hope it went well, or   if it's not happened yet.  I'm really impatient for Wed and my day 21 bloods now.  Guess if I have ov then I'm officially in  Wow, been a long time coming    Had a few tummy twinges yesterday and today again...

Hope to catch up with you two again soon,
     both

Hi to anyone else reading this thread.  And Gayn - thanks - hope you've had a better day  
Kx


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi girlies

I'm going to have my scan this morning so fingers crossed my follies have grown more!!! I've been getting twinges and stabbing pains near my ovaries so hopefully they've had a growth spurt over the past few days. 

I've been doing my best with   although we're both so tired at the moment!!! Got to keep it up though because like you Katy, I have no idea when I should be ovulating due to not having a proper cycle for so long. 

Spending the weekend with my in-laws. Will need to keep going though so we'll have to keep quiet!!!  

Good luck for your day 21 blood test Katy, I really hope it has worked for you. 

Stalyvegas - how you doing?

Lots of love,   and              

Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Morning

Good luck with the Scan - hope you have plenty of growth, dont envy you having to have BMS with the in laws around, not sure I could manage that....

Katy, Yes its the Metformin that gives me a bad tummy/toilet issues (TMI sorry), however its great for weight loss!!!!! 

Its CD9 today and DH offered a quick jump this morning, told him he wa a bit eager! Though I think its ful steam ahead from tonight though dont have a nateral cycle/AF ever so have no idea about days....

Have a good day
R
x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi all

Had a big disappointment today - had my scan this morning and was told that the follicles haven't grown at all, in fact they look like they've shrunk!! (don't know if this is possible?)   

I'm going to have to speak to my consultant and hope that she increases the dosage for next month. I'm having another scan on CD19 (which they are doing for free) and a blood test on CD21 and 25 to see what happens but it doesn't look likely this month.  

The other problem is I don't know when I have to start taking my Provera again. The sonographer wants me to have a 28 day cycle, which would mean starting them on CD23 but I'm reluctant to do it that soon just in case I have ovulated (I know I'm being hopeful but you never know!!). Hopefully my consultant will advise me about that too. 

Anyway, I really hope that things are going well for you guys, I'll keep my fingers crossed for you and send you lots of                

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hiya,
Oh Bev  I'm really sorry to hear about that - I didn't know that could happen either  I would imagine your cons would increase your dose if your bloods confirm you haven't ov'ed. That's kinda what we were lead to expect happening this month. On the positive, it was picked up because of your scans, and they _did_ grow, so it was moving in the right direction and maybe you just need an extra boost  By day 23 they'll surely have your bloods anyway - I'm sure they'll not advise the provera again until they can be sure either way on the result of that. So sorry  Fingers crossed it can be sorted out quickly so you can keep up the momentum and feeling of progress 
Day 9 Stalyvegas - he's at it  Hope the BMS isn't driving you mad yet  I felt a bit guilty because we'd planned to for a week solid, but were both so knackered last night - nothing! So we missed day 16...don't know how important that was 
Apart from that I'm just really nervous about my bloods on Wed  Don't mind needles or anything, but at the moment I can hope I'm in the 2ww, and I don't really want that illusion shattered.
     to both of you.
Hope you're having a restful w/e,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Katy

You're absolutely right that at least something happened this time, even if it wasn't exactly right. I'm phoning my consultant on Monday so hopefully I should have more answers by then. 

Fingers crossed for your   . Let us know how you get on!!! 

Lots of love,   and         to you and Stalyvegas

Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hey Bev - and everyone else!

I finally got around to joining your thread - been busy! 

Im CD 14 today - webt for follicle tracking scan on fri - apparently no follies over 10 (Whatever that means!!!) why does everything have to be so damn confusing - am just hoping that theyve grown a bit by tomorrow - have another scan tomorrow afternoon so ill find out then  

how are you feeling today - any brighter?

hi to everyone else - hope all is well

Sj x x


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hiya everyone

CD11 today - think I might have ovulated last night, had stabby pain in oveary area so DH had to perform last night when I got in and he is on duty for the next 10 days just in case.  I am not having tracking/scanning etc... just blood test on CD21 so fingers crossed!!!

Bev hope the consultant give you a bit of good news.
R
xxx


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey everyone

sj79 - glad you've joined us!!! Good luck for your next scan. The bigger the follicle, the more likely it will produce an egg. 18mm upwards is good (I think!!!) so hopefully they will grow nice and big for you!!  

stalyvegas - are you using ovulation tracking kits? They should tell you when you have your LH surge and then ovulation usually happens up to 36 hours later. Good luck with the BMS!!!  

katylou - how you doing hun?

Anyway, take care everyone and I'll let you know what the consultant says tomorrow. 

Lots of love and       

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi sj79   Best follie-growing vibes for tomorrow, hope your scan goes well  
Good luck with the   Stalyvegas - keep it up!  
Hope your cons can say something helpful tomorrow Bev - let us know how you get on.  Went shopping tonight and got lots of fruit, veg, yoghurt, etc.  Going to try and really look after myself this week.  I have a weird draggy feeling around where I *think* my left ovary is tonight.  No idea what's going on with my body anymore   
   all,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi everyone

Well I didn't get a chance to speak to my consultant today, only her secretary. She was going to speak to my consultant and get my prescription posted out to me. She didn't know what dosage I would be on next, as she says she's 'only a secretary!!!' 

Having my last scan done tomorrow so hopefully, fingers crossed, I will have follicles waiting to pop!!!     

I hope everyone is doing ok - well done Katy for the healthy diet!! I did the same for a few months but bit by bit the chocolate crept back in  

Take care, will update you tomorrow.

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hi all, 

Well - still no decent follies - all still less than 10 and m womb lining still thin - though there is a poss that maybe were just a bit too early yet - because i havent had a proper period sonce coming off the pill wh knows how long my cyle is!! 

Stylevagas - hope all is going well!! it does kind of take the romance out of it - weve been at it since CD 10 - not wishing to leave anything to chance!! 

Katy - i joined slimming world 6 weeks ago and just this week have let the chocolate and wine back - you see with the follicle tracking i know that today im not pregnnat so its safe to drink - bonus!! 

Bev - hope you get on ok with yoir scan tomoz - will be senidng you lots of    

hi to anyone else i may have missed and hope all is well with you 

Sj x x


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

I just spent ages typing a reply and lost it!  
Quick summary before I totally lose the plot!  Sj79 - another reason I wish I had scans, would have been a less boring w/e   Hopefully you're still early in your cycle still, fingers crossed  
That's annoying you couldn't speak to your cons, Bev, but at least you have tomorrow.  Let us know how you get on  .  Come on follies!  
Stalyvegas - hope you're doing well out there, and anyone else who reads this  
I'm doing alright - one more sleep until the hospital, and I'm so impatient!  All sorts of prob imaginary symptoms like bigger (.)(.), weird pains, more CM (sorry far TMI!!), etc... Had weird, spaced-out, dizzy feelings again a few times today.  How embarassing will this be if my bloods show nothing happened?!  
Keep in touch girlies, and look after yourselves  
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi girlies

Just had my scan, no progress other than a nice, thick lining!!! She said I should definitely move on to an increased dosage and is going to speak to my consultant herself. She did say that it looks like I might have a natural AF as the lining looked ready.  

Hopefully, I'll have more success next month. 

Anyway, enough about me, how are you doing?

Katylou - sorry to hear about your dizzy spells again. sj - fingers crossed your follies and lining grow bigger. stalyvegas - keeping up the BMS  

Hope you are ok, speak to you soon

Lots of love,   and


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## xmissnawtyx (Sep 26, 2005)

Hi Can i join 
Just been prescribed clomid and going the start taking them beg of dec..
Been told only have 1 tube working the other side is blocked but all other tests come back ok..
Jayne


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hi bev - if nothing else at least you may get a natural AF....  hope things perk up for you.

Yes I am still on BMS duty - think we need to eep it going until next weekend as I am at the hospital for bloods CD21 next tuesday.

Hi Jayne, good luck on the Clomid, the main thread is at the top of the main screen 'Clomid Girls' - I would suggest you post on that too as there are hundreds of us at various points in cycles.

Hi Katielou, hope the dizzy spells are getting better.
R
xxx


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi Jayne

Welcome to our thread!! Of course you can join us on this one!!! I only started this one as it is so hard to keep up with the 'clomid girls' one!!!

I'm sorry to hear you have one side blocked - hopefully with the clomid you will get follies on the side you need!!!

Take care and keep us posted with your progress.

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Just a quicky tonight girls.  Been flicking back and forward between this site and other windows for a few hours now.  Partly because I'm online xmas shopping, and partly because I'm really scared about my bloods tomorrow and can't deal with reading too much ttc stuff  
Still having weird crampy feelings - wondering if it might be   warming up...
Hi and welcome Jayne, welcome to the mad world of clomid   Good to see you 
That's some positive news then Bev    
Glad you're keeping busy Stalyvegas  
Cross your fingers for me tomorrow girlies,
     all
Katy x


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hi everyone, 

How's you all doing - ok i hope? 

Katy - hope the witch stays away!! 

Jayne - welcome

Bev - well - thats one thing about your lining and at least they are going to spk with the cons about it for you

had a further scan today - apparently i ahve one follie at 9 (nearly at the magic 10 - the hosp said they would get a bit more excited/interested then!!!) and lining increased to 6.6 so fingers crossed - got another scan on Fri

stylevagas - keep up the good work  - its xhausing isnt it!! 

sorry if i missed anyone - hi to you if i did!!  

fingers crossed for everyone   

Sj x x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi everyone

sj - that's really good news. Fingers crossed for the magic 10 for you!!!

katylou, stalyvegas, jayne - how you getting on?

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Bev you were up early...

DH is having his leaving do from work tonight so he was up at 6 - so I have been up since 6 too.... DD wants to get up now too! Still on BMS duty, really couldnt be arsed this morning so early but we best not miss an opportunity.

 SJ

R
x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Yeah, I'm always up early. We get up at 5.45 to get ready for work and walk the dog!!!  

I have my day 21 blood test this morning but I'm not holding out much hope for this month. Hopefully next month though!!  

Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

5.45..... thats practically the middle of the night!!!!!!!

Got my 21 day test next wednesday, fingers crossed for yours.
R
xxx


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Wow you early birds    I'm def a night person!  Well, yesterday didn't go wonderfully well - big post about it below, don't really want to think about it again  
Hope you have a better experience Bev, and hope you manage to avoid the attractive purple junkie-bruise I have on my inner elbow today  
Glad you're keeping up the BMS Stalyvegas.  I saw a car with the reg plate "BMS" the other day  
Nearly there sj - fingers crossed for your scan tomorrow  
Not too long now Jayne before you're on the crazy pill rollercoaster   
   all
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Katylou - OMG, what a b**ch!!!        That is so horrible you've been treated this way. Your medical information shouldn't be kept a secret from you, you have every right to know what your levels are!!!!!!

I really hope they treat you better in the future, there is no excuse for that. 

I've got the junkie bruise too katy - I didn't expect it though!! What a whopper!!!

Thinking of you and hope you feel better. Here's a   too. 

Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Katylou - that is truely terrible - silly cow   i know its a while to wait but if i were you i would ring on monday nad not get off the phone until they give you some sort of proper answer - be polite but firm - i find a kind of patronising tone always does the trick! its slightly harder over the phone as you cant give the smile through gritted teeth - whilst your head is slightly to one side can you! 

Thank yu al for your   - ill let you know what tomorrow brings - am just keeping my fingers crossed

hope everyone else is doing ok

Sj x x


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Thanks girlies    Had a day off work cos generally feeling stressed and poo, and feel better for it.  Aside from all that carry-on, there was another WTF! moment there yesterday.  I was at the reception desk in the clinic, and there was a girl in front of me who was led through to a room leaving me standing there in front of the office bit.  I *honestly* wasn't listening on purpose, but it's open plan and there was a woman on the phone.  She was saying that officially there wasn't a cancellations system for appointments, but if whoever was on the phone wanted to phone every month they might be fitted in    So glad I waited 10 months   I think I'm going to have to be polite but firm and pushy with this department, no matter how I'm feeling inside  
Thanks, as always, for your support girlies, and knowing how it feels  
 for all,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi everyone

katy, I'm sorry you've been feeling poo and stressed    I think being polite but pushy is always the best policy. My DH described doctors and nurses as being like estate agents - if you don't push them to do something, they will sit back and do nothing for you.    You have to take control of your own situation unfortunately because if you don't do something, nobody else will. I've lost the faith I once had in doctors because I feel they don't really care about your situation. The most success I've had so far is when I've done the research myself and asked for clomid and provera to be prescribed. Without me doing that, I would still be waiting for AF to arrive!!!  

I hope you can stay positive and know that there are lots of people (us!!!) who can support you and encourage you throughout this journey.      

Lots of love
Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Aw, thanks Bev  This is a great place for getting support, and everyone has been fanstastic.
I didn't know you'd pushed to get put on provera/clomid yourself. You go girl!  I would still be waiting for AF as well - last one I had was in June/July, and that was only the second this year  
I'm having a great (if very late..) evening watching Working Girl, my favourite film  As I've posted on the chat thread as well, I keep thinking that AF has started only to discover it's loads of CM  Now I know that's far TMI and very embarassing to post but I'm quickly losing my sense of shame on here and just want to know what's going on 
Blood results on Mon, the next step  
I hope everyone has a great weekend, and we can all take some time to relax. I'm _so_ excited because tomorrow is the Club Noir night I've been looking forward to, so I'll be laced into my corset and a fantastic bustled, fishtail skirt I bought tonight. Funny how you can squeeze a wee bit more out of the shopping budget for clothes without DH being too bothered when you're ttc 
     to all,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hello again

Katy - wow, sounds like a great outfit!!! Fingers crossed for your blood test results on Monday, I get mine then too. 

Hello to everyone else too, hope you are doing well and keeping positive. 

Lots of love and  

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi everyone,
Well last night was fantastic and I had great fun wearing my outfit   Look how far through the cycle we are now girlies - getting there.  I just want this one to hurry up so I can started on the next!  Don't have any BFP or AF symptoms, so just want it over with...
Hope everyone had a good w/e, and keep in touch over the week.
 all,
Take care, 
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey girlies

I got my CD21 blood test result today - 1.3 nmol!!!!! That is quite possibly the lowest of the low!!! Oh well, I knew it would be anyway from my scans. I'm just looking forward to my next AF (  I know!!) so that I can get started again. If AF hasn't arrived by day 28, I'm going to start Provera again. 

Hope everyone is good, take care, 

Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hi all

Hope everyones doing ok - ive been for yet another scan today - i have progress my one and only follicle is now 14 and my endometrium is up to 7.5 - have to go for another scan on weds hopefully it will have gotten even bigger - fingers crossed   

hope evryones monday wasnt too bad - has anyone put there tree up yet?! i have, i just couldnt wait any longer - im so excited about the whole festive season  -got my first x-mas party on saturday - just going for a meal with the girls!! 

Was at the good food show on sat - it was fab - saw gordon ramsey - he was ace!! 

anyway,   and   to you all 

Sj x x


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi everyone 
Aw Bev  Well the good thing is you can get on with the provera again with no worries, and you'll be into your 2nd cycle again before you know it!
That's great news Sj - sounds like you're ready to pop  No, going to put my tree up a week on Sat because we always go for a real one so can't do it before then. I love the smell, and I like to put gingerbread biscuits on it as well to make the flat smell all Christmasmassy. Prob will put the tree up in my classroom soon or there won't be much point before the end of term...
I've had a bit of a frustrating day. I phoned up the hospital this morning, was told I _wouldn't_ get my day 21 results because they don't do them over the phone for data protection (who else would want to know my results? ) Did you get yours over the phone Bev? They told me it was "illegal", but I don't know if that was a line or not?
Argued and was told someone would phone me back between 12 and 2 - they didn't. Finally spoke to a nurse at 4. She agreed it was ridiculous that I was told to up my dose if I didn't know if I ov'd, but she couldn't tell me and the computers were down anyway, yeah right  Said that it was unlikely that I would be told to do anything different other than take the 50mg for 6 months, and she said when we go in in 6 months they would look at the results with us, etc, and then "you might be put on it for another 6 months" . I asked what the point of being on clomid for 6 months if it wasn't working, and that we'd been told there was no point in being on it for longer than 6 months. She just keep saying that she'd speak to the doctor, and try and phone me back after work tomorrow.
What I can see happening is being told to stay on the 50mg and at best getting my results posted to me which would arrive after day 28 (and prob af ) anyway! I've peed on plenty of pee sticks in my time, but I've never been so scared at the prospect than I am about Wednesday. 
To make things worse I feel very upset and guilty tonight. Hubby's cousin had a baby earlier this year, and he finally cracked and told me tonight that his other cousin is pg. He's known for a few weeks, but didn't know how to tell me because he knew it would hurt me. It did  And I feel really awful for being so upset, and for him being torn at what to do to protect me.
Anyway, sorry for the big long rant  Dear me, there's a lot of it!! Hubby has let me nap, cry eat mint chocolate and watch tv tonight, and we're just going to keep our heads down and get on with the next few days. 
Sorry if I've throughly depressed everyone, hope everyone else is feeling a bit more positive,
   all,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Aw Katy, I'm so sorry you're feeling upset. Remember though that what you are feeling is natural and you shouldn't feel guilty about it  
In response to your tx, I think they are barking mad   !!! I received my results over the phone from the receptionist at my GPs no problem. They even phoned me!!!! I will be doing the increased dose next month because there is no point staying on 50mg forever if you are not responding    
I would speak to them again and demand your results now. There is absolutely no reason why they should keep them from you. I think if it is below 30 or 40 (not sure) then it is unlikely you have ovulated. Like I said, mine was 1.3!! Granted, some people don't have their dose increased straight away, I am because I need to have as few AFs as possible otherwise my endometriosis will come back with a vengeance. Still, you should know what is happening in more detail. 
Also, you are completely correct that it is not wise to do clomid for more than 6 months, any longer and your endometrium becomes too thin to conceive in the first place!!! 
I hope you get some good news soon and know that we are here to help you too. 

Lots of love  
Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Thanks Bev 
Well _kinda _ got somewhere today. The nurse from the clinic phoned me back at lunchtime, and told me that I didn't ovulate, and one of the doctors said I've to be on 100mg next month. We're all going to be totally  on here soon with all this clomid  
Obviously not the best news, and I still didn't get a figure - she just said that she was ok because strictly speaking she hadn't told me my results, just that I needed to up my dose. I'm wondering if there's a difference between getting results from the hospital and doctor over the phone, because I've had hormone results from my doctor before? I'm also wondering if it was a very low level, hence the increase, or if they were just trying to shut me up  
I'm doubting very much I'll get AF, and still a bit hazy on what to do next. I explained again that I was provera before, and she said just to start taking it if I don't bleed after day 28. My original advice was to wait for 14 days after af should be due (I know!! ) and do a HPT before I started provera again. I guess the idea is if I didn't ovulate, I might as well get started straight away but it still feels a bit odd 
Ah well, onwards and upwards. Hope everyone's well out there,
  all, Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey katy, that's good news though!! At least you will be on the increased dose and hopefully you'll have results this time round!! I'm doing exactly the same as you, waiting until day 28 and then starting provera. I can't wait (  I know). 

I guess that means you'll be starting today? I really hope we have success this time round!!! 

I still don't understand why you're not getting your results but at least something is being done. Maybe next time you can ask for a comparison between your first and second rounds. 

Anyway, good luck for this cycle, I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. 

Lots of love,   and      

Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hiya

Just shoving my bit in....  I was on norethisterone to induce a bleed and it didnt work, I read the instructions of the clomid in the box and it said take even if I had no bleed. I put this up on the board for opinions and was bombarded by people saying to re check with doc rather than taking without a bleed. In the end was given more norethisteorone and it worked, but not sure what to do about the 2nd cycle if I dont bleed.

I was told to wait til at least day 40, then take a pg test to be sure as Clomid can muck up your cycle.....  Good Luck.


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

bump!
How we doing girlies?  Still sitting twiddling my thumbs waiting for af    Don't really want to have to take provera again, so going to wait until day 35 (next Wed) and take it then if nothing.  Guess we're all out of sync by now then?  
Hope you're doing well out there ex-cycle buddies     for this time round...
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey

I've started taking Provera again because my consultant wants me to have as close to 28 days as possible. Oh well. I thought it might happen naturally but hey ho, not to worry. 

Hopefully AF will arrive soon so I can start my next round. Katy, here's an AF dance for you                      

Hope you're ok. 

Love Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Wow, you're the greatest dancer Bev, thanks  
Had a bit of a brainstorm today.  Thought stuff it, hospital wouldn't tell me to double my dose if it was marginal, only if I def didn't ov.  Feel nowhere near AF and really fed up.  So I did a test - obviously BFN - but wanted to check.  Decided to start the provera today, so here we go again...
You'll be a few days into your Provera then Bev?
Hope all of your girlies are doing well out there,
Take care,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Good on you katy, I hope you get your AF soon. I still haven't got mine but hopefully will do in the next few days. I really can't wait to start my next round of clomid, even though it will be over xmas time. Hopefully my relatives will cope with my mood swings       

Hope you are ok, speak to you soon

Love Bev XxX


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

OMG, woke up this morning, AF has started      

I'll do another AF dance for you Katy            

Had my appointment with infertility specialist today - was ok although he wants me to have a lap & dye test so has put me on the waiting list for it. In the meantime, we've got to keep going with the clomid. 

Hope you're ok

Lots of love, Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Yahoo   That's great new Bev    I'm still taking the provera, so still waiting...
That's good news about your lap and dye too - means you'll know that the clomid is worthwhile if that's alright.  
My clomid's going to be over xmas       At least you're going to get yours out of the way by then  
 for the clomid tomorrow, let me know how you're doing,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey katy

How are you? 

I'm taking my last clomid tablets tonight      Also had a cd5 scan today to check that everything is looking good. Next scan is on xmas eve (cd12) so hopefully I'll have a nice, big follie waiting to burst!! Won't be able to have any more scans after that as the scanning centre are shut from xmas eve til 2nd Jan. I'll still do the ovulation pee sticks and blood tests so hopefully they'll tell me I've ovulated. 

Have you got AF yet?? I hope you do, it would be nice to be (kind of) close to you cycle in your cycle this time round too. 

Anyway, hope you're ok. Take care

Love Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hiya you two - hope you're both well?!

ive finally had some good news from consultatn today - i ahd a CD21 equivelant blood test on fro despite actually being CD33 or something and have got the results back today and apparently i did ovulate!!!!!!!! 

So if AF not arrived by christmas morning ill be testing - to be honest ill prob test before then tho that was the advice the consultant gave me - it would be a good christmas prezzy though otherwise ill be back on the clomid over crimbo too - no drinking for us!! 

Anywya, i prop wont get chncae to come on again before all the festivities as we're away this weekend - hope you both have a happy christmas - and thinking of you adn wishing you lots of luck

Sj x x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

That's great news sj, I really hope you get the xmas pressie you wish for!!! 

I'm sending you lots of positive vibes to help you on your way          

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi girls  Long time no type! That's really great news that you ovulated SJ - fingers crossed you get even better news really soon 
Bev, I'm getting further and further away from your cycle now - I'll probably catch up on the other side  I've finished the Provera, so judging by how long it took the last time AF should arrive on xmas eve, and double the loopy pills start on xmas day   It's seemed like a _very_ long time now, and I just want to start again. Hope you get news on xmas eve. So are you on 50mg or 100mg this time? I keep thinking my result must have been pitiful to bump it up straight away 
Ah well, 3 more days of work, most of my shopping done, gingerbread cookies made for the xmas tree, things could be worse! 
I hope you both have a fantastic Christmas if I don't see you on here first, and that we've all got bits of good AF/follie/test news to share really soon.
   to both,
Katy x


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

christmas greetings to you two too!!   

no news as yet, AF not arrived so keeping my fingers and toes crossed!! 

Katylou - i hope the double dose doesnt send you too mad - they told me at the clinic that if i hadnt ovulated the first month they would double it straight away so i think its good that they are - otherwise, you could just be kind of time wasting when it wasnt going to be effective - im sure it'l be ok!!   

Bev, hope your CD12 scan goes well - come on the follies!!! 

Have a fab christmas

Sj x x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey everyone

This is the last chance I'll get to post before xmas so I just wanted to wish you a merry xmas and a great new year. I think we all deserve a relaxing, enjoyable time. Fingers crossed we get the result soon that we so desperately want. 

I'm having my day 12 scan done on Monday and then we're straight off to see my in-laws for xmas and then off to Spain on boxing day to see my parents!!! Hopefully I'll have some good news on my return and will hopefully hear good news from you both too!!!

Take care, lots of love,   and       

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hey both,
Ooh fingers and toes crossed SJ    Yeah, I'm surprised and pleased they said to double straight away - saves time wasting.  
Sounds like you're going to have a lovely xmas jetting off to Spain Bev- lucky you    Fingers crossed for good news for your scan.
Well I AF turned up today  so clomid tomorrow and hopefully the worst of AF will be over by Tue, and the   pills won't have kicked in properly yet... 
Have a great time girlies - 2008 IS going to be our year - I've decided  
Lots of Christmas wishes         
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey everyone, I'm back from sunny spain!!

How are you? Well, I hope. 

Just to let you know I had some great news at my scan on xmas eve, I was told my lining was really good (3 layers and 9mm) and I had a 24mm follicle waiting to pop!!! She said it looked 'raggedy' and it should be released in the next few days. Then, on xmas day, I did my pee stick as always and got a positive ovulation result!!! I was so thrilled. So lots of BMS for me while I was at my in-laws and then my parents   and now fingers crossed for my   . So far, I have been analysing every single thing but something that I do have is really, REALLY sensitive nipples (sorry if TMI!). Of course this is getting me really excited, my DH is trying to calm me down, saying it might be an ovulation symptom rather than a BFP symptom but hopefully it is, only time will tell (any thoughts??)  Will be having my day 21 and 24 bloods again and then testing on Jan 9th.

Anyway, hopefully everyone is doing well, Katy I see you finally got AF, hopefully you haven't been too   over the xmas period. 

Hope to catch up with you soon. 

Lots of love   and      

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hey Bev,
That's great news about your HUGE follie, hopefully it went "pop"! Poor you having to do the old BMS at your parents and in-laws  I really hope it's good news for you this month. I get sore (.)(.) at various stages, it's hard to tell why they'e sore sometimes. I know it's hard but you're just going to have to hang in there for  and see - and come and moan on here when you're going properly   
Yeah, I'm now on CD 9 - BORING! - and I'm going to try the pee-sticks again. The last time I did them I had no cycle at all, and they showed nothing. I really want to know if this mega-dose of clomid is working. Must say - don't feel _too _  on it just now!
Hope you're having a suitably festive time, and happy new year when it comes. You might be getting some fab news just round the corner 
        

Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey Katy, Happy New Year!!!

How are you? I'm going              . I can't stop thinking about my 2ww and it is driving me nuts!! I've started feeling nauseous now which only gets me really hopeful and my nips are still really sensitive (sorry   ). I was out with DH walking the dog and started retching because of a smell outside!! I have these hpts that detect 25 units of hcg and I'm really tempted to use one tomorrow, even though I'll only be cd21. My DH thinks I'm mad because it's unlikely to show a +ve even if I am pregnant and that'll get me really upset!! I think I need the   to come in and tell me off. What are your thoughts??

Anyway, glad you're not too   for the moment!! I used pee sticks the first cycle and it showed nothing (I didn't ovulate and my progesterone levels were only 1.3!!) but this time it was good news. Even though it drives you nuts, I would still recommend using them, even if it is just to feel like you are doing something!! I have my day 21 blood test tomorrow so hopefully that'll show a good result. 

Hope you are ok, will update you when I know more.

Love and   and       for you. 

Bev XxX


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## petdowe (Mar 17, 2006)

Just wanted to wish you all  and hope that your dreams will all come true real soon
           
Fingers are crossed for you all too take care nicky


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hiya!

Happy new year to you all

Bev - i hope things are going well for you!! 

Katie lou - i started my clomid on boxing day so we arent far apart i dont think - go for my forst follie tracking scan on fri - im hoping for a big one like bev!!!

Wishing you all lots of love and luck for 2008 - lets hope this os our year

Speak soon

Sj x x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey sj, how are you?

Good luck for you scan, I'll keep my fingers crossed for you hun       

Love Bev XxX


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hi Bev/Katylou

Dont know if you read the other Clomid main thread, but I got a BFP today.... I am 6 weeks pg - lots of       for you this year for the same.
Rach
x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

OMG Congratulations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm so happy for you Stalyvegas. Good luck for the rest of your journey.     

Keep us updated, lots of love

Bev XxX


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hey everyone -
Wow Stalyvegas     What a fantastic start to the year - you must be 
Sorry I haven't been around much ladies - I've been finding this cycle much harder than the first, and I just didn't want to be on here too much dwelling on ttc  I'm on day 16 just now, and no more convinced that anything has happened than the last time. If anything I feel that I've had_ fewer _ symptoms and pains this time round! Blood tests on Sat, so DH can come too. I'm not looking forward to standing my ground and demanding to know the results this time, but guess I don't have a choice  
I've been doing OPKs (the ones where you need two lines the same to be a positive), and on day 14 and 15 I got two lines, but the second wasn't dark enough to be a positive. I'm hoping I got the surge on the way up and on the way down. Any thoughts? 
Bev,  far too early to test hun, but you know that  When's your proper test date then?  for then, you never know  
Did you find out anything at your scan SJ? Fingers crossed you had a nice big follie 
Hope to hear some good news from you all soon,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi everyone

Katylou - I'm sorry to hear your finding this cycle hard but from what I've read, each cycle can be different, it doesn't necessarily mean nothing has happened. Good luck for your blood tests, I hope you get some positive results from it. Hopefully having your DH with you will make a difference, it certainly did for me when I brought my DH into the appointments with me. 

I don't really know when my official test date is because I don't have regular cycles. I'm going to test again tomorrow and then up until day36 just in case I'm a late developer    I have to be absolutely certain it isn't a bfp before taking my provera again. 

Keep us updated, big   and    

Bev XxX


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## linlou17 (Jul 3, 2007)

hi bev sorry i dont know you i usually post on the main thread but just read your post and wanted to wish you lots of luck i really hope you get bfp       i am currently on 2ww and cannot think of anything else its taking over!!! its so hard not to analyse things i was once in bath getting dp to see if he thought my nipples were darker than before!!! lol the things we do you gota laugh!!!  anyway all the best and keep us posted i will keep popping on to see if you have any news

katy all the best with the tests i agree each cycle can be different try to stay   take care and good luck

L xx


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi linlou

Thanks for the post. I did the same thing with the nips except we were lying in bed and I'm holding them up towards them going 'look, do they look different??'   I'm going to chill out tonight because I am feeling rubbish. Had cramps all last night and today and I'm now just waiting for the   to turn up. I've decided this calls for a night of pizza, ice cream, duvet and some dvds. I'm testing tomorrow morning so I'll let you know what happens from there!!

Good luck when you test, here's to a BFP for everyone!!              

Bev XxX


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## linlou17 (Jul 3, 2007)

ah bev hope the   dont find you!!  yes keep me posted how you go on. and enjoy your pi**a and ic**re*m - i have written it like that as i am on strict diet and they are swear words to me at the moment!!   i'll let you off though as you're not feeling too good think you deserve them!!!

my last 3 cycles (without clomid) have been 32-36 days started 100mg clomid this cycle am not sure when af is due but will prob wait until at least 30 days

       to everyone

L x


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

Hi all, 

Sorry for the delay - ive been buy trying to do some work over the last couple of days - im studying for a degree at the mo  - submission date of assignment number 4 tomoz - fianlly got it finished - four modules down - one biggy to go!!!!!!

I was glad to read about you lot and the nipple checking - ive been known to take photos of them before now!!! 

well, fridays scan was really positive - had two follies, one at 11 and one at 15 and my endometrium was at 6, went again on moday and it was rubbish - well im not sure if teh scan was rubbish or the woman doing it was rubbish - she said she couldnt tell if i had ovulated and my follie that was at 15 was now sasuage shaped and if its sausage shaped and i havent ovulated its tru sze would be much less than 10 she said shed have to check the pics from fri and then never came back to me she just told the receptionist i need to come back again on weds - im sooooooo fed up, its ridiculous - each scan ive had has been done by a different woman - considering i ahd 8 scans last cycle and two already on this one thats a lot of women!!!!!!!!! personally, i think i did ovulate and therefore, its just collapsing as they do post ovulation - it does drive you mad tho if there was a bit of consistency with the scanning ladies it would be a start - at least then they could remeber what it looked like last time instead of having to interpret what someone else thinks!   

anyway, on a positive note i think that stylevegas is just the first in a long line of us to get the BFP that we all so desperately want, so, chin up everyone - this year s definately going to be the year!!!!!!!!!!!!!!             

ill keep you posted and try and get on here tomoz and let you know whats what - ive got my CD21 blood test on moday then back at the consultant on weds so should get my results then!! 

Love to you all

Sj x x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hey everyone

Just to let you know that I tested this morning and it was a BFN.    I'm not going to test again until day 36 unless AF arrives of course. I know I'm not pregnant so I just want to get on with the next cycle now. 

DH and I are trying to decide whether to not have blood tests and scans this month because it makes me think about ttc all day every day. Instead, since I got a +ve ovulation result, we were just going to use that next cycle. What do you think about this?

Anyway, thanks for all your support and encouragement. I really hope we all get the BFPs we want so much. 

Lots of love

Bev XxX


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

hi bev, 

i'm sorry you didnt get teh result you were after - this morning anyway.    

its difficult to know what to do for the best isnt it - ive been scanned this cycle as last cycle lasted so long (you only normally get scanned thru one lot of treatment on teh NHS)- last cycle i was doing my BBT but is didnt really seem to be steady - it was still all over the place and drove me insane as i seemed to be continually scutinising it, and so this cycle i just havent bothered - i do seem to have felt a lot calmer so far - i think that some of these things just add further pressure sometimes - im not saying this is the case all the time, or for everyone, i suppose in teh end up iots how each individual feels isnt it? 

on a positive note at least you have ovulated - the way i try adn look at it now is that before the treatment i wasnt ovulating at all but now last cycle i did, so really, despite the last year ive been trying im now at the same sort of stage as somone without fertility problems ttc and not everyone gets a BFP straight away do they - even without problems- am i making sense - i know what i mean!!its not always easy - buit i try and remain positive - i know that one day ill get there and i just need to remain calm in teh meantime!!!!!!  

have you tried any other treatments, any complimeta=ory therapies or anything? i hjad reflexology for a little while and it didnt neceissarily help with my PCOS symptoms or anything but did help me to relax and chill out - again i know its different for everyone but might be worth thinkinh about. 

anyway, best dash - im actually at work - ill let you know how i get on this afternoon

Hope everyone is ok

Speak soon - thinking about you

Sj x x


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## linlou17 (Jul 3, 2007)

bev sorry you got negative result i know how hard it is i have developed a bit of a testing phobia it kills me when the line wont appear despite me begging and pleading with it.  i have not had scan yet (next cycle) but i find i think about it too much already at least you know that you are ov and when so you can work around that i have had blood tests which show that i do ov i just dont know when as cycle irregular so i am hoping to have scan and injection to bring on ov so that we know we are "doing it!" at the right time.  its so hard though just do what you and dh feel is the best for you and keep ya chin up xx

take care and all the best to you and sj79


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## Stalyvegas (Oct 14, 2007)

Hi Bev

So sorry its a disapointing month - I dont get scans etc... just day 21 bloods (which mean bugger all to me anyway) - and I dont use OPK kits as I have PCOs and apparently they dont work very well alongside that. I didnt even do a pg test as I thought it hadnt worked, so imagine my surprise to find out it did.

Good things can happen, and I am thinking lots of positive thoughts for you, hope AF arrives soon so that you can get cracking with the next go.
Take care
R
xxx


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## sj79 (Sep 2, 2007)

hi all, 

just  a quick update - they still cant work out from my follies if i ovulated or not - have to go back again on friday!!   

i think i did ovulate on sunday - change in CM ect - but well just wait and see what the cd21 blood test shows!

Bev, i hope you're feeling ok

Speak soon

Sj x x


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi girls,
Oh Bev, I'm so sorry   You know you were ovulating though hun, and you did everything right - just not your time this month.  Why don't you try just getting the bloods this month?  Then your cons has a record of how clomid is working in your body and you're still getting a bit of offficial monitoring, but you might take off a bit of the pressure if you don't go for the scans.  
Grr SJ   That must be really frustrating.  Fingers crossed you did ov already then, and hopefully I was your ovulating buddy  
I don't feel any different today really, just really tired.  Just fell asleep for a few hours after eating, but I'm putting it down to not sleeping well last night with the storms.  
    to everyone,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi everyone

Thank you for your kind thoughts. AF arrived yesterday afternoon so I'm starting clomid again tomorrow. 

Here's to BFPs for everyone        

Lots of love and 

Bev XxX


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## linlou17 (Jul 3, 2007)

ah good luck for this cycle bev

L xx


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## katylou (Nov 11, 2007)

Hi everyone,
How're we doing?  You must be on your clomid now then Bev - hope you're not too      Lots of luck for this cycle   
Could they tell you anything else useful at your scan yesterday sj?  Hope you got some good news  
Well, had my 21 bloods this morning (at 9.15, over on the other side of the city  ), which meant I could take DH with me.  It was a different nurse and a MUCH better experience.  She said all the crap about patient confidentially again, blah, blah, but that she would put a note on my form to get a doctor to write a letter or phone this time when the results came in   She said I did the right thing with the provera last cycle *smug*  She didn't know whether or not they would up me to 150mg or not if it hadn't worked - said it would depend on the doctor, but she reassured me that if it wasn't working then they would re-think.  I was worried I was going to be made to do 6 cycles regardless!  My next cons appointment is April 9th, so if I don't get natural AF and I have to do the whole provera thing then I would guess I could fit in this cycle plus another before that time  
I feel much happier today because she took the time to talk to me, and didn't have the "disapproving" air the other nurse had - I don't know if it was cos of my age (everyone at the clinic looks about 10 years older than me) or if she thought I was bolshy the first time    Onwards and upwards  
Hope everyone's alright out there, and having a good w/e,
      all,
Katy x


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## bev82 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hi Katy

I've just posted on your other thread but wanted to say congrats on a great day 21 blood test result - keeping my fingers crossed for a BFP for you (and us too!!   )

Bev XxX


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## cleg (Jun 27, 2006)

just popping on to send  's to all who have had a bad month this time round buit fiongers crossed that next month will be the one

also have a little suggestion that you girls that are still on the clomid take over the CLOMID CHICKS 2007 thread what do you think ? its just that most of the ladies on there now are no longer taking clomid + for  new FF'ers that come onto the clomid board that is probably one of the 1st places they go + we are no longer on the crazy pills so the supprot is not the same as others that are cycling with clomid, us EX clomid chicks will start a new thread so if you want to take over that one   feel free me dearies  

xxx


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## linlou17 (Jul 3, 2007)

hi thats a great idea by cleg, me and a couple of other girls (all on the   pills ) post on there quite a lot so why dont you join us the more the merrier!!!

L xx


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