# Create Health Clinic : Part 2



## dakota (Feb 6, 2007)

New home ladies, love and luck to you all


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## rolney (Feb 1, 2009)

Great news CWSG.  Very happy for you


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Just bookmarking!!


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## LEECOWDEN (May 24, 2005)

Jess, 

Have been following your cycle and thought I'd check in to see if you had been tempted to test before d-day. Wow!!!! That's fantastic. Good luck with the bloods tomorrow, just keep thinking positive vibes xxx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

oh, i didnt even know there were these messages

thanks so much all for your congratulations and good vibes.

I will find out tomorrow results of blood tests but everone telling me theres noway it will be diffrerent. Not sure if i will be able to tell if its twins as sometimes one baby can produce high hcg.

those pregants ladies - does create give a free scan and if so at which time?
Also what vitamins are you taking, i'm already taking folic acid and vitel dha fish oils, but is there a particular multi vit and supplement thats best to take too?

cwsg xxxx


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

CW - Try not to think about whether it is twins or not. You are quite right, it can be impossible to tell. I think just a very low or very high number can be indicative of an issue ie hcg 4 or hcg 8000. But of course the clinic will let you know if you should worry or not.

Re the scan, yes, they offer an early pregnancy scan at about 6 weeks to confirm that the pregnancy is in the correct place and how many there are. This scan was included in the cycle 'package' We were asked back the following week (at our own expense) as one baby had a heart beat but the other didn't yet. Next time I think I would rather just have the included early preg scan at 7 weeks as some other clinics suggest. I suppose it depends on your own history and feelings.

About the vitamins, I have been on sanatogen pro natal for about three years now   Pregnacare also do a good combined pill. Mostly it is just folic acid at this stage that is really important and you having lots of rest and a good diet, which I am sure you do already. I read conflicting reports on the effects of Omega 3 fish oil supplements in pregnancy so I took one every couple of days and eventually cut them out.

Hope this helps!

Beegey x


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

beegey,


thanks for the advice, its dha ive been taking, they sell it through the Zita west clinc, i think its different from omega 3 oils.
I will get one of these vitimin complexes. I was taking one before but ran out.
I'm feeling worried about the result tomorrow. I'll be glad when i can start to relax.

when did you start to stop worrying about the pregnancy.


cwsg


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Dont be worried about the result   The pee stick tests are very accurate these days. Hmmm, when did I stop worrying...Hate to braek it to you, but I never have really! Our pregnancy, though officially 'normal' has had some complications ie losing the twin at 9weeks, the baby being so small in the beginning, then a suspected heart problem, then she was in the wrong position..Currently concerned that she is not engaged yet and I am 37 weeks tomorrow. Dh is worried about something going wrong at the birth and the baby being deprived of oxygen. Or a nurse dropping her.  . BUT, it was a great relief to get to 12/13 weeks and to be given the all clear at our anomaly scan at 20 weeks. And once she started to move it was a real comfort too.

Just try to enjoy now for what it is. Once you have it confirmed by the blood test, there is a 'waiting for the first scan' thread which can be quite helpful xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

thanks beege,

just phoned to get blood test result and its got to be seen by a doctor first, so must wait till 1pm. This is such a long wait. I also need to find out about scans too.

cwsg


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

cwsg !!! WOW

So pleased for you   


Gives me hope to at 43! Although 44 in July


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi everyone!!

CW ... looking out for the results of your blood test! So excited for you!!
How many did you freeze this cycle? 
You froze some at day3 didnt you??
Why did they freeze some at day 3 and not the others,,, the ones you left for day 5?? Why didnt they just freeze them all or leave them all to day 5?
Just a question as it made me wonder??

Im doing a frozen cycle at the moment and am doing blood tests every second day at the clinic waiting for progesterone to be just right!!


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi Angels and Shell, good to hear from you both.
I got my blood test back and its positive.
Need to phone the hospital for the level as they didnt write it down aparently.
I have my free scan at create on june 24, 

Shell, they froze just one egg on day 3, I dont remember them saying why, but think it was because it was at a good stage, the others were slower, but they got to blasocyst, so I felt a bit sad that they didnt freeze them. They said that they wouldn't have felt confident that they would make babies?
I hope they didnt sell them on the black market 

I hope that all works perfectly for you Shell, sending baby vibes your way  

angels, where are you at now.

cwsg xxx


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## LEECOWDEN (May 24, 2005)

cwsg - many many congratulations. I have to agree with Beegey - this is the start of the worrying, and now that mine are 2 years old and 7 months old - I still worry. 

XXX


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi cw

glad the bloods came back positive, great news    

quick question: did any of you at create do acupuncture as part of your treatment and did you have sessions during treatment as well as at transfer?  This was the only thing that Geeta suggested I do differently this time as it all went well, I just had a biochemical pregnancy and I think I will be more stressed this time as last time was so easy.  Any thoughts much appreciated.

hope everyone else doing well...where is everyone in their treatment?

x


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

lulumead,

i had accupunture 3 times during the week, after egg collection and twice on the day of egg transfere, imediately before and after. The woman is in Tooting, which is managable from Wimbledon. I can pass on her contact details, in fact i've given create her cards at reception. Her name is Juliette Davis.
If you want her number private messege me.
My accupuncturist here in Wales did all the ground work over the last 2 years.

cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Ooh Cw! didnt realise there was a black market! I will have to look into that!!   
I think I will be buying!


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## rolney (Feb 1, 2009)

Morning all
Hope everyone is well.  Create seems very busy at the moment.  I was there yesterday and Erica mentioned they had done 11 egg collections on Monday and 3 transfers.  Must be busy times for them.

Well I got my AF on Monday but quickly dealt with the fact as the odds of a BFP from no egg collected and IUI were pretty low.  Had to go in for an early scan (day 3) as I'm going away with my in-laws to the Lake District for a long weekend.  All clear by the looks of things so am starting 150ml of Menopur on Friday until next scan on Monday.  I think they call this a controlled cycle? I only ever take this a step at the time now after previous experiences so will update again on Monday if we are going any further ahead.

Enjoy the weekend


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi bobbi... what is tcm I keep meaning to book another accupuncture session but havent got round to it!!!
How is it going for you Bobbi, August is just a few months away!! At least you have a date!!

I agree, after cws result, I may even start drinking that lovely wheatgrass again!!   

Rolney... have a very good weekend and Im hoping this treatment cycle will be the one for you!!
I love the lake district!! Lucky you!!

Lulumead... when you starting treatment again?? 

cw... happy days!!! How are you feeling?

I had my one and only frostie from my second IVF(long time ago) cycle put back today. I was really happy as my embie survived the thaw! 
So this has been my very first FET!!! Soooo easy, it was a natural frozen cycle! Snuggle in embie!!!!PLEASE!!


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi i got my hcg level today from my test day, 1 june and it was 167.

Am waiting for create to phone me back with interpretation..re twin or not or dont know.

cwsg


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Cw - they will probbly be reluctant to speculate with regards to the twin thing. Mine was 169 at 13 days post ec and it was twins but everybody is different. Most def preggers though  

Shell - Good luck with your FET! Sounds like a very tough little embie to me  

Beegey xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

beegey,

I see that it is common to loose twin in the first few weeks, so if i do have twins then this may happen, but it feels bet not to think about it. You must be over the moon to have made it this far with you wonderfull baby growing inside.
Did you have your first scan at 7 weeks, then 12 weeks, then 20 weeks.

omg! you are due in 2 and a half weeks, that amazing and so exiting 

how are you feeling now, 

cwsg xx


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

so many of you pregnant.....can some of it rub off on me...ha ha. Im not at create at the moment, maybe i should be.

Good luck Shell and cwsg

angels


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello ladies

CW; numbers are sounding good - how exciting.

beegey - hope last couple of weeks go by quickly

shell: hope embie is snuggling in nicely  

Rolney and bobby - hope you're doing ok.

I think I should be starting towards end of the week/next weekend, just have to wait for period to kick in  

xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

shell,    great news that your embie is now snuggling in, 
I'm taking this chinese herb called planting seeds which is for this, you can buy it in tablet form.
Are you taking complete rest, make sure you do for the first 4 days 
Glad it all went so easy, that a good sign.

good luck angels and lulumead

Lee - thanks for posting, will need you advice about pregnancy soon.

cwsg


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

bobbi,

glad to hear you have found a good accupuncturist, you sound really happy!

shell - how are you feeling

cwsg


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## Kellois (Jan 28, 2009)

Hello everyone! 

I lost the link to the new thread so have been searching for a day or two. Now caught up on all your news. 

CW - so happy for you and your +ve result. That's fabulous news. As for "when do you stop worrying", you never do! My son is almost five and we still cluck and worry about him. I'm sure my mum still worries about me!!

Rolney - Thanks for your PM. AF arrived for me too yesterday. I've booked a follow up with Geeta on Thursday at H St, so will find out what her prognosis is for us. Terrified that she'll say, "no more treatment at all for you missus". But you know what, I'm half considering just taking three months off and enjoying the summer. I'm fed up of this relentless rollercoaster and the stress of it all. 

Good luck to everyone with all their treatment!
K


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi everyone, how are you all today

My cramping got worse today, it happened to be after yoga, which was very mild? So i'll be even more carefull next time.
I have been worried because of the pmt like symptoms, i wish i know what i would be like without the progesterone.
I can believe i've got to take it for another 2 months. I have fear about the baby'ies not lasting, which is really horrible, but understandable since it's still hard to believe it has worked. I guess my emotions are balancing themselves out after a week of bliss.
I havent had any bleeding, so hopefully this means they/it is still growing wonderfully inside. The truth is I wont really know till the scan in two and a half weeks. Before this i have got to make a performance and installation!!!OMG

sorry getting into diary form, this happens when i'm uptight and need to release mental tension.

hopefully i'll feel better later.


Jess


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Jess  . Try not to worry, cramping and tummy pains are very common at this stage as long as the cramping is not severe and accompanied by bleeding. Your body is going through massive changes at the moment and your uterus will be stretching too. If you can hun, I would give up the yoga for a while. This is a really delicte stage in preg as you know and it is best to give yourself the best chances from the start  

BTW, we were scanned at 6 weeks (Create), 7 weeks (Create)9 w (Create), 11w (nuchal scan, Create), 12 w (nhs nuchal) 13w (more accurate nuchal at Create) and quite a few times by nhs after that because of the suspected heart condition which Prof C picked up at 11 weeks. Last one is this Friday, 38 weeks, with the nhs to ensure the baby is at the right position for labour. This child has been seriously papped  . Dh says I am scanorexic!

Hope everyone else is well - there is a great vibe on this board now and I really hope that we have lots more bfp's from Create!

Beegey x


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Jess, I'm sure all will be fine, but maybe a month of yoga would be a good idea, although I'm sure if you do regularly anyway there shouldn't be a problem...I've told my yoga teacher I'm preparing for next go and she is keeping an eye on me in class - which is nice.

Not long now beegey  

hope consult is good on thursday Kellios

hello to everyone else.

eeek, should start going again at the weekend...excited but scared...I always find the week before treatment a bit stressful, as a singlie I start to have lots of wonderings about whether I'm doing the right thing, am I destroying chances of ever meeting nice bloke etc etc...but then I think I know I want to have children, I'm practically 37 and if I don't do it now it might be too late!!! oh la la....

good to see BFP's on here, I so want it to work as I think create's philosophy is right  

x


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

thanks for your replies beegee and lulumead,

beegeey, you may be right about stopping yoga for a few weeks, i'm so used to doing it and it has supported me for so long that this will be a big change, but, i'll do what is needed to give everything the best chance. I'll just have to teach without doing it.
My you have had alot of scans, but i see why if there may have been a problem. My first scan will be just over 7 weeks.
thanks for the   i really need them at the moment.

The cramps have gone now too. I havent had any bleeding.

good luck Lulumead

cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulumead.... lots of luck, thinking of you. I cannot believe you are already starting again! 

Cw... lucky lady, how are you feeling?

hello to everyone, bobbi, kellois, rolney and anyone I have missed.

Today I am 5dp6dt and I did a home test and as usual nothing!!Well still a few more days to wait and test. I really hate this part of the treatment. The waiting!! My blood test is set for sunday.


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## Kellois (Jan 28, 2009)

Hi all

*Bobbi3* - Where are you going for your TCM and acupuncture? And where are you at right now re: cycling? Is Geeta ok for you to do another stimmed cycle?

*Shell034* - What does "5dp6dt" mean??

*CW* - I'm sure everything is fine, but if you are worried at all about the early stages of pregnancy, get yourself down to see your GP or your early pregnancy advisory unit at your hospital. Don't worry about thinking that you are making a nuisance of yourself - that is what they are there for. The first 12 wks can be really nerve-wracking, spotting is common and not always a bad sign. But if you've got any concerns, better to go get it checked out properly that worry at home.

*Everyone * - What does OTD mean?? Sorry I'm just not that message-board savvy!

KL


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## Be Lucky (Mar 22, 2008)

Jess.crampin is very common in early pregnancy.i had them2.but better wait till 7wks 4 scan as u mite not c a heartbeat till then and that wld make u feel worse.i spk fm experience.beegay cant believe baba nearly here!luv 2 all berniex


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## rolney (Feb 1, 2009)

Good luck Lulumead

Hope your appt with Geeta goes ok Kellois

Fingers crossed for your test Shell

Have had a bit of a nightmare this week.  Went for 8 day scan on Monday and just the one follie despite taking 150 Menopur to help things along.  Got a phone call Monday night from bloods to say my LH was too high for size of follie and couldn't start the cetrotide.  We are now at risk of spontaneous ovulation and am tracking surge every 12 hours.  Create were great and have me a schedule of egg collections for next few days and very clear instructions.  But I'm terrified if we go ahead tomorrow.  There is no anaethetist in and if I have EC tomorrow it will be without any sedation.  I really don't know if I can do it.  Anyone else been in this position?  What a quandary...


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## rolney (Feb 1, 2009)

Crisis averted hopefully.  I didn't get a positive test tonight so am going ahead with HCG injection tonight at 00.45 for EC on Friday.....with sedation thank goodness.  Must keep myself awake for next hour and a half  

Very glad to have stopped the Menopur which gives me crashing headaches and makes me very


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

good luck Rolney,

fingers crossed that you get an egg 

cwsg


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## Kellois (Jan 28, 2009)

Dear Rolney

Best, best, best of luck for EC this week. I'll be keeping everything crossed for you! 

I'm in exactly the same boat as you, had a day 6 scan and only one follie (this has stopped upsetting me now, I'm genuinely delighted to have one!), so am thinking of just trying completely naturally this month. Remember that it only takes one follie and that completely natural conceptions are usually only one egg, from one follie. 

I wish you all the best that they can get the egg and that it all goes according to plan,

KL xx


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## rolney (Feb 1, 2009)

Thanks for your kind messages.  Another bad day for us.  No egg retrieved again and follie hadn't grown enough with the Menopur.  We had better size without the Menopur!
Oh well, back to Geeta in a couple of weeks for follow up


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

sorry to hear that Rolney - hope you get some answers or way forward when you meet with Geeta.
 

xx


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## Kellois (Jan 28, 2009)

Dearest Rolney,

So, so sorry to hear that the EC didn't work for you. I'm in exactly the same boat and absolutely, completely sympathise with the disappointment you and your partner must be feeling right now. Try to stay strong. Fingers crossed for next month for a big juicy follie growing all on its own. It can happen.  Don't give up hope. 

BTW - make sure Create do refund you all the monies owing due to no egg collection. I got quite a chunk back which kind of makes the bad news easier to stomach. 

All the best, PM me at any time if you want to let off steam and if you think I can help at all,

KL


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## lily17 (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi All
I am new to Create, had my first appointment with Geeta last week, I was very impressed with the examination of me, very thourough, sadly it did reveal that my own ovarian activity is poor, and Geeta confirmed that DE is the only way forward for me. Its what I had resigned to anyway, but I am shocked how rapidly my ovaries have stopped being active, when I had very good response to IVF with my own eggs twice last August!!! I was 43 last time, but I am now 44, so I suppose its only natural at my age.
I am delighted Create have a partner clinic in Cyprus,with no waiting list- I will definately be booking in for DE there if my donors in the UK dont work out. It takes quite a while for UK donors to be screened so at the moment I am waiting to see if they get through screening.
Before I knew about my poor ovarian reserve I was interested in the natural IVf that Create offer, I asked my local consultant about mild and natural IVF that Create deliver, and he dismissed it as a treatment with very poor results and not widely used because of that reason. He said that the body naturally produces follicles without eggs in them, so its very risky relying on the 1 egg the body produces every month which is what natural IVF does. I suppose he must be right, when I think back to my own IVFlast year, I had 9 eggs from 12 follicles, so there were some follicles without eggs in. Having said that,Create must have some positive results, or they wouldnt offer it at all!

Karen xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Karen

welcome to the board!  sorry to hear things didn't go as expected but at least there is a way forward and its better I suppose that you get told what the most likely chance of getting pregnant is.  I do think Geeta is very direct which is good (although sometimes hard to hear!) and therefore makes me trust that they aren't just after your money but about trying to get the result.  Hope your wait isn't too long   

I start injections tonight for my 2nd stimulated IVF...excited but very fearful that it won't work following my last experience which was all so good and resulted in biochemical pregnancy.  Oh well, need to keep positive.

hope everyone else doing ok.
xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello Everyone,

It has been quiet here!!

Hello bobbi, how are you?? I went for my first appointment for TCM and accupuncture today and it wasnt soooo bad!! I am going to get some herbs as well!!

CW... how is are you feeling? 

Rolney.... so sorry to hear about the empty folly!!

Kellois... when are you starting again? 5dp6dt means 5 days past a 6 day transfer!!

Karen, welcome!!!!

Lulumead.... fingers crossed, this cycle it will work!

Well all the home tests are negative for this frozen cycle! Havent done a blood test yet, was supposed to go yesterday but didnt bother. just waiting for AF now. Started with Acupuncture and TCM today and have an appointment with UCH tomorrow so think I will take a months break and then on to the next!!


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## Kellois (Jan 28, 2009)

Hello again Shell!

I'm not sure when I'm starting again, probably August. We went for a consultation wtih Geeta last week and she said she isn't that optimistic for ivf (mild or natural) working for us with my super low amh and two lots of empty follicles. We discussed various options. Her recommendation is for a donor egg but as we have a son already, my DH isn't keen. And I'm not sure either. 

So we are trying for a natural conception this month and July (mainly due to very busy couple of months and holidays). So pray for a miracle!! And then we are going to think again for a different protocol for the cycle in August. Geeta suggested putting me on a controlled natural on Menopur from day 5 and then seeing if I get an egg from the follicle. She's suggested we can do this just the once and then revert to completely natural IVF. In total she's only happy for us to attempt a couple more times with IVF. Then if that doesn't work, she has said I could go for ovulation induction to guarantee one follicle each month. This can't be clomid as I've taken too much of this already, so maybe tamoxifen instead. 

And then if that doesn't work - well, I think our attempts to have a second child will be over for us and I'll probably spend thousands of pounds in therapy to get us over it! But I'm very very blessed to have one child already. 

KL XX

(feeling very philosophical about my predicament today as just heard that a friend I met through the NCT five years ago died suddenly and without any warning on Saturday morning. Went to bed on Friday and didn't wake up. She leaves behind a five year old son and 9 month old (ivf) twins. She was 36)


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Kellois,

That is awful! 9 month IVF twins and only 36!!
 

I hope it works out for you over the next few months. 

I must admit I am so tired of IVF... I look to the future and see that there will be a day, when I wont be thinking of my next ivf cycle!!

I really need just once a positive!! But we will carry on trying for now!


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Really sorry to here everyones disappiontments, Shell, Rolney, Kellios.

I am very tired at the moment.
Trying to deal with my fear over the scan results in a week and a half at Create, and just about to go away for work to Coventry for 11 days. The scan is towards the end of this eleven days.
I have been feeling a mix of happyness and enjoying everyone saying how well i look with tiredness, cramps and twinges lessening now. I have no nausea but am little more sensitive to what i eat. i have alot of trapped wind.
I have told a fair amount of people now, but not officially annonced it, waiting till 12 weeks for this, or a bit before.
I'm only 6 weeks.   
it feels like the 2ww all over again, but a big step further.

cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Oh my Kellios - that sounds horrible about your friend from NCT. How sad.

Try not to worry CW - I'm sure it will all be ok.

I start injections again tonight so 1st scan friday!  I am starting to talk to my follicles now!! just to give them some encouragement.
xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu... I have a good feeling for you with this cycle!! Fingers crossed!!

CW... 6 weeks!! It feels like it has been longer than 6 weeks!!! Come on 13 weeks!! and lots and lots of luck for the scan!

CW did you take any herbs, I am sure we had this discussion before but today I decided to do acupuncture and the lady is giving me herbs

Anyone have some experience of herbs to tell me


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

shell,

yes i have taken herbs, infact i'm taking them now. They really help. Mine have been in powder and now tablet form, but i've heard other have had to boil up the mixtures themselves, which seems harder. What type have you got.
Really so sorry that it hasn't worked out for you this time. Have you waited long enough for the test.
Accupuncturist and herbalist do seem to vary alot, so go with recomendation if you dont feel completely comfortable with this one. I could ask mine to recomend one in your area if its needed.

best wishes

take care

cwsg xxx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi

i am doing a dance/art project in Coventry about fertiliy/infertility and my experience.
On
www.summerdancing.co.uk

then look up performance series, Herbert series, Jessica Lerner Conception Vessel

If anyones near by I would love it if you could come. I also doing a performance at 5pm on Wednesday 24 June there.

cwsg (Jessica)

/links


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks shell...am hoping this one goes ok!
CW; that sounds great...i used to live in cov and was part of theatre company based there. if i was nearer I would definitely be there. I too work in the arts! Not long til your scan, how exciting. x

love to everyone else.
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello creaters!

day 5 scan today and all good...nice bunch of follies developing and lining doing well so I start cetrotide tomorrow night as well and then have scan again on monday morning. Not sure when egg collection will be but sometime between weds and fri...hopefully friday as I managed to work my work around this!!

hope everyone else doing ok.  The herbs sounds great.  Beegey must almost be ready to pop by now  

xx


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone!

I have just joined this forum.
I've read some of your posts and really hope all goes well for all and each of you.
My experience at Create H. has been good- specially after having a terrible experience at Chelsea&W.  

Have to say that at first I was against going through any kind of fertility treatment that required taking drugs. My partner was hoping I changed my mind. I researched on-line and found a Geeta Nargund's article about Women Health and fertility. We decided to talk about this with our GP and he refered us to her at St George's.
Once my partner and I met Geeta I did understand very quickly I could trust her opinion. 
So, we decided to have a go and book an appointment at her clinic. During the first consultation, Geeta said that she did expect from me to do well (35%) and we thought that it was a good enough percent. 
During the treatment I felt very comfortable with every member of the staff and I hardly noticed any second effects to the injections. I felt my health was put first than any other goal. I am grateful for that.

Cwsg, congratulations for your pregnancy, I understand your fear of scans at this stage of your pregnancy. I have been pretty relaxed during the cycle and VERY philosophical about the result- it helped me a lot that my partner was as good as gold. But now I am finding the wait until 12-weeks a bit of a nightmare.

Lulu, lots of **** luck for you at this moment. 

By the way, I am trying Reflexology- had my first session last week-will have once a month. Acupuncture/herbs never worked for me, I felt ill after every treatment and had to stop but Reflex. is good and nice . In my first session I was recommended some kind of homeopathic treatment with salts for the pregnancy (Mg, Fe, etc). I am not sure what to do as my diet is pretty good.. any ideas?

Azul


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

congrats on your pregnancy Azul!  This whole process seems to be lots of waiting!!! but not long now until 12 weeks.  reflexology sounds good.
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

me again!

Just had scan and now waiting for blood results.  So far so good...looks like about 14 follies of a decent size so hoping there are some nice eggs in there, and lining doing ok.
Depending on blood results it's either wed/thur/fri egg collection...am hoping for thurs  as I have some stuff to do at work on wednesday   and if friday then would have to have another scan on wednesday and that would throw it all out! but whatever happens happens.
It seems to be going well again, but finding it hard to stay positive as it was like this last time and ended in biochemical pregnancy so who knows.

hope everyone else ok.

CW: whens the scan?
xx


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Lulu,

thanks for your reply 
Lots of good luck to you for this week and also the next one.

Glad to know that you are having a second go just after an early loss. 
It feels like you have some good chances there. Keep positive!

Azul XX


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks Azul...my biochemical was so early, I wouldn't have picked it up if I hadn't tested on the very very earliest date! But i'm glad i did because if same thing happens again then i know there is some issue to do with implanting.
I bet you can't wait for 12 week scan now.
x


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Hi Creaters!

Azul - Congrats on the BFP. Sounds to me as though you have an excellent attitude towards tx and your pregnancy. I know how hard that wait for 12 weeks is, good luck!

Lulu - Best of luck for you this week, sounds like the cycle is very promising and you are responding well again to the treatment    

Our little Create baby girl, Clover, was born very early on Sunday. It CAN and DOES work!

Hope everyone else is well,

Beegey xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

brilliant news Beegey...and hello to CLOVER - how cute.

EC for me on Thursday - panicking slightly as i forgot to put the HCG injection in the fridge so it has been out of the fridge for over a day...have put in the fridge now.  Hope it will be ok.
xx


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

congratulations beegey


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu,... good luck, fingers crossed for you!!

beegey... congrats on birth of clover!!

Azul.... well done on getting a BFP!!

Bobbie... hello, we have missed you!!

cw... how is things going?

angels for me..... hello, hope you are well!!

I am currently going for a cycle at UCH, I am on a "prep" cycle and doing a hysteroscope and dnc on friday!!
Then think I will be on some tabs to disolve cysts or something and then after AF will start treatment.
Hoping my ovaries can crank it up again and eek out a few eggs for IVF!!

Had an AMH test It is 12.7 does anyone know what this means??
Oh well if it was bad, sure someone would have told me!!

Hello to anyone that I have missed!!! babydust to everyone!!


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

Hi Shell

Have you ever had any immune testing?


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Angels!!

yes, I have had immune testing while at the argc. On the first cycle with the argc, I didnt have it and on other cycles, I have been tested on all the rest of the cycles.

It came back with not much out of order!! So frustrating!!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all..just recovering post egg collection. Bit disappointed, although i know I shouldn't be but only 3 eggs...I had about 14 follies that were large enough so was expecting more as were the doctors. They were surprised and disappointed too.  Fingers crossed they fertilise but not feeling very positive.
xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

lulu   

that is really unexpected to only have 3 eggs out of 14 follys!!

But you only need one!!!    

On my last cycle I only had 4eggs and they all fertilised and all were put back!! (I was in SA so they put any amount back)
Are you using the same donor as last time?

Will be waiting to hear that they all do well tonight!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks shell - doctors were pretty shocked too.  anyway good news is that they all fertilised so I actually am in same position as last time.  Transfer tomorrow - only day 2 so am hoping that doesn't matter too much. I thought day 3 was better - but trying not to stress about that, at least something to put back, so in with a chance!

love to other creaters
xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Bobbi, did you change to bonita apple...thingy to confuse me I thought you had been on a loong holiday!!!


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Bonita applebum!! I am also doing it all, the chinese herbs in a powder form and acupuncture?

lets hope this makes the dIfference

What does ng or pmol mean and do I need to find that out??

The dnc/ hysteroscope went well and I told them to do a smear test while they were down there. it is strange being in a different clinic as this is the first time there. They seem okay. We did the hysteroscope to aid implantation and for the first time we are going to do assisted hatching so Im excited about that. But my cycle wont start till 25 july as they have me on tablets this month that will delay the cycle till then. I am happy about that as i will then fit in more acu and herbs!!

To be honest I dont know how many more cycles my ovaries are going to crank out eggs before they decide they have had enough!! But we can only hope, I just need one.  

Things are looking up on this thread with so many creaters getting their bfp!!

But I agree it is quiet.

Lulu......... thinking of you, glad they all fertilised and now they just need to snuggle in.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

all sounds very positive Shell and end of july will be here before you know it -     

had 2 put back today, a 2 cell and a 4 cell...the other one was already 6 which was a bit too fast so they will monitor that one and if it turns out ok, freeze it. so now just have to wait.  

xx


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Lovely news!! 
Congratulations Beegey for the birth of your beautiful baby girl Clover. Great name!
I agree with Shell, things are looking up in this thread and that makes me feel very positive about everyone of you .. great news about Lulu and look forward to knowing more 

I am now feeling much better, just suffering from funny smells.. I feel my house smells a lot but I seem to be the only one that is noticing it ! and looking forward to mid July for the Nuchal scan..  things will look much positive then. All seems to be a long wait and every stage as fragile as the previous one.


Azul XX


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi all, just catching up after now being on here for a week.

Many congratulations beegeey, fantastic news on the birth of Clover.

Best of luck lulumead on implatation.

good luck shell on your next treatment

hello newies, Azul and bonita apple...

I feel a little more confident having had my 7.3 week scan last friday and saw one little baby with a heart beat, i couldn't believe it. how wonderfull is that.

i also now have pretty full blown morning sickness at different parts of the day. My cramping has gone now though, just getting used to the amount of rest i need.

Being away in a new project really helped get things into perspective, less worrying and wasnt on internet.

cwsg xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

brilliant news CW  

i have had to go to the doc's today to get antibiotics for urine infection post embryo transfer - so bit disappointed in case it has negative effect and it is very painful!!

hello everyone else
xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi

i had something like that, but didnt have it diagnosed as drunk cranberry juice and it went away


cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

i not surprised we end up with things like that with all the poking about!  I've just nearer had one before and there was some blood so I thought I'd best sort out.  

How was Cov?
x


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

really good overall,

very productive, but i felt a bit lonely at times being away from my partner and doing a solo piece, when everone else seemed to be hanging out together.
but they were going for drinks and i was going to bed at rediculously early times of the evening. I made a conception vessel and performed in it twice. I worked on the internal imagery inbetween. I took all the fertility objects i had tryed to use to get pregnant over the last few years and 4 years worth of charting. Objects included a fertility corn dolly, and fertility african head mask, a lucky marble. I also decorated the vessel with parts from beehive as they are folicle structires.
i was happy to addmy scan pictures on Saturday.

cwsg


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi Girls,
Can you explain a little bit about drugs used for mild ivf. Also do they do this in the central london clinic as well as wimbledon? We have 2 tubes of frozen sperm which I would like to use, but I am feeling weary now. I have just started the microgynon pill to cycle at the Lister but my heart is not 100% in it (I have been overstimulated in the past). To top it all, I feel extremely nauseous and think it is a side effect. If anyone could give me some idea of what is involved I would be very grateful.
Thank you,
Prija


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi Prija,

I chose mild because i overstimulated taking drugs for IUI.

I tryed natural first, 

The mild cycles are tailored to the individual case. Others have had different amounts and types of drugs to me there. They monitor your reaction to them and ajust the dose as you go along. As I react quickly to them, i took them for less time, I have my EC on day 11. I was taking 125ml of gonal f from day two of my cycle with 0.5ml of burserolin half hour apart, once per evening up to day 8 then hcg shot to time ovulation.

It's really best to have a consultation there. I think they do all the EC and ET at Wimbledon, but you can have scan in Harley street.

hope this helps

cwsg


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Thankyou for your help cwsg.
I almost had a consultation at Create a couple of years ago, but for some reason changed my mind to the Lister. I really have had enough of high drug dosages and too many eggs. Congratulations!  May I be nosey and ask you how you came to have an embryo frozen on day 3 and some also cultured to blast? I asked at the UCH if they would do that but they will now only freeze blasts. I find that very hard as my son was a day 3 frozen embryo. Also, do you think mild ivf is less gruelling than the high stimulation one?
Thanks again for the advice!
Prija


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Priya

I'm just in the 2 week wait following my second mild IVF at create and I have found the whole drugs side of it very easy...having said that I've never done conventional iVF but I am very pleased to have chosen this way of doing it and everyone at the clinic is very nice.  I also think they are upfront and honest and Geeta tells you how it is which makes me feel like they aren't just there to take your money!!  I have been very happy with them as a clinic, just hoping I get the result.

congrats on your little one, and hope you get another to join him 

I would recommend going for a consultation with them and asking some questions.

xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi Lulumead,

I was wondering how you were doing. I also wondered if i may have seen you at create on June 26 ?
Wishing you best of luck, how do you feel?

Prija, I had a day three transfere and one frozen on day three also. The others were taken to blastocyst, which they made, but were aparently not chosen to freeze. They said the reason was that they had to feel confident that they would give me babies at the end?. I guess they know what they are doing. Anyhow, create also freeze day 3 embryos.

Just to do a me post, i have been very nauseas and last night worked myself up into a crying temper, I guess the constant nausea for three days has drained me. I'm not complaining, how can i. I have had a couple of nightmares and a weird flash back type lucid dream where I saw a woman walking accross my garden. She looked piercingly at me and she really didnt look from this century. Anyway, this set me off more tired, which made the nausea much worse. I have actually felt down for the first time for ages. I have more time off, and sometimes i'm not good with time off on my own when i'm not motivated. I got out two pregnancy books from the library yesterday, they both had very little reference to IVF. At the moment it does seem relevant that I have had an ivf pregnancy, for example, the fact that i am not told exactly when my midwife will contact me and therefore dont know if I will get a 12 wk scan on time is hard to deal with.
Also I want to feel like a fertility queen at home, but now things are settling down, other things in our life are taking over and I really dont want then too. I just feel abit angry, I think the hormones are affecting me differently.

i'm not mad, really

cwsg


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello, Lulumead, thank you for your help too. Thanks again cwsg. Just wanted to let you know that I had lots of nightmares during my pregnancies and I am sure I read that it is the hormones. Also any pregnancy is hard but it is an especially draining and anxious time when you have had to go to such lengths to get there. Don't be hard on yourself! You sound like I felt in 2003!
Love Prija


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi cwsg:
Prija is right, it is just the hormones. It sounds like they are making a mess on your emotions! 

I have also been finding it very difficult and feeling very lonely- this is my 11th week after IVF at Create. But I know all is happening at the moment are just to do with changes in my body, I know, but I never felt this depressed before and it is a bit scary. I try to ignore it and think that the nightmares are just like being in a movie that is nothing to do with me and it will eventually change.. hormones!!

My partner, however, that hasn't had any body/hormonal change is much more moody than me! I think guys find all this a lot more difficult than I previously thought. 
I haven't had almost any sickness yet, I am trying to eat only healthy food (lots of fruit).. I felt sick a bit at the beginning but it was because I needed to eat- so I know now that if I eat on time I am fine.
Lulu, am thinking very much of you-


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all...been a bit absent as totally exhausted from urine infection - i think, plus have had weird spotting since monday...well really (sorry TMI!) only blood when i wipe so I'm really not sure if period is just waiting for me to stop the pessaries in order to kick in...all will become clear in the morning!!

CW - I don't think I was at create on 26th but 25th for egg collection...I often wonder though in the waiting room if there is anyone from the board sitting there    hope the nightmares ease up, think that sounds very natural to me...hormones do weird things, and its hard when you've wanted it for so long to attempt it might be hard or different to what you expected. But we have to remember most people want to be pregnant and they are entitled to feel whatever they like, we just have an added guilt about staying positive all the time as we've tried so hard...we still have the right to moan sometimes     Hope this makes sense....don't be hard on yourself, you can feel whatever you feel.

will update tomorrow with the result!!!
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi all,

As suspected it was a negative for me on this go. Not surprised as I felt so bad with the infection don't think my body could really cope with it all.
So think I will go again in September, depending on what Geeta's says about this go.
Hope everyone else is doing ok.
xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Ah no

really sorry Lulumead, so close again.
You must be feeling very disappointed and confused. I hope you have a good friend at hand for the support you need.

besy wishes

cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks CW...yes my friends are great, they are all very involved and I'm very grateful to have good friend who has had IVF so knows all about it...but it is the time when you miss not having a partner around!!

I'm hoping geeta has something useful to say and not just 'unlucky' again!
xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

sorry if this is too personal a quetion but, are you going for IVF because you dont intend on having a partner, or that you dont want to take the risk of the biological clock running out, or are you gay.

Apologies in advance for being so frank.

cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

not personal at all - I'm quite open!!

My prince charming seems to have gone AWOL! I would love nothing more than trying to get pregnant with a lovely man, but the timing with partners has never seemed to work - I'm ready they aren't. So I'm in the weird position of never having tried to get pregnant naturally, naively I assumed I was just missing the sperms and it would happen easily.  nothing to suggest otherwise. No other problems.

I know that I want to have babies, so don't see the point in waiting when it only gets harder the older you get.  I started an adoption process to adopt from China 3.5 years ago...which when i started I was told would be 2 - 2.5 years, somehow the process has got delayed and the prediction for me meeting my baby (if it happens at all!) is now at 2015!!! making it a 9 year process.  My papers are currently sitting in china and have been since december 2006. So I feel like I've been trying to make a family as a single choice mum for a long time. I did meet a lovely man in the middle of all this but he wasn't and still isn't in a position to have a family with me, his life is a bit of a mess and he needs to sort that out.

I feel like I've gone the other way round to most people starting with adoption, then fertility treatment and hopefully one day ending with natural conception the fun one (obviously more unlikely the older I get)  .  Also always known I want more than one child if I can, so I just decided it was time to crack on...it's hard to wait to meet the right man, spend a year getting to know them, have it not work out and then just be a year older in the same position. Its a lot of pressure when you are meeting people so by having baby first, I'm hoping that takes the pressure away and i am then open to meeting a nice man who can handle the path i've chosen, they will need to be pretty lovely.

If you know any nice men send them my way!!!!

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu.... so sorry about the negative result!! I was sooo sure it was gonna be a positive test for you.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks Shell...this cycle didn't quite go to plan...think the post transfer urine infection was the major factor!

have you started now?
x


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Lulu,

I bet it makes you even more determined that you made the right decision not to waste any more time waiting for "the one"!! my husband and I had been together since we were 29!! And he wasnt ready to commit!!!!! So infuriating that we wasted sooo much time... and then we only got married and started trying near to my 36th birthday and now there is a problem and I sooo wished we had started earlier!!

I am on tablets, like the pill, I think.
They will disolve any cysts and I stop them on the 22.7 and start when af arrives.
That should arrive on about the 25.7.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

no long til you start then.  it is ironic how we spend so much time trying not to get pregnant and then when we want to it turns out to be quite hard!!!  I'm telling all my friends in early 30's to just get on with it!
xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

shell,

similar to me, we got together when i was 28 and he also wasn't ready to commit until i was 36. But then we started a business together which took over for 3-4 years. By which time i was 38 and starting to panic.

Are you downregging.

cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

I am not sure if it is downregging or not?
I dont usually. It is a new clinic and everything is soooooo different that I am unsure.
At my scan on my monotored cycle I had my usual friendly cyst and another one on the other ovary.
I asked if they were going to remove them and they said that the tablets arent to down reg but to disolve the cyst?

I really dont know!!!

To be honest I thought they werent going to treat me! 
I didnt have any follys at the folly count and they werent too happy, but Ive never had a problem before!!
It all feel sooo unfamiliar.


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Lulu,

I am so sorry..not expecting that really. the infection isn't great news.. make sure you recover fully from it as your health should be always put first. It is good to know that you have good friends near to talk to about it. I am sure Geeta and her team will support you on this one and will tell you what she thinks it is the best.. I would listen to her and also make questions about it so that you can understand.
Love,

AzulXX


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

Hi Lulumead

Sorry to hear about your bfn

Just reading about you ttc whilst single. I totally relate to you. I got married when 23 to a womanizer, i was young....made mistake but took me years to get over really. Although i knew i wanted children when out with other men, never the right man to have a child with, not committed or i knew they were not the one. Whilst single up to 2007 I paniked because of my age and wanting a family and it made me really miserable that i didnt have children and couldnt believe, me...that I had left it so late. I went to my my gp 2007 to start investigations re having a child by myself but couldnt get my head around donar sperm! Then after quite a lot of years of being single met my beautiful DP end of 2007, he is so the right person to have a family with, we are so happy and so right and ready, both emotionally mature, committed and both have loving families to support us too....and low and behold im now 44, who would have thought i would meet someone at this age that was on my wavelength. We have been ttc fairly soon after we met but it has not happened yet.....the age thing really can be an issue at my age. anyway, rambling now. Im ttc naturally with immune drugs this month, if no bfp then i will try our 2nd ivf

all the best
angels


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## lily17 (Sep 25, 2008)

Hiya ladies

Ive been following the thread, hope ya dont mind me butting in!!!
Lulu- sorry to hear BFN- just go for it!, dont give up, my hubby is a scientist and does alot of probability and stats, and if theres one thing that you can control in all this trying to get Pg malarky its the will to keep going! As he says, if you give up, it wont happen, just keep trying probability says you will succeed eventually.......whether you run out of funds first is another matter!!!!
Angels- Im 44 too- same to you keep going!!! the difference with me is- Im lucky enough to have 3 grown up kids from my early 20's with another partner. I never thought I would have fertility probs, but I met my hubby 3 years ago, and he has no kids, and desperately wants one, and we got pg naturally straight away, but I had a M/C and then got an infection after the D&C and it damaged my tubes ( totally blocked!!!) couldnt believe it, had 2 cycles if IVF with my own eggsboth BFN, but the whole thing takes so long by this time I was 43 and the odds are really low ( less than 2%), so to cut to the chase we then went for DE in Russia( DE at my age increases chance to 65% from 2% thats a good bet!) ( that was an experience!!) 1st time BFN, 2nd time with frozen eggs BFP!...but M/C at just 6 weeks, really bad M/C ended up in hospital for 4 days on drip , hemorrhaged, it was terrible.
Now seen Geeta at Create, and we are opting for DE at Creates partner clinic in Cyprus, we are going to discuss details on Friday, choose a donor ect.
I just hope it happens and I manage to carry it, its keeping the Pg to term that will freak me out after having 2 M/C 
Its the wrong age to be trying to cheat mother nature! I didnt have any probs in my 20's, it just happened. which makes it so frustrating, you do take fertility for granted, and your right, you spend half your life worrying about not being pg, and then you want it and you cant have it....typical!
karen xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi create-er's!

thanks for those thoughts, it made me feel like I am doing the right thing getting on with it, and am feeling  bit more positive today. I knew I just needed a couple of days to feel upset and then i would be ok.  Just want to see what Geeta has to say now.

karen: good luck with donor eggs...fingers crossed...maybe there is something they can do extra to support you once embies are put back?

angels: good luck this month...or at least have fun trying.

I love stories like these, gives me hope that meeting nice man is still possible.    Even as I head towards 40  

love to everyone else, especially the little bumps that are growing.
   

xx


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi Lulumead,
So sorry, but hang in there. I strongly believe from my experiences that luck is a big factor in this game. I have not rung for my appointment yet but know that it is what I want to do. Don't know how long I will have to wait, but I need the right moment to call. Lots of luck for your follow up and I hope everyone else is doing well.
Love Prija


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## lily17 (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi Lulu

Also, dont give up on the man front!, I had 3 kids and was married in my 20's, got divorced when I was 33, and didnt meet a nice man until I was 40  and a half! It took me 7 years of being on my own! I had a few boyfriends but no one who I knew was right. I actually met my husband on an internet dating site!
Theres some one out there for everyone!
Karen xx


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## Angels4Me (Apr 8, 2006)

errr, just have to tell you. I always had long term boyfriends when in 20's....anyway, got married in 20's and divorced. Wasted time with wrong boyfriend for another 5 years when about 29.(No.3)  Then was single for ages...meeting people but no-one that was right. Then blow me down...dont know why...in 2007 met DP on internet dating site !!!! at grand ole age a 42!!!!!! why it took so long to meet my lovely DP I have no idea but was really panicking prior to meeting him that I want children but was too old/single(having cons. at that time re ttc with donor but could get my head around)......Now we are ttc and maybe i am to old as it has not happed yet.....but havnt finished trying.  Had a little vibe in the garden the other day that i will be pg by Christmas !!!!

Heres hoping

Yeh....internet....who would have thought it......and his family only 10 mins up the road to mine !!!  Im still shocked and happy we met   I guess if that can happen so can baby

angels


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hiya,
Can I just add to this conversation? My own sister didn't meet the man of her dreams till she was 38, she got married at 40. She was told she could never conceive a child and that her only option was donor eggs, which she tried. She is now 13 weeks pregnant naturally, no help and all going well (fingers crossed).She is 43. Never give up on your dreams. Sadly for myself, I was married at 27, very lucky to conceive first son quickly but by the time I was 30, DH became seriously ill and was diagnosed with azoospermia. Life is certainly fickle.
Love to all!
Prija


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## lily17 (Sep 25, 2008)

Hi OMG angels, how similar our stories are!
I wish I had met my DH earlier, this getting pgnt malarky may have been a bit easier!!
Well, Im looking forward to going to Create on friday, seeing some one called Freda, their donor co-ordinator, she will match us and explain the treatment plan, Im looking forward to getting on with it, I seem to have had a huge gap between treatments.
My last one was Russia in March.
I have no idea what the plan will be next if this doesnt work....cross that bridge when we come to it I suppose.
Where are you with treatment ladies?

xxx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

nice to hear all those positive stories.  

good luck meeting freda on friday - I thought she was great, really lovely woman. In fact all the staff at Create I have found to be fantastic.

xx


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi everyone,
Just wanted to tell you that a lady has written on UCH's thread about her success with very mild stims. She did well to persuade them to give her a low dose as we tried that with them, no such luck! It's really interesting what she has recently written about low dose stims, I asked if she would mind copying it here but I have no doubt she has her hands full at the moment. I hope she doesn't mind me telling you this, her name is Bionic Hobbit. Very inspirational!
Hoe you are all well!
Prija x


----------



## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone!

I have some lovely news..  last week I had the results of blood tests and a 12-week scan and the doctor says that the baby is healthy!!  has very low risk of malformations/genetic problems, so we won't have more tests until 5 month scan in Sept. The nuchal scan showed every small detail .. we saw the brain, heart and arms and legs (as the baby was awake and trying to swim).
We are much more relaxed now- hopefully the rest of the pregnancy will be enjoyable. 
I had a very low dose stims on my IVF cycle and it has worked the first time we tried! 
I would say, put your health first, you will the have the same chances and better health for, maybe, trying for more kids in the future.

AzulXX


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Great news Azul,

I have my scan on Monday.
My partner has flue at the moment, I hope he's better by Monday otherwize he wont be able to come!

cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

lovely news ladies

CW: look forward to hearing how your scan went.

I am a bit tipsy as have drunk today for the first time this year...figure I need a couple of months off!
x


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## lily17 (Sep 25, 2008)

oh its so nice to hear of all the positive stories, well done ladies! it makes me motivated to get on with my treatment, fingers crossed( and toes) you are all healthy and well for the weeks and months to come 
Lulu naughty!- alcohol isnt that bad now and again, I had the odd drink when I was ttc the first time round and manged to have 3 kids no probs.
Now we are trying again, I dont  drink much, just the odd glass when we go out , now and again...probably only once every couple of weeks or less.
I am taking multi vits and folic acid and iron ( I get aneamic really easily) so hopefully that will help.
We saw Freda yesterday, she was very nice. The DE clinic is in Nicosia in Cyprus on the south side, so that will be a nice trip at least!.
I have to get them a photo of me, so they can match me with a donor. Apparently , they have loads of east europeans working in Cyprus, so no shortage of fair skin and light eyed donors that we would be looking for, Im really impressed with the price, its no more expensive than any of the DE at UK clinics, but none of the waiting and hassle the UK clinics give you! and Create look after you before and after your treatment. 
My treatment wont be until Sept at least as they close for the whole of August.
well, hope all it well with you guys, is anyone else doing DE at Create?

Karen x


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi cwsg,

Good luck for tomorrow..I hope you are taking it easy today.

My partner couldn't come to the hospital but we've got a 15 min DVD which we did enjoy together when he got back from work. It was lovely to watch it at home, as during the scan I was just so desperate to know the facts!! that it was healthy and the size was good. 

I feel it has been a turning point psychologicaly, I feel much more relaxed now. 
I hope all will be good news for you too. It's great your scan is tomorrow.. no more wait!

Azulxxx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi azul,

was it ok having the scan without him? My partner will be too ill to come. Did you go with a friend

cwsg


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hello again,

cwsg, it was fine. I had no problem about going on my own .. also, there were plenty of other women waiting on their own, just like me.. in fact, most of them. It wasn't as stressful as the previous scans as the baby is much bigger now- I found it very pleasant and enjoyable. I wish you all the best for tomorrow.

Azulxx


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Glad to say my scan showed positive news, the baby moved and saw heart beat and beautiful little body.

I was exhausted when i got hope from all the emotions and had to rest for a few hours

my due date is 7.2.2010

cwsg


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

lovely news cw....very pleased all ok.   

xx


----------



## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Lovely news!! 

AzulXXX


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

excellent news CW!!!


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello I'm new here, I have my first scan at Create on Mon - we are planning to try a totally natural IVF cycle. Has anybody done this? xx


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Annabelle,

hello and welcome!! I have been meaning to do some totally natural cycles with Create but havent got round to it!!

I did do a controlled natural cycle with them and a mild cycle!!

Good luck!!


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Annabelle

good luck with the natural cycle...I'm on mild IVF so can't help with the natural cycle.
xx


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thank you! I have the "induction" appointment on Monday. Just tried IUI at the LFC but no success, so hoping this will work better.. xx


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all

I have my follow-up consultation with geeta next tuesday, just wondered if anyone had any ideas of good questions to be asking her.  I have the ones of the poor-responders thread, but I feel like create do things a bit differently so there might be more pertinent questions.  I produced 3 embryos each time, 1st go they implanted and were then bio-chemical pregnancy, and last time I was on anti-biotics for urine infection. 1st time of taking anti-biotics ever in my life!!

any thoughts greatly appreciated.

Hope induction went well Annabelle.

CW; can't believe you are nearly 12 weeks, how lovely.  
xx


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

hi lulumead,

geeta seems to be prety thorough in follow up consultations. She seemed to answer my quetions before  i'd asked them. But I think just ask what YOU really want to know.

Maybe it will just take you 3 goes.

I am actually 12 wks today, my ticker isoneday behind and my due date is 7th Feb. I had my blood and urine tests today and it seems that if my appointment with the obtsiatricion shows no concerns then I can go for a home birth, which I want.

I'm feeling alot better, more energy and less nausea. But i've had a cold sore and now conjuntivitus. Both i couldn't use medication for. I actually went to a party in London on Saturday and danced jumping up and down! it was great to not be worried. I'vestopped worrying about things going wrong.

best of luck

cwsg x


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

brilliant to hear you are feeling so well...nice to get to point of being able to enjoy..ultimately worrying doesn't change things anyway - if only it was that easy to switch our worry brains off! wow february feels like no time at all.  

yes, I think I was unlucky this time...first time Geeta was surprised it didn't work all the signs were good. this time I think my urine infection scuppered it but who knows. I do trust her, and think she is very straight talking which I like..so hoping I have some clear answers...although a lot does seem to come down to luck!

xx


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

The induction was great, really clear and friendly, so I am feeling very positive about the process- next scan tomorrow.

Good luck with the follow up appointment Lulumead, I hope it goes well for you. xx


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

that's exciting Annabelle.  Everyone at the clinic is very lovely.
x


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi,
Could you tell me is the induction appointment to go through drugs etc? I have appointment booked for 20th but I explained to receptionist that DH can't be with me that day. She said as we are using frozen sperm that shouldn't be a problem. Wondered if he needs to be with me for induction? Bless him, he does work hard but I'm sure he doesn't like being there. He didn't come when I had ET for my youngest son, but he is a wonderful Dad.
Love to all,
Prija


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Prija

I think the induction is just to talk through the drugs protocol...you could always drop freda an email and check.
xx


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Lulumead,
Thank you for your advice!
Prija


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi,

i've been really ill with my eye, in bed for 4 days and now on my way to emergency eye unit. as the latest doc thinks it may be something worse than conjuntivitus.
It's one thig being ill, but being pregnant as well is so worrying.
Just wen i stopped taking the progesterone this happened to me.
I'll update about the diagnosis.

Cwsg


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks Lulumead!

Prija- 

I had the induction meeting on Monday, my DH came along because it is our first time and all new to us but as you have already been through it I don't think that he would need to be there? I wasn't sure until the day whether my DH could get the time off work, as it turned out he could but if he hadn't been able to I would have gone on my own.

You do need to both sign the forms & have them witnessed but you could do that beforehand.

cwsg- I hope you have had help with the infection at the eye hospital and are feeling better now.

xx


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

CW-    Hope it gets sorted...How rubbish especially as it must be nice to be off the pessaries !

Speedy recover.
xxx


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

the hospital have given me three medicines, two of which may cause birth defects. They also didn't write down the name of what i have,so must wait till morning to ask advice!!

cwsg


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

how frustrating...can you wait til tomorrow to take them once you know more.
x


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

i have only taken one, so frustrated as in so much pain. The other two arnt worth the risk.

I have preceptul cellulitis, a bit scary, but at least its not orbital cellulitis. My glands are swollen and my tongue is completely white| I wa up all night trying to sort out the different pains, eyes, throat, nose, ears. 

It started last sunday with itchy and slitely swollen eye. Ive been bed ridden all week feeling sorry for myself. My family have helped by phone, especially my sister who rang lots of people to get more info on the medicines for me. My partner has been a little absentemotionally, but he's just like that at times.

hope your well
how did the follow up go

cwsg


----------



## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi cwsg,

How horrible! I am so sorry to hear that you are having to cope with so much.
I understand it is a bateria infection so some kind of antibiotics or drugs will be probably necessary.
Nice to hear that your sister is helping out with the drug info.

I found this on the web today about drugs vs pregnancy:
http://www.revoptom.com/index.asp?page=2_13659.htm

Take care,

Azul
xx


----------



## Be Lucky (Mar 22, 2008)

Dear cwsg.sorry ur suffering like this.as ur over 12 weeks when everything develops is ther still such a danger of defects.just a thought though it mite not b very helpful.i hav been 3 days down at day assessment unit.went in with slight brown stainin but they wer mor worried bout my bp which has been up and down.on meds now and i understand bout not wanting 2 take them.hope u get things sorted out soon.luv 2 all berniex


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

cw...sounds pretty horrible hope you get some relief soon.

Bernie: hope you are doing ok and that BP calms down.

I'm off my consultation on tuesday so just trying to get my questions together this weekend!
xx


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi CWSG,
Just wondering how you are doing? Hope you are feeling better. Love to all!!
Prija


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Yes CW - how are you? really hope its easing up and you are feeling better and can start to enjoy it.

I had my follow-up today with Geeta...I do like Create as a clinic, really feel like they are on your side.  She basically said she thought it was down to back luck and that my urine infection and having to take antibiotics probably didn't help.  Basically had two good embryo's put back and lining was good so again she said was 50/50 that it would work!

So round 3 in October...she is changing my protocol slightly to see if that helps and will give me some anti-biotics from day of egg collection to pre-empt any infection.

Also had blood test done to check my AMH has never had that done...really hope its ok.

hello to everyone one else
xx


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hi Lulumead,
Glad you feel positive about your follow up. Got my appointment on 20th. I was looking at the statistics on the website today and found them to be very encouraging.
Love Prija


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Thanks Lulumead and Prija for asking how i am. 

My eye's swelling has now gone down, but both eyes are still hurting and my vision is a bit blurry from all the moister in them, they both aren't fully open yet.
Not sure about starting working in my shop tomorrow, i guess i'll have to see how it goes. I still ave low enery too. Taking penecillin antibiotics, but a mild form aparently and eye drops.
My nausea has come back since my illness is getting less. 
I go back to eye specialist and accupuncture on Thursday.

cwsg


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hey cwsg,
Glad things seem to be better. Can't you take a bit more time off? Hope you feeling 100% very soon.
x


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi CWSG - are you feeling any better?  Hope its all clearing up and you can enjoy bump!

Everyone else doing ok?

xx


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello,
I'm still here and have appointment next week. They rang with cancellation for today yesterday, but too short notice for me as had things going on. Never mind? How are you lulumead?
Prija


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

glad to see a bit of action on the thread, again.

thanks for asking, my eyes are improving alot, i think the homeopathy really helped.
I only had one tablet too.

I have an appointment with an obstiatrician, not sure what this is, Prija, maybe you can explain. I can ask him to check the heart beat, he will ask me some routine questions, aparently because of my  age, and then from this they will decide if i'm low or high risk, in terms of home birth.
I always thought having a baby at home would give so much to a home. Still have nausea.

Hope you are all well

cwsg


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

cwsg,
Glad you are feeling better. You will be seeing an Obstetrician. This is the type of doctor who looks afer the mother and baby during pregnancy. They are normally gynaecologists as well. I am sure you will be well looked after. Sorry about the nausea!
Best wishes!
Prija


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi all, how's everyone doing?

CW; hope by now your eyes are totally healed and you are back to normal, and bump is coming along nicely.

Prija: when's your appointment? is it this week?

I'm feeling quite chirpy today as my AMH came back as above normal so ovaries are active...which is a relief after the last attempt where I had 12 follies and only 3 eggs, so at least nothing sinister going on. Am concentrating on getting myself sorted for my next attempt in October.

love to all the other create-ers on here.
xx


----------



## pink tulip (Dec 5, 2007)

Hi Ladies,

I'm dipping into your thread in the hope that I can get some advice 
I'm running out of alternatives as we  had one failed ICSI after 5 yrs ttc, then I was diagnosed with breast cancer.  Having completed all my treatment, I've been told this week that we can't start adoption processes until at least 3 yrs time - too late for us. I've been reading a little about Natural IVF and the Create clinic but don't know much about it. I contacted the clinic and they have told me that I'm a suitable candidate. Is everyone on this thread going through natural IVF? If so, please can you tell me if you would recommend Create?
Thank you, Pink Tulip x


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu... hello!!! How are things? I had my amh done recently and it came back 12.7. What is your plan? When are you cycling again?

CW... how are you feeing?

Pink Tulip.... I think natural is a good thing and if not they also do mild IVF. I think most of the ladies here have done naturaL and mild. Create is a good clinic.

Bonita... hello, havent seen you for a while?

Prija, have you had appointment yet?

I came off progesterone on Monday to wait for AF and then to start stims at UCH. Hoping AF will start today!!
My ninth fresh cycle!! Oh it goes sooo quick!! I am thinking of getting a surrogate and trying that next if this cycle doesnt work.


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

good to hear from you Shell, i was wondering where you had dissapeared to.

Hi Pink tulip, I did natural ivf first, but my folicle was empty, then moved on to mild ivf which worked! 

i'm now 15 wks pregnant

best wishes

cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi CW,

It has been really really quiet here!!

No action! at all!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello create-ers  

pink tulip: I think create is a good clinic and because of low drug dosage might be good for you, worth having a consultation.

I'm going for another mild IVF at the beginning of October. Decided to give my body a bit of a rest and enjoy the summer, which is going so fast....am also very busy at work so trying to get all done in September so I can relax a bit when i start injections. The only thing that slightly worries me is that everything on paper for me looks great...just lack of man with sperms and yet I'm already on my 3rd go, am just hoping nothing more sinister lurking beneath it all like abnormal chromosomes. Just clinging to the fact that 1st go was biochemical so hopefully possible.

look forward to this thread being busy again
xx


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Lulu!


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Shell, I know .....why dont people who go to create post here? and if not where do they post.

are there other creaters reading but not posting??
cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Cw.... exactly, according to this board you would think they had no patients but when you are at the clinic in wimbledon it is full....

Maybe there are lots of lurkers!

How are you feeing?? My AF arrived so hopefully I will start stims in a few days!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

it is strange isn't!

any lurkers say hello  

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Lulu,

I have an appointment at UCH or CRGH (they changed their name) at 10.45am... feels like I have waited forever for this appointment. !! It is the longest it has ever taken to get a cycle started.
And we arent there yet... I still have to go for a scan!!

Sooooooooo watch this space.... I really hope that it is going to go well and we just start the cycle, nothing eventful!....    no big bad cysts or anything!!


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

sending you lots of luck     

hope all clear and you can get going.
xx


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

All clear!! Starting stims on sunday!!


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Shell, good luck

lulumead, I hope the break from treatment is just what you need

lurkers, hello out there 

cwsg


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

I havent had such a good day, my accupuncturist is explaining that i'm getting weak during pregnany because of my age, my partner doesn't seem to be very supportive at the moment so we need to talk.
I'm realising that being pregnant bring challenges as will being a parent and I dont want to go through this alone, or feeling like i'm alone sometimes.

cwsg


----------



## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello

I am new on this board although I have been going to Create Health for a few months trying to do natural cycle.  Maybe I have seen some of you ladies in the waiting room?  Is anyone else here do a natural/controlled cycle?


----------



## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello,
Just a quick post from me as going on hols tomorrow until 6th Sep. I had my initial appoinmet yest and I was so impressed. The staff were so courteous and caring and the Prof and Dr Nargund were fab! I think the protocol sounds great. I met a lovely lady in the waiting room so if you are out there, hellloooo!!
Cwsg, I think it is just men!! We are all here for you! Hey when I start cycling maybe we could meet for chat!! I travelled all the way back to Newcastle yesterday and got home at 10.30 and DH said he didn't want to hear anything about it until we are away on hols!!
Anyway I'm off now,
Love to all!
Take care!
Prija


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello!

Sorry I have been lurking a bit...

Just finished our first natural ICSI cycle at Create, one lovely embie but then BFN last Friday  still I guess it would have been very very lucky to work out first time.

AF started this morning so back to Create on Friday for day 5 scan to start another natural cycle, hopefully this will be the one...

Anyone else doing a natural cycle at Create at the moment? 

xx


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

annabelle
 

So sorry to hear about your negative, however I think it is a real achievement on a natural cycle to go all the way. When I did a natural cycle my egg didnt fertilise. I have been meaning to try a few natural cycles again with create. I think it is great that you can go from one cycle into the next without having 2 cycles break inbetween.

And it is so much better for the body and must be good for the embryo.
I really think on a natural cycle you need to give it a number of goes as they suggest however I have noticed that most ladies on here have moved from natural to mild and havent given it the few goes that is needed!! It will be interesting on this thread to see someone stay with the natural till the got pregnant, I have been meaning to give it a good go and do 4 treatments in a row and see how it goes. But I went off track.

last time I went for a natural cycle I had a cyst and abandonned the cycle and I was meaning to go back but havent.

I am not doing a cycle with create at the moment, I am doing a cycle at CRGH or UCH.

prija, glad the appointment went well

buffy... welc0ome!!


----------



## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

I am glad to be able to communicate with some others who are going/have been through a natural cycle.

Annabelle I think you did really well to get an embryo on your very first try.    I reckon getting pregnant with natural IVF is like getting pregnant naturally in that you can't expect the very first month to fall. I hope your next cycle goes well, please let us know.

Shell - what sort of cycle are you doing now?

CWSG - Congratulations, and you are a timely reminder that getting pregnant is not the end of our problems!

I have been trying for a while.  The first time there we got an egg and fertilised it with ICSI but it didn't divide properely so it was never put back in.

After that I had a premature LH surge.  Then I had some problems with polyps, then a cyst - time passed.  I had to have 2 lots of strong antibiotics and my cycles afterwards were duff - the follicles not growing properly.  Most recently I had 2 very short cycles of 3 weeks which is not long enough for a good egg to form.  I was hopeful about this cycle I am having now but it turned out to be a long one and the blood flow to the follicle was not so good so decided to skip egg collection until I get something more favourable.

I hope that's not too much information.   I should add my case is complicated by having only one ovary.


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Buffy, you put that so well, yes natural cycle will take as long as it takes if you were trying naturally!!! I totally agree! That is what I meant in all my ramblings!!

I am doing a cycle with maximum drugs and everything thrown at me! I have also planned my next cycle, if this doesnt work then I am going to south Africa to try with a surrogate in December! I have found someone and nearly all is finalised. Just waiting to see if this cycle works before flying out for tests and doing the legal papers.

Buffy, when is your next cycle planned for? Are you doing natural? and how many months since the first cycle?

Good Morning to everyone, have been on stims for 4 days and have my first scan this morning! I am on max drugs and am hoping to see some follys, very nervous as think they are getting less!

Will check in later!!


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks Buffy and Shell for your kind messages! 

As long as it is possible our intention is to keep going with the natural cycle approach, certainly for three goes although hopefully     it will work out this time!

Shell good luck with your cycle, I hope your scan went well and there were lots of follies! Let us know how it went. 

Buffy, I am sorry for your struggles there.   What point are you at in your current long cycle? Are you going to give it another try when you get your period this time? 

Lots of love

xx


----------



## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

It was good to hear back from you girls.

Shell - I was looking through your history, I can see you have come close a few times.  I hope your present cycle produces the goods as it were.  Were you thinking of trying some more natural cycles with Create if not?  Where are you in your ivf cycle, did you see any follicles yet?  Remember it's quality and not quantity. 

Annabelle I think you have the right attitude although it may take more than 3 goes, however you never know  .  Are you using fsh injections and cetrocide? 

I did my first natural cycle July 08.  I have been doing them on and off since but with a lot of interruptions for various things, so far from every cycle.  My current cycle is long, I am about day 22 and haven't ovulated yet.  It's a bit weird because I had an 18mm follicle a couple of days ago (the one with the poor bloodflow).   Anyway, once I get my period I'll be off for another scan.  I really need a nice 27-29 day cycle.


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Buffy-

Not sure what fsh injections and cetrocide are (sorry I am a complete ignoramus!  ) 

Last time I had one injection of Ovitrelle to cause the LH surge because otherwise ovulation would have been at a weekend, and then Cyclogest pessaries (oh what fun) after EC.

I don't want more than one egg so not doing any stimulating, obviously there is quite a big risk of not getting an egg at all though.

Day 22 without ovulating is a long time, that must be very frustrating! I think if you are stressed that can delay ovulation, I guess that is not hugely helpful though because it is not easy to get relaxed with all this to think about is it! I have just been to have acupuncture for the first time, mostly to help with relaxing. I have to say it does seem to help, I definitely feel a bit calmer than normal at the moment.

I hope you ovulate soon, then you can move on to the next cycle. You must be really fed up with the short ones and now the long one, let's hope that the next one is the perfect length!   

xx


----------



## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Thanks Annabelle

Cetrocide stops you ovulating too soon and fsh just helps the egg mature in the follicle.  I have used them once. 

I now think I may have ovulated on day 21 although I'm not sure as I am on holiday and didn't take a stick to wee on    I'll know for sure if my period comes in a couple of weeks.

I hope your scan goes well.  Let us know if you feel so inclined.  I'm sure the acupuncture will help.  Did you know that having acupuncture on the day of embryo transfer has been found to significantly increase the chances of conception?


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Buffy,

I had accupuncture on the day of transfere and egg collaction and it really did help. I was recommended one not far to create in Wimbledon, it you need her number I left cards with the receptionist, or I can give you her contact

cwsg


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all, bit of a busy week so haven't stayed up to date...so just saying hello.
xx


----------



## Happiness07 (Aug 16, 2007)

Dear all,
I thought I'd come out of the shadows and reveal myself as an ex lurker! I've been reading this thread with interest and following your progress here and it's so heart warming to read about the bfps! After 6 fresh ivf/icsi cyles and 1 frozen, I'm at the end of my tether really. practically I know that DE is the answer but my heart isn't ready to give up on OEs.So Geeta has suggested natural cycles for closure and DE after that . She showed me convincing research on how the quality of the embryos is worse with stimulated cycles . So I'm going ntural ivf in October and hope for the best! Good to be part of such a positive thread!
Cheers,
Suki


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello all!

Buffy- I hope you did ovulate and AF turns up soon! I know long cycles are immensely frustrating, when I first came off the pill (7 years ago) I had really long 40+ days cycles and I used to think every time that I must be pregnant - seems like a bit of a joke now really, but I had no idea back then.  

Oddly after I had a hysterosalpingogram (?not sure if that is how to spell it) my cycles went back to a more normal length, although they are still a bit long at 31 days. I don't know if it was just a co-incidence or if the hysterosalpingogram did something inside, it certainly hurt enough to have rearranged all my internal organs! 

CWSG- thanks, the acupuncture was really relaxing and I am going again next Fri and then on EC and ET days. Fingers crossed that it helps! The acupunturist is called Ian and his cards/leaflets are in the Create waiting rooms. He seemed really nice.

Hello Suki! I am really sorry to hear about your 7 cycles  . It seems to make sense to me that an egg that grows naturally should be stronger? I really hope it works out for you in October.  

My scan was ok yesterday, all where it should be on day 5 so back again on Tues morning for an update and have to start doing the ovulation pee sticks on Tues too.  I'm not expecting to be ovulating until the end of the week at the earliest, still better safe than sorry I guess!

I hope everybody has a good weekend!

xx


----------



## ves (Jul 26, 2009)

Hello,

I am new here and  currently with London Woman Clinic, very disappointed with their service and incompetence, they have send me a  referral letter for hysteroscopy  that contains the details of the treatment and the names of the another couple in error.  Could you tell me if Create does IVF with donor sperm as my DP has azoospermia


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi ves

I was at LWC and moved to create who I am very happy with. I am using donor sperm which I had to import as they don't have their own sperm bank. I'm doing this as a single woman, so don't have any other choice. I'm using ESB (european sperm bank) but you can also import from xytex which is based in the US.


Let me know if you want anymore info about donor sperm.
xx


----------



## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Shell - how did your scan go, I have been thinking about you? 

CWSG - yes please give me the details of the acupuncturist, or is it the same one Annabelle talks of?  I have one in Basingstoke where I live but she only does 3 days a week and may not be available for embryo transfer day

Happiness - I think you are absolutely right to try some natural cycles.  When you get over about 40 you get at least as good, if not better, results on the whole.  (I'm 41.)

Annabelle you made me feel better by telling me you have had longer cycles too.  I know what you mean about taking the pregnancy tests, I've been there.  That's weird that your hysterolsalpinogram altered your cycles.  I had to have a polypectomy and I was pleased I had afterwards because my mid cycle bleeding stopped and my periods became more controllable.  The lady who does my chinese medecine says she can give me herbs to regulate my cycle if it carries on like this.  I am pleased all went well at your scan and hope you see some good development on Tuesday.

Ves - nice to meet you, I hope you come to Create.


----------



## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Everyone,

The scan went sooo bad, they have such a bad scan machine there that i cannot see anything at all!! The doc couldnt find one of my ovaries and was thinking about cancelling. I was told i only had 2 follys. So I booked a second opinion and went CREATE to prof campbell for a scan and I could see everything again and i had 9 follys in total Not very happy with the clinic!! (I am not at create for anyone reading this)

Well they havent cancelled yet?? At least after going to create i know i still have follys!!

They told me that if you have less than 4 follys, they cancel!! I think this is shocking as you can have 1 folly and fall pregnant. and they only tell me this now? I wouldnt have started a cycle there at all if this was the case?? ARGC, create and LFC will collect if you have just one folly??

Anyway enough of my rant!! I have enough follys and I didnt need the added stress!!

Buffy, I have been on chinese herbs and i am hoping they will make the difference this cycle as I have taken them for 2 months. This is the first time.

happiness.. I also want to give some natual cycles a try. I would like to do about 5 in a row. I too have had loads of failed cycles!!

hi to anabelle, ves, cw, lulu, bonita and everyone! it is great that this thread is picking up!


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone!
am back from holidays.
Sorry to hear about some of the posts.. 
Happiness, Ves, nice to meet you both!

All good here- on week 19th and all good but yes, it is demanding to my body.. am still eating for two and having plenty of naps! but can't really complain about pregnancy- just the first 12 weeks were a bit hard,  the rest a blessing. 

cwsg, i am glad you are feeling better now. i have also been feeling pretty alone, i understand it is part of it. at the moment I am swimming, walk, having reflexology and having home-made food on time and this seems to work for me.. am a bit nervous as am starting work. just hope I will cope but also am starting to be very concern about being a teacher at 4 different schools and bird flu..
not bad! 

ves- my general view about Create, treatments, etc. is that women shouldnt forget to put their health first: natural ivf/mild ivf at Create certainly a good option and in my experience first listen carefuly to D.Nargund's opinion.pregnancy is demanding to body/mind. good luck to all,

Azulxx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Glad the thread has picked up!

Buffy, the accupuncturist I went to was called Julia Davis, who lives in Tooting. She was recomended to me by my accupuncturist here in Wales.
her number is 0208 6720455. I think create are thinking of having alternative therapy avaliable there, according to the embryologist there who i was talking to.

Hi to Shell, Azul, Lulumead, Happiness, Annabelle, Ves

cwsg


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Shell - sorry to hear about your experience when you were scanned.   I don't really understand why they would threaten to cancel if you had any healthy looking follicles.  Just what you need when you are trying to avoid stress.   Are you going back for another scan with them?  I was glad to read you are planning some natural cycles should this one not work out for any reason 

Azul - congratulations!  Good luck with going back to school.  There are lots of things one can do to boost one's immune system to offer more protection against flu, such as taking garlic capsules, vitamin C or zinc although as you're pregnant you'd want to check that with your doctor.  If you can't take the capsules you can eat foods rich in these sources.  Either way I hope you stay fighting fit.

CWSG - thanks for the acupuncture details.  I hope Create start offering treatment in situ.  You must have been doing a lot of travelling if you live in Wales.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi all

Buffy: just to let you know I had acupuncture at create with Ian and he came to the clinic for ET...although I have to say for me, I wasn't that impressed with acu.  Going to try a different person to see if that makes any difference.
xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Everyone,

Final Scan today and we have 9 good sized follys and 2 smaller ones. Very relieved!!

Egg collection on Thursday!!

Lulu... I also didnt like acupuncture the first time I tried it on my second cycle, I went to Zita West just once on the day of embryo transfer. was supposed to go before and after but didnt go back after as was sooooooo not impressed!! But about 3 months back started going once a week to Harley Street... London Acupuncture Clinic to see rebecca. (they do have other locations)

I love it!! I feel sooo relaxed and am also on chinese herbs!! Well we will see if it makes a difference this time. I think it helps if you go for a few weeks before treatment to get used to it ....

When are you starting again??

hello to everyone out there!!


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Buffy, you are right, thanks for that!.. you made me feel much better..I have an appointment with my GP soon- am sure he will advise me on that. I can't wait to go back to school really.

Shell, all best wishes for tomorrow .. all sounds very good and you are ready for it- try to be relaxed and positive XX

Best wishes to all of you,

AzulX


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Great news about follies Shell, hope all goes well.

I'm gearing up to go again on cycle after this one, so in about 4 weeks time. Have to say, have enjoyed not having to think about for a while.

hope everyone else is doing well.
xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Shell - I hope your egg collection went well    I had been wondering about Zita West treatments so your feedback was interesting.

Lulumead - thanks also for your acupuncture feedback.  So far the lady in Tooting sounds the best bet locally to Raynes Park clinic.

Annabelle - hope your second scan went well and you haven't had an early ovulation.

Everyone else - have a lovely day


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Shell -  best of luch on you egg collection 

Buffy -  if you want a regular accupuncturist to go to in your area outside of the treatment days i can ask my accupuncturist to reccomend someone, she teaches accupuncture in London, she taught Zita West too. Julia Davis was reccomend to me from her and it was coincidence that she was near to Wimbledon. She specialises in fertility.


cwsg


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello everybody!

Been for another scan today -day 11- and leading follie is only 12mm so it has a way to go yet, but this is pretty much what I expected coz I have longer cycles. Having another scan in the morning though because I'm paranoid about ovulating over the weekend! 

Has anyone else used ovulation prediction tests & if so which brands? I have been using the clearblue digital ones (they are great because they have a nice smiley face if you are surging!) but yesterday I tried a Boots own brand as well (obsessive checking I know   ) and it came up positive even when the clearblue was negative. I had a big panic but the clinc said that I wasn't surging coz my folllies are still too small. So I wonder if the Boots own brand give false readings sometimes?

I had acupuncture again today, I didn't find it quite so relaxing this time but then it hasn't been a great day so I was probably not in the right mood for it. Ian does come to the Raynes park clinic, and also does Harley St clinic and a clinic in Clapham. I am going to have acupuncture at Raynes Park around ET I think becuase everyone says that is the bit which makes a big difference.

Shell- I hope the egg collection went well, sorry it sounds like you have had a hard time with your scans.   that it all worked out today.

Hope everyone else is well!    to all!

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Annabelle - I am never sure with OPK!! I often get a false read as I get a lot of positives and for a few days in a row. This is why I never really know how to read them. But the clinic will know best about whether you are about to ovulate.

Are you doing natural natural or controlled natural?? I too am sooo hoping that acupuncture will make the difference.

CW... how are you feeling? Any better?

Buffy... have you done any acupuncture yet? I think it is better to start a good few weeks as possible before a cycle, so you can get into it and really relaxed. the first few times I didnt find relaxing! Now I love it and feel relaxed as soon as i lie down, before even they put the needles in   

Lulu... I agree, I also like not thinking about treatment and this is the longest break between stim cycles I have had, mainly owing to the cyst, but I did squeese a FET inbetween, but my ovaries have had a 6 month break!! this must be good!! 

Azul... Hope you are well!!

Ves... hello!!

happiness.... hope you are well! I am also not ready to move onto DE yet, keep trying untill you are ready, whatever you think may work!!
Sometimes for me it is natural and somethines throwing everything at me and hoping that will work.
I really would like to give the whole 6 months of natural cycles a go!! maybe i will but I keep changing my plans!! 

To everyone else out there that I may have missed... lots of luck!! 


I cant sleep!!! I have been up for 2 nights, dont know if it is nerves waiting for news of fertilisation or just the drugs??
This cycle, I have slept much better, I think the acupuncture must have helped.
We collected 11 eggs today, 9 looking very good and 2 not sure yet?? So happy about that!! But dont want to get tooo excited while I wait with bated breath for tomorrows call.


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## clucky (Nov 5, 2008)

Hi ladies

Sorry for jumping in but do you mind if I pick your brains on Create's 'Natural IVF'? Their website doesn't have very much detail.

(Firstly though - just saw your news - well done Shell on 11 eggs yesterday - that's great.     you get good news today and this cycle gets you  that long overdue BFP      . Are you back at Create now?)

Create Qs

How do they rationalise the greater success rates for natural ivf in older women?

Do they scan you regularly to check a suitable follie is growing and if not can they switch to low stimms ivf in the same cycle, or does that decision need to be made up front.

Can you go straight onto a normal IVF cycle immediately after a failed natural or low stimms cycle?

Their pricing page is pretty confusing. What happens if there is no good follicle and therefore no EC? 

Are there any other costs apart from the initial consultation, initial scan cost and then the cycle cost?

Who normally does EC/ET? (It seems very strange that they charge more for Dr Geeta doing the ET!!)

Thanks so much for your time and best of luck to all of you undergoing treatment         

love clucky
xxx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hi Clucky,

How are you? WELCOME!!! So nice to see you here!!

((6 fertilised! Looks like transfer is on Sunday. I am ar CRGH or UCH this cycle.))

The figures on their website a % of embryos transferred, not cycles started. The official clinic figures are not yet on the hfea yet as the clinic has only been operating at wimbledon for just over 1 year. Before that they used LFC as a clinic for EC and ET.

I think it is obvious that the figure for natural will be lower than a clinic that only does stimmed cycles as more can go wrong and you need more cycles to get it right.

You get 2 types of natural cycles... controlled natural where they wait for a dominant folly and then once they have that one they feed it with a little bit of something like gonal f till it gets fat! So there is no chance of then adding some stimulation as you already have a dominant folly.
((I once at the ARGC had to wait for another cycle as I had a dominant folly, once you have a dominant folly, you wont have anymore growing and all the stims only grow that one))
For a stimmed cycle you need to start the stims before thisnatural selection process.

If you are ovulating every month you should always have one dominant folly, so I think you will always have one suitable as the body naturally does this.

On one cycle I had a cyst and we abandonned the cycle. They just made me pay for the 2 scans and not the cycle, but I would check this with the clinic first. I was lucky to get the HFEA fee back as they hadnt already paid that over. This doesnt always happen as you dont get money back from HFEA if it has already been paid.

I think the only time it may be unsuitable for treatment is if you have a large cyst like I had. If the cyst had been smaller we would have gone ahead but it seemed to be obstructing the growth of the folly.

I did one natural cycle at Create and at that time they didnt have their own clinic so I did egg collection at LFC, but the egg didnt fertilise so nothing went back. The JOY of natural and mild is you can have treatment back to back, so I went straight into a mild cycle at Create, this was the month they opened the new clinic at Wimbledon and got 5 embryos on a mild stimmed cycle. EC and ET was at Wimbledon. Then I went to LFC and went straight into a mild cycle with them.

At create you can go straight onto another cycle with natural and mild, however a clinic like ARGC may want you to wait so you dont start a cycle with progesterone in the body. I think if I remember correctly that ARGC didnt mind the natural inbetween as they dont even see it as treatment!! I dont have any tubes so do like to have a mild cycle every now and again just with what my body selects.

I cannot remember who did my EC/ ET?? I think for my ET Geeta was in the room.

Hope you are well and good luck with your next cycle, it is always so hard to decide which was to go! I do love the ARGC and Create but they have totally different ideas and who knows what will work for different people?? I hope that answers most of your questions.


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Well, it's all happening here!

Annabelle - welcome to the strange art of LH surges and natural follicle growth.  Last month my follicle grew steadily 1mm a day then slowed down to 1mm over 2 days and then went from 12.5 to 18.5 in 3 days.  So your 12mm follicle could get bigger quite quickly or over a long period, there's no telling    Also I did have one cycle cancelled because of a premature surge so you are right to keep a close tab on your LH.  I think the ones with the smiley faces are the best so I would stick to them if I were you.  I hope your scan today (if I understand you right) goes well.  Try to stay relaxed (I know, impossible).

Regarding acupuncture I do have regular sessions where I live but the lady here only works 3 days a week so I wanted to get someone else lined up for embryo transfer local to Create in case my usual lady is not available.  I have just started taking herbs and ginseng regularly so am hoping this will help too.  I find acupuncture very relaxing and feel it helps me get more "balanced".  

Shell - glad to hear your good news and will   for a positive pregnancy result in a couple of weeks.  Do they do a special test at the clinic or will you be basically weeing on a stick?  Why are you waiting until Sunday for transfer, are they waiting to see which ones grow the best?  Please try and get some sleep, you want to be on top form for the next couple of weeks.   I find Valarian Tea bags help me drop off.

Clucky - nice to meet you.  Shell has given you a lot of info but I can add the following:

Natural ivf works better on older women than full stimulation ivf because over a certain age (which varies between different women) if you force the ovaries to produce lots of eggs the quality will not be so good as if they produce just one - like spreading your butter too thinly!

They scan you very regularly from about day 5 until they know whether your are producing a good follicle or not.  Sometimes you only end up having one scan, sometimes 6 or 7.

You can go straight from one natural cycle into another.

If no egg collection takes place you pay for the scans only (I think there is a cap on the amount).

You pay for all drugs and blood tests.  Sometimes you need them, sometimes you don't.  It's hard to predict from one cycle to another.

Egg collection seems to be done by one of about 3 highly trained people.  I imagine it's the same with embryo transfer but don't know as haven't had it done yet.

Let us know if any more questions.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello all!


Shell - congrats and good luck for sunday!    I find camomile tea helps with sleeping, also the body shop do a "pillow spray" which smells nice and has a calming effect. I am having a lot of trouble sleeping at the moment as well so I know how it is. Too much to think about, I find it so hard to clear my head!

Clucky - good to meet you ! I don't think I have anything to add beyond what Shell and Buffy have said. I can say that I have been to a couple of other clinics previously and much prefer the atmosphere at Create. I guess to some extent that is a personal preference thing but all the people there are very nice and friendly and it feels less like a "conveyer belt" than some other places.

Thanks for the info on your follie growth Buffy, it's good to know that growth isn't always steady. I went for another scan this morning and there was no change from yesterday, still 12mm - the nurses seemed a bit worried about this, is it unusual? They did a blood test but I haven't heard back from them at all on it. It is a bit odd because in the last 2 months my dominant follie has grown quickly and then stayed for days at around 18mm before LH surge, this time they're not growing quickly at all. Could this be due to progesterone in my system as this is a back to back natural cycle?

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Happiness07 (Aug 16, 2007)

Hi all,
Hope everyone is ok.
Shell- congatulations on 6 embryos - that's a great result. I like you, have had a no of cycles because I too have no tubes and really want to try out natural ivf before DE. I'm hoping we both don't have to rely on DE to get pregnant but can have our own biological children! This cycle seems very promising for you! 
I'm going to do 3 back to back natural cycles from Oct - Dec and then go for DE after xmas if they don't work. I need a clear cut off point since I'm older than you and really every clinic has been telling me the grim stats for mid 40s women so maybe for my sanity I need a clear plan. BUT I have decided that if and when DE works , I'm going back to trying natural cycles until my money and/will ceases (of course it will be a long shot if I'm around 46 but miracles do happen! ) After so many cycles of heavily medication, I'm looking forward to a more holistic approach. It was so odd to hear Geeta talk about the effects on my body- Lister & ARGC NEVER mentioned this! 
Hi to everyone who are waiting for ovulation/EC - all the very best!!!
Suki X


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

oooh its lovely to see this thread getting so busy.

shell: great news about the 6 embies

annabelle: hope follies get a spurt on   and all is well.

Suki: i agree its nice to hear a dr care about the effects on your body, its one of my reasons for choosing create and I like the fact that they are a smaller clinic. good luck with natural cycles.

welcome Clucky  

hello to CW, Azul, Buffy and Ves, hope I haven't missed anyone  

I'm on day 1 today...so am starting again on my next cycle. Not sure how I feel about it as it will be number 3. Had my head turned a bit last week by my friend from New York who came to stay...am wondering if I'm doing the right thing doing IVF and possibly passing up an opportunity with him but he lives in the US so really how practical is that.  Grrrr...doing this as a single person is tough sometimes.  

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello ladies

Something weird happened yesterday evening: my AF arrived 4 or 5 days earlier than expected based on when I thought I had ovulated.  This means that when I had my last scan when the follicle was about 18mm I must have already just ovulated.  This is the last time I don't use ovulation test sticks as soon as the follicle gets to about 12mm.  I'm so glad I decided not to go ahead with egg collection!  So I'll be phoning for another scan on Monday.

Annabelle - I think follicles can grow in fits and spurts so it doesn't necessarily mean anything that yours didn't grow in 1 day.  The blood tests will give you more info, have you got them back yet?  They usually give you the results on the same day.  I don't know if progesterone affects the growth of the follicle but I think it can be affected by a range of things such as being too tired or stressed over several days, I also think having a virus, being ill or just taking antibiotics before or during the week when your follicle is growing can sometimes have a detrimental effect.

Suki - good luck with your natural cycles, you may need to allow for more than 3 though.   The odds are the same as falling pregnant naturally, from my understanding, and you would allow more than 3 months for that.  In fact on average it takes 3-6 months (assuming no fertility issues) to fall pregnant naturally.

Lulumead - I hope you find a way to spend some time with your American friend


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

buffy, were you going to have egg collection?
I thought that 18mm is when you are ovulating, I used to ovulate on day 17. But when i had mild stimms they did the egg collection on day 11.
So does this mean your treatment gets delayed till this cycle.

cwsg


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

lulu     you made me smile about the american friend! i can see how doing IVF may get in the way of romance! well heres to hoping you get a baby and a new man!! Who says you cant have it all!! 

buffy, I thought that it wouldnt be 18mm if you had ovulated?? I would have thought there would be nothing there?? I maybe wrong as I never thought about this before. but once you have ovulated wont the folly go small again??

happiness... I think it is soo good to have a clear plan for your treatment in your head as in my situation it is hardly going from one cycle to the next I am always a cycle or 2 ahead!! I plan in batches of cycles!!   But you can always change your mind too along the way and try another route!!

Hi to everyone... suki, cw, bonita, annabelle, clucky, ves, azul and anyone I may have left out!!

Had the call, all 6 are going strong, all 4 cell. 3 embryos are the top grade and 3 are the second top grade! never been told about quality before 
but glad to be told when it is a good thing! They said a very small chance of doing transfer tomorrow. They want to wait till monday or tuesday but will let me know tomorrow. I am doing assisted hatching for the first time so this happens tomorrow, hope the embies wont mind??


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

This is what I found re the follicle:

"It is very hard to differentiate between the follicle and the corpus luteum, the aftermath of the ruptured follicle. They both appear as fluid-filled cysts. Only a very skilled ultrasonographer can tell them apart. The ultrasound evidence of ovulation is very subtle -- a small amount of fluid behind the uterus, and a slightly brighter, fluffier-looking edge to the cyst."

At the time of my last scan the doctor said the follie was bright and defined round the edge but I didn't know at the time what that meant.  I think she was confused because I had told her I hadn't had a surge yet, but in retrospect I think I probably started testing just as the surge was declining.  I probably had the surge 3 days earlier when I had a 12.5mm follicle.  I didn't realise they could grow so fast??  Anyway, I chose not to have egg collection because the blood flow round it was poor.  I want to wait for a really good follicle before doing egg collection again.

Shell - great news on your top grade embryos.  What is assisted hatching, sounds like chicks LOL?


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## clucky (Nov 5, 2008)

Thanks Girls for all your replies and the lovely welcome. 

Suki I agree it would be great to try something that is much easier on our poor bodies! And we don't live too far from Raynes Park so it would be so convenient too! I have emailed Create with a few questions - are they good at replying to emails (I know ARGC are not!) or should I just phone them instead? 
At the other end of the treatment spectrum I had a phone consultation with SIRM in the US last night so I am more confused than ever! Maybe I should go and see Create and then decide - it does sound like you are all pretty happy there!

Shell, sounds like you have good strong embies. Are you likely to go to blast now?       

thanks again
love clucky
xxx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Buffy, maybe ask when u are there whether there was a chance of you already having ovulated as I would have thought that they should know the difference. Just before EC they always scan to make sure that you havent already ovulated. This makes me think that they must be quite certain Who did your last scan? was it Prof Cambell? He is very good.

You would think that they should all be very experienced with this as this is what they do and what they are looking for??

Assisted Hatching is when they make a whole on day 3 in the embryo to help it hatch out of the shell.

Today is day 4 and I have 3 morulas and 3 pre morulas. So looks like transfer is set for 2pm tomorrow.
  that they make it to blast before then. I would LOVE to be told I have a hatching blast!!
(I always get such embie envy when someone says that they had a hatching blast put back!!)


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello everybody!

Not good news for me - the follies hadn't grown so this cycle is cancelled    So all over for this month.

Buffy - a strange co-incidence, the nurse said one area looked as if I could have ovulated - it was either one big follie with lines across/around it which apparantly means it has ovulated or it might have been several small follies close together. I think more likely several small ones together though coz I have done loads of OPKs and haven't got a surge yet.  

A question- have any of you had/heard of cervical erosion? It is where cells from inside the cervix grow on the outside and because they are soft they bleed easily. I have this and the clinic have suggested I get it removed (frozen off - yuk) before the next cycle, because it bled a bit at ET.  BUT it takes six weeks to heal so given it takes ages to get appointments this could push the next cycle back by ages. So I was wondering if it is necessary to have it removed?

Shell I have my fingers crossed for tomorrow!      

Lots of love to all

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi annabelle

I think I have a cervical erosion...it used to cause problems when I had smears, and sometimes during sex I'd bleed a bit but I haven't had any problems during ET, so don't if its healed.  As far I know its just an exposed blood vessel, so it it gets nicked then it can bleed...not sure why it would need to be removed, I thought it was only necessary if it was annoying...i.e. you kept bleeding when you had sex or something.

Sorry follies didn't grow.
xx

hello everyone else.


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

I am learning a lot from talking to you ladies.  Assisted hatching, morulas, cervical erosion...

Clucky - I'm not sure how good Create are with emails as I usually phone them.  It takes about a month to get a consultation with Geeta but once you've committed you can usually begin natural on your next cycle if you want.  I hope you go and talk to her, she has a lot of experience and cares about your long term health.

Shell - I was scanned by one of the female doctors.  Next time I see her I will ask.  I'm hoping to get a scan later this week anyway to see if this cycle might be viable.  I know having had several scans that there is only so much they can tell from ultrasound - for example I have had a cyst mistaken for a follicle and vice versa.  There's a lot of detective work going on!   for your transfer.  How many will you have put back?  Will you freeze the others?

Annabelle - don't be downhearted, not even a perfectly fertile 22 year old produces a viable egg every cycle!  Anyway, the good thing about natural ivf is you get to start a whole new cycle in 2 weeks time.  It's interesting what the nurse said to you about a line across the follie as the doctor also said this about the one I had that I now think had already ovulated.  How often did you do the OPKs?  I've heard that sometimes the surge only stays in your system for 10 hours.  About your cervial erosion - when I was advised to have my polyps removed they advised me to call Mr Carter at Parkside Hospital in Wimbledon.  He did the procedure the following week, privately of course.  I just said Geeta had advised me to call him and he was really helpful.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi-

Re the erosion - yes it sounds like the same thing you had lulu. It bled a bit when they did ET because the speculum was too big   , but it doesn't annoy me the rest of the time. 

Buffy - it gets weirder with the follicles because I did an OPK this afternoon and it was positive - even though the biggest follie this morning was only 12 mm, and even though it looked as if I had already ovulated! It is all very mysterious. Still I guess with a positive OPK we can try VERY natural methods of conception this evening     . Who knows, miracles do happen sometimes. Otherwise you're right, it is only 2 weeks until we can start again.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello Everyone,

Just got back from transfer and we transfered 2X day 5 hatching blasts!!

I got a picture of them! And we arefreezing another hatching blast today and there may be one more to freeze tomorrow.

I am very excited as this is the best result I have had so far!


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Congratulations Shell!

That is wonderful news, you must be so pleased!

Lots and lots of luck for the 2ww    

xx


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi Shell,

Congratulations! it's great! Lovely to hear that it is going so well.
Now go on with your normal life and lots of good luck.

Azulx


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## Happiness07 (Aug 16, 2007)

Hi Shell,
What a fabulous result - this is the very exciting. I guess you must have had mild ivf ? Geeta says she won't put me on that since I've had too many drugs already. Anyway all the best on your 2ww !!!
Suki


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

fantastic news Shell 

now lets hope and pray they stick 

cwsg xxxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabelle - I hope you enjoyed your natural methods of conception  at least you know you had your surge now.

Shell - that's great news  , I hope you are getting lots of r&r.  How soon will you know if you you have conceived, do they do a special test at the clinic?  

Suki - I think Shell did this cycle at a different clinic to Create Health.  It's good that Geeta is thinking of your long term health.

Well I am having my first scan of this natural cycle tomorrow so am   all goes well.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Buffy- How did the scan go?

Hope everyone is well!

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

just popping on to say hello...how's everyone?  updates please  

xx


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## Azul (Jun 20, 2009)

Hi everyone, 

went to GP last week and the baby is doing well, good size and steady 150 heart beat. I started to work and coping well with new job.after discussing with GP have decided not to have flu vaccination this winter. next week I have my 5 month scan and hopefully will know more. am feeling not too bad, but a bit upset with my DH (men!).-I went yesterday to bed at 8 pm feeling exhausted and upset as my DH was pushing his luck! I don't suffer fools gladly  so I left the room, went to bed and slept until morning 9 am.I felt so weak I couldn't bear talking silly staff. I told him in a calm, clear and direct way that I am not getting the support/understanding I was expecting from him and asked him to reflect on that.grrr  

I send lots of good luck for this cycle to you girls!!
Azulxxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Not so well, unfortunately.  I was set up for egg collection on Monday (day 10) then had a premature surge on Thursday.  This is the third time in four cycles I've had a 21 day cycle which is not usual for me at all.  Can stress make this happen?  Also they said I had a 2 small cysts (under 20mm).  One I've had for a while but I think one might be the strange follicle from last cycle.  I have an appointment to discuss my (lack of) progress with Geeta in a couple of weeks.  Feel a bit down.    Why does my cycle have to screw up now?

Azul - I hope you and your husband manage to sort things out and find some harmony.  I suppose this is a stressful time for both of you.  A friend of mine said her dh was useless for the first six months after her baby was born: he just sort of took to his bed and let her do everything.  They came through it though, and he grew into being a father.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Azul I hope you and DH have made up and are happy. It's sometimes difficult to keep calm when there is lots on your mind isn't it? Good to hear that you are getting on well with your job and the baby is growing well.

Buffy I am so sorry to hear about your early surge, I know how you feel   . I normally have totally regular cycles (even if they are long) so I was completely freaked out when this one didn't go as I expected. There are so many obstacles in this process that it seems unfair when the things that you can normally rely on start acting up! Stress can cause longer cycles, I didn't know it could cause shorter ones, but I hope Geeta can give you some answers. Are you going to try again next month? 

xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi all

My 19 week scan went very well today, babe is the right mesurements and everything is looking healthy. After talking in the car on the way there we decided not to fing out the sex. It was made easy by the nurse not even asking us if we wanted to know.
Will update with the new pic when i get time. But so relieved. 

Much less worried about the discharge, which has stopped today. Will get the result on Monday though.
We are going away for a couple of nights tomorrow morn to a freinds cottage, they live next door so will hang out with them for some of the time.
Big sigh, we really need the break. Running your own business is relentless.

best

cwsg x


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello ladies

Great news CW, thats lovely to hear. Enjoy your rest.

Azul: hope all is calm and lovely in your house  

Buffy: did you get any useful answers from Geeta? Have you met her yet?

Shell; how's it all going with you?

hello everyone else.    

I'm getting myself prepared for round 3!  Appointment on monday to go through my new protocol...am switching to Puregon and Buserelin, so nice to have something new to do  . been really struggling since the lovely man I met went back to the states at the end of august.  Keep thinking I am doing the wrong thing with IVF and should I try and see if it could work out, but then thats so much pressure to start a relationship from!  His best friend and my friend here says that i need to do my thing and if its meant to be it will work out, and that having a baby will not put this guy off.  Not really seeing how as a single mum I could manage a long distance relationship but there you go. So...after my wobbles I am back on track!  Let's hope its lucky number 3 otherwise I need to import more little swimmers from Denmark!

Lxx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi L,

does the guy know you are having ivf with donated sperm?

I guess he also thinks it's early days to be offering his, or asking you to wait.
Do you think it would riun the relationship if you asked him about his feelings about it, or maybe you alreafy have.


cwsg x


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

HI CW

he knows all about it and thinks its great that I am doing what i want. He did say he would have a baby with me if he lived here, its just that he wants to be involved when he has kids. And we had unprotected sex when he was here, but not the right time.

Think asking him will apply too much pressure and we are making a show together which tours next year so lots of time to see him in 2010.
Bit annoying though.x


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello ladies

Thanks for the kind words.  I haven't had a talk with Geeta yet, that will be on Friday which will be about the same time as my AF.  I did look up short follicular cycles on the internet and it said it can be the beginning of diminished egg quantity OR it can be the result of too much oestrogen in your system as a result of long term stress.  Apparantly having too much cortisol (which is released when you are stressed) makes your oestrogen rise for some reason.  So then you ovulate far too quickly.  Hormones are so easily upset.   Apparantly there is a drug that can stop you releasing too much oestrogen (lupron sp?) so this is something to maybe talk to Geeta about.  I would really like to carry on for a few more cycles anyway.

Annabelle - I hope you're getting lots of rest and looking after yourself ready for your next cycle.  Will you be beginning another one next week?

cwsg - great news about your scan!  I can imagine how anxious you must feel beforehand hoping all is well.  I hope you had a lovely break at your friends' cottage.

lulumead - what a dilemna!   Do you think you would ever consider moving out there to be with him?  

Shell - haven't heard from you in a while, how's it going?


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello!

CW- that's brilliant news about your scan.  

Lulu- blimey, such a difficult decision!   Would you be able jobwise to move out there to see if it could work out? I guess it is such a big upheaval though and puts so much pressure on the relationship. It is lovely to hear that he is so supportive of your decisions though!

Buffy- good to hear from you again, I have been worried. I hope Geeta has some wise words on Fri. Don't get too obsessed with Googling  - it's so easy to latch on to the most worrying explanation. More likely surely that it is stress related!  

I'm waiting for AF at the moment so that I can start another cycle (well 90% waiting for AF and 10% hoping for a miracle BFP). I think she is due this week but then since this month has not been like my usual months I'm not totally sure. It sounds like some of us will be cycling at the same time in the next week or so, which will be nice.

Lots of love

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all.

Yes going to be nice to have a few of us going through this madness at the same time!

Re lovely NY man...I could live in NY one of the few places that I think I would...but I can't just up and leave now...its such early days in terms of us meeting and getting on plus we have to work together in the next year that I think I just have to wait it out and see what happens. At the moment all we know is that we really get on and like each other, and if he was here we could explore that further but he isn't so I think I just have to do my thing and hope somehow it all works out.  Not in my nature to just trust that it will....I like to be able to control it!!!

Am off to create tomorrow for induction as slightly different protocol this time...then reckon I should start injections around 1st/2nd October.

buffy: hope friday is useful.

Annabell: hopefully a miracle this month  

hope the bumps are coming along nicely.

I like this thread...really nice and calm and positive.
xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi 

Lulumead,  well it's sounds good that he's not put off by you possibly having a baby by sperm donation before he possibly might give you his own!!
A pretty chilled out guy. Has he asked you to come to NY?

What type of shows do you make?

We both feel tones better for our weekend break. It was a very remote cottage, no sounds of cars or other people apart from our friends who live there in the house. We really must remember to do this regularly before we get to near breaking point. We also talked about names for the first time.

Cwsg


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi CW

Glad to hear you are relaxed after a lovely weekend away.  Sounds like you should squeeze a couple more of those in before bubs arrives.  Ooh exciting getting to talk about names. must be feeling quite real now.

NY man is lovely and very relaxed but obviously doing his own thing, he makes films and runs his own company which consumes all his time so I'm not sure he can imagine how I could fit into that. So he hasn't offered for me to go out there.  He's back in January so he feels like that is really soon!!! 
We're making a show for young people which combines rap/music/illustration and projection and will be shown in disused buildings if we can pull off the funding!

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabelle - thanks for your wise words re googling.  The internet is a great tool but a terrible master.  I'm hoping Friday goes OK, I am stressing about it a bit as I don't know what Geeta is going to say.  Having just had yet another stressful/draining few days I've decided to try and have a relaxing 2 or 3 months and hope that helps.  Has your AF turned up yet?  I know what you mean about hoping it might be that miracle BFP!  After all, it does happen.  I tend to monitor my PMT symptoms a little bit obsessively to see if anything different happens.  When I had that 56 day cycle I did several PTs.  (Does anyone wonder why we get stressed LOL.)

cwsg - glad you're feeling much refreshed after your holiday and how lovely that you are talking about names for the little one.

Lulumead - I hope you keep this relationship alive and kicking as it sounds so promising.  And you have something to look forward to in January!  Sending you good wishes for your next cycle, what protocol are you doing?


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello...just been for my new induction...this time I'm on 0.5 buserelin and 300iui of puregon....so lets see if that makes any difference!

due to start next week/weekend.

Hope all ok.
xx


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## lucky173 (Jan 20, 2009)

Hey All,

Sorry to be interupting the flow of talk here.I did`nt know much about the create health,recently came across this clinic which was suggested to me in the NHS hospital.I am now planning to look into booking a appointment with Dr.Naragund.

We are put on a waiting list for NHS treatment for IVF, but the wait is for atleast 2 yrs,this is what I was told in the gynae clinic.

I need some advise as to how to approach the first consultation and so on.I am quite nervous about it.How is the clinic and the std of treatment offered there?please share your experiences and views,very much appreciated!

Good luck to all and hope for a positive results.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi - 

Just a quick message to say good luck     for tomorrow Buffy, let us know how you get on if you want to!

Lulu- good luck with the new protocol   that it works out for you !

Hi Lucky! I really like Create, I have been to a couple of other places and for me Create is better because they make you feel like an individual rather than a statistic. It suits my approach perfectly also as I don't want to use any drugs other than where absolutely necessary.  Don't be nervous about the consultation, there is nothing to be nervous about really, Geeta is really nice. Saying that, I don't remember much about my consultation because I always get worked up about these things  - luckily DH is good at staying calm and remembering what was said! If you are worried that you won't remember everything, you could take a list of questions with you to make sure you cover everything you want to, and make notes?

I'm still waiting for AF - typically taking ages to come now I want to get on with the next cycle! I hope this doesn't go on for 56 days like yours Buffy, I think that would be torture! I know exactly what you mean about over-analysing PMT symptoms as well, I have been doing exactly the same thing! I must confess to a sneaky HPT on Tues   , of course it was a BFN. It's so difficult not to think about it, even though realistically I know the chances are miniscule. I reckon AF will be along soon though.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Ambition (Aug 19, 2008)

HI Everyone

I hope you don't mind if i join you here? I've got my first appointment with Dr Nargund in a couple of weeks. 
I was on here a while ago as I've had three miscarriages. last one was about a year ago. So I'm lucky in some ways as I know it can happen, i just need it to stick! But we haven't had any luck conceiving over the last year and I just want some help getting there. I know you'll know what i mean about the strain it takes on the relationship!
I'm also waiting for AF this month and although it seemed i ovulated really late on day 20, i'm still hoping (can u ever not?!), even though i can feel AF round the corner!
Has anyone else had miscarriages and now going to Create?
Good luck to everyone
x


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Ambition, welcome to the thread!

I'm sorry to hear about your miscarriages    hopefully you will be able to get a sticky one soon! Have you  been told that there is more chance of that happening with IVF? Or are you worried becayse nothing has happened over the last year so you want to check everything out? Sorry for my ignorance, I don't know much about treatment for miscarriages. 

Buffy - hope it has gone well today with Geeta, I've been thinking of you  

I finally got AF this morning  so can start a new cycle now which is good (although I'm a tiny irrationally bit sad that the miracle didn't happen!) I will ring Create on Mon to get a day 5 scan appointment - for some reason I didn't want to call them today, maybe emotionally finishing off this month, I don't know.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello everyone, it's good to see this thread busy.

My appointment went well considering!  Geeta was very nice and we agreed to try six more cycles and she's going to try to be the one to scan me so she can get a good idea of what's going on.  She says it could be stress or age causing the shorter cycles.  The stress thing is a real problem for me, even knowing I was going to have this discussion with her about the future I got so stressed I had a headache the rest of the day.  I'm going in on Tuesday which will be day 4 and she'll have a good look then at what's going on.  In the meantime I have to work at staying calm and relaxed.

Lulumead - is that a Mild Stimulation cycle you are doing?  I'm not au fait with these drugs, never having had stimulation.  Do you know when your start date is?

Lucky - Geeta is very understanding and will take your individual needs into account and also focus on your health, which a lot of clinics don't seem to be too bothered about from what I've heard.  Bear in mind that often the clinics with the best results only take on the most fertile women and then throw lots of drugs at them instead of working with their natural cycle.

Annabelle - sorry your little miracle didn't happen this month   I always feel bad when I do a test and it's negative, like I was "fooled" into doing it and I should have known better.  Still, as long as you have cycles you can't help hoping.  I started yesterday evening!  I have heard of women cycling together when they live in the same house but not over the internet LOL.  Maybe we will see each other at Create sometime?  

Ambition - nice to meet you and I hope Create Health works out for you.  So sorry to hear about your miscarriages   that must be heartbreaking to have got so close...  Has anyone ever given you a reason for them?  I don't think late ovulation means you can't be pregnant BTW.

Have a lovely weekend everyone


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Buffy, really pleased to hear that the talk with Geeta went well! 

LOL at the synchronised cycles, I need to call on Mon to get an appt but Tues will be day 5 for me so I may well see you there..

I have MAJOR issues with being calm and relaxed also, I actually even start shaking when I get nervous (including EC, ET, OTD etc) which doesn't help at all. I ordered the Zita West CD yesterday because I've seen people saying that helps with staying calm. I don't know when it will arrive because the post is so erratic at the moment, but I'll let you know if it helps. 

Hope everyone is having a great weekend, the weather is so beautiful!

xx


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello everyone,
Just wanted to let you know that I will be starting cycling in the next couple of weeks. Missed last cycle as prescription got lost in the post enroute to pharmacy. Feeling very nervous but have ordered my drugs today. Of course it would help if DH was more communicative, but hey ho!!
Love and good luck to all!
Prija


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Well my first scan this cycle went well  : ) - mysterious 18mm cyst has disappeared thank goodness.  Two small follicles, largest one measuring about 9.5mm so back on Friday for further scan.  Hoping no premature LH surge before then.

Annabelle - how did your scan go?  I'm glad I'm not the only one who gets worked up.  Let me know if the Zita West CD works well, I am thinking of listening to some meditation CDs as I've heard they're very good for getting rid of stress.

Prija - are you at Create Health too?  Are you doing a Mild Cycle?


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello all!

The scan went ok today - biggest follie seemed to be around 10mm - so hopefully back again on Thurs. 

Geeta was still worried about the ectropion, luckily when they had a look today it appeared to have gone   but I still need smear test results showing all clear (previous results were Jan 09) before they will go ahead with this cycle. 

Luckily I had a feeling that would be the case so I went a couple of weeks ago to a family planning clinic to get a smear done - my GP wouldn't do it because the previous one was so recent. They said it would take 4 weeks to get the results so now I somehow have to convince them to get it done by Thurs...  possibly a bit of a challenge.

Haven't got the Zita West CD yet but boy do I need it!

Buffy- really pleased to hear your scan went well! Fingers crossed that you will get to EC this month   

Prija-that must have been frustrating last cycle! Good luck for this time   

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Ambition (Aug 19, 2008)

Hi Everyone 

Thanks for your lovely messages.

Hi Annabell - sorry AF came - she came for me as well. Sometimes it affects you more than others doesn't it? i was pretty down this time as well even though I just knew she was coming. I read recently though that because progesterone causes the PMT we feel, you can never really tell whether you've been lucky or not as the symptoms would be exactly the same. Not sure I quite believe it although when I was pregnant for the third time I could have absolutely sworn AF was round the corner. So I guess you can never really be sure until she shows up properly.
Hi Buffy - glad the appointment went well - is she nice?!!!!

Miscarriages - I've had all the tests and nothing has shown up. THe IVF is in a attempt to kickstart things for us -perhaps the stress of it all has prevented us from conceiving again. I was booked in last year for IUI at the Lister and the week before my appointment, I tested and had conceived. It happens to so many people - you relax because you know you've got an appointment and know that help is coming, and then you conceive. Perhaps you even care less about trying because you know it doesn't really matter and someone is going to be doing the hard work for you next time! Tell you what, it will be a big relief to have someone else doing the hard work!

Also, trying to get help has been really hard - even though I've had three miscarriages I still can't get taken seriously by the NHS. They told me to come back when I'm pregnant. Great! I pushed for tests and got some clotting ones done and all clear there but they never sent the notes to my GP and now they are lost in the ether apparently. I'm fed up of waiting and so Create sounds like a light at the end of a long tunnel. I'm not expecting miracles, or maybe I am, I'm not sure. I know I'm hoping for them though.

I'm sure you've all been like me- I've tried everything. I've been following the Foresight plan, been to see a naturopath who has had me on amazing herbs, changed my diet loads - although can't resist a bit of chocolate and bad stuff even though they tell me it's a nightmare for upsettting hormones. I've had acupuncture regularly (actually, I have conceived three times and each time it's been in the third month of having acupuncture - her name is Jessica Kennedy and she is amazing.) I don't go to her anymore because I couldn't bear a repeat of what has happened before but maybe I will once I start with Create. After the last miscarriage I had some hypnotherapy which did wonders for me. I look back now and know I was  bit loopy, actually, a lot loopy, but I wasn't as bad as with the first two and I was a lot more philosophical and positive that things will work out in the end.

I've tried the CDs as well -they are good but I did feel like they were making me focus a bit too much on pregnancy and I find that I need to try to get on with the rest of my life rather than focus on this too much. Does that make sense? I've realised that this has all changed me completely in the last three years and I need to remember who I am again. 

I know I'm going on and being a bit introspective but I thought if my experiences can help anyone else.....!
It's good to talk  

Good luck everyone


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Good news for me - the family planning clinic were really helpful and managed to prioritise my smear results and it's all good.  

For some reason they can't send out the letter early, but they are able fax a copy of the results to Create providing Create call them and ask for it  . Well I don't understand the bureaucracy but I am happy because I think that means I will be able to go ahead with this cycle. Next scan is in the morning so I will know more then.   

Ambition- it is indeed good to talk, and it's really good to know that we're not alone in all the things we are going through, so thank you for sharing! I   that now you know you are going to Create that will help you relax and get a BFP, or if not then that they will be able to get one for you.  When is your appointment with Geeta?

I'm so sorry to hear about the trouble you have had getting tests done etc. I can't think how awful it must be to have three miscarriages and no explanations   . I think we may have had a very early miscarriage the month before we started tx in May - I had a late period which (TMI alert) all sort of fell out at once. But because at that stage I had abandoned all hope of conceiving naturally I hadn't done an HPT, so we will never know. Since then of course I have done LOTS of HPTs every time because now I think well it just might be possible.... but then it is disappointing when it hasn't worked of course.

I know what you mean about focusing too much on it, but it is SO hard not to. I found that trying the morning-temperature-taking FAM thing completely drove me crazy because it meant thinking about it everyday, and also there was lots of data to interpret and reinterpret and obsess about all the time. We do try to eat healthily etc although I am a bit too fond of chocolates and sweets, and I have only just got decaff tea bags (tastes like sick to start with, but you get used to it). I have heard good things about herbs - do you think they helped you?

Hope all's well with everybody, lots of love

xx


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello!
Sorry I can't keep up with everything, not enough minutes in the day!! Yes I am going to do a mild cycle. I have been assured it is much easier than  cycles I have been through before, so I am happy about that. Worry about fitting everything in.
Good luck to you all!
Love Prija


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - glad to hear your first scan went well and that the ectropion was so much better.  It was a good idea to go to the clinic and have a smear done, and you must feel reassured that all was normal.  Hope your scan goes well today and the follie looks promising.

Ambition - I hear you about the progesterone and PMT.  Unless you get implantation bleeding/cramping I don't think you tell whether you are pre menstrual or pregnant.  Yes Geeta is nice.  Are you worried about seeing her?  I don't think you need to be.  Have you got a meeting set up yet?  I think Create can also provide a range of fertility tests if you wanted to investigate things further.  Sometimes it's just easier to bite the bullet and pay for this sort of thing than wait around on the nhs.  Tell me more about the Foresight plan - do you think it's any good?  What's the food to avoid to keep your hormones healthy?  I hope you go back and see the lady that does acupuncture.  They do recommend it at Create.  Are the CDs you tried the Zita West ones?  Hope you don't mind all the questions.

Prija - all the best for your mild cycle.  How long do you have to take the drugs for (I've never done stimulated cycles.)


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## prija (Apr 24, 2003)

Hello,
I found Geeta and all the staff absolutely lovely and they really made me feel at ease.
I start off injecting on day 2 of my cycle and then go for a scan around day 6. I assume I inject up to a couple of days before egg collection but time will tell. I think it is similar to other cycles but with no down regging and much smaller doses of the drugs.

Love Prija


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all...glad to hear things are moving along for everyone.

I am due to start my injections on saturday!
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Wow lots going on on here now!  

Lulu- good luck for tomorrow with the injections! How long do they typically last for?

Priya- I'm glad you found the staff put you at ease. When do you start your injections? I hope it goes well. 

Buffy- Yes I'm so glad I went to the family planning clinic (such a gross place to go, but to give them credit they were really helpful) otherwise I might have missed this cycle, and even though I knew I have always had clear smear tests despite the bleeding, it was good to get my mind put at rest again. Scan was ok yesterday, lining had increased and the follie had grown a bit - not much, but I hope that's ok because it was only day 7. I have another scan tomorrow morning   even though given my long cycles I'm not expecting anything to happen until late next week really. I guess they are just keeping a very close eye on things. I hope all goes well with your scan today.   

Lots of love

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Well my second scan (day 7) went fine.  Follicle had grown a little bit and had healthy blood flow.  After discussion it was decided that I would try the cetrotide (to stop early ovulation) and fsh (just to encourage the egg to mature) from this evening (Saturday).  Back on Monday for another scan so hoping everything will be shaping up well.    I have already started to get EWM, but thankfully no surge yet.

Prija - I hope your mild stim cycle goes well, let us know when you are starting on the injections.  I am sure this will much easier on your body than full stimulation with everything that involves.

Lulumead - you're doing mild as well aren't you?  I suppose in that case you will be going for your first scan in a week.  Hope you manage to stay rested and calm over the next few days. 

Annabell - I don't think follies usually grow very fast until after day 7.  How did your scan go today?  It's good they're keeping an eye on you.   

Have a good weekend everyone.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello everyone.

Buffy glad scan was fine and sounds like it is all going in the right direction.

Annabell - hope all going well, are you doing a natural or mild cycle.

I start my injections tonight, on a protocol which means no scan until day 8, then another on day 10 then EC around day 13 I think...but I suppose it depends how its going.  So start with just buserelin tonight, then that and puregon tomorrow for the next 6 days. Hope no side effects as these are different drugs for me, and gonal F and cetrotide were all fine.

hope everyone else doing ok...sounds like we could be on similar timeframes.
x


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

My scan this morning was fine - follie was 14mm so it had grown, I'm so relieved!   Have to start doing the OPKs from this evening, so if all goes well EC will be next week some time depending on when the surge comes along...although if this is like my normal cycles it will be the end of the week I think. 

Buffy- glad to hear all going well so far! Does the cetrocide mean you definitely won't ovulate early? That would be reassuring- I'm worried about that now of course because that it the next potential problem!   Sounds like we will be pretty much on the same timing if all goes well - my next scan is Mon as well.

Lulu- I'm on a natural cycle. How "mild" is your cycle - i.e. how many follies is it likely to produce? I hope your injections go well this evening!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Annabell,

Good to hear follie going well  

Not sure I'm that mild any more as this is attempt 3!!
1st go was 150iui of gonal F & cetrotide - this produced 10 follies - 7 eggs, 3 fertilised, biochemical pregnancy.
2nd go 225iui gonal F then cetrotide - 11 ish follies, but only 3 eggs, 3 fertilised
this time I'm on 0.5 buserelin and 300iui of puregon...thankfully only for about 10 days in total.  I have no idea what these new drugs will produce. Just hope I get something to go back in.  

In theory Geeta doesn't understand why it hasn't worked yet, which is both reassuring and annoying!!  Its certainly not just the lack of sperm that i thought it was as this will be attempt number 6 (I did 3 iui's before starting IVF).

Hope we see some BFP's on here, I am very positive about the fewer drugs approach and really want it to work. Not sure where I go if this attempt doesn't work. Might switch back to IUI's...all my hormone levels are good and AMH was good and high so in theory I have a bit of time, and IUI would be cheaper. Oooh dilemmas....sorry rambled a bit here.
I reckon my EC will be about a week behind you and buffy so will be nice for us to crossover on the 2WW.

lots of     for us on here.     
xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Lulumead - hope your injections are going just fine, not much fun is it?  Was Saturday effectively your day 1?  if this cycle doesn't work maybe you could try some controlled natural cycles.  It could be the one egg your body produces would be better than the several produced by mild stim??  I only mention it because you were wondering what to do if this mild stim doesn't work.  Let's   it does!

Annabell - great news that your follie is growing well  , I hope mine is doing the same when I have my scan tommorrow.   Cetrotide means 98% likely not to ovulate I think.  You take gonal f (fsh) to counter any side effects of the cetrocide affecting the follicle growth, but it's a much smaller dosage than someone on a mild cycle because you only take it for 2 or 3 days.  I think this is what they call a controlled natural cycle.  Having lost 2 or 3 cycles to premature LH surge I was keen to make sure it didn't happen again, especially as the follicle looked good this month.  It does feel like you have a series of fences to jump: timing, blood flow, growth, LH surge at the right time etc etc.  I hope your OPKs have been clear so far.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks for the thought Buffy, will definitely consider that and whether to go back to IUI's. lets hope I don't need to  

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone-

Scan ok again today, 17mm   No positive OPK so far, so back for another scan on Weds if I don't get one before then.

Buffy- the cetrocide sounds like a good idea, as at least you are removing one hurdle (early ovulation). Is there any downside to using it? Good luck for your scan today, I hope it's still going well!   

Lulu-I agree with Buffy that it might be worth trying natural if it doesn't work out though - I know it costs more than IUI but at least you know whether you are getting an embryo?  Let's hope that you don't need to consider it though -  I really hope it is going to work for you this month!   . 

Lots of love

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - glad to hear your follicle is growing well!    Mine is a bit behind at about 13mm but this does not appear to be a cause of concern as it *is* growing (it was 10.5mm on Friday).  I'm back on Wednesday too, so hoping to see some more growth.  Sounds like you could get your surge any time?  Only downside to cetrotide I'm aware of is it can sometimes inhibit growth which is why they also give you the gonal F as a kind of backup.  Still, early ovulation doesn't seem to be a problem for you this cycle...


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Buffy- Glad to hear your follicle is growing too!   Don't worry about being "behind", it is growing and that is what matters! Looks like EC will be this week for both of us, hopefully  

Not sure when my surge will be because it is still only day 11 and usually it would be at least day 14 (last few cycles it has been around day 16) ...I'm paranoid about missing it so I'm checking 3 times a day at the moment   I think if I still haven't surged by Weds I might have Ovitrelle, depending on the scan, to make sure it doesn't happen over the weekend.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

good news on follies lovely ladies...lets hope there are some embies getting popped back very soon.

my injections are stinging a bit. not sure if its just cos I'm a bit out of practice or if its new drugs. Oh well...not too bad...

xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

just popping in to say

best of luck everyone, nice to see you are all supporting each other well.


I am now 22wks pregnant and have a definate baby bump now. Feeling good, and much less worried that anything will go wrong. My midwife came round today and i heard the heart beat again and kicking. I can now feel the baby move too.


Cwsg xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello Lulu,

Lots of luck with this cycle!! Will be popping in to see if this is the one!!

My last cycle I had a BFP for about 5 days then negative, heartbroken! Next cycle going to SA to use a surrogae.

hello CW, glad all is well!!

hello to everyone else!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

oh shell, sorry to hear that. It seems so hard to even get the BFP, and then for it to actually stick seems even harder. Good luck for SA, always good to have a plan.

CW - how lovely that you have bump and all good.

I'll keep you all updated, I have scans on friday and monday.
xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - any sign of your surge yet?  You must be on tenterhooks...thanks for your kind words re growth of the follicle, I'm hoping for good news tomorrow, maybe I will see you there if you are having another scan, I think we keep missing each other.  Does your husband go with you for the scan?  Mine hasn't been able to since the first one this cycle, although obviously he would come for EC.

cwsg - great news and glad you are relaxing a little more,   they say the middle trimester is the easiest...before you start feeling like a beached whale.

Shell - so sorry to hear about your BFN, how disappointing after you got a BFP for a few days .  I hope the surrogacy thing works out well.  Have you decided against natural cycles at Create?

Lulumead - I trust your injections are getting a little easier, and that your scan goes well on Friday.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello everyone!

Buffy - Still no surge...yes I am on tenterhooks! My appointment is 11 am tomorrow, maybe I will see you there? My DH doesn't come along for any scans as he can't easily get time off work, he will be there for EC though   !!! I hope you are ok and your scan goes well tomorrow   

Lulu- Sorry to hear the injections are stinging, I hope they are getting easier now  

cwsg- lovely to hear your little one's heartbeat! So good that you are able to relax and enjoy it now!  

Shell- very sorry to hear about your BFN  . 

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - I am 11.30 so I might see you leaving    If, as you reverse out of your car parking space, you see a red peugeot hovering looking for a space that will be me.


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Good news,   follicle grown to 17mm and E2 blood results healthy so I'm on course for EC on Friday. 

Annabell - it was lovely to bump into you and put a face to the name.    Maybe I will see you on Friday if we are both on Ovitrelle tonight.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy- so pleased that your follie had grown and you are on course for EC!    

It was lovely to meet you too and maybe will see you again on Fri- I will be able to update later whether I have surged or whether I have to use the Ovitrelle.

xx


----------



## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Shell, so sorry to hear your news, so near and yet so far. You are so determined i'm sure you'll get there.

cwsg x


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Quick update - still no surge so I have done the Ovitrelle injection. I don't like injections but can't complain since it is only one! Some of it seemed to come back out of my leg once I took the needle out (TMI, sorry!) but there was nothing I could do about that so I hope it's ok.

EC is 9.30 on Friday, fingers crossed    

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - One of the doctors told me that Ovitrelle injections increase the chances of embryo transfer so it's probably a positive thing that you've done one.  I wouldn't worry about some of it coming back out, this does happen sometimes and I am sure they must allow for it.

I am 10.00 on Friday.    for both of us!  I didn't sleep well last night as I was too revved up, I hope it won't have hurt anything.

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks for the reassurance Buffy! I'm glad Ovitrelle has a positive effect, I didn't know that.

I'm not sleeping well either, but I didn't sleep AT ALL (literally) last time I got to EC and the follicle was fine then so don't worry based on that experience it doesn't seem to affect it! 

Have you ever been told about no makeup, deoderant etc for EC? Some of the girls on other boards talk about this.

I haven't been told anything like that and last time I went for EC as normal (i.e. with makeup and deoderant!) and it didn't seem to be a problem, nobody mentioned it. I do have some highly unfashionable fuzzy knee-high socks to wear tomorrow as I was so cold last time.  

I hope you get a better sleep tonight and maybe see you tomorrow! Let's hope it's good news for both of us    

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

I trust you get some sleep tonight then. I'm glad to hear that it didn't hurt your follicle, that's reassuring.

No, I haven't been told about no deoderant or make up.  I think different clinics do different things at EC.  The first one I had was at LFC (before Create opened it's theatre in RP) where they seem to give you a light anaesthetic and it was much more formal (and therefore nerve racking).  I think at Create you're actually getting a sedative which probably means there are different rules.

I must remember to bring my long furry socks tomorrow as well.   Is your dh bringing his blackberry, that's what most of the men seem to do?

 Hope you have a relaxing evening. 
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Ah, it makes sense that there are different rules for a sedative. I'm glad it is a less formal route, it is nerve racking enough as it is  

DH will DEFINITELY bring his blackberry! Last time I took a sudoku book to keep him occupied (like looking after a kid!  ) as well. 

There was awful lot of waiting around beforehand last time so best to bring a book or some other distraction (as well as the furry socks  )  As far as I remember the actual EC didn't take long at all. There was more waiting around afterwards to find out about sperm count etc but I guess you don't have to worry about that bit!

I am planning to have a nice long relaxing bath this evening as it might be the last for a while. I hope you have a good evening too , try not to worry I'm sure it will all be fine tomorrow!   

xx


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Best of luck Annabel and Buffy  - I was really nervous for my ec at create but it was surprisingly enjoyable in the end! Pretty sure I made a wally out of myself a few times as apparently I didn't stop babbling   and even asked the anethnetitst (sp!) if she liked my newly painted nails (dh heard me shrieking that my toes match   !)

Seriously though, the whole thing was very chilled out, hope you have a similar experience and good luck  

Beegey xxx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Good luck Annabell and Buffy, hope it all went well today.

I had my first scan today...looks like around 5 follies on each side which is good.  Was annoyed though as they told me that my HIV/hepb and hepc tests all run out tomorrow and therefore without updating them I couldn't have egg collection!!!  They also asked if my husband would need them...had to point out no husband!  So had to pay for blood tests, annoyed as I could have done these at a clinic or my GP for free if they had told me in time.

Another scan Monday so will then find out about EC looking like wednesday or thursday....am hoping for thursday as wednesday is my bosses leaving day so tricky to miss work.

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Thanks for everyone's kind wishes.

The EC went fine and they found an egg very quickly.  Sadly they rang later that day to say it was abnormal so no point trying to fertilize it.     It was very disappointing because this cycle had been going so much better than before, which I am sure was in large part because of using the cetrocide and gonal f to control it. 

I suppose at my age you have to expect a few abnormal eggs but it's not exactly reassuring. 

I was very pleased that at the EC they gave me the option of a light or heavy sedative and I chose a light so I was pretty much aware of went on.  Although it was a little bit uncomfortable I recovered much more quickly and feel much better the next day.

Annabell - I hope you have some better news?

Lulmead - congrats on your 10 follicles!!!  I can understand your irritation re the blood tests.  Mind you, I had to cough up £80 to get my doctor to do them anyway.  Hope the scan on Monday goes well.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy - I am so so sorry    I have been nervous about logging in here to find out what happened because I was so hoping it went well for you. At least you know you can get to EC so hopefully it is just a matter of keep trying (easy to say I know, less easy to do!) until you get a good egg? Look after yourself, I know that it must be such a disappointment   

Beegey- LOL at your toenails! 

Lulu- congrats on your follies! I can imagine that you are annoyed about the blood tests, at least you ahve been able to get them done in time though! Good luck for the scan on Monday  

AFM, EC went much better than last time (no tears!) and becuase I said I was scared of being unconscious they did light sedation which was great. I think I knew pretty much what was going on the whole time, and apart from a bit of discomfort it was all over very quickly. I don't think I babbled or did anything embarrassing- Buffy please let me know if I did...

Good news that the egg was ok, sperm count not so good though so we had to go for ICSI, which is what happened last time as well. It has fertilised ok so far, they will call again tomorrow so we have our fingers crossed.

Lots of love to all, Buffy I really hope you are ok I'm thinking of you xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

annabell great news...fingers crossed for a lovely embie to pop back.

buffy: so so sorry to hear that egg not viable. very upsetting. Hope you are ok.  Will you go again?  it does feel like a numbers game sometimes. sending big hugs.

It was weird as I was thinking that you two would be over the road whilst I was having my scan done!!

Lxx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks lulu- I remembered your scan on Fri and had a quick peek into the waiting room when I went over the road to pick up the cyclogest after the EC but I didn't see anyone who I thought could be you (not sure how I thought I would be able to tell, I think I was still full of sedative  )

Embie still doing well so ET scheduled for 10.30 tomorrow. Bit worried because it was such a nightmare last time.

Lots of love to all

xx


----------



## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

ooh I think I heard someone buying that!  I was reading a script in the waiting room!!

Glad the embie is doing well...I will have finished my scan by 10.30 (hopefully!) and heading home but I send some positive vibes over the road for an easy transfer. Then have to come home and prepare for a job interview at 2pm!  Not much chance of me being calm and rested this week!!

At least should find out tomorrow if a weds or thurs egg collection.

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - that's great news about the embie     I will be thinking of you tomorrow and hoping everything goes more harmoniously than last time.  It probably will, and I am sure you will be more relaxed like you were for EC.  I don't think you did anything embarrassing on Friday although when I went in straight after you they said I was the second person wearing long furry socks  

Lulumead - will be thinking of you too.  Yes, I am intending to have at least another go otherwise how will I know if I have any good eggs?  As you say, it is a numbers game, especially when you get over a certain age.

I have read that at my age only about 35% are healthy which is a drag, but at least I am not at risk of getting pregnant naturally with an abnormal egg and then facing a miscarriage.  This happened to my sister-in-law.  She was in her 40s and had 3 or 4 miscarriages before she fell pregnant with my nephew who is now a very healthy 14 year old!  I guess she had to work her way through some abnormal eggs, but it can't have been pleasant.

Looking forward to your updates tomorrow.  I'll have to live this cycle vicariously through you two.

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

oooh beegey, I only just realised that your little one arrived in June.
How is it all going?

Shell: any news on when you might head to SA?
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello - Just got back from ET and it was a LOT easier this time - no pain or bleeding and all over very quickly. The furry socks had another outing - I really think they help!  

Buffy I'm glad you're sounding positive about trying again, I hope you will get the good egg next time. 35% healthy sounds low I know but that hopefully means that in 3 tries you will get a good one?

Lulu- I hope your scan went well and the interview also! 

Lots of love
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

good to hear annabell.

My scan was fine...egg collection on wednesday...I have some good follies but until they find the eggs I am not going to be too hopeful.

My interview was weird, and I don't think it went well but the person I am applying to job share with felt that too...so who knows.  As long as they appoint someone good I won't mind!!  although the extra money would have helped.

Lx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell - glad to hear ET went without a hitch - must be the lucky furry socks    Did you decide to spend the 3 days resting in bed in the end?  

3 tries to get a good one is a positive way to look at it.  I have bought a couple of supplements which are supposed to be good for egg quality, so hopefully this will help as well.

Lulumead - glad to hear the scan went well.    for a succesfull egg collection.  I hope you hear good news about the job share too.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy- Thank you, yes I think it is all due to the socks- I'm still wearing them!   

Freda and Lakshmi said there was no need to stay in bed, but try to stay calm and rested. So I have spent the afternoon watching TV - thank goodness for Sky Plus! DH said I should only watch cheerful things so as to keep the embie happy   so I have been watching lots of Doctor Who. I will try to do as little as possible for the next couple of days as well.

It's really good that you are staying positive, I hope the supplements help and the next egg will be the one     I have been taking Wellwoman Conception and EyeQ (DHA fish oils). Which ones have you got?

Lulu- Glad to hear the scan went well, good luck for Wednesday! Don't forget to take furry socks - it gets cold in the theatre! I hope you have a good result from the interview, I think it is always really hard to tell how they went. It's amazing that you managed to do it as well as a scan this morning and EC coming up!

Lots of love

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Lulu - I have been thinking of you and hope to hear a positive update on your EC soon  .  Take care.

Anabell - hope you are still taking things easy.  Do you have to go back to work this week or have you taken some time off?  Enjoy Doctor Who but don't watch the episode called "Blink" or you might frighten the embie    Are there any early signs of conception you can look out for like implantation bleeding or is it just a case of waiting until you can take the test?  

I have been taking basically the same supplements as you only the Zita West brand.  The new ones are called L-Argenine and  Co-Q10.  Here's what I found on them:

COQ10- helps to maintain the eggs' integrity by protecting it from free radicals. Coq10 is best taken for two to three months before having IVF or natural conception. 

L-arginine - an amino acid that has been shown in studies to increase ovarian response, endometrial receptivity, and pregnancy rates in IVF patients who supplemented in large doses of L-arginine. (Published in Human Reproduction 1999). 

The only thing is, from what I have read, it takes 90 days to form a good egg so they might not be a "quick fix".

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Lulu- I hope your EC went well, I've been thinking of you today   

Buffy- I'm still taking things easy! I'm not working at the moment which is good because it means I can try to relax, but on the other hand not so good because DH is out during the day and there is so much time to think!! 

LOL at "Blink" - I watched that episode a month or so ago and I was so scared afterwards that I had to sleep with the light on   ! I don't think any of the other episodes are as scary as that one, although some of them can get quite emotional..

I will definitely be looking out for all and every possible sign of conception - I am already even though I know nothing can have happened yet !  I think realistically it is a matter of waiting for the test though because signs of conception and cyclogest side effects/AF symptons are very similar. 

I still have slight cramps from the EC- I don't know if you do too? It's nothing bad but I get little twinges where (I imagine) the needle went through, it feels a bit like ovulating pains.

Those supplements sounds really good, I hope they help    , although it must be frustrating that it doesn't have an immediate effect. 

Are you planning to try again straight away next month? I know at the clinic they say it is ok to do that (and obviously they are the experts!!!  ) but after what happened last month on a back-to-back cycle (folllie not growing etc) we have decided that if we have to do another cycle (  that we don't have to) we are going to leave one free month for everything inside to recover from EC etc... Of course the follie not growing could have had nothing to do with the back-to-back cycle though, it's impossible to know!

Lots of love to all

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello lovely create-ers!

Well yesterday was quite an adventure. I arrived at create, got undressed had blood pressure done and then was told that there was no anaesthetists (spelling wrong I think!) so all 4 egg collection patients had to go in cabs up to central london!!!
All quite stressful but I got 12 eggs, 10 mature, and they called this morning to say 7 fertilised. So will possibly have ET on saturday or on Monday if good enough to go to blasts.

Crikey, been tricky though.
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Blimey lulu that must have been stressful!! You must have been really scared that you would ovulate in the cab!


Congrats on your 7 fertilised, that is great news!    for the next couple of days, hopefully you will be able to go to blasts 

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Lulu - oh my goodness, way to increase your stress levels!  Thank goodness they were able to refer you to the Harley St clinic and it doesn't seem like it did you any harm in the long term.  Seems like these drugs were good for you?  7 fertilised is excellent, surely you'll get some blastocysts to put back.   Good luck trying to stay calm.

Annabell - I am very envious of you not working, it certainly is stressful trying to do a cycle whilst holding down a job.  Luckily for me my boss is my dh so I get to take some days unpaid leave for scans etc    Actually I work 4 days a week but I hope to start 3 days a week shortly so this should make things more manageable.  Good luck not over-analysing every sympton you get, I know I would!!  I had slight cramps until about Monday morning and no spotting at all this time.  I hope I get Lakshmi again for EC    I expect I will try again next cycle, barring illness or other unexpected happenings.  If I were to skip a cycle it will be December because it is incredibly stressful to combine preparing for Christmas with doing a cycle.  I tried last year and my oestrogen levels dropped at a critical point.  I wasn't surprised because I was just a ball of tension at the time.  (Crying, not sleeping etc.)  I'm no expert but I would have thought the *stress* of the EC would have been more of a problem for your next cycle rather than the EC itself.  You did say you got quite worked up didn't you?  I am convinced that stress has this sort of effect, but that's just my guess.  It would be interesting to see some stats.


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

crikey Lulu,

but you did well none the less, great news that 7 have fertilised. Fingers crossed  

Jess xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

lulu- hope all going well with the embies!   

Buffy- Yes I am totally in awe of everyone who does this and works too. It would have been pretty much impossible with my job, and we thought that the stress of trying to cope with that would be very detrimental to the chances of the IVF working. It wasn't an easy decision to make though! It is a good thing your DH can give you unpaid leave   , and I hope going to three days a week will be easier for you.

I still have slight cramps but I wonder if it's just because I'm obsessing about that area! I only had one little bit of spotting immediately after EC. Lakshmi is great isn't she - she is so calm! She did the ET as well this time. 

I'm sure I will be symptom spotting soon - the embie is 7 days old now so    should be implanting soon. The only thing to note so far is an upset tummy, I think that's the cyclogest  

I think you're right about the stress creating most of the issues, I was SO tense last time. I do wonder if the Cyclogest had an impact too, because it took a long time for my cycles to get back to normal after being on the pill, maybe it has a similar effect? I hadn't thought about co-inciding with Christmas (that is a bit of a worry now!) but in that case it does make sense for you to go ahead next month.  
Lots of love
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello...will find out about the embies tomorrow and either have transfer then or blasts on monday.

Annabel; looks like we might be on the 2WW together, thats good.

lots of love to everyone else.
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Good luck for the call tomorrow, hope it goes well!   

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hello all

Clinic phoned this morning to say all 7 still dividing! 6 are doing great but one is only 3 cells so might not make it. Am going to blasts so hopefully will have some obvious front runners come Monday. Also have my second interview on Monday morning so its nice to have them put back after that and then I can relax.

thanks for all the well wishes.

hope everyone else doing ok.
xx


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

That's great news lulu, good luck for Monday!
 

And congratulations on getting a second interview!  

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello Annabell, Lulu and any one else reading.

Lulu - congrats on your good news all round, you are certainly firing on all cylinders this month!  I   for a harmonious ET on Monday and that you spend the next two weeks thinking happy thoughts.  

Annabell - have your cramps eased up yet?  I think you are right that when you start monitoring that area you notice every twinge.  I   your embie is now comfortably settled in your endometrium.  I've heard of progesterone giving one constipation but not the other extreme - maybe it is just excitment, although there do seem to be a lot of bugs around at the moment.  Still, if you are feeling OK in yourself I'm sure it's nothing to be concerned about. 

You raise an interesting question, can taking two weeks of Cyclogest affect your next cycle?  I wouldn't have thought so in themselves as it is natural for your body to have progesterone at this time anyway.  Experts now say when they come off the pill most women are more fertile for the first 2 or 3 months than they are usually.  I think more studies need to be done into this whole area.  Having said that, I am convinced that taking heavy does of antibiotics does screw your body & cycle up for a couple of months.  

Re the Christmas thing, I would have to miss two cycles in December because the second one would be between Christmas and New Year when they are closed.  At the same time I seem to have succumbed to a cold virus right now and am concerned about whether this will affect my next cycle so really it is very hard to decide what to do next  .

love
Buffy


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello create-ers!

Well I am now officially on the 2WW.  I have two early blasts on board...not sure of quality they said they don't grade them at this early stage  .  The others are developing slower than they would like so doesn't sound like there will be anything to freeze.
And who knows about job - can't be bothered with it anymore!

Annabell: how's your 2WW going?

I'd never thought about what cyclogest does to your cycle, but of course it would well do something as it is a hormone!!

Buffy: are you any further with deciding what's next?

xx


----------



## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Congratulations lulu!   Two blasts is great!   it works out for you this time!

I'm ok thanks - actually a bit   at the moment because I feel so completely normal. I know that it is still early days, but I can't help thinking surely something would feel different by now if it was working. OTD is Friday which is only 4 days away now, so I'm getting worried.

Buffy - I hope you are recovering from your cold! I have had a bit of a cold for the last week, unfortunately I can't say if that has caused any problems or not   . Maybe you could ask the clinic what they advise? I still have an upset tummy but not feeling ill with it so maybe it is just tension? I know cyclogest is meant to cause the opposite problem, due to slowing down muscle movement or something   

I don't know if cyclogest can affect the next cycle, instinctively I think it can but maybe it depends on the person. I had 45+ day cycles for about 6 months after coming off the pill, so I know that definitely had a big long-term effect on me, but then as you say you do hear that a lot of women fall pregnant straight after coming off the pill, so it is all very confusing. You're absolutely right, more studies would be helpful as it's so hard to know what the right decision is. I've never had any issues with antibiotics, but then they do give me an upset tummy as well so maybe that is my reaction to everything!  

I hope everyone is well, lots of love

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Lulu - great news about your 2 blasts.  I hope you're able to get plenty of r&r over the next couple of days.  Are they going to keep an eye on the others and see how they go?  It's amazing how many eggs fall by the wayside isn't it?  It's amazing anyone every gets pregnant.  

Annabell - sorry to hear you are a bit down    I expect this is quite normal at this stage.  It's frustrating getting a cold or virus when you are trying to stay as healthy as possible, isn't it?  Still, I expect lots of women get pregnant even thought they are sick.  A colleague of mine was telling me that his daughter got pregnant by accident because she got a tummy bug which make her throw up for a couple of days and this stopped her pill from working.  (Astounding when you think of the effort we're all putting in.)  Your upset tummy could be a result of the cold as well, if your body is trying to eliminate the virus.  We just have to face the fact that we are in a season when there are a lot of viruses going round.  

I don't think you can read too much into not getting any symptoms yet.  Doesn't everyone say you can't tell the difference between PMT and very early pregnancy?  Presumably you are close to the time when you can start to do a test (although even then it's possible to get a false negative until after AF is overdue).

My cold finally feels like it is clearing up, so on Friday, when AF should arrive, I will probably book a scan .  If it had carried on into next week I am sure it would have screwed up the cycle.  I go down to 3 days work next week, yipee.

Well, I will be thinking of you both.


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu... congrats on being pupo!! 2 Blast on board is excellent.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all,

annabell; hoping for great news for you on friday.     Also am pretty sure on the cyclogest side effects it says upset tummy!! might just be that.

buffy: hope you are good to go on friday  

Shell: thanks for the positive vibes. Have to say that am not feeling very positive. I know I should be pleased with two blasts but to be honest it feels like it is meaningless if they don't work and so many people seem to have top class blasts popped back that don't make babies so hard to stay positive.

Didn't get the job...so am expecting work to be pretty grime.  Glad I have got the week off.
xxx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

hi everyone!

Thank you for all the hugs and kind wishes - it really helps to know there are other people out there! I'm still feeling a bit down - I think it's because it's getting nearer and nearer to OTD and I'm so afraid it's going to be a disappointment.   Still I don't KNOW that yet so I guess it makes no sense being upset before it's necessary! 

Not helped by the fact that our heating has broken (again!) and it's absolutely freezing. Had the heating engineer here all afternoon BUT as usual there is water everywhere now and it's still not fixed. He's back on Thurs... so I might have to think of somewhere a bit warmer to go tomorrow in the meantime!

Buffy- I hope you are better by Friday and ready to go again!   I'ts great news that your cold is clearing up. I'm sure you're right and lots and lots of people get pregnant with colds etc - it's just that we have so much time to focus on and worry about every possible related factor! My cold has (I hope!) nearly gone now. It hasn't been anything serious in terms of raised temperature or anything like that so I'm not too worried about it, although as you say it is so frustrating as I eat so healthily now and take all the vitamins and still get ill at the worst possible time!

The strange thing is I don't have any PMT symptoms either yet - I just feel totally "normal". It's true that I could probably test with the early response tests from tomorrow (have to wait 2 weeks  after ovitrelle injection to be sure that the ovitrelle has gone out of the system) but I don't think testing early is hugely reliable...OTD on Fri is for blood test at the clinic, Lakshmi said wait two days beyond that to use a HPT because HCG goes into blood earlier than urine apparantly. I think I will go to the clinic on Fri , but waiting for the results call from them last time was so awful I'm almost tempted to wait two days to do a HPT. 

It's great news that you're down to three days a week next week- I hope this will help you relax and have a successful cycle!   

Lulu-   try to stay positive (although I'm hardly the poster girl for positivity at the moment!   ) Two blasts is great and there is a really good chance of them working, the fact that they have got to blast shows they are strong little embies, it is still a better chance than a day 3 transfer so look on the bright side if you can!   

I listened to Zita West CD for the first week to try to keep calm and positive- but I haven't for the last couple of days because she started sounding more and more like my Religious Education teacher at school and that got really offputting   SO I'm not sure if it helped. 

I'm so sorry that you didn't get the job  . Are you doing anything nice with your week off?

Lots of love to all

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Sorry me again- help, after all that saying I wouldn't I did do a HPT this morning and it was BFN.   

The instructions say it is 87% accurate 3 days before expected AF so I suppose it's possible that it will change but not likely.

I am devastated because both times we have got this far everything has been perfect - perfect embryo, perfect lining, perfect bloodflow- so what on earth can be the reason for it not working? What else is there we could do about this? 

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

annabell - lovely, please don't give up hope yet...it can change. I know its hard to keep positive, I am feeling exactly the same, in theory everything is "perfect" but it hasn't worked yet so why think it will this time. And actually if they are saying sunday or monday for a HPT then you are testing much much earlier than they would expect.
I always test early to prepare myself. If you can, hold off for another couple of days and test again - you could always do a HPT on Friday morning and do a blood test to confirm then at least you have prepared yourself a bit. Over the singlies board women have tested early got a BFN which has been a BFP come official test date.  On my bio chemical I didn't feel anything, although about a week after egg collection I felt really rough and peculiar for a day or two, so I kind of thought something was going on.  Last time, I started spotting about 4 days before test date so I knew it hadn't work.  Fingers crossed that you have just tested too early.    

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Annabell    

I agree with Lulu that, whilst it would have been lovely to see a BFP so soon, your BFN must be treated with caution.  Lots of women have an early BFP that then turns into a BFN and vice versa.  Until AF arrives or you have the blood test you cannot know for sure.  There has to be a reason that Lakshmi said the test isn't accurate until Sunday.

Even if your hopes are not realised this month, remember this is only a temporary setback.  The most fertile couples take on average 4 months to conceive and *most* blasts don't make it, so if you are playing the odds it's going to take a few times.

Also remember how stressed you were the first time and how much easier it was this time.  Next time you'll probably be even more chilled out and this will be another factor in your favour.

I also hope your heating gets fixed soon.  This can't be helping raise your spirits.

Lulu - glad you have the week off to relax in.  I can understand your state of mind but I am sure your chances are better than you anticipate. 

As for me, this stupid cold has resurfaced.  It's really hard having to work and not get time to rest, which I'm sure would get rid of it.  I may take the day off sick tomorrow and Friday is my official day off anyway.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello-

Thank you so much for the messages yesterday,  they really really helped!

I think sadly it is defininitely no good because now I have quite heavy almost black bleeding.   Last night I had burning/aching pain on my left side and down my thigh (sort of along the bikini line  ) and then this morning stabbing pains followed by the black bleeding. 

Does anyone know if this could be a burst cyst? There was a cyst on that side on one of my scans this cycle. It wasn't the side that I had EC from so it can't be related to that. 

I have booked in for the blood test tomorrow morning, as at least that is closure. 

I have also asked if they can do a scan as well to see if they can see what was causing all the pain. I'm really worried that it might be a cyst as m y sister had one which burst and she lost her ovary and nearly died due to internal bleeding. I'm also worried that it may be a blocked tube because it's 5 years since I had the hysterosalpingogram, so I guess things could have changed in that time. I was thinking of getting another hysterosalpingogram done at Create just to eliminate that possibility, what do you think? I know blocked tubes are bad even if you are doing IVF becuase they can leak yucky stuff which harms embryos.

Sorry lots of talk about me!   

Buffy - I hope you are taking the day off and getting better from your cold!     

Lulu- I hope the 2WW isn't driving you mad yet!

Lots of love

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi annabell, I have no idea what that could be. I do know that sometimes I have very dark almost black blood at the beginning of AF which is supposed to be old blood...so its possible that its that and that could be due to AF or implantation.  Worth asking Create tomorrow when you go for the blood test.  Good idea to check about cyst. Its all so frustrating isn't it.

I have thought about having another check of my tubes as I might switch back to IUI if they are clear.  At my last clinic it was really hard to tell because my tubes went into spasm.

Hope it all stops and tomorrow brings you a lovely surprise.
x


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Sorry to hear it sounds like your AF arrived Annabel   - mine started early this morning, rather to my surprise as I expected it tomorrow.  Do you usually get aches and pains and very dark blood at the beginning of your AF?  I suppose it is possible your cyst burst - I think they are supposed to do that sometimes when you get your AF.  Was it a particularly big one?  The other thing is your descending colon is close to your left ovary so it could be related to your upset tummy if you still have that.  Sometimes I get confused between period pain, ovulation pain and colon cramps.  Are you having a scan tomorrow as well?  I don't think it sounds like anything to worry about if the pain has stopped now.  Have you had blocked tubes before?  If not I wouldn't think they would have blocked up for no reason - unless you have put on a lot of weight and I'm pretty sure that's not the case for you!  I've never had my tube checked.  I suppose you can ask tomorrow if they think there is any point in redoing it.

I've got the afternoon off so hope to get some rest ready for my first scan on Monday (day 5).


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks for the messages! It is lovely to have people to talk to at this time xx

I still have bleeding- brown and now a bit of red so I suppose it is AF starting   Bit strange as I am still taking the cyclogest, I thought that was meant to hold off AF.. but obviously not. Buffy we clearly still have synchronised cycles! 

I am hopefully going to have a scan tomorrow to see if I can get any answers about the pain I had, it was unusual and a bit frightening, it was painful enough to keep me from sleeping.

I don't know if I had blocked tubes before - when I had the hysterosalpingogram 5 years ago it took ages for the dye to go through one one side and it hurt like crazy (I think it was the most painful thing that has ever happened, in fact   ) and apparantly that might mean there was a blockage there but it got flushed through. That is why I have a niggling concern about it, though of course it is probably just overanxiety.  

I just really want to make sure I have eliminated all possible problems before we try again. I would hate to find out there was something we could have done to avoid the BFNs, although I know that it is probably just statistics and we just have to keep trying  

Buffy I'm really glad that you're getting some rest and it is so exciting that your day 5 scan is on Monday!  

Lulu - I hope you're ok!   for your little embies!

Lots of love

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello Creaters, just a flying visit!!

Lulu, 
hope all is going okay, I usually go     in the 2ww.
I always test right through! From trigger to OTD I prefer to know what is going on.
Last cycle, is the first time I got a positive pee test and It was positive from 4dp5dt till 9dp5dt and this clinic only did a test 16 days after transfer so by the time I got to OTD it was negative.
I am glad I know it was positive, I would hate it if I had just been for the bloodtest and it was negative and I had never known that it was a chemical. So I am all for testing even though it is sooo hard when it is negative and sooo hard when it is positive!! Neither is easy!!

Annabelle       I hope you get all your answers when you go in for your appointment. dont get down!! and I am watching your treatment with interest as it is the first time someone on here has actually tried a few natural cycles in a row. I am sure it will take as long as it would take trying naturally. And it is very quick if someone falls in 3 cycles so you are still going well. I have always meant to give natural a few good goes but always went off track for the hard drug thing. But still may do it in the future.

I really hope you get your bfp soon.

Buffy Hope you are feeling better soon.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hi annabell - your tube experience sounds similar to mine...it was really painful...some dye went through slowly on one side but the other side really hurt and they told me that my tubes had gone into spasm and had shut down so its hard to know if they are blocked or not. Geeta suggested having a hycosy under sedation as this would stop the spasms!

shell: I'm sure I will be testing early...just want to make sure the HCG trigger has cleared my system...which I think takes 10 days! so I might test at the weekend depending on how I feel, I definitely want to pick it up if its a chemical again. I totally agree with you, its hard knowing either way but at least of you pick up chemical then its clear something has been going on.  

buffy: good luck for day 5 scan.

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hi Annabell, Lulu and Shell

Annabell - how did you get on today?  Did you have the scan and did it reassure you?  Did they explain how your AF could start whilst you were taking Cyclogest?  Did you ask about your tubes? 

Shell - it was good to hear from you again.  I hope you get to try some natural cycles  

Lulu - your and Annabell's tales of getting your tubes tested sound a bit scary, I hope neither of you have to do it again.  I also hope all goes well if you do start testing at the weekend  

I'm getting lots of rest today, only got up for lunch after sleeping in and now watching Pirates of the Caribbean #3


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone

Well the blood test was definitely negative    . I  guess I knew that really but I was surprised how upset I was when I got the call- I think no matter how rationally you know it's not worked you just can't help hoping for a miracle  

I didn't have the scan because the pain had stopped and apparantly I would have had to pay the full cost for the scan. Now I wonder whether I should have done it but at the time I was getting really emotional and I just wanted to get back home and not cry in front of everybody. I did ask about  the cyclogest but there doesn't really seem to be an answer...

I have booked a follow up with Geeta for Tues 3rd November. I really want to know how the statistics work out - I know that you expect to be trying longer with natural cycles but is that because you have more cancelled cycles due to lack of growth, or because you don’t get to ET each time etc? 

I guess what I am really wondering is given that I have had two BFNs from really good embryos is that the same as two BFNs from "normal" IVF? Or do people usually transfer more than one embryo per go of "normal" ivf and that increases the success rate, so you would expect more than 3 goes with natural IVF even if you had ET each time?

I'm worried because I have heard people say that if you get 3 BFNs from normal IVF then the chances of it working at all are slim.

Not sure if I have made sense there....

I will ask Geeta about the tubes when I see her on the 3rd. Also,we've never looked into any of the genetics or immune testing stuff- do you think we should be doing any of that?

Buffy- I'm glad you're resting!    I have just bought the "Twilight" DVD after my little sis got me into reading the (awful but strangely addictive) books - I'm going to watch that tonight -maybe with a beer!  I hope your cold is better now. 

Lulu- Good luck with the testing  . In my first cycle I had a positive HPT on day 7 and 8 after transfer which was 11 and 12 days after the Ovitrelle jab. I've never been sure if that was the Ovitrelle or a very early chemical pg. This time I didn't test until 9 days after transfer to allow a full 2 weeks for the Ovitrelle to go out of my system. I guess your method means you will know for sure! 

Shell- Thanks for your message, I hope to be able to give good news about natural cycles soon!

I'm off to have a cup of tea WITH CAFFIENE IN IT. What a rebel.

Lots of love,

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Sorry Lulu and Shell- 

i've just been thinking about what I wrote and I didn't mean to upset you or be insensitive by writing that people say chances are slim after three full goes.

I don't know if it's true, I'm just worrying about it. 

Lots of love

xx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

annabelle,

the argc say percentages decrease after 5 good goes at very good clinics and when adding up my cycles they wont count natural cycles at all or mild cycles.

I dont think natural cycles even count!! So not to worry, if you have only done natural, this is the same as trying at home naturally, just a very very expensive way of ensuring that you get fertilised eggs.

If you look at all my 10 cycles, 9 fresh and one frozen, I made it to transfer on every occasion except my natural cycle. this is why the figures are so high, a lot of people dont make it to transfer, but this is expected. More can go wrong when you only have one egg.

I still think it is an excellent treatment having natural or mild IVF!! Figures should compare to trying naturally.

please dont think that there is something wrong and IVF wont work, you still have LOTS of options. IF is not easy.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

don't worry at all Annabell...I think you voiced what I feel anyway!!  If this go doesn't work then I have effectively had 6 'perfect' embryos transferred. It begins to ask questions about genetic/abnormalities and immune issues.

I would imagine natural cycles are much more like trying naturally...so the stats must be similar...15%-20% a go?

with IVF I always worked out that stats that if 100 people started and 35 succeeded on the 1st go, that leaves 65 moving onto attempt number 2...if 35% of them get pregnant, then thats about 57 pregnant after 2 goes, leaving 43 for attempt number 3....so by the end that would be about 70...I know it doesn't really work like that but it always made me feel better.

Ultimately though it feels like a complete game of chance, and it happens when it happens....which is why its so hard.

Sorry that you had your BFN confirmed....I hate that call, which is why this time I'm going to just do home tests.
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thank you for being so understanding! xx

Shell - thank you very much for that info, it has really helped to know that 3 cycles is not some dreadful cut off point!  

The stats on Create website for Aug 08-March 09 give 50% success rate per ET for natural cycle < 35  years -  BUT they don't say how many ETs were done in total in that age group, just that there were 44 natural cycle ETs in total across all age groups. I guess it is possible that given the total number is quite small there were very few ETs in the <35yr age group in the time period.

The success rate for 35-39 years is given as 20% per ET.  The previous year's success rate was 18.2% for <37 years. This is much more like the stats for trying naturally.

Lulu - I like your way of looking at success rates, that helps too!  

I think I am going to do a home test next time, going in to the clinic this morning and then waiting for the phonecall was awful. I think maybe it would be better to only do a blood test to get confirmation of good news rather than bad.

I'm sorry you have the same worries, and I pray that your little blasts stick.    

Buffy - I hope I didn't upset you either with my earlier mail - I know you have been trying for a long time and not got to ET and I didn't mean to be insensitive about that either.  

Lots of love

xx


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi all,

just letting you know, I have been in hospital for 4 days with a chest infection. The cough that I have had for 3 months finally got the better of me. I was away from home too, in London visiting my parents and collecting a car. I got breathless and sick and we went to the hospital as there wasnt a doctor around and they wouldn't let me go home! I was in a delivery ward and heard babies being born, which was nice. but got very depressed there by the last evening as I was told I could have a clot on the lung. As it turned out they said this was very unlikely and the xray showed an infection at the base of my ribs at the back.
The baby was monitored three times a day and heartbeat and movement fine.

I'm now on antibiotics off work.

cwsg


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello all

cwsg - you poor thing  , please get lots of rest so your body can recover...don't push yourself, I know it's horrible when you know there's work to be done but you just have to force yourself to rest sometimes.  Thank goodness it doesn't look like a clot, and also they monitored your baby and everything was OK.  Everyone seems ill at the moment  

Annabell -   you didn't upset me at all, I think we all feel frustrated about what our bodies are doing (or not doing).  I understand you want answers, that's just how I feel when things go so right and then suddenly so wrong.  The irony is you hear all these stories about women who managed to fall pregnant because they stopped trying and just relaxed which is just the opposite of seeking answers.  Letting go....I wish I could.

Remember what Disraeli said "There are lies, damned lies and statistics."  For everything you read about statistics you will read 5 exceptions.  How about Trinny Woodall who fell pregnant on her *tenth* ivf treatment?  It's just as well she didn't read somewhere that no one falls pregnant after the X attempt.  Or Patricia Hodge who had 12 years of unexplained infertility before she had twin sons (conceived naturally in her 40s).  I read recently of a women who has just fallen pregnant for the first time aged 48 - she thought she was going through the menopause.  The point of all this (in case you're wondering) is that as much as we try to control our fertility there seems to be a huge area of luck, God's will, timing, fate or whatever you want to call it that can't be controlled by doctors.

Even if the odds of conception are as good as 50% it doesn't necessarily mean anything if you try it twice and it doesn't happen either times.  If you were told to roll a die and get 1-3 you would have a 50% chance both times.  If you then rolled a 6 and then a 5 it doesn't mean there's something wrong with the die.  However if you keep rolling then you will get 1-3 sooner or later.  Anyway, that's my thoughts, take or ignore as you like    I hope your conversation with Geeta helps you to feel more confident as well.

I think you're right (and Lulu) about doing the testing to confirm good news BTW.  

Twilight - is that the vampire stories?  I hope you enjoy the DVD.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hello everyone!

I am feeling much better and more positive today thanks to all your wise words and help, thank you so much!

cwsg-    I hope you are feeling better, that must have been very scary! Take time to rest properly, antibiotics can really take it out of you as well so you need to take extra care of yourself. It's great news that they were able to reassure you that your baby was ok though, that must have been a relief.  

Buffy-   thank you, it is good to remember that statistics don't give the whole picture. I absolutely love the dice analogy! I think I will keep telling myself "there is nothing wrong with the die" whenever I get stressed. 

I think you are very right to point out that there is a huge element of "it will happen when the time is right" which medicine/statistics can't do anything about. I am going to try hard to accept that. The really difficult bit I think is to strike an emotional balance between accepting that and keeping as positive as possible about each individual attempt.

Twilight is the vampire stories, I was too tired to watch the DVD last night but looking forward to watching it soon. I have my myriad siblings coming for sunday lunch tomorrow, so a busy weekend ahead!

I hope everyone is well

Lots of love

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy-

Good luck with the day 5 scan!   

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello

I hope everyone had a pleasant weekend.

I've just returned from my day 5 scan.  I wasn't expecting to see much activity because I'm still spotting and I've noticed that shorter cycles seem to coincide with shorter AFs.  (I suppose because your oestrogen starts rising earlier.)  Anyway there was a small follicle just under 6mm and lining was thin so I had read the situation right.  Freda said it was baseline and to return on Friday to see how follicle has grown.  Hopefully it will be Geeta doing the scan so I can touch base with her.  Also I met the new Italian doctor called Sylvia who seemed very friendly.

My dh doesn't like me driving my 10-years old Peugeot 106 up to Raynes Park and back everytime so he is trying to get me to drive his BMW.  He drove me there today, and I drove us back and I felt like I was driving a tank, plus how can anyone keep up with 6 gears?  

Annabell - glad you're feeling more positive.  You've just got to roll the die again!  Have you decided when your next cycle will be?  I've pretty much decided to skip December, I'm already feeling overwhelmed with the number of presents I have to buy before then, not to mention all the family gatherings.    I saw the new Twilight film being reviewed by Jonathan Ross and he said his daughter had been very upset at how much had been changed from the books.  Hope you enjoyed your time with the family.

Lulu - did you decide to go ahead and do some home testing in the end?   

cwsg - hope you are feeling a bit better now.


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## dora3 (Oct 24, 2009)

Hi 
I have just booked my first appointment at Create and just wondered whether you had any feedback you could offer? It seemed like such a lottery picking which clinic to go with but I chose Create as it is the closest to where I live and work and seemed like they had a pretty good success rate on the HFEA website. Any comments would be much appreciated.
Thanks and best wishes.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Ladies,

I just thought I would let you know how I got on at Create. I had mild IVF back in spring that got 4 eggs, they all fertilised and they were all grade 1-2 and I had 2 replaced and 2 frozen. That cycle didn't work and I kind of knew it hadn't straight away. I was really unsurprised when my period started the day I was supposed to test.

On the 1st of July we had the frozen embryos replaced - one didn't survive the thawing very well and was only 3 cells but the other was 7 and I felt totally different that time. I knew from the start that it had worked. I am now 19 weeks pregnant with a little boy.

I had a hard time early on - I bled a lot up to 13 weeks, with two very big bleeds that had me in A+E. It turned out I had a subchorionic heamatoma which thankfully has now resolved. I am also concerned that my PAPP-A is very low at 0.23 (normal is 1) but I am to have regular growth scans and I am trying not to worry too much.

I am 36 and was 35 when the eggs were fertilised. 

They can be a bit disorganised (they realised they hadn't got us to sign a consent form for the thawing the day they were doing it so there was some frantic faxing) but they are very kind people and I think they know what they are doing. I would rather have fewer eggs of better quality each cycle, and I think that's what mild stimulation provides.

Good luck to all of you having treatment at Create. x


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## dora3 (Oct 24, 2009)

Congratulations Natasha - wishing you lots of luck for the rest of your pregnancy. Thanks for posting your comments - they did seem really nice at the clinic when I rang to book the appointment and I definitely like their more natural and holistic approach.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Buffy- I hope all is well on Friday    Sounds like you are on top of things as you accurately predicted your scan results today!

I understand your car issues- my car is very old indeed (40 yrs!) and definitely wouldn't make it as far as Raynes Park. I won't drive DH's car because it's way too big and fast for me, so I go to the clinic on the train if DH isn't with me. Do you have a long journey to Raynes Park? We're in Clapham so it's not too far.

I think we're going to go for December for the next cycle, DH has the view that if it's a matter of number of rolls of the dice then we should just keep rolling! We're planning to go to my parents for Christmas this year so not too much work for me to do, although obviously there will be travelling. The thing which is most offputting is that if my cycles stay regular then  OTD would be pretty much on Christmas day, which might not be the best timing  

I had a great time with my family thankyou, it was lovely to see them all and a nice distraction for me too. I've still not managed to watch Twilight though!

Dora- Hello and welcome! I have had only good experiences with Create, I would agree with Natasha that they are really kind people. We tried a couple of other places before and were not comfortable with them, but Create has been a refreshing change.

Natasha- thanks for sharing your story, lots of luck for the rest of your pregnancy! I am sorry to hear that you have had a difficult time to start with  

Lulu- How are you getting on? I hope all is well  

Lots of love

xx


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## dora3 (Oct 24, 2009)

Thanks Annabell - it' s really reassuring to know that you have had good experiences at Create. 

Did anyone go down the NHS route before going private? I got home today to find a letter from the NHS to say I have an appointment on the 3rd December - I'm assuming this is just the initial consultation as my GP told me the waiting list on the NHS was at least 18 months!


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## Lexicana (Aug 28, 2009)

Hi everyone
Just wanted to say your're really lucky to have a clinic like Create where they believe in natural cycle and mild stimulation.  I went there a year ago, but unfortunately had to abandon my controlled natural cycle ivf as i got the drugs wrong.  There was quite a big time gap between them showing me how to do the injections and me actually starting the treatment and i was so nervous about it as well, so I got one of them wrong.  I do think they could be a bit better organised, as this could have been prevented by them insisting on going through the injection process again.  I do think they're good though, and would go back if I lived nearer.  Unfortunately I live up north and have to go to Liverpool Women's hospital.  They're quite good, but I had to persuade them to do a mild ivf as they would never offer this unless someone asked for it.  They were then amazed when I got a really good response - 9 eggs, 5 embryos, 2 put back and got pregnant, at age 40.  Unfortunately had a miscarriage.  Am going to try again soon.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

I'm really sorry to hear about your miscarriage, Lexicana.  

Well done for sticking to your guns with Liverpool and congrats on such a good response. Were you able to freeze any of them for another go?

I also got the drugs wrong one time - I loaded up the pen with far too much and had to discard it. It was about £400 for a replacement but luckily I had enough to last me until the courier came. I'd forgotten all about that.... God, I was in such a state when I realised what I had done.


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Dora - I haven't tired any other clinic but I think the people at CH are very kind and also listen to what you have to say.  Their weakness is probably administration.  They definitely make a big thing of looking after your health in a way that I hear does not happen in many of the other clinics which are just after good results.  I am sure your appointment will go well.  Are you going to Harley Street or Raynes Park?

Natasha - thank you for sharing your story with us.  It's interesting that you say you somehow "knew" whether or not you were pregnant.  I know a lot of women feel like this.  I am sorry to hear of your problems in early pregnancy   I hope your PAPP-A results turn out to be only a blip, there seem to be so many tests they can do these days and it's easy to worry when something doesn't seem exactly right.  Hopefully the growth scans will reassure you. 

Annabell - I am travelling from Basingstoke, I could go by train but would have to change, probably at Clapham.  That's great news that you're going to have another go before the end of the year.  As you're not working you'll be able to fit in some Christmas shopping as well I'm sure.    You must have quite long cycles if OTD is Christmas Day?

Lexicana - It's good to hear from you.  I'm sorry to hear you got the drugs wrong.  I got really het up one time with my Cetrotide injection and ended up not doing it.  I don't know how the people doing full ivf manage.  It's great news that at Liverpool they were prepared to try out mild stimulation.  I have noticed that with most health issues you have to take responsiblity and not leave all the decision making to the doctors sometimes (although obviously I would never do something a doctor told me was dangerous).  After all, you know your own body best.  Sorry to hear about your miscarriage   that must have been disappointing when you had got so far.  Still, I am sure you are quite right to try again and hope that next time will be The One.  

Lulu - hope you are OK


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## Lexicana (Aug 28, 2009)

Natasha - I got the gonal f one wrong, I just primed the pen and then gave myself a far to small dose!  At Liverpool I was put on Menopur, which I found much easier, the only problem was breaking the vial, which took a while to get the hang of.

Buffy - yes I am pleased that I managed to convince Liverpool Women's to do mild ivf.  Most people aren't aware that this is an option and just go for the full version like the doctors tell them to.  I don't think that this is necessary a lot of the time.  I wonder whether the profit motive is at work here, and whether the drug companies have an influence.  Anyway, I hope maybe my case has in some small way made a difference and shown them that this may be an option

I'm quite into alternative health anyway, so quite sceptical of doctors and their so called 'evidence based' approach.  I'm using acupuncture, herbs and a good diet to try and improve my chances and I'm convinced it helps.  My cycle is not yet right, I was going to do another ivf at the end of this month but this is only my second menstrual cycle after the miscarrage and last month was longer than usual and then this month has been shorter.  So I'm going to wait another month until things get back to normal.  Such a lot of money to pay for ivf, is best to make sure that everything is optimum first.  That's another good thing about Create, it's a bit cheaper than other clinics.


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Hi ladies, sorry to gate crash  

As many of you know, I got my bfp from CH over a year ago. A quick tip if anyone is ever in any doubt regarding the jabs, we watched short films on youtube which were a real god send as they explained and demonstrated really clearly what you had to do. 

We had a great experience of the clinic and plan to go back, probably next summer sometime to try for a sibling.

Good luck,

Beegey xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone! 

Lovely to see so many people on here!

Buffy- I have 31 day cycles so it would pretty much get to Xmas day I think- last cycle started 25th Oct. We are definitely going ahead in Dec though as long as the meeting goes well with Geeta next week. 

Basingstoke is a long way to travel! I hope you are well and getting lots of rest, eating milk and keeping warm etc to get that follie to grow!   

Lexicana- I'm really sorry about your miscarriage  , I hope next time works out for you. Congrats on getting the docs in Liverpool to do mild ivf. I asked another clinic in London (before going to create) whether they would do it and they said it was "a waste of time". Your experiences and those of lots of people at Create show that is just not true!

Beegey- I hadn't thought of youtube, that is a really good idea. I have done natural ivf so only one injection (Ovitrelle) but I managed to freak out enough over that one! 

Lulu- I hope all is going well with the TWW   

I have a question for those doing mild ivf- how many injections do you have to do and how often? Are there any noticable side effects?  I am wondering if that would be the best thing to do next... 

Lots of love to all

xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Annabell - in response to your question about the injections for the mild IVF, it depends if you are doing a long or a short protocol. I did long so I had to down regulate for about 14 days before my period was due. That was nightly injections with Buserelin - about 0.5ml I think - I had to draw that out of a bottle with a disposible syringe and inject myself in the tum. Then after my period started I started also using the Gonal-F pen at night alongside the Buserelin. I started off injecting 150units one day and 112 the next but I didn't have that many follicles so we went up to 150 every day. I think that was for a couple of weeks as well. 

I didn't feel many side effects at all and I had been really worried that I would - neither emotionally nor physically. Well, I  mean I was emotional but I don't think it was as a result of the hormones, rather because of wanting it to work so much. I had a slight headache for the first few days of down-regging but apart from that, nothing. 

Buffy - I agree with you about the admin side of things at Create being a bit iffy. They let me down on a few things, as well as forgetting the consent form for thawing they also told me to go and pick up a form from their Harley St branch to get my pregnancy blood test done the first time (when I was unsuccessful) and I turned up and the office was shut and locked and I had a bit of a weepy meltdown on the landing. It turned out I didn't need a form at all. I did tell Geeta about that when we went for our follow up and she said that that particular admin assistant no longer worked there. However the thing with the consent form happened the next cycle we had so they hadn't really got their act together. I don't care though, I would rather they be a bit flaky in that area than the actual baby making stuff.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all

sorry been a bit absent.  think attempt 3 has failed have been spotting since monday and it is building up in the usual way that it does with AF.  Officially my HPT date is friday but I think i am going to do it tomorrow as quite frankly I will be amazed if it isn't negative.
feeling pretty depressed, in theory all is ok...I thought I just needed sperm!! but this will be the third go with 2 good embies put back and nothing!! all my hormone levels are good especially AMH, lining good so I have no idea.  And I'm getting a bit sick of the its just luck argument.  Can my eggs really be totally rubbish at 37!!


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Oh lulu I'm so sorry to see that      I have been thinking of you and keeping my fingers crossed all week.

I hope you get a good surprise when you do the HPT   

Lots of love

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

definitely a negative.  Will need to push Geeta for some more concrete answers.

Thanks for thinking of me all
xxx


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Lulu,

    

I was sooo hoping for a positive for you this time!!!

Maybe you should try assited hatching next time.
I think it makes a huge difference and am always gonna do it. My last cycle was my first BFP even tho only for a short time and it was from the assitied hatching.

maybe they not totally rubbish! Maybe just need a helping hand!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

good idea, Shell...I'll ask about that and do some research. Thanks for the suggestion.
Geeta just says well it worked the first time, as I got a biochemical - not really worked in my opinion!! there is no baby!!  I really like Create and I don't want to take loads of drugs but I have a limited fund as we all do and I need to maximise the success rate. Am going to look into switching back to IUI's if its a numbers game then this would give me more goes financially.
xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Lulu  -  sorry it didn't work out for you this cycle - I'm sure your eggs are not rubbish!  Maybe it just wasn't the right sperm?  Or maybe you'd do better on natural cycle rather than stimulating more eggs than your body would naturally produce.  Or maybe assisted hatching like Shell suggested would help.  You have lots of options.  I hope your talk to Geeta is fruitful.

Natasha - I agree with you about their flaky admin, but as you say better this area than any other!  The important thing is they don't care more about results than your health. 

Annabell - I am clearly having a long cycle this month so maybe we will stay in sync    Is milk supposed to be good for follicles, I haven't heard that.  Re mild I think it is possible to just start injecting once your period stops until you ovulate.  I was also going to ask if you had thought of trying Chinese herbs.  I only mention this because you said earlier your AF was very dark so I think a Chinese practioner would say your endometrium needed tonifying or something.  Don't you already have someone who does acupuncture?

Lexicana - I am sure you are right to wait another cycle for everything to settle down.  What you have been through takes its toll on your body.

I am a bit fed up at the moment because as soon as I went back to work my virus came back.    I am also sure that my oestrogen hasn't kicked in until today (day 8 ) because of symptoms I've had such as feeling very hot and spotting for a long time.  I'm not expecting to have seen much growth tomorrow.  I've already committed to this cycle so I'll just have to hope for the best.


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

lulu  so sorry that it didn't work out again. So frustrating. I hope you get some good answers from Geeta.

p.s. did anyone else see Geeta on tele last week, it was on a morning discussion on IVF.

cwsg x


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello CW   

and hello to all the loverly ladies on here!!

No didnt see her, what was it about??


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## cwsg (Nov 10, 2008)

Hi Shell,
it was about the moral issues of having IVF, a chat show. 

She looked good, sound as usual. Maybe it could be on the internet.

cwsg


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Lulu - I'm so sorry it was negative    

When are you seeing Geeta? I hope she will have some answers for you. We are seeing her next Tues. I have decided that I am going to ask about mild then. I much prefer the idea of natural BUT like everyone we have finite resources and want to make sure we have the highest chances of success in relation to the cost. (We don't have the option of IUI becuase of sperm count).

Buffy-   at the continually synched cycles. I am still spotting too, which is unusual for me!  I think milk and chicken (basically protein) are good for follicle growth, so is keeping warm, especially around your tummy. It's spooky that you mention chinese medicine because I have just got a book on that today, I will follow it up. 

I hope your scan goes well tomorrow   

Lots of love

xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Lulu - I am really sorry to hear that it was negative. Thinking of you and sending hugs .

CW - I didn't see Geeta on telly but I did hear Professor Campbell on Radio 4 talking about ultrasounds. It was quite bizarre as we were driving back from having had a scan with him.


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Hope you don't mind me joining this thread but I've been monitoring it since about April and I'm going to be starting a mild course at Create in less than 2 weeks. The drugs arrived today so it's all feeling a bit real now! We've found Create to be very good so far and Donna (who did our induction) is lovely.

Lulu, I was really hoping that this time would be positive for you, I'm so sorry.

Just wanted to check with you all about the drugs though - in our delivery today we got an autojector which was not mentioned in the induction, is anyone using this or just using the syringe manually? Which is easier?

Good luck to all of you!


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi Susie!

Welcome and good luck with your cycle! All the people at Create are really friendly.

Sorry for being nosy but could you tell me what drugs you have to take for the mild cycle (what and how often?) I'm thinking of doing that next time.

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello all

Just reporting on my day 9 scan.  As expected, very little has happened, the follicle has grown about 1mm and the lining is still thin.  They asked if I would like to come back for another scan next week and I said yes.  I think I am just having a long cycle, no idea how this will effect the follicle when it eventually grows but seems silly not to keep monitoring when we have already committed to the cycle.  So hoping for better news when I go back on Tuesday. 

I'm sorry I missed Geeta on TV.  If anyone finds a link to the discussion on the internet perhaps they could post it.

Annabell - I hope your talk with Geeta is constructive and helps you decide what to do next to optimise your chances.    Maybe we will see you in the waiting room as my scan is at 9.00.  I am still spotting very, very slightly.  Weird huh?  Thanks for the info about chicken and milk and keeping your tummy warm.  Is your book on Chinese medicine any good?

Susie - thanks for de-lurking and saying hello.  Donna is very cheerful and friendly isn't she?  I hope all goes well with your mild cycle and do let us know how you get on.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Suzie - I have never used an autojector, but I found the syringes pretty easy to use. Good luck with your cycle. Donna is really nice and very kind and caring although I liked all the nurses there - I used to have a laugh with Freda. 

Buffy - I will be thinking of you and hoping for good news on Tuesday. x


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Annabell - I'm gonig to be taking 150 units of Menopur from day 2 and then on to Cetrotide and then Pregnyl before the EC. I think that's pretty much the lowest dose of Menopur you can be on but I may be wrong. 

Natasha - thanks, I think I'll stick with the syringes too as that's what Donna showed us 

Buffy - good luck for Tuesday


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Annabel - I took 112 of gonal f for about a week, then added cetrotide for  few days '(so took them together) and for the last couple of days had just the cetrotide with the pregnyl two days before ec. Sounds a lot, but went by super quicky and I never really had any probs with the drugs.

Another tip for folly growth whilst stimming is to eat lentils, again I guess for protein content. Oh, and think ORANGE, eat orange food etc - apparently the colour of fetility!


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone-

Susie and Beegy, thanks for the info! I will see what Geeta says on Tuesday. Susie when do you start your cycle?

Buffy- I hope the follie is growing!    Our appointment is 4.30 on Tues (so hopefully DH can make it..) so unfortunately I won't see you there, but I will be thinking of you at 9am   . I think (fingers crossed) that I have stopped spotting now, but it was definitely still going yesterday. Very odd! The Chinese medicine book is good, it is called "The infertility cure" (horrid word  ) and makes quite a lot of sense. The only issue is that as with all self-diagnosed things there is a danger of going off on the wrong tangent. For example it suggests agnus castus to help with my pre-AF spotting, but I am fairly sure that that is quite a powerful herb and I am worried that it would mess the rest of my cycle up.    It does have a lot of advice about diet and vitamin supplements and I am happy to adopt those because i don't think they can do a  ny harm.

Lulu I hope you are ok   

Lots of love to all

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hello all,

Annabell: I did 150 gonalf & cetrotide for 1st go, 225 gonal f and cetrotide for go 2 and 300 puregon and buserelin for go 3...really fine...buserelin made me a bit forgetful and I got headaches a bit on the gonal f but nothing major.

SusieB: i used a gonal F pen which was really easy but equally have used syringes, they are pretty similar pens are just less fiddling about.  

Bfy: good luck

To be honest I am pretty fed up and doing this alone makes it even tougher somehow as no one to share your frustration with. I am just not sure what to do as in theory I have no problems (apart from no bloke around - which is also annoying as it means I have to put the bins out  ) , respond well to drugs, produce lots of eggs, have good fertilization, always have had 2 embies to put back, lining good, hormone levels great blah blah blah....but something has to be wrong.  I really like Create but I am beginning to loose faith with their, "it will just work for you" attitude - I need something more concrete. Couldn't face speaking to them last week so need to push for an appointment with Geeta ASAP.

Is any doing natural or had success with natural at Create, am considering if this is a good way forward.

Also need to step away from fertility stuff - googling is bad!  I am not going to do anything until February I think, although that might change once I have had my follow up.

Lxx


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Annabell - I should be starting on the drugs in the next week, already getting AF symptoms so I might be on a short cycle this month which would be good as I just want to get started now.

Beegey - I've been told orange too so have got an orange top ready to wear around the time of EC and ET - DH probably thinks I'm bonkers but it won't hurt to try! I've also been told that selenium can help with implantation - you can get it from brazil nuts, garlic & pineapple juice (lots of friends had told me to drink pineapple juice before but I hadn't realised the connection)

Lulu - I can't imagine how you're feeling at the moment, especially when all your tests have shown up fine. This is only a thought and I hope you don't mind me asking, but have youhad your immune levels checked (NK cells etc)? There was quite a lot in my Zita West book about how that can impact on implantation. Hope all goes well with your follow up with Geeta.

xx


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## beegey (Apr 24, 2008)

Oh yes, Susie, I forgot about the brazil nuts/selenium - both dh and I guzzled loads of them (got fed up of them in the end and haven't had one since!). Also, though pineapple juice is great, it is to be avoided post ec as is thought to be a cause of uterine contractions, hence pregnant women at their due date encouraged to drink it and eat fresh pineapples in order to go into labour spontaneously.

I would also be interested in the natural approach to ivf. I thought it too much of a gamble before, putting all your 'egg' (singular) in one expensive basket, but I am still breast feeding and really reluctant to give it up. Though I expect even with a natural cycle one would need sedation at ec?

Lulu - I don't blame you for being down about it all. I think you are really brave  and I have tons of admiration for you


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Buffy - I hope the scan went well   

Lulu- I understand how you are feeling    I hope you get an appointment with Geeta which helps. I will update after my appointment this afternoon if there is anything useful.

Susie- Hope your AF comes soon so you can get started! 

Beegey- You do have to have sedation for natural cycle (although mine was very minimal so I was fully conscious throughout) , also cyclogest and sometimes Ovitrelle. I don't know how that would fit with breastfeeding?

Hope everyone is well, lots of love

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello ladies

My day 13 scan went well.  The follicle has grown to about 10mm and has a good blood flow and the uterine lining is thickening.  Back on Thursday to see how everything is shaping up.  There is some debate about whether or not I should use cetrotide but I don't think my LH surge is imminent yet.  My throat virus is still hanging on.  I have been trying to work half days but even this seems too much.  Anyway, I'm going to take it easy for the rest of the day.

Annabell - hope your appointment with Geeta goes well, and that by the end of the day you know your way forward for your next cycle.     I've got that same book but haven't got around to reading it properly, I've just dipped into it.  It's difficult to know what to do about the agnus castus.  I think it's better to have an expert in herbal medicine advise on what's right for you but I suppose you could try small amounts and see what happens?  Isn't pre AF spotting supposed to be caused by a lack of progesterone?  Have you had your levels tested?

Susie - good luck with your cycle, I hope you have a restful AF to start with.    Thanks for the tip about drinking pineapple juice.  I'm going to get some as I like it anyway 

Lulu -   I hope you manage to get an appointment with Geeta soon and that what she has to say is helpful.  Have you tried acupuncture and Chinese herbs as well?  Maybe natural will work out for you?  I expect Geeta will be able to tell you.

Beejay - thanks for the info re lentils and oranges - I'll buy some of them too  

cwsg - I hope you are feeling much better now and are on top of the infection.  

Natasha - I hope you are feeling more relaxed about your pregnancy and the scans are reassuring.  

Shell - have your started the surrogacy cycle yet?


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Thanks Buffy, I am off for my 20 week scan tomorrow afternoon so will let you know. I am so glad to hear that your follicle has grown and the lining is thickening up. Good luck for Thursday.

My husband and I had classical five elements acupuncture at the Kite clinic - http://www.kiteclinic.co.uk/ (still go every 6 weeks in fact). I really did feel that I got something from it - but who knows if it would have worked this time anyway. I was in a pretty bad way emotionally leading up the first IVF, totally despondent and I think the acupuncture helped me feel like I was 'doing something' and getting support and talking to someone about fertility stuff in a semi-clinical setting is helpful. I liked Julia Indichova's books - not that I stuck to the all organic/no processed food thing all the time but I did try to eat more healthily - the things she had written from a philosophical point of view and the visualisations helped me a lot.

I looked into the Foresight programme and I met one woman who swore by it, she had a daughter after a lot of losses including an ectopic that took away one of her tubes... but I didn't feel it was for me. For a start they've been done for lying on their promotional material and I don't think their claims hold up.

Annabel - hope your appointment went well. Looking forward to your update.

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.UK or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all,

finally got a follow up booked for the 20th. off to my GP's on friday to see if she will send me for tests, as a single lady I am discriminated against by the NHS    but as I now have had 3 IVF attempts they might bend the rules a bit.  Will definitely ask about NK cell tests.

Natasha: hope scan went well.
Buffy: hope follies are growing and all is good on Thursday

love to everyone else...can't remember where everyone is at but I think a couple of people are about to start cycles soon...fingers crossed.
xx


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Annabell - just coming back to you about Agnus Castus: I took it for a while as I think I have a slightly short luteal phase - you have to take it for at least 3 months I think to see any effect. Unfortunately it didn't work for me but it did for a friend who had had m/cs due to short LP. However, you're right in saying it is a powerful herb as it impacts on your hormone balance so might not be suitable for when you're having treatment, probably best to check with the clinic.

Buffy - good to hear the appt went well, hope the follicle keeps on growing nicely

Natasha - good luck for the scan tomorrow, am very excited for you. I've also had a lot of acupuncture since January and have found it to be really beneficial. I would sometimes go in for the session and have a good sob and then leave feeling that I could face things just a little more easily. Maybe it's just the relaxation side of it but I'll definitely be going both before and after ET.

Lulu - I hope your GP is understanding and agrees to refer you for tests, it would be very unfair of them not to. 

Right, I'm off for a cup of tea in my new orange mug that a friend has sent through to me - so sweet, I'm really on board with the orange theme!

xxx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Buffy- I'm so glad the follie is growing and it's all looking good! Fingers crossed for Thursday.    Are you likely to have EC on Saturday? 

Have you tried hot water, lemon juice and honey for your throat? It's really good, and all natural. If you put lots of honey in it tastes ok too!   I hope you manage to get plenty of relaxation. "Twilight" was pretty good, if you are looking for a film to watch!

I made a big list of everything the "infertility cure" book suggested for me in terms of food, vitamins and herbs and have been trying it out this week, as well as the usual multi vits and fish oils. It is A LOT of tablets  , I have had to hide them in the cupboard so DH doesn' think I have gone mad.

Vitamins: B6, Zinc, Co Q10, Calcium & Magnesium

Supplements: Royal jelly, Spirulina, Sea Kelp, Wheatgrass

Herbs: Ginseng, Wild Yam (and agnus castus, but I haven't been taking this)

This is meant to help with short luteal phases, though I have no idea how!  

Strangely I got a +ve OPK yesterday (day 11) when it's normally +ve on day 14, for ovulation on day 16. I'm sure this can't be due to the vit overload though as I haven't been taking them very long (apart from the B6, which I've been taking since day 1 this cycle). 

Natasha- I hope your scan went well  . I haven't heard of the five elements acupuncture, is it different from the usual type?

Lulu- I think I heard you booking your appointment over the phone while I was in the waiting room yesterday!   What tests are you going to ask the doc to do? I might consider doing the same.

Susie- thanks for the info about agnus castus, I haven't taken it due to worry that it might mess up the first half of my cycle rather than fixing the second half! LOL about the orange - I have bright orange post-its stuck to my laptop so I see them all the time when I am on the computer! I don't have any orange clothes as it really doesn't suit me but I was considering orange underwear  

AFM the appointment yesterday was pretty stressful. There was a big queue and we were waiting over an hour, and DH decided that he wasn't going to wait any longer so he went home before we got to see Geeta . Not great   . BUT he is under a lot of pressure at work at the moment and really upset about the tx not working so the wait was obviously the last straw for him and I can understand that.

Geeta was really nice (and ok about the disappearance of DH!) but said what I already knew- that it should have worked but didn't - i.e. there is nothing to be done to make it any more likely because on paper it was all perfect.

So I don't know at all what to do next. We could try mild ivf and have 2 embryos put back (which would increase the chances of it working) but I am really small and in the event that both embryos stuck I don't think there is much chance of them getting anywhere near full term. Geeta suggested the positive aspect of mild IVF is that we are at least pretty certain of getting an egg, and if we got more than one egg we could choose how many eggs to fertilise (one or two) and freeze the others unfertilised for another time.

I really don't know what to do. 

Lots of love to all

xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi All,

Annabell - I am so sorry that your husband left. I know it can get frustrating waiting so long when you're paying and everything but I think it would have been nice if he'd stayed to support you. I hope you were able to talk about it when you got home.

I have a shortish luteal phase (28 day cycle and usually ovulate on day 16 or 17) and worried and fretted about it a lot but it didn't seem to be a problem this time around. The one time I did ovulate on day 14 I celebrated but then came on on day 24... 

There's nothing to stop you trying mild IVF and you don't have to have two embryos put back. Having frozen two and then got lucky I am all in favour of FET - I have read that babies born from FET have better birthweights than ones from 'fresh' IVF, and lots of other positive things. I think in the past the freezing technique wasn't all that, but they have it down to a fine art now. So if you got, say, 4 embryos and froze three then you could have one replaced each time until it worked. It does feel quite comforting to have some in the bank. 

Classical 5 elements acupuncture is different to Traditional Chinese Medicine acupuncture but I don't really know exactly how except for that in classical they stick the needle in and pull it out again immediately and they burn lots of moxa (mugwort) on the point first. I didn't get much from TCM and the practitioner wanted me to take all these herbal pills as well that I didn't really have any confidence in. I did feel that I got benefit from the 5 elements acupuncture and my husband, although sceptical at first, swears by it now. He says it cured his allergies - he used to have to take antihistamines all the time.

Lulu - I hope all goes well at your GP appointment. Do you have a good relationship with her? They shouldn't be funny about sending you for some tests. Very mean spirited if so.

Susie - I hope you are able to stay calm and positive for the treatment. Keep using the orange mug!

My 20 week scan was good, the little boy was very accommodating and showed the sonographer all the things he wanted to see. All the measurements were normal. It's a real relief.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hi Annabell et Al.

I'm not sure the "it should work on paper its all good" argument is good enough really.  I suspect that is what she is going to say for me....I feel like saying ok...then do it for free and then if it works I'll pay if you are so convinced its going to work!

Re: GP, officially singlies don't get to have fertility treatment on the NHS...how dare we want children - we aren't married    but my GP is very lovely and said she would refer me at last appointment so fingers crossed I can at least get FSH/LH and E2 redone....going to ask about NK cells and immune testing, I know that Geeta doesn't believe in it but I think its worth a go.

love to everyone else....sorry in a very bad mood today.  Fed up with it all.

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Thanks Natasha- that's really useful and it's lovely to hear of a success story!  

How does FET work at Create - do they wait until you have ovulated naturally and then put it back in?? Or do you have to take any drugs? 

Lulu- I'm sorry you're feeling grumpy. I do know how you feel   . It's absolutely ridiculous that you don't get NHS treatment. I hope your doc is helpful on Friday. 

Lots of love to all

xx


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## GJB66 (Sep 23, 2008)

Hello,

I am an occasional lurker on this thread. I have been going to Create for over a year and my next cycle with them will be the 8th cycle. I started with mild ivf, but as I only produced 1 egg, decided to change to the natural controlled protocol. I have got to ET only 3 times out of the 8, and have been considering using donor eggs. The reason I haven't yet is that the last 2 cycles did get to ET, and this has given me the encouragement to try again. I have been going for the 3 cycle package, in the vain hope that at worst - I would fall pregnant on the first cycle, and it would be an expensive one - but - hey - I would be pregnant. I have just noticed that the prices have gone up as of the 1st November.

I have done most of my EC without sedation. As it is a single egg retrieval, I find it bearable. Not sure I would be able to do the same for multiple eggs being collected though. The pain/discomfort varies, but the last ET Lakshmi did and she did a wonderful job. It really was just a mild discomfort. BUT - no refund for not needing an anaesthetist, which I do find a bit annoying.

I have also tried acupuncture, TCM, hypnotherapy as well as all the usual eating healthily, stopping aerobic exercise and avoiding alcohol and caffeine. I found trying to do all of the above way too stressful, so have settled on being sensible with eating and drinking. No aerobic exercise and trying not to dwell on all it. 

I commute from the Reading area - which also adds a bit to stress levels, but I do have an understanding manager - which helps loads.

Similarly to a number of people on this thread, I find the staff really friendly, but the admin can be a bit haphazard. For my last cycle, yet another consent form was required to be signed. I thought, after a year, I had them all done. I also find the lack of being able to pinpoint why things have not worked frustrating - but would be interested to know if people have had different experiences at other clinics.  

I am currently having a month off - as I feel that my body really needs some time out. I am 43 - so don't have much time (or funds) left and after the next set of 3 cycles, I will move to donor eggs.

Hi lulu - I am also single, but am using a known donor. I do understand your frustration with not having someone to share details with. I hope you get some answers to your questions.

Best wishes to you all - cycling or not. 

Bee


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Hi ladies

I'm a newish Create patient & have been reading this thread - it's been really useful thanks everyone!

Thought it about time to hop on board & regale you with my story so far!

I had my first ever mild IVF (no previous attempts at IVF) at the end of Sept/October & had an all round positive experience at Create. Unfortunately the attempt failed even though all the signs had been good. I was on 150 ofGonal f & they collected 7 embryos of which 5 fertilised. So we do have 3 in storage for a frozen ET.

It's very frustrating that the implantation bit of the process is the bit that modern medicine seems to still know so little about. Being able to do nothing in the 2WW that might help implantation is excruciating!

We had a follow up with Geeta last week & she was positive & encouraging (& by the looks of it said what's been said to many others of you on here!). That should we do it again, there's no need to do anything differently. She said the fact that i hadn't got any bleeding until after i had the BFN was a good sign that there was some communication between the embryo & the lining. (The fact that I'd not got my usual spotting before AF i took as too good a sign too!) She recommended going for a frozen ET next as the embryos were good quality.

Natasha - thanks for sharing your positive outcome - it's given me the confidence to try the frozen one next too. Now i just have to decide when to do it - i thought my next cycle was due on 11th Nov, but i'm getting spotting already so it may be earlier (i usually spot for 4/5 days) which will mean this cycle might be only 22 or 23 days. Perhaps this is influenced by the drugs from the mild IVF last cycle - so i wonder if I'm better off waiting until my December period.  How exactly did the frozen transfer work at create with timings etc?

Anyway thanks for reading my essay - any advise much appreciated & i hope i can return the favour to fellow creaters. Good luck to everyone...


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Just wanted to do a quick update - after having the shortest cycle ever (just 24 days, what is that all about??), I am now on day 1 so start injecting tomorrow. My first scan will be on Monday (so day 6). I think I'm a bit shellshocked as it's nearly 2 months since our first meeting with Geeta so it doesn't seem real yet.

Natasha - glad the scan went well

Annabell - will keep you posted on how the mild cycle goes - as Natasha said, you could always put some embies on ice if you're worried about having more than one transferred.

Lulu, sending you a  , sounds like your GP is nice so hopefully you can get some tests sorted

Bee, welcome to the thread - hope you manage to relax on your month off and best of luck on the next cycle, let us know how it goes

xxx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi all and welcome to the new ladies - thanks for introducing yourselves and the best of luck to you.

Annabel - For my FET I didn't have any drugs. I had to have a few scans leading up to ovulation and used OPK sticks every 12 hours and also a clearblue fertility monitor just to be sure I didn't miss the surge. They do do medicated FETs as well as unmedicated. I just did what they suggested. I had to ring them as soon as I had my surge and then they booked me in for embryo transfer a few days later. I'm pretty sure I ovulated on day 17 and had the transfer on day 20. I thought that would give them no time at all to 'take' because I was due on so soon after, but my usual spotting didn't start a couple of days before I was due on. One of them didn't survive defrosting intact and was only 3 cells, but the other was good and 7 cells and I think that's the one that worked... although we covered all bases and my husband likes to think it was maybe a natural... bless him. 

JGB66 - It must be so gruelling to have gone through so many cycles  . I was really nervous about the sedation for egg collection (I had 4) but I actually really enjoyed the sensation and I wasn't 'out' cold. I was talking but God knows what about. Wishing you all the best with the next three cycles. If I were you I would probably try the ARGC if they aren't successful - I know a 42 year old who just had a baby with them after two unsuccessful attempts elsewhere. Also the situation was not a nuclear family set up and they did not feel judged at all.

ClareTG - I'm sorry to hear that your first attempt didn't work, but don't give up! I waited til after two cycles to have the FET - the one where it was obvious the IVF hadn't worked and the one after that, so I suppose I had FET on the third. I did go for scans for the second cycle after the IVF but I had a blood filled cyst on my ovary where they'd collected an egg and they felt it would be advisable for me to give it another month for the best chance.

Susie - So exciting. I remember the first injection. I think I went into very mild shock after I'd done it. It was so alien to stick a needle into myself. Remember tiny air bubbles aren't anything to worry about, sometimes you can't get rid of all of them - but you're injecting into your fat layer, not into a blood vessel so it doesn't matter. Anyway after the first time it was really easy - it hurts much less if you put the needle in quickly and confidently than if you use a slower, more hesitant technique. Good luck. xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello everyone

I'm just checking in after my scan.  Follicle had put on a growth spurt and is now 14mm and blood flow good etc.  I am a bit concerned that I am going to have an early surge because there was mucus in the cervix.  I have not been taking cetrotide this cycle and am hoping this was not a big mistake.  They have taken a blood test to check the levels and I won't know what's happening until they phone me later today.  Meanwhile I am going to do a OPK test myself later today. 

Susie - good luck with your first injections   

Clare - thanks for sharing your experiences with us.  Sounds like it's just a matter of time for you.  

Bee - hello to you too.  I am sure that if the last 2 cycles got to ET you are right to have a few more goes before moving onto a donor egg.  Why have you chosen to go without sedation?  I find it very relaxing.  I know what you mean about the commuting as I am in Basingstoke.  Luckily my husband is also my boss  

Lulu - glad to hear your doctor is understanding and I hope your tests will throw some light on the matter, even if it is just to reassure you everything is OK.

Natasha - so glad to hear your scan went well, I hope you can rest easy now and enjoy the rest of your pregnancy  

Annabell - sounds like a good list of supplements to me.  Co Q10 is the one I mentioned a couple of weeks ago that I am now taking to help grow healthy eggs.  I am also taking liquid ginseng that my acupuncturist gave me.  I doubt they would have any effect on your ovulation so quickly.  The good news is that you can start your next cycle quickly.    Sorry to hear your dh is under a lot of stress - you can see why they say IVF puts more strain on your relationship but I think you are being very understanding.  Re mild cycle, it doesn't sound like it will benefit you that much if you can't put 2 embryos back in, as you don't seem to have much trouble producing good eggs naturally anyway?  Maybe you could try a couple more natural then move on to Mild?  I suppose it all depends on your funds as well.  Either way, I'm sending best wishes for you to come to the right decision.   BTW I spoke to my acupunturist/chinese herbalist and she said very dark blood can be a sign of stagnation in the uterine area which would not help with conception.  This is easily treatable with some chinese herbs (from an expert of course).  She said a little spotting before AF is probably not a problem though.  I hope you don't feel I have been impertinent to ask but just thought I'd pass it on.  Please feel free to ignore.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

ooh buffy that is interesting re dark blood...my spotting always starts with very brown blood...which i know is old blood...maybe something for me to investigate if I can be bothered  

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everybody!

Welcome Bee- Good to hear from you! I hope all goes well with your next cycles - are you going to try again in Dec? I nearly did my first EC without sedation becuase I had never had sedation before and I totally freaked out at the thought of it   Lakshmi was just about to go ahead without sedation when the sight of the big needle thing in her hand convinced me that maybe a little painkiller wouldn't be such a bad thing  . However, the second time I had very light sedation and I really loved the "no worries" feeling. Why are you against using it? I know what you mean about the stressfulness of trying to incorporate good diet, TCM, acupuncture, exercise et al into daily life. It sounds like it should be a recipe for relaxation but in fact what it really means is that you can never for a minute get away from thinking about tx, because everything becomes related to it. 

Welcome Clare- I'm sorry your last cycle didn't work out   but it sounds like you have some good frozen embryos so hopefully it will work out next time!

Susie- good luck with the injections!     I nearly fainted the first time I did Ovitrelle (my one and only injection  ) but it didn't really hurt at all, as Natasha says it just seems so wrong to be doing it to yourself! The second time round it was fine, so I think the psychological barrier is the worst bit. Please do keep me updated on the mild IVF, that would be really helpful! 

Natasha- thanks for the info on the FET procedure. That actually sounds very straightforward, I will explain it to DH later as when we were discussing it last night I told him I was waiting for an update from my online friends!  I love "covering all bases", that is such a sweet idea!

Buffy- Congrats on the follie growth!   I had mucus in the cervix on my last scan last cycle but I still didn't get a surge that day & had to do Ovitrelle, so try not to worry too much about that. Good luck with the call later, I will keep my fingers crossed for you   . Thank you for you kind thoughts and I really really appreciate you speaking to your herbalist, that is such a lovely thing to do! I will look up stagnation in the uterus and see what I can do about it.  I didn't used to get the brown bleeding, it has just started over the last couple of years, so maybe something is a bit out of kilter. I asked Geeta whether the Cyclogest wasn't working becuase I was bleeding before OTD but she said there is no point holding bleeding back, if it is going to happen it will happen. Instinctively I would rather it wasn't happening though so I will definitely look into the stagnation possiblity, thank you again!

Lulu- yes that is exactly what happens to me too!

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Just done the OPK test and no surge yet, thank you God.    Just waiting for the phone call now to see if it is likely to be EC on Saturday, depending on levels of LH in my blood.

Glad the dark blood thing is useful.  There seem to be so many things you have to keep any eye on.  And I suppose that whole area in our bodies is constantly "on the go" so it's not surprising if some things go a bit out of kilter.

Annabell - thanks for the feedback re mucus in the cervix, very reassuring!!


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

fingers crossed Buffy that all goes to plan  

Annabell: let me know what you discover re stagnation...I'd be interested to know.

I love sedation...I'd have it every day if I could  

Also just a thought with people considering mild IVF....I thought this was what I was doing, but really it turns out I've been doing pretty standard short protocols. My doses have been 150/225/300 iui of the stimulating drug.  Feel a bit stupid about this as I thought I was being really good about not using too many drugs but I could have been doing this at any clinic really!!  

feel like I am building up a lot of questions for geeta and I will not be happy with the "I don't know why it didn't work, nothing we can do response!"

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Good luck for the phone call Buffy!   

Lulu- I've been thinking about the "old blood" thing - my dark brown spotting is usually about 3 days before AF, so I don't see how it can be "old blood" at that stage? If it is "old" because it oxidised while taking a while to get out then the actual bleeding must start around 4 days before full AF which is surely a problem as it only leaves 10 days luteal phase? Very confusing and I will look into it. Maybe you could put it on your list for Geeta and see if you get the same answer as I did?

Re the mild ivf- I could be wrong but I thought other clinics favour long protocol (i.e. with downreg) as standard and only do short protocol for specific cases? I didn't know the drug amounts were the same though. Geeta said if I did mild ivf I woudl have 125 iui because I'm small.

Lots of love

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

I think thats where it gets confusing...lots of clinics do short protocols with the level of stims that I did...its not mild there is just no down reg!

your spotting sounds exactly the same as mine...I'll ask Geeta but I think I mentioned it before and she was very unbothered...I think ultimately if they implant then it doesn't matter anyway.  Re: spotting TMI! mine is really only when I wipe for a couple of days, is that the same for you?  No one really every talks about this! So interesting to find out.

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Warning: Please don't read unless interested in brown spotting!!  

Lulu- To continue spotting TMI   : yes, only when I wipe, but also sometimes if I look in the loo after I have been there can be grainy drips which look a bit like tea with fine tea leaves    I know this due to obsessive AF checking over previous cycles, looking in the loo is honestly not my normal behaviour!  

Also after some experimentation, if I use tampax on brown spotting days then it does pick up brown stuff. But if I don't use the tampax the brown stuff doesn't come out other than spotting.

So it's a mystery to me.  I also get very bad back pain with AF, don't know if you get this too?

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hmmm, interesting discussion about pre AF spotting going on here... 

Just to avoid confusion, the dark blood indicating stagnation I was talking about was not in terms of a little light spotting before your AF but about bleeding dark blood once your AF starts.  It is quite usual for light spotting to be brown.  I expect a practitoner of Chinese medicine would make something of your lower back ache too Annabell.  Turns out a lot of symptoms western doctors say are normal are considered to be signs of disharmony by Chinese medicine.  (Personally I've never been able to stop having period cramps.)

I got the phone call to say the LH has started to increase, so it can't be stopped with Cetrotide now (they can detect it in your blood a couple of days before you can using an OPK stick).  Likely OPK surge is tomorrow with EC on Saturday at the moment, so hopefully the follie will have grown some more by then.  So I am going totally natural this time.  Will be testing tomorrow am and will have another scan if no surge yet.

Lulu - I think it's not only the dosage of the drug that counts but also how many days you take it.  Anyway, by not doing the downreg you've been gentler on your body that most protocols from what I've heard.


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Hello again

Natasha - thanks for the info on the FET at create - interesting that they don't rush to book you in for FET straight after the surge - but then i suppose the embryos are a few days ahead of the natural cycle. When did they thaw the embies & tell you how they were looking? Love the idea that your DH thinks it's the not the FET responsible for your pregnancy! Hope all is going well & you're confident after your 20 week scan. I may go for early dec to give my body one more cycle to balance out.

Buffy good luck for your EC - hope you can breathe out now you know you didn't miss the LH surge. 

Lulu & Annabell - i could write a novel (admittedly a v boring one) on spotting. Mine usually starts off light brown/pink then gets mid brown & often i have a deceptive splurge of fresh blood before it goes back to spotting for a couple of days that gets darker until thick dark brown & then I finally get AF. I know Geeta doesn't believe it's a problem, but there must be an imbalance causing it - whether low progesterone or bad circulation (& i suppose these are counteracted by the progesterone pessaries & baby aspirin. I tried lots of herbal mixtures from Trevor Wing who i saw over the course of a couple of years (he also did lots of tests like immunity & compatibility & womb lining staging) though the whole time i didn't know i had endometriosis & the only treatment for that opposes what you want to do to optimise getting pregnant!

I've often found eating a banana every day to ease my period cramps a bit - i used to get terrible ones but reckon its the bananas (selenium? magnesium?) but could be wrong.

I too LOVED the mild sedation. I thought i'd know what was going on during EC but must've been dozing for 20 mins & blissfully unaware of proceedings until i came round as they wheeled me out. At ET i just wanted to be wheeled out of the clinic & into the back of the car so i didn't have to go vertical - but then had to remind myself that naturally occurring pregnancies happen whilst people carry on their normal lives mostly upright!


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy- I hope all has gone well today with the OPKs. Lots and lots of luck and love for tomorrow if you have EC     Don't forget the furry socks! 

Clare- Thanks for joining in the spotting conversation! It is fascinating to hear other people's experiences because it is not something anyone ever talks about (can't think why not!  ) Do you think it is related to endometriosis?  I thought like you that progesterone/aspirin should sort it out but lo and behold it was exactly the same on my ICSI cycles as it is every other month. Thanks for suggesting the banana cure for AF pain, certainly worth a try! AF after the last cycle was the most painful it has been for years, just really rubbing in the BFN   . I think we are going to have another go in early Dec so we may co-incide if that is what you decide.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello all

I got my surge today so am going in for EC tomorrow.  Furry socks on standby.    I'm not getting over excited but trying to stay realistic about chances of getting a good egg. 

I'll try out the bananas next AF I have.  (Is it everyday or just while you have AF?)  Can't do any harm.  It's weird how sometimes it's more painful than others...I don't know why.


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Buffy -lots and lots of luck for tomorrow, hope there's a great egg waiting to be collected   

Lulu - how did it go with your GP?

Well the injection yesterday wasn't too bad at all - lots of hovering over DH as he got the syringe prepared and then I did the injection myself which didn't really hurt (apart from when I nicked the skin when deciding where to inject - I'm a bit accident prone!). As you all say, it's definitely better when you get the first one out of the way so we should be all set for tonight.

Just a quick post tonight ladies as I have nothing to add to the spotting conversation!

Have a good weekend xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all

I've been very lucky not to ever suffer too badly with period pain...I know it can be horrendous for some people. I feel very lucky about that.

SusieB: well done on getting injection done, once you've started it becomes really easy, I am rubbish at swallowing tablets and would much rather inject myself, weird  

Buffy: good luck for a lovely egg...will be sending you positive vibes.

My GP was nice...she is sending me for FSH/LH but I basically can't get referred to an NHS consultant as I don't qualify for treatment so they won't bother seeing me. Bit annoying as I would like a second opinion, as the unlucky thing is not really washing with me. She said she would put me in the unexplained category which is weird as I have never tried to get pregnant naturally, so if was doing that, might have no problems at all....anyone got any nice single male friends
xxx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi All,

I am glad I'm not the only 'druggie' who loves the sedation!

Buffy - All the best with the egg collection. Wishing you lots of luck and a lovely, good quality egg. Do let us know how things went.

Lulu - that's interesting about Create not mentioning that what you were having wasn't mild, and a bit disingenuous. Does the 150 a day that I had still count as mild? They also had me down-regging so it was a long protocol (maybe because it was my first and they didn't know how I would react to stimulation?). I had one scan with the prof where he assumed that I had PCOS because I was having a long protocol and I got a bit upset and said that on the initial scan he'd done he said I didn't and I had a normal number of follicles. Then he checked that out and backtracked and said something like "oh yes you had a good number of follicles" so yes... again with the organisation. 

That said, I was diagnosed with PCOS on one side only in my 20s by ultrasound - had no periods at all for ages - over 6 months, horrible deep spots on my cheeks and increased body hair and was put on a strong contraceptive for that, but when I came off (some 10 years later) my periods were normal.

Re Spotting/period pain - I have a couple of days of spotting (mostly brown) before I start my period proper but I don't really have a lot of cramping/pain. I spoke to Geeta about the length of my luteal phase and she said there was nothing that could be done to extend it - even though I've read about vitamin B6 and some other things having an effect. She didn't seem concerned and well, here I am pregnant. It's so hard to know what has an effect and what isn't relevant. It is so frustrating to not know if there's something else you could be doing or if something you are doing has a detrimental effect. Also the worrying doesn't help. 

Clare - Yes, the embryos were three day ones but if you count the day of the surge as day 1, I actually had then replaced on day four. You talk about how many you want to thaw in advance, but they only told me how well they had survived when I was actually there for the transfer. They come and give you quite a detailed explanation of the grade of them and you sign a piece of paper with that info on it. I would give it another month's break if you can, to give your body and mind a bit more time to get over the first attempt. But you would be testing around Christmas if you go for early Dec - could you cope with the stresses of Christmas and the stress of waiting to test? Of course it could well be the best Christmas present ever!

Susie - glad to hear you got your first injection over and done with. Bless the husband for helping out. It will be a breeze from now on.

Lulu (again) - I'm sorry that the NHS rules are like that. I don't suppose you have time to take them to the international court of human rights? (joke). It seems bonkers to me, and totally unfair. There should, of course, be criteria for who they help - but I'd say a psychological and financial assessment of the potential parent/s would be a lot more sensible than - 'are you single?' I also think it is massively unfair they won't help a couple if the bloke has a child from a previous relationship - it's not the poor woman's fault. But I do understand that money is incredibly tight within the NHS. I hope your blood tests are normal. x


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Oh dear not a very succesful morning.

Arrived to find that because of transport issues both offices were shut up.  Waited outside with Prof Campbell, Lakshi, the nurse and another patient for the embryologist to turn up with the key.  Everyone very charming and apologetic throughout.  Then on arrival the alarms went off - we all thought the security alarms had been set off but after about 10 minutes the fire brigade turned up!  The fire alarm was for the whole building not just CH.  Started to evacuate back outside and then went back in again as it was a false alarm.  No criticism for CH staff for any of this but it was an interesting start to EC day.

Then the nurses were a bit worried about my throat infection because my blood pressure and saturation levels were too high.  (It's good that they take your health seriously though.)  Finally went in for the preliminary scan and the follicle had gone AWOL.  Presumably I had ovulated.  Everyone was very sweet about it.  I did ask if we could not control the cycle next time as my natural cycles don't seem to work so well as the controlled ones.  We went home and tried the natural way to make a baby, just in case since for all I know there is a viable egg travelling down my fallopian tube at the moment.

love to all


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Oh Buffy I am so sorry to hear that    

What a total nightmare that must have been, and I'm so sorry you must have been so disappointed about ovulating. Fingers crossed for the natural way - I'm totally impressed you managed that after such a stressful morning! Lots and lots of love xx


Natasha- I'm surprised you have to downreg, I didn't think that Create did that! (Lulu- did you have to?)

Good to hear that spotting may not be such an issue!   You're right the worrying doesn't help at all but it's so scary to think that maybe there is something you could be doing to make it work.

Lulu- I'm glad the doc was nice but it's so silly that you can't get any NHS help. Do you think trying a different sperm donor might help incase  you are not getting on with the one you have?   (Maybe not very scientific!)

Lots of love to all

xx


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Oh Buffy how frustrating for you on all fronts! Well done for your persistence - worth having a go to catch that elusive egg! Will you be able to have a controlled cycle next time then? (On a banana note i try & have them as often as i can throughout the month)

Lulu - the nhs has some really draconian rules on IVF. Hope there's a way of getting round at least some of their obstacles & good to have your GP on side. Maybe there's some gay best friends out there to consider too (Like that awful film with Madonna & Rupert Everett)?! 

Natasha - thanks again for the FET info - we have 3 which Geeta recommended thawing, which makes sense if you can't guarantee their quality. If they get frozen as an 8-cell, can they deteriorate to a 3-cell in the thawing process?  And it is good to know there's no point obsessing like i often do over the meaning of spotting & seeing it as the enemy to me getting pregnant! I will also take your & DH's advise to give it another month before trying.

Which means Annabel  - hopefully we will coincide then. Really don't know if spotting & endometrios are connected - only in the fact that they're both lining related! No-one's ever said there's a direct link over the years i've asked about what could cause my spotting. 

Susie - well done on the injections - you'll probably be a pro by tonight.(My mum who's a nurse was v impressed by my descriptions of self-injecting!)

Best wished to everyone reading & posting & have relaxing, cozy weekends everyone
x


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## nevergiveup1 (Mar 23, 2008)

Hello everyone,

Lulu,

just so you have an idea about the short/ long protocol and amount of drugs used at other clinics here is my list:

1st treatment: LFC short protocol (SP) 200iu
2nd treatment: ARGC long protocol (LP) 300iu
3rd treatment: ARGC (SP) 300iu
4th Treatment: Create controlled natural (SP) dont remember the dose but did take some to feed the folly once it became dominant
5th treatment: Create (SP) mild?? 150iu
6th treatment: LFC (SP) 200iu
7th treatment: ARGC (SP) 300iu
8th treatment: Dr Hansen South Africa (SP) 300iu
9th treatment: CRGH/ UCH (SP) 450iu
10th treatment: Due to start in SA in december short protocol again and we are trying to do the same as crgh/ uch so 450iu again.

That may give you some idea about treatments at other clinics!!   
I have a little experience in that area!!
Hope you are well.

And to all the other loverly create ladies out there.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hello everyone,

Oh Buffy - what a nightmare. I am so sorry about the lost egg, but as you say you are still in with a chance for a natural pregnancy.   

Annabel - I don't know why they put me on a long protocol. I didn't ask as it was my first time, and I just assumed it was the normal procedure. Maybe because of my history of PCOS which can cause OHSS.

ClareTG - As far as I recall they froze one 7 and one 8 cell (both good grades) so yeah, unfortuately some of them just don't survive the thaw all that well. I think you are doing the right thing giving body and mind a rest before the next go. Postitive visualisation really helped me with the FET. I tried 3 CDs - the Zita West one was a bit clinical, another one the visualisations were really short so not enough time to get relaxed but the third one - fertility goddess by Tracy Holloway was really good - she has a totally annoying voice so I really didn't think I would get on with it but I did. You have to imagine yourself walking through a wood and then finding a castle and one room in it is your special room and it has a pool and you have a swim in the pool and meet your inner goddess and all that. I know it sounds incredibly cheesey but it was very relaxing (I was usually off to sleep before the end of the CD) and I needed that. I felt it gave me more confidence and a more positive outlook about the treatment.

Shell - Wow, that's some list. I am so sorry that you've been through so much   and I wish you the best of luck for December.


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Buffy, I'm so sorry to hear about what happened, as everyone else says though, you still stand a chance of a natural pregnancy - will keep my fingers crossed.

I was a bit disappointed with my scan today as my largest follicle (out of 9) was only 7mm and the others were even smaller than that. They did an LH test (which they got the result for very quickly) and that is still low so I don't start the cetrotide yet and have go back on Wednesday for a follow-up scan. And I managed to mess up my injection last night and give myself a lovely bruise on my thigh!  

So I'm sat here with a hot water bottle, guzzling water and wondering what else I can do to make these follies grow. Have got acupuncture tomorrow so maybe that will help.

Quick question for you: do you tend to have the same doctor all the way through your treatment? I saw Dr Ali for my dummy transfer and the scan today.

Sorry this is a bit me me me, will get myself in a brighter mood for my next post!

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Buffy- I hope you are ok today   

Shell- Blimey that is a lot of treatments. I'm sorry that it has been so long and difficult for you, fingers crossed for December   

Natasha- I have tried three CDs- the Zita West one (which I didn't like at all- sounded like a teacher!)  one by Joanne Scurr (hysterical accent, but I quite like it) and one by Maggie Howell which seems quite good but I have only tried once so far. Haven't heard of the Fertility Goddess one- it sounds a bit more elaborate, which I think is good because it gives you more time to "get into it". I do actually find them very relaxing, which has to be good!

Susie- Don't worry there is time for the follie to grow!  I'm sorry the injection was painful.  Protein (chicken & milk etc) is meant to be good for follie growth, so is keeping warm. I think acupuncture is good too, you could focus on follie growth with your acupuncturist in your session tomorrow.

I haven't had the same doc for scans all the way through, although I guess maybe it is less relevant for natural cycles (after all they are only observing what is going on until EC really?). Rubina did the first scan but after that it was usually Donna or Freda, and Lakshmi for EC and ET. They are all really nice.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Suzie,

No need to apologise, it is a gruelling and nerve-wracking thing you are going through. 

What cycle day are you? My follicles were pretty small, so they increased the Gonal-F and I ended up with 4. Collection day was postponed to give them time to grow a bit more. I think because I naturally ovulate on day 16 or 17 usually, even with stimulation it was going to be at that point in my cycle anyway. Everyone seems to work to day 14 but that's just an average, so if you are a late ovulator then I'm sure your follicles will have grown big enough by your usual ovulation day.

Sorry about the bruise, I hope it fades quickly and doesn't hurt too much. I found it easier to inject around the umbilical area - I never tried the thigh. 

It is ok to feel sorry for yourself you know. You don't have to be Mrs Perky all the time, especially not right now.

I saw different doctors throughout my treatment. Sometimes it was Freda who scanned me as well, she's qualified to do it. I don't think you will see the same person throughout, and that's ok.

Again, please don't worry about feeling down. It is totally natural and understandable. Sometimes we need to ask for a bit of support and other times we're the one who can give it.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Annabel,

I think your post appeared as I was writing the last one. 

I agree with you about Zita West being very schoolmarmish - she sounds a lot like Delia Smith as well - Delia Smith when she is very slowly and deliberately talking to the audience like they are 12-year-old schoolchildren who don't know how to cook an omlette.

xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

thanks for the list shell...useful to see.

sending everyone else lots of love and    .

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Thanks for the encouraging comments.

I'm off to the doctor's on Friday to see if she can throw any light on my ongoing throat infection which is getting me down now.    I'm thinking of skipping December at the moment and trying again in January.

Clare - I'll try and eat more bananas!  I already have the drugs for a controlled cycle so will probably push for this early on next cycle.

Susie - sorry to hear the follie growth was not all you hoped for, but follicles are funny things that do have sudden growth spurts and it's not as if you're surging yet so hopefully your body knows what it's doing.  I never see the same doctor (or nurse) throughout.

Annabell - let me know how you are getting on with the Maggie Howell CD; if it is good I'll get one to try.  Have you decided whether you're doing Mild or Natural cycle next?

Best wishes to all


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Buffy-

Hope you sort out the throat problem  Bit of a long shot but do you ever have trouble with your wisdom teeth? I had recurrent tonsillitis last year but (touch wood!) it has not returned since I had my wisdom teeth out.

I've tried the Maggie Howell CD a couple of times now, it is currently my favourite. My only issue with it is that I would quite like to listen before I go to sleep, but it "wakes you up" at the end. I'm going to try it out on DH because I think it is quite relaxing, but I'm not sure how he will take to imagining golden lights in his ovaries ... 

I think we are going to do natural cycle in December. The rationale is that we can accept the concept of being "unlucky" twice, so it seems like a good idea to give Natural one more go, but if the same thing happens again three times then it looks less like luck. In which case I would feel more comfortable then taking the mild route.

I think that makes sense but I am still not 100% sure if it's the right thing to do  

Lots of love to all

xx


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Natasha & Annabel -  thanks for the CD advise. Funnily enough i've just bought the Zita West one & was already a bit put off by the picture of her on the front looking like a cross between Angela Rippon, Dana & Delia (i am that shallow!). I do like the sound of going for a swim in a pool in a room in a castle in a wood - hopefully I'll get to try all 3 CDs before december & decide on a favourite.

Annoyingly i'm STILL spotting - which even for me is ridiculous. It's about 8 days now - usually a maximum of 5 before AF. Technically i'm not late, but once the spotting starts I really want AF to start to get it over & done with. PLus the sooner i start this month, the sooner i can look forward to the FET in december.

Buffy - hope you manage to beat the throat infection. You've probably tried it already, but what about Manuka honey? (Perhaps too lightweight at this stage?) Hope your doc has some good advise.

Suzie - hope you have a pleasant surprise at your next scan. I was pretty ignorant at my first one but remember that only a couple of follies seemed to be responding well but by the time of EC, a good number had had enough of a growth spurt for them to give up some eggs.

Big love to all  
x


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

I hadn't thought about wisdom teeth, I will mention this to the doctor as I do sometimes get irritation with one on the same side as the problem tonsils.  I will try some Manuka honey as well - can you get some from Boots or is it online only?

What is the name of the Maggie Howell CD?

Annabell it sounds like a good approach to do another natural cycle in December and then if you don't strike gold you can start the New Year knowing you have a new procedure to try.  Psychologically I think January is a better time to start something new than November/December.  In the meantime maybe third time lucky   

Clare has your AF started properly yet?  Are you past your due date now?  8 days spotting must be very irritating.  Have you been particularly tired or stressed?

Susie how was your follow up scan?


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Buffy - hope you get the throat problem sorted soon - another idea could be to try ginger tea with lemon and honey as ginger is a good antiviral - I'm drinking some each day as a few people in my office have got colds and I'm desperate not to catch anything!

Thanks for all the feedback on the follicle growth - I had a day 8 scan today and they have got to around 10mm now (7 seem to be growing in total, the other 2 are still tiny). I had oestrogen and LH tests done as Freda thought I might need to increase my Menopur dosage but the oestrogen level came back fine and my LH is still low - Freda discussed with Geeta and I'm keeping to the same Menopur level and start on Cetrotide tomorrow, then back on Friday for another scan. I feel I'm being taken good care of so fingers crossed - I can feel my ovaries throbbing a little bit so maybe the acupuncture gave them a bit of a boost. I usually ovulate around day 16/17 and Freda didn't seem too worried that they're taking a while to grow.

I love the comments about the CDs - I've got the Zita West one and I couldn't  figure out who she sounded like but it's definitely Delia!!

Clare - hope the spotting sorts itself soon so you can get on to your next cycle, it must be really frustrating for you

Annabell - your plan sounds good - December can be such a busy time that it could be quite stressful to start on a different procedure. 

Had better go now, Spooks is about to start! 

xxx


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Hello ladies

So my AF started today - which is exactly 28days - i'm usually 26 or 27 so no big difference - only the 9 days of spotting that threw me! I can only put it down to it having been the 1st cycle after the mild IVF - maybe the drugs affected things.  All my plans of doing the ET in december have gone out the window as another 28 day cycle would mean the ET would most likely be timed for xmas day! 

We're going to attempt it this cycle so that even if we're unsuccessful we can hopefully try another Mild attempt at the end of Jan/early Feb. (Shame Annabel i won't be coinciding now - boo - though we may overlap slightly). This means i'm going to have to get going with those CDs sharpish! I have a scan next wednesday to the state of things & I guess judge when to start using the OPKs.

Natasha - if you have any more advise as to what you did for your FET, i'd be most grateful to hear it (& from anyone else too of course!) Did you have much time off work?

Susie - good news about your follies - 7's a good number to be responding. Fingers crossed for the next scan.

Buffy - I think you can get Manuka honey in most supermarkets now (& health food shops) - it's supposed to be amazing for anti-bacterial properties (& is about 3 times the price of normal honey!)

Love to all

xxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Well I'm back from the doctor's and she did do a throat swab for me and I should know next week whether I'm dealing with bacteria or a virus.  I'm going to buy some Manuka honey and ginger teabags too.

Susie - glad to hear of your follicle growth.  Sounds like everything is moving along just fine.  I hope your scan today goes well, maybe you'll get some idea of when you'll be going for EC.

Clare - good news that your AF started at last.  How exciting that you're going to have another go this cycle.  Are you going to try fertilise the egg you produce naturally as well or are you just transfering the embies you already have?

love to all
Buffy


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi All,

Annabell - I agree with the other ladies who said it was a good idea to do another natural cycle in December - good luck.

Buffy - Hope the throat clears up soon. I am sure the manuka honey and ginger tea will help whether it is a virus or an infection. 

Susie - Sounds like everything is progressing well. Very pleased for you. Keep us updated.

Clare - I think I had extra long spotting before my period the one after the failed IVF too. I only took the day of the transfer off work. What did I do? Well I used a lot of positive visualisation. I ate lots of seaweed salad from Feng Sushi around the time - I really craved it and tried to eat healthily in general. No booze or caffeine obviously. I went to the gym about 3 times a week in the lead up. Not loads of excersise though - ususally about half an hour on the cross trainer and rowing machine just for a bit of cardio. After I had the transfer I stayed laying down for about 20 minutes. The rest of the day I moved around as normal. I read that you shouldn't do bed rest the day of the transfer because it doesn't stimulate enough blood flow to the uterus so I think we went for a walk in Dulwich Woods and just took it easy for the rest of the day and then I was back at work the following day. Oh, I drank lots of freshly squeezed vegetable juice normally one glass in the morning (not every single day but more often than not) - we have a juicer. It was from the Julia Indichova book - 1 apple, 2 celery sticks, half a cucumber, handful of baby spinach leaves, a peeled lemon and 5 lettuce leaves. Oh and make sure they remember to give you the progesterone pessaries before you leave on transfer day. They nearly forgot to give me mine. One in the morning and two at night. And aspirin 75 mg OD but you buy that yourself. 

I am a bit under the weather today. I had my swine flu jab yesterday and my arm hurts and I have a headache and I am on antibiotics for a suspected urinary tract infection and I can't have eaten enough for breakfast before taking the morning dose because I kept heaving all morning and nearly being sick. I came home from college at midday because I was feeling so peaky and now I am in bed having comfort food (tinned mushroom soup and white sliced toast with dairylea on it).


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi everyone!

Thanks for all the support and advice re the natural cycle in Dec- we're definitely going to do that so I'm waiting for AF now. Don't quite know when to expect it because I had a positive OPK on day 12 this month (much earlier than normal- usually 31 day cycles) and then another one on day 20 (much later than normal)   . So we tried to cover both possibilities...    and now I guess I just have to wait to see when AF does show up.

Buffy- the Maggie Howell CD is called "Prepare to conceive:For natural and drug assisted conception". She also does an IVF specific CD, but I thought that might refer to downregging and stimming and so might not really be relevant for natural cycle IVF.

I hope your throat problem is getting better!   You can get manuka honey from Waitrose- I have often been tempted to get some but the price has put me off   I think it is really good though. My mum keeps bees and she reckons we should all be taking royal jelly supplements.

Susie- I'm glad the follies were growing well, I hope the scan today was good   

Clare- sorry we won't be co-inciding but I think we will overlap a bit depending on when I get AF. It's really exciting that you are starting your cycle - good luck for the scan on Weds! 

Natasha- Sorry you are feeling ill, that sounds totally miserable! I hope you feel better soon.  

Lulu- I hope you are ok  

Lots of love to all

xx


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Natasha - thanks for all those tips. How funny that you went walking in Dulwich woods - that's one of my favourite places to go (when i fancy a change from Crystal Palace Park). Perhaps you live in a similar part of SE London? i will follow as many of those tips as possible! I know on the mild IVF i only took 1 progesterone pessary each morning & night - maybe 2 at night boosts the fact that you start taking it later in the cycle? Hope you're feeling better today & your comfort food did the trick. Urinary infections are grim.

Annabell - how confusing you've had 2 OPKs. What day of your cycle are you on now?

Susie - how was yesterday's scan? Hope all is growing nicely.

Buffy - hope your throat's getting better & you find out what it is.


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Yesterday's scan went really well - the follicles have had a growth spurt and were up to 14mm now so Freda is pretty sure I'll be going in for EC on Wednesday with ET to follow on Saturday. I've got 6 good size follicles and some others might catch up as well. Have got a follow up scan on Monday.

I was having a dilemma about getting acupuncture done after the ET as I usually go to Zita West and didn't fancy the trek up there straight after the procedure. I'd picked up a leaflet at the clinic for the Balance Wellbeing Centre and didn't realise they can do the acupuncture on site which is perfect for me so I'll get that booked in once I know the transfer date. Has anyone else used them?

Natasha - sorry to hear you're not well, hope you're better soon. Comfort food is always the way to go though, and lots of good DVDs!

Clare - good luck for the scan on Weds

Buffy - hope your throat is improving

Annabell - hope you're feeling nice and relaxed in the lead up to your next natural cycle

Lulu - is it Friday that you've got your follow-up with Geeta? Hope all goes well and that you get all your questions answered

Have a good weekend xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi All,

Annabell - that is a bit weird about the two postive OPK tests, I wonder if you can ovulate twice at different times in your cycle? I know you can release two eggs at once, obviously because of people having non-identical twins, but no idea if you can release two at seperate occassions. Good luck though, it would be amazing to get a natural positive. 

Clare - No problem at all. We must live quite near to one another, I'm in Sydenham. 

Susie - That is amazing about 6 good follicles. You must be feeling very happy. I've not had acupuncture at Create - wasn't really aware they did it there but it sounds useful. I would have liked to have had a session directly before transfer as it is supposed to boost the success rate quite a bit. 

I'm fine today thanks. I just needed an afternoon in bed watching telly on my laptop and being sat on by the cat. My arm is still really sore from the flu jab though. I got my urine result back and it was a 'mixed growth' which made me feel really dirty! Like I've got a bit of everything. I have to give them another sample next week to make sure the antibiotics worked and everything has been cleared up. 

All the best to everyone, 
N xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello ladies

I am sitting here with the pleasant taste of Manuka honey in my mouth, having bought some at Boots.  Apparantly it cures everything!  I haven't told dh yet I spent £15 on a small jar of honey.  I haven't managed to find the ginger teabags but hope to locate some in Sainsbury's (unfortunately no Waitrose in Basingstoke yet).

I've also been reading about how xenohormones found in cosmetics can cause hormonal imbalances and damage your eggs so have decided to replace anything which I leave on my skin with something more natural, for example body lotion, moisturiser, foundation, bubble bath etc.  I'll use up what I have first but then buy something from Neal's Yard or Dr Haushka.  

Natasha - sorry to hear you're under the weather,   there are some nasty viruses and infections going round.  I think urinary tract infections are quite common when you're pregnant...maybe it is the lowered immunity?  Please take it easy, I hope dh is looking after you.  Maybe you need the anti-bacterial qualities of Manuka honey as well?  Thanks for sharing with us all the different things you did when trying to get pregnant, that sort of thing is really helpful.

Annabell - that's weird that you had 2 surges in one cycle but I'm pleased to hear you covered all bases   Any signs of PMT yet?

Susie - glad to hear your follies are coming on well and will   all goes well for EC and ET next week.  I think it is a good idea to have acupuncture either near the clinic or your home rather than track into central London when you've just had ET.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Buffy,

REN skincare is really nice as well and that's all organic and paraben free. http://www.renskincare.com/ I love the damask rose shower gel. I tried some of their moisturisers though and didn't get on with the facial one - made my skin feel bobbly. I have an unfortunate addiction to creme de la mer - my friend bought me some Duty Free back from Spain as a present and I've never been able to find anything as good.

I might get some manuka honey as well. I'm feeling a lot better today, mind.

I left off one thing from the list of 'things I did while trying to get pregnant' - lots of almonds and brazil nuts. There was also the 5 elements acupuncture at the Kite clinic which I have mentioned before.

I did try robitussin when we were trying naturally, because it is meant to increase your CM and make it slippery and easier to swim through but I never noticed a difference.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hello lovely create-ers,

Sounds like everyone has been a bit poorly. Sorry not been posting much, but I have been reading...just not feeling very inspired at the moment! Just want to get Friday consultation over and done with so I can think about next plan.

xx

PS I am local to the Palace, sounds like a few of us are based around there


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi all!

I'm day 23 now, so not expecting PMT just yet. Will be interesting to see which (if any!) of the OPK surges was the correct one though, depending on when AF arrives...  of course I am praying that we might have a miracle, even though I know it's so very unlikely.  

Buffy - I'm sure it's a good idea to change to natural cosmetics etc. "Lush" is quite good for cheaper natural alternatives? Also smells really nice. They have a shower gel called Flying Fox which smells of honey and jasmine, I absolutely love it!

Susie- I'm so pleased your follies are coming on well! I had acupuncture a couple of times with Balance Wellbeing centre, Ian was really nice and calming. Unfortunately it was during the cycle which got cancelled due to lack of follie growth so I haven't gone back to him BUT it absolutely wasn't anything to do with him, I just prefered  not to have the associations with that cycle so I went for a different acupuncturist this time.

Natasha- Good to hear you're feeling better!  Have you tried cranberry and pomegranate juice? It's really good for Urinary issues.

Lulu- Lots of luck for Friday.   I hope you can see a way forward from there.  

I'm in Clapham, so slightly further north (I think- my geographical knowledge is truly awful!) than most of you, but not so far away.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Oops Clare my first point in the message was for you, I forgot to put your name


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello everyone

Natasha - thanks for adding REN skincare to my list!  I hope you are continuing to feel better and are taking it easy.

Lulu - hope your appointment on Friday goes well and you feel more inspired afterwards.  

Annabell - how soon before AF do you start to get PMT?  I usually get breast tenderness as much as a week before, I suppose because of the rise in progesterone.  Then it eases off completely by the time AF arrives.  I do sometimes get moody just before as well.  I am expecting AF on Friday and am in a terrible mood today, snapping everyone's head off.  No breast tenderness this time though, don't know why.  I know what you mean about   for a miracle, I'm doing that too.   Thanks for the Lush suggestion, there is an outlet in Basingstoke.

Susie -   for a good scan today.

Take care all
xx


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

I had a bit of a tense day yesterday as I got a lot of breast tenderness and all other symptoms that I'd ovulated so I was really worried that the cetrotide hadn't worked. However, the scan today showed the follicles are still there - phew! The growth has slowed a bit, prob because of the cetrotide so the biggest follicles are now only up to 16mm, so the EC day has been put back to Thursday. My oestrogen levels came back fine so I suppose I can't do any more than keep on with the protein and fluid intake and keeping my belly warm. Hopefully there will be a bit more growth before Thursday.

I've got my pregnyl injection tomorrow - how long have people been leaving it out of the fridge before injecting? It's going to be so cold otherwise!

Annabell and Buffy - here's hoping for a natural BFP   

Thanks also for the feedback on acupuncture at Balance Annabell, Ian came across as very nice on the phone, it's just good to find someone close by

Right, off for my glass of milk now, hope everyone's well

xxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hi Susie, I think it is OK to take the injection out of the fridge a few hours before you use it.  That's certainly what I did with the Ovitrelle (same drug, different brand).  Wishing you all the best for a good EC tomorrow.    I think follicles do tend to put on a sudden spurt in the last couple of days.

I got my results back from the throat swab and no bacteria was found so it must be a virus.  Just a case of getting plenty of rest I suppose.

I hope everyone else is doing OK.


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Everyone,

Good luck for tomorrow Susie. Will be thinking of you.

Buffy - hope the throat is starting to feel better. I'm glad to hear that it wasn't an infection.

Annabell - hope that you are keeping well and that you haven't had any PMT symptoms. Would be wonderful if you got a surprise natural pregnancy.

I suppose it isn't that odd that so many of us are in South London as that's where the clinic is, but I didn't choose it because of nearness, I chose it because of their ethos.

I am starting my very first ward placement on Monday (I'm a first year nursing student). I'm quite nervous but excited too. 

Lots of love to all,
N x


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Hello everyone

i had my 1st scan for the FET cycle today - all looked OK. Looks like the left ovary has the dominant follicle which means any slim chance of a natural pregnancy is even slimmer i think as that's my dodgy side. Freda scanned me & said the lining was triple layered & fine for the time in the cycle so all good i think. Another scan on friday & then pee sticks from the weekend onwards!

Susie - good luck for EC tomorrow (mm light sedation!)

Palace Lulu! - Let us know how your appointment goes with Geeta on friday - hope you get some more enlightening answers.

Buffy - glad you're feeling better & know it's a virus

Annabell - i go through lovely clapham everyday on my way to work. Hope you're nearer to knowing if AF or a nicer surprise is on it's way.

I"ve been programmed by my mother to think that SE london is a long way from SW london (where the folks live) - though it's so near compared to Buffy coming from Basingstoke (& others further still like Liverpool!)

Natasha - good luck for the placement.


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello lovelies

hope all going well with you all,

susie: good luck for tomorrow, enjoy the sedation...I love it  

Clare: all sounding good for you.

Natasha: good luck with ward placement, I can imagine it must be very daunting.

Annabell: fingers crossed for a lovely surprise.

buffy: glad to hear you are on the mend 

Need to get myself sorted for Friday with my endless list of questions. Have to say its nice not having to think about it all at the moment or do anything about it.

Love to all
xx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi all!

I've been away from here for a while as my laptop has a virus - i have tried just about everything but everytime I think I have got rid of it,  it reappears  

AF hasn't arrived yet but I think I have PMT    I mainly get irrationally emotional with PMT but the odd thing is it's really hard to identify as PMT until afterwards, because at the time it seems to be rationally emotional!  We went to see 2012 at the cinema last night and I cried   - it's not meant to be a sad film so I think that AF must be on the way!  I am still hoping it won't come but if it has to come I would rather it came soon so that the next cycle can be done before Xmas.

Buffy -   for a miracle for you! Is your throat better? Frustrating to be told there is nothing the doc can do.

Susie- Thinking of you today     for EC and hope you enjoy the sedation! 

Natasha- I chose the clinic because of ethos too, it seemed like it was "meant to be" when it turned out to be quite convenient to get to as well! Good luck for the ward placement, which hospital are you based at?

Clare- I'm glad the scan went well! Good luck for Friday and the pee sticks!  

Lulu- good luck for Friday!   I really hope you get some answers


xx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi All,

Susie - hope today went well and they collected a good healthy batch of eggs. The first thing I said when someone came in to see me was "did they get all four?". Waiting for the call the next morning too, to see how many fertilised is REALLY nerve wracking so I'll be thinking of you and hoping for the best news possible.

Buffy - REN are doing a special offer on orders over £50 at the moment. You get a free full size morrocan rose body wash (my favourite). The offer code is ROSES. (I don't work for them, promise). 

Lulu - I hope the appointment goes well. Well done for being so organised and writing down all your questions. 

Clare - Good news about the triple lining. They say it is the best sort for implantation. Are you day 5 now? 

Annabell - Sorry about the virus. I hate it when things go wrong with my computer, it is like part of me! I hope it isn't PMT. It is so frustrating how symptoms can be a sign of either. 

I'm based at King's which is where I'm also having my antenatal care so it is all very convenient and local. 

I had another scan the other day, and my uterine artery had a high pulsatility index which means I'm high risk for pre-eclampsia. Not very nice to hear, but it is good that we know about it so I can be monitored. I've been speaking to another lady on the site who had the same thing and she's been very helpful, as has Prof Campbell who said I could start taking aspirin 75mg again. Just feel like I've had to put up with a lot and would really like to just enjoy this time. Trying not to stress too much - 60% of women with this thing DON'T have anything bad happen so hopefully I'll be in the 60%.


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Still a bit groggy from the sedative so will keep this short (loved it by the way, was so spaced!!). Dr Lakshmi did my collection and they got 3 eggs which is slightly less than I was hoping for as I had 6 good size follicles but I keep saying to myself 'quality not quantity' and   that they fertilise. I've been watching DVDs all afternoon to take my mind off the call that I'll be getting tomorrow - a friend has given me the Lipstick Jungle series to watch and it's great!

Natasha - sorry to hear the news from the scan - as you say, after all you've been through already it would be nice to have an easy pregnancy. But at least this has been picked up so you can be monitored and the odds are high for you not to get any complications. I'm sure it's easier said than done, but all you can do now is try to relax.

Annabell - fingers crossed it's not PMT

Buffy - hope you're still getting plenty of rest and feeling a lot better

Clare - sounds like everything's going really well so far, good luck for the scan tomorrow

Lulu - hope all goes well with your meeting with Geeta

Hmm, not such a short note after all - hope it all makes sense!

xxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Good morning ladies

It feels like my AF is imminent, sadly, so I don't think I pulled of the miracle pregnancy this month.    Oh well, we'll have another go with my next cycle, at least it puts a smile on dh's face.  I've definitely decided to wait until January before trying another cycle with CH, mostly because of the virus hanging around.  I think it's better to be in good health.

Clare - glad all looked good on your first scan.  I assume you are not going to have EC this time round, just ET?  Hope your scan today went well.  

Lulu - how did your meeting with Geeta go?  Did she answer all your questions?  

Annabell - I wondered where you had gone but glad to hear it is your computer that has the virus and not you as you will want to be good and healthy for your natural cycle.  Any sign of AF yet?  I was wondering if we would synchronise again    Also, of course, I'm hoping you have the miracle pregnancy this month instead, you never know.  I always know when I get PMT because I feel an urge to punch people whilst normally I am quite a gentle person.  Was 2012 any good?  Jonathan Ross gave it a roasting on Film 2009.

Natasha - thanks for the info re REN - sorry to hear about the pre-eclampsia risk.  If it helps a friend of mine was a very high risk but managed to have 4 babies without any damage.  She was just sensible about not overdoing it.  Do you have some good relaxation techniques?

Susie - glad to hear you got 3 good eggs, you are right it is quality not quantity every time.  I'm   you get good embryos.  Good luck for the call today, it really is horrible waiting for the phone to ring isn't it?

Love to all
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

hello all,

just a quick one from me as feeling a bit grrrrrrr.... my appointment was supposed to be at 10am, I finally got to see Geeta just after 11!  They were waiting for my notes to be couriered from LFC where I had to have my egg collection last time, (long story!) - was particularly annoyed about this as I had suggested that they need to get my notes back at the time that I reported it hadn't worked.

As suspected I just got told that medically there was nothing she could say. I had a perfect cycle with 2 grade 1 blasts transferred. hmmmmmm....

Anyway, I wanted to have my tubes checked again as last time they spasm'd so I have no idea if they are actually blocked or not. She has given me a letter for my GP to refer me on the NHS for these tests. I think they will say no, as I tried this when I saw them last week.  She was very supportive on this and I do believe she genuinely wants it to work, I am just really fed up with it all.

So am going dancing on saturday night and will drink for the 1st time in ages...nothing going to happen for me until Jan or most likely Feb. 

love to you all, Susie - hope you have had good news today.

xx


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi all

Didn't get the call until about 11.30 this morning, it was so hard to try to remain calm...but the good news is that we've got two fertilized eggs (yeah!) and the transfer will be Sunday morning. Apparently they hadn't started dividing yet but I think that's normal and the embryologist seemed sure that they would. So have just got to keep my  

Lulu - it can be really frustrating to wait around so long for appointments, it happened with our first meeting with Geeta and yesterday the embryologist didn't see us until 2.5 hrs after I was out from the EC. I guess they were just busy but hard to keep calm when I was wondering if there was something wrong with the eggs. It must be difficult to be told that basically everything should have worked but didn't - I suppose when we hear of all the success stories around we forget that it's not an exact science as so much depends on our bodies accepting the embryos. I have a friend who was only successful on her 5th attempt and there wasn't any particular reason for the previous cycles not working. Good luck for getting an NHS appt for getting your tubes checked - if they say no then let me know as I'll PM you the details of where I went; not cheap but really good. Enjoy your dancing and drinks on Saturday night - sounds like the best plan to give yourself a break from thinking about it all for a while. 

Buffy - sorry to hear AF might be on the way - December's probably a good time for trying the natural way - festive season and all that!

Am off now as DH has just got dinner ready - he's been such a star, esp as he hurt his back today poor thing

Love to all, have a good weekend xxx


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## ClareTG (Nov 3, 2009)

Hi everyone

Susie - great news about your 2 fertilised eggs - brilliant! Fingers crossed for the rest of it - don't forget to stay a good 20 mins resting before you leave the clinic (I'm sure i was so obsessed with emptying my over-full bladder that i didn't stick around long enough). And the woolly socks that were mentioned earlier in this thread!

Lulu - how late were they today? I had my scan at 9 but wasn't seen til about 9.40 as they wanted to wait for Geeta. V frustrating as i hadn't told work, hoping i could sneak in a tiny bit late.  So not surprised it backed up the rest of the day. It's a shame they can't investigate your tubes there, but hopefully the referral will get your GPs attention this time. It's very frustrating that it's such a demanding process to go through & then just becomes down to hit and miss.  Enjoy that night out tomorrow - sounds like just what you need.

My 2nd scan this morning was showing the left dominant follicle had grown v slightly & as i'm now on day 9 i have to start the OPKs tonight (bought a pack of 7 so hope that's enough).

Love to everyone else too - have good weekends. I'm off to wee on a stick (rock n roll!)

xxx


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi all!

No sign of AF yet for me but I'm not getting excited  - since I had the two mysterious positive OPKs this month on day 12 and day 20, if AF doesn't arrive this weekend it probably means that the day 12 one wasn't the real thing.. which is a pain because then I have another week to wait for AF to arrive around day 34  

Still suffering with the computer virus - I feel exactly the way you do Natasha, like it is part of me that has the problem! I'm the same with my mobile phone as well, I feel bereft if it is out of my sight  

Natasha- very sorry to hear about the pre-eclampsia risk,   that it won't affect you. I hope you are able to relax and look after yourself. One of my brothers did medical training in London, but he spent most of the time in the SE area so I don't think he has been at Kings. 

Buffy- Has AF arrived yet? Maybe mine is holding off until you get yours   ! (Although obviously I hope that it doesn't come for either of us..   ) 

LOL at the PMT punching, I can't imagine you feeling like that! 2012 was a good film if you like enormous end-of-the-world special effects - the effects really were fantastic. Actually if I hadn't been feeling emotional I would probably have enjoyed it more, but also it really did go on a bit too long.

Lulu- sorry to hear your meeting with Geeta was frustrating. The trouble is in this situation you DON'T want to be told that there was nothing wrong... because that means there is nothing they can fix  I was really shellshocked by my review meeting, it took me a couple of days to get back together mentally. It was strange because she didn't tell me anything I didn't already know- I guess you just can't help hoping that the doctor somehow has the answers.

Did Geeta think it was worth checking your tubes for IVF or is this so you can consider IUI? I thought about getting mine checked again but I think for IVF it doesn't matter unless they are filled with liquid (which should be picked up on the scans)? How long will the NHS take to do it? I thought it was possible to do it at Create - is it very expensive? (sorry loads of questions!) I hope you have a great night out- you deserve a bit of fun!

Susie- brilliant news about the fertilisation, best of luck for Sunday!  My tips are long furry socks, drink hot drinks rather than cold water (coz then you don't get all cold and shivery) and also you don't have to be absolutely bursting for the loo, just full enough to want to go. The first time I was really uncomfortably full and (like Clare) I was totally obsessed with getting to the loo straight afterwards, whereas it is better to stay still for 15 mins apparantly.

Clare- Good that the follies are progressing, have fun with the pee sticks!   Did you get the smiley face ones?  

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello all  

My AF is still "imminent", usual bloating, mild cramping and sleepiness.

Lulu - sorry to hear about your frustrating appointment.  Still, we all know administration is not their strong point.  I am sure it will do you good to have a couple of cycles "off".  Have you thought any more about seeing a Chinese practioner for some herbs to tonify your uterus?

Susie -   for the cells to divide on your fetilised eggs and for a smooth transfer.

Clare - good luck with the Ovulation sticks - don't forget you mustn't wee for 4 hours before hand (something I only realised recently).

Annabell -    for no period, or if not that then at least an early period.  Do you get cramping and bloating just before hand too?

Love to all
xx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

Hello all,

Looks like I am joining the AF imminent gang with Buffy & Annabel! bit early, started spotting today, not really expecting AF til Wednesday but I suppose with all the IVF drugs things might get a bit mixed up. Of course I googled and I have now convinced myself that I have diminishing egg quality    hence shorter cycle.

Susie - good news about your embies...look forward to hearing that they are safely back inside.  

Clare: good luck picking up the surge.  

Natasha: hope you are relaxing and pre-eclampsia risk is lowered.  

re: my tube tests, realised I didn't explain! Basically I could have it done at Create but Geeta feels that the NHS should do it    so she has written to my GP to ask them to refer me. I think they will say no, but who knows Geeta is very persuasive.  I feel like I might be being a bit naive although I do totally get everything that Geeta says...over on the singles board they would be pushing me to challenge her about immune issues and PGD which she doesn't feel has robust scientific backing. I do really believe that she is not about making you spend money unnecessarily but it is so confusing as other consultants totally believe in all of this, and she just doesn't.   On the one hand its great that her and freda said they thought I would be pregnant on the last cycle, it doesn't really help.
Plus my night out is cancelled    the event I was going to is postponed as one of the acts missed a flight and is stuck in Poland, then two of the friends I was going out with are poorly...so despite having bought new clothes to go dancing I am in watching X Factor...which is cool...I quite like saturday nights in  

Anyway some time off is definitely a good idea, going to go back to monitoring my cycles properly to check am ovulating still, need to get some updated blood tests done and then re-evaluate the sperm situation. And hopefully if my man from New York is still up for it when he visits in January, maybe even get some action  

Enjoy your weekends ladies.   
xxx


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## NatashaM (Feb 12, 2009)

Hi Everyone,

Susie - I am thrilled to hear about your two fertilised eggs. I guess you had transfer today, I hope it went well and you felt relaxed. When you have time, do fill us in on the cells and grade and everything. Good luck with the two week wait. It does feel like forever but just try and concentrate on the day you're in and don't try to think about too far into the future, that's my tip. 

Clare - hope things keep progressing well with your follicle. When I was testing for my FET, I used the OPK sticks every 12 hours, rather than every 24 just to make sure I didn't miss the surge. Oh and the clearblue fertility monitor as well. But then, I'm just paranoid!

Annabell - I wouldn't give up hope yet, as pg symptoms can mirror PMT. But if it does have to come then I hope it is earlier rather than later. Sorry the computer is still playing up. My internet connection has been on and off and it is usually so reliable, we had to ring the provider who changed the frequency or something because they thought there was interference. King's is SE London. It's in Camberwell.

Buffy - Hope you are feeling ok today and looking after yourself. 

Lulu - Don't worry about early spotting the next period after after an IVF cycle. I had it, and I think it is quite common. I am sure it is not your eggs. I hope the NHS agree to test your tubes for you. Sorry your night out fell through but hope you enjoyed a quiet night in and feel good and refreshed today.

My husband and I went to stay with his brother and sister-in-law this weekend. I went up after the practical exam. I did mess a couple of things up, so it depends if they are feeling kind or not as to whether I pass. 

I'm still a bit stressed about the pre eclampsia risk. If it happens, it won't happen yet. It will be more like when I am 27 or 28 weeks at the earliest so I am feeling a bit like I have a sword hanging over me for the next 5 weeks. My next scan is the 28th December, to check growth. I feel like I may ring the department and ask to see an Obstatrician to go through the risks with me, because when I asked what the odds were last time, the guy brushed me off with a "most women are ok" and that didn't really help. I then went home and looked at clinical trials of this test for abnormal uterine artery PI and freaked myself out by discovering that of about 165 women with it, 6 lost their babies at a late stage because of blood clots caused by pre eclampsia.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi all-

I think AF is nearly upon me now - sore breasts and heavy back. I sometimes wonder whether it is causing more distress to keep hoping for a miracle in the months when we don't have IVF (chances of natural preg are something like 2% with DH's count etc) but on the other hand it is nearly impossible not to hope. Does everybody do this?

Buffy - yes I get bloating and backache before AF. I only thought for the first time today that becuase implantation can be up to 12 dpo and PMT can start about 7dpo sometimes that then it is not surprising that the symptoms overlap (maybe this is obvious but I just hadn't thought of it!  ).

Lulu- Don't worry about egg quality and don't google, it never helps!  It's MUCH more likely that it is due to the IVF drugs. 

Sorry to ask again, but did Geeta think you should check your tubes for IVF, or so that you could try IUI? I think her approach is good and clearly based very strongly on what she believes, but like you I wonder why other clinics do so much about immune issues. I don't know what PGD is  ? If you are worried about immune issues would changing donor to get different genetic materal help? 

I'm sorry your night out was cancelled but pleased that you made the most of your night in - I watched X factor too last night, I have really got into it!  

Natasha- Sorry to hear your computer has been playing up too, hope the frequency change has sorted it out! Sorry I am utterly useless when it comes to geography, I thought King's was near the river   Actually I think my brother did spend time in Camberwell so maybe he has been in King's, I will have to ask him! His rotations changed so frequently it was hard to keep up, but he is near the end now (GP training).

 Please don't get worried about the pre-eclampsia risk, worrying will not help (I know that is far easier to say than do!) I think you should ring the department (or maybe your GP if they won't help) to ask exactly what they think the risks are for you. They certainly shouldn't brush you off, but maybe they were saying most people were fine becuase they don't think there is any reason to worry? The internet statistics could be misleading because those 6 people could have other indications/risk factors which you don't have.

Are there any other tests which can be done before the next scan which you could do privately?

Susie -I hope you are ok and I hope all went well today   

Lots of love to all

xx


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## SusieB20 (Apr 19, 2009)

Hi girls

Just a quick post from me tonight before I resume my role of couch potato...!

I had two embies transferred back in this morning - one was a grade 2 with 7 cells and the other is a grade 3 with 4 cells (bit of a slow starter I guess!). It's so surreal - I keep looking at the ultrasound pic with the tiny speck on there!! Hang on in there little ones!!  

Have got the week off work so planning on lots of relaxing - DH is working from home at the moment which is handy

Geeta did the transfer today which I wasn't expecting - there weren't many of us in today so managed to stay in theatre for around 15 -20 mins and then moved to the recovery area for acupuncture and manage to hold off from going to the loo for another half hour - thanks for the tips on how much water to drink - I'd had enough that my bladder was protesting when Geeta did the ultrasound but was able to hang on for a while!

Will write again in a couple of days with more personal messages, just wanted to let you know how everything went

Love to all xxx


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## lulumead (May 29, 2008)

great news Susie    

Annabell: It was me that suggested getting tubes tested as if they are clear I'd like to give IUI's another chance.  Geeta thinks this might be a way forward. Its mainly because I could do 3 IUi's for the cost of every IVF so if its a matter of numbers then I could do more IUI's! BUt then if tubes aren't clear not sure what I do.

Bit exhausted as spent all day with friend and her baby in A&E, so sorry for no other personals.

lots of love all
xxx


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## Buffy68 (Aug 19, 2009)

Hello all

AF is definitely upon me know, I'm shattered and off to bed for a nap.  Wondering if Annabell and Lulu are far behind?

Lulu - you can't say you having diminished egg quality just because you have one short cycle!  It's when it happens every time.  Stop googling, you're worse than I am.  I hope your friend and baby are OK.

Natasha - I hope you get to talk to someone about the pre-eclampsia that's worrying you.  I'm sure there are drugs you can take to rule out blood clots - in fact I know someone who has to take them (not the same person I mentioned before).  If you're that high a risk they'll put you on them.  Even if those stats are relevant to you it would still relate to over 96% chance of *not* having a clot.

Annabell - I think we all hope, even those of us with less than 2% chance.

Susie - glad to hear your good news and I wish you a relaxed and harmonious 2ww.  It's great that you managed to get some acupuncture on the day as well.


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## annabell99 (Jul 23, 2009)

Hi all! 

I am a bit in limbo at the moment - spotting started yesterday but not enough AF yet to call and book a day 5 scan. Frustrating! 

Susie- congrats on having your two little ones on board, hope it is all going well!  

Buffy - I'm sorry you have AF.  Hope you are feeling less tired and under the weather now.

Lulu- thanks for the update on the tubes testing. ANy luck with your GP? I hope all is well with your friend and her baby.

Clare- Any update on the wee sticks?

Natasha- I hope you are getting the info and reassurance you need about the pre-eclampsia.

Lots of love to all

xx


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## Skybreeze (Apr 25, 2007)

*New home this way ladies >>> * http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=218096.new#new


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