# ivf vs icsi



## bluedanube (Nov 3, 2010)

Hello 
I'm 41 and have just had the devastating news that following the retrieval of 2 eggs neither of them fertilised. 

I was shocked as we had been advised to have icsi to improve our chances due to my age. ICSI was sold to me as offering a better success rate as the older eggs can have hard shells making it difficult for sperm to penetrate and fertilise.  So we thought it sounded like a good option and paid the extra 300 and signed the contract for icsi.  

However when I asked the woman on the phone how they didn't fertilise when using icsi she said that they hadn't used icsi but ivf.  She said the sperm was good and they didn't know icsi was our choice.  I feel devastated and like we've been robbed of our last chance of having a baby through admin/technical error.  I know there are no guarantees with ivf/icsi but if we'd gone through the 2 week wait and got a negative I'd have found it easier to accept that it just wasn't meant to be and got on with my life. But we're left hanging. My body is hormoned to the hilt and crying out for some embies to nurture and we're left with a big quesiton mark over whether if they'd carried out the procedure that was written on the file and paid for we might had 2 embies on board today. 

Where do we go from here? Would icsi have made a difference? Should they compensate us for not performing the correct procedure?  Has anyone else not made it to transfer?  This is my 4th ivf and definitely not making it to transfer is 100 times worse than receiving a negative, and that's crushing enough. 

Any thoughts welcome.  Poppy x


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## Attie (Nov 24, 2010)

Hey Bluedanube, so sorry to hear your news this morning.

I definitely think the clinic should pay for you to repeat the cycle if you had asked and paid for ICSI and they didn't do it. As a compromise you could offer to pay for the meds for the next cycle but ask them to provide all the other services for free. I think ASDA are the cheapest source for the meds. If they don't agree to this I think you should get legal advice, as you had a contract with the clinic and they didn't comply with the terms.

I too had a cycle which was abandoned before ET. I agree it's far more frustrating and disappointing than a BFN after the 2WW.

Don't forget to check the "poor responders" thread for tips on ways to increase the number and quality of eggs, and think about using DHEA for four months before the cycle if your DHEA and testosterone levels are suitable: http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?board=535.0

Attie xx


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## bluedanube (Nov 3, 2010)

Thanks Attie,

I've been on DHEA for 3 months and it lowered my FSH from 13 to 7.4!  My doctor was really encouraged by all the findings throughout the cycle. Unfortunately he wasn't there for ET and a different doctor did it. He clearly didn't read my file and I was just a number on the weekend!  My own dr was so excited with my results he said that all I needed was 2 embryos and I'd be pregnant. I don't think he should have said that, but that's how good everything was looking. 

Sorry to hear you also had a cycle broken before completion. It's just awful! 

Not sure where to go from here as I'll be 42 in August and this was our last shot. Had we got a BFN we'd be ready to move on but we feel robbed. 
Px


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## coweyes (Sep 4, 2008)

Bluedanube


I think that's totally terrible and disgusting of the clinic.  Yes they make mistakes as they are only human, but they should compensate u for it by giving you a free treatment.  Maybe after that treatment you will be able to move on if u are not successful.


I have been told so many times in the past "o u have a really high success rate because ur young, your get pg its just a matter of time".  I think the same as you though its wrong when someone gives you guaranties as there are no guaranties in this process!!


Sorry if my post appeared angry i just feel really bad for you, i would def complain to the clinic. xxx


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## pmc (Nov 15, 2010)

Hi Poppy.
I am so sorry to hear you awful news, I agree with the others, that they should pay for your next cycle as you did sign a contract.
I am 41, 42 in Dec, and I just got back from the hospital today for a pg test, another negative  . this was my 3rd attempt
But when I originally when to see the consultant, she said because of your age IVF is the way to go, success rate is higher in women my age, also the meds they put you on (GONAL F high dose of 450mg) you are guranteed to grow alot of follicles. My egg store is low, so thats why my overies need more help, and because of the gonal f, I have grown 8-10 embryos each cycle and have had 4-6 eggs in them and 3 fertilised in the end.  
But what I am saying is, after disgussing the ivf treatment with the dr, I still feel that IVF short protocal is the way to go for older women, even though I have had 3 fails, at least you are given the best chance ever.

I wish you all the best Poppy, and I hope you get the answer you need.


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## pmc (Nov 15, 2010)

Forgot to say, I was also told that they will try IVF, but if the sperm isnt good enough then they will do icsi with no extra cost. The clinic I go to, will do the best they can possibly do to get positive results.
Hope this helps a little


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