# Just dipping my toe in the muddy ´moving on´waters ......



## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Hi everyone, 


I can´t keep kidding myself that I belong anywhere but here anymore. No offense but this isn´t the next board I wanted to join. I thought if I tried hard enough and long enough, I´d finally win a place on the parenting thread. Well it wasn´t to be and here I am, moving on.


How do we even start to move on when we don´t want to? My DH has decided that its time to live a life without children and not sit around waiting for something that will never happen and watch our lives pass us by. He is OK with it and I´m not. We have a frostie and he doesn´t think we should use it. I understand all his reasons and the emotional side of tx has taken its toll on my mental health. I hate the description ´mental´health. It implies it doesn´t hurt my heart and thats just not the case. I am broken inside, completely empty and have no idea where to begin in fixing it. Deep down I know that FET won´t fix it, even a BFP isn´t the complete cure for years of IF I suspect. My DH is right, we have to stop tx.


So, thats my introduction and this is me moving on. Jeez it hurts  


Katxxx


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Kat   

I'm so, so sorry.
I'm thinking of you. 

Rowanxxx


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Kat, your post on the other thread, 'limiting', oh my God!
Why did your friend have three kids if this is his view of them?!
We've been having a series of blood tests for donor egg IVF. Fine, I thought, everything was going well, only for the surgery to phone up this morning and say they won't give us the letter the clinic is demanding stating that i'm fit enough to have treatment. 
This damn body! Shall I go outside and shoot myself now? If I am prepared to risk what's left of my health getting pg at 50 it's nobody else's business, is it?
And no, a dog is simply not the same!
Having said that, it's great to read that you seem to be feeling a bit better.   

Rowanxxx


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Hi Rowan, 

I know a dog is not the same but it was so nice that he talked to me about it rather than walked away because I don't have kids. He was actually asking me questions rather than just telling me about his girls. He was trying to be nice and it was such a lovely change to have somebody interested in me and my life instead of deciding I have nothing interesting to say since I'm not a mum. 3 kids is 'limiting' because they can't get picked up from the airport when they go home (expats too  ) and it takes ages to get to kindergarten etc - he wasn't complaining more just saying they had no idea that 3 would be so much more work compared to 2. I'm not sure 'feeling better' is a very accurate description, more denial I think today   . I have so many loony assessments this week I'm  not sure whether I'm coming or going.

Anyway, far more important today is what are you going to do about the letter? Was it just the secretary that called you? Can you go and see the Dr instead and talk to them about it? I'm really cross on your behalf and I hope you can sort this quickly. You don't deserve the added stress     . Getting this far has been hard enough  

Katxxx


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Hi Kat,

No, it was the practice manager and it followed a meeting with the gps. 
My dh took the call but reading between the lines it seems that they can't underwrite the IVF. However, we're not asking them to do this, simply for a doctor  to state that if I did get pg, I wouldn't drop dead! At least, I think this is what the clinic means by fit enough to undergo the tx. 
On top of this we've had the most massive electricity bill for this last quarter (prices are going through the ceiling in this country but I never expected anything like this). It reads as if we spend the winter semi naked with dozens of electric heaters switched on all over the house! In fact, we heat with oil and usually wear thick jumpers!
Oh, God, I would love three little girls and I wouldn't put them in kindergarten, either!
I am furious and so upset. We both had loads of blood tests yesterday and now we're both wondering what on earth was the point. I don't know what to do with the grief and the anger. What can we do if we can't do this? Surrogacy? But who's going to help us?
Why is this journey so hellishly hard when other people get pg as soon as they take their knickers down?!   
Denial or not, you do sound a bit better. Are the various appointments helping?

Rowanxxx


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Funnily enough our electricity bill is a whopper too. DH made the executive decision to turn the heating down to 15 degrees and thinks we should sit in thermal for the rest of winter   


You need to go adn see your GP. Don´t give up at this hurdle. You´ve come too far to stop now. You and DH know you are fit enough for tx, as does your GP but maybe you need to go and see them to confirm what the clinic want in writing. Its crap but then tx generally is   


Sadly my indifference/denial/happier state was shortlived and my heart has splintered yet again into a million pieces. DH got angry about me keeping things from him so as soon as I was upset I called him. Sadly I was walking up the high street and as soon as I spoke to him I was in floods of tears and getting towards the complete hysterics stage. He did calm me down and now I have been and bought a bottle of port to numb the pain slightly.


As for what to do with the grief and anger, let it out here. Its a start at least. You know I´m always around and I´ll always listen and understand. There is always pm too. When I´m less upset I´ll certainly be sending you a message so you can help me put my borken heart back together.
 Hang in there and don´t give up. Go speak to your GP.
Katxxx


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Kat, thank you  I just hope I haven't made you feel even worse, you've got quite enough without that!
Yes, at this time of year I always start getting desperate for spring; this year it's going to be even worse! We can't use the drier anymore, that's right out, so we're going to have to drape everything over the radiators to get dry. Hmm, 15th Feb, I reckon there's going to be at least six weeks before I can bank on getting washing dried outside! I have no idea at all where the rest of the electricity usage has come from! I wish our millionaire rulers had any idea how most ordinary people in this country struggle to pay the bills as it is, never mind cope with these massive increases. 
My dh is currently asleep on the settee. He does try, bless him but he admits he runs out of things to say. He just holds me as I sob. What else can he do? And why does this whole business tear your heart out and break it, over and over again?
Port sounds like an excellent idea! I suppose that's all we can do in the end, try to get through these acutely painful times any way we can. I am so sorry, Kat.   
At the moment I don't want to set foot in my surgery but you're quite right that the only thing to do is go to talk to somebody, preferably a dr as senior as I can find. I still can't see what the problem is, if I want to risk this ageing body surely that's my business? And yes, I do know all about the increased risks of pre-eclampsia, etc, etc, etc. Of course. The body's not much good but there's nothing wrong with my mind and I'm qualified to a level higher than virtually all of them!
Look after yourself lovely,   

Rowanxx


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Hi Rowan, 
Of course you haven´t made me feel worse. Thinking about others lets us have a break from ourselves  
Did you pluck up the courage to contact the surgery? I hope you have made some progress this week?
Katxxx


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Hi Kat,

There was too much work last week to really concentrate on anything else and this week I think the grief's coming out - again. Oh dear, more hours of crying and asking the universe questions I can't answer! One of them is what on earth is the point of my life when I can't do this basic thing. The empty house at the bottom of our garden is to be sold and guess what I'm dreading? That it will be bought by a family with six little kids!
I can't go on like this. It's not living, it's barely existing. I don't know what to do, whether to argue with the surgery or simply accept that I'm too sick and too old. (The knees have been stiff and aching lately, as if my body's insisting on making that point). That leaves surrogacy, it's the only option left but it's not easy in this country. Also, who am I going to find to do this for me? It's not like asking someone to help you with the gardening or the decorating!
How are things with you? Are you feeling any better on a day to day basis?
This board is very quiet at the moment, it's usually a little more active than this but I think some people may have gone on to the Coping with Infertility board. It's a shame you've had no more replies.
I try to help myself, I try to meditate, etc but of course that means I have to feel the pain. At times, I do feel something else, too, a more loving, peaceful place but it never lasts. I am still no nearer accepting a life without children and I don't think I ever will be. I have probably twenty years left unless some diabetic related complication carries me off earlier and I don't want to suffer all that time. I want to_ live_! I've spent six or seven years actively struggling to conceive, as I was too ill before that time and it's been six years of heartache and a depth of pain I haven't experienced since my father died. But the physical problems are real and they won't just go away. I assume this is what's behind the doctors' refusal. What do I do? Give up? How can you do that and survive? And why is it that every time you turn on the TV there's something about mothers and babies or families or adverts with bottle feeding mothers or something?! Or even worse, pregnant teenage kids! Or you read about IVF etc in the papers or hear about people in America who have so many children. 
How do I turn my hormones off and that unending aching desire to have a family? How do I get through life feeling like this? I have a job to do, for a start! And why is motherhood all that seems to matter these days? Is this some sort of major reaction against feminism?! I have a good mind and wanted to use it. I went to uni, etc. I didn't know that my twenties would be the only time I could actually _have _a child!
I hope things are a little better with you. I suppose all we can do is take it one day at a time. Just one day. Sometimes, even infertility blogs make me cry!
Hugs  

Rowanxx


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Rowan   . Do you have counselling at all? I think you should if you don't.

I'm completely up to my neck this weekend but I'll pm you on Monday. I'm not going to post on here anymore. Since so many people are reading but not posting it makes me feel even worse. I'm guessing nobody else feels like me and they are just laughing at my pathetic life and stupid feelings   .

Thinking of you and sorry to run out on you but I'll be back I promise - just got to get through a visit from my parents. Its the first time they have seen me since they found out I'm not all they think I am. Its going to be a looooooong weekend if they try and talk to me about stuff.

love Katxxx


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## Shirley1975 (Jul 7, 2009)

Hi Kat

Its been a year now since I have 'moved on' and i was doing okay for a while feeling positive about all the things we could do. I now know i will never forget that we can't have children, things will always happen to bring sad memorys of what we tried for. To me I feel like i am mourning. I am now facing a family member on both sides of our family trying for children, yes at the same time...I am now desparate feeling guilty that i want family to turn to with out baby talk. Buy also happy that they are trying for the dream i always had, but never got. I am already dreading christmas in case one is pregnant. I always dreamed of saving my news for christmas day and shouting out 'i am pregnant' :-( 
My hubby says we can just pack our bags and go skiing this christmas, but i know it will always be with me. Today i am just struggling getting through without breaking down in tears. I am scared i will never be happy with either family once babies are around as they should be joyous times and i feel i would just be to upset around them and don't want to show my emotions at a joyous time. does that make sense.
thank you for listening, guess i might find myself turning to these pages for a while again now.
Shirley


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## Rowan22 (Dec 29, 2008)

Hi Kat,

I don't know what it is with these boards at the moment, they used to be quite busy. Perhaps the people who did post have all successfully 'moved on', I do know that some of them now post on the adoption boards, so they must have taken that route. That's not an option for us, as for you, we've been rejected three times (for things we can't help, like my heath, we don't have criminal records or anything like that) and neither of us can take another rejection. 
It's a beautiful sunny Saturday here and I hope it's the same for you. I do find that the weather does make a difference and a grey day at this time of year can feel like the final straw. I also hope the weekend's going well for you and you're able to talk to your parents. My mother's sympathetic, as she had trouble conceiving and she hasn't forgotten what it's like but of course, there's a limit to what she can say. 
I've had several lots of counselling in my life and don't really want to have any more but I suppose it might be worth considering. It would need to be someone who knows about this issue, though, not someone who immediately launches into talking about her children or grandchildren. I did look at the association of British infertility counsellors (or something like that) but their charges are prohibitive. 
I don't know why people read and don't post. Maybe they're simply not ready to share their own feelings and of course, this forum is public. I'm aware of consciously censoring some personal details, just in case someone I know identifies me, though I should think it's extremely unlikely. So few people have any understanding of what this fate is like that I can't help feeling I'm giving people ammunition. 
Emerging from work yesterday, in a town I don't normally work in, I found myself confronted with several little kids and their parents. Obviously, a nursery school had just finished for the day and the parents were heading for the town's car park. One kid was crying and getting told off, which I really, really didn't need. I thought 'you don't know how lucky you are!' and was glad to find my car and drive away. Parents don't know, they can't do and the ones who moan about their kids are the worst. 
I hope you have some good moments this weekend. 
Take care,  

Rowanxxx


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## Bottle5 (Nov 9, 2010)

oh girls......you make my heart break..Im so sorry for how youre feeling.

I dont come on very often, mainly because i find it too upsetting....even though often its uplifting but usually I just find it so draining - none of that makes sense does it!

After our 05th ICSI, I spent all last year depressed - Dr suggested counselling - and I know how positive many find it - but I couldn't handle it because to me is was almost like admitting to myself I was ready to start to give up - and I just cant do that.

Recently though, Ive been subtly shiftingto what I could do if I didn't have to spend another £15k on tx..then next day Im in floods again thinking whats the point in living. Its so hard, confusing, angry, unfair....

have you read Beyond Childlessness by Rebecca Black and Louise Skull? Ive read it loads of times over the years and it gives me some comfort knowing my anger and bad thoughts are shared by others....its not an answer or solution, but it helps me sometimes...although lets be honest, the only that will help is having a blinking baby - Gawd why should it be so hard? - and/or win some money so I can carry on funding endless tx. Im 40 this year - Im not ready to give up but I worry more and more and it never goes away.... 

I dont want to be childless.

DH Low & slow - TTC 9 yrs
1st ICSI Dec 2004 Cardiff- 2 ETs, Hospital infection led to tube removal & BFN
2nd ICSI 05, - Bristol, 2 ETs, BFP...m/c 6 days after
3rd ICSI 06 - Bristol, not good response, 1 ET, BFN
Went down Adoption route rest of 06....pulled out after being my SIL's birth partner!!!
4th ICSI 07 Bristol, - 2 ET, BFP...m/c 8 days later.
Tried old addage 'new job, new house, new baby' and moved 200 miles to more stressfull but 'fulfilling' career move!!!
5th ICSI, ARGC  Feb 2011 BFN
2011 looking into adoption again....
start 2012 not knowing where to turn,...


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## Salad4 (Feb 16, 2008)

Having started the whole attempting to conceive and treatment journey with naively high hopes, I am now beginning to consider that it may not happen for me.  I can really relate to some of the feelings that you have all described and haven't yet got my head around what I should (could) do next.  And my age doesn't help.
It isn't fair is it?


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## Bottle5 (Nov 9, 2010)

Hi salad....nope it 'aint fair!! We all know the 'common sense' stuff about a child is a gift, not a right...theres life after childlessness blah, blah! But you know what...Im starting to really understand that the fears I always had about 'what if it doesnt work, what if, what if..' have actually become my reality. I dont think more tx will work - although Im scared to give up; I know life will go on for me and you can find a quality and happy life, but it will never ever go away...i hate being childless...i want to be a mummy.

I feel your pain and anger!


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## latestarter (Apr 1, 2007)

Thanks for starting this thread Kat - after getting yet another BFN I was desperately searching for something on FF that I could relate to after all these years of bad luck.  I have steered clear of FF for the last couple of years as it seems that so many people I originally posted with have all moved on with successful pregnancies....like the rest of you ladies I had anticipated being one of those too.  Again, I really didn't want to end up posting on the 'moving on' thread - still not sure I can face the thought of giving up the dream of having my own baby to carry inside me for 9 months - but after 6 failures what else can I do.........


Bottle, I feel just the same - I'm terrified of what now - I don't honestly believe tx is going to work, but I don't want to give up on it either.  
I am so so sick of being childless too.  I am so sick of attending weddings, knowing that there will be yet another happy pregnancy announcement to contend with in the near future.  I am so sick of being the only sibling without grandchildren for my Dad - he would say it makes no difference, but his actions show his preference for family life.  


All your posts made me so sad for us all.  We just want something so normal and natural and the constant failure and disappointment is too cruel.  It seems unimaginable that we can't get our turn for baby happiness.  I used to have an optimistic outlook on life but now I am realising that baby dreams don't come true.  Again, I thought that if you keep trying for long enough things will work out but they don't, you just watch them working out for others and end up jealous and unable to be part of the big exclusive club that is motherhood.


I am so sorry that we are on this thread but so glad to find others who feel the same way.  I feel so lonely - thank you for being there.x


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## mamabear3 (Feb 17, 2012)

Hello lovely ladies. Reading your posts breaks my heart, I truly know how you all feel. I currently doing a medicated FET cycle but I'm seriously wondering if this will be last tx as I'm 41 this year.
This is my 6th lot of treatment but 1st since 2005. This is because I was so lucky to get BFP on 5th attempt and had my little boy in 2006. The full story is to long and painful but the truly tragic and life changing event was my precious darling boy died 2 weeks after his 3rd birthday.  
I'm really not sure whether the saying it is better to have loved and lost than never loved at all is right or not as my poor heart is truly broken and to be a mummy with no child is a heartbreaking state of affairs. 
I wish I could come up with some gem of wisdom to help us all, but unfortunately all I can offer is support and kindness.
Love and hugs to you all xxx


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## Salad4 (Feb 16, 2008)

Hi MamaBear3
Best of luck for the FET - I hope it is successful for you - you sound to have had a rough ride of it.
Sally


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## mamabear3 (Feb 17, 2012)

Thank you Sally, today is a difficult one but it's nearly over.  

Hope everyone is ok.

Sarah x


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

Wow, so many new posts to read from new names   . I´m in hospital again at the moment and I´m a bit low on energy reserves but I´ll be back to read about you all as soon as I can. I´m guessing that you are all in need of a   though since you are in this board.


I really only popped on to leave   and   for all of you since I guess today is a bit of a toughie. I´m an expat abroad so only just discovered is mothers day today and I do wholeheartedly hope you have escaped it as well as I have.


Take care of yourselves and be kind to yourselves too, 
Love Katxxx


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