# Create Clinic vs Lister - Any experiences??



## EllsBee (Feb 8, 2012)

Hi 

I'm new to this message posting. Just wondered if anyone had any experiences at the Create Clinic in London. I'm 43 just had a salpingectomy at the Lister. I had a consultation at the Lister but they are recommending full drug IVF cycle which is really expensive. Create offer a natural cycle at much more reasonable rates, plus I don't fancy my chances with the drug protocol, apparently women my age don't respond that well? Any experiences, thoughts or input would be most welcome. 

Thank you.


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## dips (Jul 19, 2011)

Hi EllsBee,

I had 2 cycles in 2010 at the Woking Nuffield and am moving to Create for my next cycle. I do not have any experience of Lister so cannot comment on that...but I really like Create's philosophy of not stuffing ur body with drugs unnecessarily and instead trying to get the most from limited or no drugs... Hence I decided to go with them...I have also gathered that this approach is best suited for older women and poor responders.

Create also offer a 3D scan which not many other clinics do and that helped me know that I have a septate uterus instead of a bicorneate (as diagnosed by our dear NHS  ) ....they use this scan to have a good look inside and see if there could be any potential problems before they begin your treatment... Depending on various factors, Dr. Geeta will be able to say whether u can try natural or mild IVF.

If you have any more questions or need more convincing, I would suggest u go to one of their open days where Dr. Geeta gives a detailed talk about what they do and also offers a 5 min free consultation to each couple at the end of it...might help u make up ur mind 

Good luck with whatever u decide, feel free to PM me anytime if u wish to talk  xxx


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## henriettta (May 8, 2010)

I have been to both with no success unfortunately  I did three rounds of full ivf with Lister and found them pretty good but despite producing good quality embryos they didn't stick.
I didn't want to have any more drugs so tried Create. Their scans were great and very detailed, and of course they are cheaper and less of the drugs but the natural  cycle can be a bit more complicated. I  had  two cancelled cycles due to the egg not being big enough when I had a sudden LH surge in the afternoon on the way home after my scan, or hormone levels not being right. I  then went on for two  cycles where I had egg retrievals which are done under light sedation and you are awake very quickly so quite a different experience to the Lister, although I found both fine. One was natural assisted cycle where you have very minimal gonal f and some cetrotide to stop ovulation. the second was completely natural and the only thing you have is a tablet which is actually a pain killer but which also delays ovulation.
Actually for my fully natural cycle  I had to have the retrieval with no sedation as the tablet to stop you ovulation the  night before made me vomit all night as I have a sensitive stomach, and so they couldn't give me sedation when I got there. The team were really fantastic and looked after me really well to get me through it.  First one was no fertilisation and second was abnormal fertilisation. I am now 46, was 45 at the time last year and hadn't started at the Lister until age 44. I have given up now as too exhausting making all the endless trips down to London from the North for scans and retrievals but you can do it every month if you wish with natural cycles.
Let me know if you have any more questions about either, but both were good in different ways.


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## Lil Elvis (Dec 31, 2009)

Hi EllsBee,

My friend was 41 when she went to create after finding that the more heavily medicated cycles didn't work for her. she now has a 9 month old. ladies react differently to the meds and it obviously worked for her. By that time I had given up on my own eggs and was already pregnant with DE as I am classed as a 'bad responder' - great FSH/AMH, loads of follicles but even a bucket-load of menopur and gonal-f wouldn't get them to 'pop'.

Go for a consultation, but be prepared for the 'pep-talk' about donor eggs as each year past 40 makes an own-egg cycle less likely.

Good luck and I hope that you have success.

Caroline


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## finlay foxy (May 31, 2006)

I just wanted to say, i went to the lister and the ARGC, which resulted in 2 babies. I was 41 on my last cycle and got 33 eggs (without ohss). As we know in this game your fertility is luck. Just because you are 43, it doesn't mean you will be a poor responder. If i was you, i would have all the tests done and go with the advise of the doctors. if they think you will be a poor responder then go with Create. If not, i think it's a numbers game. If you get 10 eggs at our age, it gives you a higher chance of getting pregnant, than 2 naturally.  Good Luck. . . .and don't give up!


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## EllsBee (Feb 8, 2012)

*finley foxy * - *Lil Elvis*  - Thank you so much for you responses and advice - really, very much appreciated. So good to know that there are people out there going through similar experiences and having to work through dilemmas and are there to help and provide input, advice & positive encouragement- it really helps.    

xx


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## daisyg (Jan 7, 2004)

Good advice above.

I would always choose the Lister first because at 43 you need a clinic with long experience treating women your age and with better results than Create TBH.

Also, the Lister will be much more helpful when it comes to essential testing to eliminate causes of ivf failure which I believe are absolutely essential.

At 43, chances of a live birth at either Create or Lister are very low as you know, but you need to have a good chance with OE at a top clinic in order to decide how to proceed.

Chromosomally abnormal embryos are likely to be the most common cause of failure BUT if you have any other issues you may not only fail with OE ivf but also with DE so it is worth having at least level 1 tests.

Your GP can do many of these for free and the Lister will help with the rest.

Uterine issues - polyps, fibroids etc
DH sperm 
Have you and DH been karyotyped for genetic issues?

Thyroid - have you had this tested?  TSH, T3, T4 and Antithyroid antibodies.  TSH needs to be between 1&2.  Problems with thyroid are a common cause of infertility.

Clotting disorders.

Infection - you and DH.

Autoimmune and immune issues.

I got pregnant on every OE ivf between ages 44 and 45 and miscarried every pg.  Then moved to DE and miscarried 3 more pgs until I was diagnosed with clotting and autoimmun issues which could have been treated and allowed me a baby with own eggs.

Basically, I would always choose Lister over Create.  Create's live birth rates at 43 are not especially good IMHO.

Don't forget that it is your hormone profile and drug protocol that determine how you respond and the Lister will give you a better indication of where you are in order to decide what you next step is.

Best of luck,
Daisy
xxxx


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## urbangirl (Jul 28, 2010)

Lister.


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## Millie M (May 11, 2008)

I would recommed the Lister. I've had all my ivf treatment with them so don't have anything with which to compare them but have been really impressed with my treatment and am a medic so have some inside knowledge.
I would particularly recommed Dr Parikh and Dr Wren for their high level of knowledge and honest but sensitive way of communication.
I really hope that things have gone well for you but if not please don't give up hope. Have you tried electroacupuncture with Zita West? Their research data seems to suggest that it really makes a difference and I had it on all my positive cycles.
Wishing you all the best.
Millie x


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## Millie M (May 11, 2008)

Just for clarity - I was 40 at my last FET.
Mills x


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## EllsBee (Feb 8, 2012)

Great - thanks for the feedback and advice.  xx


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