# Poor Responder....part 2



## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

New home

Happy chatting


Good luck & take care 
Natasha


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Jo - last cycle I ate only organic, had acu every week, didn't drink, no caffeine (including chocolate), got down to my ideal weight, high protein and still had a BFN... this time its wine and take away all the way.. never know may help!!  When are you off again?  You a S/W too!  What field?  How exciting we can talk about fair access to care!

Nicki - you get your Inhib results back yet?

Roozi - How ou doing honeY??

KJ  - ha!!!  housework!!  Glad to see your not just bobbing about in the pool today!


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hmmmmm....

http://www.haveababy.com/infert/ncivfwho.asp?site=

/links


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

evening chapettes, (and social workers!)

hope you're all fine. 

Nicki, i'm sorry too about the wicked witch.   Booooo!   Hope you'r feeling a bit less PMT ridden now anyway - it's your fave tV prog. tomorrow night isn't it, so at least you've got that to look forward to!    Have you got any provisional dates yet for next lot of tx or still up in the air with test results?  

Hey LB, you've got a profile!! So what prompted that? I tried to put a tickery thing on mine the other day, chose a lovely worm and a snail to do the biz, but it totally failed - thought i was reasonably PC literate but obviously not.  

Lister looks interesting, just had a look at thir web site. If UCH tries any funny business with me next week and aren't keen to offer IVF, (i've just got this niggling feeling they'll try to push me towards IUI and i'm really not interested as i don't know a single person who it's worked for) i might give them a ring and see what gives. I know my rights!!!! Us poor responders ain't gonna take any ****!!  It's as simple as that. 

Still no bloody results. Am getting nervous about them now..   When i called up yesterday to get them they said a nurse would call me back but now today they've told me i'll have to wait to discuss them with the doc on Monday, v frustrating.   

Right, off to beddy-byes now - totally whacked tonight for some reason.

Nite all.
R.
xx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

forgot to say LB, i had a look at your natural IVF link - are you thinking about that at this stage? Does sound like it could be a  good option for poorer responders, and quite nice not to have to feel so grotty injecting all those hormones..

also, just saw that my last post got edited - i wrote the "sh*t" word and it got replaced with "poop"!!


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Rooz- Poop!!   I don't know what I'm thinking of doing to be honest!!
someone pmed me and told me I should do a signiture, especially as I keep going to other boards and asking for advice.

What went wrong with the ticker.. I can do one!! just cut and paste the weird number thing at the bottom of the ticker and paste where your signiture is!  That make sense?


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

!! Yeh, poop indeed. Makes me sound like i'm from the US of A!!  

Thanks for ticker advice - will try again when feeling clever. Supposed to be tucked up in bed now - but been posting on other threads here again!

Glad you've got your signature now - bet you feel good coming out of the closit don't you?!  Just wait 'til i get that FSH test result - it's proudly going straight up there !!!

R. x


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Morning Girls

Really bored at work today.  Weather not too nice again so no pool for me again.  Didnt bother with housework yesterday had a little snooze instead!!!

Just waiting for AF to arrive now.  Its due around 7 May and I am usually very regular so I dont expect it to be early/late.  Am looking forward to starting next session as I feel it gives me something to focus on and look forward to.  Was going to change my diet and start eating healthy but to be honest I dont think it makes much difference.  Will definitely give up the alcohol though so I had better get some drinking in this weekend!!

Going DR's on Monday to have lump cut out of leg, am quite looking forward to it actually.  God am I a sadist??

Got a big Army function coming up next week.  Its my first one without my DH as I am going with my work.  Dont think he is too impressed but I am actually quite looking forward to it.  Think the big bandage on my leg is going to spoil the posh frock look though!!

God I am talking rubbish now - cant you tell I am bored!!

Anyway speak to you all soon
Take care
Kerry


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Morning all,

LB - I'm with you all the way with the wine and take aways during tx - I'm convinced all the healthy eating etc makes not one jot of difference! Only thing I will do is continue to cut out the caffiene, as i've seen so much research supporting the view that it does affect fertility! Oh, and I'm having full fat milk and ice cream, following the recent news that it helps ovulatory problems (but maybe that's just an excuse to scoff...)

I'm not currently practising as a SW anymore as I work in SW education now at the local university. My SW background is in mental health and adults. Can't tell you how much I would luuurrrrrvvvve to chat about fair Access to care though............(!)

Roozie - how frustrating about your blood results! Still, this time next week we'll both have more of an idea where we stand. And I don't blame you for wanting to hold out for IVF rather than IUI. I haven't heard of anyone getting a BFP with IUI either... At my last consultation my dr suggested that if we only get 2 follies again next time we convert to IUI. I'm not keen, as that's giving up really as far as I'm concerned. And god knows, my eggs are very rare therefore precious, so surely I should do all I can to get any fertilised?!! Hmmmppphhhh.

LB - have you found a clinic in the UK that will do natural IVF? DP and I did question why we bothered with all the blooming drugs and stimms last time to produce just one egg, when naturally I would do that monthly with no help..... Sounds worth considering doesn't it?

Kerry - hope you enjoy the 'do' in yer posh frock. How the other half live - me sat here in my jim jams, trying to find the energy to go for a run ....

Jo xxxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi Girls
Glad you have come out of the closet LB (nearly wrote cupboard then - am sure that's a good place to hide too!   )  I do read the other poor responder thread too - they are very high tech and knowledgable!    Not like us!
KJ sorry weather not quite warm enough for you! Roll on May 7th.
Flooz and Jo - good luck on blood results.    Floo - you are right about where I will be at 8pm tonight!  
I have booked appt for hysteroscopy next Wed am   Am hoping to do it without sedation but we will see what the man in charge says.  
Got all next week off on A/L.  Should start pill on day 15 then which is May 8th.
 
nicks


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

hi girls,

well I have been doing more investigating today, spoke to Bourne Hall, i've scrubbed them off for me, but still a possibility for if we use my sis, they do sperm sharing and knock of 3K from the bill.

Spoke to CREATE in london about nat IVF, lady thought i was  a good candidate as been preg before and went through it in more detail, i like that idea.

Been trying to get more info on NOtts protocol, its called antagonist protocol and hard to find stuff on the net about it.  As its new all the stuff is in 'doctor' type language.  I don't quite get what they do but they get a few high qualty eggs rather than tryong to get lots of eggs.

Nikki - I was flicking through and saw alan titmarch and thought of you!!    Yeah I have posted on the other thread.... they are very knowledgeable!  Lucky you. A/L!  i love not working!  

KJ - he he!! posh frock and bandage!  

Jo - yeah i like the sound of nat ivf, they also do light stimualtion where you produce 2 eggs (i only get 4 on the highest dose!!!).  Actually alot of the clinics do it but don't advertise it.  But ones that are promoting it are midlands health centre and Create in london which is affiliated with the London fertility centre which has great stats, they do the EC and transfer, CREATE just to the consult and scans.  

So i am completely torn between notts and CREATE.  open day for notts is in June, both have 6-8 week wait for consult.  thinking maybe should book the consults now?

So can't decide... what do you girls think?  NOtts will prob be 4-5K for one cycle and CREATE is about 1.5K per cycle after initial consult.  You can do Nat IVF every month, they reccommend doing for 3 consequtive months at least to be equiv to a full cycle.

So want to make a choice and get started.  

XX


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

evening all,

Lb, you've been a busy bee - you're more worthy of my buzzy bee today than i am !!

It's a tough one making that kind of decision isn't it?   I've had a quick look at Create before (when i was thinkig the worst and loooking at donor eggs) and they do look good. The idea of treating our ovaries a bit more kindly appeals to me - i've kind of got this image of mine being a bit fragile and lazy, groaning at the sight of an ampule of puregon. So going the natural route, to me, sounds a nicer option in many ways. Obviously you want to feel you're maximising your chances in whatever you choose to do and the stats they give you for natural aren't great compared to stimmed IVF but i s'pose if you think about it, those stats are pretty irrelevant when you're in the minority % that doesn't repond well to drugs because we don't have that average 30-40% chance each cycle. So who knows, natural could even increase our chances by being less harsh and coaxing just one or two much better quality eggs out to do the biz...?? And a mere 1.5K versus 5K to boot! (if it works)

Oh i dont know, then again Notts sounds like a good option too - esp. if they're really tailoring to us stubborn responders, although more journeying and so perhaps more stressful actually during tx Not much help am I LB? Sorry ! 
but I'll see if i can find anything else on te antagonist thing that you mentioned. 

Nicki - so did Gardener's.World hit the spot tonight?! Good you've got a week to yourself now.. tho' i'm sure having a hysteroscopy isn't the most enjoyable thing you want to be doing so you'll have to have plenty of other treats and DH spoiling to make up for it.   Hope that all goes ok anyway - i've never had one -  is it just to check for general uterus health before your next cycle starts?

Jo - so we both get to hear about results next week. Bring it on...!! Will just be good to get those out of the way, whatever they show, tho' hopefully nothing too sinister. I  just found out that other girls at UCH who went up for their OST test last week were offered a dummy ET and hycosy appt. at that OST appt. So i'm feeling a bit left out given i wasn't offered one - and i'm obviously now even more convinced it's because they're doubtful they want to suggest another IVF cycle for me (in case i muck up their great stats!!)    Well,  if they don't, it might have to be clinic number 3 in 3 months!

KJ - glad to hear the weather isn't fantastic out there all the time...that would just be too unfair!!  I hope your leg op. goes ok next week - at least you can concentrate on the tx once that's over with, and not too long to go now before you start...

Off to catch the end of a film i started watching earlier - The Dreamers. Anyone seen it? I was watching it on my own earlier while DH was out and felt like a bit of a perv during the racier scenes!!! Can't decide if the French guy (forgotten his name, but seen him in another really awful, pervie film, "Ma Mere") is good looking or not??

R xx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi girls,

Just popping quickly as just off to Notts to visits the inlaws. I'll be back tom eve but DP is staying up there for a few days!

But exciting stuff...  Notts just called and they have a spot free on the open day 2nd May!! So I have to drive back up to Notts on Tue eve (so long as I can book wed off work).  

So feling quite excited that by the end of the week I will have a consult booked with either CREATE or Notts!  CREAT don't do open eves so I said I would print out all the info for nat IVF and then thurs we can look through that and make a decision about which we will go with!  

Oh I LOVE having a plan!!

XXXX


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi all!  
LB - good news about open day!  I'm sure you will find a place that will suit you.  It does sound like you stimmed too fast last time and i'm sure you have the potential to do better.    Its worth a try  
Rooz and Jo - hope blood results come back this week!  I might phone for my repeat FSH later in the week (the one that was free rather than £95!   )
Looking forward to getting hysteroscopy out of the way  
Annual leave tomorrow   Going to Shrewsbury to buy some new running shoes (Ya boo sucks Zita!   ) as mine have got a hole in.  Unfortunately not from running too much but from a bad fit!  
Been forgetting my folic for a few days as a miniature protest   Anyone else do that?  At least didn't throw them across the room as I would normally do!  
KJ   
Enjoy your night guys.

Nicks


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Nicki - ha!!!! I exactly the same, I have shoved the expensive pre-natal's right at the back of the cupboard!  Lucky you off tomorrow, I've got an early start!

Hi girls, hope you all had a good weekend, can't beleive its back to work tomorrow!!!


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi guys,

just a quickie..hope you all had good weekends - seemed to fly by this one 

LB, sounds v +ve on the open day front... your research is hopefully starting to pay off!    I'm sure once you've been there and got a feel for them you'll find it easier to decide what's right re. next steps... i hope so anyway. 

Nicks, enjoy your week off.... massacist tho', i hate running!! Will be thinking of you for the hysteroscopy, hope it all goes fine.  

Am off up to London tomorrow for the dreaded results.. just want to get on with it now and hear what they have to say so i can move on to doing something more +ve.

Jo, got my fingers crossed for you too... i think you said Tuesday??

Hi to KJ (how's the tan coming along?)... good luck gain with your leg op.  

R. xx


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Morning girlies,

LB - good news about the 'plan'!!! Sounds like it's all coming together.

Nikki - I LOVED the   to Zita re. running! I run too, and before my last cycle checked that the clinic were happy for me to continue it through tx - they were and I did. But many people have said to me I shouldn't have because it can result in a poor response (which I did of course have). Although the clinic are adamant that the running had nothing to dowith the fact that I didn't produce any eggs, I do wonder, and have been considering cutting out the running for the next tx cycle...What are your thoughts on it?

Roozie - good luck today getting your test results. i have everything crossed for you. yes, I hopefully get mine tomorrow, but I expect they won't be bcck and i'll spend the rest of the week chasing them....

better do some work - catch up with you all later,
jo xxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Hi Girls

Just a quick one today.  Just got back from Dr's.  Was very disappointed cause couldnt watch him do the leg op.  He showed me what he had cut away and showed me the stitches before he covered them up!!

Hurts a bit now the anaesthetic has worn off.  DH has put his back out and cant move so, so much for him fetching and carrying for me whilst I am off my feet!!

Good luck LB with your open day.

Hi everyone else.

Speak soon
Take care
Kerry
xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

KJ - sounds gory!   Hope it wasn't anything nasty.  Rest up  
Jo Mac - I think running will only effect fertility if you really go for it and your BMI is low - hence stopping ovulation.  I am no where near that stage   
People will always find a reason why exercise is bad..........I am still trying to lose the extra kilo's i put on last time from all the lounging and fat milk   I will deffo be running until 2WW then i might stop but hey ho Zita i might not!    Bought some new shoes today anyway, Saucony. The best news being they fit really well but sadly are not pink.  Have sore throat today though so may wait til tomorrow for testing them.  
Gotta go my mum's on her way and haven't finished hoovering!  
 
N Dubs


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

mmmm, thanks Nikki - my BMI is nowhere near too low either - and I'm also still trying to lose the 10lbs I put on with my last tx cycle... ho hum....

Roozie - any news yet hun? Hope it went ok.

Jo xxx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hello my lovelies.

KJ - ohhh poor you... hope that leg gets better soon!!  No swimming in that pool for the time being!

JO - I honestly think that running, standing on your head, bungey jumping, scuba diving makes no difference!!  If you fancy a jog have one (I quite like the excuse to not do anythin during treatment personally!!)

Rozi - let us know the bloods!!  Was it ovarian reserve we are waiting for?

Nicki - are we waiting on bloods for you too?  I had sore throat over the weekend, maybe you caught it from me?!

Well my research is continuing, i've been emeiling Dr Sher!!!  You can do it through his website, you can have a free 1/2 hour phone consult with him too!!  They also give you back a percentage of your IVF fees (based on your prognosis, so about 1% for me!!  ) back.  Which is good.  But they are based in Las Vegas, well all over america actually.  But I just emailed him to say can I have treatment at Notts if I have a phone consult with him, as he works there sometimes too!

Also my appointment at Brts which was July I complained and they have had a cancellation at the end of the month! See hard core moaning does pay off!!

XXXXX


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi all,

afraid i'm not a v happy floozy today.  OST results yesterday were not good, and confirmed the worst, namely they don't think further IVF will really help because all the indicators (AMH only 9, FSH was 8 tho' surprisingly which i thought was good but antral follicles were only 5) show that my supply of eggs is pretty crap and i'm unlikely to get more than 3 or 4. I thought that was enough to at least have a bash at it, and i still believe it is, but the cons. thinks they probably wouldn't withstand being fertilised or if they did would be crap quality hence we're best going for another method where egg intervention is less. So he's advised we really have 2 choices - neither have v good odds but are better than nothing i guess.
First one, which he is in favour of, is have one final fling at stimmed tx doing GIFT, where they'd put me on max stimms, (Mix of Menopur and Clomid)  no D/Ring at all, scan days 7/9/11 and if all looks good, get me in for EC, remove the eggs, check they're ok and while i'm still under G.A, put 3 back into my fallopian tubes (via laporoscopy) mixed up with DH's sperm. He reckons they would probably fertilise but would obviously never know if they implant or not. Odds of success he thinks could be 15-20% versus only about 1-2% for IVF.
The other alternative is just IUI, but that'll give us less info as to whether i even get any eggs from the follies and what their quality is like - at least GIFT will give us more answers. Can't start for another few weeks tho' - they insist on doing a hycosy D6-10 before the cycle month so looking at 6 wks before stimming. 

Sorry for such a long winded explanation, but you did ask how it went! 

Jo - have you heard anything yet?? Got all crossed fro you hun'. Was it just the result you were getting over the 'phone or have you had an actual fact to face?  

Nicki, you all set for tomorrow - hope it goes well and you've been managing to relax a bit in the glorious sun the last coupla' days.  

LB, you'll be at your open eve this eve, so hope it was informative and you're on your way to making that decision...??   If you do end up going with Dr Sher, you've got to have it out in Vegas, much more glam than Notts!   Can play the slots & sunbathe in the desert to take your mind off it all.. what could be better?

KJ - glad you've still got your leg!!

Take care all,
R xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi rooz!
Sorry you results weren't great  Is AMH of 9 really that bad? I thought some people had <1 levels. Your FSH is OK too. I would do some research on GIFT though as i am sure I read in NICE guidelines that it wasn't really a beneficial treatment and not recommended. Surely your eggs and sperm would do just as well in a petri dish and you could pick out the best. GIFT isn't very technical and I wouldn't have thought the success rate would be great, in fact isn't that what essentially is happening every month anyway in your tubes?? Also it involves laparoscopy and general anaesthesia which in themselves are just added risks for you. Have you had a full IVF cycle yet anyway because without that you don't even know if your eggs fertilise normally with your DH sperm. At least you would get a bit of info on this if you did IVF. It just sounds a very strange approach to me, I haven't heard of anyone else being told this and we are all pretty similar. I never had AMH done, my inhibin B was 70. did you have that measured? See what everyone else thinks..... I will try and look up what i read for you.  
My hysto is postponed til 11th May now as Con has gone to Nigeria following a bereavement. Am really down about it, irritable and tearful. Just can't stand this hanging around just getting older.  
Nicks


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Just to add after having another look - it does say that tests of ovarian reserve are of 'limited value', no evidence for inhibin B and not recommended (that cost me ££££!) and GIFT no evidence that it is any value compared to IVF.    I wouldn't limit your chances due to some blood tests that don't always tell the truth hun, so don't read too much into it and don't be down.  Get searching - i bet there are loads out there who managed it with your test results.  It may not be first time lucky but hey ho we are in the special gang  
Love N x


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Hi again,
Oh N, i'm so sorry you've been dicked about ( i wonder if that'll get edited to " male member-ed" )with your appt. How frustrating for you. Look on the bright side - always easy to do when it's not you i know - but yo ucan use this week to do nicer stuff without that getting in the way - you might feel generally a bit more +ve after that. I hope so.  Although i hate it,('cos i;m a lazy moo) running is excellent for relieving stress so get wearing those fancy new shoes in and go for some marathon runs!

Re. the GIFT - all v good points and ones i wish i'd pressed the doc on a bit more than i did but was kind of bamboozled at the time i think.  He was just so dismissive of the chance we'd have with IVF ,and said from experience, people like us were having such low success rates so they turned to using GIFT & that had generally improved outcomes. But as you say, i will research it some more, and ask someone on another thread (who apparently did it and got a BFP at UCH) why they were recommened it over IVF. It's all so bloody confusing isn't it? Your point about not even knowing whether DH's sperm can fertilise my eggs, is a really good one  - think i might ring the clinic and ask to speak to someone about that. Will let you know whsat they say.

R xx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

just checking.. "dicked" is still there!!


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Sorry to hear your news Rooz.  I am sort of in a similar position.  My FSH was 12 and my first IVF was abandoned due to lack of response and on my second go I only produced 5 decent eggs.  However all went on to fertilise and 2 really good ones were put back in.  BUt unfortunately they just didnt stick.

My DR has advised me that chances of success of IVF are less than 20% but unfortunately I have no other options as both my tubes are blocked and DR in Cyprus does not do egg donation.

I am due to start another session of IVF next week and as the time is getting nearer I am getting very nervous as its such a long roller coaster journey.  Not looking forward to the mood swings and tearful moments.  I hate the thought of putting all that crap into my body but needs must I suppose.

Anyway on a brighter note the weather is picking up again, might be having a BBQ on Friday and inviting some people over (it will be my last drinking sessoin in a while and I intend to make the most of it)!  Got my "do" tomorrow night which I am looking forward to.

My leg is still pretty sore and I am dying to take the dressing off to have a peak at it.  Having a bath yesterday was a nightmare trying not to get it wet.

Speak soon everyone
Take care
Kerry
xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi guys!
A bit of sun will get your leg healed in no time KJ   I know what you mean about the fear of starting IVF again.  I think its the big 'what if it doesn't work this time....'  
At my last clinic i was told 25% for the first go and then after that went all wrong then 10%.  I know therefore if it ever happens it might take a few goes.  Not sure what my chances are on a different protocol - each time is different.  It does help being on this thread though with people who are going through the same thing   
Rooz - I presume if you were told you had a 10 % chance you would still go for it.  I think some Consultants want to be realistic so as not to offer false hope, but a small chance is a chance as far as i can see.  I haven't tried to post too many rude words on the main thread but in a PM (where i think you should be un-edited!) if you put spaces between the letters it works!  
LB - hope the open day was good   
About to call work and book 11th May off.  At least now i get a day off for it rather than in my annual leave.  Off out to lunch with DH in a bit!   
Jo Mac - any news?  
Love Nicks


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

Hi all,

Rooz - i too have had bad news. My AMH is 0.7, so in the 'very low / undetectable' fertility category. The consultant said there's little point in trying again, but it's up to me. I can't face going through another failed cycle and wasting all that money again, so I'm not going to. But Rooz - if mine was 9 I think it might be worth having another go?

I'm gutted. I can't believe that, at the age of 36 I've left it too late and now have no fertility left.

jo xx


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

Hello there,

I am another poor responder and am going to request a AMH. Is it a blood test and if so what day of your cycle is it done on?

Thanks

Pam x


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Jo - I am sorry to hear that hun.  Think about what you are going to do for a bit     I know someone at the moment whose level is lower than yours who is giving it another go.  Don't beat yourself up for 'having left it too late' , none of us know what is in store for us.  Life is incredibly cruel sometimes  
Hi Pam i think i have spoken to you before.  I haven't had my AMH done and I am going to cycle again and see what happens.  I think it is only worth doing if you really think it will help you make a decision to NOT try again.  Everyone on this thread has a lower than normal chance we already know that.  
Wish we had some happy news girls     
talk soon
N


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

Roozie and Jo - very sorry to read your results were bad. I have not had any of these tests but assume with my response to my two IVF's that I am in a similar position. I am not sure if there is any other reason for a poor response to the drugs other than our ovaries are older than our actual age.

Jo I am 40 and can't believe how stupid I have been to have left it until I was 38 to try and TTC. I can understand how devastated you must be at just 36 to feel it is too late. I have to keep telling myself that it is pointless to think like this as I can't go back and change things and I also keep telling myself that if the worst happens and I remain childless it won't always feel this bad and it will get better. Sometimes it helps.

Pam x


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Blinkin internet - just lost my post!  Trying to be really positive but now the mad axe woman feeling has taken over.  Argh!!!!!!!!   
Pam - will you try again??  
KJ - we need some good news so all hopes pinned on you for next time girl  
LB - waiting to hear some good stuff from you dude  
Going away this weekend to help DH with garden on his development.  I passed my gardening exam (Feb 21st - day of last BFN) with commendation   so am half way to having a qualification!
booked day off for hysto next week - at least it gives me a short week with the B/H.
Jo and Roozer    
Love ya  
N


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

I would like to try again Nicki but it depends on what the consultant says today. If he thinks we have a reasonable chance of getting 3/4 follicles then we will go for it. 

Pam x


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi everyone,

yes, some better news here would be welcome... 

Jo, i've just read your post and am truly sorry it wasn't the kind of result you were hoping for. But please try not to think about everything at once and panick yourself. OK, so we've all left it later than nature would ideally have liked to have a crack at this, but there are still chances and there are no definitive answers to any of this stuff. Had we all ttc 5 years ago or more it still may not have been straight forward, we just don't know. It may just be that hard core stimming isn't the right approach for some of us - but other options like soft IVF and (dare i say it..) IUI might be. Did you actually have a meeting with your consultant and did they categorically say it's not worth trying normal IVF again? They obviously have to give us cautiously realistic odds so, if like in my case, they're assuming odds of 15-20% at best or so, they are reluctant to recommend it given the ££££'s involved. But you are the patient and if you want to take those odds, that's surely your prerogative. There are plenty of clinics that will treat the likes of us with lower chances - Notts, Lister , etc. So maybe looking elsewhere could give you further options.
Sorry to go on here - you probably need some time to reflect but please don't despair - there are other things you can do before DE's come into the equation. I'm sending you big hugs for now anyway. (can't find the huggy faces but i am sending them)     

Hope everyone else is keeping well today? 
Nicks, glad you've got your date sorted out and like you say, every cloud ... only a 3 day week for you next week!   I'm well impressed you're so green fingered (officially too)  - fancy a trip to lovely  Basingstoke to sort out mine??   How are those shoes treating ya by the way??

LB, hope you've got some +ve news about your open eve.... 

Pam, hiya! The AMH i had done was on day 3 of my cycle - along with FSH & oestradial. It costs a bit more than the others and had to be sent off to Germany from our clinic (UCH) so you may as well enquire if you feel you want to know what your's is. 

KJ, hope you have a fun night tomorrow... get those drinks & partying in while you can!!    (ok, maybe not the dancing on your poorly pin but the alcohol should numb the pain!..) . Try not to feel too tense about starting tx again - do know exactly how you feel but you'll be in good company.

Right, enough floozy-ing on here. Better go and make an honest living.

take care girls, 

R xxx


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

Well wish I could lighten the thread with a bit of good news but its not looking good for me either.

Went for our follow up meeting yesterday. The consultant said he would not advise another cycle of IVF given my results and this was due to a low ovarian reserve. He said my % chances would be in the low single figures. He does not believe a change of drugs would give a greater yield of eggs. He did say that a SP ( I have had LP on my two tries) may give a greater number of eggs but not a greater chance of PG ie you may get more eggs but they will not necessarily fertilise and divide as well as eggs produced via the LP.

He talked about ED as a way forward and we had a bit of a discussion about waiting lists/ known donors. So I think I will start to test the water with DP. I didn't want to talk last night we said we would discuss it properly at the weekend. DP was genuinely shocked yesterday when the consultant recommended stopping treatment so maybe now is the right time to talk.

Given all that was said yesterday I still want to try again one last time with my eggs! Crazy I know but then I would think I had given it my all. On my first cycle I only had two follicles which gave two eggs and both fertilised into good grade eggs so in my head if I can at least get some eggs they are good ones! Obviously that is not the case and they are still older and statistically far less likely to lead to a PG. Anyway I asked the consultant would he be prepared to treat us if we wanted to try again. He said he would have to discuss it with his department and for us to ring next week

I would prefer to stay at this clinic as it is a small unit but has very good results and the staff are lovely and it is 15 minutes from where we live. I have thought about changing clinics but according to the HFEA 2005/6 there is not a huge difference in results in my age group ( except for the ARGC) and we would probably have to go through loads of tests again and then there is all the time off work and travelling.

Thanks for the welcome Rozzie

Pam x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hello chaps? Can I join?

I'm 34 and was at the Lister for egg share. All was well with the FSH et al, then I failed to respond. Turns out I have an AMH of 0.6.

BUT I'm going for it anyway - we've had dh's sperm frozen and waiting for well over a year now, so we'll give it a bash.

Seems like everyone's told something different when it comes to AMH results - I'd be over the moon with 9!!! My cons said they should be between 2.2 and 6.6, so I don't know where these higher numbers are coming from.
It's all so inconsistent and just adds to the misery and uncertainty.

ANYway, I'm sure once the test is less new they'll get a bit more clued up...


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi Miranda   - the numbers aren't always helpful are they?  anyway you can always defy them     Are you in the middle of a cycle now or was it cancelled?
Pam - Oh dear!    Glad you are maybe looking at other options.  I would say though that different consultants have different views on LP and SP.  My first one said same as yours - maybe get more eggs but preg rates the same.  Very negative but that was a place that did one protocol for everyone , not at all tailored, and I don't think that con was very interested.  Second one said, LP has higher oestrogen levels which may be detrimental to egg quality.  I am going to give it a go.  Also it might be worth checking out DHEA - has helped improve egg quality in women of 'our age'!  I've had no side effects so you might have nothing to lose.  Its a tough one for you if you like the clinic and a real bonus that its close to home.  good luck in your decision.  
Off to Stroud for weekend, back Sunday night though.
Love to all
Nicks


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

Thanks Nicki - I don't know anything about DHEA, is this something your consultant recommended? 

Hello Miranda - I've only been here a few days and already learnt loads

Have a good weekend everyone I am going to try very hard not to log on again until Tuesday and forget this TTC for a while.

Pam x


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi girls,

Wow lots of activity on here!!!

I will try to life all of your moods!!  Notts were really positive.  They have a new protocol which I can pm any of you if you want it (although I can't understan it).  Basically they say that SP is not great for producing good quality eggs due to the high LH (or something), so they give you a very detailed drug plan that chances frequently throughout the cycle to produce a few good quality eggs.

The Dr from America that has developed it is Mr Sher, you can post him on his website (type SIRM into google) and go to discussion borad and the 'mosaic' clinic which is las vegus, and you can post your situation and Mr Sher actaully answers your post!!  You can also send him your medical notes and have a free 1/2 consult on the phone!  

They are now doing his protocol at Notts but it works out about 6K due to the amount of drugs involved.  

Jo - sorry you got bad news, I don't know that much about AMH I have the inhibin B, but Kateyl had a really low AMH too and she is 31 week preg now! Sure she would be happy for you to PM her, I think hers was about 1. XXXXX

Hello newbies and welcome.

Hello Rooz, Nicki, KJ!!  

Ok I'm back to the nurse my cold in bed, trust me to get ill at a bank hol! XX


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi girls,

just before i go out (floozying to be done!!) wanted to wish you all happy bank hols. I know the news hasn't been the best on here this week so here's to hoping for some better over the days to come.  

Miranda, good to have you here... i like your spirit girl! You go for it... we'll all be joining you in various forms.  

LB. glad the Notts thing was productive... that link sounds really interesting. A freee opinion can't be bad so think i might pick Drt Sher's brains about GIFT. Thanks for that.. hope you don't go down with a cold too heavily. I've been sneezing a bit the last coupl a' days but hasn't developed into anything full blow so you may get off lightly. Just get munching those yummy vitamin tabs!

Nicks - hope you're having a lovely romantic wkend with DH ?!  

Pam, sorry to hear about your latest news but encouraging to know you can still get 2 decent eggs from only 2 follies. I hope your clinic will agree to support you further if that's the path you decide to go with, otherwise, at least you've got other options to consider. Good luck for next wk anyway. x

Jo - hope you're ok and feeling a little less down after your news. As you can see, you're definitely not alone with the AMH thing....something will work out for you.

Hi KJ, hope the hangover isn't too minging tomorrow!!!  

talk to you all next week,

Annie x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Thanks for all your messages!

I love this site...   

Nicks - I was in the middle of a cycle looking to share my eggs when they found I didn't respond so well - I had one massive egg and some dots on my scan and it stayed that way even though they upped my meds.
So they cancelled my cycle, then I had to wait for two AFs until having the AMH so all the hormones were out of my system. I spoke to the consultant Monday and she told me the awful result, but said it was still possible, so I've been kept on the pill until my scan on Tuesday.
Then if my womb lining is ok it's all systems go - be about three weeks to egg collection - thank God! Feel like I've waited so long to get going.

While the chances aren't great, at least I'll have given it a shot I reckon. It may be that one egg is just gagging to get fertilised and turn into twins!

Roozie, hope you had a good floozie! And I hope everyone has a better week than last - we deserve it!

xx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Afternoon Girls

Well my AF came today so I will be sticking pins into myself tonight!!  I must admit that I am really nervous about starting another session.  I think now I know how devastating it is to get a BFN I just cant bear to think of feeling like that again.

Well my Army do was fantastic.  It was really posh.  I was the only civilian there.  Didnt know which knives to use, had men opening doors for me and pulling out my chair.  It was ace I loved it.  DH was not impressed and we ended up having a massive argument and he threw my mobile phone and it smashed everywhere!!  Gutted cause lost all of my photos and videos off it.  MEN!!!!!!!!!!

BBQ was great as well but it was the day after so I was feeling extremely ropey and ended up not drinking anything.

Leg still really sore having stitches out Tuesday cant wait.

Anyway better go.

Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Awww, Kerry! Tell him he's being an ****!
Funny things, chaps - don't like it when others treat you better than they do!

With cutlery it's outside in, but you prob know that! It's bloody fish knives that seem pointless to me!

I love a posh do - makes you feel all special.

xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hello girls!   
Back from my weekend! No romance Rooz! Not really a holiday - have been working all day Sat and Sun landscaping the garden at the house DH is doing up.  Garden looks fab now though and in true property developer style hardly spent any money!  All plants salvaged, recycled, split up etc.  Had to leave DH down there though as his car has broken down (I was in mine) so Billy no mates again tonight.  
KJ do you start stimming straight away then on day 1?  Not sure how SP works.  How fab that you are going again.  Glad 'do' was good.  My DH holds his cutlery backwards and he's not left handed!  -can't take him anywhere.   Sorry about mobile   
Pam - hope you have had a fab weekend.    My first consultant mentioned DHEA to me but there is not enought evidence for its use so I made my own judgement and decided I had nothing to lose.  There has only been one 'trial' and a couple of reports about its use.  There is some info at www.centerforhumanreprod.com
LB - good to have you back.  Sorry you are feeling poorly.  Good news on Notts.  I had read Dr Sher's idea's on the internet - about the flare bit of SP not being great due to the LH bit.  Are you deffo going to go there?  How does it work cycling a long way from home?  I don't know if I could do that.
Miranda - you just didn't want to share your eggs hun!     I am about to start the pill for 3 weeks before my next go.  Hopefully straight after hysteroscopy on Fri   
Enjoy your BH Monday - isn't it going to rain (my newly planted garden needs it!)
 
Nickster


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

That's just the thing - I really, really did want to share my eggs! It seemed so much easier and less pressure if someone else could get pg as well!
I have to shoulder it all now - with my one ruddy egg!!!!  

It's raining down here - not much, but enough to give the plants a little drink - it takes me half an hour to water it all, as so many of my plants are so new, so hurl it down! Please?

But just over night - got more to plant tomorrow. I had a bash with seeds this year, and while the lettuces, rocket and radishes seem ok all I can grow flower-wise is marigolds! The morning glory's not bad, but only five of the packet have done anything.

This DHEA - can you get it over the counter?

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi Mirra! Have you got a new garden then?   Let's do a rain dance!     You order it on the net - comes from the states - feel like some kind of drug dealer!!
Must go and look up LB's friend's story (low AMH) for a bit of positive thinking   

N Dub


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hello girls... I'm drunk... hic!!

Hope you all ok. XXX


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

ello ello!    

Nicks, you have been a v busy green fingered girlie, (and not even time for a romantic fumble in some weeds to something?) and so have you Miranda! Making me feel v ashamed that my little patch of garden is in such a state of neglect   I can't even get the grass to grow properly at the mo - it's all kind of bare and a bit diseased looking with loads of little worm casty type things in it. Any tips? (my mum reckoned daddy long leg larvae??)

Funnily enough Miranda, I was gonna ask NW the same question about DHEA - i went into Holland & Barrett today and they didn't have a clue what it was. So that would explain it if it's an internet thingy. I did buy some spirulina though - supposed to be v high protein & egg friendly. One of the girls on another thread really recommended it and it doesn't seem too expensive (about a fiver for 60 capsules, tho'  when i got it home i realised you're meant to take 3 twice a day so maybe not quite such a bargain after all!!  )

OK girls, have a good bank hol Monday those of you that are floozying about. 
KJ, sort your DH out, sounds like he's being a bit of a green eyed monster! (must mean he loves you lots tho'!)
LB, you feeling any better hun'?
Jo and Pam - hope you're both feeling OK.  
DH trying to get me to go to Thorpe Park with him as a late birthday treat for him!!! Big kids or what?   Will report back if i survive Stealth!!

R xx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Ach, it's old but it's new really! We moved in last year and I got really depressed as the only thing showing was a couple of rancid daffs, colour-wise! I've been planting and planting though - my arum lilies are looking fabulous in the new pond!
It was an old person's garden, with swathes of heather and evergreens and nothing glam, so I'm trying to rectify that. Nothing as posh as landscaping, but Freecycle's helping me to get odds and sods to make it look nice.
Open gardens in June, so hopefully I can get it looking nice enough for that!

It's been so dry, Roozie, that my lawn looks like Beckham's new hairdo! So you're not alone.

Hmmn, spirulina might be worth a shot then. How much is DHEA? Any ideas?

Laura, what are you drinking? Is it my round?

Nicks - have you got a link to LB's story? the low AMH one? I could do with a bit of cheering up! Honestly, when I got the news last Monday I broke out in hives for the first time ever, and they're still not gone - need some PMA!

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi girls
Mirra - read kateyl's posts - her AMH was around three I think and she only had 2 embies to put back.  Nice to hear a positive story!    do you open your garden in the national gardens scheme then?  We live in a 1970's cul de sac and most of the gardens here are full of rockerys and heather - just like in the 70's! 
LB hope cold is a bit better this am.  You aren't missing a day of hot   though so don't worry.
K - when is your first scan dude?  Hope things are growing as we speak.  
Flooz - they prob are worm casts!!  Lawns are hard work  
DHEA i think is about £20/25 for about 3 months worth.........
Better go and get up now - still here in my jim jams!   
Nickster


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Same with us! 1972 these bungalows were built. No, we're only doing the village's annual open gardens thing - it's certainly not enough to open on its own!
I'll have a squint at kateyl's - thanks! Could do with a lift today.

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi girls! 
How is everyone??
KJ - how goes it with the stabbing?  Any signs yet?   
Car has leaked diesel all over the drive so i've been up the garage today.   They can't fix it til Monday.  Am sure its something to do with the last job they did - fuel pump.  Don't trust garages!
Read something on a thread about a trial for DHEA - they are looking to see if it might increase AMH.   
LB - made any decisions yet?  Or is your head still spinning  
Hi to everyone else  
nicks


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Hi Girls

Well I have been injecting for 3 days now.  I dont really have any signs except I am absolutely knackered all of the time.  Last time I had really bad back ache so I am waiting for that to come along then I will know that something is happening.  I have my first scan tomorrow and am not expecting anything cause at my first scan last time there was nothing.

Had a nightmare on the first day.  DH was getting injection ready and it snapped and went everywhere.  Dr had only given me anough Puregon for the 3 days so I didnt have enough.  Had to do a mercy dash to hospital yesterday to pick some up.  I was so lucky that the Dr was there.

Went and bought myself a new spangly phone yesterday.  It cost £160!!  Don't care!  If DH hadnt have broke the other one I wouldnt have needed to get one!!

Well I had better go.  I will post tomorrow and let you know how my scan goes.

Take care
Kerry
xxx


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

hello all!

Thanks for all your kind thoughts and wishes - i really appreciate it.

Miranda and Pamela - nice to meet you. I'm so sorry that you've both had such a torrid time - it's an awful business this isn't it, at least when it all goes tits up like it does for us lot.....(wonder if 'tits' will be censored to 'breasts up' - not quite the same ring, is it?!)

Miranda - my consultant recommended DHEA and 75mg asprin daily to increase response to drugs - no definate evidence that either help, but she thought it was worth a go. DHEA seems to be easily available on the internet - just google it, and it doesn't seem too expensive. 

Re. AMH tests - mine was sent to the Doctors Laboratory in London (my clinic is in Bristol) and it cost £95.

My clinic is happy for me to go again if I want to , and the consultant even pointed out that some people with unfavourable hormone levels get pg. However, I've done quite a lot of research into AMH and I have quite a lot of faith in the results. It doesn't fluctuate the same as FSH and LH levels, and you can have it done on any day of your cycle as it remains constant too - my consultant wasn't aware of this until I told her!
But we've decided to move onto donor eggs probably as we only have a finite amount of money and i don't want to risk another £4000 when my chances are now less than 1% per cycle with my own eggs.
However, I was interested in Miranda's (or was it Pamela?) comment that they have had to wait for 2 AF's before doing the AMH test to make sure the drugs were out of your system. I wasn't aware of this (nor my consultant, obviously), and my test was less than 6 weeks after I finished tx. I wonder how much difference it makes. The Dr was hugely surprised by my results as my FSH is consistently low, so the two results didn't marry.....mmmmm.

LB - great to hear about the positive news from Notts. Have you decided what you'll do? Are you still p****d!!! talking of which, it must be time for a glass of wine or two......

Kerry - I had to laugh at your DH chucking your mobile on the floor in a row. Men! Honestly! It just sounded like me and my DP, who has just gone off in a huff cos I said the wrong thing AGAIN!! Good luck with your scan tomorrow hun, us poor responders know how scary they can be....

Hi Nikki - hope you're ok too - thanks for your kind words.

You've all made me feel a lot better, and a lot less like the most barren woman in the country - I can't believe I've come across someone else whose AMH is under 1 too. I'm so sorry for you though, that sounded really heartless......

much love - off to find that bottle now,
joxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hey Jo!

Well my AMH is lower than yours despite having an FSH of 4.3. It looks like I'm having the menopause at 34 - how ruddy marvellous! But I have to give it a shot with my own eggs - it's taken a long time to get this far so I'm buggered if I'm turning back now!

Hum. Whether to try the DHEA or not... I'm happy with the aspirin, just don't know about the DHEA at all.

If it doesn't work, hey ho I guess.

At the mo I'm waiting for auntie to show before starting the Clomid, so I'll join you in that drinkie! We bloody deserve it gorls, we really, really do.

Jo, what clinic are you at?

xxxx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hey everyone,

happy Wednesday to you all   Where's all the lovely sunshine gone...hate this pooey weather!  

Jo, so have you definitely decided not to try again with own eggs? I'm guessing you're also in an area where you get feck all help with funding from your LHA. Us too. We have to be 36 (here in Hants) before we qualify for any, by which time, my chances of conceiving will be even smaller. It's absolutely crazy. So i can totally understand where you're coming from on deciding to go for the option that yields the best odds, although it's obviously an incredibly difficult choice to make still. My DH is quite anti the whole GIFT idea, as they've only given odds of about 15%, (which i still think is worthwhile) given with DE's chances are possibly higher than 50%, (all else being equal). 
Do you think you will ask for an AMH re-test? I wonder if the timing did make much of a difference? It's not exactly impressive that your doc knew so little about it..can you switch or is it tricky?

Nicks - you all set for Friday? Hope it goes OK. 

LB, i had a look at the Sher institute in Vegas but couldn't see the link to emailing him personally for a freebie consultation. Am i being dense?  Are you any further forward with your deliberations now? 

Miranda - i'm also unsure about the DHEA. Maybe worth a go? Think i'll try the aspirin too as Jo was recommended. God, the pile of pill bottles is now taking up a whole kitchen surface!! Worst ones i've been trying to munch but not really getting along with, are the spirulina, they're little devils,   really rough around the edges and you can feel them slowly dragging down the inside of your oesophagus - so i'd recommend the powder form if you were thinking of taking that one too!


KJ, glad you've got off the ground OK with your cycle. Good luck with the scan, tho' as you said, probably best not to expect to see too much that early on. Does your SP involve any Buserelin at all or is it simply stimms all the way? Do they give you something else to prevent early ovulation then?

Pammy - how you doing today? Any more news/decisions your end or are you still trying to switch off from it all for a bit?

Right, time for some trashy TV i think - and of course a big glass of vino. 
Take care everyone,
Rooz. xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Yep - peeing down here Rooz    and the same for the weekend.  All the plants at DH's property will love it and they have put down turf today so rain is ideal!  
Jo Mac - I've no knowledge of when to check AMH levels.  Maybe you should get it re-checked (after DHEA?!) its a big decision to make on one blood test.  good luck to you whatever you do hun  
Kj - new funky phone  - fab!!  just what a girl needs   hope scan all OK tomorrow - you might do even better this time remember!   
Miranda - I don't know anything about aspirin to get better eggs?  does that mean you take it before stimming?  I can't take it anyway due to reflux   I am hard pushed most of the time to have a glass of wine   
LB - hello young friend - any news??  when you moving to Derbyshire?
Property Ladder and Grand Design tonight girls! - Sorry KJ -not you in cyprus   
Love to everyone  
NW


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Jo mac and Mirra - you need to get your signatures done girls and come out of the closet!  Just ask Laura, she came out only a few weeks ago!


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi girls,

Wow lots of activity again!  

Jo - thats a huge decision, but like you I have only infinate money and I am battling not only with my body clock with my sisters too!  She turns 35 in Nov and thats the cut off for egg donating.    i ordered a book on donor conception from amozon so will let you know if its any good.  My issues are I don't think its fair to knowingly bring a baby into the world and for it not to be able to trace its biological family, but that measn this country, which means that the donor has fertility problems herself!?  I actually want to be selfish and go abroad and have a baby and worry about all the other stuff later.    Lots to think about but we will all be here to help you through. XX

KJ - how exciting, can't believe your cycling again.  Wish I could get going. I got terrible back ache too with my go that I got eggs.     come on follies!!!

Nicki - how you doing treacle?  the move to Derby is not going well, DH can't get a job and has been offered a promotion here (hopefuly) so looks like we will be staying here. Still I guess its cheap and I have a well paid job (compaired to what I'd get in derby anyway) which can pay for  more drugs!!    Oh and its the apprentice for me!

Rooz - if you go to the website, then to 'discussion board' then to 'mosaic - east - mr sher' you can post on there, they give free consults over the phone too.. although someone on another baord said her was very hard sell.  And the other consultants at SIRm are more patient friendly.  Let me know how you get on. XX

My head is still spinning and AF arrived yest so feeling a bit poorly and grumpy.  Wish I had a nice glass of wine! Maybe I should get some DHEA too??  MAy start back at acu next week, been poorly since i finished going, quite poss it has to do with too many hormones and stopping my multivit but i was really run down prior to starting my acu too so maybe there is something in it?


Anyway I've had a really long day so am off to bed. 

Night night, sleep tight. XX


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Hi Everyone

Just at work waiting to go and have my scan in one hour, cant really concentrate.

Rooz I dont use Burserin at all.  I did on my first try but it had to be abandoned cause I didnt respond at all.  I dont use anything to stop me ovulating.

I have a question that I am hoping one of you lovely ladies will be able to help me with.  I have been taking wheat germ for a couple of months now to try and lower my FSH.  Do I still keep taking now I am stimming?  If so when do I stop?  After EC or ET or do I still keep taking it during 2ww?

I will post again later on after I have been for my scan.

Speak soon
Kerry


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Good Luck Kerry!   
sorry don't know anything about wheatgerm but wouldn't think it could do anyharm - although if its for FSH you could probably ditch it now as you want lots of that!


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi girls,

just a quickie from me.. can hardly keep my eyes open tonight (early AF on her way me thinks) but just wanted to say good luck to *Nicks * for your hystero - thingy tomorrow  (d'you get to have the dildo cam at all??!! ), and to *KJ*, hope the scan looked ok today, and that you weren't _too_ nervous - you're obviously bound to be a bit, that's completely normal given our previous experiences, ( know i will be when the time finally comes... feeling like it never will at the mo!) but fingers crossed you'll be ok.

Hi to everyone else here too... LB, (hope AF isn't be too much of a wicked old witch tonight! ) Mirra, Jo, Pam.... hope you gals are all doing OK.

take care all,

can't wait for my bed!

Rooz xx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Auntie's arriving for me too, Rooz, I think! Spent the evening sobbing and shagging, so she must be...

Kerry, the one thing that's making me feel more positive about this whole thing is no buserelin this time! God, that was awful. My hair and skin were dreadful! And didn't get back to normal for ages afterwards. My _teeth _ actually felt loose in my head, too!

Laura, are you sure that if your sis is a known donor there's a cut-off, age-wise?
I think if she's your chosen donor those rules don't apply, as you are voluntarily saying her eggs are ok by you?


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Evening AF girls!   
Mirra - sobbing and shagging  
Thanks for good luck messages!  Better sort out the old lady garden in the morning!  
Will let you know tomorrow how it went.  hopefully DH will cook tea - keep telling him I AM HAVING AN OPERATION!!
Love ya
N Dubs


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi Girlies..

Kerry - Well?  We need scan news?  Thining positive thigns and we are all here for you.   

Mira - You are funny!!  I will ask Bourne Hall about teh donor age thing on sat, I hope I have a bit of leway to use my sis without rushing myself.

Nicki - good luck tomorrow hon.. tell DH its a BIG operation and you musten'y do anything for a few days    Let us know as soon as your up and about and back to the comp. XXXX

Jo -   Hope your doing ok.

Just a little update with my high FSH mate (12) she got 16 eggs, 8 for her and her recipient and got 7 to blast, tested BFP today.  So we all have hope.  FSH obviously doesn't mean that much. 

Tired and head is still a bit of a spin, AF is being a good girl though thanks for asking! 

Friday tomorrow thank god.X


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Miracles do happen, don't they? Eggs aplenty, that! And a BFP. Sigh. But we'll get there.
And if I don't, we're going to do property developing instead, dh and I - got to have another dream in case this one shatters.

I wonder if DHEA would increase AMH? They need to get some answers on that I reckon - they'd sell a bundle if so!

Right, I'm off to bed - bit jaded after the S+S!  

Sleep well girlies!

xxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Morning girls

Well had scan yesterday and it was good news.  My lining was thickening fine and I had 3 tiny follicles developing (about 9mm).  I was really pleased with this until my DR said I was at about the same stage as last time but if I remember correctly on my first scan last time I didnt have anything developing.  Still waiting for my back ache to come on so I know for sure they are developing.  Have got to go for another scan on Monday and as of tomorrow got to start taking the Oralgatron as well (forgot that you have to start doing two injections a day).  How on earth could that have slipped my mind??

Still dont know what to do about the wheat germ.  Was a bit annoyed actually, I posted a thread on inbetween treatment asking if anyone knew the answer and I got an email telling me it had been deleted cause they didnt want to clog up the system.  Well that doesnt bloody help me does it!!!!

Nicki - good luck with your MASSIVE op today.  Let us know how it goes.

Laura - what fantastic news about your friend - there is hpoe for us afterall.

Right better get back to work.  You will all be pleased to know that its peeing down in Cyprus today with massive thunder storms!!

Speak soon
Kerry


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

Kerry - fingers crossed for Mondays scan. I know I will be sick with worry through the stimming next time.

Nicki - good look for today and I agree with the others you should milk it with DH and have yourself a nice little rest! Thanks for the DHEA info still can't make up my mind - have a huge urge to have no crap whatsoever in my body for a while but then it does look like it is worth a try.

Thanks to everyone else for a warm welcome. The clinic have said they are prepared to treat us again so we are going again on a short protocol sometime end of Aug/September. We have been given a low single figure chance of success but i just need to have one more try.

Have a great weekend  

Cheers

Pam x


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

I have come out! (signature wise, anyway...)

Miranda - hope you've recovered from all that sobbing and shagging! I find that the one thing that makes me feel better after sobbing is a good shag! I'm at Bristol for tx.

LB - I'm hoping to use a known donor who is also 35, and the clinic have said that the age isn't an issue, like Miranda said, it's up to us.....

Kerry - great news that the first scan was better than last time - i'll keep everything crossed for you for monday.

Pamela - I'm so pleased you can get on with another go..

Nikki - hope the op goes well.

Roozie  - hi, how u doing?

In a bit of a rush - will catch up at some point xxxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

What's with all the bloody shagging!!!!!!!!


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

They are all at it KJ!   
Hysto went well.  Felt sick all day though.  Will post more tomorrow.
Love ya
Nicks


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Kerry - I've not been shagging!!!  Not had any for weeks now!!  Not normally like that but I had some 'lady probs' and now AF... maybe I'll get some early next week!    9mm!! Thats not tiny!  I read somewhere that if they get past 7mm then they are on for being a big follie, as if under 7 they can shrink.  Come on follies!!!!

Nicki - Hope your ok and resting up. XXX

Jo - so who is your known donor?  A relative?  I'm off to Bourne Hall tom which is where we will do the donor cycle, so I will check with them about how long we can leave it, really be nice tohave a while so we don't have to rush through my treatments. X

Pam - great you have a plan! X

Miranda -   hope your rested now, let me know what you find about supplements,  should look into that too.

I got an email back from a place in Turkey and they do 2 different prots for poor responders... I will get back to you all with more details, they seem really professional and are only 1.5K per cycle and nice weather.

XXXXXXXXX


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Ladies, please!! We're going to get ourselves a reputation if we're not careful, what with all this S & S talk!!  

Glad to hear some more +ve news on this thread today... a nice change from last week. Everyone seems to be hatching plans which is cool.

KJ, congrats on some early follies. Am sending some big egg thoughts over to them. You back for another on Monday then?    

Nicks.. glad you survived the massive op!! Was your lady garden to their liking?? Made me crack up  - never heard it called that before. Hope you're not too sore anyway... remember to milk it girlfriend!. At least brekkie in bed all weekend and massages on request.

Jo, wow, sounds as tho' you've been doing some serious thinking about DE's - the age thing's interesting. Not having researched it at all, I'd just pretty much assumed that if the donor is > 35, we're not allowed to receive their eggs but i'm obviously wrong. That might change things a bit for me too then... my sis is 39 and has had no problem having 2 babies, one v recently - she did make noises about donating a while back if it ever came to that, but we kind of dismissed it thinking she's too old. I also found/find the idea of a baby being biologically hers and DH's v hard to get my head around but it's food for thought. So do you know if the age thing is at the clinic's discretion then? Or is it OK anywhere if it's a private arrangement?

Mirra - has AF come to stay yet properly? Or is S&S still the order of the day?! My auntie's not quite committing yet.. just popping her head round the door and disappearing again. V annoying as i want to get on with it so i can get my hycosy out the way before tx can start.

Pam, totally understand wanting to have another go. Glad the clinic have been fine about it - but so they should! Hopefully you can relax a bit now and get all healthy for it in Aug/Sep, now you know what you're doing.

Have a good wkend all... hope the rain sods off for a bit - off to try and buy a motorbike and don't fancy getting soaked!

Rooz x


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

oh, laura, just remembered.. thanks for that Dr Sher link. The poor guy, he gets about 100 mails a day -  how does he ever get time to do his job?Anyway, I emailed him asking him what he though about my GIFT diagnosis, and sure enough he replied within a few hours. He just said GIFT is antiquated, only really has a place when there are religious considerarions, and has its importance in history. So not quite what i wanted to hear, but i guess it confirms he isn't a fan and probabaly wouldn't have prescribed it for me either!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Yes Rooz, AF is here! So that means I start on the Clomid tomorrow, then the Menopur on Sunday. All systems go!
SO looking forward to the Menopur - I felt so benign on it last time. Things that would normally really razz me off I was like, 'yeah yeah...'
But as I say, crack would be cheaper! It's an expensive high.

9mm follies sound great to me, KJ! If they're all the same size, that's great - when I was days into my drugs the last time I had one huge one and the others didn't grow at all, so I'm hoping for more than one.
Is K Jones a pseudonym? If not, what an auspicious name! Every time I read it I read 'cojones'!

Nicks, how's things after your gigantic op?

Hmmn, Turkey Laura? That sounds nice! Is that £1,500 for IVF? Or just the drugs protocol?

Jo, are you from Brizzle then? I'm in Dorset, so not far away.


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Miranda - the 1.5K is for IVF/ ICSI or blasts they play it by ear and don't charge for what you have its a flat rate and you get what you need.  They seem really professional and as you ay, bit of sunshine inbetween scans is nicer then rushing abck to work!!  You just pay drugs on top of that, and of course accomodation and flights.  Interesting you say about just one follie, I read they have to cheack you don't ahve a dominant follie prior to starting stimms as naturally you only produce one and if there is a dom one it sucks up all the drugs??!

Rooz - Yeah Mr Sher thought natural IVF was a waste of time too, also heard he gies 'his' protocols the hard sell.  I guess we need to go with our gut instincts.  Enjoy that menopur!

Nicki - hope your being nursed well X

Kerry - good luck for next scan.. bring on the back ache. X

Pam -  

I'm drunk again... hic! Watching a dvd now.

Nght girls X


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hmmmn, how would they check if you have a dominant follie before stimms?
That's interesting...

£1,500 is damn cheap! We'd have to pay to get the sperm flown out there too, though.


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi girls!! Look at the time!   that's what you get for sleeping all day   
My 'sedation' was fairly full on to say the least but I had iv Pethidine and that made me feel really sick all day   Hysto was normal though and the NW cervix was negotiated OK.  Have retroverted uterus so he said there is a big bend where it meets my cervix but at least he knows what direction to go in now.  Had no pain (just nausea!)  DH made me fishfingers for tea    I am on the pill now for 14 days and have clinic appt on 26 may.  Then I presume get AF and start Suprecur and Menopur.  Thought I was 'pilling' for 3 weeks so 14 days is good i have saved a week! 
Mirra - glad you are starting again    How many days to AF after last pill?
LB - turkey sounds good value, we should all just move out there for a bit!  
rooz - glad you got some info back from Dr Sher - typical it would be conflicting
Jo Mac - glad you have a donor sussed, that makes things alot easier.  Still think you should maybe have your bloods re-done?  
Pam - glad you are having another go - that will be here in no time.
Kerry - last but not least!  Great to hear about those follies.  Sure you are on the right track.  Lets hope this is the one.  
Talk soon girls - when you have all woken up!
nicks


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Morning Girls

Wat u doing up so early Nicki?  Whereabouts in the Midlands are you from?  I grew up in Birmingham and will probably settle there eventually.

Unfortunately Miranda, K Jones is not a pseudonym.  My name is Kerry Jones (married a Welsh man)!!

Still waiting for my back ache to arrive.  Start taking two injections today.  I will post on Monday after my next scan.

Take care
Kerry
xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

K - worked all around the midlands, lived in Brum for 6 years, now we live in a little South Staffs village.  Not too far from Wolverhampton but i try not to mention that  
Good luck with double jabs!  
Feeling a bit sick again now   so back watching telly with a blanket.
N Dubs


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## Pamela39 (Apr 6, 2006)

So glad I joined this thread I have learnt loads already.

Miranda - good luck with the stimulating. Have read on another site a poor responder being given clomid as well as Menopur this cycle. She is doing the best ever ( third IVF ) and has 4, 8 cell embryos and she wasn't going to do a third cycle as she had responded so badly in the prior two goes. Fingers crossed it does the trick for you too . How much Menopur are you on and how much clomid?

Kerry - it does sound very good having them all the same size. Like Miranda I ended up with one huge one and the others didn't develop.

Laura   I had a glass of wine last night yes just one and I was plastered! Also did something else last night we haven't done for ages 

Nicki - I bet you are glad it is over, make sure you take care of yourself. Have finally made my mind up about DHEA and I am going to give it a go. Where did you get yours from and what dose do you take?

Jo - great news you have a donor. I am just starting to get my head around this and if my next cycle fails I am going to ask my cousin. If she says no I am not sure what we will do I can't quite get my head around an anonymous donor yet.

Rooz - I am impressed. Over the last few years I have turned into a middle aged bore. I have turned from the girl who loved to socialise with a drink or ten and had in her time bungee jumped and skydived to a non drinking/ non smoking/ no caffiene etc etc champion vitiamin popper/ organic devotee - and you are off to buy a motorbike good on you girl!

Have a good weekend - off to book a holiday

Pam x


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Holiday sounds good Pam   Always need something to look forward to.   Where you thinking of going?
I got my DHEA from agestop.co.uk about £20-25 for 300  25mg tabs which is about 3 months supply.  I'm on my second lot now! I take 50mg in the morning and 25mg evening.  They do seem to help immune function as I haven't had a cold all over winter and i have felt very 'well' on them.

Nicks



/links


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Oooh, this DHEA sounds better by the day!

Pamela, I'm on 375 Menopur a day and 100mg Clomid. Hopefully it'll do the trick! I'm stopping drinking now, and hoping for the best - this is going to be our one and only try, as we can't afford £6,000-a-pop treatment.
My parents are paying for this one, which makes me feel pathetic  

STILL, got to look on the bright side!
I could be sitting here next year with twins!

If only we could get that woman psychic off the telly to tell us whether to go for it or not.

Nicki, I was at one point going to go to St Jude's - great name for a clinic, plus they're only round the corner from my sis in Finchfield.

What clinic is everyone else at?

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Really?  Small world!  Takes us about 7 mins to get to -much less stressful than driving to Brum (at least an hour)  
Fingers crossed on twins!  
N


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Is it lovely there? I had a feeling it would be, but at that stage I didn't pursue it and ended up at the Lister because of the egg sharing programme.
I've decided to stay though, as they're lovely there, too.


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## sazz (Jun 1, 2005)

Hi Ladies,
I'm a terminal lurker/v. occasional poster-hope you don't mind me poking my nose into your thread and asking s/t.I am also a v.poor responder (due to old age!) and started 3rd and final cycle last Sat. Found out today that I have 3 medium follies (16,15 and 14) and one giant greedy follie (25)  scoffing all the v. expensive Menopur.Can I ask your advice as to what normally happens in such a cycle? The dr said to keep on stimming until the others catch up.Has anyone had a + result/or even got to EC or ET with such a scenario?
Thanks alot
Sazz


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi Sazz and welcome!
I had a greedy one last time!    I thought it was the best one but on the last scan is was something like 29mm and I called it the duck egg!   It was too big in the end and didn't have an egg - don't know what happens to the egg? Fortunately I had others of a different size but they were alot smaller so I ended up with 3 eggs.  I suspect your 25mm one may be overcooked but hopefully the others will be fruitful and you will hopefully get 3  
Nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I think the egg gets re-absorbed, but I may be wrong. Of course, a follicle can contain one egg, or two, or none - gawd I hope mine will contain two each!!!

Sazz, I have heard positive stories for people in our situation, and three follies is really good going. Well done!
I would be over the moon with three, so you have a great chance there.

Anyone watching Eurovision? Or am I the only saddo?


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi girls just a qucik post.

I'm drunk (sorry!) but have read your  news and will post properly tom.

Been to Bourne Hall today, it was so nice, i really liked them.  Now I'm even more confused??!!  They even had home made cakes there!!! Does that help you conceive!!??  But what sold it to me was we were chatting to a consultant and told him about my history and I said about my sister being a donor and you kow what he said..... 'but you produced eggs and good quality embryo's you should concentrate on that not thinkings of a donor' I was beaming!!  So used to being shuved in the 'donor' egg category.

Anyway love to you all and I'll chat proper tom. XX


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Oh, how lovely! Someone with faith in your eggs is worth millions, isn't it?

Brilliant news, petal.

xx


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## sazz (Jun 1, 2005)

Miranda and Nicki,
Thnx so much for reply.I had no internet access for hours yesterday night/today so cldn't say thnx for the info. Am off for scan tommorrow so hopefuuly the midget follies have got bigger!!!(and the giant one hasn't.... )
Sazz


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Do let us know - I'm so nervous for my scan on Thursday it's unbelievable! I just so want more than one follicle - preferably a whole bunch, but I've been told that's unlikely.
I'll cross my ovaries your three have grown.
xx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Cross your ovaries??!!    Ouch!!

I doubt my old lady ovaries will manage that but I'll have fingers and toes crossed for both of you.XX

KJ - whens your next scan?  Must be tom?

Nicki - how are you, still feet up I hope.  

Can't believe its Monday again (well nearly).


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Good luck for scan Sazz   
Good luck for follies Mirra. Hope you are getting back into the swing of injections     Think it is true you were the only eurovision saddo   (this from the only gardeners world saddo!   )
You too KJ   well follies luck, not calling you a saddo!  
LB - You go for it girl with you own eggs   - even the best eggs don't succeed all the time.  Have you nearly visited / phone consulted all the places in the whole world yet?!     hope you are nearer a decision then you can get going again.  
Saved £260 by getting our HIV and Hep tests from the last clinic.  he he he!  Its only £3700 a go now and that includes all drugs ( of which I am going to bleed them dry   )
Love ya 

Niks


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Nicki - 3,700 a go thats not bad.  My estimates are all about 4.5-5K a go.  I guess I will be on the highest dose so costs a packet.

Nearly completed my quest, but not actually any closer to making a decision.  Except def going to book a consult at Bourne Hall, as they do sperm share!  So will knock 3K off the bill, they not great with poor responders though so they may be a contender for our donor cycle.  you can't get the 3K off treatment until a 6 month HIV check anyway so, wouldn't be eligible until next year, but guess we can get the sperm rolling into the bank!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Oooh, no - I too watch Gardener's World! Love it.
So... a double saddo?

Eurovision was terrible, as ever - why do I do it to myself?


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

I so need to abandon this thread!!  Please gardeners world on a friday night and euro on the sat ROOZI FLOOZI  come rescue me from these two!!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

The Apprentice? Is that better?
Ugly Betty?
They're my faves...
Don't leave!   I'll follow you and sing Bucks Fizz numbers...


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Oh Oh!!! Love them both!!    Think its the last UB next week?  I also watch ER although must admit its gone downhill since Dr Green and Carter left!  And Eastenders... god knows why!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I've watched EastEnders since the beginning, but i've had to switch off over the last year or so - I can't stand the endless misery!
And I feel so much for that poor doctor whenever I do see it - it's just too awful...

Is UB repeated? I keep missing episodes.


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

evening my lovelies! God, what a wet coupla' days it's been. Yuck.

You've all been chatter boxes this weekend... sounds like there's tons going on, KJ, Sazz (hiya by the way  ), Mirra, great that it's all getting going for you with scans happenning/about to happen the coming week.

Sazz, i so hope your big greedy one has calmed down a bit and the others are gettting their fair share of the drugs now! All crossed for you this week. 

KJ, will be thinking of you tomorrow and hoping for some more good follie news..c'mon c'mon, c'mon ....!

Mirra, i'm going to be on the same drugs combo as you, Clomid 100 + Menopur 375 so that's pretty handy, you can be my guinea pig!!  Let's pray the super cocktail does wonders for our eggies and we're pleasantly surprised. Hopefully it's just what they need to coax them out of their shells.. reckon ours were just a bit shy last time. Are you also just stimming then with no other drugs to surpress anything?

Nicks, glad the humungus op went well - i've heard that fish fingers are supposed to speed up recovery times (something to do with the combination of breadcrumbs and fish flakes) so DH obviously knows what he's about!  No but seriously, i hope you're feeling less sicky and sore now. Not long before you get stimming now that you're scoffing pills. Don't start mine for another couple of wks so trailing behind a bit. 

LB, i bet that made you feel great, what the cons. said. Wish someone would say that to me! So what _are_ you going to do now? Stimm at one, have E/C at another, ET at another..?!!

Pammie, how you doing this eve? So did you book somewhere sumptuous where you can forget about all this crap for a while?! Hope so! (anywhere you can do a couple of parachute jumps in case you get the urge?) DH an d I are going to try and do the same sometime soon, just tricky with tx coming up and all that. A week's glorious sun would be seriously welcome tho'....oh, bought a bike yesterday by teh way. Yippee!! Got to wait til Friday before i get my mitts on it tho'! Am quite excited.

Jo, how you doing hun'? Hope all's going Ok? Any more news your end?

Right girlies, bed time.

Hugs to all,
R xx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

LB and Mirra- just seen your posts while i was doing mine! Hmmn, Lb, have to side with you on the Gardener's World front - i really just don't get it. But then again, come and take a look at my diseased, worm ridden lawn and you'll see that's not necessarily a a good thing.  So, suppose i have to say respect to the green fingered ones!!

Easties is more up my street altho' as Mirra was saying, can make you feell ike ending it all!! Never watched Ugly betty but heard so many good things about it so perhaps shpould ditch Easties and watch that instread? Apprentice is fab too... they're all so up their own arses, it's great!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Rooz, yes, it sounds like we're on the exact same protocol! It's ok so far, but I've only had two days on the drugs. Thursday should be revealing!
I felt ill on the downregging drugs last time, so I'm glad not to have them again! Ugh.

I'll make a TV confession... I can't wait till Big Brother! I waste vast chunks of my life following that show.


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## sazz (Jun 1, 2005)

Hey ladies-just back from scan with good and bad news  !!!Good news is that greedy guzzler follie is obviously satiated with drugs (for now at least) and has stayed at the same size and the two medium follies have grown to 19 and 20.Bad news is that the littlest follie (14) has completely disappeared.Aaaagh!!!!I think I need to have a stern talking to my old lady ovaries-what is going on!!!
Thnx for all yr kind wishes-Roozie,Nicki and good luck for Thursday scan Miranda-am rooting for yr follies!!!!   
Sazz
p.s yr right Eastenders is terribly miserable-but am addicted!!!!


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Don't talk to me about bloody Eurovision.  I absolutely love it and the bloody Army decided this year that it wasnt going to show it on their rubbish channel so I didnt get to see it.  Apparently I didnt miss much but all the same I was not happy.  Went the pub and got plastered instead!!

A bit of sad news about my scan today.  Went there with all high hopes only to be told I have 2 follies on each ovary around 14/15mm.  My hospital will only do ec with a minimum of 4 follies so I have got no room for manouvre.  Have to go back Thursday and see if they have grown or not, might have to abandon.

Keeping my fingers crossed.  Have just done injections and must admit my heart has sort of gone out of it now.  But lets see what Thursday brings.

Love to you all
Take care
Kerry
xxx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Kerry - I think you are looking pretty god, your follies are all the same size which I think is a good thing.  I had mine really speaced out and feel that the big one was over cooked and the the little ones were soft boiled.. that is only my made up logic, may actually be a load of rubbish!  

Roozi  -I don't have a garden and would love one, I used to have an allotment, so maybe my felings towards gardeners world are based on pure jeolousy?? Nah... its just its FRIDAY NIGHT you should not be watching gardeners world, there is something just not right about it!!

Miranda - Ugly Betty is repeated on Sunday about 5pm incase you are out floozing on a Friday (or watching gardeners world).  What I hate about Eatsenders is the IVF dr who is completely mad, with her calender with the baby date on it and the nursery..... people always paint us IVF birds as completly nuts!! And we are not (I hope).  I feel like calling her up and suggesting donated eggs?? Surely a more sensible option than hounding and planning to steal your hubbies girlfriends baby??!!  Sorry that was a rant!

Ok, I'm getting confused about where everyone is at with tx.... whats this combination drug therapy You all know I need to know all treament options!!! And NO i'm not having my treatment, Ec and tranfer at different places... cheeky bunch!!

Anyway off to cook my tea now. XXX


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## Jo (Mar 22, 2002)

Kerry.
Just read your post and want to send you some positive vibes 

I too never respond very well, this time I had 5 follies that were slow to start with,had to stim for 16 days, in the end got 8 follies but 3 were small and the doc really said I only had 5 ready ones , I went on to have EC today and got 7 eggs  .

Try to stay positive and remember it only takes one 

Love Jo
x x x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Thanks for the good wishes Sazz! We'll get there, you and I. I felt my ovaries burn today, with all the drugs, so I hope that's a good sign. Repeat after me until we both believe it: It only takes one, It only takes one, It only takes one, It only takes one, It only takes one, It only takes one, It only takes one...

Why won't they go ahead with less than four, Kerry? Honestly, clinics are all so different it makes IF even more of a minefield than it is already.
You didn't miss much on Eurovision - there was only one country worse than us, and that was Ireland! So... pretty poor. Still, what do we expect when we reject Justin Hawkins in favour of Scootch?  

Laura, who says we aren't mad?   
Do you mean the combination of Clomid and Menopur, when you say combination drugs?
I'm on it because of my low AMH.

Jo - brilliant egg count! Were there more than one in a couple of the larger follies? Or did they manage to get an egg from the smaller ones?

xxxx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hi girls,

Well it's finally stopped raining here this eve thank goodness... even had a chance to go out and pull weeds from my lawn (& skewer some horrible fat worms while i was at it) - Nicks and Mirra i know you'll approve of that.  (sorry LB, not trying to make you jealous here!!...but believe me, if you saw my weedy, worm infested lawn you'd be glad not to have a garden!)

Kerry - don't lose heart. You're doing really well - it's obviously a pressure knowing you need to have 4 but you're on track for that if those follies continue on the way they are. Will they absolutely, definitely not do EC with 3 even if you plead? I would! xx  

Sazz - great news that you have 3 good sized follies, sounds promising you may get 3 lovely eggs. When's the second scan?

hope everyone else is doing ok tonight? Easties in half an hour - wey hey! LB, know where you're coming from with that silly Dr. cow! It's all so far fetched it's ridiculous, so hopefully don't think we're all quite seen in that light! 
Re. the drugs combo, Mirra is & I will be (in about a month) on the same mix of Clomid 100 and Menopur 375 to start with. So Mirra, i'm looking to you for inspiration that it's going to be a good'un! 

Rooz x


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## Jo (Mar 22, 2002)

I am not sure I didn't ask,  , I would think they got them out of the small ones as well  .

Good Luck everyone 

Love Jo
x x x


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Justa  quickie... trying to order some drugs... what strength DHEA should I get?  25 or 50mg?  Wheatgrass? What strength? Any recommendations for a particular website? 

Oh eastenders now!! I want Stacey and Bradley to get back together!

XX


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Gawd, I hope I get a million follicles, Rooz! I'm on the brazil nuts and pineapple already, together with goji berries and high-potency manuka honey. Cost a bloody fortune!

BUT I felt my ovaries burning hot today, a sure sign that the Menopur is doing something or other...

Have you been on Menopur before?
Last time I felt so blissed out it was untrue.

I saw a recommendation to take 75mg DHEA per day, but I don't know where that was. I feel like it's too late for this cycle to order some.  

xxxx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Yeah I was on Menopur last time, I had terrible back ache which I assume is is good thing.  He he i had the pineapple and brazil nuts last time!!


Ok I'll order the 25mg ones then can make up to whatever I need to take.  

XX


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## Jo Macmillan (Mar 19, 2007)

LB - I was recommended by my consultant to take:

50mg in the morning
25mg in the evening of the _micronised_ form of DHEA.

I was also told I needed to start taking it at least 3 months before tx as that's how long it takes to get into your system.

jo x


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi all!
Need to update my profile cos i am now 39!     Had lovely day though and lots of pressies.  DH is now cooking me special dinner!  
LB - I wouldn't worry about the micronised DHEA - you can't really get them here.  I did get some off a supplier on e bay but i didn't take them in the end cos they were just capsules that looked like you could put anything in them!
I never had backache stimming  
KJ - at least your 4 are the same size - i am sure you will be on track  
Is there a woman having IVF in Easters then?  I don't watch is anymore.
Jo!  7 eggs is really good - any more news?
Mirra - hope there are lots growing this time and its good news for you.  First scans can't come soon enough.  Never heard of Goji berries  
Flooz - you waiting for next AF to start then??
Jo macca   hello hun!
Mostly recovered from major op now    Having lots of little cramps though, don't know if this is normal after someone illegal has been inside your box!  Having reflux from hell too   Think cos they made me eat toast and then I slept all day (while tea and toast spent the day refluxing up and down).  Having bad pain all day now and had to double up on my tabs.  Hope settles down soon.  Was much better after my GA for EC.  This time was really heavy sedation - I slept nearly all day.  Think he needs a bit of re-training by a proper anaesthetist (me!) for a better short acting recipe!
Tea nearly ready! Pain goes when I eat thank goodness! 
Love Nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Happy birthday Nicks!
I'm not getting backache either! But my stomch's swollen after three lots of Menopur, and I can feel something going on with my ovaries - just hope it's good things and they aren't just about to explode!

Goji berries - look 'em up - they're meant to be a super super dooper food. You can get them from Julian Graves, they're not wondrous tasting but I've heard such good things I'm just going for broke.

Glad to hear you're being looked after, what with your op and your birthday and all - can you get him to keep it up?


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Just a quickie for Nicky!

   HAPPY BIRTHDAY NICKS!        

Hope your special supper was tasty!

Mirra, bit personal asking if Nick's DH can keep it up... i don't know!! 

Hope everyone else is keeping ok today, espec. you stimmers....rooting for you all KJ, Mirra and Sazz.  Go girls... 

Off to beddy-byes now.

Rooz. xx

PS. Nicks, are you really an anaesthetist?!?


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Well, can he?


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Just a quickie to wish Nicks a Happy Birthday!!!  Woo Hooo!!

And hope you stimming girlies are all filling up with lovely follies. 

I'm feeling glum again  X


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Don't feel glum! Go score some Menopur...

I am FAT with follies. That's what I'm telling myself anyway...


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

hiya everyone,

Mirra- so, you high as a kite yet??! I can't wait to start stimming then.. Puregon didn't really do it for me last time so i'm hoping that Menopur hits the spot. That's the way my girl - you WILL be fat with follies. Your scan's tomorrro wisn't it..? I've got fingers & toes crossed for you. xx 

LB, don't be too sad chucky hen. You're bound to have glum days, none of this is easy plus we get all the usual **** to deal with, don't we?! But hopefully we'll have the biggest smiles on our faces when all this comes good eventually. 

Nicks- hope the rest of your birthday was fun? DH hasn't given you food poisoning has he?!   So come o nthen, are you or aren't you an anaesthetist?!  That's far too grown up a kind of job to have!! Way too responsible! (not that you don't sounds responsible, just a little mad perhaps ) I'm afraid if you are, you're goin to have to answer my daft questions about having a G.A 'cos i'm a scaredy cat and really not looking forward to mine.  

R xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Yes rooz i am a gas man!    Fire away!
LB - don't be glum - all your research will pay off in the end.  I think it is harder to be positive when you haven't finalised your plan.   Your time will come hun!
Mirra - good luck for scan tomorrow   Will look up Goji's  
Sazz and KJ when are you next up??
Shame b day is over    It was really fab.  Only 364 days to go until 40!   
Nicks


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Just updated profile!  Old and proud (and now have toy boy!)


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Whoo! A toy boy? And yet, no surgery - how do you do it?  

Nicks - the gojis are a bit of a chore, to be honest! But they're meant to do all sorts...

The doc told me they'd be lucky to get two eggs out of me, but I'm praying for more. Roll on tomorrow at 11.45!
I am round as a round thing, so something's happening in there.

LB, what's going on with your treatment at the moment? 
Sorry if I'm being a wazzock and you've told your story a million times!

Rooz, I haven't got that 'anything will roll off me' feeling yet, that i got last time, but I'm hoping it'll be soon! I just feel pumped and pooped. But it can't be much longer till the Menopur does its magic. When do you start your Clomid/Menopur regime?

xx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Just watched The Apprentice.. excellent, that silly cow got fired, she was really annoying me. In fact they all do, Katy especially, hope she gets the boot next.(apologies if anyone here happens to be her best friend or something)

oh so fab Nicks, you are!! Gas man...  Is that how you refer to yourselves in the trade?  Ok, then, i'm going to fire i'm afraid. 
What are the risks when you have one? Why does everyone always say it's better not to have a G.A unless really necessary? Is it possible to still feel pain even when you're "under"? I remember watching this programme once about a woman who had one but could still feel everything throughout the op. but couldn't communicate this fact to anyone... horrendous, i've never forgotten that. Please make me feel better about it!

R xx

PS. So what do you call the gas man?


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Mirra, don't listen to those white coats, i mean what do they know? (hey Nicks?) You might be pleasantly surprised and get a few more eggs.. your roundness sounds promising anyway. Last time when i only had 3 tiny follies i felt no bloating whatsoever, and that's obviously why, 'cos now't was happenning    But i reckon you've got some good activity going on inside those ovaries of yours and some quality eggs ripening. Repeat your mantra after me:
FAT with follies, FAT with follies, FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies,FAT with follies..ok?

I don't start for a few weeks yet..got my hycosy on Monday just to check for pollips etc then start drugs at next AF, so about 3 1/2 wks time. I'm impatient as hell now, just want to get going with it. 

R x


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi girls,

Still feeling glum.    Tim is thinking the best way to cheer me up is by chasing me around and trying to give me a love bite!  

I've had GA and sedation, my sedation went wrong last time so I'm pretty scared about the next time. I had major surgery under GA and am amazed they can have all their hands inside my belly for hours and I not notice!!  I was a bit worried they would all look at my boobies so I wrote across them... 'perverts'!  (that was a joke!!).

Rooz- I'm praying for Tray next week... he drives me nuts!!

Miranda - Nothing!!  Thats whats going on with me!! Well to be precise I've just completed my research and awaiting my clinic notes.  I'm thinking sperm share at Bourne Hall, Nat IVF in London or Turkey.  Not decided, I have a consult at Barts in 2 weeks, will prob book a consult at Bourne Hall as even if we don't use it now, 3K off treatment will come in handy for a donor cycle in the future and they are really nice and give you home made cake!!  Once my notes are back I'm going to send them to Turkey, see what they say, they have a different protocols for poor responders and I think I should try something different.

As for scoring menopur I can do better... I work above a specialist addictions team and get offered most illegal drugs almost daily......   I have a whole box of menopur in the cupboard for emergency though!!

Nicks -  you gonna have a party next year?  Can we all come??  My 30th I had a surprise party and a FF turned up, felt a bit of a nerd when she told everyone we met in chat rooms!!  Sound like a right ole billy no mates!

Kerry - was it scan today?  

Jo - Hows things?? XX

Me


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Whoo! Can you imagine how you'd feel on Menopur mixed with a bit of smack?  
Gah, that glum feeling - I don't know how to beat it!
At least when you start you''ll begin to feel positive - I couldn't believe I would, but I do. Even if you believe, as i do, that this will never work, just to be on the drug protocol makes you feel more alive and doing something.

Tre drives me nuts too, but he was good at that task! Katie must go - I was begging for her to go this week! Her smug, sausagey lips.... Her pale, insipid eyes and horsey braying! Ugh. She's so backstabbing and up her own **** it's untrue.
Poor Giselle was stitched up royally, but more by the production team - Katie makes better telly.

I felt no bloating last time, when they downregged me before stimms, so i know it's different this time.
BUT it might be just my appendix about to burst or some other of my innards threatening to blow...
Sigh.
I'll know tomorrow - yay!

How old are you Laura? have you got lots of time to plan, then? I feel like I've got no time left, what with my AMH result. Or I might well look into the abroad thing.

xxxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Oh crap.  I taped Apprentice last night cause its on way to late over here in Cyprus and was going to watch it tonight!!  At least all I know is its a woman and not Kate!!  I bloody hate her as well.

Well I have my scan in just over an hour.  I have bene getting slight back ache but no where near as bad as last time.  Hoping beyond hope that my follies are growing or even multiplying!!

Hope you had a lovely birthday Nicki.

I will post again after my scan.
Wish me luck.
Kerry
xxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Been for my scan.  Still have 4 promising follies that are around 16mm in size.  Have a couple of really small ones as well.  Got to go for another scan on Saturday and if everything still on track I go for EC Monday or Tuesday.

This has really surprised me as I thought I had another week of stimming left (got my calculations totally wrong)!!

Dont really know what to think.  Trying to think positive but just dont know.

Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


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## sazz (Jun 1, 2005)

Ladies,hope all is going well with your follies .
Haven't posted b/c on last scan (on monday) dr said he could see only 2 follies, so was a bit down....
But-did actually get to egg collection yesterday and they found 4 follies containing 5 eggs!!!(The giant greedy 25mm guzzler had 2 eggs in-bless her!!!)
Anyway-of those 3 were mature and 2 (still waiting for no 3 slowcoach!!) fertilized.   Will hopefully be put back tommorrow.(ovaries crossed)
So ladies, obviously they can't see e/t on these scans and we should still stay positive   
luv to all,
Sazz
p.s. those menopur withdrawal symptoms are horrible-I felt so great while taking it!!!!!!


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Thats really good news Sazz.  Theres hope for me yet!!

I am the opposite I always feel ****ty taking all these drugs, and moody and ****** off and moody etc. etc. etc.

Anyway going to bingo tonight so that should cheer me up!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hey girls!
I got....wait for it....FOUR FOLLICLES!!!!!! That's double they thought they could get out of me, with an AMH of 0.6, so I'm made up.
There's three of about a centimetre and one of 14mm, so hopefully that will contain two, like Sazz's! There may even be more as time goes on - I'm crossing everything, anyway.

Sorry kerry, for spoiling the Apprentice! How annoying are we? I'll make sure not to discuss it next week till you've seen it.
Well done on your follies! We'll be known as the Four-Follie Fillies I think, on this board. The triple Fs! 

Sazz, I'm feeling for you, withdrawing from Menopur - it's good sh*t, man.  

xx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Thats really good Miranda I am really pleased for you.  When are they looking at doing EC?  Dont worry about the Apprentice I just watched it.  I thought she would go.  Hopefully its bye bye Kate next week!!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hopefully! She's driving me bats. You don't flirt with Sir Alan Sugar! Has no one told her that?

They didn't tell me when they were looking at EC - I'll ask on Monday, so I can warn my work to expect me to be absent.
You're the second to have asked that! Do they usually give you an EC date on the first scan after stimms?


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

No I thought you were further on than that.  To have follies of your size at this early stage is really good.  Well done you!!!


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hey follie girls!
KJ - looking good for you hun!    Keep growing.  
Mirra - you must feel so chuffed   i am glad you have defied you AMH result  
Sazz - how great to get 2 eggs out of your 'duck egg' you lucky thing - never knew that could happen.    Hope that last one does its stuff  
LB - did DH catch you and give you that love bite!    i already met my DH on the internet -so if you come to my party people really will worry. And why young lady are you planning my 40th when i have only just turned 39!  

Right then - the inside story on 'gassing'.  Quick GA for something like EC prob has less side effects than sedation cos in general drugs are much more 'clean' and modern and wear off quickly.  My drugs for hysto were old fashioned and long acting hence felt   all day (as i said i could have done better!).  However 'risk' would prob be slightly more for a GA mainly due to fact that your airway and breathing have to be looked after by someone else - so if they are rubbish (ie new unsupervised trainee), or you are difficult (ie anatomical abnormality of airway, extreme obesity) there could be a problem.  Its v unlikely for us having IF treatment as we are all fit young women!  You can react to pain under a GA by moving or heart rate/breathing increase but 
people don't remember as its more of a reflex.  Also if you breathe more you get more anaesthetic and will get deeper asleep so its kind of self limiting.  it would only be if you were paralysed and there was some kind of equipment failure that you potentially could be 'awake' but this is so rare as we monitor things extremely carefully.  No one is ever left for a moment unattended cos things can change in a split second eg a tube becoming disconnected - not good if you were in the toilet    Usually if something goes wrong it tends to have the potential to be major as airway and breathing are up there at the top of the list!  99% boredom, 1% blind panic as they say!  Hope i have reassured you all  
so glad everyone is doing so well 
nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Thanks Nicki! Yes, I do feel good at having beaten the odds. I guess they might all disappear by the next scan, but hopefully they contain two eggs each!

Kerry, I've been on stimms (375 menopur) for four days, and it's a lot better than last time. But then I had been downregged last time and on much lower stimms - 225 - for the first week.
I am trying to eat things to help them along - tons of brazils, for example! But I don't know how much help that really is.


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Here's the stuff on goji berries, from a website - it says it reverses infertility in women!!!

Ola Goji Benefits
Originating from one of the most remote, mountainous regions on earth, the Goji berry is most famously associated with extraordinary longevity. In places where the Goji berry is a dietary staple, life spans of over 100 years are fairly common.

The Goji berry’s nutritional profile is both unique and complex, leading to its reputation as one of the greatest nutritional plants on earth.

In all, there are reported to be 34 health benefits from the Goji berry. While many of these have been confirmed by rigorous scientific research, studies are still ongoing. However, we do know about some of the compounds behind these health claims. Goji contains the polysaccharide "Master Molecules" named LBP1, LBP2, LBP3, and LBP4. Goji contains the highest levels of these 4 molecules, plus all of the essential amino acids, high levels of several vitamins, and 21 trace minerals. Among the trace minerals found in Goji berries are some very uncommon trace nutrients such as germanium, rarely found in foods.

Below are the 34 health benefits associated with the Goji berry:

1. Extends life, protecting your body from premature aging through its powerful antioxidant action.

2. Increases your energy and strength, helping you fight disease.

3. Stimulates the secretion of HGH (human growth hormone), the "youth hormone." Improved levels of HGH can help you look and feel younger.

4. Maintains healthy blood pressure.

5. Reduces your risk of cancer.

6. Reduces LDL cholesterol.

7. Helps to regulate blood sugar in early adult-onset diabetes.

8. Enhances sexual function and treats sexual dysfunction.

9. Helps you lose weight when paired with diet and exercise.

10. Relieves headaches and dizziness.

11. Relieves insomnia and improves the quality of sleep.

12. Supports eye health and improves your vision, due in part to its extraordinarily high level of beta carotene.

13. Strengthens your heart.

14. Inhibits lipid peroxidation, a common cause of heart disease.

15. Improves disease resistance.

16. Improves immune response. (T-cell, IL-2, IgA, IgG)

17. Cancer treatment.

18. Restores and repairs the DNA strand, preventing mutations which may lead to cancer and other diseases.

19. Inhibits tumour growth.

20. Reduces the toxic effects of chemotherapy and radiation.

21. Builds strong blood, enhancing the production of red blood cells, white blood cells and platelets.

22. Improves lymphocyte count.

23. Activates anti-inflammatory enzymes.

24. Supports healthy liver function.

25. Treats menopausal symptoms.

26. Prevents morning sickness in the first trimester of pregnancy.

27. Improves fertility.

28. Strengthens your muscles and bones.

29. Supports normal kidney function.

30. Improves overall mental acuity.

31. Helps chronic dry cough.

32. Alleviates anxiety and stress.

33. Improves mood and helps relieve depression.

34. Improves weakened digestion.







As always, consult your doctor before using Goji or any other natural product to treat any condition. Goji has a long history of health benefits, though, and a body of research supports many of the Goji berry’s reported health benefits.





-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  



They are a very rich source of vitamin C, having 500 times more vitamin C per ounce than oranges, actually more almost any fruit you could name. They are also a superb source of vitamin A, not surprising because they are a really pretty red color. Goji berries also have vitamins B1, B2, B6, and E; they are becoming a famous antioxidant. They are also a rich source of both selenium and germanium and have hence been used in a number of clinical trials involving cancer patients. In Oriental medicine, they are said to correct chi deficiency, meaning that people with low energy, insomnia, heart palpitations, and even anxiety are more comfortable after consuming goji berries.

The therapeutic dosage is 10-30 grams per day, and the berries may be taken at any time and in any form, from liquid to a snack food. The berries have 18 amino acids (higher than bee pollen) and 21 trace minerals, linoleic acid, and more beta carotene than carrots

  Goji can reduce macular degeneration
  Goji can inhibit the body's production of LDL (lower colesterol)

Goji can improve the body's ability to fight off arthritis
  Goji has been shown to reverse infertility in women

Goji has been shown to reverse infertility in women
  Goji has been shown to increase virility in men

Goji has been shown to increase virility in men
  Goji has been shown to reduce chronic fatigue

Goji is a free radical antioxidant (helps with anti-aging)
  Goji contains as much vitamin C as lemons

Goji can reverse or reduce some neurological disease
  Goji has natural anti inflammatory properties

Goji has cancer preventitive properties. It is a tumor inhibitor
  Goji combined with LAK and IL-2 was shown to improve malignant melanoma regression

Goji was shown to improve lung cancer regression 



/links


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Bloody hell Miranda are you bored or something

You sound like you are on a similar regime to me.  I took 300ml Puregon for 3 days then 225 Menopur.  That is a massive dose of Menopur you are on there.  My Dr wont increase my dose, no matter how much I pleaded!!

On my first attempt I was down regging with Burserin but this had to be abandoned because I didnt respond at all.  My second attempt I was on this same regime and produced 5 eggs which all fertilised.

Right off to bed now.
Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Nah - not bored! I just wanted to see what benefits they offered, as they're a bit boring to eat, and hit upon that website - I only pasted it in, I didn't type it out!  
Didn't realise how long it was till I posted - sorry! Should have just put the link...

I hated the buserelin - yuk. Felt  . And no wonder, as it did bad things to you and me! I produced one big follicle and a few dots on that stuff.

Does he give a reason for not increasing your dose? Would you hyperstimulate?

xxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Yeah - bl**dy hell too Mirra!  Being a sceptical medic I wouldn't believe anything could have all those benefits!    And germanium?? I've never heard of that in many years of medicine or A level chemistry.  I'm going to google it and let you know!    Presume you are eating them in some dried form?   
Buserilin switched me off too   but was prescribed 450 meno.  Think when you get past 300 dose doesn't really make so much difference.
Just caught a chicken in the back garden (as you do)   trapped her in the greenhouse and got her in the cat basket, then drove 1 mile up the road and dropped her off in a field with lots of free rangers!!  Hope she was from there and not from one of my neighbours!  
Things I have to do when DH is away.
NW


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hey dude - think you should research how much germanium its got in it cos from what I read the conclusion is that its not very nice!

"Some organic forms of germanium, notably germanium lactate citrate, have also been shown to be severely toxic. The risk of contamination in putatively non-toxic forms of supplemental germanium outweighs any possible benefits, none of which, in any case, is yet well established."

"The Center For Food Safety and Applied Nutrition concluded: "Based on the evidence of persistent renal toxicity associated with germanium dioxide, the lack of conclusive findings of differential nephrotoxicity of organic germanium compounds, and the possibility of contamination of the organic germanium products with inorganic germanium, it is clear that germanium products present a potential human health hazard."

Um - I'll leave that with you Mirra!  ....................
N


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hee! Ok, ok, so you're not convinced.
The scanner told me today though, 'whatever you're doing, keep doing it', so that's what I will do!  

Awww, chicken! Could you not have kept her for eggs? Or do you need a cock for that, too?  
They're just chicken's periods, aren't they? So no cock required peut etre.

Gwan. Have some goji berries.


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Actually they are probably fine as they are a food so will only have natural levels in not like a supplement.     Yeah and they have worked a miracle too which is fab!!!     Go for it!  
Maybe the chuck was a fertililty sign for us girls!  
Nanight!
Nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Clucking away here!


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Good God chickens and cocks and geraniums!!!

Who knows what we are putting into our bodies with all these drugs, its quite scary really, one morning I am going to wake up with a full beard and chest hair!!

Dr wont increase my dose (and I must say I am gutted knowing what high doses everyone else is on) because EC was very difficult last time cause I have a kink in my womb and he is worried that if I over stimulate (as if that is ever going to happen) he wont be able to get them all out (or something like that)!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Surely the ones he can't get out would be reabsorbed into your body, or bled out?
Hmmmn... 
Ach, he must know what he's talking about though.

I went to speak to my MP today, and he's writing a letter to my health authority, protesting that they won't fund my treatment. The only reason they won't fund me is because DH has two children from his first marriage, and he says that's against 'natural justice' and he's calling for a judicial review!!!

It may well be too late for me, but at least other girlies in Dorset would get a fair go if we win that point.

Has the chuck come back, Nicks?


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

You Go Girl!!

Had another scan today.  Follies are now around 18mm which is good.  Dr wants to give them one extra day to grow, hopefully giving us a better chance.  Am due to go for EC on Tuesday at 8.30am.

Can anyone please give me some advice as to do's and dont's on the 2ww.  Last time I didnt really change my diet and still ate crap, although I didnt drink alcohol.  But this time I want to try and do things differently.  Are there any specific things I should be eating/drinking?

On a lighter note, how bloody dangerous are the water vials in the Menopur?  My poor DH nearly choppped his finger off the other day and now refuses to touch them!!  I also cut my thumb open today on the bloody thing.

DH working tonight so its just me and my dog and the TV.  Next door are having a bbq so hope it doesnt go on all night.

Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Whoo! So you should be having egg collection on Monday, Kerry? That's great!

The water vials - are you not using the little rubber things to break them off? I can imagine they'd be dangerous if you didn't use them.

I can't advise on the 2ww I'm afraid - I've never got that far before! I'd like to know whether it's advisable to swim, so if anyone's replying to Kerry, can you answer that, please?


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Right, I thought I'd post this, as you never know if it might help anyone. I was horrified at the difference in price from the Lister to this pharmacy, and also impressed by the loveliness of the pharmacist, Ali.

Menopur: £12.20 per vial (Lister £1
Cetrotide £24 (Lister £44)
Ovitrelle £33.31
Cyclogest £21.60 for 30 pessaries

It' called Fazeley Pharmacy and they're on 01827 262488. They get you the drugs the next day.

I wish I'd known about them before I started, as I would have saved SOOOOOOOOO much. I'm on five Menopur and one Cetrotide a day.


----------



## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Thats just criminal, the charges are bloody ridiculous.  I am so lucky to get my treatment for free.  It must be dreadful having the stress of the cost on top of everything else.

I get three free tries with the Army in Cyprus and they are trying to stop this.  I can understand why now it must be costing the Army a fortune.

I understand why the NHS cant provide free treatment but I do think everyone should be entitled to at least one free try, no matter what their circumstances.

I am absolutely gobsmacked at the cost!!!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I think so, too. This one try is going to cost well over £6,000. Each blood test is well over £100, never mind the £4,300 for the actual tx.
I can't understand why the NHS won't fund me Still, they might once my MP is through with them!

Lucky you, that the Army pays! God, there are so many advantages to an Army job, aren't there! Civil service generally is the way to go I think - more holidays, better retirement package, better health stuff, the list goes on.


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Actually, if you add on the cost of dh's frozen swimmers, that brings the cost up near £10,000!!!!

I feel quite faint when I type that...


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi girls! 
Hope you have all had a nice weekend  
Kerry - not long to go now then!    I always break the amps holding it in a bit of clothing - have had many nasty injuries at work - worst one 'scalping' off the top of my knuckle and could see bone underneath! I stuck it back on with steri-strips and it 'took' so was lucky    
Yo Mirra - does pay to shop around.  I paid a bit more for my last lot of drugs  than the hospital charged, by about £20, but it meant I didn't have to drive an hour each way and wait for ages for the drugs.  Much better.  Your GP can prescribe Cyclogest its not really just for IVF so you can get it for about £6    Not that you'll be going again cos this is your turn   
Where's everyone else?  I've been away to Stroud / Gloucestershire visiting family.  Had to phone clinic as had really bad cramps Fri night (have had all week actually) and bleeding is red now.  Spoke to my cons (wot service!!) and he said it was breakthrough bleeding and cramps just due to procedure.  Looks like I am set for 2 weeks of AF then!  Appt is Sat 26th.   Bring it on!
Have a good evening

NDub


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi Girls,

Mira - I used Fazeley last time and he was great.  My order actually got caught up in the snow (PO fault not Fazeley) and he was so helpful, offered to send another out straight away and just said to send one back when the 2nd arrived, even called me from home to check I'd got it.  Rumor has it his sister had IVF and this is why he does it so check.  

KJ - I manged to slice open my finger on my med training!!  She gae me big bag of rubbers (oh er) after but did feel bit of a plum!  God luck tom! 

Nicks - Naughty AF!  

Must dash got to check on a bid on ebay!!  Back in 10 mins with my goosip.


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Bid on my car! We've just put a Fiat on there. For you my friend, a very good price.  
He's lovely, Ali, isn't he? He did say to speak to his sis as she knew about IVF.
He couldn't believe what they were charging at the Lister!

Nicks - that's great advice, except Cyclogest is the cheapest thing in the px! It's the menopur and the Cetrotide that are HUGEly expensive.  
Sigh. The costs involved are driving me bananas with guilt. My parents are paying for this - we wouldn't stand a chance of finding the cash,


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Mirra - i'm hoping my new interest free credit card arrives Sat when i think i have to pay.  Before you were on this thread LB and i decided it would be like a student loan and your baby has to pay you back when its got a job!   like your pic hun!  hope its a baby one next  
LB - you e bay addict!  did you win it?  
NW


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Mirra - No didn't speka to his sis but he was lovely.  I'd go back to him without a quibble.  Sorry really don't need a car!!  And I didn't get my lovely green kicker boots.    Was outbid.

Anyway sorry for being awol, had a difficult week, colleague who I've worked with for last 5 years jumped under a train.  Just in shock.  But I've had some TLC over the weekend tried not to think about things and have a stress free weekend.  Enjoyed some US time which was good.

Glad you girls are all thinking positive at the moment thats what I need.

XX


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I was thinking the same thing Nicks, only a wee bit different, regarding funding for IVF. I think the NHS should operate a credit scheme where you pay back to cash over a number of years, instead of just deciding who can or can't have free treatment - much fairer. And the NHS gets the cash back, too.

Laura, it's so hard when someone does something like that - it gives you such a nasty jolt, even if you weren't close to them.
Shame about the Kickers! Have you tried www.auctionsniper.com ? Faaabulous. In case you don't know about it, it puts in your maximum bid with five seconds to go. Only charges you 1% of the total and only if you win.


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Green Kicker boots    Are they something the youngsters of today wear?

sorry to hear bout your colleague dude    Someone I knew did it the anaesthetic way - not nice.  Must be so troubled to even contemplate that.

Mirra - when is your next scan?  was KJ going today too?  only 4 microgynon's left now for me  

Having a curry soon.    yum yum chicken spinach balti i think  

chat soon girls!  

NW


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Nicks - yes green kickers are what all the young and funky people are wearing!!

Surely we should be having some news on here today

Ok, corrie now, that will cheer me up (NOT) followed by Eastenders  - well surely that will cheer me up (Not)


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hello girlies!

Well, I went for my scan today and they've pencilled in EC for Friday.
I have two proper follicles and one that needs to catch up a bit, plus two diddy ones that probably won't grow now. I'm back up on Wednesday for another scan, and then we'll see.

i'm feeling pretty blue tonight though - it's so hard to keep positive when the odds are so weighed  against us. Say I get three eggs, but then they don't fertilise, it's all over.  

Laura, you funky thing! So devastatingly trendy. I always feel like a complete hick from the sticks when I go up to London for my appts!

Nicks, how's it going?
And Kerry?


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Mirra - What can I say som of us have got t and some of us aint (thats a joke I'm actually very unfashionable!!)  Its natural to feel blue, so many hormones, all that money and emotions that you have invested.  You must stay positive... you may get 3 eggs, all fertilise and have twins and one in the freezer.


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Sigh. If only I was as hip as you!  
Thanks for the shot of positivity. I need some PMA really, but think I need some Zeds before I can replenish my supply.
I'll come back tomorrow eve bursting with PMA, I promise!


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## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Hi Miranda

I too have just two follicles (2nd IVF) - short protocol
I only had one follicle lst time around , it did fertilise but didn't stick.

I also was told that Friday might be the EC.

It's hard to keep positive, isn't it? But we must! 

All the best
Odette xx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Come on girls think positive!!! Want you all back on top form tomorrow please!!


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Mirra - be positive at least there are some there   Hope the others grow too.  Odette - hello! good Luck to you too  
Kerry - think you said EC today hun so loads of luck for that!  Hope they find lots.  Let us know how you get on if you are not too sore. 
Nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Awww, thanks Odette! So, so nice to have someone in the same boat, paddling along with me!
Where are you being treated? is the sperm you're using ok?
I'll send you eggy vibes on Friday.
xxx

Yes Nicks, I'm trying to be positive! If I had other chances it might be less of a straaain. Do you think of I forewent the Menopur and went straight onto the crack cocaine I might feel better?  

Kerry - have you been collected yet? How did it go?


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Evening girlies,

Have been wondering how it's all been going - sorry i haven't been around much the last few days to cheer you on Mirra and KJ! ( been staying in London with my sis as had my hycosy yesterday) All sounds promising though.... Mirra, it's great you have 3 decent sized follies, and you never know, perhaps those other littl' uns will do a last minute gallop and catch up?? If those 3 are good quality, as LB said, you could even have 2 or 3 lovely embies .... . sending you loads of   for now anyway! Oh, btw, thanks for the Fazeley recommendation - i'll definitely check them out when i get to ordering all my lovely drugs in a couple of wks time..(am just sorry you found about them too late -   bummer!)

KJ, so did you make it for EC today? If so, i really hope it all went smoothly for you and you're going to report back some +ve news soon. 

Hope everyone else is doing ok this week..Odette, hiya and best of luck with your EC too.  

NW, hope the after effects of your massive op. have calmed down now? Sounded a bit of a nightmare but at least you know you'll have your insides in tip top condition hopefully, all ready for your embies to bed down in! Thanks for the low down on the world of gassing by the way! I think i feel reassured!?! - so basically unless you get a complete novice the risks are pretty low by the sounds of it. I'm just an old clucker and get really nervy about these things - think i'm a bit of a control freak as well so  just hate the thought of being unconscious while a bunch of strangers poke away inside me! 

LB, hope this week brings happier news for you.. that incident with your colleague must've been so grim. What's next for you anyway, you made any more decisions? 

Catch you all soon,
Rooz xx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hay floozie - My head is full of non-IVF stuff at the moment which is a change, got funeral thurs.  And one of my clients died at the weekend, although I'm not that involved with him still alot of emotional strain dealing with his family etc.  Got my follow up next tue, not really sure what my plans are just yet.  You ok?? 

Nicks - you starting this weekend?  that right?

KJ - hope your not too sore after EC, I find the waiting for fertilisation news the hardest bit, well maybe 2ww worse.. or maybe the dildo scans? Oh its all crap!

Mirra - Is it scan tomorrow?

Odette - welcome and goodluck!

XX


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Tell you what, I'm going to investigate the link between poor response to fert drugs and night owls!
It's weird - over on the egg share board I started on they all post during the day and early evening, but here there's nothing till late!

Yeah Laura, scan tomorrow. I'm quite hopeful this time, as I had a burning sensation in my ovaries the first four days and lots happened, then nothing much for four days and now they're burning again! Must mean the tiddlers are trying at least...

Rooz, God I hope I get three, but FIVE would be such a massive boost to my flagging spirits!
Fazely seems by far the cheapest - the cetrotide particularly, but when you're on as high a dose as us you save £30 per day on the Menopur too.

Kerry - are you there? Tell us how you got on! I hope you bristled with eggs today and you're not feeling too crook.

Odette, how are you feeling? Are you having another scan tomorrow?

Nicks, how's it going?

xx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Well I went for EC yesterday and they got 5 eggs.  They telephoned me this morning to say that 4 had fertilised which I suppose is good.

I have been bleeding a lot since - dark brown is this normal?

Also ever since I woke up from anaesthetic I havent been able to see properly, is this normal? I am quite scared!!

Got to go back on Friday if all goes well to have them put back in.

Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Whooooo-hoooo! That's BRILLIANT!!!!
[move type=scroll loop=-1 direction=left step=6 delay=85]        [/move]
Five eggs, and four fertilising is fab, it really is - you've got a good chance there Kerry - well done!

I don't know about the blindness thing though! Maybe you'll sleep it off?

Good luck on Friday! Yours will be going in as mine are coming out!

I still had three today, but they've grown enormously, so hopefully there's some really juicy eggs in there.
Rooz? Nicks? Laura? How's it hanging dears?

xxxxxxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hi all!
Kerry - well done chick!!  Numbers really good.  You may have had a drug that blurs your vision like atropine or hyoscine - it will wear off      Hope your embies are dividing as we speak.  
Mirra - still on track - great news.    When is your next scan /EC?
Hi Rooz! Was your hycosy alright?? Hope so.    You on AF wait now?
Anyone heard any news from Sazz?  
LB - its good not to have IF on your mind not for these reasons.  Glad you have FU next week.  Is that first time follow up at your original clinic - you seem to have had so many lined up!    Seen any more Kicker boots on e bay?  
Um off to make tea now - what shall I have?    Had bad botty after curry the other night.  
Chat soon
Nicks


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Egg collection Friday dear. Hopefully they won't be scrambled by then...

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Happy triggering then Mirra  
I'll be going to bed soon so all you late nite posters can take over - maybe I should be on another thread............... 
Love ya  
NW


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

evening night owls!!

KJ - Thats fab, out of 4 you should get some good ones... i'd be over the moon with that!!    Also maybe the blurred vision is a smudge on your glasses!!??  Rest up and get ready for those embies!!  You on the botty bombs?

Nicks - no more kickers, am looking though!  

Mirra - I'm ok ta.  Got funeral tom, glad to get it over with, will feel more myself after I think.  Good Luck with Scan tom..  

Floozy - 

Hi to anyone I've forgot (bit tipsy!!) hic! 

XX


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Ach, Laura, I hope it goes ok. I've been to three funerals of suicides - one was my uncle - and both were really...nice. You can't tell I work with words in my day job, can you?  
But they were - real celebrations of those people's lives in a way you're not expecting when they've done it to themselves.
I hope it goes ok, anyway.


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## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Hi Ladies

thank you for your words.

EC is on Friday - only got 2 follicles, one a good size, the other a bit smaller.
I hope there is a couple of eggs hiding there.

Miranda - hope all goes with with you on Friday.

Odette x


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

blimming 'eck KJ, that's a great result - 3/4 fertilised, way to go girl! I'd be pretty happy with that i think.  Good luck for ET too   and hope your sight is back to 20/20  - good job we have NW, our resident gas lady here to reassure you it's nothing to worry about.

Mirra - weird you made that comment about night owls !! Was just thinking the same thing when i saw LB's post time... in my case i can never get a look in on the P.C, 'cos DH always hogs it until about now! Anyway, more importantly, i really hope Friday's EC goes well - how fantastic that you have 3 big juicy folllies, maybe 3 double yolkers so a nice crop of 6 in store for you on Friday?!!  

LB, hope funeral goes OK tomorrow - have never been to one in those circumstances but can't say i've ever enjoyed one exactly.   A colleague of mine is also going to one tomorrow, for her friend's 17 yr old son who had a motorbike accident last week. Pretty grim, i mean what a waste.  (oh, and guess what i just bought last week?   DH isn't too happy about it as you can imagine...) Sorry, you probaby didn't need to know that but hey..helps you get stuff into perspective.
Oh, botty bombs made me crack up by the way!!  That might even rank first ahead of dildo cam and old lady garden.

Gas man -  hycosy was ok thanks - not a barrel of laughs (catheter fell out at one point so all a bit unnecessarily long an d drawn out ) but made it through in one piece. No pollips/fibroids that were visible so been given Primolut to start on Sat. for 2 wks, then AF a couple of days later hopefully, then full stimms ahead! So you due to start injections on the 26th? What dose are you going to be on? 

Ok, time for bed night owls, 

ta ta.

Rooz xx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Ah, cheers, Rooz!
I hope I get six, too, but three goodies will be marvellous.
Whoo! You're good to go! I bet you can't wait - it's the bloody waiting that kills off all your enthusiasm and positivity, dunnit?
i told you about my double yolk omen this week, didn't it? Can't remember where I posted that gem!

Odette - you and me are going to pull rabbits out of hats, flags from our sleeves and eggs from our little crop of follicles this Friday! Yes, we damn well are, so there.
Eggy thoughts, ladies, eggy thoughts...

xx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Odette, I've just looked through your posts to see what meds you are on - same as me - but I've seen other ladies on up to 600 Menopur, so that might be another option.
What other drugs have you been on?


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Thanks for your kind words.  Clinic has just rang and all 4 of my eggies are looking perfect.  Got to go back at 10.45 tomorrow to have them put back in.  I have asked about putting 3 back in and I think they are ok with this.  They are going to put me to sleep cause my last et was horrendous.

My eyes have got a bit better but I still cant focus properly.  Is it normal to last this long?  I have made a dr's appointment today just to get it checked out.

Good luck to everyone else.

I will post again after my et.
Fingers crossed.
Kerry
xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

well done Kerry - 4 sounds great and even better if you can put three back - you lucky 'abroadie'.   Hope you get some answers on your eyes......... 
rooz - brill you will be up and running soon!  Love how you spell 'pollips' (polyps!) it reminds me of lollipops (which they are a bit like having a little stalk!)    I have appt on Sat so hope will get my schedule then.  i am going to be on Menopur and Buserelin but don't know whether it will be the 6 amps still.
Odette and Mirra - keep them follies growing girls!  
Back later
NW


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Well done kerry!
That's brill, that you have four lovely ones!

I was thinking, here they can put three back but only if you're over a certain age - is that right? What if one's ovaries are that age, but the rest of one isn't? Would they consider it then do you think?

Yay! For getting started again Nicks! Hurrah!

xxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

You have to be 40 to have 3 back here Mirra - wish it worked like you said and it depended on your ovaries age!


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

But I won't have any frickin eggs left by 40!!!!!!!!
Damned rules - they're only set to bugger things up.
Now that makes me really cross, it really does.

Don't they have any leeway for extenuating circs?

It's probably academic anyway - the chances of getting three out and them all fertilising is so remote I wonder why I'm thinking it.
BUT, I'm being positive! Can't do anything more than that, eh?

Odette, are you as nervous as me?

xx


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## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Hi Miranda

It's only normal to be a little nervous - but it happens so quick when you go under - its just the waiting to go in before that gets you so nervous.  I'll just be so god when it all over. Don't worry, it's gonna be alright 

I was told that 375 was a high dosage let alone 600?

I was told by someone to think on the breathing
inhale positive thoughts and exhale negative, nervous thoughts.

Thanks Nicki W for your good wishes for Miranda's and me.

Odettex


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

It's only the next stage up from the average for menopur.
When I started the egg sharing programme they put me on 225 then upped it to 375, but there's a few on here on 450 and the odd one on 600. Bloody expensive though!

I'm nervous about the result, not the op - I'm looking forward to the gas! The result is one more hurdle, then the fertilisation bit.
Is the sperm good in your case?

xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Girlies - oodles of luck for tomorrow's EC   Hope it all goes well. Will be thinking of you both.  Also KJ - good luck with your ET - hope they will be snuggling in nicely next time we speak   PS hope eyes better but i'm sure blindness is a small price to pay for a baby!   

Nicks


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi Girls,

Lots of stuff going on at the moment!!


KJ - wow 4 perfect embies ... things looking good. 

Mirra and Odette - hoping for lots of eggie news tomorrow... hope it goes smoothly.

Well funeral was emotional as you would expect, I feel emotionally exhasted so gonna have a an early night... looking forward to the weekend and a long lay in on Sat.

XXXXXX


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## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Miranda

The sperm is good but I've had 2 ectopics which has left me with only tube and the other one is buggered.

Roll on tomorrow.  Lots of eggies please. 

Odettex


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

Evening ladettes,

Just wanted to check in and say a MASSIVE (oops, lost my post.... hang on..) good luck to you hens, Mirra & Odette, for tomorrow - will do an egg dance for you when i'v e finished posting    Shall be thinking hard about you tomorrow and hope to hear good news whenever you feel like posting... xx  

KJ - best of luck too for your ET tomoz- you must be so chuffed at getting 4 perfect embies, what a great position to be in at this stage. And if you can have 3 popped back in.. even better. They're going to let me have 3 eggs put back in when i have GIFT but i guess they're eggs and not embies so the same ruling doesn't apply. Anyway KJ, go embies go!!

NJ, your's and my turn soon.... can't wait to get Menopur'ed up! As Mirra said, this waiting does just become the ultimate in tedium doesn't it. Roll on those needles. I'll be on 375 to start with (plus Clomid), and thought that was a fair bit, but blimey Mirra, I've never heard of anyone being on 600. Is that definitely right? Wouldn't that just annihilate your ovaries??!

LB, bet you're glad funeral is over with. Hope things feel a little lighter for you now... so where's your next appt. happening? Bourne or Notts? (or Lister, or Create or...!!)

Well, I'm off to spend time with old folk in Bournemouth tomorrow until Monday with DH, a kind of substitute hol. until we get time to take a proper one! Will be itching to know how everyone gets on but guess i may just have to wait 'til next wk to know....so take care all and good long weekends everybody,

R. xx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

A massive what, Rooz?  

Great that you have some swimmers Odette! That's yet another of our hurdles, whether the sperm will make the defrost - there wasn't much sign of life when it was frozen, never mind now.
I'm thinking eggy thoughts!

Such a relief to get the funeral over with I should think, Laura. Hope you can chill out in style this weekend.

Nicks, thanks for your good wishes! 

xx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

aah, drat, you caught me out Mirra... hoping noone would've noticed my ineptitude there! Old butter fingers me (hmmn, or could it be i can't even take 1 glass of wine these days?!)

R x


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Oo, I'd love a glass of wine! I'd better not though, eh?
Right - off to bed, as I have to get up at 4am.
Speak to you all tomorrow!
xx


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi
am new to this. Four months ago i had first course of IVF and  had 7 eggs,which was good as i have endometriosis and am 37. I was lucky enough to fall pregnant but sadly had a miscarriage at 8 wks.
Yesterday i went for 8 day follicle scan for new cycle and there were only 2 very small follicles. I was advised to abandon cycle,and to prepare myself that i may never get a response if i had a future cycle.
My first cycle i had 300 ius of puregon and the second 350.
I'm obviously really upset that this is it and it would be good to have anybody elses opinion!!!!   Thanks Merse


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Merse - stick with us chick and we will get you through.  1) puregon is rubbish for poor responders 2) there are lots of different protocols to look into.  Ignore the dr's they always like to prepare you for the worst.  Big hugs. XXX

Odette - did you used to post on the ectopic trust boards??  Ectopics are really cruel.   XX

Good luck tomorrow everyone. X

XXXX


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Thanks you don't think i should give up hope then? I rang the clinic again today to talk it over and they basicly said it didn't look very hopefull for the future as they would class it as no response. But i can't understand that its changed so much from 4 months ago?
Am thinking of going for a second opinion. xxx


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## roozie (Mar 25, 2007)

drat, just lost my post again... i must be losing it!

Quickie before i get going to Mirra dn KJ. A bit more   for you girls!! 

Also for you Merse.... don't give up, no way! You had a great response onyl 4 months ago so i personally think they're talking sh*te. Research further opinions, and ask about different drug protocols that may suit you better. Were you on a long protocol this time around? I only had 3 tiny follies on LP so i've had to change to another clinic that's more knowledgeable and more flexible. Not all clinics offer the same types of treatment, some are definitely more tailored to the individual than others. So DO NOT give up, you've only just started. Good luck a nd keep us posted. xx


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## babs68 (Oct 13, 2006)

Hi Merse

just caught your post and wanted to let you know about my experience.  I'm 39 and had my first IVF in December last year.  Because I'm known to have fuctuating FSH, they put me on the short protocol with 450ius of Menopur (pretty high dose) and Buserelin.  Although I wasn't optimistic, I got four eggs, three fertilised, all top grade.  Sadly I went onto have a Biochem., but I was pleased that I managed to get that far.  Two months later I had the same protocol, but only 1 follicle developed, and it was abandoned.  Was gutted and couldn't understand why it was so different from just a few weeks before.  The consltant explained that it was probably my FSH on that particular month being high (it wasn't tested), and they suggested a different protocol this time - 5 days Clomid (150mg), then 450 Menopur with Cetrotide for just six days.  I wasn't hopeful but I had exactly the same response as with my first cycle, had four eggs, three fertilised, and again all top grade.  Had egg transfer Wednesday this week, and now it's all done to luck!  Please don't give up hope,  I think it's early days yet, and definitely too early for your Cons. to automatically be writing you off.  There are other protocols out there that may be useful, and testing your FSH before you go ahead on a given month is also useful (mine was 5 this time, although at its highest has been 13).  I've also heard that looking at your Antral Follicle count is a good indicator of how you may respond, so that may be something to suggest.  If it were me I'd carrying on pushing, and perhaps ask for a second opinion.

Good luck!
Babsxx


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi roozies, thanks for your reply! Yes i was on long protocol, did ask yesterday about short one and was told to ask cons when go back on the 11th june to talk things over, will be armed with questions!!!
I noticed you were in Hants i live in Basingstoke. xxx

Hi Babs, thank you also for your reply and all your advice i feels tons better already had a terrible couple of days thinking that was it!
My fsh was last tested in sept 06 an was 8.6 an they do it yearly in my age group but have now decided to test again.Also they said my womb lining hadn't thickened up at all is this normal when no response? xxxx


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Babs sorry forgot to say keeping everything crossed for u!!! xx


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## babs68 (Oct 13, 2006)

Hi Merse
thanks for your reply - good to hear that you're getting your fighting head on!  In my experience the lining can be a bit unpredictable - first IVF it was nice and thick (about 11mm), second abandoned cycle about the same (which surprised me), but this one, at least a couple of mms thinner (probably the Clomid) - so not sure. The good thing is that you managed a cycle of IVF, and although you sadly went onto have a m/c, you did get that far, and I think that's a good sign, especially on your first go.  I really hope they can give you some good advice about how to play it next, and I do think they need to monitor your FSH closely before deciding on which protocol next.  When I went for my review appt. after the abandoned cycle it was me who was saying "is it worth carrying on?" and my Consultant said that if I'd have responded poorly the first time, he would probably have advised me to consider stopping treatment or using donor eggs.  But he was keen to give it another go, and liaised with his colleagues at the clinic about other protocols that had been found to be effective.
Thanks for sending me your luck - I know how hard the 2ww wait is now, trying to stay a little less stressed than the first time......... 
Take care,
Babsx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi Babs, yes def no stress, would love to be in your position!
Do you know what causes the lining not to thicken? Just wondering if its unusual and thats why they were so negative about it working another time? 
Merse xx


----------



## babs68 (Oct 13, 2006)

Hi Merse
although I'm not an expert with this, I think that your Estradiol (E2) levels are associated with the lining thickening (higher E2 = more thickening).  But on my abandoned cycle, E2 was almost non-existent but lining was very much ok.........  Just goes to show that sometimes these things are a bit strange - as my Cons. said last week "people think that it's all black and white, but really, we're just using a 'cook book' approach, tweaking as we go along".  Couldn't have said it better myself!  Did you get a lining measurement when you had your scan?

Take care,
Babsx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi Babs,
i was in such shock that i can't remember but i don't think it had thickened up much if at all, just don't think anything had really happened with lining or ovaries! I had a ERPC in Feb, i wonder if that does anything or if it takes time to recover? Mersexxx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi Girls,

KJ - how was ET?  You get 3 good ones on board? PUPO  

Mirra and Odette - News please!!   

Babs - I am not sure what to do next, one of the clinics i visited suggested cetrotide (with gonal F) - what is it exactly?  Another type of stimm drug?  I've done far too much research and all confused as to what to do!! PUPO   

Nicks - you starting stimms tom? Oh get those needles sharpened!

Merse - After my abandoned cycle I was told to not try again, this was by BArts (NHS) I insisted and did the short protocol and got 4 eggs.  I have not chatted to 2 consultants at open days neither of which have looked at my history and disregarded me.  Notts have a new protocol from america which focuses on producing a few high quality embies not lots of rubbish ones and Bourne Hall uses the cerotide one.  Do you ov naturally?  If so you could try nat Ivf?  You only produce 1/2 eggs but on this thread we don't often produce that many anyway, its cheap and as no drugs can do every month.


Anyway.. what will all do later??  No FF after 10.45?? What will I do?  I have to chat to my other half! How dull!!


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

HI, yes i do ovulate naturally but not sure tubes are in working order any more due to endo!
Don't know anything about nat ivf but would give anything a try!
Merse xx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Merse - nat ivf they just monitor you and collect your one natural egg and mix or icsi with the sperm and put it back.  As not drugs to stress your ovaries you can do it every month. depending on where you go its about £800- 1100, success is only about 10% but as you can do it over several months that increases your chances. Some research says that high doses of FSH produce poor quality eggs.  I think you just need to go for what you feel is right for you.  There is some info about it on the CREATE ivf website (just type into google).  They collect the egg as in stim ivf so doesn't matter about your tubes.

XX


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Thanks will look into it! my head is buzzing with all this new information. Think i need a glass of wine!!! Thanks again xx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hi chaps!

I got four eggs!!!!!! I'm so made up I can't tell you.
Two are mature and two immature, but they're going to try and mature them in the lab. The dr said Monday or Tuesday for ET, much better than Sunday, as he must feel confident about them?
Now we've just got to worry whether dh's sperm defrosts ok and whether our gametes decide to get it on.

KJ, how's it going?

I agree with all you've said, girls, on not giving up - it amazes me how many hospitals are prepared to give that sort of advice to people without trying other methods and protocols.
try the Lister - they don't give up even when it seems hopeless, and they've given me so much hope.

xxxxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi miranda, really pleased for you and keeping everything crossed for next week!
Am trying to keep positive it really helps talking to people who know what i'm going through 
Merse xxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

It certainly does, Merse - I don't think I'd have coped but for my fertility friends! oh, and wine...
You'll be ok, you'll see. If only all consultants were geared up for poor responders eh?
With my AMH I'd have been condemned at most other places.
xx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

I know i have been a right mess this week trying to imagine life never having children all my hope was taken away, but feel more positive now!
what is AMH sorry don't know much about all this really 
merse xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

It's anti mullerian hormone Merse. It's the indicator of ovarian reserve that doesn't change, whereas your FSH does.
Only a few places do it. 
here's the reference table on the net:

Ovarian Fertility Potential
Optimal Fertility 28.6 pmol/L ? 48.5 pmol/L 
Satisfactory Fertility 15.7 pmol/L ? 28.6 pmol/L 
Low Fertility 2.2 pmol/L ? 15.7 pmol/L 
Very Low/Undetectable 0.0 pmol/L ? 2.2 pmol/L 
High Level 48.5 pmol/L? suspicion of Polycystic Ovarian Disease/Granulosa cell tumours 

My reading was 0.6! Sigh.

Yes, I've been trying to come to terms with possibly/probably never having children and, boy, it's a tough one to face down.
But we don't have to face that yet! You are by no means beaten - and don't let anyone tell you any different.

xxxx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Mirra - wooo hoooo!!!  Fab news sweetie, did it all go ok?  Fingers crossed for your news tomorrow.  You sound so positive. You having a glass of vino tonight? could be last opportunity for next 9 months??


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Certainly am Laura! I'm feeling pretty pooped, and I have to get up at 5.30 for work tomorrow, but i've managed to have some vino!
And now to bed I think - I'll let you know how our gametes got on tomorrow.
xxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Thanx for that Miranda! one of my main concerns is why my lining didn't thicken up at all my husband thinks it was 3mm which is terrible, but the whole thing just doesn't seem right really!! will have to wait 2 wks an find out what more they have to say!!! xxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Lining schmining, Merse! We all respond so differently in each cycle it's ridiculous for docs to assume that one duff one means the game's up.
Your lining didn't thicken because the eggs weren't forming - the womb thickens in response to what's going on in your ovaries, so if they didn't have you on the right protocol to stimulate you enough that's why you got that thin lining.
That's what Liz the scanner said the other day - they look for the lining to thicken to tell them your ovaries are doing stuff, so it's all inter-related.
Hope that helps
xxxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Yes that makes sense have learned so much on here already!!! thanks for your help!! what are you doin up so early on a sat you should be relaxing in bed!!! 
xxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Yeah I know.  
Working from 7am! Shouldn't really after a general anaesthetic, but thought I'd had quite a lot of time off already this week for appts and thought I'd better.

xxxx


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## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Hi Girls

I had 3 grade 1 eggs put back in yesterday.  They put me to sleep because last et was horrendous.  They also did assisted hatching which I am really pleased about cause didnt know they would do this.  Just that big long wait now.

Eyes still a bit funny but trying not to stress out about it.  Not in work now til Wednesday so going to try and rest as much as I can.

Good luck everyone else.
Kerry
xxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Wow! Well done you! Hope you've got your feet up and you're being waited on!

I wonder what's going on with your eyes? Have you been sleeping ok? I get funny vision when I haven't slept right, but then i had laser eye surgery a few years back.

Hope they improve soon!

xxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Yes i know what you mean about time off work had so much last time!!
kj wishing you tons of luck and get lots of rest!
merse xxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Hello Girls!  
sorry didn't have much time to chat last night - we were watching The Constant Gardener.  V good but a bit sad   
Hello Merse1 - what am i going to shorten that to?  Is it anything to do with Mersey?  Perhaps you are a closet scouser?  
Hi to Babs too - i think i may have chatted to you before  
KJ - well done hun - you rest up now.  another GA will well and truly have bugg*red your eyes but it will all be worth it I'm sure.   Do you know how many cells your embies were?
LB - did you survive last night's shut down? I thought all you youngsters were out floozying on Fri night - bet you were Rooz!  
Mirra - waiting for fert news today then, fingers crossed  
Odette - hope you got on alright chick  
Am off to the clinic this am so hope to come back laden with drugs and a much lighter wallet!  will fill you in later.

Nicks


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi nicki,
good luck today at clinic,i'm sure your wallet will be much lighter!!!
Merse is my dogs name an to do with football,my husbands idea not mine!! It was first thing i could think off when logging on!! My name is Tracey but theres a lot of us around so merse is fine!! xxxxxxx


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Can anyone tell me what the bubbles mean? And how do you do your history on the bottom?
Also has anyone been to London fertility clinic? xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

I just blew you some dude!  They are just a friendship thing   The bit at the bottom is your signature - you should be able to do it if you go into profile.

N Dub


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Thats cute!! Think i did it back!!! will check out profile!!! ta xxxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hi chaps!

One of my eggs fertilised - bit disappointing, but at least I have something to put back!!!
One fertilised abnormally, one not at all and the other must have been too feeble for them to bother.

So Wilma - my embryo - has to be The One - can you add her to your prayers please?
I'm getting her put back on Monday.

xxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Mirra - Well done hun!  Try not to be disappointed - you have one fighter!  Am crossing everything for you.   
Went to clinic.  Had scan which was OK.  Need to wait for AF - hope Sun or Mon and then get a baseline scan day 2 - then start!  Will be on Menopur 450. DH's sperm was 112 million - he's looking it up on the internet as its his highest yet.  Boys eh  
Feeling a bit crap and sore throaty today, hope nothing too bad brewing.  

Good signature Merse!  Short proto next time for you hun and you have good chances if you've been preggers before.  

nicks x


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## babs68 (Oct 13, 2006)

Hi Miranda - crossing fingers for your ET, I know it's a cliche but you only need one good sticky one and job's a good 'un!

LauraB - Cetrotide is the drug that holds back ovulation, so I presume it's the same as Buserelin that I've used before.  I don't know why they recommended it over Buserelin this time, perhaps it works better with Clomid....?

Hi to Nicki - good to meet again!

Merse - honestly, try not to worry too much about the lining this time, as Miranda says, if your ovaries are struggling that month, your lining can't really develop well either, it's not necessarily a sign of things to come.  Have a good chat with your Cons. (I always take a list of questions in with me otherwise I just feel overwhelmed and forget....).

Taking it easy today, just going for a little walk, buy a bit of cake to bring home (yum!).  Still feeling pretty tired, glad it's the bank holiday on Monday.  

Take care all, 
Babsxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Cheers Babs! I do feel that we've gone over so many hurdles to get to this position that my embryo is a fighter - she'll be the one!

Nicks, I hope you haven't got what I'm still suffering from! Halfway through stimms I caught a cold and it hasn't gone yet.
You will be well for starting those lovely drugs though - and this will be your cycle of cycles.

I'm going to bed in a tick - was working from 7am and after the anaesthetic yesterday I feel like taking it easy - feel weak and flatulent. God, the WIND!!!! They put suppositories in during the op, and because I have irritable bowel anyway, I just feel like they've pumped me up with air! When it does 'release' it's the most awful, squelchy sound! Too much information? I don't care - you can all suffer my wind with me!  

xxxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Miranda well done one is all you need!! 
Babs thanks for advice will write all questions down as always forget to ask something even though they laugh at the amount of questions i ask!!
Nicki will def ask about short proto only two wks to wait to ask feel waiting is all i do!!!!!!!!!!!!! xxxx


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## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Blimey,

I'm exhausted just reading through all this stuff!!

Mirra-   Come on Wilma!!  I'm sending her all my energy (not that i have much!!)  

KJ - wow three top grade on board! I'm SOOOO jealous.... think i may go abroad next time!

Nicks - good luck today hope that sore throat doesn't turn into owt X

Merse - I've heard really good things about LFC, thats were they do the EC when you have nat ivf.  I've blown you some bubbles too... they must ALWAYS end in 7!!

Babs, rooz -


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Am thinking of going there for second opinion! why must bubbles always end in 7 xx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Seven's a lucky number, dearie! Lots of people have their own superstitions though - sometimes it's an even number or whatever...

Me, I'm just so happy when people think fondly of me enough to blow me bubbles! I haven't got a lucky number, you see, so I'm unencumbered by number stuff. Thank God! I have enough to worry about!
I'll tell you why - I was born on Friday the 13th of the witching month (October) - Maggie Thatcher and Edwina Currie's bithday. If I was paranoid about numbers that might just finish me!

xxxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

well i was born on the 7th but def not feeling very lucky!!!! my best friends birthday is oct the 13th an she has 2 lovely children so maybe its lucky!!! xx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Maybe it is - I wouldn't call getting to be prime minister that unlucky!


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Well I just googled my birth date and I share it with Rio Ferdinand and Lily Thai ( a famous porn star!!!)  

I was born on the 7th too.. not been lucky so far!! 

Any one up to anything exciting tonight?

I've been cleaning ALL day and still at it.  The Queen is coming to stay tomorrow (MIL).  Shattered.

How was the appointment Nicks?

Mirra - I can't believe you worked today??!  Take it easy hon you have a op yest even if it was a little one. X


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Yeah I know - I shouldn't have worked really, but I felt guilty for letting my colleagues deal with the eejit deputy. We were still there till noon, even though I went in!  

Argh! MIL staying? Scrub the skirting boards! 

Nothing exciting - I'm having some wine and some Chinese, on the basis that it'll be my last chance for nine months.    

Just looking forward to Big Brother really! I have a terrible addiction to it.

xxx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Yeah me too, although i tend to watch the first one and then not watch it again til half way through.  Had it on the calendar for last night but it was postponed til wed!  Its clashes with apprentice too!   whats the eejit deputy?!


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

When our boss is off the duty falls to his deputy, who couldn't run a piddle up in a brewery! Usually on a Saturday shift we get away at 10am. Still, I'm home now...

Oo, I love the Apprentice! That will take precedence.


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

But the first BB is always good as they all dress up silly... but the apprentice is nearing the end??  Maybe I wil try to work out the video recorder?!
Will you get an update on Wilma tomorrow?


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I don't know - should I get an update on Wilma tomorrow? I have no experience of getting this far - should I ring up?

They repeat BB constantly, don't they? Oh God, I don't know - I'd forgotten the first one was Wednesday, bbecause I have it lodged in my brain that it's Friday.
I may have to get both tellies side by side!!!


----------



## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Night girls  
LB - love the cat pic with its paw out - very arty  
NDubx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Nicks - did you not have an appointment today? Am I going mad?  Thats a my kitten, shes adorable a!

Mirra - not sure mine was a day 2 transfer so only got info on day one as was at hosp for day 2.  But yeah tom they should be able to tell you if its divided, how many cells and be able to grade Wilma. X


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Hmmn, I'll give it a go later, see if Wilma is dividing! God, I am so cross with myself - forgot to put the Cyclogest in last night, so did it first thing this morning. Then it fell out when I was on the loo, so I put another one in!
Now I'm worried it'll bugger everything up for Wilma.
I've always been terrible at taking drugs. I'm going to have to put a big sign up at my bedside, reminding me... It's the only way.
What does Cyclogest do, exactly?


----------



## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Mirra - it is meant to maintain your lining all nice and ready for snuggling in.  it won't matter that you missed one.  Looking forward to Wilma news  
LB - you obviously missed my update girl!    Waiting for Af, then phone clinic, scan and start stims on day 2.  Will be on 450 menopur.  Had a little scan yesterday just to make sure no cysts etc and everything was OK.  So.... not too long for me then. Excited!   
Kitten looks fab!!  never did find out what your 'ring' picture was?
Porridge ready in a minute!  
Hi to everyone else -enjoy your wet day  
NW


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Phew! Thanks Nicks - was a wee bit worried!

Are you getting your menopur from Ali?

Come on auntie! Let Nicks get going!


----------



## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Morning all.

Well I was born on 6 November and share my birthday with Nell McAndrew (wish I was as beautiful as her)!!

Had a strange weekend, I slept yesterday for 3 hours which is not like me at all.  Have not been having any symptoms really, a few aches and pains but nothing major.

Struggling with the Cyclogest this time (they keep falling out)!!!

Might go out for lunch today, lovely and sunny here today.

Speak soon
Kerry
xxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

So do mine!!! I hope that doesn't affect anything. I would go back entrance, but I get terribly IBS and that'll just make it worse.

When's your test date, Kerry?

xxxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Hi all, am a bit hungover today as went out with dh last nite for a curry and got drunk to commiserate a horrible week!!! Trouble is just feel worse about the situation today and now dreading going back to see cons as terrified of what hes gonna say next!!! 
Atleast we have BB i am addicted too!
Miranda any news? xxxx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Hi Girls,

MIL due any moment so just a quickie.

Nicks - Yeah I think I did read your update, take no notice of me i'm  .  The last piccie was a ring I saw in Florence and Tim said would get made for me.. still waiting!  

Merse - Ah don't worry aboutt he hangover and its ok to feel down.  We will get you all armed with info and questiosn for you consult.  Mine is tue, I need to write some questions out. On the top of the ICSI board there is a list of questions for a follow up. XX

Mirra - you found out how Wilma is?  I used the back door.. front door too messy.

Kerry - we are nearly twins!!!!!  my birthday is 7th Nov!!!    Your a naughty scorpio too!!!! X

XX


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I never did phone about Wilma - don't want to worry myself! Let's face it, I only have her, and she's going back in tomorrow whether she's ready or not.
I might try back door tonight - it is messy front door - looks like a hideous case of thrush!

xx


----------



## laurab (Apr 17, 2006)

Mirra - yeah i was advised to use back door.  Only did front door once and felt that i didn't absord any of it!!  Back door takes a little to get used to but I think better. XX


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Laura-thanx yes will def need lots of questions from everyone as you all know much more than me!! And hope tues goes well for you!
Miranda-prob right not to ring you'll only worry more!
Also sorry more questions when am i likely to get af as been getting pains on an off for last two days? And what percentage of money am i likely to get back from clinic for an abandoned cycle?? xxxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

The AF would depend on you Merse - you never can tell when she's going to show her ugly face!
The refund will depend on the clinic - best to ask them. When my cycle was abandoned I hadn't paid them anything at that stage, so there was nothing to refund. It took AGES for AF to show up after that, but everyone's different.

xx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

I was told it could be up to 5 wks b4 it showed up but i've def had pains on an off so we'll have to wait and see! 
We had to pay in full before treatment started an when i asked about money back they said we'd get some back so what that means i don't know, i've only had a blood test and a scan not even a consultation as it was at my follow up from my last cycle that we decided to go ahead again!! xx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I took four weeks till AF, though they said it would be two weeks. Throughout that time I had pains and thought I was definitely coming on. Sent me   as I wanted to get going again!
Look through your literature from the clinic - if you have a price list it may tell you about refunds on there. What clinic are you at?


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Wessex southhampton with a satelite service with basingstoke which is where i live. Can't find any info on money back! xxxxxxx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Are they a BUPA lot? The Winterbourne offer your money back, save for an £850 deposit - I have that in my file, which I rearranged today to separate the two clinics.


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

They could be will check!!

xxxxxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Merse - Think I paid for drugs and then only about £500 instead of £2000 on our cancelled cycle (well we did IUI).  They made me wait a month for my refund though and had to get shirty with them.  Next go though i didn't pay until EC as they were trying to make up for it!  
Kerry - glad you are OK.  How are the eyes?    My technique with the bullets is lie 30 mins in bed if you are doing front door for dissolving and absorption   Back door is less messy but they could do with giving you a tube of lubricant to ease the passage!    
LB - not long til Tues then    Don't envy you with the MIL - mine is barking mad    she always throws a strop like a 5 year old - first time was the weekend of our wedding and had to bite my tongue.
Mirra - loads of luck for tomorrow hun  

No AF today so presume will be tomorrow - should be predictable as its post pill.  Hoping to start the hard stuff on Tues!  My acu lady has had to go to India for some family issue and might be gone a few weeks - great timing thanks!    Wrapped 2 presents this morning and felt like I needed to kill them and throw the sellotape across the room!    That'll be the hormones then!

NW


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Cheers dear! I'm hoping to get my first glimpse of Wilma as she's piped aboard...

Back door for me tonight then - I am convinced...

Dontcha just love PMT?


----------



## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Ladies, (laurab, miranda,nicki, roozie, merse & anyone else I may have forgotten.) 
thank you for all your good wishes for my EC. 

My one and only follicle produced two eggs which fertilised and I'm am due for ET on Bank Holiday Monday.

I'm so happy, I'm truly blessed to have got this far.

laurab - yes I used to go on the ectopic boards - boy you have a good memory!

Miranda - Well Done Girl on good luck tomorrow!  

Merse/Miranda, regarding the Cysclogest, you really need to stick it way up to stay up - horrible I know.

I have been going to acupunture for the last 5 weeks to to thicken my womb lining to be just right for ET.  When I was scanned the hospital said that I had a triple layer which was perfect for EC.  I will them go for another couple of weeks after EC to continue maining a good lining for the next 2weeks.  


Ladies, I'm on top of the World      
Odettexxxxxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

That's brilliant Odette!

We'll be on the two-week wait together, so feel free to burble at me - I'll be burbling at you!
Gosh, what luck that you had two eggs in there. I did wonder on my abandoned cycle whether there were two eggs in my one follie - maybe I should have just gone ahead.

Ach well though - je ne regret rien!

I can't remember if you said which clinic you're at? I'll have a peek at your posts.
Good luck for the next two weeks!         

xxxx


----------



## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Miranda

I'm at the Hammersmith, and you?

They have let me go ahead twice with just one follicle wich is great because some clinics would have discouraged me or not let me go ahead with the EC.

Can't wait until tomorrow.

We must be one of the two happiest bunnies. 

Odette xx


----------



## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

I'm at the Lister - like you, I'm lucky to have consultants who are happy to try their best for me and won't be discouraging.

Roll on tomorrow!

xx


----------



## kjones (Feb 7, 2007)

Good luck girls with your ET's today.  I have everything crossed for you.

My test date is 8 June!!!

Kerry
xxx


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Yes good luck with ET'S today let us know how you get on! 

Still can't find any info on money back will call clinic in the wk if i don't hear from them!
What a horrible day weather wise whats everyone else up to? xxxxx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

The sun has been out here Merse   but it is struggling a bit!
Odette well done on your double yolker!  I am so hoping I get some of those    Good luck to you and Mirra for today  
Nicks


----------



## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Its terrible here! 
Have you started your sp yet? Am going to ask about it when i go back to the clinic, did you ask about it or did they reccomend it? xxx


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## odette (Nov 3, 2006)

Hi there girls

Thanks for your good wishes re ET
one egg had divided into 7 cells, the other into 5 so really happy.

Both are tucked up inside mummy where they belong.

Happiest feeling in the world!

NickiW - I love the way you called it  a double yolker!, it made me laugh.

kjones - hows the 2ww going? 

Merse1 - What stage of treatment are you at? 

Miranda - how did it go today?

Odette xx


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## Nicki W (Nov 1, 2006)

Brill news Odette   Take it easy now.
Merse -    here now!  Waiting for AF....... Its on its way, but I suppose even if it comes now they might take tomorrow as day 1.  Am starting stims on day 2.  My original consultant was very pessimistic when I asked about SP - he said might get more eggs but preg / live birth rate the same.  But then he was a waste of space and didn't even get me a diagnosis so I don't really think much of him.   I ended up doing a second LP, DRing for ages as they were oversubscribed and only getting 3 eggs.  There is no point wasting time doing LP down reg if you are not going to produce lots of eggs.  The 3 week down reg was just 3 weeks wasted.  Most poor responders on here are on SP though.  My current consultant believes SP much better for girls like us.  As far as i am concerned more eggs means more selection of the best ones.  Our success rate is lower there is no getting away from that but it doesn't mean it can't happen.
Hope we are going to get some good results in the next couple of weeks girls!

NW


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Well, mine was slap bang in the middle of yours Odette, at 6-cell!
The embryologist seemed really pleased at that - said normally she would spend ten mins injecting three eggs, but due to the quality of the sperm it took her an hour and a half! So the fact that one has progressed this far is very heartening.

KJ, how come you're testing on June 8? I thought you had egg collection earlier than me? That's my test date, too!

Nicks, how in hell can the pregnancy rate be the same for more eggs? I don't get it! Statistically each transfer will have the same chance, for sure, but your actual chances of getting a baby are surely higher if you've got more eggs!   Some people ought not to be fertility consultants   But I guess at least he wasn't an accountant!

xxxx


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Odette and Miranda great news for both of you and keeping everything crossed for you both!!! 
Odette i've just had my second cycle abandoned as only 2 very small folicles an due to go back 2 wks tom to discuss what to do next but was told its prob the end of the road which i can't really beleive as i had 7 eggs in dec 4 fertilized an 3 were grade a so i have one frostie! xxxx


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## Miranda7 (Feb 12, 2007)

Merse, I really think you should think about changing clinics! Yours sounds so discouraging.
Two follies needn't have been that bad - look at Odette, who got two out of one!


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## merse1 (Apr 15, 2007)

Yea but they could hardly see them they were so small and he said by day 8 they should be much bigger which they were last time, also the lining hadn't thickened up. So he said i would be wasting my money as nothing was gonna happen this time and it didn't look good for the future, then i rang the day after and they said it could be the end of the road. Talk about negative!!! xxxx


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## Rachel (Mar 10, 2004)

This way to a new home

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=96944.new#new


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