# Single Women Pg Loss - Part 1



## aweeze

Well I'm sorry to be starting this thread but as our group grows rapidly by the day, so does our need for a thread where those of us that have unfortunately suffered the loss of a pregnancy can offer and receive support. .

If you would like a list to commemorate your angels, I can add it to this post.

    ​


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## suitcase of dreams

Lou, 

I wish we didn't have to have this thread either....and I wish even more than I wasn't posting on it  

But here I am, I don't know that I have any words of wisdom for others, but certainly lots of    all round,

Suitcase
x


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## Roo67

I agree - I wish we didn't need this thread but it will be good to chat to others who know what you are going through and feeling etc.

Thanks Lou.

    to all that are suffering

r xx


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## Mifi

I ditto that too - I miss my angel babies so much    

First due date getting closer 9 March    

BIG HUGS TO ALL     Life just isn't fair


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## Mifi

Can I ask a question please??

On my due date next month I wanted to go to church and light a candle for my beautiful angel babe but I still feel so angry & raw at God or whatever the higher power is   I am not sure if I should.   I know I can light a candle at home but it doesn't feel special or significant enough  

Love FM XXXXXX


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## suitcase of dreams

FM - I can't help too much I'm afraid. I gave up on God a long time ago - he - or she - never played that much of a role in our family life anyway although I did used to go to church when I was a child.....and in my teens after my father died, the idea of a god just seemed less and less relevant to me

I do sometimes wish though that I had that sort of belief and faith as I've seen how it can sustain in difficult times - but faith isn't something you can magic up, and for me, it just isn't there...

What I would say though, is that if you want to go and light a candle in church, then you should do so and not feel bad about it. I'm sure that God understands your anger and bitterness and doesn't hold it against you - and if marking your due date in this way feels like it's the right thing for you to help you get through this, then you go ahead and do it

Take care,
Suitcase
x


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## Annaleah

Thanks Lou.

Ditto what others have said.... and wish I didn't have to be here either.  Always feared this but never truly believed it would happen.  
  and hope to all.

Full moon, I did the strangest thing last Saturday - went into church and lit a candle...then went ahead and lit 14!! for my 14 embies thawed this cycle that never made it including the 2 transferred (don't really know why I did that except that my mum keeps referring to each embryo as a soul).  I was brought up a catholic (pretty certain about the church's position on my choices!!).  Also went to fight with the priest and ask why - surprisingly he was much better than my clinic counsellor.  Anyway, I still have strong attachments to the church so that felt like the right place for me.  I'm sure when the time comes you will know what feels right and what you're able to do  
Annaleah xx


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## Betty-Boo

FM - that to me sounds a beautiful idea  ^hugme it might help with your feelings.
Haven't been to church in a while - but must admit have been thinking more about it recently.  
Annaleah am glad you had a good talk with your priest.  To be that is such a beautiful thing to do.  
Really must go to church - haven't been for some time and really feel the need at the moment.
mini x


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## ♥JJ1♥

FM I am not a very Holy person but I do light my baby candle and release balloons on my due day the day that your baby died etc
L x


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## Mifi

Thanks guys  

Suity I am not really religious but like you often feel the space of a lack of some sort of faith   And i am sure that if there is a heaven somewhere I like to think that both my angel babies will be there   I will probably do the candle thing but also release some pink & blue balloons - thanks JJ1 I had not thought of that  

Annaleah 14 candles   why not ehh - big hugs   

Its hard posting on this thread but in some ways it is a relief as I often feel a bit guilty bringing this up elsewhere but I have obviously still got quite a few issues to work through as time & time again it seems to come up in my life - denial just no longer works  

Hugs to all


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## ♥JJ1♥

I attached a note on the balloons to my baby on what should have been it's first birthday, other people have released flowers and things in streams/sea.  I also think that one day we will meet our babies one day.

My friend gave me a book Angels in my Hair by Lorna Bryne about a lady who can see angels and looses a baby. Only half way through

L x


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## ♥JJ1♥

This thread might be helpful to some people trying to look at out of a terrible situation there is sometime good....and remember bad things happen to good people for no reason
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=45682.0

L x


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## Annaleah

aaarrgh....some quick questions about m/c if I may pick your brains.....

Stopped bleeding last Wed -ish but for about 2 weeks I have had tenderness on right side (HCG levels 1.8 so ectopic wasn't a concern).  I went back to the GP last Wed and again today with concerns about pain and tenderness when lifting my leg, going to the loo etc.  Also had brown discharge today so hope i'm not going to start bleeding again. GP suspects a womb infection and has put me on 2 antibiotics and said to come back if problems still persist in a week and they will consider a scan to see if there is anything more sinister.  GP was very nice - graciously accepted my need to say the F*** word a few times - but I just want someone to look inside me and tell me there isn't anything bad going on that my affect future tx (without having to pay or travel 150 miles for it)

Anyone else had this problem?  Is it common/ normal / ok? Might it hold up my next FET? Bit worried to mention it to clinic in case they say wait another month (already looks like next FET won't be till June as my clinic down regs before FET)...any ideas ladies?  
Annaleah x


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## Roo67

I'm sorry Annaleah - I can't remember pain like the ones you are describing but think I did  have a bit of tenderness for a while. (tbh I think I have blocked it all out) Its good that you GP is taking it all seriously and I think I would be tempted to go back next week anyway and get a scan even if the pain subsides with the AB's.

r x


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## Mifi

Annaleah

I did have pain on my right side and a second bleed two weeks after the ERPC which did end with brown spotting. I queried my pain with the clinic as I even thought eptopic!?!    I was told it was my womb etc shrinking and everything else down there settling back to normal - if you are particulary sensitive to your body like me it may be the same situ? I was also given a course of antibiotics as a precaution and I think my first proper AF after m/c arrived about 5 weeks and even that was not a normal AF for me it was heavier & more painful than usual. I think it just does take time for your body to heal    If it gets worse or you are really worried go back to your GP - I did request a scan at the time of the pains and the clinic wouldn't do it they said best to leave alone and not to worry unless I started signs of infection such as abnormal discharge, feeling unwell, temperature etc.

Best advise I can give you is to drink plenty, take paracetamol and rest up when you can   

Hope that helps hun

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


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## Annaleah

Thanks Roo and FM - I've been goooooogling womb infection this eve.  Dr has given me metronidazole and doxycyline - both for 7 days.  Looking through the net it looks like these antibiotics are both recommended for this sort of infection.  I don't have any abnormal discharge just pain and tenderness (feels very much like bruised insides).  Hopefully it's just inflammation and will settle. Didn't have ERPC (so if there is infection it won't be instrument related) and in some ways I was glad that I started bleeding within 48 hrs of my scan and advice to stop oestrogen and progesterone - dreaded the thought of knowing I was going to m/c and waiting. 

I have appt with my regular GP on Tues - I've known her about 9yrs and she's supportive about me TTC so I don't have same GP worries as some others.  Hopefully things will have settled by then
Annaleah xx


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## ♥JJ1♥

so sorry to hear that you have a an infection, my GP said that if the baby hadn't come away completely within 10 days there was a risk of infection
L x


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## Mifi

Hi guys

Been keeping a low profile for a bit of FF and still am as need to sort my head out, if that will ever happen   but felt that I should post on here today as this would have been the day I would have met my first baby if he/she decided to arrive on time that is   I had a few tears last night and was apprehensive of this day - not really sure how I would cope but at the moment I am not as bad as I thought - got a very mixed pot of feelings, didn't help either as I dreamt of tx/clinics and babies last night    If I had managed to wangle some time off work today I would have done the balloon thing but we were just far too busy and I completely lost my bottle to ask my manager if there was any possibility I could leave early today   so I guess I will just light a candle at home tonight and hope that me my angel baby will one day meet   it is still so hard to swallow down that pain and carry on, especially when I think about my egg recipient holding her baby boy and I still have empty arms    but I still wouldn't change my decision to share and will do again if I find the courage to reimbark on the IVF road again, at least one good thing has come of this journey.

Will light two candles - one for my angel baby and one for all the angel babies - far too many of them now  

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


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## ♥JJ1♥

Full Moon-  Take care hun, it is a hard day, as nobody else around you knows how hard your are trying to get through the day and they all carry on as normal.  
I'll light a candle for your  tonight as well- hopefully they are all playing together in a better place.

L x


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## Annaleah

Full Moon   ...don't know what else to say except life is so s*** sometimes. xxx


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## Mifi

Thanks guys your kind thoughts are much appreciated  

Its so hard for all of us and just so unfair     I am so sick of putting on that i'm ok front all the time & its exhausting   TTC is exhausting hence my break for the next few months  

Take care all   

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXX


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## lulumead

thinking of you and sending      


xx


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## suitcase of dreams

FM -    hope you've made it through the day OK, will be thinking of you lighting the candles this evening

I hope the break from ttc brings you renewed strength and vitality,
take care,
Suitcase
x


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## ♥JJ1♥

I saw this on the Pregnancy Loss Thread from Dizzi

Hi ladies

We have our 1st PG loss chat for next Thurs 12th March at 8pm
I am going to open a new room especially for us
Which will be called 'Angel Mummies'

If PG loss has touched your life and you would like to chat with other ladies who understand
then please do come along.

Hope to see you there
Love Danni x x  Hug


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## Mifi

Thanks Lulu & Suity  

JJ1 thanks for that - not sure if I will make it for that chat, I guess it depends if I have a good or bad day   something to think about anyhow as its a hard one but at least with the beauty of FF we can take it or leave it  

Night all - just glad to get through today


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## Betty-Boo

FM         
Thinking of you x x x


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## Mifi

Thanks mini


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## carnivaldiva

To all who've lost their babies


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## Mifi

Thanks Carnival good luck with your 2nd IVF


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## carnivaldiva

Thank you Full Moon.

Unfortunately BFN.  I don't think I was in a positive frame of mind towards EC. They were only able to collect 3 eggs as the rest had 'callapsed' and only able to fertilise 1.

Last time they fertiised 4 and put back in 3 and 1 took.  So with the news of jus the one and then the pain I was in, I kinda of knew then.

I've got another 2 goes.

  to all.

Mothers day was kinda hard.  My mother lives overseas and I couldn't help but think that had things gone to plan I would've been a mother of a baby girl.

Hard putting on a brave face.  Hard to forget.

I've got some relaxation cd's so I guess this weekend I'm going to store them on to my IPOD (never done that before, my brother always does it for me) and get some speakers so I can listen to them at work.

I'm going to try and get my mind and body back into a 'good place' and then start again.

Good luck to all


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## Felix42

Hello all, first of all Carnivaldiva, my belated sympathies that your last treatment was a BFN.  What are your next steps?

I've been having a rather up and down time since I found out I was miscarrying last Wednesday and am now trying to look to the future once again as much as possible.

For those who sadly have experience of miscarrying   can you tell me how long it was before you had your next normal AF and did it keep to more or less your usual timing i.e some sort of relation (say multiples of 28 days) to your previous AF before you were pregnant, or was it's timing related to the date you miscarried? 

Any advice much appreciated.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


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## Roo67

Hi Felix,   

They do say time is a big healer and I have found this to be true, I still have bad days from time to time, but they get less and less. It is still early days for you so allow yourself to grieve. I too found that planning next steps really helped me.

As regards to AF I think it was timed to the miscarriage and was about the same timing as if the M/C was AF (if that makes sense !)

r xx


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## Felix42

Thanks Roo.  That is really helpful.  It's good to know that it does get easier and you have had it so much worse than me.  

I think I will try and be a bit more realistic about how long it might take to get back on an even keel again.  I will start planning big time now though as that really does help and estimating my next AF based on the miscarriage should be a good start.

Thanks again and lots of love 
Felix xx


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## suitcase of dreams

Felix, 

I was 5 weeks to the day from date of ERPC...they told me 4-6 weeks....and apparently same applies to miscarriage in general

  as Roo says, it does get easier although it never really goes away  

Take care of yourself,
Suitcase
x


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## Felix42

Thanks Suity.  I will use these next 4 to 5 weeks to heal and get stronger and plan, plan, plan! Stepan has confirmed that he can do a hysteroscopy and this can be done after I've finished bleeding so I'm just checking with him now if I can do it this month or need to wait until after a normal AF bleed.  I'm just dying to know whether I do really have a septate uterus.

Thanks again for sharing Roo and Suity.  I do appreciate it must be a difficult thing to think back on.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


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## Roo67

All sorts of things bring back memories.

At work today I saw Mat Leave against a girls name, she announced her pregnancy just before I got my last positive, we should have been sharing this pregnancy  and I should have been preparing to start mine too.

And then earlier this eve, flicking through threads, i came across a name i recognised, couldn't remember where from and then saw she had a 2 month old. I should too   

Most of the time I am ok, but just now and again you get little reminders.

R x


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## Felix42

Roo.  I can only imagine how difficult that must be.

 when you have your own very special little one.  It will happen!  We will get there.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


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## Mifi

Hi Felix

After my first m/c it took 5 weeks for my next AF to arrive and it was much more painful & heavier than normal but the one after was normal for me, after my 2nd m/c it took a good 6 weeks for my next AF to arrive but I did have an ERPC with that one, as Suity has mentioned it tends to be around 5 weeks for most I think. 

I also second that time does help you heal, but it doesn't ever go far from your thoughts and as Roo says you will get triggers   and you will have good days and bad days. I had a bad day just out of the blue last week and ended up being sent home from work because I couldn't stop crying - It was a surprise to me as I had been doing so well but I think tiredness and stress also doesn't help. 

Take care of yourself   

Love to all 

FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


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## Betty-Boo

Roo        I know words are so smallin these situations - am thinking of you - who makes this   journey so darn hard  x x x 

Felix am so glad S is there for you and can perform the procedure - thinking of you         x x 

FM      
Take care mini x x


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## carnivaldiva

Felix   

They say it get's easier, but don't know when.  I got my my first proper AF about 30 days after MC, but didn't realise it was AF as it was so heavy.  Went to the doctor as I thought I was bleading to death.  Was really embarassed when they told me it was just a period.

All I can say is look after yourself.  Put your needs and feelings first.

Take care

 x


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## ♥JJ1♥

Felix sending you a bug hug, it is so hard I didn't really bleed much and then went back for a scan 10 days later and the baby was still there so had ERPC and AF came 4 weeks afterwards.  I then cycled after a AF but I really thought that I would get pregnant and the battle would be keeping my baby safe, when I had a disasterous cycle that was when it really hit me.

Take time and each day as it comes.
L x


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## Felix42

Thank you so much for your replies.  JJ, that must have been so difficult to find you still needed an ERPC  and your subsequent AF sounds like a horrible experience Diva.  FullMoon, so sorry that you had another bad day recently.  I guess it just lurks there and can ambush us.   

I've been having my head in the sand the last week so apologies for not replying sooner.  I had my parents down for the weekend - they were meant to be coming to see my first scan   As it was instead of that, I would have been going to the EPU on Friday to see if I needed an ERPC, but I couldn't even do that as I had two days worth of migraine on Thurs and Friday.  So I'm off to the EPU tomorrow instead and am so hoping that all will be over.  It was so lovely to see my parents though and when I got all tearful yesterday it was fantastic to get a hug from my mum. 

Love and hugs, Felix xx


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## suitcase of dreams

Felix - so sorry you are going through this, hope all goes well tomorrow at the EPU...lovely that your parents could be there for you 

Sending    to all of us who have suffered losses. 

Suitcase
x


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## Betty-Boo

Felix honey -I can't seem tofind the words        
thinking of you - take care mini x x


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## ciaelle

Felix  so sorry for you

i had several misscarriage (no reason found) one at one week,  8 weeks,3 weeks, then i had my daughter naturally,(she is now 3and half years old) and after i had again other misscarriages at 3weeks,10 weeks and 3 weeks; each time i had af normally between 25 and 31 days after the loss.  i had a fet in march, but biochemical pregnancy and will try again in may (according to my dr, misscariages were due to my age 45years, but not for last fet..so no luck or problem, still don't know..)

good evening


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## lulumead

big hugs felix...glad your mum was around to give you a real one.    
xx


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## ♥JJ1♥

Felix  I hope that the EPU trip goes ok, and that you don't have to have an ERPC.  So pleased that you could spend some time with your parents. Thinking of you
L x


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## RedRose

Felix, so so sorry to hear what you are going through.  Like most of us, my AF took about 5 weeks after my m/cs to return ( but don't worry if it takes a bit longer ) and was heavier and more painful, you might need to put your feet up and take extra care of yourself then as well as now.  I felt better when it came, it's your body regenerating itself and preparing itself for another successful pregnancy .  Glad you have got a hysteroscopy sorted, like the others have said, I found it helpful to think ahead.
    It's very poignant reading people's comments here.  I remember when it snowed last winter it just came into my head how I would have been showing it to my baby for the first time and those thoughts do hit you without warning at times, as in any bereavement.  I think it's important to do whatever gives you comfort, physically and mentally.  Hugs to everyone on here, love Rosi.


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## wizard

Felix    I hope tomorrow goes as well as it can x


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## Roo67

Felix - hope the appointment went well today, thinking of you

R x


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## OneStepAtATime

I've started this post several times. I don't know what to write because it's hard to put it in words.

People say "I hope you're feeling better" - but I want to say "I'm not feeling better at all. I'm just able to get on with "normal life" now. I still cry. A lot. I still get incredibly upset at dates, reminders, other pregnant women (I have a good friend who's expecting and it's just too painful to see her at the moment...), so many things..."

They put my babies in a box after the D&C and let me spend time with them, saying goodbye. But then I was put on a ward and the woman in the next bed (where I then spent 5 hours) was pregnant with twins, and she/other patients were talking about her pregnancy.

People try and say helpful things. But they've no idea how hurtful what they say is. 
"It's God's plan" ?? That makes me so angry that someone can tell me that. 
"Now you can get out and date" !!!!! That left me speechless. I've just lost my two precious precious babies and you're telling me I can date?? That friend is about to get married and she also said to me that maybe we'll get pregnant together soon... She has no idea. This is about grief and loss - not just rebooting a computer. 
"At least you can get pregnant" was another classic. And part of me knows that they're right - it's some comfort to know I responded well to drugs and the embryos did implant. But they didn't give me a baby - and that's what I really want (not just getting pregnant).

I so want to get going on another treatment. But I bled for 4 and a half weeks (they'd said it would be 7-10 days, but it wasn't) and I 've no idea when AF will be here. And I know that mentally I'm not in a good place for treatment. I long to be pregnant again - but being so sad can't be good.

I wanted to get back to sport and being fit. But I've put on 10 pounds since the D&C... I can't fit my clothes and I feel rubbish.

I don't really know what to post - there's nothing anyone can say to make things right. But I know from your signatures that some of you have gone through this and worse.

I've still got a frozen blastcyst. But the chances of that working are slim. I will be trying that - perhaps next cycle, perhaps the one after (I'm worried my sadness will affect things).

I've spent a fair bit of energy (and it's really upsetting to do, because talking about the m/c upsets me every time I say anything) having appointments at other clinics and talking to the European Sperm Bank because MFS had said I'm at the back of the queue and it'll be at least 8 months for a donor. I've reserved someone from ESB, but he's not available till July (he sounds good, and although others are available before then, I thought I'd prefer someone I really like. But not trying is killing me. I just want to be pregnant again. Time is rushing past and I'm now 38...).

I just so didn't expect little Baby A to die. He was so well the week before. A strong heartbeat and waving arms and legs. I just don't know why he didn't make it... And I wonder about things I did (I did swim that week. The midwife assured me it'd be ok. But I do wonder. I came out of the pool flushed in the face, despite going very very slowly. Maybe I was overheated and that killed my baby No one will ever be able to tell me. But I promise you that I won't be swimming next time. No matter what anyone says.)

I was lent a book - Grief Unseen - about Pregnancy Loss and the Arts. It has ideas for expressing some of this through art, creative writing, etc. Giving birth to _something_. I'm still searching for images that fit with how I feel. One woman found a teapot a good image - you fill and empty and refill it. She had had multiple miscarriages. Perhaps this weekend I'll get some paints out. My mum was an art teacher and although I'm not talented at all, I'd like to have a go at expressing this another way. I just can't find the words to express it all.

This is when being single and going through this is particularly painful. No-one else is mourning my children.

Others have written on the boards about feeling their life is centred solely on TTC - and that's how I feel. But I'm not even trying at the moment, so it's TTC except I'm on hold. So there's no hope at all of being pregnant soon.

I don't know how long it'll take to feel well enough emotionally to try again. It feels important to make sure I am, so I don't compromise things. But part of the pain is that I can't try again at the moment.

I'm sorry - a long "me" post. I will start posting again elsewhere. I wondered whether an "in-between treatments" thread might be an idea?

Take care
OneStep


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## Roo67

onestep - there are no words but just wanted to send you a big  

never apologise for a me post, I'm sure many of us can identify with how you are feeling, I know exactly what you mean about no one else mourning our little angels, people are well meaning but they cannot really understand.

take care hun

R x


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## lulumead

wish there was something that could be said to make it better but there isn't, but we're all hear to listen, so please post whatever is on your mind, hopefully knowing you can do that here is helpful.

sending you lots of     

Doing something creative sounds like a very positive thing too.

xxxxx


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## Elpida

Oh OneStep, I've been thinking of you. I don't know what to say, I can't know how you feel but I hope that you continue to post here and that it helps.


Ex


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## Betty-Boo

Onestep       I just can not find the right words ... Thinking of you.    

Mini x x


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## wizard

Onestep    

However well meaning people are, they things they say just aren't useful sometimes.  You lost your babies and that's the awfully painful reality for you.  Well not lost them - it sounds like you left on the bus or something or were careless which you were not.  Your babies died and there are no words that can change that or make it ok because it isn't and never will be.  The one thing that may at some point make a difference to where you are now is time and nothing can make that come sooner than it can or will. My heart goes out to you and your suffering and I hope you manage to find a small comfort in something, whether it be words, friends, time alone or whatever might help in some small way.

Take care of that very sore heart you have

Wizard x


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## Lou-Ann

Onestep    
Thinking of you....

Lou-Ann x


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## sunnygirl1

Onestep        

I feel for you.  I wish I could find some words to ease your pain.  Thinking of you

Sunny xx


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## suitcase of dreams

Onestep - the other girls have said it all, and Wizard particularly eloquently. But really there are no words, I know that only too well. Nothing anyone else says will make it any better, as much as we all wish it could and would. 

So I am simply adding my thoughts and    to all the others and hoping very much that each day brings you a step closer to a form of acceptance (I think this is as close as 'getting over it' that we can hope for), and a step closer to the strength to try again if that is what you want to do

Oh, and you just post wherever you want - or even have your own thread - at least that worked well for me when I needed to express myself at the most difficult times,
Take care, am thinking of you,
Suitcase
x


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## Chowy

One Step

Thinking of you and sending you lots of      

Chowy x


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## winky77

Just wanted to send     to all the ladies who have experienced such terrible losses.....words fail me right now...


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## Felix42

Onestep, I'm so sorry for the pain you are going through.    
I hope you are treating yourself kindly. From what I've read there is little that we do that can affect a miscarriage happening, so please go easy on yourself. 

Love & warm hugs to you & all who have experienced the pain of miscarriage. 
Felix xx


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## Mifi

One Step

I am so so sorry hunny, I know nothing will take away your pain but please just trust that it will get a little easier with time    The worst thing you can do is analyse what you did or did not do,but I know this is much easier said than done but doing this won't give you the answers you crave so much for   Try not to bottle it up, just let it out    and give yourself time to heal physically and emotionally. You are in our thoughts and sadly I know so many of us can completely identify with what you are going through and we are here for you so pleease keep posting.     

Maybe an inbetween treatment thread will be a good idea, not sure how many of us are at that stage now  

Huge hugs to you and all   

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


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## RedRose

Hi everyone,

    Onestep, I am so sorry for what you have been through.  I could identify with almost everything you said and I totally understand that longing to be pregnant again as soon as possible.  It somehow seems that it is the only way to make yourself feel better and if going for appointments and looking ahead helps, ( which it did for me ), then carry on doing that.  I know how it's worrying when you are older but at 38, you still have enough time to not put too much immediate pressure on yourself.  And although I know it doesn't help with the grief for your babies, the fact that you got as far as you did is a very positive sign for the future.  After a few months, I did start to see this and now I can look back and treasure the time that I did have with my babies, although it still breaks my heart that they didn't make it.
      I did find it helpful to read as much as I could about miscarriage and the reasons for it as like you, I looked for things that maybe I had done, that had caused it.  Like felix said, it is true that it is hardly ever anything the mother has done, it is caused by things that we have no control over.  But I know, like you there are a few things that I won't be doing should I be lucky enough to get pregnant again. 
      I also found it helpful to have a few tests done as well just to rule out any problems.  One of the hardest things is that very few of us ever get a reason for why our babies are lost so we are left worrying about everything.  I think it must be especially hard when you see, as you say, that your baby A looked so healthy on the scan.  
    I would agree that doing something creative is extremely helpful.  I can remember after my first miscarriage, one of the first things I felt like doing was spending time in my garden and looking after seedlings and cuttings.  I think I just needed to nurture, grow something.  I can remember feeling totally worthless and empty and feeling that I had failed to take care of my baby when now I can see that I did my best at the time and that is all any of us can do.  Even if we can't have babies ( hopefully all of us will   ) everyone is still valuable in themselves for their other talents and what they can contribute.  But I know how hard it is to see that when you just want to be pregnant again. 
      Please don't worry too much about your weight, I put on too and it doesn't help you feel any better.  But at the moment, you need to do the basics, eat good food, get plenty of sleep, fresh air and spend time with people who make you feel better. You have been through a very physically and emotionally traumatic experience so take it easy on yourself.  
                              lots of love, Rosi.


----------



## carnivaldiva

I don't read this thread very often, as sometimes the pain is just too much to bear.  

OneStep sending you loads of     .  Know exactly what you mean about being single and the feeling of going through this alone.

My mother was with me when I miscarried last year at 22 weeks.  I know it broke her heart having to watch me go through it.  As if things weren't bad enough, watching my mother trying so hard to be strong for me and watching her cry was heart wrenching. 

Love my mother dearly, but I remember her telling me not to cry and things will work out and me screaming at her like a demented banshee that that was probably my only chance of being a mother.  I know she was really hurt and only trying to comfort me.  She's supported me 100% and still continues to do so.

Inside you feel like you're dying, but you still try and put on a brave face for others.

I lost my daughter October 08, but I still feel the pain.  Some days are better than others, but we just all have to deal with it in our own way.

One Step, take comfort where you can.  Take time out for you.  

This is for you     and to everyone else grieving


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Thank you Carnival, Rosi, FullMoon, Felix, Winky, Suity, Chowy, Sunnygirl, Lou-Ann, Wizard, Claire, Mini, Esperanza, Lulu, Roo  - these are hard journeys we are on. 

It's now almost 2 months since I had that last scan where they found no heart beats, but so much is still so painful. Someone I manage at work came to see me a couple of days ago to tell me that she's 11 weeks... I only slept 3 hours the following night - all those feelings of grief and injustice and sadness all came back with a vengeance. 

As you say, some days are better than others. The counsellor gave a useful image: getting the news about a miscarriage is like dropping over a waterfall (you're swimming/travelling along smoothly then suddenly you're plunged into all this grief and sadness). You're stuck in the turmoil at the bottom  - but then sometimes get to the sands or quieter bits under the waterfall and have some relief. But then back into the turmoil (and hearing news about others' pregnancies has that effect at the mo). The end of the image is meant to be to get to the continuing bit of the river which again is taking you onward more smoothly. 

I found it useful because I have days when I'm plunged back into feeling awful - but as the counsellor said, over time it might be the turmoil lasts less time or I can get out of it more easily. It's true that some days are better though. I can smile a genuine smile now (everything was very forced for a while - or done just out of habit to get through...) 

To all of you carrying the pain of pregnancy loss - big, big hugs.   
OneStep


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Onestep  

Take care,
Jovi x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Onestep     x x


----------



## lulumead

Onestep...more      sorry they are only virtual.
Take care.
xx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Oh Rose, big   to you

It seems this has been a very very bad week for us single girls  

I know sadly only too well that there are no words which will make you feel any better right now, so just sending   
Wishing you the strength to get through the difficult next few days and weeks, 
Suitcase
x


----------



## wizard

Rose what can I say. I was so very pleased for you when you succeeded this time againt all the odds and it is so sad to hear that you have lost the baby.  My thoughts are with you and take very good care of yourself at this desperately difficult time


----------



## Damelottie

Oh Rose - I was just stunned when I read your news  . I am so so sorry and wish there was more I could do


----------



## lulumead

Oh Rose, I am so so sorry to hear this.  Absolutely shocked.      
Glad you had Felix with you this afternoon.  We're here when you need us.

sending lots of love
xx


----------



## winky77

Rose   .....I was so shocked to get your text.  It is so cruel that you were just going along for an extra scan but with no reason to think there would be a problem. I know there is nothing anyone can say to make things better right now.  But if all of us could take a little bit of your pain away you know that we would do that.  I am so glad Felix could meet with you and that you weren't on your own.   

Suity is right that in lots of ways this has been an awful week for the singlies thread. Your news,  Suity's PGD results and far too many BFNs in a row.  But at the other end of the spectrum we have had 2 healthy bouncing babies join our group and a bumper number of people on the 2ww which has to give us some hope going forward. It is one of those BitterSweet weeks that many of us will never forget. 

I have every reason to believe that Christmas will still be special this year....yes of course you will mourn the anniversary of this lost little one but hopefully you will be blooming with a full bump of a well established pregnancy.  I know I intend to be ! 

Sending you what strength I can to get through the next few days.   

lol

..Winky


----------



## indekiwi

Rose, wish I could be half as articulate as Winky - who has said everything that I would like to have but wouldn't have had the words.  Going back over your post, I promise you that you were never stupid, and you should always dare to dream - this has been such a special period in your life and your pregnancy was in all senses real and no one can take it away from you.  The baby clothes you bought while away will find good use with the baby you will eventually have.  Words may seem to be empty, cold comfort, but draw whatever strength you can in the hours, days and weeks ahead from the concern and well wishes of everyone who posts here for you.  Dare to dream again, and we will dare to dream for and with you too.     at such a dreadfully sad time in your life,

A-Mx


----------



## some1

Rose - so very sorry to read your devastating news - am thinking of you.

Some1

xx


----------



## Sima

Rose - I am so sorry to hear your news.  I can't even begin to imagine how you are feeling right now but I do want you to know that I am thinking of you.   

Sx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Rose  - I really can not find the words         take care - we are all here for you    

Mini x x


----------



## Elpida

Oh Rose     the others have put things far more eloquently than I ever could, you're in my thoughts.

E x


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Rose
I'm so sorry. It's too sad for words...       

Do what you need to do to look after yourself now and over the coming weeks. 

Take time for yourself and be gentle. When you long for a baby so much and for so long, it's... I actually can't find the words... unbelievably painful.  

Don't be surprised if you feel worse in a few days time. Grief doesn't follow a linear pattern. I didn't know how I'd get through. But somehow you do - you will.

If you want to get in touch I'll PM my number. 
Take care of yourself.
OneStep


----------



## muddypaws

Rose, so sorry to hear your devastating news. I know there is little that I can say that can help and little to explain why some of our babies do not make it - I guess it was easier for me because my lost one was one of twins and the other kept going and this certainly made all the difference. The only thing I can say in relation to my experience is that there are other embies that will work for you - your body hasn't done anything to reject your embie and this is positive, it's just the embie that couldn't quite make it. Keep going, look after yourself and make use of all the support here.    

Muddy x


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Rose I am so sorry, words fail me, thinking of you  
Take care
Jovi x


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Rose I am so sorrry to hear your sad news- I was asking if you were coming tomeet us yesterday for coffee and at that time you nightmare was becoming a reality. It will be a hard time ahead for you -like the girls said you'll always be a mummy to your angel baby and it will always have a special place in your heart and be ur first baby.

This ttc process is so hard and just when you hope ur baby is on the way
Another cruel twist and turn

I hope u have support around u
L x


----------



## RedRose

Rose, I am so sorry for your terrible loss, my heart goes out to you.  I hope you have some supportive friends and family around you to help you through the initial shock and grief.  Your little baby will live on inside your heart.  Take care of yourself  , love Rosi xxx


----------



## Lou-Ann

Rose, I am so sorry for your loss  . I can't even begin to imagine what you are going through and know that words will be of little comfort at the moment, but just want you to know that I am thinking of you    

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Mifi

Rose

I am so so sorry to hear of your loss and can completely relate to the total utter shock when you think all is well and then to find out all is not - I am still haunted by flash backs of me in the lift at the hospital with my best friend laughing and joking saying that I must be feeling like C**p for a reason and looking forward to seeing my little bean again     I knew instantly from the doctors face that something major was wrong    For me that m/c was so much harder to take than my first one as with this one I had had no pain or bleeding and was still feeling most of pg symtoms. I to was so angry with myself letting my guard down, living the dream and daring to relax a little with that pg and of course I hadn't resisted buying a selection of carefully chosen baby items which are now wrapped and boxed away and out of sight. The only comfort that I can say is time will help you heal hunny    

The hospital recommended an ERPC which I decided to have, rather than prolong the agony waiting to naturally m/c (which I was told could take weeks) I am more than happy if you want to pm me if you have questions you would like to ask. I am utterly devistated for you and so wish I could take away your pain     but really glad Felix could be with you   

I know each time we have to endure another loss on this thread my heart beats so fast as it is  so gut renchingly hard and pains us all, but reading support from FF even though through tear filled eyes more than often at least we can share our pain and it does help even if at times it feels like just a tinsy bit  

Huge hugs to all    

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## dottiep

Rose I was so shocked and upset to read your news just now   
Please take some time out to grieve and give yourself some tlc but don't give up.  You are a strong and determined lady and this will happen for you.  For now, look after yourself & spend time with people who are close to you.
My thoughts are with you hun.

dottie
x


----------



## Roo67

Rose, I am so so sorry that you had this dreadful news, Felix did text me and I'm glad she was with you on Saturday.

As the others have said, take some time and hope you're able to get some TLC


R xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Rose thinking of you - may your little one rest in peace- they were v much a part of you & our thread and will be missed- take care
L x


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Hi Rose  

I am so sorry you are in this position but pleased that clinic and staff are being supportive.  I can only speak as I have been effected by ERPC and was not offered a medical management, only natural ewhich failed or D+C. 

ERPC's are usually done blindly not under camera/ultrasound guidance which could account for damage (it is possible to do them under camera ike hystersocopies), and also you could ask about the options of them examining the baby to try and find out why this happened, was s/he chromosomally normal or was this inevitable fate- the last of the London ladies I heard of had hers done at Royal London Hospital and they agreed to do it for her (4th m/c) most Drs will try and refuse. Also the risks of leaving the baby inside or infection and also damaging the lining, or could you have antibiotics etc

I have posted the Asherman's support link to help you make a more informed choice- the youtube links are alos very helpful (an interview with a Dr from one of the ladies about the condition and a personal story of the lady who set up the support group in Cyprus).  Saying that I now have the real possibility of never been able to get pregnant due to lining damage and if I do then a condiserable higher risk of mc- but many ladies have no problems.  I think I would have opted for a medical management had I been offered but I was scared of 'seeing a baby' and pain.

Take care
L x


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Rose
I've just written a long message, only to have it swallowed by cyberspace.  

I will write again later.

Thinking of you   
OneStep


----------



## RedRose

Hi Rose, good to hear from you .  Although I wish none of us had any experience of miscarriage, it is something that can't really be imagined unless you have gone through it, so at least we can support each other.  I knew no-one who had gone through this at the time when I had mine and was not a member here either, so I remember desperately trying in the midst of grief to decide what to do.
     Remember you don't have to make any quick decisions, if after seeing your GP tomorrow you want more time or want to speak to anyone else do that, don't feel pushed into doing something you are not comfortable with.  I personally found the Miscarriage Association very helpful, when I rang them I got straight through to a real person who was very comforting and very helpful, their number will be on the net.
     Your priorities here are to protect your future fertility and to manage as safely and comfortably as possible the end of this pregnancy, of course all the options are terribly sad.  I am normally a quite independent person but I even asked a close friend to stay with me as I simply didn't know what my body was going to do.  I had some warning with a little light bleeding at 9 weeks but the first scan still showed the heartbeat, a week later the heartbeat had gone, but I still did not miscarry fully.  I found deciding what to do incredibly difficult and felt as if my body almost wouldn't give this baby up as I wanted it so much.  
     I decided against an ERPC as partly by then I had seen enough doctors and hospitals and just wanted to be left alone and also because I read some information about how the womb can be damaged, although I know this is rare.  I considered the pills but at my EPU this had to be done in hospital and I just wanted to be at home.  I am sure if you chose this option they would try and manage your pain as effectively as possible.  I decided in the end to opt for expectant management.  It was important to me that I "looked after" my baby until the end if that makes any sense and that was just my way of doing it.  I think everyone will have different views but this was the least worst option for me.
     I wasn't scared about seeing the baby, carrying it for a bit longer even though I knew it had died, other people feel differently, I know.  I was also fortunate that I didn't get an infection even though I passed a little more tissue during my next period after the m/c , which was heavy and a little more painful but nothing I couldn't manage myself.  I personally felt that my body could cope naturally but I would have gone straight back to my EPU if I felt anything was wrong.
     Just take your time with your decision, and do whatever gives you the most comfort to help yourself through the coming days and weeks.  We are all thinking of you and here to help if we can.  
                       lots of love, Rosi xx


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Rose
I chose a D&C because I didn't want the trauma of a long wait with heavy bleeding and pain for an extended period. 

I didn't bleed much for 3 or so days following the D&C (perhaps because of the progesterone?) but I then bled for 4 and a half weeks (I was told it’d be 7-10 days). Who knows how long it'd have been without the D&C. When I contacted the hospital, concerned about the bleeding, they said that it was normal (they got me to do another pregnancy test to check everything had gone). And it did eventually stop. 

I had my A/F about 2 weeks later – reasonably heavy but only for a couple of days. I guess my lining had been pretty depleted by then. 

Even if you have a natural m/c, you may need a D&C because they are sometimes incomplete. And there is a risk of infection.  

I hope my lining is ok still. I wasn't aware of Ashermans etc at the time (only through following JJ1's link since then). The procedure, they said, went well, with no perforation of the uterus etc, so I hope it's ok. It’s something I want checked before my next treatment.

I'm now thinking a lot about reasons for the m/c and reading Alan Beer's book (Is my body baby friendly?) about reproductive immunology. No-one (clinic or hospital) mentioned about doing any tests on the "products of conception" as they called them. Maybe I should have asked for them to be done. It might help now if I had done. If you get the chance, then perhaps try. 

I felt it was important to have my little ones put in a box so I could spend time with them - I remember the awful empty feeling from after the termination in my 20's when I woke up and everything had just gone. I felt it was good to have an interim stage where I could say goodbye to them outside of me. Everyone's different - but I felt so strongly about this and although it was certainly viewed as unusual (I had to keep repeating it to the various people, doctors, nurses etc) it was respected. I'm only saying about that so you know that if there is something you feel strongly about, the normal protocol can be changed - so just tell them.

Thinking of you 
Take care
OneStep


----------



## Felix42

Rose, I just wanted to send you a big  for what you are going through & the decisions you face. You know we are all here for you. 
The girls have offered some great advice here. It is so helpful to be able to hear others experience about this very little talked about tragedy that affects far too many of us. 
I'm so pleased your manager was supportive. 
Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Mifi

Hi Rose

I have had a natural m/c as well as an ERPC and happy to share if it helps you hunny    

My first m/c was natural and for me I felt very scared (but I was alone) and it was very painful - the only way I can describe it it was like I percieve what it was like to be in labour as I had painful contractions every few minutes. In a panic I ended up seeing my GP and he gave me a painkilling injection and some tablets aimed at relaxing my muscles, but if I am honest neither really helped me I just had to wait it out and hope I didn't end up in hospital anyway due to excessive bleeding or incomplete miscarriage. Luckily for me I didn't have to go to hospital. One thing that did really shock me and wish I had been warned about was the amount of bleeding and the size of the blood clots that came out (sorry TMI) but at times it felt like some alien matter was leaving my body!!! I can't really remember how long I bled for but I think approx. 7 days. The next AF was 5 weeks later and was still not normal for me as heavier than normal and had lots of tiny clots in, but wasn't really painful.

For my second m/c I opted for an ERPC as I was pg for longer and also had no signs what so ever that I would m/c anytime soon and was told it could be weeks before it happened and I could also end up with an infection. I also wanted to start the greiving process as soon as possible as I still felt pg and couldn't move on until I wasn't, if you get what I mean   

From the clinic I was taken onto the gyney ward to do the usual paperwork and sign the consent forms. After a while a doctor came to administer a pessarie to soften and open my cervix and was warned it could start me cramping and bleeding (which it didn't), then the porters came down to collect me and take me to theatre. By this stage I was shaking with fear and ready to run out of the hospital in my gown screaming you are not taking my baby away!!!!!!  He/she doesn't even want to leave me yet   As much as my impulses was saying to do that, I knew deep down that the ERPC was the right decision, so I managed to hold it together, as I knew it wouldn't be long before I was put to sleep. Not sure if you have had an anasthetic before? but you have a catheter put in the back of your hand which is mostly just a sharp scratch and then they administer an anti-sickness drug and a strong pain killer and then the white stuff that just makes you sleep, so within 10 seconds your gone (the white stuff does feel cold and wierd pressure on my chest but maybe different for others). I then woke up in recovery with the usual heart monitor and a nurse asking me how my pain was. I was given morphine in the catheter in my hand and the nurse checked the sanitary pad that was placed inbetween my legs in theatre - although that sounds awful other women doing that I was so drugged up I was aware what they were doing but just didn't care plus I new my baby was gone and kinda had the attutide 'I just don't care anymore' because I couldn't possibly hurt anymore than I was     I was then taken back on the ward were nurses checked my pad again and also put a pair of paperknickers on me and I was left to sleep (but it was about 9pm by them anyway as I was the last to go to theatre). I was woken up 2 or 3 more times in the night to check my pad but I would say the bleeding was equivalent to a medium flow period with moderate cramping. By the morning the bleeding had practically stopped and I was allowed to go home to rest and I was signed off work for a week. I had no bleeding until 2 weeks later which was then just residual old brown blood for a few days and then my next AF was about 5 or 6 weeks later. 

For me the ERPC was the easier experience as in some ways it felt like I just went to sleep and when I woke up it was mostly over. I do appreciate there are risks with having the ERPC but even if you opt for a natural m/c you may still have to have one anyway.

Big hugs and sending you strength & courage    

I hope this hasn't scared you and it has helped - My tears join yours and you are in my thoughts  as with all the ladies with angel babies   

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Rose, 

Having read FM's ERPC experience, it sounds much more 'serious' than mine. 

I did not stay overnight in hospital after mine and I had almost no bleeding/cramping afterwards at all. I went in at lunchtime, was last on the list, so went down to theatre around 4pm. I'd started to bleed a little by that point because they'd given me the tablet around 1pm (I wasn't supposed to be last on the list but got moved around a bit) - but not heavy bleeding...

Anyway, I was back on the ward by 5pm and home by 7pm. I do tend to recover quite well from GA though - the girl opposite me had gone in before me and was still asleep when I went home....

It was a Thursday and I went back to work the following Monday, and physically I was fine already by Friday afternoon - no pain, no bleeding

So it doesn't always mean an overnight stay etc

Hope all goes well with the operation, I'm so sorry you're having to go through this,

Suitcase
x


----------



## Mifi

Rose,  I hope all goes well and it isn't too traumatic for you    take care and be kind to yourself  


Suity   

Onestep   

   to all

Love FM XXXXXXX


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Rose
I so identify with so much of what you wrote. 

I too wanted to hide away.

I haven't posted the following on the board before - but I tried to go back to work several times (starting on Mon. mornings) and found that I couldn't. The first week I left at lunchtime Monday. The next week I stayed till Wed.

When I was still bleeding after 3 weeks, the clinic said just to get my GP to sign me off - and I had another 12 days off work. 

I really really found it tough.

Go with what you need - I'm sure I'm being unfair, but I felt a certain pressure from others because they seemed to think I'd get over it quicker. And I didn't. 

I'm just trying to say that it's ok to take this at your own pace. 

I couldn't get over to other people enough just how awful it is. 

I too was looking for meaningful ways of saying goodbye. I know what you mean about having a reminder there. The book "Grief unseen" might be of interest to you. It looks at pregnancy loss and the arts. I haven't really done much in the way of the exercises, but it was good to read. Maybe for later though. 

You're very much in my thoughts. 
Sending you a big hug - especially for tomorrow.  

By the way - something that no-one told me until the acupuncturist diagnosed it - I was getting terrible headaches after the m/c. I never get headaches - ever. And the acupuncturist asked me where they were and diagnosed them as hormone related. You've still got tons of all sorts of hormones in you and they will be affecting you a lot. That does get better with time. I found acupuncture really helped my head. 

Take care
Love
OneStep


----------



## Myra

Hi Rose

I just saw your post hun, I am so sorry for your loss and my heart aches for you, I have been for an ERPC today, well my second one as I lost identical twins at 11 weeks, I had a ERPC on 20th April which was not successful, I am glad that they are going to use the ultrasound guidance for you, I wish they could have done that for me.

Just wanted to wish you all the best and hope that it all goes really well for you, the actual procedure is not that bad and I feel ok, not much pain and hardly any bleeding,   that all goes well for you tomorrow.

Myra xxx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Thinking of you Rose


----------



## Mifi

Rose


----------



## Lou-Ann

Rose, I'm so sorry that you are having to go through this. I hope that everything goes as well as it can for you tomorrow, thinking of you    

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Felix42

Rose, sending you lots of big   for what you are going through.  I will be thinking of you tomorrow.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


----------



## muddypaws

Rose, so sorry that you are having to go through this. Will be thinking of you tomorrow and hoping that it goes as well as these things can.   

LOL

Muddy x


----------



## bingbong

Rose, thinking of you.   

Bingbong x


----------



## RedRose

Rose  , hope tomorrow passes as quickly as possible for you, you sound like you are in very good hands.  Take as much time as you need off work, like Onestep I too tried to go back very soon and then had to go off again as I couldn't cope.  Most people will understand and if they don't, tough.  Put yourself first.  
    I also saw my baby on the scan when the heart was still beating and I am now very grateful that I have that perfect little image.  I even did a little drawing of it when I got home and wrote all my favourite baby names around it, trying to will it to keep going I suppose.  Ways to remember your baby will come to you in time.  I promise you will feel better in time.

    Myra, what a dreadful experience you are going through.  Surely as you say they should be using ultrasound for everyone, it's bad enough to have to go through it once, let alone twice.  I hope everything will be fine now for you and your body can start to recover  ,
                         love Rosi.


----------



## lulumead

Rose     

I wish there was something more I could do. I hope it is as smooth as possible.  The rose sounds a lovely idea.  As the others have said, time to focus on you and do whatever you need to until you feel stronger.
Thinking of you, sending big hug.

Myra: sorry to hear of your loss too.    
xxx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Rose thinking of you and hope that your procedure goes as smooth as possible I took my donors partner and my friend.  My donor's partner always comes with me and into the anaethetic room, he is the last person I see and always the first person I ask for in recovery, as soon as I have spat my LMA out I beg for him.

My friend had a spinal op today and I was there when she came back to the ward and she started to cry as soon as she saw me, I just held her hand, phoned her mum for her to say she was ok, wiped her face , lip balmed her, got her water to drink, (then sorted out her anti metic prescription, prevented a drug error and made sure she got her analgesia) I would take someone with you.  

I treasure my baby photos/scans.  In a way I felt I could start to move on, and even though I am not religious I do light candles for my baby, release balloons. 

L x


----------



## indekiwi

Rose, so sorry that you are facing this outcome, and hope the op goes smoothly tomorrow.      

Myra, thinking of you.      

A-Mx


----------



## Damelottie

Rose - I feel so very sad for you and am sending all my love for tomorrow. I'm so so sorry   

LL xxxx


----------



## Felix42

Rose, sending you huge hugs for a smooth recovery physically and emotionally from what you've been through. 

JJ, hope your friend is ok after her op.  Sounds like you are a lovely coming round companion. 

Myra, hope you are doing ok.  Sounds like a horrible experience to be going through.  Thinking of you too.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Sima

Rose - I am so very sorry for your loss.    I hope the procedure went well today.  I am thinking of you.


----------



## lulumead

sending some    rose.
xx


----------



## RedRose

Rose, I hope you are home now? and everything has gone as well as it can in this awful situation.  Hope you are getting lots of TLC from your friends and family, love Rosi.


----------



## Roo67

Rose,

I hope all went well and you are now recovering.  

R x


----------



## Elpida

Rose, thinking of you  

E xx


----------



## Damelottie

Hope you're OK Rose and it all went as well as it could have done


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Rose, thinking of you  

Jovi x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Rose       thinking you you honey x x


----------



## wizard

Rose what can I say?  You are very brave and I'm sending you lots of    and rest and I really do hope you feel better soon although I know it will take time too.  I'm very glad for you that the hospital already had a policy in place and that your baby will be treated with the respect it reserves.

Take good care of yourself.

Wizard x


----------



## lulumead

Sending lots of  . Look after yourself, I'm glad that the nurses are taking care of your baby in a sensitive way. So hard for you. Take it easy, its going to take time, and you are probably completely emotionally exhausted and will need lots of time to recover.

love
xx


----------



## winky77

Rose....you have very much been in my thoughts over the last few days.  You are a very strong incredible woman and the way you are handling this is testimony to that.  At the same time I know you will tune into how you are feeling and will do what your body, your mind and your heart needs to keep moving forwards.  I have been really touched by the postings from the other girls who have also been through this.  It is clear that life will never be quite the same again after an experience like this and your baby will always be part of you.  I am sure you will find a way to grieve and to remember your baby in a way that works for you. 

  

..Winky


----------



## muddypaws

Rose, I am glad that the hospital have been sensitive and caring. This is such a heartbreaking time for all ladies who have had to go through this experience but is an example of how incredibly brave we all are. We take such a chance in hoping that our dreams will come true, take the risk that we will be disappointed but we do it never-the-less. It is so brave to go through this pain and carry on hoping. I hope that you will recover in time and continue your journey. Take care  

Muddy


----------



## RedRose

Hi Rose, so glad you are home and that the hospital has made proper arrangements that you are comfortable with.  It sounds like you have been very well taken care of.  Take it very, very easy on yourself and don't worry about work, love Rosi.


----------



## Mifi

Hi guys 

How is everybody doing?     I am struggling again a bit, I think it is because I am about to start tx again which feels so bitter sweet   I know I should be grateful that I can start again so soon but it has definately brought back the pain of my losses. I feel very alone sometimes, bad insomnia, I crave hugs but no one to give me one   and I am pretty tearful at times   I am hoping this will pass quickly and it is just PMT as AF is just around the corner.

Will the pain ever go away? Will we ever stop missing our angel babies    Even the thought of a baby in my arms doesn't offer the comfort it used to - after all each baby is an individual  

Perhaps I am still not ready to start again   I am not sure that waiting any longer will make much difference though  

  to all

Love FM XxXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Chowy

Rose and Myra you have both been through so much over the past few weeks, I have only just got round to reading the posts and feel for you both so much.  I was very lucky and havent been through a pregnancy loss so cant even imagine how you must be feeling, but please be kind to yourselves and take the support offered from this wonderful thread with wonderful people on it.

Take care

Chowy


----------



## suitcase of dreams

FM - sorry you're struggling at the moment.   

When anyone dies, you know that it's not a case of getting over it, or the pain 'going away' as such. And rather about learning to live with it. And over time it does become easier to live with. But there will always be moments which remind you and which are tough - I guess right now when you are starting tx again it's all come top of mind. But it will fade into the background again as you move forwards - not forgotten, always a part of you and who you are, but hopefully not something which stops you from becoming, and doing what you want to do in the future  

Take care, and hope you feel brighter soon,
Suitcase,
x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Suity, I know this will pass, but in the meantime I am going to have to just ride it out   Feeling exhausted from lack of sleep probably doesn't help, I am going to take Nytol tonight to see if that helps as I am sure a good nights sleep will help me feel that bit more positive & stronger.


----------



## Mifi

Hi Guys

How you all doing   Can I please ask if anybody else experiences this please.......

I can be absolutely fine for days and then suddenly I will be doing an everyday task like running a bath and I just get this rush of intense overwhelming sadness, literally out of the blue which often brings me to the brink of tears or at times into a complete sobbing mess on the floor   I just don't understand it as its not as if I was thinking about anything at the time    so no triggers   Its has happened a few times now   Afterwards I feel unsettled, exhausted and my heart hurts (if you get what I mean) this can last a few hours and then I feel OK again - Is this some strange symptom of subconcious grief or am I losing my marbles?   

Has anyone else experienced this? 

Thanks Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Hi Full Moon
I am so sorry to hear you are suffering so much and not sleeping. 

Those times of being reduced to literally lying on the floor sobbing were frequent in the first few weeks. When I get upset, it's more from triggers now - especially the "what might have been" (eg tomorrow I'd be 23 weeks...) - and not as intense. But we are all different and we take different amounts of time and it's ok to react in different ways.  

I would seriously encourage you to try and find someone skilled in grief counselling. My clinic's counsellor has worked in fertility and grief counselling for years and I'm sure her wisdom and insights have played a significant part in helping me on the path towards healing. And those sessions were paid for by the clinic too. She poses good questions (she's not just a nodding parrot, which some counsellors can be) - but a lovely and very experienced person. 

And you're feeling worn down through lack of sleep... it's very understandable that you feel low and emotional. 

Where are you based? I can pm you her details if you like (she lives in Kenilworth).  

Take care
    
OneStep


----------



## Annaleah

Hi Full Moon, 

Sorry to hear you're low at the moment.  I think it is understandable to have waves of grief...even when there are no evident triggers.  I imagine the fear and anxiety raised by embarking on tx again is perhaps trigger enough.  As OneStep says people process and manage loss in different ways and maybe it would be useful to have therapy to explore some of the distress.  I hope that your episodes of sadness become fewer and further apart.  

I fear reaching my due date and not being pg...it might not be so bad but the anticipation of the distress is bad enough.  Just starting my current cycle of tx brought such a depth of fear in me that I never believed possible.  Even though I have had a couple of positive hcg bloods last week.  My ongoing loss of brown discharge and clotty stuff this morning (albeit still brown) makes me meel uncontainably frightened.   

I hope the pain gets easier.I'll be thinking of you
Annaleah xx


----------



## Damelottie

Hello FM

These losses are just so painful and there just is not right and wrong 'pattern' to the grieving.    . I'm no expert at all but I do wonder if grieving/depression are slightly different things and I imagine we need to look out for signs that one hasn't tipped over into the other if you know what I mean? I have often thought that grieving (although ghastly) is also sort of 'normal', whereas depression is dysfunctional and needs treatment - either counselling or whatever really.
Whatever - you are for sure not losing your marbles but it is such a horrible feeling and I have felt it too.

When I lost my adopted child, it took me a couple of months to realise that my reaction probably wasn't a 'normal' type grief and I had become veru unwell. At that point I saw my GP for medical advise, and then started to see a clinical hypnotherapist, and also having regular refelxology. My credit card took a bit of a battering but within 3 months I felt as though I was 'just' incredibly sad for the loss rather than overwelmed and not coping.

I hope some of that makes sense and I DO wish you well    

LL xxxx


----------



## Mifi

Onestep, Annaleah and LL thankyou so much for your messages   

If I really think about it I guess I am being pretty niave saying that there are no triggers at the moment as my 2nd due date is fast approaching (10 July) and my best friend who only had 10 days difference with our due dates has now just finished work to start her maternity leave, which of course I am happy for her but it does more than tug at the heart strings   plus with me stimming at the moment I am probably hormonal too   so I guess that is more than enough to cause another blip - It was pretty stupid of me to think that I should be getting over it   never to be a weeping mess again and ironically I think my pg test day will just be a couple of days before my due date so not sure if that is a good thing or not   I am still having counselling but the appointments are now a good 6 weeks apart and I just don't have the funds to compliment with any other therapies. 

Onestep thanks for the offer of your therapists details but I am not based in the UK   It is so hard I know when you just can't stop thinking the numbers thing    you are doing so well hun   hang on in there   

Annaleah, I really   with all my heart that your little bean keeps on sticking, I remember the worrying times so well myself and it is really nothing short of torture    Take care hunny and try and keep    If I could do a beam me up Scottie to you to give real hugs I would be there in a shot   

LL I can't wait to hear about the safe arrival of your little Alfie you must be just so excited    I know I am for you  

Thanks again guys
Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Annaleah

hi Fullmoon, sounds like there is  lots going on for you which might bring all those emotions to the surface. I hope stimming is going ok. 

Thanks for the hugs, im definitely in need at the moment. Got reassuring blood result today but got heavy feeling down there and discharge seems to have increased this eve. I'm resting in bed  and praying this little one sticks, and I agree the not knowing is torture. I'm trying to stay positive but the fear is unbearable.

Sending lots of hugs your way 
Annaleah xx


----------



## Mifi

Ah hun keep that bed rest going    I have everything crossed for you and fur babies have paws crossed too


----------



## Annaleah

yesterdayI had a lovely hcg level over 3000, today I'm bleeding. just don't know what to say, l'm just numb as I sit here with sore boobs, nausea and bleeding!  I just don't understand why


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Annalleah tyr and stay potisive if you do search on here that are ladies who have bleed and flooded all through, my friend Cubster being one who was hospitalised etc and she has a lovely daughter now. Good news that your HCG is rising as it should. DO they know where you are bleeding from? something it is a clot etc

Thinking of you


----------



## Annaleah

thanks JJ1 just back from hospital. internal examination showed that my cervix is closed and no points of bleeding on cervix.  scan showed lining and sac still present but it's too early to see anything else. They were really helpful, took swabs to check for infection and have booked me in at early preg unit for bloods tomorrow and scan thursday to check ovaries and tubes.  Praying that this little one hangs on in there .
Annaleah x


----------



## Roo67

Annaleah - I hope you got some reasurance from hospital and the bleeding soon settles down, it must be so worrying. rest up and take it easy

R x


----------



## Annaleah

thanks Roo, I've been sleeping but woke with mild pain and losing more blood and clots so feeling less hopeful than few hours ago xx


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Annaleah
I'm so sorry to hear you're bleeding, with all the worrying about what it means. Sending you my very best wishes that your little one is not affected by this.    
  
Thinking of you.
OneStep


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - I am keeping my fingers crossed for you.       I do hope the bleeding stops soon.


----------



## Annaleah

help - just lost lots more 'material' a couple of hours ago. what else can I be tested for to see if they can establish a cause?  also really worried that internal examination(which was very painful because of my difficult to locate cervix and gave me contractions as speculum was taken out which I've never experienced before) might have made things worse or opened my cervix. is this possible? 

Don't think I've ever been so scared or cried so noisily.  Really don't know how little one can make it after the amount I've lost
A


----------



## Damelottie

Oh Annaleah  . How awful. The worst thing is that I honestly don't think there is anything else you can do, other than wait to see if your blood levels drop. The problem with scans at this stage is that they aren't conslusive either.
I'm not aware of any reason why an internal would have made things worse. They only look at the cervix and don't actually touch it.

I remember sitting in the waiting room when I was bleeding. I think I was just in shock.

We are all thinking of you xxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah I am so sorry hun to hear what you have been going through    you are in our thoughts and we are all    for you. Unfortunately I agree with LL I don't think there is anything you can do other than to wait for your bloods test   Don't worry about the internal exam surely if there was a chance it could make things worse they wouldn't have done it in the first place    Can a friend or family member stay with you right now? I don't think you should be alone hun


----------



## Roo67

Annaleah -   i am sorry that you are having to go through this, i hope you are not alone.

there really is nothing that can be done but wait and i do know what torture that is

thinking of you

R x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Annaleah -       I really don't know what to say - although a friend of mine had a few bleeds in the first few weeks and went on to have a healthy baby boy.
     that everything is ok honey.  Thinking of you x x


----------



## indekiwi

Annaleah, oh lord, am hoping and praying that your little one is locked up snug well inside and has no intentions of going anywhere despite what's going on elsewhere.        I really hope you have a friend or a family member to give you hugs right now.    

A-Mx


----------



## Annaleah

Thanks all for thinking of me. 
Inde - i'm hoping snug enough to go the distance. 
Had a good friend who has had just as little sleep as me last night with phone calls and taking me up to the ward. They asked me to go back this eve with the stuff I'd lost so they could examine it. Just blood clots lost so far so glimmer of hope remains, so fingers crossed for more hope from blood test
Annaleahx


----------



## indekiwi

Annaleah,       

So pleased you have a supportive friend nearby.  

Hoping that glimmer of hope is actually a growing poppet that is ignoring all the shenanigans around it...

A-Mx


----------



## MistyLake

AnnaLeah,

Many women bleed in early pregnancy, it doesn't have to be bad news. I am thinking of you, and hope the scans and bloods bring good news.

Rx


----------



## Annaleah

not looking good. hcg levels have gone from 3171 on monday to 3232which for me is pretty conclusivewhen they were more than doubling for the whole previous week. The woman who phoned from epu initially said they'd gone up and to come for scan tomorrow as planned.If I Was ignorant about hcg levels I would have thought things were all well.  She was reluctant to give me the actual level but when she did she insisted it was ok because it was still rising, and that as a sac was seen yesterday they would expect tomorrow to see it increase in size.  I  did say my levels could have risen considerably over monday and not started to fall till bleeding started tues or that slowly rising levels could be arrested development but she wasn't having any of it! I really resent her treating me as though I'm  ignorant. Anyway I'm pretty sure I'm miscarrying. due for scan tomorrow morning. 
Did a lot of crying yesterday. today I just feel quite numb
Annaleah x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Annaleah         take care honey and thinking of you x x


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah I am so so gutted for you     Life just is so unfair  take care and be kind to yourself, try and get lots of rest you are probably mentally and physically exhausted    I    with all my heart that a miracle happens at your scan tomorrow   I hope someone can be there with you.   

PM me if you prefer I know only too well what it is like to m/c again when you have bearly learnt to live with the first one   

Love and huge hugs   

FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - I am so so sorry for you. Words fail me   .  I wish you all the best for tomorrow and I will be thinking and praying for you during this difficult time.


----------



## indekiwi

Annaleah, I don't know if it is holding out when there really is no hope, and you know your body and your responses much better than anyone else, but I am still     that you and bean are both going to be okay.      

A-Mx


----------



## lulumead

sending     that all is ok.
xx


----------



## Annaleah

aaargghh.......as if things weren't complicated enough. Scan today showed lining intact and gestational scan in lower part of uterine cavity . Consultant said it may have implanted there although it's more common apparently to implant in the upper bit or could be that it's migrated to the lower part on its way out!  I naively thought scan would be more conclusive. Consultant also found cystic mass near left ovary(which I think....hope is a fimbrial cyst that has been spotted before).  Because my hcg has plateaud they are still querying ectopic - think i'd be very unlucky to have one in uterus and the other wandered off up a tube. Hospital want me back on saturday for bloods. 

Today's hcg has dropped to 2878 so I was hoping I could stop meds but clinic say because the drop is small they want me to keep going till scan on 29th to make  sure. not sure if I bear the m/c to be dragged out so much. already lost lots of blood but clearly lots left to go if lining etc remain intact.  really don't know what I feel right now. 
Annaleah xx


----------



## Roo67

Annaleah - sorry that scan wasn't more conclusive, but at least you still have some hope left and the hospital are obviously looking after you.

hope and pray that your bloods start to rise again and that the bleeding stops soon.

r x


----------



## Mifi

Oh Annaleah it truely is just agonising for you    I really hope that there is a miracle and your levels rise and bleed stops    take care


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - I am so sorry that the news was not conclusive today.  You must feel as though you are a bit in limbo at the moment.  I hope the weekend brings better news for you.    

Sima x


----------



## Lou-Ann

Annaleah, I'm sorry that your appt yesterday was not conclusive  .   that you get better news tomorrow 

Thinking of you..... 

Lou-Ann x


----------



## lulumead

big hugs annaleah...must be very stressful not knowing. thinking of you and sending lots of     
xxx


----------



## indekiwi

Annaleah, thinking of you and praying the results from the bloods tomorrow give you much better news than you're expecting.       

A-Mx


----------



## RedRose

Annaleah, I hope you are getting plenty of support and have someone with you    .  I'm still hoping that things will still turn around for you.  I went through a similar drawn out experience and it was the only time in my life that I just could not cope on my own.  Hope your levels are up tomorrow and the bleeding stops for good,
                      lots of love, Rosi.


----------



## Roo67

Annaleah - thinking of you   any news?

R x


----------



## Annaleah

looks like more waiting and yet another glimmer of hope- hcg level has gone up again after having gone down! so  from 2878 on thursday it's gone to 3489 today so looks like I've either got a fighter or an ectopic. I'm waiting for the consultants at local hospital to review bloods and call me with a plan and have called clinic to let them know. 
A very prayerful Annaleah x


----------



## Roo67

hoping and praying that you have a little fighter in there

R x


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - that does sound hopeful.  Let's pray you get some more positive news later today/Monday.  I hope you are bearing up ok.  I will keep on sending positive vibes for your little fighter


----------



## Lou-Ann

Annaleah  .   that you have got a little fighter on board and that you get some good news over the next couple of days 

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Annaleah           for you honey - sounds like a little fighter to me.
        for the next coming days x x


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah           for a little fighter, take care hun    I really hope its going to be a little miracle for you


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Annaleah what a week you are having hun     it's good news for you  
Take care & rest up when you can
Jovi x


----------



## Annaleah

Thanks all,  was just scooped up and taken to friend's house for dinner. I'm now tucked up in bed feeling very full.  
Dr phoned this afternoon to say that after reviewing my blood results this past week he did not think this was a viable pg. He was still concerned about the possibility of an ectopic. I need to have more bloods and another scan on monday.  Dr also mentioned laparoscopy and injection to dissolve pg in the event of ectopic... so the waiting continues. 
Annaleah xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

oh Annaleah I am so sorry- it is methotrexate he wants to give you?  I really hope that Monday brings happier news, delighted that your friends are looking after you
L x


----------



## Annaleah

yes it was methotrexate,  I did say I wouldn't be happy to consent to either without further scan& bloods as evidence thst they are clinically indicated
annaleah x


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - I am so, so sorry.  This is a very difficult time for you and the uncertainty must be driving you mad.  I am sorry that my words are of little comfort to you but we are all here thinking and praying for you. I   that there is still hope but I guess you now need to go with what the experts are advising.  If it is ectopic then I hope they can at least protect your tubes to give you every chance in the future.


----------



## Felix42

Annnaleah so sorry that you are going through this. I do hope that the dr is very wrong and that your scan tomorrow is better news.  

love & hugs Felix xx


----------



## lulumead

Annaleah...sending big  .

xxx


----------



## Annaleah

Thanks for all the cyber hugs, just a quick post to say that my hcg has gone up again slightly to 3886. Scan hasn't changed much since those last tuesday and thursday. Gestational sac doesn't have properly developing fetal pole and is an  irregular shape so clearly not viable.  because levels are rising they can't rule out  ectopic but they are hoping it's just m/c with plateauing levels. just waiting to hear from clinic about whether they are happy for me to stop oestrogen and progesterone so I can complete m/c 

might be away from posting while I get my head round this one but still thinking of you all.  
Annaleah x


----------



## Sima

Annaleah - I am so sorry.   Take care of yourself and please do come back when you feel ready to post again.


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Annalsah thinking of you Hun xx


----------



## Roo67

annaleah - so sorry to read this, you are in my thoughts, come back when you are ready, we will be waiting with more cyber hugs.

r x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Annaleah - I so   that this wasn't the case.  Honey you take all the time you need.  We'll all be here for you when you return.  Take care mini x x  x


----------



## lulumead

Oh annaleah, so sorry. take care of yourself and hope to see you posting again soon.    
thinking of you.
xxx


----------



## wizard

Annaleah I have been away so just catching up; I am so so sorry that you have been through such an emotionally gruelling and devastating time.  It is so terribly unfair.  I am sending you    and thinking of you.

Wizard x


----------



## Lou-Ann

Annaleah, I am so sorry    
Take care of yourself, thinking of you...... 

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah I am so so sorry        Thats devistating news   Take all the time you need, be kind to yourself, we are thinking of you         

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Annaleah - I'm so very very sorry. Thinking of you   

Suitcase
x


----------



## RedRose

Annaleah, I am so sorry that this is happening to you.  I hope you are getting all the medical and emotional support you need at this very distressing time to help you through.  Take care, love Rosi.


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah thinking of you, I hope you are ok and getting lots of support


----------



## Mifi

Hi guys

Struggling a bit again, my 2nd due date is coming up as this Friday   I feel old wounds breaking open again and bearly managing to keep the tears at bay    I have a constant pain in my throat and chest and know its intense emotion brimming. As much as it pains me I can't bear to be near my best friend at the moment as she due baby no.2 in just 2 weeks time and looks ready to pop any day. I miss her and am sure she probably misses me but its just too painful for both of us to be near each other these past few months and I wonder if our friendship will ever be the same again    I seriously don't know if I will be able to visit maternity when the big day comes and I know she will feel hurt and probably never forgive me either if I don't   

I have the day off work on Friday as don't want to risk a melt down in public but I really can't decide what to do with myself. I have a scan in the morning but other than that nothing else planned   got some decisions to make.

Hugs to all    

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXxx


----------



## Roo67

Fullmoon - so sorry hunny, it doesn't get any easier does it  no words can help but just so you know that I am thinking of you.

Annaleah - how are you doing hun ?

R x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Roo, no your right it doesn't get any easier    not that I regret any of my decisions or journey I do feel it has changed me as a person and not always for the best. I used to feel so confident and strong but this last year I feel that I have been losing that side of me   

Has anybody else noticed this? or something similar?


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Full Moon    x


----------



## Felix42

Full Moon and Annaleah, sending you both lots of  I am so sorry that you are going through this. Life can be so cruel. 

Take care of yourself.  

Love & warm hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Felix & Jovi   

Its so hard coping with this and doing it on your own   at times I just long to be held and told everything will be ok. I feel so isolated and alienated most of the time with all my friends leaving me so far behind whilst they experience the next chapter in their lives. I guess being single for last 15 years has also taken its toll on me too - oh dear I am down in the dumps today 

Off for a bubble bath my ** is eagerly waiting   thank god for **


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

FM    I find due dates v hard as well, my baby would have been 2 and it is coming up soon.  I always do something to mark the day, like light a candle, relaese a balloon with a note on it, some people put leaves in a river , plant a tree etc. It is good to have some tears and moments for them.

It is also your scan day so hopefully the start of something very good.
L x


----------



## wizard

FM it's just so hard and there are no magic answers. If only there were.  And I think it's times like this that doing it on your own really hit home.  Sending you     

Wizard x


----------



## Mifi

L , thanks, I think some people find it difficult to understand why I get hung up on the dates, so it is good but sad to know that I am not the only one that does it - I can't help it the dates for both pg are ingrained in my brain forever    think I will go to the crematorium with some ballons to release  

and Yes hopefully the start of something good but also the last place I want to be on that day, especially as my clinic is based in a hospital and is just a floor under the maternity & labour ward   - I guess I just have to look at it as a good omen  

My heart hurts  

huge huge hugs to all, especially those with angel babies


----------



## Mifi

Thanks wizard, I agree it is times like this that does really rub salt into the wounds of us singlies   

I,m off to catch some zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz as cream crakered and not sleeping well

Nightey night all XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

FM The predicted due dates are the only ones that we have, my friend can't understand as says that no baby arrived on their due date.  I have never thought of going to a crem, I go to a nice  park and let my balloons off last year as as I would have wanted to be there playing with him/her.

L x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks JJ1 I think I prefer the idea of going to the park. I'm a little better today but still feeling pretty upset    every now and then my eyes well up with tears    I keep having these awful nightmares and they leave me unsettled and upset all morning   but I I know there is not alot I can do about it as we don't get much choice when it comes to dreams


----------



## wizard

Oh Full Moon you poor thing     You really are having a hard time with it aren't you?  Dreams are awful as you just can't control them at all.  Have you spoken to anyone about how you're feeling?  It might just help to get it out there and talk about your grief and loss.  Not easy I know but otherwise it stays entirely within and then resurfaces in uncontrollable ways like in dreams.  I'm not saying it's an answer but it might be worth trying.  

Wizard x


----------



## Lou-Ann

FM, sending you loads of virtual    

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Lou-Ann & Wizard   

I went to yoga tonight and do feel a little better so I am hoping that I sleep better tonight with no nightmares!! I also had a therapy session today which was well overdue I think   although it was so difficult not to put up the usual brick wall & concentrating on control and not at what was being said I actually managed to let go a bit even if it did mean sitting there and crying. Huge tears running down my face but it has shifted the pain I have carried in my chest and throat for the past few days. As my counsellor said to me today, I am very good at giving myself a hard time so I need to make more of an effort with concentrating on the good things and giving myself a break. She said I need to plan something nice such as a holiday or even a weekend away especially as I will have no tx in August as the clinic closes for the month - I find it hard justifying spending money on anything other than tx especially as the money pot is practically empty and still no baby   but I also know that I will probably have alot of benefit from getting of the rock that I live on - so I will at least think about it. It also niggles me when I go away having to pay the single supplement making a fairly reasonaly priced holiday expensive  

Anyway I feel pretty drained and worn out tonight so off to have a bath & bed. I'm still desparately trying not to think about Friday but with not much success  just hurts so much 


Love to all XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Full Moon so pleased that the session has helped you.

I have just bought some chinese lanterns that I might release this year 
http://www.yorkshirefireworks.co.uk/ we had them at my donors place this weekend and they gracefully rise and burn into the sky.

L x

/links


----------



## RedRose

Hi all,

   Annaleah, I hope you still getting lots of support and taking it easy at this sad time and are at least feeling physically better  .

   JJ, that's a nice idea about the balloons in the park, I sometimes think of my babies when I am walking by the sea and looking at the clouds or the sunset. 

   FM,  , sorry you are feeling so bad at the moment.   I did notice in myself what you were saying about loss of confidence in general.  I must admit I feel a different person from the person I was before my miscarriages and I think my ex and my friends would agree with that.  I think miscarriage is still pretty much a hidden thing and we are just expected to get on with it and get over it, to a large degree.  
    
   As you say, thank goodness for furbabies, they are usually obliging in the cuddles department.  I think your therapist is right about planning something nice for you in August, and a change of scene and people often helps lift us out of ourselves a little recharges the batteries and  hopefully helps bring back some confidence.  Not always easy to do when you are feeling low, though.  Hope the yoga helped and you have a restful night tonight, sleep well  ,
               love to all on this thread, Rosi.


----------



## Mifi

JJ1 thanks so much those lanterns just look fab    

Redrose thanks hun, its good but sad to know that at least i'm not wierd and other people can identify with me   

I was told today by someone to stop dwelling and to let it go   I find comments like these so hard to take, this also came from someone that has also had m/c and the way she thinks about it I find so alien   how am I supposed to do that when it hurts so much and as far as I see it the losses I have had now make me the person that I am today. 

Hugs to all 

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Roo67

Everybody deals with things in different ways and you need to do what helps you.

will be thinking of you tomorrow 

 

R xx


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Roo


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Full Moon Take care, I can't understand some people but as Suity says every deals with things differently. I can empathesize with how you feel that your confidence has gone.

Have you seen this thread http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=45682.0
Thinking of you
l x


----------



## Mifi

Oh JJ1 thanks for that I am     buckets but it needs to come out - not quite ready to post on that one yet but I will be soon  

Better than a therapy session I think!! Helps to untangle the mess of thoughts 


Huge hugs    

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## indekiwi

Full Moon, thinking so much of you today        

A-Mx


----------



## lulumead

big hugs full moon    
xx


----------



## Annaleah

FM - hope today wasn't too bad.  I was thinking of you.  

I'm hanging in there - had a tricky abuse case at work this week and went to see a patient of mine this morn whose brother was murdered a couple of months ago so that's been keeping me busy and keeping my own distress at bay!!  I'm ok but I know that the tears are usually never far away.  I have lots of good friends around and am back to dancing which, bittersweet as it may be, gets me out and makes me smile for a few hours.  My new touch control glass hob also went in yesterday so the kitchen is nearly finished, small consolation but always a little to get excited about. I am applying for a consultant post where I work which I would love to get (not least the money would help with tx debts)....so life is still moving but I do feel a bit lost sometimes.  My mum phoned yesterday to suggest I go to Canada in August for one of her friends weddings.  I think she hopes Mr Lovely will appear somewhere like that and I know she would wish for me to be able to TTC with support and without the financial burden -I think it really breaks their hearts to see me having to deal with m/c's and the financial stress of it all without a partner.  Featherbabes have been great esp Archie who keeps telling me i'm a "good boy" and asking me if i'm alright!

I have a review with fertility cons next Wednesday and with local gynae cons on 10th August who has agreed to do karyotyping and any other tests which haven't been done and I am thinking about whether to see one of the immunology cons in London....also trying to make sense of some of the complicated literature on PCOS, endocrine system probs and m/c....not sure yet what to do next about tx as I haven't any frosties left but hopefully will have a plan to look forward to over the coming month. 

Anyway, thanks for all your thoughts. I am floating about the site every few days just not posting much. 
Annaleah xx


----------



## Mifi

A-M, Lulu, Rose and Annaleah thankyou so much for your kind thoughts today    they are very much appreciated   Today wasn't as bad as I thought it would be - I think I had such an emotionally challenging week that by today I was just too exhausted and feeling a bit numb. It was good that I had a scan this morning as it made me get out of bed and go out as my first instinct when I woke this morning was just to turn over and go back to sleep and have a duvet day   instead I had my scan and met a friend for a cuppa and a cuddle with her 10 mth old baby girl and I then went swimming and did 30 lengths of the pool which wacked me out a bit but it felt good to be doing something active. I did get a bit choked watching some mums carry their little ones to the baby pool but I managed to swallow the tears down. 

Annaleah I am so pleased that you are ok (well as you can be  ) applying for consultant sounds a good goal so all the best of luck and I loved your story about your feather babes looking after you especially Archie - made me smile so much  

Good luck with your app next wed I do hope things can look positive for you from now on   

Huge hugs to all      Thanks again  

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX PS Happy weekend


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

FM so pleased that your scan went well and your got through the day!

Annaleah nice to see you posting, take care
L x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

FM, just wanted to send you a big   at such a difficult time. It's true that everyone deals with this pain differently. I'm pretty good at sticking mine in a box and stuffing it under the bed (if you see what I mean  ). My counsellor said that was fine if it worked for me, and that I should just be aware that the box is there and if I feel the need to pull it out and open it, I should. So far I'm leaving it where it is, need to focus on the next stage of the journey, and maybe one day I'll come back to it. Maybe I won't. 

But everyone is so different, and I think the chinese lanterns or other ways to mark the anniversaries are lovely ideas too

Annaleah - gosh, sounds like your work is pretty demanding. Great that you are back to dancing and finding enjoyment in it. Best of luck with the upcoming tests/consultations - hope you get some answers

Love and hugs to all those feeling the pain of m/c,
Suitcase
x


----------



## Mifi

Hi Suity

Thanks    at times I too have that box under my bed but at times I think it gets so full it over flows and I have no choice but to deal with the overflow at least   its so exhausting, I think I get better  and then  it still catches me by surprise when I get days that feel so overwhelming and i'm crippled with pain   and sadly I know that I am not the only one that has to endure this  

Huge     to all, especially those who have lost 

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Roo67

hi all,

I hoped I would never have to post on here again but I fear it is all over for me again. I had bad cramps over the weekend and then had a massive bleed overnight, I am still ina lot of pain today, no painkillers are touching it. i phoned EPU who have booked me in for a scan on 27th July !! won't scan any earlier tha 8 weeks. I do have a scan booked at Babybond tomorrow does anyone know if they will still scan if bleeding ?

I just dont know what to think or feel, I really hoped and thought that this one going to be ok, I can't believe that I will ever be able to be a mummy after this, not sure if I can carry on, i have been through so much for it all to be snatched away again, Life is just so unfair.

R x


----------



## Annaleah

Oh Roo, I am so sorry and sending you all my thoughts.  Although I have not been posting much, you are one person who has been in my thoughts and I have been sending messages to universe for things to be good for you this time round.  Life is very unfair, and i'm feeling sad and angry for you.

Hopefully they will scan you- I was scanned when I was bleeding (though this was by gynae & EPAU).  This time round I took myself to A&E so they had to send me to the gynae ward and make follow up appointments with EPAU for monitoring scans and HCG bloods.  If you are able to and can face it maybe it is worth just pitching up so you don't get made to wait until 27th, which I think is just cruel. 

I hope you have someone who can be with you if you need it.  I'm thinking of you and sending lots of   
Annaleah xx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Roo am         that this is going to be ok.  So many womoen have such large bleeds and go onto have healthy pregnancies.
     for you honey 
Take care mini x x


----------



## kylecat

Roo, just to let you know I am thinking of you and hoping that everything is OK, 

Lots of Love
kylecat xxx


----------



## Papillon

I am so sorry Roo, thinking of you.   Hope everything is OK.

Papillon


----------



## indekiwi

Roo - I am     that you have a defiant embie or two lurking with intent away from where the bleed is.  I really hope it is not over for you - and that in the interim, the pain can be managed.  It may be a long shot, but one of the women on the DE Newbies thread has had some frightening bleeds but her pregnancy continues intact.  Sorry if you don't need or want the PMA - I just really don't want to believe that life could be so damned unfair as to put you through yet another loss.  
          

A-Mx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo I am so sorry hun I really echo what Inde has said and hope it isn't over. I hope that the scan shows you some reassurance
L x


----------



## wizard

Roo I couldn't believe reading your post.  I can't imagine how terribly distressing this must be.  Like others I am     that your embie sticks fast and that this is just a horrible scare.  My heart goes out to you and my thoughts are with you   

Wizard x


----------



## Mifi

Oh Roo i'm     with all my heart for a miracle for you. Life is just so   unfair   I am so upset and angry for you     I was scanned at 5wk + 6 by a obstiatrition when I was bleeding. I do hope they wont make you wait    

Huge huge     thinking of you hun

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Lou-Ann

Roo, so sorry to read what you are going through  . I am hoping and   that everything is ok  

Thinking of you.... 

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Damelottie

Oh Roo - Oh my god!! I'm just horrified for you   . I just don't know what to say. But huge huge     for what they are worth. I do hope all is OK xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Elpida

Oh Roo - I'm gutted to see you've had to post on here, been thinking about you so much. I echo what inde said and will be sending you lots of positive thoughts and love 

E x


----------



## Felix42

Thinking of you Roo and sending you lots of   & love for what you are going through. 

 you get better news at the scan tomorrow. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Roo I am so sorry, words really fail me  .   For better news for you tomorrow, love & hugs xxx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Roo - only just read your post....have texted. 
Am so so sorry this is happening to you again. Life really isn't fair at all, it makes me so sad and angry that you have to go through this again.  
Am just   this time it's not all over for you - will be thinking of you tomorrow, 
take care, 
Suitcase
x


----------



## RedRose

Oh God, Roo, it is so shocking and heartbreaking to read your post.  No-one should have to bear what you are going through.  So unbelievably cruel, I hope you have lots of love and support close around you and you can get a scan and some answers.  Praying and praying that this is one of those nightmare scares and that everything will be fine,
          sending you lots of love, wish I could do something to help, Rosi xxxx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Roo..... thinking of you for today x x x  x


----------



## Teela

Roo I am so sorry to read your message, take care and I hope all goes well today.  

Teela


----------



## dottiep

Oh Roo - I have only just seen your post from yesterday and am so very shocked and upset for you.  I am praying that you have a fighter in there despite the bleed - we all know of many ladies who have had successful pregnancies with bleeds.  I think it is awful to have to wait until 27th - I hope you get some answers and good news today.  Please know you are very much in my thoughts.
Big big hugs
Dottie
xx


----------



## wizard

Sending you love and thoughts Roo  

Wizard x


----------



## sunnygirl1

Roo, I am so sorry to read your post.  I really do hope that you get some positive news today.  My thoughts are with you  

Sunny xx


----------



## some1

Oh no Roo, so sorry to read your post.  Really hoping that you get some positive news at your scan today  

Some1

xx


----------



## winky77

Roo..    .....only just getting on FF what with the mad rush around in Brno yesterday and only getting home at midnight...and out again for 8am train.....so really sorry my text earlier was an 'uninformed' one.  I really hope you got to have your scan and got some turnaround news....    .....every ounce of my PMA and thoughts have been winging your way all day. 

..Winky


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Roo
I'm so sorry to hear your news. Thinking of you and hoping that things are ok despite the bleed. 
  
Take care
All the best
OneStep


----------



## Mifi

Roo sending you lots of hugs - you are in my thoughts hunny                                           

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Felix42

Thinking of you Roo.      

Love and hugs, Felix xxxx


----------



## Roo67

Hi all, thanks for your thoughts and good wishes but as expected there was nothing to see on the scan    

I can't believe I have to go through this again, all I want now is a reason for this, 1 or maybe 2 m/c is just unlucky but 3 to me says that there must be something wrong, but finding out what that something is is so difficult to find. I was on full immune protocol this time so don't feel as though there is much hope left. 
I am seeing my GP in the morning  - doubt he will be much use they never are are they ??

I phoned EPU they will not scan until 8 weeks - even the sonographer at Baby bond (who also works in a hosp) was very surprised, may have to move before next time !! (if there is a next time )

Love to you all

R xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Oh Roo I just don't know what to say I am so sorry for you- Does Stephan have any recommendations?  Take care and I hope that you have some support around you

L x


----------



## lulumead

roo - so so sorry.     I hope you can get some answers and find a way forward. I know you probably can't think of going on at the moment but that the fact that you even wrote the words "move before the next time" saws your strength to carry on, which i am sure you will. 
Wish was something I could do to help. Sending you lots of   

Hope at least the physical pain eases soon.
xxx


----------



## Myra

Roo

So sorry hun   

Myra xx


----------



## wizard

Oh Roo I was wishing with all my heart for a different outcome for you.  It is just so so cruel and I am so very very sorry   .  I can't offer any wisdom or advice on the immune side but I hope someone else might be able to.

Take very good care of yourself

Wizard x


----------



## Betty-Boo

Roo       I'm so so        for you honey.  This just isn't fair.
Am here if you need me. 
Big hugs x x  x x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Have texted you Roo

  

Don't make any decisions now....take some time.....

Thinking of you, 
  

Suitcase
x


----------



## indekiwi

Roo, too many words, none of them fit for purpose and none that would make the slightest bit of difference.      I'm so very sorry for your loss and for the physical and emotional pain that now envelops you.       I hope that someone can identify the cause for these m/cs - like you say, this seems more than sheer misfortune.  

A-Mx


----------



## sunnygirl1

I'm so sorry and so so sad for you Roo.  I wish I had some words to ease your pain   

Sunny xx


----------



## Papillon

Roo, I am so sorry.  

Big Big Hugs,

Papillon


----------



## upsydaisy

Roo, so so sorry, it's heartbreaking,      

you were the first person to welcome me to this site and that meant a lot, 
why does life have be so cruel

Take care

UpsyX


----------



## Lou-Ann

Roo  I am so sorry to hear your sad news . I was so hoping for a different outcome for you. Life can be so cruel and unfair 

Thinking of you..    

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Felix42

Roo, I am just so very very sorry hun.    You have been so strong but no one should have to go through what you've gone through.  Please ask your GP to at least refer you to a recurrent miscarriage specialist as you should be able to get that on the NHS at least, single or not! 

You are in my thoughts and I do so hope that in time the pain you are going through gets a little easier and you can see a way through to go on and achieve your dreams.  A little one will be so blessed to have you as their mummy and I   that you can find the answer to what you are being so cruelly put through.

Biggest   for you.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


----------



## some1

Roo I am totally gutted for you, I was so convinced that this was your time.  Will be thinking of you lots    Really hope you can find some answers as to why this keeps happening to you hun.

Some1

xx


----------



## madmisti

Roo hun - there really are no words I know, but so so sorry - it is just so cruel as others have said. Take time to be gentle with yourself - I hope you have support    ANd I hope that you will get some answers in the next weeks.

Lol
Misti x


----------



## Roo67

Thanks ladies, I don't know what I would do without this site, it is so nice to see how many people care, those I have met and also those I haven't

I went to my GP this morning who sent me to EPU who took bloods and will scan tomorrow and will monitor me for next few days / week. this is a different hosp to the one I work at and who won't scan until 8 weeks. I didn't know that this one had an EP unit but at least I have them now and they will scan at 6 weeks. so if I do get this far again I can go there and know that they will do something. I also asked my GP for some counselling or someone to talk to and all he did was to print out a pt info leaflet with the no. of the miscarriage association - could have done that myself !!

I asked about testing for recurrent M/C but all they would do would be clotting bloods and as I was on Aspirin and fragmin anyway they don't think there is much point, don't do hysteroscopies either - so no further forward there, the Sister just said she think I have just been very very unlucky.

I have got a freind who does some voluntary work with pregnancy crisis team, whe is going to arrange for me to see someone, she said it helped her enormously when she lost her babies years ago.

R xx


----------



## Lou-Ann

Roo  . Sorry that your GP wasn't very supportive this morning. Glad that your friend is being supportive and has recommended someone for you to talk to 

Thinking of you... 

Lou-Ann x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

GPs...hopeless most of them....sorry yours couldn't be more help. Seems to me that if you need counselling you pretty much have to find it for yourself (I'm sure there are some GPs who are the exception but mostly I only hear negative things - you seem to have to be pretty much suicidal before they will do much to help in that respect)

I was recommended this site for counselling:
http://www.bacp.co.uk/

Although the one I have ended up with was a personal recommendation from Olivia at DCN...and has proven to be fabulous. You could post on here and/or DCN and see if they can point you in the right direction

Although I haven't been through 3 miscarriages so I can't really understand, I do know how frustrating it is to feel that there are just no answers, and no tests you can do to give you an answer. It's so so tough, especially for strong independent women like us who are used to being in control of our lives and suddenly we find ourselves completely powerless

Wish I could say something to help more, but I know there isn't anything that can be said. Sending more   in the meantime though, 
Suitcase
x

/links


----------



## Roo67

Thanks suity - will check out that link.

All I want is answers or a reason but I know in reality there probably just isn't any, that is what is so hard about all this.

Can't wait to get all some real hugs at the weekend !!


----------



## Damelottie

Lots of love and hugs Roo. 
I don't know why but I thought there sometimes was more answers for miscarriages. But maybe not - it is awful tho and I do hope somebody can help.
That link is the best one for counsellors as they are registered and have Codes of Ethics. My friend had a not good experience today with one not from there so worth checking them out.
Lots of love xxxxxx


----------



## kylecat

So sorry to read your news Roo. 

Thinking of you and hoping your weekend away helps a little  

Kylecat xxx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Roo honey - there will be plenty of hugs this weekend         
I hope you find a counsellor who suits you honey.  I know the one I went too wasn't a specialist fertility counsellor and tbh she was brilliant.  Was interested in what I wastrying to do and gave me so much support.  Hopefully you'll find one soon - have you tried a local fertlity clinic?  
Take care honey x x x x


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo thinking of you hun  hope the EPU look after you and you get the support you need and deserve- some GP's are a nightmare
L x


----------



## Mifi

Roo I'm so so sorry     I hope you find a good counsellor very soon and in the mean time hope you get lots of support & hugs from your friends and family as I can't give you real ones her are some virtual ones X10000    

Thinking of you  

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Felix42

Roo, so sorry that the GP wasn't much use at all. I honestly thought you'd be able to get referred to a miscarriage unit. That is good to know that there is an EPU close by who do do earlier scans. Hope that tomorrow's scan helps in some small way. 

Those counsellor links look good and it sounds a very good idea to follow that through. You've been through such a lot and I'm sure a good counsellor can help you build your strength back up. 

So pleased that you've got good friends around you this coming weekend. Will be thinking of you and sending you the warmest virtual hug possible from this distance. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## indekiwi

Roo, plenty of hugs coming your way - only wish there was more we could do to make life less sad and painful right now.           

A-Mx


----------



## wizard

Roo, bl**dy gps, neither use nor ornament most of the time.  I can't offer any advice really but do want to say that I hope you find someone helpful to talk to and get some real hugs very soon.  In the meantime    and take good care of yourself.

Wizard x


----------



## muddypaws

Roo...I am so gutted for you. You don't deserve this.    

There will be other girls with more knowledge about miscarriage specialists so maybe they can recommend someone to consult about your experiences but I know there are some specialists that have been mentioned before. 

It's so exhausting and painful, I just wish I had some wise words that would help...in the end all I can do is say that I am thinking of you and feeling angry on your behalf. Wishing you lots of love... 

Muddy xx


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Roo
How are you doing? Thinking of you and sending you lots of good wishes.  
OneStep


----------



## RedRose

Hi all,

    To Roo and Annaleah and to anyone else reading who has been through this truly dreadful experience I hope that you are still getting lots of support and beginning to see a way ahead.  I have seen a couple of miscarriage specialists in this country and have to say I have not been over-impressed.  I really think it is still a very neglected and undertreated area and we have to be very assertive to get treatment especially from GPs and the NHS.  As ever, I think you have to do your own research and trust your instincts.  Not easy when you are recovering from the emotional shock and in some ways fearful of being pregnant again only to have it taken away.  Make sure you take life easy and look after yourselves,
              lots of love, Rosi.


----------



## Roo67

thanks for your thoughts

Not having a good day today, should of been having my first antenatal scan and appt this afternoon, instead i was having a scan and bloods done at EPU clinic so make sure all going away   

I don't know what to do now, I have 2 frosties but can't face going back over to Czech again anytime soon but have been thinking about having a hysteroscopy just to rule out any problems, but I have been told that the amount of scans I have had then any thing major would have shown up. I will go back to my GP and see if there is a miscarriage clinic in this area and try to get a referral, not holding out much hope though, All I want is some answers and then I can move on - either more treatment or call it a day.

  to all that need them

R x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Oh Roo

Sending big    your way. Sorry you're having such a tough day. Hope you manage to get a referral soon and feel that you are starting to maybe get some answers
Take care of yourself, we're all here for you,
Suitcase
x


----------



## wizard

Roo I'm so sorry that you are going through this, it is so very hard and so terribly unfair.  It is so soon after your loss that thoughts of going back for your 2 frosties are not possible right now.  Take time to grieve and look after yourself first so that you are in a position to go back if and when that time comes.

Wizard x


----------



## Annaleah

Hi all, 

Roo - Big hugs     Been thinking about you even though I've not been posting much.  I hope you're getting lots of hugs (as well as the cyber ones). I hope you get some joy out of your GP.  I think most centres guidelines say they will accept a GP referral to recurrent m/c clinic after 3 m/c's so even if you need a referral to a tertiary centre you are eligible.  

My GP referred me a couple of weeks ago and I was able to make an NHS choose & book appt online for 10th August with obs & gynae consultant.  I'm not sure if they'll have any answers but I just wish I could know why - holding out hope that there's a magic key just something that needs to be done differently with tx protocol.  Also considering immune tests but my clinic doesn't endorse them and also take a very conservative approach to steroids (eg 30 mg prednisolone pre ET and reducing dose of 10mg for only 5 days after ET then stop!) which in times of piggy flu is probabaly not a bad thing, but does leave me wondering how I would negotiate meds for a more aggressive immune protocol if tests showed I needed it.  However, my cons did ask to borrow my copy of Dr Beers book at my follow up so maybe there is hope. My head is a bit of a swim at the moment about what to do next. 

Annaleah xx


----------



## Mifi

Roo huge hugs to you     you are in my thoughts often, I do really hope that you get the answers you need


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo thinking of you  and really wish there was something that I could do to ease the pain. I really hope that you get the help that you need, give yourself time to grieve, gather strength and be kind to yourself. 

Annaleah so pleased that you have an appt and maybe some answers.
L x


----------



## Felix42

Roo, so sorry to hear you're having a bad time of it and haven't got a referral to a miscarriage speciallist yet. Could you ask the consultant that did your IUIs to do a referral by any chance? I think you said he's been helpful in the past. 
Sending you big  Just wish I could do more to help you feel better and even more so achieve the dream you so deserve. 

Annaleah, so good to hear you have a referral. I hope it is very helpful & you're able to move forward. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## muddypaws

Annaleah, so sorry. Haven't kept up with FF very well and only just seen your posts. Am sorry that things are as they are but glad the NHS is offering you a service after all you've put into it yourself. Hope it's useful.  

Muddy x


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo how are things hun?

Annaleah have you had your referral?
L x


----------



## Mifi

Annaleah how did your appointment go on the 10th   I hope you had an informative and supportive experience and    for a happier future  

Roo thinking of you, I hope your pain has eased and you are still getting lots of support   

After a short break I am warming up to my next tx cycle either Sept or perhaps Oct and I am feeling the butterflies in my tum again - terrified of a BFN but also just as terrified for a BFP   I find whenever I am due to start another tx I start thinking of my angels often, which in turn brings back snippets of the pain and grief. I recently visited St Malo and found a church with stunning glass windows. When I was there I felt compelled to go in & light a candle for my angel babies so I did   I haven't been inside a church for a long time I just couldn't face it, I was just too angry and hurt so it was kinda wierd that I felt I had to go in this one and light a candle   

My best friend of over 20 years had her 2nd baby recently and just 11 days after my due date. It took me nearly 3 weeks to pluck up the strenght to visit but I new I had to as our friendship has been pretty much in pieces for the last few months and also knew the longer I left it the harder it would be. I coped but only just. I went in the house set in my mind I wouldn't hold him as I just wasn't ready but as it happened he was screaming for a feed and my friend had to go to the kitchen to prepare his milk so she asked me if I would hold him while she got everything ready - I really didnt feel I could say no!! As soon as I picked him up the tears were just pouring down my face and I could bearly breath   I don't know why but I knew I just had to get control of myself before my friend got back in the room as she probably wouldnt of appreciated me crying whilst I was holding her precious baby, so I managed to swallow down the pain and tears just in time for her to come back. She then passed me the bottle and said there you go you can feed him if you like - again I just didnt want to say no as I didnt want to hurt her feelings so I fed him, which was kinda nice and also extremely hard at the same time   anyway I coped better than I thought but as soon as I got home I collapsed, shaking like a leaf and sobbing for a good hour leaving me utterly exhausted enough to put me in bed for a couple of hours. I know as this was the first time it will probably be the worst. I am yet to visit again and just   it will be a bit easier a second time at least   

I think my last loss wasn't just the loss of my baby but also a loss of a bit more out of who I am or who I was and also a loss of the sparkle of a longterm close friendship we has shared since we were 14 years old. It is just so so sad that something that could have bought us even closer in friendship has ended up almost destroying our friendship altogether    

Huge hugs to all    

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Annaleah

FM- big   holding back your own pain to share in others joy is pretty exhausting!  Don't Know what else to say but i'm thinking of you.

Roo - my thoughts are with you too , as FM said I hope you have people around you for support. 

my appointment was interesting!  It was with a locum cons (Egyptian- his attitudes towards women were very evident).  he was nice until he found I was having tx as a single woman, at which point he began talking over me answering questions before i'd  finished speaking and said that I didn't necessarily have proven fertility issues that had led to me having tx but it was because I "didn't want to be physically touched by men". that was one of his many assumptions! he agreed to do karyotyping but otherwise his knowledge was limited. 

anyway, I was planning to give IUI another try with gonal f and prednisolone and today is D3 when I would start stimming but I've decided to wait a bit longer. need a bit more healing and me time which will hopefully involve a dancing w'end in bratislava and salsa congress in the salt mine in poland then I'll hope to start tx end oct. 
A x


----------



## Betty-Boo

A - men can be so judgemental can't they?  Saying that some women I've come across are the same.  
    

All the best for the dancing!! Sounds fabulous!
   for your next treatment honey x

FM and Roo - big hugs x


----------



## dottiep

FM - sending you    
I think you are being very brave and I'm sure your friend would understand.

Annaleah - enjoy the dancing and sending you best wishes for your next tx.

I know I don't post much anymore but this week would have been my due date and I don't really know who else to share it with.  
This is the first tme I've felt really lonely over here.  My life seems to have taken on a completely different direction now and not sure whether I can continue with tx with the way things are now.  I think I'm sad for what I lost but equally sad because I feel I have also lost the dream.

Dx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Dottie - lovely to hear from you.  So sorry you're feeling alone honey - especially at the moment.        

You take care x x x
You are missed x


----------



## Felix42

Dottie, sending you huge  for it being your due date. I'm thinking of you.

FM, congratulations for getting through your visit to see your friend and her new baby. That must have been so difficult. Congrats for getting through it. I hope you can rebuild your friendship in time for both your sakes. 

Annaleah, I'm sorry to hear about the consultant. Goodness, how judgemental!  Hope you have a good time dancing. 

Roo, thinking of you and hoping you are doing ok. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

FM - well done on getting through the new baby visit - always hard. I still cry now sometimes when I'm feeding my niece or putting her to bed - and she's 13 months....so although it gets easier, there's always a sadness there and it does challenge our friendships/relationships with our friends/family who are already parents but we'll get there too...one way or another
 

Roo - haven't heard from you in a while, hope all OK....thinking of you  

Annaleah - taking some more time out for you sounds like a great idea, hope you come back fully refreshed and ready to try again in Oct

Dottie - I've texted you, not sure if you are still on UK mobile? Send Dutch one if not...

Love to all,
Suitcase
x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks guys for all the      

Suity thanks for sharing that   it feels better and that im not the only one that feels these things, at least i know im not going mad  

Annaleah - I can't believe that doctor!!! What a total   Are you going ahead with the karyotyping? I think it is a good idea for you to wait another month and enjoy yourself hun   the last month I have been out and about even managed clubbing a couple of times and although I regretted the the much deserved hangover the next day it was just so nice to feel 'normal' again, if you know what I mean - I could feel periods when I was just me again and not someone racked with fear and pain, obcessing with dates, drugs and prenatal vits   I like to hope that the break I have had means more sucess for a BFP with my next try   

Dottie - huge   hun, im so sorry you are having such a hard time, be kind to yourself   

Roo thinking of you   

Hugs to all


----------



## Annaleah

Dottie- good to hear from you and big  . Thinking of you. xx


----------



## Chowy

Dottie, nice to hear from you, I still think of you even though your not posting much.  Be good to yourself honey.  Sneding big    

Chowy


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

I thought that I would post on this thread, it was 3 years ago tomorrow that I found out my baby had died  I hate this time of the year and due dates.  I do put it to the back of my mind but then times like this resurrect everything!  I did work the day last year but I knew I had something at the exact time that my donor's partner and I were in the scan room.  Tomorrow I am doing a half day so will come home, my donor's partner will be at mine which I am pleased about.  We were only talking the other day that we can remember the treatment cycles, the bad point but not much about being pregnant and excited about our baby that was meant to be.
L


----------



## wizard

JJ these times are so very hard    I hope tomorrow passes as well as it can and I'm glad that your donor's partner will be with you.

Take care

Wizard x


----------



## lulumead

jj big   for tomorrow. Hope your donor's partner is there for some real ones.

xxx


----------



## Mifi

JJ1 huge hugs honey    I know just what you mean it the anniversary of my 2nd   yesterday     This time of year doesn't help either I know with Xmas coming fast and New Year just round the corner  

I will be thinking of you both tomorrow     and I share your tears     as many of us do  


Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Felix42

JJ, I'm so sorry to hear that hun.   Will be thinking of you tomorrow and sending you big     That's good to hear that you are taking a half day.  I hope you are treating yourself gently and planning something special.

It would have been my due date from my first pregnancy today.  I've been feeling so sad all today in spite of knowing how lucky I am now.  It still feels such a big loss though and my heart goes out to all those who have experienced this heartbreak, especially those who are yet to achieve your dreams.  Sending lots of    and    for happier times for all who have experienced loss.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Mifi

Oh Felix huge hugs to you too honey       

Thats freaky timing, 3 consecutive days you, me & JJ1     

Life is so hard     take care   

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Thanks girls only you would understand and I opened 2 Christmas cards with photos of their babies and the annual round up letters!!

 to Felix and FM
L xx


----------



## Damelottie

Gosh - I hate those annual letters.

Ditto to what Lou said JJ1 - 3 years   . Such an awful time. I'm glad you and the boys chat about it. So sad for you all that this dream still hasn't quite come true.

Felix and FM - Huge huge    

xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

This times are so hard for us, and certain dates are harsh reminders for us all  I got through the day I asked for a few hours to finish early, as I didn't want to be there at 3 pm when my awful scan was.  I had a few tears on the platform waiting for the train to work, then my second appt of day wasn't a nice task but management is management.  I came home and my donor's partner was here on nights, so he got up we chatted then I went and had a manicure and pedicure, I came home and he had a lovely bunch of flowers for me, and had cleaned the house- he is so thoughtful.

Tomorrow will be a better day.

L x


----------



## Felix42

Oh JJ. That is just so thoughtful of him.   Roll on tomorrow and I hope the flowers bring you a smile in the morning. Take care. 

Thanks to everyone for my hugs too. Felt so much brighter this morning. Its good to get past the day itself. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## cocochanel1

JJ1, Felix and FM,     to you all

JJ1 so sorry that you are having to go through this, so glad your friends are amazingly supportive - you are a lovely, beautiful, kind woman and things will work out. Love Coco xxx


----------



## Mifi

Hi guys

Thanks for all the      sorry I have been AWOL again as I ended up re-admitted to hospital on Saturday   severe abdo pain and spend the whole weekend in hospital ward drugged up   so glad to be home now but feeling rather weak and low as had the week from hell  

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

FM I really hope that you are feeling better you poor soul in hospital and what a week for you.

L x


----------



## Mifi

Thanks ladies finally feel like im picking up TG!!! Stil cant believe that a supposidly minor op turned into almost a week in hospital and another 2 weeks at least recovering - typical me nothing is ever simple   

Sending    right back at you  

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Damelottie

FM - Glad you're starting to feel better


----------



## wizard

It is with a leaden and perhaps dying heart that I am posting here.

Today I am 21 weeks pregnant but the life of my wee man was not meant to be. I had another scan on Tuesday and saw the renal specialist from GOSH. The prognosis changed from 'guarded' to 'poor' as the baby has virtually no renal function at all. The chances of him surviving past the first days, should he even get that far were very slim. There were other problems too but it's even worth me going into detail; on the basis he would go through great suffering I felt, no matter how much _I_ wanted him, I just couldn't do that to him.

Yesterday I had what is called 'feticide'. Or more accurately he had feticide, where the baby is injected in the heart with potassium chloride and the heart stops instantly. I didn't have to have that, I could have delivered him without it and he may have been alive. And although I would have dome anything to see him alive, I could not bring myself to force him through a labour when he wasn't yet ready only to take a few gasps and die. Or for him to die during the labour. In both those cases he would have felt pain and suffering and whilst I know that that injection yesterday will haunt me until the day I die, that that room I lay in, those ceiling lights, that monitor, the words 'pass me the KCl' and seeing the plunger go down in the syringe in will live with me forever, I had to do it for him. But it has completely broken me, I am beside myself with grief and loss and I feel like a part of me has died too. And I don't know how to carry on right now.

I have taken tablets to start the labour process and will go back to the hospital tomorrow morning to deliver him. It could take between 12 and 24 hours, it just depends how I respond but it's likely to be at the longer end as I haven't delivered a baby before. Today I bought a blanket to wrap him in, it's not what I wanted really and I feel like I'm doing him a disservice. I know that's silly really, I guess it's just an indication of me wishing I could do more for him than buy a plain old blanket. I wish I could have made him something but I don't have the capacity to do that right now. Walking through the shop to get to the baby section was surreal and crippling. All around me were mums with new borns and shelves of sterilising equipment.

I have to think about funeral arrangements; I know what I want but can't bring myself to start contacting funeral directors.

I never knew I could feel this bad. And like many people my life hasn't been the easiest but nothing, nothing, has ever been this hard. The best I can hope for right now is that tomorrow I get a good, professional and sensitive midwife. Not a patronising one that had the brains of a lettuce like I saw yesterday. She told me that I'd feel better after a good cry. If that was the case I'd feel on cloud nine right now given the tears I have shed these past days. But don't get me started on her, I couldn't believe the number of gaffs she made in the space of minutes. On the one hand I had to laugh because you couldn't have made it up. The line that he will be 'like a proper miniature human being' with the gesturing of her hands was just bizarre. She asked me if I had any questions several times, and most of the time I said no (her responses were either inaccurate or trite e.g. I asked 'what are the (side) effects of pethidine?' and she said 'none'!), but at the end I had to almost bite my tongue from asking 'Why are you so stupid?' Tomorrow I may not be so controlled or wise. Regarding the drugs, I had originally thought that the more out of it I was the better it would be, or should I say easier to get through, but given that the birth will be the only time I get to see my baby I have changed my mind completely and I want to see and remember him clearly and not be high on drugs so that it all becomes a bit of a haze.

Love to all of you who have lost little ones

Wizard x


----------



## Chowy

Wizard lots of love and all the very best for tomorrow.  You will meet your little angel and he will be at peace with the world.  If you have an epidural you will be pain free but not out of it honey-if that helps take it. 

Just something I thought about, I know its awfully hard but can you take a camera and take a picture of him so that you always have him near?  Also you could send him with a lock of your hair so part of you will be with him forever.

take care darling we are all hear and thinking of you each and eery day and so wish that we could make things easier on you.

Many   Chowy xx


----------



## lulumead

Wizard...thank you for taking the time and finding the courage to post here so that we know what is going on.  I can imagine how heart broken you are.  Will be thinking of you.

Do you have someone to go with you or help with the arrangements after?
If there is anything we can do please ask. 

xxxxxxx


----------



## bingbong

Wizard I'm so sorry to see you posting on this thread. You have shown so much courage and strength through this, I really wish that I could say or do something to help, and if I can then please ask. I will be thinking of you tomorrow, I hope that you get support from the people with you and have some special time with your little boy. 

Please, if I can do anything at all I am here  

Bingbong x


----------



## starbuck

Wizard

I'm so sorry you are having to go through this.  You have done a great job in loving and supporting him from day one and even now making the right decision for him.  I hope the delivery is handled well and you get to spend some precious time with him.  

I know there is nothing I can do or say to make this pain go away - I hope your Aunt and friend can stay with you for a while and take care of you whilst you need it. 

You will continue to be in my thoughts. 

Starbuck
x


----------



## Teela

Wizard

My heart was also breaking reading your heartfelt words. You have shown so much strength and courage to get to this point I just hope
you have someone there tomorrow to be strong for you.... 

There is nothing I can say that would be remotely adequate or useful, so just know many people are thinking of you.

Teela
xx


----------



## Damelottie

Wizard - I must be honest in that I have no idea what to say. I simply feel aghast and horrified and words to you are failing me completely. 

You say that part of you has also died. It would me too - all of us I imagine. I don't think there is anything worse that what you have just been through/going through.

You shall very much be in my thoughts this evening and tomorrow. I pray you get the right staff with you. The others have given you some great ideas of photos etc. 

Your little son is one of us too. Please hug him also from us all.

Thank you for posting. xxxxxxxx


----------



## indekiwi

Wizard, all my love and thoughts are with you tonight and tomorrow.  I'm wishing with all my heart that your labour will be a peaceful affair, with sensitive and professional midwifery care and someone close to hold your hand and help you along this path.  I also want to send gentle hugs to your wee boy and to you.  No one will grieve more than you for the loss of your son; I'm grieving for you, for the decisions you've needed to take, and for the hard climb back to some semblance of normality and happiness in the days and months to come.    

A-Mx


----------



## Lou-Ann

Wizard, I am so sorry that you have had to make such an agonising decision  . I hope that you have the support of your family and friends. Thinking of you  

Love
Lou-Ann x


----------



## ameliacooper

Wizard

My heart goes out to you and your precious son.

You will both be in my thoughts.

 

Axx


----------



## Felix42

Wizard, my heart goes out to you and your little boy hunny.    I will be thinking of you tonight, tomorrow and over the coming weeks and months.  I hope you have caring midwives with you tomorrow and someone who can give you all the love and support you deserve in person. 

My mum also wants to say she is thinking of you and sending her love and thoughts at this most difficult of times.

Love and hugs, Felix xx


----------



## RedRose

Wizard, I am so sorry to read your heartbreaking post.  You have made such a brave and unselfish decision for the love of your little boy.  Please God you will have some sensitive staff with you tomorrow and a friend or family member with you.  Do whatever your natural instincts tell you to do when you are going through this, they will guide you.  This is your time with your baby and people need to let you do what you feel is right.  Like all the other women on here, I will be thinking of you tomorrow and wishing somehow we could help take the pain away,
                  sending all my love, Rosi xxxxxxxxxxxxxx.


----------



## kylecat

Will be thinking of you and your little one tommorrow Wizard and hoping that you have sensitive and knowlegable staff there to help you, 

Love and hugs  
Kylecat xxx


----------



## upsydaisy

To a very special mummy and her precious little boy.
Thinking of you at this terrible time.
Upsy
xxx


----------



## cocochanel1

Wizard, I'm dreadfully sorry to hear your news.. No words are sufficient to convey the sadness and heartbreak that we all feel for you. You have been incredibly brave and selfless towards your little boy - you have shown him such love. Life can be so cruel and I'm really sorry that you are having to go through this. Love, Coco xxxx


----------



## Rose39

Wizard - I know I texted you earlier, but you'll be in my thoughts and prayers tonight and tomorrow,and I hope that the hospital staff take care of you and your precious little boy with kindness and sensitivity.     

Rose xx


----------



## muddypaws

Dear Wizard, you are so brave to even be able to post and I hope that good wishes from the girls on here make you feel cared for and thought about. It's just the most awful and traumatic experience and I just hope that you get some good support tomorrow. Nothing can be as heartbreaking as losing a child, I so wish that you were not having to go through this. 

With love
Muddy x


----------



## aweeze

Wizard - I have read your very sad post with tears rolling down my face. I guess in situations like this you always hold on to that tiny shred of hope that a miracle may happen and I have been keeping you and your little boy in my thoughts and sending those 'atheist prayers' out to wherever 'atheist prayers' go in the hope that you would never have to come to this unimaginable place. 

You have acted with braveness and dignity at every step of the way and your decisions have been thoughtful, caring, selfless and have demonstrated great love for your little boy. 

As the others have already said, I hope that you have sensitive staff tomorrow that show you the respect that you and your son deserve. Don't let anybody control what is your time to say goodbye. Please make sure that you spend whatever time you need to with him. My thoughts will be with you hunny.    

Lou
XX


----------



## acrazywench

Wizard, I'm so, so sorry. I know there's nothing I can really say, but I just wanted to echo what the others have said, you and your precious son are in my thoughts at this awful time. I hope that you are met with understanding at the hospital tomorrow and that you have family and friends close by who can offer you suppoprt at this difficult time.    

crazywench xx


----------



## Mifi

Wizard I am just so terribly sorry to hear your news    I am at a loss of what to say and am in absolute floods     it truely is heart breaking and I too echo all the support and thoughts here    I hope and   that you get the support you need   we will be thinking of you and your angel         

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## madmisti

Wizard hun, I am just devastated for  you    This is so unbelievably cruel and unfair, but you are showing incredible courage and love for your little boy. I can only begin to imagine how hard this time is, but my thoughts and 'prayers' are with you. I am sure you will find the strength to arrange a beautiful send-off for him - and he will always know how very much wanted and loved he is.

Take care honey
Misti xx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Wizard - I really do not know what to say - words completely fail me.        just reading your post makes me just want to run to you and give you a big big hug.  
     please know that altho I don't come on here often - I am thinking of you and pray you find the support you so need.
Take care, stay safe and we're here for you x x x


----------



## Felix42

Thinking of you today Wizard. 
    

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Damelottie

Have been thinking of you today Wizard


----------



## midnightaction

*wizard* My heart is breaking for you, having to go through such an awful and life changing time 

No words can heal the pain of what you are going through, but the thought that we are all thinking of you might help you to remember that you are never alone 

I hope that today has gone as smoothly as such a day can and you have been able to spend some special time with your very much loved little boy.

Your in my heart and my thoughts 

Sarah xxx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

wizard I have just seen your post and I am so sorry that you have had to go through this, life is so unfair and cruel, I really hope that you get sensitive staff today and that you can lay your LO to rest in the way you wished for him.
Thinking of you, words fail me and I have shed tears for you and your very sad situation 

L x


----------



## kizzi79

Wizard, I am so so sorry   You have had such courage and have always put your little one first, you are a truely amazing mum. I know there is nothing i can say to make things better but I will be thinking of you today    Krissi  x


----------



## Chowy

Wizard

Our thoughts are with you today and we   that things have gone as smoothly as they possibly can have.

I wrote a poem years ago that may help a little in time.

I think of you and I smile, 
then I think some more,
the tears they well inside of me, 
with the hurt and pain once more

The feelings that I have for you, 
they are instant every day,
and that feeling in my stomach, 
oh it just wont go away.

One day the hurt will go,
the tears and pain will cease,
but I never will forget the time
that the love was so intense.


Lots of love and thoughts  
Chowy xx


----------



## sweet1

Wizard I have been thiking about you last night and today. I hope that somehow you have managed to get through this terrible day and meet your little boy, and spend as much time with him as you could have done. I hope that all our thoughts provide a small amount of comfort for you at this time. xxx


----------



## bingbong

Wizard, just wanted to say that I'm thinking of you and hope that you got to have some special time with your precious little boy.

Bingbong x


----------



## Sima

Wizard - I have just read your post.  I am so sorry to read your news.  I trust you managed to get through the day and I hope that you have plenty of support around you at this sad time.


----------



## winky77

Wizard ....if only tears could wash away the pain you'd have a river to add from all the girls on here, myself included.  What you are going through is purely heart-wrenching and I feel privileged that you have been strong enough to post on here and share it with us and to give us the opportunity to add our cyber support to the support you have from those who can be with you in person.  I have a couple of friends who have been through similar situations and your words echo how they also felt at the time.  Their babies may no longer be with them physically but they will always be with them in every other way and are still part of their families even in the minds of the children who they had subsequently.  My heart breaks that you will not get to see your baby grow but the choices and decisions you have made for your son in the last few weeks and days have shown a selfless love that only an amazing mother could have. Like others have said, I just really hope that you found some medical staff who at least respected you and your son and the painful but precious journey you will have made together today.     
..Winky


----------



## Papillon

Wizard, I am so so sorry.  

Thinking of you.    

Papillon


----------



## Candee

Oh Wizard I can't think of anything to say, except my mum and I have been thinking about you all the time and what unbelivevable pain you are going through. Just hoping that you are getting support and help and that you got a better midwife to help you to get through.        
Candee
x


----------



## Annaleah

Wizard - my thoughts are with you


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Wizard
I haven't been online since Thursday - so have only read your terribly sad post this morning.
I am so, so sorry that things have worked out this way. 
My thoughts are very much with you.    
Take care of yourself 
OneStep


----------



## some1

Wizard   am thinking of you loads, really hope that your little man arrived peacefully and that you  have had some special time with him.  You took such good care of him and did everything you could - I hope that you and your loved ones are taking good care of you know.  Wishing you peace.

Some1

xx


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Wizard   I am so very sorry, the pain you feel must be unbearable but you have shown such courage and love throughout.  We are all thinking of you and your little boy xxx


----------



## cocochanel1

Wizard, how are you doing? We are all thinking of you xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Roo67

Wizard - I am so sorry to read of what you have been through the past few days, I hope you have some support around you at the moment.

R x


----------



## wizard

I can not thank you all enough for your love and kindness and offers of help and support.  They are truly wonderful.  I have felt very sad and hurt at the way some of those closest to me have responded to me (or not as is actually the case) this past week so your posts have meant a great deal.

I gave birth on Sunday 24th January at 1am to a perfect and tiny baby boy.  I called him Louis (pronounced as in King of France, not the well-known racing driver!)

I will post properly when I can.  At the moment I feel like my world has completely fallen apart and the grief I feel is insurmountable.  Louis's funeral is on Wednesday 3rd February.  There are unlikely to be any ashes as his bones are so soft so I have bought some semi-precious stones to go in his casket with him in the hope they will burn in such way that I do get something back.  There must a tiny part of him that will come back to me, so I hope. 

Love
Wizard x


----------



## upsydaisy

Wizard  - you and your precious little boy have never been far from my thoughts these past few days.  Your pain is beyond imagining and it is truly beyond my comprehension that others wouldn't see that. 
Such a beautiful name. I will be thinking of you on Wednesday  .
Upsy
xxx


----------



## ameliacooper

Wizard   

Louis is a lovely name.  I'm soo sorry for your pain and sorry that some people have disappointed you soo much.  Try not to focus on them and think about yourself.  I will be thinking of you on Wednesday and I hope you get something back from his ashes so he will be close to you forever.

I saw a TV programme really recently - can't think of name though - where people wore ashes of their loved ones round their necks and I thought it was a lovely thing.

Wizard - I know you're a London Girl too and GIA2 is hosting a lunch at her house on Saturday - I know there are lots girls who would love to see you.  Not sure if you are up to it - but wanted to let you know.


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Wizard
My heart goes out to you. So much loss to carry. You have been, and are, very much in my thoughts - and will be particularly so on Wednesday. 

Louis is a lovely name. 

I wondered whether there is a grief counsellor you could see? My clinic's counsellor was incredibly supportive after my miscarriage - nothing takes away the pain, but having a real person who is there for you can be helpful. This woman is trained in grief counselling, so may be different from other clinics' counsellors.

Take as much time as you need - this is your grief and no-one else's timescales or expectations have any importance. (I say that as I felt there was pressure on me to get back to work and be "normal"...). 

Love    
OneStep


----------



## Candee

Wizard Louis is such a beautiful name. 
I will be thinking of you and Louis on Wednesday. I hope that you have support to help you through the day.
I cannot imagine the grief you feel. I wish I could help. All I can do is let you know, like all the others on this thread, I am thinking of you every day and I think your courage is beyond description.
Candee
x


----------



## indekiwi

Wizard, as others have already said, Louis is such a gorgeous name for your precious son.  

I've been hoping that you had a straightforward labour and birth - not that it would have provided you with much solace - but so that at least one part of this hugely painful process could be uncomplicated.    

I also wish I could take a   to the individuals who have wounded you with their insensitive responses.  Know that were you surrounded by those posting on these boards, you would have a towering wall of belligerent women prepared to kick the   of anyone who showed you unkindness in the face of such a horrendous and grief stricken time in your life.  

Finally, I'm sending lots of love - and a few tears - along with you on Wednesday, and really hope that the people that really matter to you step up to the mark, hold you close and see you through the day, and the days to come.

    

A-Mx


----------



## kizzi79

Wizard   Its just so terrible all that youv'e been through. Will be thinking of you on Wednesday. Take care, Love Krissi  x


----------



## loubi

Wizard, What you have been through is just heartbreaking and I often think of you.

Louis is a beautiful name for a beautiful baby I am sure.

You will certainly be in my thoughts on Wednesday.

Take care

Loubi


----------



## bingbong

Wizard   I have been thinking of you often and will be thinking of you even more on Wednesday. I agree that some people find it so hard to know what to say, and so say nothing. Louis is a lovely name.

bingbong x


----------



## Lou-Ann

Wizard, I have been thinking of you . My heart goes out to you and I will be thinking of you and you little boy on Wednesday. As the others have said, Louis is a lovely name.

Love and hugs
Lou-Ann x


----------



## Roo67

wizard - my heart goes out to you and will be thinking of you on wednesday, I agree with Patterdale sometimes ppl just do not know what to say and are afraid of saying the right thing and although they don't mean to be unkind or hurtful if certainly feels that way.

I bought a necklace, a gorgeous forget me knot with birthstones of my due dates on it which was accompanied my this little poem and though it beautiful

Forget me not

My little one,
you have left me too soon,
though my body can no longer hold you
I hold you forever in my heart
As precious and beautiful as this flower caught in time
A mothers love does not forget


R xx


----------



## Damelottie

Thats loveky Roo  

Wizard - I have also been thinking of you a lot and am glad you posted to tell us about Louis. Its is beyond belief that you have endured any negative reactions and I am so sorry to hear that   

Wednesday will be a very difficult day and you will very much be in my thoughts and prayers.

LL xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Wizard thinking of you and hope that Wed brings you some solace as you say goodbye however painful it is. 

Louis is a beautiful name and your little boy has a very special Mummy who loves him very much.  Louis will be with you in your heart forever.

L x


----------



## GIAToo

Wizard - so sorry to read your post and as others have said, I hope you have the right support on Wednesday.  Will be thinking of you.  
You are more than welcome at my place on Saturday, but of course will totally understand if you're not up to it.
Love and     
GIA Tooxx


----------



## Betty-Boo

Wizard         - have been thinking of you.

Louis is a lovely name for your son - my thoughts and prayers are with you and I'll be thinking of you both Wednesday.
Take care x x x

Roo - that is a lovely poem x x


----------



## lulumead

Wizard, thank you so much for posting about Louis, what a gorgeous name. Have been thinking of you and will be thinking of you both on Wednesday, and sending you lots of love.

We are all here for you    

xxx


----------



## RichmondLass

Wizard you're a brave, brave lady.  None of this is going to get easy in the near future but I can only promise you that it will get easier with time, even though it doesn't feel like it.

I hope that Wednesday at least brings the solace of some sort of ceremony in honour of your little boy's life.  With you for such a short but precious time.  What a great little gift he was!

Little Louis was loved enormously and protected by his mum while he was with her.  I hope you are surrounded by your more supportive friends and family for the funeral and you get to spend time this week alone or with people that can help you - whatever makes things more bearable for you.

Very sad.  Thinking of you both lots.

Take care and thanks for sharing what's happened with us.

RLXX


----------



## sweet1

thank you for posting Wizard, and I agree with the others that Louis is a lovely and fitting name. I hope Wednesday will be a peaceful time and that you are surrounded by understanding and kind friends and family. He couldn't have hoped for a better and more loving mum.


----------



## starbuck

Wizard - am glad you found more courage to post us your news and let us know about Louis.  He will always be with you in your heart and forever be loved.  I will definitely never forget him or the difficulties and heartbreak you are living through. Have been thinking of you both and hope your ceremony on Wednesday is very special.

Love
Starbuck
x


----------



## Mifi

Wizard my thoughts and prayers are with you    especially on Wednesday


----------



## acrazywench

Wizard, thank you for keeping us updated. You've been so brave throughout this, Louis couldn't have had a better mum. I'll be thinking of you both tomorrow.   

xx


----------



## Chowy

Hi Wizard,

Our thoughts are with you both today and especially tomorrow, but you will be in each others hearts forever.

Thanks for posting as we do worry about you alot.  It is at times like these that you find out really who your freinds are. 

Chowy and Pup xx


----------



## wizard

Thank you thank you thank you. You are all wonderfully kind.

I saw my boy for the last time today. I took him in a fresh blanket and wrapped him gently in it. When I was at the hospital with him and wrapped him up before he went to the mortuary, I was looking for something to tie the blanket with. I pulled out one of my tops that I'd brought with me but not worn (I refused to go to the post natal ward after the birth so didn't really need any of the clothes I had) and cut two strips of fabric off the hem of it. It was a cotton top with lycra, with a dark blue and beige fine stripe. I tied the blanket at both ends with the strips. My girlfriend, who had been with me at the fetocide and after and then at the birth wept. She hadn't shed a tear until then, I think to be strong for me, but when she saw me just cut up my top without a second thought she said she saw that I would give anything I had to my child. That what was mine was his. So today the new blanket encased him with those same ties. I have the top, no longer wearable, still in my bag from the hospital because I can't yet bring myself to unpack it.

I also put a small kangaroo with her joey next to him, and a soft cat to represent the furbabies that would have been in our lives and taught him to be kind to pets and animals. The semi-precious stones are with him, along with some words from my mother, my aunt and my girlfriend. He also has a letter from me, which if I can manage it tomorrow I will read to him. A lock on my hair is under his arm (has been since the hospital) - thank you Chowy, and there is a jade heart next to him that says 'peace'. Finally, at his feet there is a photo of me cradling him at the hospital. I got some animal lettering in his name that I have stuck at the end of the casket on the outside.

There will only be me and my girlfriend at the funeral tomorrow. I didn't want a big thing where I had to worry about other people and have them in my house (all my family live in Germany / Manchester). There is no minister or music, just quiet time for me and him and the only other person who was fortunate enough to meet him. I will carry his coffin / casket in to the chapel myself.

My girlfriend has been wonderful. I haven't mentioned her before because we did not embark upon fertility treatment together and she did not come to any of my scans until the end of the pregnancy. She certainly would have had a place in my child's life but this has been a solo journey and co-parenting is not on the agenda. She is supportive of my choices but in terms of parenting I am a single woman. However I don't know how I could have got through these last few weeks without her. My sister has sent me 2 txts since I told her I'd given birth. Both saying 'I'm very sorry', and that's it. No offer of support, no time, no telephone calls, not even a measly card. Nor did she offer to come to his funeral. I admit that I am bitterly hurt by her and very angry.

Anyway, enough of that. I don't quite know how I will get through tomorrow. It is early in the morning so I am thankful that I won't be just waiting all day. It is so lovely when you all post and refer to me as his mummy, it breaks my heart every time but it affirms who and what I am, but more importantly, what I actually _feel_.

Wizard x


----------



## bingbong

Wizard, little Louis is very lucky to have a mummy that loves hims so much. You have put so much thought into what will be with him, it sounds so lovely.

I am so pleased to hear that your girlfriend has been there for you, and that she will be there tomorrow. I'm sorry that your sister wasn't able to reach out and support you too. 

I will be thinking of you tomorrow, and sending both you and Louis lots of love. You are his mummy and you always will be. 


bingbong x


----------



## Mifi

Wizard

As BB has said Louis is very lucky to have such a loving mummy. All the things that you have done for him has shown such thought and deep love. It is good to hear that your girlfriend has been such great support and continues to be so. It is so unfortunate taht your sister couldn't do the same   My thoughts will be with you tomorrow and im sending you the biggest cyber            that I can. I'm just so sorry that you have to go through this       If I could take away your pain or even some of it believe me I would    

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## RichmondLass

Wiz I'm sorry your sister has been so horrible.  We can't pick our family but we can pick our friends - right?  She should be last on your list of people to think about right now.  Your girlfriend sounds lovely and glad she's come through for you at what couldn't be a worse time.  She sounds an absolute star and I'm glad she's around for you.

Best wishes from me for tomorrow and it sounds as if you've arranged things as beautifully as you possible could for your little boy and his mummy.

Take care of yourself
RLxxxxx


----------



## wishingforanangel

Wizard....

I don't have any words for your loss or your pain.....just


----------



## aweeze

Wizard - all of the things that you have put in with Louis sound beautiful and have such meaning from a mother to her much loved child. 

It makes my heart so sad to read your posts and yet I am filled with admiration at your strength and courage. I'm sure you don't feel like that but you are doing so incredibly well to cope through this such difficult time.  I'm so glad that you are receiving support from your girlfriend especially as your family are failing you.  

Take care. My thoughts are with you and I hope that tomorrow goes as well as it can do   

Lou
X


----------



## cocochanel1

Wizard, we will all be thinking about you tomorrow. You are amazing - so strong and courageous and thoughtful. Louis is lucky to have a mummy like you.
Coco xxx


----------



## ♥Jovial♥

Wizard, will be thinking of you and Louis tomorrow    
Jovi x


----------



## Candee

Wizard all the arrangements you have made for your little Loius are just so beautiful. No other mother in the world could have made it more special. I am so glad that you have your girlfriend to support you and look after you. 
I will be thinking of you all day tomorrow.
Candee
x


----------



## Rose39

Wizard hunny        

You are and always will be mummy to your precious little boy, and nobody will ever be able to take that away from you. Everything that you've done for Louis has been done with such kindness, tenderness and love, and no mummy could do anything more for their child. 

I'm glad that your girlfriend has been supporting you and helping you through this awful time, and that she will be with you tomorrow, to share special moments with your baby. 

You'll be in my thoughts and prayers.   

Rose xxx


----------



## ameliacooper

Wizard

 I will be thinking of you tomorrow.  No Mummy should have to go through what you have.

Keep strong 

xx


----------



## Lou-Ann

Wizard, you will always be Louis' kind, caring, thoughtful and courageous mommy. Glad that you have the support of your girlfriend at this sad time. I will be thinking of you tomorrow   

Lou-Ann x


----------



## kizzi79

Dear Wizard, I will be thinking of you and Louis tomorrow. You have been an amazing Mummy to him and always will be. Take care   Love Krissi  x


----------



## Teela

Wizard, my heart and thoughts will be with you and Louis tomorrow, your amazing   

Teela
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## lulumead

Wizard, your post brought tears to my eyes, you are incredibly strong and your girlfriend is right, you are a fantastic mum to Louis, shown in the amazing way that you are looking after him. Its good to hear that you have someone supporting you through this. I'm sorry to hear that your sister has let you down when you really need her support.

Will be thinking of you and Louis tomorrow. We will all be shedding some tears for you both.

Here when you need us.    
Much love.
xxxx


----------



## Felix42

Wizard, I will be thinking of you and your little Louis tomorrow.  You have so thoughtfully and lovingly cared for your son.  I hope that you and your girlfriend can find some comfort in tomorrow's ceremony.   

love and hugs to you all, Felix xx


----------



## indekiwi

Wizard, thinking of you today.      So pleased your girlfriend has helped you through and will be with you to say good bye to Louis.  The things you have packed for him to take with him are just beautiful.  Sending you strength and hugs to get through the day.     

A-Mx


----------



## 9£Bundle

Wizard - You are an incredible mummy, you've given your Louis such strong, deep & tender love. I hope todays service helps you & your girlfriend say goodbye to him in the calm, quiet, peacefull way you want.    

9£B
xxx


----------



## Chowy

Wizard and Louis you will forever be in each others thoughts.  

I will tell my Chow babies that have left us to seek Louis out and take good care of him for his Mummy.

    

Chowy and Pup.


----------



## Mifi

Wizard just wanted to say that you & Louis are in my thoughts today


----------



## Damelottie

Have been thinking of you today Wizard. I hope you and your girlfriend found some comfort together   

Be at peace Baby Louis


----------



## estella

Wizard, you are simply amazing and you, your girlfriend and your beautiful darling Louis are in my thoughts today.

 

Love Estella

xxxx


----------



## muddypaws

Dear Wizard, I hope that today has helped you to mark little Louis' presence in your heart. The things that you put with him were beautiful...I'm just so sorry that you had to leave a piece of yourself in a place that you would rather not have been. I cannot imagine how you have got through today. My thoughts are with you and if Mini could understand, she would definitely give you a big squeeze and sloppy kiss.  

Muddy


----------



## Roo67

Wizard -  I hope today was not too traumatic for you and you managed to find a little comfort xx


I have felt really out of sorts today, tomorrow would have been the due date for my first little angel, so can't help but think that they should be 1 yr old now, ironically my 3rd m/c if it were twins would have been due tomorrow also and as the reprofit june/july thread was mostly twins I feel that I should think of them tomorrow too.

Love to all the other angel mummies 

R xx


----------



## aweeze

Roo - sending you lots of cyber hugs hunny    

Wizard - You and Louis have been in my thoughts today    

Lou
X


----------



## blueytoo

Wizard - you have been in my thoughts today too. I am really pleased to hear that you have a partner to help you through all this, especially as your sister has not been very supportive   

Roo -    two due dates on one day, that must be so hard. I really struggle every year as my due date for my LO approaches so it must be worse for you with twice that pain on one day.   

Claire xx


----------



## Rose39

Roo and Wizard - sending you both big hugs today     

Rose xx


----------



## some1

Wizard - I have just logged on after a few days away and seen that your precious son Louis had his funeral today.  Coincidentally, I have also been to a funeral today and was thinking of you and your little one.  The preparations you made and special things you put in Louis' casket sound so lovely - what a wonderful mummy you are to your boy.  I am making a small donation in memory of your son to ARC (Antenatal Results and Choices - a charity which provides support and information to expectant and bereaved parents throughout and after the antenatal screening and testing process).  Thinking of you often  

Roo -   thinking of you at this difficult time hun.

Some1

xx


----------



## lulumead

wizard and louis, been thinking of you today...sending   

and to you Roo   

xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Wizard your momentos for Louis are so fitting and I am so pleased that you have your gf with you for support at this sad sad time. Sending  a 

L x


----------



## Felix42

Wizard, sending you lots and Louis lots of love and hugs for this sad day.  

Roo, so sorry that you have both anniversaries together.    Will be thinking of you tomorrow.

Love and hugs to all, Felix xx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo  are you going to do anything tomorrow to acknowledge the day? I always do a little something, and I buy flowers for the house and usually take the day off

L x


----------



## Damelottie

Lots of love for tomorrow Roo xx


----------



## Mifi

Ah Roo huge     hunny im sharing your tears          

Wizard hope you are ok      

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## indekiwi

Roo, sending heartfelt      your way for today.

A-Mx


----------



## starbuck

Wizard -  Just wanted to let you know I was thinking of you yesterday.  You have been such a loving and caring mummy that I'm sure your son felt this and is at peace.    I'm really glad you could find some special things to go with him and that you had your girlfriend for support through everything.  Don't forget we are still here if you need us. 

Roo - thinking of you too. 

Starbuck
x


----------



## Lou-Ann

Sending    to Roo and Wizard  

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Bluebelle Star

Wizard and Roo sending lots of      to you both.


----------



## Candee

Wizard and Roo      
Candee
x


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Roo thinking of you hun
l x


----------



## madmisti

Wizard - I just wanted to say that i am full of admiration and respect for your courage - and the fierce love you so obvioulsy have for little Louis. I hope that Wednesday's ceremony was all that you wanted it to be, and you can find some comfort in the fact that Louis knows how very much you love him and how much tender care you showed him.

I know that words cannot really express the pain and sorrow we all feel for you honey - but you are very much in our thoughts and in our hearts.

Take care of yourself as you try to deal with this trauma and loss.

Roo - I hope your OTD wasn't too painful and you found a way to get through it, and maybe mark it, in a way that was right for you.

I so wish we didn't have a need for this thread - hugs to all of you who have experienced this unique and cruel loss.

lol

Misti xx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Wizard hun, I've been away this past month with almost no internet access so I've missed much of what's been going on, but I've just read back through this thread (in floods of tears   ) and wanted to at the very least send some   
As many of the girls have already acknowledged, there are no words which are right for this situation. Sometimes life just seems impossibly cruel and unfair and no one should ever have to go through what you have recently been through. I am so sorry this has happened to you, and so sad for you. 

I hope that you have the continued support of your girlfriend and other family and friends, and that in the coming weeks and months you are able to look forward to the future once again.

My thoughts are with you  
Suitcase
x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

And   to Roo too, these anniversaries are never easy (although I must confess I've dealt with it by simply blocking it out....may come back to haunt me one day but for now seems to be the way for me to cope)

You take care - we'll get our chance at motherhood one of these days  
Suitcase
x


----------



## wizard

Roo     I hope you managed to get through the anniversaries as well as you could.  I know that nothing can change your loss  

Wizard x


----------



## wizard

Once again, thank you all for your posts and warm words and thoughts.  It really is nice to know that you are all there and kind enough to think of me.

The funeral came and went.  The 'hearsette' arrived at my house with his coffin / casket in it.  I think I'll say casket as coffin sounds so gloomy     Me and my girlfriend travelled with him in the back of the hearsette.  We arrived at the chapel and I carried his casket in.  Initially I put it on the plinth thingy with the curtains around it (sorry I don't know the proper name) but he seemed so far away and the casket was so small that I immediately lifted him off and placed him on the floor.  I sat down with him and read him a copy of the letter that was in his casket, and then I'm not really sure where the rest of the time went.  I lay my hands on his casket and talked to him for awhile and then it was time to go.  I placed his casket back on the plinth and got into the car outside.  I looked through the doors of the chapel and saw his tiny casket at the end of which was 'LOUIS' in the animal letters I bought for him.  And then we left.

The next day I called the crematorium to find out if there were any ashes.  The first guy, Peter, I spoke to said that there weren’t, and when I asked ‘but what about the stones?  Did they not leave anything?’, he then recalled that he had collected remnants of the stones but couldn’t now find them and thought they might have been thrown away.  I was absolutely distraught by this; if there were no ashes that was one thing but for there to be something and it had been thrown away was completely another.  The Friday before the funeral I had visited the crematorium to speak to the people that actually do the cremations, and had spoken to the manager stressing how important it was that I got anything at all that was left.  He told me that he had to check and sign if there were no ashes and that if there was anything at all, even fragments of the stone, he would make sure they were kept.  I felt very reassured by this and to be told by ‘Peter’ that they might have been thrown away was just too much.  Thankfully, 2 hours later I got a call from the crem saying that the remains had been kept and put in a small urn.  For those 2 hours I think I barely breathed due to the paralysing fear I had that the remains had not been kept.  Half an hour later I was there collecting them.  The jade heart I had put in with him that said peace across it had been broken by the furnace but after going through almost every fleck of the remains I found all the pieces.  At some point I will put the heart back together.

I think I am going to be one of those crazy people that keep ashes on the coffee table / mantle piece etc.  I don’t fool myself for a minute that the ashes or stones or whatever I have are him, but they are all that I have of him in the physical sense.  During the day I take him into the lounge and at night I take him to bed with him and the urn sits on my bedside table.  I bought a small locket to put some of the ashes in which I will wear all the time.  My aunt came over from Germany yesterday and stayed last night.  When she saw the locket she asked if there was a photo of Louis in it and I said no, it was his ashes.  There followed a stunned silence and widening of the eyes.  I said nothing more and neither did she.  I love my aunt very dearly but she has been quite absent these last few weeks.  I know she doesn’t mean to be insensitive or jump in with her size 9s but phrases like ‘I have to move on’ and ‘get back to normal’ are not helpful and fall on very stony ground with me.  My line at the moment is ‘only when you have walked in these shoes, can you pass those kinds of comments’.

The birth.  I haven’t said anything about the birth.  I went into hospital at 11am on 23rd January, thinking that I would have the first pessary soon after admission to induce the labour.  I waited 4 hours in a grim delivery room before the doctor eventually came, so that was 3pm.  I started to get pain an hour so later and had a second pessary at 6.30pm as I was only 2cm dilated.  Shortly after that the pain started to become quite bad and I tried gas and air but vomited immediately after so that wasn’t going to work.  I reluctantly gave in an hour later and had some diamorphine; I didn’t want to be out of it when he was born so had wanted to avoid this but with no gas and air, and with my girlfriend and the midwife saying I didn’t need to suffer I gave in.  The diamorphine worked for about 2 hours but by 10pm the pain was getting unbearable again.  At 10.30pm I was given another pessary but not told how dilated I was.  I hadn’t a clue where I was at in the labour process at that stage and couldn’t gauge what the hell the pain was – was it contractions?  What I did know was that if this was going to go on for a good while longer, which is what seemed to be the thinking of the doctor and midwife, then I wanted an epidural.  The midwife went out to organise it and 30 minutes later hadn’t returned.  My g/f went out to find her and she came back saying I wasn’t allowed an epidural because I wasn’t far enough along, but that I could have some more morphine that I could administer myself and the anaesthetist was preparing it.  At 11.45pm, over an hour after I’d asked for the epidural, the machine with morphine arrived.  The anaesthetist hooked it up and I pressed the little green button so desperately as by that stage I was in unbearable agony.  The machine let me administer the morphine every 5 minutes but 15 minutes later it had made zero difference and the machine was beeping.  The anaesthetist came back in and I was pleading with him to give me something that would help as I didn’t think it was working.  He played around with the machine and said all was ok.  My g/f was obviously finding it difficult to see me in so much pain and asked him if he could do anything more, to which he replied he felt he was being criticised.  At that point I lost it rather and yelled at him ‘You’re feeling criticised?  For Christ’s Sake, get over yourself.  I’m in labour and about to give birth to a dead baby and you’re the only person right now who can help me right now.  How you can turn that into you being criticised I have no idea’.  He didn’t say much more after that.  

The pain then just got worse and worse and worse and I realised that they were contractions but I had no idea how close they were or how close I was to giving birth.  The midwife asked if she could examine me and I said yes, but when she went to check this with the doctor, the doctor wouldn’t let her.  Half an hour later, the doctor appeared and examined me and told the midwife (not me) that I was ready.  Ready for what I didn’t know, I was out of my mind with the pain.  There was then lots of rapid activity whilst (I assume) the midwife got her kit out.  I told the doctor I was in agony and asked her if she could do anything.  She replied very rudely ‘push, and you won’t be’.  So I did and Louis was born at 1am.  I held him almost immediately; he was still warm for a short time afterwards from being inside me.  

It seemed that no-one actually had any idea that I was close as I was to giving birth, and that refusing an epidural was not a good decision.  The icing on the cake came when the morphine machine showed that it had not administered any of the drug  , so apart from the diamorphine that lasted from 7-9pm I had no other pain relief and effectively gave birth without any.  And all that after being told I could have anything I wanted….

But when I held my son in my arms, looked at this perfect face and tiny hands and feet, his fingernails, his ears and nose and cherry red mouth the pain didn’t matter.  For the next few hours I just gazed at him, and felt such intense love for him.  For a few hours I felt at peace with him, I felt tranquillity and pleasure and incredibly lucky to have him.  The shunt had got rather messed up though; it had come out of him at one end and pierced the top of his thigh and wrapped itself around his leg.  The midwife helped me untwist it and his leg fell free but it was quite deformed.  This meant the shunt falling out must have happened some time before he died as the leg growth had been badly damaged by it.  It didn’t matter though, he would not have survived without kidney function and the shunt by that stage was irrelevant.  

I wrapped him in the blanket I had bought and cradled him and gazed at him the whole night.  At some point the blanket got soggy and the fluid that had been sitting in his shunt came out.  It was one of those rare and unforgettable moments when I said to my girlfriend ‘Eureka!  At last he pees!’ and we both laughed.

At about 10am I started to get him ready to go to the mortuary.  The midwife came to weigh him and do his head circumference, and wanted to do that herself but I wouldn’t let her.  I decided that he was my baby and just because he was dead that didn’t mean anyone could handle him.  So I weighed him, but drew the line at the HC.  I wanted to know what he weighed but his HC was irrelevant to me and he was so fragile that I didn’t want him to be lifted and moved more than was absolutely necessary.

Saying goodbye to him in that hospital room was unbearable.  I didn’t at that stage know that I would see him twice more before the funeral.  And oddly, although the room I was in was pokey, grubby and noisy (it was on the ground floor and faced the hospital car park), I had become quite attached to it.  Moreover, I wanted those feelings I had when I was with him to be indelibly etched in my mind and on my heart.  I was terrified that when I left the hospital my post birth euphoria and joyous time I had with him would be engulfed by the grief and loss and that my world would come crashing down around me.

I am stuck for words (perhaps unbelievably so given this long post) to describe the grief and loss I feel.  It is like nothing I have ever experienced.  I find that lots of people don’t ask me questions, don’t want to talk to me about what happened or hear the detail (hence why this post is so long I guess, it's airtime that I can't seem to get from others).  I might know their reasons for this but it doesn’t make me feel any better.  It just makes me feel even more alone with my loneliness, and that my grief is so frightening to people that I am unapproachable, some freakish monster that might spread disease with my grief if they come too close.  Whenever I do say something about how I feel people immediately ask if I’m seeing a counsellor.  It’s like no-one wants to listen to me themsleves, that they want to pass me on to an ‘expert’, which just compounds the feeling I have that my grief is too much for everyone.  I am seeing a counsellor but 50 minutes once a week for 6 weeks with a stranger I don’t warm too cannot replace what I actually want which is those closest to me to want to listen to me, hear my story and not feel uncomfortable or awkward in my presence.  To just be there.  The main word the counsellor used to refer to the loss of my son was ‘disappointing’.  ‘Disappointing?’ I said.  ‘That’s a word you might use when you fail your driving test or don’t get a job’.  Perhaps I should cut her some slack, but really I thought, was a ridiculous and inappropriate word choice.  She also referred to Louis as ‘it’, after I’d called him both my son and by his name.  I pulled her up on it immediately.  Perhaps my expectations are too high.

Well if you’ve managed to get to the end of this thank you and well done.  I hadn’t really planned what I would post – that is probably quite obvious by the rambling.  As I said to another FFer, I feel like my life has turned into a row of dominoes, starting with that last scan, and that something (someone? me? Although that gives me a control I felt I never really had - responsibility yes, control no) flicked that first domino which then hit the fetocide domino that then hit the birth domino that then hit the organising the funeral domino that then hit the going to the funeral domino and that the dominoes keep on falling but I haven’t even got my head around the fetocide yet, let alone anything after.  I am still in that room staring at those lights and trying to stop my body moving from the sobs so that the doctor could get the needle into his heart properly.  That was 3 weeks ago today.

I must stop now before I crash the FF website or this turns into a book.    

Love
Wizard x


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Oh Wizard hun, I feel so powerless to do anything to help. I can't even begin to imagine the loss and grief and pain you are feeling and I'm not going to even try to offer meaningless platitudes, all I can do is send more    and to say I'm thinking of you and hoping that you find the face-to-face support you need over the coming weeks and months (and by the way it sounds like you should ditch the counsellor, she's clearly completely unsuited to the task...there must be better ones out there)
take care, my thoughts are with you
Suitcase
x


----------



## Felix42

Oh Wizard. My heart just breaks for what you have gone through. Not solely the loss of your beloved son but the added pain of those who haven't helped you along the way - the midwife & doctor who weren't able to provide you with proper painkillers, the mortuary man who gave you wrong and very painful information and an insensitive counsellor who sounds completely inappropriate.    Can you ask for another counsellor - she sounds like she will do more harm than good. I hope you can find some peace over the coming days, weeks & months and that those closest to you are able to truly listen to your pain. This is the most heartbreaking thing that any mummy can ever face and the way you have dealt with it does you and your precious son, Louis, so much credit. Thinking of you both and of your girlfriend. I am so glad that you have her with you. 
Thank you for being able to share with us at the most difficult time. We are all here for you.   

Love & heartfelt hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Lou-Ann

Wizard, I can't even begin to imagine the pain that you are going through    . I hope you are able to find the support that you need over the coming weeks. My heart goes out to you and I am thinking of you   

Lou-Ann x


----------



## Annaleah

Wizard -  I am tearful as I read your story and have been thinking about you a lot over the past few weeks. I admire the courage you have shown as a mother and wish that the people around you had the grace to allow you to be as you are and express your grief without having to close it off because of their own inability to respond.  My thoughts are with you....Love Annaleah xx


----------



## kizzi79

Wizard - I am so so sorry, to go through losing Louis must have just been the worst thing, I just can't imagine the grief - and to then have so many thoughtless/incompetent professionals involved makes matters even worse  

I wish there was something to say to make things better, but i know that words cannot heal what has happened, take care and know that we are all thinking about you, Love Krissi  xx


----------



## bingbong

Wizard, thank you so much for your post, it felt like an honor to read it. I was so sorry to read that you didn't get the pain relief that you wanted and deserved. I also agree that your counsellor doesn't sound like the best one for you.

I have been thinking about you a lot and am sending lots of    I think that your locket sounds like a lovely way of keeping Louis close to you  

bingbong x


----------



## acrazywench

Wizard, thank you so much for sharing this with us. I know there's nothing I can say, but please know that I'm thinking of you.     

Your experience at the hospital sounds terrible, I can't believe that the care you received was so patchy and insensitive. 

I have to agree with Suity that your counsellor doesn't sound particularly good. Is she a grief counsellor? A friend saw a dedicated grief counsellor to help her deal with the loss of a family member and although she found it hard, it did help her. I know your situation is a bit different, but the miscarriage association may be able to give you some support or recommend a decent counsellor (www.miscarriageassociation.org.uk or by calling: 01924 200799). (You may well have this information - but I just thought I'd mention it in case you haven't.)

I hope that those around you give you the love and support you need at this time. Please post as much or as little as you need to on this board - we're all thinking of you.

acrazywench xx


/links


----------



## Damelottie

We are all listening and here for you Wizard


----------



## Grace10704

Wizard
If only all mums in the world had half as much love and half as much bravery as you do - all children could then be as lucky as Louis is to have a mummy like you.  I am so sorry that you have had such awful things to cope with and I think it shows your total courage in being able to share your words with us.  People don't know what to say most of the time but I hope you find more people in the real world who give you the courtesy of listening when you talk and giving you some of the love and strength you need in return.
Thinking of you lots


----------



## Mifi

Wizard, thank you for sharing your story,  im just so so sorry                   

Huge             

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## indekiwi

Wizard, the incompetence and insensitivity displayed by so many professionals, added to the unthinking pain caused by family members, on top of the tragedy that befell Louis, is simply beyond my ken.    Crikey lady, you must be made of stern stuff if you haven't walloped someone by now!  (The midwife, doctor and anaesthetist would have done for starters, followed swiftly by the counsellor...)  I'm so relieved you managed to retrieve your poppet's remains and have a way of commemorating him that is fitting and appropriate for you and him.    I hope there is a break in the clouds for you (seems to have been unrelenting horror and pain for many months now  ) and that you can find a way forward to some peace, however imperfect it might be.  Though your posts make me cry and hurt for your loss, I'm really happy you can share this experience (no matter how sad) with us, and that we at least can acknowledge and honour your son and your motherhood in the way that many of us would love to be able to do in person.   

A-Mx


----------



## lulumead

Wizard, I read your post with   but want to say thanks for sharing it. Although very very sad (beyond words) it was an honour to hear about Louis and the time you had cuddling him after his birth, he sounds gorgeous.  The locket is a lovely thing too, and I don't think you are a crazy person for wanting him near you during the day and night time, its entirely up to you to do whatever you want to.

Sorry you have had to deal with some very insensitive people during this process. Quite unbelievable.

Please keep posting about how you are feeling, I have very willing ears/eyes for reading  

Sending loads of   

xxx


----------



## ameliacooper

Wizard - I have no words to ease your pain but you write your sad story beautifully.

I hope that by writing it down it helps

xx


----------



## upsydaisy

Wizard - it was a real privilege to read your story, 
maybe it should be a book, one that all professionals involved should be made to read. That anaesthetist! words fail me!

The locket is a beautiful idea, if your a crazy lady your in very good company here    
Upsy
xxx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

Wizard I don't know what to say,  but thank you for sharing your birth story and Louis' funeral with us, it is a privelege to read, and we have been here before he was conceived for you.  I think people just don't know what to say hence they can't say anything, or say the wrong things.  I am sure that they do love and care about you all.

I also pleased that your girlfriend is there for support to you.

You mention keeping ashes etc, my dad died 5 years ago and I have his ashes in my living room, and our family Alsation dog next to him- so what if people think it is odd that is what I want. Your locket sounds a lovely idea.

Take care of yourself and allow yourself time to grieve you have been through the most upsetting times I can only imagine.
l x


----------



## some1

Wizard, I have just logged on to FF to send you a pm to ask how you are doing and saw your post.  I am so glad you have managed to put so much of your heartbreaking experience down in words and really hope that writing it down is helpng you to process what has happened.  Although some of the 'care' you received has been appalling, it is all part of your son's story and recording it all is a real honour to his memory.

I agree with JJ1, you commemorate Louis in whatever way feels right.  I think what you are doing with his precious remains sounds absolutely lovely and completely appropriate.  I'm sure people do all kinds of things in memory of their late loved ones, it is just not spoken about or shared in our society, people just seem so scared of death and grief.

I am so sorry about your pain and fear during your labour and feel so angry with the health 'professionals' who should have taken so much better care of you.  What happened would have been unacceptable in a live birth let alone a birth of a baby like Louis.  With a live birth, the pain would have been so much more bearable and so much less frightening because you would have had the excitement and anticipation of bringing a new life into the world.  In your circumstances, with such sadness surrounding the event I am stunned that the care you received was so sorely lacking.  I wonder if you would feel able to make a complaint about this?  I recently complained about the behaviour of a nurse at my local hospital and was really impressed by the way my complaint was handled (sadly, this efficiency is probably a result of the number of complaints they deal with!).  If you did decide to complain, you wouldn't have to actually have to speak to anyone about it (unless you wanted to), you could just send them an email (you could even cut and paste it from your post adding some bullet points about the specific elements that you feel should be investigated).  In my case, my email was forwarded to the nurse's manager who spoke to him before writing to me to explain what was discussed, pass on the nurse's apology, detail changes to service provision and say that the nurse concerned would be given further training.  I wonder if something like this would give you some comfort?

I just wanted to finish by saying that I was really struck by a metaphor in your post where you talk about carefully gathering up the pieces of the broken heart so that one day you can put them altogether again.  At the moment you are still gathering all the fragments of your own heart hun, I so hope that im the future you can put them all together (albeit with many scars in honour of your son) and find the peace that you so deserve.

With so much love 

Some1

xx


----------



## Candee

Wizard I am at a loss for what to say. I just wanted to let you know that your story has moved me so much. I can't believe everything you have had to go through. I am thinking about you and hoping that you can find some peace in
knowing that you have done everything possible for your little Louis. Take care and be kind to yourself.
Candee
x


----------



## OneStepAtATime

Wizard
Others have said far more eloquently what I would like to say. You are and have been very much in my thoughts. Thank you for posting. You've been through so much and you looked after little Louis so well.  

Love    
OneStep


----------



## sweet1

Wizard -


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## kylecat

Wizard - as many of the others have said, at times like this words fail me, although I am glad others have so eloquently voiced theirs. You are such a caring mum to Louis and I do hope that your girlfriend, friends and family can help you along the way in the next few weeks and months. 

My own mum sends her love too as I have told her of your story

Lots of love, thinking of you  

Kylecat xxx


----------



## starbuck

Wizard - thank you so much for sharing your precious memories of your son with us.  He will always be with you and we will also never forget him - or the love and devotion you have shown for him.    I hope you are continuing to get good support and those friends who currently aren't sure how to handle your grieve can get passed this and help you.

You continue to be in my thoughts.

Starbuck
x


----------



## winky77

Wizard.....to echo many others...a heartfelt thank you for sharing your story with us....it is indeed a privilege....and keeps little Louis alive in our hearts as well as your own.  And if collective rage has any power, those imbeciles you have had the misfortune to meet along the way will be feeling distinctly uncomfortable as the wrath of so many FFers is winging their way.  I wish you strength and fortitude as you slowly try to put back together the pieces of your own heart and the jade one.  

      

..Winky


----------



## muddypaws

Dear Wizard,
Thankyou for sharing your story with us, it is a privelege to be trusted with such an intimate and heartbreaking  experience. People do find it so difficult to deal with other's grief and I'm sorry that you have and will encounter this. Also, well done for pulling the anaesthetist up on his self-absorbed behaviour. This is a terrible example of healthcare. I'm so sorry that you had to have that experience on top of everything. I feel like going to the hospital and giving them a helping of good old fashioned anger and reprimand -what the beejeebers were they thinking? Even just imagining something terrible happening to my baby makes me feel absolutely beside myself so I can't really comprehend how actually experiencing it would be. I still find it so difficult to manage the fact that life doesn't seem to be fair - why not? It's painful and awful and I just hope that at some point life will eventually bring you something good. 

With love

Muddy x


----------



## madmisti

Wizard - honey    Thank you for sharing your beautiful but heartbreaking story with us. As others have said it is  a privilege. I hope that the telling of it has helped - and I hope that you can find someone who will 'hear' it in person as often such a painful and traumatic experience needs to be shared over and over.

Everything you have done  both for Louis, and for yourself to help you through, is really beautiful. I am sorry that people feel the need to judge you - your aunt's shock over the locket for example. It seems perfectly understandable that you want Loius as close to you as possible. 

As Some1 said, the metaphor of the broken Jade heart is very poignant. I know your own heart is shattered and it wil take time to put the pieces back together, And yes, the joins will be there, and a part will always remain missing, but these will be testament to your courage and your love for Louis. The Peace on the Jade Heart and in your own will never be restored fully, but it one day you will know some peace again.

My anger over how you have been treated - both by so-called professionals  and by those who should be giving you the most support and understanding - is great, but a tirade from me won't help. I do think a complaint is in order though - but only when/if you feel ready and that it would be helpful  to you.

Take great care honey
With my thoughts and love
Misti xx


----------



## RichmondLass

Wiz one day at a time is all you can do sweetpea. Xx


----------



## wizard

Oh my, your posts are so kind and supportive and you say such lovely things.  I just can't thank you all enough.

A couple of random and not so random things.

I thought (naively) that as my baby was smaller that I would have a 'mini' labour    This was not the case; I had to dilate the full 10cm before being able to give birth.  In retrospect I was thinking that if I'd gone to term I would have had ante-natal classes plus appointments with the midwife where I'd have been given advice about the whole labour process, pain management and relief (includng breathing exercises) and the stages of labour.  As it was I got none of that, which is why I hadn't really much of a clue what was happening.  I would also have read up myself on what to expect and what to try, but there was no opportunity to do this plus all the books are geared towards having a live birth and a healthy baby and I doubt I could have managed to read books like that....

Some1 I am planning to make a complaint but not infact about the stuff in my post.  I missed it out first time round because it was so very awful, but one of the doctors who examined me 4 hours into the labour said to me and my girlfriend after a conversation with the midwife about needing larger gloves 'sometimes size does matter' whilst snapping the latex rims of the gloves up his arms.  He then examined me so roughly and aggressively and forcefully that he physically pushed me up the bed.  It was excruciatingly painful and I felt like I'd been assaulted.  Battling with health professionals and putting in complaint letters is the last thing I feel like doing; I could let the other stuff about the anaesthetist etc go, but not this one.  I wish I could organise a march on the maternity unit for all of you so angry about how some of the people involved in my care have behaved.  I love the idea of collective protest and representation.  It’s so damn hard to do it alone. 

Another gem from someone close to me: ‘I’m sorry to say this (in a non sorry voice) but you aren’t the first person to go through this and you won’t be the last’.  Subtext was other people have gone through this and coped better than me so get a grip.

Patterdale, you are spot on with just needing a listening ear and the fixing / pulling back behaviour.  Listening just seems to be so hard for people.

Thank you for those who have commented on the counsellor.  I think I do need to ditch her but I have the parrot on my shoulder that’s saying ‘I haven’t given her a chance’ and ‘I’m too hard on people’ and ‘I’m too critical’.  Sigh.  

You have said such lovely things about me and being a mother.  No-one else in my life (g/f excluded)  refers to me as Louis’s mother and each time I read it my heart somersaults and my eyes fill up.  I can’t tell you all how much that means.  Love to you all.

Wizard x


----------



## GIAToo

Wizard - I think you need to ditch the parrot on your shoulder too!    I can't imagine my counsellor saying to me that yours said to you    You will always be Louis' mum and nothing can change that.  My Mum still talks about Baby Ken and I still think of him as my brother.  And if you want to organise that march - I'll be there!!! The doctor needs to be dealt with, though I understand you not being in the right frame of mind to take on the battle with the health professionals.  I seriously would be up for helpinig you do that if you decide to.  I'm sick of sitting on my laurels and not fighting for things that matter in this world (sorry - don't want to get political) but it seems the health service needs to take a long hard look at how it deals with situations like yours.  Take care and keep posting if it helps you.  We are all listening to you.
Love GIA Tooxx


----------



## estella

Wizard,

I'm so terribly sad for everything that you've gone through and I can only imagine the grief that you are feeling right now. I do feel honoured that you have shared your beautiful and incredibly heartwrenching journey with us. 

Just on your last post - I'm actually outraged by what the doctor said - size matters -  That is absolutely appalling, how dare he! I would definately complain about him and then maybe the anaesthatist. 

I would also get a new counsellor, they are supposed to help you, not you trying to give them a chance, just ditch her, no remorse. This is your precious time and during this incredibly difficult time for you, someone like that may actually make things worse.

I'm glad you have your gf for support - how's she doing by the way? I think you are right about people not knowing what to say, I just want to let you know that both Louis and you are in my heart and my thoughts are with you. You have been the most incredible mother to your little angel!

Estella xxx


----------



## some1

Wizard - just a quick post to send you a   and let you know i am thinking of you.  How are you? 

some1 

xx


----------



## madmisti

Geeze Wizard - what WERE these people playing at? Insensitivity, total lack of professionalism, medical inadequacy etc doesn't even begin to cover it. I would def do complaints when you feel ready.

Your comments about not having any preparation for the labour etc make me think that one day, when you feel ready etc, you could maybe write a sort of booklet to help other mums in the dreadful situaiton you found yourself in. One that the professionals ( so-called!) could read too.You have written here so eloquently and I am sure you would do a great job of it. And it would be a kind of legacy for Louis. Just a thought.

And of COURSE you are Louis' mummy honey    

As for the comment about others having been through it - try telling her that when something devastating happens to her! Your experience is unique to you and is your own story. The ways in which you have dealt with this tragedy - your incredible care for Louis and the special things you have done for him, and the things you are doing to help yourself through this unimaginable grief, reveal only strength and courage - and an inner wisdom which will see you through.

Thinking of you still hun

Take care Misti xxx


----------



## Rose39

For several of us, it would have been our first mother's day on Sunday.  

Sending big hugs to all those who have lost precious LO's.    

Hoping for better news for all of us soon.  

Rose xx


----------



## Felix42

to all the mummies who aren't able to cuddle their LOs tomorrow. May all our dreams come true for next Mothering Sunday. 

Love & hugs, Felix xx


----------



## Mifi

Thanks Felix      

Ive been thinking about my first angel baby lots lately as it should have been his or her's first birthday this week      

Huge hugs to all     especially tomorrow XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

FM  my heart goes out to you, due dates are such hard times

L xx


----------



## Annaleah

Thank you Rose, Felix, FM and others for remembering us...i've been struggling on and off for weeks since my second due date (14/2) but felt ok this eve until I arrived home with one too many glasses of wine in me (2 in total..barely drinking since ttc so even the slightest alcohol is too much) and thought about what i'd hoped for today..... .  No-one (friends or family) has really ackowledged what I might be feeling or might have wished for today.  

Hugs to all mothers, mothers in waiting and mothers to be
Annaleahxxxx


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

annaheah it is so hard and a silent suffering of loss, as when someone dies everyone knows but after a few years I have come to realise that even then people forget as well, but with mc's it is so personal to us

L X


----------



## RichmondLass

Love and kind thoughts to all the mums-to-be out there who have suffered loss.  RLxxx


----------



## indekiwi

Loving hugs to everyone who has experienced the cruel loss of their bubs.  

A-Mx


----------



## some1

Thinking of all the mummies who don't have their precious babes with them today  

Some1

xx


----------



## lulumead

big hugs to everyone...   

xxxx


----------



## Roo67

Thinking of all or you that were not able to hold your babies today.  


just back from lunch with my mum, dad, sister and neices, had nice time, but would have been nice today of all days for them to at least acknowledge that I should have been there with my own little bubs. 

R x


----------



## cocochanel1

Just to let all of you who have suffered the loss of a baby I am thinking of you today. Hugs   . 
Roo, yes it would have been nice if they had thought - it seems people who haven't been through loss themselves do not really appreciate the depth of pain one can feel. 

Coco xxx


----------



## starbuck

Just wanted to send my love to all those missing their LO's today.  

Starbuck
x


----------



## wizard

Thanks to all those who have thought about us without LOs today.  And love to all of you who have lost dear babies.  I have found today so very hard  . 

Roo  , I wish your family had recognised your losses.  I'm very sorry that they didn't today.  

Wizard x


----------



## bingbong

Just wanted to send a big   to all of you missing your LOs today  

bingbong x


----------



## some1

Wizard - thinking of you today on what would have been your precious son Louis' due date.  This will be such a very tough day for you, but I hope you get through it okay   .  I will sing Twinkle twinkle little star to Jasmine this evening and be thinking of your little twinkling star keeping watch over his Mummy.

Some1

xx


----------



## suitcase of dreams

Wizard, I too am thinking of you on what must be a very difficult day for you    
Hope you have lots of love and support around you today
Take care of yourself,
Suitcase
x


----------



## bingbong

Wizard I too am thinking of you today. It must be an incredibly hard day for you. 

  
bingbong x


----------



## Damelottie

My thoughts are with you today Wizard


----------



## ♥JJ1♥

wizard thinking of you on this special day- I hope that you are surrounded by people weho can give you love and support
L x


----------



## Mifi

Wizard sending you bucket loads of love & hugs           Thinking of you     

Love FM XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## ameliacooper

Wizard

  for today for you and your precious Angel Louis.

xx


----------



## indekiwi

Wizard, sending all my love and support to you today.         Poppet and I will be following Some1's lead this evening and singing Twinkle Twinkle Little Star for you and Louis.        


A-Mx


----------



## wizard

Thank you all, so very much for your kindness and thoughts. It means a great great deal to me as this is such a lonely journey. Some1 I was so touched at the thought of you singing Twinkle Twinkle Little Star to Jasmine in memory of Louis, and inde to you too 

Today has been hard and continues to be. All week has been hard as I think about how different my life would if Louis was still here. I miss him as much as I did the day I gave birth to him and handed him over to the nurse to take him to the mortuary. I cry and cry but the huge hole that he has left in me gets no smaller and the pain no less.

I have put a book together of his 'things' - photos of when he was born, scan pictures, his coffin with the animal letters, a copy of the letter I wrote to him and read to him at his funeral, his cremation certificate etc. I have handwritten this poem by E. E. Cummings at the front. May be one day, when I can bear the pain, I will write my own.

_i carry your heart with me (i carry it in
my heart) i am never without it (anywhere
i go you go, my dear; and whatever is done
by only me is your doing, my darling)_

_ i fear
no fate (for you are my fate, my sweet) i want
no world (for beautiful you are my world, my true)
and it's you are whatever a moon has always meant
and whatever a sun will always sing is you

here is the deepest secret nobody knows
(here is the root of the root and the bud of the bud
and the sky of the sky of a tree called life; which grows
higher than the soul can hope or mind can hide)
and this is the wonder that's keeping the stars apart

i carry your heart (i carry it in my heart)_ 

For Louis, my first born, I miss you more than words can ever say.

Wizard x


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## Chowy

Wizard you may not hold your Louis in your arms but you are still a wonderfull Mummy to him.
I think of you lots and hope that your future is bright.

Lots of love. Chowy


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## Lou-Ann

Wizard, thinking of you     

Lou-Ann x


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## Damelottie

Oh Wizard    . We also sang Twinkle Twinkle for you both tonight    .
All our love xxxxx


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## RichmondLass

Wiz - as always, in my thoughts.  Love to you today
RLxx


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## lulumead

thinking of you today....    
sending love.
xx


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## Annaleah

Wizard - words fail me when I think of your loss, but I think of you often    
Annaleah x


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## starbuck

Wizard - you and Louis are often in my thoughts - especially at the moment.  

Starbuck
x


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## loubi

Wizard - You and Louis have both been in my thoughts especially recently
Take care


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## kizzi79

Dear Wizard - what can I possibly say        - thinking of you and Louis    Love Krissi  xx


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## kylecat

Wizard - so sorry I am a couple of days late but just wanted to let you know that I was thinking of you and your precious little Louis on Friday. The poem you posted was just beautiful, 

Love Kylecat xxx


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## Mifi

Taken me a while to post on here today      would rather bury my head in the sand      but 
I just wanted to post on here to say Happy Birthday to my second beautiful angel baby as he/she should have been a year old today        my heart aches so much that we are not together but spiritually we will always be together and maybe one day we will be reunited.

I have fantasized on and off all day about what cake I would have bought and filling the room with multicoloured balloons and presents, I can imagine my LO with white blond hair, blue eyes and a cheeky smile, eagerly grabbing at the lighted candle on his cake as all LOs do  - oh I so wish our lives had turned out differently   

Dates are so hard and of course forever continuing. Sometimes I feel so angry that im the only one grieving the loss of my lost LOs and that nobody else really cares about them but I guess thats all part and parcel of taking the single ttc route after all it is my grief alone. Dont get me wrong I think that my friends and family will be marvelous once I do actually have my baby in my arms        but until that day I feel pretty much isolated and alone - that is apart from my lovely FF buddies    so thank you    

Love FM XXXXXX


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## ♥JJ1♥

FM-  due dates I find very hard for angel babie
L x


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## Sharry

New thread -

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=241688.0


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