# Poor Responders : Part 87



## dakota

New home ladies, love and luck to you all


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## beachgirl

Thanks Dakota x


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## Suzie W

Hi All,

Wow! This has been a very busy thread today. I'll try and remember...here goes (osrry if I leave anyone out). 
Kate –so pleased you had a good time.

Sam & Malini & LW – thanks for the good wishes.  

Sam - I’m pleased for you that you enjoyed your holiday. Its so hard when there are families about. Mostly my DH doesn’t say anything but when he does express his sadness when he sees a nice family then it has quite the impact on me.

The clinic looks very interesting. Please let us know how you get on. Good luck with it. 

Pixie- I’m so pleased to hear from you. Thanks for your good wishes. Please don’t feel that you need to stay away when you are feeling down – this is the place to be when you feel like that. We care about you and if anyone can understand its us.  

So pleased to hear that Anne is having a good time. She and Jason deserve it after all they have been through over the last few months. Please let her know that we are thinking of her and that we are hoping and praying that everything goes well for tomorrow.

Purps – Your work ethic sounds like mine  . Hope Candy will be okay.

Zuri – that sounds like quite the bike ride

LJ – thanks for the good wishes. How are you getting on? Are you managing ok in getting back to work? 

Malini – what you said about not judging how bad things may appear… well I agree – Zuri I thought you put it eloquently

Lucy – 8 follies sounds fab! I really hope that your body puts more energy into the others so that you get a few eggs. Please let us know how it goes. I know its so hard waiting to see what happens at the next scan.   As the others have said history need not repeat itself.

Ally – Hi! Welcome Back! I’m sorry that your holiday wasn’t all that you hoped it would be. A real shame about the weather! We’re all pleased you’re back.  

Sarah – good luck with the 10k. You have my admiration.

Anna – sorry the meds are making you feel horrid. Hang in there! Just try on focus on starting the next tx cycle (if that helps). I do the same plan out what will happen if I do get that BFP or if its fails. It makes me feel tired so I’m trying not to do it.   

WW-    I’m so sorry that your cons was an insensitive @#$! The appointments are so hard even when the cons is nice. I’m sure you must be gutted about your AMH. I don’t have much technical advice but I would say that you should give yourself a little time to digest all of this. If it was me I would probably ask to be referred to the other clinic and get their opinion. Just so that I would know that I had tried everything before going down the DE route. To be honest that is my plan – I want to know that I have done everything I can before trying DE.  I see LJ has said some useful stuff. Thank goodness you hang out here LJ what would we do without you?  

Popsi – How exciting! You are moving through the process. Best of luck for going to panel. Hopefully you’ll have your family soon. Well done to you for getting through this. I know that being assessed is not easy.

Hi Ali, ALegria, Almond, Lainey, Steph, Laura, Miranda and everyone else.

I'm about to start mixing up the menopur for the first jab. I'm starting to feel hopeful amongst the fear.

Love, 
Suzie.


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## Züri

Book marking x


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## Little Me

Hi girls,

I just lost an absolutely massive post       and I don't have the energy to do it all again- really sorry but have a headache from hell and need to get some food soon cos I am on starvation mode then  

I did a personal message for everyone and then the thread locked  
I am thinking of you all, wishing the scan and stimming ladies millions of luck, saying welcome back to my lovely holiday friends, giving    to my sad and down friends and will catch up soon I promise.

Been to Cevahir Shopping today, 360 shops, and can you believe, I didn't buy myself anything    
Jason found a couple of golf tops that  he's been looking for in every single Debanhams in the Midlands so he was happy and we bought my nephews a local football shirt each as they love collecting them.
We then went to see Marley and me and I was in    poor little Marley  
I am feeling So bloated, god knows why with only one flippin follie! 
Been on the Metro system  too and it's great- LW, you must give it a go.
Had some nice meals out and also some nice room service in- I have been feeling so tired.
I have my slippers and dressing gown packed for tomorrow and also my book.
Feeling fine but have been     hard that there is a just one special eggie in my little follie.

Lots of love to you all
Anne
xxxx


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## Suzie W

Hi Anne,

Its so wonderful to hear from you. I'm so pleased that you have been having fun shopping. How have you managed not to buy anything with so many shops  .

Good luck for tomorrow! I really   you get at least that one special egg/embie.

Love,
Suzie.


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## Little Me

Thanks Suzie- I just couldn't be arsed to try anything on, I felt too uncomfortable , some nice shops though


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## LV.

Oooo Anne - hello honey! Best of luck for tomorrow chicken. Have more to post but wanted to catch you before you signed off

xx


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## TryMeditate

Anne - really the very very best of luck for you for tomorrow.


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## Han72

Bonjour

just a quickie to bookmark and a few persos as there are about 5 million posts to catch up on!

Zuri and Purps - gutted for you both honies  

Anne - good luck with your golden follie hon! Is EC tomorrow then? Wow that seems to have come around so quickly!   

Welcome back Ally! I gather the holly wasn't all you hoped it would be and I'm sorry to hear that  Is it any consolation to know that we really really REALLY missed you?! 

Same to you Malini - I often think the nicest thing about going away is the joy of coming back home to familiar things (even the stuff you usually hate!) Still no news about the precise date of my FET, they said they'd have a better idea tomorrow which I assume means it's not going to happen before the weekend, but you never know with the ARGC!

WW - sorry your doc was such an  I do think that Anna said it best  and I've heard good things about tx in Belgium. My gynie in France was originally from Belgique, would you like me to ask him if he has any recommendations?

Suzie - good luck for the first old lady pee jab 

LJ - (aka "research guru"  ) How are you doing hon? 

Mira - how's Bob doing now lovey? Sorry if I missed the update but last I heard he was roaring his head off cos of the dreaded pox, poor l'il munchkin! I hope he's better now 

Hey Laura - How're the chippers doing?

Steph hon - How's yer bump?!  Sorry I haven't got round to replying to your wotsit request on **,I'm scared of getting hooked on the game as well as this website, I'm spending more time in front of the PC now than I did when I was at work!

Kate lovey  so good to see you back on here and posting again. I love logging on to see what Katy did next! Sorry the carboot sale was a washout tho 

Ok I've forgotten everything else I wanted to say! Am currently back in London for the FET so if anyone else would like to meet up (am already meeting Malini for lunch hopefully) then that would be grand! I'm pretty much free in the daytime except for when I need to have bloods done (usually in the morning) and I'm free every evening except Friday (family thing!) As I mentioned previously I'm still not sure of the timing of the FET as typically there was no surge on the ovulation kit this month, but this time I'm going to do the full 3 days bed rest after the transfer. Well ok, maybe not _complete _bedrest (couldnt take the boredom!) but I certainly won't be leaving the house! In the meantime I'm all set to start jabbing tonight! I've got the clexane plus I have dexamethasone and aspirin to take so that should keep me busy (must try to take the right flipping dosage of steroids this time round as I messed that up last time!) Oh and the poxy humira didn't flipping work, hence the dexawotsitcalled . Never mind, what would we have done with 2000 euros anyway...?  

Love to all!

xxx


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## Little Me

Nix- Lots of love with FET love. Yep, EC tomorrow   

Thanks Lucy hun- Sorry about the AMH result- it really is an evil test isn't it. 8 follies though eh, nice one. Keep smiling hun  


Think I am gonna order room service cos I'm too tired to dry my hair and get dressed to go out. 
F me, I'm not only a recluse in England but in Turkey too


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## beachgirl

Nix- woohoo, glad to hear from you, wish I was near London as it would be great to meet up x

Anne- wishing you lots and lots of luck for EC tomorrow


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## Han72

wotcha Beachy!


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## Little Me

Thanks Beachy xxx


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## Han72

Hey Dakota - what's a poor respomder then?   

(Love the piccy of Lewis by the way, he looks like a real cheeky chappie!)
xxx


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## Malini

Evening friends,

Just wanted to answer AnnaCam re the queries about follies, as much as I can.  I think it has already been said, and I agree with you (my memory is rubbish) but women with low ovarian reserve (low AMH) tend to have a charged hormonal picture at the beginning of a cycle - as body thinks it has to work really hard to get that one follie grown and ready, and yes early ovulation is a problem naturally and with IVF.  My acu thinks she can regulate this with herbs (in my case in pill form and not the difficult route that Pixie and friends are following) alongside weekly acu sessions - expensive and unproven.  I do reckon down regging can help with this and also picking a month where for some reason your levels are steadier.

WW - I agree with Anna and loved Mir's words of wisdom.  I am younger and 2 years ago my AMH was in the region of yours.  I have had the DE speech twice already and just had one perfect embryo put back (not with the right result) but I proved that I do have eggs, just less of them, and some of them might work.  Oh, and I would kill for your hormone profile. 

Anne - I will get down on my knees tonight and pray before bedtime (I have not done this since I wanted a boy to like me in primary school), but for you I will send wishes to anyone who will listen to them.  

Good evenings to all of you.  Am hopefully lunching with Nix tomorrow - pls join us if you can!!  

M xxx


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## Little Me

Thanks Malini- I hope you got your boy to fall for you


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## Züri

Just a quickie via phone

Anne my lovely ex cycle bud wishing you so so sooooooo much luck for tomorrow really keeping everything crossed - you deserve this xx

Nix and Malini enjoy your meet up tomorrow - wish I could join you both x

Lots if love to everyone else will catch up better tomorrow - having a '24' night  x


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## Suzie W

Hiya,

Nix - so pleased to hear from you. I would love to meet up. Unfrotunately I couldn't meet you and Malini for lunch tomorrow but I'm in London on Monday - having a scan at the Lister. If you're still around then perhaps we could have lunch. Good luck with the FET.  

old lady pee - charming  . The thought didn't even phase me when I gave myself the jab. the things we do... perhaps we should start a list of all the things (crazy?) we try to get that bfp  .

Love,
Suzie.


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## Belliboo

Anne G good luck for tomorrow     

I think this must be the fastest thread ever its so hard to keep up but hope everyone is ok not much news from me still waiting for miscarriage clinic date to come through xxxx


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## emak

Anne wishing you loads of luck for your wee eggie  and e/c   .Just to let you know about a success story we had on the N.I thread ,a very lovely FF is now about 8 weeks pg and she only had the one egg ,so it can happen ,it was her 3rd attempt and finally she got a   ,like us she too was a poor responder and look at her now    .I just thought i would share that with yous as we all need to have hope that one day soon our dreams will come true.Sending loads of        AND      to you all.
Emma xx


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## purple72

Just a quickie for Anne & Nix & Ally as off out to see 3D friend

Anne sweetie, all the luck in the world for you tomorrow hunny! Will be thinking of you and sending     vibes across the water!! Will keep everything crossed for you hun!! Big hugs for you and Jase

Nix hunny! hope the FET is arranged soon, thinking of you!

Ally hunny! So glad you're back, sorry holiday was not what you'd hoped for, but echo what others have said, WE MISSED YOU!!!!

Hugs to all

Ladyverte just seen your post sweetie,     we all have days like that when we torture ourselves, mine is why did i smoke for so long!!! putting toxins into my eggs, but at the end of the day, whatever decisions we made in our past we made for the reasons we had then, now things are different and we all are trying so hard to make our dreams of families complete, we shouldn't start punishing ourselves, we should actually be proud that we are doing so much to get our babies, most people just have a quick fumble under the covers, but when we get our babies it will be the most precious times of our lives, not only will our dreams of having a child have come true, ( however we acheive that be it through IVF ICSI DE or adoption) but our dreams of being parents will come true, and boy will we be ready for it!  

Sx


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## Pixie75

Just a quick one -

Anne



for tomorrow honey. I'll be  for you.

Lots of love.

Pix xx


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## purple72

Pix   sweetie

Sx


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## popsi

anne darling good luck for the golden follie tomorrow honey, you never know with E2 levels like that it could be a double yolker !! xxx i will be    or you and Jason x

Nix.. good luck for your FET honey, wish i was near london would love to have met you xx

Love to everyone else xxx


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## shortie66

Evening hunnies 

Anne - wishing you the best of brummie luck for 2moz sweetheart im keeping    and     like mad here for you. Sod the expense, order room service and have a nice juicy steak  

Wing wing - not posting on donor thread yet hun. But i would defo get a 2nd opinion that dr needs a kick up the ****.

Ally sweetheart lovely to have you back.  Sorry ur holiday was not everything you wished for petal    

LV - oh darling please dont beat urself up about past events in ur life hunny.  "if" is a big word and none of us can see into the future to see the outcome. And as for judging you hun i can only quote what someone else said on here i think which is "never judge a person till u've walked a mile in their shoes"  I think it may have been sam or tash but cant remember, but that quote has stayed with me, and i always try and think twice now.  Good luck with ur scan petal hope it all goes ok  

Hello to sam, purple, pixie, nix, mallini, hazelnut, almond, mag108, sobroody, natasha, juciy, popsi, tracey, steph, fishy, annacameron, alegria, swinny, suzie, emak and everyone else.

I have booked my 3d scan of uterus for friday 15th may.  I know it is already bicornuate but just want to get confirmation there is no septate or septum there (which i think is a think lining of skin running down the middle) which would need removing before any more tx.  Not 100% sure on this tho   Also getting certain immunes done same day but what they are i couldnt tell you as the nurse was irish and i couldnt understand a bloody word she said    Luckily she is putting it all a letter to me so should know in a few days.

Kate
xxxxxxx


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## Wing Wing

Great to hear from you *Anne* - really am crossing everything for you - you really do deserve some good news.    Tell Jase we are all routing for you hon. Slippers and dressing gown sound good to me by the way! Can't believe you managed to resist so many shops! Not even a souvenir teatowel??!!!

Thanks to you all for your support and advice re AMH levels - you have honestly turned my day around. Am quite chipper again now and am going to look at all the wonderful research that *LJ  * Encyclopedia has sent through. LJ, am going to PM you re stuff you said you'd email. Thanks everso hon.   

*Suzie* - I am agreeing with what you and others have said re going to get second opinion. Will make appointment with Mr Nice Man tomorrow and at least take him my readings and see what he has to say. Good luck with the jabbing loverlee. 

Bonsoir *Nix*. It would be fab if you could ask your guy if he knows anything about the clinic in Leuven and, if not, if he can recommend anywhere for me. Merci beaucoup ma cherie! Bonne chance with the FET - you must be getting pretty exited about it. Is it nice to be in London for a bit? I would love to have met you but unfortunately can't swing a work trip this week!!! 

*Malini* - thanks for words of encouragement . Do you honestly think the rest of the readings seem ok then? Have fun with Nix tomorrow. Am dead jealous!

Gotta eat now but will try to catch up some more later.

Love to you all! WW XXX


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## Ourturn

Anne - Good luck for tomorrow      

Lady v - please don't beat yourself up, it was the right decision for you at the time. I waited to meet Mr Right until ttc and we didn't marry until I was 34 ...hind sight eh! 

Anna x


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## Wing Wing

*Anna*

Just remembered you asked me if I had been given high dose stims yet. I think I probably have but it was a drug called Puregon while most of you UK based buddies seems to be on Menapur.

The highest dose of Puregon was 250ui to be injected each evening. Really don't know if this is high or not - any idea how to find out? [email protected] doc said it was high but injection pen went up to over 400 so not sure.

Thanks Anna for the support!

WW XXX


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## LV.

Thanks girls  

xxxx


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## emak

Girls i have a wee question actually a couple  I have noticed DHEA being mentioned on FF and wanted to know what it is and what its supposed to do.Am i correct in thinking that it may help improve egg quanties/quality   AND another question what do your clinics advise yes/no .I really wanna give myself the best chance when i go for round 2 in the summer ,was taking a good few vits etc but not DHEA,so would love to know what yous think.Thanks  Emma  xxx


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## Pixie75

Lucy hon - I made the same 'mistake' when I was 20 and I still kick myself for it BUT we both know it was the right decision at the time and we could have never thought we'd have the trouble of IF in the future.  Please don't beat yourself up for what's happened in the past cos it will only make things worse.  
Don't be so down on that one leading follie - there is a lady on the Jin thread called latestarter who had the same issue on her cycles but she got pregnant with that one leading follie, she sadly miscarried but it goes to show 1 is all you need.     

Purps   

Nix: Best of luck with FET    I really hope everthing goes well with bloods and you get your embies back.


xxxxxxxx


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## dakota

Nixf01 said:


> Hey Dakota - what's a poor respomder then?
> 
> (Love the piccy of Lewis by the way, he looks like a real cheeky chappie!)
> xxx


Good spot  my spelling's a bit off today, just ask Suzie


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## odette

Well, my egg hasn't cracked yet 

Went for a check up and hospital said the little chick is quite contented where he is and doesn't yet feel the need to make an appearance 

So I will just wait patiently   

Hope everyone is well 

Odettex

ps.

Jenny - didn't realise you had had a MC  so sorry - Thoughts are with you.

Steph - No,  I don't have time for ********, let alone FF


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## Miranda7

Morning!

Lucy - I was downregged on Suprecur and the pill before my first Lister egg sharing cycle, then went on 225 Menopur, which they upped to 375, but by then it was too late - I had one big follicle and some dots.

My next cycle, Lister again, they put me on SP - pill first then 450 menopur for 11 days and I got 4 eggs. Stil the eggs were of wildly varying sizes and one was too wee to inject.

The Jinny cycle I had the pill again, to make sure I flew out at the right time primarily, then letrozole from day 2 and 300 Gonal F and 150 Menopur from day 3, adding in Cetrotide a few days later. I stimmed for 13 days and got four eggs again, but had eight follies? The four eggs were all good this time, and about the same size.

So I'd say the downregging caused the runaway follie situation. I did downreg quite a long time though, as I was waiting for my recipient - poor girl wanting to share my one egg! - to be ready.

Gawd, if only we had crystal balls! It's not God, or karma or anything - it was making a responsible decision at the time. If onlys are so dreadful. Don't beat yourself up.  

Anne - best of luck for today! I'm thinking two eggs, me. I really do! Two fab, juicy, scrumptious eggs that will divide and conquer. Room service is cheaper than the places I went out to eat in! How was yours?

Nix - NOT FAIR! I want to meet you!!! Don't suppose you're coming to see your Somerset pals?


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## Ali27

Anne - thinking of you today and wishing you all the luck in the world  

Lucy -   please dont torture yourself hon.  You made what was the right decision for you at that time.  If we all had a crystal ball then it might be different but we dont so we have to make choices based on the info we have at that time.  No-one has the right to judge so dont even give that anotehr thought. Thinking of you  

Love to everyone - i popped on at work yesterday and just as I had caught up adn went to start posting my boss came back in to the room so i had to dash!  May try again later today!


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## purple72

Morning Ali,

Hope you're recovered from your birthday weekend!   

Mir just seen Robsters pix on **! Poor sweetie! my heart goes out to him, and you bless   

Sx


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## Suzie W

Morning All,

Anne - good luck for today.  

Lucy - like the others have said please forgive yourself. I think we all have the regrets, the 'if onlys' around our fertility. IF is one of those things that no one expects as well all grow believing that having a baby is the most natural thing in the world. I sometimes think of the irony of being on the pill for all those years and panicking when I forgot one. As everyone has said we make decisions based on the information we have at the time. That time wasn't right for you. 

Kate - good luck with the scan  

WW - thanks. I'm really pleased you'll get a second opinion. By the way your AMH is better than mine on the one scale is 4.8 and on the other is less than 1!

Miranda - oh poor Bob he looks so cute and so ill on his photo. How is he doing?

Odette - when was the baby due? will they induce or are you just going to wait a bit longer? Good luck  

Steph - how are things going with the bump and preparing your flat?

Emma - I'm sure someone more knowledgeable will come along shortly and answer your question re DHEA but here is what I know. DHEA is the hormone precursor for testosterone and oestrogen. Its meant to increase egg quantity in women who have low ovarian reserve. Its had mixed results - its been great for some and had no effect for others. Probably because we don't really understand premature ovarian failure and how that links with other systems like the endocrine and immune systems. Some have decided to take it and others have first had various tests to see if they are low if DHEAS and other hormones. The consultants also vary in their opinion - some are ok with women taking it and others discourage it. I don't think its meant to be taken after ec.

I was just wondering what is lezerole (sp?) ?

Pixies & Purps - how are you doing?

Hi to everyone!

love,
Suzie.


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## Miranda7

Letrozole is a breast cancer drug Suzie - but in tx it's used like Clomid to increase the number of follicles and boost your chances.

Purps - he's so sad looking, isn't he? Bless him. Mind you, he's bouncing away in his Jumperoo at the moment so he's on the road to recovery!


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## Suzie W

thanks Miranda

Pleased Bob is starting to feel better. Are you both getting more sleep?


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## purple72

Morning Suzie hunny  

Mir, bless him, he has the heart tug look down to a T!!!

Glad to hear he's bouncing about! It takes it out of them and he'll be up and down for a while but he will turn the corner and then not look back!

Big hugs to you both  

Pix thanks for update! 

Sx


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## Saffa77

Just got back and cycles been cancelled! surprise surprise, was expecting doctor to be there but wasnt  she is going to phone me at lunchtime to discuss.  So went in this morning saw Elspeth who did a scan and follies were as follows: 1x19.5  , 1x 20.5 and another two 1 at 11mm and the other at 14mm so nurse got excited and said let me phone doctor and have you got the trigger shot to take tonight and im llike no ways! am i actually going ahead to EC but then she comes back and says doctor is leaning on cancellation because we have 2 and not really 3 even though i feel the 14mm could still grow and because they going to be frozen then dont think its a good idea and also because I have my reversal op soon she dosent want me to risk the procedure(then what is the point of doing this cycle in the first place)  I dont think Im going to respond any better anyways! so this is so annoying but am going to see what I can wrangle with the doctor at lunch time what do you think

Sonia


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## purple72

Hi Sonia,

So sorry to hear about your appointment this morning!

When you speak to the DR can you ask about what your E2 levels where and whether this indicates there are Eggs in those follicles? Might give you more weight to push for go ahead

Thinking of you, you must feel pulled from pillar to post!

   

Sx


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## Pixie75

Morning girls,

I know I've already texted some of you but just wanted to update everyone as Anne asked me to!

She's had her EC this morning and they've collected an egg from her - so it's all very emotional and EXCITING!



I wish it is the golden egg for her and she comes back preggers I really do!

Sorry I haven't read back so I'm not up to date yet but will do shortly.

Hope everyone is well. 

Pix xx


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## beachgirl

Thanks for the update Pix x

Good luck Anne and Jas


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## Overthemoon

Yay Anne yay yay yay!          

Sonia, really sorry to hear about your scan this morning, hope you can get some positive feedback from the doc this afternoon    

Lightweight xxx


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## Jumanji

hi all!

WW - 250 of Puregon is nothing like a high dose!!!  I'd say that, whatever your hormone results, most clinics would put a women over 40 on 300 or 350.  I really think that is ridiculous!  My understanding also (although this does vary between individuals) is that some older ladies respond better to menopur because it has LH in.  I have to say I don't think your clinic is giving you the service you deserve. 

LV - Please please don't beat yourself up.  You are someone who very probably wouldn't be here were it not for your DH's vasectomy - are you beating him up about his decision?  I very much doubt it!  We make decisions which seem right at the time and, although you are having trouble now, would you really want to be married to Mr Wrong and miserable, even if you had a couple of kids? 

Pixie - the same applies to you; if you had made a different decision your life would not necessarily be better.  

Miranda - I am so relieved Robert is doing better; chicken pox is a miserable disease - I remember it very well!  I was about 5 and there is a pic of me standing by the fire and Mum putting calamine lotion on me.  I'm all naked and there are spots all over my little back and bottom!  

Odette - I am sure you will pop soon! 

Anne - delighted about the news of your golden follie. 

Emma - thanks for your inspiring tale; on DHEA I will PM you my standard post!  I would get your levels checked before you kick off on it though!

Kate - good luck with the scan!

Purple - i hope you are recovering well.  I know you have been through 3 disappointments so it is probably trite of me to tell you to treat this as your first but I think in terms of going forward this is cycle to look at as telling you how your body can respond.  And the answer is that it can respond fine so please stay positive!  

Malini - great info on runaway follies.  I know it's unproven but I do think that acu and TCM can really help with "aging ovaries" because all this really is part of the whole person and western docs tend to hone in on the "problem area".  I think it is all MUCH more subtle than that and much more is involved. I often wonder whether, if my sister had been advised more about natural conception (I have recently discovered she and her DH, being the most unbiological couple in the world, were "trying" at totally the wrong time of her cycle!!), she would have had a decent chance naturally.  Despite her high FSH she had excellent egg quality and decent numbers.  The trouble is the moment her FSH result came back the only focus was on IVF.  No doctor ever checked that they were "trying" at appropriate times, eating healthily etc.  And I think that is sadly typical - they just honed in on her FSH and nothing else mattered!  On this thread, I would always encourage everyone who can to make sure they continue to keep going with the natural route.      

Nix - fabulous to see you!

Ali - hope you can evade the boss and post soon!

Ally - it is so nice to have you back.

Sam - hello there!

Popsi - please the adoption is progressing

Rachel - nice to see you!

Zuri - I do hope you are feeling better!

Anna(s) - sobroody and cameron! - hi there

Tracey - I agree the flowers were a lovely gesture; I decided to tell my boss at work about the m/c and he sent me and DP some flowers too. It was very touching. 

Sonia - so sorry about the confusion you are going through; I would avoid cancelling if you can but others are probably more knowledgeable.

love to all I have missed.

Well! DP is a bit nervous cos he works for UBS which has just announced massive redudancies and he hasn't been there long so he is vulnerable.  We will know by the end of the month.  Luckily, we can live on my salary ok.  I am more upset by the fact that DP was a bit ill yesterday and I am about to ovulate!!  I hope he is better this evening or I will simply have to rape him.  
  
Kate has now got both Oliver and Emily sleeping through the night!


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## Ourturn

Sonia - if it were me I would press for ec, after all you may have 2 - 3 eggs, unless your E2 levels say something else? 

WW - I was on 450 of Menapur so that sounds like a low does to me. I think Menapur is the drug of choice over here as it tends to get good quality eggs (correct me if I'm wrong). You should definately ask about it when you see your new consultant. 

Great news re Anne!


----------



## Saffa77

Thanks ladies they havent taken blood from me once!!!! so wouldnt know what my E2 levels are.  I think im also going to push for it even though they will be frozen afterwards as have to have reversal of my colostomy first then thawing the embies then go ahead so I think the debate is the freezing bit!! so annoying!

I hope she phones soon cos im ready for a heated debate


----------



## purple72

So happy for anne hope the love lab is active tonight!

LJ hunny I didn't think you wer being trite, and I know what you mean, just hope Raef Faris (DR) will see it the same way! My uterus or cervix problem isn't an issue in regards to fertility but i think he will want to do a laproscopy to check out that para ovarian cyst/hydrosalpix before the next IVF, I'm hoping I can get that done on my health isurance though! and then hopefully will go with the same protocol

Just wondering if that 8 weeks of DHEA I took around xmas was responsible for my good cycle, think to be honest though it was a mixture of the protocol and the work I did with my acu guy, in regards to diet and weekly acu sessions

Good to hear the twins are sleeping through the night! your sister must be so pleased

Poor DP he doesn't stand a chance hey!

Love and hugs to you and all other PR's

Sx


----------



## almond

Morning all, just a quick one as I have got some work to do and not quite started yet   All ok here, have started planning the wedding which is really exciting 

Anne - brilliant news!!! Sending   Please could anyone in touch with Anne say we are all thinking of her here

Malini / Nix - hope you have a lovely lunch, wish I was coming. Nix - sending you   for your FET. Don't know how they work so no ideas what the timescales are, how long are you in London?

LV -   So hope things are different for you this time. I can't remember, when is your next scan?

LJ - it can get a bit nerve-wracking at O time cant it! 

Saffa - it seems a shame not to do go to EC when you have 2 decent follicles there and if your E2 levels were good, I would want to be asking about going ahead. You have already put a lot of the work in now and it seems a shame to abandon. I would definitely ask why they would not let you go ahead with 2 (and it is not out of the question that another could catch up as well) Let us know how you get on


x


----------



## almond

Meant to say - Mir poor little Bob   hope he gets better soon


----------



## Miranda7

Yay! The golden egg! I have everything crossed - even my gonads, tell her.

Sonia - how disappointing! Hope you can talk the doc round.

Suzie - he's gone into sleep mode now! Though he wakes every hour or so, mithering because of the pox, but he's sleeping lots in the day.

LJ - can we see that photo?  

WW - yep, that's a heck of a low dose. And Purgeon's not usually the best for PRs either. New clinic perhaps? I do think a new clinic is good for the soul sometimes...

Almond - I'd love to get married again! But without the planning - that sent me half barmy - good luck! When's the big day?


----------



## Züri

Pix thanks for updating us on Anne and great news they got a little eggie, wishing you lots of luck Anne and Jase xx

Morning to everyone else too xx


----------



## almond

Mir - still sorting date but prob Sept. Will be small and cheap so hopefully not too much planning but that is prob wildly overoptimistic  

Morning Zuri
x


----------



## Pixie75

Hi Girls,

Saffa: I’m sorry I hope you didn’t find my post about Anne insensitive. I’d just read back and realised my timing was wrong – sorry. 
I agree with the girls – it’s really not fair for them to cancel EC if you have good E2 levels. Is there anywhere private you can go and get your blood taken for E2?
Docs reckon for each good egg your E2 level should be 300 - 400 so you can work it out yourself and take it from there. 

LJ: Poor DP but I’m sure a bit of   will make him feel better.   Go for it and rape him!  

Miranda: I’m glad Bobster in on the mend. Your new profile pic of him looks soooo cute even with spots! Pls give him a big kiss from me.  

Almond: ohhh wedding plans…how very exciting! Are we all invited?!  

Zuri: Morning hon? How are you today? 

xxx


----------



## Jumanji

I have developing a love-hate relationship with OPKs.  I first used them last cycle and, since I got pg, I am naturally using them again now, despite the fact it probably had nothing to do with it!!  I have both the first direct line-reading type and the clearblue digi!  I wee into a cup and test with both using the same wee.  Last month the FR went positive while the CB was still negative.  Then the CB went positive later the same day!  Today, I get a smiley face on the CB and a negative on the FR!!  So frustrating!  I will test again later but I am definitely leaping on DP tonight and am really annoyed he was ill last night!!


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Hello girlies - sorry no personals except for Anne                for fertilization and a BFP you brave little lady!!!!   

I am afraid that my family has had more bad news   After I was diagnosed as POF my little sister Hannah asked her GP to screen her fertility but suprise suprise her GP tested her FSH while she was on the pill, it came back at 2 and so Hannah was sent packing being told all was fine. I encouraged Hannah to have her AMH tested as I was concerned about her (particularly in light of my own experiences with an imbecile of a doctor). She was told that testing FSH whilst on the pill was pointless as the pill can suppress the fsh (why didnt I think of that  ) Well she got her AMH result back yesterday and it came out at 5 pmol/ 0.7 ngl. We are all in shock, so she must be so so shocked and confused. She is only 26   I am absolutely GUTTED for her. I wouldnt wish this on my worst enemy let alone my precious sister. I feel such mixed emotions about advising her in this way. Now she has to deal with so much sh!t when she should be enjoying herself. She has been with her fella for a couple of years but they don't feel ready to start a family at all. I went with her to the Lister this morning for an appointment with Yau Thum (who was utterley gorgeous to her) and he advised her that she would be much better off freezing embryos but that they really don't know how she will respond to stimulation - she could get 10 eggs but more likely closer to 4. So she has to go and ask her bloke if he will go down the embryo route (LJ I am sure you can understand the implications of this discussion) and is scared that he will get freaked out and dump her (not likely she is stunning with a heart of complete gold). Why oh why has this happened to all 3 sisters? Really really upset


----------



## purple72

oh Ally, I really don't know what to say, but sending love and hugs to you and your sisters!!!


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Thanks Purps   how you feeling hon?  

Interestingly I said to Yau that there seemed to be alot of fluctuation in AMH tests and that they seemed to go up and down. He has seen quite a few cases where the AMH has gone up and says he agrees that this test is less than perfect! He also seems to be championing the LP again saying that they now think this is their most successful protocol?? Will they just make up their minds!!

A xx


----------



## Züri

Ally I am so sorry I can imagine how gutted you must be to see it happen to your little sis too - really sorry words fail   xx


----------



## purple72

I'm ok hunny, having a bit of a low day today as DH is back at work, and although I was desperate for him to go back, now I'm missing him?!?!? (i cant make up my mind either   )

Dr Thum did my ET bless him, negotiating the bumps and u bend in my cervix, but I will change clinics before I'd do the LP again!!

How are you hunny? 

Sx


----------



## Züri

HI Purps sorry you are feeling low   I found it hit me about 4/5 days later and i am also the same re hubby, when he is at home he drives me mad but then miss him when he's not  he's been off all week sick and driving me mad!

xx


----------



## purple72

Thanks Zuri hunny, I'm ok, just bored I think, watching crap TV then going to go and have a nap I think! Then I will get to photo scanning again!!!

How are you doing hunny?

Sx


----------



## Züri

Purps I'm OK thanks, enjoying the sun and generally feeling better  

Are you off work this week?

x


----------



## purple72

Yep annual leave this week, thought I'd need it either way 

OOOh lucky you with sun! it's p1ssing down here!

Sx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Z & Purps - it is such a wierd feeling, I almost feel more upset about her than I do about myself. I also feel as though this is a disease that has spread from me as I was the first one diagnosed, then Becka has been having probs with her IVF and now Hannah with her low AMH. I know this is so ridiculous as low AMH is not catching but its how I feel right now. I just need to get myself together, stop being so upset and get on with being useful and supporting her & Becka. My heart breaks for her though as I know first hand how she is feeling. Okay so she has a chance to freeze some embies but first she has to convince boyfriend and she is convinced he will run for the hills, second she has to go through round after round of IVF, then she needs to hope for some embies to freeze and she still doesn't know if at the end of it they will defrost and give her a BFP. She also doesn't know if she should be just getting on with doing it naturally now when it could destroy her relationship plus they really really can't afford it as they are both really just starting out. So many what ifs and no certainties it is a real head f*ck for her. Ramble ramble ramble xxxx

Purps - take control of the remote - eat chocolate - have a bath and luxuriate in having the place to yourself, he will be back leaving is boxers and socks on the floor before you know it!!


----------



## Züri

Good idea to take the annual leave Purps - you are right either way you'd have wanted the week off. Have you thought much about your next cycle? will you wait for a while or start again soon? I go for my follow up tomorrow with my doc and taking hubby with me so he can do all the questions this time - he sems to respond better to men! which is a bit odd being a gynae wouldn't you say?  want to ask if they do any kid of immune testing here because if they don't I'm considering coming back to the UK for them

x


----------



## mag108

Hello lovely ladies
Been away and lots to catch up on on the thread. Had a great time with my family, lots of laughs. Hope the weather improves so I can out in the garden. Nuns wee, I cant believe it! Already anxious about injecting stuff intome now I know menopur is made from wee! Yipee. If its from nuns wee does that mean we get xtra holy eggs?

Rang CARE for my AMH results and its dropped from 6.9pmol/l in October to 3.83 today.
Its a rollercoaster. Was feeling ore positive since appt at Lister, now feeling a bit crap. Will pick myself up again. My consultant in Oct told me that I have as much chance then on clomid as on IVF. I think he was talking crap. He gave me a 10% chance. he also said amh doesnt drop quickly!!!!!!!!!Feeling angry about it all. Wished I'd tossed him aside and gone my own way in Oct....and found you ladies....

Purple–really sorry things havent worked out this time, hope you have lots and lots of TLC... you should take heart in how well you responded.

LW- delighted to hear your Istanbul plans are coming together.

Mir: Interesting article, hope your little one is feeling a bit better!

Sam - yes being away can really take your mind off it all, I was distracted by my large Irish family and the goings on! But have landed too with a bump, results etc plus we still have my husbands little boy who is a dote but could really do with some time out to get my life sorted re tx....hence online in bed in the middle of the day hurray! The info on the US clinics is helpful. Will keep an eye on how you go. 

Pix - hope you are starting to come out of feeling down hun,

Tracey - what a sweetie for sending Purps flowers....

LV: Fingers crossed those follies start catching up. Please dont torture yourself about the termination. You made the best decision for you at that time, hun. Like Purps, I smoked and now wished I hadnt and I didnt start trying til I was 36! 

Ally -  Really sorry to hear that the hol wasnt great what a big shame the holiday ...All that bl**dy rain! And I am so sorry to hear about your sis.


Sarah: Well done you for all the prep for the run....you must getting lots of + endorphins released....

WW - What croc of a doc, they are a shoddy lot at times these docs, picking and choosing what to say, offering their 'opinions' but not suggesting 2nd opinions....Mine is now lower than yours and I am sticking with my own eggs for now....


Popsi -  good luck with the panel I am sure you will get approved hun!


And Anne    we are all rooting for your golden egg hunX
XXXMAG


----------



## Züri

Ally all that you are thinking and worrying about is so natural and I think we'd all feel the same for our little sister - it so heartbreaking for her and you as you know what it feels like - on the one hand though if her partner agrees collecting eggs now and freezing embies may mean that they are good quality because she is young - do you think POF is hereditary? its seems odd that all 3 of you are having the same problems - has your other sister got low AMH also? has she been tested? are you the oldest?

sending you lots of love and    xx


----------



## purple72

Oh Alls hunny! You KNOW it's not your fault or responsibility! But I know it must be so hard for you dealing with all this, and it brings all your own emotions to the fore! Oh babe sending you huge hugs!!! Your sister will work her way through this journey, and her DP will hopefully surprise her! And she has you and your sister to help her and guide her! Plus us lot if she needs us! Stop beating yourself up sweetie, you're such a sweet amazing woman, I just wish I could show you what we see!!

Zuri, good on you for taking DH tomorrow, I've got follow up on the 1st May but think they'll probably want to do a laproscopy and get rid of the hydro/para ovarian cyst before I cycle again, so probably in a couple of months

Hey MAg hunny  

Sx


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Oh Ally, so sorry to read your news hon. Sending  abig big hug to you and your sisters.   Is there any way that Hannah could freeze eggs instead of embryos? I know it's not the whole answer, but would it take the pressure off her relationship....? And of course that may make it easier when she was ready to have children, in case she's with a different partner (awful to think, I know, but it does happen...)

Hi everyone else - will catch up at some point - just wanted to say congrats to Anne and Jason as well - I'm praying that the egg and the swimmers get well together     

Hi, Mags, Zuri, Purps xxx


----------



## Züri

Purps do you have a hydro? you know how bad they are for IVF? I had them also last year hence all the ops to drain unblock and finally remove as I knew that my tube would be better gone before doing IVF - I am now worrying about the other and thinking maybe i should have had them both out - will be good if you can get that sorted though before your net cycle

Hi Mags xxx


----------



## purple72

They are not sure if it's a hydro hunny they think it might be a para ovarian cyst, but I think they'll want to check it out before next cycle. hopefully can get it done on health insurance 

Hey Jo

Sx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Z - yes I am hoping that the quality will be good becuase of her age - so hopefully that is on her side. My elder sis has only produced one follie on IVF1 and is struggling now on IVF2, she has not yet had her AMH done.  We all know how miserably I did at IVF so I guess this is a genetic thing, we are thinking maybe we should warn our female cousins. Not easy when you know how horrible their lives will become if they get a low figure.

Purps - thanks honey that is so sweet of you but there really is nothing special about me just getting on with it like all of you, although I did joke with Hannah earlier that we were 'special' and weren't we so lucky to be the 1/1000 that this happens to!!! I trully hope her DP does suprise her and that this era of our lives has a happy ending. Feel like we are stuck in a vortex. 

Jo - Hello honey   H has been advised that egg freezing is really not as good as embryos and that there is still a low success rate with frozen eggs in this country. Embies really seems the way forward particularly since money is not that readily available. My poor Dad, he has tried to help us out a bit financially but bet he didn't expect to have to do it for all 3 daughters, that retirement fund must be looking rather empty now  

Mags honey - re that AMH I am really sorry that you got that bad news but did you see my earlier post about what the consultant at the Lister said to me today about AMH's going up?


----------



## purple72

You're a special lady ally hunny   

off to have a nap now but will catch you all later

hugs x


----------



## Züri

Ally you know where we all are - really feeling for you going through all this you must just feel like all the sh!t just keeps getting flung your way - have consultants said it can be hereditary?

 

Hi Jo x


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Can I just say, I hope that I haven't offended anyone on this board talking about Hannahs troubles. It may seem to some that she is lucky having the opportunity to at least freeze embryo's but this is really a horrible experience for her and what I have realised is that for each of us there are pro's and con's. For me I had my 20's unhindered, I had a fun time, I partied ALOT, I had a lot of relationships and was pretty carefree. But in my 30's I have found out I may never have my own biological child. For Hannah her life will not be the same as the day before she got her result, it is changed forever, this will colour her 20's, but in her thirties she may have the opportunity to have her own biological child. Oh my head is scrambled sorry I am waffling xxxx


----------



## Jumanji

Mags - with your AMH i really do think you should take heart from what Ally has said, namely that the doctors now seem to be realising that the test is far from perfect and, as I think we are seeing here, does fluctuate!  I know it is gutting but don't set too much store by it since it could go right back up again!

Ally - I am so sad for Hannah.  What a horrible situation for her to be in. It is just awful that she has to think of all these things so soon when she is so young.  One question I have is are they absolutely sure that the pill does not mess with AMH results?  It seems to me that if your hormones are shut down by the pill then it will make a difference and I did read elsewhere that you should be off the pill.  I am sure the Lister will know but did she double check this? I think that egg or embryo freezing might be the way forward and  she could do a cycle of each.  The main advice I would give is not to panic and rush it.  A few months is not going to make a difference at her age and she needs time to consider all this and deal with it.  My heart truly goes out to her and to your whole family.    

Zuri - POF has many possible causes and they think, at the moment, that some cases can be hereditary but most are not.  Most of the time, they think it is some kind of random autoimmune problem but the fact is that they really do not know.


----------



## Züri

Ally of course you haven't offended anyone at all xxx your head is scrambled and understandably but i don't think anyone would feel remotely offended xx

Hi LJ x


----------



## purple72

Ally I think your post about hannah is appropraite hunny! 

I think we all feel for her! As you say it's tough enough at our age when we KNOW (mostly) what we want, but in our 20's well that would have knocked me off my feet! Send her our hugs

Sx


----------



## Pixie75

Ally LJ is right!

See below study honey 

http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/22/12/3192

/links


----------



## Jumanji

Ally - take a look at Pixie's post; it would make sense to me that since th pill shuts down the normal follie process, you are going to have a smaller early cohort and hence lower AMH.


----------



## popsi

ally honey... your in exactly the right place nobody is going to be the least bit offended, we have nothing but sympathy and compassion for your whole family darling  , you need to be where people understand and this is the right place.. read pixies post too xx

purple..   to you too honey xx

pixie.. xx

LJ.. you made me   when you said you would rape your DP lol xxxx good luck but i suspect you wont need to go that far   

anne and jason... OMG amazing news, thanks pix for posting... good luck hope your golden wonder is getting jiggy as we speak xx

kate, lv, lainey, nix, swinny, mir, steph, mag, lw, and the million others i think of each day   

well as for us we have what is hopefully our last social worker visit at 4pm so best get ready for that xx


----------



## Pixie75

LJ: Don’t you think this also explains the AMH’s drops after IVF protocols with OCP’s – e.g. Anne’s AMH drop and I can’t remember who but there was another lady here a few days ago questioning the same thing?

Hello Popsi & everyone   

Sorry having another manic day at work!  

I’ve just had a text from Anne’s hubby asking me to translate something which turned out to be a bottle of ‘full fat salty yoghurt drink’. I said I didn’t know why he was asking but I didn’t think they’d like it! I also asked how Anne was doing and here is his response;

“She’s better now she’s not eating salty full fat yoghurt drink drenched corn flakes!”   

He said they’ve just woken up from an afternoon nap and she was craving for corn flakes so off he went to get some milk then you know the rest of the story! Bless them.

Pix xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Erggghhh poor Anne - that sounds really horrible!!        for Annes golden egg  

Pix & LJ - we did ask that question but Yau thought this was not the case - he also checked with Sam Abdullah but I have urged H to come off the pill and get re tested. She is exhausted and can't entertain the idea at the moment but I am sure she will come round.

Pops - thank you darling   I meant to say that you made the hairs on my arm go up the other day when I read your post on preparing your spare rooms! I truly hope you can get going really soon and am certain that you will be approved in no time     Good luck with your SW visit (bread in oven - coffee brewing - cake on table?) 

LJ - thanks hon - means alot.

Sorry for monopolising the thread today! I am going to do some work now so hopefully everyone else can get a look in!!! 

Much love to all - you are quite simply my rocks - each and every one of you and I love you all to bits!! 

A xxxx


----------



## mag108

Hi
Thanks Ally, re AMH things never stand still do they! And LJ thanks to you too.

going to catch up with madmen on iplayer...a litle bit of escapism goes a long long way!

X


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Mag - I have a few episodes on the sky box - think I am going to snuggle on sofa with DH tonight and catch up on a few!! Enjoy x


----------



## Jumanji

Pix - I would agree that AMH falls during an IVF cycle because the stims try and pull out all the possible follies and it reduces your cohort and gives you a drop until your system sorts itself out.  This happened to both Anne and Lucy and it may have impacted Mags (I am not sure how longs ago her cycle was) depending upon how quickly the body sorts itself out.   Glad you heard from Anne and Jas!!

Ally - I really think poor Hannah should be retested when she is off the pill.  I really doubt that any doctors have enough experience of the impact of the pill on AMH to make a judgment on it and Pix's study suggests there is an impact and I had read the same.  Given the little they really know about AMH generally when you add the pill element they are likely to be even more ignorant.


----------



## Wing Wing

Blimey girls! I was determined to keep up but 4 pages have shot by in the blink of any eye!!

Any news *Odette*? Bated breath here&#8230;&#8230;. Must be soooooo exiting for you and DH. I wish you all the best for a smooth and painless delivery!

*Sonia* - did your doc change his mind? Seems an awful waste to me.

*Purps*, what are E2 levels? Obviously my 5hithead of a doc didn't know either as otherwise he wouldn't have knocked me out with a GA for an EC when there were not eggs!!!!

*Anne* - hoping along with all the other PRs that this is the golden one - that makes you a goose by the way!!

Yeuch - salty milk Anne - you poor thing! V Funny tho!   

*LJ  * - how do you find out all these things? Am so happy to know that 250 is not high for Puregon and thanks for the info on Menapur (You too *Sobroody *  and *Miranda*!!). Will ask Mr Nice Man about that. I made an appointment to see him next Weds so can't wait now thanks to you! 

Thanks for the additional information re AMH hon - mucho appreciated!

Could you also PM me your standard post re DHEA as I am as confused as everyone else as to whether it is a good thing or not.  Thanks!

Hope DP is better or he is in for a shock this eve! Do him good! 

*Miranda* - I agree with you about wishing I could get married again but for the simple reason that I wasn't all there the first time. I hope this will make you laugh girls&#8230;

After the ceremony we had a champagne reception on the lawn of the park where we had a marquee, so I had plenty to drink. Just before we tucked into the hog roast, I started to get a bit of a headache. Told Mum and she gave me a couple of pills.

Mum had just had a hip replacement operation and was taking extra strong codeine for pain. She was supposed to take just one, at night, with zero alcohol. So unbeknown to me, I had taken double the dose on a gut full of the fizzy stuff! Never felt so out of it in my life and spent a good half hour lying on a park bench watching the world spin! Had to leave the reception early, didn't get to dance or anything! The worst of it is that everyone said it was the best wedding they had ever been to, so much fun, blah, blah, blah. Was (and secretly still am!) outraged!! We won't mention the photos&#8230;&#8230;!!!

So *Almond *  - stay off the drugs!!! But have fun planning - that bit was great!

Oh *Ally* - I really feel for you and Hannah. Poor love. I guess the only positive is at least she has a fab sister in you to help and support her and at least she CAN do something whereas if you hadn't stepped in, she may have left it way to late. Just a thought, but can she freeze eggs rather than going the whole hog embryo route? Big hugs to you both. And don't be ridiculous about offending anyone. We are surely all here for each other - whatever the sorrow or joy!

*Zuri *  - it is the old fashioned way here as well. Pig doctor much more responsive to DH than to me - almost as if I were just the receptacle for his marvellous sperm. Luckily new Doc is far more modern in his approach and realises that I am the important one!! Quite right too!

Hi *Mag* - welcome back!

Hi *Popsi *  - how exiting for you. Must be quite a process. Is great to hear that you are getting near.

   to everyone.

Love WW XXX


----------



## Züri

*WW* that is awful about your wedding I would still be secretly outraged as well! I think you need to re new your vows and have a big day again 

Good luck at Mr Nice Doc appointment 

*Mag* and *Ally* what is Madmen? that one seems to have slipped through the net with telly addict me!  me and hubby just spent the past 6 evenings watching series 4 of 24 (I know we're a bit behind the times  )

Poor Anne with her salty Milk  (tried to find a puke smiley but there is non  )

x


----------



## purple72

Pixie75 said:


> Ive just had a text from Annes hubby asking me to translate something which turned out to be a bottle of full fat salty yoghurt drink. I said I didnt know why he was asking but I didnt think theyd like it! I also asked how Anne was doing and here is his response;
> 
> Shes better now shes not eating salty full fat yoghurt drink drenched corn flakes!


HAd me laughing my head off!!

Thank Pix for that

Popsi, good luck on the social work interview! will be almost done now!

Wing, E2 is Estradial levels measured whilst on stims and E2 levels of 2-300 per follicle SHOULD indicate an egg in that follicle. They should rise as stimms progress, they start low and by time they arrange ET then they are looking for the 200-300 per follie (correct me ladies if i'm wrong please)

Bless you on your wedding story!

Sonia what happened with the doc?

Hello Everyone else

Sx


----------



## H1

Just marking thread x


----------



## Saffa77

Ladies

Update

Going ahead with EC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  what a day i have had.

stimming me for longer and EC on Monday  as they reckon that I am a bad responder and will need donor eggs if this cycle dosent work?? I am 31 and have only been on their highest gonal f on 300ui ( which I dont think is the highest ) have only had FSH tested which was normal - havent had AMH but will be getting that tested and now they saying donor egg?? what do you ladies think?  I definatley think go to another clinic in London ( I am in Scotland )  I seriously dont think that I responded badly seeing as I have severe endo and 1 Ovary? Let me know if im wrong.  I got 4 follies one of which is 11mm but the 2 are perfect and third is 14mm.  I would like to still try other drugs like menopur?? advice would be appreciated thanks all you lovely ladies for reading and always giving me advice.

Sx

Anne - well done on your EC!!! YOU GO GIRL everyone else HELLO


----------



## Züri

great news Sonia!!

LJ can you PM me the DHEA info too for a friend fo mine - she has just had her 8th miscarriage (she has had 4 miscarriages in 4 months) been to see her clinic to get her test results for bloods taken and all were normal although didn't have NK test done - but they have recommended her on Clomid as they say it improves egg quality but as she is super fertile and falls pregnant so easy they are worried about multiples so I have just mentioned DHEA and told her to investigate it - if they are recommending climid for egg quality then wouldn't DHEA be a safer bet for her?

Sorry to hijack but i really feel for her and she just doesn't know what to do pr where to turn

thanks girls

x


----------



## purple72

Sonia hunny, Maybe I can help here as my story was similar

I was in oxford 
1st cycle Long protocol Synarel down reg 25 days 150 iu gonal F 11 days, only 1 follicle cancelled
2nd cycle Long protocol Synarel down reg 19 days 300 iu gonal F 14 days 2 follies pushed for EC got 1 egg which fertilised abnormally no ET
FSH normal, would not do AMH
Advised 5% chance of success with IVF told DE was only realistic option

Moved to Lister

Asked about AMH Dr Faris said why bother, previous cycles are better indicator of response so put on high dose menopur
Short protocol, 24 days on pill, then started menopur 450 iu stimmed for 12 days with cetrotide added in to prevent ovulation, got 6 follies, 6 eggs 5 fertilised and 2 went to blastocyst stage and where put back on day 5! unfortunately they didn't stick.

Change of clinic and protocol and drug made a HUGE difference.

Not so sure I'd advise getting AMH done as you can see how much heartache it causes but would definately recommend The Lister

Sx


----------



## Jumanji

Sonia - pleased you are going for EC. I agree with purple that you should step away from the AMH test.  First off, it seems to raise as many questions as it answers with a lot of people and causes a lot of confusion and worry. Second, you only have one ovary and who knows what difference that makes?  I am quite sure the docs won't know!!  And if they don't know why put yourself through the test?  I also do not feel that you should even be considering DE at this stage.  You are very young so your egg quality is likely to be good.  OK - you may not have as many eggs as most women your age but so what?  You only need one.  I also think you would benefit from a clinic which is more flexible on protcols etc. and which is more experienced with more challenging cases.  I really would think about getting a consultation at say the Lister. I know it's a long way to travel but it may well be worth it and I know they work with some local clinics so you mgith be able to avoid travelling for your cycle but still get the Lister treatment.  

Zuri/WW - will PM you the post on DHEA.  Zuri - I am not sure my standard post on DHEA has much on m/c but I think the CHR link does have some details.


----------



## Malini

Hello all,

You've all been busy today.  

Ally - big hugs for you and your sisters.  If I had a sister, I would want her to be just like you.  I have all these regrets that I didn't know more/act on my wishes when i was younger and you have put her in a position where she can do something.  It is a shock and there are still unknowns, but you are taking care of her and that's lovely

Yep, WW - I'd be thrilled with your levels, no doubt about it.  Get yourself down to the nice man.  What the docs don't get is that we will decide to move to DE IF/WHEN we are good and ready.  Their job is to lay out the options, but we live our lives.

Sonia - You've done well to beat those conservative docs.  I was on 600 iu of Fostimon and got one perfect embryo.  It didn't stay but it might have.  And stay away from that AMH test, I say.  It has only caused me grief and not changed how I feel about ttc with my own eggs despite the fact that the docs said to them, 'the writing is on the wall'.  

That's so awesome for Anne and Jason.  I did get the boy when I prayed (in primary school, see above) - and we're still friends!!! - so I will pray some more tonight to absolutely anyone/thing/energy that's listening.  Is that drink called Ayran or something like that?  I used to drink it all the time round my Turkish mate's house as a kid - definitely an acquired taste.

Mir - I am weeping - you want to have lunch with Nix and not me?  So pleased your baby is feeling better.

It was so lovely to meet you funny, beautiful Nix. We missed lunching with all of you very much. Here's hoping for a w/e FET for us to celebrate.  We were so good girls and toured the entire basement of Oxford Circus Topshop and came away empty handed.  I feel saintly.

To Zuri, LJ (much fun tonight  ), Mags, both Annas, Almond, Odette, Elinor, Kate, LV, Swinny, Lainey, Steph, LW, Ali, Pix and everyone else have a great evening.  

Malini xx


----------



## Züri

Thanks LJ you're a star, forwarded the info on to her  x

Hi Malini glad you enjoyed lunch with Nix today - is she as bonkers in real life  

x


----------



## Malini

Well, I don't think I am the best judge of bonkersness seeing how I can spin on my own madness most of the time, but I can report that she is very, very funny!!!  And made me feel better in myself within minutes of being in her company.  

How are you?  Did you enjoy your 24 telethon last night?  I have my ER and Brothers and Sisters fix tonight - can't wait.  And have burgers and chips in to make it heavenly bad for us.

M xxx


----------



## Züri

We have been watching 24 for the past 6 nights! got lat 3 episodes to watch tonight and we will have finished season 4  so addictive, love lost and heroes and desperate housewives too  

Yes I can imagine Nix is a funster  glad she made you feel better - if you're listening Nix good luck for FET whenever it may be xx


----------



## Malini

Her FET may be as soon as this weekend, fingers crossed.

Enjoy tonight's tv fix.  You sound so much brighter and I am seriously impressed!!

M xx


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi girls

Anne  - yyyaaayyyy for your eggy!!    

Hello to everyone else.  

Ally     , again so sorry about you and your dear sisters.    

Just dropping in for 5 minutes, very quickly.  Call with the US doc last night went "okish", this is the clinic with the amazing success rates.  He did say he'd treat me, which blew my mind as I thought with their success rates surely they don't treat amh 0.1 \ fsh 42 women! But he said given we know what a low probability it is, that they would treat us.  He then said my chances of ivf being successful with my levels were 1-2%, so good and not good.  I'll update you all more when i have more time.  I didn't get all the info I wanted from them, so even though their stats are really amazing, it's not clear they are the best for PRs...will put my thoughts together when I've more time.


I've been lurking a little bit today, but feeling "really" depressed the past few days, really down, and can't seem to drag myself out of it. I can't even post.  I'm so down I can barely function.  I feel like all is lost, that I don't have a chance anymore, and it's really dragging me down.  I KNOW I need to go and see a counsellor, but it's so hard to fit that in along with all the other infertility \ pof appointments I have.  I need to be reminded that even if it doesn't work out for me, it's not like that has to mean my life is going to be terrible, it's just not going to be what I thought it was.  So now I'm posting when I do have to run and get things done tonight - as I've left everything until now, bad me.

Sorry for no more personals dear girls.  xx

LOL Sam xx


----------



## Malini

Oh Sam, I am sorry you feel so low.  Thank you for posting about your appointment but it sounds like having that grim statistic levelled at you was understandably horrid.  Maybe it is best to put the analysis of it to one side for the moment while you focus, in the short-term, on looking after your heart.  I have been taking 5-HTP lately and it has started to help (or maybe it is a placebo effect) me sleep better which makes me more chipper and stronger during the day.  I know you know about counselling, and I understand what you mean about stacking appts up around your already busy, full life BUT my CBT sessions changed my life.  That sounds dramatic but I know that I use techniques she taught me every day and that I can help myself more than I could and I have a plan, I doubt it sometimes and meander from it, but she has made it more solid and real than it was before.  I only went about 7 times, and that was expensive but it has made me so much better and improved my relationship with Dh.  Almond mentioned that IF is considered a life crisis and that makes sense to me because unlike other problems I have had in my life this feels connected to everything I think, do, dream about, wish for and love.  It is an all consuming hell that can only be fully understood from the inside and we all get that.  Don't beat yourself up.  I procastinate all the time, and it is so hard to feel energetic, enthusiastic and willing when you are low.  This is Depression and it is a nasty thick fog that dulls your senses and makes the brighter horizon seem unattainable.  Here's a  .  I so wish I could do more.  I really, really hope tomorrow is a bit better, but if it isn't please come back here so we can help you.  Well come back regardless because we all care about you.

Malini xxx


----------



## Züri

Malini you really do write such beautiful posts x

Sam sending you lots of    and can only echo 
Malinis words as she put them so well x


----------



## Stillgrumps

Saffa777....just been reading your posts and am so glad they are going ahead with your EC.  Your story sounds similar to mine....however would say you have responded much better considering you only have one wee ovary...there are definitely options to try before going down the egg donation route so don't give up hope.  

On my first cycle (had 7 follicles in total but only 2 good sized ones from 225 menopur) we were initially told the cycle was to be abandoned (totally devastated by this after ttc for years and finally trying IVF it didn't even occur to me that I wouldn't respond), but we decided to finish the treatment and we got an egg.

I agree with the other ladies ref AMH....my clinic won't test for it and they say that your response to the treatment is a good enough indicator of your egg reserve...and I think I would just freak out if I knew for certain that mine was really low and just focus on that and worry worry worry.

Have you considered the Glasgow Centre for Reproductive Medicine?  Not sure where you are in Scotland, but they are supposed to have a good reputation and do much more tailored treatment for individuals.

Anyway, you don't have to worry about going anywhere else....you need to focus all your positive thoughts on the EC....Its all about getting over each hurdle and onto the next....you are nearly there!

Sending you lots and lots of    

Lots of   to everyone......Sam just wanted to add also that I have found talking things over with a counsellor and doing regular meditation has made a huge difference to me and how I have been able to cope with everything....I didn't think it would.


Stillgrumps


----------



## TryMeditate

Yep, pushed work to one side again for another 10 minutes  so I could post ..bad me.   Thanks girls    

Thanks so much Malini,     you summed it up.  IF permeates through everything in my life... I honestly don't know what I'd do without you girls.  I will get counselling, I have too.

I know what has got me downtoday. I was feeling a bit better today, I got the courage up to tell a friend (who knows a lot about IF for different reasons), that my plan B was donor eggs, and she wasn't judgemental at all.  She was really great, told me I couldn't worry about what other people thought, and that this is a different generation, and by the time my children are at school, it will be different again, people will be more open minded and accepting. I felt more positive from her reaction that people will be more open minded.    Then I started looking for positive stories from donor conceived children.  

I almost feel like I am not allowed to mention this, but my biggest concern is how will the DE child feel.  i really really apologise if this offends anyone....  I know how I'll feel - absolutley in love with the child and so happy that I get to have the family that I dreamed about, and forever grateful. But are we too focussed on our own pain, and not considering the child?  As I said, I really feel like I'm almost not allowed to mention this subject..... but whenever I look for the donor conceived childs point of view, it's not good news, it really brings me down again, and upsets me. 

There are 2 positive stories on the donor conception network site, the rest are all negative.  And I've really really looked. I've even bought the book experiences of donor conception, which has a lot of stories, but they are not positive. I've looked on websites all over the world, and all I can find are stories of donor conceived children who are not happy about it.  I'm so so sorry, I don't want to upset anyone... but I really feel I need to talk about this as I'm seriously considering the DE route.  I don't think the opinions of 10 years olds count, you need to look at the opinions of children who are at least 15.   I know when our children grow up, it will be a different generation, so part of me thinks we can't really judge what previous generations have felt about how they were conceived, but the other part of me thinks maybe I'm kidding myself.   I guess what I'm asking for is if anyone has any positive stories written by donor concieved offspring.... I'd love to read them.

LOL 
Sam xx


----------



## TryMeditate

Again, I'm sorry.  I feel a bit like I've opened an unmentionable topic.  I really hope I haven't offended anyone.... but I'd love to be pointed in the direction of any positive DE stories.... it would really help ease my mind.

xxx


----------



## LV.

Hi Sam,

Sorry to hear you're feeling so down at the moment, it's rotten to feel so blue. There are so many open minds on this thread and we've discussed all manner of possibly offensive topics I'm sure you'll find people won't mind you sharing your fears - they are your feelings which make them important to talk about, and as they are feelings, not facts, it means there's no right or wrong here - please don't fret.

I've not done much research around DE this far but it's something I will consider if things aren't successful for us, however I did my first Google following your post and had a look at the Donor Conception Network and I found a positive story straight away, but more significantly there was also a research paper there and from what I read the negative stories are from those that were told much later in life and therefore had the foundations of their life rocked and put in to an emotional tailspin. Could you imagine being a teenager with all those raging hormones, and then on top of that being told about donor parents? It's not difficult to understand a negative reaction. The stories that were positive had one thing in common - the children were told really early. Granted I've done 5 minutes reading on this subject but it seems to me  that the answer to positive experiences for donor children is to be told early on so it's a natural part if your life and seems normal. There were some lovely comments in that paper from those that were told young - it really is they key it'd seem from reading that.

I'm sure some ladies who are far more knowledgeable then me will be along very soon but I just wanted to reach out my hand and hope you grab on.

Thanks to all of you for your lovely and kind reassuring words for me today - you are all so gorgeous and I melted on a number of occasions. I'm feeling much better - in addition to your lovely messages I wrote a list of all the wonderful things I have already in my life today and it really helped to focus on the positives that I already have rather than those things I don't. Scan tomorrow - who knows?!


x


----------



## almond

Hi ladies, I have only been away since 11.15 and already had pages to catch up on

Sam - so so sorry you feel so low   This really is a life crisis and I have had to have a lot of help to deal with it. Malini put it beautifully. I can understand totally why you feel that you don't have the time to sort out your head because you feel how having a baby is the only thing which can make you feel better, so you are pouring all your energy into that. But if you invest the time to feel better emotionally, then all the decisions you are having to make will be easier, coping with treatment and all the routes you are pursuing will be easier and on top of that you will feel better about NOW. None of us ever knows what is around the corner and I would hate for you to miss out on the beauty of what you have now because you are feeling so low. I only say that because I had to do this myself. At some point last year I really understood (with a lot of help!) that I will not get this time in my life back and baby or no baby it is the life I have and I want to enjoy it. It isn't easy, and it doesn't mean I don't feel desperately sad sometimes, but I needed to do it because I am important in all of this too. I am definitely not saying stop doing what you are doing, not at all. Just that making taking steps to feel better emotionally will make everything so much better, and easier, and make you feel happier. I am really not explaining myself well. You are such a wonderful woman Sam and I don't like to see you so unhappy  

Ally - and so sorry to hear about your sister. What a horrendous thing to have to face at her age, but how lucky she is to have you as a sister  

Pix - poor Anne but I was laughing a lot at that story about the cornflakes ...

Saffa - great news re EC. The others have given you great advice and I agree. And btw, I also wish I had never had my AMH test done.

WW - you never fail to make me laugh and your wedding story had me laughing out loud (sorry!!) I consider myself duly warned ...

Nix / Malini - so lovely you met up and had a great time. I love meeting my cyber friends
as you know!
Popsi - I hope your visit went well, so exciting 

LV - just seen your post, good luck for tomorrow  

That's it from me, worked late (been working at home) and now got to sort dinner and cant be bothered  

Love to everyone not mentioned by name, I dont know what I would do without you all
xxx


----------



## TryMeditate

Thanks a zillion dear girls, you really did help.  I had a big   to dh tonight and he was really great.  He's come such a long way... he told me that whether we do DE or Adoption, he's convinced we will make it work.  He thinks the children will be fine, and I know he really believes that.

Almond you are so completely right to try to enjoy every day baby or no baby, it's one of the things that makes me feel worse is that i'm not enjoying what I have now.   

Ally - has Hannah told your mum & dad yet?  I can't imagine what they must be feeling now - if it were me I know I'd be feeling guilt that all 3 of my gorgeous daughters had this horrible thing inflicted on them, I know I'd be worried it was me.  She is very very lucky to have you as a sister.    

LV -       for tomorrow.  I really hope you get good news.

Popsi - I'm sure everything went great for you today. Really exciting! From when you go to panel, do you have roughly an idea of how long it takes?  I noticed you said babies - does this mean you've asked for more than 1?? oh my god, double joy and happiness!  Are you applying for children from the UK or from overseas?

Saffa - great that your going to EC. I don't think you would find anyone on this thread that wouldn't know that was the absolute best decision.  

Anne -     

LJ -thanks for keeping on posting the amh info, your a star.  Girls I do have to question one thing though,  whereas it does seem true that amh drops after an ivf cycle... i can't see anywhere that they are doing retesting to see if it comes back up again.  Is it possible that ivf lowers your reported amh number permanently?  I really don't see anywhere that they say that it only temporarily comes down.  I'm not suggesting that ivf makes you permanently less fertile, as most people seem to go on to get a similiar number of eggs cycle after cycle, but I am wondering if maybe the large dose of fsh does something to the amh hormone \ future reported numbers? 

Pix, Ali, Kate, WingWing, Purple, mags, Mir and the rest of the gang 

big kisses... it's good night from me.

xxx


----------



## almond

Sam, don't feel guilty about feeling bad! It is totally understandable. But also know that there are things you can do so that you don't have to feel that bad. If that makes sense! 



x


----------



## Han72

Bonjour les filles!

Sam my lovely, the others haved already said it but I just wanted to reiterate: please pretty please give yourself a break and take the time to feel better in yourself.       Could you bring yourself to just call the counsellor and book an appointment? Or even perhaps contact them by email if that's possible?  Re the DE don't beat yourself up for raising the subject hon, it's a perfectly understandable concern.  I looked into this myself at one point and I, like LV found that the kids who had the most problems with it were the ones who weren't told until later on.  I really feel that it's the feeling of being kept in the dark that causes the problem if you wait until they're older or, worse, they find out by accident.  At the end of the day, as a parent you're constantly telling your child to be honest - how would you feel if at the age of eg 13 your legs are suddenly cut away from under you with a revelation like this?  I think the mere fact of not having mentioned it for so many years would give them the impression that it's something to be ashamed of when it's nothing of the sort. Add to that the typical adolescent angst and the fact that this is exactly the point where they're forging their own identity then it's no wonder they freak out!  Er well that's what I think, anyway sorry went off on a bit of a mini-rant there!

Anne -    for your golden follie.  What's this salty yogurt business though? Sounds like a euphemism for summink else to me mate!  Are you sure Jason wasn't having you on?   

LV - good luck for the scan tomorrow hon! 

Saffa - so glad they're letting you go on to EC, personally I don't think you've responded badly at all given you've only the one ovary and the dose of stims isn't that high either!  450 is the max that most UK clinics go for as I think has already been mentioned, although the ARGC will go as high as 600 for slow/poor responders so I think you're doing pretty damn well! 

Ally hon -  to you and your sisters, it's at times like this I regret being an only child, it's so lovely the way you're all there for eachother!  I spose you lot will have to be my surrogate sisters instead!

So Malini sis, it was fab meeting you today chica, even if you did make me feel like a heifer with your skinnymalinks self!  Thanks again for the book, haven't started yet (I want something to read in the clinic waiting room!) but I'll let you know how I get on   However my husband is unlikely to ever thank you for introducing me to the aladdins cave that is the jewellery dept of top shop, I feel a spending spree coming on!

Almond, feel free to join us next time chick, the more the merrier! 

Mira - bless Bob!  I nearly bawled when I saw that  picture of him!  What a little beamer though in the piccy next to it, even with a face full of pox he is still gorgeous!

Right I really need to get off here and go to bed, early morning bloods (well I'll probably get there for around 10 tbh!) and the FET might happen this weekend according to the nurse who called this afternoon...  I was so shell-shocked that when DH called just a few minutes later I didn't even tell him!  I think that shock (for some reason I'd convinced myself it wouldn't be until next week!) probably had more to do with me not going mad in TS today with Malini than any sensible "I really mustn't spend any money" kind of thinking!  I'm trying to stay calm but I have to admit I'm worried about how I'll react if they don't survive the thaw...  I really wish I'd asked them to freeze a couple of the ones that made it to day 6, even if they weren't great quality, as apparently they thaw them 2 at a time and from what I've heard the thaw survival rate on a good day is only 50%....  no wonder I can't bloody sleep!  Anyone got any info re the use of xanax and ttc   Or a safe alternative if it's not recommended? 

xxx


----------



## Swinny

Morning girlies

Just popping on at work to wish Anne loads of luck and love today      

S xxx


----------



## Züri

Morning

Anne lots of luck for today xx

Hi Nix x


----------



## Wing Wing

Morning my loverlees! 

Hope the weather wherever you are is better than here - absolutely hissing it down  - hope it gets better for the weekend. Have just started with the fake tan after all the sun we had and will look very odd if it rains for the next week!! 

*Zuri* - am liking the idea of renewal of wedding vows - wonder if I can still get in dress tho?!!!!! YIKES!   

Thanks *Purps* for the info re E2

Sonia - good news on the EC - good luck for Monday.

*Nix/Malini* - congratulations on the non shop! You deserve to feel saintly!

*Sam,* I am sorry to hear the you are feeling so down. It is a horrible feeling and I do know what you mean - quite often you don't even want to wake up, never mind haul yourself out of bed hey? I guess you just have to think that, "This too will pass." And you will start to feel a bit better gradually. I think that it is well worth seeing a counsellor and should probably be a priority as how you feel is going to affect everything you do. So if you feel energetic and positive it has to be better than feeling lethargic and negative. My counsellor really helps - just because she is a third party who has no involvement in my life or what I am trying to do. This makes her very objective which is good for me. Not such an eloquent post as *Malini's* but same message to end - WE ARE HERE FOR YOU!

I was surprised to read about negative responses from donor egg children but what* LV* said really makes sense. I am a potential DE candidate and must admit that my initial reaction was that I wouldn't tell ANYONE if that was the route I went down and then there would be no need to tell the child. Not so sure now about that now.



Nixf01 said:


> Anne -    for your golden follie. What's this salty yogurt business though? Sounds like a euphemism for summink else to me mate! Are you sure Jason wasn't having you on?


             

*Nix* - you are a hoot!!! REALLY made my day! Am sooooo praying for a hugely sucessful FET this weekend   . Good luck babes.    Keep us posted hey? 

 to all of you great women.

Love WW X


----------



## Wing Wing

Me again!  Is anyone available for lunch in London on Friday 30 April.  Will be flying into City Airport about 1130 and then leaving later from Liverpool St going to Ipswich for the eve so plenty of time for a meet up if anyone fancies it.  Would be REALLY nice to put faces to names.

WW X


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Morning all,

Good luck to Anne and Jason - hope the egg has fertilised nicely and that you're PUPO v soon  

LV - good luck with the scan - I'll be thinking of you     

jo xx


----------



## TryMeditate

Wing wing - I would have loved to meet you for lunch, but that's the weekend we are away and we are leaving on Thursday night :-(

Nix - oooohhhhh please please please let these little frosties survive the thaw.  xxx

Anne - Fingers crossed for you today.  Good luck.        

LV- good luck with the scan.       for you too.

And yes girls, I am going to book that counsellor.  I know I need to start sorting my head out, because I can't see the good things that I have, and I certainly avoid 3D friends - my antisocialness has now extended to my not even being able to return texts!

Back on the DE debate... Wing Wing at first I like you was certain I'd not tell anyone, including the child, thinking it would be selfish of me to tell them something that would hurt them.  All the reading I have done has made me turn completely on this. 

I would absolutely have to tell them from the begining now.  (Besides the fact that for me, not telling them means I could never look them in the eye, and the damage to our relationship caused by me knowing that lie would do would likely far outweigh the damage to the child of knowing I was not their biological mother).  I've done a lot of reading, and yes, a lot of the damage seems to be done by the child finding out later, so yes telling early seems best.  And LV I know there are the 2 positive stories on the donor conception website, I believe both of these are from the children of 2 of the founders of the DC website... but that's my point....I've searched and searched - globally- and these are the only positive stories I can find.  I know the first DE baby was born in Australia 26 years ago, so is now an adult, and as we know there have been many many more since.... so why can't I find more positive stories - other than the 2 on the donor conception network?  This is what's really upsetting me.  I really want DE to be an option for us, but I have to wonder - is solving my own pain creating pain for my child?  IF is an unbearable pain, and DE is an amazing wonderful development of modern medicine to help us have the family we dream about.... but I need to know, in solving my pain am I only going to create a terrible pain for my child?  I know I know this feels like an unmentionable topic.... Again, if anyone can help me find positive stories from children above 16 other than the 2 on the donor conception uk website I'd love to read them.  

My DH has a theory, that the only people who are bothered to write are those who are negative, that the positive stories are out there, only they can't be bothered to write anything.  I'd love to believe he is right. 

Sam xxx


----------



## Miranda7

Hey Sam - think what human nature is really like.

Most of the time people do not phone up a company and say, hey, I just had to congratulate you! That was the best egg sandwich I ever ate! And the waitress was so nice!

They do, however, write to complain if there was a hair in the sandwich or the waitress was rude.

People will only put fingers to keyboard 90% of the time to complain. If they're happy, they say nowt.

And the stuff that makes it into the media... it's much more interesting to read about an angry person, furious about his or her roots than a kid who says I was donor and it's fine.

So you're up against it for starters, as the net is a breeding ground for nutters and the dissatisfied to vent their twisted spleens. 

Stop looking for other people's stories and focus on your own is what I say - your DH knows you can bring up a happy donor child, and you will. xxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Pixie75

Morning girls,

Hope everyone is OK.

Bad news from Anne I’m afraid. Her poor little egg didn’t fertilise.   
I’m really gutted for her.

Catch up later.

Pix xx


----------



## Overthemoon

Anne, I'm devastated for you and Jason   As I said in my text,  I wish I could take the pain away from you both right now.


----------



## LV.

That's exatly what I was going to say Mir... I work for a software company and our Helpdesk gets so much flack and the staff that work on it think that our software is pants, when in actual fact it's probably the best on the market for what it does. This is becuase none of our customers EVER phone up and say "Oooo your system is running really well today and I'm extremely happy with it" They just phone up and moan about how crap it is that something isn't working or that they don't like some feature or other. I took some of our Helpdesk staff out on some customer visits and they were all flabbergasted that every end user they saw were really happy with the software and complemented us on how great it was. I think it's the difference between being reactive and proactive with how feedback is gleaned. 

I know babies are soooo different to software or restaurants but we're just trying to demonstrate human nature I suppose. 

Have you done much research on adopted children? It's in the same area and I'm sure emotions will be similar and you'll find more positive stories as it's a more established process.

x


----------



## LV.

Oh Anne poppet - I'm so sorry. Words are not really adequate

thinking of you

x


----------



## beachgirl

Anne    so sorry sweetheart, big hugs to you and Jason x x


----------



## popsi

oh no anne i am so so sorry for you and jason xx i had so much hope for you, you both take good care of each other and have lots of hugs and tears xxxxxx


----------



## Züri

Oh bugger!! so so sorry Anne & Jase absolutely gutted for you both  sending you lots of   

Sam - just wanted to send you a hug, can;t really add much to the ED discussions but can understand your feelings of anxiety over it   

Morning Pix, LV, Wing, Jo, Popsi, beachy, Mir and everyone else

Will be back later - off for follow up appointment xx


----------



## bonchance5

Hi there,  I am new to this site but have been following your journeys and thought that I would pop on to say hello , can I just check this works before I write my story xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

OMG Anne and Jas   I am so so so sorry. I wanted this for you both so much. You have been so amazing through so much sh!t and you really deserved for this to go your way darlings. I am thinking of  you both and am here for you whenever you need.      Absolutely gutted


----------



## Suzie W

Hi All

Ally – I am soo sorry to hear about your sister. My heart goes out to you all. You all must be having such a tough time.   I would agree with the others – when she’s ready she should re test after being off the pill. The pill suppresses fertility so I just can’t see how it wouldn’t affect the test results. Hopefully it isn’t as bad as it seems. All three of you – I really wonder if there isn’t an autoimmune problem – particularly given how young you all are. Perhaps this could also be investigated but for now I suppose its about digesting all of this. Its good you got her to have the testing done - she's still young. It would've been worse to learn about it in her 30s and it be too late.

Anne – I am gutted for you, hunny. I’m so sorry.     . We are here for you when you are ready.

WW – I agree with Zuri I think you should have your wedding reception again. I’m so pleased for you that you have found a better doctor. I really think they should have more humility – they really don’t know everything. If they did we would all be pregnant.

Sonia – we have all been given the DE speech. I’m so sorry that you too have this dreaded disease. It really damages our ovaries.   I would say get a second opinion and try the Lister. DE might be something to consider but given your response and your age, personally I would say not yet. So pleased you made it to EC when I read your post yesterday I was annoyd for you that it wasn't a given that you would be going to EC with your follies. I'd be happy with your response given the fact that you have one ovary.  . I totally agree with the others, step away from the AMH test.

Sam – I’m so sorry that you feel so low. I find any contact with fertility specialists makes me feel down even if its ‘positive’. IF really does take over our lives and sometimes I forget the motivated, fun, energetic person I used to be. The counsellor might be just the person to help lift your spirits and hopefully we will too  . How wonderful of you to look for the stories of children conceived from donor eggs. I think you should consider the possible bias. It may be that the children who are not happy are the ones that are posting but the ones that are haven’t posted. There is also the other bias – lots of children (from their mother’s own eggs) are unhappy. The children of DE who aren’t happy are they unhappy because they were conceived from DE or are they just unhappy and DE is the thing they can latch onto? I work with children in care and adopted children and their families and one of the big things that distinguishes families in my experience is something very simple but profound. Does the parent look at the child and think/feel - 'I love you with all my being and you are mine.' If you really want to research this then have a look at the attachment literature. I have met biological families where there seems to be a misstep between a parent and the child that creates problems, and its like the dance of attachment is out of step - both will complain that neither understand each other (more profoundly than the usual adolescent moans of being misunderstood). I think what I am trying to say is that life is a lot more complex than being unhappy over being conceived through DE. I would have a hard time believing that that was the sole factor.

Lucy – good luck for the scan  

Hi Nix – Good luck! This is so nerve wrecking.   I'll be   that your embies make it through the thaw and be put back where they belong.  

WW – I must admit I was thinking the same as you were re DE. I was thinking that I wouldn’t tell anyone including the child because they would be my child. But I suppose I would have to reconsider if we go down the DE route. I don't think there is anything wrong with it and wouldn't want my child to think that either.

Good morning to everyone else I haven't directly mentioned. Yes! - its nearly the weekend   My DH has invited some of his work colleagues around for a barbeque tomorrow (hopefully it won't rain). SO there is so much tidying to do. Why can't I be one of those people whose house is always tidy? - oh well - I'm not one of those people yet so unlikely to ever become one  .

Popsi - how did the visit go?

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Wing Wing

*Sam* honey. I was going to post exactly the same as Mir until I saw her post. People complain all to readily but fail to congratulate or praise enough - you only have to think of work really don't you? If something goes well that you did then all credit to the boss, if it all goes tits up - naughty you! It is human nature to complain and actually most people are negative rather than positive - at least initially. I think you should think along the lines of your DH - he sounds fab! He is obviously really positive about the whole thing and believes that the 2 of you will make wonderful parents. How much better than that can you get?

*Anne* - am really sorry to hear your news babes. Devastating for you both. Lots of cuddles to you and Jase.

*Zuri* - good luck with the follow up hon.

WW X


----------



## Miranda7

Oh, ANNE - God, I am so sorry. That's so utterly devastating. I can't think of a thing to say it's so dreadful. If I could do anything to help you I would.

Perhaps, with bad luck running in threes, that's yours finally over? Maybe things are on the turn now and your next cycle will be the one that really gets results. That's what I always tell myself when things are going wrong one after the other.

Let us know what the cons says to you - I hope they're positive about you having another go.


----------



## Wing Wing

*Suzie* - just wanted to say that your post to Sam was spot on. Lovely lady you!


----------



## Malini

Oh Anne and Jas, I am so sad for you both - no, with you both.  I wanted this for you - we all did - and I know how hard it must be to move, think, breathe at the moment.  Sending you   and love, care...oh it is so painful, and I wish more than anything that I could make you feel better.  This isn't a special punishment for you or anything like that - YOU MUST HOLD ONTO THAT.  You are one of the most joyful, considerate, funny, kind people I have ever 'met' and I know all the people who have had 3D meets with you believe that too.  Life is very cruel and you do NOT deserve this.


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Another gorgeous post from you Malini - you really are wonderful with words     Anne Malini is right you know - we all adore you


----------



## bonchance5

Seems to work,  Firstly so, so sad for everyone who is in this hideous,  painful process, I have done 4 treatments in a year and managed to get to 4 2 week waits alas, BFN each time. The reason I am popping on is that have been reading about some of your concerns of the DE route,  I am myself adopted from the age of 6 weeks and wanted to say that I have no issues what so ever with this,  I too am looking at the DE route after failed attempts and really just want to say that I was told at a young age that I was, adopted, special, hanp picked etc and to be honest have never had any thoughts or wishes to meet my biological mother.  If I ever did all I would want to say is THANK YOU,  I have the most wonderful parents and really believe that it is the environment you are brought up in.  I obviously do not look the spit of my parents but never once has it been noticed or been an issue.  Maybe because of this I am not gonna try with my own eggs anymore as the chance to be a mum and give my child the love and happiness that I had far out weighs a mini me.

Also half of the genes will be my DH,  something my parents never had the opportunity of,  sorry to jump on with my experience I just thought that it would make some of you feel better that it is not always as complicated as it seems the DE and Adoption route.  You all will be amazing parents,  just because of the pain you are having to go through to get there.  For us it is the getting pregnant is the hard bit,  being a fab mum and dad will be easy and come naturally.  I have many traits of my mum and dad and for that am incredibly honoured. Sorry if I have waffled on, Be happy xx


----------



## Saffa77

Hi ladies

Oh Anne - I am so so so sorry I know nothing we say will make it all right right now but hope you ok  

Ladies I would like to say thank you all for your lovely advice and yes you are right DE is an option but not until I have milked my own ovaries dry!! I will seriously consider the Lister as have heard that they are good with poor responders.  Purps thanks for your story it made me feel a little better.

Another question I have is - how much does IVF cost roughtly? and is it a long waiting list?? at the lister and how would I find out which clinics work with the lister in my area and how would that work?  would it mean having scans etc here but have EC and ET there?  

Everyone else hi there!!

Soniax


----------



## Malini

Thank you good women for the kind things you say about my posts.  It cheers me no end, aren't I vain? 

WW - you get a new dress, that's the whole point  

Nix - oh, all those worries are so valid and I am hoping that they are all proved totally negative very, very soon.  The waiting must be agony.  Good luck with the bloodsuckers and I hope your FET happens sooner than later for your sanity and dh's.  You are allowed affordable treats from TS (it must be part of the ttc budget, I say), especially in beautiful shades of orange   And about making you feel less than tiny, well I came home and told my dh that I had met the most beautiful woman and I meant in character and in physical appearance.  Beauty, my funny friend, is in the eye of the beholder.

Sam - I agree with the others about bad news stories.  We relish them as a public.  Zoe Williams has just spent a whole page of the Guardian whining about the boringness of being pregnant and how the second time round it is even more dull and awful.   You will invest all your wisdom and smarts into making that child understand your reasons for what you did, if you do, and they will know that out of love they were conceived - I'd like that story better than to patch up a failing marriage, an accident one drunken night or because I felt I had to (although all those reasons are valid too, not judging!).  Hope you call that counsellor and can get project 'feel better Sam' off the ground.  

That's a lovely story bonnechance and you made me feel positive.

Good luck with your scan today LV, that's right isn't it? And keep fighting Sonia.

And all the best to all of you as we struggle under skies of concrete or is there actually sun somewhere in the world?  Gosh, I hope so.

M xxx


----------



## Miranda7

Thanks for that Bonchance!

That's a great boost for those considering DE - and really heartfelt, thank you.

xx


----------



## Wing Wing

Thanks *Bonchance* - really nicely put.


----------



## bonchance5

Thank you girls for acknowledging my post,  you all seem to be such a fabulous bunch of people,  I just wanted to share my experience as I started to feel a bit guilty that I was not having a big  issue about DE and adoption until obviously I realised that is because I am a product of my parents infertility and selfishly am honoured to be in their lives.  

Have a happy day,  may everything you wish for you all get,  We have to experience  the rain to reach the rainbows xx


----------



## popsi

malani.. that was so beautiful and heartfelt you are a special lady     

bonchance thanks for telling us your story ... i am in the process of being aproved for adoption and its made me so happy to read that today xxx thank you and good luck with what you decide in the future xx i love that poem you posted its what i am going to put on our announcement cards xx

well the visit went well and it was our final one and she is gonna recommend 100% that panel approve us on 20th May .. so nerves are jingling for that now, but its another hurdle and step towards being a mum and dad xxx


----------



## Pixie75

bonchance5 - That is such a nice poem, I am in    

xx


----------



## Malini

Bonchance, please stick around - that's exactly the kind of inspiration we need.  Your mum sounds like a treasure.  Wow, I am so moved.  

Popsi, that's great news - good luck to you both.  I think what you are doing is very brave and it inspires me to get over my fears about the intrusion.  

M xxx


----------



## Suzie W

hi,

WW - thanks   I meant to say that if I am in London on the 30th I would love to meet up. It all depends on my treatment.

Sonia - I think I would phone the Lister and ask them about satellite clinics. I don't know if their website has anything useful on it?

bonchance - thank you for that. It was really lovely to hear your story and it makes more feel more positive.

Popsi -       Well done! Let me know if I can be of any help (I work with foster and adoptive families).

You ladies write such amazing things that I am struggling to get to the housework and shopping.

love,

Suzie.


----------



## Hazelnut

Good morning ladies, I'm still amazed by how much you all chat- this thread moves so quickly.  I've been lurking from a distance and trying to keep up to date with everyone's news.  Just to say foremost...

Anne- I'm so so sorry to read your news, I really am. I was so hoping that this would work out for you.  Thinking of you both    xxx

Ally- good to see you back, sorry your holiday wasn't what you were hoping for.  And also sorry to hear about your sisters news, must be such a shock for her.

Zuri and Purps- hope you're both doing ok.  Zuri- I love 24 too, it's addictive, I think we watched the whole first series over about 3 days, we were just glued to it!

LJ- hope your DP was feeling abit better and you were able to have your wicked way with him!

Sam- I'm sorry that you're feeling so low  

Miranda- I like your new profile pic- v cute!


I've got my apppintment with my consultant tomorrow- just hoping he doesn't still want to start me on Clomid, as I know I ovulated last month and am pretty sure I ovulated this month too (keep quitely hoping that ttc naturally has worked- wishful thinking eh!), so don't really see the point in Clomid.  I almost made an appointment with Lister this week, but I just feel too nervous to do that, I haven't quite accepted that I will have to go down that route yet!

Lots of love to everyone

H x


----------



## shortie66

Anne hunny im gutted for you and jay    .  As per txt hun, im here if you need me    

Bonchance - lovely poem sweetheart, i too am looking at donor cycle next year, to me it is just like adopting a special ladies eggs   

Hi to everyone else. just quickly sneaked at work.  Am feeling a bit low as af's still here and im working this weekend 

Kate
xxxxxx


----------



## bonchance5

popsi,  so so excited that you are being approved for adoption, well done,  all you need is that poem,  after I got that I just carried on with my life,  never questionning why I was here.  Forever grateful for knowing I was special to mum and dad and hand picked.

I have a brother who is of the same thoughts.

Good Luck

xx

ps sorry Pixie didnt want to upset anyone xx


----------



## purple72

Morning Ladies

Wow such lovely lovely posts from you ladies both last night and this morning!

Bonchance looks like you fit in here perfectly hunny!

Sam sweetie, I'm sure the ladies are right, we all are very vocal in our moaning, hardly anyone (except all the wonderful PR ladies) puts positive stories up!

Anne & Jase as I said in my text guys, This is so unfair! sending you both the biggest of cyber hugs!

Nix good luck with the FET, sure your wonderful emies will defrost perfectly hunny!

Ally how are you this morning sweetie?

Can't remember who asked about treatment at the Lister, our last cycle came in around 5K that was including drugs bought at Central homecare (I'm on max dose) and £500+ for blastocysts too.

Pix,   hunny

Kate sweetie  

Ladies the 30th is a thursday! friday is the 1st

Hugs to everyone else thinking of you all

Sx


----------



## Hazelnut

Bonchance- really lovely poem, and lovely to hear you thoughts and experience about adoption x

Kate- Hi!  sorry to hear you're feeling low today, big hugs to you


----------



## popsi

malini.. thanks honey, please know that the process was not intrusive at all and to be honest we found it a lot less stressful than IVF as that was a nightmare !! xx 

bon.. thanks again honey and yes purps is right you stick around here honey xx

suzie.. thanks honey i will remember that and know where to come for much needed advice xx

love to you all, now i really must go as i am shampooing the carpet (well trying to but keep getting distracted by all you lovely ladies, oh well hubby on way home from work now lol so he can help and i can stay with you lol)

later ladies xxxxx


----------



## bonchance5

Thank you for all making me so welcome,  would love to hang around and go through the hurdle of no 5 with you all xx

ps no dreaming idea what I am doing with smileys and posting, pse bear with me xx


----------



## purple72

Popsi forgot to say CONGRATS hunny

You'll be reciting that poem to you bundles before you know it!

Sx


----------



## Little Me

Hi everyone,

I just wanted to say thanks to you all so much for your posts and texts.
I don't get how this happened again, wft is wrong with me.
Anyway, Dr Karachan was lovely but, sadly, he did say that the problem is my eggs- it was something to do with the neucleus and the sperm not reaching each other. He said that the best chance I have is DE. Something that will take a lot of thinking about between the two of us.
We could  do it in Jinemed northern Cyprus and still have Romina to look after us on all the negociating. Can't get my head round anything at the moment but if we want a baby, this is the only way.
We can't go through this again- and it's very likely that if we did use own eggs again it would happen again.

Just booked our flights for tomorrow afternoon that cost £500 Easyjet and we then have to get a coach from Gatwick to Heathrow to get our car but we just can't stay here a minute longer than I need to - too upsetting.

Lots of luck to Lucy for you scan and Popsi, really pleased about the adoption
Sorry it's  me post but I am so devastated
Thanks again from us both
Anne & Jas
xxxx


----------



## purple72

Anne hunny! 

Sending hugs to you both!!

Sx


----------



## Pixie75

Anne: I so wish there was something I could do to help for you right now honey. I absolutely feel your pain and i'm so SO gutted this has happened to you. Sending you the warmest    xx


----------



## May74

*Anne* I am so sorry, you must be devestated. It is a hard decision to make you need to give yourself plenty of time to come to terms with things first, sending you a massive ((((((((((((((hug)))))))))))))) wish I could give you a real one

Pam


----------



## TryMeditate

Oh Anne I'm so so so sorry for you , really it's so unfair.  There are of course no words I can say.                    This is just so so horrible.

Bonchance, your post made me      , now I've got 5 minutes to get out of the house and how am I going to do it looking like this  
I feel like I know your name from another thread... did we maybe ever chat on IVF world?

Kate - sorry about AF   

Popsi - congratulations!  That's great news that it didn't feel really instrusive.  Your so going to be accepted by the panel      Do they give you any idea of how long you may have to wait once your accepted?

Thanks girls, I'm really hoping you are right about the good stories not being posted anywhere.  When I get some time... whenever that is, maybe I'll write to the DCN and ask them if they have anymore good stories, can they please please please put them up.

Sam xx


----------



## Suzie W

Hi Anne,

I'm so sorry hunny  . I think you need to give yourself a moment to process all of this before you think about DE. I hope you and Jas will be able to spend time comforting each other. I hope the trip back doesn't take too long.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Pixie75

bonchance5 – You didn’t upset me hon don’t worry.   I’m just very emotional these days anyway and your mum’s poem really set me off. Beautiful words…

Sorry girls for lack of perso's as I am not up to date with everyone’s news but this doesn’t mean I am thinking of you less. Massive     for everyone who needs them especially Anne. 


xx


----------



## bonchance5

Sam,  I invested in waterproof mascara on 1st round of IVF..... 
p.s have never been on FF or anything similar. so am a newbie, hence no idea what I am doing xx
Pixie,  glad I did not upset you  

Anne,  you dont know me but my heart goes out to you,  when you feel stronger please read my earlier posts,  there is always a way,  you will have your time, big hugs  

Everyone else, hello and  thank u for the welcome xx


----------



## Suzie W

Hi Pix

Its great to see you back on the thread. How are you?


----------



## Little Me

Pix- Thanks for being so lovely  

Bonchance- thanks for your post. I have read your post and your poem and they were beautiful x


----------



## bonchance5

Thank you for replying Anne, Take care of yourselves  xx


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Anne - I am so so gutted for you. I am in tears, I can't believe how unfair all this crap has been to you particularly. I echo what everyone else has said - you are an amazing, lovely, funny person. I know this even though I've never met you. I know you and Jason will help each other through this as it sounds as if you have a very special relationship. There's nothing anyone can say that will make you feel better at the moment, but as you know, time will make it more bearable. It's too early to think about the future now, but i do believe that one day you will look back at this time and remember it with sadness, but you will have your little one in your arms. And how much you will appreciate him / her then.

love,
jo xxx


----------



## Rachel

Hi everyone

I have had to remove bonchance's poem due to copyright issues. However, I am sure that she would send it to you by PM if you asked her   

I also thought it was a lovely little poem but have to remove as I am sure you will understand.

Love to everyone 

Rachel x


----------



## Jo Macmillan

LV - really hoping for good news from your scan sweetie  

Bonchance - its really lovely to 'meet' you. You and your parents sound like very special people. Your poem made me cry too, but I think you posted it at a very poignant moment. Welcome to the thread honey. Looking forward to sharing the journey with you.  xxxx  

jo xx


----------



## bonchance5

Thanks Jo,   I am looking forward to doing the 5th one with a group of friends who are going through the same thing..... Wishing us all luck, love, happiness and as the great Take That say.......PATIENCE xx


----------



## Little Me

Thanks Jo, Jason has been amazing but he's devastated too.
I am feeling like a failure at the moment but like you say, time will heal.
We will concentrate  on him gettign a nice job when he gets back.
Hope you're ok


----------



## popsi

anne... YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE !!! please believe that honey you are an amazing and strong person and beautiful inside and out, we cant be held responsible for our crappy situations there is no reason why life deals us all this sh!t, it took me a long long time to realise this, and i so know what your going through as I went though ICSI twice and never had an embie to even try the pain of the 2WW xxx you will get through it the love you and Jason have is so obvious for all to see xxx your news was the first thing i told my DH when he walked in from work i was so sad for you xx

love to everyone else on this very emotional day xx

Sam.. no they cant give you an idea of the wait but hopefully it will not be too long, we have been told there are a few babies coming through the system at the moment so    one of them will be ours


----------



## Jo Macmillan

popsi said:


> anne... YOU ARE NOT A FAILURE !!! please believe that honey you are an amazing and strong person and beautiful inside and out, we cant be held responsible for our crappy situations there is no reason why life deals us all this sh!t, i


Exactly. Perfectly said Popsi. x


----------



## Jumanji

Anne - I am so utterly gutted for you; you and Jas truly do not deserve this.  I have no words.


----------



## Little Me

Thanks Popsi- You are lovely. 
I am so pleased for you and the adoption. I know you will make lovely parents.
Think we are gonna get on with trying to be Anne & Jason again and see if anything happens naturally. Then if we need to talk about the next stage we will.
Right now, I know it may sound harsh but I don't feel anything, almost numb but surely thats wrong.

Gonna go out in a mo to get some air and a pressie for my stepsons



LJ-  

At the end of the day, we have each other and that means the world to both me and Jas- I am lucky, and I'll never forget that
xxx


----------



## purple72

Bugger just lost a post

The essence of it was Anne hunny in no way are you a failure, I know a bit of what you're feeling and babe it's just part of the grieving process, along with feeling numb! It's not wrong to feel that way, but as I said to Ally yesterday, If only you could see yourself through our eyes, you'd know how phenomenal you are!

Big hugs to a very special couple!

Love S&G

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


----------



## Swinny

Anne -   As I said in the text babes, if there was anything that I could do to change this for you I would. I am so so gutted for you both. We had such high hopes when we met up. I can only imagine how devastated you are to have gone through so much to get there and then this happens. I am sending you a massive


----------



## almond

Oh Anne no, I wish I had some words which could make you feel better, no actually, I wish I could take it away and change the outcome  for you  Like Purps said, these feelings of failure and numbness are all part of it, that describes exactly how I felt after my BFN. But you are an amazing woman, you have not failed at all, you have been dealt a horrible card and it is not your fault. You deserve happiness and I know you can find it whatever you decide. But everyone is here for you in the meantime.
Thinking of you and Jason
xxx


----------



## Ali27

Quickly sneaking on at work but just wanted to Anne and Jas how sorry I am - I wish I could take away the pain and grief that you must both be feeling right now.        

Sending love to everyone x


----------



## Züri

*Anne*    just wanted to say once again how sorry I am for you and Jase, I echo what eveyone else has said but am unable to put it as eloquently as most - you are not a failure at all please don't think that - you are a caring kind wonderful woman who doesn't deserve what you are going through - i am rarely moved to tears but i have shed a few reading yours and everyones supportive posts on here - I just hope with all my heart that you one day get what you both really deserve

xxx


----------



## Wing Wing

*Anne*, entirely supposed to be a "ME" post when you have had such distressing news so don't beat yourself up about it - you have enough on your plate sweets. I guess you will have to take some time to be together and talk about the next step but for now just take some "me and him" time and try to be nice and gentle to yourselves. Not a time to make decisions or predict the future. You are so NOT a failure - everyone on this thread (and probably others that I don't post on) thinks the world of you and is with you every step of the way.
Take care both of you. 

*Popsi* - that is really excellent news. Am sooo pleased for you. What happens once they approve you? Do they already have a child in mind for you to adopt and love or does that follow approval. How long has it all taken? Great timing by Bonchance - her post was inspirational to us all but particularly poignant for you.

*Miranda* - love the new photo - what a cutie!

*Hazelnut* - good luck hon! 

*Bonchance* - as I missed the poem before it was removed, could you PM it to me - mucho appreciated. Glad you are sticking with us!

Hi *Kate*. Bummer that you have to work this weekend. Hope you feel better soon. AF is a pain when makes you feel down. 

*Suzie* - if you can meet up on 30 April in London, let me know - it would be great. Anyone else? Would be around lunch time. Purple, thanks for pointing out that it is a Thursday - I am sooo rubbish with numbers - famous for it at work!

SO, anyone who is free on THURSDAY 30 APRIL in London around lunchtime and afternoon and fancies meeting up, let me know!

WW X


----------



## shortie66

Anne sweetheart you are not a failure at all, none of us are we have just been dealt a hard hand to play but we will get there whichever way we have to     Wish i could take your pain away  

Popsi congrats hunny


----------



## SU_xx

Hi all

Sorry for the random intro in the middle of your thread! I was advised to post this here by Ali (as i put it on the POF thread), but I would be really grateful of your support/ advice/ info. Anyways, I have recently been diagnosed with POF, this came as a big shock to me and my DH as we didn’t expect anything like this. I had taken the contraceptive pill for about a year and a half, after I came off this it took me about six months to have a period, but when it came back it was regular, then my period stopped and I have now had no menstrual cycle for just over a year. 

I knew something was up but got really fobbed off by the docs who told me to ‘relax’ and my period would come back! After about a year though I managed to see a trainee GP at our practice who referred me to a consultant gynae. I will never forget the day he broke the news and the shear devastatation and shock that hit my DH and I, my FSH was measured at 128. We were both eager to have a second opinion and went privately, it was then that my consultant did my AMH which came out at a disappointing 0.7. We were keen to have a scan done which would show if I have any follicles that could be stimulated but I was told there would be no point! We were told the only route for us is DE’s and adoption as it is impossible for me to conceive using my own eggs and nobody with my FSH has ever done this!

I have started acupuncture and have been taking agnus castus, which I read about online. This has really helped with the hot flushes and night sweats. I have also started eating better and am trying to do more exercise!!!

It has now been 5 months since the diagnosis and my DH and I are really eager to seek more treatment and advice to help us to move forward. We are desperate to start a family and feel that we have got time and age on our sides (we are both 29). We have heard about the Lister and would be really eager to hear from anyone in a similar situation who has been treated by them or anyone else with a high FSH who has gone on to conceive naturally using their own eggs…any advice/ inspiration at all would be really helpful!

Thanks for reading.

Su


----------



## LV.

Hey girls,

First off - Anne - you are sooooo not a failure darling! Not in a million years...

Had my scan today as you know and this cycle has been abandoned  I had 1 follie at 28mm (!) and 2 others at 11mm (although she did give up with dildo cam when she found the big boy so I'm secretly hoping there were more, all be it small ones). I've only been stimming for 6 days - how do you get a follie at 28mm after 6 days?! It's grown from 14mm to 28mm in 2 days!  We talked it over and the choices were to go for EC with the 1 on Monday, or abandon.  I asked if my 28mm follie would even last until Monday, especially seeings as I ovulated early last time and Jeya said there was no guarantee and they would scan me before hand to check (I must say a repeat of the experience I had last time of being all gowned up and ready to go in the pre op room with the anaesthetist, being a scanned by the surgeon and then wheeled out again after they couldn't find anything isn't one I'd like to repeat in a hurry) I asked why I had such a biggie after only 6 days of stimms but she said I was actually on day 12 of my cycle so it was the right size which in itself is bizarre as if this is true then it means I didn't start stimming until day 6 which on any protocol seems wrong. A prediction of the cycle day I'm on seem very fluffy to me anyway - I had no bloods  done and I bled before I was supposed to when taking the OCP (which they said was fine) and I bled for 8 days (all be it v. light)  I did have a "surge" bleed day in that which they took as day 1 for this cycle and were working on.  I just feel like my poor body doesn't know whether it's coming or going - I stimmed for a whole cycle, then pill straight after, then D/R then stimms again and throughout some of it I'm not 100% sure what day was where and where I really stand and I'm just not convinced D/R worked properly for me so I was I really doing the right things on the right days? And the lack of any bloods until day 5 of stimms doesn't help fill in any gaps either. I feel I've been pretty wonky this time - I don't think stimming back to back was a good move.

I've been doing lots of thinking about the Jin and I really like the fact that you get monitored every day there and with how skewy both my last cycles have been this is really appealing. I was sat in there thinking that I could  go ahead with my 1 folllie and yes it may well be a golden egg in there, or I can hang on to my cash and try at the Jin in the sunshine in a few months time once my body has had some time to chill out and get back in to a rhythm and get monitored every day and treatment adjusted accordingly. Part of me is bricking it that we've made a mistake and we should have gone with the 1 follie with my recent AMH and all but there aren't any concrete answers and you can only go with what feels right I suppose.

Love to everyone else and thanks for all your support this week girls - don't know where I'd have been without you

x


----------



## Züri

LV so sorry your cycle has been cancelled - that folly is bloomin big! can it not be converted to IUI or BMS? seems a waste of a nice big juicy egg?


----------



## TryMeditate

Anne - your the opposite of a failure, the absolute opposite. But of course we all know how you feel..     I'm so so sorry my little Anne.

LV - Sorry your cycle has been cancelled. Zuri is right, do go for IUI or BMS if you can. And I think your analysis of your cycle sounds correct, this seems like a total mess without much of a plan. Your plan to take a break and go to the Jin does sound like a good one. xxxxx I'm sorry  

Hi again Su,

Again very very sorry about your diagnosis. I know just how life shattering this is.

There are a lot of us on this thread with amh of 0.1 who have been ttc, most of us are at the Lister. With our amh, there is no evidence that IVF has any greater chance than trying naturally, so it's unclear whether or not this is the way forward.

If you search my previous posts, I have posted a link before to a woman in the US with amh of 0.1 who had a baby in September through the SIRM in the US using their Estrogen Priming Protocol, I also recently posted a link to another women in the US with an FSH of 57 who on her 4th IVF cycle conceived twins. I does happen, but with POF unfortunately something like 5% of women conceive, unfortunately no-one knows why they do and others don't.

Here are some older links below.

So you can see it can happen, unfortunately it is incredibly rare, and it really is a miracle baby. A lot of women move onto Donor Eggs. I received my devastating amh of 0.1ugl (which is 0.7pmol) result in August last year, and fell pregnant in October but unfortunately I had a miscarriage at 6 weeks - this is common with low amh women and they believe it could be egg quality.

Some women do conceive with very low amh (0.7pmol \ 0.1ugL)\ very high FSH, but I'd be misleading you if I said it was common because it is extremely rare. I'd like you to know it does happen - so I'm giving you all the links below, but I don't want to give you a sense of false hope, as I don't think that's very helpful for someone with POF, it may even be cruel as we do need to look at our situation realistically so that we can deal with it, and one day, hopefully go back to living happy lives. The chances really are about 5%, so any doctor who tells you zero is wrong, but to look at it another way, 95% of women with POF do not go on to have children with their own eggs, so I don't want to give you false hope either.

Most of the ladies on here have low amh, some of us also like you have amh of 0.7pmol \ POF. It does seem that the lower your amh the less likely you will respond to stimulation.

Some people claim DHEA can help with egg quality \ numbers, but there are mixed reviews about DHEA and whether it does help or whether it damages egg quality.

There is a doctor in the US called Dr Check who has had some luck with POF ladies, but even he will be the first to say to you "this is very unlikely to work", and I believe he first tries to persuade people to use DE before embarking on treatment with him.

Only this week, some new research came out about stem cells and fertility - which is very exciting, but a long long way off. 
http://news.scotsman.com/nhshealth/Stem-cell-fertility-claim.5170701.jp

I hope we can be here to support you on your journey. Stay with us ok.

LOL 
Sam xxx
---------------------
Low AMH links

Lady FSH 124, no periods for 1 year, diagnosed POF, fell pregnant and had a baby.
http://community.babycenter.com/talk/a2761715/hi_new_to_this_group_introduction_-_long_story

The one follicle baby with Jaya
http://www.ivfworld.com/topic.php?id=81323

Ally sent me this, A lady who had 0.1 or 0.2 AMH and got pregnant at 40 at the Lister.
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=116054.msg1648954#msg1648954

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=155373.0;topicseen, amh not known. High fsh 42year old woman conceived naturally using a book using TCM methods

Lady whose AMH went up on DHEA from 0.6 to 0.9 as did her antral count - dramatically!
http://boards.babycenter.com/bcus1143741/messages/3590/5914

Jennig & baby Caitlin, AMH 0.5, surprise natural BFP while waiting for treatment.
http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=172819.45

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=165339.0
katherine1907
Had baby girl

/links


----------



## shortie66

LV - so sorry sweetheart    

Sam - hello petal, hope you are feeling better today    

Welcome Su - please stay on here the ladies are so lovely    

Well ladies im feeling quite poo myself today, af's still here and quite heavy tho im on day 5    Also got a dose of the poo's (not very nice) and have also discovered a little pea sized lump on the inside of my mouth with moves about     Phoned the docs as im a proper hypocondriac and he seems to think its a retention cyst    so whilst hes put my mind at rest im still not 100% convinced.  But thats me im a proper worrier and think everything may be cancer.  Still gonna go the docs and get it checked over next week tho      Now i've written it down i sound like a complete twit   

Hi wing wing, zuri and everyone else.

Kate
xxxxxxx


----------



## TryMeditate

I'm so sorry Lucy.  xxxxx

Kate - I've had those little lumps in my mouth,  wait I even have one today.  I've always had them I think.


----------



## Malini

Oh, LV - what a rotten day this is proving to be.  I am so sorry.  It does sound like they made a right hash of it.  I really feel for you and wish I could take away the disappointment.  I 100% support your decision to walk as I was a wreck when suited and booted I had to have that pre-scan, and I was able to continue - so very fortunately - but it gave me a horrific insight into how scary and sad to end there would be.  

Su - welcome - I can't top Sam.  I hope we can be of assistance and if nothing else, we should be able to make you laugh - not today though.  Today isn't one of our good ones for laughs but a brilliant example of the love that's around.

Zuri - I think you are eloquent, so you must stop being so mean about your messages.  I scan for them, relish your PMs and laugh at all the humour you inject into this thread.  Thank g-d for you I say.

Anne - You great woman.  If a failure is someone who has her world crushed and then goes out to buy presents for the stepsons she dotes on, then there is no hope for me in the success stakes.  

WW - I am about on that day til about 4pm, let me know if you'd like to meet up, keen to meet you all.

Kate - Feel better soon.  AF has been cruel to me this week too, and I have fallen out with her properly this time.  Silent treatment.    I get little ulcers in my mouth whenever I am run down and a little bonjela (sp?) does the trick.  

Popsi - That's so great that you didn't find it an intrusion and I think I can imagine it being less stressful than IVF, aren't most things?  I do tend to awfulise the whole process and need to get my head round it in a more positive way.  I appreciate your encouragement and hope you'll have even less time for posting very soon.

Gotta dash now.  Lots of care for you all.

M xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Anne - Sweetheart - my heart goes out to you it really does  I so so wanted something else for you and J. I am unfortunately quite lost for words as I cannot comprehend why such gorgeous, caring, loving, nurturing women have to go through so much heartache. The sooner you are home the better and you can snuggle in and lick your wounds in the comfort of your own home. We are all here for you when you need us.    

Pix - thanks for your message honey - you are so right - my message was a total knee jerk reaction. I am over it now 

Pops - I am so excited about your next step I can hardly contain myself - can you get one of those babies for me too please!!!   

Lucy hon - I am so so sorry - what a load of bloody sh!t really, how completely disappointing and frustrating to have gone through this again. It does sound like your body got into a muddle there and that this may not be a predictor of future tx. You have been so amazing through this you deserve more 

Kate honey - I am certain its not cancer but don't worry we all think these things, I have done this alot recently! You will be fine. Sorry you feel crap babes, there is something in the air, but planning on clearing it up for everyone!! 

Sam - I am really really sorry that you have felt so awful but am so glad that you have organised a counsillor. Maybe this is the time you turn things round. I personally always say that I need to hit the floor before I can start climbing back up again and although I know it is exhausting picking yourself up time and time again I know that you can do it!! 

Tracey - thanks for text love!! Good to be back 

Bonchance - THANK YOU so much. You will never know how much you have lifted my spirits today, I and obviously so many of us needed to hear that so thank you for sharing your very personal story with us, sorry I missed the poem as it had been edited out, could you pm me please . Yes please stick around!! 

SU - Hello! You are amongst friends  . If you read my signature you will see that I have a similar diagnosis to you. I am so so so sorry that you are having to go through this but this is the best place for support on the planet so thankfully you have found us!! Now I don't want you to be saddened by my story but I have tried IVF 3 x at the Lister and whilst I cannot fault the Lister as I was so appreciative that they treated me, unfortunately it didnt work for me. Having said this when I was diagnosed in Jan 2008 (by UCH  - do not go there they are not sensitive to POF girlies) I was told that I would never have another period (after I had missed them for 3 months) but miraculously my periods returned in April 2008 after 6 months although they have not been exactly regular they have hung around which gives me hope (have a look at my first posts to give you an idea of my history). I am utterley convinced that this is due to chinese herbs, diet, exercise, no smoking and reduced drinking. I am currently working on being as healthy as I possibly can, working on my relationship (which took a serious bashing in the early days of my diagnosis) and hoping for a miracle, with a view to moving onto DE or adoption when the time feels right (and I manage to convince my DH ). I am personally not convinced that IVF is necessarily the answer for those with low ovarian reserve as I never responded to the drugs to produce a viable follicle but wierdly out the blue last month after a very long cycle of 50 + days I produced a follicle all on my own (which I caught with cycle monitoring)!! So although unfortunately this did not result in a pregnancy this has given me enough hope to continue with the TTC naturally + Chinese herbs. I am also planning to visit the NIH (National Institute of Health) in Washington DC to take part in a study on POF, which although they stress will not restore my fertility I am secretly hoping for some tips re HRT that gives you the best chance of pregnancy and stories about women they have seen who have conceived against the odds, so watch this space, I will be back 21st May (hopefully with lots of inspiration!!) If you need a bit of a lift I started a thread over on the POF board (which was unfortunately brutally edited by mods ) but there are still lots of stories with women with very high fsh that have got pregnant through various routes, most of which are woman who have spontaneously ovulated randomly or who have been on HRT, have a read, heres the link http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=174687.0

Okay so poor Becka had some bad news today, she had her second scan and nothing much has happened. Looks like this really was not her month, on 450 menopur and just no action. They are keeping her on until Tues but she has been told to prepare herself for a cancellation. I am so so so gutted for her but of course she still made me laugh during our conversation. Hannah and I are off to stay with her tomorrow so hopefully there will be strength in numbers!! The nurse told her "your ovaries have stopped working, you no longer produce eggs". I was utterley incensed, anyone thats anyone in this damned IF business knows that there are NO certainties when it comes to ovaries and what they choose to do and not to do!! Grrrrrr. Poor Becka, they just don't understand how damaging there flippant comments can be.

I have convinced Hannah to have her AMH re tested after a pill free month and she has written to Yau Thum to that effect. So now we are just     for her.

Much love to all my girlies xxxx


----------



## Little Me

Lucy- God what a pile of sh!t of a day. I am so so sorry for you. Eventhogh we have had another failed cycle- I have to say, the Jinny were fab. If you go for the whole time (and I do recommend doing it that way having done it the other way having scans here) they will monitor you big time - I even had 2 scans on Monday!
Anything you need to know, just pm me hun.
Once again, I am so sorry.
of course, the only bad thing now for us is having to wait till tomorrow to get home , so that's the only downside of having TX abroad.   

Ally- What a   of a nurse    . Please give my love to Bec.  

Couldn't find anything nice for Luke & Ryan so we'll take em to Toys R us next weekend when we have em .

Did manage to have some food though but now \I feel like I wanna be sick.

xxxx


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## Züri

OH LV I'm sorry I should have read your signature xx  

Malini you are lovely big   for you  xx

Anne top of hugs for you   

Ally I really feel for you, not only going through this yourself but seeing your lovely sisters dealing with it also, a triple blow and I really admire you for the support you are giving them - its such a heartbreaking situation for you all xx  

Had my follow up today and feeling a lot better about my clinic, we're going to go for a fresh cycle again in September and in the meantime he has advised losing a few kilos (ahem 10!!)  so diet and excercise firmly on the cars to get a bit of weight off, it's so refreshing over here though because they don;t put losing weight as a condition of treatment, he said to me today that there is no evidence that IVF wont work for over weight women but he said he actively losing weight slowly will help chances but he hasn;t said I have to be a certain BMI - in the UK i would re refused treatment point blank due to my BMI

So having a good 3/4 months off - will start the pill beginning of August

So tonight going out for the first time since my BFN!! can you believe its been over a week and still not been out for a bevvy   

xx


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## TryMeditate

Anne - you are a truly amazing woman... you inspire me so much.        I feel so weak compared to you, I'd be crying my eyes out and focusing on TV to not think, your  not only thinking of but shopping for your step sons. 

Ally - I terribly sorry for Becka.       Maybe the love an energy of the 3 of you will find a way through this, and one day you'll all hold your little ones in your arms.   I knew you'd be along sometime with some inspiration for Su.  You really give me the insirpiration to keep fighting when I feel like giving up   .   

I am still up to somethings.  I've had my call with SIRM and CCRM in the US, next is Cornell (that's booked for either next week or the one after), one other guy who is an RE who had teamed up with a chinese doctor, then hopefully I'll be able to put together a summary of what the best clinic for us PRs is in the US..... with a view of course to getting their protocols and finding out what they are up to!  I'm not crazy, but it does seem to me that the majority of the miracle POF births are coming from the US....maybe it's just because there are more of them there Americans.  What is certain is unlike here, where we have only one clinic willing to treat us, in the US there are lots, and lots more women try IVF before they move on, so they have a lot more experience.  

I've also been talking to a Gynea who specialises in metabolic imbalance, specifically she thinks their is a link between insulin resistance and infertility.  I'm going down to Surrey on Wednesday night next week to meet her.  Even she says that she maybe wrong, but it is interesting and worth trying.  She suspects that I have insulin resistance problems (which is why I called her in the first place as I suspect this too), and thinks that there is a chance if I get my insulin levels sorted, my fsh will come down. She is not a huge fan of amh, but thinks that it may go up after a few months of balancing my insulin.  We will see.  She talked about how insulin can restrict blood flow to the ovaries, and egg quality, and implantation.  Apparently it can make your lining poor quality also - so even though on an ultrasound your lining "looks" good, it actually may not be.  Anyway, there maybe nothing in this at all, but I'll let you know if I find out anything else.  I'd we willing to fly to the moon if I thought it would help me fall pregnant.   A few things she said I thought were way off, like she didn't know that estrogen suppresses FSH, and I think her views on reported amh potentially being able to be influenced by your diet were a bit far fetched.  Again, maybe I'm just spending money on something else unlikely to work... 


Have a great weekend girls - I really intend to try   

LOL 
Sam xx


----------



## AoC

Excuse me butting in, but it seems I'm a poor responder.  Someone mentioned there's a list of questions to ask your clinic in cases of poor response?  I've another scan on Monday, and I'd like to go prepared if they suggest cancelling the treatment again.

Also, does anyone know if down-regging for longer might over-suppress the ovaries and cause poor response?  I've had to down reg for three weeks (lp, obviously) both times.

Again, sorry to just jump in, but this seemed like the right place to ask!

  Thank you.


----------



## Overthemoon

Sam, I'm really interested in your insulin resistance investigations. Do you have diabetes or hyperglycaemia? Or is there another reason why you suspect insulin resistance? I have insulin resistance, they diagnosed me with MODY (mature onset diabetes of the young) and thought I had glucokinase deficiency. My family took part in a study at the endocrinology dept in Oxford but they now think it's another metabolic gene that causes our family diabetes. I'm curious about it restricting blood flow to the ovaries. 

Lightweight xx


----------



## TryMeditate

Hhhmmm, LW you sound like you fit her theory of insulin resistance causing problems... she also has a theory its possible it can make you use your eggs too quickly, hence low ovarian reserve \ POF.  I'll let you know how I get on with her next week. Let me know if you'd like to see her yourself. 

anna, the best way to find out if your are a real PR, or simply someone who had been put on the wrong protocol, is to ask for an AMH test, and a Day 3 FSH test.  They also must look at your estrogen, as high estrogen can suppress FSH and your real FSH maybe higher.

Sam


----------



## Little Me

I'm struggling a bit girls to get my head round donor eggs.
I am researching like crazy when I should probably be resting but when I rest I think about my lost egg   

Nix- Meant to wish you luck for FET  

Ally- I feel so sad for you H & B  

I want to come home and see my cats  

I really do trust my Jinny doctor and now feel donor is our only route- any advice would be really appreciated?

xxxx


----------



## Overthemoon

Thanks Sam, I'm interested to hear how you get on. It's hard to comprehend though as my Nan, aunty and Mum (the diabetic side of  the family) had no problems conceiving, all my sisters (who are not diabetic and have shown no symptoms) have had no problems with fertility, they have fallen pg within 3 months of trying each time. One cousin on the diabetic side of my family had no problem (2 children both conceived without planning) and she's insulin dependent. But her sister has had major IF problems and I have just started talking to her about my issues. We hadn't spoken for years but the death of my DH bought us together 2 years ago. On my Dad's side, of the 16 cousins, I seem to be the only one with IF.   for me but   for my cousins and sisters. Looking at the whole picture, I do find it hard to see that our insulin problems relate to IF but I am certainly keen to know more.

Anne, I am aching at your disappointment from today. You are such a brave little soldier, still moving forward despite your tragic news today. You never cease to amaze me with your inner strength. How about talking to Jinemed about doing another cycle in parallel with a donor on the side, maybe at their sister clinic in Cyprus?

LW xx


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## Ocelot Cub

Anne - I should probably say please don't think about this now as it will drive you crazy but I know first hand that that is impossible as I have gone through similar myself. Getting ones head around the DE issue is not something that happens over night, it requires research, talking to others who have gone down this route (and I can personally recommend Steph who wrote me some beautiful emails on the subject when I was struggling to get my head around it -   for Steph x), time and plenty of counselling so do not worry that you cannot get your head around it today, that really is not suprising.   I think it is good that you trust your Dr and I think that sometimes that is half the battle, I eventually learnt to trust the Lister when they agreed that I would be unlikely to be successful on other protocols and I think finally feel comfortable with my decision to stop the IVF (although going back to the Lister with H this week really tugged at my heartstrings   and I wanted to go back and try more, I won't for I fear becoming addicted to something that ultimately would destroy me  ). I don't think that you suddenly think yeah donor eggs are for me and then stop having doubts, I am sure they creep in and out of your mind all the way through the process and it is hard sometimes to hear the negative things that people are feeling on the subject as this can be very confusing. I find that I wake up some mornings in a very pro DE mood and then read something and by the end of the day I have completely changed my mind! On other days I wake up in an anti DE mood and somebody posts something wonderful like Steph or Lainey or Bonchance earlier today and it warms my heart and I think "I can bloody do this, yes I bloody can, and my baby is going to be the happiest DE in the world" knowing you as I do I think I can say that I was wrong and in fact YOUR DE baby (should you go that route) will be the happiest DE baby in the world!! So of course I am completely rambling as per usual but what I want to say is research if you need to as I know for me it is a good therapy, but definately don't do it into the early hours as it messes with your dreams and also be kind to yourself and allow yourself to feel negative feelings aswell as positive ones on the subject as this is an essential part of the process of acceptance.

Darling sending you loads of kitten cuddles       

Love you little'n xxxx


----------



## Little Me

Hi LW- When we got the news today I pretty much just wanted to run out of the clinic- after we left, we then went back in after I had got myself together and asked to speak to Romina about Dr Karacans suggestion of DE. 
She told me a few things about DE in Northern Cyprus, ie cost, selecting the donor (bless her, she said she would look for someone pretty!) waiting list (about a week for a match!!!!!) and the basic protocol- lucrin, I think along with progesterone.
I would have to wait 2 full periods before going again but would prob leave it till about September as work commitments and Paul being on holiday etc etc.
Being half Greek Cypriot I guess if I was to go to DE then Northern Cyprus would be the best place for a match but it's so much to get your head around.
My thing was I have  stepsons that are obviously Jasons, and I so desperately wanted my own biological baby (and thats not meant to sound horrible) BUT, it ain't gonna happen with my eggs- thats the long and short of it SO, lots to think about but for now- I think I need a break from it all.
So, why am I sitting here researching donor stuff eh?  
xxxxx


----------



## Little Me

Ally- You may remember the Pm discussion we had a few months back  about DE's 
You post makes perfect sense to me, and thanks for taking the time to do it   

Pix- You ok hun?  

I am gonna disappear for a bit girls and watch some Entourage on DVD
We have 600 channels here but only one that I can understand so thank god for dvds. 

Back through the evening
love to all
xxxx


----------



## shortie66

Anne sweetheart i have pm'd you


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## annacameron

Dear Anne, Im so sorry. You of all people deserved better from this. You are so bright and funny and warm, it all shines out even through this dire internet medium. You have also had a lot to cope with recently and you've done it brilliantly. I take my hat off to you. xxx

Re the DE issue, I agree it's a big decision and one for you and J to work through together. Is it worth considering this in that thought process? - your baby would be totally totally totally yours environmentally. Futhermore, there are many studies that show long term couples grow to look like each other as they have similar experiences in life. Your baby actually would too, as his/her expressions would mirror your reactions. So, assuming they started with someone of your colouring, the baby would resemble you. You would be the best mother in the world and some little one deserves the chance to be your child surely? 

sending you much lvoe, 

Anna xx


----------



## LV.

Anne - Ally's hit the nail on the head there, you just need some time to contemplate and work out how you feel.

Ally - You're just brill. Thanks for your lovely words earlier (and for everyone else!). I'm so sorry to hear that your beloved sisters are also suffering related troubles, it's wonderful they have you to help, support and advise them.    You're such a rock.

Question for all you ladies taking Chinese herbs - I've decided to give this a whirl too. There's a place I have seen in Greenwich that does them - do you think I can just rock up tomorrow or do I need an appointment? And are there any questions I should ask? Will I need to give them and info?

Also - DHEA - where are we all on this? I stopped taking it because I got hideous spots (amongst other side effects) but I'm thinking if my AMH has dropped it might be beneficial for me now. I know that Laura and Miranda took it and then went on to the Jin for their successes so I'm wondering if I should copy cat?!

Hi to everyone else, sorry for [email protected] personals - feeling a bit squished. Normal service will be resumes soon.

I have a very large glass of WINE! Anne - are you having a tipple ce soir too?

Lucy xx


----------



## Little Me

Lucy- Enjoy your wine. I had a shandy earlier when I had some pasta out but, I've just thrown my guts up so I must be a lightweight these days 
Take care hun

Anna- What a lovely message, thanks so much for that, it means a lot  

Kate-Thanks hun for your PM, you are a very special lady  

Not started on the dvd yet - forgot we had to pack  

xxx


----------



## shortie66

Ally - i feel exactly the same sometimes hunny, but deep within me i know we have made the right decision for us.  Like you hun if we had enough money i would keep trying and trying with my own eggs, but it would destroy me, i am not strong enough to cope with the failure.   

Anne - massive hugs for you and jason and your furbaby's too      

Anna - great words on the DE issue, thank you   

Lucy - i will certainly be joining you on the pop tonight hun im gonna get smashed.

Ladies i have written a little poem called "The Gift Of You" about a baby born from a donor egg, i wont post it on here as i dont want to offend or upset anybody   but if anyone wants to read it i'll pm it to them.  Hopefully if our cycle works next year i'll keep a copy of it in our baby's box.

Kate
xxxxxxxxx


----------



## TryMeditate

Anne - i think Ally completely summed it up, this is not a decision you come to overnight, and you certainly won't get there tonight ok xx.  I know Ally and I have had many discussions about DE, and sometimes I'm elated by it, completely gung ho and know that I am comfortable with it..... and then I have my DE twins fantasies (i'd loooovvvee twins), and the thought of it makes me really happy and the pain of IF is gone. 

Then I swing the other way, I think it's not right for us, and then I get really depressed.  I'm exploring DE, I've been doing it for 7 months now, and I think I'm comfortable with most things, except this uncertainty about how the child will feel.  Again, sorry to have posted this on here, I really hope I haven't offended anyone, but I really feel like I need to talk about this, as I'm hoping others can point me in the direction of positive stories.  I've actually emailed the donor conception network today and asked them for their view on why I can only find 2 positive stories, and do they have any more for me!  I'm hoping their response is what my DH thinks, that the positive people just don't talk about it, they are too busy living their lives.      


Sam xxx


----------



## TryMeditate

Oh, and thanks for that LW.  That's a question I intend to ask next week, as diiabetics have children so can it really be that much of a problem?

Sxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Hey Lucy - Chinese herbs - the only advice I would give is go somewhere that you are recommended to go, the market is flooded with lots of charlatans and you really need to know that you are being seen my a reputable practitioner. I LOVE mine and will PM you details if helpful (but he is a he and in primrose hill) but this is such a personal choice you may not want what I want if you see what I mean (sorry not making sense I am too feeling squished!) Re DHEA I have stopped and feel a whole lot better off it, I actually produced follicles of varying degrees when off it but didnt when on it so that is decision made for me anyway. Everyone responds differently and I have been so confused about taking it or not taking it and have stopped and started many times!! Not sure how helpful any of that is!! Enjoy your wine!

Kate - honey - thank god we all have each other to go through all this with, imagine navigating this storm alone? I would love to read your poem if thats okay. Is your next cycle going to be with own eggs or DE honey?    

Anne enjoy the DVD's best you can and have as much choccie etc as you like. I know that Becka and I will doing a whole lot of comfort eating tomorrow night!! Anna is so right about you xxxx

Sam - I guess then that this tossing and turning through the positive and negative thoughts is part of the early stages of coming to terms with this, and that in some ways we should be happy as maybe in some ways we are already progressing.... towards DE or adoption or moving on. Progression means that we are one stage closer to our goal (thank f*ck as I am not sure how much for yearning I can take!!)

A xxxx

Thanks for everyones lovely words about my lovely sisters - means alot and I will pass them on to the others too


----------



## annacameron

totally agree with Ally's post. 

(nice feminine skirt, I need more floaty stuff. WHEN IS SUMMER DAMN WELL COMING?)


----------



## shortie66

Ally - next cycle donor eggs hun   

Hi anna


----------



## Wing Wing

Malini said:


> Anne - You great woman. If a failure is someone who has her world crushed and then goes out to buy presents for the stepsons she dotes on, then there is no hope for me in the success stakes.


Well done *Malini *- another tip top truth! Would deffo like to meet you! Where in London would you be - I understand it is a big place!!!
*
Anne* - you will be a marvellous mummy whether your baby is from your own genes or not. THAT is the important thing to hang on to.

Welcome *Su* - I think Ally has said it all. Stick with us - Malini is correct in saying today was not a good day to join - too much bad news.

*LV *- sorry to hear your news loverlee. Not an easy decision to make but sounds as if you know what you are doing. Always good to take time out if you can I think.

Hi* Kate* - sounds like you are having a nightmare of a day. Sorry but your use of the word "twit" made me smile - so polite for this thread! And you are not a twit as you would only be a twit if you didn't check it out -see I can't stop using the word "twit" now - am loving it!!!

Gonna join you and *LV *in a glass or two. Feel like I need a lift after the bad day. Would love to read your poem please!

*Ally* - I am surprised that nurse still has her head - what a flippin' cheek - the insensitive PIG. She should come and work for Doctor Pig in Lux. Poor Becca BUT lucky Becca and lucky Hannah for having you as a sister. Wish you were mine!!! Thanks for sharing your thoughts re DE - I think it really helps to talk about it.

*Zuri* - enjoy your night out girl - you deserve it. Good idea to have a break before next cycle. Maybe we can meet up after all?

Anyone heard from *Lainey* recently?

Good weekend wishes to everyone.

WW X


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Kate - thank you for the gorgeous poem hon - absolutely lovely and such a therapy to write I am sure. I am so excited for your next cycle     

WW - I know what a beatch!! Ah I can be your cyber sister if you like!! I also have Pix who started as a cyber sister but became a real 3D sister over time, its nurture not nature round these parts!! Oh and Lainey I spoke to her yesterday, she is doing well, feeling like sh!t and rather sick which she is finding reassuring, got everything crossed for her      I think she will be back when she is feeling a bit less rough  

Having fishcakes for me dinner - yum - contemplating wine but think I will save myself for tomorrow with sisters xxxx


----------



## shortie66

Ally - i had a lovely chicken tikka masala for tea, half a large bottle of watermelon breezer and im gonna have a jd and coke in a bit    Im having a blow out this weekend as next week i start the chemical diet with my mate kay and start an exercise regime with my other mate elaine, as one wont diet and the other wont exercise     So far today i've had 2 toast for brekkie a smal cone of chips and a scallop for din dins oh and then 5 bars of choclate throughout the day     Im definately going out with a bang this weekend     Glad you liked the poem, yes it was theraputic for me especially the last couple of lines as  think i always worry too much about whether the child will look like me, it turns it round.  And to be honest i looked nothing like my mom she had brown hair brown eyes, im blonde hair blue eyes.  Work that one out if you can  

Wing wing    i know hun, i've been very good of late not using naughty words as dakota kept telling me off    I do happen to slip up sometimes tho especially if i've had a drink or two. 

Bonchance - u are welcome to use it hunny i hope we all get the chance to


----------



## mag108

Hi Ladies
I am really zonked today, the candida symptoms of foggy head and sick tummy (I had three rolos the other day...broke from my strict no sugar diet)....thought I had beat it but no...

There have been so many interesting and lovely posts, longs posts, and ones I want to respond to but it will have to wait for now as my thoughts arent stringing together very well tonight....

So its going to be a very short post as my eyes are knackered. I just wanted to say to *Anne* how sorry I am that it hasnt worked out. Its really sad, you've put so much into it and things havent worked out. Really sad for you guys and hope tomorrow comes soon so you can get home and cuddle your cats, chill with some wine and some home cooked food. xxxbig hugs

*Lucy* - really sorry the tx has been cancelled.

Welcome Bonchance- enjoyed your posts, missed your poem!

xxxto all you lovely ladies, we are such a resource and support for each other

MAG


----------



## almond

Hi ladies, late home from work and just been reading and catching up. The past few pages have been powerful reading. You women are amazing

Anne - I don't really have any words, I feel like I am typing and saying nothing. I love that saying, how dark it is before the dawn. I cling to that sometimes. It can't stay dark forever and it doesn't, that has been my experience so far anyway. I do believe that you can make someone the most amazing mum, however that comes about. You are clearly a fantastic auntie and like Malini I was really touched that you were off to look for presents when you had had the most devastating news. Hope you are feeling physically better after being sick. You will soon be home curled up with your cats 

Lucy / LV - I am so sorry for what happened to you today and I so wish it had been different for you   I understand what you mean about feeling your body has been totally bamboozled (not that you put it quite like that!). I felt like my body didnt know if it was coming or going with the pill then stims and suppressants etc etc and you have had a lot more than me by the sounds of it. Can totally understand why you would be attracted by the Jin but can also see why you would want to take time out, I have felt like I had to. Anyway dont want to ramble on, just really wanted you to know how sorry I was and that I am thinking of you  

Ally - so sorry about your other sister, can't believe what your family has gone through this week . I love your posts and your strength shines through, is lovely to have you back! 

Zuri - glad you have a plan, and hope you enjoy tonight without worrying about the diet   

AnnaofC - welcome. I have to get off the net now so can't post a list of questions now but there are lots of things to ask and we can help you with that before your appt. But in answer to your question, I have been told that downregging can oversuppress your ovaries if you are a poor responder - in layman's terms, they find it hard to "wake up" again. Having said that, I have read some interesting posts on this thread about how sometimes the long protocol can be the right thing for poor responders, so it is certainly not cut and dried (how I wish it was!) You will learn a lot if you stick around here and this is a fantastic group of women

WW - I can't do 30th can do the Friday as not working but think that too late for you? What a shame, would love to meet some more ladies from this list

Anyone fancy doing another London meet one weekend? I am happy to organise. Maybe we could do something in May?

So much other stuff I have read that has really touched me tonight, and thinking about you all 
xxx


----------



## Miranda7

Oh, what a sad day for team PR. Horrid, horrid, horrid.

To Anne, I would do what Steph did I think, in your position, and keep bashing with my own eggs while all the time being booked up for DE. Perhaps you could do one more cycle with your own before DE? I do think until you've done three you don't know for sure, and besides, those antrals were so promising - it might just need a tweak in protocol to get more.

Lucy - the urologist was WONDERFUL at the Jinny, and Pete's PESA only cost £500. The cycle saved us a huge amount because of that, as it would you.
I'm so sorry you were cancelled today - it's just so upsetting. Again, a change of protocol may help I'm sure - and the sunshine, and the extra monitoring is fab, as you get to know just where you are every step.
I personally think I wouldn't have gone for donor as like you and Anne I have two stepchildren, and so... well I did feel it's not the same as if he didn't have children already. Can't explain it.

Kate - I missed that you were all set for DE? Wow!


----------



## emak

ANNE       just seen your news hun ,im gutted for you.


----------



## Suzie W

Hi Ladies,

It has been quite a day.

Anne - I hope you get home soon so that you can curl up in comfort.  

Kate - I would love to read your poem. I can't believe that anyone would be offended. I wouldn't know why? Personally I find it really good for me to hear others talking about DE, issues, concerns, etc. I know that DE may well be a reality for us. After our first failed cycle my DH was talking about it and to be honest I just wanted to slap him. I had some mean thoughts that it was easy for him to say becuase it would be his biochild.... I do intend to give my eggs the best go possible but the reality is my ovaries are very damaged. So reading what others think is helpful.

Lucy - I am so sorry about the cancelled cycle. You have been through a lot with these back to back cycles. 

Mag - its good to hear from you. Sorry you are still feeling horrid. I really hope it clears up soon.  

Ally - so sorry for your sister. Some people   - how could the nurse have said that?  

  to all.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## odette

Hi Anna

Sorry to hear your news .

I'm about to give birth anyday now to a DE baby after 1 IUI and 3 IVF's.  You probably need to lick your wounds first before contemplating DE but I like Steph hopefully am here to answer your questions if you so need to talk to women who have made that choice.  

It really is a delicate topic for some at first but I always make a joke and say the Jesus was a donor child - so if its good enough for him, its good enough for me . 

The more information you have (ie donor conception network, counselling, the more you see the opportunity of having a family)

Big hugs and kisses  

ps - Kate - could you pm me the poem you were talking about.  Thanks

Odettex


----------



## Pixie75

Hello lovely ladies,

I am so sorry for not being around much and not giving enough support and hugs to everyone who has had bad news today.

Lucy & Anne special    for you my lovelies.

I don't know what's wrong with me at the moment - I just can't seem to stop crying. Anne's news really hit me today and reading the posts and seeing so many wonderful ladies struggling to get what other people take for granted really breaks my heart in many many places. And all I can do is CRY!!! I'm even crying while I'm typing this and trying to keep quiet so DH doesn't see me and get upset too. 

I am just so tired in my brain, in my body, in my heart...

rant over!

Emailed Romina and we decided to give microflare protocol a shot this month. I will start taking Estrofem tablets on day 14 which is this Sunday and stop using them on day 28 and then I should get AF in 3-4 days. I then will do Lupron & Merional from day 2 and if my timings are right I'll be in Istanbul on day 4 or 5. Let's see what happens  

I have a week off work next week as my sister is coming from Turkey with my nephew tomorrow - I really hope I will be able to entertain them as they are so looking forward to seeing me and doing things together. If I don't get chance to post much next week don't think I think about you less my lovelies.  

On a positive (ish) note - I saw my Chinese Doctor today and she was not concerned about my raised FSH at all. She looked at my BBT chart and said things are not looking bad. She reckons I will ovulate this month again. She still stinks I have weak pulse and my tongue is not red enough (what ever that means!) but these things can be treated - She gave me, in her words, ' top herbs' to drink for the next 2 weeks! Yummy - not!

Anyway, I know most of you told me off for keeping quite last week so I thought it would be OK to come here and moan!

Love you all.

Pix xx


----------



## Han72

Hi all

just a quickie as haven't really been able to catch up with all the posts on here today.

Anne -  it's all been said honey, you know we all love you to bits and if we could take the pain away we would. You're no failure - truly you are one in a million and I'm proud to count you as one of my surrogate cyber sisters 

Welcome to Bonchance, sorry your poem got swiped, I'd ask you to PM it to me but worried that the evil cyclogest will make me start bawling incontrollably!

Well love to everyone else and apologies for no more persos but I have to take my  to bed! Bloods at 8.30 tomorrow and then possible FET with my mother hovering in the background, as she's decided to come up from Hants to hold her daughter's hand although she's more likely to drive me  and quite probably makie me even more    than I am already! Bless her she means well but when things get stressy we tend to clash! It's already started - I said on the phone tonight that it would be nice to have her there if things don't go to plan as a shoulder to cry on and her first reaction was "oh no, no tears!" and she wasn't joking, she really does expect me to hold it down if it all goes to sh1t! I had to say, "Look mum, if the embies don't survive, I can't promise you no tears, so if you can't handle me crying then don't come" Jeez, I can feel the stress levels rising already - if she tells me to pull myself together or anything unsympathetic like that, the ARGC is likely to witness a major slanging match! On the other hand I've been a bit naughty and just shoved 2 cyclogest up the aforementioned  in an effort to ensure that FET really DOES go ahead tomorrow as I don't think I could stand a delay after getting all worked up for it!

Had a laugh with the girl that called from the clinic to advise of ET tomorrow. She was saying yeah we'll do it if the prog levels are right and I thought it took like 24 hours to defrost 'em (like a frozen chicken kiev or summink   ) so I said, "you do realise it's frozen right?" and she kind of hesitated so I said, "you won't forget to take them out the freezer will you or we'll have to bung 'em in the microwave on defrost"   

Hmm, I wonder if I'll manage to sort out any acupuncture at all? I know it's recommended before and after tfr but I can't see me getting an appointment on this kind of short notice and on a Saturday to boot! Ah well, we'll see what happens...

Love to all!  that this time tomorrow I will be PUPO with 2 lovely healthy sticky blasts on board!

xxx

PS Hey pix - sorry you're feeling down honey but this made me :



Pixie75 said:


> On a positive (ish) note - I saw my Chinese Doctor today and... she still stinks


   

Sorry I think the cyclogest has gone to my head. Maybe I wasn't concentrating and stuck it up my nose by accident. No wonder I feel a bit stuffy...   

xxx


----------



## almond

Oh Pix   I'm so sorry. You are NOT moaning, you are talking about how you feel. For me it is just like that sometimes, I find that I could cry and cry, this huge well of grief just comes to the fore   Have you had any emotional help e.g. from a counsellor, because this is a huge thing to manage on your own?   
I hope you get to spend lots of time with your sister and nephew if that is what you want but dont be hard on yourself if you need to take time for you. You are going through a lot right now. 
You're so lovely Pix, so beautiful and friendly and kind  
x


----------



## almond

Nix - good luck for tomorrow. Sorry about your Mum. I don't know, I think sometimes they can't bear to see us in pain. But sometimes you do just need to cry. But I hope you are not crying tomorrow! 
I think you prob could get short notice acu if you wanted it tomorrow?
     for your FET

Lucy / LV - love the plan and OMG you need to post pictures of your kitten and FULL details

x


----------



## AoC

Thanks Sam and almond for the responses.     I really appreciate it when everyone's struggling with such big things and bad news.

I've had the FSH tests, both cycles, and this time they tested the estregen, but I don't know what AMH is?

I was really upset on Thursday to find out my ovaries had done worse on 300 menopur than they had on 150 menopur last time.     Last time they cancelled the cycle on day 10 of stims.  For both cycles, I'd been downregging for 3 weeks instead of two.  Now I'm up to 450 menopur, and back for another scan on Monday, but I could tell they expect to be cancelling the cycle on Monday.

Wish I knew what it was I've done, or not done.  It's all so bewildering.

Anyway.  Hope everyone has a good weekend.  And thanks again.


----------



## Miranda7

Have you tried eating beetroot before you see that doc, Pix?

Sorry your feelings are so close to the surface right now - but it's healing at least, if a bit of a pain in the bum when your sis is coming. 

Lucy - so fab they responded right away. I must admit, that was the first reason I chose them, because I was so used to being messed about by UK clinics - so impressive to get a speedy response! Ooooh, a kitten! Lovely, lovely, lovely.

Nix, poppet! I sympathise. My parents drove me to London for one of my Lister scans, when I thought just one of them was coming (both make me feel about 12). 
I was mortally embarrassed to be sitting in that waiting room with two 60-somethings who were obviously my ma and pa! 
And when I came out from my scan they were happily chatting to a couple who'd flown over from Iran or somewhere and probably wanted them to shut up, shut up, too...  
Your mum won't try to engage people in the waiting room in conversation, will she?


----------



## LV.

Nix - bestest, bestest luck missus! If you really want to give acu a shot then try the Zita West clinic - they have a branch Marylebone/ Bond St way that's open Sat and Sunday and you can call on the day (I've done it). Just checked my phone and I have their number as 020 7224 0017 (that might be the Sloane Square one but sure the Marlyebone is Google-able if that's wrong)

Hope all goes well with your ma and keep us posted

Lots of luck - we're all rooting for you! We need some good news so it's all eyes on you (no pressure or anything  )

xx


----------



## Han72

Miranda7 said:



> Your mum won't try to engage people in the waiting room in conversation, will she?


Oh GOD. That's EXACTLY what she's going to do! What are the chances that they'll write her a scrip for valium, just to help ME relax?!

Pix hon, I really hope you don't feel like I was making light of your situation hon, you know how much I love ya (but not in a lezzery way!)

..... Jeez, I am just incapable of being serious tonight, I'm logging off! Night all!

xxx


----------



## Ali27

Anne and lucy -   to you.  i am gutted for you both.  lucy - the kitten sounds like perfect timing and Anne - i hope you have a safe journey home.  

pix - i can so relate to your post.     

I cant post any more tonight as have had too much to drink - really need to stop that.


----------



## Suzie W

Hi,

Pix - its good to hear from you. Bad days are very hard. I have them too from time to time where I just lie about the house crying (now I'm back at work I'm just hoping they'll be fewer). IF is painful enough without bad news. Pix we're here for you. Please treat yourself with care. If you need to let your feelings out here then please do. Don't let let them fester inside.  

Nix - Best of luck for tomorrow.     I'm    that it all goes well. I hope your mum is on her best behaviour. Parents.. they can still make you feel a like a teenager no matter how old you are. I really want the opportunity to embarras my own offspring  

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Miranda7

Nix - before you turn in, the very very best of luck for tomorrow bird - I'll say a prayer that your embies bed in... and your mum belts up.


----------



## Ali27

Nix - really realy good luck for tomoorw Nix. As much with your Mum as the FET!


----------



## lucky_mum

Sorry have been AWOL and have only just caught up  what a couple of days on the PR thread  - so much sadness, but so much lovely support as well, which is so great to see 

*Anne* - I know I wrote to you on the Jinemed thread but just wanted to send you    on here too - as the others said, it is too soon after your devastating news to try to get your head around a huge decision like using DE - give yourself some time hon and I am sure that when you get home things will slowly become clearer. You and Jase sound like a very grounded, solid and loved-up couple and this is what will see you through whatever you decide to do next. As Mira said, I carried on trying with my own eggs while on the waiting list for DE at Reprofit, we always had good fertilisation rates though and I know it must be hard, both financially and emotionally, to risk the same scenario happening again for you... it depends on what you feel up to trying. Going for DE in Cyprus sounds like a good option for you due to the physical match for donors, and it is good that there is no waiting list - but give yourself time sweetheart  I can appreciate how hard it must be for you to say goodbye to the idea of a child which would be biologically yours, as Jase has that biological link to children already, but I can truly say that any baby you conceive through donor eggs, if you feel even half of the same way I do about my LO growing inside me, then that baby will be YOURS, growing in your body, nurtured by your blood and when it is born, by your love as a mother. Sharing the same DNA is such a small part of being a good Mum, and I feel positive that you will be a fantastic Mum, no matter which road it takes to get there.  Please feel free to PM me any time Anne (and anyone else who ever needs to talk about DE) I would do anything to help you, and just wish so much that things will all work out, I am sure they will    - just maybe in a different way from that which you expected.   
*
Ladyverte* - so sorry your cycle got cancelled  - sending you huge    also, and good luck with the Jinemed if you do decide that is the way forward for you.   

*Ally* - welcome back we really missed you  I am so, so sorry to read about your younger sister's problems  - can't believe how unlucky the three of you have been with the cards life has dealt you. I hope so much that Becka's cycle won't be cancelled, and that if it is she will find a much better month for her to try next time.    Have a nice time together this weekend, and your family is in my prayers - as others have said, if I had a sister, I would want her to be just like you. 

*Anna of Sunderland* and *Bonchance* - welcome to Team PR - Bonchance, I also loved the sentiment of your post, you wrote it beautifully and it made so much sense, please stick around and lots and lots of    for your next treatment cycle.

*Sam* - I am sorry you are feeling so low  and that you are having to go through this and get your head around using an egg donor. Don't worry about upsetting anybody by raising your fears and doubts - that is what we are here for, to help if we can with what experience we each have. I agree with what Mira said, although I know it must be hard, you need to try to focus on YOUR story, not those of others - although it is great that you are researching the whole DE thing as part of coming to terms with it. I did exactly the same, way back when and also found more negative stories than positive - but I agree with the others, that this does seem to indicate that happy people are less likely to make a big thing out of their story on the internet, rather than that there are more sad than happy donor-conceived children. I also feel that if told early enough, the child will grow up with that knowledge as part of their "normal" as they would never know any different, and would not use that knowledge to "define" themselves in the same way somebody told later in life would. You also need to remember that many of the stories from those old enough to tell how they feel as an adult, are often conceived with donor sperm, I feel there is a big difference between this and being conceived using DE by having a mother who although she has no biological link to you (other than that of epigenetics), carried you in her body and gave birth to you. I found looking at the threads under the donor section of FF a huge help, especially in choosing the right clinic for me, and realising just how many FFs are using DE ... there is an FF called Olivia_M (I think!) who posts over there, who is the founder of the donor conception network and very probably the mother of those "positive" children you read about, am sure she would help you if you PM'd her. Sending you lots of    your DH sounds like a great guy and things WILL get better.   

*Nix* - sending you lots and lots of    for those embryos to defrost beautifully this weekend for your FET 

*Popsi* - great news!!!  I know it has been a long road, so glad it has all gone so well for you and that you are nearing the final stages now - lots of   

*Odette *- thinking about you lots (as you know, you was a huge inspiration for me to use DE myself a long time ago now ) good luck for the birth!!   

*Pixie *- big    and huge    for your cycle coming up at the Jinemed - enjoy your sister visiting and hope you have a lovely time together catching up 

Sorry to all those I have missed and if I have waffled on a bit - very tired tonight after a really busy week, but wanted to post, hope it all made sense! 

Huge love to all    , I hope you all have a lovely weekend and that we all get some  !

XXXXXXX


----------



## Suzie W

Hi Steph,

the new pic of your bump is lovely   It lovely to read your view of DE.

love,
Suzie.


----------



## almond

I agree with Suzie Steph, and thank you for being so open. I looked at your sig and cant believe it is 32 weeks already?! Where did that go?! (I was lurking long before I started posting and I remember your bfp)

Hi Suzie   
I need to get off the comp and go to bed ...
x


----------



## Suzie W

Hi Almond - me too. I need to get some sleep buts its so hard to put the computer down.


----------



## almond

Suzie - I know! Am still here ... just posted a reply to AnnaofC and lost it that's my excuse!

AnnaofC - AMH is anti-mullerian hormone and is a fairly new test which is an indicator of ovarian reserve. It is not without controversy, but it seems to be a fairly reliable indicator of ovarian reserve, but not quality of eggs. If you search this site you will find a lot of information, and look for Littlejen's posts as she has posted a lot of useful stuff. 
x


----------



## Kazzie40

Hi girls

*Anne * (and Jason) I am so sorry I was so gutted to read your post  I do understand the need to examine the option for DE whilst still in shock from the news today, it is a coping mechanism that helps us realise that there is another way to have baby even if it is not the way we planned. I do understand that it must be especially difficult since Jason already has biological children but carrying and giving birth to the baby will make your little one 100% both of yours   and one day your little one when not so little will write a post like Bonchances about being honoured to have you as parents. Do what you need to do to get through today then take a break. from all the research to be kind to yourselves.

*Lucy * -  I am also sorry about your cancelled cycle, due to a runaway folly, I personally think you are making the right decision to cancel and saving the money to try the Jinemed. It was the same heartbreaking decision I made last October when I had two that raced of in front, though I might not make the same decision if it happens this time (which like you this time am bricking myself about in advance.)

When I read your post the other day about the smaller ones fizzling out and all the energy going into the bigger one/s I could really relate. I think I am prone to develop non symetical ones as I had 8 the first cycle but that really varied enormously in size on the scans and everyone was worried about premature ovulation. The first cycle was birth control pill then 450iu Gonal F, the second cycle was long protocol downreg with lucrin and then a split of 225iu each of Menopur and Gonal F. They did think that the lucrin may have cobbled me along with the fact that I might not respond as well to Menopur as Gonal F.

I am glad that you have contacted the Jinemed and have a plan of action. It did seem to sound as it things were not 100% certain where you were exactly in your cycle when they started stimming so giving your body time to rest and chance to get back into a more normal cycle if it can does sound a solid plan of action. Let us know what the jinemed suggest, I would be very interested to hear their suggested protocol.

*Sam*, I am glad that you brought this issue up about how the child might feel re DE. I am know I am extremely fortunate to already have two children but I personally do feel very selfish that we may create a child that will not be related to any of us biologically and whilst like you I know I will totally adore that child I worry that this will cause the child pain and ask myself how fair that is, because I think we might go for the Donor embryo option. That being said I will do what Steph did in that try a bit more with my own eggs and DH sperm whilst we are waiting.

My other thoughts at times though are is it best to just go straight to the donor embryo option as that should wipe out any chance of the baby getting that terrible heart disease or being affected by DH dogey gene. I could not bear to think that my desperate need for a baby caused another child of mine to suffer the way Joshua did.

I do agree though that the chance of a more positive outcome if donor/s are used ( confirmed by Bonchance thankyou) does very much depend on telling the baby/child early so that the way they have come to be is completely 'normal' for them, I would also press upon them how special they are to have been conceived this way, though I know that all of us having suffered the pain of IF truly appreciate how 'special' our children are whether biological or not.

*Nix,* the very very best of luck for your FET this weekend,   I am so   that this is your turn, I can imagine you being a complete tonic to everyone you meet from your fantastically funny posts!

*Ali - * I am sorry about yours and youre sisters trouble with IF, I think telling your younger sister to test was absolutely the right thing to do because it gives her more options and less chance of regret that she didn't do anything sooner. Good luck with your study in Washington. I really hope it helps you get your hearts desire.

*WW* - your story about your wedding day was funny but I can understand how you might feel cheated!

*Pix * - sorry you are feeling low  but the microdose flare does sound like a good option to try for you. Thanks for your help with all my questions, I really appreciate it.

*LW,* how are things going my fellow turkey buddy? Did you mention what protocol you will be on? I am also very interested to hear what happened when you meet that consultant about insulin resistance. I think there is something in it maybe. I have a friend who had two poor quality embies on the first IVF cycle, then the second (She went to HRC in USA) she was tested for insulin resisitance and put on metformin for some weeks prior to stims. She produced much better quality eggs and three embryos were hatching blasts when put back.

She gave birth to triplet girls at 28 weeks a few weeks ago and although small the girls are doing quite well though they do need several months in special care to grow.

I am really tired now but wanted to do some personal tonight but will come back tomorrow.

Take care love Karen xxxx


----------



## beachgirl

Nix    my old cycle buddy, wishing you lots and lots of luck for FET this weekend, looking forward to catching up with you on your 2ww


----------



## Belliboo

anneG so sorry to hear your news i am devastated for you  so don't know how you must be feeling, I just don't understand why life is so unfair.

Lady Verte again I'm sorry your cycle was cancelled must be so dissappointing for you 

Nix good luck with FET today, this has got to be your time xx

looks like another lovely day so hope everyone has a great weekend, xxxx


----------



## AoC

Thank you, almond, you're a star.  

Good luck today, Nix.  Lots of       for you.


----------



## Jackeen

Morning ladies, I have been reading your wonderful posts and hope you may be able to help  me too, like you all I am a poor responder and have recenlty finished my 6th cycle.  For the first time I had no eggs collected and was wondering if any of you had ever been in this situation and gone on to have eggs collected on a subsequent cycle?

AnneG, I hope you got home okay and are doing okay, I am very interested in reading about DE too as the NHS have offered me 2 cycles but I haven't been able to get my head around it, I have a year left until they pull my funding so haven't really focused on it, you have time to think about this when you're ready hun, there's not such a rush with donor eggs.


----------



## Ali27

Morning everyone!

beachy - you are up so early    wish i was more like you  

I am making myself go for a jog now along the river.  If you dont hear from em agin it'll be cos I have been eaten by them viscious swans.

Be back later (hopefully) xx


----------



## beachgirl

Ali- thanks chick, enjoy your jog x


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Karen - thanks hon - where are you at at the moment I am so out of touch with everyone!!  

Pix - honey pie - going to call you en route to Bath, I am rushing now so can't really give you the attention I want to but suffice to say I am thinking of you, TOTALLY understand everything you said and will chat it through with you later on xxxx     

Anne and Jas - I hope you have a quick and stress free journey and that you are home with cats on knees in no time at all. Much love to you both     

Nix - good luck with your FET     

Ali - well done on the running, I am taking 'baby' steps towards getting back on my healthy regime post hols. I had porridge for breakfast today - erghhhh its amazing how little time it takes for your tastebuds to forget all you have trained them to like!!!!  

Steph - thank you for being our DE Ambassador!! You are a shining example and we all appreciate your help and support as we do our other DE ladies Lainey and Odette. Thank you all, you help us so very much   And you look utterly gorgeous in your bump pic - will have to have a look on ** to get the full picture!!  

Thank you to everyone else for lovely kind words, will be showing the girls the thread tonight and I expect a few tears from them, we are rather emotional us siblings!! 

Off to Bath now so hope you all have lovely sunny weekends and look forward to catching up with you later/ tomorrow.

Much love 

Al xxxx


----------



## beachgirl

Ally    enjoy your catch up, bet there will be a few tears between you all tonight x


----------



## Ali27

Ally - read back and saw what you had posted about Becka and Hannah.  I totally agree with you about encouoraging Hannah to take the positive action she is taking and hope that her DP will be understanding.  Please tell Becka how sorry i am that her cycle is not going to plan.  I cant believe that all three of you are experiencing this issue.  Hope you have some giggles this weekend, in amongst the tears and frustrations. xx

I survived my run and am now eating my porridge.

Pixie - how are you today?  Are you planning something nice for this weekend?  Cos you should, I think.  It may help you to feel a bit better.  Or are you having your shaggathon?    

Have decided to cycle again in Jane - Jaya wants me to redo my FSH, LH and E2 next AF (beg of May) and also my AMH - WHY  It was 0.1 last time!!! Might it go to minus figures!! So am trying to get fit and eat well.  my eating is generally ok, its the wine i cant resist.


----------



## Wing Wing

Hi Girls - still in jim jams - shocker hey?!! Well, it is raining still and seriously can't be @rsed to get ready or do anything - has actually been rather relaxing. The wine knocked me out for 12 hours last night - bliss!!!

Hi Cyber -Sis *Ally *- hope you are having good weekend with Becca and Hannah. Hope they know how lucky they are - if not, show then this!!! Thanks for update re Lainey. If you speak again, please give her my love.

Oh Mag, really hope the candida isn't back with full force and that you feel better soon. 3 rolos doensn't sound like a crime!!

Hi *Almond* - sorry to cock up the dates but yes, Friday is too late as will be in Ipswich by then as my Gran is in hossie so can't delay - she is 96!

*LV* - did you get the kitten yet - pets are wonderful therapy!

*Odette* - what a marvellous thought about Jesus - am really liking that one! I really do think that as donor eggs are a real possibility for us on this thread that it is really good to hear about experiences/thoughts of others. I am really finding the information useful so thanks to everyone who is willing to discuss. Thanks also to Steph - you are looking good hon!

*Pix* - sorry to hear you are so sad - crying is good for you though and is much better than trying to keep it all in and be "brave". I hope you are feeling better today. Was reassuring to know that your Chinese doc still stinks and she thinks your tongue is not red enough - blimey - sounds like she is the one who needs help! Try eating raspberry icepop before you go next time!!!

*Nix* - wishing you all the luck in the world today. Please don't kill your Mum - be awful to be pg in pris!! I think Mum's find it hard to understand sometimes as they have their children - YOU and on top of not realising what it is like to have to go to such extreme lengths to have a child, they don't want YOU to be hurt and going through all this must be hard for them to comprehend.

Hi *Kazzie*. 

*Ali* - hope the swans left you alone!

*Anne, *hope you get home quickly. Hope to hear from you later.

Right, off to dry hair and maybe put some clothes on!

Talk later.

Love to all.


----------



## Han72

Hi all you lovely girls, just a quickie as mother is hovering... 

Anne hon - thinking of you and Jase still   

Ally chica - how are you sweetie?



Wing Wing said:


> *Nix* - wishing you all the luck in the world today. Please don't kill your Mum - be awful to be pg in pris!!


 WW you make me larf!    Also I think if I killed her under these circs I'd definitely be let off! Sod getting dressed, clothes are sooo overrated! Sorry I've missed loads so I don't know what's happening with your Granny but I hope she's ok 

Pixie honey I hope you're feeling better today  Next time the wiggy woman starts on you about the colour of your tongue just poke it out at her again and say "well at least I'm not stinky! And I'd rather have a rug on my tongue than on my head!" 

Zuri - cheers for the message on the FET board, how are ya luv?

Forgot to say "welcome!" to AnnaofCumberland yesterday  

Ali - best of luck with your get fit plan hon, here's hoping you can get going again in the summer! I must admit I have difficulty staying away from the womb juice too - living in France doesn't help 

Almond - would love to meet up on the 30th but will have to see how it goes as I think that's going to be the day after test date if all goes to plan!

Malini - I tried to eke it out as long as I could but I finished the book already  Such a beautifully written story I LOVED it, thank you for recommending it. I'm going to buy my own copy and lend it to everyone I know! Let me know when you're around so I can pass your back to you chick!

Sorry no more persos but thanks to EVERYBODY for the good luck wishes and I hope you're all well and that you're enjoying the same sunshine that we're having here in East Lahndon! But guess what? After all that flap yesterday, the Fet was cancelled for today as progesterone levels weren't high enough. Bah! It should be tomorrow though (Anuvver 2 cyclogest should fix it!) so mummy has just changed her ticket so she can stay overnight and go in with me tomorrow  Bless, she is a sweetie really! Oh and apologies for the pre-FET hysteria last night, feeling much calmer now! (Not that it's likely to last )

xxx


----------



## Malini

Oh, Nix - that's disappointing. I'll be thinking of you tomorrow too. Give that copy to whomever you think will like it - I am not bothered. It is way too distressing to ever contemplate reading again and I am just pleased I managed it and have had the experience of it making me think really hard about something other than myself for a while. For all of you who may want to know what we are talking about the book is; 'The Other Hand' by Chris Cleave. BIG HEALTH WARNING: It is sad, upsetting and real but written in such a compelling and fresh voice that you get through it so fast, and Hollywood won't make this one into a film, no way.

To all newbies with questions, welcome, the sun is so tempting I have got to make this short. But Ali, I am pleased the swans didn't get you. I'd miss you so.

I thought I would take a leaf out of the Sam book and do a little research. So for LV particularly, and maybe Karen too - here's some thoughts about follies growing out of sync.

Here'e the reading: http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Carolyn+Givens+Poor+responders&meta=

I emailed the author to ask her if she still uses this protocol and here is a paraphrase of her response (and there is no infringement of copyright and I know of what I speak as I dedicated two long, lonely years at Uni perfecting my waffle on intellectual property):

We usually use the protocol mentioned in the article if the patient has had a tendency to stimulate quickly (9 days or less of stimulation) and there is a large disparity in her follicle sizes. We believe it helps to synchronize the follicles into one cohesively mature cohort and allows for between 10 to 12 days of full maturation without suppressing the response in PRs.

What do you think?

And Pix - my acu nearly cartwheeled last week b/c my tongue is now almost pink enough  The reason, she says, is that I haven't had enough blood in my system and therefore not enough is nourishing my ovaries. It all sounds lovely to me and I guess that is what insulin concerns point to (my former bf is type 1 diabetic and it took her 4 weeks to get pregnant after metformin/ocp brought back her first AF in over 10 years, sigh) and all the hot water bottle chat.

I am very interested Sam in the lining looking good, but possibly not being?

And Ally, would you PM me your PH specialist. I live around the corner, and am intrigued (read desperate).

Oh and WW - I knew I wouldn't get out of here swiftly - I live in NW Ldn but anywhere on the Jubilee or Northern line is easy for me.

Off to sun,
Malini xxx

/links


----------



## Ali27

Malini - thanks for posting that link - intestering reading.  I had my first/last cycle cancelled due to an eager beaver.  Jaya has suggested a different protocol for next time - the pill for only 2 weeks (4 last time), microdose supressing drugs and then one done higher of Menopur.  Less supressing basically.  If it happens again I will ask her about this protocol.  Sounds promising.  Hope you are out enjoying the gorgeous weather  

Nix - sorry bout the delay.  At least it gives you more time with mummy    Hope you have a relaxing day today and I am crossing everything for you for tomorrow.  

Wing Wing - You dressed?  Wouldn't blame you if you weren't!  Hope you are having a lovely day whatever  

Anne - hope you are having a speedt, safe journey back home  

love to everyone


----------



## LV.

Mallini - thanks so much for posting that link, very interesting reading and a few of us certainly fit the bill. I'm going to send it to Jeya and ask her if we can discuss it in our follow up. I'm still set on going to the Jin but I'm still going to have the follow up and get her opinion - I'm paying for it so might as well get my money's worth

I've got my Chinese herbs and they are currently boiling - god they stink and I'm sure they ain't going to taste much better. How forgiving is honey when mixed in?! 

No kitten - they've all gone but it's on the list now so we'll keep a look out.

Nix - good luck with FET, bless your ma. We love being with 'em (just not for prolonged periods!)

Anne - hope you have landed ok

Hi to the rest of the crew

x


----------



## Wing Wing

Nixf01 said:


> Next time the wiggy woman starts on you about the colour of your tongue just poke it out at her again and say "well at least I'm not stinky! And I'd rather have a rug on my tongue than on my head!"


            

Nix, haven't said anything about my Gran so you haven't missed anything love! She is just old and had a fall and is in hossie and not very strong so feel I should pop over to see her just in case.....!!!

Good luck for tomorrow sweets.   

Malini, will have a think about where we can meet. I will be coming from City Airport so can get DLR to Bank and then Central to Bond St or Oxford Circus. Any good to you? Am sooo jealous of the sun you are having. Seriously raining here all day and poor woofties have yet to be walked. Gonna have to get the sexy caghool thing on with the rain hood. Nice! Ali - At least now I have some clothes on so not naked in the rain!! 

Hi to everyone else and hope you are all enjoying your weekend.

Off out for dinner and drinks this eve - high exitement!!

Lots of love to all.

WW XXX


----------



## Han72

l\v hon, I think I may have forgotten to say I was sorry to hear your cycle got cancelled (sorry, it's lack of sleep I am losing the plot!) Hope you can get your kitty cat soon tho! 

Malini - thanks for saying I can keep the book, you're right it's a tough one to read more than once but it definitely deserves to be passed on.  Have you read The Time Traveller's Wife...?  Oh by the way I'm not feeling quite so disappointed now about the delay, apparently Mr T's the only one on transfers tomorrow so that means I get the best of the best. AND there's only 2 of us for tfr tomorrow so even if I'm not first, I won't be hanging around for hours on end in a great long queue  The only drawback is another sleepness night worrying about the thaw (which is absolutely pointless but I can't seem to help myself!)

WW are you coming out to play in London then? YIPPEE!!!  

Steph - I forgot to say, I love your new bump pic!


xxx


----------



## Malini

Ah, a date with Mr T Nix, that's good   By the way, I am back in London as of Monday eve, so if you need distraction or wanna visit then you know my number.  Fingers and toes crossed for those frosties - hehe about the microwave. I wouldn't sleep so well either, so just hope you are quickly in and out tomorrow and can be napping in no time.

Glad my little research exploit may inspire a chat or two. Pls let me know what anyone says about it.  The Jin may also be up to a think about it as they seem so approachable. LV - you're right, get your money's worth.

WW - enjoy your dinner and drinks, what fun.  Hope it makes up for the rain.  Those locations are great for me.  Let's switch to PMs for details though, just to keep us safe.

Okay, off to commune with my ironing pile (have been in the garden in the sun Ali), and trying very hard to pretend that it isn't FA cup semi-final weekend .... too bad dh has it on the radio on our surround system and my home is open plan  

Malini xx


----------



## Wing Wing

*Nix* - you won't still be in London will you on 30 April? That is when I am meeting up with Malini. If you are, that would be great! If not, I am determined to meet you in Paris still!

*Malini* - agree we should PM location - suggestions appreciated! Good luck with the ironing - I HATE ironing. Luckily DH seems to like it so he will face a huge pile tomorrow. I expect I will get some other nasty job to do though - oven cleaning or something just as heinous!!

Big kisses to all. Thinking especially of *Anne* and hoping you are having cat cuddles by now sweetie.

WW X


----------



## Han72

Put it this way, if I'm still here then that means it's a BFP cos I'd have to stay for the monitoring 

Hey Malini - best thing about being here is that Dr Evil is doing his own ironing.   

Oh God, mum and I are home alone as my cousin's gone out to dinner.  She's had a drink and now she's asking me if I want one but there's no womb juice open!  Does port count?  
xxx


----------



## popsi

LOL .. nix i would go for it honey.. its better red wine lol !!! you make me laugh so much, good luck for tomorrow darling xx


----------



## laurab

Hello girls,

How are you all.  Completely out of touch as usual! Sorry!

Popsi - Hows the adoption stuff goin?

Anne -   

Purp - How you feeling?

Nix -  

Right... bed for me.

XX


----------



## popsi

Laura .. hiya honey how are you and the beautiful 3 xx .. i am ok adoption going really well all homestudy finished now hope to go to panel on 20th May (  it does not get postponed due to them being busy) xx

Ann.. hope your ok and had a safe journey home darling xx

pix, purps, kate, ally, ali, anna, lw, lv, steph, mir, lainey, malani, nix, and all you other inspiring ladies   have a good sunday the weather is gorgeous here, so off to B & Q for some outdoorsy stuff xx


----------



## Overthemoon

Morning gels  

Anne, more     for you

Nix, lots and lots of luck today hun, hope it all goes well.     

Kazzie, will you be Pixie and my cycle buddy in Turkey? When do you fly out? Pixie, what dates will you be there hun? They're put me on the SP 450 stims and Cetrotide, I don't know which stims they are putting me on, I'll see when I go. I'll also be very interested to see what the insulin resistance doc says to Sam, please keep us informed Sam! I have loads of metformin here so if there was a positive correlation, I'd definitely take it. Lucy, great to see you'll be out there in Turkey too. We should get a FF flat out there, it would never be empty at this rate!!

Lightweight xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Hiya Laura - kisses to chippies xxxx

Pops - really hope I get back from US to some great news from you    

Nix - good luck with the FET hope it happens today     

Malini - not home now so don't have TCM guys details will do when back  

Lucy - hope herbs went okay babes - my guy puts liquorice in mine which really helps (strangely I don't really like it but it really works in the herbs and I really don't mind them at all!!)

Ali - well done for getting back in the tx saddle - so praying this is your one honey pie        

Anne and J - hope you are finding some comfort from being home in your familiar surroundings with your cats, bet they were so pleased to see you back. Lots of love.     

xxxx


----------



## Malini

Happy Sunday gang.  Thx Ally for that.  And as for ironing any of you who are about to be married have it written into the contract that it his job!  I am soooo envious of WW and those who have hubbies who like to smooth.  It is too dull but my perfectionist self loves the result.  Sod that I am going back into the garden to assault weeds.  M xxx


----------



## Züri

Malini I get a strange buzz from ironing, i get satisfaction from a nice smooth pile of neatly folded ironing, I am a weirdo


----------



## LV.

Happy Sunday girls,

Ally - How are you girls doing? Good catch up and lots of hugs are the order of the day I suspect. Hope you and your girlies are holding up ok . I got the herbs thanks - god they are revolting, I actually threw up this morning after 1 mouthful but I was a bit hungover so I suspect that it wasn't the most brilliant decision to try and get the grim stuff down my neck so early in the morning after too much red wine last night. I put 2 very large teaspoons of honey it in which made it _almost _palatable, I'm not looking forward to trying to get them in before work this week but needs must! The Doctor I saw was so lovely - really sweet Chinese lady and I checked her credentials on your advice and she's registered with the council and had a little biog - trained in China alongside western medicine and worked in a top Chinese hospital for 10 years - sounded pretty plausible and her acupuncture is on £25 a session so I'm definitely going to switch to her - what a bargain! Maybe I'll ask about liquorice next week.

Zuri - that's just plain strange - you like ironing?! Fancy popping round to do mine?!

Malini - lovely day for the garden, enjoy

LW - hello m'dear. God that flat would be over run - we'd probably save a fortune and we could pop over for long weekends in between treatmetns (but of course we will ALL be successful tis time - PMA all the way)

Nix - best of luck today chicken. Hope you manage to keep your mum in line and sending you a wheelbarrow full of sticky stuff

Morning Wing Wing, Popsi, Laura and everyone else I've forgotton

Lucy x


----------



## Hazelnut

Morning everyone, haven't had chance to read back the last few pages, but I hope you're all well and enjoying the weekend.

Anne, how are you?  Hope you're back home now safe and sound, how are you feeling? xxx

Just wanted to say I saw my consultant yesterday morning who said he doesn't want to waste any time and is referring me for IVF asap, so I will be joining all on this very scary journey.  I actually feel terrifed by the thought of it and not at all mentally prepared for treatment.  I just want to bury my head in the sand and pretend none of it was happening!  He wants me to have a HSG with my next cycle, which I'm absolutely dreading as I've heard it can be quite painful- have any of you ladies had any experiences with having this done?  Do they give you pain relief?

Anyway must go to Sainsburys!

Love to all you lovely ladies on this lovely Sunday.

H x


----------



## Malini

Just back in from the garden - what fun it is to dig, get grubby and be warm!!!  Thanks LV, it was lovely.  Hazelnut, it is scary to start but I wish I hadn't dithered so much - so good for you for being brave.  I didn't like having an HSG but didn't find it painful at all - not very lady-like legs in the air and all those medics looking where I didn't want them but I am very used to that now.    I think the pain is how difficult it is for the ink to get down the tubes - do you have painful AFs?, that may be an indicator b/c I don't usually.  

Zuri -any day you want to pop by and tackle my pile, you're welcome  Sounds like there'll be a queue.

Nix - am so anxious for news from you. I hope - really, really hope - that you've got those beautiful blasts on board and are being spoiled and mum and you are on the very best of terms.  

M xxx


----------



## Han72

Hi everyone, just a quickie as am knackered! And PUPO! One blastie on board, not great quality but at least it's in there. The other one didn't make it unfortunately. So now loaded up with all kinds of pills and potions to keep the little blighter safe and sound and I have to have IVIG tomorrow morning which I'm not particularly pleased about (cost wise that is, not really bothered about the safety aspect which I know worries some people) but if "Mr T says" that's how it's gotta be then that's how it's gotta be!

Oh and no running up and down for me, total bedrest cos "Mr T says" so I can't come out to play on Monday Malini   I will be watching the clock to ensure I don't forget to take the aspirin, the 2 lots of clexane, 2 lots of cyclogest, the 4 lots of ritradrine, 25m pred, and God knows what else. It's the ritradrine that's a killer, every 6 hours! 6am, midday, 6pm, midnight etc etc etc!  Oh well at least I escaped the dreaded Gestone!

And if this one doesn't stick, noone can say we didn't try absolutely everything!

Love to all

xxx


----------



## Suzie W

HI All,

Hi Nix - congratulations on being PUPO! So pleased for you. Wow that really is a lot of meds! But as you say you know that you are doing all that you can.  

Zuri - I'm impressed that you get some lovely satisfaction from ironing. A Part (a big part) of my decision on what clothese to buy is based on whether I have to iron them or not.   I make DH do his own which means he doesn't.

Hazelnut - yes it does feel very scary when things start to move forward. At first is seems as though its so long to wait and then you are on that roller coaster. Like Malini I wish I hadn't dithered about in the beginning. Good luck I hope it goes well.  

Anne - I hope you're snuggled up at home.  

Hi to Pixie, Miranda, Laura, LW, Lucy, Almond, Kate, Ally, Ali, Malini, WW, Bonchance, Beachy, Popsi, Kazzie and everyone.

Tomorrow I have my first scan since starting stimms to see what happening.  The stims (450 menopur) is making me feel a bit nauseous and woozy. I'm trying accu at the zw clinic as the company I was having accu with went into administration which is a shame as the accupuncturist was really good. Hopefully it will help with some of the symptoms. I'm   that this time there won't be empty follies.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Suzie W

Kate,

The poem is beautiful - thank you for sending it to me. You have a talent for poetry.  

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Malini

Oh Nix, poor you! That's a crazy amount of drugs but I know the score and if you decide to join the A-team then you have got to do as Mr T says.  Congrats on being PUPO. I am delighted that you have got one and I wouldn't fret too much about quality as mine was supposed to be super, super and it didn't stick but I watch plenty of other stories where it isn't so perfect and they have little bundles now.  Good luck with the ivig, I know what you mean about the money.  How did it go with having your mum there?

And Suzie, I am   for you too.  Good luck with that scan.

Love to all of you,
Malini xx


----------



## Suzie W

thanks Malini


----------



## Suzie W

Congratulations Rose!  

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## dimsum

Very best wishes and good luck Nix and congratulations Rose!


----------



## mag108

Ladies
What a fantastically sunny weekend. Spent the day in the garden, planting, weeding and then a prolonged period of sunbathing. DH playing golf so had place to myself and girl done good. 

Been off work for a week. Today was first day I had any time to myself. Had a good break, had Dh's son all week who is a dote, at some pt I just had to leave them to it, left them to hang out. I had some of my own stf to do acu/shopping etc but realise now, having spent time on my own, what a strain it is doing lots of kiddie things with Dh's son, in that I am constantly reminded of IF.  Being around lots of families is such a strain. 

I am so happy in my backgarden having nothing to do with anyone. Feel a bout of hermititis coming on again......

Off to queue for GP's tomorrow am, get there for 7.40am, opens at 8.30am. May see Dr by 9am. Need to have a catch up and get blood results.

Bit anxious starting tx, specially since amh drop. Baseline scan on Thurs. There's so much to remember/take in. Am in god form but wish I could take 2mths off work.


Sam - thanks for all the amh info, need those up stories right now. I have had some early thoughts on DE. I share your concern. I have a huge amount of respect for you bringing this topic to the thread, you are a very conscientious and open lady. I am following the discussion on it all as its helping inform my own thoughts. To add my twopennies worth....20yrs ago IVF was such a big deal and I wonder did parent then think 'will I tell my child they were an ivf baby'. I know DE is a different set of circumstances, but I wonder if in 20 yrs it will be more common just as IVF is now.

Su - very sorry to hear your story and diagnosis. I am just beginning TX at Lister My story is different, but I know there will be others on here who have lots to offer you.

Odette - wishing you all of the best with the birth!


Pix -  sorry to hear you have been having a tough time. I am of the school of thought that a good cry is really theraputic.  I find sometimes that after bottling things up for a while, when I feel like I have turned into a beatch, I can have a cry and feel a bit human again.May not feel so good straight after but a day or so later there can be a sense of peace, letting goi hope you feel better though, in time for your visitors....

Anne -  hope you have gotten back safely and you are sipping a G&T somewhere cosy.

Miranda- what does beetroot do then?

ROse - delighted at your great news!

Stephjoy -  Your openness  re DE is touching. Thank you. I am not there yet re DE but may be. Your story is inspiring. Like Ally I get great inspiration from you all (DE's Lainey and Odette), so BIG THANKS

hi to Sarah, Malini, WW, Nix, Suzie, LW, Lucy, annacameron, purps and everyone else on Pr thread.....xxxx

MAG


----------



## LV.

Wow  Congrats Rose! Thanks for sharing that - we needed some good news

Nix - PUPO lady!!! Woo hoo!!


----------



## annacameron

congrats Rose, that's great news. thanks for the uplift! )))))

(I'm convinced that how embryos look visually is pretty irrelevant - save for massive fragmentation. Look at Laura and her triplets; she was so upset about what the embr looked like. bottom line - it doesn't matter much.)


----------



## shortie66

Evening my lovelies 

Wow what a great weekend its been, we had a bbq yesterday and been over to one at m-i-l's today    Needless to say i have stuffed myself solidly this weekend in readiness for 2moz start on the chemical diet    

Nix - congrats my darling on being pupo, take great care and do just as u have been told, no running marathons or anything like that.  I will keep all my bits crossed for you hunny and     like mad for a bfp for you    

Anne - hope you and jay are back home safe and sound.  If you wanna talk anytime hun just let me know, i'll be here for you.    

Mag - i have also done some more planting this weekend and bought another magnolia tree today so will be doing more planting again tomorrow    Hope your scan goes ok on thursday hunny   

Rose - huge congrats on your bfp sweetie   

Suzie - aahhh thanx hunny, it is written from the heart and made me   a bit when i wrote it, soppy cow that i am  

Mallini - joined you on the getting grubby hunny    I just love seeing all the new plants come through   

Hazelnut - is the hsg where they put the dye through your tubes to see if they are open?  If it is then its not really that painful, i just had some period pains while they were doing it and cramps for a few hours after but they soon went with a couple of painkillers.  Next day i was on the pepsi max in blackpool   

Zuri - hi petal, are you free for a few hours next sunday?  I always have a pile of ironing come sunday and if it makes you happy and gives you a buzz your welcome to come over and do mine.  

Lucy - good luck with the chinese herbs petal.   Think i'd rather try those than the liquorice tho, uugghhhh cant stand the stuff  

Hello to lightweight, ally, laura, pixie, steph, tracey, natasha, annacameron, alegria, so broody, sam, lainey, almond, juicy, popsi, missyg, odette, miranda, ali, kazzie, wing wing and everyone else.

Gonna catch up with bgt now on itv2, missed it last nite cos i was ratted.  Managed to drink 8 bottles of bacardi breezer in less than 3 hours and really cant remember much else after that  

Kate
xxxxxxxx


----------



## Miranda7

Mag - Pix's therapist was complaining her tongue wasn't pink enough! Thought that might help...

Nix - congrats on being PUPO!!! Rah! I'm screwing up my toes, my eyes and my bumcheeks to get them to stick...

Rose - congratulations! Fab news - it's so easy to feel so downhearted when you're told your embryos don't look like George Clooney and Linda Evangelista - but I've heard so many tales where it doesn't matter a damn. Well done you!


----------



## Hazelnut

Thanks to Malini, Suzie and Kate for your positive comments and reassurance about the HSG, it really does make such a difference having the support of people here on FF, thank you x

Congratualtions to Nix on being PUPO, fab news, although I'm afraid I have no idea what IVIG is??!

And also congratulations to Rose on your wonderful news too xxx


----------



## shortie66

Hi mir - how is the bobster?


----------



## beachgirl

Just popping on to say congratulations on being PUPO to Nix


----------



## Kazzie40

Hi everyone - Nix congrats on being PUPO   

congrats Rose, it does give us all hope!

Suzie, good luck for tomorrow's scan, will check in to see how it went   

Hazelnut - good luck with starting on IVF, can't comment on the HSG as mine was done at the same time as a lap but I have heard it is slightly uncomfortable but not overly painful for most.

Mag - well done for the planting and even better for the sunbathing, got to be done  
just seen you are having scan Thursday, hope that goes well.

Zuri - you have started something now, I will let my ironing pile up  

LW - I am not sure about my dates for going to Istanbul because I can't predict when my AF will turn up - last time it took six days to come after stopping the last pill and when I D/R it was a week late so not entirely sure of my dates yet, I might be coming out the day you leave or 2/3 days before that in which case I will be round to eye up your joint as I may still stay at the same apartments as last time.

Did you say what your protocol was and did you ask mine ( or was that you lucy?  ) Anyhow my protocol was BCP, 450iu Gonal F and Cetrotide, but I sent an email to Romina a couple of days ago to see if they might want to change it to perhaps the microdose etc since my AMH result was low, just waiting to hear what Proff T says.

Pix - hope youre feeling better and gearing yourself up for this months try,    what does the esterferm and letrozole do? 

Anne - thinking of you, hope you are both resting up, look forward to hearing from you when you are able xx.



Kate - enjoy your catching up on TV!

Miranda - how's Bob's pox?

Hi everyone else, love Karen xxx


----------



## mag108

Mir - thats funny! I just planted some beetroot today!

Kate: I love magnolia's! Was eyeing up a neighbours one today!

Looks like its going to be sunny all week: so the dilemma is; no lunch break to leave work early...or sunbathe at lunchtime?!
Lifes little dilemmas! Once thr sun comes out I am a whore to it, I sell my soul bigtime and will do or not do anything to be in it. BYT a lovely woman I met a few weeks ago who is doing full on TCM training, said that evening times, dusk, is very good for the pituatary glands re fertility...

x


----------



## shortie66

Mag - wow thats interesting - looks like a dusk time shag for me every night for the next 2 weeks then   

Hi beachy  

Hi kazzie


----------



## almond

Evening ladies I am recovering from being given 2 free club level tickets to FA cup semi-final yesterday then losing   I am still deeply traumatised   Did get to see my little nephew though which was lovely. Tho my mum and dad's house seems to be littered with cards from people announcing birth arrivals etc. And yest I unexpectedly bumped into a woman with a bump who I knew had been ttc. Just so hard to watch one person after another getting pg / having babies, some of whom I dont think had even met when we started trying. It makes you feel more and more isolated. I have eaten sooooo much [email protected] as well (I have gone WAY beyond a little of what you fancy does you good) and I know I shouldnt be but part of me just wants to say f it, I am just so fed up with IF ruling my life. Anyway am off for follow up with nutritionist tomorrow so hopefully that will get me back into line a bit - but I have already made it perfectly clear I am not going to be strict!!! Sorry for the moan, things are ok really, just sometimes it all feels so sh!t and unfair - which it is, of course ...

Nix - congrats on being PUPO   the drug regime sounds a nightmare, tho I am always v jealous of ARGC'ers because they def cover every eventuality! I so hope this is your time  

Rose - I remember you, congrats!!! And thanks for letting us know. Wishing you a happy and healthy 9 months ahead

Kate - I have been a total pig this weekend as well, my excuse was the football but that doesn't explain why I have eaten the equivalent of a small country in chocolate today. And the night is yet young!

Hazelnut - it does feel really daunting when you get started but like you I really didnt hang around. I was under general when I had my HSG (was at same time as lap) but I had heard that they were fine. Good luck  

Suzie - good luck for tomorrow  , I can't remember how many days are you into stims? (you started mid week didnt you) The Menopur made me feel ill for the first few days as well (must be all that wee  ) I have acu with one of the ZW acus as well she is lovely

Mag - are you feeling excited at starting treatment as well? That means your birthday is coming up soon doesnt it? I absolutely know what you mean about being around families being a strain. Really hope this is your time  

Pix / Anne - hope you are ok and thinking of you  

Sorry that's all my football / chocolate addled brain can remember, love to all
xxx


----------



## LV.

I emailed Jeya yesterday about the protocol that Malini found and said I'd like to give it a whirl and asked if we could discuss it at the follow up and she's replied "Will do". A woman of few words but good she's open to discussions. We're still planning on going to the Jin (sent my form off tonight - yay!) but it'll be good to get her perspective anyway.

Evening Kate, Mags, Zuri, Mailini, Karen, Beach, Almond, Suzie, Hazlenut, Mir and everyone else

xx


----------



## purple72

Just a quickie from me! 

NIX congrats PUPO lady!! Keeping everything crossed for you for next 2weeks!!!

Rose congrats hunny!!

Hugs to everyone else!!!

Sx


----------



## fluffy jumper

There has been so much sadness here in the last few days    I just wish I could take away everyone's pain.  Or at least be as good with words as Malini.

Anne.  I hope you are safely settled back at home now.  Although I know you should take time to lick your wounds, personally, I find the best thing is to make another plan - or at least start researching another plan.
I just can't believe such crap has happened to two such wonderful people.  Life just chucks this crap at random people.  If only it was down to what you deserve to get but I am convinced there is no rhyme or reason to any of it - it just sucks.

Sam.  I woudl be interested to hear how you get on talking to the Guildford clinic about insulin resistance.  I know many others have answered your post about positive DE stories.  I am convinced of your DH view that those who have no issues about being donor conceived don't post their stories on the internet.  I know I would definatley be the kind of person (if I were donor conceived) to just not even think about it very often, certainly not enough to be talking about how OK I was.
I do think the issues are slightly different for those of us who have a biological child already as there will be a difference between them in how they were conceived.
It is probably wrong, but I am just going to not think about the issue and go for it and then worry about my/his or her feelings if and when they come up as thinking about them ahead of time doesn't make it easier, it just gives you stress now and later on.

Ally.  So sorry to hear about Becca and Hannah.      for the three of you. I hope that Hannah gets a better reading when she has been off the pill for a few months.
It is interesting that you say about frozen eggs being worse quality than frozen embryos.  Someone I know had her eggs frozen at about 36 - she is now 41 but just thinks 'I can have a baby when I want as I froze my eggs'.  She has no idea that IVF doesn't just always work if you give it a couple of gos.  I try to tell her but.

Nix.  Congratulations on being PUPO        Sounds like you have a lot of meds to get through.  When is OTD?

WingWing and Malini.  I might be able to meet you.  It is only a couple of days before I go on hols so might be too busy to escape work.  Can you PM me the details and I will try and get there.

Rose, congratulations.  You give the rest of us hope.

Sorry I have run out of energy for more personals but I did read all your posts (took about 2 hours to catch up from the last thread!).  We had my family for lunch today as it is Mum's 70th on Tuesday so I was up at 6am baking birthday cakes.  I had been organised an made it yesterday but it was a disaster so I had to make another this morning. 
She had a lovely day and is going to a posh hotel with Dad for her actual birthday.  

Lots of Love to all you wonderful girls.


----------



## laurab

Rose - Fab news!  I promise these poor quality embies still make perfect babies!  

Ally - Good  Break?

Pix/ Anne - How's you girls doing?  

Mir - Has bob got the pox? Poor lamb.

Nix -  

XXX


----------



## fluffy jumper

Laura.  I can't believe the chiplets are 4 months already.  How are you?  Do you manage to get any time to yourself?

Miranda.  I just looked at Roberts pic on ********, poor love. Max was lucky and only got a couple on his face.  His was two weeks ago now and he still has a few scabs left on his back.  Luckily they will be gone in time for our hols in two weeks.

Better to as it is about the right time of the month for BMS.  DH couldn't complete the other night so can't leave it another night without.  Sorry if that is TMI.

Night night (again), I really am going now


----------



## shortie66

Tracey oooo eerrrr missus        poor dh, be gentle with him.  

Laura - brilliant pic of the chiplets there hunny   

Hi purps - u ok hunny?  

Almond - i have now eaten the best part of a huge bar of mint aero and am on me 5th bottle og bacardi breezer   

Lucy - hope you hear back from the jin soon hunny   

Oooo i am tired, think im gonna gom to beddybyes in a bit i need my duvet  

Kate
xxxxxxxxx


----------



## Züri

Just a real quickie as just got in but wanted to say congrats Nix on being PUPO sounds like they are throwing everything at you to keep your little embie safe and it all sounds good - and wow IVIG did you have raised NK cells then from you tests? I have good feelings for this especially as they are doing so much for you - wishing you soooo much luck

and all i can say girls is that I am glad I don;t live in the UK as i think i would be very very busy doing all your ironing 

Hi everyone else, will catch up proper tomorrow xx

oh and PS hope you arrived home safe Anne and Ally hope you had a lovely weekend with your sisters xx


----------



## Ali27

nix - congrats!!  Brill news  

Rose - congrats to you too!!  

Anne - you back safe and sound?  

Ally - how was your weekend away?  

Suzie - good luck for tomorrow.  Will be thinking of you  

Lucy - great that Jaya is willing to discuss further.  

Mag - My Sunday was very similar to yours.  My mum came for lunch adn then i too lost myself in my veg patch and herbacious borders  


Almond, Hazelnut, Zuri, Kate, popsi, Mir, laura, Tracey, Purple..... Night night all xx


----------



## lucky_mum

Just a quickie before I go to bed!

*Nix* - yay!!!!  so pleased you had a blast survive the thaw and are now PUPO -  that this time will be the one for you - good luck with the IVIG tomorrow    when do you test sweetie?

*Rose* - congratulations on your  and thanks so much for coming back to tell us  - let us know how you get on - wishing you a very happy and healthy  pregnancy 

*Laura* - loving the new chips-in-bumbos pic!  can't wait to see them again! 

Lots of love and  to all!

xxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Ourturn

Anne - I am so so sorry, you and Jas really do not deserve this     It feels like life dishes out real sh*** to the the most undeseving people.              

Ally - I can't believe this is effecting all 3 of you, how bloody unfair    

Suzie - I stimmed on 450 of menapur and it made me feel as sick as a dog so I can sympathise, but it did work, so hang on in there.

Nix - congrats on being PUPO! Fantatsic that a blast defrosted.      It  sounds like you are doing everything possible. Makes me worry that my protocol is way too conservative (20mg pred from et, aspirin the whole way through, but lwm heparin only from bfp) I will def go to CARE and see if they recommend IVIG for me after this tx.

Rose - what fantastic news! CONGRATULATIONS! 

Hi Zuri, WW, LW, Almond, Hazlenut, Purps, Pixie, Mailin, Steph, Tracey, Ladyv,Kate, Ali, mag and anyone I've forgotten.  Hugs to everyone who needs them

Sorry I've not been around, its been a toughweekend. Friday was my EDD for the pg were we saw a hb, the baby would have been 1 year olds. So instead of celebrating our baby's 1st b-day, I was baking a novelty cake and a load of cupcakes for my friend's babies 1st b-day party on Sat   I had a total breakdown (after I'd finished baking) and cried myself to sleep. DH didnt even realise the significance of the date or the irony of my baking. 
I felt better on Sat and we went to the party. Despite being told there wouldn't be that many kids, babies there (as the friend isn't into the baby crowd), there must have been around 20, with newborns and a couple of pg ladies thown in for good measure. So I downed a couple of large glasses of red and focussed on my 12 week old pup. He was like the pied piper, the kids were all all over him, and he was so so gentle, even when in a 5 year olds head lock! 
I think the pills I'm on to bring on AF aren't helping my mood. Just 1 week left of taking them. Only thing is I'm worried that I will not have had a natural AF with this tx. I bled with my failed tx 7 weeks ago, and will bleed in a further 2 weeks, but that will be due to the pills. I'm worried that this will mean I will produce less eggs? Don't have a choice because of my pct's funding rules around my age. 
On the up side I have a v short work week as its our 3rd anniversary on Thurs. We're off to our fave italian and I will treat myself to a new dress. Just sad that we have no children to celebrate with us.
Sorry for the me post 
Anna x


----------



## Malini

Oh, Anna that's so incredibly sad and difficult.  I admire your strength to bake on such a day (well anyday at all) and to get yourself through a party.  You are inspirational.  So pleased your pup is giving you the energy and spirit to battle on but I understand your concerns about AF and treatment (not that I know that your fear it true, I just get worked up about everything when I am in the mix).  Congrats on your anniversary and enjoy your dinner in a great new dress.  The sun should be shining still for you, so hopefully it will all be very special.  

Rose, that's so great.  Thank you for sharing.  

Good luck Nix with Mr T and the IVIG.  I hope they don't keep you waiting around and you have another good book to read.  I forgot to answer you but yes, I have read the Time Traveller's Wife and thoroughly enjoyed it.  

Anne - hope this sunshine is helping wipe some of the grey out of life for you.  

To all of you good morning and I hope this week is kinder to all of us.

M xxx


----------



## Jumanji

Ali - what do they hope to gain by re-testing your AMH?  When AMH first came out there was all this fanfare about how it didn't fluctuate etc. so you only needed a test once every couple of years and people were told that their one test result was reliable.  Now it seems that retesting every few months has become the norm. And the Lister seem to be retesting right after an IVF cycle, which goes against the research.  I cannot help feeling there is more to this than meets the eye and I hate to be a b^&*% but I wonder if some docs (not all - Raef at the Lister didn’t test Purple's AMH) are using patients as part of their research to find out more about AMH cos they still don't know much about it.  I would ask what they hope to achieve and how different results would make a difference to their treatment of you.  Just my thoughts.

Sam - I agree with Tracey and others; many more people are going to post negative DE stories.  If you look up "prozac experiences" online you will find loads of horror side effect stories etc.  You will not find so many stories of how the drug turned someone's life around for the better, but there are far more cases of that happening than the horrendous side effects, which get far more publicity.  I also DO NOT think you are wasting your money looking at alternatives and continuing to try naturally.  There is so much more to all this than hormone results.  One of my favourite quotes from Randine Lewis is "in places where they don't know that age and FSH are a problem, they aren't."  Don't give up hope. 

Anne - I am so terribly sorry for you at the moment.  And don't rush getting yout head around DE.  the great thing about DE is that you don't have to decide this week, this month or even this year.  Give yourself time and, as you said, go back to being Anne and Jase again.  The other thing is, as I said to Sam, don't forget to keep trying naturally, since you are in a position to do so.  OK, you know you haven't got masses of top notch eggs but you NEVER know when you will crank out that one good one. 

Pixie - you know what I am going to say now!!!  The same applies to you. You can try naturally and you have been ovulating so keep the faith. 

LV - really sorry your cycle was cancelled.  I cannot help but think that you must keep going because your first cycle shows, you have it in you to respond fine.  I think your approach is totally right in that you are looking at a place which will monitor you more carefully and the Jinemed would be good for that. 

Steph - I don't pretend to understand but your posts on DE seem spot on.  I remember reading about one lady who was explaining how she would not have wanted a child with her own eggs now that her daughter was born because that child would not be her daughter and she couldn't imagine loving any other child more.          

Rose - thank you so much for sharing your news.  I do remember you and it is so good of you to come back and tell everyone.  Congratulations!

Nix - congratulations PUPO lady.  Now, are you sure they have you on enough drugs?? 

Malini - I just wanted to echo everyone else and say how beautiful and eloquent your posts are.  Have you thought of writing a book?

Ally - so sorry for Becka.  Could kill that ignorant nurse.   I do hope you and your sisters have had some happy moments this weekend.  I am glad Hannah is being restested off the pill.  It is important that she knows the score before panicking.  

Anna - I know this will be a hard day and I hope you are ok. 

Love to everyone else.  Sorry to to do more personals.  The thread moves so fast!

Looks like I am back on track after the m/c, since I think I ov'd on CD 15, just one day later than normal (I usually ov on either day 12 or day 14).  Luckily, I did not have to rape DP, which would have been a bit of a pain (not to mention tricky cos he has about 5 1/2 stone on me!!)  and we managed to  on days 13 and 14.  Not sure how the m/c will have impacted things so I am not hopeful this cycle but I am glad we tried.  I saw the doc the other day and he was reassuring and said he knew it was no comfort but early m/c was very common and it was a good sign that I got pg so quickly.  I am getting it into perspective now.  I have a friend who had severe endo (loads of operations while we were at uni and beyond) and went on to have a baby with IVF.  She got pregnant naturally after 2 years of trying and then had a miscarriage.  That must have been far worse than it was for me since she had been trying for so long and knew from the endo that it wouldn't be easy.


----------



## peewee55

Hi Girls
Looks like I'm coming to join you lot...should that be    or     

Am on day 6 of stimms at Jinemed Turkey (Hello Anne, Miranda, Lightweight) and only got 3 follies. It's my first IVF and I know nothing at all about response or drugs or much so bear with me. I'm wondering why the clinic is recommending cancelling the cycle though. Surely it's better to go ahead with 1-2 eggs now I'm out here already than to cancel and go through the whole thing again with a similar result? 

Feeling bit shaken up by it - but determined to go all the way to DE if that's what it takes to make a sibling for DD. 

Ho hum.....
xxxx


----------



## Wing Wing

Hurrah *Nix* - that is brillopads! Well done you PUPO girl! So, you can meet Malini and I on 30th then?!!! Hope you don't mind me asking but what is IVIG?

*Laura* - chippers looking great!

*Popsi* - what did you buy at B & Q - really miss that store here in Lux. It is so difficult to buy decent paint!!! AND there is no DIY allowed on Sundays - never mind a DIY shop being open - that would be scandalous!!!

*Malini* - did you get rid of all the weeds? Definitely preferable to ironing! *Zuri* - I am sorry but liking ironing? That is just sad!!!



Malini said:


> Zuri -any day you want to pop by and tackle my pile, you're welcome  Sounds like there'll be a queue.


*Malini* - sorry to hear about your anal troubles!!!   

*Hazelnut* - no experience of HSG but wish you all the luck in the world with IVF.

*Suzie* - hope the scan goes well and you have lots of juicy follies growing.  

Hi *Kate*. Would love it if you would PM me your poem. Thanks babes. By the way, your blood must be running with BB by now!!!

*Rose* - thanks for sharing your joy with us. It really is fabulous to hear such good news. Congratulations and keep in touch re progress if you can.

*Mag* - funny that you have practically quoted my doc in what you said about IVF being the unknown 20 odd years ago and DE probably becoming more and more common. He said the same and was of the opinion that it is already becoming quite common which means that, given a few more years, there will not be such an issue in considering it or for the children born as a result. I think now (having changed my mind) that after LOVE, knowledge and timing of informing the child are key.

*Almond* - I am suffering from "Too much of what you fancy does you no good" syndrome as well and have just come back from an appointment with a personal trainer/nutritionalist who just happens to be sex on a stick so am hoping that will motivate me if all else fails!!! (Don't tell DH girls!!!!)  

*Tracey* - it would be fab if you could meet up with us on 30th. Got a PM from Malini so need to read that and will then let you know where we are meeting. But will be somewhere near Bond St/Oxford Circus. Nice to hear you had a cooking disaster. I am sure my brain is being curdled by the TX drugs - yesterday I was trying to make béchamel sauce for lasagne and strained the milk like Delia said - trouble was&#8230;. I strained it down the sink and was left with all the crap I was meant to throw away!!! At least it made our guests laugh!! 

Hope BMS was a success honey!

Oh *Anna,* I am sorry to hear you had such a tough time. You are a really kind lady for baking for someone else's baby - that is sooo unselfish. Doesn't surprise me that your DH didn't realise significance - on the whole, I think men are much more future focused and he will be thinking of when you have your own child rather than looking back, I'll bet. Glad Benji is a success with children - stands you in good stead! My dogs HATE children which is not good at all! They would never hurt them but are terrified of them! With good reason as Molly was thrown into the deep end of a swimming pool aged 4 months by a little girl and Amber had stones thrown at her as a pup by the delightful young boy who lives near us. Gradually introducing them to children now. Both, oddly enough are fine with babies and actually seem to love them. I think they know the babies are helpless and won't hurt them.

Hi *LJ* - glad the BMS was not forced - you can get arrested for less!!! 

Welcome *Peewee* - hope you can proceed. As you say, seems silly to cancel now but I am not an expert!

Hi to everyone I have missed and love to you all.

WW X


----------



## fishface

A big   to all my PR girlies needing it, just popped on to see how you were all were doing and find all this sadness  

Purps, Anne, Ally, Pix, Becka, LJ  

Nix - well done on being PUPO hun, i'm routing for you  


All ok with us, had a few   on sat after too many vinos and being sat next to the PG friend of a friend, who is a crap mother to her 8 month old and is expecting another on little girls 1st birthday  

Have BIL's inquest on wednesday, hoping that MIL will then be able to start moving forward, things still crap with DH's family, sometimes wonder what i married into, hey ho, wouldn't be without him though  

Thinking of you all even though i'm crap at reading and posting these days


----------



## fluffy jumper

Hi Fish

I hope that the inquest brings some closure for MIL.  I remember with Marcus, Toby and Kate's it is something hanging over you then things get easier when it is over.
There is nothign worse than seeing someone being a crap mum when you know you would be a fab one.

I saw a girl on the bus last week with a baby and toddler.  Someone pushed past her to get on and she was fing and blinding and using the C word a lot and very loudly that she had a fing child with her how dare he push.  I felt like saying she was doing her daughter far more damage by shouting and swearing like that than he did by pushing past.  I wonder what she would have said/done if I had  

WingWing.  Look forward to meeting you (hopefully, I can't guarantee that work won't get in the way), I have an image of you being chinese/japanese due to your name.

BMS went well last night.  I have to get pg this month as AF is due while I am on holiday and I hate having AF when you are by the pool/beach every day.  Especially as I don't get on very well with tampons.  

Kate.  Would you be able to PM me your poem


----------



## LV.

Hi Peewee - welcome! Seeings you're already in Turkey I'd push to go ahead regardless, they let Anne go ahead with only 1 follie and they knew she only had 1 follie before she flew out. Can you not be a bit pushy with them? Otherwise it's a total waste of everything (and a very long way home)

Lucy x


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Hi peewee,
I agree with Lucy - I would try and push on too. i know it's not nice to consider, but you may get less than 3 follies in future and then you'd be kicking yourself. Have they told you why they want to cancel? I get the impression that they are much better with communication than GB clinics (ironic really, considering the language barrier  ). I hope it goes well honey - keep in touch and let us know how it goes.

Lucy - I'm so sorry your cycle was cancelled. It sounds like you're coping well though. I would have hit the wine box for at leats a week, only sobering up when I thought some of the pain had passed. The kitten is a lovely idea. Getting my puppy really helped - even though she's a 7 month old horror now, I wouldn't be without her. 

Fishy - Hi!   I've been thinking of you. I hope you feel better after the inquest. I'm sure you will. How's the ttc naturally going? About as well as mine?   I can't seem to stop hoping every month, and every month my body lets me down......

Hi Anne and Jase - hope it's comforting to be home again.

Well, I loved the sunshine over the weekend. Yesterday wasn't great though - I had a lovely time gardening then snoozing on my sun lounger when DP asked if I would go to the pub with him. I thought I ought to show willing, so went, but our 'friends' who were supposed to meet us turned up over an hour late. Just when we were about to leave. So of course we had to stay, even though it was getting cold and we were ready to go home for some 'romantic' time. They had a baby 11 weeks ago, and I REALLy can't bear being around them, but DP likes the bloke. I've never liked her. And she's turned into the most boring person EVER now she's had this baby. Honestly, after 2 hours of discussing the colour of baby poo, MPV's, nappies, breast feeding, I was ready to reach for the condoms last night. Sorry. I've become a bit anti-babies. Obviously it's a defence mechanism as I'll never have one.  

hello everyone else, Malini (I think you should write a book too!), LJ, Kate, Popsi, Wing Wing, Zuri ( i hink my DP would love to marry you. I NEVER iron.), Tracey (you just HAVE to get pg this month then, great practical reason!), Ally, Pixie, Sam, Hazelnut, Laura, Miranda. And so sorry everyone else I've forgotten.

Nix - congratulations on being PUPO! oh, how you made me laugh


----------



## fluffy jumper

Sorry Peewee I forgot to welcome you. How rude of me  

if I were you I would definately go ahead with 3 follies, both my cycles I went with two.  I suppose they are trying to save you money going to EC if they think you might get lots more on another cycle.  However, the fact that you are in Turkey and you might not get more on another cycle I would def push them to go ahead.

Hi Jo.  There is nothing worse than being with baby bores.  I know someone who goes on about her daughters schooling constantly.  Better than poo but still boring

Tracey


----------



## Jo Macmillan

oops, I need to clarify that, Nix, your description of your mum's support made me laugh! x


----------



## Jumanji

Fishy - nice to see you! so sorry about getting upset;  you do have a lot going on at the moment.  Some people really amaze me at how they are with their babies.  My sister was at a "twins club" meeting and one woman seemed to have come along purely to whinge about how awful it was to have twins, what a pain two of everything was, how it took up so much time etc.  She finished up with "I wouldn't wish this cr%p on anyone".  Another lady immediately said she would wish "this cr%p" on each and every couple struggling with infertility, which seemed to shut the loudmouth whinger up.  Kate spoke to the second lady afterwards to say how great she thought it was that she spoke up - this woman's twins were IVF too.  It is amazing how unappreciative some parents are.  

Tracey - hi there!

PeeWee - I am with Lucy and would push ahead!  do you know why they want to cancel?  What dose of stims are you on?  Are they cancelling with a  view to trying higher next time?  If not, it seems illogical since we know they let people go ahead with less follies.

Lucy - hope you are ok.

WW - I am pretty sure DP would be too embarassed to shop me to the police if I managed to rape him! 

JoM - baby bores are the worst; I am pleased that my sister has not become one!

Kate's dog has not got the hang of putting dummies in his mouth just like the babies do!  It means they get through rather a lot of dummies but have some hilarious photos of the dog!


----------



## Saffa77

Ladies

It's all over for me they didnt collect any eggs!! 

1 follie was a fluid filled cyst other was an endometrioma!!!! OH NO meaning need another op!! They now saying donor egg where can I get info about donor egg andwhichclinic is good without long waiting lists where do I start and howdo u go about contacting these clinics etc Am feeling so gutted about today my endometriosis must be really severe!


----------



## fishface

Jo - yep the TTC is a bummer isn't it, we are really struggling with the timing too, everytime we need to get jiggy with it one of his family is staying, that ain't going to happen   So the last two months have been a right-off, but i still get my hopes up and then come crashing down to earth at the end of the month   We seem to be socialising again too much as well, back to how we were before we started with the IVF at the beginning of last year, at least when you are doing tx, you can concentrate on something positive and rein it in a bit  

Tracey - loving the no AF for hols idea, i think i've used that one for the last 14 years though   Hopefully you'll be luckier than i was   

LJ - how you doing hun? sounds like you've got straight back on the TTC horse, well done, you are such an inspirational lady  

saffa -


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Oh Sonia - i am So sorry to hear your news. I'm afraid I can't really help with your questions. I would always say wait before rushing into DE, but i don't know how realistic it is for you to conceive using your own eggs as I know NOTHING about endometriosis. I do know that for DE clinics abroad will be your best bet due to short or no waiting lists. Steph on this thread went to Reprofit in Czech - she may be able to help you more. But maybe it's a bit earliy to make any decisions hon? take care of yourselves xxx


----------



## Jo Macmillan

fishface said:


> We seem to be socialising again too much as well, back to how we were before we started with the IVF at the beginning of last year, at least when you are doing tx, you can concentrate on something positive and rein it in a bit


fish - I dunno . I kind of feel that getting on with life, socialising, getting pi**ed occasionally and generally forgetting about IF is better for you than the other way. I tried the other way and it made me miserable, not pregnant. At least this way (a la anti-Zita-West-Way) i'm enjoying life while I'm not getting pregnant.

xxxxx


----------



## Wing Wing

Hey *Fish* - nice to hear from you. Don't know about your BIL etc but sounds like a sad story. Sorry for you hon. Sounds like you need some hugs!   

Tracey - that is so funny that you think I am oriental - at 6'1" I couldn't be further from it!!! Wing Wing was actually a childhood name my Dad had for me as he used to swing me between his legs while he stood up (he is tall too!!) and, as I couldn't say Swing, it became Wing. Sorry to disillusion you!

Hope the BMS works - there is nothing worse that AF on holiday - constant paranoia re leakages and white trousers.....

Hi Jo - you must not say you will never have a baby! What you mean is you will but you will never become a baby bore!!!

*Sonia* - sorry to hear your news sweetie. Not sure you need to rush straight into DEs though. I had bad endo and had it lasered away and then it came back and I was put on Zoladex (which is also used for down - regging) as it stops menstruation. I was on that for about 12 months (which my UK doc said was too long and 6 months would have been enough) but, as soon as I came off, I fell pg. OK, so I miscarried but I was 38 and it was the first time I had ever been pg knowingly. Only telling you this in case it is an option for you - especially as you are much younger.

I got no eggs at last IVF EC but no explanation as to why (Brilliant!!) and was told DE was the only option but have gone for a second opinion - appt on Weds so will let you know what new guy says.

Hugs to you honey.   

Love WW X


----------



## Jumanji

Sonia - I am so very sad for you.   However, I am with Jo - WAIT before rushing to look into DE.  I can't remember which clinic you are with but you are only 31 years old and if you also have current endo which needs clearing then they shouldn't be making judgment calls on DE at this point.  I would grieve for a bit and then go to another clinic and get a second opinion.


----------



## Saffa77

Hi all

Onlyhave one ovary which now has a endometrioma too soon I will loose that ovary too that is my concern!was on decapeptyl similar to zoladex but now got the cystsince doing this cycle don't know where to turn and which clinic am in Aberdeen at the moment


----------



## fishface

Hey Jo - you always make me feel normal, i would love an evening out with you, i think we'd be a liability togther though  

Thanks Wing Wing - great name by the way! very long story, but yes will be glad to get this week over  

Sonia - i have endo too and they lasered mine before tx, wait for your follow-up and listen to the options with an open mind, don't jump into DE because that's the only option they think you have


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi girls - just dropping in VERY quickly...

Saffa -     so so sorry. But take your time with DE, you can still do this when your 45! Clearly you won't wait that long.  Don't have your other ovary removed until you've seen one of the London experts on endo, and don't go to DE until you've had you've consulted with one of the really good clinics in London like the Lister ok.  there is so much hope for you yet.

Anne -     Hope your ok today hon.

Fish - nice to hear from you!  Did you ever look into that study I sent you at Cornell? I think you may qualify..... could be free IVF for you.

Ally - hope your we with sisters was good.

Pix - I hope your feeling more positive today hon.  I was crying all the time last week too, it was horrid!  Must book that counsellor 

LJ - I loved to hear how that woman stood up to that ungrateful whining twins mummy..... oh what we wouldn't give for twins!

So i've been on the pill for 21 days so had to have my FSH retested today, results tomorrow.  If it's come down (to below 15) I can start stimming, if not.... well we will see. Stay on the pill another week, pray then retest. If it doesn't come down they don't want to treat me. It's a pretty poor state if even the Lister don't want to treat you!  I've got all the symptoms of high fsh at the moment - I can "feel" when my fsh is high now, not sleeping, hot and cold at night..... really bitter and snappy with people.... so I'm not really thinking its come down.

LOL Sammy  xxxxxx


----------



## Jumanji

Sam - sorry to hear how you feel about your FSH.  We are all   it has come down for you.  Hang in there!


----------



## fishface

Hey Sam - keep   hun, you;ll find out tomorrow!!

Think i may have missed your message with the study info, i've only been dipping in and out recently. Would really like to see it if you've still got it - can you PM it to me - thanks hun


----------



## Jo Macmillan

fishface said:


> Hey Jo - you always make me feel normal, i would love an evening out with you, i think we'd be a liability togther though


yeah, we would, but it'd be great though wouldn't it??!!!    

Sam - I'm     that your FSH comes down sweetie. xxx

Off to salve my conscience by cooking a yummy chilli for DP tonight..I've been working from home today...in the garden on my sun lounger.....the pink bits are a bit of a give away...I did take work out with me though


----------



## TryMeditate

thanks girls - praying it's come down but not getting my hopes up.

xx

Hi Fishface

It's actually a link Malini found.  Cornell are doing a study comparing the E2/garlinex protocol with the microdose flare on poor responders - they believe what they will prove is that the Estrogen Priming protocol is better for poor responders.  Have a read of what you need to qualify to join the study, i think in order to fit you must be a pr, but not have tried either of these protocols before.

If they would accept me I'd absolutely try Cornell.... Dr Owen Davies is referred to as the "patron saint of poor responders" in the US.

I don't have the link anymore, but if you either google it, or trying searching by the word Fish in my previous posts you may find it.

Sam xxx


----------



## fishface

Thanks Sam - off for a search now  

Jo - hope those pink bits don't sting later


----------



## Swinny

Hey ladies

Just popping on to say hello. I am a cr*p team PR member at the moment. I am thinking about you all even when I don't get on to post.

Beachy -  

Nix - Congrats on being PUPO girl xx

Mag108 - Are you around this week, we need to catch up. When do you start hun??

Anne - Hope the crap tv yesterday helped a bit. Hope you and Jase are looking after one another   

Sam - Hope the FSH is low enough for you to get going on Tx    

Wing Wing - Good luck with your appointment  

Anna - Chin up sweetie xxx

Laura - The chippers look so cute in their little chair thingy's xx Hope you are not run too ragged.

Steph  

LJ - How are you? xx

Sonia  

Rose - Congratulations x

Jo, tracy, LV, Ali, Ally, Purps, Kate, Malini, Zuri, Fishy, hazlenut, Almond, Lightweight,Mirra,   Hello to the rest of the gang, hope you are all well. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Love Sarah xx


----------



## Spuds

Hellooo

Newbie here though have been posting on Lister thread for a while now.

Anne - I am sending you and Jason loads of      - I had no idea what the pair of you had been going through until I caught up on this thread today and just wanted to let you know how fantastic I think both of you are. I have no idea why some of us end up with this sh*t but know that you two are so deserving and you will add to your family one day I'm sure xxxxx

I'm fealing guilty about fealing sorry for myself - amh is 0.83 and first scan of first ivf only showed 1 follicle of 16 mm and 1 of 11 - still going to go for it and trying to keep positive but keep crying - that annoys me because I need to keep positive to keep whatever chance is in there at its best but all I want to do is cry and reach for a bucket of red wine  total pants.

Any inspirational 1 egg stories to keep me going ? - I wish there was a magic wand I could wave for all of us  

Jerseyspuds
xx


----------



## Spuds

PS - Someone mentioned a get together on the 30th ? Would love to meet some people - promise to be less negative by then !

xx
JSPuds


----------



## Jackeen

Sorry to gatecrash ladies, but your posts are really funny (mostly) and maybe this is a good place for some advice from another PR.  I had EC on the 7/4 and none were collected, then got a natural BFP yesterday, started to bleed and had a bad blood test result today.  It's been a weird 24 hours.    

Saffa, don't give up hope yet hun, you're only 31, I'd go for a second/third whatever opinion, where was your txt? lots of us have been told to go down the DE route and gone on to get pregnant.

Jerseyspuds, most natural pregnancis are from one egg hun, sorry best I can do!

Jo, you are very funny, I wouldn't have lasted 20 minutes never mind 2 hours, does she know what you're going through?, maybe one of us shoudl start a 'child free' pub that'd keep them out  

Sam, I'm really surprised about the FSH at the Lister, they haven't tested mine since cycle 1, just finished number 3!


----------



## shortie66

Hi ladies 

Saffa hunny im so so sorry      

Jersey - welcome to to thread hun   

Sorry its only a quick one from me, first day of diet and im bleeding starving    So just a quick hello to mallini, hazelnut, almond, jo mac (im still ur beatch) swinny, tracey, steph, pix, nix, natasha, sam purple, fishy, anne, lucy, sobroody, juicy, ally, ali, littlejenny, suzie, miranda, laura, lightweight, beachy, mag and everyone else. 

Kate
xxxxxxxx


----------



## Spuds

Hi Slycett - thanks for the welcome 

Jackeen - thanks for your message - what a crap 24 hrs !!! ......not sure if I can help but will be back in Lister Wed and possibly Thurs/Fri - let me know if you need a friendly face / coffee - Im always trying to suss out if there are any of us in the waiting rooms but people really seem to want to keep to themselves which I can understand.....anyway lovey the offer is there - I'm the one usually with long suffeing DH - both a bit portly  arguing over whose turn it is to get the peppermint tea in


----------



## almond

Just popping on with quick message for Saffa - Saffa I have endo too and it attacks my ovaries. I had a lap last March to remove an endometrioma but that ovary is still working - it is just a bit smaller than it otherwise would be and the op has obviously adversely affected my ovarian reserve. I don't know your situation but I just wanted to say that having an endometrioma doesn't necessarily mean you lose the whole ovary - in fact with a good surgeon you shouldn't. PM me if you want to discuss any more
x


----------



## May74

Hi Girls,

sorry not been posting much recently, there are so many of you I can never keep up!!

*Anne* hope you are OK  

*Ali* where have you gone, not chatted for ages?

Can I ask a question please...

Last cycle (that failed) I was on syneral spray 2sniffs twice a day and then menopur 375mg, I am due to start again on Friday and this time Jaya said to reduce the d/reg and I am having very low dose injections 0.2mls of Burselin to d/reg and then reduce it to 0.1ml when I start stimming with menopur 300mg. Now I was worried that seeing as I didnt respond to 375 I wont respond to 300 as it is reduced instead of increased , when I questioned this and said I was worried I was told a) the d/reg dose is reduced and b) if I wanted to take menopur 450mg I could (and I dont think she was impressed with being questioned). So    what do I do, its not that I *want* to take more drugs, its just that I am worried about not responding again- but I am not the expert

HELP any advice please??

Thanks

Pam


----------



## almond

Thinking of you Sam and sending   for tomorrow
x


----------



## Suzie W

Hi All,

Sorry this is going to vbe a quick message - DH is cooking and waiting for me to keep him company in the kitchen.

Sonia - I am so sorry hunny. This is so awful. Like the others I don't think you should rush into anything. I think you need to give yourself some time to process all of this. IF is such a struggle. I would get a second opinion. I think the idea of going to an endo specialist is important. Its true the endo does affect egg quality because of the cytotoxicity (sorry not an expert, hoping I'm using the right word). The immune system tries to get rid of the endo but in people like us it fails and there is a lot of inflammation. I think there is alot to do before embarking on the DE route - like strengthening the immune system (so that it can deal with the cysts) and reducing the inflammation. Personally I consulted with Dian Shepperson-Mills - clinical nutritionist specialising in endo. I've also been dipping in and out of Dr Beers book and he strongly advocated intervention from reproductive immunology. You're still young and that means your eggs are still young which is a good start. Take care of yourself first though - this is such a shock.   They may not have to operate to remove the cyst - how big is it? I developed an endometrioma of 3 cm on my right ovary but fortunately my body delt with it.

Anne -  

Sam -   re FSH testing/results

LJ - Good luck for this cycle. I hope you get that BFP!  

Jakeen - It sounds like you have ahd a rough time of it lately. Sorry. 

Jerseybuds - welcome! Someone (was it you Kate) recently reminded us of the links to the one egg wonders.

Pixie - Hope you're ok?  We're thinking of you.

Purps- how are you getting on? 

Nix -  

I just wanted to say thank you for all the good wishes re the scan and stimms. I don't know what I would do without all your support. I went for the scan today. I had hoped DH could come because I was feeling quite afraid but unfortunately he couldn't  . Went for acu first at the zw clinic which was great and it helped to relax me. The scan went to ok there are six follies on the right ovary - 3 much larger than the others (larger ones 11 - 12mm range, smaller one around 7/8 mm) and one very small one on the left. This is roughly what I had last time at this stage. It sounds promising but I don't really want to feel too positive as last time there was only one egg even though the follies looked good. So I'm   that it will be okay. I' starting to struggle with the injections they are starting to becoem painful. They have never been before. I'm hoping its the after effects of the acu.

Anyway better go. Dinner is ready. Hopefully I'll be able to catch up properly later - sorry.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## fluffy jumper

Jersey.  I got one egg on my last tx at The Lister and did get pg.  As you can see from my sig, it didn't last but I did get pg.  
I don't think it actually makes a ddifference to success whether you are negative or positive.  I was convinced with my first tx that I would get pg - I couldn't have been more positive - got a BFN.  I was much less positive with my second tx and got a BFP.  So, don't worry about crying and feeling down, if that is what you feel that is what you feel.

Pam.  I am not an expert but I don't think you necessarily respond better by having a higher dose.  I would have thought that they would at least leave you on the same.  They know what they are doing (I presume?), it is in their interests for you to have a successful tx for their stats.

Sam.    that your FSH has come down.


Kate.  Thanks for the Poem - it is lovely.  Keep at it with the diet, after a few days your stomach gets to expect less food.  When I am hungry I try and think that my body must be using up fat stores while it is being hungry.  

Jackleen.  How confusing.  Could the BFP be the result of the trigger shot still being in your system?

Sonia.   you poor thing.  I agree with the others, get a second (and maybe third) opinion.

Suzie.  I hope you end up getting eggs from all your follies.  

I am off swimming in a minute. I have to force myself to go - only 12 days until my hols now.


----------



## LV.

Pam - Tracey's right. PRs don't necessarily respond better with a higher dose of stimms. Your last cycle could have been down to your diet I believe so don't fret yet honey.

Hi to everyone!

x


----------



## Wing Wing

Ah but Jo - did you actually DO any work?!!!     Hope the Chilli turns out good.

Welcome Jerseyspuds.  Get together on Thurs 30th is gonna be in central London somewhere - any good for you?  Bond St/Oxford Circus area for lunch.

Kate - you poor thing.  Have delayed second appt with the yummy personal trainer until Friday so I have a few days of scoffing myself silly left!!!

Suzie - follies sound promising - good news hon!

Sam - good luck for tomorrow.

Tracey - have PM'd you and Malini.  Have fun (?) swimming!  Can't help thinking of Finding Nemo - "just keep swimming, just keep swimming..."

    for Anne - hope you are back soon hon - miss you!

  to all you other marvellous PR ladies.

WW XXX


----------



## shortie66

Wing wing - i am feeling very sorry for myself, and having chocolate withdrawal symtpoms    Enjoy the nosh up while u can, im very jealous 

Tracey - glad you like the poem petal. I'll keep at it with the diet, i seriously need to lose some **** flab i dont know where its come from all of a sudden    Enjoy the swimming, im finally going on saturday after buying a new swimsuit in february 

Suzie - well done on those follies,    for those naughty injections i remember them well.

Sam - hope everything goes ok tomoz sweetheart  

Pam - i have also been told that higher dose of drugs does not always mean better response, but we are human, we are paying, and we do have the right to question them  


Hello to almond jackleen and everyone else.

Had a salmon salad for tea, could just scoff a walnut whip or a mint aero tho.   AND i have finally sent off the forms to reprofit for a donor cycle    To be honest although my mind was made up i was still hesitating i suppose there will always be a part of me that was hoping it would be my biological child.  BUT now im thinking well of course it'll be mine you idiot, who else's could it possibly be, cos when i got given it it wasnt a baby, it was an egg, its dh's swimmers and my body thats made it a baby  

Kate
xxxxxxxxx


----------



## beachgirl

Kate   exactly, you'll be it's mummy sweetheart x


----------



## almond

Kate - first day of diet or healthy eating is always miserable as hell   I haven't quite got back to healthy yet today (oops), I need to take a leaf out of your book. I keep saying one more day / one more treat ... and now the days have become weeks. So exciting you have sent your forms off. I love your attitude to donor and some of the things you have said have really helped me.

Suzie - thinking of you and really hope this cycle is different   I have been meaning to pm you for a while to talk about endo and the immunology stuff as we are in a really similar position, would be good to chat some time 

Pam - I dont think higher stims necessarily means higher chance of success as Tracey and LV have said. I am going to ask my consultant about possibility of lower dose next time - I was on max dose of Menour for 15 days and I was warned it could affect egg quality. I was slow to respond hence max dose, but for all I know a slightly lower dose would have produced same no. of follies but better quality eggs. You are perfectly entitled to ask questions as the others have said - I think the people on this thread keep the Lister on their toes!

x


----------



## Han72

Hi all

Saffa hon  so sorry to hear your news hon but like the others have said, please don't rush into any decisions ok sweetie 

Anna  to you too, what an awful way to spend that particular day  . I'm sure the pill isn't helping with your mood either 
hon, but I hope your pup is helping to cheer you up. And I hope you and DH enjoy your anniversary hon 

Mag - did you enjoy the sunshine? I'm just like you, I just HAVE to be out there when the sun's shining, I've been known to walk the long way round to get to places if it means avoiding the shade and I am a lazy cow so it just goes to show!



slycett said:


> Mag - wow thats interesting - looks like a dusk time shag for me every night for the next 2 weeks then


 so now, not only do I know What Katy Did Next, I also know when she did it!   

LJ - glad you and your man got jiggy with it at the right time! How about you Tracey? Did you get yours too    Thank gawd the blokes don't read what we post on here, my DH would be  (poor innocent boy! )

Welcome to the nuthouse Peewee Jackeen and Jerseyspuds!  and Peewee - I hope the jinny lets you carry on with this cycle hon   ,

Malini and WW and Spuds (as ye shall henceforth be known cos Jerseyspuds takes too long to type and I am, as previously stated, a lazy cow ) I would lurve to hook up with you guys on the 30th, but I just need to figure out what to do with DH who's coming over for OTD on 29/4 and staying for the BH weekend. Don't worry, I'll think of summink!

Sorry there were loads more persos I wanted to write but I'm feeling a bit of cramping despite the ritodrine so I'm gonna go lie down

Love to all!

xxx


----------



## shortie66

Beachy - thanx hunny    

Almond - i got a right stinking headache.   Hunny you will know when the time is right, it doesnt come as a bolt of lightning one day, more like a gentle acceptance and the willingness to move forward   

Nix - Sorry ur feeling rough sweetie    Well you know hun, we have to keep trying dont we


----------



## fluffy jumper

Yes Nix, I did get my BMS.  Now trying to decide whether to try every other day between now and the end of the week or every other day.  Some say every other day but DH has been taking his vits and herbs for men so his swimmers might be up to every day.  Not sure I am though.  I can grin and bear it though if it stops AF while on holiday    I think if DH read this I wouldnt get any BMS at all  

WingWing, I am a shopping adict too.  I have a whole day shopping with some girl friends this Saturday. I am going to the new(ish) Westfield Shopping Centre for the first time.
I will look out for a 6'1" non oriental girl on 30th    Love the description of how you got your name.

Managed 30 lengths, I hate swimming but it is the only thing I am remotely good at.  People do give me funny looks when I leave as I always walk get into the car with my towel on my head as I hate wet hair running down my back.

Anne and Jason. Hope you are OK (or as OK as you can be)


----------



## lucky_mum

Hi all 

*Saffa/Sonia* - so sorry you got no eggs sweetheart    - I agree with the others, at 31 you are too young to have to panic about DE - that option is there for you if you need it until you are way into your 40s, and won't be going anywhere! and there is lots of research going on into stem cells from ovaries which may help PRs before you get to that stage    I agree that the best thing for you to do would be to explore your options for getting the endo sorted out/lessened, whether by surgery or zoladex for a few months and see where you go from there. If you still have an ovary, a good place to seek another opinion re further IVF with your own eggs would maybe be GRCM in Glasgow - this clinic was highly recommended by one of the girls on the Jinemed thread (Buster) - for either OE IVF or DE IVF (she used her sister's eggs and now has twins). If you do need a DE-specialist clinic eventually, I am biased towards recommending Reprofit in the Czech Republic as they helped me - their waiting list is almost a year long though and they are currently booking for March 2010. Another option would be to book yourself in for DE at Reprofit next year - they don't ask for any deposit or payment until the month before tx - and you could of course cancel this if you got lucky in the meantime after exploring your other options with sorting your endo/using your own eggs (I did this and had 3 cycles at Jinemed while I waited - was ready for DE by then and very glad that it was there for me as the next option when I needed it). Lots of  - take your time to get over this cycle before you make any big decisions hon 



slycett said:


> AND i have finally sent off the forms to reprofit for a donor cycle   To be honest although my mind was made up i was still hesitating i suppose there will always be a part of me that was hoping it would be my biological child. BUT now im thinking well of course it'll be mine you idiot, who else's could it possibly be, cos when i got given it it wasnt a baby, it was an egg, its dh's swimmers and my body thats made it a baby


*Kate* - I loved that - is a great way of looking at it  really hope you never need the Reprofit tx    - but well done for getting it booked so that it is there if you need it next year 

*Pam *- agree with the others that 450 might not get you any more eggs and may compromise quality - my UK clinic had me right up to 600 units by the time I had my last cycle there and this didn't get me any extra eggs, my best cycle was on 375 units... maybe you could have that as a compromise between the two? Good luck hon   

*Peewee, Spuds and Jackeen* - welcome to team PR 

*Peewee* - I would definitely push for EC to go ahead even if you only have 3 follies, as you said you are there now and have already spent a lot of money - also check with Romina as to why they haven't done any blood tests yet - that sounds odd! as I thought everybody got them, to check the e2 level. Lots and lots of love and luck from one Holly House-to-Jinemed girl to another!  and enjoy Istanbul - I loved it there so much am envious!

*Sam* -    for that FSH test 

I know I've missed loads but gotta go! lots of       and    to all

xxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Jumanji

Nix - my DP would be appalled at what I wrote here!  

Tracey - at least your man takes herbs and vitamins; mine will take berocca but that is it. I leave him alone cos he is only 30 and can probably get away with it!!

We think our cat, Posy, may be pregnant.  Her nipples are swollen and she is getting a bit of a belly.  I thought we still had time to have her spayed because she seemed so small and undeveloped.  However, it seems she may have been reading Zita Mewest and, given that she is 9 months old and cats can get pregnant at 3 or 4 months, decided she was in serious danger of leaving it too late unless she got a move on.  In keeping with Zita's priorities, the right partner was obviously irrelevant since I don't think the tom involved has stuck around.  We are not sure yet and it is hard to chase her around the garden with an HPT so we shall have to wait and see.


----------



## AoC

LOL Jenny!  Kitty must have been affected by the mood of the household...    We ended up getting one of our kittens spayed quite early, when she developed an unhealthy and unnatural obsession with DH!  

I'm a bit lost in this thread, sorry  .  But I did want to say thanks for the advice.  Yesterday's scan showed two follies (15mm and 16mm) and some smaller ones (<10mm).  They were talking about cancelling, but luckily went and got the doc who said that there didn't seem much point cancelling again, as I'd likely get the same response again.  So I persuaded them to give me two more days on top dose (I've been on 300iu for 8 days, and 450iu for 4 days) with a mind to an EC on Friday.

Wow.    We're actually talking about an EC.

Doc also said something interesting - she said that if stims have shown no result, then they almost discount those days of stims.  When they up the dose, they count stims as starting from the new dose... so with my example above, as far as she's concerned, I've only been stimming 4 days.  (Funny, I sure remember sticking needles in me for longer than 4 days...  )

Anyway.  Thought that was interesting.

Pam - does that mean you're on short protocol?  If this cycle doesn't work, next time we're going to try short, because they can't find a reason for my poor response.  That said, I DO have endo, and have had endometiomas on my ovaries (I managed to get rid of one myself, while morris dancing.  Not a recommended method.  Long story.)

I'm so sorry, Sonia.        That's awful.

Thanks for letting me ramble on.


----------



## Little Me

Hi girls,

Just trying to catch up on the last few days but I'm at work so it's a bit tricky

Will be back asap

is everyone ok?

Anne
xxxx


----------



## Wing Wing

Morning girls
*
Kate* - 100% perfect attitude to DE! Think we will christen your little one "Walnut Whip" and if there are twins, Twix!!!!
*
Nix*, really hope you can make it on 30th. Just invent something to put DH off the scent - talk about "women's things" and that should put him off!!! If not, bring him along!!! Hope all is going well with you. What happens next?

It sure is a good job that DH's and DP's don't read our chat - I would be crucified - as would you, *Tracey*!!!



LittleJenny said:


> We are not sure yet and it is hard to chase her around the garden with an HPT so we shall have to wait and see.


    What a great visual image that has given me!!!!

*AofC* - (sorry but I am as lazy as Nix!), good luck with EC on Friday. Glad it is not a cancelled cycle for you!

 for everyone else.

WW X


----------



## Wing Wing

Hurrah!  Anne is back!  How are you loverlee?  Great to see your beautiful face on here again!    

WW


----------



## Kazzie40

Hi girls, Sonia sorry about your news but like the others said there are options for you to look into before going the DE route.   

Kate - the diet, I hate em, I have been on one for several weeks and have lost a bit but had to work for every single half pound I swear with the starvation and the swimming four times a week. I did however slip on saturday night, I had a big bag of buttons and some smokey bacon crisp sandwiches! I was craving choc so bad I couldn't think of anything else, however I had put 2 pounds on overnight so that clipped my wings somewhat!  

Well done for putting your name down at reprofit for DE, I put mine down about a week and a bit ago, I think it's a good idea to have that as a backup plan like Steph says but keep trying in the meantime with your own eggs.

Malini - Good luck for your appt, it's tomorrow isn't it and thanks again for the link to that info.

Pam, I don't know much about stim doses as being over the hill always require the max anyway but sure in some cases less is more as long the starting dose is not ridicuously low. good luck with your next cycle.

LJ and Tracey, Good luck for your natural BFP this month, wouldn't it be grand if you both got a BFP, I have put in a   taking into consideration how convenient that would be for your hols, Tracey  

Lucy I am still waiting to hear from Jinemed re the new protocol that Malini posted up, I will let all know what they say, though think it may be too late for me this time as I have taken the pill. It will be good to hear what Jaya says, when are you going for your follow up? Can anyone confirm that it is just one dose of 3mg of cetrotide 11 days after ovulation or do you think it's more?

Wing wing, how are you? Loved the story about your name, I too pictured a oriental girl!  

Sam   that your FSH has come down, when will you find out?

Anne, thinking of you  

Steph, you are looking blooming in the true sense of the word, will go to ** to see the pics better  

Laura - how are you and the chiplets? Did you come on as a friend to my **, I have a Laura on there but don't know whether it's you but would love to see more pics of you and the chippers  

Pix, I hope you don't mind but have PM you about microdose Lucrin. When will you be going for your AFC?

Nix - hope you are feeling ok with all those drugs but at least you know they are doing everything to get your darling embie to stick, when's OTD? we will all be   for you.

hi to everyone else, Miranda, fish, purps, Almond, nicki, peewee, spuds and Jackeen and to anyone else I may have missed mentioning,

take care all love Karen xxx


----------



## Jumanji

Kazzie - hi there!

WW - and you!

Anne - wonderful to see you.  Hope you are ok.   

Anna - interesting on your stims.  I think it makes sense to "start again" when they get you on a dose which seems responsive!  Good luck!


----------



## Little Me

Hi again girls,

Nix- Hope you're looking after yourself hun. Well done  

Lucy- How are you? The Jin will look after you hun  

Odette & Steph- Your posts were lovely - thank you so much  

Jackeen- Sorry to hear your news hun  

Rose- Congrats to you. It's nice to hear good news. Look after yourself  

Anna- Hope you're ok hun  

Fishy-   for tomorrws inquest hun. Hope it brings peace to the family  

Saffa- Gosh hun, so sorry . How awful  

Jersey- Welcome and   

Suzie- Glad scan went well hun  

Pix- Hope you're ok hun and having a lovely time with Sis and nephew  

Ally- Thanks for being so lovely and for my email  

Kate, Sarah, Purps, Lainey, LW, Sarah, Tracey- thanks so much lovlies for all my texts and lovely posts  

Mira- I would love to try again with my eggies hun, but feel that if the doc said it 99% would happen again he knows surely- or does he. Oh I don't know. All so confusing and stressful. How is little Bob?  

Peewee- Sorry we didn't get to say hello in the waiting room. How you doing?  

 and heartfelt thanks for your support and kindness to Beachy, Popsi, WW, LJ, Mag, Jo, Zuri,Emma, Karen, Malini, Pam, Lucy, Sam, Laura, Ali, Pam

You girls are the best, thank you  

Back at work today, it's fine  
yesterday we did the garden and I planted 13 pots. I was really pleased actually, it felt nice and took my mind off stuff for a little while.

Love
Anne (and Jas)
xxxx


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Hi Anne - great to have you back lovely. And you're sounding quite chipper.


----------



## AoC

Good to see you back home again, Anne.        Nothing like a bit of gardening in the sunshine to soothe the soul.  

Thanks WW and LittleJ.


----------



## Little Me

Hi Jo- trying my best hun yes  

Hi LJ, WW, AnnaofC, karen

xx


----------



## Malini

I am dizzy. 24 hrs away from you all and I've missed loads. Welcome to the newbies, I will get to know you better and post more soon. Today, I must dash b/c I feel it is my duty to enjoy good weather because I complain too often about it.

But first for Anne 

And Sonia , I am so sorry.

To LJ and WW who mention bookwriting - well girls you've uncovered my dream. My dh has been after me about it, and I worked in publishing for years rewriting authors' shoddy text (legal books, so not fiction like I wanted) BUT I am so self critical that I think it would be a tough prospect. Does the world need another book about IF, it is all I could write about now?

For the stims quantity debate - I have got three follicles on 150 iu Menopur, 300 iu Gonal-F, and 600 iu Fostimon......

Kazzie - I have tried to reply to your PM but your inbox is full. I don't know the answers to your questions b/c I haven't pursued that clinic yet, sorry. I really wish I did.

And there was metion about Cornell - this is the link: http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00826839
Ali and I wrote to them and they aren't actually offering any funds or assistance to be on it  So it is really only for people who have already decided to cycle with them.

Sorry my loves, must go....  for you all. I will be back properly this week with meaningful persos

Malini xx

PS Can't wait to see everyone on the 30th.


----------



## Wing Wing

Hi *Kaz*, I am fine thanks hon. Hope you are too. Quite looking forward to my appointment with Mr Nice Doc tomorrow. I feel then at least I will know if there is any hope of success with own eggs although have already made an appointment to see the guys in Barcelona re DE. There is no waiting list!!!

Hi *LJ* - still not been arrested then - glad as that means all BMS has been voluntary!! 

Hi *Malini* - enjoy the sun! 
*
Anne* - glad you are feeling ok enough to be at work. It probably helps as it takes your mind off other things. Be gentle on yourself thougth and take it easy hey? 

Have a good day everyone. Off to a management lunch now so will be taking the opportunity to have some yummy food! AND dessert!!

WW X


----------



## AoC

Malini - do you want to write fiction?  I'd say go for it.  And I speak as writer who achieved her dream and is a published novelist (romantic suspense for the US market, US publisher).

For most of my adult life I've had two dreams - get published, and get pregnant.

Now I'm working on the second one.


----------



## Saffa77

ladies

where do you think i turn to now?  I am in Scotland how would I go about going to say Lister etc?? would it work having treatment in Lister and living here in Scotland or should I try another clinic here in Scotland?? Do you think I should give IVF another bash even though when doctor phoned me last night she said that the follicles had some blood cells in them but no sight of any egg is worrying and that I have premature ageing ovaries.  Would you spend money and go to another clinic closer to home or spend more money and go to say Lister that I hear is good or just go abroad for donor egg  

Sx


----------



## Little Me

saffa- What a dillema for you hun  
I PERSONALLY would give TX abroad a shot? Thats my opinion hun. The Lister were good but the travelling even for me from Birmingham was hard. I only paid £1000 for a full cycle of ICSI (they refunded the £350.00 as there was no ET. Having had this happen at the Lister in Jan I still had to pay for all TX which was £4300.00. TX abroad is defo less stressful if you can spare the time / holidays etc. I can only speak from eprsonal experience hun. Let me know if you need any help/info on Jinemed


----------



## Ourturn

Maini – thanks for your kind words. The truth is I’m not inspirational, but simply over compensating with the baking to ‘appear’ ok to the outside world.

LJ – its great that you ov’d on cd15, shows your body has sprung back/recovered very quickly. Congratulations to your kitty! I was in hysterics thinking about you running after her with a hpt! I think a trip to the vet may be your best bet! 

Peewee- hope you pressed for EC

WW – thanks for the kind words. Your poor doggies…they have long memories don’t they? I’m sure they will be fine when you have your own as they will see them growing everyday. Our pup was shaking the 2nd time we took him to the vets…he remembered the 1st lot of jabs! You are right about men being future focussed. 

Fishface – sorry you are having family troubles. 

Jo – that woman sounds like a nightmare. Does she know about your situation? 

Sonia – I’m so sorry.

Kate – I love love your attitude! 

Nix – thank you 

Anna of C – great news re ec

Anne – great to see you back! Gardening is so therapeutic. I plan to get planting this weekend. We spent a fortune putting in 4 raised veg borders last year and so far I have only planted up one of them! 

Saffa - sorry I can't advise you but Anne has

I had better get back to work! 

Anna x


----------



## Overthemoon

Morning ladies 

Anne, _really_ lovely to have you back 

Saffa, I would think along the same lines as Anne. I travelled to the Lister for my first tx and stayed there for the week of EC and the whole ICSI cycle including drugs cost us near to £7000. It's cheaper to fly abroad than to get a train from Yorkshire to London. Jinemed is £800 for meds and £1500 for ICSI, less if you have the initial scans at home and fly out for 10 days as Anne did. And apparently the treatment and service there is so much better than here in the UK based on other peoples experiences. PR girls get a rough deal in the UK as not many clinics are even prepared to give us a go.

Nix, congratulations on being PUPO hun!     

Pixie, where are you? 

Hello everyone else 

LW xxx


----------



## Jo Macmillan

Hi girls,

Anna - yes, she does know of my situation. This is the woman who told me she knew how I felt as it had taken her 3 months to get pregnant and  those three months had been 'so hard.' Try 7 years love.  

Anyway, just talking about her  has made me angry, so I gotta go. I seem to going through the 'anger' stage of IF at the moment. Bloody DP has invited them over for a bbq on saturday...until he saw my face and then promised he would come up with an excuse to cancel......    

jo xx

PS Malini - I agree with Aof C (you remind me of sausages.) You should go for it, you have a real talent. And why not write about IF? I for one have been looking for stories / fiction on IF and can't seem to find much. It's always been my dream to write for a living, but I know I haven't got the ability. But you have, so go for it!!!!

PPS - Hi Lightweight - you snuck in there!


----------



## Overthemoon

Morning Jo!

Anne, did you fly from London to Istanbul with BA?

Pam, forgot to ask, did you sell you house in the end?

LW xx


----------



## Jumanji

Jo - 3 months! what planet is she on?  I got pg in 3 months and I know that is no time at all and anything but "hard".  I'm sorry but that level of ignorance makes me angry.   Even if someone has no experience of a loved one dealing with IF they should know that even helathy, fertile couples will normally take 6 months or so!!  3 months is extremely lucky!!!


----------



## Little Me

Jo- WTF?      

LW- Yep- it cost 99.00 each - coming backi would have been about 1300.00 though cos it was end of Easter.
Ended up on Easyjet at £500.00   cos we were desperate to come home
x


----------



## Kazzie40

hi anne, welcome back 

Malini - thanks for letting me know about the inbox being full, I will have to delete some stuff! I don't know whether its just me anyone or does that article just say cetrotide 3mg on 11 days after ov, which I can't work out means just the one dose (which it may well be because that is a big dose of it!) Malini could you let me know the email of the author I could always email her and ask! thanks for your help.

the link to the article is http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=Carolyn+Givens+Poor+responders&meta=

Jo - that 'friend' of yours  glad DH is going to make excuses for you to get out of them coming over for a BBQ just what you need - NOT!

Saffa - I also agree that maybe try a clinic abroad since London is not convenient for you plus its so much cheaper as a bonus too which is better when you know your odds are low like mine!

Hello LW, Anna, Sarah

LW I booked on airline network last time and did turkish airline, ok if you want to book in advance, they have the whole range of flights available on airline network not just turkish airlines. This time will leave it until the day or so before so probably will go to Swiss Air as Turkish airline get very expensive the closer you get to the day.

love Karen xxx

/links


----------



## dimsum

Hi everyone!

I read this thread everyday and follow everyone's journey but I don't often post. Today I'm being selfish and posting because I could do with a boost! I start stimming on ICSI #4 today at my local clinic in the Middle East, which I discounted after moving here 18 months ago (I'm from London) as I thought it would be a waste of time (not up to Western standards, mind-boggling bureaucracy, etc.) However, after 2 goes at the Lister and one at SIRM I've decided, what the heck, let's give my local docs a go - the outcome couldn't be any worse and they are sooooo much cheaper (and get cheaper with each subsequent attempt ) Here's hoping that the time is right this time!


----------



## Overthemoon

Thanks Anne and Kazzie, I have just reserved seats with the Flight Centre on Turkish Airlines at £217 pp return from Manchester and there is a charge of £75 pp to change the return tickets if we need to change so not too bad. I told her we were out there on business   I'll have a quick look at the Airline Network to compare. I'm booking to go out on CD1 in case I'm a day early, I'm usually so regular so fingers crossed I am this month too. I ov-ed today which is on track for a normal 25 day cycle.

Anne, if you fancy meeting up at any time for a chat/hug/creamcake/doughnut/chocolate/anyoftheabove please just let me know

LW xxx


----------



## Han72

Hi all

just a quickie to say welcome back Anne    

Oh and:



LittleJenny said:


> We think our cat, Posy, may be pregnant. Her nipples are swollen and she is getting a bit of a belly. I thought we still had time to have her spayed because she seemed so small and undeveloped. However, it seems she may have been reading Zita Mewest and, given that she is 9 months old and cats can get pregnant at 3 or 4 months, decided she was in serious danger of leaving it too late unless she got a move on. In keeping with Zita's priorities, the right partner was obviously irrelevant since I don't think the tom involved has stuck around. We are not sure yet and it is hard to chase her around the garden with an HPT so we shall have to wait and see.


   Cheers Jen that made me giggle!

Sorry no more persos but am really trying to not spend all day sat in front of the pooter!

Love to ALL 

xxx


----------



## Little Me

Thanks Nix & LW
xxx


----------



## Ourturn

Jo - OMG I would have swung for the stupid cow.   What an insenstive thicko! I'm not suprised you cannot stand being around her.


----------



## fishface

Anne - glad to see you back - hope you're doing ok  

LJ - good old posy, hope she enjoyed her BMS  

Jo - don;t you dare let that woman into your garden at the weekend  

 to all xx


----------



## Kazzie40

LW - I think we got ours for around £186 - 188 each. Airline network is strange because you can put in exactly same dates and times and the cheap flights disappear only to return later. what I did was mess about within a day or two with the dates because if I remember rightly Fridays/week days are dearer to travel on or other way round, have an experiment you could find you could save by staying longer or going a bit earlier.


----------



## Overthemoon

Thank you Karen. I found another call centre offering return flights at £198 each so I called the first one back and asked them to beat it. They came back at £194.20pp and they allow a change of flight for £75 so I'm hoping that it will be relatively easy if we need to come back on a different date. So, that's it! We are now booked to go on 6th May


----------



## Kazzie40

Thats good LW, is that a change of flight on the way back or both ways? did you say it was the flight centre you booked with? which airline would you fly with?


----------



## Little Me

LW- Good prices! I really hope this is your time


----------



## Wing Wing

LW - well done on booking flights - not long to go hey?  

Saffa - Can't advise re Lister or overseas but others have done that.  I can deffo advise at least trying again and again - don't give up til you have explored every option.

Jo - you deserve a medal to even breathe the same air as that stupid ignorant cow - what a waste of space!   

WW X


----------



## Overthemoon

Hi Kazzie, I booked with the 'unbeatable' (!!!) flight centre. We're flying with Turkish Airlines. We can only change the return flight after departure and we have to change it directly with the airline. I would check the competition after they've quoted you though, that saved me £40 thanks to your Airline Network tip off. 

I'm a bit worried now though. Peewee is having a bad time of it out there at the Jinemed. Only 1 scan, no bloods, poor communication and they want to cancel with anything less than 5. Now I am concerned.   I know I won't have as many as 5 follies  

LW xx


----------



## Kazzie40

Hi LW - that does seem a bit odd to me how they are treating PeeWee, what protocol was she on?

Oddly enough I haven't heard back from Romina about my protocol so still waiting, perhaps she is waiting for Proff T.

Did PW go out from day 1 of cycle? From what I have heard hardly any scans and blood is very unusual for the Jinemed, I will be tearing my hair out getting mine done here. I have phoned the birth centre, and Welbeck hospital, so thanks for that tip Pix. 

I would ask the other girls on Jin thread for reassurance if you are worried. I know they certainly said they would take whatever eggs I had ( if if only one or two ) though in which case they would want me to come back for another cycle to save more embies for PGD.


----------



## Little Me

LW/Karen- Prof T actually was there when I had EC, his words were " I will look everywhere and find the egg" bless him, he was tru to his word. Lovely man, really lovely


----------



## Kazzie40

Just had an email from Romina, she says that as Proff T is not familiar with that protocol in the article which I attached he would prefer not to use it and as I have already started the birth control pill I am not overly disappointed. He said short protocol 450iu. I have just sent a email back checking they don't want me on the lucrin microdose instead.

LW hope you have managed to find some reassurance on the jinemed thread. It also does worry me when I read things like that but having also read so much more positive things as well I am going to trust them and hope for the best. I could always go to the other hospital if necessary but am hoping I won't feel that I want to and will stick with Jinemed. 

The IMSI issue is in the back of my mind of course but I also have to get to that point and that can be extremely stressful with the other hospital. Also I will get DH to leave a deposit behind at Jinemed so I have a sample at both hospitals and have a choice which one to go back to if necessary.

Malini, I found the email for the author of the article and have been cheeky and emailed her with some questions about it. I will let everyone know what she says if I get a reply.

The weather is so lovely today - I should also be out there enjoying it like it seems the rest of you are who are not working today!

Take care love Karen xxx


----------



## Kazzie40

Anne thankyou for letting me know about Proff T  - I have spoken to him before on the phone and he does seem really nice. I am hoping for Dr. Munip as my named doctor but don't know if I would get him, it would depend I suppose on whether is he there when I go!


----------



## Little Me

Girls- can I ask honestly...... After my 2 failed fertilisations, in total 4 eggs collected,  only 3 months apart and the Jin doctor saying he really thinks I would get the same outcome with another go with my own eggs, in fact gave a bout a 1% success rate- is it really really time to give up with my own?
Having a bad moment here and just needed some help    

xxxx


----------



## Overthemoon

Anne Hun, please give yourself plenty of time to think through all the options. As I said in my e-mail earlier, only 1 in 5 eggs is any good in the average fertile woman anyway and you do still have eggs there and you have regular periods. If only they could find the magic protocol that made all 6 of your antral follies in your last cycle produce eggs. There are still different protocols to try, it's just the money and heartache of a failed cycle takes it out of you alot. If you are happy with the DE route, is it possible to run your cycle in parallel with a DE cycle?

Lightweight xxx


----------



## Jumanji

Anne - I am with LW.  Take a little time.  If you want to try another cycle with your own eggs then go for it.  And continue to try naturally since you don't know when that good egg will pop out.  You can always move on to DE.


----------



## annacameron

agree with LJ
how long were you ttc naturally?


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Oh gorgeous one - I am so sorry that you are having to have these thoughts. I cannot answer your question as my are of expertise is not in quality issues. What I do know though is that ovaries are very complicated organs of which it appears science knows so little. They seem to be completely unpredictable things. Although our issues are maybe different it ultimately boils down to the same thing. When is it time to move on to other options? I hope that I will know when the time is right but like you, just now, I am still holding out for a natural miracle, maybe I will never give up on that. For me a step in the right direction was to accept after 3 attempts (and no bloody eggs) that IVF was not going to work for me. I am now reducing down my options gradually. Now I just have a natural BFP to hope for until I decide that enough is enough, we have waited long enough and our need for a family becomes more important than our need for a biological one. For you it is a bit difficult, your issues are quality, you did get eggs, if I had got eggs but I had quality issues I would want to do a whole lot of research into this subject. Can quality be increased? What protocols are good for improved quality? etc etc, look for women who have had poor quality who have gone on to concieve naturally or with IVF etc. I would also want a second opinion. If I was assured by a reputatable clinic that my particular issue was not improved by IVF then I would probably stop doing the IVF and concentrate on au naturelle for the foreseeable future whilst gradually getting my head around the other options. Also putting your name down on a waiting list ifor DE in most clinics doesnt commit you, Steph did this and was able to move straight to it when her mind was made up. If Ben would agree I would have my name on a list now too.     

LW is so right though, you need time time time honey xxxx

Love and hugs xxxx


----------



## Little Me

Thanks girls   

AnnaC- Been trying since July 2007
xx


----------



## Little Me

... it doesn't even sound that long that we've been TTC BUT,  it also seems like ages with all thats happened if that makes sense 
Never met the right man till Jason


----------



## Kazzie40

Anne - I also think take time to think things through and don't just write your own eggs off just yet if you can find it in yourself to go through more cycles. I think before moving onto to DE we need to do what we can to satisfy ourselves that it was really the only way. This is why I am determined to do a few more cycles with my own eggs and DH sperm before my turn comes up at Reprofit. 

The waiting list there is 11 months so it wouldn't hurt to get your name down there as it doesn't cost anything so if you do put yourself through another treatment you know there is light at the end of the tunnel. I certainly wouldn't rush into having DE at Cyprus because I don't think you are emotionally ready to do that yet though I admit the lack of waiting lists must seem quite tempting but I see the waiting list at Reprofit as a positive thing because if there wasn't I think I would be really scared to just go for it.

I have had a reply from that author of that article:

You do sound like the perfect candidate for the protocol. I think it does help to synchronize the follicle sizes. You could use the Cetrotide 3 mg dose, but in your case, I would have you take it 9 days after the LH surge in a natural cycle (you are correct, no birth control pills). she said day 9 because I told her my LP is usually about 12 days hence the difference.

Bummer - how mad am I going to be if I develop runaways this time eh? The only thing is I would never get DH to go to the USA as he hates flying so I would have to see if they would be willing to consult with whoever I was having the treatment with. Doesn't look if the Jinemed is ready to try this yet for the time being. 

Lucy be interested to hear what Jaya says to you. I have taken it as far as I can for the time being but had I not taken the birth control pill I think I would have tried to persuade the Jinemed more or run it past the other hospital but can't see them doing it either as they do everything by the book!]


----------



## Jo Macmillan

You know Anne, I don't feel that's that long. I've been ttc (#2 with new bloke) for roughly the same amount  of time, and I still feel that there's a chance. (on my optimistic days!   My friend had 4 kids - none of them planned, she never used contraception, and they just came along every few years - the first took 5 years to arrive. But as she was ambivalent about having a family anyway she wasn't too worried. i also know someone who ttc for 6 years, including 6 IVF cycles, 2 of those DE, and she then gave up. A year later she got a natural BFP, then once her little girl was 18 months she fell pg naturally again!

Like Ally, I personally feel that IVF would not help me, as I wouldn't get many/any eggs. So what would I gain? I also feel, (very unscientifically I might add!), that women who have few eggs and or poor quality (as they tend to go hand in hand as your body uses the good ones up first) have more chances of conceiving naturally with the fragile eggs staying in the body to fertilise.

So if I were you I would get your name down on the waiting list for DE and spend the next year having lots of sex (it's free and less stressful than IVF!) and seeing if you get a natural BFP. There's also, of course, not so much of a rush age-wise if you're using DE anyway, so no pressure to hurry up with a decision.

Well, that's my opinion! I'm sure you'll get lots of conflicting advice, but hopefully it will help you reach the decision which is best for the two of you.

Lots of love to you both,
jo xx

PS Hi Ally hon!


----------



## Little Me

Defo TTc naturally for as long as we can yes.
Cyprus seems good for us BUT, like you say Karen, it will take time to get my head round it.
I can't see me having to emotional strength for another own egg cycle to be honest, espicially with the  way things have turned out.
Jason too is not keen. 
It's all so frig gin tiring isn't it  

Bloody hell, I'm a right moaner today
sorry girls


----------



## Saffa77

Hi Anne

I totally agree with what Jo has just said.  I would definatley put your name down on the DE list as its true you dont feel rushed and also do you really want to put your body through all this stress of IVF again?  You have tried your best and have tried 2 completely different clinics and same thing happened?  so you cant say you didnt try.  I seriously think DE is not bad the baby has your blood running through it and you would love it the exact same.  I dont have an issue with DE at all. you have nothing to loose!  Anne are you unexplained?

Sx


----------



## Little Me

With the Jinemed in Nicosia Cyprus- they can fond you a match in a week or two so I can make a decision in a few months without a massive wait.

xxxx


----------



## May74

*Anne*

I dont think there is any right or wrong answer, and it is such a difficult decision to have to make, if it were me I think personally I would try 3 cycles before making the decision my eggs were no good, it is a big decision to make based on only 5 eggs. Even people who have good responses and 12 eggs could easily get 5 that dont fertilise, maybe they were just not the right 5. Plus you are on DHEA now and that may make a difference too. It is totally personal decision though as I know how difficult it is to go through a failed cycle, and how expensive too when Jase is out of work. Take some time out first until you have got your head around this and then think again

  

Thanks everyone for the thought on my next cycle, my gut instinct is more drugs will mean more success but at the same time, of the 2 cycles the most successful was with the least drugs  Ahhh it is so difficult 

*Lightweight* when are you off?, I am   for you, and regarding the house, same lot of people have viewed it 4 times each time saying def put in an offer tommorow and we still have not heard. I want to go and    them, the last viewing was Sat and they said def offer on Monday- needless to say we still have not heard a thing 

Pam


----------



## Wing Wing

Anne, I am with the others.  If you can afford another cycle and to run it parallel with a DE cycle, that would seem to be a good idea.  Deffo am with Saffa on DEs - don't have a problem with going that route at all.  As far as I am concerned, the baby will be mine and DH's and will be loved as much as any other.

Gotta dash now as off to see Lloyd Cole.  Anyone old enough to have been in love with him like I was?!!

Have good evenings all.

WW X


----------



## almond

Just logging on from work to welcome Anne back  

Anne - what a horrible dilemma. I agree with the others about taking your time. One thing I have in the back of my mind about donor is that there is not so much time pressure with it - it is not like with our own eggs, where we feel we are racing against time. From memory, the success rates with donor are pretty even across different age groups. Like you or I think someone else has said, the issue is more when you feel you have had enough and just want to move on. 

I also agree with what has been said about natural conception and poor responders. IVF has 2 main advantages: (1) it bypasses some fertility issues (e.g. not ovulating properly, egg not being released properly or not being picked up by fallopian tube, blocked tubes). Some of those things are issues for people with "unexplained" IF as well as those with identified issues; (2) it gives you a better chance of getting pg, at least if you are a normal responder, because it recruits a number of eggs. 

But for poor responders who don't need IVF for one of the reasons I have just written, it is difficult to see why it would be much better than ttc naturally. The difficulty is knowing whether you are someone who neeeds IVF or not for my reason (1), as some of the issues like egg not being released properly can't be tested for - e.g. you will still appear to be ovulating normally. What people like you and I don't know is whether our inability to get pg so far is due to something like that which can't be tested for (in which case, ttc naturally unlikely to get us pg!) or whether in fact it is just simply a case of it taking us longer, because we have fewer eggs and therefore harder for the body to find a good one. Of course, it could be the case that we dont have any good ones left - I really hope that is not the case for either of us  

I dont think there is a right answer and I am sure people in your situation have been told to give up and then got pg - but its a personal choice as to whether you want to put yourself through it again. I wish I had a crystal ball   

I don't know if any of that helps - I'm really sorry if not. Thinking of you  

x


----------



## TryMeditate

Wingwing - Oh I totally LOVE llyod cole.  I didn't realise he was still around!  How many people will be there, it must be tiny.


DimSum - I saw you are cycling again in the middle east.  Good luck!! Let us know how you are going.   

Anne - I'm with the other girls. If I were in your shoes, I would try to improve my eggs first.   The egg takes 4 months to form, alcohol, caffiene (including in chocolate I'm afraid), and white refined carbs (white flour, white rice etc), and sugar have all been linked to poor egg quality in one study or another.  Try cutting them out for 4 months and doing a whole foods diet.  Have you ever contacted foresight and done their hair analysis? Maybe you have heavy metals in your body that need cleansing.  You could also try the foresight multi vitamin program, you never know, maybe your not getting enough zinc or one of the other vitamines really important for fertility.  Do you use chemicals in your home? Switch to ecover for everything.  You could try to clean up your body for 4 months, then after 4 months do some cycle monitoring (£50 scans at the birth company) with IUI for a couple of cycles.  If this doesn't work for you, then you have DE option in front of you.  It will be hard to stick to the diet for 4 months..... but we know how absolutley worth it it will be.  If you really are sick of it all though I totally understand too.  If you really want to give it a go, look at foresights website hon, become a member, do their hair test... read what they tell you, and mabye give it a shot. 

Malini - thanks for posting that link to the Cornell study.  So they you have to pay to be part of their study - ggrrrr us poor PRs, we just don't seem to cut a break do we.

Pam - sorry I can't help, I don't have enough experience.

Ally - I was thinking about you and your sisters..... did you maybe want to do a call to Dr Checks clinic together?  I just wonder if there is a key to open the door with the 3 of you..... you know your first very high FSH was many many years ago, and you've had irregular cycles for a long time.  It does seem that while someone like me my ovaries seem to age very quickly, yours seem to go slowly.  If we assume hannah is following the same pattern as you, then at 26 your amh was 0.7, then this is a slow decline.  Some women have resistant ovary syndrome, rather than POF.... where they do ovulate sometimes, you just don't know when. I wonder if you and your sisters could have ROS?

Hi ya Jo, LJ, Ali, LW & Kazzie and the other girls on today.

Well my FSH came back at 2.8, I was sooo happy, so it looks like the pill has suppressed my FSH.   I really thought it was still high as my sleeping has been terrible, night sweats, and I'm a moody cow! My estrogen is also super low though, which probably explains the insomnia and night sweats, but apparently I'm just a moody cow!  In the words of my consultant 

" the low E2 may reflect the low endogenous levels your ovaries are producing which may be a true reflection of the real ovarian potential?".   

So next step is to book a scan, then if it's all ok start stimming I guess.  I'm a mixture of excited, and really really terrified.  I am really going to try to keep a level head through this cycle, and not get too focused on it.  My plan is,

Do this cycle at the Lister, if it doesn't work out, cycle using the EPP with one of the US clinics, if this doesn't work, Dr Check, and if this doesn't work then it's time to focus on a natural miracle whilst I'm finalising how I feel about DE and Adoption.  

It's really important for me to not get too hopeful about this cycle as I know if I do, and it doesn't work, I will fall back to be paralysed with depression like I was before.  So I'm going to keep focussing on the next step while this cycle is going on.   We get a lot of combined experience from this thread...and so far of us girls with amh of 0.1, Pix is the only one who made it to ET, and that was on a different protocol than what the Lister are offering.... so realistically, my chances are very very very slim.... and I really need to remember that and focus on the next stage of my plan, or I think I'll fall apart!

Hope you all have a good  night.  Big hugs and    

LOL 
Sam xx


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi Almond -  you posted whilst I was posting.


----------



## almond

Hi Sam, just about to log off and go home but that's great news re your FSH!
x


----------



## Kazzie40

yeah Sam, glad your FSH is playing ball! sounds like you have a solid plan of action, though who is Dr.Check?   We will get excited on your behalf if you don't want to, what your protocol for this cycle then this time?  hi Almond, how are you?


----------



## May74

*Sam* thats brilliant blood results, I have come to the conclusion that I am a moody cow as well, I blamed the hormones for months but it hasnt improved and I am not on any    , must be my natural ones then that i am too scared to have re-tested    whichever way... its not our fault


----------



## shortie66

Hello ladies 

Anne my darling like i have said to you before you do not have to rush into anything   You do not have decide today tomorrow or even the day after that.  DE is an option and if you just see it like that there is a ray of light at the end of that tunnel. Its not easy to get ur head around it i'll admit, and like i said yesterday its more like a gentle acceptance of things and not a lightning strike.  Please explore everything you can before you decide and give urself some time beforehand, it takes months to come to a decision finally and even then theres always little thoughts pop into ur head.   P.S thanks for earlier 

Sam - well done on the fhs test sweetheart   Good luck with the scan, i will ave everything crossed for you   

Just want to say a quick hello to everyone   im not feeling very socialable this evening, dh rang me today to say he had spoken to one of his friends and his missus is pregnant.  She is 44 and about 23 stone, they already have 7 kids scattered between them here and there and im so        about the injustice of it all  Then he asked dh if we would like to go over for a meal, luckily dh said we are far too busy thank god.  I really dont want her 4th pregnancy at 44 and 23 stone shoved in my barren face    I dont mean to sound so nasty it must be my hormones too.  Im off to do some research on immunes now, my appointment has come through for 3d scan of uterus and ovaries and certain immune blood tests.  I'll list them here and if anyone knows what they are for or if i should have any more please let me know?

Kate
xxxxxxxx


----------



## Suzie W

Hi All,

Kate - I don't blame you I also wouldn't want that shoved in my barren face either. Thanks for your wisdom re DE - its helping me thin about it too.

Anne - welcome back! This is such a hard decision and the others have said it better than I can - just take your time.

Sam - fab news! that's an impressive drop! How did you do it?

Pixie -  

Jo - hi

Almond - yes I would love to chat about the immune issues and endo. If this cycle fails I am def going for the immune testing. The cost is a lot. Apparently they need quite a lot of blood for the tests. I'm not sure if they'll get it out of me though. Yesterday they tried to get blood but couldn't even get enough for E2 testing from my hand  . I think they make me nervous and then my blood vessels near the surface constrict (well that's my theory anyway).

Nix and LJ -   hope you both get that bfp.

Karen and LW - wow! your cycles are coming up quickly - good luck!

Mag - I hope you're feeling better.

Ally - how is Hannah doing?  

Hi Steph, Laura, Rachel, Beachy, Ali, Hazelnut, Pam, WW, Zuri, Sonia, Anna and everyone else.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Little Me

Hi all,

Thanks for your comments  

I am just fed up I think. I have only drank alcohol twice since last September, cut out coffee, I have had tea though, been taking DHEA , stopped sugar in drinks and swapped to natural Agave nectar, yes I've had chocolate and bread but I can't believe that I have not done lots to try and help things. You see women who have drank, smoked, ate sh!t foods upto getting pregnant, (and some during too    ) . It's not bloody fair is it.   
Maybe I will have a look at that website- Sam, would you have the web address hun?

I feel so f'ing livid with it all - what a nasty old bag I'm turning in to.

Sorry  
xxx


----------



## May74

*Anne* what your feeling is normal and natural and I would be worried if you werent feeling  , it is like grieving each cycle that fails, but you will get thru it like you did before


----------



## shortie66

Anne - no more nasty than i feel i am being.   You are lovely sweetheart


----------



## mag108

Hey everyone
Nix - ha! I do the same, cross busy streets to be on the sunny side, cancel everything to be out in it! It got a bit cold up here when I was sitting out at lunchtime and I remembered what my ma used to say 'naer cast a clout til May is out'....

Kate: by all means shag from dusk til dawn...enjoy... I think my TCM friend meant LOOKING at the light at that time of the day (and the dawn) helps the pituatary....

AnnaofCumberland - good news they are not cancelling I wish you all the best

Sonia I was sorry to hear your news. I dont know a whole lot about your situation, but having read what the others have suggested I go along with the idea of having more medical help to heal and then trying with your own eggs again....

Anne-I didnt meet the 'right' bloke til I was 35 and we started ttc when I was 37. If I was in your shoes I would give IVF another shot. I am not convinced 2 cycles is enough to know that it will/wont work.
Another protocol may bring a different result. But I think its too soon after this last tx to really make a decision, you will naturally be feeling like you dont want to go through that all again. Give it a few months and see how you feel then. You know we will all support whatever decision you make sweetie! And its totally understandable that you are narked off bigtime, its a big f'ing pain in the **** whats happened. There is a process to grief, I am sure you know, denial, anger, bargaining, depression, acceptance.
Anger is a good thing, be an oul bag for now. 

X
MAG


----------



## almond

Kate / Anne - neither of you nasty or moaning, I feel the same as well. It is sh!t and not bloody fair at all

Anne - if you mean Foresight, its here http://www.foresight-preconception.org.uk. We did some of the recommendations, I saw a nutritionist who was a Foresight practitioner a couple of years ago. I'm a bit anti being really strict on food etc these days (I feel like I need some life!), but that's just me

Kate - I would be f furious as well. It is just so bloody unfair. On the immunes stuff have you had a look at the investigations and immunology thread because they go through some of the tests on there as well (first couple of topics I think) who is doing the immunes tests for you?

Suzie - my DP is away this weekend and I am going to start reading the dreaded book ... I'm planning to get the tests done before my next cycle I think. I gather it costs about £1000 at least 

Hi Pam / Kazzie / Mags

x

/links


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi

Kate - the best thing I found for interpreting immunes is read dr beers book "is your body baby friendly", and look at the website repromed for the latest updates as well. I found reading the book \ looking at the site more informative and easier to digest it all at my own pace than talking to the doctors.

Suzie - My fsh has been artificially suppressed by taking the pill for 21 days - I don't have a miracle cure  sorry 

Anne - I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes I'm good, then like a couple of weeks ago I am so fed up with it all that I feel like nothing makes a difference and I eat whatever I want  http://www.foresight-preconception.org.uk/ Here is the website.

I warn you it's a bit of a challenge to do their program properly - no chemicals in the house, no eating things like processed meats - so no hams, salamis, no microwaves, don't eat ready meals \ take outs \ anything heated in plastic, look at your skin creams and cosmetics and only use natural products, drink filtered water (not bottled in plastic)....... I don't know that I could do it again to be honest. For me and my fsh of 42 it just all feels like nothing I'm going to do will help. But you don't have POF, and we know you do have eggs so it could be worthwhile for you. Totally understand if you just can't face it though. As I said I try pretty hard, but I don't seem to be able to stick to it.     to you Anne, this is such a difficult journey.

Kazzie - Dr Check works from the US, he had got some women with POF pregnant (FSH of 164 etc!). He doesn't do IVF, but using estrogen therapy to "coax out a follicle", which works in some women. Even he says this is unlikely to work - meaning the chances of it working are really really tiny. If you still have a fairly regular natural cycle \ don't have POF \ do respond to IVF then I doubt this is the most successful approach.

Hi mags 

Off to watch some TV I've recorded now lovely ladies - nighty night

Oh Hi Almond - you just posted again.. Our posts seem to be in sync today  The immunes testing costs £780 whether you do them with Dr Gorgy or through the ARGC. I think it's probably better to see Gorgy if your not being treated at teh ARGC. At least this way you speak to the doctor about your results. I found through the argc, you don't speak to mr T if your not his patient, he gives a bit of info to the immunes secretary who then calls you, then you have to ask her questions, then she asks him, then a week later calls you back..... and it goes on this way. The info was conflicting and not entirely accurate. I think what kind of happened there with me was as I wasn't ever going to be one of their patients, Mr T wasn't really focussed on my results so I got answers that were given after a 5 second glance.... a little annoying as they were still happy to take my £780 for the tests! Better to see a doctor direct if you can.


----------



## almond

Hi again Sam   I am exactly the same as you with the food. I think it is impossible to do any of it religiously. And most people I have spoken to - TCM, nutritionists - say that there is no need to go over the top with it. I remember Dr Z gleefully telling me about how she has liver and chips when she goes out   Thank god - otherwise just something else to beat yourself up about  

I agree with you about Mr Gorgy, I think. 

Still waiting for follow up from Barts tho - pretty [email protected] given that I got my BFN nearly 7 weeks ago. Have appt at Lister on Mon to see what they would do differently with me

x


----------



## Ali27

Evening ladies  

have spent ages reading through so that I can post properly....

Sam - Great FSH result!  It sounds like you are approaching this cycle with such a good focus and perspective.  I have taken note    When I read your post about the diet stuff i was just devouring some G&B chocolate    Green tea has some caffiene - do you think that would be ok?  Dont think I can totally cut out red wine but am trying to keep it just to the weekend.  Unfortunately there are afew longer ones coming up so......  

Swinny - hello hon!  How are you doing?  

Almond - i totally agree with your post about DE.  Good luck for your Lister appointment on Monday    hope you get your other follow up soon  

Suzie - your scan result is great!  I am willing those follies to get real ripe and juicy   

Tracey - well done on the swimming.  I too hate wet hair down my back!  You plans for this Saturday sound lovely  

Pam - Less can be more honey    Try not to worry too much    The px can be adjusted following the first scan so perhaps see how you get on.    

Anna of C - Hope your follies grow for Friday  

Nix - hope you are taking it well easy!   

Steph - not long to go now  

LJ - i took your advice adn emailed Jaya - see below.  Thanks    Might we be seeing posy on Jeremy Kyle, the little hussy!  

Kazzie - I'm the laura on your **!!  Have you been scouring my photos for pics of trips??  

Saffa - i would say try the lister too    Dont give up yet if you still have it in you to continue  

LW - 6th May!!  Thats like 2 weeks!!! So hoping this is your turn  

Jo - loved your positive post about pg friends etc (not the stupid one - the other friends   ) I'm holding on to that ideal too though need to find someone to have the sex with first!!  

Dimsum - good luck   Qatar may be on my list of this goes well for you - which i am sure it will  

Anne - you sound like you are doing pretty well considering so please dont be hard on yourself    The suggestions from Ally and Sam etc sound like a good plan.  Are you going to continue with the DHEA?  Do you have an opinion on it now?  

Pixie - hope you are enjoying this week with your rellies.  How are you doing?     Thinking of you  

Purple - how are you doing gorgeous?  


Big hugs to Sobroody, Fishy, Ally, Mag, Missy (you about at all??) Wing Wing (missed how you got your name so need to read back further!), Malini, Lucy, Zuri, Sonia, Elinor, Lainey, Laura, miranda, Popsi, Hazelnut, Beachy and all the other lovely PR women. 


I emailed Jaya again today about why I have to have my AMH repeated before next cycle as it was the lowest it gets last time.  She said that it does not stay the same and my last test was in November so its worth doing again.  With the FSH she wants me to do that again as if it is over 30 she would recommend postponing to a better month.  Her emails are so short, they dont really answer my questions properly.  What I am asking her is a)how come she can send me my px now without the info from my repeated tests?  And b) if I have the FSH done next AF (May) and then wait for the result, start the pill the June AF as she suggests only taking it for 2-3 weeks, that wont be a cycle when I have had the FSH tested    But if I wait to test the FSH on June cycle, how will I know whether to start taking the pill or not when my GP takes about a week to get the results back?  Does that make sense?  We keep firing short emails back and forth cos i have foudn that if I ask too much in one, she only answers the first question!!  

Any suggestions/feedback?


----------



## May74

*Ali* I have had the same frustrations with Jaya and still not sure what I am doing and i start on Friday , she told me not to bother getting my bloods re-checked, and so I didnt cos a) I was scared of the results and b) it was Easter weekend. It is so frustrating. If you have your FSH done though with your next cycle you should be able to get the results that day so shouldnt delay the June cycle as you can start on the pill as soon as you have the bloods taken so May AF, day 3 bloods start the pill for 2 weeks and chase the results before the 2 weeks are up?

Pam


----------



## Ali27

Thanks Pam - trouble is i dont want to have the tx til june so was not going to start pill till beg of June with that AF.  Or am I just being think adn not understanding Jaya's emails or yours?


----------



## May74

Ali- meet you on **


----------



## Ali27

OK - just looked and you were not there.  You still doing your washing?


----------



## May74

yes- I only just put the machine on and the stupid things cant be tumbled so I need to stay up till they finish so I can hang them up to dry and then be up in the am early to iron them    god I am just so organised


----------



## May74

OK ** chat is not working, chat room here same password and name as last time?


----------



## dimsum

Ali, thanks for the good luck wishes!

I don't see any point in re-testing your AMH. Jaya once suggested this to me. I said it's REALLY low and not going to get suddenly and dramatically higher so what's the point? She had to agree and I didn't have it done. These tests all cost money which I sometimes think they forget we do not have an unlimited amount of! Perhaps as LJ said, they are trying to collate some stats but getting us to pay for it!

Good luck for your next cycle


----------



## Guest

Hi sorry to but in (again )

Dimsum - just seen you have done EPP with SIRM and did not get any more eggs than before - did they say why when they seem to think this is the be all and end all there?    

while I'm here   ...

Pam and Alli - Keep the emails short (though I am one to talk  )  I think they get an awful lot....and if you are not sure about bloods just call up the nurses? Alli - as your FSH is around 30, looks like Jaya is saying test FSH on the cycle before you do the Pill to see how it is and then after the Pill on the next cycle, though I may be wrong? To do this you'd need to get it done there for same day results etc?
Anne - I think you need the Pill first to really dampen your FSH(sorry   ) and if you have it in you, go one last time but somewhere where they can monitor you more than you have had during stims this time to see if that helps with egg development  - or ask for more monitoring?...Maybe DHEA is not for you? I also agree that you need to relax in life and a normal healthy diet etc is all that should be needed 
Sam - great the Pill did it's job, this should mean you have the best chance of stimulation at least   

Bye  

xxx

xxx


----------



## Little Me

Morning all,

Everyone ok?

xxxxx


----------



## Jumanji

Sam - I know you say it is just the pill but I am pleased about your FSH since you were worried that even the pill may not have helped.

Ali - I'm still not happy with the reasoning for your AMH retest.  First off, initially all the clinics said AMH only changed very gradually over time, didn't fluctuate etc. If they are now saying something different it just proves how the goalposts are changing and you can legitimately say you would rather stick to tests where they are in a position to interpret the results on the basis of many years of experience rather than new tests that they clearly don't know much about.  Second, and more importantly, what will it achieve?  Let us say your AMH has gone down. Will it change your protocol?  Probably not, because you'll be on a "poor response" protocol anyway.  Will it upset you?  Hell, yes!  And what if it has gone up?  Again, will it change your protocol?  I would say not unless it has absolutely skyrocketed, which is (not to be negative) unlikely, although you could ask Jaya this directly.  Will it make you feel happy? Admittedly this is probably a yes, but it is a gamble you may not want to take.  I still wonder if they are effectively getting you to pay for them to learn more, which isn't fair.  One thing I have always respected my sister's clinic for was NOT testing her AMH - their advice was it wouldn't change her protocol because her FSH was so high and it would almost certainly be god-awful since you do not hear of women with FSH of 22 and cracking AMH!! Hence they told her that all it would achieve would be greater stress and misery to her and it was best left.  Good advice I think!

On the nutrition debate, I am a firm believer that it makes a difference but not a believer in extremes.  I think the average 30 year old can get away with drinking, smoking and eating cr&p and still get pregnant easily.  There are exceptions but I would say this is the general rule.  The average over 35 I think needs to be more careful and these things will make a difference.  Again there are exceptions who can have wild weight fluctuations, drink heavily, smoke, take god-knows how many drugs and still get accidentally pregnant at 38!  But I don't think there is much difference between a woman who is sensible about these things and one who is extreme.  With the Foresight programme, I know it has very high success rates but I wonder how much of that is attributable to the main principles of healthy eating and a healthy lifestyle and how much is attributable to the extreme end of things such as clearing your house of chemicals, drinking only from glass and banning ham.  To give an analogy - a weight loss clinic could say it had success rate of 99% of its clients losing half a stone in 3 weeks using its technique of eating only an apple and a glass of water a day.  I agree that diet would achieve this.  However, I also think that 99% of people would lose half a stone in 3 weeks if they adopted a low calorie, if less extreme, eating regime.  I know we tend to malign Zita West here but, to do her justice, her clinic has an excellent track record too and it does not deal in extremes and ban lots of normal things from your life in the way that foresight does.  For what it's worth, I am drinking very little alcohol at the moment and barely have caffeine but I do have a cup of green tea a day and a square of two of Green and Black's yummy organic dark choccy every couple of says.  This and the green tea will contain a bit of caffeine but not much.  Apart from that I am just following a healthy, balanced diet.  Yes, I try and avoid additives etc. where I can, but I'm not obsessional about it.  And yes I lapse; I got pretty drunk a few weeks ago for the first time on months - about two weeks later I got my positive pregnancy test!!!  

On trying naturally, I think that it is soooo important to keep going.  I know we have ladies here with tube problems or severe male factor (e.g. vasectomy) which mean that the natural route is not an option.  However, for others it definitely is!  If your AF are still regular then it is a really good sign.  I think I have told this story before but my ex boyfriend was born when his mum was 49 - they had basically ditched the contraception when she turned 45 and using nothing worked fine for 4 years until she just happened to pop out that good egg.  I VERY much doubt that her FSH and AMH were stellar at this point in time.  I also very much doubt she would have responded well (if at all) to IVF drugs! Plus, her egg quality was probably not the best in her late forties!  But she was still having AF and out popped that one good egg!  I agree with Ally - they just don't know that much about how it all works.  One of my friends in the US had difficulty getting pg and went to see an "RE" there who told her it was really "more magic than science" and to keep going.  She did get pregnant eventually.  DP was also telling me that his parents took 2 years to conceive him and 3 years to conceive his sister.  This was in the 1970s when there wasn't really a lot to be done apart from keep going but it does show that even young couples can take time!

As Ali says, I think we could well see Posy on Jeremy Kyle since she has proved to be a bit of a slapper.  Both DP and I are pretty sure she is pregnant!  I commented last night that I hoped she could hold onto babies better than her mummy and DP got all sweet and gave me the "it wasn't your fault" speech.


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi Lukey - Thanks for that, though it's not clear whether this gives me a better chance at stimulation. Even the lister have told me that they can't be sure whether it's better to use the pill first, or worse as they can also oversupress our tired little ovaries   this is just their first shot with me. 

Yep, DimSum did the EPP with the SIRM and had the same response.  The SIRM are excellent at sales, but they never told me that it was 'sure' that they would get any more eggs, just that in controlling the LH the eggs they did get would be better quality.  

Anne - Hi ya hon.  

LJ - thanks for your - as always, very informative post!  I'd agree with you about not retesting amh, I'm never going to restest mine again as their is no point - your right it won't change my protocol, the only lower it could go is zero - and the SIRM have got a 40+ woman I have spoken to who had zero amh pregnant, so I'd still keep trying, and if it goes higher will only be marginal.  But I don't think we can disregard it altogether, it has shown to be a more predictive measure of how you would respond to ivf tx than FSH, but neither are 100% predictive, and how you respond is the best measure of all. I think low amh means your unlikely to have a cracking response to ivf, can help determine what protocol is best for you, and leave it at that.

The US Clinics..... 

I've almost got through consulting with them all, so I thought it may help to put out there what I have found.  My goal was to find the clinic with the most experience \ most success with DOR patients, and then listen to "their" advice on protocols, DHEA etc.. So here is what I've found so far. 

This is not specific to the SIRM, there is also Cornell, the CHR and CCRM.... the success rates for very low amh \ high fsh patients are appalling wherever you go - there is  no miracle protocol. But the US clinics do have a lot more experience than the UK clinics.  In the UK, women with high fsh \ low amh are told "you won't fall pregnant, go to donor eggs"...when what they SHOULD say is "you are unlikely to fall pregnant, but the Lister will give you a go".... so a lot of PRs fall through the cracks and don't try.  Whereas in the US, a lot - in fact most - of the very good clinics will treat PRs, so there are a lot lot more women trying.  

The Lister showed me the number of women with amh of 0.1 to 1.0 that they have treated over the past 4 years,(or women with 3 follicles or less).  It was less than 200.  It's important to note that a clinic like Cornell alone treats more than that each year.  SIRM collectively probably does too (but this is spread between their new york, vegas, long island etc clinics). The CHR doesn't treat as many, and CCRM have the best success rates on the planet, but the "volume" of very high fsh \ low amh women they have is less than Cornell or SIRM.  So given they have a lot more experience, we should probably listen to them. Don't get me wrong, I think the Lister is a top clinic and I'm very proud of them that they WILL give women like us a try, but we are also a very small part of their ivf population, and I do wish they would listen to the US clinics more as they do have the experience (though I also understand that as they don't have the experience of the EPP - which of course changes depending on how you are responding, I understand that they don't really want to be "trialing" a new protocol on us, as they don't have the experience to tweak it through the cycle). 

Though they are clear it is still unlikely to work (well CCRM and Cornell have been very clear on this with me that my chances are still very very low and I would be best to go to DE - SIRM and CHR wouldn't be specific - gggggrrrrrr, but did tell me it all depends on whether or not you get to ET - SIRM told me per "embryo transfer", you have about a 17% success rate, the difficulty is getting to ET, so they are certainly not saying that they WILL get me pregnant.).     What these clinics have all found is that for DOR, they do get more "lucky" with the EPP than with the microdose protocol.  Cornell (who has the most experience) is now doing a study, in which they believe it will show that the EPP is more likely to be successful for DOR patients than the Microdose.  But keep in mind that the success rates of either are still very very low, just that the EPP maybe LESS low.   Who knows, maybe the Lister will be right, and the Cornell study will show that both protocols are the same and it doesn't make any difference.

I read a lot on the pr threads on the US boards (ivf connections has a wonderful PR section, there are so many of us in the US   ), they also do polls of their members.  One poll I found really interesting was that of women with FSH from 15 to 20, 33% have had pregnancies through IVF. Most of the DOR women in the US have been using the EPP for sometime now, the poll is not age specific, but I hope you girls find this uplifting. 

The depressing part of the poll was when you got to my category, FSH 40+, only 2% had babies     This is in line with the stats that CCRM gave me.   Fertile thoughts also has a good PR \ high fsh section, but doesn't have the polls.

The EPP is also different at each clinic - unfortunatley.  For example, SIRM downreg using the pill, Cornell seem to use estrace - which makes sense and I like the sound of this as estrace is a bio-identical estrogen (unfortunately you start learning about the differences between bio-identical estrogens and not bio-identical estrogens when you have POF and are looking into HRT).   Some use estrogen injections during stims, others a patch.  Missy has the details of the CHR protocol, but it's different again.  CHR are pro DHEA for DOR, SIRM against for anyone with high FSH, CCRM are undecided, as the arguement is around whether male hormones help or damage egg quality, and they have seen studies which show that testosterone damages and that it also helps! I'm looking forward to the Cornell study concluding- either way, as it would be good to know if one protocol is more successful than the others or not.  

So there it is.... I do have stats for each clinic, if your interested you can download them yourselves from the CDC website, but if you want to make them DOR specific (which you should do, as you need to look at who is treating the MOST DOR patients - that is high stats with only 10 DOR patients does not make a good clinic), then you need to use the SART website.

As you know, my plan is to try a cycle in the US next.  I haven't decided between SIRM, Cornell or possibly CCRM yet. (CCRM are an amazing clinic, if I had any problem OTHER than DOR I would absolutely think they were the bees knees, but as they are in Denver it's not so easy for us, and also their DOR experience is much smaller than Cornells).  I don't think I'm a good test case of any protocol though.  My amh at last test was 0.1, but my FSH is over 40 so I'm in the "miracle only" category wherever I go....


----------



## Züri

great post LJ re TTC naturally, I have been told i have no chance of conceiving naturally but this month i thought what the heck it can't harm -  that one mangled tube that's left might miraculously do the job - I know it wont but you do hear about miracles happening - so for all you ladies with no tubal or severe male factor probs keep trying - I don't know about others but when we started IVF i just felt like giving up on sex after 3 and a half years of constant BMS but now after 4 months off I am going to relax about timings as i know its pointless and just try and get our sex life back to how it used to be - spontaneous and you just never know what might happen (in my ideal world I suppose  )

Hello everyone hop you are all well, not been keeping up to date much lately so sorry for no personals but thinking of you all x


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## purple72

wow you ladies amaze me with your knowledge!

Thanks for sharing it all with us   

Sorry for not posting much lately, really busy at work and with home life and also finding it hard to post at the moment, but I do keep reading and following you all

Hugs to all, thinking of you all

Sx


----------



## Little Me

Hi Purps, Z, LJ & sam  

Feel Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo  fed up today it's untrue

xxx


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## purple72

Hey Anne hunny!


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## TryMeditate

hi girls xxxxx

Anne hon, I know exactly how you feel      every day  I google the stem cells story for new hope!  There have been  no updates on this story since 15 april..... i guess there won't be until someone either confirms \ disproves the study     

Purps - do you know when you are cycling again??

Zuri - happy shagging   

I'm offline now for a few hours girls - must get some work done!

Sxx


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## Züri

Sam as I just said to Purps on PM the addition to alcohol back in my diet has improved things back in the bedroom! hmmm that does sound bad that i need to be ****** to shag my husband but no its more about me relaxing and losing my inhibitions a bit more - hubby is happier


----------



## purple72

Hi Sam, good luck with the work hunny

As for cycling again, not sure TBH have follow up on 1st may but feel will neep Lap to remove ?para ovarian cyst ? hydro ?endometriosis adhesions before next cycle so probably looking at June July, I'm not of the mind that cycling back to back is right for ME (my opinion ladies not a researched or evidenced based decision, just my gut feeling) so I think 2-3 months between cycles let's my body recover from the drugs

Thinking of you all

Sx


----------



## dimsum

Hi Lukey,

You know, the EPP was a bit of a mixed result for me. I only developed 3 follicles (my left ovary did absolutely nothing) which was the worse result to date BUT I did manage to get 2 mature eggs (which was the best result to date) although I still only had 1 fertilised egg to play with (which was the same as on previous attempts).

I wasn't expecting a dramatic improvement in eggs collected so I was actually pretty happy to get two mature ones. But the EPP was another avenue that I needed to explore. I wouldn't do the protocol again as it involves a HUGE amount of drugs (I normally try and keep crap out of my body) and is very expensive (because of all the drugs and having to pay for accommodation in the States).

I didn't ask them why I didn't produce more eggs on the protocol because they wouldn't have had a clue! I've decided there is a bit of science but a massive slice of luck involved where PRs are concerned. I am a firm believer that it does only take one - the same as in nature. The trouble is when you introduce lots of human intervention into a very delicate process (i.e. conception), you introduce lots of points for something to go wrong. If it wasn't for severe MF issues I may have conceived naturally and never known that I'd be a poor candidate for IVF!

So, I'm just remaining positive, eating well, not drinking alcohol, continuing to research ways to (supposedly) increase my chances and will keep going until that one damn egg decides to stick! 

And I'll keep plugging my DH with vitamins and have sex at the right time cos you just never know


----------



## Ourturn

Hi ladies

Re the diet issue

In one day I found out about two pg couples (bloody great!). One is a neighbour, saw him lugging stacks of stuff in from Mothercare, the other are friends. Haven't heard from the friend for months. They were meant to be coming around for dinner one weekend but then I heard nothing from them, now I know why! They must have felt akward. The (he) friend casually mentioned attending an NCT class in an e-mail so she must be at least 6 months. Anyway they're in their early 30's, both smoke and drink like fishes and must have conceived soon after their honeymoon! So I guess the younger you are the more you can get away with!

I gave up caffine a while back mainly due to the link with miscarriages (but I have had the odd cup of real tea whilst waiting for af for next cycle), drink a minimal amount (couple of glasses of wine at weekends) and nothing at all during tx (saying that I do intend to have a few when we go out for our anniversary tomorrow!), only eat wholemeal bread, drink no fizzy drinks, steer clear of artificial additives/sweetners ect etc BUT I do have a sweet tooth and partake in the odd choclate bar or slice of home made cake.  I have read some where that I should could out wheat beacuse of my raised nk cells! I will cut down on the sweet stuff with this tx but that's it I think I'm doing enough for now. Might feel differently if the next tx fails.

Kate - totally sympathise. How bloody unfair! We are constantly hearing obesity effects fertility....doesn't seem to be the case were I come from! 

Anna x


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## Brambles1

Hello ladies? Can I join your lovely board?

You all seem so caring and supportive of each other and I've been stunned by the fertility knowledge you all have - amazing. I hope some of you could maybe give me some advice... I've just had my second early miscarriage (chemical preg - hate that term!) in 5 months, so I'm feeling pretty low. But I'm also at the stage of trying to make decisions about what to do next. DH and I have an ivf review meeting at the clinic next Thursday and I'm trying to work out what questions to ask, whether to ask for more tests etc etc. If anyone has any suggestions...?

Both cycles of IVF have been pretty identical - only 7 follies, most of them empty. 2 eggs retrieved but both fertilised, 2 good quality embryos transferred. BFP with low HCG levels that creep up then fall. The most recent tx I was on low dose aspirin and I kept the progesterone pessaries going after the positive test, but to no avail.

I've been reading a bit about the old killer cells and blood clotting problems causing early losses but I don't know if these apply to me. I turn 40 in the summer and I just feel like our chances are slipping away and we'll never get beyond the stage we seem to be stuck at. Sorry to moan, ladies - I know most of you have been through much, much worse and have come out fighting, but I just feel a bit lost and bewildered at the moment.  

Brambles x


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## shortie66

Morning ladies 

Anna     hunny, i know exactly what you mean, im trying so hard to cut down everything i enjoy, im even having a bash at packing the **** up again, but what happened yesterday just made me wanna scream and cry and shout  

Ali - hunny just want to wish you the best of luck with the tx   Can you not do a phone consultation with her at all  Have a list of questions ready and dont move on to the next one till she answers you properly?  All these tests hun, they do ur head in sometimes    

Anne - i'll be fed up with u today hun, i wanna be out in the sunshine eating ice cream  

Hello to purple, dimsum, sam, natasha, fishy, zuri, lukey, lttlejenny, ally, pam, steph, tracey, mallini, almond, hazelnut and all our other lovely girlies 

Think i may get my progesterone checked this month (if i actually ovulate that is)  Just read back and realised i didnt put what immune blood tests im having   Right here goes but it is from memory

Complement c3 &c4
Lupus Anticoagulant
DS DNA

and 2 others i cant remember     

Kate
xxxxxx


----------



## Little Me

Welcome Brambles  
So sorry for your heartache, I can't offer any advice I'm sorry but someone will come along soon to help.
xxxxx


----------



## Little Me

Hi Kate- I feel so full of anger. I don't like it . I may have to disappear cos I don't want to drag all my lovely friends down   
xxxxxxxx


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## Züri

Anne its completely ok and normal to feel angry don't disappear unless disappearing will make you feel better xx


----------



## shortie66

Anne - hunny if you think it will help you then disappear for a while like i did, although i did still do rather a lot of lurking    But if it helps hunny stay   we are allowed and entitled to feel angry hun and really it will do us the world of good to let it all out.  

Hello zuri my sweet, how are you today?  

By the way clinic has just called and one of the blood tests is

Extractable nuclear antigen - i mean girls what the f*** is that    

Didnt the namce of the other 2, but the 5 tests are costing 200.00 quid and the 3d scan is 290.00.  Good job i have my flexible friend.

Oooo day 3 of diet and 3lbs lost already    Tuna salad for din dins and pork chops and salad for tea.  Im dreaming of chicken tikka masala egg fried rice cheese and onion nan and a nice pint of lager shandy tho   

Kate
xxxxxx


----------



## Ourturn

Brambles - I am so sorry for your losses . After my 3rd mc I had the majority of recurrent mc tests which included: 
Chromosone testing for me & DH 
Blood clotting disorders APS, Protein C, Factor V Leiden 
Thyroid 
various hormone tests 
All came back normal. Consultant concluded it was down to either poor egg quality or bad luck
After mc no 6 next consultant concluded that there was clearly a problem (no sh** sherlock!), but that I may have a condition that's not beng tested for yet so I would take aspririn and heparin (from a bfp) as a precaution. I did some researched and begged for a referral to Liverpool to get tested for uterine killer cells and bingo, I have high levels. Some of the mc's might have been caused by faulty eggs but chances are it was down to my body rejecting dh's dna. I took steroids from et with my 1st ivf try but sadly it did not work. I will start another cycle next month.
A consultant will tell you that due to your age, you will have more faulty eggs and therefore your chances of mc are higher. BUT I think its still worth you getting all the tests done, including the test for high nk cells. If something shows up you may need to take steroids, heparin or both. 
If my next and final free ivf cycle does not work I will be going to CARE in Nottingham. I will ask them to do the full suite of chicago tests (nk cells...blood gets sent to the states) and see if they recommend more agressive treatment, ie ivig + steroids. We will also pay the 2k to get them to test to see if the embies have the correct number of chromosones (very useful if you suspect poor egg quality may be the cause of mc's). Here's a link 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2009/jan/26/ivf-egg-screening-chromosomes
Hope this info helps you and sorry you are going through this 
Anna

/links


----------



## Little Me

Hi Anna  
x


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## Ourturn

Hi Anne 
Sorry you're not having a great day  
Anna x


----------



## Han72

Anne G said:


> Hi Kate- I feel so full of anger. I don't like it . I may have to disappear cos I don't want to drag all my lovely friends down
> xxxxxxxx


Hey! What's all this about missus Honey, if you do feel like you need to take a break, fair enough but please don't do it because you think you're dragging anybody down! What kind of friends would we be if we only wanted you around when you're cheerful? You have every right to feel angry and bitter and hurt and all we want to do is be there for you    That's the joy of this site and this board in particular, we've all been thru absolute bloody hell in one way or another, and you don't always find people in the "3D" world that can get their heads round it. But here, we all understand, we really do get it. And we all know without a shadow of a doubt that even though it hurts like [email protected] right now, you won't always feel this way. It WILL get better, it really will. And you'll be making us all laugh with your "poo stories" .   

And you'd miss all of this:



LittleJenny said:


> As Ali says, I think we could well see Posy on Jeremy Kyle since she has proved to be a bit of a slapper.





slycett said:


> Oooo day 3 of diet and 3lbs lost already   Tuna salad for din dins and pork chops and salad for tea. Im dreaming of chicken tikka masala egg fried rice cheese and onion nan and a nice pint of lager shandy tho
> Kate
> xxxxxx





Züri said:


> Sam as I just said to Purps on PM the addition to alcohol back in my diet has improved things back in the bedroom! hmmm that does sound bad that i need to be peed to shag my husband but no its more about me relaxing and losing my inhibitions a bit more - hubby is happier


  

I love my PR crew!

xxx

Oh nearly forgot - another one egg wonder story from the ARGC, a girl called PepperminT got her bfp yesterday after only getting one golden follie after stimms.... Miracles happen every day girlies    

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=178173.msg2974453#msg2974453

Love to all!


----------



## Guest

Sory you feel fed up Anne - it stinks doesn't it          
Sam - v interesting - and I'd say the same...I've had consults with all of those clinics too and the results are v low for PRs but as you say they do think they may favour the EPP for some ladies...the hard thing is that there is no consistency ie DHEA or no DHEA?, EPP r or not? what type of EPP? etc etc As you say it is pointless looking at the overall stats - you need a stat for "you" (ie one) and your issues....Hope the Pill has helped you....sorry if I was not clear, I was meaning that at least with a lower FSH now you are starting at the best possible place (ie better than if it's high) before stims   
Thnx Dimsum - that helps a lot ....Dr Sher had sold the EPP and antagonist/agonist protocl to me as a way to get more and better eggs so interesting to see it is not always the case  ...As Sam says keeping the LH low throughout is key, which is why the Lister favour the Pill and LPs first really I think   
Oh lots of luck Nix!

xxx


----------



## Little Me

P!sssed off as Jason had been entitled to Job Seekers allowance that he received until we went away, he then had to "sign off" as he was out of the country.
He hand delivered the relevant form to sign off and when he went to do the "rapid signing back on" he was told oh, sorry, we never got your signing off form so you have to go through the whole process again    
He's been today to the meeting and now they are INVESTIGATING him- can you believe!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  to make sure he isn't a fraud     
WFT is the country coming to eh?  

Oh Nix- Hi love  , just ignore me hun, just feel ff'd off but it will pass. Thanks lovely lady


----------



## Züri

oh Anne that is so crap about Jason why oh why does it all get so complicated this is so not what you need right now and can understand you feeling thoroughly ****** off and angry. Hope they end up with egg on their face after bloomin investigating him what a cheek grrrrrr feel angry for you both too xxx


----------



## Brambles1

Hi Anna,

Wow - thanks for all that info. I'm so sorry for your losses.    It's a lot to go through and it's not helped when certain medical professionals refuse to believe there's a problem... I want to go armed with as much information and questions as I can because I feel a little bit in the dark at the moment, even though it's my body! The article was interesting. We've already spent most of our savings on private treatment cos our local NHS has a 28 month waiting list for IVF and we've only been on it for...oh...20 MONTHS!! Ugh. I'll ask the clinic about screening though if we do try again. thanks for that - it gives a bit of hope.

Anne G - Aw, honey. Anger is normal in this journey we're on. I'm honestly not usually an angry person but this whole fertility rollercoaster would make the most patient and mellow person into a seething bucket of rage at times. After our most recent failed IVF, my father in law made a very insensitive comment and I almost took his head off! I just felt totally furious for a week. It feels crazy at the time, but it's a coping mechanism, I suppose. Don't feel guilty about it - be angry!! 

Brambles xx


----------



## Little Me

Thanks Brambles  

yes Z- I really want to phone them up and scream [email protected] down the phone but I know that's just childish


----------



## Ourturn

Brambles - forgot to say, get yourself a referral from you gp to your local miscarriage clinic and you should be able to get most of the tests (except for the nk cell) done for free. They usually won't refer you until you've had 3 losses, but if you point out you age that should do it. If it doesn't ...cry that might work! 

Anne - what a bunch of incompetent idiots! Problem is these guys are really badly paid, not an excuse but what do you expect when you pay peanuts. I would storm in there and see the manager and ask how can it be fraud if he's done everything asked of him, but they have lost his form through incompetence?

x


----------



## Little Me

Anna- yep, I agree with you. Oh well, sure it will get sorted soon eh


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Anne honey I am so sorry today is such a sh!t day for you    Please don't go, you are entitled to be angry and upset, this is where you let others support you   

Sam - well done on your fsh result honey - brilliant news.    

I am in the middle of it with Ben too. I have realised how unhappy I have been for so long, living in denial about my relationship. Not accepting that there is no relationship. I have to come clean to you all now as I feel it is pointless holding any details back as you can't comment unless you know this. About 6 months before I was diagnosed Ben and I were not living together as we had spent 3 months living seperately as I had cheated on him. There we go its out, please please don't judge me I couldn't bear to lose you all   It was a one night stand, I take full responsibility for my actions but I was very drunk and in a real state. Ben had gone away for the night after working away, it was his first night home in 3 weeks but had to go and see his father who was very ill with cancer. I had held the fort with his family in Norwich in his absence while his father had major surgery and was also battling with my hormonal imbalances which were making me feel really dreadful and out of control. I begged Ben to stay with me and said "I just feel so dreadful, I don't know whats happening to me" he said "sort yourself out I am going". I totally understand why he had to go of course but just really needed him there. I ended up going out with a friend, getting totally smashed and meeting someone. Most of the night was a blur after the tequila and I have regretted it ever since. Ben found out as I had exchanged texts with this man and he checked my phone. Ben threw me out and I got a flat temporarily. Ben begged me to come home and said we would work on things, I moved back home in July 2007, I was diagnosed as having POF in January 2008. 

Since then we have been on the IF rollercoaster and trying to mend our relationship and I am not sure that it is going to heal. Ben is obviously still extremely angry about what I did and I am desperate to resolve things because I want us to be together but also because I am panicking that if we don't then I will miss any chance I do have of having a biological child. We have hardly had sex since we were married, even less now than in the beginning (5 year anniversary in August) I am not sure who's fault this is, maybe I lost interest first, maybe this is where my POF symptoms started which include loss of interest in sex, who knows it is all a bit of a blur now after all this time. So as we are not really having sex for fun it is even harder to get him to have sex with me when the time is right. I never thought my life would be such a mess when I reached my 30's. I was 36 in Feb, should be in the prime of my life, a happy wife and mother. Its all such a mess. 

Ben has finally agreed to go to relate (although I have heard that one before) but feels it is unlikely that we will resolve our issues. I am so scared about my future.

I am so sorry to tell you all this but I couldnt keep discussing the problems I was having with B without giving you the full picture. 

A x


----------



## Züri

Ally so brave to share your story sending you lots of hugs, we all make mistakes xxxx


----------



## purple72

Oh Ally    

Thinking of you hunny, only advice I've got is about counselling, DH and I went before the marriage! Not the same problems as you more his family and how he treated me when they were around. We went to a Relate trained consellor, and I think we had 6 or 7 sessions, Best Thing we ever did! The wedding was cancelled prior to the sessions, but back on after! I can't say we stick to what she taught us most of the time because we don't but when things start looking rough one or the other of us remembers some of the things she said and it truelly helps! 

Hope things get better for you hunny! This IF rollercoaster really takes it out of even the most stable relationships! As long as deep down you love each other and want to move forward then the conselling will help hunny! I'd say book an appoint before he changes his mind, and if there is a waiting list at relate, just google local relate trained consellorrs!


----------



## Ourturn

Ally - I'm so sorry you're having problems with Ben   I'm sure no one here would judge you, we all make mistakes. Relate sounds like a positive step foward, I do hope you both go. 

Looks like I'm having an allergic reaction to the pills they have given me to bring af on! I have been red and blotchy since Sat. Called the unit up. They said stop the pills, take piriton and come in tomorrow for a liver function blood test! Said reactions to these pills never happen, but then again I do have a dodgy immune system! They said becasue I've taken them for 1.5 weeks I should get AF. Fingers crossed!


----------



## Little Me

Ally- you are a brave and beautiful woman and we are your very best friends. We love you and would not judge you, ok  
I bet you feel better for getting all that heartache off your chest? Well, I hope you do hunny.
We do things in our lives that hurt others and indeed ourselves in the long run but, we're human hun- simple as that- things happen that we can't explain.
I can't advise on Counselling, but Purps seems to have had success. I truly hope you and Ben manage to sort your marriage out- it must be a terrible strain on both of you  
You love each other and at the end of the day, if you've got love, you can pretty much conquer all- you two just may need a little help. It's amazing what these people can do sometimes to help
Lots of love hun


----------



## Jumanji

Ally - it is so brave of you to be so honest!   We ALL make mistakes and you were going through an awful time feeling like "something" was wrong but not being able to identify it.  Nobody can, or should, judge you.  I think seeing a relate counsellor is a big step forward.


----------



## missyg

Hi,

sorry I have been away from FF for so long - I have been trying to keep up. 

First I want to say a huge sorry to Purple for your BFN - it was looking so fantastic for you. I am so sad for you but with such a great response hopefully next time will be the one.

I don't think I have been on since Lainey had her good news and both twins were going strong. So pleased for you.

Sorry also to Zuri that your FET didn't work out.

Anne - so sorry it didn't work out for you this time.

So sad to hear of your news too LJ - a miscarriage is so heartbreaking. 

Ally - I just read your post and I am so sorry things are really totally tough for you at the moment. I hope you and Ben can sort things out. I am also so sorry for your sisters.

Sam - so pleased your FSH has come down. You go girl! Sorry I have been so rubbish at being in touch.

Hello to everyone else - sorry if I have missed any important news.

Well my hands are slightly sweaty as I am so nervous to put down in written word what I have to say. I have been away alot and I do have a broken laptop so it is hard to get access always to FF but the main reason I have been in hiding is that I got a natural BFP. It was my first cycle after my failed IVF where I got no eggs. I ovulated from my right side which is my only ovary that works and that tube is apparently blocked. I found out very early and went straight to Dr Gorgy and have had 2 x intralipids and now 1 x IVIG as on Mon at 5 w 6 d we saw a heartbeat. I had some bleeding over the weekend and thought it was all over but I have something called a haematomia (sp?) which is bleeding outside of the sac and is not great really. The bleeding seems to have stopped but I am not really ready to be excited as I am too scared. I am 6 w 1 day today. I have been told I am at high risk of miscarriage due to all my immune issues and should have had humira before ttc and I have just had the DQ Alpha test back which requires LIT which I can only get in Greece. I am back to see Dr G on Mon and hoping and praying there is still a heartbeat and good growth. 

I hope this can give some of you ladies hope. I know I may still miscarry and I don't think I will relax until I hold a healthy baby but the fact it has even happened up to this point is something I don't think anyone thought would happen.

Love to you all

Missy xx


----------



## Little Me

Oh Missy- What wonderful and inspiring news hun. So pleased for you


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Thank you all for your responses I really appreciate you being so understanding, I just thought "how can I get advice when my girlies only know half the story". I am not sure how much better I feel for sharing though as it really exposes me as being a not very nice person. I have left a message with a relate lady so hopefully that is a step in the right direction. 

Missy - this is wonderful news - I truly hope that this baby hangs in there for you!! Sounds like you have improved things dramatically with doing your immunes tx.


----------



## AoC

Ally, love, no one has the right to judge you but yourself, and it sounds like you're being the harshest judge of all.         Sometimes relationships get in such a mess, it's a mistake to think we can fix them on our own.  I'd really, really recommend counselling.  It's amazing how a situation that feels utterly hopeless can not only be turned around, but made to be better than it ever was.   

Anne, I know I'm a newbie here, but I'd say you had every right to feel and express anger.  Go ahead and be angry for a while, it's a great cleanser.  But get some sun, get some rest, drink plenty of water and eat well, huh?  

Oh, Missy, that's wonderful!  Congratulations!  I understand your fears, but remember that whatever happens, right now, right this instant, you're pregnant.    And that's a thing worth celebrating.  Lots of       and       heading your way.

I now feel like a complete and utter fraud.  After one cancelled cycle due to poor response, and this cycle also threatened with cancellation, today's scan showed we now had NINE follicles.... in my defense, even the doc was bewildered as to where they'd come from!  I'm obviously very happy about that, and so, so relieved.  

But I'm sorry I'm kind of here on false pretenses!


----------



## missyg

Thanks Anne, I have been putting off posting as have been so sure something was about to go wrong but I read your post today and just wanted to give you some hope - and to everyone else who needs a boost. xx

Ally - I don't think it exposes you as that at all. Anyone who has met you will know what a wonderful person you are. We all make mistakes. No one will be judging you. I really am praying you can sort this out. xx

This was the first time I had tried naturally while being on steroids so yes I think it does seem to be down to that and I was on 100mg DHEA for 6 months.

Thanks Anna and wow 9 follies - good luck!


----------



## almond

Just logging on quickly at work but had to reply quickly to Ally, Ally I can't imagine anyone here would judge you other than to think what an amazingly courageous and strong woman you are, am sending you a pm  

Anne - no wonder you are angry. I would be seriously worried if you weren't. I know it doesnt help to know it is normal, but it is and please dont go away unless you want to   As to DWP, can you make a formal complaint about them losing the form? Outrageous!

Purps - hope you are ok  

Sobroody - bummer re the reaction, hope you are ok  

Welcome Brambles, sorry manic here and no time for anything else

Missy - just seen your post, oh wow! Please please let it be ok for you      

x


----------



## Little Me

Ally- You are such a lovely, kind and special person, no one could think anything else. And if they do, (which I am 1000% certain they don't) then they aren't worth knowing anyway. OK hun? Just look at today as a step in a positive direction day  
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Missy- thanks, we are gonna try naturally until about October/November - then if my head is clear, looks like DE in Cyprus for us.
I know there is technically "no rush" for DE's but, I am 41 next month and don't want to be much older. Hope that doesn't sound shallow and makes sense?

xxxx


----------



## Little Me

AnnaofC- Well done, brilliant   

Hi Almond


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Thank you Almond - that means so much.  

Anne - thank you darling, I really appreciate it.   No you are not shallow for having those thoughts at all, you have a good few months to get your head around stuff and as I have said before I am happy to talk about it with you if you want xx

Missy -  

A of C - well done on the follies - hopefully this will inspire some girls who have cycles cancelled to carry on!! Good luck with the rest of your cycle.

My clearblue monitor has shown high for 4 days, today I have EWCM, I had BMS on Monday morning, have not managed to get anymore as B too upset about our relationship. Its pretty tragic really, I havent ovulated for months, and when I do I can't do anything about it. I think this is what has brought everything to the surface, I find it so upsetting to watch my chances pass me by. Who knows when I will ovulate again.


----------



## Little Me

Wish I could wave a magic wand Ally for you


----------



## AoC

Thanks everyone.  

Honestly, they could easily have cancelled on Monday.  I talked them round to carry on for a day, then said, "well, if we're going to carry on for one day, can we make it two?"

Scary how close we were to having a cancelled cycle again.


----------



## Jumanji

Anna and Missy - thanks so much for your posts! We could really do with some good news around here!!  wonderful news for both of you!

Ally - so sorry that you see ovulation passing you by like that.   However, I have to say that it is good news that you are still ovulating.


----------



## missyg

Ally -  EWCM today probably means ovulation in the next day or two or even three. Do you remember when we were talking on the phone about it (yikes!!) when I was off down to Devon for a family wedding? Well I had it on that Friday and I didn't ovulate until the Monday or even Tuesday. I am sure you haven't missed it. x


----------



## Little Me

Ally- Pretty sure you have a day or so hun x


----------



## fluffy jumper

Afternoon girls

I had my appointment at the NHS recurrange miscarriage clinic today and they weren't really able to tell me much.  As usual, being in the Gynae dept it was full of pg women having their scans etc.

I gave them the blood results I had done at the GP and they said that everything looked normal except one clotting factor (immunoglobulin IgA) was slightly raised. I asked what I would do about that but she said to discuss with the IVF consultant when I have a cycle.

The GP hadn't done the Thrombophillia (sp)/Factor V Leiden/Lupus so they took bloods to do that.
The only other tests are MTHFR and Insulin Reistence plus full immunes but they don't do that.  They don't think there is enough evidence for immunes and they think it unlikely that I am insulin restant as I am not very overweight.  Talking of which, she told me to get on the scales and said I was overweight which I should try and address - then realised that I had a heavy handbag on my shoulder, long boots and a jacket. Once I took off the bag and jacket I miraculously went down to a normal BMI  

Sam.  I think I will wait and see how you get on at the Surrey clinic re insulin resistance then decide whether it is worth me persuing.

I do feel slightly reassured that with a donor I am much less likely to miscarry and my MC's were probably due to my age - I had them when I was 41 and 42.  I am still considering whether to see Dr ******* at the Miscarriage Clinic privately and get immunes checked out but it will probably be a waste of yet more money that we can't really afford.

Anne.  I know exactly what you mean about DE and still not wanting to wait until you are much older.  It is exactly how I feel, I had previously said that I would give up the day I turned 43, but I am still going.  
Also, you have every right to feel angry/cheated/peed off/sad etc

Ally.  It was very brave of you to share you story about your relationship.  You are definatley not a bad person, there was an understandable reason why it happened.  I just admire you even more for sharing and trying to work things out.   

Missy.  Absolutey fantastic news.  I know how worried you must be though.  It really gives us all a lift when we here of a BFP

I wil be back to do more personals later as I am working from home today and want to go swimming before the kids come out of school and fill up the pool.


----------



## Züri

Missy fantastic news congratulations very happy for you xx

AnnaofC great news re your follies too, I was similar only 4 antrals seen and told not to expect much and then the scan before egg collection i had 9 follies, my consultant was surprised too and still surprised how i responded

Ally you are not a bad person at all and non of us here think that - I am so sorry amongst everything you are going through you are also battling to make use of your ovulation time it must be frustrating - thinking of you and hope you get to see a counselor before Ben changes his mind - finally got my hubby to go to counseling this year which was a great achievement - men find it hard to do these things

Top up    for Anne too 

Hi Tracey sorry you're non the wiser after your appointment x

Girls I had told myself i was taking a break from FF for a while but I have had to come on and be vocal today after hearing some good news and not such good news from members - just wanted to show support for you all

xx


----------



## Little Me

Hi Tracey-


----------



## laurab

Anne -   Feel angry honey because your allowed too.... its just so unfair.   

LJ - How are you doing sweetie?  

Tracey - why do they always do that.  I used to have scans in the IF dept in myhospital as I was scanned by the consutlant and I used to sit there with all the couples with my huge belly and feel awful... felt like shouting I was here once too, these are mirical IVF bubs!!  Its just crap, just shows a complete lack of thought doesn't it.  

Ally - Don't beat yourself up. I can't speak for everyone BUT i certainly have done stupid things that i've regretted. Thats life.. we are not perfect, especially after tequilla!

xxx


----------



## purple72

Ally NO WAY are you a bad person hunny!! We are all human, what is wonderful is that you're still at it trying to fix things! STOP beating yourself up hunny! You're still our special ALLY!!!

I doubt anyone feels anything but sorrow for you going through this!   

AofC congrats hunny! we all wish we could be frauds   good luck with the rest of your cycle

Missyg congrats hunny bunny! here's to a happy and healthy 7.5 months!!!     

Hello to everyone else big hugs

Sx


----------



## Ourturn

MissyG - what great news! Congratulations! Did you take steroids throughout your cycle or from ovulation? What dose? 

Anna of C - thank goodness you carried on stimming! Great news! I'm a slow starter when stimming too. I was on the max dose of menapur and had 3 follies at the 1st scan, by day 14 of stimming  8,  had popped up and we got 6 eggs. 

Anna x


----------



## fluffy jumper

I'm  back from swimming.  The pool was practically empty.  I now feel very virtuous, especially as I am doing pilates tonight.  Although a bit guilty about the lack of work getting done today.

I am not doing too well on my ttc, we only managed BMS once so far, it was meant to be last night but I fell asleep before DH came to bed.  Oh well, there is always tonight.

Laura.  I think all hospitals should have a section in their gynae departments for infertility and miscarriage completely separately to where they do scans and ante natal appointments.

Anne.  Reading back a few pages where you say you think you are done with IVF and your own eggs.  I must say, it was how I felt after two cycles with only one egg.  I just felt that another cycle, even on different protocol would just bring the same result, and I felt lucky that my one egg fertilised, we would pushing our luck to get another cycle to ET.  My consult at the Lister totally agreed and said in my situation I had just as much chance ttc naturally for a year as trying a cycle of IVF. 

Sam.  Fab news on your FSH coming down.  Good luck for this cycle.  I think you are right to be realistic as you don't want to have further to fall if it doesn't go your way. Your ff friends will just have to have all the positive thoughts for you.
I would love to have the foresight hair analysis but unfortunately my hair is dyed and you have to have hair that is untreated.  Do you know much about the allergy testing they do in places like Holland and Barratt - is it a load of rubish?

Have to go into town now to try and buy some comfy shoes for my shopping trip on Sat.  So, I am going shoppping to go shopping


----------



## almond

Tracey, just to say that all sounds really encouraging from the miscarriage clinic. But   re mixing up the IF / miscarriage and the pg scans. They dont have a clue dont they

I have just heard from Barts that my follow up from my failed cycle is in July!!! I cycled in Feb!


----------



## Little Me

Tracey- thanks for your comments, they help as I am in a real dilemma. 
My honest GUT feeling, (and I am ashamed to admit that I've deep down felt this for over a year now is I will never have my own "biological baby") It's a feeling that's got so stong now with what's happened again that I can't ignore it- BUT am so sad to give up with my own little eggies. But, I think I know the route we will have to take eventually to have our dream come true. 

xxx


----------



## shortie66

Ally sweetheart please stop beating yourself with that stick      None of us are perfect we have all done/said things that perhaps with hindsight we wouldnt have done or said.  What has happened has happened and i hope for both your sakes you can sort things out.  You are a lovely beautiful lady hunny and we all make mistakes.  Forgive yourself hunny you are not invincible none of us are    

Missyg - i wondered where you had gone to you little minx    Wow hunny congratulations, im keeping everything crossed for you, and once again someone on here has given me hope.  I too have one blocked and one scarred tube sometimes i ovulate sometimes i dont, but if it can happen once it can happen again and perhaps one of these times who knows.   Take care hunny hope everything goes ok  

Tracey - better luck on the ttc tonight hun    Perhaps tie your toe to the door handle so that when dh comes in it wakes you up, i must admit i;ve thought of doing that myself once or twice  

Anne - snap hunny my feelings exactly   

Hi nix, pix, almond, mallini, fishy, anneofc, anna, purple, steph, natasha, sam and everyone else.

Gotta go, sneaked on while boss is out, he's back now tho   

Kate
xxxxxx


----------



## beachgirl

Just wanted to say to Ally   don't ever beat yourself up about what's happened in the past, leave it there and look forwards..life is too short, we've all done things we shouldn't have and regret and no one will judge you at all sweetheart, really hope that you both can work through this


----------



## Han72

Hi all

just a quickie as I have a massive headache

Ally hon     God if I had a quid for every [email protected] up thing I've done while going thru this if crap, I'd be able to pay for tx for everyone on here!  Don't beat yourself up honey, you made a mistake and you're trying to make up for it now and noone could ask more of you than that!  I really think that counselling can make a HUGE difference and really help so I hope that you guys will go ahead and give it a try    

Missy - I'm speechless, how FANTASTIC is that?! I know you're still nervous as everythin is so uncertain but I am so pleased for you honey!!!  Low AMH my  !!!!  YEAH!!!!  I'm  that all these obstacles can be overcome and that you have a happy and healthy pregnancy     

Hey Sausage! (well it's quicker than AnnaofCumberland innit!) Nice to see I'm not the only fake PR on here   They're quite nice and still let us hang out with them though and thank God for that, my life would be so much more boring without the PR posse!  So glad you managed to talk those guys into letting you continue hon, I hope they're monitoring Estradiol closely to ensure thos follies have some nice juicy eggies in there     

Sorry no more persos, but I have to get off here, my head's killing me, and although I'm really not one for symptom spotting, also I'm feeling a bit sicky and sorry if TMI but I think I saw just a bit of implantation bleeding last night.... oh please God let it be our time this time!         

Love to all, must go it's nearly time for Sirrallan!
xxx


----------



## beachgirl

Missy that's amazingly fantastic news, so pleased for you and praying all will be good news


----------



## shortie66

Nix - god hunny im      like mad for you here like you wouldnt believe.  I wish i could wae a magic wand and give us all a bfp whether it be natural our eggs or donor eggs we are all in the same boat here and i for one would be lost without you all     

Hi beachy hope ur ok hunny   

Well day 3 on diet today and its been a struggle tonight i must admit    I had 1 piece of dry toast and a huge orange for brekkie (was supposed to be grapefruit but i tried it on monday and couldnt manage it....ugghhhhh nasty stuff) Tuna salad for dinner and another prece of dry toast   And tea was supposed to be 2 lamb chops (i cant eat sheep i love them so much) so i had pork chops instead, should of had a salad with it but im so bloody peed off with salad i couldnt stomach any more of it    Tomoz should be ok tho....same again for brekkie chicken and dry toast for dinner   and then ladies for tea i have got..........wait for it...........2 poached eggs on dry toast and a carton of cottage cheese     Dont think i could follow this diet for much longer than 5 days without a curry to look forward to on saturday  

Kate
xxxxxxxx


----------



## beachgirl

Kate-thanks hun   you're doing really well on your diet. I;ve just got a peroni   I'm not bad thanks x


----------



## shortie66

Beachy whats a peroni hun? Whatever it is it sure sounds better than fecking salad


----------



## purple72

Nix sounding good sweetie!

     

that this is your time!

Sx


----------



## beachgirl

Hi Purps x

Kate- ti's a beer lol x


----------



## AoC

A fine Italian beer, no less...  

Ah, shopping to go shopping.  Tracey, you are speaking my language...



Thanks for the nice words, ladies.  I feel very glad I fought for those extra days.


----------



## beachgirl

Hello Anna x


----------



## shortie66

Oooo beachy - im so jealous i could just do a bottle o carlsberg export.  

Anna - a bottle of anything even slightly alcoholic would do me at the moment  

Yayyyyyyyyy i finally worked out how to do a ticker      Put a 28 day cycle on tho with me who knows 

Hi purps my darling how are you today?


----------



## purple72

Hi Beach hunny how you doing?

Tracy miss virtuous! well done

Kate good on your for the salad hunny, not bad thanks sweetie  

Hey Aof C

Hugs to all x

Sx


----------



## beachgirl

Purps    I'm not bad, up and down really tbh...


----------



## purple72

it's a bl00dy roller coaster sweetie isn't it! 

Only not a good kind!

A nightmare at times, thank god for you ladies on FF think I'd go nuts   without you!

Sx


----------



## AoC

Definitely I'd go tonto without this place.  I almost feel normal here  .

Got my author copies of my June release today.  *Hugs Books*  They are puuuuuuuurdy.


----------



## purple72

Congrats Aof C xxx


----------



## TryMeditate

Hello ladies - what a huge day on the PR thread!  

Would you believe I only just returned 30 minutes ago from the doctor in Surrey (insulin resistance lady).  It's been a big day for me, immunes dr, then 3.5 hours at lister - mainly in the waiting room - nurses at lister, followed by scan at lister (all ok), followed by nurses at lister, got script from lister... then train to surrey, saw doctor, more scanning and bloods, train home!

The Surrey Dr was very nice, and it was very interesting, but as it's just a theory of hers that she is formulating, she has decided to treat me for free - how nice is that! She even gave me the drugs for free (Metformin to control insulin resistance.... but only works if you do it in conjunction with a no suger \ extrememly low carb diet - no fruit for a while- boo hooo I love fruit).  I did tell her about you girls and how interested you all were, but she said lets see how I go first - so I'm officially a lab rat!  I did tell her with my amh and fsh I was not the best test candidate, but she still seems to want to use me. I have to say, the diet will be tough - but Missy your big news today has given me strength - as it's very close to the diet you have followed (amazingly without slipping up at all!) for the last 6 months.... so I'm feeling positive about following the diet as I've seen how much it helped you my amh 0.1 buddy!  I am allowed diary though, but have to limit it, which I know you don't touch, and I'm allowed salt too.

Missy - your an inspiration.... I know how hard you have worked on your diet - you have been so much stricter than me, and look at the odds. High FSH (I think your highest was 48 right?), amh of 0.1, POF, thyroid problems, immune problems, one working ovary with a not great tube - and yet your pregnant!!!       you get to hold this baby in your arms.  I need some diet advice - besides eggs, what can I eat for breakfast   

Aof C - why don't you PM some of us the name of your book so we can kick off the sales figures towards your best seller on amazon? xxxx

Ally - I did read your post tonight.  Everybody on this thread knows the wonderful, amazing, caring, nuturing, funny, witty, sensational woman you are.      Never say your not a nice person again on here ok  , the evidence is all over this thread that you are a wonderful person.  I really really hope you and Ben can work this out,  it is painful to even think of what you must be going through.       One thing is for sure, somewhere in there Ben does love you Ally.  I remember the nice things he planned for your birthday, and many of the things he has said to you.  I'm sure he is holding onto a lot of hurt, and I think this will take time, counselling, and a lot of love from you to prove to him that he can trust you, and help him heal.  

I'm sorry girls - I know you all deserve many more personals, but I'm exhausted... 

I took my first suprecur injection tonight...... it stung for a while afterwards and bled a little too.  I tried my best to draw it up without any air bubbles, but this tiny one would not go away.  Is it a big problem to inject yourself with a tiny airbubble?
LOL 
Sam xxxxx


----------



## missyg

Just wanted to say thanks for all your kind words and especially thanks to Sam for your lovely phone call - you are wonderful and I really hope it went well at the clinic in Surrey.   Oh just seen we crossed posts - glad it went well - ooh a lab rat how exciting - what a great lady to do it for free!! Keeping everything crossed for you and thanks again. If you really want I will do you a week plan of my diet so you can see what I have been eating for the last year!

Sobroody - yes I started 25mg prednisolone the day before I ovulated - I asked Dr G what he thought and he said it was highly unlikely I would get pregnant naturally but it wouldn't hurt to take the steroids and then wean of them when I got my period. He said when we did a DE cycle we would throw everything at it - intralipids, ivig, humira etc. He said when trying on a natural cycle you normally start on day 6 with the steroids. I just thought I would give it a go incase I didn't ovulate again even though my tube on that side is blocked - I guess that answers the debate on whether the other tube can pick up from the opposite ovary!

Nix - thanks so much - I really hope this one works for you!    

Lots of love

Missy xx


----------



## annacameron

Sam, no, or at least i've injected many small bubbles without ill effect. there should be a picture on the syringe that shows the size of bubble you need to worry about.  

Ally, oh gosh, I can totally understand. I suspect many of us read your post and thought - "there but for the grace of god", after a drunken night and a humgunous amount of stress etc. the very fact you HAD to set it all out and tell us  all indicate you are a good person IN ITSELF. So please sweetpea, no more beating yourself up. YOu need to recover yourself so you can work with your husband to fix all this. In any event, once you got back a good r/ship, maybe the ttc would follow. You're putting your body under far too much stress in far too many different ways right now. YOu're still young - the eggs are young, albeit not as many as you would like. You can do it. BUt you need to give yourself a break, in the sense of forgiving yourself and moving on as constructively as you possibly can with a guy who sounds lovely but desperately hurt and who may react like a wounded dog at first. Im so sorry you are in this situation, but you can fix it. Believe me, with the benefit (?) of more years, and many more disasters  - you can fix this. xxxx  

Missy - congrats, lovely news  xxx


----------



## almond

AnnaofC - congrats on your follies  

Nix - oh how I would love to see you get a bfp   

Sam - my friend who is a paramedic and who I got to help me with first set of injections said you really cannot do yourself any damage with an air bubble. you are only injecting below the skin and it cant do any damage there. I think the bigger problem with air bubbles is that can affect dose. But not a tiny one!

Missy - am still really excited re your news. I would be interested to hear more about the diet you followed and why, would you mind pm'ing me if you don't want to go into it here? I'm also guessing that you have seen Mr Gorgy re immunes which I am also thinking of doing (I need to get my immunes tested, just not sure where) and I'd be interested to hear more about that from you as well. Sorry for the barrage of questions and obviously feel free not to answer them if you are too busy or dont want to!!!

Kate - sorry to hear re diet hell. It sounds hideous. You do make me laugh. Maybe it will get easier, like giving up smoking ... ?! I now have one foot in healthy camp and one foot in bad camp ... getting there!

xxx


----------



## Ali27

Lukey - hello!

Anne - It is not surprising you feel pants today    you are only human    It will take time to digest what has happened over the past few months so allow yourself that time and be really kind to yourself.  Re the Job Seekers issue - Jason is allowed to go away for 2 weeks a year I think and still have a live claim.  but really, the best thing to do is to keep the claim continuous and on the the day he is due to sign phone up and say he is sick or get someone to do that for him.  I know it is too late now but it saves all the hassle of the rapid reclaim etc.  Sadly, sometimes being too honest is more detrimental.

LJ - you are right.  I think I will refuse to get the AMH done again. I have my px already so it is not going to change that and i doubt they will say they wont treat me and take my money of i dont get it done.  Will do my FSH etc at GP as thats free!!   

Sam - love the post about the US clinics.  thanks for that.  Great news too about the insulin woman    And on officially starting your tx!!   

Zuri - hello hon    Good luck with the BMS!  

Purple - hey there!  you down to a 4 day week yet?  Hope you still make sometime for yourself    

Dimsum - how is it going?  

Anna -  

Brambles - sorry for your recent m/c      Sorry too that I cannot be of more help but hope you gleened valuable info from Anna  

Kate - well done with the diet  

Nix - oooh!  Sounding promising   

Missy - amazing!!!  Unbelievable!!  Congrats to you !!!  Shall i up my DHEA to 100mg?  And could you PM me more about your diet too?   

Anna of C - well done re the book.     And the follies!!!  

Almond - hello there  

Tracey - like your style with the special shopping trip shoes!!   

Ally - You are so not a bad person for what has happened and no one has any right whatsoever to make any judgements.  You have summarised events into a short, to the point paragraph that in no way fully explains all the lead up, the history, the emotions, the hormonal influences etc to what happened.  From what you have said it sounds like you felt desparately alone at that time and confused with what was happening in your body.  Perhaps this person showed you the attention you were craving and needing and after tequilla, who can be held responsible for their behaviour?  Judgement is blurred.  you dont think straight and at that point it made you feel good (in an emotional way I mean here).  I certainly wouldotblame you for that.  Ben obviously adores you and wants you both to be together as you said he begged you to come back and that you would work at it.  Am I right in remembering that you were diagnosed with POF "by accident" and this forced you to start ttc before you really planned to?  If so, i am guessing that soon after you moved back home and found out about POF, the focus shifted to solely about ttc and not about your relationship etc.  Therefore there must be so many unresolved issues for you both that need addressing if you are to move forward together.  the fact that he is still there with you is testimony that he wants to be.  Counselling sounds like a good way forward.  I hope that I have not talked out of turn here.  We are all here for you no matter what!     

i am proud of myself this evening as got my bike out and went for a ride along the river path with a friend who was running.  We saw an otter, a deer, a rabbit, 3 ducks and a nesting swan.  the sun was setting and i kept trying to look at it (who said it was good for the pituitary?)  Nearly knocked my head off when I did not see a low tree branch in front of me...so thanks!!!    Might run with her on Friday.  Cant be doing with lifting my bike over all those styles


----------



## purple72

Ali27 said:


> i am proud of myself this evening as got my bike out and went for a ride along the river path with a friend who was running. We saw an otter, a deer, a rabbit, 3 ducks and a nesting swan. the sun was setting and i kept trying to look at it (who said it was good for the pituitary?) Nearly knocked my head off when I did not see a low tree branch in front of me...so thanks!!!  Might run with her on Friday. Cant be doing with lifting my bike over all those styles


Oh Ali      

Bless you made me laugh out loud!!!

4 day week starts in may so not long to wait! Just hope the pay packet still stretchs to what it needs to 

How are you sweetie?

Sx


----------



## purple72

Away tomorrow so no internet but just want to wish PIXIE

     A VERY HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!!!     

Have a wonderful day hunny and I hope this year brings you all your heart desires!

Sx


----------



## purple72

Just to add to what Steph said the other day about DE

Found this thread by another FF member

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=191498.0;topicseen

Sx


----------



## Ali27

Happy Birthday Pixie                                                

Sent you a PM  

purple - hello there.  i am good thanks.  Trying to get a bit fitter.  Trying to keep my head too though, literally.  Who was it that said that?     4 day week sounds divine.  apart from the reduced pay.  The extra time will do you the world of good though  

Night everyone


----------



## beachgirl

Happy Birthday Pixie, hope that you have a lovely day x


----------



## Little Me

Happy Birthday Pix hun


----------



## Little Me

Hi girls,


LJ- Don't beat yourself up hun, I believe next time will be your healthy and happy pregnancy  

Nix-    for you love  

Hi Beachy  

Everyone ok so far today?

xxxx


----------



## almond

Morning Anne, Beachy, LJ

Pix   hope you are ok  

Anne - how are you this morn?

LJ - I think BMI can be misleading. My SIL is TINY and no doubt technically underweight, but she has a v tiny frame and when she was a normal-ish weight (probably BMI still less than 20!) she was told by doctors that her fat levels were too high. If you are like that, then I don't think BMI is terribly helpful (by the way, she got pg first month of trying and had a healthy baby). If it is a case of not eating enough or not eating enough of the right things, then there are things you can do although it is difficult when you are trying to be healthy. Only you can judge which of those categories you fall into though, maybe with the help of an objective third party if needed (I'm thinking of the people on Superzize Superskinny who think they eat loads and don't)! Knowing you from this site, I can't imagine you have been anything other than careful and conscientious about this and sought about the best advice - in which case, please stop worrying 

x


----------



## Little Me

Hi Almond - Feeling a little less evil   today I think  
You ok?
xx


----------



## missyg

Hi everyone,

Happy birthday to Pixie   . I hope you get to enjoy the sunshine today.

Hi LJ!

I have had quite a few people asking about diet and anything else I have done so I think I will do a big post tonight when I get time rather than pm people as hopefully it might be useful for lots of people. Though if anyone wants to pm please feel free - Sam I am going to do that for you! I am nervous to say that anything has worked for me as obviously I am still in the very early stages and am very high risk as well as not knowing that the baby is OK etc but I do know that just getting to this stage gives a lot of people hope so I will do the post but we will have to wait and see what happens - I am just trying to take one day at a time. 

Back later.

Missy x


----------



## Little Me

Missy- that would defo help me hun. Thank you.
We will be TTc naturally for the foreseeable future and who knows eh, maybe it could happen to us aswell  
xxxxx


----------



## Jumanji

Missy - thanks for doing the diet post.  I can totally understand taking it one day at a time.  

Anne - no reason the same shouldn't happen to you..   I assume you are not like my sis and actually know the right times to try!!!


----------



## Little Me

Hi LJ   
I am trying from day 1 to day 28      
Bloody hell,  I won't be able to walk   
Maybe I'll try from about day 7 to 21 then, cover all egg bases


----------



## Wing Wing

Hi girls

Just thought I would pop on following my appointment with see Dr Nice yesterday.

*Sam*, Lloyd Cole was brilliant. It was just him, his guitar and about 50 people - all very civilised. He looks soooo different tho - a real middle aged guy now. I guess he would be as I am a middle aged woman - YIKES. So, no desperate urge to throw my pants at him!!! Will be getting a copy of his new CD though!

Good news re FSH honey - very promising. Really hope this cycle does work for you. You seem to have a good attitude to try and remain chilled throughout. Hope you can!! We are all here to help you stay sane!

What a day you had yesterday - you must be worn out?!!! Good luck with being a lab rat!!

Hugs to *Kate* - life is just not fair hon is it? Think you are doing brill on your healthy eating plan love (HATE the term diet as it conjures up images of unbelievable misery!!) Thanks God for curry!

*Anne*, you are not a nasty old bag at all - just a normal woman with emotions and feelings. I read a magazine article the other day about a girl who was pregnant, didn't know it and gave birth while completely out of it on alcohol having drunk loads during her pregnancy and changed nothing to help it (as she didn't even know that a drunken shag had produced a baby) Nice hey?

Please don't disappear for anyone else's sake but your own if you think it will help YOU. Am sure everyone feels like I do in that we are all here to help and support each other. You have always been a major source of support to others and it is now your turn to cash in on that. We are all here for you hon.

Re Jason and the stupid  at the benefits agency - What a load of old SH*T!!! Can you believe that there are hundreds of non British people camped out at Calais waiting for the chance to get into the UK illegally cos the benefits are so damn good and then someone like Jase is going to be investigated cos THEY lost his form?? UTTER madness! So sorry Anne - not what you need.   

Hope things are better today.   

*Pam* - sounds like you need Zuri's help with your laundry!!! Hi* Zuri  * - glad you are having fun in the bedroom. Am jealous - got the smiley ovulating symbol this am and have warned DH! Maybe some wine first&#8230;..!!! 

Glad you are not leaving us!

*LJ  * - thanks for your long informative post. It is really good to get perspective on things hey? Thanks also to *Sam*. Do you know when you are off to US?

*Purps* - Hi there! You OK? I have also been told that cycling back to back is not good and that a break of at least 3 months is optimal. This was by Dr Nice and not Dr F*cker!!
*Purps* - thanks for sharing your Relate story too. It is great to know the reality of other people's relationships and to know it is not all milk and honey. I am going mad with frustration in my relationship and can't figure if it is the IVF etc or cos things truly are shi*e!! 

Hi *Brambles* - welcome to the thread - it is a great place to be!

*Ally* - cyber sis - I am going to PM you as am in similar situation. 

*Anna* - hope you are OK!

Hi *Missy* - big congratulations for you. Yes it is early and anything could happen BUT this is a massive step in the right direction! Wishing you lots and lots of luck hon. Can you enlighten me about your eating plan as seriously need some help on that front. Not a weight issue but a not really knowing what to eat for the best results issue. Thanks. Ahhh, just seen you are doing a special post this eve - cheers hon!

*AoC* - that is brilliant news re the follies! When do you have EC?

Hi *Tracey* - glad to read you are keeping up the swimming

*Nix* - you are amazing to remember what drug you have to take and when! Am soooo praying for you!

Hi *Beachy* 

*Ali* - the bike ride sounds nice. I am going to start cycling to work next week. 

Happy Birthday to Pix. Hope you have a lovely day sweetie!      

No time now to tell you how I got on yesterday with Dr Nice so will try to get on again this arvo.

Love to you all.

WW X


----------



## Wing Wing

Before I go to lunch - just had to say that I am seriously impressed with your stamina Anne.  You must really LOVE that man!!!!


----------



## Little Me

WW- Thanks hun, today is a new day and I am  
Lots to be thankful for, so the evil   that I was yesterday I hope has fff'd off for a bit   
Hope you appointment was ok?
Hear from you later


----------



## Little Me

WW- I'm ashamed to say that the bedroom antics in the House of The Greens have slipped so I think I will be using up old stamina   
But I do love mr G sooo much yes, I don't always show it enough though   , bless him, he deserves a medal putting up with me 
xxxx


----------



## Little Me

There are some real dick heads out there ..... Jas is selling his mountain bike on Ebay and some idiot has just emailed him to ask him if he would swap his bike for a Blackberry phone... WFT?


----------



## Han72

Hi all!

HAPPY BIRTHDAY PIXIE!!!!     ^pom pom^ ^pom pom^ ^pom pom^ ^pom pom^

Oooh Sausage - I'm so excited about your book! I have the utmost respect for anyone that has the guts and the gumption to write a book and then to be published as well is fantastic! Can you tell us anything about it? And when and where can we buy a copy? We'll have you in the best sellers list before you know it!

LJ - weight gain tips, I can definitely help you there my love! The first thing you need to do is give up work and then become a complete hermit. Try to only leave the house if you absolutely have to and then make sure it's only to stock up on carb heavy food to comfort eat while you sit on your  in front of the PC. The most exercise you should do is pressing the "Show new replies" button on FF. Never fails! In only 7 months I have put on an entire dress size    Fortunately I can just about get away with it cos like you, I was slightly underweight to begin with. On the other hand, I've been advised to start drinking a litre of full fat organic milk a day (cheers Malini!) Even if I was exercising regularly, which I ain't  I'm sure that would help to pile on the pounds. It took a bit of getting used to but I quite like it now. I drink it warm before bed (like a little ole lady!) cold during the day and bung it on me weetabix in the morning, so it's quite easy to get through a whole litre. Of course having nothing else to do but eat and drink all day is a help! In any case, someone else reminded me that we need to bolster our calcium intake in our mid-30's to avoid osteoporosis later on and this is a good way of doing that too...

However, as almond says, I don't think it's a good idea to get too hung up on the BMI thing. My DH was told he was overweight the other day, but he's over 6 foot, swims does thai boxing, goes running and basically never sits still (personally I think he has undiagnosed ADHD!) and doesn't have an ounce of fat on him, it's all muscle. But because muscle weighs more than fat it throws the numbers out a bit so the  doctor said he was overweight! Oops as usual have got distracted and I see you already do the full fat dairy thing, so I don't see what else you can do hon! You're just born to be skinny I guess  And I'm sure that's not going to cause you any problems, if you were starving yourself that's one thing but you eat regularly and healthily so ignore the BMI b0ll0x and just carry on as your my lovely!

Sam - that is great news to be able to try this new thing out for free, and if Missy's example is anything to go by, well... I have high hopes for you honey 

Hey Missy - how are you feeling today sweetie? I'm still smiling after your news yesterday and I'm just  and sending you tons of  !

Hey Anne how are ya hon? Glad you're still sticking around, I'd miss ya if you went into hiding! 



Ali27 said:


> the sun was setting and i kept trying to look at it (who said it was good for the pituitary?) Nearly knocked my head off when I did not see a low tree branch in front of me...so thanks!!!


Sorry Ali but I did have to laugh!   

Hey Beachy lovey - what's up babes? 

Yo Wingers! Good luck with Doctor Nice Guy   

Hiya purps the other Anna's (we seem to have an embarras d'Annas at the mo, wot's goin' on?!) Laura, Malini, Mira, Steph, Crazy Katy and everyone!

Right, it's taken me about 2 hours to type this what with stopping for a cuppa and a natter with my cuz, so I'm going to sign off now before another 500 replies get posted in the meantime! I'm fine, although all of yesterday's alleged symptoms have disappeared so I'm reverting to type and I'm gonna stop looking for them!

Have a lovely day all!

xxxx
PS Anne you were never an evil beeyatch, you nutter! You and Jas seem like a lovely couple and you're both fantastically lucky to have eachother 

xxxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Morning all xxxx  

Firstly - Happy Birthday darling Pixie pops!! Hope you have a lovely day 'en famile' (spelling??  ) and am praying that the year ahead brings you huge amounts of happiness! xxxx

Thank you all so so so much for all your lovely understanding supportive words, I really did have to tell you as I didn't feel I was giving you the full picture when discussing my relationship and felt it was really mean as it inferred that B was the one with the problem when it is so much more complicated than that. Well first relate counsellor has not called us back  , going to try another as we just want to get on with it now.  I need to read all your posts again and respond individually but i really appreciate your support and advice. I really loved what you said Ali about B, I really wanted to rush home and give him a huge hug and tell him how sorry I was for hurting him so much, i am quite a toughy with him and can be quite defensive and I am not sure if I have really said that enough.

Ali - your ride sounded lovely, wish you lived round the corner I need a running/ biking buddy  

Almond - thank you for your gorgeous PM, I am so sorry I have had a manic couple of days and it was my mums birthday last night so havent had a chance to respond, it didnt fall on deaf ears though  

Sam hon - thank you for your text and your PM I will try and call you in a bit  

Anne - thank you for your text too   Glad you are feeling a bit more   we may as well try as the weather is gorgeous and of course its not going to last so maybe we can save our   for when it starts p!ssing down again! 

Nix - Congrats pupo lady - come on hang in there you little snowbaby!!     

WW - I look forward to my PM  

Love and hugs to all xxxx


----------



## Nicki W

Morning all!
Just wanted to pop by and say hello!
Anne - so sorry to read about your recent cycle hun   hope you do well with your ttc naturally - you do have eggs they just don't seem to like test tubes. don't give up   
Purps - big hugs to you to    sorry it wasn't to be. But what a great cycle you had though - you can only improve I reckon   
Sam - good luck with your cycle - very exciting!
Missy - great news on your natural miracle - such a blessing!
Pix - happy birthday!
Lj - glad you are straight back into it! Helps with healing I think, you never know you might just hit the jackpot again   Don't worry too much about your BMI - you are obviously very fertile it just wasn't quite right last time. Probs with BMI are mostly anovulatory cycles I think - eg in the anorexics
Nix - great news on being PUPO girl!   
Ally, Ali, Zuri, WW, LW, Kate, Aof C, Almond, Tracey, Malini - hello to all you girls and all i;ve missed too
 
Nicks xx


----------



## almond

Hi WW   Look forward to hearing re your appt later

Anne - I am always a little bit   

Missy - thank you for doing a post for us. I totally understand about you taking it one day at a time at the moment, that is all you can do. We are all absolutely rooting for you here  

LJ - I guessed you would be doing all you could and were already onto the nuts and seeds thing   I think DP is right. Early miscarriage is unfortunately very common and I'm pretty sure there is nothing you could have done to prevent it. But that doesn't mean it will happen again! I am interested in the chocolate research! I am trying to take a balanced approach to food, tho after my BFN I went way too far the wrong way and not quite back to healthy yet. There are also some things that I can't eat as I get a reaction. I am similar to you in that I dont put on weight easily and also lose it quickly, but my BMI is normal rather than low. I dont think I could put on weight without resorting to Renee Z's pre Bridget Jones diet either   I tried it when I was in Canada and it seemed to work, but not a good idea for ttc  

Right back to work  

Oops hi Ally!

x


----------



## Little Me

Hi NW- nice to see you, thanks for your post  

Ally-  

Nix- I'm ok hun, still here and  
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Almond


----------



## Little Me

Girls- is there any way I can stop receiving posts from threads I don't speak to ?
I have tried on my profile but still keep receiving them  
xx


----------



## annacameron

http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=191498.0;topicseen

thought this an interesting thread. 
migth google woogle a few of the terms used.

Anna XX


----------



## Han72

Anne G said:


> Girls- is there any way I can stop receiving posts from threads I don't speak to ?
> I have tried on my profile but still keep receiving them
> xx


Do you mean receiving email notifications or do you mean when the thread keeps coming up in your "new replies" thing? I think I know what you mean, it seems quite easy to turn off the email notifications but I thought you were supposed to be able to switch it off so unwanted threads don't keep coming up in your new replies but it doesn't seem to work properly. Often you have to wait til the mod closes the thread and starts a new one... I posted about it on tech support but didn't really get anywhere with it, maybe I'm just a bit fick  

xxx


----------



## Little Me

Nix yep, it's the unwanted threads. That makes sense actually waiting till a new part comes then that shoudl do the trick.
ta
xx


----------



## Ali27

Afternoon everyone!  Just having a quick sneaky peek whilst at work    About to go into a boring meeting but will be back later!!


----------



## almond

Ali - hope boring meeting was bearable. when is there ever an interesting one?!

Anna - that's really interesting, will read more of that when I have time

Anne / Nix - I'm jealous, I'm missing out on something here! what is the "new replies" thing? and why do people mark a thread by posting in it, what does that do?

Ally - please dont feel you need to reply to my pm, I will not be remotely offended! I just wanted to say it in case any of it helped  
x


----------



## Han72

almond said:


> Anne / Nix - I'm jealous, I'm missing out on something here! what is the "new replies" thing? and why do people mark a thread by posting in it, what does that do?


Hiya hon, it's nothing special, basically there's 2 different issues. You can set something up in your profile so that everytime someone posts on a thread that you've posted on, you get an email notification on whichever email address you registered with when you joined FF. It's not a good idea on a busy thread like this but it's quite good if you've set up a poll or started a topic yourself and you want to know if anyone has responded.

The other thing is automatic, as soon as you post on any thread you can find out if anyone has posted after you by clicking on "show new replies to your posts" in the top right hand corner of the page. You don't get emails for this one though, it just takes you to a page where you can see every thread where someone has posted a response since the last time you posted there....

The thing is the second one can get a bit annoying cos sometimes you've only posted on a thread once to ask a quick question or whatever and you're not really interested in following it, but from then on it shows in your "show new replies" list until such time as the thread is closed down by the mod. I'm sure you're supposed to be able to stop it from showing but I'm buggered if I can figure out how!

I hope that makes sense!

xxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Almond - thanks hon - but do really want to! 

Nix - love the ticker x

I didnt tell you all earlier (I don't think) that I got some more BMS today!! This has to be a world record, trying twice at the right time!! I am on 5th day of high on monitor, its probably just stuck there though, I do hope I get a peak. I haven't got that much EWCM but trying not to worry too much about that. Another odd thing is that I am getting twinges again on right hand side which is the side I ovulated from last month. I am pretty sure both have the same functionality (I won't say "I am pretty sure both work"!!!) as I had some action on each during my IVF tries but wonder now  

God who knows eh, just need to keep having the BMS and hope for the best! Missy proves it can be done, now I want a piece of the action!!! 

It does make me wonder though about giving up DHEA, oh I wish I knew what is best for me! I don't think it did me any good at all but I only took 50mg regularly, only for a short while did I do 75mg. It drives me   wondering!!


----------



## Little Me

Ally- Glad you got some      
Wonder if I should get a monitor or just use pee sticks?
On DHEA- I stopped last Wednesday, I really don't think 75mg for over 2 months helped me at all.
Not sure if I should take again - Jason really wants us to really try naturally, no drugs and just healthy diet - oh and no alcohol, or sugar or caffine for us too.
What do you think?

xxxxxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Anne - we can be 'Free IVF' cycle buddies!! I have just been chatting to Sam about diet etc and really feel I need to get mine under control as my healthy diet has been out of the window for weeks! I have been eating chocolate, biscuits, drinking tea, wine, bread blah blah blah. I need to stop not just for my fertility but for my waistline which is expanding again after all that hard work pre hols. I think it sounds like a really good plan hon. I use the monitor as my cycle is so irregular I would never know when the time was right with pee sticks but maybe read up on it, it may be good for you as it tests both E2 and LH, whereas pee sticks only test LH. If your FSH is high your LH is likely to also be high which can effect the pee stick readings. I say all of this but I am hardly an expert, there is no guarantee that I am getting accurate readings with the monitor either!!


----------



## beachgirl

Just a quick hello from me as enkoying the sun in the garden, Anne and Ally, if you manage to give up sugar and alcohol let me know how you did it    seriously though I'd like to join you as I really need to be healthy..


----------



## Little Me

Thanks Alls  

beachy- i always had sweetners in my hot drinks UNTIL Janurary when soemone said here how bad they were SO, I started using a natural syrup called Agave Nectar,tastes fine but as I've ran out I've just been having tea with nothing in. I know tea isn't great but way better than coffee
xxxx


----------



## looly

hey lovely ladies,

I hope you don't mind me joining you, but just wanted to finally say hello to all you amazing women. I have been following your various journeys for about the last 6 months, and laughing, crying, praying and hoping for you all. I wanted to tell you my story briefly as a positive story for you all but it never seemed the right time to do so. I've finally bitten the bullet after reading about various recent heartaches and have decided if I don't do it now I never will.

I too am a poor responder, as you can see from my signature, I think at the last test my AMH was 0.4 and I was told I had very little chance of success, but i wanted to give it a go anyway.

I had what was supposed to be my fourth and final attempt in July last year, which produced one immature egg that didn't fertilise. We then had to wait 3 months before our follow-up appointment to close my file and move on. We decided after 18 months of IVF and all the heartache that goes with it to just enjoy the summer and not to even discuss IF before this appointment. However, now and again inevitably it did get spoken about and my DP finally managed to get his head around the idea of DE. So I started looking into this more closely and we had some of the initial tests and appointments to start the ball rolling.

At beginning of November we went back for our final meeting with our IVF consultant and I explained that I hadn't been totally happy with the final IVF attempt as I had only stimmed for 6 days and had a huge follie very quickly which didn't seem right at the time. They wanted to go to egg collection anyway (I think probably just to try to get rid of me once and for all!). I didn't think we should have that month as the cycle was so unlike all the others that I had had, where I had stimmed for about 12 days. She told me that it would never be the right time and that this simply wasn't going to work for me. She also said I was going to make myself ill if I didn't give up. I told her that if I didn't try one last time that I would always be thinking what if and wouldn't be able to move on and would make myself more ill! Rather reluctantly, and I think helped by the fact that she knew I had already had appointments for DE and was on the waiting list, so essentially I was ready to move on but at the right time for us, she let us have one last go. I had it straight in my head this time, that no matter what, this was going to be the final attempt as I would have tried all that I could with my own eggs and I would be happy to move on knowing that. 

Well, amazingly out of nowhere, I produced 5 follies, 4 eggs, three of which fertilised, all put back, one of which stuck and I am now 23 weeks pregnant. Every day I wake up and can't quite believe it has happened as I had been told to give up. I know I haven't yet got my baby in my arms but it's an absolute miracle that I've got this far. It still makes me cry every time I tell my story as it wasn't supposed to happen for us and I still can't quite believe it has. But it just shows you ladies that it can happen and you will have your babies one way or another and only you as individuals and as couples will know when is the right time to give up with your own eggs. I personally wasn't quite ready. And I don't think they can ever tell you it won't work for you because they just don't know that for sure. 

I hope this helps some of you out there. I know I found this thread just as I was about to start my stimms last November and all of Ally's fantastic positive stories that she posts helped me believe that it was possible and that miracles can happen. So thank you Ally. I just wanted to give something back to you all that have unknowingly helped me along the way.

Good luck to you all with whatever decisons you make with regards to your next steps.
Congrats to you Nix on being PUPO, I have my fingers crossed for you. 

Ok, so my story wasn't as brief as I wanted it to be, sorry about that! but hey ho, I hope some of you find it encouraging.

Looly
x


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## annacameron

WOWOWOW, great story. CONGRATULATIONS!       

and great to know that our meanderings have helped other people.


----------



## Little Me

Looly- I am in       in a good way xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


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## dimsum

Looly,

That's absolutely wonderful and inspiring. Well done you!  I've just started stimming again and this fills me full of hope and good vibes. Thanks for sharing


----------



## Little Me

Looly- What was done differently on the last go? xx


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## Züri

Hi girls just a quickie as I am in bed with the lurgy but was just skimming posts and saw Anne's mentioning the natural sweetener, I use sweetener and as far as i know i can;t get any natural ones here but as hubby is back in the uk this weekend I might try and see if he can get some - where do you get it from Anne? and is it in tablet form like the sweeteners?

Looly lovely story and congrats

Nix you made me laugh so much with your story how to gain weight it is EXACTLY the same description as my life!! how are you doing on your 2WW you are being very quiet. When is test date? lots of luck xxxx

Missy i'd be interested in your diet too - I need to lose about 10kg before next cycle

Happy birthday Pix xxx

Hi Ally xxx

and hello to everyone else sorry it's short 
xx


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## Little Me

Z- Hope you feel better.
It's in syrup form so can go on cereal etc too. Asda sell it so do Holland & Barratt
xxxxxxxx


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## Züri

thanks Anne x


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## looly

Hi Anne,

so sorry to make you cry xxxxx

Well I don't know what made it work, but I was on a much lower dose of Gonal F that time, only 150. My consultant said that sometimes a high dose can put too much pressure on your ovaries. But who knows ,the first time I was on the highest dose of 450 and produced 4 eggs then too. so not sure. I was also on a short protocol.


xxx


----------



## Little Me

Looly- Don't be sorry  
You can probably remember very well how I'm feeling now yourself- do I look at DE, do I ask my consultatnt if there is any otherway for another cycle (even though he gave us a 1% chance!) It just seems unlikely that I could work for me. Also my hubby is really worried about another own egg cycle cos of the emotional pain.  I am in a dillema  
xxx


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## Züri

girls i am back sorry a silly question but am a bit worried - ever since my ops last year and mainly the last one when they removed the tube - when i sneeze i get severe pains in my ovaries mainly my left one (my left one was the one with the cyst removed and the left tube removed) so as i am full of cold i am sneezing a lot and last night i did an almighty sneeze then was in agony feeling as if my ovary had twisted or something - or maybe if its covered in adhesion its pulled away to whatever it was stuck to - the pain was strong for a few seconds then died down a bit, but later in the evening and a lot of today i have been getting lots of dull aches in that area nothing like i have had before from ovulation pains etc... has anyone else experienced similar?


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## almond

Just popping on quickly instead of working

Looly - wow, thank you so much for posting your story. Congratulations!   I was a lurker for a long time here and it helped me so much. I am interested that a lower dose produced a pg for you, that is interesting 

Nix - thanks v much for the explanation. It is complicated isnt it! 

Zuri - just seen your post and I dont know the answer I am afraid. I have endo on both ovaries and I get all sorts of odd pains, but I dont know if they are anything to do with the endo or not. I reckon it is worth checking this out if you are worried?

Just reading all this stuff about nutrition and am starting to panic ... ! I have seen 3 nutritionists in the past couple of years ( ) and basically the advice I have had is to balance my blood sugar, restrict wheat and dairy (because I get a reaction to them and also because of endo), eat plenty of fruit and veg etc. I don't drink alcohol anyway (that is nothing to do with IF) and I don't drink tea or coffee with caffeine, again nothing to do with IF (but do have the odd decaff). 

My remaining vice is def sweet things, though I am pretty careful about what I have generally. I am careful to balance my blood sugar, because I feel [email protected] if I don't. But I am now panicking that I should give up sugar totally, but truthfully I really don't think I can bear losing my last treat, especially as I don't drink. I have also been told that the odd treat won't do me any harm - good advice for me, as I have a tendency to be obsessive! - though I have def strayed beyond odd treats to way too many over recent weeks.

Iknow we all have to find our own way with this, but I'd be really interested in hearing what others have been recommended. Having said that, I really dont think I can bear to be any stricter than I have been, but now I am worried   Is this just something else to beat myself up about?- I dont think I will ever be satisfied that what I am doing is enough? ...

x


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## Little Me

Z- Sorry hun, can't advise you. Sounds nasty though  

Almond- I have a sweet tooth too hun, I don't really drink- or if I do, it's once every few months or so. I do have tea though

Well girls, I have mailed Romina to  ask if there is anything at all that the docs could suggest that may let me try again with my eggs. EVENTHOUGH the doc gave me pretty much no hope and said this would 99% happen again.
What is wrong with me? I should just bloody listen to the people who know........but then look at Looly and Missy
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


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## Han72

Hello Looly  congrats on your  and thanks for sharing your inspirational story with us!  Whereabouts in France are you hon? 

Zuri hon - not really sure what to suggest, I've felt pain on sneezing before but always assumed it was just a muscle being strained or pulled or whatever.  Is it worth asking for a scan just to make sure all's well down there and that there's not a cyst or something causing the pain?  

Anne - if we'd all taken our docs advice, none of us would even be here now.  Odds and statistics are one thing but if this board has shown me anything it's that the docs can get it wrong and miracles do happen! So as long as you feel like you want to keep going then that's exactly what you should do! A former cycle buddy once told me, "it'll be all right in the end. If it's not all right, then it's not the end!"  
xxx


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## Little Me

Nix- I am loving that expression   
xxx


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## laurab

Zuri - I used to get that after my ectopic, it was scar tissue I ended up having an op to clear it and all fine now.  

Ah... beth crying back in a mo..


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## Züri

thanks laura that makes a lot of sense as I have lots of scare tissue adhesions not sure they'll give me another op to remove it again as it seems to come back quickly after each op


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## shortie66

Hiya ladies  

Pix - happy birthday hunny hope you have a fantastic day   

Just a quick hello to everyone   be back for personals later only 5mins left till hometime and not been able to log on all day    Am shattered think i am suffering a carbohydrate low from this diet and my knee is playing up somat rotten 

Back later girlies 

Kate
xxxxxxx


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## Little Me

Hi kate


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## Han72

slycett said:


> Am shattered think i am suffering a carbohydrate low from this diet and my knee is playing up somat rotten
> xxxxxx


rub some lard on it   

xxx


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## looly

Anne honey, i can remember exactly how you are feeling right now, and it's a really tough decision. Only you will know how you feel and if in your heart you want to try again and have the means to then I would obviously say you should go for it given my experience. The doctors don't always get it right, but only you know if you have the strength to deal with any possible pain again. Right now I'm sure you probably don't think you have, or at least that's how I felt after my one follie failed to fertilise, but give yourself a bit more time sweetie and don't rush into any decisions yet. I think you were right when you said you and Jason were just going to try to be yourselves again for a bit. IF is so all-consuming, there are days when you can think of nothing else, but now it's important for you guys to take some time to enjoy yourselves, and each other before deciding what to do next. 

Hi Nix - thanks for the welcome. I'm in the South, near Avignon.

xx


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## Han72

You lucky moo! Wanna swap? I'm in les Yvelines nr Paris   Have you been there long? Did you do your tx there or here?  Sorry I'm so nosy! 

xxx


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## Han72

actually that looks a bit garbled, I should explain I live in France but am in London for tx!


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## looly

Been in France for 5 years, so yes had all my treatment here. I know how lucky I am, as don't think I could have done it if I was still in London.
Have often wished I was nearer to Paris just to meet up with you, you've made me laugh out loud so many times!!!

All you ladies are an absolute inspiration, that you can maintain such a wonderful sense of humour given all the sh*t. It's wonderful and so important, and that's why i believe you'll all get what you deserve someday somehow because you all seem to have the right spirit.

xxx


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## Pixie75

Hello my girls  

I only have 5 seconds to write so here we go... 

Thanks everyone so much for my lovely birthday wishes! I'm [email protected]@dy 34 now - no spring chicken anymore!  

Ally: Thanks SOOO much honey - you are so lovely!   
Please don't be so hard on yourself, as all the girls have already said we ALL make mistakes. Nobody has any rights to judge you and I doubt anyone from our lovely PR team would do that anyway. I really hope you and Ben sort things out very soon. We are all here for you whenever you need us.  

Anne: You seem brighter these days honey - glad you are feeling better  

Almond: Were you in M&S Oxford Street last Monday? If not, I swear you have a double!  I think I saw you while I was in the queue but by the time I finished you'd gone! Ps: Thanks for your lovely words the other day - I really appreciate it.  

Nix: You nutter! Congratulations on being a PUPO I'm  for a little nutter/s like you! 

Missy: Wow!! absolutely amazing news hon! Congratulations! Please, please take it easy.  

Zuri: Sorry you are not feeling well honey   Hope you are better soon.  

Suzie:  


Ali, Sam,Lainey, Wing Wing, Beach, Purple, Malini, Lightweight, Kazzie (will PM you as son as I get chance) Miranda, Laura, Steph,Tracey...I know I missed loads of people but I have to go now cos DH is looking at me like this    
We are off to a fish restaurant to celebrate my bday. 
Yippie!!  

Pix xxx


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## almond

Hi Pix!! Hope you have a lovely evening tonight! if you think 34 is bad, wait til you get to 35  

yes I was in M and S in Oxford St last Monday!! where were you? I was in the clothes bit and in the food bit (of course!) I had just come out of having lovely low price facial and massage at LCBT  

x


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## laurab

Happy birthday Pix! Oh fish restaurant... yum.


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## Spuds

*Looly* - sitting here in tears reading your story - happy tears if that makes sense - thank you so very very much for sharing it with us it really really helps......CONGRATULATIONS - is not a big enough word to say but MANY MANY MANY of them !!!  

*Anne* - Ive been catching up and really really feel for you hun - this is a difficult crossroads but one I'm not sure you need to decide on yet. If it were me - I would take time out - try and switch off from all this IVF nonsense even have a beer or two and treat it as a 'holiday' from myself for a bit if that makes sense - just really try to enjoy myself - get back into sex for fun and think 'stuff it' for a bit.......easier said than done I'm sure but I just wonder if you need to have some extra time for you n Jase without this poo to recharge your batteries ? - sending you loads and loads of       + 

*Tracey* - I dont think I have all of your name properly - sorry for that - am technophobe and cant seem to get back to the earlier posts to check it !!! - just wanted to say many thanks for your message - it does only take one so Im going for it on Monday/Tues and hoping n praying 'the one' is in there somewhere !!

*Nix* - ha ha ha ! I will shorten to JSpuds for you and thanks for the welcome and kind message 

*Wing Wing* - the 30th would be great for me - would so like to meet up - slight dilemma as it may be ET day - can you let me know where you are mtg and I'll keep in touch - not done this before so not sure if I'll be completely fine to come out to play or should be in bed with me feet up 

Best wishes   and  to all

JSpuds
XXX


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## shortie66

Hi ladies 

Looly - what a fab story hunny      Congrats on your success   

Anne - hi hunny, how are you doing today? 

Nix - ive thrown all the lard out petal, but i could always use a bit of my **** god knows theres enough there  

Pix - hope you have a lovely meal, please think about me while ur there i'e had 2 poached eggs on toast and a tub of cottage cheese 

Hi almond, wingwing, mallini, hazelnut, laura, miranda, steph, tracey, littlejenny, anneofc, jersey, lightweight, kazzie, purple, suzie, zuri, ally, ali, missyg, and everyone else.

Going to eat my cottage cheese and be a miserable cow while dh eats his takeaway chinese   

Kate
xxxxxxxxxx


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## sarahq

Hi All

I'm new to this site so please bear with me if I ramble a bit.

I'm 37 and I have a DS who's just turned 3 - he was conceived naturally and quickly after I came off the pill which I had been on for about 10 years.  After this I didn't think having another baby would be a problem - how wrong I was!!!

I have been told I have POF - FSH about 70, AMH 0.22 and no periods for 8 months.  I have tried herbal medicine to no avail.  The doctors I've seen say donor eggs are my only option but I'm reluctant to go down that road - prob a bit selfish I know but I feel I have a DS who is 'all mine and DHs' but using a DE the baby would not be 'mine'.  I know I might change my mind but that's where I'm at just now.

The doctors say I would not be a candidate for IVF with the stats I have.  Has anyone else had results like mine and then gone on to conceive?  How??  

Please ladies give me some hope !!!!

Cheers
Sarahq


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## Donkey

Evening girls

Hello again, I know I’ve been absent for ages but I just needed a break from IF.  After my last BFN it has taken ages to get over it and I still have wobbles.  I have been lurking for a while after cutting myself off completely and realised that I have to pull myself together.  I’m not the only person who feels sh1t and I do worry about being negative and pulling you girls down, but I know that we are the only ones that really understand each other. I think I am feeling very similar to Pixie (happy birthday by the way) as I too have looked at the ‘accepting and moving on’ board and we are seriously discussing adoption…these things take time to sink in and come to terms with.  I also have been continually ill since my last IVF with coughs, colds, laryngitis – I think my body is telling me it’s had enough for the moment.
DH was also made redundant a couple of weeks ago, several hundred people were without any notice or redundancy pay…shocking!

Anyway onwards and upwards…be positive.  

Firstly congrats to missyg and looly, wonderful, wonderful news. You give us all so much hope.
Lainey – I hope you and the twins are well, take care.

Anne – I was devastated for you.  There’s nothing I can say that will make anything better but you are so strong.

Purps – again so sorry for your news, it was ll looking so good.  I hope you can reflect and look at the positives from this cycle to help you next time.

LJ – you have always been there for us and I’m so glad the girls have been there to look after you.

Ally – please don’t feel embarrassed talking to us, it was very brave of you.  I can’t imagine that there are many girls on here who haven’t done something they are ashamed of in their relationship.  If ben wanted an excuse to leave he could have taken it.  He’s still here, so he wants to stay and he wants you.  You can’t change the past but you can make the future good together.  

Nix – GOOD LUCK  

I just wanted to touch base and rejoin the gang, I’m afraid I’m not good at long posts but I will try and improve  

Lots of love
Donkey xx

PS welcome sarahq


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## Ali27

Almond - meeting was bloomin awful.  Given me a bit of a headache now tbh.  It was the content - meant that some staff will be made redundant so not nice at all.  your diet sounds pretty good to me.  My chinese doc always said everything is ok in moderation.  And to listen to your body.  Whilst lots of fruit and veg may be great, if it makes you bloated etc then dont eat so much.  Dont give yourself too hard a time.   i have defo become more aware of the ingredients of food and check labels before I buy - especially with MSG's and such like.  And I dont use many chemicals in my house nowadays.  But i do still use hairspray everyday which must be really bad and have gone back to proper deoderant as the aluminium free one made me smell!     

Nix - yoou were allowed to put "buggered"!!  Love the quote from your cycle buddy  

Ally - well done ont he BMS today!!   

Wing - hello there!  

Anne - sounds like a good plan with the au naturel.  But if you feel like trying again with your own eggs then do that!  I know it is so hard emotionally but I am not sure what is worse - trying and not succeeding in achieving our dream or not trying as hard as we thought we should have tried.  Does that make sense?  

Looly - wonderful story!  Fills me with lots of hope. Wishing you a very happy adn safe remainder of your pregnancy.     Could I just ask how high your FSH was?

SarahQ - Welcome!  Ally started a new thread of success stories for women with low AMH/high FSH - perhaps have a peek there.  And Sam has posted links to stories of women with high FSH becoming pg.  If I knew what i was doing I would paste them here but i dont!   

Dimsum - hello!!  

Zuri - hope you feel better soon.  And I would say get that pain checked  

Pam - have you read the post from Looby saying about the higher dose etc?  

Spuds - Hiya!  

Pixie - hope you have a lovely meal out  

Kate - hope knee feels better soon.


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## Ali27

in case anyone is interested there is a prog on radio 4 now about children born from anonymous donor sperm.


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## Ali27

Hi Donkey - was wondering if your DH had totally disabled you!!  good to hear from you  

DOES ANYONE FANCY A MEET UP WITH PIXIE AND I ON SAT 2ND MAY?  I KNOW WE MENTIONED THIS A WHILE AGO TOO.  IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO COME THEN DECLARE IT NOW!!  IT WOULD BE GREAT TO MEET SOME OF YOU.  IT SOUNDS LIKE BOTH PIXIE AND I ARE EASY WHERE IT IS SO LETS SEE WHO CAN COME AND THEN SEE WHICH LOCATION IS MOST CENTRAL.

love to everyone


----------



## missyg

I really don’t know how much this is going to help anyone but it may at least give you some hope. I am going to start right from the beginning as I don’t think there is any point in just telling you what I have been doing if I don’t explain why, as there are, as you will see, so many different things going on with me and I am still finding more out every day. I feel that my situation is so delicate and how can it possibly work with so much going on but I just have to stay positive and do a lot of praying! I also would like to say at this point that if it wasn’t for you lot I wouldn’t even have got this far anyway as I have learnt so much from all of you and particularly those of you that kept asking me what my immune issues were and I kept saying I didn’t have any!! Sorry to those that have heard it all before – I am not very good at keeping it short!

Where do I start? This has been a journey I started about 2 years ago when we first started ttc no 2. Having conceived easily first time with DS we were not in any rush and to be honest I think it happened again first time but was a chemical pregnancy. I have had over the years many times when I thought I was having the same very early pregnancy symptoms I had with DS and this time (taste in mouth, sense of smell) and even very faint hpts but thought I must be imagining it as I would get my period almost immediately. However as I had had such a f****ed up situation with retained placenta, 2 x d + cs and a uterus infection following the birth of DS I wasn’t taking any chances so went to see a private gynae who by chance tested me for thyroid antibodies as well as FSH. My thyroid antibodies were sky high, 4400, the normal range is under 50. My FSH was 16.2. He told me I had POF and would need donor eggs. I later had my AMH done which was 0.1/0.7. 

My immediate reaction was no way. I was not having this and set to with research into it all. I discovered autoimmune thyroid disease can cause POF and retained placenta/heavy blood loss and even bad d + cs can cause an thyroid autoimmune reaction. I now know autoimmune thyroid can then lead to elevated nk cells etc. The retained placenta was a bit like someone knocking the first domino over…..

I started of by seeing a nutritionist who ran complete thyroid panel tests and adrenal stress test. My thyroid was in a mess and I had adrenal failure – very low cortisol. She gave me nutritional advice and put me in touch with Dr M who specialises in thyroid disease. At the same time as all this is going on I started having severe vertigo attacks, they would come out of the blue, the only sign I would get was a build up of ear pressure like when you are on a plane and it won’t pop. This would build up very quickly and feel as if it was spreading over my eye and side of my face, I would then fall over and the world started spinning to the extreme that if I opened my eyes I would throw up. These episodes would last 4 hours each time and each time I would lose a tiny bit of hearing in that ear. My GP told me it was labryntitis (inner ear infection) and it would go. Four attacks later they couldn’t understand why it hadn’t cleared up. I went to see a ENT specialist who said it was Menieres disease. A devastating diagnosis. I wasn’t convinced and showed him my hormone level results – low estrogen, high fsh, thyroid etc. He said it was definitely not connected. I researched a connection and came across premenopausal women experiencing the same thing. Basically I was going into premature menopause with dramatic symptoms.

Dr M confirmed adrenal failure and tested me for candida/fungal dysbiosis and various food allergies. I had severe fungal dysbiosis which is where the candida has got out of control and made holes in the intestines causing food to leak out into the blood stream which then create food allergies. Excuse my basic explanations and I hope they are not too inaccurate but this is my basic understanding. He believes this is connected to the thyroid disease and if we combat the candida we can reduce the antibodies. By this point I had been told by many doctors that my thyroid did not need treating as my TSH was just at the top of normal – 3.5. I had read that if you had thyroid antibodies and your TSH was not below 1 you would not conceive. Fortunately Dr M agreed I needed treating. 

At the same time as all this I started reading about DHEA and contacted Dr Gleicher at CHR. I decided to try everything else before doing this as the list of side effects they sent me in an e-mail initially freaked me out. 

Dr M put me on a diet that was no dairy, no eggs, no banana (often connected with dairy allergies), no garlic and no soy. These were for my allergies. For the candida I was not to have sugar, fruit except apples, pears and berries, no yeast, vinegar, mushrooms, alcohol plus was put on anti fungal meds. For the menieres disease, which, although I don’t think this is what it is, it is still to do with sodium levels in my blood, caused, I believe, by low estrogen, and so the low sodium diet is the same for menieres and my symptoms. It does seem to work as since I have been on a very strict low sodium diet I have not had any attacks. This is the hardest part of all my restrictions and means no salt at all, everything I eat has to have no more than 0.12g of sodium. It is pretty impossible to find anything ready made with these levels unless they are packed full of something else on my long list of no nos. So I can’t have normal bread, I have managed to find a no salt no yeast bread which is a bit like chewing grains and leaves me with jaw ache! I pretty much make everything I eat from scratch and all ingredients are wholewheat so no white flour, pasta or rice. Lots of grains and pulses. Lots of vegetables. Lots of fish – salmon, tuna steaks, white fish – grilled or in foil parcels. Organic chicken and occasionally organic red meat but not that keen on it and as I was vegetarian for 20 years before all this I am still getting my head around meat! Not so much fruit but I do use a lot of lemons and limes for dressings and to make fizzy water a bit more interesting! Lots of nuts and seeds. Every day I do myself a fresh juice of apple, celery, carrot, beetroot and ginger. Then porridge with rice milk and I use perfect sweet which is the natural sugar alternative (xylitol) – you can get it in Sainsbury’s free from section. I have also had two spoonfuls of Linwood’s ground goji berries, flaxseed, sunflower and pumpkin seeds mixed into this. No caffeine, only herbal teas and water. I get around my chocolate cravings by eating huge amounts of Plamil’s dairy free, sugar free chocolate. 

Dr M also put me on an extensive list of supplements based on what I was deficient in. One of the main things he has had me on is large amounts of fish oils.

So I kept this all going but my cycles weren’t improving and by July last year I wondered if I would ever ovulate again. I started having hot flushes and skin crawling symptoms – signs of POF. Dr M did an FSH test but it wasn’t day 2/3 but it was pre ovulation. It was something like 48 and he told me I had menopausal levels – this was the only time I didn’t like Dr M as apart from that he has been fantastic! I bit the bullet and did a telephone consultation with Dr Gleicher at CHR who put me on 100mg of DHEA. 3 weeks from taking it I ovulated and fell pregnant. I think I got to about 5/5.5 weeks before it failed. Dr Gleicher told me to reduce to 75mg after this but my symptoms started to return so I made the decision to go back up to 100mg. 

Since this time my thyroid antibodies have reduced gradually to around 500 at the last testing. Pretty amazing considering other doctors had told me that could never happen.

Most of you know my lack of eggs from 2 good follicles and perfect estrogen levels from my IVF cycle at the Lister in Feb. This pregnancy is from the first ovulation following that. I had started 25mg prednisolone from the day before ovulation. Since I found out I was pregnant I have had 2 x intralipids and 1 x IVIG plus am on 75mg aspirin and 0.4 (just reduced to 0.2 because of bleeding) clexane plus 2 x 400mg progesterone pessaries. I have also been put on some estrogen as that was a bit low. I am waiting to discuss whether I need the LIT treatment in Greece with Dr G on Monday. I have been trying to reduce my DHEA gradually and had got down to 25mg a day but when I tried to do every other day my skin crawling symptoms started to come back which is making me very nervous. I am going to go back onto 25mg every day until I have some tests done to do with this. The reason I am mentioning this is that I have been in touch with a Dr P who wrote a book that makes the connection with retained placenta and autoimmune thyroid disease and he seems to think (not definite until I have another adrenal stress test) I may have something called Sheehan's syndrome also referred to as postpartum hypopituitarism caused by the retained placenta and blood loss – this can cause a sudden, potentially fatal (!) undersupply of the hormone cortisol. Perhaps this is why I need so much DHEA? The treatment for this also just happens to be treatment with steroids! Coincidence that the first time I try on steroids it works?! I just need to make sure I stay on the right things to keep pregnant – just not sure exactly what this is yet!!!

I hope this has been helpful to some of you. If anyone wants the details of any of the doctors I have seen or anything else feel free to pm me. 

Missy xx


----------



## Han72

DAMN!  Missy I'm speechless you really have been to hell and back!  I am in awe honey  . I pray that bubs hangs on andyou continue to prove the naysayers and doom-mongers wrong   
xxx


----------



## Ali27

Wow missy - thanks for taking the time to post that - and for adding in some paragraph breaks!   

I have noticed that when I am in bed sometimes i get itchy skin/crawling like i have eczema.  Is that what you were describing?  It is usually just before AF.  Or is this a coincidence?

I am going back to read it again!


----------



## missyg

Thanks Nix - you make me laugh out loud through all this so I give you some credit!!! 

I can't believe I forgot to mention something but I did ....I also took 2 x sachets of wheatgrass per day from urban wheatgrass plus v. good probiotics for the candida by biokult.

Really going to bed now! Ali just crossed posts - mine was always when I was trying but failing to ovulate. It feels like something crawling under your skin or like a drip of water running down you. Not nice.

xx


----------



## Han72

How could I have missed this


Ali27 said:


> IT SOUNDS LIKE BOTH PIXIE AND I ARE EASY


*sniggers*   

But I thought it was the 30/4? N'est ce pas?

xxx

Whoops wotcha Missy, glad to be of assistance! 
xxx


----------



## May74

Ali27 said:


> I have noticed that when I am in bed sometimes i get itchy skin/crawling like i have exzema. Is that what you were describing? It is usually just before AF. Or is this a coincidence?


Have you checked your bed for fleas or bed bugs


----------



## Ali27

Pam - good point - will do that.  Am sat here itchy and twitching now just talking about it.  

Nix - there is one on 30th but I live in Southampton so for me it needs to be a weekend.  you still in London on 2nd May?  Like I said pixie and I are easy    

Missy - you able to come on 2nd May?  

Anyone else?


----------



## Han72

PamLS said:


> Ali27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have noticed that when I am in bed sometimes i get itchy skin/crawling like i have exzema. Is that what you were describing? It is usually just before AF. Or is this a coincidence?
> 
> 
> 
> Have you checked your bed for fleas or bed bugs
Click to expand...

   oh dear it's getting a bit silly, I think I'd better log off!

Whoops wotcha Ali - I think I'm gonna be down in Hants myself on the 2nd (oh the irony!) I'll play it by ear....

xxx


----------



## May74

*Looly* Your story is amazing, on my first cycle (SP) I was on menopur 225 and started with 12 follies, although ended up with 5, 2 of which were immature, my second cycle they upped me to 375 menopur (LP) and it ended up being cancelled as I failed to respond. Now i have the dilema of menopur for this cycle, Jaya said 300 and when I questioned that it was lower than last time and last time failed she said I could have 450 of I wanted but she suggested 300 as they reduced the d/reg drugs. Lots of people on here seem to think that PR respond better with lower doses, and you seem to also back this up- so think i will follow all the advice given and go for lower dose, after all it did me well the first time

Thanks for your story, it is truly inspirational and good luck with the rest of this pregnancy  

Pam


----------



## May74

Night Nix x

Ali- dont think i will be coming to visit you in Southampton


----------



## Züri

Missy thanks for sharing your story, you really have been through a lot and i hope you get what you thoroughly deserve with this pregnancy

Oh and what is d + cs?

Ali I get that itching as well and it usually happens before ovulation and sometimes just before AF - it's only legs but I feel like I could scratch them forever and ever and it's bloody frustrating, don;t really understand what it is, i don't have a rash and they are not red or anything they just itch like crazy and it's the nicest relief to just scratch and scratch - interesting that it sounds like you have the same

x


----------



## Miranda7

Let me know if you're meeting in Sotton folks - I might just be able to make it that far! As will Bugle - she lives there.

Missy - gawd, I'm now worrying about my retained placenta and thyroid troubles! Gah. I too am going to have to read that again on a quiet moment.

Nix, PUPO laydee! You'll know if you're preggers by the 2nd, won't you? Will it be a celebration meet? God, I hope so bird.

A belated happy birthday Pixie! Hope you had a grand day!

Anne - I really would go for one more cycle with own eggs, but come up with a very different protocol. Perhaps not with the pill? Then on to donor if that fails. I really think you haven't had your best cycle yet. There are so many examples on this thread of people failing to respond again and again, then suddenly popping out a goodly batch.

Ally - oh, it must be even harder for you, getting through the tough tx while still resolving issues with Ben. You must be a heck of a strong couple - take heart in that at least. So glad you managed unprecedented levels of bonking at the right time! Whoo!

Kate - your diet sounds a little bland dear! Can you not add some tasty stuff to that? Pineapple in the cottage cheese? I mean, ew...

Looly - brilliant story! Well done you!

Sorry - got to go, but I do read and think of you all, just my posts are a bit short these days!

xxxx


----------



## Little Me

Morning girls  

Missy- Wow x  

Donkey- Nice to see you   , so very sorry about DH's job- how horrible  

Mira- I emailed Rom yesterday asking for help/anything positve./diff protocol etc . I didn't have the pill on this cycle but i did on the last one. It's all so bloomin mind consuming eh!  How's Robert ?


At work so strruggling to do personals but will chat through the day

Everyone ok ?


----------



## dimsum

Hey Missyg,

You've been through so much. Really hoping that this pregancy works out for you and that you get your body back in balance too 
Hellloooooooo to everyone


----------



## Ali27

Morning everyone!

Just popping on to say hi before going to work  

TFI Friday!


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Morning lovelies

Never so glad to get to a Friday!! Shame I have an old Greek friend staying for the weekend, he smokes like a chimney and the forecast is for rain !! There is going to be so much moaning about the smoking ban!! What am I going to do with him. He treats me like his mum and expects me to organise everything amazingly for him! 

Looly - congrats - thanks for your inspiring story and so glad that our posts helped you  

Missy - well done for that very informative post  

To everyone else chat later as am at work and actually need to do some! 

Love and hugs


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Ali - I am a definate maybe for the meet - would really love it. Have spoken to Pix about it already but just need to work out what Bens work plans are, he may be off to USA and so just need to make sure its not the day before he goes!! 

Pix - did you have a lovely dinner honey?? Hope so xxxx


----------



## Little Me

Hi LW, Ally, Ali, Dimsum


----------



## Han72

Coo what's going on with the PR meet ups? It's like waiting for a bus, nuffink for ages then 3 come along at once   

I'm not sure which of these I'm gonna be able to do. I suspect that if the news is positive on Weds then I'm going to be wrapped up in cotton wool by various relatives and DH but I am determined to do at least one of them!

As you all know, I don't do symptom spotting so this morning I am not feeling at all sick or lightheaded or having little pulling sensations in the womb area and even if I was I wouldn't tell you about it so there!

Sorry no persos but am off to do something with this disaster that passes for hair on my head as my mate is coming round to visit me today which is great as I haven't left the house since et and am going STIR CRAZY!!! I really must make an effort as she's just had a baby so I can't have her looking more groomed than me!

Happy Friday all!!
xxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

LW - I know this AMH retesting really gets to me, to think that they are now saying that the AMH can go UP aswell as down!! All the heartache they have caused with their diagnosis that with very low AMH you will NEVER conceive. To think that there are ladies who have gone straight to DE because they were told it would NEVER happen and they are now having to listen to the consultants backtrack   Thankfully I am a cynic and NEVER believed a bloody word they said!!!  either that or I have been in denial for the past year!!!  

Anne darling how are you today   

Nix - hang in there - as you know very well symptoms mean nothing at all


----------



## Little Me

Nix- Take care & have a good day with great hair     

Alls- I'm ok ta hun, Hmmm, wonder what my AMH would be now?  -1000000 P/mol     

xxxxx


----------



## May74

Hi Everyone,

just got back from my pill scan and only 1-2 antral follies were seen, am feeling so   because I so hoped that my PR was due to the diet last time. Does this mean that I am only likely to get 1-2 follies when I start stimming?

Pam


----------



## Little Me

Hi Pam- sorry hun  
At my first IVF pill scan in Jan I had 3 A/Follies but when I stimmed they got 4 proper size  follies and one small one.
the Antrals can defo change, my last cycle I had 6 antrals in March and only got one at EC time.
It's all very fff'd up and no exact science I don't think.


----------



## May74

Thanks Anne, I kept saying to myself that it was the diet all will be well this time, it was the only way I could cope approaching this cycle. If this fails before even getting to EC just dont know what I am going to do


----------



## Ourturn

Looly - Congratulations, how inspirational

Pixie - belated birthday greetings! 

Hi everyone and hello and   to newbies 

I'm away for one day and there are pages to go through! Sorry no time for personals. Need to get over to the hospital as they want me to have a liver function due to my reaction to the pills they gave me. Had a lovely anniversary day yesterday. Bought a very flaterinng empire line bright blue silk dress from Monsoon. Found a place in town that blows up pics and prints them onto canvas.  BYGOF! Had 2 wedding pics done for dh in sepia, one was the big group shot, the other was a lovely natural shot of us laughing whilst walking near a river. They turned out really well are hung in pride of place.  Dh bought me an orchid, bottle of pink champagne and took me for dinner in our fave Italian. Got to our table and there was a bouquet of flowers and card from the owners! (they are our friends). So all in all a lovely day and really lifted my spirits. Feel much better now I have stopped those pills. Just hope my AF turns up soon so I can get my IVF schedule.

Anna x


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Pam - Hi hon - we haven't spoken for a while   Did they actually do an antral follicle scan? Quite often they don't, they just have a quick look to ensure no cysts no problems etc, if this is the case they wouldn't have done a thorough count up. Maybe check and find out what they say? If it was an antral count this can change from month to month so you could maybe discuss waiting a month or so for a better count??


----------



## May74

*Ally* Hi, I think you were somewhere exotic when my cycle was abandoned last month due to a PR and have popped in and out of PR since but its such a busy place , have been on the pill 2 weeks and it was to check the lining etc so that I could start d/reg today, the lining was fine, no cysts and then they said antral follies seen were 1-2  so was that an antral follie scan?? I never asked before my last cycle and had 12 on the first cycle

Thanks for responding

Pam


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Anna - glad you had such a magical anniversary - days like that make all the difference don't they  

Pam - sorry I haven't been more helpful hon


----------



## Little Me

Sounds like a perfect day Anna   

I know this might sound odd after just coming back from being away but I so WANT a holiday,really want to just book one for September maybe but then that's more ££££££££ that I could use for my next cycle(what ever that maybe)

x


----------



## Pixie75

Morning girlies,

Pam: I learnt not to trust AFC scans hon after Anne’s last cycle and a few other ladies experiences on this thread. You might start with a couple and end up with more or vice versa – so please keep positive. 

Ally: Your friend sounds a bit strange!   My sis smokes and every time she does I chuck her out in the garden and tell her not to come back after the smell has gone!   I know she is my sis I can tell her that but still, your friend should respect the fact you guys don’t smoke.    

Anne: Hello my lovely - any plans for the weekend?  

Ali: Me easy?! Speak for yourself missus – I’m a ladee!    So what is TFI Friday then?  

I’m totally confused about the meet up dates!    I know we were talking about meeting for the last 3 months (or something like that!   ) on 2nd May so are we meeting on the 30th in Sutton now?   What’s going on?!

Girls, I’m on day 19 today and I think I ovulated yesterday with very little notice! I’m on Oestrogen tablets for my tx in May which I reckon messed up my FM cos it had a high reading since I started taking the tablets but yesterday I had loads of   EWCM and this morning my BBT rocketed! I might have missed my [email protected]@dy chance this month cos we only   last night! It was another bday present from my DH –   thanks, I’d rather cash!   

Hello to everyone else and big kiss.  

I'm off for more shopping with my sis now. You think I'm bad then you don't want to meet her!  

Pix xx


----------



## Little Me

Pix- You make me  
Hoep you had a lovely meal last night x
We have the boys this weekend so step mum I guess for me


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Anne honey totally understand you wanting a holiday, not strange at all, your trip to Turkey wasn't a holiday darling!   I am sure there must be some good deals out there so you don't have to spend a fortune, although the bloody Euro is a bit of a bad deal at the moment, wonder where else?? Turkey would be good but doubt you want to go back after such a sad experience last time.   I think a holiday could do you both a lot of good, you would prob just want to be careful what you spend so that you don't come home and regret it


----------



## Little Me

Alls- Found a gorgeous hotel in Riveria Mexico called the Grand Sirenis Riveria Maya for £950.00 each all inc, 2weeks , 5 star, 2 years old the hotel.
Have been to Mexico 3 times already but LOVE it there
Not bad eh!!
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Sounds amazing - what does J say?


----------



## Little Me

He said he wants to take me away from all this sh!t    
we'll see eh.
maybe could do that and then do DE (if we need to as a miracle natural COULD happen to any  of us  ) next April.
How are you and B?
xxx


----------



## Miranda7

Sorry - Sotton is short for Southampton!


----------



## annacameron

Missy, 

many thanks for your posting. while I am DELIGHTED for you, it totally depressed me  how poor UK drs are. theya re staggeringly illinformed. and apparently the culture is not open to leanrign either. it's not as if what you were investigating was a new or weird area. rather it was a question of being a detective and actually diagnosing accurately. 

thank goodness you managed to get through it all.  

i do know someone with suspected Sheehans so might put her in touch with you if that's ok. 

thanks again, 

Anna xx


----------



## May74

*Pixie* thanks, I hope it not right as feel so , hope you have a good time shopping

*Anne* I am with you, I soooooo need a holiday and not cheap and chearful but some pampering. I have 2 weeks off at the end of June, if this cycle fails which is looking likely before it starts I am jetting off somewhere !!! Anywhere!!!! never been one for a beach hol but maybe its not too learn to start 

Pam


----------



## Ali27

Really quick sneak - 

Pixie - made me laugh about wanting the cash!!  Perhaps you could get a cash compensation?  We are still planning 2nd May arent we?  others are planning 30th (Almond, Wing Wing etc).  I cant do 30th.  

Easy with the venue - shall we see who can come and then decide?

Ally - are you coming?

Anyone else?

Ali xx


----------



## Ali27

Just had an email back from Jaya.  I was asking for a copy of the protocol and also to check why she had put Puregon on my script and not Menopur as discussed at FU appointment.  Email back said it was a mistake!!!!!  She is sending another one!

Jesus!  Good job I checked it and did not buy loads!


Will read back later x


----------



## Little Me

Ali -


----------



## Ali27

Hi Anne - I know!  I was hesitant about checking but glad I did now.

Ally - just seen you post about being a defo maybe!  Fabulous.  Sorry, but I am hoping Ben goes to US on Friday    

Pixie- enjoy shopping

Hi to everyone else.

xx


----------



## Little Me

My bro has just bought a good blood pressure monitor - mine is 151/79 - what the F?
Looked it up and it seems quite high.
Never had high before


----------



## Ali27

do some work anne!!


----------



## shortie66

Hi ladies 

Anne - ditto what ali said, you are having far too much fun for being at work   

Hi everyone, just a quick sneak on at work.  I have the weekend off      

I need a holiday too, mite try and twist dh's arm to a week somewhere in the summer  

Kate
xxxxxxxx


----------



## TryMeditate

Hi girls - just popping on quickly before weekend starts!

LJ – if you want to put on weight, it’s carbs carbs carbs.  Bread, pasta, cereals, more bread and pasta.. stick with me hon I’ll turn you into "big jen" in no time.

Missy – thanks for putting your full story out there.  You know how much we need miracle stories.  Time and time again we keep reading stories of how diet improves egg quality, but it doesn’t happen overnight, it takes a minimum of 4 months of devotion and you certainly had that!  I say we should add  link on the miracle stories thread  One of our very own   

AnnaCameron – thanks for posting the link to the lovely response from the SIRM doctor about the mothers influence on the DE baby, I really enjoyed reading that.  Very interesting.  Steph, hope you didn't miss this one.

Looly – thank you sooo much for your amazing story!  Hey would you mind updating your profile with your amh and highest FSH number, then we can post yours and Missy’s on the miracle threads link that lovely Ally put together for us to give us hope.

Anne – Sweet Anne, I don’t know what to advise you about DE or trying again... miracles do happen – even on our little PR thread!  Re DHEA, I’m off it at the moment, but I came off it as my FSH went above 40 and LH and testosterone were also high.  I have no idea if this was caused by DHEA or not, but I guess I’ll retest FSH after being off it for a couple of months and see.   I do know that it takes a minimum of 3 months to work, so you were only on it for 2 months.  After this cycle, I really think I may give DHEA another go, do 75mg of micronised and stay on it for at least 6 months next time without stopping and starting because I'm confused. It depends though on what clinic I choose for my next cycle, I know SIRM won't like it at all if I take DHEA.

Almond – I know what you mean about the diet, it’s really hard to give up everything.  I’ve decided to do it though, as there will be plenty of time for sugar, white carbs, alcohol and all the rest of it when I’ve moved on one way or another.  I try to think about the food I am allowed as a treat – I have eggs for breakfast, sometimes scrambled with smoked salmon.  I'm making some calamari for dinner with tartare sauce (no sugar) a yummy salad (calamari is soo cheap at the moment, and so easy to cook yourself - what a treat!). Last night yummy snapper with lemon butter and roast veggies  - see, I’m not doing too badly!  I try to think of these things as my treats.  My snapper was expensive I thought – but I figure it’s cheaper than a night out with wine & dessert!

Pix – have fun shopping with your blister.     

Ali – hi, hope your doing well.  I can’t make the meet up in Southhampton, though i would love too.  I’ve had the “wrong” protocol sent to me from the Lister – mine was protocol and script for an entirely different person!! Lucky I checked with the girls on here as to why mine looked so weird compared to everyone elses.  It shakes you a bit doesn't it.

Pam – I wanted to test AFC and the “quality” of the people who were scanning me.  This was right at the beginning of my IF when i still thought AFC meant anything at all – which now I don’t, (see SIRM website, 40+ woman with undectable Amh and no antrals – pregnant) , as I’ve heard AFC vary in the eye of the beholder.  One day, I did 3 AFC in a day with 3 different clinics. Results were a total of 11,8 and 5...... ignore them.   I think there is a difference between an AFC of 2 and an AFC of 30, IF the scan person is good, but the exact numbers really don’t mean anything at all.

WW - I'm so jealous of your lloyd cole personal experience! I always loved his music, but didn't really lust after him.   I'd still love to see him though.

Kate – why don’t you look at mexico with Anne – sounds fab to me!

Hi Zuri, Ally, Nix, Mir, Laura, Steph, Popsi,  LW, Lucy and the rest of the gang. 

LOL Sam xxx


----------



## Jumanji

just saying hello!  Work has been v. hectic today. I am still on the world's dullest conference call - on speaker with mute so I can actually deal with important things like posting here!


----------



## Little Me

Hi LJ, Sam, Kate, 


have a lovely weekend all, I have the boys this w/end so prob won't get on much.

Lots of love

xxxxx


----------



## shortie66

littlejenny      ive sneaked on at work again 

Anne - hi hunny - nearly hometime for me   I love weekends when im not working saturday  

Sam - i would love mexico or morocco but dont think our funds will stretch to it.  I was thinking more of a last minute deal to tenerife or lanzarote for a week   Unless of course we win the lottery or get that elusive bfp naturally......oh well i love dreaming


----------



## annacameron

Sam, that is ridiculous!  3 different nos for AFC!  this IVF malarkey just gets worse and worse!


----------



## May74

*Sam* thankyou so much for the info on AFC, they want you to go into each cycle feeling positive but its just bloody ridiculous I feel like I am starting treatment for something awful with an awful outcome instead of any positivity. At least there is some hope then, maybe I should go back tommorow and have another one  and as Ally said it was mainly a pill scan so maybe they didnt look too carefully and there are more hiding  - thanks 

*Anne* clearly still struggling to work at work  you deserve a holiday 

*Ali* any news re work today?

Pam


----------



## Wing Wing

Hi Girls

Was not able to get back on yesterday  as too busy at work and wanted to spend evening with DH.

Have now found that the website has been blocked for use on our work computers – do you think I have been rumbled?  Am I next in the firing line for redundancy or dismissal – oh sh1te!!!  Been a bit clever and sneaky tho as can get FF on Blackberry so read on there and typed on word doc at work, emailed that doc home and hey presto!  Here I am having pasted it into here!

Trouble is, I wrote LOADS at work and forgot to save it all so only got half of it at home - bl00dy computers!  So, this is TOTALLY a me post as this is all that came through on the email and I have to go out now for dinner with some friends so will try to do personals tomorrow.  Please remember that I love you all!

Anyway, I had my appointment with Dr Nice on Weds and it really did go very well.  It amazes me that some of you seem to know more than the doctors themselves – particularly with reference to my old Dr Pig!!

I told Dr Nice about the follow up appointment with Dr Pig and showed him my test result papers that Dr Pig had given me.  Dr Nice said all seemed ok and although  AMH was within the low range it was not catastrophic!  This is totally the opposite of what Dr Pig said but totally agreed with what LJ and others told me – thanks girls!

He advised that there was no reason to give up on the IVF just yet although reminded us that there was obviously no guarantee of success.  He confirmed that Puregon  was not necessarily the best drug to have been given and mentioned menopur (again, you girls knew that so why didn’t Dr Pig?).

He said that our options were to try with him in Lux or go to Leuven in Belgium.  He confirmed that we still have 4 free attempts here in Lux and that this includes treatment in Belgium!!!  We decided to have one go with him in Lux first, see how we get on and then try Leuven if necessary.  

Dr Nice took us both through medical questionaires and asked me for a copy of the extensive  notes  I have been keeping re gynaenacological matters for the last  3  years (I was gobsmaked as Dr Pig had dismissed those notes with a wave of his trotter and now Dr Nice was saying how useful they would be to see what has happened in the past!!.  

Also he would like to do a hysteroscopy  which again is something Dr Pig never did.

He prescribed contraceptive pill to start taking on day one of next cycle and said I had to make another appointment with him then for the Hysteroscopy and we would also discuss the details of the protocol

DH and I were well happy with this and, as I had got the smiley face on Clear Blue digital ovulation stick, went home and had BMS!

So, I feel a lot happier about the treatment aspect of things but our relationship is not great.  All this treatment has placed a huge strain on us both and whereas I am good at talking about it, DH is rubbish and I only learned this morning that he feels under a lot of pressure near to bedtime as to what he should do!!!  So much pressure last night that he got the trots just before bed and we ended up rowing cos no BMS.  BUT I didn’t know he felt such pressure cos he never told me!!  Have said that this weekend we are going to try to have 2 whole days of just being nice to each other.  Wish me luck girls!

So sorry for the Me post but no time to do any more - am gutted that I wasted about an hour at work preparing a word doc for nothing - in fact I should complain to work for not allowing direct access to FF as at least the hour I spent would not have been TOTALLY wasted had I been able to post direct!

Good evenings to you all.

Ally, i have not forgotten that I said i would PM you and I will!

WW XXX


----------



## Han72

Hey love, no worries about the me post, I'm so glad it went so well and I want to say thank you for this one which made me laugh out loud:



Wing Wing said:


> I was gobsmaked as Dr Pig had dismissed those notes with a wave of his trotter


   

xxx


----------



## Ali27

Evening all!!

Just got in and about to go for a run with my friend    Same route but as the sun is not shining my head should not be at risk from low-lying branches as i try to look at it!

Just to clarify - the meet up on 2nd May has no venue yet.  Just seeing who can make it/want sot come and then decide.  

Back later cos I have no life


----------



## Han72

Life   Whassatden?   

xxx


----------



## Han72

Real life pacman    






/links


----------



## beachgirl

Nix- you're not going mad on the 2ww are you chick?


----------



## Han72

who me    Mind you, if you think I'm going mental you should check out the FET board mate, I think I'm gonna have to stop posting there as it's starting to raise my blood pressure as other people's paranoia is starting to rub off!

xxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

WW - the trotter gaff - love it love it love it!!

Nix - don't go off on those other boards you nutter,you know what happens when you do!! I went on the UCH board last night (why?  ) A girl over there had 20 eggs and 9 blasts!! I wanted to kill myself temporarily, then got my positive head back on!!   Another girl had 21 in the freezer - WTF!! What a freak!! Thats just unnecessary!! 

Ali - LIFE?? I am the sadest mother in the world! I actually (for once) have the chance to go out but I am feeling torn as i just want to get my jimjams on and chill with you guys!!   Oh damn better get my sh!t together and go meet Ben  

See you later xxxx


----------



## Züri

what nix paranoid about dropping a laptop on your tummy?   I don't think they're listening to nurse nix 

WW glad your appointment with dr nice went well x

Ally


----------



## Han72

Züri said:


> what nix paranoid about dropping a laptop on your tummy?  I don't think they're listening to nurse nix


   You know I'm sure I must have been just like that at some point. How embarrassing!

Oi Ally! I am here going absolutely barmy cos I'm in London, I KNOW that my mates and just about everyone else in the flipping town is going out dancing and getting langered and I'm here with the remote and a mug of warm milk! Get your glad rags on and get your fine  out there girlfriend. RIGHT NOW!!!   

xxx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Z  

Nix - Okay okay already - I am out that door


----------



## Han72

Good!  Now, in the interests of maintaining my sanity, I think it's time to dust this one off again. Steph posted it ages ago but I promised Malini I'd find it for her... It was unfortunately censored but if you replace the words "naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much" with "[email protected]" it's even funnier!

IVF Barbie
When Mattel were looking to design their new Barbie, IVF Barbie, they soon realized that there was not one universal Barbie that would accurately portray the spirit of IVF Barbie. So they decided they would come out with a few variations thereof.

Newbie Barbie: Newbie Barbie, also known as BabyDust Barbie is a bright, perky, Barbie, filled with optimism and confidence that IVF Will Work. She is thinner and usually younger than the other IVF Barbies. Her accessories include rose-tinted spectacles, a positive bank balance, healthy insurance coverage and a million questions. Newbie Barbie has lots of other Newbie Barbie friends and they congratulate each other on a job well done. This Barbie only says pleasant, optimistic things and believes that Attitude is Everything. Their motto is Think Positive!!

Pregnant Newbie Barbie: Pregnant Newbie Barbie is the big sister to Newbie Barbie. She is still slim, now with a cute belly. She is proof that IVF Does Work, usually the first time. She also comes with rose-tinted spectacles, a positive bank balance (only very slightly depleted) and total confidence that All Will Be OK. She glows when pregnant and liberally uses baby dust when playing with her sisters, the Newbie Barbies. She comes with Very Cute maternity clothes, a double stroller, and a fully decorated nursery even though she is only just a few weeks pregnant. Her motto is ‘See! Thinking Positive Works!!’. Newbie Barbie and Pregnant Newbie Barbies are great playmates and you can collect them as a set.

Veteran Barbie: Veteran Barbies are not at all related to the Barbies above. Veteran Barbies are the Anti-Barbie. They are a whole lot plumper than the Newbie Barbies, less perky (in boobs and attitude), have grayer hair, a largely negative and over-drawn bank balance, plenty of bruises and marks and a slightly cynical attitude. They are dressed in comfy track pants with elasticated waistbands. Their accessories include a wealth of knowledge of reproductive procedures and protocol, the ability to practically do their own cycle, a snarky attitude, little tolerance for stupidity, a well defined sense of humor, the ability to laugh at themselves, a fondness for wine/beer/crack and a aversion to pineapple, baby dust and Newbie Barbies. This aversion in its more severe form can be allergic and acerbic. Veteran Barbies tend to swear quite a bit (especially when playing in the Barbie House with Newbie Barbies and Pregnant Newbie Barbies) and parental guidance is advised.

Pregnant Veteran Barbie: Very similar to Veteran Barbie, only now with an added dose of neuroses and paranoia. Continuously and obsessively over-analyses every twinge, convinced that the end is nigh. Only buys stroller and decorates nursery when in eighth month. Accessories include disbelief and a sense of not quite belonging, and 10 home pregnancy tests just in case the first one was faulty or the clinic made a mistake with her beta. Pregnant Veteran Barbies have been known to pee on the sticks up until the day before giving birth just to see the two lines.

Celebrity IVF Barbie: Celeb Barbie comes in two versions: Denial Celeb Barbie and Out the Closet IVF Barbie. Denial Celeb Barbie does not play with the other Barbies and pretends not to be an IVF Barbie at all. She drops the IVF part of her name and thinks 'Donor Eggs' is a swear word. She pretends that her twins at age 49 are Natural and she did it all On Her Own. She also claims her boobs are her own and that she has never had a face lift, hence her credibility is not at an all time high. Out the Closet IVF Barbie is the preferred Barbie. We like her.

IVF Ken: Ken is a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much. Sorry to sound so harsh, but besides being a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much there is very little that Ken does in IVF land. Sometimes Ken administers shots, hands out tissues and occasionally accompanies the Barbies to their Dr’s visits (normally during the first few cycles only), but mostly he is just a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much. If you choose an IVF Ken, then try and get one that also cooks or does DIY. Otherwise just sit him down in front of your Barbie TV and let him know when it is time for him to do his, um, contribution. Mostly the Barbies love their Kens, unless Ken is being particularly insensitive or obnoxious, then he becomes a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much in all senses of the word. Some IVF Barbies don’t even have a Ken and they do just fine. If you do find a good Ken, hang on to him, don’t swap him with your other friends.

RE Ken : RE Ken (RE = Reproductive Endocrinologist) is the all knowing, all seeing Ken. He might be a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much, or not, but here we are talking about being a naughty boy who plays with his winkle too much in the figurative sense. He could also be very nice. He may call you by your first name but you may only call him Doctor. His accessories are many and wonderful. He comes with a zooty new car (normally very expensive), a smart house, a very healthy bank balance and a holiday home or two. RE Ken knows every thing and is considered second only to God. Some RE Kens are kind, some are not. They are all rich. Ken’s office is filled with fun toys like ultra sound machines, dildo like probes, waiting rooms filled with the different types of Barbies (some annoyingly come with miniature Barbies or Kens en tow), medicines, procedures rooms etc. RE Ken also comes with a free Nurse (Ratchet) Barbie, who will not return your calls, will hand out annoying platitudes and generally add to your frustration levels. When purchasing RE Ken you will get Ultrasound Ken and BloodDrawer Ken. Unfortunately they come as a package deal and you are not able to get RE Ken without them, they aren’t as much fun. However, you will need a RE Ken if you are going to play the IVF Barbie game.

Mattel foresee a big demand for these Barbies and say that for extra fun and lively interaction, collect the full set of IVF Barbies, put them in the Barbie house together and see the sparks fly.


----------



## Donkey

Missy, what an amazing story you really have had a tough time, I admire you for being so strong  

Ally I know exactly what you mean and just to make you jealous I'm in my PJs  

WW so glad that you had a good appt, it makes such a difference knowing that the dr is working with you rather than against you.  We all know we should get that every time but sadly we don't.  I have to go next week for an nhs appt and I'm nervous as to whether we see a competent dr  

OK I'm having a nail EMERGENCY...they are YELLOW.  I painted my nails dark purple without a base coat     and now they are yellow.  Does anyone know how to get rid of the stain

Nix try some horlicks in your warm milk, go on be a devil  

xx


----------



## Spuds

Pants - not had time to read Nix's Barbie story - running out door for non alcoholic night out with the girls (not right hey !) 

Quick hello to all - hope to catch up on either the 30th or 2 May - have a good night tonight girlies whatever you are up to 

Anne n Pam -   to you both 

Spuds


----------



## Züri

nix that's hilarious   

I don't think I have ever been a newbie barbie, never been slim and never had a healthy bank balance!


----------



## Han72

Hey donkey, do you have a nail brush?  Try soaking it with nail varnish remover and giving them a good scrub...


----------



## Donkey

Thanks nix I'll try that! xx


----------



## Han72

This is what my social life has become. Giving Woman's Own type "how to" tips on a Friday night.  Jeez    

Anyone want to know how to put a quilt cover on the easy way    
xxx


----------



## beachgirl

Nix- get someone else to do it


----------



## Han72

Züri said:


> nix that's hilarious
> 
> I don't think I have ever been a newbie barbie, never been slim and never had a healthy bank balance!


   I do love that barbie story it's always good for a larf!

xxx


----------



## popsi

nix..  yes i want to know lol.. i have no life lol so tip of the day is great


----------



## Han72

I'm gonna log off I've got to the point where I'm posting absolute random b0ll0x on boards I didn't even know existed!  

Night all!

xxx

Oh sorry Popsi you'll have to wait, if I tell you now I'll have NUFFINK to say at all tomorrow   
xxx


----------



## Ali27

Donkey - try soaking your nails in denture tablet solution (steredent?).  Should make them white again.

Spuds - enjoy tonight.  Hope you can make 2nd too.

Ally - hope you went and met Ben - it says you are still online but it also says you are idle on ** and has done since at least yesterday.  i have visions of you slumped over on your computer waiting for someone to discover you  

Nix - are you in alone this evening then?  Just you and your milk?  If I lived nearer i would pop by  

Beach - hello hon  

Zuri - you are home alone too aren't you?  

Just got in from my run.  Well, more like a run walk run walk run walk...... went about 3 miles though in 45 mins so I am thinking it is not a bad start.  All I have planned for this weekend is a christening on Sunday.  Dreading it cos its old uni friends who are all sprogging/have sprogged and I've not seen them for 18 months but will get the inevitable questions about do i want kids/when etc adn the helpful advice that i need to hurry up as I am 37!! (since a week ago   ) and also the added interrogation about what happened to me and ex-DP.  Not good.  So tomorrow I think i will spend the day with my plants in the garden.  They accept me just the way I am


----------



## Züri

Ali I like the idea if spending time with the plants  yes home alone on sofa wrapped in diver feeling very sorry for myself  hate being ill, well I suppose who does - silly comment really - well done on the run very impressive

Xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

Don't fall off your chairs or anything but Ben and I are going to go to a club night in a pub in East London (we live west) - our mate is a French guy who DJ's - it is a tropical theme. I am sh1tting myself! I will be drunk after 5 minutes!! Gotta go make a costume and shower!! 

A XXXX


----------



## beachgirl

Zuri   hope you're feeling better soon x

Ali- you've been for a fun....most I've done is run upstairs lol...

Well..I'm bored...DH is away for the night on a boys night out, got a bottle of wine open, nearly finished and not sure what to watch,.,

Ally- wear a grass skirt lol...I'll be in London tomorrow..shame we can't meet up x


----------



## mag108

Hi everyone
Been keeping up with the thread but not enough time to post this week.
There has been so much going on in the thread and I have wanted to respond to some threads but no time...Finally...

Had a good week. Manager away so me and the other mouse played....
I cut myself a little slack. Did my work of course but it was a more relaxed week without her there. Have had session 2 of one on one yoga with my pal who is doing further training, she's taking me through supportive postures, you yogis, its nothing special, Restorative Poses, Supta Baddha Konasana (Reclining Bound Angle Pose), Viparita Karani (Legs-Up-the-Wall Pose, but  backs of legs resting on a chair instead), holding for 15 mins. Supposed to reach parasympathetic system (deep relaxation). Helping me to drop into myself and deeply rest. Hoping it will help get me through all the stress of TX.

Had baseline scan. Theres 4 antral follies in left ovary, 9 on the right. I start nasal spray tomorrow morn, YIKES and Menopur next Sat, double yikes.

Had a good chat with Sarah the other day and realise that when I am talking to friends re tx I am downplaying success rates, for myself and for them. Managing expectations. So if it doesnt work I wont be too upset. But it means I am not focusing on being positive about the outcome and I need to focus on positivity. Thanks again for meeting up Sarah, you are such a lovely person!

Sam • yet again, great detail supplied by you on the US clinics and treatments. Really good of you to share that with us all. Great so great that FSH has come down....Delighted to hear about the Dr in Surrey. Really positive for you to have that kind of support

Anna - its tough having to deal with pregnant people, bigtime tough.

Brambles - welcome, good to have you on board. really sad to hear of all the things you have been through.

Anne: So sorry you've been so down, like others have said its here we all get the support for the ups and downs of it all. We all care about each other and how everyone is doing so please dont hide the dark stuff, (unless it feels right to do that). Really big pain, all that jobseekers stuff, they just pull the heart out of you dont they, so shockingly bureacratic. And I think a holiday is a defo, the sooner the better! Mexico sounds fab....

Kate/Anne, totally get you on the diet front. Trying not to be too miserable about it but I am still having to stick to the anti-candida diet. Every second day I seem to feel really sick. Spent a fortune at the healthfood store yesterday on acidopholus, and a digestive enzyme to help lining of stomach. Its tricky trying to get things I can each. Really wish I could have treats....But well done Kate on losing the weight.!

Ally -So brave and such integrity. Like others have said, I would never judge you. I am sure most of us have been nearly there/or there/or maybe there at some pt. You have been through so much and I really believe it was a consequence in some part to all the stress. If there was lots of alcohol involved then your judgement was severely impaired. 
I sincerely hope you guys get to move on from this. I agree that some counselling sessions may help. You've both got to try and forgive. It must be such a strain for you trying to get preg and dealing with all this, really feel for you. Hope you guys have loads of fun tonight!

Missy - I am really happy for you! What an amazing story. And you are so good for typing in that long description of all thats happened.

Pixie- belated happy birthday!

AnnaofCumberland -  thats great news, good for you for not letting them cancel

looly- great news for you hon

Tracey sorry there was no real outcome to the appointment 

Nix - it'll be all right in the end. If it's not all right, then it's not the end!" I love that! And the barbie story....

Sarahq - really sorry to hear your story. You will find lots of help here.

Welcome back Donkey, sorry that things have been so tough for you

WW I am sorry that things are not so good with DH. Sounds like you had a positive Dr meeting

Ali -  hope the christening isnt too nasty

xxxfingers crossed no rain tomorrow, we are going to an early eve barbie

have a great weekend x
MAG


----------



## AoC

Thanks for all the cheers.    We had EC yesterday, and I have to say it was a piece of cake for me!  Hooray!  Hardest part was the 5 hour car ride home!

They only got 3 eggs, but I'm choosing to believe that will be enough.  

Sorry, this thread's got away from me, I'll try and do better.  Just wanted to let you know.

Will be back after we get the embryologist's call.


----------



## Ali27

Morning everyone!!

Anna of c - well done on ec and fingers crossed for that vital call    

Mag - nice to see you.  Hope the bbq is good today    Was thinking about this Christening in bed last night and thinking about sending my apologies (but i did do that last time to get out of a birthday bash for someone).  Part of me cant face it and the other part thinks why should I let IF ruin all aspects of my life.  

Lucy - I tick all those same boxes too (although i am only talking about one IVF response) but I often seem to ov early etc in a regular cycle).  I hope that Jaya lets you try it.  I'll be following your progress with baited breath.  First though I hope that Romina will let you do it so you dont have a difficult decision to make.  

Zuri - hope you feel better this morning  

Ally - how was the club night?  

Beachy - morning honey!  

Nix - are you getting out today? 

Tracey - enjoy your shopping day  

Morning to everyone.  I'm off to get showered and dressed then popping to Winchester quickly before I return to spend a loving day in may garden.  Must get my carrots in today   and my broad beans need some canes   

Have a lovely day


----------



## Züri

morning girls

AofC well done on EC - when will you get the call about fertilisation?

Ali enjoy your garden today i would love a garden and a veggie patch, i have a huge huge roof terrace surrounding my flat and last year i got really into growing veggies but made a right balls up of it having had no experience and it's a pain trying to grow things in pots so this year i have put flowers and plants in all my pots they're easier  might grow a few radishes, lettuces and tomatoes as they're easy 

Mags lovely top hear from you - sorry you are still suffering with candida it sounds awful poor you xxx

LV lovely long post from you how do you do it?!! good luck with your next cycle and hope you get to do the protocol you want

Ally did you have a good time raving last night? did you get your glow sticks out?   god I can not ever imagine going to a club again gone are those days - you're very brave  

Well feeling a tinsy winsy bit better this morning going to brave the outdoors and go to the shops, not been out of the flt for 4 days!

have a lovely weekend all xx


----------



## Donkey

Ali I'm going to spend time with plants too, much better!    Hope the christening is bearable tomorrow.

Zuri - hope you feel better soon.  Enjoy being snuggled under your duvet 

Mags your candida sounds horrible I hope it's not too bad at the moment  

AnnaofC   that your fertilisation call brings good news

LV excellent news that Jaya will consider your research, it's good to be listened to  

Ally you are soooo brave going to a club, I can't remember the last time I went  

Well I'm off to the allotment soon to see my chickens and get some eggs, lets hope the weather picks up.

Anyone of us superfit, keen ladies running the marathon tomorrow      

xx


----------



## AoC

If you want another easy veg, Zuri, try courgettes.  Get a young plant from a garden centre, plant it out in a big pot, and make sure it doesn't dry out.  Loads of courgettes come late summer!    Onions are easy, too, but you need plenty of space for them.

I've just got a postage stamp front garden (cottage style, loads of flowers) and a little shady courtyard back yard.  This year I'm trying to grow some veg in pots - courgettes because they were successful last time, loads of herbs, tomatoes (risky - we're too far north for much warm sunny weather, and I don't have a greenhouse), lettuce and potatoes in these canvas tub things.  I love to grow, but don't often get time.

Sounds like between us we could get at least a good veggie omelette going...    

Anyway.  On to more important things.  Thanks Ali, Zuri and Donkey!  Just got the call, and all three have fertilised.  Huge relief!   ET is tomorrow at 10.30am.  Just booked another cheap hotel room for the night.  Much more comfy than driving both ways in one day.

OMG.  I'm going to be PUPO soon.


----------



## Suzie W

Hi All,

Its been a while since I posted although I have been trying to keep up. Wow! A lot has happened so I'm going to have a go at some persos but please forgive if I leave anything out.

Looley - welcome! and thanks for sharing

Mag - fantastic news about the follies.   good luck with this cycle. It seems as though it takes ages for the cycle to happen and then when it does it all seems to quick.

Missy - Wow! you have been through a lot. I really hope this all works out for you. I'm inspired by your courage and tenacity.  

Sam - you have done a lot of research - good for you! Good luck with this cycle. I am so pleased that you have started this cycle - you've waited so long.

Nix - I know it was from a few pages back but I have been following the same diet - the hermit diet and it really does work   . Nix, I love your posts. YOu seem to be managing to hang onto to sanity during this 2ww - good for you.

Kate - well done on sticking to your diet.   If this cycle fails I'm going to have to start following your diet  

WW - great news about your new cons. It makes all the difference speaking to someone who knows a bit more about what they are doing and is prepared to behave in a decent manner.  

Ali - Oh hun  - I hate those get togethers. Occasionally my mates from uni meet up and I've not gone to the last three as I would be the only one who wasn't pregnant or with a baby. Part of me really wanted to go because I've missed them but DH talked me out of going to the last one as he said that it would be likely be too much. I was in a positive frame of mind so I thought it would be ok but in retrospect I'm pleased he talked me out of it. Unfortunately we can't always avoid these things as I'd hate to loose all my friends. I hope it goes well.

Ally - I feel really priveleged that you would share this very hard part of your life with us.   As the others have said you are a lovely, beautiful person. I was really struck by how much you and Ben have been through in such a short space of time and I think it really does show how strong your relationship is. I'm so pleased for you that you went out. As the others have said counselling can really help. From what you have said Ben is reluctant to go. So I wanted to make another suggestion  in addition to the counselling. So much has happened and you've both had to deal with so much. I'm guessing that the two of you have stopped doing a lot of things that you would have done pre IF and all the troubles. Perhaps trying to remember (I've started to write them down because its so easy to forget) all the things you used together when things were good between you and try to do some of them. It may feel strange at first but after a while it will help to reconnect you and hopefully help with the healing process. I've been trying to do this for myself. IF has become all that I think about and motivates all my behaviour. I feel that I have lost that highly motivated, energetic person I used to be. I'm trying to do some of the things that I used to do/we used to do. I must admit I don't feel the same buzz but I'm hoping it will come back if I persevere.

Almond - hope your appointment goes well.  

Welcome Sarahq and Brambles.

Lucy - interesting about the cetrotide. thanks for letting us know. I hope it all goes well for you.   

Pam -  

Anne - Good for you about feeling angry! I'm pleased you didn't stop posting on FF. We'd miss you. You have such a dilemma on your hands. The only thing I can say is trust the process - just give it time  and the process of recovery for this last cycle as well just getting on with who you and Jason are together and as individuals - you'll know what you want to do. I'm starting to do this. I've spent so much time beating myself up since finding out about IF about why am I feeling down/low/angry/anxious, why aren't I dealing with this better, why am I not feeling worried/sad, etc... etc. But we are where we are and I think it will all work out in the end whichever path we choose and we just need to trust that we will get there.

Anna of C - great news about the eggs.  Congratulations!!!! they have fertilised! whoohooo! 

Purps - how are you? 

Pixie -   Do you have a new assistant at work yet?
LW - 

Welcome badk Donkey!

Hello to everyone else - LJ, Laura, Steph, Tracey, Malini, Emma, Beachy, Zuri, Lucy, Anna and everyone else.

I went for a scan on Friday. My left ovary doesn't seem to be responding - i small follie - not unexpected. My right ovary has 4 biggish follies from 17 - 14mm and 3 small ones around 12 and under 10mm. EC is on Tuesday - yikes! I'm trying to keep my fear under control. Last EC wasn't great besides the bad news it snowed that day and we struggled to get into London. We eventually walked from Clapham Junction to the Lister. Iwas dehydrated and so the anaethetist struggled to get the needle into a vein in my hand. It was painful. I'm starting to feel hopefully that this time there might be more eggs than last time. My E2 is around 4000 but I'm still worried it all looked good last time and they only got one egg. My e2 is higher this time so I'm hopeful. The hopefulness starts to worry me too because I'm weary of the possible let down.

Meet up on the 2nd. I'm hoping to come but it will all depend of how this week goes.

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Züri

Wow AofC thats great news that all 3 have fertilised, good luck for ET tomorrow - yes i did courgettes last year but i got one minute little courgette - think i didn't have enough space for them all, need some big planters but they're expensive! x

Donkey I would love an allotment - as the swiss all live in apartments theirs lots of them here and they use them as their gardens have lovely petty little huts on them and have parties and BBQ's on them, they look so idylic - I want one! x

Suzie great news on the follies wishing you lots of luck for EC x


----------



## Suzie W

Thanks Zuri ... I'm   that we get at least one or two embies.


----------



## AoC

Good luck Suzie!  I'm sure it's going to be much better than last time.    

You could buy some buckets and drill holes, Zuri?


----------



## Ocelot Cub

My head hurts, I have a hangover. Got in at 3.30am!! Had a good night although drank way way too much, was on a bit of a mission to prove I still have it in me!! Mind you whatever damage it did to my eggs has to be outweighed by the good it did our relationship  

Donks - so jealous you have chucks, Lainey does too, so does my mum - I want some!

Mags - thanks for the lovely words, so sorry you are still suffering though   Sounds like a great load of antrals, good luck with this cycle x

Z - I bet you could do the club night too!! Just have to set your mind to it! (if you actually had any desire to do that of course!! I certainly cannot imagine making it a regular thing)

A of C - hon congrats on your eggs, fab news on the fertilisation, now get dividing little one!!  

Ali - totally understand your feelings on Christening. We have been invited to a naming day in a couple of weeks, I really feel I can't face it, not so much about seeing my friends and their baby as I am so happy for them as they  took 3 years to conceive their daughter due to severe MF, but mainly because you get all those questions about "have you got children" then a shocked look when you say no!! I hate all the smug marrieds with 2.4 children! But like you say I almost want to force myself to go just to prove I can cope with it, sounds like torture I can probably do without though. I am definately idle and slumped over computer today!! 

LV - good luck with getting your protocol right hon, make sure you get what YOU want, not what THEY want   Did you manage to stay off the wine??

Beachy - Oh hon I would have loved to see you, I wouldnt be a pretty sight today though! Next time eh. Hope you have a lovely time x

Suzie - thanks so much for your kind words, I really appreciate them, I will take everyones advice on board. Our night out really did us good. You are so right we have stopped doing so much as i have pretty much refused to go out for anything more than a quiet meal with Ben. I have refused to spend any time with his or my friends. I really need to get my head round it but it is so so hard, at gatherings I am always the odd one out and while the mums all huddle together swapping tips, I stand on the side lines just looking on, wondering if I will ever be amongst the huddle. Your scan sounds good hon, it is a shame that your left ovary has not responded but sounds like you have some great follies on your other ovary, when is EC? 

Anne - hope your having a good weekend with the boys and that you are managing to convince J about that lovely holiday in Mexico (mind you make sure this flu pandemic is sorted before you commit - did you see the news about that yesterday??)  

Pix - hope you are having a gorgeous time with your sis. I know how special that time is. Becka, Hannah and I are pretty much joined at the hip at the moment!  

I think I pretty much have to accept that there has not yet been ovulation and that it may not happen, my monitor has been stuck on high for 7 days which I think is too long, I am going to keep going as it is just a few quid on sticks but have no CM, just that first bit I had a few days ago which left as quickly as it arrived. I am also having twinges on right hand side again (which is where I ovulated last month??) who knows, I am a bit loathed to go and have more monitoring, although I guess it would be interesting to see what the hell is going on in there.

Have to go out and do 'the sights' with our Greek friend today, hope I get a second wind soon!! 

Love and hugs xxxx


----------



## Ali27

Anna of C - Whoo hoo!!  Fantabulous!  WC tomorrow.  how many you hoping to have transferred?  

Suzie - sounding very promising!  Well done hon    And really please you can make 2nd!  Watch this spacve (or PM's) for details of venue etc.  Where abouts are you?

Ally - ah, sounds like last night was the medicine you both needed    I am so pleased for you.    hope you feel better soon.  Big cooked breaky should help  

Off to the shops now and to meet a friend for a cuppa and a chat.


----------



## Züri

Sounds like you had a good night last night *Ally* and I agree a good night out, some booze and lightening up does wonders for relationships, I have felt so dull and boring for the past 4/5 months but last weekend i let my hair down and felt so much better and improved things on the relationship front too - I know lots of people are on a no alcohol zone but i think breaking away from it now and again is needed to keep your sanity - glad it was a success - sorry your head is sore today - enjoy the day with your friend x

AofC good idea re buckets but they're bloomin expensive here too  everything is expensive!

x


----------



## Ali27

Zuri - i could post you some over - you can big big plastic tubs at the pound shop for less than a pound!!


----------



## Little Me

Hi girls, quick one from me  

Ally- A night out.....what's one of those again?       
Glad you had a fab time and let your hair down. 
Not sure about a holiday at the moment- Jas really wants to find a job first- understandable I guess.


AnnaOfC- Well done and I   you have a happy phone call tomorrow morning  

Suzie- EC on Tuesday, brilliant  
Have a lovely weekend xxx

Mag- Wishing you lots of luck for this cycle hun  

Pix- Missing you    

Right gotta do one, have a lovely weekend girls
Love
Anne
xxxx


----------



## Spuds

*Girls* - just a quick hello from me - Ali - sounds like you had a good one  hellooo to Anne too 

Nix - The top tip on duvet covers has made me howl with laughter 

Am off to the fresh air of the countryside for my birthday today - and the garden centre - how sad am I - must be turning 39 that does it - since 35 I like garden centres and pubs with seats ha ha ha ......trigger jab at midnight  and have decided I will have 3 eggs on Monday 

Looking forward to seeing you on either the 30th or 2May - keep me posted

Lots of  to all

Spuds
xx


----------



## Ocelot Cub

HAPPY BIRTHDAY SPUDS!! 

        

Have a lovely time in the country! Really really hope you have all the eggs you desire on Monday!  


Hiya Anne honey


----------



## purple72

Happy Birthday Jspuds! Enjoy your day

Hello to everyone else

Hugs

Sx


----------



## Züri

Happy Birthday Jerseyspuds xx


----------



## Han72

Happy birthday Spuds!!!      I like your PMA for the number of eggs on Monday, if I recall correctly I did something similar the time I ended up with 16   



Suzie W said:


> Nix, I love your posts. YOu seem to be managing to hang onto to sanity during this 2ww - good for you.


Are you sure you were reading my posts and not someone elses?!  Follie scan sounds great hon, you've got a lazy left follie just like me, but that's a good number on the right!    

Oops my little cuz needs to get on here to do her A-Level essay I'll catch up with you all properly later!
xxx


----------



## Züri

*Ali* you inspired me - popped over to the shop and bought some little lettuce, tomato, courgette and pepper plants and just planted them up in an assortment of old plastic pots - was very funny went to shop on my bike and walked back balancing two huge bags of compost over the seat and 2 carrier bags over the handlebars, i looked a bit silly

Lets hope as i have bought them from plants and not grown them from seed i'll have better luck this year! 

Hi *Nix* - how you feeling? must be about 3 days is it until test date? are you feeling positive? you've been very chilled during this 2WW I have to say! how do you do it? xx


----------



## laurab

hello girlies,

lovely day!  hope you all having fun? 

suzie - good luck for monday

AnneOC  - good luck for ET

Ally - oh i aint had a hangover for so long... must remedy that soon!

Is there a London meet up soon? When you \rrange one can someone PM me details as can't always keep up... cheers.


----------



## babyspoons

Boo!!!

It's been a while ladies and I don't know a lot of you here so nice to meet you! Nix, Beachy, Laura, we did the cycle together last year. Nix & Beachy, sad to see you both still here if you know what I mean, was hoping you ladies would be pushing some littlies round by now. Laura!! WOW!!! I think you were the only one at the time who got PG ion our round and now you have triplets!!!! WOWOWOWOWO!!! That's fab news.

Hello to everyone else. I have been away for almost a year after the last IVF failed.  We have severe MFI. Had 4 eggs and 4 sperm, 2 embryos survived but didn't take.

Anyways, our PCT have just changed their policy to 3 NHS attempts WOOOOOOHOOOOOOO!!!!              

So we are back on the roller coaster starting beginning of June. Needed a month to get my head around it!!

So am desperately now trying to lose weight and get fit and am doing exercise to try and lose it. But I need to up my protein I think sooner rather than later. Am not a huge meat eater and can't have soya (cos I am an underactive thyroid victim - long story but just had a second thyroid op in Jan due to another cyst so no more thyroid!). Anyone got any tips on increasing protein??

Bye for now.

Spoony x


----------



## Ali27

Hi Babyspoons - Welcome back!  how about lentils, mixing beans with rice, cheese, eggs?  Do you like fish?  

Zuri - you have done better than me!  i have been shopping instead and also went to a friend's house for a cuppa and a gossip.  Not vefntured out yet.  Glad I inspired and motivated someone though.  

Laura - will pm you about meet on 2nd may  

So far it looks like me, Pixie, Ally (def maybe), Laura, miranda if its down south, Suzie, Jerseyspuds. Any more?

Jerseyspuds -     i've just got back from the garden centre - great arent they.  I'm 37 so its a rite of passage  

Hi Anne and Nix and anyone else who is popping on.  

I feel a bit down today to be honest.  Already this year i have had a relationship break up, a cancelled IVF cycle and yesterday I was informed that I am losing my job.  Whilst I knew this was coming and felt ok about it as I was looking at it as a positive, now that it is real i am scared.  I am scared about spending too much time on my own as I live alone (not cos I am not independent cos I really am but cos I will have too much time to think), scared about not getting another job, scared that my cycle in June/July wont work (but I cant postpone that just cos i dont have a job even though that is crazy - I dont have time to spare).  

At Sainsburys just now I found a parking space and was waiting patiently whilst this woman put her shopping in her car with her passanger door open so i could nto get in the space.  She saw me, shot me the filthiest look, slammed her door shut and shot me another filthy look as if to say "dont f'ing park by me!".  She had a small child in the back and I so felt like ripping in to her and saying "lighten up you b!tch.  This is a car park".  I was being really patient with her.  I didnt say anything but when I came out my back bumper on the corner had been deeply scuffed - probably when she reversed out and scraped it.  It would have done more damage to her car but you could tell she was seething with anger already and i added to it by wanting to park next to her.  But I felt I hated her more cos she had a kid.    And then on my way home there were hoards of parents picking up little ones from a party at the town hall and they were all happy, skipping along, some with their party dresses on, some asleep in their mothers arms and it made me so sad


----------



## shortie66

Just popping in to say hi to everyone, been a manic day here.  Got roped into cleaning dh's sarnie van for him, will i ever learn  

Hope everyone is ok, going over neighbours for a well earned curry in a bit.  Had nothing to eat yet today not good i know   been swimming and done loads of sh1tty housework again.  Cathc up 2moz ladies

Kate
xxxxxxx


----------



## Züri

*Ali *so sorry you are feeling so sad but you have had a tough year and it's understandable - sorry you have lost your job, i know its a bit of a bitter sweet decision as i remember last time we talked you thought it might happen and you were sort of OK with it but I can imagine now it's happened it must be a scary thought

I hope things pick up for you soon I really do xx


----------



## Donkey

Ali   Sorry you are feeling so low, it's understandable with so much that has happened.  The job thing is hard to...I know with dh it was hanging over us for ages then it happened just like that.  In some ways it was a relief as we could move forward and the waiting was over.  Try and look at it that way it's a new begining rather than hanging on to old stuff   .  We too are going again in June/july so we will be cycle buddies    Like you I'm not ready but don't have time to waste!    You are so strong and positive so don't be hard on yourself  

Kate ive been doing houssework too  , went swimming last night and a bike ride into town today.  Well done on your diet  

Zuri glad you're feeling better.  I can picture you cycling with your goodies.  I am trying to cycle a bit more and not drive into town in an effort to get a bit fitter and save on petrol/parking now dh is redundant.  So I have a basket on the front of my bike which I loooove!  DH said he would rather chop off a testicle than have a basket on his bike    Happy gardening, it's so satisfying.

Spuds I agree you grow into garden centres, I'm sure I never found them so exciting    HAPPY BIRTHDAY, what fab weather for you.

Ally HOPE YOUR HANGOVER IS BETTER!

Baby spoons great news about the nhs.  Where are you?  I'm in herts and they have just changed their policy too.  I am trying to get another 2 rounds and have had to jump through various hoops.  Have a final local appt next week and hopefull they will refer me.

Have a good evening girls
Donkey xx


----------



## Jumanji

Hi there.

Just a quickie from me but had to post cos:

(a) just got AF pains so feel confident that first cycle after m/c has not worked and that AF will come so feel a bit low and have had a couple of glasses of pink champagne cos it is my birthday (shared with jerseyspuds??)

(b) had to welcome back Donkey cos she is another KathArine like my sister Kate 

(c) had to welcome back Babyspoons cos I will never forget that she was Kate's cycle buddy this time last year but was not so lucky and I posted news of Kate's BFP right after her BFN and have forever felt guilty   

(d) need to go online to check calendar and assure myself that Posy's brother was neutered in time not to be father of her kittens! 

love to all!!


----------



## Suzie W

Hi there,

Jspuds - wow! I do my trigger tomorrow so it seems that our OTDS will be close to each other - heres to hoping that we both get to ET. Happy Birthday!

LJ - Happy Birthday! Sorry you're feeling low. Just think you've made it through a month and it wasn't that long ago that you were doing things one day at a time. Well done to you! Its been a tough month but you've made it.  

Hi Babyspoons

Ali - sorry you're feeling down. Its been a tough year for you.  Do you have nice things planned? That woman in the car park what a $#@!  

Nix -  

Zuri - I just love the image of you on your bike. A few years ago we lived in a flat and I had a garden of pot plants. We only had one car at the time and my DH was using it most of the time. I remember walking 1/2 mile from the town centre carrying compost and all sorts. People looked at me strangely but I didn't care I just loved my little garden of pots. Not adventurous to grow veg though. It really is peaceful mmmh. I think I might do some gardening tomorrow.

Hi Anne - thanks for the good wishes. Hope you're having a good weekend too.

Hi Purps  

Ally -  

Just done my injections for the evening. They seem to be getting harder to do.   We had a nice day out. Decided to spend the day in Windsor and I'm trying to make a list of other places to have day trips to. I'm determined to get out and about a bit. 

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Donkey

Suzie and spuds good luck with the trigger...sooo exciting  

LJ sorry to hear that AF is on the way   .  I love pink champagne too, I don't know if the pink makes any difference to the taste but I still prefer it   .   to you too.  Kate and spell our name the best way although I am sure like me she has spent her entire life spelling it for other people  

Right I'm off to make home made burgers and potato wedges...my concession to junk food, all home made.  I made a lemon drizzle cake this afternoon which is just begging to be eaten...especially the end bit where all the drizzle has collected  

Love to you all
xx


----------



## babyspoons

Hi all
Just a quickie

Ali thanks for the suggestions, am fish phobic and beans don't agree with me but I'll look into the lentils thing. Have never used them before. Don't you have to soak them? Also big hugs ref today. What a [email protected](*& in the carpark! Seriously!! Did they have CCTV in the car park? SOme places do. Also kids parties can be sooooo hard. I usually boycot them all now. If my friends are good friends they understand. If they don't then they shouldn't have invited me to make numbers up!!!!!  

LJ!! Helloooooo! Happy Birthday!!!! Oh my sweet! Please don't ever feel guilty!!! I saw the photo of your sis and it brought back a smile to my face. I was so happy when it worked for her. And   it will for you too. Not sure what's been going on for you but from your siggy looks like you have been going through a really tough time. Big hugs hun. Maybe we'll get a BFP together this time. No more guilt please young lady! xx

Suzie and Spuds - good luck with the trigger....almost there now!!! Excited for you!

JSpuds HAPPY BIRTHDAY!!

Donkey - I'm in sunny Swindon (but sulking as we didn't get tickets to Radio 1's One Big Weekend  )

Right, am off to get the tea. I'd forgotten how addictive this forum is! 

XX


----------



## popsi

little jenny... enjoy your champagne, sorry your feeling down honey, but enjoy a few drinks, if it has not worked this month its simply because your little body is not ready just yet xx

jerseyspoons ... happy birthday xx

heres to you both


----------



## purple72

LJ enjoy the champagne hunny!!

Big hugs to Ali! So sorry about the job but IT WILL BE OK! BIG HUGS HUNNY thinking of you!!

Love and hello to everyone else!

Sx


----------



## lucky_mum

Hi all  and sorry I have been such a rubbish poster this week, just been so busy and just about keeping up!

Just wanted to say      to *Jerseyspuds* and *LittleJen* - hope you both have the most wonderful year ahead of you 

Welcome back *Babyspoons*  and lots of luck to you   

*Ally* - glad you had a good night out sweetie - you deserve it!  How is Becka doing?

*Ali* -   

Well done *Anne of C* on your 3 eggs  - good luck for ET   

*Nix *-         

*Purps* - thanks so much for posting that link to what that doc said about epigenetics/birth-mother's influence - loved it! 

good luck to those currently having treatment and soon to have EC!   

Sorry for no more personals - gotta go do some dinner! 

xxxxxxxxxxx


----------



## shortie66

LJ and Jerseyspuds      to you both.  LJ im also a kate but a catherine and my last name was kimberlin, it took me so long sometimes to spell my name to people i used to lose the will to live      Hope you both have a lovely birthday, i will have a jd and coke on both ur behalves   

Ali - hunny sorry about the job my darling      and the beatch at sainsburys i will send her a huge spot on the end of the chin tonight..... that'll teach her      

Anneofc - well done on those lovely eggies hun    

Steph - enjoy ur dindins petal, i've had the chicken tikka masala which i had been dreaming about all week  

Donkey - ooooooooooo i just luuuuuurrrrvvvveeee lemon drizzle cake, save me some please?   

Ally - glad you had a good nite out sweetie, does us good to let our hair down and get ratted now and again. I had about 15 days high on the monitor last month but no peak, i know what a bugger it is hun    

Hello to nix, anne, purple, fishy, pixie, tracey, suzie, zuri, mallini, hazelnut, almond, missy, sam, natasha, sobroody, popsi, lukey, looly, miranda, laura, lainey, lucy, juicy and everyone else.  Gonna watch hells kitchen and enjoy my drink me thinks.  M-i-l coming over for dinner tomoz so suppose we had better give the house a dust free appearance for "THE VISIT" Its the only time its ever really spotless   

Kate
xxxxxxxxx


----------



## Züri

happy birthday LJ xx


----------



## shortie66

Hi zuri - how is ur cold now hunny?


----------



## Züri

rubbish Kate  been the cold from hell! normally clears after a couple of days but tomorrow will be day 5  feeling sorry for myself  

How are you> hope you're enjoying those JD and cokes tonight 

About to take a sleeping tablet (stashed from my hospital stays  ) and pop off to bed and hope for a good nights sleep

x


----------



## shortie66

Zuri - i am enjoying them soooooooo much    Only have enough left for a couple more tho    Ooo sorry to here ur still feeling rough hun, there is a nasty bug going round work at the mo, head cold sore throat and that, i've managed to stave it off so far but will probably come down with it just in time for the bank holiday.   Hope you have a good nights sleep petal, careful of those tablets tho dont want you sleep walking


----------



## LV.

Happy birthday you lovely ladies LJ and JS!!
      

Ali - sorry you're having a blue bit. You've been so strong - it's so admirable. I'm sure a woman of your wit a charisma won't be without a job for long.   

Kate - you didn't eat until 6pm? Why would you do that your crazy bint? I'd be eating my arm off. Hope you've rectified in the mean time!

Zuri - hey there, happy Saturday

Babyspoons - welcome back! Good to have another "veteran". We'll be picking your brains in no time

Ally - how's the head? Did you make it through  the sight seeing? I got new herbs today which are still rank but a tiny bit better than last week, I asked about liquorice and apparently last week's batch already had it in them so I just think I'm not a fan, in fact far from it - they are still revolting.

Suzie - good on you for getting out there, Windsor is lovely I hear, we're heading there in a few weeks for a weekend

Donkey - hope you're having a good evening

A of C - congrats sweets! 3 eggies is fab! And great fertilisation too

Mag - yoga you up! You sound very bendy

Suzie - everything crossed for you, sounds like you've got a fab crop of follies there

Nix (PUPO) chick - you still resting up?

We've been house hunting today and didn't find a bean. we've been looking for a few months and I'm blinking bored of it. Considering begging Kirtsy and Phil but think chances of their help might be a tad slim. 

Have also enjoyed some lovely wine. Hic!

Love to all
Lucy xx


----------



## shortie66

Lucy - i've had a lovely chicken tikka masala egg fried rice a few chip and a bit of cheese and onion naan, oh god it was b.loody lovely     On 2nd jd and coke and its going down really really well.     Poo on the house hunting front, u should move up to the midlands hunny, it be just lovely up here


----------



## LV.

Ooo Kate that sounds like a lovely treat of a Saturday tea. We had steak and garlic mash and it was looooverely. I make a mean steak, even though I do say so myself.

We're looking all over the blo0dy place which is half the problem.

What are you up to tomoz?


----------



## shortie66

Another maic day for us  Up to me brothers in the morning, then over to m-i-ls to have a look at her partners nw ice cream van.  Then back to do food shopping and clean the house a m-i-l is then coming for dinner, have to laugh really as its the only time we really give the house a makeover, the rest of the time its a tip    

What u up to hun?

P.S. just poured me 3rd jd


----------



## Züri

Kate you p!ss head get to bed  

Wish my MIL visited more often to make me clean up more often, there again would rather live in a pig sty 

Night girls

x


----------



## Han72

Hiya been having probs with the flipping net all evening so just a quickie to say  to LJ too hon, hope you had a good'un and Ally I hope your hangover's better now!

xxx


----------



## shortie66

Hey zuri - thought you had taken a sleeping pill    

Nix - hi hunny hows 2ww going? Im still keeping everything crossed for you even sending a     to the fairies, im really hoping this is a magical time for you


----------



## shortie66

Hope you have all noticed that although i may be slightly ratted i have not been a naughty girl and not said any swear words yet    Dakota hope you are taking note im being a very very good girl


----------



## Han72

Shall I start you off then.....?  

B0ll0x!   

xxx


----------



## Züri

Just taken it Kate so 5,4,3,2............ Zzzzzzzzzzzzz


----------



## shortie66

Oh feckin hell you started me off now nix.
  Im sure i have the starting of tourettes somewhere within me   

Zuri - fight the sleep - stay with us!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Han72

Blame it on the [email protected] diet!  Can you tell it's why past my bed time? My poor embie is being corrupted before it's existence has even been confirmed. Poor little bugger!   

Hey that's what I should have called me embie, Tourette's, not Popsi, , it's much more appropriate given that in my last job I put more money in the fr1cking swearbox than I spent on rahtid clothes.


----------



## shortie66

Nix its way past my bedtime too, tho i am an old girl     Funny how dh is ready for bed now match of the day has gone off 

No chance of a baby dance tonight think bot of us are way too p1ssed    Ah well day 13 tomoz tho ticker says day 14 as got dates wrong    Hoping for a high on the monitor and then we can start the shagathon   

Nite nite sweetie let popsi snuggle in tight


----------



## Han72

You wanna high, you should try some of this stuff I'm on, it must be bloody good if the state of my posts is anything to go by!  Go oojn jump him anyway it should be good for a larf if nothing else  

Ah fekkit, my computer ain't working properly so I'm gonna take some drugs and take my raas to bed!

Night!!!
xxx
PS Popsi says "Sorry about my mum's language  
xxx


----------



## Ali27

Kate - you deserve that lovely treat and the JD's after spending your Saturday cleaning and more to come tomorrow    Thanks for sending the spot to old arsey ***** in the carpark.  

Zuri - thanks hon.  hope you get a good sleep and wake feeling much better  

Donkey - thank you    You are right but it is still hanging over me as i think i am going to be made to work my 10 weeks notice    how did they get away with not paying your Dh any redundo? 

LJ - happy birthday to you!  Sorry this was not the month you hoped it would be.  And hope Posy's brother has not fathered her babies.  They might have 2 heads and 8 legs!!  

Suzie - thanks   and good luck with the trigger tomorow (today now)  

Babyspoons - you dont have to soak all lentils.  And i just looked at mine and they have 25gms protein per 100gms.  So a lentil bake with vegetables and some cheese on top would be healthy and high in protein.  

Popsi - hello there!  

Purple - thanks hon.  how are you doing now? I know things are busy for you but are you OK?  

Steph - thanks too    Hope you had a lovely dinner.

Lucy - thanks for the vote of confidence.     i heard that Phil's company which helped people to find properties (for a fee) has gone out of business.  He may well be available for you  

Nix - you are embarrassing Popsi    You need to set a good example   

Thank you all so much for your lovely reassuring and comforting words.  Today is just not a good day for me.  My eyes are now all puffy and I am dreading the Christening tomorrow even more now.  Too fragile for the inquisitions.  There is another meeting on Tuesday that i will not be at and this one will decide the timescale of my demise.  It is likely that i will have to work my 10 weeks redundancy notice period, though i will get my union rep to represent me and negotiate this - its tax free pay if you dont work it but normal salary if you do.  Its complex and not due to this recession/economic depression but because of a cost cutting exercise by the local council/government.  Those 10 weeks will be awful because i will have to watch the staff that i have helped train and manage for years either be transferred to another company or made redundant too and then, probably, help to shut down the organisation i have worked for since 1998. 

Obviously in the meantime I will start applying for other jobs but i know this is such a bad time and I cant put off tx any longer cos of it.  It cant be allowed to mess up everything!!!  

Need to go to bed, i think, and hope that tomorrow is a better day.  

night to you all and thanks again for your invaluable support, in this case on issues not related to IF!!


----------



## Donkey

Nix, kate - you girls are a disgrace        

Ali if it's upsetting you that much do you have to go to the christening?  Surely not?  I totally understand which is why I haven't been to any in ages, even one where DH was godfather, in fact he didn't even go!! (not sure if he's still godfather - it wasn't a religiuos ceremnony so I guess he could be?  I've never asked.)
DH didn't get any redundancy cos they said it was too expensive, they would rather flout employment law and pay a fine than pay the money to the 300 hundrred people they laid off.  This was said in front of said hundreds of people and was videoed.  hey are putting together a case for unfair dismissal but I'm not holding my breath...

Take care girls, enjoy the sunshine
xx


----------



## Ourturn

Ali - so sorry about your job and that you had such a bad day and had to deal with such a stupid cow!     I have a recruitment background so if you would like me to take a look at your CV, PM me and I will look at it tomorrow. 

LJ - belated greetings....I love pink bubbly! 

Hi everyone. 

Good news, after 8 long weeks AF has finally arrived! I was worried it wouldn't as I had to stop the pills a few days early. Hope my liver function test is OK. Will call the unit so I can get my schedule. Will ask them about shorter/less aggressive down regulation. Its just that my body seems to have shut down a bit too much on gonapeptyl? 
All being well tx/et will be in the middle of June. 

My puppy is snoring...so funny  

Off to work on my veggie beds.

Anna x


----------



## Suzie W

Morning,

Nix, Kate, Zuri sounds like you girls had fun last night    

Ali - do you have to go to the Christening? You've taken a few hits recently it would be great if you can have one less.  
Sorry about how things are going withyour job hopefully your rep will be able to negotiate a different timescale. I know you are feeling low. I think its important to acknowledge just how strong you've been. I admire the fact that you are not going to let this redundancy affect your tx.

Anna - good news re AF and starting tx  

Anyway I'm off to do some shopping - if I can get away from the computer   It the trigger tonight   

Love,
Suzie.


----------



## Han72

Mornin'

Ali hon - sorry I was so wrapped up in 2ww hysteria yesterday that I completely missed your posts, I'm sorry you're having such a sh1te time of it honey  Don't beat yourself up about not wanting to go to that Christening, it must feel like the last straw after everything else that's happened. If you've decided to brave it, I lift my hat to you, and if not, noone with an ounce of compassion would blame you for it. I hope that today is a better day for you, no matter what you've decided to do   

Spoony! Welcome back hon, great news that the NHS is gonna cough up for you    that this is your time!

Zuri - how're you feeling this morning? Did you get a good night's sleep in the end, despite Kate and me turning the web blue? 



sobroody1 said:


> My puppy is snoring...so funny


 Awwwwww! Enjoy your gardening Mrs Green Thumb  Glad to hear the beeyatch has finally decided to show her face (better late thann never, eh?!) And good luck for the liver function test - when is it?



Donkey said:


> Nix, kate - you girls are a disgrace


 It's her fault, she led me astray by sending p1ssed up JD vibes over the interweb!!

Wotcha Katy - HOW'S YER HEAD?!    Did you jump DH in the end or just collapse in a sozzled heap?

Suzie - good luck for the trigger hon! Enjoy the shopping babes, you can do it.... Now just step away from the computer, nice and slow... keep your hands where I can see 'em 

Hey Sausage! How are the embies getting on hon? Will you get a call today? When's ET? Sorry I've lost the plot just slightly so haven't been following the proceedings very closely

Love to everyone else! I have to say I'm highly amused by all the congratulations on how calm I am when my posts over the last few days have been prime examples of 2WW hysteria. They follow a distinct pattern - the sillier they are, the more nervous I am! I have to say that confidence is at an all time high this time round, I have worn a rut in the carpet between here and the bathroom as I can't stop peeing and the weetabix I had this morning seems to think that it was attached to a bungee rope but I'm 'olding it dahn as we like to say in Sarf Lahndan innit! Not that I'm symptom spotting or anything like that of course 

Oooh, must go for a pee, laters y'all!

xxx


----------



## Ourturn

Suzie - good luck with the trigger! 

Nix - had blood taken for the test on Friday, will call to see if the results are in tomorrow. 

Lots of peeing is a great sign!     When do you test?

Anna x


----------



## Han72

Wednesday.....      And here's some more for you that the bloods come back fine tomorrow            

xxx


----------



## Züri

Oooh Nix it's sounding promising! i think this is it for you feeling very confident

Feeling much better this morning, the belly laughs with you and Kate before bed coupled with the sleeping pill has done wonders and feel mucho chirpier

Morning everyone happy sunday xxx


----------



## Little Me

Hi girls,

Another quick on from me between showering and doing a stew    

Ali- God hun, I am so very sorry about your job and how sad you are. Life can be very cruel at times, and it's usually to the good people hun. All will work out in time   

Jersey & LJ - Sorry I'm late 


Lots of love to Beachy, Ally, Pix, Nix, Karen, Lucy, Anna , Almond, Tracey,Mira, Laura, Steph, Jo, Lainey, Donks, Fishy, Purps, Kate, Suzie, Mag, WW, Sarah, Zuri, AnnaofC, Sam, Pops, LW,

Anne
xxxx
xxxx


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## Little Me

....I hope AnnaofC gets some good news this morning   

Nix- 3 sleeps to go, I REALLY hope this is your time hun


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## Suzie W

Hi All 

Nix - thanks for the encouragement     I managed to go shopping. Seeing my @rse in the change room mirrors . That and the sunshining means that if this cycle is BFN then I am going to start running and dieting. So I had better get that BFP  . Its not long now and it sounds promising for you.   

Anne - stew sounds yummy!

Anna - good luck for the blood tests.

Zuri - glad you're feeling better.

Love,
Suzie.


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## shortie66

Afternoon ladies 

Nix - we both sort of passed hun     Dh kept waking me up in the night as well, cos if he gets too hot for some reason he puts one leg out of the duvet and keeps pushing the duvet down.  So the conversation goes like this scott please put let leg back in so i can pull the duvet up im cold.  2nd time scott put ur leg in please. 3rd time scott put ur leg in.  4th time scott for f**ks sake put ur f***ing leg back in the duvet will u, ur driving me f***ing crazy.      In the end i got up at 7am in a really bad mood so there was no way he was gettin a shag even if he wanted one   Oooo nix i never led u astray im a good girl i am    Honestly tho hunny im so so hoping this is ur time,  and peeing is definately a good sign.       

Anne - stew sounds lovely we are having chicken and beef im starving   

Zuri glad u are feeling better this morning  hope the cold is finally leaving you   

Anna good luck for those blood tests sweetheart  

Suzie - good luck with the trigger, know what u mean about the **** tho, mines huuggggeeeee  

Ali - hello sweetie, dont know what u decided about christening but hope it went ok for you whatever ur decision   

Donkey - it has gone cloudy a bit now but the suns still coming through, suppose id better go and plant that magnolia i bought last week  

Love to everyone

Kate
xxxxxxx


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## dakota

New home this way.......http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=192170.0


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