# Failed cycles - is it really all about the egg?



## Molly99 (Apr 16, 2012)

Hello wonderful negative cycle ladies, 

We have had two failed cycles in the last 3 months (1st one resulted in a BFP but loss at 5-6 weeks and the second absolutely nothing).

I have a phone consultation to wrap up this cycle (our last ever fresh one).  It all seems a bit wasted because what's done is done and I can't see what they can add that would make a difference because we've already failed.  Still, we do have one little perfect 5 day blast frostie left, it isn't an option to use it because we've seriously run out of money, but I'm hoping that we can get some advice about perhaps what has been going wrong for us.

I've been reading quite a bit about questions to ask but one piece of research is really nagging at me.  I keep reading that it is the egg that causes that causes 70-80% of embryo incompetence.  Is this really the case?

It's bothering me because, although I'm an oldie, all of our transfers so far have been with a top grade perfect egg.  I had blood tests with every scan and my LH and oestrogen levels were really good and my lining, though not massively thick, was well in the normal range.  My DH has some serious sperm problems after a vasectomy reversal, but does ICSI really take away any issues around this and it's still my eggs that are failing?  

I'm finding it difficult to understand.  I know that embryos & implantation failure can just happen (especially over 40) but I'm feeling a little like it all comes down to egg competence and nothing to do with sperm quality - which I really thought might have played a major part. x


----------



## In sha Allah (Nov 15, 2013)

Morning Molly 99 ..... So so sorry to hear your history I'm gutted for you xx 

I feel the same like you about talking over the failed cycle I know it's failed I don't need someine at a desk with no emotion what so ever telling me, although you do reflect back and ask yourself so e questions
This was our first and probably last try of icsi
Everything went ok and we had 2 blasts on board I'm heartbroken that both didn't stick and I am hVing a horrible af at the moment 

Sorry I. Ant really answer your question but thought I would jump on board as just to let you know you are not the only one feeling like this 

Lots of hugs xxx


----------



## Molly99 (Apr 16, 2012)

Thanks In sha Allah, I'm so sorry that you are in this place too.

I have so many questions, I don't know whether they can be answered, and it's a weird place to be where it doesn't really matter if they are because it won't affect the outcome.

I'm just a bit confused about it all really.  We have male factor (and my age) but absolutely everything in IVF is geared towards the woman.  Is ICSI really the complete solution to poor sperm and it is all about the egg?  I keep reading about far more indepth help in clinics (mostly like Serum) where the man is treated too.  I just wish that there was an answer really, I know that there probably isn't.

Sending you lots of hugs xx


----------



## In sha Allah (Nov 15, 2013)

Well icsi is suppose to be the best option for male factor infertility like us 

And you has good outcomes and good fertilization I think it's more with if it's gonna stuck and implant  X


----------



## purpledream (Nov 6, 2013)

I am very sorry to hear about your bfn Molly.
Here's what I think.

You can't tell embryo competence solely by looking at it.
The most important factor is whether it is chromosomally normal and that you can't tell by looking. Need to go through DNA testing.

Also, ICSI tries to pick the best sperm (sometimes using the same material as the egg shell - hyaluronan) but if the sperm is DNA fragmented I think if I am not wrong it will still pass motility and morphology tests. That is, I am not sure about picking the best sperm and whether it is foolproof generally… unless there are more tests done? I am not completely sure about this - I need to read more. 

Also, implantation needs a competent uterus. And from what I hear, there is the whole womb immunology. But you don't have endo ...

This is what I think could be the other factors that could maybe help shed some light. 
 many hugs to u.


----------

