# Why do I never get past day 10 before bleeding?



## Jess75 (Nov 4, 2005)

Bit if a emotional day today - just found out my 5th ivf has failed. My question is I always start spotting on day 8 then on day 10 post transfer I get my period. I am wondering if I have a progestorone problem as in my body is not absorbing enough from the pessary? Should the pessaries not hold off af?

I know I am looking for answers I probably cant get but it just seems strange I never get anywhere near test date. My clinic basically say if I was pregnant I would make my own progesterone so they dont think its a problem. 

I have heard of so many women get things like gestone injections etc - is it possible cyclogest just does not work for me or have I just had bad luck?

Thanks


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## lizziek (Feb 23, 2006)

Hi Jess

First of all, I'm so sorry that this cycle didn't work out for you (as you can see from my signature I've had a few failed cycles too). I'm not an expert but I have spent an awful (some may say completely absurd) amount of time reading various bits of IVF literature. From what I understand the jury is still out on progesterone support post-transfer and that a number of clinics do it because it can't do any harm, whereas others see it as being completely necessary and will bump up the dosage if, like you, a patient starts bleeding a while before OTD. 
I used Crinone gel on two of my negative cycles and started bleeding a good week before testing. On other cycles I had Prontogest injections (think it's the same as Gestone) and hey presto always made it to OTD without bleeding. Personally I would always opt for the injections (though they're a bit unpleasant - big painful lumps at the injection site which took months to go) as it removes any doubt about whether or not my body is producing enough progesterone on its own to support a pregnancy.

It might be worth getting a second opinion if your clinic is very resistant to upping your progesterone in future cycles.

Take care and once again I'm so sorry that you're going through this.

Liz x


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## karenanna (Dec 27, 2008)

Hi Jess

So sorry to hear about your BFNs   - I had 4 so know what you are going through. I also had the same issue with bleeding before the OTD - mine always started around day 8/9.

Anyway I wondered if you had looked into immune testing - I moved clinics to the ARGC and they picked up that I had immune issues and was producing antibodies to progesterone. They tested my progesterone on ET day and it was fine, but the next day it had plummetted and I was put on gestone as well as cyclogest to supplement it. I also had a whole range of other issues that I won't go into here, but let me know if you want to know more.

Here is a link to the immunes board http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?board=52.0 if you want to read more - I would also recommend getting hold of 'Is your Body Baby Friendly' by Alan E Beer.

If you want to check out the ARGC and ask more questions about their immune testing and protocols there is a thread for those considering the clinic http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=245856.372 where you can ask questions and an info page http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=231484.0

Hope this helps and take care 

Karenanna xxx


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## Jess75 (Nov 4, 2005)

Thanks so much to both of you for your detailed responses. I did ask my clinic about the Immunology testing but they said there is not enough evidence to support it and basically I have just had "bad luck". I feel very let down by them now and will read the links you have attached.

Things have progressed slightly today - I have taken a test which showed up a faint positive. No way its a ongoing pregnancy with the amount I am bleeding but its a line. This would look to be my 3rd chemical pregnancy in a row so I am certain something is going wrong at implantation and its a progesterone issue.

We are approaching a new clinic in edinburgh to get their take on our situation and see what they would do for us differently. I am just gutted. Seeing the faint line is worse than seeing the white space. Will test again on Wednesday as I am supposed to but hold out no hope.

I am just glad you dont think I am going mad thinking their is a problem. My clinic just say because I have had 1 succesful pregnancy through fet there is no issue. Never mind the 5 failed full ivf's and now 3 chemical pregnancies.

Thanks again for all your advice I will look at the links now

XX


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## suitcase of dreams (Oct 7, 2007)

Jess

So sorry to hear about your latest negative result

Many clinics do not believe in immunes because there is limited 'evidence' that they are effective, especially in the UK. However if you look at the US, immune tx has helped many women who could not conceive before. It's an expensive route to go down but so many failed cycles has to be more than just bad luck so it may be worth looking into it..at least get some of the initial tests done so you can see if you may have issues - just because you have had a child does not mean you do not have immune issues - it is very common for these issues to surface after you have had one baby already

re progesterone, my first 2 cycles I bled on day 8-9 with cyclogest. Switched to gestone injections and always got to test day....took me a few more cycles to get to my BFP but then I also subsequently discovered egg quality and immune issues (I've been doubly/triply unlucky I think!)...but the gestone def got me to test day many times so even if you don't go down the immune route, I would insist on injectable progesterone next time

Sounds like a change of clinic is an excellent idea too
Best of luck
Suitcase
x


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## sunbeam (Nov 19, 2007)

Hey Jess so sorry to hear of your BFN.  Its so heartbreaking.  Well im no expert, but having had three failed cycles I have read and read on this.  On my FET I got to test date.  My Dr doesnt treat immune issues.  On this cycle he gave me an extra pregnyl 5000 units injection 5 days post blastocyst transfer.  To keep the hCG levels up to trick my body into thinking it was pregnant.....well we got a BFP so it must have helped....hope this helps you.  I was taking 2 x cyclogest a day but the other cycles one crinone a day.

Good luck Jess


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## prayingforthetictac (Dec 21, 2010)

Hi Jess,

So sorry about the latest cycle.   for next time. 

I had 2 failed cycles with similar bleeding patterns to you, both not being able to get to test date. I used cyclogest rectally.

I changed clinics and have just completed my 3rd cycle. The clinic said some women don't absorb the cyclogest progesterone well enough and so they put me on gestone injections (yes they are horrid!) and cyclogest inserted vaginally. I got to test date and have a BFP! My progesterone levels on HCG blood test were 500 and need to be at least 100. So at this stage I'm a fan (albeit sore one) of Gestone. 

I've had immune testing and came back fine - so progesterone and immune probs aren't necessarily hand in hand.

Good luck x


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## kitten77 (Nov 15, 2006)

hi praying..... thank you for your positive story, i am on the injections next cycle (stary jan!) and ive never got to test day either, so thank you you have made me that little bit more positive.


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## QUEEN B (Leighsa) (Sep 12, 2008)

Hi sorry to gatecrash your conversation I have been posting on both Oct/Nov & Nov/Dec thread. This is my 1st cycle with ICSI and I am currently 8dpt and started bleeding yesterday, I didnt expect to bleed so soon into 2ww, I have read some stories of ladies bleeding and still getting there BFP but I am also very very worried and scared that this has failed, it is my 1st cycle so dont really know what to expect but I do know that im finding it extremely difficult to stay posistive now, all I seem to do is cry all the time and am feeling stressed constantly.

I have been told it could be many things and everybody says not to worry at this stage which is kinda reassuring, im just praying that its down to me having a little sex 7dpt and has cause the bleed (which I have been told nothing to worry about) or maybe it could be just one of the emrbyos detaching and hoping that the other one has implanted......  

I had a 10 cell & a 7 cell out back 3 day transfer im just hioping that these strong embryos are srong enough to stick with me despite the bleeding. 

Leighsa


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## karenanna (Dec 27, 2008)

Hi Leighsa

Sorry to hear you are worrying       and please don't worry about the    as I have heard this can be a good thing!

As you say some ladies have bleeding and go on to have a successful pregnancy and others don't - it is so difficult to tell and this whole thing is a really emotional journey. I had a cycle 2 years ago where I tested on Christmas day and got a BFN so the whole thing was really miserable - however this year it has been really different sharing it with my 2 month old twins - never give up hope!

Lots of   for a positive test

Karenanna xxx


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## QUEEN B (Leighsa) (Sep 12, 2008)

Hi Karenanna thank you for hun, have to say am feeling a little more positive now that the bleeding has pretty much stopped, all in all I had bled for 3 days and now today have just a tiny amount of brown (Sorry tmi).... Im praying this was due to me  having sex or alternatively my 2 lil embies implanting. 
Im due to test on the 4th but think they gave me that date as thats when they re-open... but 14 days will be the 31st so gonna test then and again on the 4th

Im   this bleed hasnt prevented my embies growing. 
Leighsa
xxx


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