# Am I too old at 41 and a half?



## Camellia (Feb 28, 2008)

Hello ladies,

The question I am hoping you might be able to help me with is:

AM I TOO OLD?

As you can see from my signature I've been through 3 ICSIs, none of which lead to a BFP.  My dh and I married in 2006 and we started ttc immediately.  Although I was 38 I felt a pregnancy should have been fairly easily achieved.  My mum had my brother and sister aged 37 and 39, and conceived them in the first and second months of trying, my aunt had my cousins at 40 and 41, and my grandmother had my uncle at 45.  However, after a year of ttc, with no hint of success my dh and I had some tests done and it turned out my dh has a low sperm count etc.  There have never been any fertility problems diagnosed with me, other than the fact that my age is now a significant factor    

My AMH was 1.0 a year ago, so not good.  My FSH levels have always been good i.e. under 9 (and were tested in Apr, Jun and Jul this year).  That was until I decided to start a cycle in mid-Sept and my FSH came back as 18 and the cycle could not go ahead!  That really shocked me.  I decided not to try for a cycle in Oct, but did have bloods done.  My FSH was 6.4.  

Anyway, I do wonder if I have just had my time, need to move on, and find a way to enjoy a childless future.  In Sept I felt completely mentally prepared for another cycle, but the FSH result completely threw me. Now I am scared to put myself through such a gruelling thing.  I see other ladies on here get a bfn or m/c and it is completely heartbreaking.  Giving up all hope of having a family isn't easy either, and would I regret not trying one last time?

Please help if you can, although I know we all have to make our own decisions.  I am scared of the emotional turmoil of putting myself through yet another failed cycle.

Love Cam x


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## nbr1968 (Feb 25, 2008)

Dear Camellia

I can totally emaptahise with how you feel - the whole TX rollercoaster is so scary - it verges on masochism! Only you can answer the question about whether you want to put yourself through the emotional turmoil of a potentially failed cycle, but I know that for us we are just not ready to give up yet and I am the same age as you. We have been through absolute hell this year, but for us, the dream of holding our baby is not yet extinguished. We had a hiatus with TX for nearly 18 months after our first failed Tx and I regret that delay every day because as you said the older we get our chances of success are lessened.

I know from reading other posts on FF that FSH levels can fluctuate - indeed there is a lady on Ff called Belladonna3 (i think) who had high FSH was told donor eggs is the only way forward for her, and then got pg at aged 43 I think (naturally) and she is now 13 weeks pregnant. So there is always hope if you choose to go for another TX.

One thing I woud say though is that for "older" ladies, I know that tweaking protocols can really help to get the max amount of follicles and eggs. Have you discussed your concerns with your consultant?  And then maybe get a second opinion before you finally make a decision whether to go ahead or not. Whatever you do, don't delay - the more information and advice you have the more confident you will feel about the decision you do make, and the less likely you are to have deep regrets later on.

I wish you all the best for whatever lies ahead for you in the future


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## manny (Nov 3, 2009)

Hello Camellia
I recently found out we need to go down the IVF route after ttc naturally for the last 2 years and not getting anywhere. I am 42 now and i did start looking at getting fertility tested last year jun 08 but was made to lose a whole year of time at the hands of my previous unhelpful incompetent gp, so only started testing in jun 09, we discovered my partner has a normal count, low motility and high abnormal morphology  i have one blocked tube  but told can still get pregnant. I've also had endometriosis twice about 12 years ago with no recurrence thank God. Though as there was no conclusive evidence that we cant get pregnant because of it, I was told it can cause infertility issues. Anyway we are now at the stage where we have to book an initial consultation and we want to go to Guys & St Thomas assisted conception unit, has anyone here been there? Does anyone know how good they are? I have looked them up and they say they have a success rate of 23% 131 embryos transferred, for women aged 40-42 for clinical pregnancies in 2008. 
I'm trying to call them now to get an appointment for next week but cant get anyone to pick up the phone! Typical, we narrow it down to a clinic and we get this!  
Can I ask is yours an unexplained infertility? Does your dh have any fertility issues?
I hope to have a bfp soon as I hope for you too, dont give up, unless you feel you have exhausted all possible avenues


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## Vaudelin (Jul 5, 2009)

Hi Carmellia

Just wanted to ask if you decided to go through with another treatment would you consider changing clinics?  Have all your treatments been at the same clinic?  Also, would you consider immune testing?  

Just a few ideas.  I wish you all the best whatever you decide.  Follow your heart.

x


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## Camellia (Feb 28, 2008)

Hello all,

I just wanted to say a huge thank you for responding to my post.  This whole infertility thing is so isolating, and it is wonderful knowing there are people out there who will understand and provide support.

I decided to go ahead with another cycle although felt very scared.  I went along for my day 1 blood test on Sat and was told on Sat afternoon that I could not go ahead as planned as my FSH was 20.2.  I asked why it had been 6.4 the month before, and was told that although that result was low, it was probably a false result and the levels were actually much higher.  I can't say that I understand it at all, but at the end of the day I cannot go ahead with another cycle    I feel emotionally battered and know it will take some time to work through it all.

nbr1968 - I was so sorry to hear of the troubles you have been through.  It really is far more than anyone deserves.  I will keep everything crossed that the future does hold what you so want it to.

manny - In answer to your questions, our main problem is male factor.  Without ICSI our chances of conceiving are very low.  Add my old eggs into the equation, and the chances must be nothing.  I hope that you have now managed to get in touch with the clinic of your choice.

vaudelin - Thanks for your thoughts.  We did our first three cycles at the Lister.  The first was a complete disaster and I do think they should have known better than to go ahead with an EC which yielded only 1 mature egg.  We changed to ARGC earlier this year but have not actually ended up having any treatment there.

Love to all,

Cam x


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Cam I am so sorry abou t the rollercoaster you  have just been on. Don't give up on your dream of being a Mummy. There are lots of ways to get there. Just sometimes you need to be flexible and keep researching!!!
Chin up. Onwards and upwards.


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## simone hart (Jul 6, 2009)

Hi,
your post 'am I too old at 41 and a half caught my eye' and I really empathise.  I am raw from a recent first failed ICSI and we need to make a follow up appointment to discuss our treatment. I've been ttc for two years ever since I got married at 37( 3 months off 3 and we started trying immediately because I'd read that women's fertility reduces after the age of 35. I was aware that some women retained their fertility for longer than others and that I wouldn't know until I started trying. I was also annoyed with the doctor who wouldn't do tests until I'd been trying for a year as 'she had friends on their second and third babies at my age', even though I'd read that women over the age of 35 should have tests done after trying for 6 months! I did naturally conceive at 38 but had a miscarriage at 11 weeks.

My first FSH results were from another doctor who told me that they were fine for my age ( then 39), although I have since learned that they like them to be under 8.So I felt lulled into a false sense of security. We were still referred to a specialist who thought the result was high for my age and a second FSH result came back at 23.4.  I was obviously devastated. Then my DH had a SA which shocked us as he had an abnormal SA  ( normal count but low motility and only 1% normal morphology). We were referred for ICSI but the NHS doctor didn't know why we'd been sent with my high FSH and refused to treat us.

We then went private for a second opinion and my FSH went down to 10.41 Lh 6.16 and I also had AMH reading of 10.4. They were happy to proceed with ICSI based on these results.

It does show that FSH does bounce around quite a bit. We were so grateful to have the chance after being turned away by NHS consultant. But I think that I had low expectations as a result.
nbr1968 It was interesting that you mentioned that protocols can be tweaked. If you stay with a clinic perhaps they can learn from previous cycles? Is that better than moving around?

It is difficult camellia to offer advice when you are on the same journey but I have had higher FSH than you( and I'm a few years younger) and I had a tx when my FSH went down. I know that your oestrogen result can hide a higher FSH result some times as well which might be what your clinic were saying. I hope that they will allow you to have another blood test and tx if that is what you decide to do. In a book, I read that you can conceive naturally with FSH results in the 20s, but it is just made harder when the swimmers mught not be able to get there.
There is no history of infertility in my family either. Although my mum and my aunts had their children in their twenties, my mum hadn't gone through the menopause when she had a hysterectomy at 49 and my aunts were nearly 60 when they stopped having periods. I suppose we're grappling with any information that we can use to help use to gauge our own individual fertility.

I know that if our clinic will offer us another opportunity, then we will probably go for it as our situation is made more difficult with  Dh problem. I know that time is of the essence and I suppose we want to look back and feel we've given it our best shot.

I have also enquired about adopting but have been told that we would be unlikely to have a baby and that we are not considered young parents now. So would I consider a donor egg? It is early days yet but this offers a chance to have a baby that at least is biologically related to one parent, if, of course it is successful. I just know that if at all possible we dearly want to raise at least one child but as yet, we don' know how we will achieve this. x


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Simone what is your next step then? I am sure you have a plan?


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## simone hart (Jul 6, 2009)

Armi,
    Thanks for your reply. Well, I am meeting with the fertility nurse next Wed who is going to talk through my treatment process. I think I am just eager to know what they think the next step will be for us. 

Thanks Rose for your email about FSH levels.
I am wondering how often your FSH/ AMH is tested prior to treatment. Am I right in assuming that they take it prior to any IVF cycle? I'm still learning so much about it all.

I was disappointed with only 4 follicles (I was on the short antagonist flare protocol) but what can you do? However, the nurse was really optimistic throughout the process and said that she'd be pleased if we could get 4 eggs and that people get too 'bogged down' by numbers. I responded to stimms really quickly and I had to take Orgalutron after my first ultrasound scan as my follies were quite big already (after taking an ovulation test to check that I wasn't already ovulating). And even then, by ER one follie had ovulated naturally. I suppose I would like some feedback about that.

I have read that DHEA is suitable for some women who have aging ovaries so I might mention that to the nurse when I've had my feedback. if it could be supervised by the clinic, then I think i would try it. I've read that it has to be taken for 4 months for any benefits to be noticed. I've also read that you should wait for 3 months between fertility treatments so I thought it might be an option....( is that right?)  I know you can order DHEA from America but I wouldn't know the dosage to take and the thought of putting hormones in my body without understanding it properly would be quite daunting.

I'll also keep reading threads on this site, it's keeping me sane, somehow.
I'm really chuffed to get a star and some bubbles 

Simone xx


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Well Simone I have just sent you som more bubbles. Good luck for your follow up.
As for numbers I have a good friend from who who produced one follie and she now has a 10 month old little boy!!


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## simone hart (Jul 6, 2009)

I was just about to sign out and realised that I'd received another message.

Thanks for the bubbles and the news about your friend too. It's heartening to read good news.
Keep up the optimism and good luck to you too   ( I can't send bubbles yet).
Simone x


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Simoe look on the right had sideo the page at people names.Underneath s  message to blow bubbles. You can blow bubbles to whoever you want to.


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## simone hart (Jul 6, 2009)

Hi Armi,
I've just sent you some bubbles.Hope you're not superstitious about numbers ending on a 3 etc I didn't realise that's how it worked.I should have read the info sheet better
I'm feeling a bit down today. Been reading about age and fertility on the internet and on average, even people with 'normal' fertility rarely achieve a pregnancy after 45.  Yet, you told me your news( you only need one folly to achieve a pregnancy). I think that I just feel a bit panicky because I'm 40 in a couple of months and fear that I really have 'mised the boat' for my own personal fertility. I will need to wait and find out what the feedback is tomorrow from the fertility nurse.

I've got to get myself out of this rut. I need to start pilates and exercise again and I've got to be thankful for the good things in my life. I know that. Sorry for my depressing message,


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Simone
easy to feel sorry for ourselves. I am older than you, and not had a natural pregnancy with thisDh an we have been together 13 years!!
Hope tomorrow brings better news for you. I will be nline to see.


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## simone hart (Jul 6, 2009)

Hello Armi,

Thanks for your message. I felt a bit guilty about my pessimism in my last post. It won't get me anywhere and life is too short isn't it?
I had a few days break from the computer so thought I'd let you know how I got on last week.

They were pleased with my cycle even though it wasn't successful. I had egg hatching and they said that my eggs were easy to work and not hard ( they do it if you're 38 or over as older eggs can get hard and blastocyst can't hatch out then).You probably know that but it just helps me to write it all down!!! Also dh motility was good despite count being lower .  Don't know about morph as it was ICSI so it wasn't recorded. Perhaps our 'trying to be  healthy' diet is working. Who knows!

So we will have another cycle next year. I mentioned taking DHEA but the nurse didn't think I needed it. However when she spoke to the consultant, she thought it wouldn't do any harm as we'll probably have a 3 month break anyway so it's now on order!

Thanks for your kindly messages and good luck with it all too! 
With the festive season approaching, I'm concerned about letting good habits slip. I do love sparkly wine and I've been avoiding alcohol as much as possible. Have you radically altered your lifestyle and diet at all? It must be hard when you've been trying for a long time without success. But you have one beautiful girl now. Your FSH result is under 8 which is a good sign too so you do have to try and be as optimistic as possible thoughout.
Take care , x


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## susie13 (Oct 2, 2009)

Hi Camellia

I am in a similar situation to you.  I am 40 (turning 41 in April).  Although started TTC on at 37 yo I thought it would be pretty straight forward, as all my mum had 5 kids, and all my siblings have been pretty fertile.  Discovered my husb has low sperm count and on my side no real issues other than mild pcos.  Decided to go through medical intervention, so did two IUIs, 1 fresh IVF and 2 frozen - no preg result.  Just in Nov went for another fresh cycle and wow was pregnant.  I think the fact that I introduced chinese med and accupuncture really helped.  HOWEVER big problem - i had an ectopic pregnancy and had to have my right fallopian tube removed this weekend.  I am distraught and feel I have gone from a relatively healthy though ageing woman to one that has reduced chance of natural conception.  I knew ectopic pregnancy is a higher risk in IVF (than natural) but it didn't strike home how serious it could be leading to an operation and removal of a body part!

I am thinking that I may call IVF a day.  I feel I have been unlucky and tend to overrespond to the medication (I had mild Ovarian Hyperstimn the first time) and dont know what other risks I am opening myself up to in the long run.  That is just what my body is telling me and may be different for different people.  I have avoided medication my whole life, i hardly even take aspirin and panadol, and this is really not natural for me.  And I have avoided hospitals my whole life so an operation is a BIG deal.

Anyway I think I will continue with chinese med and accupuncture, get my husband to look at some chinese alternative therapies also, and if something happens it happens.  May look at adoption - though that's all a new realm for me to research - else try to make the most of my life in a healthy and postive manner.

Bear in mind my views are a bit negative at the moment, my operation was only on Sat and I was emotionally distraught all weekend (getting better now).


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## alegria (Dec 10, 2007)

Hi Camellia,

Just wanted to send you a massive 
You are not old at all. I will be 42 in a couple of months  Have been ttc for 3 yrs now (met dh late in life  ) and have had 5 IVF attempts so far that have either been BFNs or cancelled or converted to IUI in the end due to poor response to the drugs.

I want to try once again in the New Year but it's sooo scary!! It's really hard to pick up the pieces and pull yourself together to try again despite the emotional, physical and financial upheaval that we go through during tx but I feel that I have to try everything possible so I won't regret anything in the future...



Camellia said:


> We did our first three cycles at the Lister. The first was a complete disaster and I do think they should have known better than to go ahead with an EC which yielded only 1 mature egg.


Snap! I had my first 2 cycles at the Lister too and for the first one the whole cycle was totally mismanaged an a complete disaster. I ended up coming back from EC with only 1 mature egg too.. 

nbr - I'm so sorry for all that you have been through.. my heart goes out to you and your dh 

Armi -  hello again!

Sending lots of    and good luck to you all!

Alegria x


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## armi (Sep 1, 2007)

Alegria
wAs just thinking of you the other day. Pleased to see you back.


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## Terry (Feb 24, 2005)

I hope you're not too old, because then I am!!  I say don't give up if you still have the stomach and the wallet for it!!  I'm plannning to call it a day when I'm 42.5, but that's just because my daughter will be 5 by the time any conception at 42.5 occurs, and I've figured she won't the sibling by then that I desperately want for her now.  Someone once told me (i'm a poor responder and my child is One Egg Wonder, the result ofa  cycle with only one follicle) that a poor responder (and let's face it, most women in their forties start to become one) just has a higher number of dud eggs.  If you don't produce many, you just need more cycles to get your statistical entitlement of non-dud eggs. Yes, that costs money and time...but if you can do it, you may feel better.


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## Grem (Feb 19, 2010)

Hi Folks

I'm 42 and trying for the 2nd time - we both think we're completely mad but it'll be worth it if it works.

Doesn't the saying go that you're only as old as the man you're feeling....mmmm just remembered that DH is 55 - so that doesn't work for me!!  Still he's 55 going on 18 like most men so I can dream.

Unless we get some frosties this will be our last time as we don't have the wallet for it (to use Terry's words).

Should know some dates after my donor's scan later today - can't really think if anything else so glad I've got the day off!!!!!

Gx


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