# Help, we are sinking with wee man's behaviours



## Flash123 (Jan 29, 2006)

Ladies, once again I need your help! And sorry this is a long one because life is tough at the moment and we are drowning in a sea of negativity.


Some of you may have picked up from another post but we are seriously struggling with wee man at the moment. He has always been a 'challenging' little one, always very demanding/controlling since he first came home but things really seemed to have stepped up a gear. In an attempt to get my head clear I am going to approach this post in an analytical way.
Wee man is 32 months old, exceptionally bright. Both his receptive and expressive language are fantastic. 
He has recently gone from sleeping 3 hours every morning to nothing and is up by 5.30  at the latest every morning.

These are the behaviours he is showing:
Aggression - scramming, hitting, head butting, 'rough loving' at any opportunity. Always when he has been asked to do something or a boundary has been informed but also at other non- confrontational times. It is mainly aimed at me but not always. Never anyone else but dh and I. So far we have tried - ignoring (seems to make him up the intensity) firm "we dont *****, it hurts" and removing ourselves from him but staying relatively close by (he just charges at you and rugby tackles you), removing him from us but staying relatively close (again rugby tackled) .


Tantrums/melt downs - currently these are happening most days/nights and they are incredible intense and last for approx 1 hour. He screams at the top of his voice, makes demands which change constantly and he doesn't want (just screams for things he knows he isn't allowed e.g. Softplay at 3 in the morning) throws things. I joke not he screamed so much and got himself so tense and angry he pooed himself!  They can be triggered by ANYTHING - dh collecting him from cot, his toy bus falling on the floor and me refusing to pick it up, me refusing to stop the car on the motorway so he could look for elephants. While having these melt downs if you get close to him he just gets worse, lashes out at you and screams louder 'don't touch me' so I can't try creams, rubbing, rocking etc.  we have the same reaction if we try speaking to him. Distraction doesn't work he just screams 'no' so we are just sitting in relatively close to him in silence trying to judge when we can start to speak and comfort him. 


Rejection of me - he has always been a daddy's boy. I put this down to FC where fm worked a few jobs and he was mainly looked after by fd. Fd rocked him to sleep in his arms, slept with him on his stomach, indulged him in EVERY way - you get the picture. On a normal day, wee man and I have a very good bond. He comes to me for comfort, can be VERY clingy with me when out and about and is VERY controlling on me. However, every few weeks we go through a phase of him not letting me go anywhere near him. If on my own he is fine, if dh is there he screams in terror if I walk too close to him. He won't let me push the pushchair, feed him, change nappy - nothing other than our goodnight cwtch and bottle. I have to be honest it really breaks my heart ( and I know that really selfish because I'm thinking about my feelings not his) I try to rise above and stay smiley mummy but sometimes I feel like saying '**** off and have your bl**** daddy'. (Obviously I don't!) 


On top of this his behaviour can generally be very poor, pure oppositional non-compliance and it feels like we have become entrenched in a cycle of 'no's' and negativities.


So here we are  - I need help to get out of this rut we are in xxxx


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## Mummy DIY Diva (Feb 18, 2012)

Hugs really  tough. My eldest  hates being  touched / stroked  when stressed  i have  to  let her work  it through.  However  if she's  endangering  herself  or sister  such as repeated  kicking  of glass panels  on a door.  Then i will hold her down  / safe restraint  till she's  calm enough  to  stop. This  works  really  well  for  her  i think phySical contact  but zero intimacy  is what  she needs. 

She also  does the  repeated  requests for  things that  are  an obvious  no as an excuse  to  kick  off.  In response  to  this i calmly  point out what  she's  doing.  Totally  none  judgementally  just  at the  moment  you are  saying  things to  mummy  you know  mummy  will say no tO, to try and  make  mummy  argue  with  you. Mummy  doesn't  like  arguing  with  you  so I'm  not going  to  respond  to  things where  you  know  i will say no. If you  need  to  scream  and  shout mummy  understands  that but mummy  isn't  going  to  argue.  Just scream  if you  need to mummies  here. 

Not a miracle  but often  stops yhe constant  annoying  requests  xx


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## GERTIE179 (Apr 20, 2005)

Flash huge hugs honey as this isn't easy and I've had my own dark periods where we just couldn't shake lil man back into our wee guy. For us it was the start of pre-school and we had about 4-5 months of hell with behaviour, sleep, agression, and a very scared lil boy. I'll be back later with some things that help us & see if any of them do.

Of the top of my head, have you seen an OT? My boy is very sensory seeking and especially when stressed. Your guy may be similar to Divas in that he's seeking the physical connection but is hating the intimacy. Things that help that part have been hugs in a towel/blanket and lil man facing away from you. Other things that we've not had too much success on (too much push me pull me), is a den where he can retreat to when he escalates. Get him to help build it with pillows etc when he's in calm mood and reiterate he can go there any time he wants/needs to feel calm/safe.

Thinking back has anything in his routine changed, any big stresses, flashback of memories re time of year, holidays etc if he's really bright he may be picking up so much more than you realise/think. It can help with other strategies.
Interesting that on cuddly days, the outside world scares him as normally be a way to avoid some of the intense behaviours.
X x x


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## Flash123 (Jan 29, 2006)

Thanks both, fab ideas as always. On my way to work at the moment so will read again and digest later.

Gertie it's funny you say that about time of year it is something we have considered and I have tried to research. We had very similar behaviours the same time last (but obviously developmentally younger). On both occassions things intensified end of april/may time He was meant to move in with us end of April but intros ended up starting end of may. I had wondered if FC changed towards him in Preparation for his leaving as they were exceptionally attached to him.


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## Sq9 (Jan 15, 2013)

No words of wisdom I'm afraid flash but sending you huge hugs    Xxx


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## littlepoppy86 (Feb 14, 2014)

Flash sending you a big hug, my boys only 23m but experiencing large tantrs constantly now like Youve described...No words of wisdom but just you're not along and a virtual hug xx


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## AoC (Oct 28, 2008)

Flash, we've had escalations of Bug's behaviour at his 'change' time of year.  Which doesn't help right now, but at least means it's likely to pass.  

Big hugs, I know how relentlessly hard this can be.

With Bug at that age, we found that actually we had to work on his self esteem, massively.  Only when we started on this did we realise that actualy somehow he'd got the idea that all his changes had happened because, "I'm not good, I'M A NAUGHTY BOY!" (His words, not ours).  Initially we just stickered him to death *g*  So any time he did anything remotely 'good' we over-played how happy we were and slapped a gold star sticker on him.  Bug at this stage usually kicked off when DH came home and was very angry/rejecting of him.  The first day we started this, he ran to greet DH at the door, shouting, "wook Daddy!  Wook!  Wook how may STARS I HAVE 'COS I AM A GOOD BOY!"  I cried.  Obviously.  

After a few days of this we noticed huge change, so we graduated to a sticker chart.  I know it's not approved of by many, but we did it with our SWer's advice.  We made sure at least 50% of what was on the chart were things he liked to do and found easy, and nothing on it was negative, i.e. you can't just say, "no hitting all day".  We focussed on routine-based activities, like "getting dressed nicely and helpfully".

For us, many of the 'usual' things to do with aggression, like ignoring, "we don't do that," etc just made things worse.  We did a lot of work on emotional intelligence, too, with DH and I talking about how we felt a lot.  "Wow, I feel really happy about x,..... x has happened and that makes me feel sad.... " etc etc.  That rubbed off on Bug quickly, too.  I found reflecting how he felt back at him helped, too.  "I can see you're really angry right now.  I bet that feels really awful.  How about we try x to make you feel better?"

When we made it a discipline issue, it got worse.  When we empathised with how he was feeling, it got better.  We got it wrong initially, thinking we needed to be 'stricter' with the behaviour, but what we really needed to do was step back from our reaction to the behaviour, and address the underlying need.

At the end of the day, though, although we tried lots of things and gave him lots of tools, it was Bug who made the changes himself.  I'm not convinced any of our 'methods' were a magic bullet, but I am convinced I'm mothering a magic child.  

I remember, really remember, how rancid and brutal it was when things weren't right.  And just to give you some reassurance and hope, I do not have the language to tell you how brilliant things are right now, and the vast majority of the time these days.  

Hang on in there.  You're doing a great job, and you WILL get through this.


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## aaa is a MUMMY (Oct 13, 2009)

Hugs Flash it sounds just like Bubba just as she approached her 3 b day and thankfully apart from the very odd occasion it stopped after Christmas a year later. She came home middle of Dec and oh boy every year so far once the hype starts we know about it. I remember having talks with Fc and sw as they debated on moving her on before Xmas.  The sw said to us we had to be very careful you can never under estimate the power of memory and what can trigger those memories. For example lights, smells etc. We all thought she was being silly after all she was only just 1 at the time but I know almost wish we had delayed intros by a few weeks as I often think  will we ever have a stress free Xmas.  
I guess what I am saying is we survived. Nothing we did worked I cried most days feeling totally awful we were failing miserably. Stay strong ask family friends for some time out and get the strength back to survive another day.
I am dreading school starting as anything that means she is away from us or somewhere with different surroundings sets it all off again.


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## gettina (Apr 24, 2009)

Just sending love and strength to you and DH flash. V v tough times.  
Gettina


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## Flash123 (Jan 29, 2006)

Thank you all so, so much. It means such a lot knowing you aren't alone in this battle. 
His 'change' time co-incided with his first experience of summer so perhaps the change of season has contributed. We have decided to give it until the 6 weeks holiday with us really emphasising positives, firm calm but realistic and not too severe boundaries and hope it helps. If we haven't seen and improvement we will contact PAS and hope for a miracle from the world of SS lol.

The sticker fest has began and we will continue with the emotional literacy stuff. I do a lot with puppets as well so I will continue with that. At the moment, when we say "I can see you are angry ..." He just screams "noooooooo I'm not angry i am calm" at the top of his voice. The irony is quit funny to see. I think I expected too much. I expected results straight away and we all know that just doesn't happen with kiddies - let alone ours. 

I think his tiredness is having a huge impact. He has gone from sleeping 6.30/7 till 6/6.30 followed by a 2 hour morning nap to same going to bed time but up at 5 with no morning nap. No child can drop that many hours and not be affected. We have tried everything to get him to sleep later and morning nap again. The only working at the moment is a car ride but we can't do that everyday. 

What do you think i should I do with the rejection? For example this morning at 5 I went in to collect him and he had a meltdown because i wasn't daddy. I still picked him up, told him how I had missed him and was looking forward to our morning cwtch etc. daddy is trying by 'bigging' me up when wee man refuses to let me help him. He gets so upset that sometimes it's just easier to let daddy do things but then is that making the situation worse?

Thanks again. You are treasures xxx


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## GERTIE179 (Apr 20, 2005)

Hey honey - I had a period of this from wee man (only does fleeting at times now).  If he does sometimes I just act as the conduit I.e I say come on i'll take you to daddy then?  RE-enforcing I can meet his needs (if I feel its need driven).

Then all I do is work on other things that build our relationship so I do my own version of "Love Bombing". Basically I pick a day or afternoon where we let everything else go and just have time doing something together and be child led for as much of it as poss i.e. he picks a movie and we get our blanket and snuggle watching a movie (we did this lots more when we were all sleep deprived). Basically anything that helps you re-connect. Sometimes we go soft play and we just play with the two of us. other times its back garden and making up crazy games etc (sounds like fun games but it can be hard work as he'll be defiant and oppositional and holds hard to refuse to smile/enjoy himself but slowly we get there.  

I stay resolute on things that matter to us (i.e. bedtime is still fixed with normal routine and dinner is normal dinner) but if he wants to stay in PJ's all day I don't pressure him. Effectively its about taking he pressure off so we can enjoy each other again (think of it like a mini-date you would have with DH in terms of leaving the petty arguments at home whilst you have a day enjoying each others company again). As said, it can be difficult and feel like a trudge but I've found it does work with us at times and if nothing else it reduces the tension and I can zone out when movie is on etc.

Hope this helps with maybe some ideas that might help but like BUbba sometimes its just knowing you need to ride it out helps too (and I have a lot of facials/massage/wine at night during these times so please remember about self-cre and look after you).
x


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## Flash123 (Jan 29, 2006)

Thanks gertie. all of these replies help more than you can ever know. You are right it does help knowing its something we just have to get through. ladies i have read your replies in tears, trying to gather resolve and energy for the fight. (i know it sounds dramatic but thats how it feels at the mo!) 

my rejection plan is rather than resisting and persevering with him when he wants daddy i will try to be the 'deliverer' and i am actually looking forward to seeing how he will react. 

Over the last two days I have made a conscious decision to watch exactly what happens both before and during his melt downs. There have been many over these days and all have been due to his lack of control. Throughout the meltdowns he was clinging to me like a monkey demanding the exact opposite of what you are doing. He hung on me demanding and screaming that i stood. If you are standing he will scream and demand you sit in another room e.g. the kitchen - anything to take control of the situation and get you to do something. We don't do what he is demanding but the intensity increases substantially if you engage in any dialogue. One of today's was made worse if I simply took my eyes off him - he wanted me to look at him continuously. I repeated over and over 'mummy loves you and is here for you but I am not going to....' 

I feel truely awful though because today I crumbled and cried in front of him. It upset him so much that he was holding my face saying 'don't cry my mumma, don't cry'. At that moment, seeing his scared face i felt like such a failure and the worst mumma in the world.
Xx


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## Sq9 (Jan 15, 2013)

xxx


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## GERTIE179 (Apr 20, 2005)

Aww petal please don't feel like a bad mummy (we all have these moments and sometimes it can be over a little thing).

If he's getting to that controlling state we tend to just treat as a meltdown and we tend to treat those a bit differently - sensory works here so literally whatever he's wearing scoop him up and straight outside (I've even done this in pouring rain/wind on one truly out of control meltdown), or run a bath. Even if he's fighting against it (mostly just noises) he now hardly protests as he recognises he's lost control and our ways are to help centre him and regain control (if he's proper fighting then it tends to be a normal paddy if that makes sense). 

Other games we play is mad singing and dancing to pop music. My little boy is loving the sone "I really really really like" you just now and we do all the mirroring actions at each other. It's another little way we can do that positive self image thing like AoC.  I think sometimes our LOs can't always do the intensity of feelings so it's a nice way of getting that type of thing over and in our house it helps re-connect (ps I make up words ;-))

And probably telling you things you know but I ramp up the choice thing - do you want the green late or the blue plate for your lunch so much so that all I feel is I'm asking questions all day but over a few days/week with lots of these things it seems to settle a bit more (or at least feels tolerable). Tiredness makes behaviour 10 times worse and my patience very very low.


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## NancyS (Oct 16, 2013)

Bless you Flash, you're obviously anything but a bad parent

You've had some fantastic advice - but also wanted to add that often 30-32 months is the absolute peak of toddler tantrums for non-adopted children.  It's often the last scream of toddler defiance prior to them becoming easier as they get nearer to 3-years.  I've had more than a few friends with non-adopted children, driven to despair at the 30-32 month stage - and even though everything is often exaggerated in adoption world, you might find that behaviour naturally gets slightly easier over the next few months.  Do you have the book 'A Child's Journey through Placement? - it has a great chapter on age appropriate behaviour and is quite detailed on the nightmare that is often the 2.5-year-old 

Good luck x


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## AoC (Oct 28, 2008)

Flash, have you ever tried simply telling him calmly that he's not in charge, that that's Mummy and Daddy's job, and that one of the reasons he's not in charge is because it can be upsetting and hard work?  Bug would always scream, "I AM in charge!" when we said that, but it would have a notable positive effect on the severity and duration of any meltdowns and control freakery.

Don't be ashamed of crying.  I think kids need to see us express emotion and deal with it's consequences.  Scared as he was and wanting you to stop, I think he also made a connection with you at that moment.  And that he did that, instead of laughing harder and looking for things to hit you with (which happened with my Bug once - and this was during a sobbing phone conversation with a random duty SWer at my agency when I'd phoned for help!  I can laugh about it now..... ;-) ) is a really positive sign of empathy and understanding cause and effect.  

For me, it's not not crying that matters, it's what you do when it happens that counts.    In saner moments I would say to Bug that I was crying because I was sad and tired and a bit grumpy, that it wasn't his fault, and that I wished we could both feel better.  And I'd ask him what he thought we could do to both feel better.  

More recently, when grieving for my Mum, this bore fruit when he'd leap up if I was upset and run off to draw me a picture of fetch me a toy, shouting, "I KNOW!  THIS will make you feel better....."  

(I should tell you I laugh WAY more than I cry... in case you're imagining me sobbing my way through motherhood.... ;-) )


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## -x-Lolly-x- (Feb 3, 2012)

Flash I can't not reply to send you all my love   I'm afraid I have no practical advice but I'm happy to see you've received some great advice already, and I hope that little tweaks and changes can make all the difference. It sounds very hard and I really feel for you. Please don't feel bad for crying, it's human, we all do it and children need to see we feel and are able to show emotion too. It's part of their learning. You've always been so supportive on the forums I wanted to send some back. Thinking of you and wishing easier times are coming for you all xxx


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## Anjelissa (Jan 11, 2007)

Flash, I just wanted to send you massive hugs 
I'm another one who can identify with so much of what you have said.
It's so very hard, and at times I can honestly say that after going through quite a lot in my life, it's one of the hardest things both myself and dh have ever experienced. I think one of the main reasons is that it feels so relentless and you love them so much that you just feel so helpless when nothing you are doing seems to turn things around .
We also went through a period of little man rejecting me for Daddy, major melt downs (still not out of the woods yet on this score, but hopefully turning a corner), and as for sleep deprivation, he woke at around 4am for a few years running 
I can also totally identify with feeling like a terrible Mummy  and both myself and dh have been in tears more than we'd like to admit (fortunately at separate times).

I just wanted to say you are definitely not alone and you are a wonderful Mummy, you are simply human and have feelings and limits just like everyone else. If it _didn't_ get to you, that would be more worrying 

Just know that it will get easier and things will get calmer 

We love our lo's more than we could ever describe and wouldn't be without them, but I have to say we have had (prolonged) periods of wondering how we were going to cope the way we were going. We are now feeling as if we are starting to finally slowly (very slowly) turn a corner, but I can honestly say I know how you are feeling and I also know it helped us a great deal to know we weren't alone. We have friends with birth children who went through similar (years before us) and it helped to know that things do eventually calm and you do get through it.

Lots of love and hugs hun 
x x x x


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## Flash123 (Jan 29, 2006)

I am so sorry I haven't replied to each of your comments but I just want to say - from the bottom of my heart - thank you all so very, very much. Your advice and support is keeping me going at the moment. 
To be honest, I am feeling a little over whelmed by you all (this hysterectomy induced menopause has a lot to answer for!!!) and not for the first time I am reading your posts through tears - both happy and sad ones. Sad that so many of us have been through these tough times and happy that so many of you have come through the other side - and because of that I know we will. 

We are going abroad in a weeks time and I am hoping (maybe rather foolishly) that a change of scenery may sock him out of his rediculously early wake up routine (4.30 yesterday!!!)

Love to you all and thanks again xxxx


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## AoC (Oct 28, 2008)

I think it might do that, Flash - plus lots of fun holiday activity.    Here's hoping for you.

Flash, I was so terribly, terribly ashamed of not being happy once I'd got my 'happy ever after' that I didn't talk about it, even on here, until the challenging behaviours had pretty much stopped.  It meant that I missed out on so much support I didn't realise I could have had.

It makes me so happy to see people post that they are struggling - not because they're struggling!  But because they're posting, and that means we can hold their hand and help.  

Next time, I'll definitely post, and throw the shame in the dustbin.


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## aaa is a MUMMY (Oct 13, 2009)

Flash are u getting getting help with menopause?  Those were my darkest days trying to manage I know Hrt is frowned upon but try taking it off me and watch me explode. I truly think it's because we love our children at a deeper level because of the heart ache we have all suffered that we beat ourselves up more than we should. I really hope the holiday helps. Take care of yourself xx


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