# A couple of niggling questions to ask about IVF? (Mainly about Work & IVF)



## Scorpy (Oct 2, 2014)

Hi, Im currently working on coping strategies for my Depression etc with my employer - as knowing that if my infertility treatment continues (to fail) this is now impacting my ability to cope with my Depression so I am trying to help them to understand if my next step come Decembers consultation is IVF then how can work help me through this 

Apparently the guidance for my employer states any appointment 'times' for IVF will be classed as special leave - great, although that doesn't include the travelling there etc and would expect me straight back in work afterwards etc. I already work 1/half hours away from home so ontop of the travelling for treatment really this isn't going to work.
But what I am concerned about is the fact they also state 'appointments for IVF should be made outside of working hours where possible' - as far as I gather during the actual process - surely this isn't possible? Aren't you called in almost on a last minute/as and when basis? and at times therefore that you won't be able to manipulate? 
Does anyone know any other impacts of IVF on working full time? 
If anyone could give me any advice on the impacts of this treatment I would be grateful - Ive read the main post on here which was really helpful.
Just reading about the law and IVF as opposed to the law and pregnancy - is disgusting that it is not treated the same and also the fact that both partners will want to be present at appointments yet this seems to be difficult to do without using your leave or unpaid leave 

How has everyone else's employer been? (note mine is a very large organisation)

My other niggling question is:
What if the Dr... is a man! - I bet no one else is bothered about this but me right!?   But I am and no I won't get used to the idea, is there anyway to stipulate females only??  

Also; what IS the actual process of the egg collection/transfer? i.e. 'how' do they perform this?

Thanks for any help


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## Flips (Jul 12, 2012)

I had very little control over when my IVF appointments were - I asked for appointments as early in the day as possible but I think this has only worked twice (My clinic is 25 miles from home in on direction, work 20 miles from home in the other direction!). The worst appointment was at 1.30 in the afternoon - I came into work an hour early and took work home with me to do after the appointment.

My boss was really good about it - I came in early and worked over lunch to make some of the time up, but there's no way I made all of it up - my employer is very small and has no IVF policy.

For egg collection and embryo transfer I chose to take the time as annual leave - for my fresh cycle I took 5 days - collection day to day after transfer (there was a weekend in there too) and for my frozen transfer recently I took 2 days leave - transfer was on the Friday and I took the Friday and Monday off. I'm not sure how my boss would have reacted if I'd asked for the time off not as AL - they are medical procedures, but I felt more relaxed taking it as annual leave.

As for the Dr being a man - obviously this varies from clinic to clinic, but for consultations I've seen Drs (both male and female), scans during treatment have all been done by nurses (female), egg collection was a male Dr and both my transfers have been female Drs. Your best bet will be to raise your concerns with your clinic and see how they respond.

Egg collection and transfer - For collection I was sedated, an internal ultrasound probe is used and a needle inserted through the vaginal wall to reach the ovaries and aspirate the follicles. Embryo transfer - some clinics use ultrasound guidance, some don't - a speculum is used and a catheter inserted through the cervix with the embryo in it.


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## Lilly83 (Jan 19, 2012)

Hi Scorpy

My staff handbook has an extra section added due to me having had ivf 3 times, I work for a really big organisation

The official rules are 2 unpaid days off up to twice a year for ivf appts, I presume you would use them for EC and ET

As for appointments a few days into stimms you would be expected to go every other day usually very early morning, I was done for 9.30 so I just went to work and worked through lunch and/or stayed late, I went to work the day after both EC and ET but I chose to use holidays for those as I didn't want to lose the pay, as it happened they offered to pay me 2 weeks extra leave to be off as they know in 7 years with them I have never been off sick so they did that extra for me (I chose not to take it)

As for DP as nice as it would be to have them there at every appointment the impact can be huge and if your treatment is sucessful I feel its best your partner saves his 'favours' from work for when you have the baby

My DP just comes to ET and EC its pointless him missing time at work just to sit in the waiting room for me to have a blood test, that's my opinion anyway  x


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## Flips (Jul 12, 2012)

Like Lilly, my husband only came to EC and ET (and consultant's appointments made for both of us) - scans and blood tests etc. I went to on my own. I sometimes found it hard when everyone else in the waiting room had their partners with them, but at the same point there was no point him taking time off work. For EC and ET he used annual leave.

I only had 2 appointments during stimms, and one during DR, so it wasn't too bad. Other clinics monitor you more closely though.


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## Lilly83 (Jan 19, 2012)

I was the same at my injection teach a lot had partners with them but you have to think of the impact on both employers I don't think its fair when you might be having multiple ivfs, pregnancy and a child (hopefully!)

I think use your time wisely, he will want to save holidays for further down the line x


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## Dory10 (Aug 6, 2013)

Hi

I work in a school so a little different as I am unable to choose when to have my annual leave.  For the last 2 cycles I just said I had medical appointments or took time off sick.  My GP was very good and signed me off after ET.  I would be entitled to no time off at all for anything IVF related if I didn't take it as sick.

My DH just came to the consent signing appointment and scans that fell on weekends or flexitime days plus EC and ET day - he said it was for a medical appointment and they were fine with that.  After our first cycle and our mc he spoke to his boss about why the loss had hit us so hard and explained about the IVF, his boss then said that he could take as much time as he needed for anything IVF related even if only to support me and just to make the time up when he could.  

Good luck

Dory
xxx


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## melbg (Jun 10, 2012)

Hi 
I also work for a large organisation. How do your work handle general hospital appts? We get the time given to us including travel so when having fertility treatments they couldn't discriminate as to the reason why as my appt card said I was at the hospital.

We also have an ivf policy giving 5 days special leave per year, I didn't use this though as was worried about keep using sick when I might have needed another cycle if the fet hadn't worked

My dh wasn't given any time off at all, so for his necessary appts he had to take unpaid leave as it was short notice.

Mel
X


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## LuluLimon (Jan 17, 2014)

My work has a special assisted conception leave which covers all appts and a full day for EC and ET per cycle. It is a charity whose main aim is plañned parenthood- however I chose to leave a much higher paid city job as I needed the time and space to do ivf. I am quite lucky, but I was open at the interview stage and they were fine to support it.
DP was fortunate to have an understanding boss who allowed time off for initial consultation, EC and ET- but he took work home on those days.

I strongly feel there should be a generic policy as part of emp!oyment law. I seem to remember a post about a petition for this earlier in the year that was posted.


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## Cloudy (Jan 26, 2012)

For our initial consultation we both booked half days holiday, and booked the appointment as late in the day as we could.

For injection teach and pre-treatment scan they did them at the same time in a morning - we both booked a morning off work.

For the scans during stims your partner doesn't need to attend as they are all over in 5 minutes. These can be booked really early at my clinic, but I had to book a morning off work for one of them.

I had to take time off for EC as sick - but I got OHSS so was actually off work poorly anyway. For my FET I used holiday time off for ET. My husband had to use holiday leave for EC and ET.

My GP signed me off sick for my first two 2ww, my most recent one I didn't feel as worried and carried on working (other than having a few holidays off work)

I have always found the nurses doing the scan being female. For EC the anaesthesiologist was male, but I haven't ever met a female one, but then they don't stand at the business end  

My employer has no IVF policy. We do have a "Special Leave" policy for unpaid leave but my request was denied  

Good luck x


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## Scorpy (Oct 2, 2014)

Wow it does seem to differ with individual policies.
Cloudy - did they give a reason why special leave was refused?
Ive been reading about the law this morning - apparently for 4 weeks after 'transfer' you are covered under pregnancy employment policies. Refusal for special leave can be investigated as gender discrimination but it was unclear as to how you'd actually prove this. I just can't believe its not featured more in the law.

It seems like most of you were able to manage the first stages by just working around your appointments/flexibility - but with my office location being so far away etc I know this isn't going to be possible/easy so I'm interested to find out what they suggest. It would also be a struggle getting there without my husband as I haven't driven for years - we only have one car and he works an hour away in the other direction to me, so him coming with me is probably more than likely going to be our choice but he does work for the same place I do so the same policies.
I have x2 conditions which have legally been classed as disabilities for me and my sick record isn't great because one of them certainly means I have to have frequent absences from work


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## Lilly83 (Jan 19, 2012)

I didn't know that about legally being classed as pregnant, surely it must be for 2 weeks though and not 4? There's no appointments during 2ww anyway Scorpy so you wouldn't need to attend medical appts however some ladies take holiday so they can rest, and some I believe get signed off for 2 weeks sick , I have never claimed sick leave before even after my first lap I went back after 3 days hol but that's personal choice as I'm the manager where I am so I was keen to get back

Have you got all your holidays left to take? Maybe you can use that rather than sick leave? Or were you planning on sick leave? 

L x


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## Cloudy (Jan 26, 2012)

It was refused on the grounds that they saw it that I was either fit for work or unfit for work, and if I was unfit then a GP should sign me off. Though to be honest it wasnt a problem as GPs have always been willing to sign me off for IVF.

I honestly wouldn't worry about it honey, from what you have said I think the best way around it may be to book the days off as holiday. For your consultation, teach, and maybe a pre-treatment scan that's 3 days - or 1 and a half days if you can do half days.

For stims you often don't have a scan until day 6, and maybe only one or two more before EC, and then with a day off for ET too that's another 5 days - or 3 and a half days.

At the worst that's 9 days holiday - but even then you can self-cert for 5 days sick to cover EC and ET so you might not need that much time.

Try not to get too stressed about the nitty gritty details at this stage honey because it can be really hard: honestly the only way I have got through 3 treatment cycles is by taking each day as it comes. I completely understand you need to plan given your circumstances, but maybe accepting that you will need to use a combination of holiday and sick leave, will be better for you. With regards to your employer, you will be able to advise them better once you know the treatment protocol (e.g. Short/long etc)

Xxx


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## Scorpy (Oct 2, 2014)

I know its just so scary with jobs not really being 'safe' anymore, Ive had to fight for my job before and it wasn't nice. My employer is seen to be all encouraging of helping staff to balance work and personal lives - but if you have 'too much' personal stuff going on you can quickly see their attitude change 

Lilly83 - I know what you mean about the 2ww opposed to 4 weeks, it states;

A woman undergoing IVF treatment should be regarded as "pregnant" when in vitro fertilised eggs are transferred into her uterus.
However, a woman will in addition be protected under sex discrimination legislation during the very short period following the laboratory fertilisation of the eggs and the implantation into the uterus - usually 4-6 days.

Employers should therefore be alert to the special protection afforded to women undergoing that particular stage of IVF treatment after the ova have been fertilised but before implantation into the uterus. Following implantation the woman is regarded as being pregnant. If the treatment is successful and the woman remains pregnant she will remain protected until the end of her maternity leave.

*If the treatment is unsuccessful*, the woman's protection will end *two weeks after* the end of the pregnancy. As a pregnancy test is taken two weeks after the implantation of an embryo, the woman will have special protection for those two weeks and, if the pregnancy test is negative, for a further two weeks from that time.

So I can't quite figure that out is it saying 4 weeks in total or just the 2 weeks?


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## CrazyHorse (May 8, 2014)

4 weeks in total.


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## Dory10 (Aug 6, 2013)

Scorpy - It would be for 4 weeks so allowing time for you to be protected if you want some extra time off to get your head around it all.  It is the same after a miscarriage you are still protected for the time you are absent from work as long as the reason is given on a GP's sick note or self certificate.

Good luck

Dory
xxx


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