# 5 BFN's in a row - is there any point trying again?



## Claire223 (Jul 24, 2009)

Hi Ladies,

I've had 5 BFN's in a row....... is there any point in trying again?

Claire
x x x


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## poodlelover (Sep 3, 2009)

Claire
Have sent you   on another thread but you can't have too many.

Just to say DON'T GIVE UP!! I too have had 5 BFNs so I do understand how cr*p it is. I am leaving no stone unturned and am about to begin my 6th cycle~ at a new clinic with a different approach. It ain't over til it's over and all that.
Go to your review (which clinic are you at?), see what they say and then decide where to go/what to do next. Are they giving you any specific reasons?? 
Keep in touch. Take it a day at a time and take care of yourself. 

PL x


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## livity k (May 19, 2009)

Big hugs   - it is a horrible day isn't it
definitely worth keeping going especially as 3 bfns were from IUI which is much lower chances of success, 

Ask your  clinic if they will do any tests to see if they can change anything- e,g, immune tests, 

We've had one fresh and 2 frozen cycles BFN and next time ( last frostie) I will be taking steroids as tests showed my immune system was a bit overactive, 

Keep hoping,   

K x


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## karenanna (Dec 27, 2008)

Hi Claire, PL and Livity K - sending you  as I know how difficult this can be.

I just thought I'd post to try and give you all some inspiration - I got my first ever  a couple of days ago on the 5th attempt and have an HCG of 336 - I know it is early days, but I have never reached a test date before.

I also cycled with a Lady (posts on here as Grons) who recently got her BFP on the 6th attempt. So don't give up hope 

*What did I do differently this time?*

First of all - I changed clinics - to the ARGC, they have been brilliant and I can't fault them on their thorough approach.

Every single bit of the treatment is tailored to you - daily/twice daily bloods whilst stimming and different mixtures of drugs.

I had my full immunes done (had stage 1 at the previous clinic and no problems) but Chicago tests picked up high CD3 count and my Natural Killer assay went up whilst I was stimming.

I have been on Clexane, 75mg aspirin, dextamethasone (steroid whilst stimming), prednisolone (after ET), Gestone and Ritodrine - I am a bit like a pin cushion and have lovely bruises to show for it, but don't care! Ritodrine is to stop uterine contractions during the 2ww and I think that and the gestone helped with the early bleeding in the 2ww.

They also picked up that whilst my progesterone was OK at ET it dropped 2 days afterwards and that was when I switched from cyclogest to gestone - so the monitoring really works.

I also got signed off work for the whole process - my GP was great!

I have been having acupuncture for 6 months and also had it both pre and post ET.

I hope you find this useful and there really is hope - stay positive - 2010 is our year!

You may also find Angelbumps fertility protocol helpful - link attached - http://www.fertilityfriends.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=226042.0

Karenanna


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## poodlelover (Sep 3, 2009)

Congrats K!! That is fab news!!   

Interesting to see you were monitored after ET . I kept asking for this @ Nurture on my 3rd, 4th and 5th tx but they kept saying there was no point as it wouldn't show anything. I told them I could feel my hormone levels dropping after ET and they just told me to keep taking the pessaries (cyclogest) and looked at me like I was  . Needless to say I had 4 BFNs and one mc. Now @ CARE and am hoping they will do more monitoring. Never heard of Ritodrine though and wasn't aware this was an option. I did know other clinics gave more pessaries but Nurture said I was already taking max strength ( altho since found out could've increased to 4 rather than 2 per day). Why did they decide to give you this??

Sorry for being a nosey parker. Big CONGRATS  and  again.
PL x


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## karenanna (Dec 27, 2008)

Hi PL

The ARGC have a theory that contractions in the uterus can stop the embryo implanting - they therefore give you the Ritrodine that is a muscle relaxant to try and stop contractions and the embryo being rejected (I think?).

I was switched from Cyclogest pessaries to Gestone injections when my progesterone started to drop - I think a key thing for me was that I had never reached a test date before and that is why they monitored me - if I was you I would insist on this, after all it only costs a little extra money for the blood tests.

Have you had your immunes tested? the full Chicago tests - I would definitely recommend this.

Karenanna

PS Don't mind the questions


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## mariabelfast (Nov 2, 2009)

Dont give up Claire. i too had 5 bfns but tested bfp this morning. The big difference was that i was put on the antagonist drug protocol which resulted in 9 eggs at ec as opposed to 0 in the previous attempt. Ask your clinic about changing protocol
Good luck on your next step


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## BraveGirl (Mar 30, 2010)

claire I would suggest that you get the chicago tests.  I have had 1 miscarriage and 3 BFNs and am getting them done.

You need an immunology friendly clinic and then when they know what is wrong they can treat with a variety of drugs.  Dont throw more money at IVF without checking this out.

Also buy Dr Beers is your body baby friendly book? which is all about immune issues.

good luck x


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## catmadblonde (Feb 2, 2005)

Hi clare,

So sorry, i know how you feel. I have had 6 attempts and all failed. My clinic suggested immunolgy testing, but i cannot afford it as its very expensive.
We have decided to have a break from ivf for a year or so. I think time is running out for me as im 36 now and may have to face up to the fact that im fighting a losing battle.

Give yourself sometime and do your normal everyday things to make you feel better and then you may see things more clearly on what to do next.

love nd hugs xx


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## Mistletoe (Holly) (Jan 1, 2007)

There is medical evidence that trying at least 3 times with IVF is worth doing - I believe that the NHS recommends 6 IUI and 3 IVF cycles in the NICE guidelines. After that there may be some evidence that up to 6 full IVF cycles is worth doing, but the numbers are small as not many people do this many to get the numbers. They have either been successful by then or have given up.
If there is an average 30% chance of an IVF cycle being successful then statistically you might be in the ones that get a live birth after 1 go, 2 gos, 3 gos or 4 goes. Like throwing the dice.

I would say that your individual response to the drugs also needs to be taken into account when assessing individual chances. If you are a poor responder, then maybe you need a different approach or protocol.

I am a pharmacist - and the use of ritodrine is an interesting one. Ritodrine is licensed for stopping premature labour. It is a beta 2 agonist - rather like the blue inhaler people use for asthma containing salbutamol. In fact injectable forms of this drug can also be used for prem labour. It works on uterine muscle in the same way as it works on the smooth muscle of the lung in asthma, to relax it.

I have done IVF (BFP) and FET (BFN). In my first cycle I had cramps and a spontaneous sleeping orgasm (TMI - but apparently very common) and got a BFP.
My FET I had cramps and a BFN. I wonder if the uterine contractions do or don't make a difference?

"Please note, Fertility Friends does not endorse any type of self medication/DIY drugs administering . We ask you to seek advice from you GP/clinic on any aspects when self administering drugs of this nature without professional medical supervision/approval"

Who suggested anyone self medicates? I am a pharmacist and would never do that - both ritodrine and salbutamol are only available on prescription therefore their use would have to be supervised by a doctor. It is just simply interesting that some doctors at some clinics are suggesting these medications and I was explaining how there might be a rationale based on the mechanism of action. If people want to try them to see if they work then they have to discuss it with their doctor and obtain a prescription if it is agreed.


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## flomc (Aug 17, 2009)

am soo sorry. have just have 3rd ivf BFN. Have also had 1 frozen BFN and 3 IUI BFN. Totally understand how you are feeling. thoughts are with you xx


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## beachgirl (Jun 7, 2007)

Flomc    sorry to hear that, it's very hard isn't it trying to deal with so much disappointment


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## Nordickat (Feb 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry flomc. I know how you feel, give yourself some time to recover and one day you'll feel string enough again to find the right way forward for you and your dh.
 katxxx


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