# Back on the rollercoaster - brought my sickbags this time though...



## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Hiya!
After 'lurking' for a bit, I decided I really ought to join as we're about to start a new chapter of our fertility journey. I chose fertility friends because whenever I google ANYTHING fertility-related there are ALWAYS loads of results from the site and I always found useful information here.
Anyway, a bit about me and my hubby (prepare to be bored!)...
We started TTC in 2008. I'd had an IUD for a couple of years as I'm allergic to latex, DH is allergic to the non-latex substitute, hormonal contraception methods make my blood pressure go sky high, except the depo injection, which makes me put on, oh, about 20 million kilos and stops my periods altogether which I don't like. I mean, I HATE my periods, but it just feels wrong to not have any at all (not to mention a bum the size of Russia...) So out came my old-style copper coil and at it we went...
Because I'm a control freak, I'd bought a whole load of OPKs and it didn't take me long to notice something a bit strange. I have a 28 day cycle you can set your watch by, and I got all the fertile signs - clear mucus, high, soft cervix, the lot - around day 14-15...but no positive OPK. Not until about day 22-23, when there was a sort of possible positive, but all the kits say it's a definte line and mine weren't. Then my period would turn up, schedule, on day 29. This happened for six months, so I went to my GP.
My GP said, "You're trying too hard, what you're suggesting can't be happening, just go away - oh, and, btw, lose some weight because that's probably why you're not getting pregnant."
Three more months of trying, of emotional ups and downs every month, during which time three more friends got pregnant, I went back, armed with my charts, my results and some relevant passages from books. I managed to persuade the sceptical GP we saw to do a day 21 progesterone test. Now, bearing in mind that on day 21 of my cycle I had usually only just ovulated, or hadn't yet, according to my OPKs, I wasn't expecting normal results.
They weren't normal. I had two in the end - one was 13, one 14, both 'equivocal for ovulation'. On the back of this, we were referred to our local fertility service.
It took six months to get an appointment. We went along only to discover that they wanted to repeat all the tests, despite me showing them my charts (which were ignored) and telling them what we'd observed and the test reults we'd had (which were dismissed). Apparently, OPKs "are not reliable" - even though it transpires that we were using the same brand the clinic does...
I had several day 21 tests. All indicated the same thing the GP's had. I peed in a plastic pot once a week for eight weeks - when those results came back a little confusing, they simply said that maybe I hadn't done it right.
I'm a registered nurse. I found THAT professionally insulting.
So we started on the monitored cycles with the ultrasound. Three or four times a month, around mid-cycle, I would go in and allow myself to be violated with an ultrasound probe that felt like an air-cooled cricket bat. Every month I would produce beautiful follicles by around day 15....
...that would then fail to rupture. The first time, the follicle finally ruptured on day 22. They told me to ring in when my period started. I said, "Well, that will be next week then." 
"Oh no, if you've only just ovulated, it will be a couple of weeks." This despite the fact that I've NEVER had a cycle longer than 29 days. That cycle was 28 days. I phoned the clinic. I know they didn't believe me. I actually had to go in and have a blood test to establish that yes, I was menstruating. I was so cross I nearly took them a couple of used tampons...
A few more monitored cycles followed. I never released an egg before day 18. I never had a cycle longer than 28 days. It explained my dubious progesterone results - when my progesterone levels were taken seven days post egg release, usually only a couple of days before my period turned up, they were what would be expected. But my luteal phase was short - 8 days or less - so it was highly unlikely I'd conceive naturally. I started having triggered cycles with Pregnyl, injecting myself when the ultrasound indicated that my follicle was mature, and were I ovulating normally I was ready to release the ovum. These cycles gave normal progesterone results. Things were looking up!
No, they weren't. One thing that monitored cycles showed was that I have a 'lazy' ovary. I only ovulate on the right once every eight cycles or so. The left, however, appears to have been drinking Red Bull - on more than one cycle it released two eggs, meaning I have a greater chance of naturally conceiving twins (awesome...I think...)
I was concerned about this. My first HSG had indicated that my left tube may not be patent. But the consultant said, "Oh well, they're not very good at HSGs here - it's probably fine." So we kept going - but no joy. So he decided to repeat the HSG himself.
That HSG was the single most unpleasant experience of my life, and I've had a colonoscopy. After several dye injections and half an hour spent flopping about on the X-ray trolley like a beached whale - a nauseous beached whale with no knickers on and a tube shoved where the sun does not shine - the conclusion was reached that, yes, in fact, my left tube was completely and irretrievably blocked. So all those triggered cycles were wasted. I wasn't devastated - I was numb. Numb, and peed off.
So, at our next scheduled follow-up, it was excitedly announced that they'd 'discovered' what the problem was (fortunately, DH got a clean bill of reproductive health early on) - I don't ovulate when I should owing to a less-than-adequate LH surge and as a result, on natural cycles, my luteal phase is too short to allow implantation and my progesterone levels too low to maintain a pregnancy if I did by some miracle conceive. Plus, I have a blocked left tube and a lazy right ovary, so even if I do have the occasional 'normal' cycle, my chances of unassisted conception are infinitesimally small.
I burst into tears, but no one could understand why I was so angry until I pointed out that, apart from the tube issue, which was almost by-the-by, the GP and fertility clinic had spent over a year and a half piddling about to 'discover' something that _I'd been telling them all from the very beginning and all they had needed to do was confirm it..._
I remember actually begging them to remove my left ovary at one point, so that all my triggered cycles which gave normal hormonal levels and luteal phases, would present a reasonable chance of conception. They refused. I asked for tubal surgery to try to unblock the left tube. They refused - the low success rates, apparently, don't justify the cost. We'd need IVF.
The waiting list was two years. The weight limit is a BMI of 30 or less. You have to reach the weight limit before you can even go on the list and then maintain the weight loss. They weigh you regularly. If you go over the limit, you're off the list and you don't go back on until you're under the limit again. And you go back on _at the bottom of the list..._ 
This is in order to reduce the waiting list to achieve a government target. I know one woman who 'waited' for four years. I'd never been as light as they wanted me to be in my entire life. I got within 20kg of the target weight I'd have to achieve once - I was so exhausted and constantly ill with viruses and infections that my GP at the time told me I needed to gain back a bit of weight as it was clear that being that light was unhealthy for me. I'm a tall, broad, muscular person. I will NEVER be as light as they wanted me to be and if I did get there, I wouldn't be in the best of places, health-wise, to become pregnant or carry a baby. All this sunk in slowly.
I had a nervous breakdown a few weeks later.
Naturally, we took a step back from the whole process. I went to counselling, took antidepressants and slowly recovered. As a result of this, we decided to move to be closer to our families and the invaluable support they provide. One downside that we discovered is that IVF entitlement where we live now is even more woeful, and to be honest, neither of us can face jumping through the NHS' hoops any more. I'm still so angry at the way we were treated, ignored, dismissed, when we were right all along if anyone had cared to listen to us - and at all the wasted time. I think that hurts most.
So we've decided to go private. The clock is now ticking. I'm 34 this summer and we can't afford to wait any longer, fertility-wise. We've had a recommendation, done our research and chosen a clinic in Essex. I'm hopeful and nervous and so is my husband. We're getting our notes sent from our old clinic and although I know they will want to repeat some tests I know that nothing has changed - my charts and OPK results are the same and I'm STILL not pregnant - so I'm hoping that being self-funding will give us a little more control over the process. We're also stronger now and we want this so badly, but we've also come to terms with the possibility that we may not have children and we know that there IS life beyond infertility.
Good luck to everyone who is trying!


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## Betty-Boo (Oct 14, 2007)

and welcome to Fertility Friends   

FF is a lifeline for everyone and anyone, seeking support, information and lasting friendship whilst going through fertility issues. FF members are fantastic listeners when when family, friends, doctors and sometimes even partners just don't "get" what you're going through and feeling.

I've included some forum boards that may help answer some of your questions   
Have a look round the site and if you get a little stuck with the navigation side of things - please ask and we'll do our best to guide you.

*Cycle Buddies ~ *Click Here

*Diagnosis ~ *Click Here

*Fertility Investigations ~ *Click Here

*What Every New Member Needs To Know (includes a list of common abbreviations) ~ *   CLICK HERE

*FERTILITY INFO GUIDES ~ *CLICK HERE

You can also "meet" and chat with people in your local area through the *Location boards*. This is especially useful to find people who may be using the same clinic and or in the same PCT area. CLICK HERE

FF's chat room is a fabulous place to 'meet' and chat with others. Our newbie chat is every Wednesday. A great chance to meet other new members and find out a little more about how the site works: 
*Newbie chat ~ *Click Here

All the best - our paths may cross again in other areas of the site.

Good luck,

  

Tis xx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Ta for the welcome! Tbh, it just felt good to write it all down, once I got started I just couldn't stop  
I have to say though, this time even just a year ago I couldn't have done it - and if I had I wouldn't have been able to inject any humour, even if what's there is a little black. So it's an improvement...sort of...I just wish my experiences weren't so depressingly common among those who have to have fertility treatment.
Fingers crossed!


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## Goldielocks80 (Feb 26, 2013)

Oh my goodness what a story you have! I'm almost speechless 

I'm so sorry to hear that you've had such a rough ride (that's an understatement!) it sounds like you have great support from your DH and your family now you're closer. I desperately hope going privately works for you- soon!

We had 1st NHS appointment few weeks back and to be honest it wasn't a great experience really- knew I wouldn't walk out pregnant but had hoped to walk out at least feeling well informed and optimistic...i really didn't. The doctor sat with his back to us asking quesipns whilst filling out a computer assessment, felt cold and impersonal. Like you I'm a nurse - I Hope I never make my patients feel Like that   I've always believed as a nurse that patients (in this case us!) know their bodies far better than anyone else ever will so why don't they listen to us?!! 

We're waiting for few more tests then tube assessment. Am at the start of a very long journey!

Truly hope that all works out for you and the next clinic have the common sense to listen to you!

Take care and lots of positive thoughts coming your way


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Thanks for your kind words - I hope things get better for you too. Don't be afraid to stand up for yourself - I wish I had done so a bit more but the whole process was so emotionally draining that I just couldn't. It's just so frustrating. I worked in renal medicine for ages and we always listened to what our patients told us about their bodies and their symptoms and I just felt like our concerns were dismissed over and over again when if just one person had listened to us we could have saved ourselves and the clinic a lot of time AND a lot of money!
The only reason we're going private is because we just can't face being caught in the NHS machine again. We'd be eligible (I'd have to lose some weight, but we already know we'd qualify for funding from our local trust) but the thought of waiting weeks and weeks for every step is just too much for us to take any more. It's heart-rending enough as it is without feeling like time is slipping away. So we've saved up and our families are helping out so private it is! The clinic we've chosen also offers free IVF if you donate some of your eggs and I am more than happy to do that if it means we can perhaps have more tries than we can afford to pay for. Plus, even if things don't work out for us, I may be able to help someone else achieve their dream.
Good luck, thanks for stopping by!


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## Goldielocks80 (Feb 26, 2013)

That's really great and you sound
Much more positive   I suspect we'll be going down the same route as you- as currently the asked to see us again with more results in 2 months when the earliest try can fit us in is 4months! As you say every week and month that goes by is such a waste!

Wishing you lots and lots of good luck - fingers crossed!

Keep in touch x


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## yogabunny (Sep 12, 2012)

Hi Ruth, 
I just wanted to say that you are not alone, I can relate to your post in many ways. Like you I had to push to be heard. Sorry to hear what you have been put through. That has been the hardest thing for me, being ignored when you know there is a problem, for years.... I asked for a private referral in the end, got referred back for a lap and we got the answers. Otherwise I have no doubt we would would be on clomid, or IUI despite blocked tubes !! I also find it hard, as sometimes I can see that I am being put into the "stereo typical fertility challenged/IVF crazy lady". But actually I am just a normal human being not being listened to.

I have faced the same frustrations again when started bleeding after this long awaited BFP, to be told that blood tests for progesterone and hcg not in the NHS guidelines... well next time I will pay for them, but this time i was finding it hard anyway, without having to research what i should do for myself and then fight for it. If they tell us it was just bad luck and we have to go through this again until we have 3 miscarriages I'm not sure how patient I can be, there are a few things in my history that need looking at. Seems crazy not to be a little proactive to understand what is going on better, it would surely save some IVF funding in the long term. I am hoping my follow up appointment is going to prove me wrong.

rant over! Sounds like you are in a good place now, close to the support you need and with a good clinic that will not make you jump through hoops, and should have the time to treat you as an individual. I have found this forum an amazing source of information that has really helped. I wish I had found it earlier on. Lots of luck to you, hope that you can have an easier ride from now on to your dream come true xxx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

It's so frustrating to hear stories of people who are dismissed when they raise their concerns. Believe it or not, all health care professionals are taught, almost from day one, that the patient knows their own body best! Yes there are textbooks, but human beings are all individual and what's in the book is just what is experienced by MOST people - all symptoms and conditions are experienced on a spectrum so there will always be people who don't 'fit' into neat little diagnostic boxes. 
You're right, you are made to feel like you're being unreasonable, you can practically sense the eye rolls when you say, "I did some research..." and the most annoying thing is when people say, "You're trying too hard," or "You shouldn't be stressing yourself out like this, it won't help." No, what will stress me out is being ignored when I KNOW I'm right! Thing is, I know that whichever clinic we choose (we think we've chosen, but we're keeping our options open and 'trialling' two) they're going to end up hating us - me in particular - and thinking we're the patients from hell because I will not be standing for any BS this time. I'm planning to make that clear from the beginning. The first time round was such an up and down experience but it's an ill wind that blows no good and I know it made us stronger. We're in a much better place now to try again, we're ready for what's to come but we're also well on the way to coming to terms with the possibility of failure. Since we stepped back a couple of years ago, we haven't been 'trying' specifically or even really thinking about children. It was so hard at first but now I know that although we would be very upset and need time to recover if it did all come to nothing, we would be able to get through it and go on with our lives. I suspect we'd end up with a few more dogs...
It's nice to be able to talk to people who 'get it'. I was talking to one of DH's colleagues at his Christmas do, she'd asked about family plans and I was explaining that we'd been TTC for a while and it may be that we'd need assistance and that it had been quite a difficult time and she said, "Oh yes, I know exactly how you feel. It took me three months to conceive our first and I was beginning to think it would never happen, so I understand how you must feel." I was pretty speechless! Of course, I didn't say anything - but I don't often open up to people who don't already know any more. It's not something you understand unless you've experienced it, I don't think. I know she was just trying to be sympathetic - but sheesh!
Love and hugs x


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## yogabunny (Sep 12, 2012)

hi ruth, it must be frustrating to hear these stories as a health professional, i hope you find the right clinic that clicks for you.... as for comments, we have been very selective about who we have told, but i am ready to be more open, as it is getting more of a burden, and harder to explain behaviour like going into hiding! and i'd like the support.... but those kind of comments, which come from a good place i know, are difficult to deal with and do make me less confident about telling the world! xx


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## Bemy (Mar 2, 2013)

Hi Ruth.

Gosh your story is so sad and I am really glad you're feeling positive but I just want to give a tiny bit of advice. You will still have to do a bit of waiting. It sucks so much but even privately (we don't get NHS as DH has son from previous marriage even though we have male factor n I've never been pregnant) there is a heck of a lot of waiting involved in this rollercoaster. .

We waited 3 months for SSR, I am now waiting another 5 weeks until I can have my appointment to take part in the egg sharing program (which I presume is what you mean by sharing half your eggs), once all test are done I have to wait 4 weeks for the results. Then you have to be matched with your recipient - which can take up to 2 months. Then you have to get your cycle in line with the recipients. I don't want to be doom and gloom but I want you to prepared there is still a lot of waiting if you choose to egg share.

Wishing you all the best and please just prepare yourself, I got told about my 5 week wait on Wednesday and I was totally gutted and in tears. But no body has told me I can't go through with my cycle its just I have to wait, the time will go quickly I hope and although I thought I'd be cycling by June I just have to be more realistic about my expectations and time frame.

Beth xx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Thanks Beth!It's nice to hear from someone else who's gone private, the only people we know had their treatment a few years back and things have changed since then.
I knew that things wouldn't happen straight away but honestly, it's going to be warp speed compared with last time. At least the waiting is to do with the treatment and things are _happening_ - you're not just hanging around on a waiting list because there isn't enough time or money to see people in a reasonable time frame!I don't mind waiting a couple of months for an appointment - it's better than 8-9 which is how long we waited after referral for our first consultation, followed by another couple of months before they could fit us in to do tests. It's that hanging around that we can't abide. And waiting for things to be optimal is fine, even if it's frustrating and even if we're 'waiting' for someone else - it's waiting for a purpose not just hanging about until it's our turn while time and cycles tick away. 
The whole rule about excluding people if there are children from a previous relationship is such a load of unfair BS. We have friends who are TTC and may have to have IVF. The guy has a daughter with an ex, the little girl is seven and was born when they were both teenagers. He sees her once a month for two days, she lives at the other end of the country and never stays with them because her mother objects to (direct quote) "another woman trying to play mummy". She claims it's 'confusing' for her daughter, so he travels down and stays there for visits. So his wife never has any contact with the child and is in no sense a 'parent' and yet because of this previous child she is denied IVF on the NHS (the problem is hers, it seems). They have argued their case, provided documented proof that the little girl plays no part in their life as a couple, but nada. At one point they were going to try to challenge it legally but decided the money would be better spent on a really top notch private clinic if it comes to that. I really feel for you and I think it's the one rule we should really concentrate on trying to overturn through campaigning. Good luck to you - I have all my extremities almost permanently crossed for everyone I meet who's going through the same stuff!


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## Bemy (Mar 2, 2013)

We never even tried any further than GP with the NHS so I didn't realise it was quite so bad. Your poor friend too, its a joke, I'm not my ss mum, love him to bits but I'm not his mum. I love being his life. Your friends SD's mum sounds like a crank, more confusing for the child to have daddy stay over just once in a while - what family basis is that? Some people are just weird and the child is never the person they are thinking about in such bizarre decisions!

Anyway ex's rant aside.

Your reply has made me feel that my 5 weeks is not that long and its true I am going to have treatment at some point, just hope I get accepted as a donor as financially it'd be the only way we can afford it plus we both really want to help someone else too as if DH's op hadn't worked we would have considered donor sperm. 

Anyway welcome to the IF rollercoaster. I'm not going to lie, it sucks and is exceptionally horrible even when you've got the chance of treatment. But we're all here to help each other and someone usually has an answer for any question or has been through some similar situation or emotion, so you are definitely not alone. Which is great when the 'crazy lady' moments happen - and they do frequently.

God bless sweetie xxx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Ohhhh man, tell me about 'crazy lady moments'!
When we were waiting for our first appointment, trying like crazy because we were constantly being told, "It'll happen eventually," "There's probably nothing wrong - it's all in your head, don't stress so much," and my personal favourite, "You're just trying too hard," (eh? what? HOW can you try TOO HARD? Never understood that...) the ward where I worked (which like most wards is at least 75% female staff) had a baby boom. Nine staff went off on mat leave. 
NINE.
And my heart broke every time. I would keep myself together until break time then go and cry hysterically in the toilets for a few minutes - only a few minutes so there was time for my face to stop being red before I went back. There was one girl who got pregnant when I first started there, had the baby, went on mat leave, came back just as we were being referred to the fertility service, and then got pregant again and I swear to God (I'm not proud of this) I hated her for a bit. I kept thinking, "But it's MY turn! How dare you take MY TURN!"
It gets worse. 
When the seventh and eighth pregnancies were announced, someone said, "These things come in threes." I was so screwed up bv then I kept thinking, this is it, it's the third set of three, it has to be me this time. That month I got myself so convinced I was pregnant. Of course, I wasn't, and then one of my other colleagues announced that she was, on the day my period turned up, and I actually had to go home because I just couldn't cope. It's the only time I've ever pulled a sicky - I told them I had a migraine. Thing is, I reckon the nurse in charge knew exactly what was going on but it was a quiet day and she was a lovely lady, she didn't even question it and she phoned me later to see how I was doing. I also stopped speaking to my best friend for a bit when she got pregnant because I just couldn't even look at her without wanting to cry. I know it sounds irrational - it IS totally irrational - but I kept thinking, "How could she get pregnant? How COULD she? How could she DO that to me?" She was so understanding though and we're still besties, thank goodness she's a better person than I am! That's what made me finally go and see the counsellor, I just couldn't stand feeling these things any more. I mean, I'm not condoning it or saying it's right, but you start to understand how a woman can 'steal' a baby, how she reaches that point and what drives her to it.
The depth of those feelings is astonishing, it's so primal - we intellectualise reproduction and pretend it's a 'choice', and it is - until that 'choice' is taken away and all of a sudden all these basic and powerful emotions rise up and swamp you. I think that's why it's so hard to explain it to people who haven't been through it, why you can't just get over it or accept it - it's beyond rationality and you just have to learn to understand and control it and it takes time!
I'm back to normal now- well, almost, and for a given value of 'normal' - so you're safe, honest...;-)


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## Hevlaw (Apr 4, 2013)

Hi,
I'm so sorry to hear your story and I really hope that this time brings you some luck.  We were lucky with our NHS referral for our first IVF.  I had to loose some weight, but luckily it was only a couple of stone and I literally got to BMI of 30 and they referred me.  I was lucky that I chose a clinic nearest to us (in my naivety I didn't look at success rates, just distance!) and was amazed at how quickly we got in.  It turned out they were a fairly new clinic and so didn't have loads of statistics making them look not as successful.  Anyway, we were sooooo lucky and our son was conceived after our first cycle of IVF with donor sperm.
When we went back for our consultation for a sibling, I spoke to the consultant about my weight as I'd put on a it - my BMI was about 33. He said it doesn't really affect the success of IVF, that the nhs use it to reduce their waiting lists and that a new piece of research was published early 2012 stating this.  But, he said to me 'you're a midwife, you know the risks of being 'obese' and being pregnant, and this research didn't talk about that'. I managed to loose a few pounds to get me to the same weight I was with my son's IVF cycle but sadly it didn't work.  I then went on do to another cycle immediately and that also didn't work.  I have weighed myself today and I have out on a stone over the last few months and so now am loosing weight before doing another cycle - probably because this will be our last chance and I feel this is all I can do.
My main reason for responding to you, apart from to try and reassure you about the weight stuff, is that in terms of waiting lists is I guess you have to weigh up their success rates and popularity compared to waiting.  Our clinic can get me in for another cycle with about 4-6 weeks notice on my part.  They now have more stats and their success rates are about 2-4% less than the others nearer me.  For me, getting in quickly before I get even older is more important than a very slit lay higher success rate.
Also, I wanted to say that as a health professional too, I completely get where you are coming from.  Trying to care for others when we feel so low ourselves is hard.  I also feel shocked at how easily I get sucked into the 'you don't know what you're talking about' attitude - not so much from the staff at the clinic, but from friends and relatives....in January, I knew, just knew that the cycle hasn't worked, yet everyone told me to be positive, that I didn't know that etc etc.  when the test was negative, I felt like shouting at everyone 'see? See? I KNOW my body, and I knew that I wasn't pregnant'.  I'm telling women all the time to trusts their bodies and sometimes need to take a leaf out of my own book.  The whole process is so medical and 'baby-making' is out of our hands, we have no control (it feels) and so I think we easily loose our ability to trust our bodies.
Anyway, sorry, I feel I've rambled off on so many tangents there, I'm new to this site and its SO lovely to speak to people who understand!


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## Bemy (Mar 2, 2013)

Ruth: I know what you mean, DH's 2 best friends and partners who are our closest friends both announced they were pregnant one weekend and I too had the whole primal emotion, I just took myself to my room and wailed. I couldn't control it and it felt like my insides had been ripped away. I felt totally lost. 

I flew through the, 'How could they do this to us!" To the, "Why not us?!" Both couples knew we were struggling and I felt as if they'd betrayed me. All I could think about was how far along in their pregnancies they'd be when we did our first cycle and how could they expect me to even be happy for them or around them if I'd got a BFN! I was such an emotional wreck. Plus that week I was due on but AF wasn't turning up, I started to feel nauseous, boobs hurt etc. I was telling myself it was just AF being its usually random self but it got to 3 days late which is the latest I've been since early twenties and told myself when you're a week late you can test.

I was try not to but every day late I was I was just thinking, "Oh my goodness it could be us too, we could all be in the club at the same time." I was tempted to test but I was determined to wait. I woke on the 7th day and was biting the bullet to test - I hate them, the bfn just takes it out of me and I'm low for weeks. I prayed (I have faith and believe in God) saying that I really didn't want to do the test if it was going to be negative, so if I could come on before then I'd cope better. Still didn't feel like AF, so while DH was still sleeping I went to the top floor bathroom, in the bottom drawer of the cabinet is the only p test I have. 

I got it out and just looked at it. I hate the box, I hate the packaging as if the words and the clearblu happy colours on the box are there just to mock me. I read the instructions (not like I don't know them) to buy me some time. I really didn't want to do it. I thought I'll have a quick sit on the loo and just wipe not wee (too much info but you know, just explaining), just see if AF has turned up. So very glad I did. There she was.

Although I was gutted it was not half as bad as a BFN would've been. I suppose the BFN is so final, it's not just AF turning up and showing you, "sorry not this time lovely, try again next month I may not turn up." The BFN is just so desperately final, clinical and cold, "it's clearblu not you." Sucks. 

So the next time I pee on a stick will hopefully be 2weeks after my ET, whenever that will be and I'll cope with the consequences then. I'm so sorry but I have no idea where this reply is heading, I just wanted to say your not alone in convincing yourself that it worked this month, struggling with close friends being pregnant. It's all part of this. Especially when you don't know and you have no clear path as to where your journey is heading you gravitate to the negative thoughts as they're the only solid ones you have, as actually having a baby seems like the impossible. 

But let's just cling to the postitives in stead. We have a journey path opening up before us all and that will become clearer as we had along them. I'm hoping and praying we all get there and become mummies. Xxx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

Can I just say how lovely of it is for everyone to share their feelings so generously - I'm in tears of relief because I know it's not just me who has hated - I mean, really LOATHED - people I love for getting pregnant and feeling like it was a personal betrayal. You know, even when you're feeling it, that it's a stupid thing to think but you feel it anyway. I learnt that fighting it made it worse. I had to acknowledge the feelings and accept them in order to get past them. 'Primal' is the only word that defines it for me - and I know what you mean when you talk about wailing, I made a sound I didn't think I was capable of, sounded like a cow in a mangle but it came from waaaay down somewhere I have no control over.
It sounds weird but even when all the messages I was getting were negative, I actually enjoyed being in touch with my body on a really deep level. I can tell when I've ovulated, I know when I'm fertile - it's actually very empowering, if we can just get people to believe us when we say we know what is going on! I'm sure I'm not alone in actually hating my body too, for a bit, for letting me down and betraying me. I hated the teachers at school and my parents for telling me it was 'easy' to get pregnant when I was younger, I hated the fact that I'd used contraceptives for years when I needn't have done, I hated that I'd spent my most fertile years trying desperately NOT to get pregnant - I did a lot of hating but although I'm sometimes annoyed by stuff still I try not to let the negatives overwhelm me. I suppose it's all part of the grieving process. My counsellor told me that it's normal to feel that way - we're grieving for the assumption we'd just have kids easily. That woman saved my life!
Hevlaw - I'm going to have my various bits and pieces extra crossed for you honey! The clinic we are going to see (next Wednesday...ZOMG!) made my year when they told me their weight limit was BMI<_*35*_ because there's no convincing evidence it needs to be lower for success. I will still have to lose a little weight (my bum is enormous right now) but I feel that it's doable because I've done it before. Last time I was trying to lose weight for treatment I got down to 110kg reasonably easily and I only need to go down to 107kg from where I am now whereas before, even at 107kg I'd have had around another 15kg to go! We had a recommendation from friends for a clinic in Essex and they have good rates and they were lovely on the phone. I feel our luck may be better this time - so I will be sending lcuky thoughts your way xxx


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## Bemy (Mar 2, 2013)

Ladies I really hope you comfortably get your weight down and that it makes you feel really good about where you're going in your journeys. Just over a week Ruth and you'll have some more information and a next step in your road - I live for my next steps at the moment. 

Hev, how long are you giving yourself till your next cycle? Or a you just seeing how the weight goes and then deciding? DH and I have only got the finances for 3 cycles. Before we went for our consultation we decided to put a limit on how many tries we could do emotionally and financially - DH's previous relationship deteriated largely due to IF. We chose 3 tries and we were comfortable with that and ediffied when I ask the consultant how many cycles he'd recommend, he said, "if it hasn't worked by 3 its not likely to." 

I know that's not always the case - from reading lots of people's experience on here - but I'm glad he said it as it just confirmed our decision and made us feel a little bit better about it.

I know what you both mean about being in tune with your body, we've not even done the normal TTC, checking when I ovulate etc as we've always known there is no chance. But I know when I ovulate and I know when I'm most fertile, I think you just naturally listen to yourself more when you know there is a cycle that can be followed to get what you're desperate for.

Ha and you're right Ruth, this is supposed to be easy isn't it. But no-one tells you for some people it can be the most difficult thing they'll experience in their lives. The bloody liars. Tbh I didn't think about it massively other than: get married at 25, start having babies 26 then finish popping them out at 32. Ha ha ha. Well I didn't even meet the love of my life till I was 26 and he couldn't have any kids! Ha ha! The only person who gave me a bit of caution about falling for a man who wouldn't be able to have kids was my friend who was struggling to have her second child.

She told me, "you're fine now but just wait, something will just change, you'll settle and something I can't properly explain to you will kick in and you'll find this really difficult." At the time I was adamant that no, I was fine, I know what I'm doing, I'm accepting this and we'll adopt and have a family that way.

She was so right. Literally we got engaged and that was that. It was a new state of mind, longing, desire, primal force inside me that I just knew I wanted to be pregnant and extend our family.  The grief that came with this feeling because i knew it wasn't possible was overwhelming and even though i was preparing for my wedding and marriage it was just a constant. 

We were only engaged for 6 months and we decided just to box it off to get my fertility checked and get a review of DH's situation. I was fine but waiting for them to tell us what we already knew about DH to 10 months!!! A bit of a joke. And through that wait we looked into adoption and for some reason we never got past a phone call. When we finally got the letter from the urologist saying nothing had changed with DH (not his fault it took forever it was the SA team) he said to contact his private clinic for a consultation. We were too scared to go but the not knowing is a killer so we bit the bullet and paid the fee so we could be put out of our misery.

So glad we did as here we are, sperm and everything. Just can't wait to start, well I can wait for down reg as that's the bit I'm scared of most but the posibility of being a mum! Eek, I still am amazed I'm here and have those 3 chances. 

See I've completely rambled again. I'm just saying girls, be confident with yourselves and your weight loss, keep the focus on the positive. Everything is going in the right direction. 4 months ago I didn't even think this was a possibility, so anything can happen. Much love xxx


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## ruthhr (Apr 5, 2013)

We sort of arrived at a figure of three too. It feels right and like you it's for financial as much as emotional reasons. We can get the cash for two cycles ourselves if we're careful and makes some sacrifices (which will be TOTALLY worth it) and we're hoping to do an egg share to cover a third (it's free if you donate at the clinic we've chosen) but our parents, bless them forever, told us they'd help out if necessary. Which made me cry because it's so touching that they'd do that.
We have our initial consultation next week, then I will need to lose some weight but I'm NOT going to crash diet, so it may be two or three months before we could start treatment. But there's tests to do and some other things we can try before then while I'm losing weight. If we can get my right ovary to to be more active, then trigger ovulation so I release the egg properly there's a chance I could get pregnant. They sort of suggested clomid + pregnyl to trigger - it won't matter if I ovulate on both sides as the left tube is blocked anyway, but it will stimulate my right ovary to get in on the action! They might also do a more in depth investigation of my blockage and see if they can clear it, then I'd still need to trigger ovulation but again, it might be possible to conceive naturally. Hell, it feels good just to be doing something, being proactive again, we've taken a break from the whole thing for a couple of years and it's done us good but it's time to pick it up again.
I remember mentioning kids to DH once long before we married, and he said, "Oh, I won't want kids until I'm in my forties at the earliest." I had to tell him that he'd need to go out with a teenager then because by the time HE was in his forties, so would I be and that's too late to be starting to have babies if it's even still possible! And that if he didn't think he was ready for a kid, no one is EVER ready for a kid with special needs and the chances of that rises with the age of the parents...it was a bit of a revelation for him but as we fell more in love he became more and more keen on having kids. Then, of course, we found out it wasn't going to be that simple and it hit him very hard. I felt so guilty, I felt like because of me he'd gone from not really being bothered about having kids to really wanting them, then it had been snatched away - I felt like I was responsible for the hurt he felt for making him care and want kids. I know it's not like that now, of course, and although you hear about couples who are ripped apart by the process so far it's brought us closer together. Even if I can't have a baby, I still have him and having him and his love will make being childless bearable. I fell in love with HIM and married him because I love him, not because of the children we would have together and no matter what happens we'll still have each other. We've talked about it a lot and I know (thank goodness!) he feels the same. So we'll get through it together, no matter what. We haven't really talked about the possibility of adoption - one thing at a time, we'll cross that bridge if we come to it. Gawd that's so mushy! Sorry if you now have to go and puke...
I'm so glad to have met you ladies, thanks for making me feel welcome and don't worry about shooting off on tangents - if it needs to be said you need to say it! It's so nice to be talking with people who get it, such a relief to not feel alone


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## Goldielocks80 (Feb 26, 2013)

Hi ladies,

Just caught up on this thread tonight- reading your post Ruth especially about how you are surrounded by pregnancy at work, I can totally relate to that!! I'm surrounded at work at the moment - it's so hard to keep painting on a smile whilst viewing the latest scan pictures! One of my girls (who knows what I'm going through) said they hadn't even been really trying   then followed it up with "it's your turn next!!". Wanted to shout "It should be my turn NOW!!!". The other mum to be (1st time) is understandably excited but EVERY conversation comes back to THE PREGNANCY!! I'm the boss so I feel I have to be interested and supportive but sometimes it hurts so much   Although it's not common knowledge at work - I don't want to be pitied by those that do- and if I hear "Just relax and it will happen" one more time I won't be responsible for my actions!! 

Just keep trying to tell myself that we have all this excitement to come when everyone has already been through it! It helps so much reading your posts and seeing so much of my own feelings and experiences in them! Thanks so much ladies- wishing you all the luck in the world for the journey ahead!!

Lots of love xxxxxx


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## Goldielocks80 (Feb 26, 2013)

Ps- If you're looking for a great way to lose weight Slimming World did it for me! Shifted 2.5st easily whilst eating loads! Changed my world I must admit


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## Bemy (Mar 2, 2013)

Ruth: I wouldn't beat yourself up about giving your DH a biological reality check. He needed it and it was part of being in a relationship with you and who's to say the desire to have kids may have just kicked in naturally anyway. I'm sure me have a biological clock too. 

It's a strange thing that nobody thinks about fertility being a problem until it is. It's just supposed to be so natural and easy. If only. 

But you're right, you fell in love with DH not the fact he can have kids. My hubby really struggled with that. I knew from the off he couldn't have kids and it took him a very long time to come to terms with that himself, the only person who knew was his very recent ex and me. He hadn't told a soul.

I had to convince him to tell his mum and dad just to share his burden and help him come to terms it. And when we did finally get together I think he felt a lot more stable as I was in love with him and whether we had a family (in whatever way adoption, IVF, fostering) or not it didn't matter as long as we knew we had each other. We both know we're in this forever and he knows I don't just want a baby, I want our family.

Don't get me wrong I am totally amazed that we have got this chance to have our own baby, to be pregnant and experience all that. I am amazed and so very thankful that we do. But it may not work, we may have to look into adoption or fostering and they might not work out either and all that journey will be so incredibly painful and beyond difficult. But we know it will and we'll make sure that we keep a focus on each other as there'd be no point trying to extend our family if we loose sight of the one we have.

I was just kind of agreeing with you there but as usual it went on for a lot longer. Ha ha.

Goldilocks: 
Oh honey, those scan pictures are so painful. I don't know why but when the baby is here in person I don't seem to have a problem but the baby bumps and the bloody scan pictures rip my heart open. I think it's because I'm happy to adopt and could have children but I want to be pregnant with my husbands baby so desperately that it aches when I see how blessed other people are with their big bellies, maternity clothes and those scan pictures! The baby talk is emotionally draining though isn't it. I switch off at points, some sort of self preservation mode kicks in. I do make a conscious effort to ask all the polite questions but anything else is a little too much.

One piece of advice though, if you are invited to any baby showers DO NOT GO! It is the most heart wrenching, soul destroying, depressing thing to put yourself through even if it is for your bestest of friends. Last year I went to a friends, I'd never been to one before it was just supposed to be a few of us for coffee and cake in a nice cafe and just give our gifts, sounds simple. What the hell was I thinking?! 

2 and half hours of mothers and babies, there was one other person there who was neither a mother or an expectant one. I cried all my way home (an hours drive) and for an hour when I was home. I must admit this was when I believed it was never ever ever going to happen for me and DH but I still wouldn't want to go to one now as I still don't know if it will ever be me.

Oh my goodness more rambling, yeah just avoid baby showers. Plus if I am ever blessed with pregnancy  I'm only going to showing my close family my scans (and framing them for the house) and they certainly aren't going on ********. If I can save one bit of heart ache for someone I don't know who is going through IF I will as there a so many more people struggling with this then you think.

Ramble over defo time for bed.

Love n God bless xxx


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