# SIMS clinic - European Egg Donor Programme



## Chilli Pepper (Nov 11, 2008)

hello girlies!

I was just hoping there might be someone out there who could shed a bit of light on this European Egg Donor programme that SIMS are running?
I've read about it on their website, but can't find a mention of it on here at at all. It seems like a great idea as they are working with a clinic in Ukraine to provide more donors. you don't have to go to the Ukraine - all appointments are in Dublin. they freeze the sperm, send it over, fertilise the embies, freeze them and send them back over to Ireland for ET! It sounds pretty nifty... so there must be a catch! Price maybe? Freezing those teeny embies - can that be good for them??

Anyway, can anyone tell me if they've gone with this programme? it'd be really convenient for us as DH is Irish and we could stay with family. But is it a bit too good to be true for some reason?

love
jill x


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## Mersie (Aug 7, 2008)

Hi Jill,
I was with Sims for OEIVF but went to IM Barcelona for DEIVF.
I am on another discussion board (Irish based) and there has been a lot of disappointment recently with this programme.  Here are some of the issues that have arisen:
1) One girl had 11 embryos shipped back to Dublin none of which survived defrosting, same thing happened to another girl and a further one only had 2 to transfer and BFN.  This has all happened on our Board withing the last month.
My feeling on it is that even though it is DE and they quote a success rate of 67% that they are still frozen embryos - in fact they freeze the sperm to ship it out, defrost it to fertilise the eggs in Ukraine and then freeze the fertilised embryos on Day1.  They are then shipped back.  To me, a 67% success rate seems very high for what is effectively FET.
2) You are provided with a list of donors  - none of these may have similar looks to you or same blood type - so no matching as such.  Some of the girls recently saw a couple of Cystic Fibrosis carriers on their donor lists and Ireland is a country with a very high occurrence of CF.
3) Timeframe has recently seen some improvement reducing from around a year from paying deposit (half cost) to ET to around 6 months or so now - still very long compared to Spain/other countries.
4) Cost is c. €14.5K once tests are taken into account.  This is before meds.  Meds in Ireland can be got under the Drugs Payment Scheme for €100 in any calender month - not sure what you would end up paying in the UK.
5) Years experience in DE is far less than other clinics on mainland Europe.

I know that this may seem like a negative post but I just felt I should let you know what the experience has been with Irish girls on another discussion board.  That said, I had a good experience at Sims for OEIVF even though it was not successful.  
Hope this helps you a little.


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## boboboy (Feb 29, 2008)

Hi,
I think your post was excellent Mersie,  I too have no experience with SIMS but I am also a member of an Irish fertility site and there are 2 girls currently doing DE with SIMS and already having lots of conflicting info from them. One girl was told her donor gave her 24 eggs out of this only one was fertilised !!!  
Also her time scale seems to keep changing even though its FET she will be doing they cannot seem to give her a definate date 

Oh and one other thing to consider - the Irish government has changed its mind on the drug payment scheme - now for some fantastic reason fertility drugs do not fall under this catagory - please I just have no idea why they do these things but anyway in order to get your fertility drugs now you have to get a special script from your doctor or clinic and to be honest most have no idea what your talking about - so be careful !!!

We looked into SIMs when we first considered DE but could not get as much info out of them as we did from Czech Republic. Also it cost us E3100 in CR and compared to the price in SIMs it was a no brainer !!!

BoB


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## Chilli Pepper (Nov 11, 2008)

hey mersie and bobo

thanks so much for your replies - I knew it seemed too good to be true!
Mersie, don't worry at all about seeming negative... your reply was exactly what I needed - constructive, factual information! To be honest, it's quite a relief to be able to cross a clinic off my list - less choice now!

take care  
love jillx


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## Mersie (Aug 7, 2008)

Hi Jill & Boboboy
All I can tell you is that the vast majority of girls on the Discussion Board I contribute to are going to Spain (IM mostly) and Czech Republic (Reprofit & Repromeda).  All of them are happy with those clinics even when they don't get a BFP which is surely a good sign.  There is a vast difference in cost between the Spanish Clinics and the Czech Clinics but some of the girls who have been to both feel there is no difference in standards or care or expertise which is good to know.  
Reprofit has a 1 year waiting list so if considering it get on to them straight away - you can email them and they will take some details and give you a date within a week or so.
Repromeda has a wait of 4 months or so.
IM has no waiting list and might be able to get you an appointment within a week.
The lack of wait with IM was what swayed me - we were very eager to get going asap.

Boboboy - I see you are pregnant with twins - congratulations.  You are a month ahead of me if I have worked it out properly - September due date?  

Jill - good luck with your decision.


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## Lesley08 (May 4, 2008)

Hi ladies I just wanted to add that I went to reprofit and was very impressed - it was cheaper and had a higher success rate and the travelling wasnt too much hassle. We are based in Belfast but found it easier to travel out of dublin with Ryanair. We were lucky as we got a BFP first time and have one frostie waiting for us. i would have no hesitation going back. Hope this helps

Lesley xx


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## ♥JJ1♥ (Feb 11, 2006)

I think where clinics offer an arrangement with an overseas clinic it must be more expensive as there must be someting in it for them, I went independently to IVI Barcelona- they are (as I presume all the Spanish and Shady Grove in the USA) are geared up to working with overseas couples looking for DE.

Good Luck


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## boboboy (Feb 29, 2008)

Hi Mersie,
My EDD is 30th September but for some reason everytime I have a scan it seems to change slightly - anyone else notice this ??  
It seems to move a few days each time you have a scan   God maybe thats normal - oh so much to learn so little time !!!!

BoBo


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## Mersie (Aug 7, 2008)

Hi Bobo
My delivery date is pretty easy as I am having a Caesarean so it is one week before the real due date i.e. on or around the 24th October.  I have had 2 Caesareans already due to an emergency on DD and failed VBAC on DS so my delivery date is fairly fixed.  
If I were you I would go with the Donor's egg collection date as ovulation day, count back 14 days from that and use that date as LMP.  Then use that to calculate your due date.  Scans really only take account of growth and may change your due date up or down each time depending on how close or far away from average growth your baba is.  Don't worry too much about it - it is pretty normal!
Mersie


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## Jecca (Oct 29, 2008)

I have had 2 failed OE-IVFs at SIMS, and soon will have ovarian drilling, before I embark on OE-ICSI in August. If this fails, we are considering going to IM in Barcelona, my gynae highly recommended DE there. He has a number of very happy patients with twins - many in their late 40s. I emailed IM to see how long the wait list is and when realistically we could look at DE-ET?


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## Mersie (Aug 7, 2008)

Hi Jecca,
there is a very active DE discussion thread on the trying to conceive board on rollercoaster.ie  - even if you don't want to join in on the chat there is loads of information there relevant to us Irish girls.
Sorry to hear you have had two failed IVFs to date.  Do you have PCOS?  Is that why you are having the ovarian drilling?  I hope that it works for you and you have a good response for your next cycle.
There is no waiting list at IM - generally, you go over for a first appt within a month of initial contact (could be within a week!) and then you are looking at ET within 6/8 weeks of that depending on where you are in your menstrual cycle.
However if you are doing another OEIVF at Sims, IM generally want you to have a break of 2 months between cycles.
HTH
Mersie


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## Jecca (Oct 29, 2008)

Hi Mersie, 
Thanks for that information. I do not have full blown PCOS. I don;t have any of the side affects related to PCOS. I only have PCO during stimulation, I have normal ovulation when not doing IVF. All my hormone levels are normal, with FSH and LH 5.0 or less. Progesterone normal etc.
My issue stems from the fact that I had a mis-managed emergency C-Section and a long term infection afterwards. I went semi-private and so did not get the aftercare that I needed and was left to fend for myself. 

The PCO was only discovered when after a few days on 450 puregon and I had developed nearly 40 follicles and had serious OHSS and Ovary Torsion as a result. My gynae said that the drilling should make a difference, and already on 850 X 2 a day of Glucophage. So if this does not work for ICSI in August, then I am defintely going to consider the DE route. Just have to figure out where we will get the money. Not sure if they bank will give us a loan ! Don;t want to ask any of our family as they would not be keen with us going down the DE route and we just couldn;t take that pressure from them. I will hope over to the Rollercoaster site, I am already on there, was active in the Mar/Apr IVF thread.


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## Mersie (Aug 7, 2008)

Hi Jecca - fingers crossed then that the ovarian drilling does the trick for you.  Reprofit in Czech may be a more cost effective option for DE (if you need it!) but you would want to make an appt now as there is a waiting list of nearly a year.  I made an appt at the same time as I started my DE meds for IM and it was for January 2010 with Reprofit.  The cost of DE is under €5K from memory so much less expensive than IM.  A lot of the girls on the rollercoaster DE thread with a couple of failed cycles at IM have moved on to Reprofit due to cost and many say they are sorry they didn't go there in the first place as they were so impressed with the clinic & their treatment AND they would have had money for a lot more cycles....
Still, hopefully you won't need it - maybe the drilling and a lower dose of puregon will be all you need.
M


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## Jecca (Oct 29, 2008)

I will pop over to the Rollercoaster site. I sent 2 emails for IM Barcelona and they have not replied. I just wanted a schedule of treatment costs so we could see what we would need to fund. I will have a look at reprofit, thanks for your advice


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## tide75 (Jul 12, 2009)

Chilli Pepper said:


> hello girlies!
> 
> I was just hoping there might be someone out there who could shed a bit of light on this European Egg Donor programme that SIMS are running?
> I've read about it on their website, but can't find a mention of it on here at at all. It seems like a great idea as they are working with a clinic in Ukraine to provide more donors. you don't have to go to the Ukraine - all appointments are in Dublin. they freeze the sperm, send it over, fertilise the embies, freeze them and send them back over to Ireland for ET! It sounds pretty nifty... so there must be a catch! Price maybe? Freezing those teeny embies - can that be good for them??
> ...


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## tide75 (Jul 12, 2009)

I think my post went awry. Anyway, I am at sims at the mo, my last ivf. I have heard their donor programme is not very successful in comparison to Barcelona also, I was told by my accupuncturist that Chernobyl was a factor I might want to consider too, Ukrainian donors are of the age the disaster occurred. I would go with Spain as it is more established successful and cheaper.
Good lick
Jo


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