# God is so strange....



## Bratt (Sep 21, 2005)

Well this is the last place people would expect to see me post    sorry if it turns into a bit of a ramble but I think you ladies will make me feel less  

I have never been into religion, don't get me wrong, I believe, but I find it all too stifling probably something to do with a Catholic school as a child.  I believe in God, that he gives us our sense of what is right and wrong and that sometimes if we are very lucky he will hear our prayers and help if it is the right thing to do, even if we really can't see that what we are praying for help with is something he can't do.

I think I lost my faith after my FET, when none of my 8 embies survived the thaw, how could he do that to me? Why was it right for me to lose my 2 babies, my fertility, my 2 embies on my 1st tx and THEN all 8 of my embies??  That was all a long time ago, but I never forgave him for it.  

There is a lady I work with, she is a firm believer, and on many of my '0h don't talk to me about God, he doesn't like me' or a ' me and God have fallen out' she has gently told me that isn't true, that God loves us all and just meybe he is waiting for me to come back. 

Last week was the first anniversary of my Fathers death, don't ask me why or where it came from but I started to talk to God again (I don't DO praying  )  I think I have come to the conclusion that there are many things I will never get answers to.

Wherever is this going?

On Thursday last week I found out quite by accident that my PCT are offering another IVF cycle.  I want to believe this isn't a coincidence, I don't want to lose my trust in God again.


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## georgette (Jul 16, 2008)

hello, your post caught me eye. I am so very sorry for all you have gone through. What a difficult time you have had, and I am also sorry for the loss of your father. That is such a lot of sadness to go through.  

I am pleased that you feel you are able to talk to God again, and I think it could be a great opportunity for you if your PCT is offering you another IVF. Do you think you will take them up on it? I really, really hope that if you do, you get a BFP.

IF is such an incredibly difficult thing to swallow. I cannot believe that my inalienable right to bear a child has been taken away. I have, and do, feel intense anger, normally at my own body. Throughout all of this, my DH has maintained that it is because God is waiting to give us the right child at the right time. This is how he deals with it and I respect that, and find some comfort in it. 

I have also tried to remember what my father taught me about prayer - that God always answers, just sometime it is not the answer you were hoping for. I try very, very hard to not ASK God for things. I feel like a spoilt child saying - "give me this!", I have tried to learn to ask for his guidance and help. Someone posted the footsteps poem on the christian ladies pages last week, and though I find the words a little sickly sweet, I guess I try and ask God to carry me at times of difficulty, and I truly believe he does carry us at those awful times that we all experience. 

I have no idea why all your babies have been taken from you up until now, and I cannot imagine how awful that must be to deal with. But, to stop me going crazy, I do believe that thing will work out, in some form or other. He has definitely not abandoned you, and I do believe that things happen in certain patterns for a reason. But I also do not believe that he is doing any of this to torture you. I pray  with all my heart that you find comfort and guidance and solace. 

Hmmm, now I have started rambling! I don't know if this is the reply you were hoping for. But I really really hope the coming months are good ones for you. You may not want them, but my prayers are yours for the asking! (heck even, without asking!!) 

Um, well that is it for me. Hope I did not sound like a crazy lady
Georgette
xxxx


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Dear Bratt, Its great you are talking to God again. If you look at my footnote you will see my chequered history of miscarriages, BFNs, frosties that didnt survive the thaw etc etc. I did manage to keep talking to God even if most of it was WHY WHY WHY   ?
I made it to the end of my journey and I must say I have really learnt a LOT about myself and about God. He wasnt trying to be mean , He  was trying to let me know there was something wrong with my eggs and then He was trying to lead me to the right donor so I could meet this wonderful person(see picture!). 
I dont know if my story helps but its a story about keeping talking to God even if some of it isnt very polite at the time! 

love from Bree x


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## vonnie33 (Aug 5, 2008)

Hi ladies, dont know if i should be adding this here or not, but anyway here goes i have lost my faith altogether dont beleive in God anymore at all dont see why i should after all after all my fertility tx i amazing fell pg naturally which was amazing could not beleive it. I was sent for a scan at 8wks to check everything as i had a block right tube to be told that i had an eptopic and that my baby had to be taken off of me and that they were going to do this by giving me an injection whcih in theory would stop my baby growing any further and my body would absorb it back and that i had to keep going back to the maternity hospital every week to check the my levels were going down and this could take up to 8 weeks this totally destroyed me putting me through this pain especially having to go to the maternity and the way it was done. Why give you the miracle of life to take it off you in such a cruel way my faith has gone and will never return. To me that is not a God like way to act.

Thanks for listening.

Vonnie xx


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Oh Vonnie, what a horrible, horrible thing to happen to you. I cant imagine what you must have gone through as it seems even worse than a miscarriage. The only thing worse I could imagine is a still-birth (that happened to my SIL a few years back). And I am really sorry it destroyed your faith in God. Its almost as if the experience was so traumatic that it has damaged your soul. 
There is no reason why you shouldnt post here. I am new here myself. I just wondered what had drawn you to the religion section?
Sending you lots of  


Bratt, were you really wondering if this lot of IVF was going to work? Were you wondering if God was sending you a sign? Sorry if I have mis-interpreted what you were asking.

love from Bree x


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Hi, I've found IF very difficult at times. DH and I have been blessed to be part of a church which is like one big family. Everyone has been really supportive especially our pastor and his wife. I've been through the it's not fair that people can have LO's no problem and abuse/neglect them and yet there's DH and I who would provide all a child needs to grow and develop needing IVF (start down regging tomorrow). During tough times I've turned to God. Here's the 2 poems/prayers I've written about IF. When tears Fall was written while I was waiting for my letter of offer to come. Should have got it end July to start tx on August cycle but it wasn't God's timing. God's taught me a few lessons in patience the last almost 2 years (found out end November 2006 that we'd need IVF to have our own LO).

Infertility - 1 Year on

I sit here at the foot of the Cross crying out to God
Lord, You see the hurt and the pain of watching friends and family getting pregnant and having children
Being pleased for them, congratulating them but wondering when I'll be among them
Lord, You see the look in Malcolm's eyes when he holds a child in his arms
You know how we would love and care for any child we are blessed with
We will feed them, clothe them and provide all they need to grow and develop the way You have planned for them
Lord, take the hurt and the pain, I can't face this heartache without you
Like Hannah in 1 Samuel, I cry out to You hear my prayer in Jesus name and show me the way to get through this heartache.

Written on 29th November 2007 one year to the day that we found out, we'll need IVf to have our own child.
It was written sitting at the foot of the cross in church.

When Tears Fall

When my eyes fill with tears which fall down my face
Who do I turn to?
I turn to God and ask Him to give the comfort I need
I also turn to friends who care and understand
Many a day and night I've been laid down
Crying out to God to hear my prayers
Sometimes asking when will my prayers be answered?
When will it be me?
I've cried so many tears during this heartache
Only God knows what the months ahead will bring
The only thing I can do is to put my Trust in God
He will be with me through it all.
His will be done.

Written between 23rd September and 2nd October 2008.

At the moment I'm focussing on 2 verses from the Bible which to me are so true. 1 Samuel 1:15 and 1:20.

Hope you find my poems/prayers comforting. They're on Live Journal as well as the other poems/prayers I've written, click on globe symbol under my profile pic.


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## TC2 (Oct 30, 2006)

Hi All

I am so sorry for all of the heartaches you have had to bear and i know that i now sit in a differnt place having been blessed with my miracles.... but i wanted to share with you a little of my Journey with the Lord an IF.  I had really lost my way with God before w were even told that we would not have children 'naturally' or as i prefer 'without alot of help'  - not that i had stopped believing but that i had stopped listening and talking and had not walked with the lord rather chosen to take my own path.  Anyhow when i found out about the IF i started asking questions and 'talking' 'praying' and basically trying to undertsand it all.  Anyway lifes never been easy for me or DH and certainly never 'normal' in terms of DHs health therefore i just decided it was probably because of all the health stuff and tried to focus on my marriage and career, but did continue with praying - but not about the IF particularly. Anyhow we were amazed to find out the following christmas that we were pregnant, and just presumed that the drs had been wrong about the IF.  Through the birth of my child i met a wonderful person who encouraged me to come back to church and my new walk with the lord began.  We continued to try for more children and basically three and a half years later had to realise that Harrison had been a miracle - after alot of prayer we decided to consider IVF as we really wanted our son to have a sibling - or at least the chance of one.  Our main problem was the money - but amazingly we were provided with exactly what we needed, i saw this as a 'sign' and we went ahead.  The road wasnt easy but my faith helped and my prayers answered.  We had a threatedned early labour at 26 weeks but my faith that these babies were meant to be kept me going and i am sure the PMA this gave me helped me get to 38 weeks.

So imagine my distress at 37 weeks finding out i had to have a C section as one was breech - and despite all the praying and my housegroup and church all praying for him to turn - he didnt and i found myself in an operating theatre feeling a bit put out that my prayers and those of so many others werent answered - anyway when the boys were born they found they had a very rare complication and basically had i had a normal delivery then my Elliott would not have made it or would have had serious difficulties. I then felt so stupid i had doubted my God - all the way i had placed my trust in him and then at the last hurdle i was stupid!  Its a good job we are forgiven!

I found my greatest strength to cope whn i knew that the lord was on my side as as you say - carried me.  And i keep trying to remember to trust in the lord and not ask for what i want, because although it seems sometimes ridiculous and unfathomable - he does know what is best for us.

I hope you all find your strength and that the lord blesses you all with that which you so truly deserve.

God Bless

Teena x


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Cate,  your prayers are so full of heartache and longing they brought a   to my eye. Good luck with this IVF cycle. 

TC2,  Thats a great story about God eventually answering your prayers. Isnt it strange how the infertility issue will destroy some peoples faith but others it brings them closer to God. I guess it depends whether you BLAME God for whats happening because you think if He is allpowerful why doesnt He fix this NOW, or whether you feel we are living in a fallen world so   happens and God is our only hope!!

I guess everyone is different in how they react to the grief and the trials of IF.

My own view is that the world was probably in good nick when God handed it over to mankind but we have mucked it up and are living with the varied and long reaching consequences. I am in the "cling to God He is our only hope" camp  !

But I respect the fact that others feel differently. After all, God IS strange!

love from Bree x


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## Bratt (Sep 21, 2005)

Hi, and thanks for your replies, all of them.
Vonnie, I know only too well what you have been through, I've been there twice and hospitals really need to sort this out, the LAST place I needed to be was sitting in the waiting room with happy excited couples all excited for their scans, it's just too cruel, the whole ectopic thing is a nightmare from start to horrible finish.
I really don't know what to think, this seems to have come completely out of the blue, I had pretty much given up hope of ever having any more TX, we simply can't afford to pay for it.  We are going to take it, I know we would kick ourselves forever if we didn't. 
I can't say I think God sent it for us, that'd be pretty miraculous lol   but he is strange and as I said, if I ever get the chance to ask I will have soooo many questions for all of us   and to be honest I think this time I will go into it NOT expecting it to work, I think I have been sent a few signs recently, but that might just be me making too much of daft things, I hope not, I hope this is my turn.


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## georgette (Jul 16, 2008)

brat - I wish you luck and joy with all my heart

Georgette


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## kittensdtm (Sep 24, 2008)

Hi everyone,

Brat and Vonnie esp, just wanted to say how sorry I am to hear about all you have gone through. There are no answers to these things-not right now anyway. I want to share my experience with you and maybe it will help? If it doesn't, I just want you both to know that I'm thinking about you  .

When I found out my DH was infertile, it was like the end of the world. I wanted to stop eating, I couldn't sleep but I didn't want to be awake either . I wanted to stop going to church and to hate God for what He was doing to us . But I can only see half the picture. I don't know why we have to go through this and I don't know how it will end-I can only hope with all my heart that we will have our own beautiful bundle some day and that we will not have to wait for too long. I have told God that I cannot survive if He takes my dream away...and if He does He will have to give me the strength to survive it. But even in my most anguished times when I feel like giving up on God I know He has not given up on me . He gave up His only child for me on the cross and that is something I have to always remember-in the knowledge that even my own love for a child could never match God's love, how hard this must have been for Him to do. So I really cannot hate Him over this. I agree with Bree that we do live in a sinful world and we all bear the marks of imperfection and the consequences that go with it. My only hope is to trust in God that He knows what He is doing and that He will answer my prayers in the way that is best for me. He has already done so much in my life that testify to His greatness and His willingness to answer prayer when I actually bring stuff before Him.

God is indeed strange because we do not see the half of what He does behind the scenes. And if we did, there would be no such thing as faith! This was not meant to be a sermon or anything but just from my own experience and I hope it helps in some small way.

Lots of love to you all,

Kittens xox


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Dear Bratt, I know what you mean whan you say you are going into treatment not expecting it to work. I do the same! Its a protection mechanism I guess which is no bad thing. Do you have a back-up plan just in case it doesnt? I always like to have a back up plan too for protection. We went to a few adoption meetings (I am sure you have already been over this ground), in the end we re-mortgaged the house to pay for treatment (not poss for every-one especially now!). I just wondered if you were under 35 as some clinics do free treatment if you agree to donate some of your eggs(I am sure you know this stuff already). 
  Sorry, I really dont mean to sound negative going on about back-up plans! And its not like you wont have thought of everything possible already. Its just that in our case the back up plan was the thing God was leading us to as it turned out!

However, you are in a different boat and my experience may not be relevent to you. It does sound like God is doing something in your life. But what?? Only time will tell. Just cling to the fact that God is trying to do good not harm us. Even when bad things happen, they may happen to protect us from something even worse. 

Sorry if I have waffled on. Keep talking to God  

love from Bree xx


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Bree: I've been posting my poems/prayers to try and bring comfort to people going through IF. Both were written during tough times.

I'm now 6 days into d/r and as off yesterday my Positve Mental Attitude (PMA) has gone AWOL. Several reasons, first being I think it could be the side effects of Suprecur kicking in unfortunately mood swings (DH has copped it), second it's my birthday on Tueasday and my nan died on 8th February, selfish as it sounds, it hurts that I won't be getting a card from her. Lastly, the news coverage of Baby P has got me thinking how unfair it is that his Mum got pg no problem only to abuse and then murder her DS, yet there's so many couples who would provide all a child needs to grow and develop either unable to have children or their own or like so many on FF needing treatment. Our God is a God of love and grace yet he's allowed so many child abusers to have LO's without problem yet DH and I are needing IVF to have 40% chance of having our own child. As the title of this thread says, God is strange.


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Dear Cate, Its OK to feel negative sometimes. Why shouldnt you ,its a hard journey . I am sorry to hear about your nan. It sounds like you are grieving for her and that is the right thing to do of course.  Its an extra burden right now when you are laden down with sorrow.  . She would be quite touched that you missed getting a card from her as it shows how much she meant to you. I bet she was a lovely lady.


Mood swings and feeling very down are (as you rightly guessed) side effects of the medication. It would be a good idea to phone your IF doc on Monday just to report these side effects on the off chance they might be able to do something like change your meds or reduce the dose or just tell you what else to expect!!

The baby P case is very distressing and you have set me off thinking what it all means, but I think I better save that for another post as I could go on about it a bit.

This is JUST MY OPNION about how it relates to us so ignore the following if you like! here goes;In general humans have been given the gift of reproduction. Also the gift of health. But in this fallen, broken, polluted world some of us are ill and some of us are infertile. The rain has fallen both on the righteous and the un-righteous. I guess if a dear one had cancer we might be saying why have they got cancer and not some mass murderer who richly deserves it! It does all seem a bit random because it is.
But how God deals with it is not. He has given man the know how to do IVF treatment and maybe He had you and me in mind when He did that. He has given doctors the skill to help us. He does care and He is going to help you and He has a plan to turn what initially seems like a curse to you into something good.

Actually, what might be more help than all that lot is read Romans 8,v28 and substitute the word "infertility" where it says "all things".

If non of this helps then I am just sending you   instead!

My DH has been through some rough times whilst I have been on treatment. Maybe him and your DH should get together and compare notes  .

love from Bree xx


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## sara1 (Jul 28, 2008)

Hi Girls,

I just wanted to add opinion on this topic, if you don't mind.

I always try to keep in my mind that God has a plan for me.  My DH and I have been trying for a baby since 2001 with not even one pregnancy to our knowledge.  I have PCOS, one blocked tube and slight endometriosis.  We have tried Clomid and Metformin (many cycles) and I never ovulated once on these tablets.  We then progressed to IVF but decided it wasn't for us ( one reason being my fear of needles  ).  We are now starting the adoption process from Thailand.  We both believe that God is leading us down this path - that He wants us to help an orphan have a loving and caring home instead of being brought up in an orphanage.  I can honestly say that I have asked God at times " Why can't I have my own baby?" but I have never blamed Him.  I find that I blame myself and my body for letting me down.
My DH and I have had our faith in God tested at times in the past as I have had a few health problems - ME and skin cancer- but it has been our faith that has always got us through.  I feel that I have been so blessed in meeting my DH - he means the world to me and I know if the adoption doesn't work out that I will always have him.
Please keep your faith it really will help you through some difficult times.  I hope this doesn't sound like I am preaching to you but I feel strongly about it.

Proverbs 3 v 4-5

Sara


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Thanks Bree and Sara. I know Romans 8:28 well. Other 2 verses I'm clinging to at the moment are 1 Samuel 1:15 and 1:20. Told my amazing friend at church how I'm feeling and he was great as usual. Gave me a hug and said to hang in there. Don't think my meds can be changed as it's the spray I'm using and tx is NHS.


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## sara1 (Jul 28, 2008)

Cate - it is so important to have good friends  - really cherish them.  

Sara


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Whole church family have been really supportive but there's one couple who've really been there for us and understand as well.


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## carole (Jul 21, 2003)

to all who need them at the moment. It is no wonder our faith is tested - by IF, as well as by many other things- when we have to go through all this blooming heartache. 

I deal with it by thinking everything happens for a reason. It is all part of His plan. We don't know what that plan is. We just need to trust in Him. 

Yes I know - easy for me to say .....

Good luck to everyone on their journey.


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Trust In God Always is my motto. Not easy at times. Through the IF, I've found my faith has really helped. 1 Samuel chapter 1 is one of my fave parts of the Bible. I said to my friend today about God being love and grace yet allowing child abusers to get pg no problem and there's so many like Dh and I needing IVF to have 40% chance of having 1 child. That's what I find so hard.


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Dear Cate, I just read 1 Sam ch 1. I can see why you like it, its a great story about God helping an infertile woman. I noted the bit that said "in the course of time Hannah concieved" and I thought "time" thats were the test for our faith lies. "In the course of time" makes you wonder how long the poor woman waited! I got my little boy, but what a long journey! When I come to think of it the bible is full of stoies about God helping infertile women. Theres Abrahams wife Sarah(who at one point had resorted to surrogacy because the Lord had taken so long to answer her request!) And Mary's cousin Elizabeth in the new testament whos husband laughed in disbelief and then was struck dumb because she had been infertile for so long. Why is Gods timing so slow, thats a question I would like an answer to!

What did your friends at church say when you spoke about God allowing child abusers to concieve easily when you and DH who would be great parents are having trouble?

Heres a big   whilst you are fighting those down-reg blues  

love from Bree xx


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## Bratt (Sep 21, 2005)

Good morning all!!  Wow.........I really started one here didn't I?  
I'm glad, relieved to know that these questions don't just bug me.  I too believe that everything happens for a reason, even if that reason is completely beyond me, I hope it will be explained to me one day.
I have a quote that I tend to live by these days
"I can think no longer of what to do but to ride the tide of events" 
I don't have a back up plan, this will be our last try..............as far as I know    This was completely unexpected, we had pretty much learned to live with our lot and then along it came
Never say never


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Bree, can't remember what my friend said but he understood. It was after saying about child abusers having LO's that I asked him for a hug He and his wife have been great. My amazing friend has a website http://www.livingthegospelofgrace.com. I've briefly read about Abrahams wife Sarah but it 1 Samuel 1 that I really relate to. I'm feeling a bit happier today. been back to where i ddi work experience 2 years ago during my NVQ2 in Business and Admin. Someone's off sick and they've asked me to cover, I'm in every day this week.


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## Bree (Mar 21, 2007)

Cate, will check out your lovely friends site. Thats great that you have that work project to keep you busy. I think I related to Sarah cos of my age ha ha  . If you have a boy you will have to call him Sam and if its a girl, Hannah! I know you will one day. Hopefully it will be with this cycle (although God may have bizarre back up plan in mind for you as He is, as we say on this thread, SO STRANGE    ) 

You are a star and an inspiration, love from Bree x

Bratt, loved your quote. Totally zen and philosophical. I agree  with never say never too ! love from Bree xx


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## Cate1976 (Oct 29, 2007)

Have said that if tx works and Lo is a boy, his name will be Samuel and if it's a girl I do like Hannah but not sure of it for first name so m ight have it as middle name.

I love the piece on my freind's website about Sermon on the Mount especially the part about verse 4. I found it comforting after my Nan died back in February this year.

Bree: Thanks for saying I'm an inspiration, I do have a heart for reaching out to people especially through prayer, have written a few poems/prayers over the last year (click the globe under my profile pic). Most started out as poems but my freind thinks they read more like prayers. Prayer for ME, Madrid and Pillars of Light are the only ones which were written as prayers.


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