# Concurrency Fostering (Foster to Adopt ...) Chat



## Suzie

This is for this doing or thinking of doing concurrency


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## Dame Edna

Hello Suzie   

Good move re new thread   

Further to what Anj mentioned on the general chat thread regarding some LA's not liking concurrency for families where they have an adopted child in placement (makes perfect sense), do you know how they feel about placing a blood sibling for concurrency where the baby's brother/sister is already placed and very likely baby would be freed for adoption.

Just interested if you know anything about this?  If so, is there always contact with BF or is this a case by case basis?

X


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## superal

well done Suzie!   Good idea to start his thread as there seems a lot of interest in concurrency at the moment.
good luck to those who go down this line..........it's not easy but so beneficail for the children involved and thats what it is all abouts!
Andrea


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## Suzie

Edna I know in our area they do place siblings in a concurrency placement if the plan for the child is adoption. As we are on file for any birth siblings our eldest BM may have which ss would be involved in. 
I guess if would also depend on what if any contact was and how to  be managed to safeguard your little one, I guess it can be done as we fostered C before we adopted him and had birth contact initially when plan was possibly for him to return to BM. It would just need to be carefully considered through a contact centre. 


Areas differ so much in policy and procedure so guess its done on a child's situation

X


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## Dame Edna

Thanks Suze  
X


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## Anjelissa

Hi DE  
Sorry, I should have added that was the exception with our precious LA, I think if we were to be notified about a birth sibling we understand that they would consider a concurrency arrangement. Again I'm only going by the LA's that I have experience with and in our case there would be very little chance of a sibling being allowed to go back to bf once placed so I suppose again it depends on circumstances that will vary greatly.
DH wants a family similar to the Waltons  (although I'd be over the moon with just 2 thank you very much!) so I am fully expecting to end up with at least 4 if we ever get a call about birth siblings to little man or our future little one  .
Anj x


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## Dame Edna

Anjelissa said:


> .... in our case there would be very little chance of a sibling being allowed to go back to bf once placed so I suppose again it depends on circumstances that will vary greatly.
> Anj x


That would be the situation for us too   , which is why I posed the question (just hypothetical), as we would not consider it unless there was a blood relative where there was very very slim/literally no chance of return to BF. Mind you, I would struggle with contact but none of it I have to worry myself about currently anyway! I just like to be prepared 



Anjelissa said:


> .
> DH wants a family similar to the Waltons  (although I'd be over the moon with just 2 thank you very much!) so I am fully expecting to end up with at least 4 if we ever get a call about birth siblings to little man or our future little one  .
> Anj x


Whoah, Anj, REALLY   . You could become the next Von Trap family .

X

Ps. Why does pre school homework (Biggins the Bear  ), usually equate to work for the 'parents'


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## Suzie

Wait until year 2 with spellings, maths monkey, maths homework and English reading online


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## thespouses

We are thinking of this for our second adoption though we aren't even ready to make the initial phone call as it hasn't been a year since our little boy was fully adopted.

But looking at the profiles on the website of the LA we'd go through - they have one family who adopted already and wanted to give their next adopted child a better start in life with fewer changes in carer - which is kind of how we feel - so it doesn't sound at all like they wouldn't consider you if you already have an adopted child.  The profile (probably not exact but must be generally similar) said their existing child had been in FC for about 2 years and was now school age - so old enough to understand what's going on - if people think that's the worry with having an existing adopted child.

I have actually heard of concurrency as a one-off i.e. not something the LA normally does but for a specific child who is a birth sibling (but that wouldn't be our case). I was in contact with someone doing this and they had a SW take the baby to contact meetings because they were worried about the security of their older children.  

I have to say, one of the reasons for us of thinking of concurrency is so that we can at least have a full record for the future of us and the baby meeting the BF even if contact doesn't continue - and the thought of handing over a baby to  a stranger to be taken to meet another stranger sounds bizarre to us - so we'd want to do our utmost to be fully involved in contact.


(If you are interested I can PM you the link for the profiles, I haven't seen such full descriptions elsewhere which encourages us about this LA).


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## Anjelissa

Suzie said:


> Wait until year 2 with spellings, maths monkey, maths homework and English reading online


lol  ...I'm not even thinking of that yet!  , mind you I must say our Biggins the Bear Diary was very impressive!  (much better than the others in there, not that we're competitive parents or anything, oooooooh no   )
I think it's from being in 'home-study' mode 

Anj x


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## Arrows

Thanks Susie, our LOs SW came over the other day and she said that they have lots of babies and would happily place with us. She also seemed to suggest that they would do concurrency. However the LA is out of area (2hrs) -anyone else have experience of this?


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## thespouses

We originally enquired with an agency that did concurrency about 1.25 hours f from us (1hr on a good day) and were told it was too far because we'd be taking the baby there for a few visits each week. We were a bit fed up at the time because the offices/contact centre were at the time 10 mins walk from my MIL's flat who would have loved that many visits! But I think they do like you fairly close (it's now the LA we live in.)


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## nutmeg

Does anyone know - do you get paid as a FC if you concurrently foster to adopt? I'm self employed but am being paid full paid as I'm off on adoption leave at present. I'm not sure my partners would be too pleased of I were to be off again very soon, but thought if I got paid for fostering then it might sweeten the blow a little as I won't take any pay if I'm off a second time.


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## thespouses

You'd get the regular foster carers allowance, but it's not much.


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## BECKY7

Hey nutmeg  yeah you do get paid per child if doing fostering.

Becky7 xx


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Thanks ladies a great new thread as we may have a maybe baby heading our way! We are guessing this will be the way la proceed but don't know for sure. Thanks for info about fostering pay as that was one of my worries as obviously i wouldn't get paid adoption leave again as there would be no matching cert  at time of placement. I really need to cover my wages somehow. Does anyone know for... We live in a small 2 bed flat which we have been trying to sell forever  we couldn't be considered for  a sibling group because of space would this still be case for sibling baby I guess it probably will be but i know all sorts of things change when they need to be.


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## nutmeg

Thanks ladies. It does relieve a little of that worry doesn't aaa - even if it's not much, it's better than nothing!


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Yeah it does x


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## Arrows

How does it work then? Do you get unpaid leave from work whilst fostering and adoption leave when you start the official adoption? How do employers handle it? Can your work refuse to pay you adoption pay, as you won't have been in 26wks employment before going on adoption leave? Obviously it would be very difficult if not impossible to exist without any form of additional income.


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## HannahLou

Hi ladies

I am 6 weeks away from panel (eeeek) and we are doing concurrency. Nobody in our LA seems to know really how the pay works as we are only the 2nd couple to do it! However my boss says she has looked into it and received advice that she has to terminate my contract as i cannot take unpaid leave until we get the adoption order. So basically she is sacking me but says i can have my job back when i have had the time off i want. So once the baby is adopted after around 6 months then the foster money will stop and i will have no income. In her words she said 'i dont know who pays you but its not me', so now i wont get any adoption pay and may not have a job at all, its absolutely disgusting. My social worker is trying to find out if the LA can support us in extra ways, but i doubt it. 

H x


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## thespouses

HannahLou - if you have been working for your employer for 6 months you can request flexible working. I was thinking I would ask for annualised hours so work no hours for the first 9 months, say, and then maybe 1 or 2 days a week (and hubby could take some time off too).  They can't refuse you a reasonable request for flexible working unless there's a good business reason for doing so - and as what you're asking for is not any different for their team than someone taking regular adoption/maternity leave (i.e. someone is off for 9 months and then part time), if anyone in your team has ever done that before, you should have a good case.  


ETA if you are a parent already (don't know if this is your first child) you can also request up to 4 weeks unpaid parental leave per year (and so can your partner). I think we could do this on the grounds that little boy would need to have some attention from us if we were fostering, to help him settle in to it - so it would be leave for him not leave for the fostered baby. You can't request this for fostering though.

Arrows - I have been told they will soon start to give concurrent carers paid adoption leave when they get to the official adoption part, but I can't find it anywhere in writing.

aaa - bio siblings (or once it gets to that point adopted siblings) can share if they're under a certain age (which is quite old), but babies under six months MUST be in your room and foster carers are allowed to have babies under 2 in their room if they want.


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## VEC

Sorry to interrupt.  Hannah Lou, I don't know about the legalities of your situation (have YOU asked a lawyer, as I wouldn't trust your boss), but your boss doesn't "have to" terminate your contract, she is effectively choosing to. Why can't she just give you unpaid leave?  Loads of people take that for lots of different reasons (bereavement, personal development, holidays).  Why can't you, and in so doing preserve your rights?  

Sorry, I might be off beam but it seems so wrong.


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## thespouses

(I have just tweeted the DfE and Martin Narey about the adoption leave issue and whether it's changing. Will let you know the result!)


Also - VEC is right - lots of people get unpaid leave. She can do this if she wants to for any reason (including non-family reasons). But as someone who expects to become a foster carer, you have the right to request flexible working anyway.


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## aaa is a MUMMY

just typed reply and lost it.

Hannah ouch that is a tough one. My worry is i officially returned to work 20 Nov on annual leave until Jan then went back part time. Sw  visited Jan said bm was 4-5 months. So i am guessing maybe baby will be born before i have done 6 months.

The spouses thanks we might be able to fit a baby in our room. Might mean living with 2 sets of clothes each lol one on one in the wash but if needs must. I would be heartbroken if we had to say no.

Its all a too do. The people that come up with these ideas must surely think about lose of income 

Good luck everyone x


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## galaxy girl

Hannah I would check your workplaces family policy's . I am on adoption leave .... And am doing concurrency. My workplace accepted matching panel certificate as start of leave. I am just at the stage of applying for adoption order. 1 year later!!


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Thanks Gg gives me some hope just need to hope i will have been back 26 weeks before i need to vanish again!!


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## HannahLou

Thanks everyone, I don't trust my boss and I'm really annoyed because she knows everything we went through to get tho this point and I never thought she would react this way. Hopefully my social worker will have some more info next week, I have no idea why I can't have unpaid leave. I work at a nursery too so you would think some arrangements could be made!!


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## aaa is a MUMMY

Hannah it does seem very unreasonable. Really hope u get some answers soon Xx


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## thespouses

Hannah are you in a union?


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## HannahLou

I'm not in a union unfortunately, but I'm kicking myself for it now!! Do you think citizens advice could help?


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## GERTIE179

Hannah - not sure it's the same as your situation but this was one if the reasons our LA don't really do concurrency. It's hard on pros adopters as they have to leave their current work, take a FC payment and then you can't control when court will be. If they can do indefinite unpaid leave then great but I sti font think you would be entitled to any adopt pay (unless Martin narey plans get expedited). Sorry it's not much help. We could only really considerate if we went for number 2 after a year if LO being home.

X


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## thespouses

Hannah, I think ACAS are the people to contact about this kind of thing if you aren't in a union. Or you could join one?


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## VEC

I can't find anything that might indicate a legal entitlement to unpaid leave to the extent you need anyway, but it might be worth asking Nat Gamble.  If its not a legal entitlement then i guess you need to form a business case to persuade your employers to keep you on, because they can, should they wish to, and i guess it comes down to whether they can afford to give you unpaid leave.  The cost to them of granting you unpaid leave is presumably the cost of having someone cover your workload in your absence who would have to be recruited on a temporary only basis which can work out more expensive than recruiting on a permanent basis. In addition, any costs theyd incur when you then become entitled to adoption leave.  And then there's the risk of them incurring further costs should you decide not to return after adoption leave expires.  

So youd need to persuade them that keeping you on so you can return would cost them less than dismissing you and risking that you wouldn't return. Sort of things you're looking at are your length of service, your qualifications/experience, how key you are to the business/clients/colleagues, your productivity, your client list (if that's relevant), but I'd also see whether anyone else has had unpaid leave/career breaks, and I guess whether they've returned and been productive.  some businesses would not wish to set a precedent for unpaid leave in these circs, but some businesses make a big song and dance about work/life balance.  If yours does that, they should (!) be more willing to step up.

I don't know what sort of work you do so most of that may be irrelevant.  

I'd definitely speak to a lawyer first though.  The suggestion of contacting ACAS is a great one, I suspect they'll be more informed than the CAB (sorry CAB)..

Best of luck.  And sorry to crash again

Martha x


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## nutmeg

Hmm, I'm confused and wondered if anyone could help. It's all hypothetical at the moment anyway, but I like to have things straight in my head. I'm self employed and as such have no entitlement to AL. I'm on full pay for a few months now. If we had dd2s sibling placed with us on a concurrency agreement, I would be paid the fostering fee but wouldn't be able to take any payment from work?


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## HannahLou

Thanks for all your help, ACAS are apparently who my employer has contacted but think I might get in touch myself. Its ridiculous that nothing is in place to protect adopters when David Cameron wants to push concurrency.

H x


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## GERTIE179

Nutmeg that's my understanding as my agency described. As you don't get a match cert then employers can't go forward to give you SSP it employer top up


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## GERTIE179

Ps I'd love to know if this has changed as we would be interested in this route for no 2 next year.


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## MummyPea

The SW who came to do our initial visit mentioned concurrent planning. And then at prep they had someone who was currently involved in a concurrent situation. We mentioned at our exit interview that it's something we would be willing to go through. I'm about to be made redundant so any job I get is just going to be part time as I want something to fit around us for a while, so would happily leave to be a FC for a little while.


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## thespouses

Hannah, VEC, foster carers have the legal right to request flexible working, which could include unpaid leave or annualised hours. You don't have to present a business case FOR the request, it's them that needs to show it's not going to work for the business. And if they've replaced someone on maternity leave before, they've clearly managed fine.


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## Belliboo

Hi we're waiting to hear about our AS half sibling & wondered if anyone has done concurrent planning how did they find contact arrangements, did you take LO or did SS escort LO to contact & also the effects concurrency may have on our AS especially if things didn't work out for us xx


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## superal

Belliboo......along time ago since I did concurrency.................our As was 7 at the time and we did take him along to some of the contacts with the concurrency baby......he waited in another room whilst I took the baby in to see her birth parents.  I awlays took baby to see BPS not a SW and it was always at theri offices or a childrens centrre......SWS are always there to make sure hand over goes smoothly.
As for how things may affect your AS if things did not work I can honestly say its heartbreaking!!!!!!!!!  Our baby was returned and the impact on our son was hard, it was hard for us all, especailly him.
All I will say to any one who is thinking off going down these lines is.......you have to be VERY strong, don't think for one moment concurrency will guarantee you adopting a baby....the whole idea of concurrency is to stop the amount of moves a baby/child will have in their lives and the ultimate aim is to get them back to theri BPS.


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## Belliboo

Thanks for the honest reply surreal, we have a few issues & I think I would find it very hard having to return the baby, so we will have to see what SW says as they want to discuss it once AS birth sibling is born & of course we need to know more about it to make a decision too x


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## superal

Belliboo...you are quite right to be anxious but by asking lots of questions to your SW you should get a better picture of what is expected,  You'll see from reading previous posts that a lot of birth siblings seem to be going down concurrency at the moment so maybe some one else can answer any questions for you.

Good luck with your next journey!

Superal


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## thespouses

*bump*


Just to say we're still thinking about this, probably looking at contacting the LA in the summer, I've been told though that they only do their 2nd time adopters course twice a year and I'm thinking, well, would it be very previous to ask now when they are to be held, in case we just miss one, I'm very impatient and hubby is always wanting to be laid back and wait and see!


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## thespouses

PS to happypenguin, please tell us how it's going, what have you done so far?


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## happypenguin

Thanks for the 'bump' thespouses - I'll get the kettle on and have a good read of the thread & then add my bits & bobs


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## happypenguin

Hello all - hoping to give this thread a little shake awake  

We're at the start of our Concurrent Planning journey. We've done the Skills To Foster & the Adoption Training and filled out all of our meaty paperwork along with a few visits from our SW. So far, our experience has been very, very positive & we feel aware of the pros and cons of taking on this task.
We have no children and so we don't have added things to consider so it's just our extended family and support network that will be getting on board with us over the next couple of months. 

Hopefully other people on the scheme will find this thread and we can get ourselves through this together


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## thespouses

Great to hear from you. Was the Skills to Foster just taken alongside other prospective FCs? 

Also, have you talked to the SWs about how you work out adoption leave for concurrent planning? those seem to be a few of the issues!


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## happypenguin

Yes, both courses were alongside people that were fostering only or adopting only so it was a small task filtering out relevant information (as some of it simply didn't apply to us)

I'm newly self-employed but I've halted that to start the assessment process & then while we foster and have regular BP contact etc. Then I'll reassess if/when an adoption order is granted (& no we're not super-rich, just a normal household)

If I was employed, my understanding is that Adoption Leave is granted as the Adoption Order is put in place. It seems like a very difficult process for those people in employment until that point. 

It's not a simple choice by any means but the more we're learning, the more we see how Concurrent Planning fits in with our life and what we have to offer


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## thespouses

That's lovely to hear!

I think if we go ahead with this our plan would be for me to go part time on an annual hours contract - with no hours at all in the first 6-9 months - then both of us part time for the rest of the first year.

Our SW from our previous adoption said that all the babies placed through concurrency are newborns but is that what you've been told?


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## happypenguin

We've been told that the children can be 0-2 years old but from what we're hearing we expect it to be the bottom end of that age bracket


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## thespouses

Don't panic you'll be fine!


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## Wyxie

I think this is a very tempting idea for those looking to have a baby placed at birth, but I felt that the risks were too great and made it not for us.  My husband was initially quite keen, until we talked about the reality of it, which is that foster carers have no rights to speak of, and the child can be taken back at any time.  We have lost enough babies already.  

I can see the massive advantages for the children for whom it works out for, but for every one that it doesn't work out for, potential adopters can be destroyed.  Foster carers know what they are signing up for, they know that they are looking after someone else's child.  People who take part in the foster to adopt scheme are not looking for a child that they may have to give back, and it feels exploitative to me to put potential adopters in this situation.  The lure of a new born baby for those with fertility issues who have wanted a child for so long, without any of the attachment difficulties coming from many moves, is just so strong.  

I spent a long time working in family law.  The Court has a responsibility to place every child back with the birth family if they can.  I have seen "dead certain" cases end up with children going back to birth family, sometimes a biological parent where they have separated from a "bad" partner and cleaned themselves up, sometimes to a member of the extended family who have been assessed as able to provide adequate parenting.  I also know someone for whom foster to adopt did not work out, "their" baby was taken back after 11 months with them, and I don't think they'll ever recover, let along go on to adopt.  I'm sure there are some for whom it will work brilliantly, but this just does not sit right with me at all, in fact it makes me very angry.

To me it feels that the answer is for children to be placed as soon as the placement order is made, if it's that much of a "dead certainty" that Social Services are willing to risk putting a child in the foster to adopt scheme, I'm sure they must also feel it is worth looking for a prospective adopter for the child before the placement order is made and going to panel immediately afterwards.  That would, even with the current timescales, place children at 4 or 5 months.

Even aside from any of that, for us, when concurrency was discussed in relation to a sibling placement, I felt it was grossly unfair on our daughter.  I wouldn't bring a child into the house who would be going for contact with her biological mother; aside from the question of how on earth we would explain that to a 2-3 year old, I would be extremely concerned about the security risk if the biological family ended up with our address.  They shouldn't, but I've seen it happen in the past with foster carers.  I also couldn't bring a sibling into the house that I couldn't guarantee wouldn't be taken away again.  I think it would raise massive doubts in Wyxling's head if another child we told her was her sibling was removed, and I'm not sure she would recover from that.


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## happypenguin

I understand all of that however for us as a couple it is the right choice.
We have no children and a great support network and are not looking for a baby to fulfill a need in either of us. Our desire was initially to foster and, as such, we are well aware of the boundaries relating to a looked after child.

Nor are we desperate for a 'keeper'. What we want is to work together with social services and the birth parents and any extended family to cover every avenue for the child to return home. If, for whatever reason this doesn't happen / isn't possible we have enough love and time to offer the child a safe and stable home. Forever.

Anyone looking into concurrency will be made totally aware of the issues around the process and the SW should flag up concerns about anyone seeing this as an 'easy way' to adopt a child.
Our eyes are wide open, we're happy with everything and are fully supportive of all our foster carer friends and our adoptive family friends. We're blessed to find an option that suits our family


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## happypenguin

The other point that I am keen to discuss is that, should the child return home, then we (the foster carers) will bear the brunt of any emotional upheaval - which is exactly as it should be. We will  grieve for and miss the child that we had cared for but this is not "our child" and that's the important thing. 
"Our child" only becomes a reality with an adoption order

It's a scary place to stand as a caring human person but we know we can recover from any of it in time. A child passed around the system may not.


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## thespouses

Most babies who go into foster care in the US (and they are looked after for very similar reasons) go to foster carers who hope to adopt, though there are foster only homes too there.

The FCs cope - and so do their older children - with contact, with the uncertainty, with babies going home. I don't think adults and families are that radically different in the UK that we can't cope here, if we go into it with our eyes open! It's just a cultural thing to my mind here - the culture of adoption here is that there are foster homes and adoptive homes, and that there should be very little direct contact between adoptive families and birth families, so anything different is viewed with suspicion.

In fact, in the US, almost all fostered babies (including those who will probably go to a relative, or back home after mum comes out of a psychiatric institution, or where there's no previous evidence BPs can't get their act together), will go to this type of home.  So families are even less likely to end up adopting the baby.

The people I've been in contact with just have to say, we will give this baby a home for as long as they need.  And our view is, we want to give a baby a good start in life. The best start is to have continuity of care.


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## superal

Wow.................I read the last few posts and it brought back a lot of memories for me and my family.
YES please go into this with your eyes wide open and do it because you want to give a child the best start in life. 
I have to say that you NEVER fully get over a child being returned to their birth parents and I am talking from experience...............nearly 13 years down the line the hurt is still there.
We were also told the baby we were looking after was a dead cert..if their is such a thing......would stay with us............7 months later she went back to her birth parents.
You learn to cope and we were very lucky to go down the traditional route and adopt a 9 month old baby......I would not swap our DD for the world BUT I can't help but think how the baby we looked after is doing as she is now a year older than our DD and I know how wonderful our DD has turned out and I wish the same for baby "S" & thats where the hust comes in/  Once the baby/child is returned you have no contact with them.................foster carers do have contact if possible and most adopters do keep FCs informed how their child is but with conucrrency you don't get this support.
Have a strong support network around you, talk to others going through the process & i hope everything works out find for everyone strong enough to go down this route.


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## thespouses

I guess the lesson is that we should NOT believe even if we are told it is a dead cert!

From reading all the stories from the US foster-to-adopt families they are always very very cautious and they take absolutely everything the SWs say with a huge bucketload of salt! And they also recognise that they cannot control what will happen but realise that they will be likely to be upset themselves, and prepare for that. And as you say, good support!

If anyone would be interested in chatting online to a large group of people who have done this then the forums at adoption.com have loads and loads of people who do this.  They also have something called concurrency and it's what the UK model is based on but it's a little different I think.

I think from our POV because we would be FCs who are hoping to adopt, we would try our best to see ourselves as FCs, but we recognise we couldn't keep fostering baby after baby in the hope that one went on to have an adoption plan (and that's what a lot of US FCs actually do), but at some point we'd have to say either, we want to adopt again but not like this, or we have been FCs now and made a difference to some children but we will now keep to our family of 3.

superal in a tiny tiny way I think I know what you mean about wondering what happened to children, I have volunteered with children where parents or relatives say I've made a big difference but then you never find out what happened, and you do care very deeply. I also informally fostered a little boy when I was living overseas and I wonder what he's up to too (and I know it might not be good, in his case!)


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## superal

I was actually put in touch with a family who did concurrency in the US and they had experienced what we were going through..we were the first people for it to happen to in the UK............someone had to be the first!   Anyway everything I was going through she could sympathise with as our stories were very much the same and even though SWS try to give you all the details/chances ect of what to expect she also said she was not prepared and the heartache of not knowing is the hardest thing of all.
A good support network is what is needed and people to talk to who have been trhough it, unfortunatly there was no one in the UK at the time for us as we were the first and I certainlly know we weren't the last to go trhough it.  Lots of people deal with things in different ways and by no way is it easy.


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## happypenguin

Hi Superal, I'm really glad you added to the thread - I recall going back over your posts on this before we made the decision to go ahead. I remember being utterly grateful to see your point of view and your experience because it really nipped any thoughts that this process might be 'easy' in the bud. I cried when I read your story.

I think what I did was search long and hard and find examples of some heartbreaking stories - it really helped to put everything in perspective so that when we said 'yes' we said it with all of the facts. 

I really do feel that, in order to go ahead with Concurrency right now, I need to be able to bear the weight of any heartbreak/loss - I have been through some horrific experiences in my life which I think have tested my strength & courage to the limit. Whether I could recover from anything around this process (if it were to be harsh) only time will tell. I'm certain I'll report back either way.


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## happypenguin

Hello annarosie,

Sorry, I was posting at the same time you did.

I think these forums are the best way sometimes to come to a decision about what you feel you'd like to do in your own circumstances. I did the same with the fertility treatment forums, I read, considered and decided what I couldn't deal with & I'm grateful for that. It stopped me from going down some avenues that I know I wasn't comfortable with.

We have no children and I think that this helped our decision to choose concurrency.

Good luck on your journey and I hope to keep up with your story


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## superal

Hi happypenguin
I can tell from reading your posts that you are going into concurrency with your eyes wide open and a sensible head on your shoulders!
Concurrency is hard and emotional draining BUT with a good support network and the focus being on the child's best interest you will get through this and give a child the emotional help and support for the start of their life.
Reference hardships...............please be aware that no matter what you have been through before & I have been through many myself...I can't list them on here as I don't really want everyone knowing my buisness.....lol............the return of a child no matter how strong you think you are and that you can deal with it................please be aware it's a grieving process again and if it did happen that the child was returned .....give yourself some time  to grieve.......I did.....my lovely DH didn't......................took him along time to talk about her and he still fills up now when her name is mentioned.......then he'll look at our DD and he know thinks along the same lines as me...............baby "S" only needed us for 7 months of her life where as our DD needs us for the rest of her life!.....this has helped me tremendously.
I wish you lots of luck as you venture down this new avenue and if I can offer any help or support to you through this venture then please feel free to PM me.  There will be days when you just want to shout and other days when you will be just fine!
Good luck
Andrea


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## happypenguin

Thank you Andrea. Your support is appreciated


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## GERTIE179

Hi,

I'm not sure if any of you are AUK members but I saw this notice regarding views and input being requested for Adoption leave in Foster to Adopt cases. As this was one of our initial barriers to Concurrency I wondered if others wished to offer their views on how this could work with the new proposals
X
http://www.adoptionuk.org/s/forum/108012/forum/


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## thespouses

Gertie any chance you could try and find a direct link? that just goes to the main forum.


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## thespouses

Hi, it actually wasn't on concurrency, sorry, it was on fostering to adopt which is a different process.


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## thespouses

Fostering to adopt is short term approval as FC so a linked child can be placed immediately upon matching, or something like that. Concurrency is placing a child straight from BPs with FCs who are also approved as adopters.


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## thespouses

No, in foster to adopt the child has already been in foster care before being moved to the adoptive home, and the adoptive parents are also approved as foster carers, so the child can be moved in earlier.


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## gettina

Hello
My SW has just thrown us a major curve ball as we reach the final couple of hs sessions, by saying the la has recently started trialling concurrency and would we like to be considered for it? She knows I'd like as young a child/baby as possible. 
She says they would only do it with babies that they were pretty sure would not go back to bps. So many positives about early stability and consistency from being with us from a younger age and skipping the FC time and departure and I have no problem (at least in theory) with the Bp contact but omg the potential devastation.

Dh thinks we couldn't cope it we lost the child. And your posts make v sobering ready Andrea- thank you for sharing your sad experience.

I don't really have a q tbh as no one can give me a guarantee that this could make not break my heart which is what l'd like; just wanted to tell some one my head is spinning as I'm so attracted to the  idea of it but scared to even consider it.

Gettina x


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## superal

Hi gettina
A lot( I hope) has changed since we did concurrency.......in that I mean the after support...........we knew the little baby we were looking after had a chance to go back to her BPS...SW are wrong to say that they would only deal with babies that would not go back to their BPS.the whole idea of the scheme is to reunited the BF and to cause less disruption ot the child..fewere moves! 
When we did concurrency we acutally didnt get a 2 day old baby as there was no chance the BM wqould get her back and the powers that be who make the decisions of what children will be placed down the concurrency route said it was unfair for the BM!!  
Anyway rambling a bit there (again).........what I am trying to say is that to do concurrency you have to be strong, phyiscally/mentally..........with a good support system around you ..YOU can do this.............you have to weigh up all the pros and cons of doing concurrency...........why do want to go down this route...if people are honest....they want a baby........I will behonest  here and tell you why we did it and that was simply because we wanted a baby..........at the time of adopting many many years ago there were very few babies to adopt...........now a days there are more and more babies coming into the system and there are babies to adopt.
The benefits you offer to a child in the stability of looking after them whilst the SWS make their decisions about the child are fantastic to the child..............thats one bit I dont regret...........I gave baby "S" the love/support that she needed for 7 months that she wouldn't have originally got from her BPS........its jsut the reality of heartbreak to deal with if a child goes back.........this is the reason I type my story..not to put people off but to give them an insight of what is asked of you and to let you know what could happen.
My final point before I ramble any more...lol...is contacts..............be prepared these are not easy!!!!  You take the child you are looking after to meet the BPS so many times a week..I orignally was doing 3 contacts for 4 hours a day which then went up to 5 contact...6 hrs a day!  The drive up and down the motorway was draining enough but to then pick baby up and "deal" with the comments passed to you by the BPS.they dont hold back on what they feel about you..some are great and know they have little chance of getting the baby back and support SWS/you in caring for theri child and others will be rude/hurt/angry and say things to hurt you. Having to deal with baby who now does not know who they are going to do is hard as well.
Good luck to everyone who goes down the concurrency route.
Andrea


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## galaxy girl

You know I was confused about the title's too. We are actually fostering to adopt then!! Not doing concurrency . When our children were placed contact dropped to monthly and has since dropped again.


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## thespouses

Galaxy girl, I didn't think they'd actually brought in fostering to adopt yet, though maybe in some parts of the country.


If the decision has already been made that the children will be adopted, then I think it counts as fostering to adopt.


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## happypenguin

I must admit to being a little confused about the differences between Concurrent Care & Foster To Adopt!
I have Concurrent Care sorted out in my head (as that's our route) so I'll just have to 'park' the other scheme so I don't get muddled up.

We're still ploughing through our Home Study sessions - I almost wish I had something a little more exciting to post about


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## thespouses

I think people will inevitably get mixed up especially as the two schemes are being promoted around the same time.

Do you get a sense of how your HS sessions are different from straight adoption/fostering HS sessions? I know you haven't done either before but has the SW gone over the difference?


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## HannahLou

Yes annarosie, that's what we saw and asked our sw about. We were told foster to adopt and concurrency were the same.


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## thespouses

Coram talk about both concurrency and "early permanency" on their website as if they are different. I don't think they are the same.


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## thespouses

This document has a little bit on the differences between the two.

http://www.childrenengland.org.uk/upload/Fostering_and_Adoption_Briefing-Final.pdf

(and this is not very positive about the idea of fostering for adoption but explains how it works - it sounds like a child moves as soon as the plan is adoption - but NOT straight from birth family. Concurrency is usually straight from birth family:

http://www.cypnow.co.uk/cyp/news/1077228/college-sounds-warning-fostering-adoption-plans)


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## galaxy girl

We are def fostering to adopt!!!


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## thespouses

Bump! 
Just to say since last posting we have found several other LAs who are doing concurrency but some call it foster to adopt.


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## tinkerbell80

Hi can someone tell me more about Concurrency/Foster to adopt? Our Social Worker mentioned this today and we would like to know more information.
1~ how young are the children placed
2~ what is the likelyhood of the child going back to Birth Parents
3~ are attachments and bonds harder to form?
4~ what are the timescales before the decision to return or start the adoption/care proceedings
Sorry for all the questions, I just want to get my head around it.


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## somedaysoon

Hi everyone,

We have recently started the process towards becoming concurrent carers. Have just had our  medicals and now waiting for police checks etc to come back. It is very hard to prepare emotionally for this, as we dont know how we'll feel if the child placed with us returns. It must be devastating, but we enter into the process from the point of view of foster carers giving a child the best start. We dont have children of our own but don't want to pursued ivf etc any more.we would both possibly like to foster in the future. Hopefully our 'Skills to foster' course should help us to learn a bit more about how foster  carers deal with loss.

It has been interesting reading all your responses about concurrency. I'll have to read your story, Superal to see how you dealt with the grief. It must have been a difficult time.

Tinkerbell, the children placed in concurrency programmes are usually 0 to 2 years old though some may be fostered with an older sibling. There is an 85 to 92% likelihood that the child will eventually be adopted by the concurrent carers. As for attachment, I can't really comment but I would imagine you are bound to bond with the child. I asked about this on my first phonecall to our agency, and was answered with the comment, "you should make every effort to form attachments as if you don't, who will?" I suppose that they meant forming attachments was a major part of a child's development. I wonder if foster carers really do maintain some distance to save their feelings though. In terms of time scales, if it is the 'pure form' of concurrent planning, an intensive programme of training and assessments is carried out for 6 months with the birth parent. At the end of this, a decision sbout the child's future will be made. It then takes another 6 months or so to go through the legal process of adoption if this decision is reached.

Looking forward to learning more from everyone's experience and going through all this together!


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## tinkerbell80

Thank you, we are not ruling it out just waiting for our la to get us more information. Attachments are not the problem for me it would be the letting go. 
I will be following this topic with interest.


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## Louanne

We have been approved to adopt or foster to adopt and have had a horrible time since looking at over 12 profiles, none of which were right for us. One profile we were not short listed  .

Our SW has approached us with a Foster to Adopt placement which seems (so far) like it is exactly what we are looking for.

I have cleared things with work who will allow me unpaid leave until the adoption panel and then I can take adoption leave. All in all I can take approx 12 months off.

Our SW seems to think that in this case, it is highly likely we will foster for up to 6 months. Therefore I would have to agree with work that I would then only take 6 months paid leave ( which can be slightly flexible).

It is still so early though and there are a lot of questions, legal wise, that our agency can not yet answer and so we are still really at a 50/50 chance of the placement going ahead. As the agency have never done a F2A placement before they are waiting for a meeting with the legal team before they can come back to us with answers.

It is so hard because we are hoping and praying this will work out right for us, it would be a dream come true! The baby is due mid Feb but we are unsure if things will be cleared by then so may not be able to bring baby home right away.

Something about this though feels very different to the other profiles we have seen. Obviously preparing for the worst but we both have a strong feeling about it which we can't explain.

Fingers crossed as we wait!


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## happypenguin

The very best of luck. Fingers crossed that this profile is the one for you


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## Louanne

happypenguin said:


> The very best of luck. Fingers crossed that this profile is the one for you


Thank you Happypenguin


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## Arrows

Good luck!


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## Louanne

Arrows said:


> Good luck!


Thank you.

We are going to meet a couple who have been through the F2A process very recently so hopefully this will give us some clear information on the process.


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## Louanne

So a quick update. We have decided to say yes for this placement based on evidence gathered by our SW eek! 

We have to be signed as temporary foster careers and now we are just waiting until we can take baby home.

We have been advised this won't be until the courts have decided which is not a guarantee, although chances are extremely high in these circumstances.

Our meeting went well with the couple who did the F2A and they explained they new several couples who have done the same and the babies have never gone back which was really good to hear.

And so we continue to wait...

If anyone would like to ask any questions about the process feel free to message me and I will try and help as best I can


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## gettina

Wishing you well Louanne. 
Exciting and scary.

Keep us posted.
Gettina x


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## becs40

Hi,
We are interested in a potential foster to adopt link and wanted to speak to anyone who has been through the process. I know there's a couple on here that have but sorry can't remember who, I know one of them the child was returned so would love to hear both sides of the coin so to speak and just find out more what sort of things we should be trying to find out.
Thank you.

Becs
This is the main Concurrency thread. I have merged your query here 
Good luck
DE


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## GERTIE179

Search the Forum under FTA, Foster to Adopt or Concurrency and a few threads and experiences come up.
good luck x


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## becs40

Thank you DE.


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## Forgetmenot

Can you let me know becs, i couldn't really find much xx


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## becs40

Will do forgetmenot. I've pm'd a couple of people as can't find a huge amount on the threads themselves as understandably people pm!


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## Forgetmenot

Fab! I messaged a few, but stuff is from a while ago... Fingers crossed you can get some up to date info.
Our sw should have more for us, but she hasn't of yet!!!
Like you I want to know both sides xx


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## becs40

I would just like to know more about what sort of questions we should be asking as in what is available and we need to know at this stage. I know there is no medical report or CPR because of there being no placement order but that's about it.


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## Louanne

Louanne said:


> So a quick update. We have decided to say yes for this placement based on evidence gathered by our SW eek!
> 
> We have to be signed as temporary foster careers and now we are just waiting until we can take baby home.
> 
> We have been advised this won't be until the courts have decided which is not a guarantee, although chances are extremely high in these circumstances.
> 
> Our meeting went well with the couple who did the F2A and they explained they new several couples who have done the same and the babies have never gone back which was really good to hear.
> 
> And so we continue to wait...
> 
> If anyone would like to ask any questions about the process feel free to message me and I will try and help as best I can


Sorry I have not been on for a while, we have had a lot happen over the past few months and not all of it good.

The placement mentioned above did in fact, despite us being assured it was a 99% guarantee! fall through in court. Baby was returned to BP which we did not even think was an option. So we grieved and we also learned, a lot.

We got back on the band wagon after a few weeks but nothing came up and we were back in what feels like a huge black hole. Then we learned of another LO at the end of April. However as we were discussing it a member of the family came forward so we pulled out. Back into the black hole. It was such a low time for us, we were heartbroken. Our trust was at an all time low.

A few weeks passed and we got a call to say the family member had pulled out. This meant every avenue possible had been exhausted and they were waiting for another court date if we were still interested. Of course we were as things were a lot further down the line and we understood a lot more than before. Still cautious however we agreed if it was agreed in court we would say yes. At this point baby was almost 3 months old. We did not let ourselves get attached to the idea and got on with life as normal. We were told no one knew when the hearing would be as it wasn't an emergency, baby was in the same foster placement from birth.

Around a week later, on a miserable Monday morning at work I got a call. They were in court that morning and if approved we were to meet our LO on Friday for a weekend of intros and then bring baby home the following Monday! To say it was a whirl wind was an understatement! We only had new born items from the last placement falling through so it was a mad dash to grab some bits and bobs. Intros went brilliant and our LO fitted in perfectly. Life is amazing now.

We had 7 contact sessions to attend over 3 months they get less and less as time goes on. We don't see them due to high risks involved which is a shame really.

We have our final hearing end of August and one contact session left after that. We had a visit from the Guardian who is in favour of adoption, as is the judge who has said so already in court. It is literally formalities being followed at the moment but will soon be complete.

We are very lucky this time round, we also learned so much, the hard way! But all is worth it now. We've had our LO since beginning on June and it's just amazing. Just got to get the last niggly bit out the way. Almost there!


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## becs40

Hi Louanne,
The court session that approved things I assume was a court deciding f2a was the right path rather than a placement order? It's very confusing and so little info on the stages involved with f2a.


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## Keeping busy

Louanne, every thing tightly crossed for you xxx


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## somedaysoon

Will be watching this thread as we are right in the middle of a concurrent placement. Like you, Louanne we thought everything looked set for adoption,  but now other relatives have appeared.   this is a difficult process, but still think it's in the best interests of our little one.


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## Laws1612

Hi all just wanted to pop my head in we are being approved for foster to adopt as well as normal adoption...was great to read the stories...it's such a hard process but can be so rewarding.....stay strong ladies...xxx


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## Thepinklady

Hi all, I have been lurking on here for a while but not posted. Myself and DH are nearing the end of our assessment for concurrency. Our first plan had been for me to take a career break for a year and then move onto adoption leave. This has been agreed in principle by my employers, I am a teacher. Over the last week I have begun to realise that it is likely that if it moves to adoption the matching panel and placement for adoption will happen before the end of the year of career break and this would mean I could not claim adoption leave pay. I am now wondering should I be asking for a period of unpaid leave for up to a year and then I would hopefully be able to claim adoption leave at the appropriate time. I know there are a few of you currently doing concurrency and wonder if any of you can help with my query. 

These boards have been very helpful in our journey. We are excited to be nearing the end but also nervous now as we try to iron out practicalities.


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## Flash123

Hiya and congrats on nearing the end, the light is shining at the end of the tunnel  I too am a teacher and I was under the impression that you could take unpaid leave on a term by term or even half term by half term basis. That way you could terminate that agreement as and when you needed it in order to receive your adoption leave. I may well be wrong and I am sure someone with greater knowledge will be able to answer you with more certainty. 
Take care flash


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## Thepinklady

Thanks flash, I am beginning to think that is how I will need to go. I will try to speak yo some people today for advice. Thanks


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## Mummy DIY Diva

Will you not get paid by the la as a fc in the in trim?  In which case if you work for that la as a teacher you will get continuous service and adoption pay.  Sorry if I'm talking rubbish but that was my impression of concurrency but it wasn't for us so we didn't look into it in depth,  good luck xx


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## dreamingofabettertime

Hi all, 

I thought I would add my post as I have just (and I do mean just) been through the 'foster to adopt' process with great success....

I adopted our first child last year and then birth Mum fell pregnant again and we got offered first choice as there were 'no significant changes' since previous assessment.... we didn't have long to wait (although every day felt like forever!) and then our darling baby (our child's full sibling)was born and the best bit is we had him straight from the hospital....a miracle!

The difference is huge as when we had our first child he was developmentally delayed and very small for age due to several foster placements (he was only 6 months and had had 4 different foster carers). We look at his growth chart and you can see the dips when he changed foster carers and then when we got him a rapid gain. Our second son has had a steady growth, is ahead developmentally and never stops smiling. I am not suggesting that you should not adopt a child that has been in multiple foster care (quite the contrary as the difference you can make a to a child's life is incredible) but wanted to show you what having a child from the very beginning can do to a child emotionally and physically. 

Rather than write a lot more I am happy to answer any questions about the process/contact etc and glad to be able say despite the obvious stress it was the most incredible experience. 

Yes there are uncertainties and risk but if you have a good SW who can give you a confident 'YES' to the question 'has there been no significant change in the birth families life', then you have good odds that things will run in your favour. I have also mentored 4 other couples through their process so can give you some honest responses on what can happen if there is significant change in circumstances and the impact a judge can have on a process that appears to be straight forwards. 

I absolutely adore my children and the difference this process has made to all our lives is incredible. Our second child automatically felt familiar as he looked like his brother which made him feel like ours straight away. We would spend hours studying him and looking for similarities (just like you would do if you had your own birth child), it felt natural and very much the right thing to do for our family. 

Would I do it again...yes! It was not easy as there were times when we thought he would be placed in mother and baby unit but the risk was worth it as we have him and every minute we had with him we cherished until the final order went through. 

Regarding the law and support for foster carers/adoption the law will change in 2015 giving foster to adoption leave however there is no support now. The solution....Save up your annual leave, do overtime and bank it, take unpaid leave or negotiate a career break......life is so short to not enjoy every minute of what you will have in front of you....you will find a solution. For me I chose to take a career break so I don't have the pressure of returning to work....we have had to tighten our belts but it will not be forever.

I will await your questions rather than write a lot now.

Best wishes X


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## becs40

Wow fabulous post. We're in the early stages of investigating a f2a placement. Lo is currently 2 months old, we're at ap in just over a week so plan is if we all want to go ahead move for lo would be arranged ASAP. We've sent a lot of questions through to lo's sw and are just trying to find out more. I've also been told I can take unpaid leave from work until placement order then go onto adoption leave. 
Really positive to hear how wonderful if us when it works! Congratulations!


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## Caroline S

Hi girls, 

Just wondered if any one had a BC and then did fostering to adopt?  Our SW has said we need to look at it as we are looking for a girl 0-2 years and its unlikely we will get a match through adoption, but possible through FTA.  DD is only 4 and thinks shes getting an adopted little sister, if we go ahead with FTA, we will be getting a baby girl staying with us instead.  Don't know what to do.

Thanks


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## dreamingofabettertime

I have birth children who I had to consider above everything else in our FTA discussions but it was slightly different than your circumstances as we had adopted one child already and then along came his brother (FTA). For us it was about doing the right thing for a child that was already ours, however we had to deal with a lot of uncertainty/heartache/stress where at any time that FTA baby could have gone back.

So to your question....no one can tell you what to do you need to carefully way up the risks for yourself and especially for your BC. FTA is very risky as nothing is straight forwards and a lot depends on what the court decides (despite what SW tell you). If it goes well it is fantastic but you must be prepared to take a very bumpy journey first (very stressful on you = very stressful on your birth child)

They have targets to achieve regarding FTA so the bit where it was suggested that you wont get a child under 2 unless you FTA is completely untrue as there are many, many babies waiting to be adopted who are currently waiting to go through the courts for adoption (it just takes too long). I know many foster carers who have babies waiting to be matched.

I adopted a baby (we were told there were none out there!) and others on my initial training course have all adopted under 2. You need to stick to your original brief and you will find that little person (as believe me he or she is out there waiting for you), you just need to be determined to get there and be patient. You need to do what is right for your family, don't jump into something that doesn't feel right as this is a long term commitment and getting the best fit for you is the first part about getting it right long term.

Wishing you the very best and happy to answer any other questions. X


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## Caroline S

Thank you so much for that.  Our gut feel is that DD is too young to understand FTA, so to leave it for another year, then reconsider it.  Its would be hard enough for us, let alone a 4 year old.  Thanks again. x


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## dreamingofabettertime

Caroline, please remember there are babies out there through normal adoption routes. Be strong and persuasive with your social worker. 

Much luck X


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## Barbados Girl

Hi Dreaming.  Do you not think that the impact of the re BS decision has made it much harder for LAs to get placement orders and the knock on effect being that there are fewer babies available for adoption now (as in the last year or so)? That is certainly what sws have been saying to us. Adoption Link also sent out an email about this.


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## dreamingofabettertime

Sorry don't understand your question what is the abbreviation BS decision?
Thanks


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## Barbados Girl

It was a very important Court decision made in, I think, late 2012 which set out guidelines for when placement orders should be made and emphasised the need for sws to very carefully check all options, including independent bf assessments and kinship carers. Sws' feedback while we were being linked is that it's effects have really now filtered through to the county courts and LAs are finding it that more difficult to obtain placement orders. I have also heard, anecdotally that what is happening is that kinship arrangements or supported arrangements with bfs are taking place which ultimately do not succeed and then the LA has to ask for a placement order again. So the knock on effect is that children are becoming available for adoption but when they are older and have had more moves. This has also led to there being far fewer babies available for adoption in the last twelve months or so, effectively the bfs are being given more chances. 

My info has only come from what these sws were experiencing as I don't think there are stats available (although I think the number of placement orders generally have dipped). Also Adoptionlink sent out an email basically saying the same thing. I don't know if this is consistently what is happening. It could just be localised across certain Courts. You said there were babies out there and I just wondered whether this was based on the current position and whether you had seen any changes due to the re BS decision?

I am just looking to the future (or jumping the gun!) and thinking about what the position will be like if we decided to adopt again (I am a worrier, we are only 1 1/2 weeks into placement!)


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## dreamingofabettertime

My source is from the fostering network who are being placed with more babies as social services are encouraged to recognise the signs earlier and place at birth, but more often that not in these cases placements are due to birth mothers having multiple children so the baby goes straight away due to previous history and adoption orders placing other children. Huge government emphasis is being given to Foster to Adopt with LA's as this enables a child limited disruption as the child will not have change going from fostering to adoption with one family. It is particularly successful with history of other adoptions in the family and 'no significant change in circumstances'. 

What I do know is SW's are encouraged to tell you that there are only older children available (as sadly there are a lot more waiting for a match). We were told we would stand no hope of getting a baby and asked to consider a teenager or a child over 7 as we already had older children. We stuck to our guns and were matched with a baby who was at that time 4 months old, it took a while to go through to the next stage (which was very frustrating for us) but were placed at 6.5 months (amazing!!).....but to then be offered 10 months later his sibling newborn baby, it was simply a miracle which is why we went for foster to adopt. Would we have gone for it first time around, no as there is too much risk of something going wrong. But as we already had the babies sibling the decision was different for us as he was already part of our family before we even met him.

Wishing u VERY BEST WISHES. X

I think sometimes there is a lot of propaganda in adoption and not enough research.


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## Barbados Girl

V interesting, ta. Also very interested in your FTA experience of your second. Our bub is the fifth sibling to be adopted and if bm does have another then I imagine placement orders would be obtained in fairly short order (which was the case for our son) but FTA might also be an option. I LOVE to think ahead as you can see!


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## dreamingofabettertime

In our case we got asked when BM was pregnant, we were fast-tracked through to become foster to adopt parents & ratified all in a very short time (we only had to update the PAR to include our adopted child). Baby born and then became official foster parents, then waited to go through emergency/interim and final hearing, then became adoptive parents and went through entire process end to end within 5 months (best bit is that we shared every minute with our baby from 3 days old.....he didn't experience change or disruption.....we even took him into the panel meeting!!!!) XX 

There were a few really, really scary bits especially the emergency hearing where baby could have gone to mother & baby unit however like you there are other siblings and lots of evidence no change in circumstances. 

XX
P.S It is very good that you are thinking of the future because we only had a very short time from finding out she was pregnant to buying babygrows! Planning is good!!


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## Louanne

Final court hearing over. We have the adoption order! Baby is ours! Just waiting for panel and then we apply to be legal parents. 

For those asking, I am on unpaid leave from work but get foster pay. After panel we will get a matching certificate which produces adoption pay (back dated in my case). Everyone is different though.


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## GERTIE179

Louanne - do you not mean something different as AO is only granted after you've applied to the courts to Adopt? Also do you still have to wait for the mandatory timeframe after Placement Order in case the BPs appeal and is there still the minimum of 10weeks after MP before you can submit paperwork or has the legalities of that changed?

Congrats on the good news x


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## dreamingofabettertime

Louannes news is fantastic, well done you!!

To answer GERTIE179: 
The 10 week clock starts from when baby is placed, so for us it was at 3 days old and as our little one was over ten weeks at point of PO we went straight to matching panel (a requirement) then being adoptive parents (from foster parents) and were able to then put court application in for adoption order. 

The only waiting was for ratification approx. 10 days after panel (see point 1 & 5 below) (fostering to adopt panel (not necessary from July 2014) & matching panel (still a requirement)).

To recap on stages:
1. Foster to Adopt Panel
2. Emergency Order (if there is immediate to risk to child)
3. Interim Order
4. Placement Order
5. Matching panel 
6. Adoption Order


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## becs40

Fabulous news Louanne! I bet you feel a huge weight lifted from you, congratulations!


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## Louanne

Couldnt have said it better myself thank you 



dreamingofabettertime said:


> Louannes news is fantastic, well done you!!
> 
> To answer GERTIE179:
> The 10 week clock starts from when baby is placed, so for us it was at 3 days old and as our little one was over ten weeks at point of PO we went straight to matching panel (a requirement) then being adoptive parents (from foster parents) and were able to then put court application in for adoption order.
> 
> The only waiting was for ratification approx. 10 days after panel (see point 1 & 5 below) (fostering to adopt panel (not necessary from July 2014) & matching panel (still a requirement)).
> 
> To recap on stages:
> 1. Foster to Adopt Panel
> 2. Emergency Order (if there is immediate to risk to child)
> 3. Interim Order
> 4. Placement Order
> 5. Matching panel
> 6. Adoption Order


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## GERTIE179

Thanks for clarifying


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## DRocks

We are now also approved for foster to adopt, it isn't our first choice but it's one we are fully willing to look into should the need arise.


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## becs40

Yay excellent news Disney! Good luck.


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## TillyF

Can you foster to adopt through a charity or does I have to be a local authority? 
Thanks


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## dreamingofabettertime

Thought the link would be useful to those that need further information about Foster for Adoption (please note this is not concurrency as stated in the thread title):
http://www.first4adoption.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Fostering-for-Adoption-Becoming-a-Carer.pdf

Foster for adoption is about no significant change in circumstances...e.g birth father is same as previous child that was placed for adoption, risk has been assessed recently or is the same.

Best wishes

/links


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