# 40+ afro-caribbean, overwhelmed with DE Journey, seeking advice



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hello
Due to my old eggs, have been advised to use DE (DD as single). It has taken me awhile to come  to terms with DE however the thought of not having a child saddens me. Reading other peoples experiences has given me the courage to continue as the desire to have a child is so strong. There seems to be a real shortage of DE for ethnic minorities in the UK which feels like another hurdle but prefer to cycle here mainly to avoid using anonymous donors. Finding this journey overwhelming and and would appreciate hearing from ladies in a similar situation and where you sought treatment, here or abroad and the outcome? 
Thanks

Heddie x


----------



## andromedaE9 (Sep 23, 2015)

Hi Heddie

Just saw your message and didn't want to read and run. 

I am currently in between treatments as I am having laparoscopies to remove endometriosis. I have done one cycle of OE IVF (BFN)and only produced average quality eggs. My AMH is already low and depending on the outcome of the second lap in Sept I might need to use DE.

I am in a similar position to you when it comes to needing an ethnic minority donor and in my case Oriental DE. I have been told that oriental DE are very hard to find in the UK and the wait might be long.  Have you heard of Altrui? They are an egg donation agency and I have seen afro caribbean donors listed on their website so it IS possible.

x


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi andromedaE9 

Wasn't expecting such a quick response, really glad you replied.

I started my IVF journey late (42) and had my AMH tested as part of other various test and that too came back v. low which i half expected. I was given 5% success rate at the time. Prior to treatment, I had to go through surgery to remove fibroids so kind of emphasise with your situation.  

It's a shame there is such a limited supply of ethnic donor eggs here. I do know that some clinics have tried specifically recruiting ethnic DEs but the problem still exists. 

Thanks for the heads up on Altrui agency, I have heard of them. Currently researching clinics to contact so will definitely look into them too.  How do you feel about DE? 

Wishing you luck with your next steps, hope it all goes well and you're able to proceed with treatment with a successful outcome whether it be OE or DE. Keep me posted x

Heddie x


----------



## andromedaE9 (Sep 23, 2015)

Hi Heddie

I started the IVF journey pretty late too (40).

I want to be thinking that as long as we are able to create a family it doesn't matter how we are creating it , but I'm not sure how I would actually react if they would tell me tomorrow that I could no longer use my own eggs. I am adopted and I used to think that the genetic link was important but I don't feel as strongly about that anymore. Maybe because having a family is more important to me now. 

xx

x


----------



## boggins (Feb 16, 2015)

Hi there. I'm not of ethnic  background.  But like you age means using De.  I tried Icsi with oe twice  although I was advised it was unlikely to work. De became the only option but it won't matter once your  baby is in your arms.  It has grown  in your  tummy  been fed by your  body and it's part  of you.  My sister  too has gone through the same  and  her children are hers you will not feel any differently  towards your baby. Once you start the process  it  becomes  irrelevant. I'm not sure where you are but there is a donor centre in Harley  st .Good luck.  X


----------



## Hopeful_one (May 23, 2016)

Hello, hope you don't mind me joining the conversation but your stories struck a chord with me. 
Like you I have started my ivf journey vey late (mid 40s) and am also from an ethnic background, Indian in my case.  I've just had a failed first cycle using OE as part of a multiple cycle package so there is a high likelihood that I might have to go down the DE route eventually. 

I had no idea there were agencies out there that you can use! I suppose I'm hoping that I may have a miracle with OE option before I go down DE road. 

Heddie and andromeda - I wish you both lots of luck in your I find journey. I look forward to hearing about your successes whichever path you have choose.


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi andromeda, totally agree with you about how families are created, there are various routes to parenthood and we are very lucky to be able to explore those options. I am feeling more confident about using DE now and starting the process.  It may be worth talking your feelings through with a counsellor if you have any doubts about moving to DE.

Hello boggins, thanks for those encouraging words, I am feeling excited about starting the process, although I am aware that there might be a chance it won't work first time, i will keep gong until I get there. Knowing someone who has been through it and come out with their much desired child/children makes it easier. My sister has 3 naturally conceived children and is behind me 100% she know how much I've wanted this and has been a shoulder to cry on after my OE disappointments. It's great your sister can support you through this with her own experiences. Where are you in the process? Have you chosen a clinic already? 

Hey Hopeful_one, don't mind at all. Sorry to hear of your failed cycle, I recall my 1st failed cycle it was heartbreaking but don't despair,  it's your first try and you still have more goes so i hope you get your OE miracle . Are you trying the natural IVF approach?  Yes there are agencies that can help recruit DE matches for you, they work with selected clinics, I am aware of Altrui and New Life. There are others but those 2 seem to crop up a lot. 

Looking forward to hearing how you all get on. Will keep you posted on my progress. 

Heddie x


----------



## boggins (Feb 16, 2015)

Hi heddie. I have  been attending the London woman's  clinic  in Harley st. Ive been seeing them for a year now. This started with 2 attempts to use oe. I then went for  De.  But the first  donor was  going to be with  fresh eggs,but ended up with no eggs, so had to find another  donor. We got 9 embryos from the donor. only 3 were of good quality. So we did a fresh transfer with one. I miscarried at 7 weeks. We froze the others. Unfortunately  another  miscarriage  at 5 weeks. I has my  last frozen embryo transfer on 22nd August  and pleased to announce that  I had a positive  pregnancy  test this morning. Are you still looking at clinics.  It's daunting it took me months and  months  to decide.  In the end I stopped  looking at success  rates  because it doesn't really mean  anything. no of them were showing great results for my age. So I thought if it's meant to be it will be. I went for a consultation and felt  comfortable  with them . They are very nice people there


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi Boggins 

Congratulations on your BFP, really pleased for you  .  Hope everything is plain sailing from here on. Sorry to hear of your previous losses, must've been hard to go through.

Still researching clinics, have received a few recommendations so just making enquiries. I did consider LWC when i started treatment but ended up going with another clinic which i regretted. I agree what you say about success rates sometimes that doesn't really count but i suppose it helps guide you when trying to choose a clinic.  I believe it's important to find a clinic that you feel comfortable with and is willing to listen to your concerns and tailor your treatment rather than the one fits all as some tend to do.


----------



## Tiger Smiles (Sep 3, 2016)

Hi Andromeda et al, 
As you mentioned low AMH levels, I just wanted to share with you thar There is hope. &#128515;
In March/April 2016 after the raft blood tests we go through, I was told my AMH was low. 
3.69 nano grams per millilitre was the AMH level. 
Treated under the NHS I was told I had just made treatment as given my age - 40 & AMH level they wouldn't normally treat me. 
I asked was there anything I could do to up the level. I was advised no. 
Obviously ignoring this! I did some research and came across many bits of advice but the most useful came from the Centre for Human Reproduction in New York. Informative & forward thinking videos on YouTube 



 Anyway after taking the supplement DHEA for three months my level has now gone up to 7! So don't despair ladies it can be done. 
As I said, now in my 2nd cycle and have gone private after a BFN 1st time. But trying to stay hopeful and positive. Good luck to all. Xx

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


----------



## morganna (Sep 16, 2008)

Hi Heddie
google Cryobankinternational


they have loads of spern donors of all ethnicities


PM me if you cannot find it.


My baby is nearly 2


she is the spitting image of me when i was a baby ...............


epigenetics have a lot to do with it...........


all is not lost.................


google..............


where there is a will there is a way!!


do not let anything stop you from having your baby!!


think 'out side the box'


and research ...............


love,


Morganna xxx


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi Morganna 

Thank you for your uplifting words, I will definitely check out Cyrobank international. 

I've followed your journey right from the start and hearing how happy you are makes me want this even more.  You have been one of my inspirations.  I can't believe your little one is nearly 2 years old!  I started this journey 4 years ago and it just shows how fast time goes. 

I have already downloaded some information on epigenetics and will be reading up on that and have already received loads of advice and recommendation from other lovely ladies. 

Hi Tiger Smiles, so glad you posted. It's great to hear positive stories from positive people such as yourself, Morganna and the other ladies who have posted. My AMH came in at 0.57 I was devastated beyond words but I was still determined to try with my own eggs and tried all different things to improve my chances. I did consider DHEA but reading up on the side affects scared me. I still think if I had of taken it whether it would have made a difference, i don't know but have decided my age is against me anyway.  Glad to see it has worked for you and will be looking out for your updates. Good luck with your next cycle!

Heddie xx


----------



## Kademu (Jan 24, 2016)

Hi Ladies

Mind if I join you. I am new to posting on boards. I finally feel I have the courage to not just read posts but to share my story as well. I can relate to most of you when it comes to history of fibroids/myomectomy, low AMH levels, failed cycles and the acceptance that DE (I am of African ethnicity) is the only option etc. I have a history of Asherman Syndrome (I've had 4 hysteroscopies to alleviate the problem), issues with uterine lining due to previous surgical procedures etc which further complicates the fertility process. My husband and I have been on this journey for the last 5yrs. We've had 5 IVF cycles. The 1st, 2nd and 3rd IVF cycles were with OE. Unfortunately, we never made it to transfer because the embryos were never viable. The 3rd IVF was mild stimulated IVF because my body never responded well to the aggressive treatment or high meds they prescribe to people with low AMH. At that point it was clear having my own biological child was no longer an option. Despite improving my lifestyle, having acupuncture and taking supplements. 

Being an only child it was difficult to accept that I may never have my own biological child to pass on some of the family traits so it has been a process. The main thing is that we want to have a family and at the end of the day I will be the mother of that child regardless of how he/she was conceived. We've had 2 cycles with DE (in Spain) but unfortunately we've had 2 BFN. We are taking time out for now to figure out what we want to do. Financially we have used all our resources and we're still paying off debt from the previous cycles. We are also emotionally and physically wrecked from the arduous journey we have been through. 

Heddie, you can look up Global Egg Donors. They are based in USA and have a vast group of the ethnic donors. They also have links with clinics in South Africa, Cyprus, USA, Barbados etc. I had a Skype call with the founder last year and she was very approachable. She was able to answer any queries I had. She has gone through the fertility journey herself so she can relate. 

Good luck to you all with you current journeys.


----------



## Altai (Aug 18, 2013)

Hi ladies 

Wishing you best of luck especially heddie my old cycle buddy. 
hope you will find a clinic you are happy with.
I am now debating de issue too as want a sibling for my DD. 

Will be looking for your updates.

X

A.


----------



## Mummytwins (Jun 11, 2016)

Hello beautiful ladies. I'm on a journey too like most of you but mine has become so difficult that my only best hope now is egg donation with surrogacy. Due to the legal issues around surrogacy, we have been advised that the best (and cheapest) place to have the surrogacy is in Ukraine. We don't mind Ukraine. In fact we are willing to go to the length and breadth of the earth to have our baby. The only problem now is that all the clinics we have contacted so far in Ukraine none has black donors. Does anyone have any idea of any clinic or agency in Ukraine who might have some afro-Caribbean egg donors? Would really appreciate any advice anyone can offer.


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi Ladies

Sorry for being AWOL.  Have been dealing with personal issues as well as stressful job.  Thanks for all your suggestions which I have followed up.  

Hi Kademu thanks for your message, it touched me as I see we have been through similar issues, I sent you a PMS.

Hey Altai nice hearing from you, I have replied to your pms.  Hope you and lo are doing well. 

How are the other ladies doing?

Mustbemum sorry to hear you have been through a difficult time.  I have pretty much accepted that ED is the way forward for me.  I see your only option now is surrogacy, I don't really have much advice on this but hopefully someone will come along soon to help you.

Will update shortly on my progress, still undecided as to cycling here and abroad due to the anonymity. Have attended an open day at a London based clinic but decided not to pursue treatment based on gut feeling.  Considering Lister but would appreciate opinions on them if anyone has any?

Will update again soon

Heddie x


----------



## scp (May 16, 2010)

Hi Heddie,

I have been searching FF today trying to work out where to start when it comes to DD as my clinic (The Lister) has recommended I give up on my own eggs as i am now 44.  I noticed your conversation, and thought I had better jump in to reply as I have had 4 OE ICSI cycles at The Lister and know a little bit about their DE set up.  I like the clinic and chose them 4 years ago  predominantly as their results were good and I really liked the consultant I saw initially as he gives you an honest answer to your questions, is a realist, and is very friendly / entertaining.  My second ICSI cycle when I was 40 (in 2012) resulted in my son, so I will be forever grateful to them.

I went back this year to try for a sibling and although the consultant was still the same I found the clinic less personal and so busy that scan / nurse appointments were often very late, phone calls didn't get returned that promptly, and on my last cycle the newbie nurse I had gave me some incorrect advice which resulted in me having to rush back to the UK from a weekend in France mid cycle which cost me a fair bit of cash and was really stressful.  I also got OHSS, which I am annoyed about as they knew my cycles really well so I believe there is no excuse for it.

Anyway DE.  When I spoke to my consultant about DE options a couple of weeks ago at my "failed cycle navel gazing appointment" he basically said the following:
- The current waiting list for egg recipients who are Caucasian is 6-9 months (I have no idea what they are for other ethnic groups). The donors are all egg sharers and the Lister does not have any altruistic egg donors on its books.  Costs with an egg sharer were about £8,000 all in.  No idea how many eggs you are guaranteed.
- If you want an alturistic egg donor they work with Altrui.  Rough costs are:  £1700 Altrui fee, £1500 screening tests for the donor, £750 donor fee (paid to the donor via Altrui), donor's IVF costs + drugs for both of you £8000ish, so about £12K all in. 
- If donor anonymity isn't an issue for you they work with Instituto Bernabeu in Alicante, Spain (which I think works out at about £8,000 without travel costs they also do three cycle "baby guarantee" packages), Embryolab in Greece (no idea on cost), and Shady Grove in the US which costs an absolute fortune but often results in loads of eggs as their donors are very young.

Hope that helps xx

Off to post my "DD beginner" questions somewhere now...


----------



## Sonneblume (Jul 4, 2014)

Hi ladies,
I have been reading everyone on here. I just wanted to say, that some women have had some success with clomid treatment done differently slightly. There seems to be some evidence that taking clomid improves the embryo quality creating 5 day blasts. They collect several blasts in a few cycles and put it back as a FET as the lining may be affected by the clomid. Unfortunately I can not have this option, but I believe this is being offered more and more. There was a lady age 44 who had success. It's not a case of producing lots of embryo's but quality. Also there there is the mini IVF which I'm sure you've all tried where the treatment is shorter and less hard on the ovaries. Look at the Greece section, done at Serum
The other option for DE is Barbados IVF for Afro Caribbean donors, they have some UK staff and the consultant is very efficient and they will do a 'skyped' consult. They will be at the Fertility Show. In comparison to 'Shady Grove'. They are a lot cheaper.. I hope this is helpful, best wishes to you all...


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Evening ladies,

Sonneblume thanks for posting this...I really appreciate it.  I did a clomid cycle back in Feb 2015 but it didn't yield good results for me.  My only embryo failed to reach 5 days so the cycle was cancelled. However a friend of mine was able to get pregnant through this route aged 40+ so it can work for others but sadly not me.  I did my 2nd IVF and clomid cycle at Serum. 

I'm thinking of attending the Fertility Show this year to see if I can talk to a few of the clinics presenting there about ED.  There are a couple I am interested in, I'll check out Barbados IVF too. I did look into SG clinic as they seem very good and have a wider choice of ethnic donors and i know they are affiliated with a clinic in Oxford but yes they are way expensive.  They do do a shared risk programme too.

Thank you for your best wishes and wishing you all the best with yours!


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi scp

Thanks for your input and may I say congratulations on your little boy. I'm so sorry your recent cycle didn't work out as you hoped.  It's a shame the clinic has lost it's personal appeal and has become a bit disorganised.  I think that's the same with other clinics, IVF has become big business as you hear so much about it in the news and with advancing technology it has improved chances for more women who at one point had lost all hope in conceiving. I must admit I never expected to find myself in this position as I always assumed I would have a family the conventional way - IVF never crossed my mind therefore I am happy it is possible for me and more women to be able to access it. 

Thank you so much for the detailed feedback on Lister and the costings, it's very useful information. I was considering them a while back when I did my OE treatment and I was also impressed by the talk their consultant gave at a previous Fertility Show.  I am surprised about the wait for caucasian DE wasn't expecting it to be that long - that means it will be much longer for ethnic DE?

Hope you get answers to your DD questions - best wishes on you quest!

Heddie xxx


----------



## andromedaE9 (Sep 23, 2015)

Hi Heddie,

I thought I'd stop by to say hello. I hope you are ok.

I am currently cycling with Lister and it's a good clinic in general. My consultant is honest and answers e-mails very quickly. The nurses are nice but can be disorganised sometimes. I have only got experience from OE IVF so I don't know how their egg donor programme works but I can see that other women on here has given you very useful information.

I had my excision laparoscopy end of Sept so have been off work for a while. My left ovary has been damaged by the procedure but my clinic advises that I should give it one more try with my OE but if this does not work we will move on to DE.

I have contacted Altrui again to see if it is possible for them to find an oriental egg donor but they have now said that they will only search actively for a donor if we are able to consider a caucasian donor.

This is a link that might be useful to you: www.altrui.co.uk/BAME2016 This is where Altrui lists ethnic minority donors but you need to proactively check the link and at the moment there is none on the list. :-(

A couple of clinics in Cyprus (Bahceci and Team Miracle) say that they have oriental donors. They will be at London Fertility Show so I'm going there to have a chat with them in person. I don't think that we will be using Lister for DE due to the 'issue' in finding an oriental ED and as far as I know they only work with Altrui.

Wishing you all the best 
Andro
x

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


----------



## Altai (Aug 18, 2013)

Heddie -was to good to hear from you. 
I did one IVF cycle with Lister and few ovulation inductions (some supposed to be iui). 
Good hospital. I had two different consultants, the second one specialising in immune issues. Not that I am a strong believer of immunes but was desperate. 
Consultants were good. I felt like a princess after ec. Didn't like deep sedation thou. And they are pricey.

mustbemum- I'd have thought that London would be a best place to look for ethnic de. But I know it's not the case. I don't have knowledge of Ukrainian clinics. But I very much doubt you would find Afro Caribbean de there. If it could help I was looking for a de ( oriental de), I came across adv from Ukrainian agency http://pogotowie.com.ua/index.php/ru/. They are looking for Afro and oriental donors in Russia for Ukrainian clinics. Sorry the site is in Russian but have contact details. 
Worth contacting them to see if they could help. But I think most efficient (and quicker) would be contacting Russian de agencies. 
It gets quite time consuming and possibly pricey if you need ethnic de.

Andro - I've gone with clinic called EMC in Moscow for de. I am an oriental de recipient too. To add to difficulty - I'm only after certain ethnical groups as would like to match as close as possible to my daughter. 
I will have transfer next year, so only time will tell. But they have that donor frozen eggs. I only bought 3 eggs and got 2 blasts. €300 for an egg plus embryology & freezing costs all under €2000. 
Will post all links etc in oriental de thread just need to find time to dig out all info.

Best of luck

A.

This post contains an unconfirmed link/information and readers are reminded that FertilityFriends.co.uk or its owners are not responsible for the content of external internet sites


----------



## Miller20 (Sep 8, 2015)

Hi Heddie

I haven't got much to add except to say that you're not alone. I also left it late (mid 40s) to do IVF and now am contemplating DE but again, need an ethnic egg. I have a similar dilemma in that I don;t want anonymous eggs at this stage but have been told that Asian eggs are extremely rare with about a one year waiting list at most clinics. I've also approached Altrui who say the same. I think it might be down to luck when you register if the right donor suddenly appears when you are ready.

I wish you lots of luck anyway as well as to the other ladies on here who are experiencing this. 

xx


----------



## Kademu (Jan 24, 2016)

Hi Heddie

You mailbox is full so I can't send you and PM. 

Kademu


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi Kademu

I’ve emptied my inbox.

Heddie x


----------



## ToughCookie (Sep 15, 2012)

Hello Heddie, it has been a while since you postedthis message and i hope you dont mind me contacting you about it now. I just wondered if you had indeed make the decisionto go agead with double donor?


----------



## majestic (Aug 9, 2011)

Hi ToughCookie. I don't mind you contacting me..haven't posted in awhile. Yes I have made the decision to go ahead with double donor. I have no other choice, i.e. poor quality due to age. What about you? Have you decided yet?

Miller20 sincere apologies for not responding to you. How is your journey going and did you have any luck with finding asian DE?


----------



## miamiamo (Aug 9, 2015)

No personal experiences, but have you considered using the service of First Egg bank? Here is more


----------

