# Has anyone ever got BFP with icsi & pesa/tesa?



## wrenster (May 27, 2006)

hi

I wondered if anyone can help as I am feeling really down   and wondering if me and my DH will ever be able to have our own baby. I am trying to be positive on this 2ww but  I read something yesterday on the male factor section that says that the chances of success with tesa sperm are really, really low. Its kind of what I've been thinking because everyone else gets grade 1 embies and we don't seem to get a very good fertilisation rate and our embies are grade 2 at best.

I wondered if anyone knows of any examples of success with icsi and tesa to cheer me up because I am wondering now if it is ever going to be possible. My DH does not want to use donor sperm so if we can't do it ourselves I won't ever be able to get pregant.

Love wrenster xx


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## Willowwisp (Aug 10, 2004)

Hi Wrenster

I'm so sorry your feeling low   my hubby is azoo and we have had SSR twice now, first time we got a BFN, BUT the second time at Guys we got a BFP with grade 2 embies, OK it wasn't meant to be but it initially worked, please don't give up hope, there are lots of ladies on here who have gone on to have a BFP with SSR!


Take it easy on the TWW, when are you due to test?  

Willow
xx


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## wrenster (May 27, 2006)

Hi Willow

Thanks for replying. Did you have SSR at the same time as EC - ie did they use 'live' sperm instead of frozen? Would be interested to know because my DH had his extraction done last year and the froze 5 vials which we are now using. The clinic are really good in many ways (Homerton, hackney) - they monitor you very closely throughout and tailor dosages etc, but have not offered live because we have the frozen 'stock'.

I am testing on 15th which is next wed and I was feeling really positive this time round, but as the 2ww has gone on I am feeling more and more down as the likelhood of another negative looms. 

I think its hard if your DH has azo because there is absolutely no hope of getting pregnant except via icsi and the chances are so low.   Sorry I am not a bundle of joy at the moment! Although your story gives me hope. Good luck this time, are you at Guys again?

Love wrenster xx


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## darl (Oct 25, 2006)

Hello Willow and Wrenster. My only option is ICSI with frozen sperm from TESA. Failed 3 times but there lots of ladies with positive results. From all the research I have done, we are looking at lower success rates but 16% seems way too low., My clinic tell me 30%. Its in the lap of the gods to a degree.

Wrenster the 2ww is the worst bit. My heart goes out to you, lots of love and luck. I came out of my 2ww 10 days ago. BFN but we will try again. 

Lots of love ladies.


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## Willowwisp (Aug 10, 2004)

Hi again Wrenster

Our first two cycles were with fresh sperm, this one is hopefully with frozen, providing its OK when its thawed, otherwise we will have to have SSR again which is another £1500!!   The SSR was done just after my eggs were collected so it was very fresh, but unfortunately not of good quality, but all my three eggs fertilised so it must have been OK!!  

It's still quite early in the TWW to expect any symptoms, so don't give up yet, keep up with the positive thoughts  

I will keep an eye for your results, good luck again!

Willow
xx


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## Succotash (Feb 25, 2005)

Dear Wrenster

Poor you feeling so down.  The 2 ww is hell.  We are in a similar boat in that our only chance of conceiving is ICSI and in our case TESE.  So the sperm was removed along with the testicular tissue.  DH has obstructive azoospermia with the obstruction deep in the pelvis.  DH had his TESE done in 2002 and we had 8 vials frozen so have always used frozen.  My understanding is that fresh is better if it's NOA.  

We've had a variety of fertilisations - some really high, 90%, and some really low, 30%.  Sometimes frosties, sometimes not.  I do think that choice of clinic/lab is vital when it comes to frozen testicular sperm.  Some labs are very, very experienced in this field, are involved in lots of research, cycle lots of couples, etc.  There is a huge amount of skill involved in selecting the sperm to be used.  An embryology site I have found very useful and where questions are answered by an embryologist is www.sharedjourney.com.  Go to Forums then Embryology/Andrology, Dr Smith.  Think he's away on leave right now though.

We are very lucky to have a nearly 3 year old son from our first cycle, 2 chemicals and 1 missed miscarriage.  So yes, it can happen.  Donor sperm in not an option for us and I didn't want to have go through a cycle if DH was having a fresh extraction and there to be no sperm.  Hence we had him done first before we embarked on tx.

I'll be keeping everything crossed that you have a positive outcome. 

Best wishes, Succotash


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## Panda (Mar 21, 2005)

Hi Wrenster

Sorry to hear that you are feeling so down on your 2ww but you only have 4 days to go and some people get symptoms, some don't.  I didn't get any.

We had ICSI with PESE/TESA as my DH had a vasectomy over 14 years ago and the chances of a reversal working were virtually nil and ICSI was our only chance of having a baby.

We both had the ops on the same day (me e/c and him PESE/TESA) so they used live sperm.  I was really worried about this initially as my thoughts were why put myself through all the drugs etc etc and an operation only for me to get told there were no sperm.  The Cons put my mind at rest and said that they never find no sperm, they always find something. 

As it turns out the SSR didn't work so they took a flap of testicle away and got sperm from this.  Not sure now which one is PESE and which one is TESA.  Anyway they managed to find 13, yes just 13 sperm, to go with my 13 eggs (produced 29 eggs, donated 14, kept 15, 2 were no good) so we felt blessed from the start.  Anyway 9 eggs fertilised and two are now growing and kicking madly inside me!!

This was all done at Essex Fertility Centre, Holly House which isn't that far away from Homerton (I had my nuchal fold scan done at Homerton).

Good luck to you for the rest of your 2ww and fingers crossed you get a hufe BFP next week. xxx


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## wrenster (May 27, 2006)

hello again and thanks very much to you all for replying, you have definitely cheered me up.

I hadn't thought about the risk of having SSR with no sperm on the day of EC - I can see that its better to at least have a frozen sperm sample as back up. But I might ask my clinic about doing a live sperm cycle next time.

Succotash - Thanks for the links, I will definitely have a look. What you said about clinic experience was interesting, my clinic said they don't do research and although its busy, I think its quite a small unit. I wonder how skilled they are at Icsi and sperm selection compared with other clinics? All the comparative stats I've seen only show IVF and don't break it down into that much detail. Its definitely something I will think about next time

Panda - great news about your BFP!! Contratulations!!!! I wondered where Holly House is as I've seen it appear in the posts lots of times.

All of your successes have given me hope again ... so thank you!  

Love Wrenster xx


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## Panda (Mar 21, 2005)

Wrenster - Holly House is in Buckhurst Hill so approx 6-7 miles from Homerton Hospital. xxxx


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## wrenster (May 27, 2006)

Wow just checked out shared journey.com

The embylogist advice section is fantastic!! I spent about 2 hours reading and answered lots of questions - Thanks!!


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## darl (Oct 25, 2006)

Hi wrenster, just wondering if you had any news yet. Everything crossed for you. xx


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## wrenster (May 27, 2006)

Hello to you all

Well despite all the positive thinking and the good vibes from you guys unfortunately I got a BFN. But thanks for trying to encourage me! It did really help during my 2ww. But I am feeling  really devastated this time   . It seems worse getting a BFN the second time because it makes me think that there must be something really wrong with us, and it seems an impossibility that it could work a third time. Maybe our embies are just never going to be good enough however many times we try. I just don't know.

My DH is really fed up because he had been going to the doctors on and off from the age of about 13 with concerns about his condition because his ejaculate volume was almost non existent. Doctors just fobbed him off each time, but now we know that if something had been done about his obstruction early on, it could have made a big difference to his fertility now. But because its been left for so many years the quality is really poor and its unlikely he could be fixed. By the time he was fixed on the NHS it would be too late for me anyway! Its over a years waiting list just for a scan to identify the site of blockage.

Sorry for all the doom and gloom but its just how I feel at the moment!

Darl - thanks for your support. How are you feeling now its a couple of weeks post BFN? Where are you going to go to try again?
Panda - hope everything is going to plan with your two kickers!
And good luck to everyone else

Does anyone know where the best places are for ICSi/Tesa? How could I find out?

Lots of love, Wrenster x


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## darl (Oct 25, 2006)

Hi Wrenster   
I am so sorry. Its so painful for you and DH. I know. My 3rd time failed- I felt exactly the same but there are so many ladies on here that get success 4/5/6 time. Its in the lap of the gods. Even the best embies don't always implant. Don't give up. I've spoken to ladies on here who had 1 x 2 cell poor grade embie take and them get a BFP, other have 2 x 8 cell fabbo embies put in and get BFN. Stay calm and focused. 

ICSI /Tessa is what we're going through. Budget and accessibility are huge factors in choosing a clinic. Costs range from £3500 to £14000 + per cycle. Have a look on the **** website at clinic LBR rates near you. Thats a good starting point.

All my love.


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