# Don't know if I can carry on



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

We were given a very low chance of success with OE (my age plus lowish AMH and highish FSH and severe MFI). I felt I had to try and we signed up for 3 cycles of natural ivf (only option). Consultant was very negative and said might not find an egg, might not fertilise etc. First cycle went better than expected, we got an egg, it fertilised and went to blastocyst but got BFN. Although I went into it with low expectations, during the process we both became hopeful and it was really hard when it failed. I thought I was ok about it and was feeling positive that at least we got that far. This month I was due to start again but when I went for baseline scan I only had 1 follicle (usually I have 2-3). Clinic said I could go ahead but we decided to wait until next cycle. Now all the feelings of despair and negativity have started to come up for me. Since diagnosis I have hung on to the hope that some people in my situation do succeed and that I could be one of them. Now I'm just really aware of the cold hard facts that 98% of people in my situation will fail. Although I have 2 cycles left I've lost all hope and I'm facing the fact that I'll never have my own child. Tbh I think I may only have put myself through these cycles to avoid getting to this place. I don't know if it's worth putting myself through anymore treatment. I feel like it will never work if I'm not positive about it. Last time I was doing visualisation. I don't know if I can get my hopes up like that again. We have paid for the 3 cycles which won't be refunded but each cycle costs an additional 2k for icsi and drugs etc. We borrowed the money for treatment and I feel like maybe we should stop now before wasting anymore. i keep crying all the time.


----------



## Wishings15 (Mar 27, 2015)

Oh I know, it's so hard. I literally feel your pain  

I'm 6 rounds in, and not sure how much more I can take. I used to wake up crying but it eventually gotten better with time.

maybe you could look into other options like donor....

But it sounds like you got an embryo last time, try not to give up hope xxz


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Thanks for your reply. DE not for me but I'm looking in to adoption. Ive always had adoption as a possible because I'd like more than one child and know there's no chance of that through ivf. It's still hard to think about giving up on a biological child and being pregnant etc. Also there's probably a time factor on that and being eligible for a baby which also makes me think is it worth wasting more time on cycles that probably won't work. Yes we did get a good embryo and that's what made it so hard. But I know from reading others stories that good embryos still fail most of the time - especially post 40. Im trying to keep some hope but emotionally I've given up


----------



## StrawberrySundae (Jan 30, 2017)

Aw sending you a big   I know how hard it is, sorry you feel so down today. I'm fed up of being in the 1% of unlucky people as well! I just read a post on here (its in the donor section from a couple of years ago I think) about a lady who had 20 goes and finally completed her family! She had her 1st child after 14 cycles!   But she made it in the end. Stay strong whatever you decide, try to find things that make you feel happy & be kind to yourself   xx


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Thank you. Yes if we had the money to keep doing cycles I would feel more hopeful. Natural cycle usually needs more goes to be successful. Realistically we can't do more than these 3 though. So it's always been a bit of a long shot. I don't know how people keep going. Before I started I was willing to do anything but just that 1 failed cycle was so difficult. It's the hope that makes it hardest. I almost wish I had zero chance so I could move on


----------



## aissha (Nov 3, 2009)

have you had/considered a second opinion at a specialist clinic? 

I am currently being treated at my 3rd hospital (over many years), the first just kept trying the same thing over and over, with no success and no ideas on what to do instead, the second hospital was getting more and more out there with what they were willing to try (and I ended up with OHSS as a result)   but this hospital uses actual medical science to determine the best treatment for a patient   

having said that I did not think they were much better and had made an appointment at the Lister in London to talk to someone there. The appointment was the same day I got my first ever BFP and I still went to the appointment and even thought it cost me 200 quid, I went away reassured that the doctors I had were actually treating me.

Sorry to ramble on, but I just wanted to say
a) statistics can always be manipulated and in any one cycle it can only be one of two outcomes
b) don't beat yourself up about not being able to be positive all the time, it is tough and hard to cope with and it is normal to find it overwhelming at times
c) trust yourself (like choosing to wait for the next cycle) and do what you believe is best. Try to picture yourself 5 years down the line and get a handle on what would you regret (would you regret stopping cycling or would you regret "wasting" time?)

oh and I remember the devastation of the first bfn, it is the worst, for me after a while, although I was devastated every time, I became a bit numb once the initial shock/disappointment...

   
take care of yourself


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

thank you. is it The Lister you are recommending? I did have a chat with them at the Fertility Show and they said don't do natural ivf, as my odds would be better to take max meds and try and get 2 eggs. They are so expensive though and I wasn't keen on taking loads of meds. My clinic said I would be unlikely to respond as I have few follicles. We could have only afforded 1 round at The Lister for the same price as 3 natural cycles so i thought my odds were better this way. I went to 2 clinics for an opinion first and they both said there would be no point in me doing standard IVF. its so hard to know what to believe!


----------



## StrawberrySundae (Jan 30, 2017)

Have you considered Serum's clomid protocol? Much gentler on the body & better for women with fewer eggs - they do a 2 cycle package (I think for €4k and meds are cheaper). You could combine a short holiday there maybe as it's in Greece?


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

I hadn't considered going abroad for treatment. My job doesn't allow me to take time off during term time so I'm quite restricted in when I can travel. Not sure how much cheaper it would be once you factor in flights and hotel but I guess it's an option if we did decide to carry on. Have you had treatment there? I'm a bit nervous of using a non uk clinic


----------



## QWERTY9876 (Apr 11, 2014)

Hello. I just wanted to share my experience. I had 5 rounds of IVF at the Lister and had 2 miscarriages, one being due to the foetus having Downs Syndrome. I moved to Gennet in Prague, and 3 rounds later I'm pregnant. However, this is through a donor embryo. I tried one more round with my own eggs, then with donor egg, and then finally with donor embryo. Donor embryo is quite inexpensive, (around €800 plus drugs which are way cheaper in Prague), and good chances of success. I had immune issues (plus my age, I'm now 43 but started IVF when I was 39), but this was treated. I'm nearly 28 weeks pregnant. I'm only saying all of this because if you are considering adoption, this is a different way to do it, plus you will be pregnant, grow your baby, and give birth to your baby. The clinic is excellent, they really know what they are doing, and its very clean and professional. In fact some Czech standards seem to be higher than English ones in terms of care. If you go for donor embryo, you could do it in 2 days max. A lot to think about but I though was worth sharing with you..... If you have any questions, drop me a pm. Take care. There are many ways of getting your take home baby. xx


----------



## Teeinparis (Sep 15, 2013)

You would have to check but I think Gennet was opened by the founder of Genea which is an Aussie clinic that has some of the best results in the world.  However, due to Australian laws they needed to open another clinic in a place where they could do ED and Embryo adoption.  The founder had links to Czech so bob's your uncle. 

Early on in this journey someone said those who succeed were willing to to not give up and question everything...it was this perseverance that leads to success.  I kept that to heart.


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Thanks but really don't think DE for me and definitely not donor embryo. Adoption is something I've always considered but I would have liked a biological child too. It's hard as a woman to think you will never experience pregnancy/birth but otherwise adoption is a good option for me.


----------



## Teeinparis (Sep 15, 2013)

I think the problem with adoption for us was more practical as well.  We are expats and would move so a local adoption was not an option and ED for overseas adoption is still cheaper if you can believe that.  Good luck and as I said it is the determination that got us there.  Be mindful you need to be finished with IVF for at least 6 months or more before they will consider you for adoption.  

You will get there!


----------



## Rio2016 (Aug 24, 2016)

Hello BB41, does your clinic provide counselling? I was very sad after my first BFN. I had counselling for free at my clinic and also locally privately. It really helped. I couldn't stop crying either. IVF is such a hard process xx


----------



## miamiamo (Aug 9, 2015)

BB41 said:


> Now I'm just really aware of the cold hard facts that 98% of people in my situation will fail.


 But there are 2% who are successfull. So don't give up. 
IVf at overseas clinics is cheaper, in my clinic IVF cost starts from 1500 Euros. I wish you good luck with decision - making. A few friends of mine had 6-8 cycles, and then finally got pregnant. They have been happy with babies, but less with their credits. One couple have decided even not to see a doc, and moved to adoption. They have 2 boys now. x


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Thanks for all the kind words. I did see a counsellor at the clinic before my first round but she really focused on considering donor eggs which I found a bit depressing when I hadn't even tried with my own yet! 
I think the BFN effected me more than I thought at the time. The clinic said we didn't need a consultation afterwards because they wouldn't be changing the protocol but as it's free I have asked for one now. I know there's nothing he can tell me but I feel like I need it for some closure. My plan now is to do the 2 cycles we've paid for so I can feel I gave it a good go and then move on to adoption. 
Good luck with all your journeys x


----------



## tily (Jan 5, 2017)

Hi BB41,

I know how you feel - my numbers are probably worse than yours...it's very hard to stay positive and protect ourselves from disappointment at the same time. It drives me mad when people start coming out with 'think positively' psychobabble. I do appreciate the impact of stress and lifestyle but some of us are just very unlucky to lose our fertility earlier than the rest of the population. And that is hard to come to terms with. I was also told to go donor by 2 clinics but the Lister have taken me on and we are doing the max stims to try and get that second egg..it's a cruel journey and I'm so sorry about your BFN. I haven't ever conceived - naturally or IVF so I imagine it must be devastating to get closer and then have it taken away. As a matter of interest, what's your FSH / AMH? Also, where did you get the 2% from? I was getting 10-15% on the Lister pregnancy calculator and my numbers are off the charts for my age...Xx


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Hi Tily
My FSH has only been tested once and was about 13 I think. My amh is 2. AFC 3 at best and I'm now 42. Yes when I chatted to the Lister at the Fertility Show they gave me the same odds as you. Create said 10-15% and the Bridge (where I am now) said 1-2% per cycle. I asked my consultant about the differing odds and he said they were being disingenuous with the numbers as the figures they give are the likelihood of success at all (ie over multiple cycles). I felt I trusted him more as the others were giving numbers based on averages and not me personally. When I went to Create for a consultation first they just did a scan and tested my AMH (on wrong day of cycle) and advised me to start on 3 cycle natural ivf right away £15k please! They didn't really explain anything and I was still reeling from the news about my bad prognosis. I went to the Bridge for 2nd opinion and the consultant was much more thorough. He redid my amh (and it came back slightly higher) tested my fsh and lh and estrogen and did an aqua scan to check if any issues with womb (because I have short, painful periods - which Create never even asked about). He was going to do a clomid challenge test to see if I would respond to drugs (as he said everyone different and can't just assume from amh results) but my fsh came back so high he said there was no point. The reason for the low success rate is partners sperm is poor quality and my eggs are few/elderly. I did better than predicted as he wasn't sure they would find an egg or that it would fertilise but apparently at my age even a blastocyst is more likely to fail due to chromosome abnormalities. I would have a better chance of natural conception (more chances for finding the right egg) but with my partners sperm that is highly unlikely. If we were millionaires and could do multiple cycles we might have a 10 percent chance but as it is I guess its the same as if I was trying naturally and hoping to get lucky in the first few months. It can happen but the chances are pretty low. That said I thought about it before going ahead and decided not to get hung up on statistics- no one really knows what will happen. I thought then that if we succeeded in getting eggs to fertilise I would try and carry on and get the money from somewhere but I wasn't prepared for how hard treatment is emotionally. I can't do more than these 3 cycles and I'm still not 100% sure whether to just stop now. I had assumed we would only be eligible for older children for adoption but I've found out a baby would be possible and I think that will be enough for me. There are other things I want from life (like doing some more studying) and I don't want to end up financially ruined and potentially still childless. But that's just me. I've always wanted kids but it's not the whole meaning of life for me. I know some women can't imagine life without them but although I know I will be very sad I will be ok. Wishing you peace with your journey too. Good luck at the Lister x


----------



## BB41 (Nov 16, 2016)

Tily - Just to add to that (incase I depressed you!) - the main factor in my consultants negativity is because I am over 40 so the majority of eggs will be poor quality. He said that in younger women with the same amh/fsh results the odds will be much better. Also we went for a consultation with him today and he was more positive. He said the 1-2 % figure is at the start of the cycle, not knowing how you will respond and taking into account all the risks of egg being missed, not being mature, not fertilising etc. In fact as we got to blastocyst, our odds on that cycle were 10-15%. So, I'm feeling marginally more optimistic. He also said that the reason we got one egg before was because of my early LH surge which meant going ahead with egg collection before other follicles were ready. Next cycle he is going to give me some drugs to stop the surge and try and get 2 eggs. 
Have you considered natural ivf? Seems like your body is not responding well to high meds and if you are only going to get 1 or 2 anyway then there is a theory that lower meds are better for quality - plus it is MUCH cheaper so you have more chances. might be worth thinking about.


----------

