# Should i give up?



## lisa46 (May 8, 2010)

I have recently undergone my first cycle of ivf/icsi.  I had AMH of 8.4 and FSH of 6, with 10 folicles.  I was told that at 42 years I was above average fertility for my age and that we had male infertility factor.  The treatment only saw 5 folicles mature, 2 eggs were harvested and only one fertilized.  Should I expect a similiar result if I do it again and why was my egg count so low given that I was told that I had above average fertility?
xx


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## Ceri. (Sep 6, 2004)

Lisa and welcome to Fertility Friends :

I'm sorry your first cycle didn't go as expected  If you do decide to have another attempt, the positive thing will be that your clinic now know how you responded and could start the next cycle with possibly a higher dosage of drugs. Have a look at some links which i'll leave below. I hope they help you x

Please have a good look around the site and feel free to post in any area, and make yourself at home. Fertility Friends is such a huge support. There are many who are on their TTC journey, and others who have been fortunate to have little ones with assistance. You will soon discover that our members are very encouraging of one another and offering advice or just simple hugs. There's a vast amount of information here for everyone, so start reading, posting and getting to know others. You will make some great friends too (add them to your buddy list in your profile!), lots of members often have meet ups locally too, for chats, coffee, shopping or even nights out! You can share conversations with one another freely, simply because we all understand each other. It's hard when family and friends don't fully comprehend what this journey entails and the emotions that go with it. That's where we come in!

Here are some links which you should find really useful at the moment&#8230;&#8230;

*What Every New Member Needs To Know (includes a list of common abbreviations) ~ *   CLICK HERE

*Peer Support (for asking fertility and treatment related questions of your fellow FFers) ~ * CLICK HERE

*Complimentary, Holistic and Spiritual Approaches ~ *CLICK HERE 

*What can improve egg quality and quantity ~ * CLICK HERE

*Male factors ~ *CLICK HERE

* Negative Cycle Follow up Questions ~ *CLICK HERE

*ICSI ~ *CLICK HERE

While undergoing treatment, you might find it useful to join other ladies having treatment at the same time. The Cycle Buddies threads are just for that. You will find a thread, usually with a funny/inspiring name for this year's buddies. Just pop along to the appropriate month and say "Hi" when you are ready to start treatment.

*Cycle buddies ~ *CLICK HERE

You can also chat live in our chat room. We have a newbie day in the chat room every Wednesday where you can meet one of our mods for support, meet other new members and get technical support with navigating the site and using all the functions available here.  CLICK HERE FOR INFO ON NEWBIE CHAT 

You can also "meet" and chat with people in your local area through the *Location boards*. This is especially useful to find people who may be using the same clinic and or in the same PCT area. It's a small world!

Wishing you lots of luck    and 
Keep in touch
Ceri xx

PS I have also sent you a pm (private message)


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## Momito (Nov 16, 2009)

Hello Lisa

No...I don´t think you should give up!  See my history below!

We respond differently to protocols on different months, but also differently to different drugs, levels etc.

The most important thing from your side is not really the number of follicles and hence eggs that you produce (despite traditional IVF relying on numbers), but the quality of your eggs, and unfortunately egg quality and quantity do decline with age, which is possibly why you were disappointed with the number of viable eggs from a good initial number.

I, and many other women, were told countless times that Donor Eggs were our only viable option due to a low ovarian reserve (it is true, your reserve does look pretty good), but there are clinics out there that specialise in older would be mums, low reserve levels etc.
We finally went to a clinic in New York, The New Hope Fertility Center, where I underwent a low stimulation protocol (mini IVF).  Their aim is always quality over quantity and that it only takes 1 good egg to make 1 healthy baby.  If you have male factor issues or poor sperm, The New Hope actually told me that in most cases they can overcome this more easily than our eggs issue.  The reason I tell you about the New Hope is because after lots of disastrous treatments, I have come to the conclusion that one´s choice of clinic is fundamental in your chances of conceiving.  I discovered, after lots of wasted time and money, that not all clinics are much of a muchness.  Despite my first try there resulting in a chemical pregnancy, my body seems to have been kick started and I am now 5 weeks pregnant "au naturel".  But if it hadn´t happened, or it doesn´t work out (still early days), I would certainly go back to the New Hope.  They made us feel confident that it could work, and after so much upset at other clinics, having confidence is so important to keep you going.

So dear Lisa...don´t give up!

Best Wishes to you and lots of luck...     

Momito
xxxxxx


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## lisa46 (May 8, 2010)

Dear Momito, thank you so much for your words of encouragement.  Could I ask how long you needed to be in the US to undergo treatment and did you need a couple of trips?  I certainly prefer the idea of a shorter cycle using less drugs. 

I'm so excited for you that the treatment was successful, such wonderful news.

Lisa xxx


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## Momito (Nov 16, 2009)

Hi Lisa

Unfortunately I miscarried at 5 weeks...so back to the drawing board...

The amount of time you need to spend in NY will depend on the protocol given to you by the doctor.

When I went for egg extraction I was there about 3 weeks but I did all my monitoring at the New Hope.  You can choose to do your monitoring from home and then just go over for egg extraction if you are using clomid (but you will have to pay the home clinic to do the bloods and sonograms and then the New Hope to analyse).  As clomid can thin the lining the doctors prefer the transfer to happen on another cycle, and they prepare you for this with another protocol.  Again, you could do your monitoring from home and then just go for the period leading up to transfer and then stay on a few days afterwards.  Again I went for the whole period (about 3.5 weeks) but I must confess I wouldn't do it again for transfer, as the monitoring is much less intense and I don't think it is necessary to be there so long.

I have also been informed that it is possible to use a drug called femara instead of clomid, which doesn't thin the lining but does need closer monitoring, so they ask the patient to be in NY from day 8 or 9 of their cycle.  But using this drug means that you can do the transfer on the same cycle, saving the 2nd trip.  A bit swings and roundabouts.

I rate the clinic highly on the medical front but do think that their follow-up is terrible...I am finding it very hard to have any meaningful communcation with anyone at the moment.  I confess that I don't quite know what to do!!!

Hope that helps...and best of luck!!!

Momito
xxxxxx


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## lisa46 (May 8, 2010)

Dear Momito, I am so sorry to take such a long time to reply but I went cold turkey to consider what to do.  I have only just picked this up.  I am heartbroken for you that you miscarried.  I know that anything I say cannot make up for the hurt, but the good thing is that you know you can get pregnant so next time may be the one!

I have now decided to go to CRGH and am mid cycle, although again am not responding to the drug protocol so it isn't looking great.

My experience of my first hospital, the Lister was really poor and they also did not provide adequate follow up.  We did however persist and managed to have a meeting with the Dr.  I guess all that I can say is keep insisting that you have feedback.  That said the feedback we had was useless.  I hope any feedback you manage to get from them is constructive and I really, really hope that if you try again the next attempt is successful.

Take care
Lisa
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## Momito (Nov 16, 2009)

Hi Lisa

Lovely to hear from you...don´t worry about the time lapses...sometimes we need time to think. Am sorry to hear that you aren´t responding to the current drug protocol...how many days is it now? Some of the gals on here have said that some of us take longer to respond and not to give up too soon, so do hope that you get a turnaround...it isn´t unheard of. What have they put you on?

I´ve heard such mixed reviews about the Lister...some people rate them very highly, others feel that they were dismissed out of hand. It is a minefield choosing the right clinic. They all big themselves up, and unless we get a bfp, disappoint us.

AFM...I haven´t really done anything since we were last in touch...just waiting for AF to get back to normal and to be honest we are just going to try ourselves at the moment to see if we can´t get a miracle! If nothing happens within a few months, am considering doing Mini IVF at Reprofit in Czech Republic. The doc is very good at answering any questions really quickly (within 24 hours all via email), he was patient with all my questions, the prices are very reasonable (800€ for mini IVF, including monitoring and ICSI but not drugs...but for mini IVF is either clomid or femara so not expensive).

Since we were in touch had another FF buddy who was having really trouble with the New Hope re: communication...they managed to screw up 2 cycles for her through simply mis-interpreting her results, so getting her over to NYC for nothing, or not bothering to tell her that she needed to be in New York _on the following day_! I ask you!! Unfortuantely I think they are victims of their own success...and are so inundated with patients that they can´t really cope with the numbers. So if one leaves, there´ll be 10 more coming through the door to take her place.

Is CRGH what ACU used to be? Gray´s Inn Road?

Much love to you...

Momito
xxxxxx


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## lisa46 (May 8, 2010)

Hi Momito, CRGH is part of UCL. As with the Lister they are very disorganised, although the drugs worked this time and I had 13 eggs (an improvement on 2!) .  From that we got 6 top quality embryos.  They went to blastocyst.  I had 2 transferred and the rest stopped developing on day 6, despite being told that at least 2 were good enough to freeze (very upsetting).  Waiting for the results now.  I'll keep you informed.  Good luck with your next cycle and do let me know how it goes.  I must say I am starting to feel like the whole thing is a scam.  I think this will be our last attempt.

Lisa
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## Momito (Nov 16, 2009)

Well congrats on being Pupo Lisa...hope that the 2ww won´t be too awful and that you have some fantastic news at the end of it!

Think our next attempt will be in November at Reprofit...they do Mini-IVF and it is affordable, but we can´t really take time out until then and so will keep trying ourselves   !

Know what you mean about feeling it is all a scam at times...I think the follow-up is usually disgraceful and that is what really hurts, the fact that these clinics don´t really give a damn, whilst we pin all our hopes on them and make a lot of sacrifices in order to do it.

Will be keeping everything crossed for you...hope that this one is the one and you won´t need to have another go anyway!

Momito
xxxxxx


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## Pinktink (Dec 17, 2008)

Hi, 

just wanted to say that on our first cycle my DW was told she should stimulate really easily and put on a lower than average dose of stims drugs - we ended up with 5 follicles - she then ovulated prior to EC as the trigger wasnt the right one for her either and we only got 3 eggs - one immature - one did not fertilise and then we were left with one... it then turned out that the cyclogest wasnt enough either and ended in a bfn...

second cycle changed stims, changed trigger, changed timing of trigger, changed cyclogest to gestone, scanned and bloods done more often.... collectred 14 eggs - egg-shared 7 to recipient - BFP for her, 7 for us BFP for us but unfortunately miscarried... completely different cycle

This cycle - tweaked a few more things - ended up with 9 really good quality eggs and currently on 2ww...   

Our consultant says the first cycle is always a bit of a test - everyone reacts so differently there can be no standard protocol..

nobody can tell you the future but I would definitely not stop at one... it really is only the beginning!

Lynn xx


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## Momito (Nov 16, 2009)

...and just to add to the mix...we can also respond differently from cycle to cycle too...so there are sooooo many variables!

Congrats too on being pupo Lynn...may this one be the one!

Momito
xxxxxx


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## lisa46 (May 8, 2010)

Thank you Lynn, I did have a second cycle, which i felt was better.  We had 2 blastocysts transferred, so just a waiting game now.  Really hope that it's wonderful news for you.  Fingers crossed.

Lisa

xx


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