# Doctors warn that NHS is picking up the bill for costly 'fertility tourism'



## wildcat (Jun 1, 2006)

Ooooo this makes me mad!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1199785/Doctors-warn-NHS-picking-costly-fertility-tourism.html

I'm one of those - I went to America after 4 rounds of IVF in the UK, so far I've spent over £40,000 on IVF of my own money and had NO help from our wonderful NHS, and they have the cheek to come out with this?

I'm carrying twins and I don't care if I have to have more scans, or need more care - if they had offered me the three round of IVF they promised, instead of telling me I was 2 years to young to qualify, then perhaps they could have told me to only put one embryo back and they could have more control - instead they want to make some kind of international protocol.

Well good luck with that.....


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## MrWildcat (Jun 2, 2006)

As the husband of WildCat and future father of our twins I totally agree with what my wife says for two reasons:

1. It's never wise to disagree with a pregnant woman

and 

2. Because I'm sick of hearing about how having children is a "lifestyle" choice. What rubbish is that Driving a car is a lifestyle choice but anyone in a crash expects NHS care. Boozing is a lifestyle choice even DIY is - in 1998, according to official figures, 31,000 attended A&E departments after a accident rollerskating - ROLLERSKATING!!!!! They all demanded care and duly got it - apparently that's fair game, but God help you if you have the audacity to want a child...

I would write a stiff letter of complaint to my MP, but I fear it would get lost in the sea of receipts and claim forms on his desk...

MrW


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## isobel snow drop (Feb 2, 2009)

Well put and no it's best not to argue with your wife at the minute!


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## kara76 (Dec 14, 2004)

i agree and i once spoke to my consultant who said he felt that SET is certain patients would push them to moving aboard for treatment

SET has a place but not for people who have had repeated failures

i would love more embryos than 2 transferred and i know i would get this aboard

the goverment and nhs need to realise that this is going to happen unless they give us more funding

i say good on anyone going aboard


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## Caz.s (Jun 27, 2008)

Hi 

I agree with you all. The NHS should be paying out for more tx and then we wouldnt have to go abroad. It makes me so angry

I too would love more than two transferred but if the NHS was to offer me tx here and to have one transfereed I would go for that, but who are we to question the NHS ARGHHH!!!

Good luck to all
xx


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## Blu (Jul 28, 2005)

I knew as soon as I saw the headline that it would be a Daily Mail story


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## isobel snow drop (Feb 2, 2009)

Typical rubbish from them as usual


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

Me too re the Daily Fail- good God, have they nothing better to write about, with all this swine flu, MPs with sticky pockets, the BNP antics in Brussels, the recession( oh is it all over now, its  gone all quiet).  Its a story every day.

Let them bleat. I doubt whether the rise in multiples due to people going abroad is going to make a dent in the system overall- there are not that many in real statistical terms. I am also now one of these women who is carrying twins as being greedy and reckless, after 10 IVF/6 donor txs, I thought having three put back was fairly conservative for me. However even with two back, the chances are that I would still have conceived twins. I am taking up resources now as deemed high risk, and I am also requesting mental health support due to the increased incidence of PND(I have a history from before) but overall I dont' think I am taking up many resources, compared with for instance, someone who has had 4/5 children naturally. I have had one comment from a medical professional about the wisdom of having three put back but I dealt with him fairly swiftly and on the spot.

I didn't go into this trying to have twins but to give myself the best chance of conceiving one. It is still fairly uncommon with donor eggs to conceive at all, let alone multiples. My failures are tantamount to this. I'd understand if women were having several sets of multiples but thats not whats going on.

And another thing, don't tell me that all these high risk pregnancies aren't useful to the medical professional in learning how to manage them. Twins and triplets will still occur in the natural population without fertility treatment hence learning to manage the risks are no doubt very useful.

I'm interested to know what international protocols are being talked about. Overall there seems to be an increase in success rates, especially in Eastern European clinics, as technology and skills increase. I know ISIDA for instance have had a lot of success recently and as a result they are advising people to put fewer embryos back. They don't nanny people however, and when I was there I was clearly advised about the risks, however the final decision was mine.
I would have thought that as success rates increase, there is no longer any need to return any more than two embryos , and hence the numbers of multiples are likely to reduce as a consequence.  

I have always thought that one baby at a time is best, but that everyone needs to be assessed on an individual basis. 

I doubt also whether the women involved were unaware of the risks. Sometimes you just have to make the decision based on your history and predicted outcomes. Who could have predicted that at 48, my uterus felt that it was the right time to give me twins, after so many repeated failures.

roze


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## Charlies-Mum (May 25, 2005)

Blu said:


> I knew as soon as I saw the headline that it would be a Daily Mail story


Totally agree  Bloomin' paper.

Mr&MrsWildcat  and make sure you look after yourselves. And yes MrW you are very right not to argue with MrsW


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## Mish3434 (Dec 14, 2004)

What a shocker The Mail having a pop at fertility treatments     thats why I hardly ever buy a newspaper! its full of utter rubbish!!


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## IGWIN79 (Jan 19, 2009)

i am so angery to read this , We pay are ***** taxes all are lives and dont get any help with ivf 
i have two children from a previous relationship , but my husband has not had any children and we are not allowed a free go on the NHS they wouldnt even do any tests to see what the problem was so we had to pay private DH felt really angery with this as he felt like he was been disgriminated against, we understand that couples with no children are the main people that should get help as i know what the longing for a child can do to you 
Thats why we all go abroad  cause the nhs over here doesnt take infertility serious enough and they need to start relising thats why everyone is going abroad nothing to do with set , its to do with little help from the NHS and the prices to go proivate are so high 
bet you the people that  said this has never had to experience fertility problems  and the stress and depression and the heartache that goes with it , they should read through FF for a couple of days and they will relise what excatly its like to go through it 

Roze all that money that them  pms took prob could have put alot of people through tx  they need a good  
totally agree with you hun  on the lets beat them


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

I have another little story breaking!  I have been so fed up with things such as this and being blamed for going abroad, bringing the nHS to its knees , etc that I decided to re open discussions with a well known UK clinic on whose donor egg recipient I have been for some time. I was shocked to day to realise that I have been on this list for 5 1/2 years now and have never been contacted other than when I have complained, someone calls me back to say I am practically next on the list.  I have as you can see made other arrangements but I am still peeved at how they have handled my case, and the fact they have taken£100 off me and done nothing.  

I phoned them today and spoke to an egg donation nurse. After some fumbling with the computer she advised that I would probably hear from them next week. I asked why I had heard nothing in almost 6 years only to be told that things were hard following the removal of donor anonymity which has made it almost impossible for them to recruit donors.  However I pressed them on the point that whether anyone at all had had tx in the last 5 1/2 years and was told, that , it depends on whether people had paid the £1700 for advertising costs. I said that no one had ever advised me or asked me to pay these sums, and werent they a little extortionate?  This nurse who by now was patronising and not a little terse, said that well, you have to expect that people who are willing to pay this sum get further up the list. I was gobsmacked. No one has ever mentioned this to us in the last 5 1/2 years since putting our names on the list. I had understood that the £100 paid then dealt with associated costs of the clinics own advertising campaign.  There was then some bleating about peoples data being lost in a mail merge  hence perhaps this is why they had not been in touch.  I was also told that they go through the donor list and matched couples so probably we had not had our ' match as yet' . Yet we are brown haired white persons of average everything. Yet somehow she was telling me we were almost certainly going to be notified about a donor next week? I still felt that my questions were not answered about the operation of the waiting list and expressed my anger and frustration. This person could simply not tell me where we were on the waiting list at all. Is it really that difficult? Is there some sort of secret points system involved and we are just not getting them?

I then spoke about what I had read on FF about a doctor at the clinic quoting reduced waiting times of 2 years. Yet no one has contacted us- why not.
' You can't expect us to contact everyone on the waiting list'. Why cant' I? 

Folks, this is the real story of egg donation in the UK. I am taking it further now as I feel in the mood. We are being ripped off left right and centre by UK clinics and instead of setting out blanket condemnations of all overseas clinics, this is something the HFEA should be addressing- the financial and emotional exploitation of UK couples who want to have children by UK clinics who seemingly take the money and run.

Feel so mad, perhaps I should go to the Daily Mail tomorrow.

roze


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## IGWIN79 (Jan 19, 2009)

yes roze i would you have every right  you should go to the papers , you have been


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## babycrazy (Mar 17, 2006)

RoZe
You can sell your story to magazines etc, phone the papers as you get no answer  emailing them as they get so many emails of stories that it takes them months to get through them. You go girl get yourself a little bit of money, Daily mail or whoever will print this scandal!.
Will you get your money back from Lister when you hit there upper age limit for TX ?.
Angel Blessings
XX
Karen BC


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## babycrazy (Mar 17, 2006)

Hi Again Roze
If you look in Media request there is some journelist wanting negative stories about having complecated PG after having  TX abroad. Bloody cheek. 
Perhaps with your  great way with words you could contact her and give her the negatives of  TX in UK and pros of abroad. .
X
Karen BC


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## Mish3434 (Dec 14, 2004)

Roze, The way you have been handled is a total disgrace   how dare they treat people in our situation like this   .  Yes I would definatley go to the paper with your story to make people realise exactly how frustrating the clinics are when handling (or not handling!!) our cases.

Makes me so mad I could scream


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## DreamTeam (Nov 1, 2007)

I think the daily mail probably has a dedicated desk to anti IVF stories      

Just remember to down rate any comments that are anti IVF!

love 

Snowbelle


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## DreamTeam (Nov 1, 2007)

Comments like this one make me sooooooooooo mad    

"I have always believed that, if these women can afford to have the fertility treatment, then they can jolly well afford to pay for their pre & post natal care privately too!
And, if they can't, then they should be sent back to the country where they had the treatment done - and see if THEY'LL treat them for free."

- Lizzy, W.London, 15/7/2009 08:29

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1199785/Doctors-warn-NHS-picking-costly-fertility-tourism.html#ixzz0LVMQS3Re


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## IGWIN79 (Jan 19, 2009)

just wrote a comment on this ahopeing they publish it lol that women that wrote that comment need a good


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

Babycrazy, thanks for your nice comments, but I would not be doing this to get a payment from the Daily Mail or from any other source.

I am actually beginning to wonder whether all of this anti stance and comments in the press falls foul of any discrimination laws. I'll pop an e-mail to Nat Gamble to see what she says.  I have also communicated with a university researcher who did suggest there was 'talk' about reducing ante natal care to women who conceive abroad (similar to some of the press reports and public opinion) but that this probably would not be sanctioned, as even immigrants who aren't entitled to health care will get ante natal care without question in the UK regardless of status, so this probably is a non starter but even so the prospect upsets me so much .  I don't know whats at the bottom of all of this hate. Do people think just because we are having DE abroad, we are bringing in the babies of foreigners or something  and hence do not deserve antenatal care? The BNP will have a policy on all of this next.
People get pregnant or not get pregnant all the time, at home and abroad, in a manner or ways. Is a baby conceived after a passionate night in Ibiza in a similar situation?  I really do not understand the mindsets of these people who object with so much hate.

DH had a long talk with me last night about all of this advising me to calm down. Hes probably right. Hormones are probably getting the better of me at this stage in the pregnancy. He reminded me that I am only one of several million in this country who feel picked on for various things including age, race, culture, religion, disability atc and warned me not to expect a perfect world. I am probably going to take his advice but to use any resources I can without stressing myself out too much . I have a few leads in the respectable press now so lets see where that takes us, if anywhere.

best wishes,


roze


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## helenie (Mar 18, 2009)

They didn't add my comment - I guess I'm kind of flattered that my opinion is not an acceptable daily mail view ;-)


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## PinkPeacock (Nov 9, 2006)

Roze - I'm flabbergasted by your story. Can't say much else as I feel so angry for you.


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## Candee (Feb 1, 2009)

It seems that the only group left in society without protection from discrimination are those with infertility issues. As a single woman who needs infertility treatment you can basically forget the NHS/GPs - you are persona non grata ...  I was told by my clinic that single women can't have donor eggs... so I arranged to go abroad... but now the Daily Mail would like to stop me from getting care if I get pregnant as well... Let's follows the Daily Mail logic for everyone then, shall we? I don't ski personally but from now on people with a skiing injury sustained abroad should no longer be treated by the NHS. I am now going to write to the Daily Mail to start a campaign for skiers to be sent back to Switzerland for their broken limbs to be treated!   And if people get Swine Flu from Mexico, well back they can go to Cancun to  get their Tamiflu...  
Why can't the Daily Mail just back off and leave us alone - needing help to get pregnant is not a crime and if the Mail need a group to crusade against, why not go for Drug Dealers or Sex Offenders?!   
Candee
x


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

Candee, I didn't think UK clinics could discriminate against single women getting treatment. I think you should take this up with the HFEA.

I have been in touch with Professor Lorraine Culley of de Montfort Uni who is doing research into why people go abroad for IVF treatment. She is looking to speak to people who have been treated badly in the UK ie had a hard time from their GPs, UK clinics etc and also people who have gone abroad for straight IVF with their own eggs.  She is to post something about this shortly on FF. She is very nice and I enjoyed participating in her study- very therapeutic actually having someone let me talk for an hour or so on the subject!  I would recommend anyone to participate in her study which as I see it enables a more balanced picture to be presented.

I do think we need as a group to make some sort of stand on all of this as it seems we are the silent minority who never gets a real chance to defend ourselves.  The latest insult for me is something I read about Elizabeth Adeneys case' typifying' what is going on. I have no issue with Elizabeth and will not criticise her for her choices even though having a child at 66 is not my particular choice, but there is no way her situation is ' typical' of women going abroad. Generally women are a lot younger, and actually unlike her not many of us run a major company and aren't as well off. Her case is the exception, not the rule.


roze


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## AlmaMay (Oct 15, 2004)

My story is only slightly different because I used my own eggs abroad but my experience has been similar in the discrimination I've faced.  I've been discreet with the details of my treatment with the NHS because I feel that it is my business and that of the doctor who has treated me and nobody elses business.  As far as the NHS is concerned I presented to them as a pg woman and it is their business is to treat me.  

I have had a few questions from the NHS and I've given them short and direct answers.  My main answer is, "If my septum and blood clotting issues had been found when I was 29 when we started trying to start our family I would have never needed 1 IVF let alone 11 IVFs not to mention the 7 IUIs.  Doesn't is embarass you as a representative of the NHS that I was so let down badly?"  Surprisingly I've not had a full answer to my question.  

Most women I know who have sought treatment abroad are in exactly the same situation as myself.  They had a diagnosable problems that went unnoticed or were ignored by the NHS.  For those of us who are determined enough we have sougnt out cinics who have treated us as intellegent women and diagnosed and corrected our problems which allowed us to start our families.  

We are an easy target group to pick on because of the publics general lack of understanding surrounding infertility.  Why isn't the media investigating and exposing the fact that we have the highest paid IF doctors in Europe and are close to the bottom of the league table for success in Europe?  That's the REAL story in my book.


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## ♥JJ1♥ (Feb 11, 2006)

I totally agree with AlmaMay my Asherman's Syndrome was caused by the NHS after my ERPC and diagnosed by ARGC, and diagnosed by Mr T  all my subsequent attempts at corrective surgery ahve been privately.  I have never had any IF treatment on the NHS as I am single using a known donor- wich make a joke as we have been honest in saying that we are not partners however we have been trying together  at home and then clinics for longer than many couples entitled to IF care on NHS funded cycles have been, and when I was in my 30's! (honesty pays ) - and here I am now desperately trying to get private hospitals here and abroad to allow me to cycle instead of saying surrogacy is your only option.
I am trying with DE's which are more robust and a crap lining that does well to get to 4-5 mm on a good month.
I have also worked in the NHS since I was 18! I don't begrudge anyone NHS care as that was what it was set up for and the principles should not discriminate

L x


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## Caz (Jul 21, 2002)

roze said:


> Candee, I didn't think UK clinics could discriminate against single women getting treatment. I think you should take this up with the HFEA.


I think you might find that's a law that generally applies to discrimination against lesbian, gay and transexual couples. It translates that refusing treatment on grounds of a person not having sperm _if they are in a same sex relationship_ is breaking the law, hence why most PCTs cannot now use this as one of theit "hurdles" to get around actually having to offer treatment for anyone. 
As far as I know, there's no laws protecting the rights of single women and some clinics will refuse to treat them on moral grounds (although technically they can't refuse a lesbian couple, I guess they can get round it by saying they don't have the facilities to cater for any patients needing donors.)

Not that it makes it right. 



AlmaMay said:


> My story is only slightly different because I used my own eggs abroad but my experience has been similar in the discrimination I've faced. I've been discreet with the details of my treatment with the NHS because I feel that it is my business and that of the doctor who has treated me and nobody elses business. As far as the NHS is concerned I presented to them as a pg woman and it is their business is to treat me.


That's an interesting point and one thing such negativity over treatment abroad and IVF in general might discourage people from actually admitting they had treatment in the first place. This in normal life is fine (it's up to you and I certainly don't go round saying B is an IVF baby, although if asked I don't hide it either) but medically it may become relevant, especially if the child is donor conceived. I have a vague memory of filling in forms at the start of my ante-natal care and one question being about how I'd conceived and any medical gynacological issues I had had. If I'd lied on that and said "no problems - natural conception... would it have made a difference somewhere down the line?  In my case, maybe. When B got into difficulties during the birth my MW was very quick to get help and get him delivered. She said to me afterwards that because he was an IVF baby she did not want to take any chances - the implication being she might have "risked it" had he not been because, presumably if I'd conceived naturally and - heaven forbid the worst had happened I could just go off and pop out another one next year... Hmm!  Actually I doubt she would have let that happen and I think it was just something said to make me feel better about needing forceps but I did start thinking "why should it matter? Surely any life is precious?" Clearly, in some people's eyes, method of conception does make a difference - I was also offered consultant led ante-natal care too, for the sole reason because it was an IVF pregnancy. I declined because I didn't reallly see how it was necessary and wanted, at this point, to be a normal pregnant woman not a special case.
I've digressed from the point a bit but what I am saying is that once you get this rampant disaproval of something like this then it serves just one end; it drives the whole thing underground. Maybe not literally but certainly makes people reluctant to admit or talk about it. IF has such dreadful stigma anyway (why, I don't know given how many people are affected). Once you start making people reluctant to admit to treatment at all, let alone abraod, how on earth do you start to assess any genuine positive or negative aspects of it?

Many, many ladies have excellent care in clinics abroad - certainly no worse than in the UK anyway - and many countries where ladies seek treatment are also well regulated by their own country's laws. OK there is a very small minority of patients who do come back to the UK with a high risk high order multiple pregancy because a less scrupulous clinic in a less well regulated country has gone for a high number of embryo transfers. Yes those patients do require a degree of extra care that, yes, costs the NHS money but, by the statistics quoted in the article that's one in four triplet/high order multiple pregnancies. You know 25% of all of them really isn't a lot! If we costed out the medical care for *all* triplet+ pregnancies (regardless of where and how conceived) and compared that to the overall cost of maternity care in the UK I can't imagine it would be a huge percentage. Without actually reporting facts and firgures and how the relate overalll it's very easy for any biased news report to dress something up as a big deal when it's just not. I think it's all about perspective and, frankly, the Daily Mail has absolutely dreadful perspective where fertility treatment is concerned.

C~x


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

Hi, I think your analysis is really good. This pregnancy I have been more open about the nature of conception as I have twins and felt that I needed to. The issue of pre eclampsia has arisen and I have taken comfort from my consultant who was able to advise that despite the enhanced risk of multiples, as my partner was the same, and as my egg donor was the same, and I didn't have p-e, then the chances were I wouldnt have it this time as the critical factors seem to relate to either the sperm or the egg. I felt better having opened up this time. I have felt judged a bit but am glad overall that I have disclosed this as necessary to the medics.  I do feel like you a degree of concern about people feeling less inclined to be open due to media rubbish and being judged as opposed to concern about keeping their business private, as it may disadvantage them in the long run. 

Just out of interest, my current hospital does not adopt the ' precious pregnancy' idea of IVF pregnancies, unlike my last one; it treats women as the situation dictates. I have never got to the bottom of this concept; my GP once said it was good to disclose it as it would enable my case to be managed sensitively. However I agree all pregnancies are precious hence suspect that I will never really understand this concept. A doctor did tell me that donor conceptions resulted in greater post birth blood loss due to the placenta being attached more deeply into the uterus, however I can't find any research on this.

roze  x


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## ♥JJ1♥ (Feb 11, 2006)

The NHS will and does discriminate against single women, and we are not given treatment even if we have a known donor for sperm, have IF issues and have been trying for longer than many NHS funded couples.

Single women are discriminated in many fields eg: surrogacy as you cannot legally get a parental order as you have to be married for this so cannot transfer the legal responsibility from SM to IP etc - Natalie the FF laywer has been great at trying to battle against the discrimination of LGBT and single women.  Not all the LGBT couples are funded either but have greater grounds for in law to protest now.

and they wonder why we are forced to go abroad...... if you lack sperm look at the waits and shortage of the DS, let alone DE or both!!!


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## pinkflowers (May 8, 2008)

Hi ladies

Glad I found this thread, I soooooooooo aggree with you, headlines like this make my blood boil, I also find it interesting that we have the highest paid IVF drs in Europe, a recent sighting by my boyfriend of a Porsche 4 x 4 with the plate " IVF 1" springs to mind as to how money grabbing a business it is in the UK... Seems a bit like rubbing the poor infertile's nose in it......

xxxx


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## roze (Mar 20, 2004)

Hi, I don't suppose we could trace the number plate and see whos it is?! It would be good if we went to the press with it to headline our own story.(half joking here).

I agree the UK is Rip Off Central for IVF- it was only when I went abroad that I felt the doctors made the effort to find a tailor made solution for me and not just a one size catch all effort. I was once asked about being concerned about mafia operations in the Ukraine in respect of  the private IVF clinics.  I hadn't a clue but organised crime is into a lot of things these days so I would not be surprised however I do not see the multi million pound US run companies and private hospital conglomerates operating in the UK as being markedly different in that respect. They may not walk around in dark glasses but they are there to make money, not deliver the best service. I did tell someone recently about a famous London clinic who charges women £10k for egg donor tx abroad when that overseas clinic themselves charged only £2k; they were very surprised. Is that indicative of being value for money and evidence of adequate monitoring by the HFEA in the name of consumer protection and quality?


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## wildcat (Jun 1, 2006)

Roze

I agree that UK is  rip off when it comes to treatment, the main reason I went to the US was after 5 treatments in the UK costing over £22,000 I wanted more of a gaurantee that my money was being well spent.

I found a clinic in America that offers 6 fresh cycles of IVF, (and includes any frozen cycles free for as many frosties as you can get) for $20,000 which for me at the time was £10,000. with a FULL refund of that money if I didn't have a live baby at the end of the 6 cycles, they also do DE treatments with a similar deal. I read and re-read their small print and there are no catches, it's a shared risk, if you get pregnant on cycle 1 - they win as they get to keep the $20k, but if you don't or you need all 6 - you win as it's a LOT cheaper with a full refund. Also I was surprised to find if I decided on say cycle 4 I'd had enough - they'd still give me all my money back.

I asked my UK clinic if they would do something similar - they laughed at me.

You simply don't get this kind of offer over here, I also found their care levels to be somewhat higher and they weren't pushing for multiple embies either - in fact their prefer single embryo transfer if possible, but they do work hard as they WANT to get you pregnant (so they can keep your money!) which is what we all want.

I got pregnant on fresh cycle number 3 - we also had a frozen cycle - never have they asked me for more money, and they actually saved me money by giving me some of the drugs for free.

So why should I be treated with contempt for wanting to do this abroad? Because I had the check to spend my hard earned money somewhere else!  I have told my midwife these babies are IVF, but they don't know I went to America.


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## AlmaMay (Oct 15, 2004)

Please don't rely on the HFEA to prevent discrimination (against single women etc) or to protect people seeking IF TX from being ripped off.  The HFEA is feeding out these scare stories about TX abroad.  I contacted them several years ago to ask what actual evidence they had to issue press releases saying that going abroad for TX was dangerous.  They replied to say that they don't monitor TX abroad so I asked again how they could press release it being dangerous when they don't have evidence   

The HFEA is a there to licence IVF clinics and to make UK policy on IVF.  They are the organisation that changed the choice of anonymity of donors and limit the number of embryos that can be transferred. IN MY OPINION they basically impose government and public opinion on the users of IVF services.  They aren't there to protect the users of the services provided here.  They are part of the problem and the source of a lot of these 'fertility tourism' negative stories.  Also, I have found it very interesting that the HFEA tend to target European and especially Eastern European clinics for their harshest criticism and never criticise American clinics that routinely treat IF people with the things that they ban (anonymous donors, transferring more than 3 embryos etc).


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## Jane D (Apr 16, 2007)

Sorry to change the subject  a little here, have read with great interest everyones comments as a fellow aboradie.  Just wanted to know if anyone of the Mods or Tony has thought of phoning the editor of the Mail to ask why so many IVF stories in their paper?  

Roze - so sorry you have been through so much in the UK.  Certain circles bang on about how preferable UK deivf is on account of non anonymous donors, but you have described to us a real experience in the UK and how difficult the process can be.  

Good luck to all those who go abroad for treatment.

Jane


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## pinkflowers (May 8, 2008)

Hi girls

Good idea re ringing The Mail, flicked through the last 2 weeks Mail, I do like it I admit for beauty, how vain am I? and health articles but was stunned yesterday by the sheer volume of negative IVF and old Mum stories. left me feeling vvvv fed up!

love pinkflowers xxxx


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