# Guardian article - Dr Falconer on women's age at childbirth



## molly1966

I found this rather upsetting even though the information is 'scientifically correct'.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/dec/31/pregnancy-mothers-fertility-children


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## roze

I don't disagree in general but the fact is that life throws at us what it throws at us and people cannot be blamed for trying. The issue about declining fertility is standard however for many women it starts a lot earlier and for some ( like my own mother) a lot later.

There are always risks but these I think are best assessed individually.

I agree that people should be educated that the best time to have children is before the woman is 35 but then society needs to loosen up a bit about single parents and also to financially support young people more. The fact in my case is that I did not meet my partner until I was 32 and about 34 until I decided to make a committment to him. In between that I lost both my parents and was involved with a row with my extended family as well as being made redundant. I had struggled to buy a flat in London and even when I managed this I was still struggling financially for a long time. It would also not have been possible to have a child in the life I had bought due to certain physical aspects ie being on the third floor, no lift, no storage, and a dangerous balcony with low railings which I could not alter. I was 41 when I started to seek help which is just after we managed to buy a house, again with inheritance money which I had just been able to access after many years and when I felt that both myself and my partner were in secure employment. 

My partner and are have second degrees and professional qualifications, and are paid above average . but we still could not afford to get ourselves into a decent financial position until our 40s.

I don't doubt that if had conceived naturally then we would have just got on with all of it but we didn;t so decisions had to be made as required at the time.

If the HFEA and the various bodies advising on earlier childbirth would like to address these questions as well, then good stuff, but until they do, I don't see why women should feel guilty or upset about having to seek treatment in later life.  There is always a reason= and a good one.


roze


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## Biriyani

Interesting that the starting age of suitability is 20!  I take it we need to start discouraging girls from going on to higher education?  Or maybe they should have training in how to bring up a child whilst completing a degree?


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## molly1966

Certainly, girls should be educated about fertility (I never was) and so should boys! There are many aspects to it, not just telling women their eggs will get old and they need to 'resolve the conflict between careers and motherhood'. Male infertility is such a problem - just look across the board, so many women having to delay motherhood until sperm problems are resolved. I find Falconer's tone very patronizing and really we should be moving on from this sort of thing in the 21st century. You are both correct - there is the matter of individual women and their lives and having to balance many things including finances.


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## reb363

Controversial as it is I do think the advice is right.

The framing of it isn't - in particular the assertion that " women and couples have to become "better at resolving the conflict" between their careers" - which wrongly assumes that this is the reason why people have children later and wrongly assumes that it is within their power to resolve the conflict (and not society/government).

That said, the facts are true and I wish that I had known them rather than keep being told "I had plenty of time".  I didn't and I would have sought medical advice much earlier if I'd known.

Meanwhile it's a shame that the Goverment is taking away financial support from mothers - the hardest hit group in the cuts - rather than helping those who need it more.


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## molly1966

I agree. Again, its a matter of how different it is for individual women. I was aware that my biological clock was ticking, although perhaps not quite to the extent I should have been, but until I found a partner I could trust and who would take equal parental responsibility, I was not in a position to have children. These are all difficult issues that cannot be resolved through a one size-fits-all lecture to women. Now, having conceived, and thrilled about it, I would like not to be treated like an irresponsible adult who should have known better.


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## Candee

What is he going to do about commitmentphobe men, who mess women around and waste their fertile years?  
If I could have found a decent man, who wanted to settle down and have children, anytime after I was 25, I would have been happy to have children then! I found myself still single at 40 and that is why I had my baby late... nothing to do with my career - maybe we should be teaching girls to stop searching for Mr Right and have a baby on your own before 35?


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## roze

I've had friends who went to fertility clinics for a sperm donor for this reason when they were in their 30's and weren't in a committed relationship. I thought they were very radical and brave but it wasn't something I could have done on my own. Its certainly the plan, but no doubt someone will write a medical article on the problems of and problems caused by single women raising children etc.

The common perception that we are all too busy working in glamorous careers and knocking back the cocktails whilst being incredibly fussy about future partners needs to kicked in the teeth.


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## molly1966

Totally agree! I think its important to speak up about this. It is becoming a reality for more and more women, and frankly the attitudes reflected in that little lecture simply seem out of date. I don't like the idea that girls should be taught fertility while boys can feel they have nothing but their careers to look after - its so 1950s. I fear in the current climate we have only got more such cultural conservatism to look forward to.


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## JasperP

I agree entirely.  It annoys me that, somehow, it's all down to women.  As if the men in our lives were somehow nothing to do with our decision (or not) to start a family!  There's also no recognition of male factors in infertility.

In my case, I had a horrendous (and abusive) first marriage and didn't meet my second husband until I was in my mid 30's.  I'm 39 now, and it's likely we'll need IVF - DH's first sperm test wasn't great so it could be male factor.  

Society - blaming women for everything since year dot.


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## roze

Too true!


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## Candee

Roze I am not sure there are _medical_ problems associated with single mothers?  
I hope not anyway!
Me and my LO are managing on our own ok, thus far!
Candee


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## Jumanji

I have to say that, while it is true that female fertility does decline with age, I do get a little fed up with (a) the incessant banging on about it (b) the way that "statistics" are merrily trotted out with nothing to back them up; there have never been ANY controlled, randomised studies on natural fertility over 35 or over 40 yet docs seem happy to state categorically that x% of women in this age bracket will have problems conceiving; and (c) the totally wrong assumption that "older" mothers are somehow a modern trend brought about by career women etc.; to give some actual ONS statistics - the number of births to women over 40 in 1938 was 27,200; in 2009 it was 26,976.  The numbers dropped in the 1950s/60s with better access to contraception and abortion and rose again later on.  

Yes - we know there is a decline but too many women are made to feel like hopeless cases based solely on their age.  I sometimes think that if a woman of 38 or so went to a fertility clinic with her eunuch husband the focus would still be on the woman's age!


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## Dixie chick

I agree that this information could be given at a younger age, although we also need to educate society so that the age at which to have children becomes more of a choice. Many factors (cost of living, cost of child care, work prejudices) make this less about choice and more about necessity.

My partner and I had wanted to start a family for several years before we were in a position to try.  Once we had met and made a commitment, we wanted to make sure we could provide for a child before having one, not just blunder on regardless.  We delayed so we could finish our higher education and then, because of redundancy, until I had a stable job.

I am not an ambitious career type who wants the 'moon on a stick', just an average woman who wants to have a normal family home.  Should we be stigmatised for being responsible?


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## kitten77

so why was i told when i went for isci (due to male factor may i add) that i was told i was TOO YOUNG!? at the age of 27....they are telling me now that time is getting on!!!!!


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## poohbear71

Age is always going to be controversial and the risks are higher, but the treatment would not be available if it was that bad, although this article was about pregnancy in general.

I got my BFP on my 35th birthday, just got into the right bracket!!  If my current treatment works it will be nearly my 40th birthday.  Apart from being told that chances are lower at this age clinic has not tried to put us off because of age, but then we are paying for treatment.  At my clinic you have to accepted for NHS treatment by the time you are 34, I was 2 weeks off my 34th birthday.

I do think its unfair to label all women who have children later as career women etc, I did not get married until I was 30 and then it was not our fault that we encountered so many problems.  Also we had many delays at the clinic before being accepted for the IVF, several times test results were lost and we were just told come back again in 3 months!!  Doesn't take many lots of 3 months to make another year.  then we had another delay cos of having to wait for a new financial year for funding.  

Well better finish my rant now!!!!!


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## Jumanji

I think kitten raises a very good point about younger women having their fertility issues trivialised.  We sometimes seem to have got the stage where there is so much emphasis on age that if you are under 30 you are told you cannot possibly have a fertility problem and if you are over 35 then you are told you must have one!  It is so much more complicated than that and I do feel for all the younger ladies who are dismissed as being "too young" for there to be any real problems.  It must be terribly frustrating.


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## kitten77

thank you littlejenny - yes it is hard for younger women to get the 'brush off' as that is what it is....or a pat on the head and told to come back when over 30 like its not a real problem! 

we had to fight for well over a year before our PCT let us have isci when i was 27, and that was a struggle.  

they say on one hand that shouldnt wait until older, but if you do need some help they wont give it to you!


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## poohbear71

It does seem strange to tell people to wait if they believe things get worse as you get older.  Treatment is much more successful in younger women so it would make sense to let them have it if they need it.  Or perhaps they are trying to make money out of the older people as many places do not fund treatment for over 35's so anyone needing treatment has to pay and they don't seem to try and put you off if you are paying


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## kitten77

here here, social chameleon.

we have just had to take our house off the market due to the fact we do not have a full deposit for our DOWNSIZED house (downsizing due to having to pay for tx!), and we dont have a deposit due to the fact we have to pay for tx.  but yep...im 31 now....will be sl4gged off soon for only thinking about my career - yer right....cant focus on career as all focus goes on tx! 

the whole thing is ageism.  to young in one breath then low and behold to old once you pass certian mark!!!!


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## Jumanji

Kitten/Chameleon - I am so sorry that both you you have experienced such difficulties and I am truly appalled that it was somehow suggested to Chameleon that her husband's issues would magically disappear simply because she was under 30.  That just defies logic.  I do get angry with the way "older" women are blamed for any fertility issues they encounter but it easy to forget that younger women can encounter equally poor treatment based on their age too.  As Kitten says it is just ageism.


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## kandykane

i think it's more sexism not ageism. whatever the problem, it must be the woman's fault


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## Be Lucky

if you read my profile you will see that you should never give up hope!life is not always perfect and many reasons why ppl dont have children earlier.couldnt care less what this boffin thinks!i don't care about anyone opinions regards when if and how i had our beautiful son!x


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## Missy123

We can't always pick when it will happen as i have been ttc for over 10 years. I wanted to be able to drive, have my own home first etc etc. Life is unpredictable but it will be loved and cared for whatever age it happens for me!


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