# Being childless in the workplace.....



## CopperBird (Jan 10, 2016)

A bit of a rant here but I've been thinking a lot recently about the workplace and infertile or childless couples. It appears to be the general assumption that we will work all the late shifts and weekends just so the 'mothers' can have them off to spend with their kids. They are allowed to request fixed days in the week whereas we cannot because we 'don't have childcare responsibilities'. Why is it assumed that if you don't have kids you want to do nothing but work? Why is it frowned upon to work part time if you don't have kids? Can childless couples not want a life outside work, its not as though we need as much money.

I personally feel that if we give up treatment then it doesn't mean we want to give up living. If we can't have kids then there's a world out there to be travelled but how will we ever get the time off to do this? Its not as though we will get the 'year off' on maternity leave that mothers get, or claim any of the money that families get so is it to much to ask just for some understanding that childless couples want lives to? That we are not just money making working machines designed to work so everyone else can live.

Pregnant women are offered support and time off when needed but for fertility treatment you get nothing. Just used up annual leave so you have no time to actually go on holiday. I genuinely feel that with all the discrimination laws this country has there should be something to help infertile/childless couples. I do not feel that we have equal rights in the workplace but maybe I am just unlucky. All we seem to do is work to pay for treatment :-(

Rant over :-D


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## June2015 (Jun 20, 2015)

Oh yes, i know how you feel.  When i worked in the city, i worked long long hours and my boss at the time didn't have children either so expected us to work late.  I worked in HR and funnily enough once the boss had kids she changed the firm's family friendly policies to make life better for, you guessed it, working parents.

Anyway, on another note, if you were interested (and you might already know) that all employees after 6 months' service are entitled to apply for flexible working (employees' can request this at least once a year). Of course, the organisation can decline requests based on 7/8 criteria eg, it doesn't meet with business needs.

But all that said, I agree it does often seem like those without children are the ones who put more hours in.  In the end, I made a rule for myself that at least twice a week I would leave work on time and not work extra hours and, well, two fingers to those who frowned xx


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

I'm glad you've written this Copperbird as I have been thinking about this for a while and completely agree with you.  I used to be a teacher and when I was going through infertility and watching all my colleagues get pregnant around me, I used to wish I could have the time off for appointments that they were getting and look forward to maternity leave and those early weeks before the baby comes where you can have some time to yourself.  I found too that those of us without children were expected to step up and go on all the residential trips and do the open evenings and other commitments because we didn't have 'childcare commitments'.  It's very hard.  It's so true that it is often assumed that if you don't have kids you'll be able to work all the hours god gives.  The part time issue is a good one too.  It only seems to be acceptable for mums to ask for this.  I do know someone who is in her mid 40s and doesn't have children who is part time and people do often question why she needs it. 

The other thing I find in the workplace is feeling like an outcast because I don't have children.  I work in a very female dominated field and everyone is always talking about their children.  There is always someone pregnant, going on maternity leave, coming back from maternity leave etc.  It's all very isolating as I feel like I have nothing to contribute to conversations as I don't know what it's like and can't compare notes with them all.


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

Just read your post again Copperbird - spot on!  I agree with every word; very well put.


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## stelmat (Feb 1, 2014)

In my previous job I was certainly the one expected to cover until late so everyone else could go early to pick up children, go to their events etc.  I will also mention I was the only female there (and the youngest by 10 years), so it wasn't a female dominated environment at all.  Mainly I didn't mind, but sometimes I did feel taken for granted and it would have been nice to have been asked first, not just assumed that I would do it.  Most people did ask, which made me more inclined to help out.

However they did have a company policy where anyone could apply for an unpaid leave of absence of up to one year after you had worked there a certain amount of time.  I thought this was a pretty good idea as it did enable a few people (and I can't think of anyone who did it who had children) to take a gap year and do something for themselves with the security of coming back to the same job at the end of it.  It may well be worth asking if that would be an option for you if it was something you were interested in, although obviously some employers wouldn't be able to oblige even if they wanted to.

Where I am now (very small business, just 2 full time and 2 part time) there are no policies for anything, we just agree between ourselves what is happening.  Noone has school age/young children either, but when the one did he changed his hours to start a bit earlier and finish a bit earlier so he could see them for tea and before bedtime.  His children are mid 20s now and he is still on the same hours he agreed back then as it still suits him and everyone else.


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## Jengles (Mar 3, 2016)

Totally agree with this post definitely those without children are made to feel that the schedule of those with children is much more important. Yes I know they have to be picked up on time and not left on the street but I do hate that our lives somehow are less important. If I do everything get to have a child I will make a point of not being like this. 

Although in my dept noone is part time i think not there's this change for flexible hours I'll be interested to see if anyone gets to. I've always had a massive workload but now finally getting someone to help me so hopefully I would be able to leave on time more. At my place you do get overtime which is the only positive about having too much work. 
My immediate boss is lovely and he agreed to me having 2 weeks off unpaid so I didn't have to use up my holiday for my 2ww. Yes I'll be skint but at the moment the time is more important. 
Thanks for the post


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## Blueberry girl (Oct 3, 2013)

Have just been thinking exactly the same thing myself, and getting fed up of it! Looks like lots of people are having the same feelings of being discriminated against just because they don't have children.

I have all the '**** shifts' that no-one wants because they don't fit in with school hours. I found it hilarious how a woman I work with who has all the midweek shifts and who's kids are now leaving home asked me 'but what will you do when you have a baby because you work weekends? We all work the midweek shifts...' I replied 'well it looks like I'll have to give up my job doesn't it, if you're not willing to swap shifts? She said' Yeah...it does...'

Charming.

xx


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## K jade (Aug 11, 2013)

Sorry but I find this quite shocking! 
Maybe I'm very naive or just very lucky in my workplace but I've never experienced ill treatement from being childless,. 
is it not discrimination? 

Once many years ago a woman tried to voice that only parents should be allowed to have annual leave in the month of  August  and she was quickly shot down to flames. AND I work in a women only environment 

It's awful that people are still stigmatised and discriminated for Fertility, funny how it still seems OK as well
The last remaining taboo I guess. Very sad. 
Hugs to you all xx


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## Fertilityhawk (Jan 22, 2015)

excellently put!!

I spoke to my boss about dropping a day and he looked at me like I'd got 2 heads, why do you want to do that when you don't have any kids?  erm because I want a better balance, I might not have any children but I have a dog that spends every day with my mum & dad and I'd actually like to spend more time with him - yes I'm afraid I'm one of those people who treat my dog like their my child


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## annasss (Feb 8, 2017)

CopperBird said:


> A bit of a rant here but I've been thinking a lot recently about the workplace and infertile or childless couples. It appears to be the general assumption that we will work all the late shifts and weekends just so the 'mothers' can have them off to spend with their kids. They are allowed to request fixed days in the week whereas we cannot because we 'don't have childcare responsibilities'. Why is it assumed that if you don't have kids you want to do nothing but work? Why is it frowned upon to work part time if you don't have kids? Can childless couples not want a life outside work, its not as though we need as much money.
> 
> I personally feel that if we give up treatment then it doesn't mean we want to give up living. If we can't have kids then there's a world out there to be travelled but how will we ever get the time off to do this? Its not as though we will get the 'year off' on maternity leave that mothers get, or claim any of the money that families get so is it to much to ask just for some understanding that childless couples want lives to? That we are not just money making working machines designed to work so everyone else can live.
> 
> ...


totally agree with you. 
Sometimes people don't think about others. On my previous job was like ' oh, could you work overtime? why do you need to go home, you don't have children, your husband works nights and you have only one cat. are you serious?' If I don't have children does it mean I want to stay late at work because you forgot to do some stuff? 
Sorry for my expressions, but I'm so tired of all this ..., I don't have children and that makes me crazy about different thing. I've been through lots of hazards on my life path. Now, we are looking for a next place of starting our de cycle


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## CopperBird (Jan 10, 2016)

Hey,

Thanks for your replies, it seems I am not alone in this.



Jengles said:


> My immediate boss is lovely and he agreed to me having 2 weeks off unpaid so I didn't have to use up my holiday for my 2ww. Yes I'll be skint but at the moment the time is more important.
> Thanks for the post


In response to the message above, my clinic give sick notes for the 2ww which companies have to honour even if they only pay statutory, so this might be something worth talking to the clinic about.



Fertilityhawk said:


> I spoke to my boss about dropping a day and he looked at me like I'd got 2 heads, why do you want to do that when you don't have any kids? erm because I want a better balance, I might not have any children but I have a dog that spends every day with my mum & dad and I'd actually like to spend more time with him - yes I'm afraid I'm one of those people who treat my dog like their my child


Well said, its true, nothing wrong with a better work/life balance.

I like to think there is still a life out there even if it is not the one I originally had in mind.

All the best everyone xx


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## Besidetheseaside (Nov 11, 2015)

I know exactly what are you going through. 
I'm a theatre nurse and colleagues with kids can choose their fixed days and do all the best payed days.
In January I did 6 Saturdays out of 8 because a colleague does only the Sunday (much better payed and she needs the money apparently).
If a theatre lists overruns no one even asks me if I can stay after 6pm as they assume that anyway as I haven't got kids.
People without kids have to do usually Christmas day and can't take more than 2 weeks annual leave between July and September as colleagues with kids are demanding them for their family.
It's not fair really.


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## magicpillow (Feb 8, 2015)

This week at work the topic of Christmas leave came up.  I'm fully accepting of having to work between xmas and new year (we get xmas and boxing day off) as I'm quite new to the team so fair enough.  My manager though was saying how everyone wants the time off but she can't understand why people want to be off so much at Christmas unless they've got young children.  Errr well my husband has the whole time off and I'd quite like to spend some time with him!  That comment really irked me.


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## Me Myself and I (Dec 30, 2012)

Aa


magicpillow said:


> This week at work the topic of Christmas leave came up. I'm fully accepting of having to work between xmas and new year (we get xmas and boxing day off) as I'm quite new to the team so fair enough. My manager though was saying how everyone wants the time off but she can't understand why people want to be off so much at Christmas unless they've got young children. Errr well my husband has the whole time off and I'd quite like to spend some time with him! That comment really irked me.


I understand as felt the same way as it was the only time that I got to spend it with extended family with no restrictions.
However if/when you have children it won't just be about opportunity to spend time with a partner it will be about logistics of covering the school holidays and childcare facilities being closed, so a different dynamics. 
I think that it's one of those scenarios that when it comes to holiday allocations all parties feel as deserving/as much of a priority as others. Be you childless couple, single grandmother who doesn't see the family often or just a single person. But logistics are not everyone's needs can be met and often now with family policies being so prominent inevitably the employers will struggle not to be seen disadvatnagubg parents.

Good luck in your journey.


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