# Childless but not Childfree



## Uber Barrens Club

Was wondering if anyone else felt in limbo?

I'm 34 and most of my friends have at least one child now

Most of their social lives now, unsurprisingly, revolve around their children - NCT get togethers, kids' friends' birthday parties, playdates etc

I have been completely open about my infertility and miscarriage, and their support has been overwhelming

But the fact is, they're part of a club of which I can't become a member

And it hurts. They do try to include me, but there's nothing like rocking up on your own to a kids' party to make you feel like a barren old spinster / paedo

And most of my RL friends who don't have kids are living wild and crazy lives without kids, and of course we're not drinking alcohol, caffeine, not doing mad booze fuelled nights out on the town etc. 

We're in limbo, childless but not child free

So I find myself excluding myself, and withdrawing and hiding myself away.

The only people I find I wanted to talk to after the miscarriage (and still do - it's only 3 weeks so very new and raw) are other infertile women

The militant barrens, as we jokingly call ourselves

Many of whom are virtual, but some of whom are RL friends - who by being open about my infertility, have 'come out' to me about their own struggles

I feel like I have NO chat any more. I have nothing of any interest to say The only thing in my life of late has been IVF, cancelled IVF, IVF, pregnancy, miscarriage. And to be brutally honest, that's sort of fine, because at least talking to other infertile women makes me feel less alone. 

I don't WANT to have a break from TTC, because I find the in between bits between tx the hardest bits - I just want to push on through with Project Baby.

But wondered if anyone else felt like they were in limbo between 2 worlds? (does that make infertility world like Middle Earth?!!)


----------



## magicpillow

Yes I absolutely do too Bananafish.  I'm 39 and all of my friends have children apart from one who has gone through 9 years of fertility treatment.  She totally gets where I'm coming from but apart from her, I feel completely socially isolated.  The one saving grace is that I'm on a uni course with people mostly in their 20s and early 30s so there is no child talk which keeps me sane.  
I've found in the last year or so that I've stopped going to any group get togethers where OH and I will be the only ones there without children as I feel like a completely lemon standing there whilst they all talk about their kids for hours and run around after them, play with them etc.  It's sad that I used to love meeting up with old uni and school friends but I don't want to anymore as all the talk about is kids and I feel like I've got nothing in common anymore.  Even my OH says that his mates just talk about kids all the time now and it gets really boring for him (as well as feeling left out). 
I do feel like there is a massive section of society that I'm not part of and it's hard.  I do feel like I'm gradually losing touch with friends.  I thank my lucky stars for this forum as it's so comforting to know there are other ladies out there feeling the same as me and who understand.


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

Yes it’s *exactly* that. It’s a special club that they’re all members of and I can’t join in

Which is I think why I value forums such as this, and my RL ‘militant barren’ friends, because whilst infertility and miscarriage is a club you don’t ever want anyone else to have to be a member of, it means so, so, much to be able to speak to other members of the same club

I can’t join in with the kids chat. Thankfully, because I’ve been so open about our treatment, I haven’t had the comments about how lucky we are to be able to lie in / watch telly that isn’t cbeebies / not to have conversations that revolve entirely around the consistency of the output in their offspring’s nappies.  Because they know I would LOVE to be able to do any of these things.


----------



## magicpillow

I love your posts banana.
You are spot on that the infertility and miscarriage club is one you don't want people to have to be a member of but it's invaluable to have the support of others who understand exactly what you are going through.
Although I am pretty open about our situation these days, I still get the comments about how I could just adopt, use donor sperm, enjoy lay ins and holidays. I also get told how having kids isn't all it's cracked up to be and how hard it is etc. All by people who have had no problems conceiving. I find the lack of empathy quite hard sometimes. 
I think I've hidden almost every mum blog from my newsfeed as I find those so smug and show off.


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

Thank you lovely, and likewise with your posts 

Yes - the lay ins and holidays. Brilliant. That all completely makes up for the aching emptiness in my heart for the family I'm scared we'll never have. Oh, and you made your families with some shagging, whilst I'm £18,000 down on IVF and have one mc (and 4 blasts on ice, in fairness) to show for it. Woohoo.

I haven't had _too_ many comments, but the 'have you ever thought about adoption' really gets my back up. Of COURSE I've thought about it. But you know that it's not like Annie, where there are hoards of waiting orphans desperate to be adopted, yeah? And most parents wouldn't get approved to adopt their own kids, the number of hoops you have to jump through? Oh and one of us would likely have to give up work entirely because of the needs of caring for a child with all manner of special needs (mental and physical)?

I've stopped reading comments on any articles on IVF. "Why don't they just adopt, the world is over populated as it is' is the one that boils my p*ss. I want to say to them, do you have kids? Did you 'just' adopt? No? So why is it OK for you to want to have your own biological family, and not for me?

I have however, found that by being open about my infertility, I have had a quite staggering amount of friends who have 'come out' about their own experiences. People who on social media I had assumed to be just another couple with cute kids, it turns out had, for example had 5 years of infertility (incl. 7 IUIs, 2 fresh cycles, several miscarriages, 2 FETs to get their 2 children). Another friend had 3 miscarriages in the space of 11 months.

I am pretty militant about being open about IVF (again, my personal decision, not judging anyone else for theirs), because actually I've got tremendous support, and the stress of keeping it hidden would have been awful. Similarly I can't imagine suffering the silent grief of a m/c without the support of friends and family. Particularly friends who sadly have been through it, who gave me the most incredible practical advice about 'how to deal with an ERPC' or similar

Doesn't make the endless newsfeed baby photos any easier though.


----------



## stelmat

Gosh bananafish I totally agree.  

We haven't been open about our struggles and I'm now at a point where I'm wondering if we should.  Your post has certainly given me food for thought.


----------



## Angedelight

Hi ladies

Found this thread really helpful and can resonate with what you've both said. Bananafish- I too read the comments on news articles about IF and get so angry!. The last one that made me so furious I nearly launched my phone at a wall was people ranting that people shouldn't get funding on the NHS for treatment. As I said to my husband those commenting are probably the same people that smoke, are overweight and will cost the NHS a fortune with something they can actually control! Like IF is a choice. 

And the adoption comment. I choose not to talk about our situation anymore. It's because of those sort of comments. And the 'just relax it'll happen' and the 'I know someone who blah blah blah'. I'd probably punch the next person that says any of these.

We had our first cycle back in 2013. It got cancelled and I was devastated- you invest so much in them emotionally and mentally and I was convinced the first one would work (oh the naive optimism of starting out!). But that was the beginning of the year so we picked ourselves up, had a summer of fun, holidays, festivals etc. This last one after a 2 year break has failed and I couldn't give a toss about a summer of fun. I don't have the energy for it and don't want it. I want a family. I feel like time is running out. So completely understand what you say about about feeling childless but not child free. I'm just about to order an obscene amount of supplements from Amazon after reading it Starts with the Egg. I have 2 low GI diet books winging their way through the post as that's supposed to be the best PCOS diet. So I don't actually want to do anything that will only compromise all of these efforts. 

I hate this journey and what it has done to me. This forum is so helpful for dealing with these emotions and feeling less alone. 

Magicpillow- the baby blogs! My nephews girlfriend has just started one about life as a mummy to a 3 month old and what a trial it is. It's taken every ounce of willpower to not comment!. I tend not to go on ** anymore as it usually triggers a meltdown.

At our follow up the consultant- who I don't much like anyway- asked if we had considered using donor eggs just like those people say 'you could always adopt'. I wanted to punch her too. I'm not giving up on us just yet hence supplements, diet changes etc but this is all going to consume me. So I very much I agree with your childless but not child free status Bananafish. We won't do another cycle until Oct/Nov now in order to take all the supplements and prepare as best we can. So limbo land for 7 months awaits.

I'm very sorry for both of your losses. 

X


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

*stelmat *- I can only speak for myself, but I'd find it incredibly stressful trying to keep what is essentially weaved into every aspect of my life at the moment, hidden. I also really value people being understanding and supportive. I don't think it's anything to be ashamed of, so part of me is quite militant about being open so maybe someone else might feel there's less of a stigma attached to infertility. Which actually, in my personal experience, isn't the case at all. Especially as it is WAY more common than you think.

*MrsC* oh the NHS funding rants boil my p**s. Infertility is a medical condition, it's not self inflicted unlike diabetes from eating too much, joint problems because of being too fat, lung issues from smoking, or injuries from accidents when drunk. All of which cost the NHS far, far more. We rushed to IVF when we found out my FSH/AMH, so we hadn't been TTC long enough to qualify for NHS funding in the first instance - but even if we had, it's likely I might not have got funded with such seemingly poor ovarian reserve. NHS would have likely written me off as lost cause, given their thresholds for AMH/FSH/antral follicle count. Yet I got 17 eggs, despite almost undetectable AMH. The fact they have ovarian reserve cut offs at all is so unfair, as it's saying they won't help the people who need it most! But the postcode lottery is deeply unfair as it is.

Completely, 100% agree about the not wanting to have time off. I want to go again as soon as we possibly can. Lots of people say I need time to physically and emotionally heal after the miscarriage. The former I get, will have to see what the Dr says, but the latter, definitely not the case for me. The longer we wait, the more stress and frustration. People on other threads have said to take the summer off and come back recharged and mentally ready to go again. I don't want the summer off - enforced waiting will be far more emotionally difficult for me.

BTW I don't know if you've seen any of my other posts on other threads, because I wang on about it ad nauseam like a broken record, but I followed the advice about supplements in 'It starts with the Egg' pretty religiously, and seemed to see a significant difference as a result:

Cycle 1: AFC 5 at baseline: 7 eggs, 6 mature, 4 fertilised and good quality at day 3 but none made it to blastocyst

Cycle 2: AFC 10 at baseline: 17 eggs, all mature, 12 fertilised, 7 made it to blastocyst - of which 1 was transferred (BFP but MMC at 10w), and 4 were frozen

I have no idea if there is any correlation or causation but the first round I had only been taking a cocktail of egg quality supplements for about 6 weeks vs the second round, which seems to have had better egg and embryo quality - where I had done over 3 months of the supplements (the duration of the egg maturation process).

I am trying to look upon a potential enforced wait as the opportunity to get my ovaries match fit again with more time on the supplements - I stopped most of the supplements after transfer (& stayed off while I was pregnant), so given the above, I probably need time to get the benefit.

So glad to find that I'm not alone in feeling this way 

x


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

The other thing I'd say about sharing *stelmat*, is by disclosing, it's meant my friends are aware of what might be sensitive

If we had kept our issues a state secret, then even though most people would probably recognise that infertility was far more likely than not wanting children, if they _don't know_, they can't really be expected to mind read, and consciously consider what might be difficult for us

Case in point, when I found my friend's baby naming just too painful, I was able to stay for the ceremony but slip out for the celebrations afterwards, and able to make apologies directly, and to know that she understood how difficult it was for me. If I'd had to make up some excuse, it's far more likely she would have thought she was being fobbed off, or like I just couldn't be bothered. It really does take the pressure off the moments which are difficult enough as it is, in my own experience...


----------



## mrschef04

Hi bananfish, I know where you are coming from.  I'm 39 years old.  I found out I was infertile about two years ago.  Went through the tests.  High FSH at 37 and then at 23, so it fluctuates.  Had a terrible round of IVF with pretty much one egg that fertilised and a BFN.  Even going through that on the boards was depressing, as everyone else was getting 8 or more follicles and I just had about three through the whole thing.

NHS even cancelled the next two rounds and we knew we couldn't afford private or donor.  So we sat outside after our appointment and just concluded that we would be happy just the two of us.  That the next year we would go on a lot of fun trips and just be together and stop the whole TTC thing.  

Throughout this, I did find it painful to see others find pregnancy so easy.  In fact, many that had children couldn't quite relate and we grew apart anyway, so I even unfriended two people on ******** (they both were having children to "save" their relationships and I just was angry and bitter.  I admit that).  I avoided any "baby events", etc. as I wanted to take care of myself.  The thing about friends is that they come and go in your life and I think that you keep one or two friends during each phase or chapter in your life.  It is what it is.  Everything changes.  

As for my infertility, I've been open about it over the last year and I have had a lot of women come up to me privately, who have said it was refreshing that someone can be so open about it and that it made them feel less alone, less embarrassed and that the way I handled "normal" people's stupid reactions to it was actually rather refreshing.  

We did think about adoption and seriously considered it, but the issue I had with it is that you can't really choose who you adopt and there are a lot of emotional issues that can surround a child that I wasn't sure we could take on.  I even had an adoption event booked and then we ended up cancelling a week beforehand and just thought, it's not for us now.  We will just be happy with what we have.  We truly gave up and didn't think we would have children.

We went on our first 10-day trip after cancelling this.  I smoked ****, lots of drinking and a 3-day bout of food poisoning and came back and had a natural BFP.  Even after four doctors said I had a less than 1% chance of this happening.  I'm not saying this stuff happens, but I'm just saying that sometimes life can throw curveballs at you.  

The weird thing is that none of my friends have children and they are all in their 30s and now I feel isolated again (not from everyone, but just because I can't drink, etc. during pregnancy) and need to find a group of friends that do have kids, but aren't boring as hell.

All in all, I always feel that the worse thing you can do is wallow in the sadness.  Learn to be sad once in a while.  Have a cry, but then get up, wipe your tears and go out with friends.  Be with people that accept you whether you're having children or not.  I wish I could offer way more comfort, but I just thought I would give you another perspective.


----------



## chichi85

Hey ,

I feel the same . I'm in such limbo atm , gets me down everyday .

Like you bannana , we have the wild friends that we can go out with but I'm not in the right frame of mind for wild nights.

I haven't been so open with everyone . To be honest I have found this whole situation really effecting my friendships . Not that it's anyone's fault but I feel like people just keep putting there foot in it . I think they don't no what to say or the correct things to say .
Before Xmas I was on a group chat via txts and my friends husband kept asking me if I was pregnant on the group as I wasn't drinking ( preparing myself for IVF ) the wife and the husband no we have been waiting to do IVF . So to have these questions left me rather in a state .  I had to txt his wife telling her to tell him to stop asking me in a group of 10 odd people on this chat. For this reason we haven't told them we started in Jan , feel like why should they no our buissness since being so insensitive. They no something is going on its pretty obvious , but I'm still getting questions which I'm not willing to go over with them. 

I have told a few others friends so I do have that so I'm not alone . This journey has stripped me of my life .


----------



## magicpillow

Hugs to everyone and I can really empathise with the feelings.  I'm 39 and all of my immediate friends have children (apart from one) and none of them have had any problems conceiving.  I've been quite open about our struggles and our recent ivf and mc but I still get the comments about having other options like donor sperm or adoption or saying things like having kids is hard and not all it's cracked up to be.  So easy for them to say when they've had no problems conceiving.  One (who got pregnant in the first month of trying at 39) says that she's sure it happened so quickly because her diet is totally organic and sugar free etc.  That's great for her but my partner has no sperm so that won't do it for me!

I agree with what someone else said about looking after yourself and not going to child orientated social events.  I feel very isolated from my peer group these days as I'm the only non mum and can't bear going to things where we stand there like a lemon whilst they all talk about their kids and run after them.  I can't cope with those sorts of events at all now so I just try and see people individually (although I'm not even doing that now!).  Thank goodness for this forum. 

Oh I've had issues with my CCG and the AMH test!  I was originally turned down for nhs funded ivf in 2014 because I had low amh which was below their cut off (mine was 4.4).  We started looking privately and I had an amh done about 8 month later at a private clinic which was higher (6.1).  I went back to the ccg and asked to be reviewed for funding again as the amh was the only reason I was turned down.  They asked me to have the amh done again on the nhs and it came back as 8.8 - double what it was 12 months before!  It's all really weird and I do not trust the amh test at all.  I feel like we wasted 18 months when we could have had treatment.


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

K jade said:


> I must be very unusual in that i have very few close friends who've actually managed to create their families sucessfully.


K-Jade I don't think you are unusual, I think LOADS of our friends will have had trouble conceiving, it's just people don't talk about it. Now, I know for a fact that my closest friends, for the most part, got pregnant very very easily, because we've talked very openly about it - they know how lucky they were, which I do appreciate, as they realise it's not that easy for many of us. But I've also now subsequently found, that as I mentioned above, many of my less-close friends actually suffered infertility or miscarriage, but never disclosed until I 'came out' about my infertility woes, because they had kept it completely private

I think of infertility forums as the equivalent for NCT for us militant barrens - we can share our experiences and get support from other likeminded women. I had lunch on Sat with 2 women I met through an infertility social media group. Admittedly, the other patrons of the restaurant probably heard rather too much chat about sperm samples and dildocam than they probably would have liked, but god it was nice to a) do something vaguely social and b) be with people who were going through it at the same time. Most of my friends who have been through infertility, now have kids. So even if they're struggling for a sibling, they are still part of the parents club.

The funny thing is that I often feel more square than my friends who do have kids, because they're far more social than I am, with their parent mates. And if they're off the leash for an evening, it's 'mums on the razz' and I'm sipping a diet coke (whoa, pushing the boat out with caffeine!!) while they get trollied, as it's their turn for a lie-in

I completely, entirely agree about the baby showers etc. Because I've been open, my friends are totally sympathetic about why these occasions might be hard for me. In fact I've just texted a friend who invited me over for a get together with a friend who's in town. They both have small babies (as well as older kids) - I was supposed to be in the second trimester, and it's just too raw at the moment. So I've had to say no, I'm so sorry, I wish I could, but I can't just yet, it's too painful. (And they've said no worries, we completely understand, and we're thinking of you, and here for you)


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

*Mrschef* I am so over the moon for your miracle BFP - you are in fact the mythical woman who stopped trying, relaxed, went on holiday, and got drunk&#8230;and finally got upduffed!! That's a full house and the bonus ball! 

Very very sage advice - definitely agree with not moping. My Mum had a bit of wisdom that really stuck with me, just after she was told she was going to die, she said to us that something was only a problem if you could do something about it. In which case, get off your a*se and get on with trying to do something about it! If you can't do anything about it, then it's not a problem. It's a situation, it's a fact, and you can either accept it and get on with things, or not accept it and go bananas. Important to remember when the going gets tough!


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

*Chichi* big hugs lovely, it's a tough road. Everything is very raw for us at the moment - it's only a matter of weeks since our miscarriages, so I think we wouldn't be normal if we didn't find things feel extra rough right now

Your friends sound like prize tools, and think mrschef's advice above about surrounding yourself with supportive people, not people who bring you down, is pretty relevant here xx

*magic pillow* likewise to you, oh fellow member of the recently-miscarried club. Oh the people with their exceptionally helpful advice (oh, try ovulation sticks, thanks if only I'd thought of that) can just do one, frankly. Unfortunately, unless they've experienced infertility, they just don't understand. Thankfully forums like this mean we can get support from women who DO get it

That's awesome about your AMH and NHS funding. We weren't eligible for NHS funding primarily because we hadn't been trying the requisite 2 years - we rushed to IVF so quickly because my FSH and AMH together , and the fact my AMH had plummeted 93% in 5 years, suggested we didn't have time to waste. In 2 years time it's very very unlikely I'd pass the ovarian reserve tests in any case. But even with such rubbish AMH, I got 17 eggs, which shows how AMH isn't always that useful! The embryologists all asked if it could have been a lab error, but I said it had been measured 3 times in 3 different months in 2 different labs. My consultant said to DH when I was coming round from sedation after EC 'I wish I knew what was going on with her AMH, it's throwing everything off!' When he told me how many eggs we got, and I asked how that was even possible, he said there was so much about the human body we don't yet understand. Which is so very very true!


----------



## Angedelight

Hey bananafish.
I'm so glad to hear you had a positive difference when implementing the supplements suggested in It Starts With The Egg. I've just spent a fortune ordering supplements from Amazon. I see from your other posts you're really on it with testing for various things. This is stuff I need to get my head round and do as our next cycle is our last. Our clinic is a bit dismissive and I kind of want to turn over every stone possible! Can I message you for some more info later in the week?.
X


----------



## clahay

Hey Bananafish

We are basically in exactly the same boat.

I will be 34 soon.  My only saving grace is that out of my group of 7 school friends, only one has had a child.  Until recently, I thought I was the only one trying but it turns out my closest friend is now having IF issues too.  You are right in that all the other ones are still enjoying a young, crazy lifestyle.

However, when it comes to family and my husband's friends though, we are the "childless" ones. I am now the only one of all my cousins and my step siblings who does not have a child (youngest cousin just announced she is pregnant) and I am one of the oldest.  I feel sorry for my mum because I am her only child and her only chance of a grandchild.  My husband's sister has had 2 boys recently in the space of 17 months so no pressure from that side.

It is incredibly difficult.  People tiptoe around us.  We don't get invited to things any more.  We get told things like "we wouldn't understand because we don't have children".


----------



## sophiekh

Hi All

This completely in the same boat, nearly 34, all my peers and younger friends and family are on their 3/4 child.  Most of my relationships with family and friends have become distant. Not being in the club is a bit weird sometimes. I dont like telling people I dont know I cant have children, I still havent completely accepted it myself.

My sister is due in August and 3 people close to have given birth within the last 3 days. I dont know anyone else apart from the ladies on here so I can talk to about my infertility.


----------



## magicpillow

I panicked today that I'm nearly 40 and that means there is a real possibility that I may never have children.  I find that very hard to bear.  Uni is currently stressful and I just feel like I want to step off as I'm shattered and should be focusing on ivf round 2, not getting stressed.  I feel so left out of my peer group as I'm the only one without kids.  Thank god my course mates are all younger and don't have them. 
I'm starting another placement next month and am dreading the inevitable questions around whether I've got kids which I got DAILY on my last placement for the first 2 weeks!


----------



## aubrey

Childless life is not for me. I was dreaming to become a mother during my whole life. I can't carry a baby because of the heart disease. My dh supports me. He thinks that surrogacy is a perfect variant for us. We are into search of a good agency/clinic now. I hope we'll find surrogate mother and become parents soon.


----------



## Bellzez

Yes! Me! I too feel completely excluded from 'the club' although my friends have been so incredibly supportive. I have been very open about our struggles and couldn't ask for more supportive friends but the downside is I feel like i go through the same routine again and again..... Visit/meet up with friend with baby, chat about baby, chat about a few other things, end conversation with 'how are is everything going with ivf'. It honestly feels that the IVF catch ups are never ending while their babies grow older and they move onto number 2 or 3 and I'm still talking about either a failed cycle or my life in between cycles and waiting for the next appointment. And in between cycles I'm still trying to eat clean, avoid coffee, avoid alcohol, taking supplements, going nail varnish free, hair dye free, binning all my make up and other products I love. It absolutely sucks! I too feel in limbo, almost trapped. I feel like I just want to give up and enjoy life but I can't possibly do this. It's like never ending grief because there is no end. Anyway, I plough on and am doing my best and that's all we can do! I've seen a few of your posts and I must say, you seem incredibly strong. You're not alone with how you are feeling. Much love xx


----------



## Uber Barrens Club

Aubrey I’m so sorry about your health issues. Surrogacy is a very real possibility for us.  I have miscarried two genetically normal embryos - we have set a limit of 2 more transfers before we call it a bust on my own body - that would be 4 chromosomally normal embryos that haven’t become people, and so we’d have to accept I can’t sustain a pregnancy, and that if my uterus isn’t up to the job, our best chance of having a baby is to keep out remaining 3 euploid blasts and transfer into someone else’s uterus. I’ve been in touch with a few US surrogacy agencies, and had a very useful consultation with a US Dr about exporting our frozen embryos to the US for transfer into a gestational carrier. Desperately hoping it doesn’t come to that…

Bellzez - you summed it up perfectly. My relationship with my friends is pretty much exactly what you describe! I’m just so worn down by it all! Life is just what happens between dildocam - how sad is that?!!

You’re so right about the never-ending grief. It’s just this permanent sadness and desperate fear that we will never get there. My heart goes out to you, and all the amazing women on here. Big hugs xxx


----------



## magicpillow

Yes it is never-ending grief and fear that we might never get there.  Sorry you having to think about the surrogacy route now Bananafish.  I remember being on the miscarrige thread with you earlier in the year.  It's all so hard. 

I was meant to be meeting uni friends who I haven't seen for nearly 2 years (due to my infertility really as couldn't face the kid talk!) and I'm thinking of maybe backing out again as one of them is bringing her two kids (age 3 and 1) and another one has got a 15 month old so there will be big time child talk and I'm not sure if I can cope yet.  I feel like I should see them as I'm inviting them to our wedding next October so I need to see them at some point but it could be very painful and further reinforce the world I'm not part of.  Last night I went out with some uni friends who are all younger than me and I felt very old and out of it.  I feel in limbo as I'm too old for that sort of thing now but then I'm not in the 'mum club' either so I feel like I don't really fit anywhere.  It's odd.


----------

