# Why not clomid??? Advice please!



## irisheyes (Feb 2, 2005)

Hi girls i posted on this board at end of january as i was hoping to go on clomid.

A brief summary- went to gp in jan as had had second late period since august(3 weeks late in aug and nearly week late at christmas). I was very upset at christmas when this happened and very down all Jan. So i went to gp to ask for blood tests for miscarriage and to see what i could do about being depressed.

But she then asked me why i had never been on clomid- i wondered why too as my day 21 tests were up and down.She said she would speak to specialist and get back to me.I got more bloods done for day21 and fsh as the last tests were a year old.

Anyway she was off on leave for a month and i had phoned twice so finally made app to see her yesterday.

Here is my question-- at last!! My fsh result a year ago was 11 and day 21 tests had been 32 and 81. She said when she spoke to specialist that she said my fsh was quite high and may not benefit from clomid!!

My new results were 66- day 21 and 13 fsh(which i was disappointed with). So if she thought my fsh was high a year ago then she will definitely think it is now. But is she right in suggesting that clomid wouldnt work? What is she basing this on- is it not more the prog level that it should be based on

I am a bit annoyed that this gp(not my usual one btw) gave me this glimmer of hope just to take it away again  .I told her i want it sorted soon so i can settle myself to giving up or not(no ivf planned). My sisters are getting married in Aug and Sept and i thought maybe this would be my miracle  before i have to hear them announce pgs!

hope someone can help and if she is right how do i reduce my fsh Thanx


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## b3ndy (Sep 13, 2005)

Hi Irish Eyes

From the figures you've posted your day 21 tests show in ALL cases that you have ovulated. Most consultants/docs like to see anything over 30 to indicate ovulation. So seeing as most women are put on clomid to help them ovulate, the   tabs wouldn't help you in this case, coz you don't need the help to ovulate....BUT there are those, like me, who ovulate naturally and are put on clomid to 'give things a boost'.

I'm afraid I don't know much about fsh levels other than most clinics like it to be no more than 10 - if you do a search there are some charts somewhere on the 'ask a nurse' thread which list the ranges. I see you're trying acupuncture already (this is meant to help in trying to reduce it) but I've also see on the FF site some girls recommending wheatgrass tabs to help.

Good luck though - and hope you get some answers to your questions

S
xx


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## irisheyes (Feb 2, 2005)

Yes,clomid was to boost. Anyone know why fsh has to be below 10 to benefit from clomid?


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## KerryB (Mar 7, 2005)

If you have a high FSH it shows that you alredy have enough hormone to stimulate your ovaries into producing eggs, and hopefully releasing them. I assume that by taking Clomid when you have a high FSH you might be more at risk of OHSS, which can be dangerous, and that could by why she won't give you clomid.

Hope that makes sense!

xxx


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

Hi

Your progesterone level indicates that you're ovulating (anything above 30 nmol/l , some say over 40)...progesterone doesn't indicate your ovarian reserve which is what they are looking at when checking FSH level..basically looking at the quantity and quality of your remaining eggs...

Everyone's progesterone levels will be fairly different each month so the fact that yours are "up & down" shouldn't matter that much as long as you're ovulating every month - which you appear to be from the results.

I think I replied to some of your previous posts and included some info on FSH levels...this is what I was given so may give you rough idea..

FSH levels to indicate ovarian reserve:
under 6 = Excellent 
6 - 9 = good 
9 - 10 = fair
10 - 13 = diminished
13+ = hard to stimulate


It's thought that if your FSH levels are high then you may not respond prioperly to fertility drugs...

Clomid may also raise your FSH levels slightly as it's an anti-oestrogen & it is trying to trigger your ovaries to produce more follicles and subsequently eggs, if you already have a naturally higher FSH level then it may not help you.

I'm obviously no specialist but this is just info I've picked up.

Take care
Natasha


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

Here's some more info with a good analogy...

"Follicle stimulating hormone (FSH) is one of the most important hormones involved in the menstrual cycle. FSH is secreted by the pituitary gland in the brain. It is the primary hormone involved in ovulation. 

To determine if a woman has a good number of healthy eggs left in her ovaries, a serum FSH level can be measured. The test is usually performed on cycle day 3 but it can also be performed on day 2, 3, or 4 of a woman's menstrual cycle. (The first day of menstrual bleeding - spotting does not count- is considered Cycle Day 1. Therefore Cycle Day 3 is the third day of a woman's period.) 

You can think of the action of FSH as similar to what happens when you step on the gas pedal in the car to get going. In this analogy, FSH is the gas, and the pituitary gland is the gas pedal releasing FSH to get a follicle "going" at the beginning of every menstrual cycle.

As women approach menopause, their baseline FSH level will gradually increase. When a woman goes into menopause she is essentially running out of eggs and estrogen production in her ovaries. Sensing a low estrogen environment, the brain releases more FSH from the pituitary gland in an attempt to stimulate the ovaries to produce a mature follicle and more estrogen. 

In most laboratories, normal values of cycle day 3 FSH are less than 13 mIU/ml although there is some variation among different labs in what is considered the upper limit of normal. When a woman runs out of follicles capable of responding, cycle day 3 FSH will be quite high (over 30-40 mIU/ml) and she will stop having menstrual periods. Elevated FSH levels indicates a reduction in the quality as well as the quantity of eggs."


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## riffraff (Oct 18, 2005)

Minxy hi I hope all is going well, do you know how to get you fsh level measured, is it a blood test? and who authorises this ie GP or gyny con, thanx you great!!! ( so is every one else)


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

Hi riffraff

You can get FSH tested by GP or consultant....all mine have been tested by consultant as part of our ongoing treatment...was tested after very first appt...

FSH & LH should be tested by blood test between cd2-4 (usually tested cd3)...have you not had tested before  They're usually in the first set of bloods tested as standard...

Take care
Natasha


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## riffraff (Oct 18, 2005)

no I dont think so I will find out, thanx Jo x


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## irisheyes (Feb 2, 2005)

thanx girls, i had worked out that there was obviously a reason why specialist said she didnt think it would help. The gp didnt know tho!!! or else she didnt listen to the answer!!!! 

How do you reduce fsh then? And if fsh determines the amount of eggs and quality left how can it reduce anyway- as if you get older number of eggs are meant to go down!! Bit confusing!


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## ☼♥ Minxy ♥☼ © (Jan 13, 2005)

FSH can go down because things such as stress & other hormones such as oestrogen can sometimes give inaccurate/false FSH readings & higher the FSH level temporarily ...bit like that analogy I used in previous post...spose it would be like flooding the engine (too much FSH) when nothing really wrong but engine won't start (does that make sense  )

If you check out the complementary therapies and/or prenatal boards there's several posts about lowering FSH (or use search option on these boards)...wheatgrass and acupuncture are just 2 of the things I've read that can reduce FSH levels.


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## irisheyes (Feb 2, 2005)

Thanx again minxy. i was at acupuncture from april-dec last year and it did work for lowering my bbt so might try it again.Bought new car tho and expensive trying to do the two!!!


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